# Ep 61: License To Tilt

**Source:** Final Round Pinball Podcast  
**Type:** podcast_episode  
**Published:** 2022-10-03  
**Duration:** 62m 12s  
**Beat:** Pinball

**URL:** https://www.finalroundpinball.com/final-round-pinball-podcast-ep-61-license-to-tilt/

---

## Analysis

Jeff Teolis and Martin Robbins discuss the recent Stern James Bond pinball machine reveal, comparing it to HomePin's This Is Spinal Tap and previewing Keith Elwin's upcoming 60th-anniversary Bond game. The episode covers artwork criticism, mechanical features, significant pricing increases for the Bond LE ($20k in Australia, $13k US), and Stern's strategy of experimenting with multiple designer versions of the same theme.

### Key Claims

- [HIGH] Stern James Bond LE sold out in less than a minute at $12,999 USD — _Jeff Teolis discussing pricing during podcast_
- [HIGH] This Is Spinal Tap suffered from weak flipper strength due to light flipper bats — _Martin Robbins explaining technical issues observed at Pinfest_
- [HIGH] James Bond LE in Australia is $20,000, up from previous LE price of $14,500 — _Jeff Teolis citing Australian pricing data_
- [MEDIUM] Keith Elwin's 60th-anniversary Bond will be a single-level street game incorporating all Bond films — _Martin Robbins citing Inside Connected podcast from Stern; not officially confirmed at time of recording_
- [HIGH] George Gomez's Bond incorporates only Sean Connery films — _Martin Robbins distinguishing Gomez version from Elwin's multi-film approach_
- [MEDIUM] Stern previously produced approximately 1,000 Beatles/1964 games before halting production — _Martin Robbins recalling Beatles game production history_
- [MEDIUM] Stern is experimenting with pricing to determine where the market bubble will burst — _Martin Robbins speculating on Stern's pricing strategy_
- [MEDIUM] James Bond Pro is approximately $7,000 (up ~$500-700) and Premium is $9,699 (up ~$1,200) — _Jeff Teolis citing approximate current pricing with uncertainty about previous prices_
- [HIGH] This Is Spinal Tap's playfield art is blurry and has matte acrylic overlay reducing visual impact — _Martin Robbins describing technical artwork issues at Pinfest_
- [MEDIUM] Spinal Tap 1991 album 'Break Like the Wind' was recorded partly to maintain rights to the Spinal Tap name — _Martin Robbins discussing Spinal Tap history and licensing_

### Notable Quotes

> "Welcome to the last ever edition of Final Round."
> — **Jeff Teolis**, ~00:02:00
> _Humorous opening joke about recording at 1:40 AM before travel; sets tone for informal episode_

> "The launch of This Is Spinal Tap didn't go very well I think is probably the way to say it."
> — **Martin Robbins**, ~00:10:00
> _Candid assessment of HomePin game's reception; frames discussion of technical issues_

> "I'm a manufacturer. I can't really say. Yet, yet."
> — **Martin Robbins**, ~00:09:00
> _Reveals Martin's new role as game designer/manufacturer; explains reluctance to fully criticize HomePin_

> "If I'm Stern, I'm charging more than that because people are gobbling that up."
> — **Jeff Teolis**, ~00:35:00
> _Commentary on Stern's pricing power with sold-out LEs; suggests room for further increases_

> "I think what they're trying to do now is they're experimenting with price. Experiment with the LEs, because you've got no fear of losing that."
> — **Martin Robbins**, ~00:36:00
> _Articulates Stern's strategy of using high-demand LEs as test cases for price elasticity_

> "It's a George Gomez. That was never the case with the Steve Ritchie games when Steve was there... flop flippers. When you design with that in mind, that's fine."
> — **Martin Robbins**, ~00:42:00
> _Explains design philosophy differences; Gomez's consistent use of flop flippers is now standard for Stern_

> "Stern are in a really really good position in that they have the ability to experiment. They can try new things, and if it doesn't work, well, we'll just try better next time."
> — **Martin Robbins**, ~00:37:00
> _Positions Stern's market dominance as enabling risk-taking; relevant to two-designer Bond strategy_

> "I'm putting my money on Elwin. Sorry, he's four for four."
> — **Jeff Teolis**, ~00:51:00
> _Expresses confidence in Keith Elwin's track record; reflects competitive positioning of two Bond games_

> "I want to love this game. I do. I do. But I know you're being nice. I've seen some footage."
> — **Jeff Teolis**, ~00:15:00
> _Candid assessment of Spinal Tap; acknowledges gap between theme appeal and actual gameplay experience_

> "What are your feelings towards butt plugs? Um, take it or leave it because this one's got a big one in it."
> — **Martin Robbins**, ~00:30:00
> _Crude humor describing Bond premium toy (tower/cannon); reflects podcast's informal, off-color banter style_

### Entities

| Name | Type | Context |
|------|------|---------|
| Jeff Teolis | person | Co-host of Final Round Pinball Podcast; Canadian pinball enthusiast and competitive player; provides pricing and market analysis |
| Martin Robbins | person | Co-host of Final Round Pinball Podcast; formerly of Head to Head Pinball Podcast; now involved in pinball manufacturing/design; attended Pinfest and played Spinal Tap machines |
| George Gomez | person | Game designer at Stern; designed James Bond machine; known for toy-heavy designs with flop flippers |
| Keith Elwin | person | Game designer; designing 60th-anniversary James Bond game featuring all Bond films on single-level playfield; track record of four successful games |
| Stern Pinball | company | Major pinball manufacturer; releasing James Bond with both Gomez and Elwin versions; experimenting with pricing strategy |
| HomePin | company | Pinball manufacturer; produced This Is Spinal Tap; received mixed reception at Pinfest launch |
| James Bond (Stern/Gomez) | game | Newly revealed Stern pinball by George Gomez; features Sean Connery films only; Pro ~$7k, Premium $9,699, LE $12,999 USD ($20k AUS) |
| James Bond 60th Anniversary (Stern/Elwin) | game | Upcoming Stern pinball by Keith Elwin; single-level street game; incorporates all Bond films; limited production; unique price point (unspecified) |
| This Is Spinal Tap (HomePin) | game | HomePin machine; recently launched; criticized for weak flipper strength, blurry/dull playfield art, limited gameplay depth; some issues potentially fixable |
| Final Round Pinball Podcast | organization | Pinball-focused podcast hosted by Jeff Teolis and Martin Robbins; covers game releases, industry analysis, competitive pinball |
| Pinball Party podcast | organization | Newly launched podcast on Pinball Network; created by Jason from Wisconsin; featured on network; created AI 'Mef' robot based on Final Round hosts |
| Head to Head Pinball Podcast | organization | Former podcast co-hosted by Martin Robbins; Martin previously produced episodes |
| Cleapin (tournament) | event | Pinball tournament attended by Martin Robbins; organized by Don Johnson and Kid Forest group; featured women's event run by Kim Martinez |
| Pinfest | event | Pinball festival/event where Martin Robbins played two This Is Spinal Tap machines and observed community reception |
| Beatles/1964 (Stern) | game | Historical Stern machine; priced high relative to market; produced ~1,000 units before halting; remainder never completed; theme/price resonated poorly with younger buyers |
| Inside Connected podcast | organization | Stern-affiliated podcast; featured Keith Elwin discussing 60th-anniversary Bond game details |
| IFPA | organization | International pinball organization managing competitive rankings/tournaments |
| Ray Ray | person | Pinball community figure; attended Cleapin; mentioned Final Round podcast's lack of competitive tournament coverage |
| Jason from Wisconsin | person | Creator of Pinball Party podcast; created AI 'Mef' robot character based on Final Round hosts; newly featured on Pinball Network |
| Don Johnson | person | Tournament organizer; involved with Kid Forest group; organizes Cleapin event |
| Kim Martinez | person | Pinball community figure; ran women's event at Cleapin tournament |

### Topics

- **Primary:** James Bond pinball machine reveals and comparison, Pricing strategy and market elasticity for pinball machines, This Is Spinal Tap (HomePin) technical issues and reception, Stern's strategy of releasing multiple designer versions of same theme
- **Secondary:** Game design philosophy and mechanical toys in pinball, Playfield artwork quality and theme integration, George Gomez design signature (flop flippers, toy integration), Keith Elwin's track record and upcoming projects

### Sentiment

**Neutral** (0)

### Signals

- **[product_launch]** Stern officially revealed James Bond pinball machine by George Gomez; sold-out LE in under one minute at $12,999 USD (confidence: high) — Jeff: 'Stranger Things has been released. Brian Eddy's back. This is exciting. The best, biggest reveal of a pinball machine happened in the last week.'
- **[market_signal]** James Bond LE pricing increased 41-42% year-over-year ($14.5k to $20k AUS; $13k USD LE up substantially from prior). Pro and Premium also raised. (confidence: high) — Jeff: 'Previously, an LE was $14,500... Now, $20,000. All sold out, by the way, in less than a minute.'; James Bond LE $12,999 USD vs prior unknown but implied ~$9-11k
- **[product_strategy]** Stern experimenting with releasing two completely different versions of James Bond by different designers (Gomez vs. Elwin) simultaneously (confidence: high) — Martin: 'This is unprecedented really. Certainly from Stern to release two completely different versions of a theme. By two different designers.'
- **[product_concern]** This Is Spinal Tap suffered weak flipper strength due to light flipper bats; difficult to hit center ramp early on flipper due to power loss at start of flip (confidence: high) — Martin: 'The biggest problem that it had was the flipper power was really weak... if they can fix the flippers then I think you will solve that issue.'
- **[product_concern]** This Is Spinal Tap playfield art described as blurry and dull due to matte acrylic overlay; lacking visual definition and zest (confidence: high) — Martin: 'It's just a little bit blurry. And also because it's got an acrylic overlay, that acrylic overlay is a matte finish. So it sort of just gives it a bit of a dull look.'
- **[sentiment_shift]** This Is Spinal Tap received mixed/negative reception at Pinfest launch despite strong theme appeal; Martin now reluctant to criticize due to role as manufacturer (confidence: high) — Martin: 'I just had to say, look, I'm a manufacturer. I can't really say. Yet, yet.' and 'The launch of This Is Spinal Tap didn't go very well.'
- **[market_signal]** Stern actively experimenting with LE pricing to find market elasticity ceiling; LE sold instantly at $12.999 suggesting room for further increases (confidence: medium) — Martin: 'Stern are in a really really good position... they're experimenting with what they can get away with, what price will actually cause the bubble to burst?'
- **[design_innovation]** James Bond Premium features Aston Martin DB5 car toy and jetpack Bond animation; Gomez known for toy-heavy design; discussion of toy ROI vs. novelty factor (confidence: high) — Martin discussing toys: 'Gomez comes from a toy background... I'm more excited about the Aston Martin car.'
- **[design_philosophy]** Flop flippers now standard in Stern games due to George Gomez's consistent use; design philosophy trade-off: easier outer shots, harder center ramps (confidence: high) — Martin: 'George Gomez always on his games. They were always flop flippers... That was never the case with the Steve Ritchie games.'
- **[machine_intel]** Keith Elwin confirmed designing 60th-anniversary James Bond featuring all films on single-level street game with unique price point; announced via Stern's Inside Connected podcast (confidence: medium) — Martin: 'this is actually part of the Inside Connected podcast from Stern... he has talked about it... it's going to incorporate all the movies.'
- **[content_signal]** Pinball Party podcast (Jason from Wisconsin) newly launched on Pinball Network; gained visibility through Final Round shoutout; created AI character 'Mef' based on hosts (confidence: high) — Martin: 'He created a robot of you and I... he's now on the Pinball Network... he had a few more listeners and probably sealed the deal.'
- **[historical_signal]** Spinal Tap film (1984) required 1991 album 'Break Like the Wind' recording partly to maintain name rights; recent trend of re-recording (similar to Taylor Swift) due to rights fragmentation (confidence: medium) — Martin: 'they had to do it to keep the Spinal Tap name, I think was one of the reasons... just re-recorded a little bit so that they had those songs.'

---

## Transcript

 it's player versus player and player versus machine welcome to the final round Oh, this should be a treat. We'll get to that in a second. Because I'm not producing it. Hi, I'm Jeff Teolis. I have no idea how this is going to sound. This is Martin Robbins. Welcome, everybody, to the final round of Pimple Podcast, episode 61. I did a fair job last time I edited, surely. You gave it to me. I did a little post-cleanup. Yeah. A little bit. So. But this time, you are 100% on your own. This will come out when I'm in Robert Englunds. I have no idea how it's going to sound. So, Marty, you know what? I kid. I heard what you did for years on Head to Head. Was it you or Ryan who produced that? It was me. It was you? Oh, we'll be fine. We'll be fine. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, fuck. Welcome to the last ever edition of Final Round. Thanks very much for joining us. I'm Jeff Teolis. Yeah, it's pretty much like that. I hope everybody's doing well. How's things over your neck of the woods, Jeff? Well, you know how much I care about the quality of this podcast and certainly our beloved listeners and how much they love us to the point where it is 1.40 in the morning. It is hours away from me leaving to go to Robert Englunds with zero notes in front of me. Just played some pinball earlier tonight and I'm like, oh yeah, we should probably record this because people will whine if we don't get a podcast out because I'm going away for a little bit and this is going to be it. So in a roundabout way, you're welcome. Well, as you know, the last time we didn't record, it spawned the Pinball Party podcast, so we don't want that to happen again. And look at that fucker. He's now on the Pinball Network. He's on the Pinball Network. Bloody hell. That guy's cutting into our... But it's very good. It's a good... It's a great show. Especially when he talks about us. He created a robot. Now, he's a smart dude. This is Jason from Wisconsin. He created a robot of you and I. I guess because we plugged him the last time, he had a few more listeners and probably sealed the deal to come on the Pinball Network. Welcome aboard. Congratulations. And we do sincerely think it's a great audio podcast, and you're very entertaining, and best of luck to you. We look forward to the episodes. But he said because of all the listeners, he has now been able to afford a robot of you and I for when we don't podcast, and that would be his character, Mef, that he likes to talk to. So it's very entertaining. It's on his episode four, but his first episode on TPN is episode five. You blew it, Jason. You lead strong, my friend. You put on Zach many. Wrong. But for those that missed it, we will now play you just a little snippet of the robot because we like people talking about us. Okay, well, a good combination of Jeff and Marty is obviously Mef. So I would like to bring on my first guest, Mef, the robot funded by the Final Round Pinball Podcast shoutout. Hey, Mef, how you doing? Hello, you wanker. I'm doing well, but my fly is down. okay well i guess they got that accurate um did they maintain jeff and marty's love of pinball are you a huge fan of pinball yes of course but not as much as i like hockey and kangaroos mate right uh i guess is that it i also know a lot of boot stand-up comedy what the fuck I think they just took the podcast and put it into an AI generator and made a fuck. Twat. Kind of like deep faith. Fuck, fuck. Yes, that is very, very funny. And again, feel free to talk about us. Good, bad, just get the spelling right. That's all that matters, right? That doesn't really matter that much either. So you did ask what I was doing. I came back from Cleepin. That was fun. I missed that the year before because our stupid borders weren't open. Thanks, Ian. A lot of fun at Cleapin. Big, big turnout. So congrats to Don Johnson and crew there, the Kid Forest group. I know Kim Martinez ran a wonderful women's event. That was fun. I saw Ray Day there. He's like, isn't your podcast supposed to be about competition? I'm like, fuck, whatever. What? Yeah, he was like, it's funny because we get emails and people talk to us about everything but pinball. Ray Day's like, yeah, it's supposed to be about competition. you guys didn't say anything about Northwest. I'm like, oh, yeah, well, it's on IFK. I'm sure Escher won. And he did. It's not that we don't care. It's just kind of when we record and by the time we edit, it's so after the fact. So we should mention that. Congratulations to Keith Elwin. He won Pinberg in 2019. There. Competition check. Done. Yeah, we aren't the most timely when it comes to news. But we do this week because some big news has just happened. Jeff? Stranger Things has been released. Brian Eddy's back. This is exciting. The best, biggest reveal of a pinball machine happened in the last week. Spinal Tap came out and lost. How did that get buried by all this 007 stuff? You saw Spinal Tap in the flesh. I saw it and I played it. And? So, hmm. Oh, this is tough for you. You're in the business now. You've got to be careful. No, I know. And you know what? Everyone kept asking me. I went to Pinfest last weekend. We'll get to that in a sec. But that's where they had two This Is Spinal Tap machines from HomePin there for people to play. Everybody kept asking me what I thought of it. And I just had to say, look, I'm a manufacturer. I can't really say. Yet, yet. You're sending me all these pictures of every game being played except Spinal Tap. I did nothing like that, please, people. Damien if you're listening I didn't do that at all Damien don't worry I did the same thing whenever like I would turn off I would turn off Fathom and then turn it back on really quickly so no one was playing it I was taking pictures of I was taking pictures of people playing Valhalla no one playing Fathom because it was off that's what I did you are an asshole the launch of this is Spinal Tap didn't go very well I think is probably the way to say it. I think a lot of people were dissatisfied with the game. But I think that a lot of the things that weren't great about it could be fixed. So one of the main things that people talked about was the flipper strength, that you just couldn't hit the ball fast. And that can be two things. Either that can be just up the coil strength, or I feel that they've got really light flipper bats. so you know if you if you have something that's light that's trying to hit a bowling ball it's not going to go far but if you've got something heavy that hits a bowling ball it's going to go far right so i think because the flippers are quite light you don't get enough force behind what bats do they use i think they're their own bats okay 3d printed no no i think they're proper injection molded flipper bats but they're just of a quite light material and so that was the biggest problem that it had was the the flipper power was really weak easy solution ceramic ball there you go well yeah there's that but also just get heavier flipper bats use the power ball well yeah no i know what you mean but because the biggest criticism we've had was that there's two ramps one to the left and one just to the right of the left if that makes sense and you just couldn't hit that i guess it's the center ramp and that's because in order to get it it's going to be really early on the flipper and usually early on a flipper is where you've got less power so if they can fix the flippers then i think you will solve that issue i think the other criticism and this is constructive criticism i think if they could just tweak the artwork i don't dislike the playfield art itself i know people were critical of it i don't don't mind it at all but I think they just need to sharpen it up a bit. It's just a little bit blurry. And also because it's got an acrylic overlay, that acrylic overlay is a matte finish. So it sort of just gives it a bit of a dull look and it loses just some of its zest. I don't know if you know the history of Spinal Tap. I've said before and have been saying this for 30 plus years. It is my all-time favorite movie. There is not a funnier movie ever made. If you like The Office, tip your cap to Spinal Tap and the mockumentary that it is because it inspired The Office, first the British, then the American. And the actors that are involved, and even Rob Reiner, the director, at some point kind of lost the rights to Spinal Tap. And so in 1991, some eight years after the movie came out, they made their actual real album, and the album is called Break Like the Wind. Great talent. Tons of incredible musicians on that. Steve Lukather, Slash plays on it. They're a share, even sings a duet with David St. Hubbins. The reason they kind of did that was to kind of get some of their, they had to do it to keep the Spinal Tap name, I think was one of the reasons. And then even years later, kind of like Taylor Swift, they re-released their soundtrack album, just re-recorded a little bit so that they had those songs. And when you see the movie and you see it on the back glass and you see some of the clips, which I'm glad they're on there, it's a little disjointed because what you see on the play field is from nine years later it's not actually from the movie it's from break like the wind in one way i'm i'm thrilled that there is a spinal tap game out there every time i go to tpf and they have that homebrew of i guess it was a flash gordon i get excited because there's some neat video assets and it's fun and it's spinal tap and i love it i want to love this game i do i do but i know you're being nice i've seen some footage. I mean, we've talked about it before. Boy, theme's really, really important. This is like, to movies, to me, like Led Zeppelin is to music. You can't pick a better theme for me, and I'm still not interested. The game has to be good. I will play it. I'm looking forward to playing it, but from what I've heard from Homepin is that it's not going to be very deep. It's not going to be for competitive players, and I don't expect every game to be that, but when I'm putting that kind of money out i need to have some fun playing it and uh i'll wait until i play it but it's better than thunderbirds i'll tell you that well that boy high bar set there fuck woo congrats and is thunderbirds not the last game on pin side and you're saying it's better than that yeah it is okay all right i didn't say how much it was right right above it we wish them all the best fine you used to be critical oh i used to be yeah and i i i think if you know me well enough if that's all i've had to say then you know the rest you used to allow on head-to-head pin side pd coming on you know what the worst call out is player one you're up player one you're up and you would let that fly and look at you now business marty the difference is this He's got a resume and a home pin. I can't believe you're going to admit that. Don't be like that. No, it's because I know, I now know what actually goes into making pinball. And take Mike out of the picture because I still have my feelings about that man. Ditto. But if I can look at all the other people that are involved in it as well, I know that there's been a lot of work that's gone into it. And for it to be dumped on like it has been, I kind of, no, who am I kidding? I don't feel for him. I don't. but I feel for the other people, and they were there all optimistic, and they were a little bit let down. So that's kind of what it is. I just know that there's been a lot of work that's gone into it, and I don't know. I just don't want to shit on it. I'm okay with that analogy. You're right. Home Pin isn't just Mike alone. When Trudeau went through what he went, you think, okay, is that going to kill all the other games? Well, he wasn't the only one on the game. There was the artists and the programmers and all the people on the line. It's not just one person, so I get that. Yeah, but let's move on to something much, much better, and that is the reveal this week of the long-awaited James Bond from Stern. What are your thoughts, Geoff? I'm excited to play it. I love the theme. I think the art's very nostalgic and kind of fun. The art is very nostalgic. Well, it doesn't look like something in 2022, but maybe it's not supposed to look like 2022. It's not great. I just wish that I'm okay with, I don't know, there's something with the definition of it that just bothers me a little bit. That's all. But again, I haven't seen it up close. Maybe it looks nice. I like the one that has all the movie posters on it. I'm okay with that. You know, it's true to the movie posters. So why would I want something different? I don't know. I want to play it. Because it's all about theme integration, right? So what I see, I'm going to split it into two things. One is the cabinet art and the other is the playfield art. So before the official release, we had some blurry images shown to us and I thought the artwork on the playfield looked terrible. Now that I've seen the high-res images, I actually don't mind it at all. I think it's fine. It's actually quite palatable is probably the best way of saying it. My only criticism really is that I find it a bit too pinball-y, the art, and not enough theme integration with it. Lots of inserts, lots of text, but I wanted to see more of the Bond universe on the playfield. The cabinet art, don't like any of them. And that's just a personal preference. I think that it is very poster sticker art Do you know what it is? Okay For those people that are old like me Or even older like Jeff There was a thing that we had as kids I can't remember what they were called But effectively you'd have It was a book And it would have a bit of paper with Like imagery and these little sort of Bits of the scene that weren't coloured in And you'd get a bit of stencil paper And you'd get a pencil on the back of it and you'd transfer it onto the page. Do you remember that? I just know we've said goodbye to everybody under the age of 30. Thanks, Marty. Clearly what you're saying is yes, you do. That's what it reminds me of. It's sticker art, sticker book art. Scrapbooking was big a few years ago. Can it be like that? That was like 20 years ago. Scrapbooking was a thing. When we're as old as we are, 20 years ago is not that bad. Yeah, I know. You were 50 then, yeah. Take it easy take it easy I agree with you I can see your point But you don really look at the side I don know I don really look at the side art in a lineup anyway So play field I kind of like You know it fine I think they've gone for the more is more mentality, which is kind of good, I think, these days, where it can make any play field that might be quite open and sparse, it makes it look quite busy with a lot of art. the one thing that I think in my mind going for it is it's a George Gomez game and what George knows how to do is make a game fun he knows how to make you feel good and there's a lot of shot satisfaction and now that I've seen the videos I think that it would actually be a fun flipper I haven't seen one video yet and I know it's Friday I guess it's now Saturday the 24th I haven't seen yet and I'm kind of like that anyway. I usually wait to see it myself. It's not that I don't like the videos that are produced. I've just been busy and haven't seen it yet. So I don't know if they've got any gameplay. Maybe by the time this airs, there'll be some gameplay. Again, I want to see it firsthand because I don't want to listen to anybody else's opinion. I don't expect you to listen to ours because form your own. You know what I mean? I think it might, and I say this because I think of my kid. You know, I'll go to a movie with my kid, and Brady, I'll be like, what did you think of this movie? I'll give you an example. He loves Marvel, so he went and saw Thor, Love and Thunder. He's like, yeah, it's kind of fun. It's not as good as Ragnarok. I'm like, okay, I'll give it to you. And I'm like, well, what did you like about this, this, this, this, this? Give him a week. Give him time to go through YouTube and hear, you know, whoever the Cary Hardys of Marvel movies are. You know what I mean? Like people that he listens to with their opinions, and he copies their opinion. And he's like, so, you want to go see Ragnarok again or whatever, Love and Thunder again? He's like, it's really, the more I think about it, it's really not that good. I'm like, that's not the tune you had a week ago when we saw it. So I want my own opinion, and I think you should have yours too. Yeah, yeah. Well, I am just basing my opinion on what I've seen, and I haven't actively gone out there to get reviews or anything. I just saw the trailer and the features of the Pro and the Premium. one thing i do want to ask you jeff is what are your feelings towards butt plugs um take it or leave it because this one's got a big one in it that's all i'm saying butt plugs what am i missing the big oh shit yes the fucking tower oh my god i was like okay sorry my butt plug days are behind me a little bit hey oh still got it it's quite phallic is what i'm gonna say about that is that what a butt hug looks like i don't know i would say a dildo sure bullshit go go upstairs and grab whatever you got let me know like compare let's do it we can i'll wait the other thing is quite interesting about is on the premium you've also got the little jetpack bond that sort of goes across the playfield i want that to be i want that to be cooler than it actually looks as opposed to a swinging arm yeah by the way okay about that i don't know what to compare it to but i think the first time i see it i'm like oh that's kind of cool how many times after that are you gonna be like oh fuck i'll give you some examples love gun multiball on a premium kiss oh the ball goes across the back. I guess that's kind of like Dracula, but it's not something I have to hit. It's just... Fuck, that's a waste of a mech. Or, I know you had it, and I never got the wow factor of it. Oh, look at the swinging dinosaur on the premium of Jurassic Park. That's awesome! No, it's a waste of money. Come on. Are you thrilled every time you play that? Yeah, I loved the dinosaur. I loved it. Every time? Every time. Every time. Absolutely I loved it. But again, it's a personal preference. It's one shot. It's not like you have to make a different shot. It just kind of reminded me, is it Rescue 911 that's got the helicopter? Yes. Oh, yeah. That's a good comparison. Yeah. It's just that. It's fine. But, you know, it's just fine. And it adds to the BOM. I'm more excited about the Aston Martin car. I mean, that's kind of neat. That's a good integration. Yeah. Okay. You don't like it? No, it's fine. I'm glad they've got the car. DB5 is just like an iconic car. That's a perfect place for a book. I don't know. It's kind of like, I think, what you were saying with Love Gun Multiball and potentially the dinosaur in Jurassic Park. Once you've seen it a couple of times, you don't even look at it. Particularly Love Gun, when that magnet happens, you go, oh, my God, that's cool. Would never notice it every other time I'm playing it because I'm just in Multiball and I'm worried about that instead. This is interesting because Gomez comes from a toy background And he's got some freaking great toys on some of his games. He really does. I mean, even Monster Bash has some fun with the dinosaur. Sorry, the fucking dinosaur. Is it 2 in the morning? Yeah. The Frankenstein monster is what I meant to say. You know, that's kind of cool the way it pops up. I enjoy that. I definitely like what he's done on Deadpool. That's fun. But what's my favorite toy of his? The Corvette's pretty cool. The revving motor. But there's one game I'm thinking of that I'm stuck with. Was his Johnny Mnemonic that had the glove? I don't know. Lord of the Rings, I thought, not so much. Oh, it's Batman. It's a nightmare mech, I agree, for operators, but that's a pretty cool mech with the Batphone. I don't know. I like that, the way you lock the balls there, the Batcomputer. It's unique. It's a toy. You can see where the money's spent. So on this game, on the premium, are you seeing where the money's spent? Look, as I said, I think in my mind, when I look at what I've seen so far, I look at what's going to be a fun layout. I think it does have a bit of a Batman 66 vibe to me as far as shots and layout goes. I just think it's going to be fun. But I think what's happened is great layout, great shots, and then, okay, let's put some toys on it. That's kind of just my impression I get. Does it remind you of any other game? As I said, Batman 66. Really? Yep. I don't get that feeling. Well, just that butt plug slash rocket, whatever it is, the spectre fun thingy is kind of like the phone in batman 66 i don't see why is it same area i'll give you that but it's not the rotisserie that same area same shot yeah and same footprint anyway look i love george gomez games me too me too i freaking love i don't like the fact that it's got flop flippers but i'm just gonna have to get over that because i just think that's a i think that's now a standard that all stern games are going to come now they've someone's come along and said, well, it's probably George Gomez because his designs always have them. It's gone right. That's just the standard now. Drop the flippers down a bit. So that's whatever. But it's a George Gomez. That was never the case with the Steve Ritchie games when Steve was there. No, no, absolutely not. No, that's right. And Keith certainly loves them. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah, Keith does. And George Gomez always on his games. They were always flip flippers. When you design with that in mind, that's fine. But you just don't do a lot of center shots. Certainly don't give me a ramp up the center because it's very difficult to get it. With flop fibers. It's tough to do from a cradle sometimes. Yeah, that's exactly right. Yeah, yeah. I have to do it on the fly a little bit. So interesting. Okay. So let's just talk, if we can, about pricing. Go ahead. Because the pricing for an LE in Australia, $20,000. Previously, an LE was $14,500 maybe, $14,000. Now, $20,000. all sold out, by the way, in less than a minute. What was the price before? The American price? We're looking at $13,000. Yeah, so for the US, it was $13,000 for the LE. But what was it before? I don't know. I thought it might have been about $11,000, maybe even $9,000. I don't know. It's gone up significantly is what I'm seeing. I think the Pro is now $7,000. I think that's up by about $500, $600, maybe $700. The premium is just shy of $7,000. I think that's up about $1,200. That makes no sense. The pro and the premium, you have the same price. Yeah, sorry. I've typed it in incorrectly. So I think it's probably $9,000, $9,900 something. Okay. So I should probably check my pricing. Here is it. Here is it. Here is it. No, no, no. Do a podcast with fake pricing. So $9,000, yeah. I put my sixes and my nines together around the wrong way. You know how I do that? Yes, you do. Talking butt plugs and 69s, well done $9,699 Is the premium I wish I could remember what the old prices were But it's a $20,000 game for the LE Here Which is a significant increase In the previous LE If I'm stern I'm charging more than that Because people are gobbling that up As long as people keep gobbling that up Keep moving the needle People buy them and they flip them I'll sell my spot, I'm getting it here so so my bubble's not bursting it's not bursting oh my god it's not bursting oh my god you would oh it was just what i was about to say it's not bursting it's just not it well yeah look and this was a conversation that i had actually might have been ryan that was having that conversation with george gomez when we had him on head to head stern are in a really really good position in that they have the ability to experiment. They can try new things, and if it doesn't work, well, we'll just try better next time. So I think what they're trying to do now is they're experimenting with price. Experiment with the LEs, because you've got no fear of losing that. Those are sold out instantly. Yeah, but there's money to be made on every model. So they're experimenting with what they can get away with, What price will actually cause the bubble to burst? And as I said, the LE, were they $500 maybe? $1,000. $1,000. Sold out in a minute at the US $12,999 price point. Do you know anyone who got one? No, I don't know anyone. So that's interesting. But that's not all. There's another model coming. The last show, I bit my tongue when you said, I think Venom's next. I'm like, okay, sure. Has the Elwynn thing been announced completely? Again, this is now Saturday morning. It hasn't been. I don't think it's been officially. I've seen rumors out there. So I just want to speak if it's been announced. I don't want to speak if it hasn't. Yeah, maybe. It's certainly out there. Everybody knows Keith Elwin is doing the 60th anniversary edition of James Bond. What I know is that it's going to be limited. It's going to have a very interesting price point on it. It's a single level sort of street level game. Lots of targets, four spinners, and it's going to incorporate all the films. Because that's something we didn't mention about the Gomez Bond, is that that's only Sean Connery. I don't know. See, now with the Sean Connery ones, where some of the movies may not be my cup of tea, I'm actually shocked there wasn't a Goldfinger one. Like, if you're going to do one, isn't that the one to do? Well, apparently, they've said that there might be Goldfinger later on. So they might do a special edition. I don't know. Okay. That's the one I can't believe wasn't done. But 60-plus years, 25 films. The universe is huge. Now, with some of the Daniel Craig movies, you've seen kind of remakes of the movies in a way, or certainly reintroducing some of the characters you saw. I mean, Blofeld has been played by four different actors in the James Bond movies. They use the Donald Pleasance one, I believe, on the Gomez games. But so what I'm saying is the universe is huge. All the Bond girls, all the cars, all the villains, the movies, the actors. that's a lot to choose from and you're saying ellen's may incorporate them all okay so this is i believe this is actually part of the inside connected podcast from stern and so my understanding is that he has talked about it and that's all i've heard is that it's going to incorporate all the movies cool awesome this is a unprecedented really certainly from stern to release two completely different versions of a theme. By two different designers. By two different designers. Again, Stern have the ability to experiment. So they can say, well, let's try this. Let's see if we can get away with two different editions. I think the only negative I see from it is if people weren't aware and Bond is their dream theme and they get a Gomez, and really what they wanted was the Elwynn, but they've already put their money down, that might be a bit of an inconvenience, possibly. Well, you're open for criticism. You know, it's different by saying, you know, one of the last two games that came out, Godzilla or Rush. I like Rush. I like Godzilla. They're totally different, and you're going to have fans of both. But you are probably going to open yourself up to a different kind of comparison. Now, I realize the price point is going to be unique with the L1 game, if in fact that is happening. How would you feel if you're within that company and Elwynn's game just destroys Gomez's game, or the other way around. I'm putting my money on Elwynn. Sorry, he's four for four. If it was a carte blanche, do whatever you want, Elwynn, then that's fine. But because it's a single-level, street-level game, I don't think they are going to be the same market. I think people that bought Beatles aren't the same person that likes a fast-shooting stern with ramps. Well, operators are certainly not included in this Elwynn 60th anniversary. I mean, I know there are places like Ace Goge that get these kind of things that are really cool, and some may have them, but at that price point, you're probably not going to have it beat up on location. If you are, let me know where you are. That's pretty cool. Are you bummed at all that after the success of Iron Maiden and Jurassic Park, then Avengers and Godzilla, But now you're priced out of what could have been a pro L1 fifth game. Like, oh, shit, I really got to pay that much more? And will you pay that much more? I'd have to look at it. Because, again, I see Beatles, and I wouldn't have bought that, even though I really enjoy playing it. The only thing I didn't like about Beatles was the price. Yeah, yeah. And that's possibly the same situation here. The price just didn't do it for me. And it didn't do it for Stern. They didn't sell 2,000 Beatles. Yeah. Or 1964. Yeah. Remember very carefully, they produced a bunch, maybe 1,000, and then it stopped. And we'll do the rest later. The rest later trickled. They've never completed that. So I'm not saying they missed the mark on it. I just saying the price and because people have to have ramps for some strange reason just didn do it Or maybe just the theme was too out of date It didn resonate with maybe some younger buyers I think in this case because they are doing games that are radically different I think they are going to appeal to different people. So I think it will minimize the amount of people that will feel torn between the two machines. We'll have to wait and see, as one Craig Bobby would like to say. So I don't know when that's going to be announced, but yeah, we'll see. How long do you think it's going to take you to produce the show? How many days? I'm good for both. Because the shows are over an hour, and I have to listen to yours for an hour, I have to listen to mine for an hour, then I have to meld them together, clean them up, and then do another edit. It's like a minimum five hours of editing for me, which I don't do all in one sitting. I'm usually, after we record, I'll get it out within a week. Three, five days if I'm lucky. You? Yeah, about that. Probably a couple of days. Okay. Yeah, I might go for an edit tonight, maybe tomorrow. I don't know. We'll see. I'm just having a nice, nice, long, long weekend. Four-day long weekend. Perfect. What's the holiday? Well, a very, very important holiday that we have here in Melbourne. Which is? The AFL Grand Final. That's actually a holiday? Yes, it is. Wow. Is it one of those things where they said, you know what? We might as well make it a holiday. People are taking it off anyway. Let's not fight it. They've always talked about after the Super Bowl, which is the NFL, the football, So many people on Monday calling in sick. It's kind of like the day after St. Patrick's Day. Those two days are when people are pretty hungover and messed up. Is that what it is with the AFL? It's where they have the football players parade in the city streets. So it gives people a chance to go and see that, I guess. And it's in Melbourne? Yeah. Yeah. Oh. So it's just a public holiday in Melbourne. Is it always in Melbourne, the AFL final? Yes, at the Melbourne Cricket Ground, the MCG. Because it's huge. Yes, correct. Well, it used to be called the Victorian Football League, VFL, which then became AFL, Australian Football League. But yeah, no, it came from Victoria. Wow. And most of the teams are Victorian teams. But also, that was Friday's public holiday. We also got a public holiday on Thursday. An extra one. An extra one, a one-off, an official day of mourning. Oh, okay. We had ours on the 19th. But did you have a public holiday? It was federally regulated because I work in radio. Radio is the FCC in the United States or the CRTC in Canada. Because we are federally regulated, we had the one-off holiday, but the individual provinces could decide whether or not it was a holiday. And Quebec said, absolutely no. I mean, they didn't want anything to do with it. And Ontario said, we will recognize a day of mourning, but it wasn't a holiday. But for my business, it was. So that's why I'm having four days off and needed because I've just come back last weekend from Pinfest in Newcastle, which is obviously where I got to see Spinal Tap and we had Kelts and Fathom there. And it was yet again another fantastic show. I mean, they've been doing this now, I think, for probably six years. So it's a very well organized and well attended show. Is this the show where you used to run the tournament? No, that was the one in Melbourne. That was flip out. Pinfest in Newcastle. Pinfest is in Newcastle, yeah. And how far is Newcastle? It's about two hours north of Sydney. Oh, that's a long ways away. Well, let me tell you the story. Okay. So our flight was at 10 past seven on Friday night. The show started Saturday morning. And we gave ourselves a couple of hours to travel to the airport. But as soon as we left, because it's a weekend, the traffic was terrible. It was raining. so we had to rush to get there and we got there with about 20 minutes to spare after we put all our bags checked them in, etc, like flight cases and stuff got to the lounge sitting around, 10 past 7 comes along over the announcement, sorry ladies and gentlemen just letting you know that the co-captain unfortunately has had to go home sick so we are now trying to locate a replacement, we will have an announcement for you shortly fine Hmm. A lot of information. They could have just said delayed. Yeah, sure. 45 minutes later. Ladies and gentlemen, apologies, but unfortunately we are still unable to locate a replacement co-captain. We are still on the hunt, but we will have an announcement for you as soon as we've got new information. Sure. Unrelated, is anybody interested in air travel and would like to learn about the wonderful world of being a pilot? Yes. Please come forward. So 8.30 now comes along. Apologies ladies and gentlemen Unfortunately we've been unable to locate a replacement co-captain And because there's a curfew flying into Newcastle at 10pm Your flight has been cancelled Cancelled not postponed? Cancelled Whoa Cancelled So clearly no flights to Newcastle What airline is this? Wait I'll get to that So clearly no flights for the rest of the night Because you know Newcastle curfew That sucks No flights to Newcastle the next day at all. The nearest city is Sydney. The cheapest flight in the morning to Sydney was $1,200 each one way. Oh. And then I think by about 2 o'clock it went down to $600 each way. So we just went, what the fuck do we do? Do we just not go? So what do you think we did? Obviously I went. Obviously I went. I heard the start of the show. Wait a second. Let me put two and two together. You fucking went. You played Smile Tap. Yeah, obviously. Yep. Okay. How did we get there? How did you get there? That kangaroo you've been talking about. Yep, correct. Put in some favors. Let's go, Roo. Yep. We hired a car and drove through the night, 10 hours, to get there with about an hour to spare. That is crazy. Yep. Have you ever done that drive? Oh, yeah. To Sydney. Well, not to Newcastle Direct, but to Sydney and Melbourne, because I'm originally from Sydney, so I've done the Sydney-Melbourne drive many, many times. So it's a 10-hour drive. I did about, I think, six, six and a half hours of it. I just went and bought four of those giant mother energy drinks and just flew. But we were there at the show until about 11 o'clock on Saturday night, wrecked when we woke up Sunday morning and have just been feeling shit all week. I bet. Totally worth it. But it's one of those things. But then you've got to drive back too. No, no, no, because our flight back was fine. So we just hired a car, dumped it there, and then flew back. Okay. But it was one of those situations like we've just got to go. We've got our gains there. We've got to go. So we did. But I'm tired. That is incredible. Yeah. I've done the 10-hour drives before. I've got another one coming up pretty soon, in fact. if it's scenic it's okay like for me to drive to new york is one of my favorite drives just these catskill mountains that are just gorgeous and you're driving and you're looking at like how just especially this time of year in the fall which it is this time of year for you i know it's spring there but it's it's my favorite season it's gorgeous um and it's it's not long stretch of boring roads i don't know what that drive is like uh to sydney or certainly newcastle and especially at that time of night like i don't know what the wildlife's like uh was it safe is it is it busy yeah no no you wouldn't say it's busy and there was no wildlife it was fine it was fine it's just like you know when you do a 10 hour drive you time it so you'll either drive during the day have a night's rest and then do what you're going to do the next day but it's not often that you drive through the night and then go straight to work for 12 hours or whatever it was Wow. You are a trooper. The things this man does for your pinball enjoyment in Newcastle. You didn't say who the flight was. Oh, okay. So it's from a company that has been hit with a lot of controversy in recent months about flight delays and flight cancellations. It's Qantas. So during the pandemic, they sacked like 2,000 people and they just haven't recruited them back. So they just don't have replacements. They don't have the personnel, a number of them, to be able to run the airline properly. And, I mean, there were other Qantas flights that were all fine. It was just ours that wasn't. But this has been happening a lot. So I wasn't thrilled, but I wasn't surprised. Insert the airline company here, and you're probably going to find the same situation. I know in Canada, Air Canada has had some difficulty at times, a lot of cancellations. I see it in the States quite a bit. So no different there with Qantas in Australia. And that's, I've been on a few planes and so has my wife. And by far, by far, Qantas was our favorite. Yeah, Qantas is great. They're just going through some problems now. And unfortunately, it impacted us. But not enough that we weren't going to go to this event. And it was fantastic. Just got to meet a lot of people. See, obviously, the last show I'd been to was Tazpin. This was a bigger show. and the three sessions and lots of people. And again, just lots of people that I hadn't seen for a while or people that knew me. I know we often tell these stories. So I just feel that someone came up to me and said, love what you and Jeff do on Final Round. So there you go. I walked away. I wasn't fine. I got that. Well, I haven't talked to you since Cleapin. Totally. I totally get that. I met a nice guy, Michael. He was a scorekeeper there. and he went on to tell me that he works at a construction site. So some of the blue language we once in a while choose certainly doesn't offend him, and he gets quite a chuckle. And I said, oh, what would you like? And he said, oh, my God, that Airbnb story you told where Marty was walking in on a couple of people. And I think I joked about Airbnb being what's B&B stand for, what did I say, boobs and balls or something like that? And he's like, I don't even know what that stands for. I think it's bread and breakfast, but he got a kick out of that. That's what it is. It's just meeting good people in the pinball community. It's nice because it reminds you that the toxic stuff that we see in the pinball community, and we're seeing more and more of it these days, it really is the minority. And there probably are some people that are really nice in person that are assholes online. But for the most part, most pinball people are really good people. and they probably just don't engage in all the shitty nastiness that happens in social media. I'm not trying to be funny because years ago I learned I wasn't and I should get the hell out of that kind of career. But I'm not trying to be funny when I say we are generally surprised when we get these kind of reactions. We do this. It's not like we put a lot of effort in it. We do. Do you think I put my best work in at 2.27 in the morning? Probably not. I mean, I can talk to you. Hearing your comedy, it's probably the best. Anyway, so it is surprising when we hear that. When Jason talked about it, the pinball party and the emails we get, it blows me away. I see that no one gives a shit about us, and I'm like, yeah, that's probably about right. And then when we get this feedback in person, it's a wow. But you're right. Most people are generally good people. There are some dickheads out there. And if we're going to highlight people, let's highlight the good people. And you and I have good friends in Scott and Josh from Loser Kid Podcast. And they are going to be doing a wonderful event at Pinball Expo. I think it's 12 hours of streaming, looking after an important charity near and dear to them and to us as well, too, helping out with some awareness for autism and some good things there. So when you're at Expo, please, please, please, please, please go say hi to Scott and Josh. Can you name nicer people in podcasting? Seriously, think about it. First of all, they do a good podcast, right? So you can take that off. But yeah, lovely people, really generous people, but just good folk. You know what I mean? You would just look at them and go, good people. Just not a bad bone in their body, really positive, wanting to make a difference, particularly when it comes to autism with their flipping the script stream. And I think there's going to be auctions they're going to do as well. So they're raising money for a very, very worthwhile cause. So get behind it, everyone. I think pretty much everyone at TPN is behind it, too. They're not even part of TPN, but you recognize these are great guys, and what they're doing is a wonderful cause. And shame on you if you don't realize that, because it's spectacular what they're doing, and I love those guys. Yeah, they're awesome. I mean, think about it. We've had guests on this program before. If we weren't so freaking lazy, we'd do it again, and we will do it again. But every time you go on their show, they're like, what size shirt do you wear? What hat do you wear? Yeah, I know. Whoa, whoa, whoa, stop. You don't have to do that kind of stuff. Yeah. I've been doing six years of Pinball Profile. You get nothing and like it. Or if you do, you've paid for it. I had a good pinball profile this week. I don't know if you heard. No. Fuck, you don't listen to shit. I had the Bragg brothers, Austin and Meredith Bragg, the ones who wrote and directed Pinball, the man who saved the game. So I'm going to Robert Englunds, but when I come back, I'll be headed to the Hamptons to see this film on the big screen the first time it'll be on the big screen with Roger and company and seeing this wonderful story about yes it obviously leads to the courtroom and him playing and making the shot and pinball is now a game of skill and it's it's not banned anymore but it's really the life of him and meeting Ellen and the single mother with Seth and his early struggles and just this nice love story which we always we know what how it ended it's been spectacular really looking forward to this and It was nice to hear those guys chat. So quick plug, Pinball Profile episode 349, a nice way to get you motivated for this. And we hope to see this movie kind of widespread, whether it's some sort of streaming distribution, big screens. It's going to be at a lot of film festivals. So go to pinballfilm.com, and you can sign up for the emails and find out when it's playing near you. I'm really looking forward to it, like genuinely. I mean, obviously I've got an interest in it, And also, you know, we all know about Roger, and I've met him, and he's an awesome guy. I'm keen to know the story beyond going into a courtroom and calling you shot, because that's the only detail I have. And then, obviously, he had two further crappy children, but we don't talk about that. I cut this out of Pinball Profile. I'm like, I mean, this is going to be a success. I know it is, and people are going to want a sequel. So is the next one Pinball, the sons who destroyed the game? Is that? Yes. anyway it's going to be exciting for sure and i'd actually talked to roger quite a bit and it doesn't go on podcasts it's uh you know it's i love the man i love the whole family you know that when they made this movie you know he was worried that people are going to be thinking oh is it just a pinball movie pinball is kind of the backdrop It really the story of him meeting Ellen and the struggles of those times And one thing I kind of related to was back then it wasn't the norm for single moms to be out there and stuff, right? Like I remember it specifically, and I mentioned this, but 1979, my dad's left and I'm nine years old and I got to go to a new school, a new house, and like, where the hell's dad? Oh, he's gone. go to new school and oh you know they're asking about your parents and stuff and where's your dad and i was like oh everyone's got an answer for their dad except me oh he's dead and he wasn't but i was it was easier to say that as a nine-year-old kid than try to explain divorce because new school they're going to label you oh look at this kid and all that stuff anyway so that was that was difficult and then you know i said to roger too i said you know i've been with Ann for 12 years now, but I was married before and had wonderful children with my first wife. And when I met my first wife, she had a four-year-old son that I also fell in love with. And still to this day, he is my stepson. You know, so I kind of, I said to Roger, I go, I've been Seth with a single mom and I've been you where I met a woman who had a child and I can relate to both. So I'm really looking forward to this movie. Sorry to bore everyone, but it does touch my heart. Sorry for getting soft, but it does mean something to me. No, totally understand. But it's that kind of stuff. That side of the story, I'm really keen to know about. So bring it on. Bring it on. Oh, thank you, Ed from Denmark. Gave me a great tip. This is the part of the podcast you want to know. The streak is alive again, my friend. Two weeks, all good. All keeping it up. I'm not talking about keeping certain things up. I'm talking about my fly, for God's sakes. Because I told you my method. I always say iPhone, eyeglasses, computer, keys, watch, wallet. Well, I don't wear a watch anymore. And he goes, and I can't remember a seventh thing. So he said, why don't you replace watch with wiener? And I do. Okay. iPhone, eyeglasses, computer, keys, wiener, wallet. That keeps the fly up. I'm good. Okay. Problem solved. Thanks for the regular fly update. Thanks. Are you that perfect that you have no flaws and can't admit them on a podcast to tens of twenties of people? No, I can actually tell you that right now my fly is down. And I never have my fly down. Yeah, but you were stroking it. You were stroking it talking to me. I've seen the video. We were talking about the Spectre Rocket. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I am perfect. You've got no flaws. None. None whatsoever. I've seen you try to grow your hair out. Yeah. Oh, you made fun of me with my long hair. I've seen you take off the hat once in a while. Yeah, but I wasn't making fun of your hair because it was long. What were you making fun of? I didn't make fun of you. Did you see it? It was fucking great. Was it? I was reminded of that at Cleepin. They're like, oh, where'd your long hair go? I loved it. Made you look like a crazy cat lady. Oh, bullshit. I've seen you take off your hat and I'm like, where's the rest of the handle for that fucking broom? Yeah, I had a hat on. You know, if you had a look at it now, you'd be like, ooh, who's that dapper gentleman? You used to have some good hair. I mean, listen, the longer the hair gets, the more product you need. I'm on the hunt for, like, perfect gel, like, that obviously doesn't have alcohol in it and flake and, you know, that kind of stuff. But it keeps it nice and – I have very, very thick hair. Sorry, everyone. Oh, I'm cursed with it as well. Oh, it is just terrible. Do you know what? I know people hate me for saying that, but it is super thick, and it is a pain in the ass, especially when it's humid and stuff. But you've got to put it down. I know. Who cares? But it's even worse when you've got curly hair. That I'll tell you right now. Are you naturally curly? I am naturally curly. I have ringlet curly hair. You could never do anything with that? Like you couldn't over years straighten it out? Yeah, I have. But, you know. It's just you come out of the shower, and it's like. It's afro. Wow. Yeah. Yep. Yep. So let's get back to pinball if we can. Ah, fuck. All right. I just want to talk about a rumor. All right, Raymond, we'll do it for you, even though the majority of our listeners are like, I like you talking about this. If we're looking at our emails, the ratio of people that talk about pinball versus non-pinball, it's 60-40. We actually had, when there was an episode, I don't know how long ago it was, where it was quite tournament heavy, we had someone write to us saying, oh, it's like a boring tournament talk. It's like, that's kind of what this podcast was meant to be about. So it's just not. Anyway, speaking of not about tournaments. So there's a rumor that I saw on Nap Arcade, and it has been bandied around for a while. And I just want to say, make it. And that is if Jersey Jack does a new Avatar pinball machine. Oh, my. You love Avatar. I fucking love Avatar. Do you love it because of the theme or the play? Theme absolutely draws me in. It was one of the earliest memories I have of pinball bringing me back into playing pinball. I'd had a bit of a break from it for a while, and that's what really got me back in. I like the game. I feel it's not too dissimilar from Iron Man. It obviously doesn't shoot anywhere near as well, but there's some similarities there. Yeah, no, I absolutely love the game. but I understand why people don't love it. But if there's a new one and Jersey Jack make it. Oh, is Steve Ritchie doing it? Oh, my God. They wouldn't do that. I don't know. But I'm really keen to see what Steve Ritchie's going to do with Jersey Jack. And, you know, he had been my favorite designer for many, many, many, many years. And Avatar being one of my favorite movies and favorite themes, those two together with Jersey Jack? I'll always have a soft spot for Steve Ritchie because it's his games that really got me deeper into pinball. Do I think still to this day he makes the best games? It's obviously subjective. For me, I lean towards other designers. I still am looking at two Steve Ritchie games that are new in my home right now. So I like that. I just like, you know, we talked about Gomez. They're unique. They're different. You know, they're different kind of shots. Elwin has changed the game. You mentioned it last episode, how that's really the bar has been set. Borg has great shooting games. There's been a lot of samey things with that. Brian Eddy we were worried about with Stranger Things, but then he came and gave us a great layout with Mandalorian, so I think he's doing some wonderful things. Eric is spectacular at JJP. I've liked everything he's done. Pat Lawler is, I guess, retired. We shall see. I'm very, very curious if this Avatar thing happens. It makes sense with the James Cameron movies coming out. End of this year, I believe. A few years in a row, yeah. Big bucks. Yeah, so apparently there's going to be five movies in the series. The two and three are apparently back-to-back. They've already finished filming three. What's the second one called? Like The Way of Water or something. So apparently there's going to be a lot of underwater sort of filming. I would just love for there to be another Avatar game. I would like there to be one that's really immersive in the game. I thought the Stern game was great, but it was a shooter more than it was a theme-integrated machine, really. Really, I think Star Wars is maybe the last one. Correct me if I'm wrong. With LCD screens, I'm not a huge video mode person, you know, on the dot matrix and things like that. But I thought with LCD, maybe it could be a little better. You have that with Han Solo on Star Wars. am I missing any other video modes or are they just not happening now? Really? Star Wars is it. I really like that whatever it is the warp, whatever it is video mode. Millennium Falcon. Yeah. I think that's a very clever and that's what you've got to do. Keep it simple and that makes it more enjoyable. Obviously it can be a little bit unbalanced when you've got multipliers involved. I know that American incorporate video modes but yeah really haven't seen a lot in they did an october fest houdini had a lot houdini but i don't think i don't think hot wheels did i've no valhalla doesn't maybe we'll see more i just thought you could do more with the lcd are you for or against video modes because it does divide the community i do not mind the star wars one and i'm not a big star wars pinball fan at all i don't mind that one either it doesn't take too long it's challenging it's not a set pattern like the old star trek next generation you know those are the mistakes i look at my fishtails i love playing the fishtails video mode where you're shooting the the guy on the seadoo and the boat and things like that i think that's kind of cool best video mode in pinball that one dracula dracula the wolves yeah sure because i like it because it's just simple it's left right it's flippers but it's just it's a lot of adrenaline that comes with it. It's really quite tense and there's lots of moments like that and they're coming towards you. I think it's just a great video mode. If you've got another video mode that you think is better than that, please email us at finalroundpinball at gmail.com. I have only played it once or twice. I'm trying to think if Toy Story has one. No, I didn't play it long enough to know. See, now that would make sense. Oh, yes, it does. I think it's got a little pinball machine. Yeah, okay. Okay, there you go. Perfect. Which is, eh, I would have thought with Carnival you might have some more shooting ducks or something like that. But maybe they did. Again, forgive me. Don't shoot me down because I really haven't played it much. I haven't had the opportunity to. Want to. When I did shoot it, I loved it. I thought it was pretty cool. I can see why it's popular with a lot of people, but I can't remember the video modes. I thought we'd see more. I'm not asking for, oh, let's go video mode heavy, but the technology's there. When you said Avatar and the way of the water and all this stuff, I thought that might be something that would be good for a video mode. Anyway, I am a fan of video modes. I just wanted to put it out there, everybody. Do you realize that Rick Demme wrote us? He's from California, and he said he loves the show. You guys are hilarious, somewhat knowledgeable about pinball. And, Jeff, you're right. Aussies do sound alike. I remember saying that, but, again, this email is from August, so who the hell knows. I think that was to do with the call-outs in Fathom. which again everybody at pin fest said that it was me in the game i'm like it's not fucking me i think he saw simon wasn't it simon went to district 82 he said it could have easily been marty or ryan i'm like i can i gotta admit i gotta admit before i knew you guys and i listened to head to head until you said it for a while i didn't right away know who was who really well it wasn't until ryan started bitching about the sounds aren't perfect i'm like okay that's a fucking right guy. Yellow scorecards. Yellow scorecards. We make fun of him because he might actually show up. But anyway, what else came in our emails? What else do we have here? Dakota Mike. Hello, gentlemen. You mentioned pins that have aged well. I think Elvira's House of Horrors is another game that fits this category. When it came out, it didn't get a lot of love. I thought it did. You didn't like it. You said it was too easy. I still don't like it. I think it's fantastic. I think this was in part because it was overshadowed by Jurassic Park, which came out a month or two prior. That could be the case. I think the price also had something to do with it, for my opinion. I like Beatles. What did I say I didn't like about it? The price. What's the number one thing I don't like about Elvira? The price. The fill-in-the-blank price, too. Give me a break. And it had unfinished code as well. I've always said the code is good. In fact, the code probably saves Elvira. A couple years later, now Elvira premiums go for well over $11,000. Ellie's over $15,000. Price doesn't dictate a good game, Michael. Let me just point that out, all right? That has nothing to do with it. It helps. It's classic supply and demand with this one. There wasn't that many of them made. Thank you. I've got a good friend, Miles, who I know is listening, and he's been waiting for his Elvira for over two years now. Wow. Okay. Two years. So that has nothing to do with the price. Elvira's got a smooth and forgiving layout. That you could have capitalized. Forgiving layout? Yeah. Which is good for less skilled players. Yeah, sure. No one's denying that. It's got mechs and toys. Sure. Great. Awesome. I'm also proud to say that I got the Tim Hortons question correct. And this is a guy from South Dakota. Even though I'm from South Dakota, I am very familiar with Tim Hortons from my time in the Army. Oh, thank you for your service, Michael. I spent a year in Kandahar in Afghanistan, and the Canadian Force and Stations Air had a large compound, which had a gym, a hair salon, barber, and amazingly, a Tim Hortons. That's the only way they can get us to join the army. Come on, of course. Occasionally we'd get to go over to the Canadian compound and buy Tim Hortons donuts and coffee. It tasted better than anything else we had over there. Take that, Dunkin' Donuts. FYI, the Australian compound was very nice too, but they were obsessed with butt plugs. Sincerely, Michael. Actually, he didn't say that. Oh, didn't he? I just added that. Yes, correct. He said they had the best bathrooms. Somewhat related. What the hell does that have to do? Best bathrooms? Yeah, you know. Hmm. Are you known for that? I don't know. Maybe we're known for good hygiene. Thanks for emailing us. FinalRoundPinball at gmail.com. It's the only thing I know. I know we're on Facebook. That's easy. Search it. We're on Twitter, FinalRoundPin. We are FinalRoundPinballPodcast on Instagram. When we do the show, it's probably the same for every podcast. They upload it, and then Zach or Dennis Griesel then upload it, and then takes a little while before it goes to our direct feeds. You get it on the TPN one right away, and then for whatever reason, it takes a little longer, but they'll eventually get there. Like, subscribe, do all those kind of things. Send us money. Nah, fuck the money. We don't need the money. Send your money to Flippin' the Script. Ah, good idea. Yes, that's at Pinball Expo for sure. That's going to be a lot of fun coming up. Third weekend in October. Yeah, good idea. All right, I got to get to Robert Englunds. You got to get to bed and then to Robert Englunds. Well, it's going to be fun. UK Open. It's going to be streamed. Neil McRae will be streaming it, so drop by, say hello. No doubt they'll get you on stream commentating. I only do it when I'm asked. Yeah. As I said, no doubt they will get you on stream commentating. I was at Cleepin. I was kind of asked, but I liked the person that was on there. I didn't want them to get off air because it's somebody that doesn't get a lot of time on air, and I really like him. He's a good volunteer and helped out a lot with the Cleepin tournament. I thought you've heard enough of me hear more about this guy because he's an interesting guy so you know if there's a spot sure I mean I know I'll do some of the other things you know Freeplay Florida and Indisc for sure those are all good. UK Open I'll say hi once in a while. Yeah cool. Just so you know I'm there. Awesome. Although again maybe I'll be playing in the finals Marty you never know. Alright we will definitely be seeing you on the stream then commentating just to clarify. Yeah I know I know. Awesome. Alright I gotta go to bed. Thanks everybody for listening. We will see you again soon. It is super thick. You gave it to me and it is a pain in the ass.

_(Acquisition: groq_whisper, Enrichment: v3)_

---

*Exported from Journalist Tool on 2026-04-13 | Item ID: 82864abd-8dcd-4727-a0b1-5242fa6df52c*