# Episode 71: Avengers, History Lesson, and Beer Tasting! **Source:** Poor Man's Pinball Podcast **Type:** podcast_episode **Published:** 2020-09-09 **Beat:** Pinball **URL:** https://poormanspinballpodcast.libsyn.com/episode-71-avengers-history-lesson-and-beer-tasting --- ## Analysis Poor Man's Pinball Podcast Episode 71 covers the recently released Stern Avengers pinball machine, discusses community news including the Canadian Pinball Podcast drama, reviews Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pinball, and conducts an Oktoberfest beer tasting. The hosts discuss Avengers pricing, design team, artwork, and playfield aesthetics while maintaining their signature irreverent style with technical difficulties, community shout-outs, and sponsor promotions. ### Key Claims - [HIGH] Stern increased prices by $100 at the beginning of this year (January) and will do so again at the beginning of next year for all their games — _Host states this as confirmation regarding Avengers pricing strategy_ - [MEDIUM] Premium Avengers buyers will not receive their games until almost November — _Host mentions learning this information today regarding backlog_ - [HIGH] Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pinball is not recommended for beginners or casual home players — _Drew explicitly states 'I can't recommend it' for casual players buying as only game_ - [HIGH] Keith Elwin designed Avengers with Raymond Davidson as rules support — _Official credits listed by hosts_ - [MEDIUM] Avengers has yellow coloring on certain body panels that the hosts find visually problematic — _Drew (paint specialist) criticizes the yellow as 'too light' and prone to bleeding with flake finishes_ ### Notable Quotes > "It's basically just next year's increase. So nobody freak out yet. Have another $100." > — **Host (discussing Stern pricing strategy)**, N/A > _Casual normalization of continuous price increases in the industry_ > "I like to say I'm the worst good player in the world." > — **Drew (discussing his competitive level)**, N/A > _Self-assessment of skill relative to elite players_ > "I think the best compliment I can give Jeremy Packer is the only Marvel art I've ever seen that I personally like better is Todd McFarlane." > — **Drew (praising Avengers artwork)**, N/A > _High praise for artwork quality compared to historical Marvel art standards_ > "This game is not for beginners. Hard. It's tough. It's brutal. I like it." > — **Drew (reviewing TMNT pinball)**, N/A > _Characterization of TMNT as difficult but rewarding for experienced players_ > "The whole thing. Don't do your podcast. We have things to do today." > — **Host impersonating company president (satirical skit about Canadian Pinball Podcast situation)**, N/A > _Humorous commentary on alleged dismissal of podcaster concerns by employer_ ### Entities | Name | Type | Context | |------|------|---------| | Keith Elwin | person | Game designer for Stern Avengers pinball machine | | Raymond Davidson | person | Rules design support for Stern Avengers | | Rick Nagel | person | Lead software programmer for Stern Avengers | | Jerry Thompson | person | Lead sound designer for Stern Avengers | | Ken Hale | person | Music composer for Stern Avengers | | Jeremy Packer | person | Artwork artist for Stern Avengers (Zombie Yeti attribution) | | Harrison Drake | person | Lead mechanical engineer for Stern Avengers | | Chuck Ernst | person | Computer graphics art director for Stern Avengers | | Chris Canada | person | Host of Canadian Pinball Podcast; works in marketing in New York; subject of workplace controversy discussed satirically | | Stern Pinball | company | Manufacturer of Avengers pinball machine; announced price increase strategy | | Avengers (Stern) | game | Recently released Marvel-themed pinball machine; Pro/Premium/Limited Edition tiers; $100 price increase; yellow body panel coloring criticized | | Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (pinball) | game | Reviewed as difficult, not beginner-friendly; strong theme and gameplay but punishing for casual players | | Pinside | organization | Major online pinball community forum and marketplace mentioned as sponsor/reference | | This Week in Pinball | organization | Pinball news and analysis website; sponsor of show; credited for detailed Avengers coverage | | Poor Man's Pinball Podcast | organization | The podcast itself; described as 'number one live pinball show for four weeks running' | | Canadian Pinball Podcast | organization | Chris Canada's podcast; referenced in satirical skit about workplace controversy | | Drew | person | Co-host of Poor Man's Pinball Podcast; paint specialist; reviews games and artwork | | Ian | person | Co-host of Poor Man's Pinball Podcast; celebrated birthday during episode (39 years old); 18-year partnership with Drew | | Glenn Wechter | person | Tribe member number seven; creates intro music for Poor Man's Pinball Podcast; sent gift stein | | Kathleen | person | Drew's wife; sent custom glasses gift to show | | Rachel | person | Diehard listener; organizing Ladies Flip Wisconsin tournament October 3rd | | Zach Sharpe | person | Competing podcast host/operator; currently ranked #1 on Pinball Promoters Database; also received scam T-Rex dinosaur | | Todd McFarlane | person | Comic book artist; referenced as having superior Marvel artwork compared to current game art styles | ### Topics - **Primary:** Stern Avengers pinball machine release and reception, Pinball game pricing and manufacturer pricing strategy - **Secondary:** Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pinball difficulty and player accessibility, Pinball artwork and visual design aesthetics, Podcast community drama and interpersonal conflicts, Tournament and competitive pinball events - **Mentioned:** Online scams and counterfeit merchandise ### Sentiment **Mixed** (0.55) — Positive toward Avengers artwork (compared favorably to Todd McFarlane), negative toward yellow body panel color choices, resigned acceptance of price increases, critical of TMNT difficulty for casual players, satirical/irreverent tone regarding Canadian Pinball Podcast drama with underlying affection for Chris Canada, generally celebratory of community engagement and listener support. ### Signals - **[product_launch]** Stern Avengers pinball officially released with Pro, Premium, and Limited Edition tiers; represents major new title announcement in active market (confidence: high) — Hosts discuss game details, pricing, design credits, and first impressions with visual materials; described as 'just dropped' - **[product_strategy]** Stern implemented $100 price increase in January 2024 and plans to repeat increase at beginning of 2025 for all game lines (confidence: high) — Host states 'they increased prices to $100 at the beginning of this year in January. Now people are like, well, they did it again... And then at the beginning of next year, they're going to have the same $100 increase for all their games.' - **[supply_chain_signal]** Stern experiencing significant production backlog; Premium tier Avengers pre-orders not expected to ship until almost November (confidence: medium) — Host mentions 'premium people are not going to be getting their games until, some of them until almost November' and notes Stern 'literally have more work right now than they can handle' - **[design_innovation]** Avengers artwork by Zombie Yeti (Jeremy Packer) receives high praise for Marvel aesthetic; compared favorably to Todd McFarlane (confidence: medium) — Drew states: 'the best compliment I can give Jeremy Packer is the only Marvel art I've ever seen that I personally like better is Todd McFarlane. That's huge high praise' - **[product_concern]** Yellow body panel color on Avengers criticized for being too light and prone to flake bleed; purple alternative color scheme suggested as superior (confidence: medium) — Drew (paint specialist): 'I think it's terrible. I think it's too much... It's too light... not as crisp when you have a lighter color with the fleck... purple armor will probably be the better out of the two' - **[gameplay_signal]** TMNT pinball characterized as difficult and not suitable for beginner/casual home players despite strong theme appeal (confidence: high) — Drew: 'this game is not for beginners. Hard. It's tough. It's brutal... If this is your only pin and you're casual players and you're buying it for your rec room, I can't recommend it' - **[content_signal]** Poor Man's Pinball Podcast was ranked #1 on Pinball Promoters Database for first 3-4 months; recently displaced by Zach Sharpe's podcast due to community review campaign (confidence: high) — Host states: 'we were up top for the first three or four months... Zach and Dennis now are number one in the ratings because they had a silly giveaway' - **[industry_signal]** Canadian Pinball Podcast host Chris Canada faced workplace pressure regarding podcast content and allegedly disparaging comments; situation resolved but creator status remains ambiguous (confidence: low) — Hosts present satirical skit about alleged meeting where employer dismissed podcast concerns; later confirm Canada is back but unclear on full circumstances - **[collector_signal]** Social media scam marketing counterfeit Jurassic Park T-Rex figurines as officially licensed 3-foot collectibles; multiple victims (Drew, Zach) received tiny (~3 inch) cheap versions for $60 instead of $600 legitimate product (confidence: high) — Drew received package from Hong Kong with counterfeit item; Zach also received identical scam version; Franchi confirmed knowledge of scam operation targeting pinball community - **[community_signal]** Ladies Flip Wisconsin tournament announced for October 3rd, 2024 at Private Collector venue in Milwaukee; 13-round match play, 20-person limit, $40 entry fee, organized by listener Rachel (confidence: high) — Hosts promote specific event details: 'October 3rd, 2020, at 11 a.m. It'll be hosted by Private Collector in Milwaukee, Wisconsin... 13-round match play. Limit 20 ladies. Fee is $40' - **[market_signal]** Community acceptance of continuous $100 annual price increases; hosts normalize costs as trivial relative to market expectations (confidence: medium) — Host response to $100 increase: 'Like we were just talking, what's $100 in pinball? Nothing. They know that, and that's why they do it.' --- ## Transcript This episode of the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast live broadcast is brought to you by Pinshades. Go to Pinside, talk to our friend Jackton, tell him the Poor Man sent you. You can get some awesome Pinshades. Just enter Poor Man's at checkout for 10% off your order. I should wear mine. Hold on. Oh, we can see him today. Go to pinballprices.com or friend Doc Finley. All it took was a bottle of booze, but hey, Doc Finley has this great site. You're looking to buy or sell a machine, go to pinballprices.com. We also have Jeff Patterson's This Week in Pinball, the foremost, utmost, awesomest pinball site with all the news in one place. It's where all of us podcasters steal all of our news, and we bring it to the masses. 100% of it has been stolen this week from Jeff. We actually just email him now. Hey, what are we talking about? Jeff, we appreciate all the work you put in, because we get to put in less work and drink while we do this. Thank you, Jeff. Thank you, Jeff. Go to This Week in Pinball. And don't forget, on This Week in Pinball, also, go to the Pinball Promoters Database. Give us a review. This week, Zach and Dennis now are number one in the ratings because they had a silly giveaway and they had people give a bunch of reviews. I think we can do better. So I want all you guys to go to Pinball Promoters Database on the TWiP website. Give the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast a review, good, bad, or otherwise. Get us back to the top where we belong. We got knocked off, huh? We did. I know. I didn't look at it, but Zach apparently is number one now. He was gloating a little bit. He didn't mention us. But, Zach, we're coming back for you. We were up top for the first three or four months. I just want to add, Zach. So we're coming for you. Speaking of Zach, don't forget, go to Flip N Out Pinball. You want a new pinball machine, he's got it. You want used inventory, he's got some of that. Escalier, he's got toppers. Do you know this guy loves toppers? Flip N Out Pinball has lots of toppers for sale. They might be expensive, but they are awesome. So go to Flip N Out Pinball, buy yourself a topper or a new game. And last, but certainly not least, we have PinStadium Lights. I was talking to Scott last night. Do you know what I did? You bought PinStadium Lights. I was going to save this for 4 Man's Pinball News, but this is perfect because we're doing the promos. I love it. PinStadium Lights. I'm texting with Scott, and I'm asking about the new state-of-the-art, top-of-the-line Neo Fusions. The bad boys. With the turtles? Yeah, it's got everything. It's got the flashers. It's got Orion's Belt. It's got the PinStadiums. It's got the InvisiShield. It's got other stuff. I don't even know what the words mean. But it's got it all. Go to PinStadium Lights. Check it out. Use the code POORMAN. No S on this one. POORMAN at checkout for 10% off your order. Save yourself the shipping cost. Get some accessories. Go to PinStadium Lights today. Got an upset tummy, otherwise known as a burning, itchy butthole? Well, whenever I get done drinking a bottle of hot sauce or lick in the side of a butter can in the basement of some seedy Milwaukee bar, I always turn to the one and only cure that I know is going to help me get through such troubled times. The Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. Seedy? Yeah. You're saying seedy? Yeah, look at these glasses. These aren't seedy. Pinshades.com. Pinshades. I don't even see our lighting. Everything is glare-free. I'm feeling good. I feel like I look good. Can you track my balls with those things? They're not moving. Joke's on you. They were moving. We're already starting off strong. Well, welcome, episode 71. Welcome to the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast, episode number 71. The number one live pinball show for four weeks running. Yeah, there we go. Any other pinball show live? I doubt it. No, that's a joke. I know, I get it. But I think it's cool that we're the only one. We're at the top of the ratings chart. That's what they say. That's what, who's they? Us. It's always they, who's they? Us. Oh, man. So, what are we talking about today, Ian? I did the awesome intro, so now you can tell our lovely folks what we're doing today. Well, today we're going to talk Avengers, because that just dropped, right? And then we are going to talk about History Lesson. We got some mail. Wait, wait, wait. Say Avengers again, and then look at my pants. Avengers. Oh, there they go. They're bouncing. Is that a Newton? Yeah, that's a couple of Newton balls in my pants. That's a Newton ball. I haven't seen one. Yeah, so we've got Avengers to talk about. We have a history lesson. Oh, we have our Oktoberfest beer tasting. We're going to do a fantastic beer tasting. So much. This could be a five-hour long. We don't know. We're going to try to get it as quickly as possible. But let's do this. Let's get into it right now. A lot of cover. Lots of cover. So, Drew, what are you drinking? Same thing as last week. This is so good. We'll do it again. My Vanna White. This is Amador. Amador. Yep. All right. The Chardonnay Wine Barrel. Perfect. Perfect. And I'm doing the Jim Beam Honey. Just doing it straight today, kids. Anything worth doing is worth doing straight. Wait. Booze-wise. That's offensive. Booze-wise. All right. Oh, fuck you. All right. What do we got? What are we going to start with? Do you want to start with our gift openings? Yes. We have a few gift openings. Yeah. Let's do this. We were going to save this for a mailbag, but we thought, you know what? How great is this? Why don't you start? Because I got a real special one for us. You got a special one. All right. They're all special, but this one touches my heart in a way that I love it. No, it's all good. It's all good. We have. Let me reach under here. This is where I keep all Glenn's stuff. Yeah, Glenn. Your stuff is special, too. Oh. Wow. What do you got here? We got a Glenn Glenn Waechter. It's a Glenn Glenn Waechter special here. Glenn Waechter, tribe member number seven, sent us this. I kind of know what it is already. But I was like, fuck it, let's open it up. I have my safety glasses on. See, kids? You know? And then we have our letter opener here. And you see? Go talk to Joplin. These glasses are used for literally everything. That's it. Pinball, safety glasses, ball looking at stuff. um so the these gifts are super awesome we have literally gotten what 12 packages since we started this we've been doing this for about 18 months now and like every other month somebody sends us a package of good stuff so i'm pretty excited about this one because this is glenn uh skateboarder glenn number seven does our intro music and what is it it is a stein from music city pinball Oh, he's got all sorts of cool stuff here. Hold on. Let's see if we can get a good shot of this. So there's a little bit of a glare, but we got, what is that, Music City Pinball. We have Super Arcade and Bar, Game Terminal, Tilt Amusements, stickers here. No Quarter Pinball and Pints, reflective sticker there. How cool is that? And then we have another Tilt sticker right here. So, without further ado, let's replace the beer mug, generic mug, with Glenn's super awesome Poor Man's Pinball Show mug. See what I did there, Franchi? I got too much shit in this mug. All right. That's done. We're going to call that good. This is our new official mug of the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. There we go. Boom. All right. I like the glittery one. There. Just like that. That's beautiful. Oh, Pete. I almost knocked Pete over. You know, Ian and I were talking. We're going to rearrange this and make this really nice for you guys to see. I thought it was nice. It is. It is nice-ish. You know, we're still working out the kinks, as always. Glenn, thank you very much. SilverBallSwag.com. SilverBallSwag. Buy our shit. Go right back right here. Shameless plug. We need a shameless plug button. Block it. That'd be the whole show. It's called Go Live. Stephen Silver, make a shameless plug button. It'll be on all the time. Oh, yeah. That is too funny. All right. So, Glenn, thank you so much once again. Are you ready for what I got today? I'm ready, buddy. Okay. Let's do it. So my wife, last week, and I forgot this because I'm a dumbass, she bought this. She goes, I got a gift for you and Ian. And I honestly don't know what it is. It's been sitting at my house now for a week. I brought it. I said, what is that gift for? And she's like, I can't even remember. She goes, Ian's birthday was, what, two weeks ago? August 26th. I'm 39 years young. Happy birthday, Ian. Thank you so much. So Ian's birthday, and this also commemorates, we're not sure of the exact date because Ian and I are Ian and I, but Ian and I just celebrated at some point this year, don't know when, 18 years of being together. Yeah. It's official. Yep. Where's the applause button? 18 years, Ian and I. Ian, do the honors. This is from my wife to Ian and I. So we are going to open this on air, and hopefully it's not a snake or something. It's a beautiful Madden girl box. Maybe my wife has divorce papers in there, and she's like, you can marry Ian. Smells like divorce in here. What does that mean? What do we got, Ian? What do we got? It looks promising. We got bubble wrap. Okay. Bubble wrap's always good. This is really cool. Are you kidding me? You don't even know what this is? I don't. Like I said, I wasn't going to open it. I'm a purist. You know, I wanted to have the real effect here. I might start crying here in a moment. Are you freaking kidding me? All right, so I have to get up and show you guys. Hold on. Wow. So I'll start explaining. So my wife got us these cool glasses, Poor Man's Pinball Podcast, as you can see right there. And then you flip it around, sloppiest show on the Internet. Hey. My wife is so cool. She talks shit all the time, but at the end of the day, she loves Ian and I so much. Wow. That is super cool. Way to go, Kathleen. If you're out there watching right now, I love you so much. Thank you so much for this. This is a very thoughtful gift, and holy crap, what a great wife. That is so cool. Kathleen, I love you. Thank you so much. That was awesome. That is awesome. Oh, man. Way to go. We're here tearing up. Yeah. And we're saying mean things like divorce papers. Oh, wait. There they are. In the bottom. I got it. I got it. Cool. Kathleen, thank you. Glenn, thank you. Thank you, guys, so much. Now we have official glasses that we can be using every night. I'll thank my wife later for you. Thank you. Thank you. And she'll be thinking of me. Probably. Being thanked. By you. With my Newton balls. It got weird again. Yeah, it always does. All right. All right. So let's, you know what? Before we get into this shit, I wanted to, I promised one of our diehard listeners, she's been a fan of our show since day one, Rachel. You know who you are. You're in chat right there. Hi, Rachel. I don't even know how to pronounce her last name. I'm not going to lie. Is that Lee? Leige? Leige? Leige? Leige? Don't feel bad, Rachel. I'm not going to even. Rachel, we love you. my last name. No one can ever say it right. And we're actually going to put this on our Facebook page after the show, but we have a Ladies Flip Wisconsin tournament. Okay, it's going to be October 3rd, 2020, at 11 a.m. It'll be hosted by Private Collector in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Doors open at 10 a.m. It's a 13-round match play. Limit 20 ladies. Okay, ladies out there listening. There's a lot of ladies that listen to us. Fee is $40. Responsible recreation following recommended guidelines. To register, contact Rachel at ladiesflipwi at gmail.com. That's ladiesflipwi at gmail.com. One word, guys. So enjoy. I can't wait for that. I can't wait to hear how that went for Rachel. and of course I'm not allowed and if I did she'd charge me 80. Rachel, we hope that lots of people show up now because we have a poll everywhere so people are going to be showing up I'm sure. Are we going to call Little Gee? Little Gee? Little Gee? Little Gee. That's probably phonetically how you say it. Little Gee. We'll call you Little Gee. Your rapper name. Kastner. Sounds like a rapper. I don't want to spoil it but My wife just texted me. JJ, my son, is listening to us, and he's giggling at us two buttholes. Oh, he should be. Hi, JJ. Hi, JJ. All right. Well, let's keep going down the road. We're checking shit up. We are. We're getting shit done today. We're trying. We got a lot to do. I don't want to. And Kathleen, I love you, by the way. We love you. I know. You're listening. And now, the moment you've all been waiting for. Of course, I'm talking about the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast, Personal Pinball News. All right, that got wonky, but that's okay because we're ready to go. Okay, Drew. Last week, we forgot to mention my scam recs. So why don't you go back. Set it up. Set it up again. I'm going to take these glasses off. So a few weeks ago, I talked about, you know, seeing one of those Facebook ads for that Jurassic Park T-Rex, a really cool one. It was like three feet, right? It was like three feet big. It was huge. Sorry, my son loved his shout out. I don't get much time with them, so okay, JJ. I'm going to bed soon. When you were talking about this, you said it was an officially licensed T-Rex from Jurassic Park. It was three feet. It was a real big thing. Yeah, they sell for $600 here in the state. And what did you pay? I paid $60. Because it's a real thing, right? Did you get it yet? I did. Okay. I did. Why don't you describe it to the folks? So I get this package, and... Is the package three feet? Those boxes we opened were probably bigger than the package I got. And I'm not joking. Bigger than this one? Smaller than that. bigger than this one about that so right off the bat you know it's not three feet okay i think i think it was one of those uh like soft envelopes with the bubble wrap okay right oh man yeah so so i see this package and it's got all the chinese scribbling on it and i'm like well i don't speak chinese but i know what this means uh this means scam rex in Chinese. Yes. What was funny was after we aired it and we were talking about that, Franchi didn't know the specific dinosaur, but he did message us right away and say, oh yeah, I know that company and you'll be lucky if you get a dinosaur that's like three inches tall. Yes. Then he went on to detail what he had and he got scammed on this as well. So they show you this big thing. They're quick on shipping. Like I said, it literally took like less than two weeks to come from Hong Kong. So I was like, wow, that's, that's fast. Right. And, uh, but the day or two before I got mine, Zach sends Ian and I a message with a picture. That's that. And he said, Hey bitches, I got my scam Rex first. and as you can see in the photo that's exactly what i received so zach many you get a special shout out on a live show here with your ugly mug over there but that is the dinosaur that i received and i'm not disappointed okay i lied i'm very disappointed i'm not disappointed because i got that picture yes so this is right around ian's birthday and ian just said this is the best present I could ever got because I'm picturing Drew opening up this package and he's like, oh, I'm such an asshole. Boy, oh boy. God, is that funny. It's one of those things where the sculpt is actually pretty cool. The jaw articulates. It's a pretty neat dinosaur, but it's a cool $12 dinosaur. It's a cool $12 dinosaur. Yes. It's a shitty $60 dinosaur and that $600 dinosaur. I mean, look at Zach. Yeah. Zach's not mad either. No. Zach's happy as shit. Well, he's like you. He's reveling in my defeat. Yes, but he also knows that he, just like you, has spent way worse shit for $60. Well, that's funny you say that because, yeah, Zach and I are kind of going back and forth, and we're like, what else have we bought in pinball that was, you know, shitty for $60? And we're talking about, yeah, little mods, little lights, you know. I think I got a little shark with an LED in it for the Black Rose. It came from Australia. Comet Pinball is a great company, and I love their LEDs. but you spend $200 and you get a little box that's like about this big. Yeah. You know, so $60 in this hobby is nothing. Yeah, that – It's just – yep, wash your hands of that. I mean, I bought pinball parts that didn't fit right or weren't the right size or weren't the right whatever, and you just put those in a drawer, and those cost $60, right? So, shit. At least I got a dinosaur I can play with. I got $60 worth of spinners. It's all three of them. And if my wife is still listening, yes, I'm playing with dolls. I get it. These are dinosaur dolls, okay? That's what I told her. I said, they're action figures. Oh, my. It came with COVID. All right, Therese. Hey, Therese. Nice to see you on the stream. JJ, you need to go to bed. My wife's texting me. My son will not go to bed now because he heard us, and he's laughing his ass off at Ian and I. Cool, man. Good stuff. That's too funny. So, yeah. Anything else? Oh, scam rex. Oh, just quickly a few notes on Turtles. Now that I've had some real time with it, that game is not for beginners. Hard. It's tough. It's tough. It's brutal. I like it. I like to say I'm the worst good player in the world. The worst good player in the world. That's a good synopsis, right? Yeah, you sound like TurboGrafx-7, Brian Kuyper. He always likes to say he's the worst in the world. Worst streamer. Yeah. I can play. I've been playing a while now. I'm pretty good. But, you know, compared to, like, the greats, I'm the worst of them, which is fine. So I enjoy getting my ass kicked is what I'm saying. Okay. If you're a new player playing this thing, the theme is awesome. It's fun. It's, you know, it's Turtles, right? Yeah. But it's a tough game. I would not. If this is your only pin and you're casual players and you're buying it for your rec room, I can't recommend it. I can't. You know what I mean? I'd be a no, guys. It's an ass kicker. It is. All right. Well, if you're a sucker for punishment like we all know Drew is, then Turtles is the way to go. Yeah. If not. Yeah, it's a great game. Maybe there's something coming up that you might like. Like Avengers? Like Avengers. Yes. Yes. Yes. So, do we want to get into that right away? It's up to you, buddy. We're live. We're live. We're live. Let's go into the podcast news. Let's go into podcast stuff, because we had a few new, a few things come up this week, which we just can't ignore. Can't ignore. Can I do it? Can I do it? Number one. I got number one. Podcast watch. I had to. Sorry. Good. That was a good do-do-do-do. That was good. Macho's back. He is. Do-do-do-do. That's what I wanted to do. What? Yeah. You're way better at that. Go ahead. Finish it. Finish it. Oh, yeah. I'm back, brothers. And I got off my yacht with Miss Elizabeth, and I said, I can't do it. My throat hurts after 28 seconds. That vein in my head is bulging. So, no, it was just nice to hear Macho back. Like, I'm glad he's not gone forever. Oh, it was. I was a little worried, because it was May. Yeah. You know, and now we're starting to get all this good stuff, all this news, and we still can hear from him, and now he's back. So, Macho, great to hear from you, brother. What else do we have? Who else came back? There was somebody that was gone. Then he tried to get a bunch of money from you guys, and now he's back. Maybe he was never gone. What was his name? I think it's Canada. Canada. Canada is back. You know, I was pretty sure he was done. I was pretty damn sure he was done. Well, the thing that struck me was the seriousness of his tone. Yes. Because, yeah, go ahead. No, it's just like my livelihood is being threatened. Yes. The whole story leading up to it was that, you know, two people approached his business, sent emails, and they said that he was saying some disparaging type things and whatnot. And he actually got called into a meeting, and this is all straight from Kaneda's mouth. I wonder what they said in that meeting. Well, as luck would have it, here at the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast, we were such good pinball journalists. I was able to procure that's my word of the week I was able to procure a copy of the transcript of the meeting between him and the president of his company alright let's act this out this really happened I got this I can't reveal my sources ok because I don't want to be accused of leaks but what we have here is a section of the transcript. It's actually the whole thing. It was short. It was short. Let's do it. Okay. All right, you be the president, guys. I'm going to be the president guy. I will be. Because we don't know his name, so he's president guy. I'll be Canada. Okay. So here's my glasses that are not on, but we'll pretend, okay? Hey, Chris. He doesn't call him Canada, by the way. Yeah, boss. We received an email from two different people regarding some disparaging comments you may have made and leaking sensitive material in your ping pong podcast. It's a pinball podcast, three-time Twippy award-winning podcast. It's called the Canadian Pinball Podcast. It's number one. I don't give a shit. I don't know what the hell a torpy is. This is a multi-million dollar operation, and I don't have time for your pinball shit. I guess I could just post workout videos of myself without a shirt on in the park for a while until I figure this out. Get out of here. Go get some work done. And that's it. That's all that happened. That was it. You know why? Because he's a multi-million dollar company, and he's running it, and he doesn't have time for pinball shit. What? Yeah, the whole thing. Don't do your podcast. We have things to do today. What? I don't even know I just don't even know because like I said if what happened happened then why is he back? I don't know. Chris? Maybe you can come on again and tell us but I will say this though I'm glad he's back I'm like thrilled he's back we've gone on record we've always loved Chris around here yeah he was on their show and we'll have him on anytime so let's do that do you know what else i was able to procure in my journalistic approach here what's that buddy i was able to get actual audio of him leaving his company that day after that meeting no yes actual audio of chris canada culeris leaving his office after that meeting all right well what does that sound like should we play it let's play it the people want to know oh we got camera issues cameras funny yeah uh ebw just texted us audio is fine audio is fine videos not let's try something different here let's turn that off all right let's see what we can do here sorry folks we're having a couple of technical glitches here And we got, yeah, audios, fine pictures. Picture's getting wonky. All right, hold on. Kaneda, you're getting a shout-out here. Kaneda is funny. Yes, we all love Kaneda. Is he funny, though? He's interesting. I really like listening to him. Therese Edwards, who does he work for? He works for some big marketing company in New York. I don't know. So it's way above my pay grade for sure, which is why I'm making fun of him because why not? Brian Cosner, what's more fun, shirtless push-ups in the park or shirtless driving the demon? Chris, you're going to have to answer that one. Cherise Edwards, are you broadcasting from outer space? No, we're just having technical issues. happens to everybody so what else Tim Lee I've been pissed at him since he announced that Transformers G1 was coming and said it wasn't happening crushed my soul Tim Lee you have to get over it buddy how's that everybody Ian's got shitter net at his house fuck you that's from Ari oh Ari that's hilarious shitter net Ryan Utech that's some prime time lag alright it wasn't lag guys it was just a shitty stream card that's all our cancer card is shit okay it was a gift blame Billy YJ okay Ian with a fresh fade says Josh Mudd Tim Lee Rick and Morty best game ever made Jasper just say you are done forever dude technical issues then hit us up for money Come back anyway when no one pays up. Jester Rotter, you win the gold star comments of the day. All right, let's play this stupid audio thing of Canada. Don't worry. Don't worry. I'm not going to do what everyone thinks I'm going to do. Blitz out, man. All I want to know is who's coming with me. who's coming man who's coming with me huh who's coming with me man that was if he was stoned right or he was stoned at the time yeah okay that was live audio him leaving the business okay alright so let's get into it guys our stick is over we're done we're moving on we tried it I had a good time with it I thought it was good I don't care if anyone else did big camera glitches it was weird it was the space station Therese Edwards-Simes, going to catch up on chat here real quick. Is that peanut whiskey? No, Therese, this is Amador. This is a bourbon. It's really good. I had it last week, too. Ryan says, God damn it, Billy. I don't know what Billy did, but I love it when someone says, God damn it, Billy. God damn it, Billy. Billy Ryder. Oh, first the dinosaur, now the stream card. Yeah. Yeah, you're right, Billy. Now I get it. Okay. Yep. Half-baked respect, half-baked clip. Nice. Okay. Yeah, and you do need to get some bourbon, Ryan. Amador They not a sponsor of the show but they damn well should be Yeah most of these boozers should be a sponsor so I don have to buy it anymore There you go All right moving right along because we can be here all day Avengers. Avengers. So why don't you start because you hate this game. No, let's not go into like that. It's so aggressive. Why don't you poo-poo right now? It's so aggressive. Here, I'm going to do Ian's review. Another Stern game, uninspired. This game sucks. No, I'm just beaming. Thanks. All right, let's talk about who did it. All right, game design, Keith Elwin. Rules design, Keith Elwin with support from Mr. Raymond Davidson. Lead software programmer is Nick Nagel. Rick Nagel. Sorry. Rick Nagel's been with him on every title. Artwork, Zombie Yeti. Lead sound designer, Jerry Thompson. Music, Kendall Hale. Hale, sorry. Lead Mechanical Engineer, Harrison Drake. And Computer Graphics Art Director, Chuck Ernst. Oh, Glenn missed his gift. Sorry. Glenn, your gift was awesome. Glenn just joined us. Yeah, it's in the beginning, bud. Yep. You can watch it later. Watch us now, though. So, pro premium and limited edition, $100 increase? Yeah, they did. And just so everyone knows, it has been confirmed that, so they increased prices to $100 at the beginning of this year in January. Now people are like, well, they did it again. They did it for this game. And then at the beginning of next year, they're going to have the same $100 increase for all their games. So this is basically just next year's increase. So nobody freak out yet. Have another $100. Yeah. Yeah. Like we were just talking, what's $100 in pinball? Nothing. They know that, and that's why they do it. It is what it is. Hey, if they add a few more things, I don't care what they charge. Right. They almost wrote me in again. All right, so there's a lot of information and rules and things to digest on this game. I would just urge everyone, we could go into it in detail, but we won't, because there's a better source, and that's thisweekinpinball.com. One of our sponsors. Thisweekinpinball.com, TWIP, they do a fantastic job. This week they had a good deep dive into the Avengers game. What Drew and I do is never a deep dive. We dip our toe sloppily in the water, and then we continue to drink. So I think you appreciate that out of us. But we're not going to bore you to death with what's in each game, but we will talk about our first impressions, general impressions, and it's nice that we got a video and pictures right out the bat, right out of the gate. Here's my first question to you, which will kind of sum all this up. You ready? Sure. So why do you think with the backlog they have, because now I learned today that premium people are not going to be getting their games until, some of them until almost November. So do you think they're really just trying to step on the throat of their competitors, I think? Is that why? Well, like I said, they literally have more work right now than they can handle, so to speak. Isn't it a good problem to have? Isn't it kind of funny that it's kind of like pre-ordering? Yeah, sort of. You're not getting your game. Yeah, you're right. But you know it's going to come. Yeah, you know it's going to come. Sure. That's the difference. So, well, let's get into this. So we got three models, the Pro, Premium, and the LE. This is a full-fledged game. This isn't a home edition or anything like that. I want to know what you, the paint guy, thinks about that yellow. Oh, I think it's terrible. I think it's too much. Did you see Keith Elwin did a close-up of it? It has the flake in it. Yeah, that doesn't matter to me. It's too light. You know, when you have flake in lighter colors, it kind of bleeds. It's kind of like, I don't know, it bleeds out. No, I am not a fan. I like body stuff. I am not a fan. It's not as crisp when you have a lighter color with the fleck. So what you'd want to do is, in this instance, I know somebody did a mock-up with the purple armor, and the purple armor will probably be the better out of the two. I think the yellow is too much. It's too much. So let's go into it. Should we do just artwork? Yes. See how you like it? So, Drew, we're looking at pictures now of some of the game and the artwork. What do you think? What do you think of the general aesthetic of the game? Being a lifelong Marvel fan and liking and disliking different styles throughout the years, and I think the best compliment I can give Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti) is the only Marvel art I've ever seen that I personally like better is Todd McFarlane. Okay, that's high praise. No, that's huge high praise because Todd McFarlane, as everyone may or may not know, is arguably one of the best comic book artists of all time. He created Spawn and, more importantly to me, He did a pretty long run on Amazing Spider-Man, which he took Spider-Man and made him into a badass. And he created Venom and Carnage and all that good stuff. So Todd McFarlane is by far my favorite comic book artist, so nothing against Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti). Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti) is one of my favorite pinball artists. So, yeah, you would be number two in the Marvel Universe for me. Not bad. You're not a comic book fan. You could be. Yeah, the list is a mile long of comic book artists, and like I said, you're up there, Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti). So, yeah, well done all the way around. Yeah, I would agree with Drew. I think that this, we talked a couple weeks back about Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti) and some of his artwork packages and how he does this tightrope floss. Sorry, the Chief's Life scale has been replaced with the Dildo scale. Oh, gosh. No, we're not doing that today. Go ahead. We're not doing that, guys. We're not doing the dildo thing. That's not happening. But Albert, yes, Todd McFarlane rocks. Yeah. So anyway, so what I was going to say is a few weeks ago we were talking about just that fine line he always likes to walk with, a collage versus like freaking 10 out of 10 artwork. And with Avengers, it's got to be even that much harder because you're dealing with so many different types of characters. You're not dealing with one Deadpool. Deadpool. You can't have one central Deadpool kind of character in an Avengers pin. So now you have to kind of work around that by adding a lot of characters, but making it so it's not hokey and it's cool. And what he did was fucking magic, you know, in Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti) style. I'm thinking his nickname should be the King of Color because his packages are always so vivid. Like, it doesn't matter if it's a picture or a video, you're getting some serious color right away. And I can't wait to see this in person because I think the colors are just going to pop that much more once you have it right in front of you. So, yeah, 10,000 cheese slices, Jerry Packer. It's amazing what you guys did. I'll finish the art discussion with this. whether or not I buy this game depends on if my wife is still listening to the stream right now. But if I don't buy this game then I'm getting a Translight and I'm going to light it up and put it in my room because the Premium with Thanos just standing there What do you say? Do you say Thanos or Thanos? Thanos. I know that's correct, but people just say it differently just based on their dialects and whatever. So anyways, okay. That powerful pose of his on the premium, it's iconic already. Yeah, it's beautiful. So I will buy that Translight. Hey, Zach Manning, you want to hook me up here? I'll take us to Translight. Hook a brother up? Yeah. Yeah, I want to buy an Avengers dot, dot, dot Translight. And he'll still send me a bill for $3,000. Yeah, you're worth it, though, Drew. You're worth it. So, anyways, yes, that is, yeah, you can't say anything bad about the art. No. I don't think anyone can. No. Art's great. Let's go right to toys and gimmicks. Now, from my understanding, toys and gimmicks, I mean, we have. Tim Lee, it is so cute that Drew is pretending he might not tie the game. so let's go over some of the features on the pro real quick or well when i say pro it's in all three models three flippers six balls three pop bumpers the hulk spinner okay it's a spinner yeah i'll post above the upper flipper to hold ball and avengers computer bingo grid with a bank of three drop targets. Okay. Thor captive ball. Okay. So that's in all three models. Somebody said when they hit the Thor captive ball, there might just be like a loud clang of thunder. That would be cool. Pretty cool. All right. So the premium and LE models, now we're adding a little bit. We have an interactive Dr. Strange spinning kinetic sling ring disc with dual direction velocity detection. It's sort of like the Circus Voltaire. And motorized pop-up disc scoop. Okay, and then we have the underground portal, which is that subway that's a visible subway where you can actually see the ball go down the subway. It's kind of cool. That's very cool. Very cool. It's interesting. Custom sculpted Thanos Infinity Gauntlet integrated up with light-up gems. Captain Marvel inverse gravity custom wire form ramp. The Hank Pym Laboratories vertical up kicker catapults the ball into the middle of Captain Marvel ramp. So, that's a lot of things. That's a lot of things. Do you know what I would have done? Sorry. You know how they have the gauntlet in the premiums, but the pro is just a piece of plastic, right? Yep. In the corner. I wish they would have kept the plastic in the premium and then gave you a topper of a gauntlet for the premium in the LE. All right. Let's talk about this gauntlet because I'm not going to be poo-pooing this game all night. I promise you guys. But that gauntlet. Where's the poo-poo button? The gauntlet. Poo-poo, poo-poo. The gauntlet's the worst part. I actually prefer the Pro's plastic gauntlet because there's more detail in the plastic. I tend to agree with that. Yeah. I think it looks like a guy with a. From an aesthetics standpoint. It almost looks like a guy with a. Do we have that picture up? Sorry. Yeah, sorry. It's kind of a slideshow. Yeah, go for it. But it almost looks like a guy is wearing one of those yellow cleaning gloves where you're going to scrub the toilet. It doesn't look very menacing. And in the movie, it was more gold anyway. It wasn't bright yellow. So a lot of the things about that glove really turned me off. There it is right there. It's just not detailed enough, and I would prefer the plastic, to be honest. And what are we talking about there? I mean, we're just talking about a few lights that you light up as you go. It's not that interactive, to be honest. No, I do agree. And that's why I said it would have made it better. That looks better to me. It does look better. I don't care if it's not sculpted. I think that looks better. It looks like it's his hand, too. Yeah. It fits. Yeah. It just works better. Yeah. That, to me, was the first thing that just looked really bad to me. It just did. But, you know, what I'm learning in this, and even me being a premium buyer most of the time, I was talking to Tim Lee, actually, earlier on the phone, and we both agreed, you know, if I could go back now, like Jurassic Park, I would probably be okay with a pro. You know, the T-Rex is awesome, don't get me wrong. Turtles, definitely I would have been okay with the pro. Like, 100%. You know, I love the premium. It's a fun game, and, you know, obviously I have... Would you sell your premium to get a pro? No. And take some of that money back? no because i won't lose anything i don't know okay you know what i mean it's just a thought yeah no and it has crossed my mind oh um but with this game and we'll get into it yeah glove aside i think the premium is the only way to go and there are games like that yes really premium yes because for one one full extra ramp that's a big deal okay right okay that's a whole extra ramp to me that's a big deal i would agree um plus it has an up kicker yep which which is pretty cool the up kickers are cool um and the the gravity disc of death or whatever the fuck they call it the dr strange sling sling ring sling ring yeah so i think for those three things like i said the glove you're right i i do agree with you i could have done without it i wish right imagine imagine a big menacing glove on top of your machine. Moving. Right? Mm-hmm. You know, kind of like Black Knight style, where they had an animatronic, and it's kind of like, you know, like, maybe it goes like this, and then it clenches or something. Ooh. Snaps? Yeah. Where's the rest of the play field? Says Ian. No! All right. You know, guys. Sorry. Tell everyone your comment when you first saw this. Because this is gold. This is an Ian comment, and I love it. Go ahead. I said it looked like Thanos snapped and half the play field disappeared. That's gold, man. That's gold. But, you know. I beefed up a bit. I got a little bit of a backlash on that. That's okay, though. I can take it. I'm a grown-ass man. A little bit. But I'll say this, that I'm warming up to the game big time. Like, I think it looks like it's going to be a lot of fun. Yeah, Albert. Premium or bust because you can't live without the subway. I forgot about the subway, too. The subway looks great. Yeah. So, I just think this is one of the rare instances where, like, you have to do a premium because you literally do get a lot more for your dollars. Good call, Albert. All right. So what else we got here on these things? Thanks, David. David McCann says, nice looking bar, Ian. Oh, thanks, man. So let's go into the underground portal. No, no, no, no. I'm sorry. The interactive doctor strength spinning kinetic sling ring. Billy was right. How did the subway end up on Avengers and not in TMNT? Wow. Now you're making me want to sell the damn game. Well, that's the thing. I know. That is disappointing. Wasn't that one of the comments, though? It was pretty damn funny. I don't know if it was Ian Hauer, but it sounds like an Ian Hauer comment where it's like, I'm pretty sure that Keith Elwin just designed this to spite everyone. It's like, it's got the spinning loop that should have been in fucking Hot Wheels. It's got the subway that should have been in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Yep. It's just Keith saying, fuck you guys. It is frustrating because the only thing you missed was the drive-in movie theater for It's like, we don't know what any of this stuff costs, but we can, you know, gather some sort of estimate or a guess. And it's just like, how come Keith Elwin gets so much more in his games? Well, I look at that game, though, and I don't see a lot. Wireforms are expensive, man. Man, I see a lot of wireforms. That's the thing. Drop targets are expensive. It's three drop targets. That's an expensive match. I don't care. I don't care what the tournament calls you. I don't care how much. They had to buy a bunch of kitchen gloves. I don't care what Stearns told you. And they're going to get a little midget and put him on his hand. Let's just be honest. Keith Elwin's amazing at shots. He is. And he's amazing at the wire forms and ramps and flow. He's the king right now of flow. I'm sorry, Steve Ritchie. I love you. You are the emperor of flow. But Keith Elwin is like the king now of flow. Can I tell you the sacrilege thing I heard on a podcast today? I think it was Zach. they were talking to this subject about the turnaround ramp on Jurassic Park on the right side, right? It comes back at you. And then think about the turnaround ramp on Munsters, right? Munsters is way smoother, and it is. And they kind of brought that up where it's like not that Keese is clunky, and Jurassic Park as a whole is very flowy and a very good layout that way. but I was like, huh. You know what I mean? No, I get it. So when you're saying the best at this and that, no, John Borg did Munsters. Maybe John Borg should be doing them. I don't know. Yeah, well, no, John Borg's a fucking flow master too. Don't get me wrong. Yeah, pearls is flowy as shit. I love Iron Maiden just for the shot. I don't care what theme that was. It doesn't matter. It's too fun to flip, Iron Maiden. That's one of the best layouts, period of time. And then Jurassic Park was a fantastic sophomore effort that just blew us all away because there's so much going on in that game. Now, this being his third game, again, it impresses me the amount of shots he can fit in there without it overcrowding. Yeah, Glenn says Keith cares about how a game shoots more shots. Yeah, absolutely. 100% more shots. They're faster. and I love how Keith lines up his shots and makes it challenging and rewarding at the same time and it feels good when you hit these shots. There's a lot I love about Keith. Don't get me wrong. How about this? Go ahead. But I've been getting a lot of comments and even Ian Hauer, I think, again, was talking to me about how I should really like this because of all the wire forms and it's very Bulser-esque and he says I'm a big fan of Bulser. Well, me personally, I've learned a lot about myself this week. And I've learned that. You're different than everybody. I am definitely way different than everybody. Because what I like about some of the Balser designs and what I like about pinball in general is I want to be more immersed. I want to see things in there that I want to shoot that gives me excited to shoot. Now, you guys. Do you like the Hobbit? You guys are all pinball. It's beautiful. That was a Balser design, though. Yeah, it was beautiful. No, I don't. I don't like all Balser designs. Okay. That's what they were telling me. I like Balser designs. I will say this. I think Balser, besides the Hobbit, has come up with some pretty full-looking playfields. You know, Houdini, Oktoberfest, even Hot Wheels feels full. Simpsons. Simpsons, Woz. I mean, there's a lot in those games that it's still makeable. All those shots are makeable, but it feels like a complete game. To read Joe Ballsearch rocks. Ballsearch is cool. Ballsearch, she said. Ballsearch. Oh. Way to go, Tish. We love that. That's awesome. Anyway, besides the Ballsearch. But no, I mean, people assume that I see wire forms and I'm going to love it because I love Oktoberfest so much. But what is going on over there? Now Tish said starfish poopers. Was that a ballsearch design, Tish? It must have been. Starship Troopers. Okay, anyways. Again, there are certain games that he has made that I enjoy because there's something fun. Like, Oktoberfest has a nice cool beer barrel in there and a bar that I like to shoot. It screams to me, shoot this, right? The Jurassic Park, that T-Rex in there, that makes me want to shoot at the T-Rex. It just does. Yeah. I am not. So some of you guys are pinball fucking wizards, and you look at these games, and you're like, oh, look at that fucking left ramp. Oh, yeah. And I sit there, I'm like, fuck, man. I don't really care about this infinity ring thing. I would rather have anything more exciting than an infinity ring. Even when it lifts up and you throw a ball in there. Here's what I was thinking today. I was thinking, okay, what's the difference between this and the Wonka gobble hole thing? like, you know, the infinite, the Gobstopper, the everlasting Gobstopper shot. You're talking about the Strange Spinner? Yeah, the Dr. Strange Spinner. So now it spins, right, and it lifts up, and you can shoot a ball in there, right? It's better than the Subway. It's cooler. Right. I agree. I agree. On paper, it's far superior than the Gobble Hole, right? But? But when I look at those side-by-side, which one do I want to shoot at more? I want to shoot at the stupid thing to make the thing spin faster. I'm a retard when it comes to pinball. So Everlasting Godstopper, it attracts my attention. I am a man. I have a very, very limited focus. And I'm like, oh, shit, that thing spins when I shoot it. I want to shoot that. This, I'm not seeing it as much, but I want to see it in person. But it doesn't get me turned on. That's all right. That's my only critique. Everything else looks great, guys. Relax. I just wish they had either dressed that up more or made a statement piece in this game. What if the Infinity Gauntlet glove would have reached down and got it? Perfect. Yeah, perfect. A statement piece. Now, take Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti)'s artwork off of this, right? Mm-hmm. It is a lot of wire form, and that's a lot of it. That's most of it. Yep, there is a lot of wire form. Okay. I agree. We have learned from Star Wars specifically, guys, that Star Wars versus the Star Wars comic book edition, if you've seen that in person, what looks more full? The comic book edition because the artwork is just everywhere and it looks great and it fills the play field. What we're looking at, guys, now I'm not saying that it's an empty play field, but I am saying that artwork helps it out big time and that's the draw. Here's the thing. Keith Elwin's designs rely on that artwork. I'm going to use your Star Wars analogy here for a second. Just follow me here on this journey. I'm done. If Star Wars would have been the same exact layout as Avengers, okay, and then maybe they put the Death Star in the corner where the gauntlet is, and then the elevator, you know, ball lock would have been, I don't know, something, right? Maybe the carbonite pit, right? Right. Okay. Yeah, you put the ball in. That'd be cool, right? Yep. So everything being the same, you make that Star Wars, you make that the Carbonite Pit, and then you just put the Death Star in a corner, it lights up, whatever. That game probably would have been better received than it was. Yeah, probably. So my point is that there is more in this. I agree. Than some of these other sterns. I agree. But that artwork, my point was it helps. The artwork helps. Billy Laijay. if Jonathan Bergeron did the art again, he wouldn't have bought it. But it's not. It's not. It's fucking Zombie Eddie, and he's fucking amazing. I actually disagree with that because, you know, the art may not have been as good. And I'm not saying, like, Jonathan Bergeron is not as good an artist as Jeremy Packer (Zombie Yeti) or whatever, but I'm just saying that I think people that make that statement. Billy, I'm talking to you because I would have been the same way. I mean, you'd be like, well, maybe the art's not great, but the game still is what the game is. All right. So, Brian Rager, statement piece, question mark, how about a tower magnet, vertical right ramp, stage subway, middle ramp, hit up all the flippers. Yeah, I get that, dude. There's a lot of shots in this game. But are those statements? Is that something that you're going to walk by and be like, oh, my God, look at the middle ramp on this fucking game? Or are you going to be like, holy shit, look at this game. it's got a goddamn T-Rex in it, and it's roaring. I'm saying I'm not a very smart man, Ryan. I need molded things in there. I need a flushed-out game. Yeah, but I guess in today's world, we know what we're getting, and this is way better than what we're making. No, no, no. You're a pinball. You've played a lot of pinball. So now when you see it, you understand it. I'm just talking about average. I'm an average Joe pinball player. Walking up to it. I'm not saying that the layout is bad. I'm saying I would have liked to have added, you know, you can mod the shit out of them. You can put your dolls on there. That's fine. Do that. Do whatever you want to your game. And for the record, though, I'm not going to fucking poo-poo anybody that buys this game because I know this game is going to be a lot of fun to shoot. I'm not saying that. I'm not saying it's a bad game at all. In fact, it's probably, it might be the game of the year. I think people are already saying that, which is amazing. It might be. It might be. It's up there. What's going to compete with it? You know, Turtles? Turtles, yep. Yeah, Turtles will compete with it. I'm not saying it's a bad game. I would just, for future reference, where I am, I would like, I'd like some molded things there. I'd like to get it flushed out. Glenn said it best. Ian, you're just overcorrecting the public perception of it being amazing. Admit it. It looks good. Rules will make or break it. Yep, you are right, Glenn. And for all you tournament-type players and that guys, you're right. The rules are that. But, you know, Ian and myself, we're not tournament players. We just like cool shit. Josh, my DJ mixer. All right. You guys win. That's why I love fucking shit. So, anyways. All right. So, I'm going to still give it two thumbs up. This game looks great. It does look great. And anyone who buys this is going to get a hell of a game. Anything Elwynn makes is going to be a hell of a game in your collection. I don't care what it is. It's going to shoot great. You know that. But you're right, Glenn. Rules will make or break this game, and I've got faith in the rules. And they said the art, I'm sorry, the animations are not the 3D animations we're used to now at Stern. They did more of a comic book style. Yeah. Well, I think that's kind of cool. That's cool. You know, kind of like Alice Cooper sort of did that, you know, pull from the pages. Right. So, yeah, I'm interested to see it. Yeah, that's super exciting. That's true. Let's be honest. Drew's either going to buy this and get divorced, sell something, buy it. You know, it's probably going to be in my house at some point. We'll see. Right. We'll see. Yeah. No, it's up your alley. how do you uh other than that how what else what else would you any comments you'd make on the shots in layout because i said a lot of random shit yeah um like usual yeah no i i think it's unique he's got a he's got a shot through the pops which is kind of cool you know that's always a neat thing kind of like iron maiden too the the pops on the left and then you got to shoot to the ramp yeah that's a tough ones yep so yeah it's like a little mini like loop i think where it just kind of comes out to the left orbit, that spinner, the Hulk spinner. Yeah. Spinner. Which is just a spinner, by the way. It's a spinner. I'm sorry. As much as I love imagination, I can't call it a Hulk spinner. It's just a fucking spinner. Wait, the Hulk spinner? Yeah. So I've got a foot soldier spinner on my TMNT. Wait, does the spinner grow as it spins? No. No. No. No. So, I don't know. I mean, like you said, you've got to shoot it. But, no. First impressions are very favorable in this game. And this game is people are fucking going crazy over it, and I love that. Let's get excited, man. Tim Lee and I were talking earlier. Name the last Stern game that didn't shoot well. Because, see, we were talking about all this stuff, and, like, you like the theme, you like this or that, I'll do this, fine. But name the last Stern game that did not shoot well. You know, like when you talk about Houdini, sometimes people say, like, oh, the shots are tight or, you know, Alice Cooper or whatever. It's easy to make games that don't shoot well when you don't put enough in them. That's a good critique, I guess, but okay. There's nothing to see that. You just have a blank play field. Three flippers, three pops, orbit, and two ramps. Yeah, but they're – That a lot of the thirds lately But they always get these games that are smooth shooters and they not clunky Because there not a lot there You could say that I don know How could you say that I think that a bullshit argument That's all I've got to say. Sorry. They put some shit in there, maybe it'll get clunkier. I don't know. I'm not George Gomez. Do I look like George Gomez? The dude's way smarter than me. Well, that's true. I'm just a drunk ass on a podcast. Don't worry. Eh. Maybe I should stop talking. Go ahead. I'm pissing Drew off. He's getting red in the face. No. have you met me? I've been right in the face since I was two. What else we got? What else we got? Well, let's move on. Okay. We're moving on? Well, we want to see this game. I mean, we haven't even seen it being streamed yet. It's going to be streamed Wednesday. Okay. What, 9-9? Is that Wednesday? I think it's 9-9 at 5 o'clock, dead foot. Don't quote me on that, but it's something like that. Okay, yeah. If it's 9-9, that would be Wednesday. Check your local listings. Check them. Check them. People under 30 don't even know what local listings are anymore. Check your TV guide for your local listings. Open up your TV guide. Where's this dead flip? I don't get it. Where's the dead flip channel? Okay. So moving on. So Ian challenged me about a month ago to a history lesson. And he challenged me to learn all I could about... out. Now it's time for a history lesson brought to you by poor man's pinball podcast. If you're not careful, you may learn something before it's done. All right. So I challenge you on what game? Black Belt. Black Belt. There it is, kid. This is Bally's Black Belt from 1986. And interesting thing I learned right off the bat was Zachariah had another game. I think it was from the year earlier in 85. I thought it was 86. They were both released in 86. It was very close, yeah. And it was Black Belt with no space. Yeah. So it was all one word. And they're like, yeah, we're going to do this. And then Bally's like, no, we're going to do this. And I don't know if there was like, was there a legal war about that or not? I don't know. But they ended up changing the name of this black belt to Karate Fight, I think. But that has something to do with. International. Yeah. Well, that's where Zachariah is. The Zachariah stuff. Yeah, from Spain. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so Italy. Italy, that's right. Yep. So, yeah, when you wanted to go across the sea, you had to change it to Karate Fight. So the distributors said we need to change the name. Yeah. Because they're like, we don't want two games that are black belt because then it's confusing, obviously. so yeah so in the Europe they changed it to it was just karate right I thought it was karate fight but it doesn't matter yep you're right Bally Midway 1986 karate fight super important yeah nobody cares and we're not going to be as good as Silver Ball Chronicles here as much as we'd like to shout out David Dennis and yeah those fuckers are crazy and Dan Hallett Hallett from Slam Tilt is that Dave Dave or Dan? I don't think it's either one of those. It's Ron. Ron Hallett. Ron. There you go. Ron Hallett and David Dennis. Yeah, they do a great job on Pinball Chronicles, Pinball Network. It's my favorite podcast. Oh, it's awesome because they do all the history. I like it a lot better than ours. Whoa, whoa, whoa. I'm joking. Hot take. Get the fuck out. Jesus. Wow. True. Easy there, pal. It's okay. Simmer down. Dan Langlois designed it he also did Radical which is up on people's list I love that Radical Gilligan's Island fun game fun game good layout yeah good shit rules good layout shit rules yep Gilligan's Island's okay and Valley Game Show that's one of those games that's good for a couple plays and it just gets annoying really? because people always talk about it well the call outs and stuff get a little grating it's just hey uh we're having a game show and you know So, like, that was my best game show guy, and he does this, you know. I don't know. That's how I feel about Diner, but people love Diner. Diner's good. The dishes. Clinking. Clink, clink, clink, clink, clink, clink, clink, clink. See, I'm okay with repeated sound effects. Sometimes, to me, call-outs get grating. Ah, I got it. Yeah, sound effects I'm fine with, so. Okay. But I've played Valley Game Show, and it's fine, but this is the guy that designed that, and, you know, it is. Howard Shear was the programmer and our boy Greg Freres did the art because he did a lot of art back in the day and you're looking at this thing now like this game needs PinStadiums it does need PinStadiums so whoever owns this game call Scott at PinStadiums he'll hook you up just get the regular PinStadiums for you you don't need anything fancy the one photo on here that's lit up nicely that's actually a virtual pin. That's the only one. Oh, there is? Yeah, that's the only one that makes it. You can actually see the layout. That's a virtual pin? That's the virtual pin, yeah. But here's the thing. They only made 600 of these. I know. It's a shame. Because, I don't know. For reasons. I couldn't find out why, but one of the coolest things about this game is the skill shot. It literally has a timer. So when you get about halfway up the shooter lane, there's a switch. And as soon as you hit that switch, the timer has these, there's like seven or eight lights. And each one, yeah, each one's like. You can see it right there. Yeah. On the right there. Yep. 5,000, 6,000, 8,000, whatever. Goes up to 25. Goes up to 25, yep. So depending on the speed of the ball, when it hits that switch, as soon as it hits the switch up top then, so from switch to switch, then it stops that and then you get awarded the points. You can kind of see the yellow lights on the right there. And it's got the cool guy in the middle. What was it called? Oh, it was called Gentle Touch Scores Very Much. That's the name of it? Yeah. Cool skill shot. I would say this has one of the best plastics in any pinball game ever. The karate guy? Yes. and it's dead center and there's a karate guy with his legs spread his crotch is right there and you literally hit his crotch that's like the main things of the game but this plastic like stretches it's over the middle of the game and like what a cool plastic right? it's very cool and that's why Ian gave it to me because I knew that he really dug this and these things don't go for a ton of money but they're still rare, though. Yeah, they don't come up very often. It's like you can't find them, but they're, you know, a couple thousand bucks. I'd give this one a laser war treatment, dude. Oh. I'd spend so much money on this dumb thing to get it going. And then across the center, there's the karate lights. There's a lot of inserts in here. You get your different belts. You start with the yellow belt, then you get blue belt, then you get brown belt. Is it brown, I think? It's yellow, blue. Purple. Purple, black. Yeah. Cool. So everything about this game, it screams a little bit of 80s, like Bruce Lee type stuff. But it really is, you know, this awesome theme. And, you know, pinball needs more of this. Yeah, definitely fun. I didn't know about this, but I was watching. And if you guys have 10 or 15 minutes, I think it is, of time, check out Todd Suckey's TNT. Because he kind of goes through it. I don't think he had the one, but the one video. But it's extremely cool because, and I didn't know this, maybe that's what games back in the day had, but it actually had a Circuline fluorescent light in the backbox. That was a neat thing. It was a circle fluorescent right there where all of your, basically all your boards are. Right there in the middle. And then the back glass goes right over that. Fucking crazy. and the one he had had the original thing in there yeah he's like and it works though because i'm sure you can't find those anymore yeah like if that goes out you just have to put an led in there yeah you can't hey uh hey amazon i need a circular what do you do like you can't oh my god that's a great point you know what i find interesting because we were in arcades for so long led uh ballast are one of the few things that even purists are like just just put them in nobody yeah nobody keeps the old fluorescent lights i usually do but i know what you're saying but i find it interesting that even the biggest pierce he's like i won't change the board i won't put in a 60 in one i won't do this i won't do that but whenever i go on those forums they're like oh just just change the bulb it costs like 12 bucks you buy an led and i'm like for shame Well, you know, the problem is, no, I've seen it where some guys put, like, the big strips in there, the LED strips. Well, I'm just talking about an LED bulb. I know what you're saying, and that works fine. Yeah. But I've seen people switch to LED strips because they want a really bright marquee. Oh, so they put a strip in there. And that washes out all the – it just looks – Oh, yeah. Whoa. Yeah. It's too much, guys. It's too much. But, no, I know what you're saying, the LED bulb. Very cool, though, man. Good job. Yeah, I think this is one, you know, the last couple we talked about, I was like, eh, whatever. But this is one I would like to own. Like, it's cool. Yes. It is. It's fun. It looks like it would be a silly, drunken thing. You just play some bets. Let's see who can hit him in the nuts the most times. Yes. I mean, literally, he's spread eagle like this. Yep. And then there's like, there's three, I think, stand-up targets. Yep. On one leg and three on the other. I think there's one on the crotch. Yeah. No, there really is. And is it sweep the leg? Sweep the leg. Sweep the crotch. Oh, shit. But check out the – you know what? We just need to buy a set of plastics so we can probably get that and then, like, light it up and, like, frame it. That would be kind of cool. Yes. A karate crotch frame. So anybody out there, guys, anybody out there in chat, have they ever played a black belt? Hey, Dr. John, welcome. Finally get to join Stupid Work. Well, don't live in Australia, and you can join us in the rest of the world. Orbel Albert, this machine is darker than Canada's soul. Oh, Shots Fired. We were just poking fun at him. We're not trying to. The play field is as visible as his socks. Oh, Billy, Shots Fired. See, Billy, we've been talking too much. They made more of them than Alice Cooper, question mark? Yeah, good point. A gentle tush always scores with me. Yes, yes. Very true. Is that that? Horrible. Horrible. So, guys, anyone play this? Finally get to join. John, how you doing, sir? Dr. John. I bet you need a black belt in nudging to get into wizard mode. We're assuming there's a wizard mode in this game. But, yeah, very cool, man. Well done, dude. Well done. Thanks, man. Hey, do you have one for me? I do not. Okay. But I will find one. All right. Well, let us know. Yeah. I'll let you know next week. How about that? All right. I'll have it on air, and then you'll have two or three weeks. Or a month. Yeah. Because our schedules on Poor Man's Pinball Podcast are very rigid. We're super focused. We're very focused. We're very structured. Structured. As you can tell, everything we do is tidy and neat, and stuff's not everywhere. and, you know, we do what we do here on the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. You almost knocked over our boner weights. Shut up. Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. Dude, my wife is so awesome. Can you believe she did this shit? It's very cool. We were thinking about doing that, but no, that is, I'm so happy we have those. You're going to keep it here, right? Oh, yeah. I'll keep them clean. We'll have them every episode. Yes. Okay, perfect. Thanks, Kathleen. We love our glasses. And thank you again, Glenn, for our new pencil holder with all of the very fucking cool. Billy Y.J., how about Fuck It Friday? Billy Y.J., why don't you come over here and you can do Fuck It Friday with us? Fuck It Friday is something that. It's sacred. A little hard to do live only because we do it after this episode and then we'd like to air it on Fridays. I mean, we could do it. We could. I think we're going to have to think about that a little bit. No, we will do something. People might get confused during our live broadcast, like, what, they're going again? And then they're going to be like, what is this? This isn't pinball. Mm-hmm. But you might know, because everyone knows Fucking Friday. Fucking Fridays are great, though. We love Fucking Fridays. They're our favorite segment. Well, and while you guys might be having fun, you got to remember, A, I got to drive home. Right. And B, I have to work in the morning. Right. So, you know, Monday nights are... Reality. Yeah. Reality sits in sometimes. Reality. These live shows take a lot longer, actually. Yeah. They do. Yeah, a little bit. Because there's a lot of planning. There's things. I don't know. There's a lot of detail. I don't need to get into all that. Nobody cares. Black belt. Black belt. Get a black belt. If you see a black belt or know of anyone that has a black belt, I think someone mentioned they had a black belt in their garage. Tell me. I want a black belt. I will buy a black belt. What will we spend on that? $2,500? I will spend. I'd go half. What? A thousand bucks each? We'll go two grand. We'll ship it. What are they worth? I think they were... Well, let's see. Fuck it. We'll ship it. So, guys, if you know anyone, please let us know. Get in contact with the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. We would love a black belt. All right. So, the next thing on our agenda... Yeah, we're moving on. Yeah, we're going to move on from black belts. That's cool. But thank you very much, everybody. We love you. Beer tasting. Should we do the beer tasting? Why don't you set this up? All right. We're not just doing a beer tasting. This comes from one of our tribe members who, as always, they give us silly ideas, and we say, oh, that's a great idea. Ted Finlay, he knows. He said, no, you can get one for $1,200 to $1,600. Thank you, Ted. Ted, I'll give you $1,200 right now. Well, Ted's our, you know, he's our pinballpricings.com, pinballpricings.com. No verified sales by asking $1,200 to $1,600. Perfect. Oh, no verified sales. Well, Tim, Ted, Doc, find one, please. Let us know, and we'll give you a $50 finder's fee, and you can ship it to us. All right. So you guys just chill out for a second. We're going to get set up for the beer tasting. It won't take me long, okay? We're going to do a seven-beer taste test, okay? Uno, dos, tres, cuatro, cinco, seis, siete. So what we're going to do is we're going to take sips of each one, tastes, and we're going to check them out. We're going to arrange them from worst to best. So we're going to go best over to Drew. So how's that sound, Drew? So worst to best? Yep. Okay. All right. So we have our little glasses here and the ever-trusty bottle opener. So I'm going to go through each one real quick. So we have a Sam Adams Oktoberfest. Our buddy believes in it all throughout here, right here. He thinks this is going to win. Who thinks it's going to win? EBW loves it. Okay. We have a local contender. This is Lakefront Brewery, made in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. They're right by the lake, if you can believe that. They're the River West District. This is going to be three sheeps brewing Oktoberfest. I try to get as much variety as we can. This is the Hofbrauhaus Oktoberfest. This is another German import. Einger. Private beer. Oktoberfest, right from Munich itself. Hofbrau is also from Munich. And we have here Left Hand Brewery, one of my favorite breweries of all time. They're out of, I believe, Colorado. And then here we have Spaten's Oktoberfest. Now, you may know Spaten from their Optimator, which is one of their most popular beers. So let's get into this shit, huh? Let's do it. Let's do it. All right. So what I'm going to do is one more time I'm going to adjust our lens here so we can get a little bit clearer. And then we're going to just get drunk. So just like normal. It's another day at the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. Yep. Yeah, I'll start right here because it's right here. So we're going to start with the spotting. This is spotting Oktoberfest. So spotting is from Munich, Germany. They have a lot of beer houses in Munich if you've ever visited there. Fantastic beers all around. Like I said, here in the States, the most popular would be the Optimator. So, Prost. Prost. Just as what I expected. It's thicker. Yep. It's definitely thicker than most Oktoberfests, I think. But it's refreshing in a weird way. It's got a good fucking flavor to it, I'll tell you that. I don't mind it. I don't drink a lot of beer these days, but I could drink one of these. We could drink that. So what we're going to do with beer. Right now, that's going to go in the maybe pile. Right here, we're going to just. Sorry about that. We're going to put this right in the fucking middle. Knock them over. All right, so that's right in the middle there. All right, so where's our Oktoberfest here? Okay. We're spotting. What do we got next? Well, Ian's had too much to drink, I think. This is the Eyinger. Eyinger. I don't know how to pronounce it. This is Oktoberfest Marzen. Authentic. Yeah. This is the most expensive. I actually have pricing on all of these. Oh, this was, huh? Yeah. By far the most expensive. Yeah, this one I've never seen before. Most of these other ones I have witnessed. So, here, let me pull up my photos here. I think these are going to get better as we go along here. How it goes, brother. So we're going to have to put this one in the middle again. But, yeah, this one is. This is exciting podcasting. Sorry, guys. Oh, we are. I am looking at our. I'm trying to find the time. If I would have known, I would have kept them entertained. So $8.49. Do a little damn. $8.49 for a six-pack for the spotting, okay? Okay. The Eye Anger or Eye-er, whatever the fuck. Eye Anger. $10.49 for a four-pack. Ooh. Yeah. It's more expensive. I definitely like it better than the spotting. So I'm going to put this right over here. So this is worst to best. Yep. So worst. Worst to best. All right. All right. What's the next one here? We have our local Lakefront Brewery. And by the way, we're drinking out of a little ham sampling gas and a little PBR. All right. So this is Lakefront Brewery, one of our locals. So let's try it out. Prost. Prost. Fuck, that's refreshing. That's much lighter. It is. It's lighter. It's tasty. I like the Eyinger better, though. I like it a little bit better than Spaten. I could drink more of these. Yes, but I like the Eyinger so far. Wow. This is a first. Drew likes the more expensive shit. Weird. All right. Is this Kessler? So our local stuff, $8.49 for a six-pack. All right. So we got $6.49, $8.49, $10.49, basically. So far, the pricing is kind of working out a little bit here. All right. So we're going to go to the next beer, which is the Hofbrau Oktoberfest, which I love Hofbrau. Now, they're out of Munich as well and very popular. Every time we pour this, there seems to be another ounce or two in my glass. It's funny how that works. I'm a power pourer. We start with one ounce, and we end up with six ounces. What is this? This is Hofbrau. The Hopprowl Oktoberfest. Did we explain? Did we read Josh Mudd's spiel yet? I didn't, but Josh Mudd. Why don't we read this? I don't know if I have. It was on the notice feed. No, that's not it. That was something totally different. What was that? The Oktoberfest thing started from Josh Mudd. He actually asked us if he got, he was drunk. It's already there. No, that's not it. Read it. That's not anything to do with Oktoberfest. So why are we doing this? No, that's the mailbag. You're reading the mailbag. Oh, okay. So, no, what we talked about with Josh Mudd was Josh Mudd was drunk, and he had all these Oktoberfest beers, and he was like, you guys need to review Oktoberfest beers. And I was like, fuck, yeah, we do. It's an excuse for me to buy beer. All right, so here we go. Hopped around. Hopped around. Thank you, Josh Mudd. See, I was kind of roped into this, and I'm okay, but I thought there was a better story behind it, and it's now we're drinking on the podcast. As usual. You know, back in the day, I didn't need a story to drink beer with you, dude. No, you didn't. And it's fine. It's just I thought there was like a poetic story, and it's like, nope, we're drinking Oktoberfest. This is better than Lakefront, better than Spotten, and I think it has a weird aftertaste, so I'm going to put it behind Fire. It is a bit of a weird aftertaste. You agree with that, or? All right. Yep, swap them. oh yeah poor spotting keeps going further and further down spotting we love you brother but step up your game bro all right so we should probably go into the spotting um price of the spotting or or the half brow sorry 8.99 for a six pack all right so here we go octoberfest from samuel adams because anyone who knows anything about Sammy Adams knows that America does Oktoberfest better than the Germans. All right, pros. Close to Boston. To Boston. Oh, hang on. He's got to shit himself. Oh, did you just shit yourself? No. What class is that? Nope. You like that one? I'm going to try a little bit more. I've got to get a second opinion here. God damn. This will probably be on the end. Yeah, that ain't. Why does that taste like... I don't like it. Why does it taste like last year's beer? I don't know. Yeah. All the other ones had a good flavor and taste and body to them. I'm not even a beer guy. Maybe we got last year's batch. Fuck Christ. Boston. Yeah, them all. Sorry, Boston. Sorry, Boston. Sorry, bro. Let's go into this one here. All those other ones were tasty. That one was just, that was shite. That was shite. Jesus Christ. So now we're going to go into Left Hand Brewery, Oktoberfest. Can I drink it if I'm right-handed? This is the only one in a can. Why is it in a can? I don't know. I met the owner of Left Hand Brewery. Oh, yeah? Yeah, I met him. So back in about 2003, we had a – we still do. We have a very cool liquor store that you could actually buy your beer and wine, and you can take it to the back. They had a bar, and you could drink what you buy. Where was that? It's Three Cellars. It was on 76th Street, but now it's on 27th. Oh. Yeah, it's by the old – it's the old Rafters in – anyway, it doesn't matter. But what was cool is they used to have breweries there all the time. And they had this new upcoming brewery, Left Hand Brewery. And they had released, they had about three or four good beers. But they had one that put them on the map, and that was their Nitro Milk Stout Dragon's Milk, I think they called it. Oh, who turned us on to that? Jeremy. Yeah, okay. I remember that name. I went with Jeremy, and we met with the owner. The owner was cool, man. The owner was funny. And he was like, I remember him, he was getting drunk with all of us. And then he was like, because it was only like, there had to have been 10 of us together with the owner. And he was getting hammered. And he was going on and on about, yeah, everyone wants us to do an IPA. You know what I need to do to make an IPA? I take a fucking beer and I throw a bunch of hops in it. And then when I think it's too much, I put more hops in it. And now I have an IPA. You guys wanted a fucking Friday? Here you go. This is Fuck It Friday. Yeah, we're doing a Fuck It Friday. You guys want a drink? All right. So anyway, Left Hand Brewery. Have you checked chat? Nope. Is chat still with us? Nope. They gone? Southern Tier Pumpkin is my favorite. Probably Pumpkin. That's Billy Y.J. All right. So Billy Y.J. did tell us. Damn it. I'm like in sync with Ian on the beers tonight, says Chris Chandler. Albert Agar. Nitro Milk Stout. So silky smooth. But have you had a dragon's breath? Billy Y.J. says, exactly. Glenn Glenn Waechter just says, here we go. Glenn Glenn Waechter, you are correct. But, yeah, so everyone who wanted to – are we still doing a pinball podcast? Yes, this is it. Oh, my God. I have an Oktoberfest pinball machine right here. No, wait a minute. I'm just envisioning the audio for our listeners. Oh, they're loving this. And, like, they were fine for the first 25 minutes. They got 25 minutes of a good podcast. It was a really good podcast. And then you're going to be like, these idiots start drinking beer and not talking. I might have to edit it. Guys, we love you so much. This is spectacular. We're having a lot of fun. Oh, we are. We're having a lot of fun. We really are. Josh Mudd is laughing his ass off because we're drunken fools. Pumpkin is very drinkable. So, Billy YJ, the Pumpkin. All right. Josh Mudd thinks you asshole. So, Billy YJ, I actually talked to a bunch of people at this place where I got all this beer, and I was like, well, I have a buddy who said Southern Tier has an Oktoberfest that's out of control, and all you have is this Pumpkin. Fuck this shit. And I was like, I don't want the Pumpkin. I want the Oktoberfest because my buddy, Billy YJ. Oh, is that called Pumpkin? It's called Pumpkin. Oh. I didn't get it because I was looking for Oktoberfest. So that makes sense. You were talking about pumpkins. Brian Cosner. Uh-oh, shots fired. As long as you're not three hours like Super Awesome Pinball Show. Brian Cosner, you keep up comments like that, you may be a tribe member soon. And I mean that because that's awesome because that means we're better than Super Awesome Pinball Show. Christopher Franchi, I love you, but we're better than your show. All right, so that's clearly bad. I said it. Is it worse than the Sam Adams? Oh, that was terrible. That stuff was terrible. Sam Adams. Sam Adams might have been old. It tasted old. This just tasted bad. Yeah, that's worse than Sam Adams. So can Sam Adams Excuse me We in pretty good shape Yeah Josh I ready to give you the Octoberfest back I got five of those fuckers I gotta drink yet Ari Jones says where the awkward laugh track drop Yeah, don't worry There's no awkwardness here, motherfucker Is that awkward enough for you? Three sheeps We're going three sheeps Oktoberfest Three sheeps to the wind? Everybody has the three sheeps Hey Albert, sorry Albert, if you're still out there, you are out there did Zach really text you what he said he texted you on his show? So Zach said, I got to share this. On the pinball show, Zach said that he texted Albert at like 1 in the morning after he had a few drinks. Zach doesn't drink very often. I thought this was great. Yeah, I don't believe the story already. Yeah, exactly. And he texted Albert and said, hey, so his goats are named Luke and Leah? Yep. and supposedly Zach texted him something. What was it? It was, oh, when you see Leia next, can you slap that ass for me? I was like, why are you telling us on this podcast? Albert, did that really happen? He said it was like 1 in the morning, and then Albert didn't get back to him until the next day because it was 1 in the morning. I thought that was pretty funny, though. Albert, I need you to verify that. Verify that. Yes, I was half asleep about slapping my ghost ass. No joke. So it is confirmed here on the 4 Minutes Pinball Podcast. We have an exclusive. That's real. Zach Mennie got drunk and told Albert to slap his goat's ass. Awesome. I love it. Awesome. Fucking great. You know, this reminds me of the first time you went to a beer tasting, Drew. Maybe we should tell that story. Oh, why don't you? Fuck it, Friday. Go ahead. No, no, no. This is our last beer. This is the three sheeps. Three sheeps. I don't know what we're doing here. Three sheeps. That's tasty. But it has a weird aftertaste again. Yeah, that one's okay. I would put it third next to Can and Sam Adams. Oh, you mean, wait. So Can, Sam Adams, this one, then the rest. Yeah, I'd agree with that. Yeah, it's not good. Well, Ian and I are in agreement. We're not, Ian and I don't agree on a lot, as you can tell. I'm like, Avengers is great. And he's like, poo-poo, poo-poo. So, no, that's not true, because we drink a lot, and we have similar palates when it comes to drinking. That's why we became best friends. True story. So the winner, easily. Did you say easily? It's one of the last two. Spot? No, I'm sorry. Hofbrau makes a fantastic fucking Oktoberfest, but this Eier or whatever is fucking delicious. No, it's really good. It's really good. Those last three or four were like, eh, you know, they just weren't very good. You know what surprises me is the local one, Lakefront Brewery, beat the spotten. How did we almost do those in order? You know what I mean? Sort of. Not really, because we started with the spotten. That got in the middle. I'm saying the first three were the top three, no matter how you cut it. And then those last three or four were like, eh. So let's go into some prices here since I have it here. The left-hand brewery, I got a six-pack for $10.49. Not good. Therese Edwards, who are you people? We're your people, Therese. Therese, we love you. The spotting, like I said, six-pack, $8.49. The hot brow, $8.99. They're talking about jam. Eyinger, $10.49 for the four-pack. Zachary, $8.99. All right. So often duplicated is something that comes up a lot. So Drew and I, when we started the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast, there was very little drinking going on, maybe special when lit would partake, but they would be kind of hush-hush about it. Now it seems like it's the cool thing to do is get hammered on your podcast and talk pinball. When I heard Zach say that today. Cutting edge. We're cutting edge, kids. It threw me back because I know Zach doesn't drink a lot, which is fine. Sam Adams, $8.49. No, so most of these are about $8 or $9 for a six-pack, give or take, right? Do you know it? The average. Okay. So price, except for the Eyinger, is like $2.50 a bottle because it's $10 for a four-pack or whatever. Four-pack, yep. So, sorry. So we're going to, yeah, we'll talk about that in a second. So these seven beers are essentially the same price, except for that one. That one's a little more, but all the rest are about $1 to $2 a piece, not a big deal. But there's two or three that are clear winners, right Ian? Yeah, I like this one. Yeah, because that one's good. And it's weird because, yeah, our palates are different, you know, like most people's. But, yeah, those last couple were just like, ooh. That left-hand brewery, sorry, it just wasn't for me. you know I'm sure people enjoy them and it's fine I'm not poo-pooing anybody I'm not poo-pooing like Avengers alright so I got a great story for you guys you guys want a fucking Friday or should we do a mailbag and then a fucking Friday yeah let's do mailbags alright let's get through our shit alright let's get through the list we had today alright so we'll get into the mailbag mailbag alright we don't have a mailbag music do we nope give zero fucks that's a good one I've tried, tried, tried, and I've tried even more. I've cried, cried, cried, and I can't recall what for. I've pet, I've pushed, I've yelled, and then let hope subside, subside. But the inevitable fact is that it never will impress. I've no more fucks to give you My fucks have run out of drive I've tried to go fuck shopping But there's no fucks left to buy I've no more fucks to give you And no more fucks I've tried to get I'm over my fuck budget And I'm now in fucking debt I love this song. I've tried, tried, tried Shut up. All right, we're good. All right, so, yeah, it's funny. That's our new mailbag. No, it's not. All right, so, I'll go over mailbag real quick. There's a lot of shit here. Josh Mudd. So, recently I switched from smoking marijuana to drinking a lot of craft beer. My pinball skills have gotten much better since I started craft beer, but now I have the makings of a beer belly. So, what do we do there? Have more beer. My pinball skills have gotten much better since I started craft beer, but now I have the makings of a beer belly. Pinball is more important. Josh Mudd, here's what I would say. Or you could drink whiskey. Low calories. I did tell him. I said liquor is quicker. Liquor is quicker, less calories. We've said this to ourselves a lot. Otherwise, if you like to craft beer and you want to go to craft beer, step up your gym game and start running buddy. Do that cardio. Because here's the thing. This is a great advice that was given by the founder of Sam Adams. So the guy he was on a he was doing an interview. It's a true fucking story. And the interviewee goes to him and says so I hear you taste test every batch of beer. And he goes yeah I drink a lot of beer during the day. I have to make sure that each batch is up to my standard. And she goes, okay, but you're so skinny. And he is a skinny dude. If you ever saw the founder of Sam Adams, he's a skinny dude. And he's like, here's the difference. He goes, food is food. And this is food. And he points to the beer. And he says, I just don't eat. He just drinks beer. And historically, that's Correct. There's enough nutrients in beer. You can live off of beer. There's enough there to live off of. So it's almost like liquid bread. Is that a real thing? Yeah. You could live off beer. That's like when monks would fast forever. They would drink beer, though. Just like ships. You know, they do ships. They do long voyages. Food runs out, but beer, they can always make more beer. So they'd always have beer on hand. So you have a little protein and a little beer, and you're good for the day. You're good to go. That's enough calories for you. So quit eating food. Duh. There you go. All right. I put this unanimous because we didn't want to name him because I thought maybe, because this wasn't mailbag, this was all on our Facebook tribe page. Oh, I know who that is. Yes, you do. I know who that is. It's a perfect question. So here I go. I have a problem that's perfect for this. Every Saturday I get up and bike ride or jog, have my coffee, and then play a few games of pinball. Unfortunately, this combination can lead to disaster. I was having an amazing ball on turtles, and my score was over 60 million. Then I got a rumbling in the butthole and almost crapped my pants. This has happened more than once. Am I the only one? When this occurs, do I drain the ball or go for the GC? I love how those are the options. I think I need to get the gadget they mentioned on saps. Oh, that was the thing that would hold the flipper for you. Oh, okay. Yeah, there's like some guy made a little mod. Yeah. It's like a little plastic piece you put on your button. Okay. And you can literally like hold the flipper. It's pretty actually ingenious. Yeah. It's just like a cheap little part, and it holds your flipper button. I was like, oh. Better than getting your wife. Yeah. Yeah. Ooh, so what do you do, man? Oh, I go for the GC. Are you kidding me? Why not? Why not? I told him a good crap is a good crap. Go for the good crap. Yeah. Yeah, and it is. Those are for the good crap. You're right. But you're not guaranteed a good crap. You could do both, though. No, you could drag the fucking thing in the bathroom. Why aren't your pinball machines set up in the toilet? If you know this is going to happen. All right, get those little wheelies that you can put on the bottom of your machine. Wheel that shit to the shitter. Plug it in. And then just go. Just go for it. Both at the same time. There you go. Win-win. All right. Andrew Payne. Tribe. I'm a location and virtual pinball player, and I have been dreaming of the day I owned my first machine. Today, I popped my own pinball chair with a 1993 Last Action Hero. In true poor man fashion, it is priced well at $2K in player's condition. Very excited to learn some maintenance and repair skills. Photos are in the listing. I don't own a Whirlwind or Twilight Zone. Andrew, you are in great company. That was my first game. and now I'm buying a $6,000 game, so buckle up, brother. Yeah, it's a slippery slope, dude. But a good first game. I actually sometimes have a say if I had it. Yeah, I was going to say, as far as first games go, I think I paid $2,200 for mine. Yeah, that's a killer deal and a killer first game. My first game was Black Rose, and that was also a very killer first game. You paid about $2,200 for that, right? That's cool. 27. I paid 27. Sold it and made a little bit of money because it got hot for a bit there. The guy I bought it from, he was in Rockford, Illinois and he was a he restored games and he knew how to fix them. He was whiz with it. I go in there and he's telling me, and I think I told him about your Black Rose and he goes oh did he do this mod on the uh the board it was like soldering a shit and I'm like what are you talking about and he's like he's like you know ground traces and wires and this one I knew nothing about nothing and I'm like yeah he totally did you know like it was just it was foreign it was a foreign language to me yeah because I literally knew nothing about pinball but it was so exciting you know so yeah but yeah he's telling me this stuff and I'm just like nodding my head like, yeah, yeah, totally. But, yeah, super cool. All right. I'm excited for you, Andrew. Let's go into some of these comments. By the way, this is a record comment night. 562 comments. Thanks, guys. We did it. How the fuck did that happen? We didn't do shit today. All right. No. So we just killed it. Oh, Tim Lee, Tim Lee. Oh, they're all called out. Tim Lee. The larger the beer belly, the easier it is to hit the action button. Oh, there you go. Ryan Cosner, you are fucking killing it. Chris Chandler, beer equals liquid bread. Totally true, brother. Let's see here. Let's see. Rumbling in the Butthole, my favorite 80s synth pop band. That was from Chris Chandler. Rick McClung, go Cartman. All right. Orbital Elbert, pinch the turtle head poking out until after you finish your GC. I feel like Orbital Elbert's pinched a few turtle heads. I feel like he can do it. When you're playing a roller coaster tycoon, do you go, what's coming down the ramp first? Rick McClellan, shit in a bucket. Oh, Chris Franchise here. With every colon cancer surgery, you get a free colostomy bag. Shit problems all. Oh, shit. Ian, do you miss Whitewater? Josh Mudd. Do I miss Whitewater? Yes and no. Whitewater, and I said this before, whitewater's shots and the game so fucking fun but the problem is i have a two-pin collection and there were times where i walked by and i had no desire to play that game but then i would have to like force myself to play whitewater and god damn i was like oh yeah that's right this game is fucking amazing so it's one of those games though like i wish i still had it but i couldn't guarantee I'd play it every day. I'm going to tell you. I liked Whitewater, though. I really did. Great game. There is no game. Someone proved me wrong. There's almost no game you put in a one or two-pin collection that's going to last. That's true. Right? That's true. I mean, you know. That's true. There just isn't. Yeah. You could name, okay, I love this game. You know, Medieval Madness, Twilight Zone, whatever. And you play it, you play it, you play it. Unless the theme really, really speaks to you. Sure, but even then... I have a hard time thinking Indiana Jones would go out of my collection. I'd be like, oh, fuck that game. I don't think I'd ever do that. Well, why don't you get one? You could afford it. I cannot afford that game. Get rid of Oktoberfest. That game is way expensive. But you know what I'm saying, though. I want to keep Oktoberfest, and that proves you wrong right there. I love Oktoberfest. No, no, and that's cool. I miss Metallica. I would play that game every day, but it's just one game is one game, and you play it all the time. Glenn Glenn Waechter. Sorry, he just wrote Dobos. Thank you. Thank you. Is that Prairie Doggin? Yes, Therese, that's Prairie Doggin. And if you wonder why she's a tribe member, this is why she's a tribe member, by the way. Munster, is this my dream theme? Cannot let it go. Makes sense. No, you can't let it go. And, you know, for me, yeah, Indiana Jones might be my dream theme, and I can't let it go. Yeah, but if I ever get it. I probably wouldn't let it go. But, Josh, you have six games, so that's my point. Well, Whitewater is going to be – how are you liking Whitewater? Oh, there you go. Throw that out there. Yeah. Let me see how – what's your review, dude? How many cheese slices are you giving it, man? Because Whitewater is – like I said, it was a fun game. I love the shots. Sorry. My son, who should have been in bed two hours ago, my wife, just texted me. He is still giggling at us because we're drunken idiots. Oh, beautiful. Chris Chandler, I've only got one game. The Simpsons. I love you, man. The Simpsons Pinball Party. If it weren't Simpsons, I would have sold it. See? Theme matters, man. Love it, but not real deep. Josh Mudd, the fuck it isn't. Like, have you done everything in that game? I doubt it, dude. I doubt it because there's a shit ton in that game. If you fucking hit those insanity fall shots and get the insanity fall champion, you can get that score up there. But, man, that game is a lot of fun. There's a lot to do. All right. So what else? We have, sorry. I got distracted. All right, so let's go back into the mailbag. Love it, but not real deep. Yeah, that's right. Awesome. Speaking of Rick McClung, Mr. Shit in a Bucket, been following you on Facebook a bit, tuned in to the podcast. Oh, my God, you guys had me rolling on the TMNT review. See, Rick, this is the funny thing. This is why I loved your email because the second I read that, I was like, my first reaction was, oh, I'm glad he thought we were funny and we had a good time. My second reaction was, what the fuck did we say on the TMNT review? You know, Rick, I have the span of a – my mental span is that of a sloth. I don't give a shit. I don't know. We don't know why we are as good as we are. We'll leave it at that. And who sent me that? Fuck, I got to remember. somebody sent me a message or something and they said like what is your wife oh i know what it was sorry all right so fox city's uh pinball which is uh green bay wisconsin our boys yeah they they're like hardcore pinball guys they're they're tournament players there's a lot of good guys up there they they're they're awesome at pinball and during one of their streams they were doing a turtle stream and somebody said something about, oh, they were having a problem with their turtles and someone said, Drew's having the same problem with the turtles. And somebody messaged me, and I wish I could remember who, and said Oh, I'm sorry, Sean Frayden, Tribe Member number 8. He said, what's it like when somebody just says Drew with no last name and they know who they're talking about? Drew's having this problem with his turtles. and I said and I just responded to him I said so frequently I'll ask my wife hey what's it like to be married to a pinball celebrity and she leans over and lovingly looks at me and she whispers in my ear you're an idiot and that's what I responded to Sean and it's so true because that's like my funny thing with my wife now all the time and I'll be like, what's it like to be married to a pinball celebrity? And she's like, shut up, you're an idiot. You know our lives, guys. It's great. So, anyways, sorry. All right, so thank you, Rick, by the way. Thank you. All right. Last one. Jasper Rotter. Life doesn't get any better. Got three Poor Man Pinball Podcast shirts in the mail last week. By the way, I think we had a record last month. We did, guys. Thank you. Yeah, we sold quite a few shirts. We appreciate it. SilverballSwag.com. Thank you. So much. So much, because that is really helping with this. Yes. As you notice, our quality went up this week, and it's going to keep getting better, but we need help. We need help, guys. So please don't hesitate to buy a shirt. It's going for a good cause. Hot Wheels got delivered today. We put all of that money into this show so we can get better. Yeah, we don't buy Dodge Demons. Yes, exactly. We don't take our wives out to dinner ever. No, I'm joking. We do, but with our own money. But we do care about it, and it does help us. So here we go. Hot Wheels got delivered today, trading my Judge Dredd for a Dirty Harry tomorrow and picking up a creature from Black and Gold with the LCD mod next week. Hope you guys are doing well. Jasper, it sounds like you're having a pinball week, man. Hot Wheels got delivered today, trading my Judge Dredd for a Dirty Harry. Hey, Jasper. Judge Dredd for a Dirty Harry. That's a fair trade. I think they're both like $3,000 machines. Yeah, but Judge Dredd's are loaded. I don't know. And, Chad, what do you guys think about that, Judge Dredd or Dirty Harry? I never played a Dirty Harry. No, I haven't. I have not either. I'm kind of excited for you, though, Jasper. Jasper, you're in the wrong place. You need to go to the Rich Man's Podcast up the street. Picking up a creature in black looking like an LTD mic. Fuck you, by the way. Jasper. That's awesome. It's called Canada's Canada Podcast, and you can find it on SoundCloud. Yeah. Right next to your Dodge Demon. Mrs. Drew, keeping it real. You better believe it, Therese. This was, you're an idiot. You mean screams, right, Chris Chandler? She's a whisperer. She's not a screamer, dude. She says, you're no goat master, Glenn Glenn Waechter. All right. Billy Whitehead, Christopher Franchi, Drew is famous. Oh. All right. Rick McClung, Maiden will never leave my collection. Rick McClung? Yeah, no doubt. Well, Rick, I left my collection. Rick McClung, dildos. No, we're not doing that, dude. No. Rick McClung, dick weights. We are doing dick weights, Bill. Don't insult Sloth, Teresa Edwards. Oh, come on. All right. So what else? I'm out, fellas. Great show as always. Thank you, Josh Mudd. Appreciate it, brother. All right. So dread. All right. So we're saying dread. Yeah, see, I would say dread is the better of the two. Dread is a good game. But I had never played the other ones. No, I haven't. No, Dread's fun, but it is what it is. All right, Drew, let's wrap it up. But we're still going to do a little fucking Friday. We're going to tell a little story after this. But, Drew, what did you learn today? I learned that our listeners cannot stop thinking about dildos. Oh, nice, nice. I learned a couple things. I learned that Einger is a fucking fantastic beer. I need more beer. Here. Here. Share. I found that it is a fantastic October. You took it all. You dick. There's more. There's three more in the fridge. That happened. That is a fantastic fucking beer, guys. It is. You can find it in your local place. It is from Munich. Check your imports. But that is fantastic beer. It's German for Einger. Einger. Yes. Yes. I also learned that Drew's wife is incredible in many ways. You learned that? You've known her for 15 years. Jesus Christ. Re-invigorated by the fact that she still puts you in check, but she got us these amazing glasses. I want to raise a glass for a man. Poor man. Pinball podcast. Because I think these were the coolest little gifts that I could ever get. Super cool. My wife is the best. I talk shit, but she's the best. She's not a sweet person when you talk to her, but you know she's sweet. She's sweet. But here's the thing. Ian, 18 years. 18 years of friendship here. Ian and I have known each other for literally 18 years, which is a long time. We're legal now. He's got fucking. We didn't have to wait for that. That's been going on for 18 years. What is happening here? I'm so sorry, everybody. It's fine. so the beer that was the Octoberfest 18 years Ian and I and I want to say from the bottom of my heart because you know people always talk no I'm being sincere for a second I know I'm sorry I'm still laughing at me no it's fine you know me I get it all the time no it's fine you know people always talk especially Orbital Orbital Albert always talks about our camaraderie and that's because we've been friends for so fucking long can you believe it's been almost two decades yeah you know 18 years ago when I met this guy, it was funny because there's no way in hell you would think that, A, we would be best friends at all. But number two, what was really funny is the fact that 18 years later, we still share the same hobbies and still have the same passions. And even like we didn't have these hobbies and passions 18 years ago. If one of us discovers something we're into, the other one tends to follow. and we intend to have a great time fucking doing it. We do. And, yeah, goddammit, I love you, dude. I love you too, brother. But, yeah, I just, that to me is, that's awesome. That's worth its weight in gold. We're probably going to be friends when we're dead. 69, 80, whatever. On the porch. Barely able to crap ourselves. We're going to be smoking cigars, talking about how Josh Mudd got us drunk on a stream because of fucking Oktoberfest. Yep. And we're going to talk about, remember that podcast we used to do? That was fucking stupid. Hang on, guys. Once again, I'm not getting too sentimental, but 71 fucking episodes. Yeah. So, not only 18 years of marriage with Ian and I, and I'll call it a marriage because fuck it, we are. Therese, yes, my face got real red. And my face is always red, Therese. You know that. And 17, 17, 71 episodes. Yeah, 71 episodes. You know what's funny about that is after about episode 50, I stopped counting, and then it got really fast. And isn't that funny? And if you count our Fuck It Fridays and stuff, we've literally done over 100 episodes. Yeah, very cool. Very cool. So congrats. Thanks, guys. for all the listen, all the support. You guys, seriously, you guys come out every day. I know. We're having so much fun with you guys. I don't want to be a shill. Our tribe's amazing. Yes. Our fan page is amazing. Yes. Our friends that we have met through this hobby have been amazing. Guys, I don't want to be a shill, but go to the Pinball Promoters Database on Twip. We have to beat Zach Many. That's it. Oh, that's bullshit. That's it. So all you guys who are out there... I don't think we have all the five-star ratings. All you guys who are out there, go there, give us a review. We were number one for literally like four months. Yeah, bring us back. So give us the review. You know, if you have something negative to say, let us know. We'll fix it. Yes, Avengers is amazing, Billy Whitejack. So there you go. All right. All right, so let's. I wonder what the guy in the clothes. I wonder what the guy in the clothes. I wonder what the guy in the clothes. Thank you. The views expressed on this podcast don't necessarily reflect the views of our sponsors. Obviously, they don't really care as much as we do about buttholes and what's inside them. So thanks for listening, guys. Have a great day. Bye-bye. _(Acquisition: groq_whisper, Enrichment: v3)_ --- *Exported from Journalist Tool on 2026-04-13 | Item ID: d3446785-057d-4360-bad6-6acfad8e775c*