# Total Crap- the art of Johnny Bergeron

**Source:** This Flippin' Podcast  
**Type:** podcast_episode  
**Published:** 2020-02-17  
**Duration:** 66m 21s  
**Beat:** Pinball

**URL:** https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/thisflippinpodcast/episodes/Total-Crap--the-art-of-Johnny-Bergeron-easg6g

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## Analysis

Johnny Bergeron (aka Johnny Crap), a Montreal-based artist with a background in graffiti, skateboard culture, and metal/punk band poster design, discusses his career path and his work as the primary artist for Stern Pinball's Jurassic Park machine released in 2019. The episode covers his artistic evolution, self-taught approach, the referral from Zombie Yeti that led to his Stern contract, the seven-month production process for Jurassic Park's art package, and his subsequent immersion into the pinball community as both an artist and player.

### Key Claims

- [HIGH] Johnny Bergeron is 47 years old — _Johnny Bergeron stated directly in the podcast: 'I'm 47.'_
- [HIGH] Bergeron was introduced to Stern Pinball by Zombie Yeti, who was overwhelmed with projects and referred him — _Bergeron: 'That's probably why Zombie Yeti, because he's the one that referred me to Stern. Yeah. Because I think he was just swamped with too many projects, again.'_
- [HIGH] Greg Ferrer was the primary Stern contact who first reached out to Bergeron about Jurassic Park — _Bergeron: 'it was like Greg Ferrer that like hit me up first and could boost, you know, start by explaining what they needed and what they wanted.'_
- [HIGH] The Jurassic Park art package took seven months from test piece to final file delivery — _Bergeron: 'for me it was about seven months like from like my test piece to like like delivering like all the files and like everything.'_
- [HIGH] The backglass with orange tones that Bergeron initially created as a test piece ended up being used for the premium version — _Bergeron: 'I did a backglass. Okay. It's actually like the backglass that ended up being used I think for the premium. Yeah, that's the one I did. Like there was like a previous version though. Like I reworked it after because like once I started, like I did that test piece.'_
- [HIGH] Stern deliberately delayed Bergeron's work on the playfield because 'there are so many factors that come into building the playfield' — _Bergeron: 'they threw me because like not everything was set to for a playfield yeah so like playfield is always something that moves like almost to to the end...they just made me wait on that they're like okay don't touch the playfield'_
- [HIGH] Bergeron was flown in by Stern to see the Jurassic Park prototype and understand the mechanics — _Bergeron: 'So at some point, like the, the, the play field was pretty much set for them. They flew me in to show me the prototype and show me what each target was doing.'_
- [HIGH] The map design on the Jurassic Park playfield was mandated by Stern, not Bergeron's original concept — _Host: 'what brought you to make the playfield art a map?' Bergeron: 'The map wasn't my idea. Yeah. Like I mean they told me like what it was and it had to be sort of a map.'_
- [HIGH] Bergeron has become an active pinball player, now playing in a league at North Star bar — _Host: 'you're in a league now, you play at North Star and stuff. So did that transition happen during the process of making the game?' (Bergeron affirms in response)._
- [HIGH] Stern released a code update for Jurassic Park that added a mini wizard mode called 'Escape Nublar' — _Bergeron: 'especially, like, since they updated the code now, the, the little challenge, uh, game that they added. Yeah. Like the Escape Nublar. That's a lot of fun.'_

### Notable Quotes

> "I've always been drawing since like I was very young. Yeah. And like, just drawing all the time and I but I've never seen it as a as something I could do with my life really"
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~3:30
> _Establishes Bergeron's early artistic drive despite initial skepticism about turning art into a career_

> "I remember like one of my first graffiti was a painting like a huge Uzi with Ice-T written yeah yeah and uh and it was like in ballet like you know like it's a small suburbs of Montreal, you know, like really small town. So like the dentist was probably like really weirded out by that."
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~5:00
> _Illustrates Bergeron's immersion in West Coast hip-hop and graffiti culture in Montreal_

> "I'm very much a generalist, I think. I like to touch a bit of everything."
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~15:45
> _Describes Bergeron's versatile artistic approach, which appears central to why Stern hired him_

> "I would say like if I try to do a Johnny Kraft Jurassic Park like would probably look different. Yeah. But it would probably not serve like the licensor"
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~19:00
> _Explains Bergeron's professional ability to adapt his style to licensing requirements rather than impose his signature aesthetic_

> "I never thought I would be asked to do a pinball. I'm not from the pinball world. What I've always enjoyed from pinball, like many other things like comics, it's just the style of drawings."
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~21:30
> _Highlights that Bergeron was attracted to pinball primarily as a visual medium, not from gaming background_

> "They just made me wait on that they're like okay don't touch the playfield and it was the most complicated part you're gonna have to do"
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~31:00
> _Reveals Stern's project management strategy of sequencing artwork to account for mechanical design changes_

> "I wanted it to make it look functional for them. Like I wanted a pinball player to like be happy with it, you know, like not, not me, you know?"
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~44:00
> _Demonstrates Bergeron's mindset shift toward serving the pinball community rather than creating art for its own sake_

> "there's not much that they had me like to change like sometimes they had me something changed because like either their plastic piece was changing altogether"
> — **Johnny Bergeron**, ~50:15
> _Shows iterative nature of pinball art production as mechanical elements evolve during development_

### Entities

| Name | Type | Context |
|------|------|---------|
| Johnny Bergeron | person | Montreal-based pinball artist for Stern; also known as 'Johnny Crap' and 'Zen' (graffiti tag); age 47; created art package for Jurassic Park (2019); self-taught artist with background in gig posters, graffiti, and metal/punk band merchandise design; now active in pinball community as player |
| Zombie Yeti | person | Stern Pinball artist who referred Johnny Bergeron to Stern; overloaded with projects at the time; also a pinball artist and designer |
| Greg Ferrer | person | Art director/contact at Stern Pinball who first reached out to Bergeron about Jurassic Park project; coordinated design feedback and helped integrate Bergeron into the Stern workflow |
| Keith Elwin | person | Pinball designer at Stern; worked closely with Bergeron on Jurassic Park, answering design questions and reviewing artwork integration |
| Stern Pinball | company | Major pinball manufacturer; hired Bergeron to create Jurassic Park art package; employs generalist artists from gig poster, metal art, and graffiti backgrounds |
| Jurassic Park | game | Licensed pinball machine released by Stern in 2019; first major project for Johnny Bergeron; features distinctive green map playfield, multiple cabinet artwork variations, helicopter toy, and code updates including 'Escape Nublar' mini wizard mode |
| Dirty Donny | person | Stern Pinball artist; mentioned for distinctive, highly stylistic artwork on Aerosmith and Metallica machines; represents painterly approach to pinball art |
| Pushead | person | Iconic metal/gory artwork artist from the 1980s-90s skateboard and album cover scene; major influence on Bergeron's artistic development; known for reclusive nature and distinctive technique |
| John Yowsey | person | Classic pinball artist from the 1990s; created artwork for Medieval Madness, Twilight Zone, and Addams Family; known for very graphic, stylistic approach with heavy black line work |
| North Star | venue | Bar/arcade venue in pinball community where Johnny Bergeron now plays in a league |
| Pinburgh | event | Major pinball tournament where Jurassic Park premium was revealed |
| Game of Thrones | game | Stern pinball machine criticized for flat, beige playfield design; contrasted unfavorably with Jurassic Park's colorful approach |

### Topics

- **Primary:** Johnny Bergeron's artistic background and career path, Jurassic Park pinball art production process, Stern Pinball's hiring and artist management practices, Transition from gig poster/metal art to pinball design
- **Secondary:** Influence of graffiti and West Coast culture on artistic development, Self-taught vs. formal art training, Generalist vs. specialist artistic approaches, Pinball playfield design and mechanical constraints on artwork

### Sentiment

**Positive** (0.82) — Host and guest display mutual respect and enthusiasm. Bergeron speaks positively about his experience at Stern, the team's support, and his evolution into pinball. The tone is collaborative and celebratory of his work. No significant criticism or conflict in the episode; minor self-criticism from Bergeron about aspects he'd change if designing again, but presented as natural reflective growth.

### Signals

- **[personnel_signal]** Stern Pinball successfully recruited Johnny Bergeron (a non-pinball artist with gig poster and metal art background) through a referral from Zombie Yeti, expanding its roster of generalist artists who can adapt style to licensing requirements (confidence: high) — Bergeron: 'That's probably why Zombie Yeti, because he's the one that referred me to Stern.' Discussion of Stern's strategy of hiring artists from diverse backgrounds including graffiti and poster design
- **[design_philosophy]** Stern appears to deliberately hire artists with diverse non-pinball backgrounds (poster, graffiti, metal art) who can adapt their style to licensing requirements rather than imposing a signature house style (confidence: high) — Host: 'I think Stern Pinball and the way that they've created this new group of artists is really interesting because a lot of you guys seem to have a really similar background. Like gig posters, like Dirty Donny, Zombie Yeti, yourself' and Bergeron's discussion of adapting his style for Jurassic Park
- **[design_innovation]** Jurassic Park playfield features a thematic map design with coordinated color palette (greens, blues) that serves both aesthetic and functional purposes (insert placement, visual hierarchy) (confidence: high) — Host: 'the green map and you got the blues underneath like there an artistic sense to it where it not just like hey we need to put some ink down on the playfield where we can have inserts you know there a lot more to it than that' and Bergeron's discussion of map placement and color choices
- **[product_launch]** Stern released a code update for Jurassic Park adding a mini wizard mode called 'Escape Nublar' that allows players to access challenge scenarios (confidence: high) — Bergeron: 'especially, like, since they updated the code now, the, the little challenge, uh, game that they added. Yeah. Like the Escape Nublar.'
- **[design_philosophy]** Stern maintains an integrated design process where artists (Bergeron) work closely with designers (Keith Elwin, Greg Ferrer) and have direct access to prototypes and CAD files to understand mechanical constraints and artistic integration opportunities (confidence: high) — Bergeron: 'Greg was really cool with me. He's like, dude, like we're going to help you. Like if you have questions, you can hit up like Zombie Yeti' and description of being flown in to see the prototype
- **[manufacturing_signal]** Stern strategically sequences pinball art production, deferring playfield design work until mechanical elements are finalized, as playfield layout can change significantly during development (confidence: high) — Bergeron: 'playfield is always something that moves like almost to to the end you know like it's like you know there's many there are so many factors that come into building the playfield and sometimes subjects change because like something doesn't work the way they want it'
- **[community_signal]** Johnny Bergeron transitioned from external contractor to active community member, joining a league at North Star bar and developing deeper understanding of pinball mechanics through play (confidence: high) — Host question about whether Bergeron got into pinball during the process, with Bergeron confirming league play at North Star; his discussion of noticing details that 'bug' him now after extensive play
- **[industry_signal]** Modern Stern pinball art (Bergeron, Dirty Donny) adopts more painterly, detailed approaches compared to classic pinball artists like John Yowsey who used graphic, heavy black-line techniques (confidence: medium) — Host: 'the use of colors, you know, like...Stern has done a good job and I think Jurassic Park does a good job in in using colors and really popping the playfield' and discussion comparing modern art to Yowsey's graphic style
- **[licensing_signal]** Stern manages licensing complexity by limiting which licensed properties contribute physical toy elements (e.g., declined to license Jeep truck for Jurassic Park, created in-house alternative instead) (confidence: high) — Bergeron: 'you know they already work with one license they don't want to reach out to like more you know get more and more people involved like you know like to have like the original jeep i think would have been like tough so uh so you know like they probably opted to like make their own'
- **[sentiment_shift]** Johnny Bergeron expresses retrospective reflections on his own design choices, noting details he would change having played the machine extensively since release, indicating self-critical growth (confidence: high) — Bergeron: 'if you ask me today, like our pinball machine, I'll probably change some stuff because now I've been playing it a lot at the bar, you know? Yeah. And I'm like, ah, this part bugs me now'

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## Transcript

 The episode you are about to hear contains explicit words. The opinions within are those of the hosts and in no way imply that anyone listening to this podcast agrees with anything we say. Please send complaints to thisflippinpodcast at gmail.com. Nice to see you and our special guest is someone who is truly a fan of the snowboard game when playing it. Well cool I'm really happy to see you. I'm joined by Johnny crap aka wait John John Jonathan Bergeron aka Johnny crap right pinball artist for Jurassic Park pinball like the title basically of 2019 kind of blew it out of the park with your first game and I follow you on Instagram I we seem to have some common interest and so I was like let me hit you up several times over and over again and see if I can The Messages and well, I I talked to I actually reached out to uh, zombie yeti like a while like a while back Can he's been on the show and I was like man? I was like I want to get this guy on he's like I don't know if he's gonna I don't know if he does that kind of thing and I was like, alright, and so I think I hit you up on Instagram and Nothing and I was like, okay, and I don't want to like harass the guy But I'm like, but I see the shit you post I'm like We're into the same thing. I just want to have him on to talk. I think your story is really interesting. I think Stern Pinball and the way that they've created this new group of artists is really interesting because a lot of you guys seem to have a really similar background. Like gig posters, like Donny Gillies (Dirty Donny), Zombie Yeti, yourself kind of come from this like real gig poster background, which I think is really cool. But I also think it's interesting, like seeing what you're into. Like music wise, you're coming from a very culturally heavy scene into pinball, which is a really kind of weird cultural scene because it's. Almost just pinball. Yeah, people are as intense in that as metalheads are. Yeah. And yeah, it's like it's it's it's it's a it's an interesting world to join in. And so your your background, how old are you? How old are you? I got to ask because you grew up in the. I'm 47. 47. All right. I just turned 48. Yeah, I saw that on the line too. Yeah. It's kind of funny. Like, oh, yeah, it's like we're we're at that. We grew up in the same like we grew up like skateboarding. I never BMX but I skateboarded so I grew up in that you know that I would say golden era of modern skateboarding. Yeah. Where you really saw a change in like the attitude with graphics just the entire art explosion. I know you come from like a graffiti background. I used to do graffiti. Yeah. So yeah. So how'd you get into What's your background? How'd you get into art? Yeah, how'd you get into art? Like what? I've always been drawing since like I was very young. Yeah. And like, like just drawing all the time and I but I've never seen it as a as something I could do with my life really like, you know, even like in when I was in high school, like my mom like used to tell me like, you know, just pursue a career in art. I'm like, no. Yeah, my parents wanted me to do that. Yeah. Which is pretty rare. Yeah. Usually people are like, discourage you from doing that. But, you know, I was like, no, no, I just, you know, I don't know what I want to do, but I don't want to do that. And, but then like, I fell into like skateboarding and graffiti. Like I was really influenced by the West Coast, West Coast culture for some reason. Like I was, you know, I live in Montreal where it's really cold at winter and like, it's just, I've never really got into like the Quebec culture too or like you know like I don't feel Canadian to certain extent yeah like my culture really came from the West Coast and everything like you know I remember like it like one of my first graffiti was a painting like a huge Uzi with ice tea written yeah yeah and uh and it was like in ballet like you know like it's a small suburbs of I'm a little bit of a fan of the street culture. I was in Montreal, you know, like, like really small town. So like the dentist was probably like really weirded out by that. But, you know, like I really got into graffiti after that. And the mix with like everything merged at some point, like, you know, like the music, the graffiti, like the street culture, the like the skateboard culture and all that really You don't work a worker. The criminal Main Penalty List of grosses How you adapted to be like that There could be so much point in a company's schedule to make. If you have any questions article they could be in the chat box and I do think you could bechuss podcast review Continue buried back in Alors, David decid empezando and we have to go going out this way better straight spicy returned really II like like it's a I bet you for I tell me next We're like around like 20. Yeah, wow. Like doing like, you know, a graffiti job inside of a skate shop and things like that, you know. But I just kept like going bouncing from jobs to job that had nothing to do with really what I was doing the rest of the time. And at night, I would just come back home and like just draw and, and at some point I got asked to do like some local, like posters for local gigs for like punk rock bands. and things like that and then a promoter saw some of my work and started getting me more work and uh snowballed from there like i just kept doing like bigger bigger acts like you know time after time and job after like going from jump to job yeah and uh and then i was approached like a while back like i was probably like i was around 30 at that point when like my first real So, yeah. So it was kind of funny to do. And from there, like I just, you know, got more and more work from those companies. Those T-shirts are all made like, it's not Kid Rock that hires you, right? Obviously, it's like a like big companies that do merch for a bunch of bands. And so like they have a big roster of bands and they started like giving me more of a And so like they have a big roster of bands and they started like giving me more and more work and and I ended up doing a lot of metal stuff for a long time like you know I started doing some Slayer and you know by at this point I've done probably like 20 Slayer t-shirts. So that's how it got started for real. And then I managed to leave my daily jobs. I was basically working all day at a daily job and then I would come home and I had more stamina I guess, like around 30. I could work all night too on things and go to bed at 2am and get back up at 7am to go work on a regular job. But, you know, at some point I managed to be able to just quit those jobs and just concentrate on just drawing all day. So now, now your style, like your commercial style, because like, were your parents, was your mom or were your parents art artists at all? No, no, no, not at all. I mean, so in their, their support for you was just because it was something you and you were into doing and they were just like, yeah, go with it. And so were you trained at all? Like, did you go like, were you in like special high school program or anything like that? No, I, I pretty much learned on my own. I'm, I'm self taught. And I just like to discover and back then, like there was no internet or anything like that. Yeah. So basically, you'd look at books and try to learn from that, like by just looking a lot that, you know, the materials and like buying materials, and I've been trying things and sometimes, you know, like it probably took me longer to learn my stuff than if I went to school for that. But I just kept at it, you know, like because like going to like at some point we have Cégep here. Cégep is like after high school, before university. Yeah. There's kind of like a couple of years where it's like that, you know, like you do a transition from high school to university, basically. And I went to CEGEP in arts, but like I already had like a good background in arts that like I learned on my own. And when I got there, like people in CEGEP, like basically they got into that program because they couldn't get in their main program. It's just a way for them to get into school. Yeah. By going through the art like program. Yeah. So I was very not challenged in there. And I started doing graffiti too, like pretty heavily at that point, like doing really big pieces by the train tracks and stuff like that. And I was really influenced by that. And I used to show my teachers and my teacher were like just discarding that like, like it would never amount to anything, you know? And they're like, well, that's, you know, just a phase, whatever. And like, who's who's selling right now in art, in the art world? Yeah, like just like big graffiti artists. So we're there back then. Now this was in like this was like late 80s early 90s? Yeah yeah yeah and a very early 90s like like 92 around that um so anyway so i basically learned on my own you know uh i remember taking a class like for oil painting but i was already like painting oil for like a couple of years yeah i took a class at like a little community uh like was where was it like it was like a above I was on the second floor of the scout meeting place. So I met people there and they were just old ladies. They were like, you know, people, they always say like, when I'm retired, I'm going to learn how to paint or whatever. And so I was like the kid in there. You know, I was probably like 20, no, not even 20. I've been like 18 or 19 at that point, just learning with them. That's the only class like that I took for like real painting. What were you what were you looking at? Like as far as like artwork, I mean, like being in the skateboarding and stuff. I mean, I think back to when like I was like high school, like I know Puss Head was big, like you would see his stuff and it was like that real, you know, like. It kind of I don't know how to describe his style, but it's, you know, it's like it's kind of like a gory metal. Yeah, but it's also like really finely done, you know, it's like he does he has his own technique like there's a real puss head technique that I know that I would steal, you know. Yeah, there's two or three artists that made like a good living. We're like reproducing that. Yeah, that style, you know, after because he's very reclusive to like, he's not like he's hard to get to and like, which is like, I, I totally understand like, Once you have your thing going and he's like just he's doing his own thing. Like, yeah. And I think like the beauty of him is like. He was just doing it, you know, like I don't think he had like a really like I'm going to be positive, you know, like he's just doing his thing. So, yeah, that's kind of cool. But yeah, like back then, like that style wise, I always had like a like a split personality when it comes to like art, like I love a lot of the really lowbrow kind of stuff, but I also like the fine arts. And so like back then, I used to really love everything that was skateboard and album covers, like all the old punk and hardcore covers, like the ink work, you know, like the subhumans from the UK, those kind of albums, like always like circle jerks. I always loved everything that was artwork circle jerks back then. And so I was very influenced by those guys. And at the same time. A lot by Cezanne and like those like Impressionists and Dali and, you know, like like all those, you know, those big names. And even like the like the Dutch painters and, you know, like stuff like that. So I always like both. I'm still like that. You know, like I would draw like, like a super gory, like cover, like T-shirt for Slayer, but like come to the studio and I would like to try to do fine paintings of garbage and Yeah, yeah, yeah. and stuff like that. Yeah, so. Well, I think some of it like going through your going through your portfolio and looking at your work, like I think the like the Mexican skull pieces are really interesting because they really do cross both, both those kind of genre. You know, it's like they're done in a very fine art style, but it is that kind of like punk, like suicidal tendencies. You know, like I think about that, like you put a bandana around your head a certain way and that's what I go back to. Yeah. So it's your your work is all over the place, which is really interesting. And even reading like your bio where it's like, you know, you go by Jonathan Bergeron or Johnny Kraft and it is it's like If you look at your work, there really is that division. Yeah. Which is really interesting. I also add zen as my graph part. Right, right. I'm really, yeah. Yeah, it's funny. I was just attracted to all sorts of different... I'm very much a generalist, I think. I like to touch a bit of everything. I was trying to sculpt at some point too, but at some point, I like so many different things that it takes away I'm a little bit away from my main focus. Yeah. My wife tells me all the time, you know, she's like, just focus on one thing, you know, like, but I can't like I just I just love doing all sorts of different things. Now, what type of sculpture were you doing? I was just trying to do like, like a bust of Jeffrey Lebowski, like, a big, like, big, like Lebowski thing. So I was trying to do like a mini bust. But then I noticed that somebody else online like was already selling something. I was like, Oh, I'm gonna waste my time doing that. So like getting into like the whole figure thing? Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. That rabbit hole. Yeah. Now, all right, so, you, let's get into Jurassic Park, because I think that, I think like going through and looking at your portfolio and seeing like how broad your interest is in just what you're making, like you're all over the place, And then looking at, like, if I looked at your portfolio and I looked at Jurassic Park, I would not necessarily go, that's Johnny Kraft's work. Yeah. But at the same time you a professional artist who can create an art package like Jurassic Park you know Yeah, I think that's what brought me to Stern. The fact that I could do a bit anything sort of like, you know, like I could I could change my style, like according to like a certain need. Like I would say like if I try to do a Johnny Krap Jurassic Park like would probably look different. Yeah. But it would probably not serve like the licensor and like you know like like because Jurassic Park let's say it's you know like I can't start being cartoony or like it just needed to look a certain way. So you know I always try to adjust my like I've done many jobs where like I had to adjust my style. Yeah. I feel good doing that. You know, like I don't, like certain people have like really one style and that's what they're going to be approached for. But I'm going to be approached often like because I can do it, you know, like I can adjust and like work with them like towards a certain goal. So. So, oh, go ahead. Sorry. Yeah. I was about to say, that's probably why Zombie Yeti, because he's the one that referred me to Stern. Yeah. Because I think he was just swamped with too many projects, again. So he hit me up and he's like, would you be interested? Do you ever think of doing a pinball? I'm like, I never thought I would be asked to do a pinball. I'm not from the pinball world. What I've always enjoyed from pinball, like many other things like comics, it's just the style of drawings. Everything that was graphic always attracted me. So whenever I saw pinball, I would often play it, but more than anything, it was the visual . You know, like a medium to work with, you know, like it's it's something that's totally different that I've never done. But like, it's gonna be awesome to work on. Yeah. So, so, you know, that way, like he introduced me to Stern and then like, they got back to me and yeah, yeah. So, so, so let's talk about that process. Like the process of actually creating a pinball machine, um, our package is, yeah, I don't know. Like what, what, what goes into that? Like you, they call you up and they say, Hey man, we have, um, they obviously knew the title, right? Yeah. So they approach and they're like, we have Jurassic Park. Like, yeah, walk us, like walk us through that process. Cause it's, Yeah, it's fascinating. I think it's fascinating because you're working with you're working with a license. I mean, Jurassic Park is interesting because a license, it wasn't nailed down to like a Jurassic Park movie. You know, you did have like the one character that, you know, you obviously had to use a likeness and stuff, but it it seemed very wide open because you weren't so tied down. Yeah, so what's that process like? I think the idea that they had was like basically to do Jurassic Park anyway like that was like in between movies sort of you know like how you have like Marvel comics between movies so that explains a bit more the story like Star Wars and like the Star Wars series yeah yeah they keep expanding you know like and explaining other things that like are loopholes you know so they they fill it up and I think like the idea of Jurassic Park's a bit that you know it's like it's an It's another story, but like it's based, you know, there's a history there, but like it's other stories, like it's a new adventure sort of. So, yeah, no, when they approached me, like Zombietti told me already, like, I think you're going to like this one, so, you know, like I'm not telling you what it is, I'll let them contact you. Yeah. And it was like Greg Freres that like hit me up first and could boost, you know, start by explaining what they needed and what they wanted. And then they asked me to do like basically a test piece just to see like, you know, if it would work, if it would fly with the licensor. So we went from there. I took about two, three days to just put something down, like an idea of how I would go about. Now what were you doing? Did you do a playfield? What type of piece did you do? I did a backglass. Okay. It's actually like the backglass that ended up being used I think for the premium. Yeah, that's the one I did. That has like more oranges in it. Yeah. Yeah. So I went with that one. Like there was like a previous version though. Like I reworked it after because like once I started, like I did that test piece like strains laur splgun Antoine Capont, Bell and his unit Translation & Captions Jerry It's a little bit smaller. I've got more chairs but it still looks smaller. Yeah, well, I feel better too. Okay so I haven't played any games myself. I was friends with K Cert rằng when I was in high school right. Yeah, so I was friends with K Cert rằng But time-wise, it was just like, and I was a bit nervous too, like, because when you work with a licensor, sometimes like they ask you, okay, take that dinosaur and move it to the back and then like move this one to the side. And, and then if I start doing like, like original artwork, like it would have messed with me time-wise. So, yeah, so like, you know, because the process was pretty quick too. So, I had like, I had to, you know, get in gears and because if I started like painting, I would have to do it. I think by by hand like it would have been the it could quite some work and so you start so at what point did you start working on the play field like did you start like on cabinet art because it's more of a flat medium all the yeah they threw me because like not everything was set to for a play field yeah so like play field is always something that moves like almost to to the end you know like it's like you know there's many There are so many factors that come into building the playfield and sometimes subjects change because like something doesn't work the way they want it or or sometimes they have another idea or whatever whatever the reason is like the playfield can change like a lot so they they just made me wait on that they're like okay don't touch the playfield and it was the most complicated part you're gonna have to do so like just don't don't even think about the playfield right Right now, just like, you know, focus on the cabinets. And yeah, we like, we worked on the cabinets, like, you know, like rough sketches and then that's approved and like you go the cleaner, then that's approved and then like you go, you know, for the finals. And once all the cabinets were done, that's when the, they actually flew me in too. Because at first they sent me like some files for the playfield and layers of like, you know, like basically like a CAD drawing or something like that. And I was like, all right, so what the hell is that? What am I doing with this? Yeah. So Greg was really cool with me. He's like, dude, like we're going to help you. Like if you have questions, you can hit up like Zombietti, he'll walk you like everybody who was super like chill with me. And, you know, because I was a new guy in that kind of work too. Yeah. And it's a lot of pressure too, like, cause I've never done that before. And like the stress level was pretty intense, you know, but like not from them, like the stress that I would put on myself, like during the job, you know, like, cause I wanted it to, to look, you know, good enough. So, and, uh, yeah, so like at some point, like the, the, the play field was pretty much set for them. They flew me in to show me the prototype and show me what each target was doing. So when I got back in my hotel room at night, the plans that they printed out for me and everything, I could start at least thinking, okay, I can do this with that. That's going to be a road. That's going to be a workplace. What type of conversations were you having? How integrated were you with the entire design team? Were you talking to Keith Elwin, Greg, everybody? Yeah, we were always two, three main guys. I didn't really have much work done with anybody that was doing anything that was video for the screen or anything like that. These winning pieces were a part of St 아니vile Concert is Microwave You Day giveaway for Edward So, what's the first turn is? It's like you have a TV in the backbox. It almost seems like there should be more artistic integration between... Yeah, I mean, there was. There was stuff that I sent that was a bit more towards them, you know? But, yeah, not that much. You know, time-wise, it was a bit fast-paced at the end. What was your turnaround time? I don't know. What was your turnaround time from, like... I think like me I was involved like they obviously like they were working on it for longer than that yeah like I'm not sure for how long before me like for me it was about seven months like from like my test piece to like like delivering like all the files and like everything Wow so play playfield designed when you are when you're like when you're laying out the play field like the decision to We're going to ask you a question. One question. What brought you to make the playfield art a map? Like that whole idea, was that brought to you and how much influence did you have in what the actual artwork was on the playfield? Like they were pretty chill. Like the map wasn't my idea. Yeah. Like I mean they told me like what it was and it had to be sort of a map. I worked out a map, pretty much, how I saw it, and they kind of agreed with it, and they rolled with it. Most of the stuff on the playfield had a really high input in it. Art-wise, I had a lot of freedom with that stuff. Now, you said you weren't coming from a pinball background, but you've played it, right? When you started actually designing art for a pinball machine, did you get more into pinball? Like I see on your Instagram, you're in a league now, you play at North Star and stuff. So did that transition happen during the process of making the game? Yeah, I started like being interested, but like really towards the end, like I was really, I was really asking for a lot of like, I've, I was asking Keith and Greg, many, many questions, like, all along the process, because I wanted it to work for them, you know, like, like, to me, like, I can do like, like an art piece, like to me, I saw it like as a artwork, you know, like, Yeah, just artwork, you know, but I wanted it to make it look functional for them. Like I wanted them. I wanted like a pinball player to like be happy with it, you know, like not, not me, you know, like, like, at the end, I want to be happy with it. But like, I also want to serve the purpose that I'm there for, you know, like, I'm brought in into the pinball world. And I want to serve the pinball world. Yeah. And that's, you know, that's what I tried to do to the best of my abilities. And my knowledge at that time, like if you ask me today, like our pinball machine, I'll probably change some stuff because now I've been playing it a lot at the bar, you know? Yeah. And I'm like, ah, this part bugs me now, but like it's probably more a personal thing than anything else. So what bugs you? Ah, I'm not getting into that. Oh, come on. It was like a thing or two, you know, but you know, I don't want to... No, I, um, yeah, I think it's, I, it's Jurassic Park is it's, it's grown on me. It's not, I I've always enjoyed it. I played it like, like when it first came out, basically they brought it to Pittsburgh for Pinburgh, right? Like that was a big reveal. They had the premium, the premium struck me because I really liked the orange. Like I think the orange just pops. Um, but we have, we have a, I play a pro a lot on location and, um, Yeah, the playfield, I think it's interesting because like going back to like the 90s, like my one of my favorite artists, pinball artists was John Yowsey. I probably saying his name wrong, but he did like Medieval Madness, Twilight Zone, Adam's Family. But there's just a very like he had a very stylistic way that he did his stuff. It was I mean, it was very commercial, but it was very graphic, you know, and I'm like, that's my artwork. When I was making stuff was just very graphic, like heavy black line stuff. And so I really like I think that like seeing the new games that Stern is putting out that is very like, you know, there's an artistic hand in it. It's a bit more painterly. Yeah, it's more painterly, but... Not all of them, but like, you know, that's... Well, like I look at like Donny Gillies (Dirty Donny)'s work, like, like Aerosmith is like, or Metallica, like it is so stylistic. You know, it's, it's like a hyper, it's, it's Donny Gillies (Dirty Donny)'s work. Exactly. Yeah, no, I think I think it's interesting. I think Jurassic Park, like the use of colors, you know, like, I think one of the games that really gets knocked our package wise was Game of Thrones, because it was just like this really flat kind of beige Playfield and people like I don know I think that Stern has done a good job and I think Jurassic Park does a good job in in using colors and really popping the playfield you know like the green map and you got the blues underneath like there an artistic sense to it where it not just like hey we need to put some ink down on the playfield where we can have inserts you know there a lot more to it than that so one one thing one thing that i want to ask about was like as far as like the development of like the three aspects of the playfield like plastics um toys and stuff like that like what was the process there how much input did you have into that and um what is your um what your favorite part of the game that a lot I've got to ask all the questions before we get dropped out again. All right. So, yeah, I had like, as far as plastics and everything, when they sent me like those files, I was like, yeah, like, how am I going to do this? But no, I had like, trying to see it in my head right now. Like, if there is no, there was like, I had like a lot of freedom with it. I think like a lot of it is mine like when I look at it now and there's not much that they had me like to change like sometimes they had me something changed because like either their plastic piece was changing altogether like you know once they test it out and like you know I think like the helicopter part like you know on the premium and the limited edition like I think the propellers like turn on top there and I think it was just like it was different at first like it was just like two propellers then like it was four then it was like you know like so those things change along the way and it's kind of normal like so they had me change some artwork on that sometimes like I would go with something different than what it looked like in the movie like for the the helicopter and I think they made me I think I would bring it back to look a bit more like the movie. As far as toys, I didn't have much input in the toys. It was mostly in-house, they would do those parts. The truck, I drew some possible, how I saw it. We couldn't use like obviously like exactly the truck like it's a license thing you know you know they already work with one license they don't want to reach out to like more you know get more and more people involved like you know like to have like the original jeep i think would have been like tough so uh so you know like they probably opted to like make their own which is cool and i kind of worked at first tried to do like um you know merging like the two different I was like, you know, it was like something that had some input in, but it's not something that I was really like working on. Like I had like plenty with the playfield itself and all that stuff and the plastics. So toys were not really like in my department. And as far as my favorite part of the game, I don't know, like when I play it, I like the ramps. Like, you know, like when you manage to like do a combo with the ramps too, like it's pretty satisfying. And, um, yeah, like, there's, there's a lot in that game, and especially, like, since they updated the code now, the, the little challenge, uh, game that they added. Yeah. Like the Escape Nublar. That's a lot of fun. I have not, I have not played that yet. And, uh... Like, yeah, no, yeah. No, like, it's, it's fun. Yeah. You can actually just go into it by like holding a flipper button or something right where it lets you kind of cheat your way in Yeah, you know like I don't know if it's both like are you like I hold both because they told me to hold both But like I don't know if it's both but like basically once your token is in before pressing start like you just hold the flippers and then it gives you like some you know, I think it's one is like challenge one is like I don't remember, like there's tournament or something like that, but there's a setting that's challenge. So then you hit that and then gives you like a bit of a background and what to do. And that's the actual, that's the wizard mode, right? I mean, is it the actual wizard mode or is it? Yeah, it's like, well, they say it's a mini wizard more like, I don't know. Yeah. I'm not wizard level, so I'm just having fun with it. But yeah, like basically you try to rescue people and take them out of there and you have to refuel your truck, which is kind of fun too. Yeah. It keeps telling you you're running out of fuel. And then sometimes like with the same ball, like if you run out of fuel, like you can lose a truck and you keep just playing on the same ball, but you're losing trucks, you know, and you have only three trucks. So it's kind of, it's a lot of fun to play. Designing the art package for a pinball machine. Do you look at, now that you're playing more, like do you look at pinball machines differently? Like do you break it apart kind of? Yeah, oh yeah, a bit more, you know, like of course. Like not the old ones so much, like I just take them the way they are. The old ones, like you just look at the art package and it's just like, like I just see it as an art package, you know. You know, like I just see it like that, but like especially the newer ones now, like I think like I just really like, yeah, deconstruct everything. Yeah, I was probably going to have like if I get the chance to do a second one, like probably going to be something that I have that in mind even more now. Like, you know. Yeah. Yeah. So you're you're up in Montreal. You play it. You play at North Star. Yeah. At your local place. Yeah. How is what's what's the pinball scene like up in I think you guys just legalized it in that is that right like in the last couple years or something I know that I feel we just legalize that I don't know I know I know Adam Adam Kiesler is one of the guys who uh runs North Star and I think that they they went through something where like to get it legalized oh it's it might might be like a city thing like yeah they didn't want like arcades like guests like in a bar I'm not sure about that. I can't. With Jurassic Park, did you, like you did like the side art, the like inner blades and or I don't know what they call them, the cabinet, like, you know, inside the cabinet and you designed, you did those. Yeah. Yeah. Now, when they were talking, like when you were actually going through the process of designing like different, like pro, premium and LE, like was there discussion there as to like what would make an LE package, an LE package versus a pro? Like how does that work? Yeah. Well, they sort of had like an idea that like the premium would be the Raptors, the T-Rex would be the LE. So we started with that sort of and the pro model was a bit more inclusive of everything. So I had to, they kept telling me more dinosaurs. So I would add one or two in there. It's mostly the licensors at some point they want to see their properties in there too. So we had to add a bit to the pro like that. And yeah, but like they had a basic idea of that. And then when I saw right away like the T-Rex, I saw it as a dark, rainy, like I might have been told to like that they would like the darker. I don't recall exactly like if it came from Keith or like I think it might have been Keith actually that wanted it like a bit darker for that one. I'm not sure if you're familiar with that one, but I went for, I think that's the only one that I had a definite go for T-Rex and dark, and then I had the rainy kinda night feeling to it too. And the premium, I basically went a bit, I really wanted them to be three different color So we got to take money вз könnte take money because we're a new prowaders. Yeah, so I'm actually all the Abstract of it. So the rest of... I will take the STS유 гл은 I featured two weeks ago during a run. I think they like that approach. Now, when you're talking about working with a licensor, like who was the actual licensor? Was it the film? Was it the production company? Yeah, I think it's like, I think it's Amblin and like Amblin NBC or something. I don't remember exactly. Do you know why they went with Nedry as a character? Just because he like dies off, right? I'm not sure what the story is. It's probably... I was just happy to draw Newman. I'm a big Seinfeld guy. And I remember it was an issue too with the old... because when I was approached to do Jurassic Park, my first instinct was like, all right, what are the other machines? I looked at them and like Northstar had one of them that I could like play and even look at and stuff and I'm like okay like I want to do a certain thing you know differently than that and then like I remember Nerdry's fingers so I knew I had to get the fingers right on this one but no I guess like I'm not sure what the story is like I guess they have like the rights to Nerdry but not the other characters so I'm not sure. I'm not sure what the deal is with that, but I would have liked to do... At some point, I drew like a... I remember they made me do some rough sketches at first for ideas. And one of the first one was kind of a joke that I sent to Greg. And I'm like, how about this one? And it was like Jeff Goldblum when he's laying on the side. So they're like, I think they liked that. They told me like, right away at the beginning, I really liked your sense of humor with like the ideas that you were bringing. You could do... But, you know, it would have been fun to do more characters, but like at the same time, like the time was pretty like... You know, sometimes with characters and likeness, like I can get it, but like I already had like so many dinosaurs to do and like foliage and like, you know, jungles and it's like, it's a lot. It was about like it was kind of time consuming already so I was almost glad that there was no characters personally and I think especially since the game I think was meant to be more of a like you know like an extra story from the movies. Yeah, we're like, yeah. And he's the one like he's like one of the villains. Yeah, like in the original movie, because he's the one that causes a lot of trouble. So I think they can play with with him to like more as a, you know, like a play with the rules of the game. And that the actual like drawing of the dinosaurs and stuff. I mean, that's like you don't have a background in dinosaur drawing. So like, were you just like, No, I don't. I had to learn a lot about dinosaurs. I mean, there's a certain... And then I remember Keith would just hit me up, okay, we need this blah blah blah dinosaur, and I'm like, alright, which one is that? Like, I don't know dinosaurs, you know? I had to look it up. I guess he knows more about dinosaurs than I do. But yeah, I had to look up certain stuff and yeah, I actually learned some stuff over the time I was there. I think it's a great art package. I mean, it's a... I'm saving my pennies. I'm saving my pennies. I want one. It's one of those games where it's... I mean, I'm a pretty decent player, but it's a game that is so nuanced that I feel like you almost have to have it in your basement to really appreciate the level of... Yeah, too, too. craft that goes into the rule set it's crazy yeah oh it's it's crazy because like i um i'm not like an experienced player you know so yeah but it's a lot of fun to play i'm having like a blast playing it i'm happy that's my package it bugs me sometimes because i'm playing and it's yeah it's my artwork in front but like the game itself is like a lot of fun to play for and I see people at the bar too like they're drawn to it because it's Jurassic Park and then they notice stuff on the playfield sometimes I'm playing the machine next to them and like I'm not saying anything but like I know it's my game it's mine you know and people don't like they you know I'm in Montreal so like people don't think that there's someone designing like artwork for a pinball machine in Montreal like people just don't think about that you know like even in the league like sometimes People are like, really? You did that? Yeah, they don't get it. You know, like, oh, I managed to do that. But the people just have fun playing it. But then when like I'm getting a bit better and like trying to do certain targets in a certain way. Yeah. You know, playing with the rules of the games and like trying to advance and and you discover so much and there's like there's a lot you can do in there. What, um, yeah, it's fun. You say you're paying, what, Nate, they didn't give you one? What's up with that? You need a better manager, man. Are you a better manager? No, no, I don't know. I know. I need a manager. That's ridiculous. Stern needs to drop, they need to, uh, what is it, drop supply you, uh, what art package would you, um, you would do a premium or alley, I would assume, right? Oh, it's like, if I had, if I had to have one, I think, I think I would be drawn to, like, the premium. The orange, I think the orange, like the contrast of the orange works really well. Yeah, I think the orange. Yeah. Like I can't see that like in a basement, you know, even if it's darkish and it's like orange and it's uh, yeah, I like that one. I also like the, I mean, I like them all, but like LE is cool too, like the extra, like, you know, the cabinet, like the extra. But the premium, the premium art package. But uh, but I think the premium. That was the first thing you did, right? Like you said that that's kind of your test one is kind of. Yeah, that's actually like the first one. Yeah. Dream theme. If you could design our package for any theme for a pinball machine, what would you do? I don't know, man. I don't know. You know, I'd love to do a Slayer one because I've done so many Slayer t-shirt designs and stuff like that. Like that. And there's a lot of potential, I think, for like, you know, something that's really mean. I don't know if you could do three different art packages almost for it, but if you had one like, you know, like I think I could do like a really awesome job on that. Oh, like I would paint it all by hand, though, like, you know, like old school, like 80s, you know, alza weight can cover us. But you know other really weird team I love to do I don know Yeah that be good Like a dumb and dumber one Yeah Like there so many quotes so many quotes in that movie and like it you know uh I don know Yeah that be good Dumb and dumber one Yeah So many quotes so many quotes in that movie and like it you know I don know I'd be pretty open to many, many themes, you know, like I really got the bug. Like it was really, like it was a great experience working with those guys. And no matter how, you know, they're like all, like, a lot of legends, like, that I worked with, you know, like, I worked with big names. And they were so welcoming and just easygoing and, like, you know, they were super cool to meet, like, in person. Awesome, man. Congrats. Yeah, it's a pretty, like, solid game to, like, come out in, right? Keith Elwin's second title, Jurassic Park, so you've got an iconic theme, you have pretty much an iconic designer who, coming off Iron Maiden, I mean... Oh yeah, it was... the game's awesome. Congrats, man. That's pretty fucking cool. Thank you. I still pinch myself sometimes. Like growing up, like growing up, like even in college, like I had some friends who like designed skateboard decks and it was like, I mean, I feel really fortunate that I know a lot of people who've designed, who've made things, you know, like that's, that's one of the things that always drew me to, um, like, you know, I went to art school, like I, I was in shows and stuff like that, but I always made stuff. I've always made stuff. Even as a little kid, I'd break stuff and put it back together. So it's really cool to know people who have made things. There's just a connection, especially when you have a connection with the individuals. I collect art by different pinball artists. I'm just, um, yeah, it's just, it's, it's cool to know that these are being generated by people and not necessarily like by a computer. I don't, I don't know. It seems like we've kind of lost a little bit of that handcrafted world, you know? Um, yeah. So congrats, man. That's like, that's pretty freaking cool. Yeah, it was like yours, you know, it's like it was like a really now you're wearing like suit. Yeah. And I got a really good introduction to Yeah. So what do you think about the pinball world now that you're a part of it? Like, do you do you like keep up with any other drama and shit? Yeah, some people are very intense. Oh, dude, like when that came out, like, like, I looked up for Yeah, first, like I just peeked, you know, like, because I people saw the first images. And I peeked This is a production of WGBH. No part of this recording may be reproduced without WGBH's express consent. I understand that like everything else that I've done you know like some people are like I don't like this one I'm like it's fine it's not for you you know like it's okay like but you know like even Jeremy is like you know don't pay attention to that just do like you know do what you do and you know and I was like yes you know what but everybody's pretty cool so far like you know I haven't had any hate mail and like anything like that then like when I started like playing with the lead do like everybody was like super cool and like you know just very like just genuine people like mostly most most of the time just the you know they're passionate about pinball yeah I can totally yeah you dabble in like some iconic shit you know like you got Star Wars you're wearing your Suicidal Tendencies hat you just had like a you just yeah I haven't done any work for I'm not a fan of Star Wars though. I'm just like, it's all fan art so far. And like, I'm really, that's like another one on my bucket list. Doing something for like Lucasfilm or something like that. That was, yeah, that'd be a big thing for me. So what do you think of, you've seen a new Stern Star Wars art. Like, what do you think about the difference between the two? Yeah, like it was in development, I think. Yeah, it was in development at the same time that I was like on Jurassic, like towards the end. I love it. I like it. Yeah, I like it. Like it's it's really like I like the album. Yeah, it came out as a comic book really like, you know So I think Randy did a good job on that. Like I liked it a lot I remember when he came out like even like Texted like Fred, Greg Freres and I was like, oh dude, I just saw like the you know, the Star Wars one So Mandalorian, is that your next is that your next pinball machine? Yeah Yeah Yeah, sure. If it's being offered, you'll take it. I'd love to do that. Yeah, of course, I would take that. Oh, man. Like in a heartbeat. Like, I love that show. Did you see they're coming out with toys? They did with it, so. They have the Hasbro Mandalorian. Yeah. Troop. Yeah, I've seen that. But I already follow a bunch of people who make props like for, you know, like fan props that sell them and stuff like that. And like everybody jumped on the making the Mando bucket, you know, like the helmet and like people are doing a killer job at it. And it's like, it's awesome to see people who are like, you know, really into stuff and they start making it on their own too. Like, you know, just building things and building costumes. I always loved that part. So, yeah. Where can people check your stuff out, buy your stuff, follow you? Yes, you can like go to my website. It's johnnycraft.com. I have like a lot of my like commercial work, like illustration and stuff like that. Otherwise, it's on. I'm johnnycraft on Instagram too. And yeah, so on Instagram, it's more a bit of everything like I post, you know, like whatever I was drawing in the morning, I post that. Awesome, man. Yeah. Hey, well, thanks for hanging out. Thank you. Getting through some technical difficulties. Oh, no problem. All that. I know, the internet. Like, you know, you would think like in 2020 we would be able to just have a conversation. Do you have any, are you going to go to any shows or anything like that? Do you have any plans to go to any of the pinball shows or? No, not at this point. Like, you know, I'd, no, not really. I'd love to, like it's not that I wouldn't like it, but maybe if I have like a second pinball out at some point. You gotta sign some trans lights, sign some aprons for people. You gotta get on the circuit, man. Yeah, yeah, no, that'd be good. Oh, I got like, you know, I got a lot of requests. They're like, oh, if you pass by this place and like, you know, drop by and just sign my machine or sign this and like, I'm always up for it, you know, like, I usually drive down to Florida, like in the Spring break, but this year was skipping, but like, you know, there was like one or two plays on the way down that they're like, oh, you should stop by and sign our machines. If you're ever, if you ever come to Richmond, Virginia, hit me up. Yeah, I cross by every time we go to, we usually drive down. Yeah, next time, next time, hit me up. We have a spare bedroom. You have two kids, right? I have two kids. How old are you, kid? I'm not sure you want to offer that. Oh yeah, I've got nine and thirteen. Twelve and seven. Yeah, they can fight or get along great. Or they'll just sit around really quiet on their iPads and ignore each other. Yeah, that's what they do now. Hey man, it was good to chat with you. And thanks, and I'll get this out later today. You have any music requests? What are you listening to? Not really. These days a lot of Madball, Suicidal Tendencies, you know, I like a mix of really old ones and new ones. Otherwise, I like a lot of different stuff. Do you listen to anything new? Like mob? Yeah, man. Not that much. Not that much. I feel like like I feel a little bands now that I would like are just a repetition of what happened already Nothing comes to mind right away like, you know once in a while I get like into like a New hardcore band But they usually sound like an old hardcore band because I can't like I don't like the ones between Is it what band did you not wish you had seen? Oh yeah. Dead Kennedys probably. Like, yeah, yeah. I missed them when they came when I was younger. Like, yeah. Like, but with the original members, like I wouldn't go now, but you know, went with with Jello. Like, I've seen Joe Black Flag and working, which was great. Not the new Black Flag. It's my fellow. Yeah, I think though, singing like I dig him, like I like him, but the last album that What did he put out with the cover art? I don't know if I saw that. It was like, you don't have to, I think. It doesn't look like an old school kind of... I bought My War when I was like 14. Like I go back, like I was talking to my daughter recently, I think we were listening to The Subhumans, The Day the Country Died, that album. So good, right? That's that was one of the first albums I bought when I was like 13. I remember I bought the subhumans and GBH and I was talking to my daughter and I was I was playing it because I'm like, I'm now at the point where I'm like, I'll play that. Well, I'm just like, I'm like, I've been playing that stuff in front of my kids, like since they're like four, like even though the language or anything. I think the language thing, like my kids can sing along to Fugazi, some Fugazi, some Black Flag. I try to like limit the language stuff, but now it's kind of like they've, they watch the Goonies. You know, once you've seen, once your kids have seen the Goonies, they've seen everything. They're exposed to it. And so I'm like, you know, whatever. So I'm like, yeah, playing some subhumans. I was like, I bought this album when I was your age. Like, I just don't feel like there's... Yeah, I was about 15 when I bought that album. And that album I bought at the same time that I bought 7 Seconds, The Crew. And like me and my buddy, we bought those two albums. We got back home and then we listened to both.ades Devnai Major for attorney ann thomas porceli Invincible I've never seen one. I played 99 Red Balloons for my daughter recently because they would always close with that. Yeah. Yeah. I loved the originals. Yeah, that was just iconic, iconic bands. And did Montreal have a big music scene or were you living in the suburbs at that point? Yeah, yeah. But I used to come, like I was taking the bus to Montreal to buy records like every Steven Greenberg, All right, man. All right. That's probably it. Well, thanks again, Johnny Trapp, Jonathan Bergeron. Awesome, man. Well, it was great chatting with you. I'll play out with some- Same here? Seven seconds. And yeah, man, if you're ever on this way, hit me up and I'll keep following you and take care and good luck. All right. Cool. Well, thanks for having me. Thanks for having me. All right. All right. All right. Thanks, man. All right. Thanks, man. Thanks, man. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. And congrats on the suicidal merch. That's crazy. Yeah, that was pretty hype when they asked me to do that. Awesome, man. Hey, well, have a great Sunday and I will talk to you later. All right. Take care. All right, man. Bye. Bye. Out there floating in the summer sky, 99, red balloons go fly! Yo! Do it! Yes! cyclical Caroline yeah from H зачем жтак 2006ындж tracks Are You Again football team hyžaç away Do you like my slapstick hunters? Subscribe this YouTube channel. Click the bell icon for the latest updates nosion videos. Comment my videos. Click and see too. Thank you 옷 Out of the race, I lock you away, I change your face, ancient of the new age, turned your mind, can't better live with the rest of mankind, I say the people here in the new age, you're gonna wear your loving on the right, I'm gonna put you away in the cage, don't start to, out your age, don't start to, out your age. Sports

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*Exported from Journalist Tool on 2026-04-13 | Item ID: de715204-4125-4249-b829-7589b947b059*