# Quick Alice thoughts

**Source:** Don's Pinball Podcast (patreon feed)  
**Type:** podcast_episode  
**Published:** 2024-10-07  
**Duration:** 8m 6s  
**Beat:** Pinball

**URL:** https://www.patreon.com/posts/quick-alice-113552946

---

## Analysis

Don reflects on Dutch Pinball's Alice's Adventures in Wonderland reveal, declining to purchase due to the $13,000 price, 10-year development cycle, and design he feels is dated (originally designed in the 1990s). He praises Dutch Pinball's build quality, analyzes the artwork as potentially controversial for US audiences, dissects the sculpts and playfield layout, and speculates about the game's desirability and secondary market potential.

### Key Claims

- [HIGH] Dutch Pinball took 10 years to release their last game before Alice — _Don discussing Alice reveal, referencing company's development timeline_
- [MEDIUM] Only 300 units of Alice's Adventures in Wonderland are coming to the US — _Don stating availability constraint during initial impressions_
- [HIGH] Alice was designed in the 1990s (original design from back then) — _Don analyzing game's visual design and layout philosophy_
- [HIGH] Dutch Pinball Big Lebowski had exceptional cabinet build quality comparable to CGC-level furniture craftsmanship — _Don referencing his personal experience owning a Big Lebowski machine_
- [MEDIUM] Big Lebowski delays were due to legal/licensing issues, not production problems — _Don speculating on reasons for Big Lebowski delays during Alice analysis_
- [MEDIUM] Artwork was initially done by Zombietti (Zombie Yeti) with payment/credit issues — _Don mentioning art credit controversies without detailed engagement_
- [MEDIUM] A fully dressed Lior sculpt package costs $1500-$1600 — _Don discussing aftermarket customization pricing for similar games_
- [MEDIUM] Alice's Adventures in Wonderland uses magnet flippers similar to Twilight Zone — _Don analyzing playfield layout and flipper mechanics from reveal_
- [LOW] Jersey Jack's team that worked on Magic Girl may be involved with Alice project under DPX label — _Don speculating about team composition and partnership structure_
- [MEDIUM] DPX (Dutch Pinball Exclusives) is a separate boutique side-label venture from Dutch Pinball — _Don theorizing about business structure and 500-unit production target for the label_

### Notable Quotes

> "Hard to justify this purchase without seeing a reveal. And for a game like this, and if it's popular, you need to right this hour be putting down a $1500 deposit from a company that took 10 years to release their last game."
> — **Don**, early
> _Core justification for declining to purchase Alice despite its desirability_

> "For me myself, it looks like a game designed in the 90s, because it was."
> — **Don**, mid
> _Key criticism of game's design philosophy and visual approach_

> "I had a Big Lebowski, it was phenomenal, man... CGC level I would put it directly at that as far as like cabinet build quality of a piece of furniture and just like art of wood it's fantastic"
> — **Don**, mid
> _Establishes Don's high regard for Dutch Pinball's manufacturing quality standards_

> "I've noticed a trend in the US with comic books and with comic art and the depiction of females as scantily clad has really been kind of in a bit of recession now... seems like a bit more racy than I would expect for a pinball machine."
> — **Don**, mid
> _Identifies emerging US cultural shift away from sexualized artwork, contrasts with European standards_

> "I love that idea of having kind of like a smaller boutique label put these things out there keeping the numbers low we keep it special This isn't a game that's going to be everywhere"
> — **Don**, late-mid
> _Endorsement of DPX's limited-edition business model and scarcity strategy_

> "I'm glad that I'm not 100% in on it because I need the money, man."
> — **Don**, late
> _Personal financial reasoning for passing on the $13,000 purchase_

> "It's not the game for me and that's okay. Not every game has to be for me."
> — **Don**, closing
> _Philosophical stance on collector positioning and selective purchasing_

### Entities

| Name | Type | Context |
|------|------|---------|
| Don | person | Host of Don's Pinball Podcast, collector, industry commentator providing detailed analysis of Alice's Adventures in Wonderland reveal |
| Alice's Adventures in Wonderland | game | Dutch Pinball limited-edition game (500 units, 300 to US) just revealed, priced at $13,000, featuring Zombie Yeti artwork and sculpted playfield elements |
| Dutch Pinball | company | Netherlands-based boutique pinball manufacturer known for Big Lebowski and Back to the Future; took 10 years between releases before Alice |
| DPX | organization | Dutch Pinball Exclusives, speculated separate boutique sub-label operating Alice's Adventures in Wonderland as a limited 500-unit side project |
| Jersey Jack Pinball | company | Competitor mentioned as team source for possible Alice collaboration; known for Magic Girl development |
| Big Lebowski | game | Prior Dutch Pinball release that Don owned; praised for exceptional cabinet build quality and experienced development delays due to licensing |
| Magic Girl | game | Jersey Jack Pinball game mentioned as reference point for intensive development approach paralleling Alice project |
| Zombie Yeti | person | Artist credited with initial artwork for Alice's Adventures in Wonderland; subject of payment/credit controversy |
| Lior | person | Aftermarket sculpt creator; fully dressed packages cost $1500-$1600, referenced as alternative customization vs. fully-sculpted Alice |
| Twilight Zone | game | Referenced as predecessor for magnet flipper technology used in Alice's Adventures in Wonderland |
| WWE | game | Referenced pinball machine with magnet flippers that Don notes lack precision/accuracy in gameplay |
| Elvira | game | Referenced as example of pinball game with sexualized artwork that Don uses for comparison to Alice's art style and household display concerns |
| Avatar | game | Referenced for McFarlane sculpt toy with motion mechanics (kung-fu grip action) similar to Alice's Jabberwocky sculpt |
| Tarzan | game | Referenced for motion mechanics paralleling Avatar mech and Alice's Jabberwocky moving sculpt |
| Pinball Expo | event | Upcoming event where Don expects to play Alice's Adventures in Wonderland and provide full gameplay analysis |

### Topics

- **Primary:** Alice's Adventures in Wonderland reveal and initial impressions, Dutch Pinball business practices, development timelines, and manufacturing quality, Pricing and value proposition for limited-edition boutique pinball machines, Game design philosophy and aesthetic choices (1990s design sensibility)
- **Secondary:** Artwork and artistic presentation, cultural shifts in sexualized depictions, Playfield sculpts and aftermarket customization options, Playfield mechanics and flipper technology (magnet flippers), Secondary market speculation and collector FOMO dynamics

### Sentiment

**Mixed** (0.55) — Don expresses genuine appreciation for Dutch Pinball's craftsmanship, finds the game's design interesting but dated, and appreciates its existence as a limited boutique release. However, he declines purchase due to price, company risk profile, and personal financial constraints. Skepticism about design philosophy balances enthusiasm for manufacturing quality. Supportive tone toward buyers while remaining personally detached.

### Signals

- **[product_concern]** Don critiques Alice's design as feeling like a game designed in the 1990s, suggesting the playfield and shot layout approach feels nostalgic rather than contemporary. (confidence: high) — For me myself, it looks like a game designed in the 90s, because it was.
- **[market_signal]** 300 units allocated to US market creates constrained supply; Don speculates secondary market could see $4,000+ mark-ups if game proves highly desirable. (confidence: high) — Only 300 of them coming to the US... maybe I'm misreading it, and this is gonna be so highly desirable that people are gonna be flipping their deposits for $4,000
- **[business_signal]** Dutch Pinball's 10-year cycle between releases (Big Lebowski to Alice) presents financial and delivery risk for pre-order customers putting down $1,500 deposits. (confidence: high) — Hard to justify this purchase without seeing a reveal... a company that took 10 years to release their last game. So, a bit of a risk.
- **[sentiment_shift]** Emerging US cultural trend away from sexualized female depictions in art; Don notes Alice's artwork will trigger household display concerns similar to Elvira but with stronger contemporary pushback. (confidence: medium) — I've noticed a trend in the US with comic books... the depiction of females as scantily clad has really been kind of in a bit of recession... I've already seen some comments regarding that little pushback
- **[design_innovation]** Alice features comprehensive sculpting across entire playfield rather than mixed plastic/sculpt approach, with Jabberwocky as moving mechanical element with action mechanics. (confidence: high) — Everything is sculpted. Every top of where there would be a plastic looks sculpted... Jabberwocky's doing the same thing [motion mechanics like Avatar/Tarzan]
- **[product_strategy]** DPX appears to operate as Dutch Pinball's separate boutique line with lower production targets (500 units) to maintain scarcity and exclusivity while insulating parent company from risk. (confidence: medium) — Dutch maybe being a little trepidatious... started this new side business project... we shoot for 500 just so we can sell it out... release it under the DPX label
- **[regulatory_signal]** Big Lebowski delays attributed to international court process for license securing rather than production issues; suggests legal/licensing matters resolved before Alice launch. (confidence: medium) — I think a lot of the issues with the delays with Big Lebowski wasn't due to production issues, but it was due to the legal issues because like the license wasn't fully secured and had to go through an entire international court process
- **[gameplay_signal]** Alice implements magnet flippers (from Twilight Zone) rather than traditional flipper mechs; Don notes uncertainty about playability and control precision based on WWE experience. (confidence: medium) — This has the magnet thing from Twilight Zone... I know it is a frustrating part of WWE because there is a complete lack of any accuracy
- **[collector_signal]** Don's decision to pass on Alice despite acknowledging its quality reflects collector strategy of preserving capital and avoiding perceived overpriced boutique releases. (confidence: high) — I'm glad that I'm not 100% in on it because I need the money, man.
- **[manufacturing_signal]** Don rates Dutch Pinball's cabinet construction and wood finishing at CGC (collectible grading) levels, confirming premium craftsmanship justifies high base pricing. (confidence: high) — taking that Lebowski apart... the build of the cabinet is obscenely awesome like CGC level... cabinet build quality of a piece of furniture
- **[event_signal]** Pinball Expo will be first hands-on gameplay opportunity for Don; indicates game still in pre-release phase at reveal event. (confidence: high) — We'll get to play this at Expo. I'm excited for that.
- **[content_signal]** Don recording quick first-impression segment before full podcast breakdown; indicates Alice reveal will generate follow-up long-form content analysis. (confidence: high) — I'll do a full podcast, break it down, kind of everything.

---

## Transcript

Hey, just real quick fam, pin fam, what's going on? I just watched the reveal, still going on, carry hardest things, had some quick impressions now that we've seen and can talk about Alice's Adventures in Wonderland from Dutch Pinball. What am I thinking? Don, are you getting one? Well, first off, well, no. And that was my position earlier. Hard to justify this purchase without seeing a reveal. And for a game like this, and if it's popular, you need to right this hour be putting down a $1500 deposit from a company that took 10 years to release their last game. So, a bit of a risk. With only 300 of them coming to the US though, I mean, you know, it's not like it's an open edition or there's gonna be 5000 of them or something. So, if you're getting one and you're happy about it, I'm happy for you dude. That's totally cool. For me myself, it looks like a game designed in the 90s, because it was. You know, I have to dissect all the shots and everything, but I've seen the art, I've seen the cabinets, I've seen the layouts, we kind of had an idea what the layout was going to be before. I will say this, regarding the price of this thing, this is a Dutch Pinball machine, and they've got great build quality. I had a Big Lebowski, it was phenomenal, man. I'm a little man had that lower playfield with the bowling alley like it was something special so the cabinet quality is probably gonna be top shelf because my god taking that Lebowski apart like taking the glass off lifting the playfield and looking at like the build of the cabinet is obscenely awesome like CGC level I would put it directly at that as far as like cabinet build quality of a piece of furniture and just like art of wood it's fantastic so if you were to take a Dutch Pinball machine and then if you were to go out and purchase I think that price is on point from that perspective. Now what if you just wanted to get the game way too much. Too much too much. So, I don't know. Maybe this is gonna, maybe I'm misreading it, and this is gonna be so highly desirable that people are gonna be flipping their deposits for $4,000 here in the next three months. I don't know. If so, fantastic. Art wise, man, I don't know. Like, I'm definitely not a prude or anything. I mean, I enjoy my Elviras. I enjoy boobs as much as the next guy. But, um, and this may be, you know, kind of a European perspective. But I've noticed a trend in the US with comic books and with comic art and the depiction of females as scantily clad has really been kind of in a bit of recession now. And I guess I haven't realized that as much, but like when I see it, I'm all of a sudden struck like, oh, seems like a bit more racy than I would expect for a pinball machine. And I'm like, what the hell is wrong with me? I'm a prude all of a sudden, right? But I think people are legitimately going to see this and be like, there's absolutely no way I can bring that into my house. Now I'm not at that point. You know, if I happen to cross one of these in a trade or something, I wouldn't have a problem bringing it home. You know, I've got a home full of women, you know, even most of my dogs are women, but most of my women are not dogs. Not making that comparison. No, they're, they're great. They're fantastic. But you know, we enjoy Elvira and stuff, but sometimes when we have people over, my wife I'm not sure if we'll kind of maybe hide the back glass in Elvira a little bit if they're a little, you know, more kind of conservative. So I could see this maybe causing, causing the same kind of issues. I've already seen some comments regarding that little pushback, you know, regarding how racy the art is. Now, this doesn't take into account that if, was this art, who did this art? I know Zombietti did it initially and then maybe it wasn't paid for it and then did they take it without crediting him. I'm not getting into any of that. I'm sure we'll hear a full expose from people that are angry about it. I don't really have a dog in that fight. Art I think it looks cool. I mean with the red powder coat the RGB lighting and the armor I wish that the armor would come down just enough to cover the buttons though because like I hate the idea of grubby fingers on the art print I love having you know either lollipop rails or you know curved metal rails or laser cut rails that come down and protect the buttons I dig that because I like that feel of that powder coat. I don't want to feel like my greasy nacho hands are just like scuffing up and getting body oils all over my art on the side there. I'm just me, you know, but for 13,000, we shouldn't be, you know, adding extra things to it or anything. The sculpts look like out of control. Everything is sculpted. Every top of where there would be a plastic looks sculpted. It looks like there's a whole sculpt in the back with the brickwork around the Jabberwock there. And isn't it funny that we're having another toy with like a kung-fu grip action? We just saw that with the McFarlane sculpt in Avatar where that mech raises his hand, and like the Tarzan motion, right? And now like Jabberwocky's doing the same thing. All right, let's get the next video here. Let me just get forward. There we go. All right, we're not gonna listen to that anymore. It's just funny. So like if I bought this game and it was just, you know, normal plastics and stuff, maybe I'd pick up a couple of Lior sculpts, but I don't know if I would dress the whole game. This game comes fully dressed, so if that's something you were into, you know, a fully dressed sculpt package from Lior can be like $1500–$1600, right? So if the game was 10 base and you put that in there and got a couple of stumbler mods in the topper, there you go. There you go, man. Um, you know, I think the edition size makes sense. You know, to me, this was a guy that's really hard on for Jay Popaduk's work with all the work that they put into Magic Girl. I think this is the same team. And so it seems like they approached Dutch Pinball and they're like, we need to do this next. And Dutch maybe being a little trepidatious is like or you know not willing to let a partner into the official business started this new side business project and was like you know there some room across the street open up over there we help you we we shoot for 500 just so we can sell it out and then you move on to something else and we release it under the DPX label. I love that idea of having kind of like a smaller boutique label put these things out there keeping the numbers low we keep it special. This isn't a game that's going to be everywhere, but time will tell. You know, hopefully this game will be out within a year. I think they got everything sorted. I think a lot of the issues with the delays with Big Lebowski wasn't due to production issues, but it was due to the legal issues because like the license wasn't fully secured and had to go through an entire international court process. Alright, so they seem to be cranking games out now. I'm glad there's another game that's out there. And I'm glad that I'm not 100% in on it because I need the money, man. I need the money to keep going. So those are some initial impressions. We haven't seen any gameplay yet. I'm at work so it's hard for me to follow along. I don't know if like that's already dropped on the Dutch side. I guess we'll find out. But I want to jump on and just give some first impressions. Shots and layout, there's some things that I like. The shot through the pops to the right orbit to that plastic ramp looks nice. I want to shoot that. I don't know how the magnet flippers will feel. I'll just have to play that to see. I know it is a frustrating part of WWE because there is a complete lack of any accuracy. And when you're wrestling in a ring, it kind of makes sense for that game, you know? And then when you do put the ball in and pin your opponent, it like really feels like something special because it's not something you can just trap up and then hit every time. And that had controllable slings. This has the magnet thing from Twilight Zone. So I'll have to see how it plays. I'm sure they've play tested it and it's probably just fine. We'll get to play this at Expo. I'm excited for that. I'm excited for you. I'm just excited in general to be doing something besides just work. Let me put this out there real quick and then we'll see what happens with the rest of the release. And then I'll do a full podcast, break it down, kind of everything. But those are my thoughts. Are you getting one? Congrats, man. Super happy for you. Please invite me over to come play it. I hope you think it's awesome. I think it looks great. I think the art, you know, it works for what it is. Layout works for what it is. I, it's not the game for me and that's okay. Not every game has to be for me. More to come as it comes. Later everybody.

_(Acquisition: groq_whisper, Enrichment: v3)_

---

*Exported from Journalist Tool on 2026-04-13 | Item ID: bafb660d-2a3d-4ebc-9c3a-89d2e23cbf0d*