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We Are Pinball #38 "Ralph joins the Potter-nation!"

We Are Pinball (WAP)·podcast_episode·1h 18m·held·Jun 15, 2025
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.035

TL;DR

Retro Ralph reveals Harry Potter launch details, JJP production bottlenecks, and next-game speculation.

Summary

Retro Ralph discusses his experience creating promotional content for Harry Potter Potter machine, including the dramatic reveal at TPF by Jersey Jack Pinball that reportedly shocked the industry and halted competing sales. The episode covers production capacity constraints, trim-level demand ratios (5 CE to 3 WE to 1 AE), speculation about JJP's next game (Matrix vs. Top Gun rumors), and detailed gameplay impressions of Harry Potter design, topper quality, and customization options.

Key Claims

  • Harry Potter is JJP's biggest launch day in units since Foo Fighters, and biggest launch day in dollars

    high confidence · Don (host) citing direct intel from Jeff at Mad Pinball, a top-3 JJP distributor globally

  • Harry Potter trim-level ratio is approximately 5 Collector's Edition to 3 Wizard Edition to 1 Arcade Edition

    high confidence · Don citing Jeff from Mad Pinball distributor data

  • Jersey Jack Pinball likely produces around 100 games per week versus Stern's estimated 500 games per week

    medium confidence · Retro Ralph speculating based on facility size and production complexity comparison

  • Jersey Jack Pinball announced Harry Potter at TPF after the game was meant to stay secret, likely unplanned

    high confidence · Retro Ralph witnessed the announcement; Ken Crone (JJP) never confirmed it was part of the plan; Mark Seiden facial reaction suggested surprise

  • Harry Potter announcement at TPF significantly depressed sales of other new games, particularly Kong

    medium confidence · Genghis (host) stating this as observed market effect; corroborated by discussion of people holding back purchases to see Harry Potter

  • Retro Ralph was asked by Ken Crone to create featurette content for Harry Potter after Zach Sharpe (likely JJP CEO) declined similar requests

    medium confidence · Retro Ralph's account of phone call in Chicago in winter; admits uncertainty about whether Zach was actually asked

  • JJP outsources wire harnesses and playfield manufacturing, creating supply chain dependencies that Stern does not have

    medium confidence · Retro Ralph comparing operational structures between manufacturers

  • The Quidditch player with number 11 was an Easter egg by Eric (JJP designer) that was later removed per agreement

    medium confidence · Retro Ralph describing NDA-governed content restrictions and disclosed minor changes

Notable Quotes

  • “He stops everything when I talked to pinball brothers a month ago I was like don't release anything let harry potter come out first let people see it because if you release anything before harry potter people were like nope we want to see this game”

    [name withheld pending review] @ mid-episode — Demonstrates market-halting impact of Harry Potter announcement on competing manufacturers

  • “Jack goes in there... he puts this dream theme. Bam! He ruins so many sales... Kong didn't sell as many games. Everybody held back.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ mid-episode — Direct market effect analysis of Jack Somerville's unplanned announcement

  • “I think Jack did a great free PR, man. This is the best PR. He destroys all the other companies' sales, and I think he did a great move.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ mid-episode — Reframing of controversial announcement as strategic business move

  • “They're going to be making these well into next year... at least a year and a half to completion right now”

    Retro Ralph @ late-episode — Production timeline projection for backlogged Harry Potter orders

  • “Whatever is coming next from J.J.P., it's probably going to be three years until we see it because they're going to take so long to get caught up on all these Harry Potter orders.”

    Retro Ralph @ late-episode — Long-term production constraint projection affecting next-game timeline

  • “It's not terrible or anything and then have you seen the projector working... it's the dark mark... it only looks like it's green... I don't think it can change what it can project”

    Retro Ralph @ late-episode — Technical observation about Harry Potter's topper projector implementation and current limitations

  • “Sam Stern had released this same topper, this thing would be $2,400, $2,499 probably... the Foo Fighters topper... that was a $2,000 topper”

    Don @ late-episode — Price comparison contextualizing JJP topper value perception relative to Stern offerings

Entities

Retro RalphpersonDonperson[name withheld pending review]personJersey Jack PinballpersonKen CronepersonZach SharpepersonSteve Ritchieperson

Signals

  • ?

    announcement: Jack Somerville's unexpected announcement of Harry Potter game at TPF caught industry by surprise; announcement was likely unplanned per Ken Cromwell's response and Mark Seiden's facial reaction

    high · Retro Ralph's eyewitness account; multiple hosts noting surprise and confusion at the time; Ken never confirming it was part of plan; comparison to typical coordinated marketing

  • ?

    product_launch: Harry Potter experienced record launch sales for Jersey Jack Pinball, largest since Foo Fighters in units, largest in dollars, according to distributor data

    high · Jeff at Mad Pinball (top-3 JJP distributor) directly reporting to Don that Harry Potter is biggest launch day since Foo Fighters both in units and dollars

  • ?

    manufacturing_signal: Jersey Jack Pinball faces significant production constraints; estimated at 100 games/week production capacity with massive order backlog extending into 2025+; will take 1.5+ years to fulfill current orders

    medium · Retro Ralph's production capacity analysis comparing JJP (100/week) to Stern (500/week); distributor reports of record ordering volumes; projection of at least year-and-a-half completion timeline

  • $

    market_signal: Harry Potter announcement at TPF caused customers to hold purchasing decisions on competing new games, particularly Kong, which reportedly had diminished sales as a result

    medium · Genghis stating Kong didn't sell as many units; discussion of customers waiting to see Harry Potter before buying; comparison of Evil Dead inventory depletion to Potter announcement timing

  • ?

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.235

0:00
Oh yeah, hello everybody. Welcome back to We Are The Mother Grabbing Pinball Crew. We Are Pinball, episode number 38. I'm here with Jengas and special, extra special guest, brother from another mother, the hero of Arizona, Retro Ralph himself. How you doing, sirs, gentlemen? Welcome to This Week in Pinball. what's up guys thanks for having me back again it's number two for me for the WAP show nice to have you here retro ralph friend of the show one year anniversary with a special special guest i am so ready for a great show with you guys i'm so excited retro ralph is just dominating the pinball industry right now he got the keys to jjp he just opened the doors up for Harry Potter. We're going to talk Harry Potter all day long. We have got that game. We have got Predator on the way. You have played Kong. You own a Kong. I have the Kong. So we're going to... Anybody got Dune? I don't know Dune near me. There's one in Madison, Wisconsin. I need to go spend more time on. But does Dune have code? We've all played Dune too, I guess. Because I did play it. They have it at Electric Bat. So I think we've all played Dune, right? Have you, Jegas? No, I cannot get it here in Europe. Oh, no, you're in Dune, man. We have no distros here, man. But have you seen any Dune unboxing videos or anything?
1:36
I have not seen a single Dune unboxing video. I mean, although I haven't really been, like, seeking them out, but I like to think I watch most pinball content. I have not seen an unboxing of Dune. Are they shipping out these games?
1:48
They're appearing in locations. Or is everything on pause now? What's going on? I know nothing about Dune. I like the theme, but what's going on with the game?
1:57
So I want to be careful with this because I don't want someone from Barrels of Fun to think this is me trashing them because it's not. But the one that Electric Bat got had a lot of problems when they got it. I mean, it's running right now. I did play it. It was running, but it was doing weird things. They had an issue with one of the coils burnt out. I think it's functioning now but it definitely wasn't like a good unboxing experience but I guess David Van Ness found out like he didn't find out he heard our podcast and he got in touch with them and he's like really really trying to work with them to figure out like hey why did this happen you know because I mean you know the first ones off the line sometimes can have some issues so like I'm one that gives companies grace and that as long as they handle it as long as they fix it I'm cool, right? But, like, you know, we've had some recent things with, you know, the X-Men plunger thing was screwed up. Stern sort of kind of fixed it. The one I'll say is a good example of them fixing it really fast was, like, the Dungeons & Dragons dragon thing. They caught that super fast. Oh, yeah, with the cables, right? That was great. Yeah, like, I don't – and they let everyone know. All the distros knew. I knew, like, you know, your distro, Donnie, probably told you, right, when you got yours. Like, we all knew. So I'll hand it to David Van Ness. He's all over Kale right now at Electric Bat trying to make it right. But I did play it, and it was fully functional when I did play it. You don't mess with Kale because Kale goes online and says, this is BS. Fix it. Kale does not have a filter, that's for sure. He's going to say whatever. That's why I love Kale Hernandez. I love him. Absolutely, man. All right. So we just got Harry Potter, right? Amazing. Amazing, yeah. and we got everything presented by retro ralph we want to hear ralph we want to hear what the heck happened so i'm guessing they contacted zach and zach said no is that true or is it a game zach was talking about so i actually don't know if they did ask zach and he declined but i think i know zach was declining a lot of those a lot of those featurette requests because he was like kind of trying to run the business it's got to be so much work it does take a lot of time but um but i became friendly with ken cromwell and ken just kind of asked me i was in chicago for work actually and it was weird because it was like a really crappy it was in the middle of the winter just like crappy weather and i was getting out of my rental car and i got i was like oh that's weird ken's calling me and he's like hey i have this like proposition for you he's like look i'm not asking you to give me an answer right now now i i have to go back and check but maybe Zach did say no. I'm sure that's probably what happened. So Zach maybe said no. And he goes, do you think you'd, you'd have the like know-how and ability to make a video like the featurettes that we make? And I was like, but the thing is he was, he used Avatar as the reference. And I was like, cause like, I know that was done in a professional studio. So I was like, well, look, Ken, if you're, if Avatar is your like baseline, I go, I know I probably can't do that, but I probably could do something in between with the stuff that I have, the camera equipment and stuff. So he's like, well, think about it and then let me know. And I, and I, I think like four weeks went by. And then I finally was like, you know what? I'm going to like say yes. Even though I kind of knew a little bit, like this is a stretch for me, but I was like, I'm going to say yes. And I said yes. And that's kind of how it started. But then we, then there was a long pause. I kept contacting him. Ken, we ready? We ready? They're like, not ready yet. Not ready yet. And then it's starting to get into like close to April. And I'm like, uh, like I'm getting nervous because I have to like take time off work to do it, you know? And so.

  • “I think they probably had a way lower budget for that topper after all the money that had to go into this game. And I think that's the best they could do within the budget they had.”

    Don @ late-episode — Speculation about resource allocation and budget constraints on Harry Potter topper design

    • Mark Seiden
    person
    Ericperson
    Danperson
    Jeffperson
    Christopher Franchiperson
    Cale Hernandezperson
    David Van Esperson
    Jersey Jack Pinballcompany
    Stern Pinballcompany
    Barrels of Funcompany
    Spooky Pinballcompany
    Mad Pinballcompany
    Harry Pottergame
    Foo Fightersgame
    Elton Johngame
    Konggame
    Dunegame
    Texas Pinball Festivalevent

    business_signal: Jersey Jack Pinball outsources critical components (wire harnesses, playfields) compared to Stern's in-house manufacturing, creating vulnerability to supplier delays

    medium · Retro Ralph's comparative analysis of manufacturing structures between JJP and Stern; explicit mention of wire harness and playfield outsourcing as dependencies

  • ?

    product_strategy: Harry Potter trim-level demand shows strong preference for premium tiers: 5 Collector's Edition to 3 Wizard Edition to 1 Arcade Edition ratio

    high · Jeff from Mad Pinball distributor providing specific ratio data to Don; indicates customers prioritizing premium experiences despite higher cost

  • ?

    content_signal: Jersey Jack Pinball contracted Retro Ralph to create promotional featurette content after original creator declined; involved NDA and possible non-cash compensation

    high · Retro Ralph's detailed account of Ken Cromwell's recruitment call, multi-week negotiation, NDA signing, and filming of Harry Potter promotional video

  • ?

    product_concern: Harry Potter Collector's Edition topper received mixed/critical reception for aesthetic quality; described as cheap-looking facade compared to prior JJP toppers (e.g., Godfather); multiple content creators criticized design

    medium · Don noting topper doesn't meet typical JJP standards; Retro Ralph acknowledging facade looks cheap; discussion of budget constraints possibly limiting topper quality

  • ?

    rumor_hype: Strong rumors about Jersey Jack Pinball's next game: Matrix and Top Gun are the two frontrunners; some speculation about Top Gun vs High Speed 3; no official confirmation

    medium · Hosts discussing Matrix and Top Gun as heavily rumored; Retro Ralph stating Matrix and Top Gun were strongest rumors; note that Retro Ralph is restricted in discussing JJP rumors due to NDA

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Harry Potter Arcade edition positioning itself as base for collector customization; hosts discussing aftermarket modification potential (shakers, ramp upgrades, translite replacements)

    medium · Discussion of Don's customization approach; Retro Ralph noting arcade version allows cost savings with post-purchase upgrades; mention of aftermarket topper possibilities

  • ?

    product_concern: Barrels of Fun's Dune game experienced quality issues on initial shipments (coil burnout) though company responded positively to feedback and made repairs

    medium · Retro Ralph noting Electric Bat's Dune had coil issues on arrival; David Van Ness reached out after hearing podcast to coordinate fixes; Kale Hernandez's vocal complaints about initial problems

  • ?

    industry_signal: Harry Potter announcement at TPF demonstrated strategic value of surprise reveals in halting competitor sales; hosts praising it as effective PR move despite initial controversy

    medium · Multiple discussions of how announcement affected Kong sales; hosts' retrospective positive framing of Jack's move; comparison to typical coordinated marketing approaches

    • 5:42
    But when did you know that it was Harry Potter? Oh, uh, he didn't tell me until I signed the NDA. I mean, he kind of did because I was like, we all know what it was. I mean, it's not like any of us did know. You know what I mean? We all knew you guys were talking about it. You know, nap leak did or I don't even know. The rumors have been around for some for like years. Jack leaked it. Oh, yeah, then Jack said it. So, yeah, this was after TPF, right?
    6:08
    Yeah, this was after, this was April, like after TPF when Jack said, well, everybody knows our next game is Harry Potter, right? Yeah, so that surprised me because at that point I had already signed the NDA and there was no, there was no talks about like, everyone was like, okay, everyone quiet. So when Jack did that, I texted Ken, I'm like, I thought we were all being quiet. He's like, he never, Ken never said like, clearly I think we can all agree that that probably wasn't a plan, right? I think he just said that. I think he got excited in the moment and just said it. Ken never confirmed that that wasn't the plan, but I'm pretty sure that wasn't the plan. And you could kind of tell from Mark Seiden's face because he was just like, uh.
    6:50
    But, but, guys, on hindsight, okay, wait, wait, wait. I just want to ask you this. Jack did this move like nobody was expecting this because at TPF they were about to sell more avatars and then he was like BAM I have got Harry Potter don't spend a dime this game is awesome don't you feel like Genghis that if Don was there to DJ it Jack should have said that and then Don should have been like there's some hoes in this house And then, like, yeah, just, like, making it rain.
    7:27
    Yeah, a little bit. Good. All right, ready? Someone play the role of Jack, and then here. And then, Don, you DJ.
    7:35
    Should I be Jack? And then, Don, you be the DJ. Like, you be my hype man. All right, let's go, let's go, let's go. All right, hold on. The next Jersey Jack game is Harry Potter. Everybody knows that. There's some hoes in this house. If you talk to anybody, don't do anything. Don't do anything.
    8:01
    All right. Well, thank you, Jack. Here's your medication, man. Oh, Jesus Christ. Oh, yeah. Zero trash. Should I have made it? I should have probably been more like. What, guys? He's got more of a. All right, guys. Let me tell you. Yeah. No, that's not. He's not that. Listen, soupy nuts. We all know it's Harry Potter. I love this. I don't know. Jack is like kind of, he's Italian, but he's not like, hey, dude, guy. He's not like that. He's not like forget about it Italian. He's boring. Forget about it. He's not quite Canadian Italian. Wait, wait, wait. I just want to say this. Everybody is saying some negative stuff about Jack doing this move. Okay. I have heard everything. But to be honest, just take one step back and think about this move. Jack goes in there. There are other new game releases, right? And Kong is on the way and all that stuff. He puts this dream theme. Bam! He ruins so many sales. I said it! Because of that, Kong didn't sell as many games. Everybody held back. We're distressed here. Do you want to buy this? Do you want to buy that? No, I want to see what this Harry Potter is all about. So what Jack did actually was a great move. it was kind of a baller move right yeah it was a great move he stopped everything when i talked to pinball brothers a month ago i was like don't release anything let harry potter come out first let people see it because if you release anything before harry potter people were like nope we want to see this game and see what's happened just and it's a great game right i was remember the meme thing where, what was it? Was it in the, when was it when people would do that thing where you'd say something and then it would play like the Dr. Dre music and the glasses would fly in one? Like that could, that was totally Jack.
    9:58
    He was kind of a badass. So I was there at TPF Live when this happened and I remember like Jack said, made the announcement, said not one dollar out of your pocket. Everybody quickly ran over to the spooky booth, bought an Evil Dead and were like, okay, okay, okay. All dollars are safe in our pockets now. And then from then on, yeah. That's exactly what happened. Yeah, that was when Spook is sold out. The next beat was like them sold out.
    10:20
    It's just funny how it all played out. And how unexpected. Like, I mean, you know, I'm like at the epicenter of pinball, the biggest show of the year, and I'm super hyped into pinball. And I didn't even know this JJP seminar was going on. I was waiting in line to play Merlin's Arcade or something. I was grabbing a Diet Coke and a drink from Spooky. I think Chris Franchi was signing my butt. And then I heard, like, oh, Harry Potter got released. I'm like, what are you talking about? it's so unexpected that's why it is wild though and i think i kind of made fun of the fact that no one reacted but i think the reason why no one reacted because i don you have to tell me because you're there people must have been like what did he just say like what yeah i was shocked i thought it was just people talking crowd like yeah sure that happened whatever and then i went over to ken later and i'm like dude did harry potter get released he's like kind of like yeah well you know it's all part of the plan you know it's like all right well great so what does this mean yeah You can say whatever you want to say. I think Jack did a great free PR, man. This is the best PR. He destroys all the other companies' sales, and I think he did a great move. I'm loving this. He should do it again next time. 100%. So I'm waiting. When's Kamikow going to announce their next title? Because I think that's how they do this. He gets out ahead of it, says what the theme is, Jack confirms it at the show, and then the machine comes out three months later. actually interesting you're at what do you guys because there's been a lot of rumors of the next game but there's no i don't is there a strong rumor on what that is at this point from jersey jack all the only thing i have almost got confirmed yeah it's richie and i directly ask richie is it top guns it should be top gun right when it's too richie what what the hell should else be high speed three i would like that but uh but wasn't there another like heavily rumored game I can't remember what the other rumor was. There were two that were pretty strong. It wasn't Matrix, was it? I think, yeah, Matrix was the other one. Matrix, very, very strong, yes. Which one would you guys rather have? Between Matrix and Top Gun? Yeah. Matrix, all day, all night long. That's what I would say, too. Oh, Matrix, that music soundtrack. Oh, I like highway music in Top Gun, but Matrix is 90s. Imagine being in that game, right? Like just imagine it is Matrix and imagine there's a – you're trying to get out of the Matrix and there's a phone booth that opens and you have to get the ball into it. And then like it goes in and goes back down or something. Like that would be your way. Like the phone is ringing or something. Like I don't – that seems like genius. You could do something cool with that. There would have to be some kind of Motorola. They used Nokia, the one that – the phone that was flipping down. Don't you remember that? I love that. 9,800 Nokia something. Don't you remember that, Ken? Yeah. Yeah, there's so many cool things you could do with that. I don't know. But Top Gun would be cool too. But is Top Gun like – I know Maverick came out, but is it kind of – I don't know. Has it run – Forget the 80s, 90s, 90s. Matrix, it would have to be – so if it was Top Gun for you, it would have to be the original Top Gun, not Maverick. Yeah, it has to be the original if they do it. Absolutely. But, I mean, it will fit perfect to Steve Ritchie. Don't you feel that? Yeah, he's got a ton of layout. You could just grab the, what was that game with the skull and all the motorbacks? No Fear. Yeah, it could just be No Fear rethemed, you know, Highway to the Danger Zone, jump ramp and everything. Just like how Elton John was Star Trek rethemed. Who did F-14 Tomcat? Richie. Don, what do you think, man? Like, which one would you rather have, Top Gun or Matrix? Matrix, man, because you'd have to have, like, a game-changing state with that when you're inside the Matrix, outside the Matrix. And you can do it with lights and music. But I think, remember, like the key thing when that movie came out that was really wowing everybody was that bullet time effect. Because that's like the first time that we saw that. Kind of pause in space, rotating with the camera. So imagine like if the middle area of the play field was on a turntable. And there could be a point where a magnet would grab your ball. Time would stop. Everything would rotate, opening new ball pass. And then boom, you just start going. Maybe the magnet can be thrown at targets like you're using that matrix space force, you know? Oh, that would be cool. Meaning you're kind of like you're stopping all the bullets and then they disperse or something. And I'm going to go back to the projection topper. Imagine if when you're in the Matrix, all of a sudden you got all the green letters and things being projected all around the room that you're playing in. Because like you're in Matrix mode and then you pop back out and you pop back and forth. Oh, yeah, that would be cool. Yeah, because when you're in – Imagine the light show. Yeah, well, and JJP is so good with the light shows. They can do some cool stuff. There's so much green in there. It could be awesome, man. Yeah, and then – But let's jump back to Harry Potter. I could talk for an hour on Matrix. We got excited. You got us excited, Genghis. You're like, let's talk about the new thing. You got us excited. I have heard these metric rumors, but I'm pretty restricted when it comes to J.J.P. So, yeah, about J.J.P. rumors. I can talk stern rumors, but J.J.P.
    15:21
    Am I robot, Genghis? No, no, you're good. We're just stunned by your brilliance. What I can say is whatever is coming next from J.J.P., It's probably going to be three years until we see it because they're going to take so long to get caught up on all these Harry Potter orders. Holy crap. Like I'm hearing from distributors like this is their best day or best week they've had ever, which is churning out these games. Same with my local guy. The local guy here, I asked him. He's like, man, I haven't had days like this in a long time with ordering. And I'm just like, I don't know, the thing I've been trying to figure out and it's like I can't find a reputable source that says what the definite number is. But I don't know. Like I think that and I could be wrong. You guys let me know. I think Stern could probably easily pump out like 500 games a week. But I think JJP is more like 100 games a week. So if that's the case, how the hell – like they're going to be making these well into next year, right? 100%, yeah. Well, we have insider info from a U.S. distro here because, as you can see on my T-shirt, it says Mad Pinball. And if you guys want to buy pinball machines, buy it from Mad Pinball. Use the code WAP and get free T-shirts and free shipping on Storing Games. And on top of that, we have personal info from Mr. Jeff himself. So I asked, how is the sales of Harry Potter doing? He's like third biggest JGP distro in the world, so he's a big gun out there. Jeff says, it's phenomenal. Harry Potter is our biggest launch day of games since Foo Fighters. Foo sold slightly more units day one. We sold more dollars day one with Potter. As of today, the ratio of trim level has been approximately 5 CE to 3 WE to 1 AE.
    17:17
    So, yeah, the C is just, yeah. And he talks about Merlin. We're not in Merlin yet. Dune is still strong, he says, so that's cool. But, yeah, Harry Potter, phenomenal. It has been a juggernaut of a sales success for Matt Pinball. Again, guys, when you buy from Matt Pinball, what do you do? Use code WAP and then pat yourself on the back for being a broseph. Yeah. And Donnie will send you a personal T-shirt, man, and he will kiss the T-shirt. We got him ready to go. So, like, looking at a Stern game versus a Jersey Jack game, I mean, Stern's got this thing down to such a science. Everything in the game is on the play field, and that play field has a quarter-mile-long assembly line, so they can churn those out. The cabinet, there's, like, nothing in it. There's a cheap speaker, a couple of boards, and that's it. The back box has hardly anything in it, that little CPU, tiny screen. You open up a JJP back box, and it's like, you know, there's this whole cantilever. This looks like the Costco mounting system for my flat TV in there. You know, there's so much in that back box. There's so much in the cabinet, so much on the play field, and they don't have a quarter-mile-long assembly line with just, like, tons of, you know, people like it's Wonka's factory or anything. So, yeah, I can see, you know, they want this game to sell well, but if it sells too well, it's going to be years and years, and people are going to be waiting years for their Harry Potter. Yeah. And you've got to think they also, you know, some things when you tour Stern, you appreciate a little bit, and you're like, oh, why do they do that? But I mean, they do all their in-house wire harnesses. Jersey Jack outsources that they outsource the playfield. So they're also reliant on other people to get the parts they need a little bit more than Stern. So I'm sure like if anything breaks in that chain, even though I know Stern has all these other companies have to rely on people to get parts. But these are like major things. Like if the wiring's not there, like I'm screwed, right? I have to wait till those come. Or if a playfield's not there because of some issue with shipping, like I'm screwed on that too. So I got to think they have more dependencies on other people too. So that's probably, I don't know, man. I don't, I mean, we don't know how many total orders they've gotten, but I got to think they're at least a year and a half to completion right now, at least. Yes. Unless they put out another line that built these games you know That warehouse is not that big in comparison to Stearns though Like you got Don a couple times right It not that big in comparison to Stern Shoot Stern at Costco and this place is like you know not a farmer market but, I mean, a local store. It doesn't have the huge ceilings or anything. I mean, it's adequate. I don't think they could really want for anything, but it doesn't have that just cavernous, like, we can pump out 1,000 games a day kind of capacity. How about if you compare it to Spooky's new place, NJJP? how are they compared to each other? Spooky is about a quarter the size of JJP. Yeah. And Spooky is building what? 40 games a month or something? A week? They're doing 60 a month I think right now. 60 a month? Oh, okay. But you know, they're an order of magnitude lower with their total numbers. They're making 888 Evil Deads interspersed with some Scooby-Doos and some Looney Tunes. And TCM, buy that game. Holy crap. That game's awesome. Don, you know what I wanted to ask you real quick? This is – so I'm curious. Do you think that your Evil Dead doesn't have a number either, right? It just says Don's Pinball Podcast or something? There's a number in the coin box. Oh, no, actually, this one's number 10. This one, yeah, I didn't get the special edition.
    20:41
    See, I didn't look. I want to look because I was wondering the ones that – like mine doesn't – maybe it does have a number. Maybe just the nameplate doesn't. Look at the coin box. Do they count against the 888?
    20:51
    So they should. So back in the day, I bought a Halloween, and Halloween sold out in like 45 minutes or something. I went that year to MGC And they had a Halloween A new, they just unboxed it on the floor It didn't have a number on it And it was like, so which number is this? And they're like, oh that's just kind of like a show game I'm like, what do you mean it's just a show game? So I think there used to be like Display samples The Harry Potter I played last night over at Lumberjack Johnny's in Appleton Was a display sample So it's unnumbered, it's a collector's edition But it'll exist out there in the wild I had a friend reach out to me for a CE Elton John that was a display model that he had a really good price on. He's like, is it worth it buying one of these display ones? I'm like, yeah, the number doesn't really matter. I mean, yeah. So they used to exist. I don't think they're doing that anymore. I don't think they can get away with it now. They're too high profile. But like back in the day, there were just kind of like extra ones that were made. A lot of extras, yeah. Yeah, yeah. All right, guys. So get us back on track, Cengiz. Yeah, yeah, sorry.
    21:51
    Ralph, you have played this game more than anyone else in the world. You have seen it more than anyone else compared to JJP people. Yes, you have. You have so much insider. It's so cool. So we have three trims, the arcade, the wizard, and the collector's edition. First of all, I'm going to ask you first.
    22:11
    Are you thinking about buying this game, Harry Potter? Okay, so for full disclosure, right, there was obviously, I'm going to not say it exactly like that, but I'm going to say so I had to sign an agreement to do this video. Right. That agreement was so I didn't talk about any of the, like maybe things that led up to something happening or not happening with the game, all that stuff. So I do know some of that stuff. I disclosed little things that were definitely ones that weren't a big deal. Like the Quidditch player with the number 11, that was Eric's little Easter egg. And then they told him he couldn't have it, but that kind of stuff. Cause that stuff was like, not a big deal. But, but no, as far as, Wait, sorry, what was the question again? Was it again? How free was your Harry Potter game? I was thinking about getting this game. That was actually me. Oh, yeah, so part of the agreement to film the video was some form of payment, right? So I might have taken my form of payment as non-cash. So you can take that with what you will. So yes, but if that wasn't the case, I would still be getting this game. Oh! But I wouldn't get the same one. So because of the agreement, I would be getting the you know the top end one I think if I was buying this on my own I would definitely get so there's two schools of thought sometimes I'm on the Don school of thought where I'm like I'm just going to get the arcade and do the other stuff to it because I like Don I like doing that stuff customizing my game so I feel like if you were looking to save some money you're kind of getting the same exact you are kind of getting the same exact game with some minor concessions you add the shaker mode or you go ahead and powder coat it however you want. You might want it somewhat different, so that's cool. And then, you know, if you can live with the Translight and the Backglass versus an actual Backglass, that's cool too, and I'm sure that aftermarket people are going to make one anyway. So, like, to me, if you really want to experience this game and you don't have the 12 or 15, like, the arcade's great. The negative to that is I have no idea when they're going to make those arcade versions, so that could be part of your equation, is, like, when am I going to get it? but I think if I was like if I had the money and the means I'd probably just go with the wizard because I really like how those radcals look on the side they look really nice it's more of a traditional artwork package so I think it fits with most pinball themes and you're getting the shaker and the other things too and I do like because I like to stream the games it is nice having that external jack to plug into so you could see it's easier to stream it but but I can How about the wire ramps? Because on the arcade edition, it's just normal metal. And on the wizard edition, it's chrome ramps. Have you seen? Actually, that's a good point. I haven't seen that. They didn't have an arcade built when I was there. They had wizards built and CEs built. And at that time, those were all prototypes. They were basically Eric and the mechanical engineer, Dan, were going through the line, making sure everyone understood how to build it then. So like there was no arcade. They didn't have a single arcade one built then. And that was late April.
    25:23
    So you're getting the top of the line collector's edition, $15,000 version. But I would not, you know, not to, I, if it was, I had to pay her for my own money. I don't think I would get the CE, even though I really do appreciate the art, I'd probably go wizard. And I don't, I don't love the CE topper, but I do think that someone's going to come along. And if you really take a close look at that topper, the facade can just be detached. So to me, a mod maker could make a killer 3D sculpt that just goes where the buildings are, right? And I think you could make that thing epic by just doing a couple of tweaks, you know? Because to me, it's more the facade looks cheap.
    26:05
    It really just does. It's a little shoebox diorama look. I've seen that for JJP. Yeah, for JJP. I've seen other content creators bashing the topper to the ground. I mean, I don't want to bash the topper, but it just doesn't look like a typical JJP topper to me. Can I push back just a little bit? Because this occurred to me the other day. I was in the restroom, of all things. Now, if Stern had released this same topper, this thing would be $2,400, $2,499 probably. I mean, honestly. Because I was at Lumberjack Johnny's. I'm looking at the Venom topper. I'm looking at the Foo Fighters topper. And that was a $2,000 topper. and it's just flat plastics with a little rotating sculpt. So if they would have made the Hogwarts castle with the projector, with the little plastic things that flip up, it would have been $24.99.
    26:51
    I mean, if that's what they released it for, I wouldn't be surprised. So, like, yeah, I get it. It's not the Godfather topper. That was amazing. If I could have got that but Harry Potter themed, oh, yes. Oh, yes. Yeah, that Godfather topper is pretty awesome. Yeah, right. I will say this, though. I was talking to my local distributor and we were, we were just like analyzing the crap out of the topper. And I was thinking to myself, I kind of feel like, and I have no knowledge to say whether this is true or not. This is just my, my opinion. I think they probably had a way lower budget for that topper after all the money that had to go into this game. And I think that's the best they could do within the budget they had. That's what I think. And it's not terrible. I don't look at it and go, Oh my gosh, this is the biggest steaming pile of monkey crap, but it's just not to the standard of a typical jjp topper i don't think especially if you compare it to like what don said the godfather one's pretty epic right so um but it's still i don't think it's not terrible or anything and then have you seen the projector working i did finally see that working in person no how's that look so here's the thing in the i don't think it's coded into the game yet but you can go into like the test mode and display it so right now all it is is it's the dark mark. So it's the tattoo that like Draco and all those guys have in the movie that like that dark mark tattoo that's on there, you know, that's on like their forearm. It's that, and it only looks like it's green, but it, but I looked like inside the projector. I think that's the only thing it can project. So it doesn't look like it can change what it can project. It's just that image, but it's just green right now. And I didn't see, there might be a way to change the color like it might be like an RGB but in the test it's just green it looks okay I mean I mean is it just like a little two inch projection on the ceiling above the machine I guess depends on how high your ceiling is does it so yeah so then they have a higher ceiling in that distributor so like we put we put first we put like a piece of paper above it and that's the dark marks kind of small so if it was in like your basement it probably wouldn't be much bigger than like that on your ceiling but on his ceiling it was pretty big because it was you know he has a high ceiling in there i have a i have a question to you guys because i i watched the first movie and then i saw all the merchandise for for harry potter and now when i see something something something on netflix there is a guy that's missing his mouth white head missing his mouth or is he missing his nose it's just like a bad guy you're talking about voldemort oh i thought you're talking about like a youtuber he has a mouth he has his nose is sort of weird but yeah he has a mouth all right all right so voldemort all right so there is this guy with the mask on the playfield but i've seen this voldemort guy a lot of times in the movies and i see on the playfield we have this guy with the mask on is voldemort on the playfield also because it feels like he plays a big part in the movie or movie series i don't know well that's the thing like if you think about it yeah he really is yes Voldemort is a big part of the movie but he's not actually like face to face with Harry very often at all the only time he really is face to face is like in the last two movies okay so that's the Death Eater that's the Death Eater yeah so he's much more in the movie than movies yeah because the Death Eaters are kind of like I don't know I'm not like big into the the books or anything I mean the Death Eaters are kind of the dirty work for Voldemort. That's how I would describe them. They're in the movie all over the place, especially toward the third, fourth, fifth.
    30:26
    It kind of makes sense that they'd put him on, but I can't remember. Voldemort, I don't know if he's on the artwork on the play field.
    30:33
    I don't know. Is he? I didn't notice him, but I only spent an hour or so with the game and I was just enthralled by everything else. I didn't even honestly notice. I was just thinking about it. This is the bad guy of the series. I feel like he should be there somewhere. I shot something. I molded. I'm sure Donnie could print something out, but it's just odd to me that he's not there. I mean, I guess I could see it from both perspectives. Like the hardcore would go like, well, he only faces off with them really truly toward the last movie. So he's not in all the movies. He is there, but it's more like Harry can. Yeah, he's an ethereal presence. It's like Harry has a piece of Voldemort in him. You know that whole thing, right? No, I only watched the first one. He has a scratch on his forehead. That's it. I don't know who it is. Okay, well, then the bottom line is like Harry has a piece of Voldemort in him. So like he can like hear him. He hears things that people don't hear. He kind of has this like telepathic way to communicate with him in a way. But you don't really get a face-off between them until you get like a minor one, but you don't get the major one until really the end. So maybe that was their thought process. We'll make it the final wizard mode, and it'll be more video than it will be on the playfield maybe. I don't know. That would be my thought. When people were talking about like there's no mechanism in this game, I'm like, listen, what do you want? Do you want like a big plastic Voldemort bash head like right in the middle of the playfield like X-Men or something? Is that what you want? You know, you're encapsulating eight films of content and just like putting it in a way that makes sense in pinball. and doesn't get in the way of itself. And I was thinking of like Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, you know, the big Frankenstein plastic head that's in the middle that like runs at you and looks around. Like, is that what people wanted to see? They were complaining about mechanisms? I actually thought it was that Death Eater. First, I thought that's Voldemort. But then when I saw the Death Eater, I'm like, yeah, I haven't seen the rest. But it just, when you see something Harry Potter, Voldemort is just there. We have some shopping malls with only Harry Potter stuff. and stuff, Voldemort on the doors, everywhere, this big guy. What's weird, though, is Voldemort really doesn't even have a body to be in until the later movies either. Like, he doesn't actually have a body. Like, the body you see of Voldemort, he doesn't, he's not in that actual body that you see, the character you recognize, until much later in the series. Okay, maybe he plays a very small part. That's maybe why. I don't know. But I do get it, though. Like, I get it, though. I can see it both ways because I can see they could have put him on there. I mean, maybe he could have been in place of the Death Eater, but you really don't battle him throughout the whole movie. So I don't know. I could go either way with it. I just figured it out. When we play the game, we are Voldemort, and we are controlling everything that's going on in Hogwarts. We're determining when the Golden Trio get together and they launch their multivoltaic. We are progressing them through their years. Everything is by our design as the Voldemort behind the scenes with the flipper buttons. That's good work. That's good meta. But how about your no more new games for 2025, Donnie? Yeah, screw that. Screw that business. Yeah, sir. Can we tell the audience that we predicted that he's going to buy this thing? Yes! We knew it. He's like, no, no, no, no, no, no.
    33:55
    So I think it was you, Retro, Ralph. We have this three-way messenger talk, which is really cool. We have it with you. We have it with Jeff. We have it with Kale. It's so cool. So you named it something really cool. You said something, Don is getting Harry Potter or something. I said Don is so buying Harry Potter. Something stupid like that. Yeah, something like that. So we have this talk back and forth. And Don was like, hell no. I'm not going to buy it. But what happened? What happened, Don? Every JJP loses value. There's no reason to rush in anymore. well I'll tell you the story of what happened is I was trying to be good and then it got released and I'm like damn it because of course I'm getting emails like if you want one quick you can get one now if you wait a day you're going to be six months from now and I'm like I'm looking around for stuff to sell I got that travel trailer outside I'm trying to price things together and then as I'm doing that one hour within the first hour of the launch I get this text message for my gig job and they're like hey any chance you can come out in a month for a string of days, and I was like, this is my Harry Potter money right here. I can exchange a week's trip out of town for this machine. So I said yes simultaneously to both the job and Jeff at Mad Pinball, and I'm like, let's freaking go. It didn't even register in my cortical brain. This was all like deep lizard brain responses. It was like a reflex. I had no control over it, man. Ralph, can you hear it? Can you hear it? He's like, I got some side hustle money. Now I can buy it. Just be a man and say you saw the game, you liked the ride, you just wanted it. Ralph put in so cool featurette video, you were like... I will say this, Don. You and I both get hammered for buying everything and loving everything. Yes. Why is that happening? What's wrong with that? The grapes are sour, that's what it is. What's wrong with that? I don't know. Buy a pinball, play a pinball, buy more, enjoy it, man. But I will say this, though. On this one, I have some regrets more recently. I don't try to just jump in on every LE. And I do regret that. I should have not gotten Kong LE. The only reason I did, and I know this is stupid, is because I really wanted to make content on it early. That was me wanting to get a jump on content creation. But is that worth the extra money I put in? I don't know. You could argue that. I mean, I guess like the way I look at it is if I have it and it's okay, if I feel okay with like, all right, I'm going to probably maybe lose a couple thousand bucks. And I know that's not, that's a lot of money, but if I'm okay with it, then like, why does anybody get mad at that? Like if I'm okay with it, like it might, someone might say that's stupid, but if I'm okay with it, then like, who cares? It's your money. I mean, it's your money. So don't get the C. I don't think, I don't think you should get the C. I think you should get the wizard. Yeah. So, CE's on its way. He's going to be like, I'm getting the CE. Yeah. So, I mean, I had an opportunity and pulled it off. So I'm waiting for the call. Should be any week. You know, we'll pick that one up. I have Fostered in my head because I do like the Wizard Arc. Wait, pick what one up? The collector's edition. I'm going to run down and grab it. Wait, so you did get the CE? Yeah, of course. I told you.
    37:23
    That's awesome. There's some hosier in the house. So I floated the idea of maybe having this collector's edition for a bit, and then once the Wizards start coming out, if it's still in high demand and somebody wants it, I'm okay downgrading the Wizard, except for the fact the gold wire forms. I don't want to miss out on that. I missed out on the gold legs for Godfather. I kind of want the gold. And then I saw the sparkle yesterday when I was playing it, and I'm like, this game just looks amazing. See, this is why, Don. See, this is why I can understand. See, this is now see that he's doing it. He's doing the thing. The gold. No, dude. Genghis. Have you not seen it yet? Oh, man. The gold freaking wire forms are stupid sexy. I mean, they really are. It's dumb. It's unnecessary.
    38:08
    It's so sexy, it's stupid. It's like when you look at it, it's all, it's the golden. It just plays it.
    38:16
    When this released, I looked up the price of getting those chrome wire forms and taking them to get them gold chromed. And like it was so cost prohibitive for a small number of five wire forms. It was like, it's just worth it to buy the CE because you spent all the money just doing that. And I'm like, damn it. You could go get them gold powder coated and be close to it, but it wouldn't be that sexy sex, shiny gold. Well, not to mention Eric explained to me and I'll admit sometimes I've worked in technology my whole career, but sometimes some things go over my head. And Eric was explaining to me the process of how they got those gold. and I like I left I did like what Jamie does he like leaves his body because he can't process whatever's going on sometimes he admittedly says this he like I left my body I was like Eric was still talking but it was like a shell of my body because he was like talking The process was so involved I was like holy shit Eric Like I was like it was like yes you could run these over with tanks and blast them with flamethrowers and belts hold up
    39:19
    That is awesome. Eric is awesome. I love floating above your body. He was so passionate about Potter too. He was the right guy to do it. He loves Potter. yeah yeah but guys no i haven't unboxed harry potter i haven't seen harry potter and i am heartbroken because of the way jjp jjp has treated us this time i'm not sure i should share this with you guys but i'm gonna share it in a way because yeah i'm gonna do it i'm gonna do it this is just you do this all the time jace as a viewer as someone that listens to you guys I love when you go, I don't think I should share this, and then you say it. I mean, if you jump into Patreon, I share a lot of stuff, but not here. But I'm heartbroken here. Not because this hits me, but it hits my brother, and it made my brother sad. And when that happens, I just pisses me off. So this happened. This happened. So this game comes out. my bro is the biggest jjp fan like he loves jjp and for 10 years he has been talking about when harry potter comes out i'm a huge harry potter fan he wants me to watch these movies all the time and he wants to buy them all to the locations and blah blah blah fine fine fine all right jay you love your brother so this game comes out jay is like we're gonna do unboxing We're going to film. We're going to fly them home. We're going to do everything. Because here in Denmark, you have to pay so, it's like $25,000 you have to pay for a CE, right? So people here know about our main location. They want to buy these games, but when it's so much money, they want to try them first. And I respect that. Come and try. We have some people from other countries come in and try. So he wanted to make this huge release here in Europe, which is cool. And he buys the collector's edition, the wizard edition, and the arcade edition.
    41:29
    Bam, bam, bam to the showroom. Talk about a golden trio. Just go big. Like, he's this guy. He's like this. Okay. All three games. Just give them to me. Let's release it. Let's do a big show. We have Retro Jenga on YouTube. We can talk about it. We can show this to everyone. and then people can make the orders and everything is cool, right? It's just a win-win for J.J.P., win-win for us, everything. Paid for the games, everything is ready. Today it's the 14th. We still haven't received the games.
    42:00
    If J.J.P. reaches out, we can fly them home same day. I don't even know, Genghis, though, here's the thing. I don't even think they've built any wizard ones except for the ones that were like the test ones. Yeah. yeah yeah well this happened another time i think it was with um with which game came out avatar godfather yeah before avatar godfather god yeah this happened with godfather we didn't get to see back then i hit up ken cromwell and i love ken Ken did his magic and I'm telling you bam we got everything in place and this time I don't have Ken I cannot pull Ken's arm he's not in there anymore unfortunately congratulations with the new job with Zach it's so cool but I don't have this you know Ken is just I love him but this just happened can you imagine how my brother feels he's such a he was like you know you feel like a lesser distro when this happens. And he tells me that he listens to a podcast that Eric Mignier was on. And on that podcast show, Eric says in an interview, by now, all our distros has their showroom games, except us, man. I mean, can you imagine how that makes me feel? I can see him being bummed out, especially because it's so exciting. I mean, I think we all, like, I'll tell you something that, like, it's really stupid. And I know it's stupid. So before I say it, I know that the way I'm feeling is irrational, but I got so excited doing the video that I thought, OK, I'm going to get the game like right away because I was I was so excited for the game that I was thinking, well, it's a no brainer for them to give me one right away because I'll stream it and get, you know, I'll get more more eyes on it and stuff. and when um and i'm not saying that by the way i'm i'm newer to the hobby so i don't like sending it to the flipping out it makes total sense because joel can like do his ninja magic and like look at the play field for five seconds and know every rule and every shot and every it takes me a lot longer so probably could show it in a better light than me anyway from a play perspective but i was really bummed when i was like oh man i kind of wanted it first but that but i also was realizing that I'm being a big baby by feeling that way. But you guys being a paid distro, though, I can see where that would set you because you're seeing all these other distros getting them except for you guys. In France and other countries here in Europe. And the bad part is now this happened. The game is out there to wear. So all the people that was on the list, because we have had this list for, like, a long time, you know, they're all, where's the game, where's the game, we want to come and try, we want to come and try, before we put like $25,000.
    44:53
    No one has ordered the game. They're waiting. And now those guys that are on the wanted to buy list, they're like, dude, if you come and try this game in two weeks from now and put in the order two weeks from now, they have to wait two years before they get their games. So it just destroys our sale possibilities. because they're selling like crazy now. And when the next game comes out, Jersey Jack's going to say, oh, you didn't sell that many Harry Potters. Because this industry is like that. But they're just destroying our possibility to, you know, yeah, sell the games to our customers. Because if it was $10,000 games here in Denmark, everybody would buy it. But it's just so much more over here. VAT, shipping, tariff. It's like it's crazy over here. So, yeah. I mean, so, yeah. Maybe we get the game in two, three weeks. And then people will say, okay, here is $205,000. When will I get my game? And you're at the end line of the production. It's like.
    46:06
    Where do you guys think they're at right now? Do you think that this week coming up is the first week where they're going to make customer ones? Like, I don't know. Like, no one knows. Or maybe someone does. The ones that were shipped up, they were built already. And we got insider knowledge that they were built before launch. So do you think that they already have customer ones ready to ship right now? They should be. Yes. People are unboxing now. Have you seen one that isn't a display sample, though? I haven't seen that yet. I've seen a young couple unbox and play the game yesterday. Oh, really? Okay, I must have missed that. It's out. It doesn't say display sample. Nope, it's out. So they are shipping. And I love stuff like that. But, yeah, that just bummed me out. But I want to say something else also because this is really negative, but I want to say something really positive also. I made my first impression video with the Harry Potter, and I really enjoyed what I saw. This featurette that Rachel Ralph made, without asking him permission, I just shared his video. I hope it's okay, Ralph. It's terrible. Please don't do that again. No, of course. I put a link.
    47:22
    So I loved what I saw, and from that perspective, I was just honest saying how I felt. I don't know about the theme, but look at the shots and layout. Look at everything. It's just wow. So I just shared that excitement. Fine. Last Saturday, I'm at, on a location with my son.
    47:44
    We started watching the Walking Dead series. So he was like, Dad, we got a Walking Dead over here. I was like, yeah, let's play it. So he starts a new game. He's so excited with Walking Dead. I start filming the camera and I want to make a short video and I want to show everybody how a 14-year-old first-time trier plays this game. I filmed for two seconds, and on my iPhone, this thing pops up. Bam, Jack Kunari. I'm like, what? I'm filming. And I don't know if I should share that video. I think I will share that video. Like he's texting you? Yes. Okay. So I got this mail from Jack. It says, Jack Kunari. And he starts with big letters, capital big letters. I love your video, Genghis. It's like, whoa, what? And he wrote the kindest letter to me. And I was like, I was so touched. I have made maybe 2,000 pinball videos. I mean, Gary Stern never did this personally to me. It was so, I mean, the head of the, do you know what I mean? Yeah, that's very cool. That's awesome. that's very cool. I'm like, in the video, I'm like, oh son, wait, Jack Gunari. And my son said, and my son, he's like, he's playing. He's like, man, who's Jack? And I'm like, it's Jersey Jack. And my son is like, what?
    49:14
    That's so cool. So over to my brother and look at this. It's Jack. Oh, that's awesome, man. So thank you, Jack. It's so cool. And he was excited. He was like, just wait to get the game. You will love this game. And I'm like, yeah, We bought the game. Ship the game to us.
    49:32
    Yeah, but I just want to say, yeah, am I angry because the letdown my brother felt? I felt his pain. And you can hurt me. It's all right. I can take it. But hurting my brother, I get in complete defensive mode when that happens. I cannot take it. You know how it is, right? So, yeah. But on the other hand, he did this. Thank you, Jack. I really appreciate it. It's so cool that these companies, these big guys, you know, watch us, small content creators' videos, listen to our shows. It's so cool. Just, yeah, a thank you from me to Jack.
    50:07
    Very cool. Yeah. So who's your sales guy contact over there? I mean, have you got word, like, when you can expect at least your display sample?
    50:17
    Oh, my God. Because Ken was my go-to guy. I don't have a Ken now, so I don't know who to hit up over there.
    50:25
    I cannot talk about the display sample stuff. It's devastating stuff. I cannot share it. I'm so sorry. It hurts if Jersey Jack listens. Okay. But, yeah, there are some details that we cannot share about that. So, yeah, I have to, yeah. But his daughter is our contact. Okay, yeah, yeah, Jen. I think she's cool. She's cool. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Busta from her.
    50:54
    Yeah. But so, yeah, I'm as much excited as you guys are. I really want to. I hope that, you know, I unbox this game by now. But, yeah, we have no idea. Hopefully soon, Genghis. Hopefully soon. Hopefully soon, yeah. I think we're all waiting for the same thing.
    51:11
    What? What did you say? I said we're all waiting for the same thing. I'm waiting to unbox mine. You know, Ralph's waiting on his.
    51:17
    Ralph, do you have any day, you know, ETA when you're getting yours? No. No, I don't have any ETA. I know. No, I don't. I don't have an ETA. That's all I can say. Have I been a royal pain in the ass asking? Yes. Do I have an ETA? No. But I realize I'm bordering like stalking almost, so I should probably maybe scale back just a tad on the asking, but I don't know.
    51:43
    Perfect, perfect. I know. I'm happy to talk. That's how I want to talk. Yeah. I mean, did you guys want to talk at all? I have 15 minutes left before my wife will actually kill me. But did you guys want to talk at all about some of the like feedback that's been going around? Because I think some of it's fair, some of it I agree with, some of it I don't. I know you guys probably have. I really want to talk about that, but I have a question to you guys because – and I want you two to answer because I'm from Europe and I don't know what's going on. So listen to this. We made a 20-minute show a couple of hours before this game came out, and Don and I was excited, so we just uploaded that show. And one of the responses was, how dare you to be this excited about Harry Potter after what J.J.K. Rowling said? You guys are assholes. Oh, you're going to go here. Okay.
    52:45
    I have no idea what happened. So this is the woman that – This is like you need to go offline and go like maybe look at her Twitter, and that will get you up to speed really quickly. I think that's probably the best part. Can't you just say what did you say? Is it very controversial? Is it a bad – I mean, it's very controversial to a pretty big group of people, but it and you know, but I don't I also disassociate. I personally disassociate whether someone agrees or not with like a company making a pinball machine to like people that. I don't know, are somewhat involved with the IP itself, like I never put those two things together, really. Like, I just always viewed this as Jersey Jack is putting a pinball machine into the world for us. Jersey Jack is not making a political statement with this machine or wanting to at all in my opinion so like I kind of separate the two that's just me though I don't have to agree wait what I have no idea what she said so I'm not like it's not even what she said Genghis it's like what she says it's like every day she says stuff that could upset a group of people come on share it with me what is it We need to fill you in offline, man. I don't think there's any way to navigate this. Okay. But are we assholes to be excited about Harry Potter, or is it just – is it okay? I think it's okay. Because I am excited about a Harry Potter game.
    54:18
    I think we all are. Yeah, I think it's fine to be excited about a Harry Potter game. And I also – I'll say this. I think if you were to look at things that we like in Hollywood, and we were able to learn everything that everyone believes that's made those projects. There's probably lots of people in lots of different forms of media that say things that we would be appalled by,
    54:39
    but then we probably wouldn't enjoy anything because Hollywood can be a pretty rough place as far as people's opinions and views. If you walk into a beautiful forest and you start disturbing the leaves, you're going to see the worms underneath.
    54:52
    100%. So, Donnie, let's do a Patreon show after this, and we can take it personal there on Patreon. Jesus, H, fine, sure. Good. Perfect. Good. Ralph, Retro Ralph, how was the feedback, Matt? How much love did you get for doing the featurette? It was great. The feedback's been great. But now that the game is out and people are playing it, it's a little bit different. Like, it's good and bad, right? I think there's some people that are fixated on certain parts of the overall presentation. But the video, everyone was very, very positive. Honestly, there probably was like less than 20 negative comments. Everything else was very, very positive. So it was some people just like saying, oh, it was very well produced, that kind of thing, and some just excited about the game. Lots of, oh, my God, I'm going to buy it. This looks better than I thought, like that kind of thing. And then a lot of, like, people really appreciating that Eric was the one that did it. What the heck was the negative stuff? What was the negative stuff? Yeah, what the heck? Like some of it was just like, oh, the CE, like some of it was that people, some of it, like people just didn't get the CE artwork even after Eric's explanation as to why that was so kind of important to him. But I kind of, I can see it both ways. But also I think the CE artwork, you have to see it in person. I don't think pictures do it justice at all. A hundred percent. It just doesn't. Yeah. It just doesn't. Yeah. Cause I had a big visceral reaction when it got revealed online. I'm like, oh, it's not what I had it pictured in my head. I hate it. and then now I've had some time to come around to it. I've seen it in person. I've felt the details that are in there, and I'm okay with it. I still like my vision of a floating Hogwarts castle suspended in mist with candles all around, but it's not just for me. It's for everybody. So I think the CE artwork is fine. I think the gameplay is amazing. I finally got to play it last night over at Lumberjack. Johnny's there. And, yeah, I don't know the first time you played it, but the first two games I had lasted 45 seconds because you've got to get used to how those balls are coming back, those return lanes, because they will just drain out. You have nothing slowing the ball down. So it was funny because the first time I played it, to Don's point, the first time I played it was actually when I agreed to do the featurette. I was out in Chicago for work already, and Ken's like, why don't you come over, you can sign the NDA, and then we'll show you the game. And, of course, I was super excited because this was like months ago. So I was like, okay. Now the one that I played was in, you guys know Marcy, right, over there. It was like in her office, like the game was in her office over at Jersey Jack. So it was a little intimidating because I had Joe Katz. I had Eric Minyer. Ken, of course, is super cool. Cool as a cucumber, Ken. And then Marcy, who's like kind of annoyed that we're in her office. Right. Because she's like, cool. Everyone is in my office. She's got work to do. And I totally get that. She she wasn't annoyed, but I would probably be if there were a bunch of people crammed into my office. It's not a big office. So I was playing it. And Eric, Eric was like, hey, just letting you know. It's a little fast. Like, it's going to be fast, but in a good way. And it was like the ball returned on the left side, and I missed it completely. I was like, what the hell? And he's like, yeah. He's like, him and Joe Katz were like, yeah, baby.
    58:01
    They're like, it's fast, right? I was like, holy shit. And then they were like, hey, look, that's going to be like that. Get used to it. After a couple games, I did. But then they're like, hey, try to shoot for the Death Eater. And when that ball comes back from the Death Eater, dude, it's like a rocket ship, Genghis. It's so freaking fast. Like, bam! It's so fast. It's so fast games. Love it. It's cool, right? But it's not fast. I think if you say this, like, because Don's played it. If you said to someone, oh, my gosh, it's super fast, they're automatically going to be thinking, like, oh, it's going to be a drain monster. I'm never going to play it. That's not the case. You adjust to it after a couple of games But it fast enough to be like really fun And once you start hitting the shots it does flow really well It flows better than any J I personally ever played I haven played all of them I think there's like a couple I haven't played. But, man, I really like the way it plays. Like code aside, just the shots itself are super satisfying in this game. I had a sequence. A staircase is a genius thing, even though people are like, oh, it's just a diverter. It's a freaking badass diverter. It's completely awesome. I had a sequence I played yesterday where I hit the inner orbit. off the upper flipper, went in that little side passage to that left draining lane, crossed over the flippers up into the one that gets into the shooter lane somehow, and then I was back in my flippers again, and I'm like, what the hell just happened? This serpentine pattern of this ball. Like, that's epic, right? It was awesome. Yeah, once I got used to it. Genghis, I want you to give me like, ho!
    59:28
    But I have a question to you guys. I'm the kind of guy, when I play Swords of Rage, I start a mission on mode, and it says shoot these three ramps or orbits or whatever, right? And everything else is off. I'm that kind of guy. I enjoy it. I know my mission in life. I know what to do. So if you guys watched my unboxing video, an ultraviolet light video of Avatar, I start a new game.
    60:02
    80% of the insert lights are lit and blinking and changing colors. And I have no idea where to shoot. How is it with Harry Potter? Is everything lit again? Everything is blinking different colors. You're like, when you're two minutes in the game, you're like, what's going on? Or is it you have this mode, you have to shoot these targets? How is it? Donnie, you go first. I think like anything else, you know, if you just walk up and you haven't played it before, it's going to be just information everywhere, and you're just going to have fun throwing balls around. Once I started to get into it, I started to find out, okay, there's the targets for Hermione. There's the targets for Ron. That's how I let my multi-ball. This is the little compass in front of the spinning staircase. that's going to tell me which direction the ball is exiting. And so then I started to wrap my head around it. Now, there's 90 mini modes in here, so it's going to be tons of colors no matter what, but I think there's going to be levels to understanding of it. What do you think?
    61:02
    Yeah, no, I agree with you. I do think, though, like I did – did you guys watch what – was it straight – no, Triple Drain. Did you guys watch it and listen to what their feedback was on it? I just listened to their recent episode, yeah. okay so so they were kind of they were kind of saying like joel and travis are kind of going back and forth a little bit about how sometimes when you're in a mode i will say everyone's kind of saying it's a little hard to start a mode but i think that's kind of funny because it you could totally argue the same thing about kong the gong shot isn't like this awesome easily repeatable every time shot on the pro it is what's that on the pro yes on the pro yes but i could argue like starting a mode on Kong isn't that easy. I could argue starting a mode on Godzilla isn't that easy, right? I mean, that scoop is like not that easy to get into for someone. So I don't really get the argument of it. If your whole argument behind that is that a casual might have a hard time with it, that's true. I think a casual is going to have a hard time hitting that scoop. I really do. Like someone that just steps up, has never played pinball in a long time or rarely plays, they're going to have a hard time with it. But as far as like the code, because that was your question, I think the only thing and I've I've only recently bought a Jersey Jack so I bought an avatar though and this might be just how Jersey Jack approaches code they sometimes allow for like lots of things to stack on top of each other while you're in the mode and that can get confusing so but that might just be what they want like they maybe they're like we don't care that's how we want to code games and there's people that are going to appreciate that and people that are not but um it does i will say like me and the distributor we were playing we're because the code was not the code i played the code i played didn't even let you select the movies yet like that wasn't even in it and mark silk's voice wasn't even in it none of that stuff was in it so my early day stuff was like it was just a playable it was there but you couldn't do a lot of things you could do now i do think sometimes when you nest things on top of each other it does get a little confusing but for the most part like if you've played pinball a lot you can figure out what you need to do but yeah there's a little confusion to it i think right now but i don't know if that's just by design like hey we let you layer all these things but jengis if you're like you like that like linear this is what i have to do and i don't want you to give me anything else while i'm doing that then i think in the beginning you'll have really fun shooting it to what don said you'll have a blast shooting it but you might be a little bit like oh i don't know really how to like progress i'm not that straight because if you take a game like godzilla godzilla no matter what you shoot you activate something something cool is going on on godzilla on top of each other you build up something higher higher higher all the time right and it just works on godzilla it does work on godzilla it works they did something there it just works but one of my favorite games again eric minier pirates if you have played pirates a lot it has got like five inserts just over the flippers that's the different movies multiballs right and when you start movie two multiball while you are in multiball you can actually build up all the green shots and while you're in multiball you will start movie three it's multiball movie five's multiball while you are in multiball and after a minute or something having constantly multiball in all five movies it just drains my energy. It's just too much for me. It reminds me of Guns N' Roses, if you know what I mean. So that's the only thing. I don't want stuff like that. But I have also been playing for many years. If a new guy approaches this, it would be awesome, such a blast for that person. I understand it. But you just need to, you know, balance it. Here's what's crazy. Don, I don't know if you played it by yourself or with someone else, but when I was playing it, I had played it obviously a little bit, and the distributor has it. It's Aaron over at Game Room Goodies. He hadn't played it at all yet. But despite all of what I just said, we were having a freaking blast. It was the one more game. We kept doing one more game, one more game. He actually had to leave to go. He's like, oh, I've got to leave? And I was trying to be respectful of that. I'm like, all right, Aaron, well, I know you said you have to go. He's like, no, no, no, no, dude, we've got to start Golden Cheer Multiball first. I was like, but I thought you said you have to go. So I'm trying to be respectful of his time. It's his business. He's trying to close down. We stayed another extra hour and a half. And he's like, oh, shit, oh, shit, I really, really have to go. So I don't know what he was doing. But, like, that's a good thing. If you go up to a game and you want to just keep playing it, despite code maybe being a little confusing at first, I think you've won, right? Like, if people keep wanting to plunge the ball and keep putting money in it, I think you have a winner, right? My wife and I, we walked into this place, and there wasn't a huge line to play it. And so we went there. We put $15 in the game in like an hour. And I think for any game on location, that's awesome. Yeah, like I kept wanting to play to get the damn multi-ball. This was a game. I had to work for every multi-ball that I got. It wasn't just awarded to me like some of the other ones that he's done. So I think he's listening to that feedback. And, yeah, that's the main thing I took away was like the game was fun. I wasn't there thinking like, oh, these clips are muted. I wasn't thinking, oh, these people that wrote the code have no idea what they're doing. I was just like, I want to start this multi-ball. I want to figure out what's going on with the spinning staircase. And holy crap, these balls are fast. Yeah. It's so cool. Yeah, same. That's how I felt about it too. I was just having a good time trying to figure out how to do certain things within the game. And, yeah, we were having fun. We were having a blast with it. So we did mess with the – did you mess with the QR thing at all? We did play with that. We did not. The easy mode. Yeah, I couldn't see. They're supposed to come up on the screen so you can take a picture of them and scan them. I didn't see that happening. So in the coin box, though, the keys have the dongle, have the little things, the tags on them. So it's weird. You just put it up to the camera when you start playing. We did play it on, we played it on Wizard for the majority of the time. No, we played it on Normal, then we tried Wizard, and then we tried Easy. The thing about Easy is, like, I could totally see it. If you had someone over the house, they don't really play pinball much, but maybe they're, like, a giant Harry Potter fan. If you do the Easy card, a lot of the stuff's already, like, pre-lit. so it does like it gives them more of the like you're you see a lot more the one thing i was kind of bummed about though like for easy mode it did not affect at least on this game it didn't change the um the ball save timer oh to me easy would oh yeah i thought that was weird yeah like to me that should really extend the ball save timer and it didn't so maybe they're still like coding that i don't know but yeah all right guys uh we have uh retrof here i think we we said Sorry. Before we finish, I just want to say thank you for the support. A couple of days ago, you shared some of my teaser videos for Predator. And I love when us content creators, we support each other this way. And I really appreciate it. I just have one little thing I want to say. This is not just about Predator, but any game. So we have something coming. We have Star Wars coming up next, right? We're excited. a guy like me i would love to have some tidbits some teasers whatever because like predator we know it's in four days we'll have the game but it's cool to have some teasers and see what's going on that's yeah that's just how i feel does it irritate you guys because i had one or two other content creators that got really annoyed by my teaser videos and i'm like if you're annoyed why don't you just block me how do you feel if you had done if you had the opportunity to share some star wars stuff you like star wars very much you don't need to have money no nothing wouldn't it be cool i would love to watch them i don't know um i kind of think if you spread it out too much, you kill the momentum that's building.
    68:59
    If we just get to expect every couple of days there's going to be a shot of an in-lane or something, we're piecemeal putting this thing together. I like the reveal. When we got the Harry Potter reveal, I got the picture. Now I get to go through and dissect everything that's happening. When you give me a little tease, I just want more, and then I'm thirsty because there's no more.
    69:18
    Every time I release anything, 99% of the people are like, oh, this is killing me. Give us more. He was more – and people are saying this is so awesome. But I just had a couple of content creators that was like – and one of them actually contacted Pinball Brothers and wanted to get the stuff so he could release it also. So I just want to find the balance because collectors are just – they're so happy. The response is like, yes, more of this, please. Genghis, I think you have two things in there, right? One of them is how people respond to teasers, right? Which I'm kind of with Don. I think you can tease for a while, but if you tease for too long, then I think people will start to get annoyed. I'm just talking about general public, right? Not other content creators. Because they're like, okay, you've given me everything. So I think there's definitely like a timeline of teasing, right? But then I think your other thing, that's just jealousy. That's someone being jealous that Genghis got it and they did it. That's all that is. To me, that's 100% another content creator being jealous that you have it and they don't. I don't have that gene in me. That has been my problem all my life. I don't understand jealousy stuff.
    70:36
    I mean, I knew about Retro Ralph before he did pinball stuff because I'm in love with arcade stuff also. And Ralph has made amazing videos on the arcade scene also. but when he came in to the pinball stuff here i mean he's like top of the line right now i think you're number one guy right now in the pinball content creating stuff uh especially this week and i'm not envy i'm like this is so cool more power to retro relve well i don't thank you i don't believe that's true but thank you really that's how i feel this is so cool no but jeng is the reason why like we're all so like I feel like our personalities are all just like chill guys right and I think that's why we feel the way we are like I don't get mad when I see I'm like stoked when I'm like holy shit Don painted himself freaking blue like I want to go watch what the hell he's doing and then I'm like does Don did I didn't know Don by the way that the basketball court is in your house so I'm like did he just rent a basket like for the longest time like this guy's totally nuts but I love it I'm like he rented a basketball court he freaking like I didn't even know I could have asked you but I guess I was just like he painted himself blue like I love that kind of shit I think we're just having fun and I think there are some people that just I don't know like they want to have they just have to live in a different headspace that's not fun sometimes and I don't know I don't know how to do that like I don't there's so much stuff in all of our lives to get us upset drama stuff family things things people's health you know relatives whatever that's the stuff that I want to focus that like if I need to focus that kind of energy on but my hobby should be fun right I don't want to be miserable and be like oh my god this one fucking sorry it's one fucking thing on this play field is it's like no it's like that's minor you know what I mean like unless it's something major if the game doesn't work okay we can be upset oh yeah jeez people man like we're I think we're just all very chill guys and I think that's why we understand each other like that. And there are just some people that aren't. And I don't know. They just want to live in some weird, angry headspace. And I don't get it. I don't get it. Me neither. We'll never get it. We'll be Matt. We'll be aggravated trying to get it. We're never going to get it. That's it. Yeah. Yeah. All right. So if people want to reach out to Retro Ralph, how can they do that? Just just yeah. Retro Ralph on YouTube is the main channel, which I do a lot of like the produced content on and then, uh, retro Ralph live. I tried to change the channel to the flip side, but I didn't do that because everyone was searching my name. So, um, so retro route, retro Ralph live takes you to the flip side podcast. But if you were just doing like a Google search and you want to do audio only just do the flip side podcast, retro Ralph, and it will come up on Spotify and Apple podcasts. So, uh, but no, I appreciate you guys. I love coming on here because you guys are so fun and we just have a good time and don's got the dj donny thing jengis is fired up like it's awesome i love you guys you guys are awesome and thank you for having me guys can you smell it can you smell it what is it what are you bringing
    74:01
    Oh, yeah, baby. That's how it is over here. So every time I hear Don use this, I don't know why, but it's turned into like you do a hacksaw Jim Heduggan like, it's like the best thing. I don't know why.
    74:17
    It is what it is. It's all that support we're getting. It's just love and positivity. And we just, we feed by it. It's so cool, man. Jealousy, I don't know. I don't know how to handle that, but I think pinball is, you know.
    74:36
    Almost made it. We almost made it. Almost. We're old. Am I out again? Keep going. Can you hear me? Yeah. Am I back? Yes. I just want to say we're 45, and we're like middle-aged because I think none of us will live to we're 90. So we're getting old now, right? But through this hobby, we gain friendship, talk to each other off camera. I mean, daily we're talking to each other. This is so cool. So I just love pinball. And some people are like, they say the same thing about Retro Wealth. Here's a pinball shield. They say it about Donnie, about our show. It's just pinball love, right? That's it. I mean, when you turn a game on, you're just happy, right? When you buy $15,000 games, you're just happy. If someone wants to give me money to talk up games that are terrible, like I'm open to it. Just no one's made that offer yet. So if I'm a shill, I'm the worst shill ever because I'm getting like no money for it. I know. Me too. I spend more money than I make. So I'm definitely not a shill, right? Isn't a shill like cashing in on all the good stuff? Terrible shills. I actually have one little news that no one knows about. We can share it here instead of Patreon. One thing. Okay. Give me one minute. So two shows ago, two weeks ago, we met a show, and we got a lot of mails, a lot of support, a lot of support. And one of the support was from Canada, and it was like us Canadians were lovely people, and I fully agree. I love Canadians. I have said that on all my shows. So this guy, I don't know him, right? And he writes very positive. And then he says it's a pinball company. and I'm like, pinball company? What do you do? And he presents himself and then he makes the game with the infinity in the middle. What's that game called? That is Elements. And I think we can get into that more here next time.
    76:36
    Okay, okay, let's do that. Okay, let's do that. Okay, later. Thanks again, guys. We don't want an angry retro Ralph Life. So everybody, thanks for once again joining us. Episode number 38, Fire, continue to come. Retro Ralph, thanks so much for joining us here. Like and subscribe to this guy for the best from this and the flip side. We are pinball69 at gmail.com. That's how you get on to us. We'll continue the conversation over on Patreon as we do. Patreon backslash wearepinball. I think that's everything, right? I'm Don. He's Jengis. He's Ralph. Then Ralph's wife is screaming in the background. So go have fun. Go get some lunch, sir. Bye.
    77:10
    Bye. so donnie let's jump over to patreon we're gonna talk about what's wrong with jj rolling what she said we're gonna talk about kong because i have you know fully experienced the game now and you asked me if i could give some info about the upcoming game predator oh the predator yes yes i do want to have that hot dripping news content all over my face and i'm gonna share it and i'm gonna further i'm gonna do that but before we jump over there i just want to say thank you for the Support from Enzo, from Jeremy Ford, from Anthony Muroa, and from Josh Cox. We love you guys. Thank you for the amazing support. Let's jump over to Patreon and enjoy the rest of the show.