This month on the JBS Pinball Roundtable, is Retro Ralph still a thoroughbred Clydesdale? Can Jamie handle 20 seconds of Christopher Franchi talking about AI without a nap? This week's host, Cale Hernandez, the Bruce Springsteen expert, still doesn't know who Cary Hardy is. But we know this, tramps like us, baby, we were born to run. And welcome to the JBS show, Pinball Roundtable, Part 5, Kale Hernandez's show. How are you, Kale Hernandez? And Retro Ralph, the roundtable. We're back together. How about that new intro, boys? I love it. It's pretty good. Wasn't that cool? Glenn Webber did the voice, took bits from our last podcast, and then put it in an intro form. And then Mason Rudolph, shout out to Ralph's boy Mason, who I'm paying to Rudolph. Isn't his last name Rudolph? Dude, dude, what? Do you really think? It's not even close to his last name. Whatever. What the hell? You're starting off the show strong. His last name is Conrad Rudolph. Where did you get Rudolph from? mason rudolph i know mason he's a programmer dude he's a fucking programmer and uh all of a sudden my head went to recruiting sorry whatever i love you he said it was his confidence i was like maybe his name is rudolph i don't know anyway welcome to the round table i'm jamie birchall i'm joined by keller and enders and retro ralph and uh you know we always do plugs at the end i'm changing it up i'm plugging right now okay i'm plugging right now because right out right now is retro ralph's latest podcast do pinball leaks suck and uh it was really good listen dude i loved it so congrats on that go listen to that if you haven't already and then of course uh electric backcast just uh what was it 27 or 28 you guys i think you guys is like back to back man 28 it's nice Yeah, we're getting a little busier. What are you doing over there? You got some – Oh, sorry. I was just unwrapping my pin bombs. I figured that was the next part was going to be our sponsor. No, no worries. I have another podcast coming out later this week where I interviewed Gerry Stellenberg and Michael Ocean from Multimorphic. Check that out. But it's a new – well, something new is coming from Multimorphic, and I interviewed them last week. And that will be out this Thursday around 9 o'clock Central Time. So check that out on my channel. All right. Pinbomb. We love Pinbomb. Let's give them a shout-out. We love Brooklyn Pinbomb. Everyone has their Pinbomb. Got me through the Grand Canyon. He just unwrapped his. He's putting it on right now. Thank you so much. Go to her Etsy shop. Buy yourself some Pinbomb. It's awesome. All right. Are you ready? This is Cale Hernandez's show. I'm just using his nautical maps to steer the ship. These are his things that he said. And the first thing he wants to talk about, Cale, is competitive pinball. Why is Ralph and Jamie losing their shit at these tournaments? Yeah. Yeah. What's going on? You know, I legit don't know what's going on and I need to hear from you guys. What's the dealio? Well, Ralph and I are crazy. I think that's fair. Would you say that, Ralph, that we're a little nutty? Yeah, maybe our reactions are a little bit extreme. Yeah, we might care a little too much. So it started with Ralph and I text each other during tournaments and try to pump each other up. And then we get, like, I'll look him up on MatchBite, see where he's at, give him some shout-outs. He does the same for me sometimes, right? It's nice. It's nice friendship, right? The problem is we both get in our heads. And like a stern ball bouncing in between our ears, we lose our minds, especially if we have a bad ball one and it starts off bad, right? And what I can do, what he can't do, let me tell you what I can do that you can't do. Me, that I can't do? That you can't do. There's a lot I can't do. No, no, no. So I was a golfer, right? When I would hit a shitty shot and wind up in the trap, I would grab my clubs that I needed, and I would walk up, and I would tell the guy, hey, drive the cart up. So I would walk my ass up to the green thinking, calming myself down and getting in the trap. What do I got to do to get up and down here? I got to breathe. I got to walk this shit off, right? So I do that at pinball tournaments, and people think I'm crazy. Like I just go for walks around Eureka Heights or wherever. I'll just walk because people want to talk to me, and I love to talk to people. But at this point, I just had a shitty ball one on Batman 66. I haven't even done the TV. I have no fucking gadgets, and I just want to be left alone. Okay? So I walk. I go for walks. Now, Ralph doesn't go for walks, and I've been encouraging him to go for some walks lately, right? No, my move is stay in stew. Stay in stew. Yeah, works good. And that's fine. That's a technique. It's not working for him, and the walks are typically not working for me. The walks, I do the walks. Actually, I don't do the walks. I don't have the same problem you guys have. But the walks are great. But also what Ralph is doing, the technical term is sitting in the mud. And it's fine. Sometimes you just need to sit in the mud. What happens, though, Cale, is like I'm not just sitting in it. I'm digging a hole into it so I can bury myself deeper into the mud. It doesn't always turn out bad, but you said something, and I don't remember if you said it on this podcast or if you said it on your own podcast, so I'm sorry if I get this wrong. but you said play the game not the player yes and that ever since you said that i've been keeping that in my mind and i'm like okay my a lot of this craziness that's going on is because i'm obsessed with what everyone else is doing so i was like i gotta stop that and just take it one ball at a time and i'm playing the machine and that has helped actually it's helped that has helped my walks too i've been like okay you don't have a gadget you don't have any of this shit that's You know what you need to do, Ball 2. And then I'll walk it out, and then I'll come on back. I definitely don't watch players. Do you watch them? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. What do you mean, I watch them? I obsessively watch them. You got to get the hell out of there. So I had a bad, Jamie, I had a bad night one night. And why I'd pick this game to play after the tournament was over is stupid. So I go over to Black Knight Sword of Rage. And I shit game. And I do the thing. I'm like, but instead of saying it like is normally if it's a game I own, I'm like, I own this game. I own this game. And I was like, F this game. I own this game. They said it's a black night. And Kale's like in my peripherals and he makes eye contact with me and just starts cracking up because he's like, dude's losing his mind. But in that moment, I was I was off the rails, but it was just me and black night. So it was kind of whatever. But yeah, the week before. See, I don't think Kale listened to the podcast where I lost my mind. I mean, I really I had one really and I didn't I don't think you realized it, Cale, because I was probably acting cool when I was over talking to you and Rachel. But I had absolutely was out of my mind. I just had a really bad night. And I was I was like I was losing it. I was like, I don't understand. I have James Bond, but I kept repeating the same thing. We can't just the people look at you, Cale, like there's something wrong with him. He's just repeating the same thing. I couldn't I couldn't even. I was like, I own James Bond. I own James Bond. And he's the guy from Atomic Age. What's his name again? Oh, my God. That's Amanda and Bob. Yeah. So Bob was like, hmm. I think Bob at that moment was like, you know, I thought this guy was kind of cool before. I don't think so anymore. Bob was like, dude's got problems. Like, he's really he needs help. I love Bob, though. Bob doesn't judge, man. He loves you. He doesn't judge. He's really cool, and so is his wife. But anyways, shout out to Atomic Age. We're working on it. We're working on it. We know we're crazy. He's going to start walking, and I'm going to start talking to people in between rounds a little more. Okay? Do both of you guys have Apple Watches? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I need to keep up with your steps. We need to share. You know how you can friend up? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I need that. Oh, yeah. That'd be good. I need that slug. Right. I need accountability, partner. And we all need to do that because just walking in general, it's the best exercise. It is. Put on a podcast. Don't listen to anything and just think. And it's especially good in the morning. There's actually science-backed data on this. As soon as you wake up, I wake up at the crack of dawn. I don't know if anybody else can follow along with that. You see, look at Jamie. We've already lost him. I don't understand this. The spectrum of light that comes from the sun right when the sun rises over the horizon, it gets your brain kicked into gear. And then the motion from you walking actually does something also. No, I agree. I love walks. I go for walks a lot, and I would love to show off my three-mile. I have a three-mile little walk. It's a good podcast, maybe and a half. At 1.5 speed, you've got to listen to my 1.5, Cale. So after this, we're going to link up so we can see each other's stuff. Yeah, yeah. Every time we do an exercise, you know, the best part, me and my friends do it. And then every time you do something, your friends can give you kudos. I need kudos. I've been a slug. I've been a slug. You know the secret, and this is no bullshit, you complimenting other people actually gives you a boost, a dopamine boost. That's true. You look gorgeous today. Yeah, yeah. When I go around, oh, man, you're so amazing. It actually helps me. You're like a sand master. He's a sand master, right, Rob? Yeah. Imagine if Match Play had this capability. Like, hey, Jamie just got first place. And I could be like, Jamie, you kicked that. Like, go, Jamie. That might work. That is great. A thumbs up. Yeah, that'd be cool, actually. I don't know how much engineering effort Match Play has behind them as far as people, but that would be actually really cool. Wouldn't that be a cool other level of interaction between players? No, match play needs a social aspect to it. Yeah. And that's great. It's actually only one dude that does all that. Oh, damn. Well, that's pretty impressive. We'll give him a point. He's doing a great job. Match play is pretty awesome. It is. It's pretty great. All right, product ready for show and tell. Kale has an idea. He wants to show off a product, a pinball-related product or service that he wants to talk about. And let's start off with Kale, right? Yeah, this is a new segment of the show. We need to come up with a name for it, but this is the evolution process. Like roundtable picks or something like that. Yeah, something like that. And Glenn needs to come up with a little jingle, and then so you hit your button on the Rodecaster, and then we get into it. Okay. My pick is, and I think Ralph knows these guys, at Electric Playground. yeah the topper guys yeah i'm working on a video for him right now actually you're kidding me is it is it something you can talk about we don't need to get into it i can't talk about it but you'll it's something you guys will probably want it's pretty cool okay very good they sent us the pulp fiction double tap pinball topper yeah have you guys seen this thing yeah this thing's That's cool. Man, it is so cool. Yep, it's at the bat. So when they called me, first of all, we met at – it's Alex and Rob. Rob and – yeah. It goes by Rob or Robin. Yep. And we met them at Expo. So it was a while back, and they said, we're working on something super cool that I think you're going to love. We want to send you one so you can install it at the bat. I was like, yeah, sure. Let's do it. They got in touch with me, and it was this – this Pulp Fiction topper. Man, it's so cool. It comes, it's just the way, these guys have thought about everything. It is packed so incredibly well, so things can't get damaged. I opened it up, followed the directions. Everything is very clear. And now, if you've installed a topper before, like a stern topper, of course, there's a little more to this because they didn't make the machine and the topper. So they have to find some workarounds. And it was like, you know, I had to run some cable through the backbox into the cabinet and plug it into a board. And that's the way all this stuff works. And when I put it together, I was like, this is genius. These guys are brilliant. And most importantly, I mean, that's just how the sausage is made. But what the people see in the arcade, I'm getting so many questions about this thing. That's cool. And head over to their website. I think it's just a TEP pinball, right? P-E-P pinball.com. Yeah. You can see videos of it because it's mechanical. It has a little – every time the gunshots go off, a little ball goes across a habit trail. And it is like – and everybody is like, how do I make it happen? I want to see it happen. So they put more money in the machine just to see this little ball fly across the habit trail. And another cool thing is – I stopped your pulp fixing so you'd never see that ball do shit when I'm playing it. Yeah, there you go. You've got to keep putting money in there. Very cool thing. During the attract mode, it has two big speakers built into the topper, and it fires off gunshots. So we'll be like we're in the arcade like early in the morning, and we go bam, bam. And, I mean, it's just like genius. That's when you think of Pulp Fiction, that's when you think of guns, doing gangster shit. And this just exudes that. The important thing about this topper, they're only making 300 of them. And we know for a fact there's more than 300 Pulp Fictions out there. You know, not the LEs with the toppers. You don't need a topper, right? But these things are super limited, and so you might want to jump on them. And they also come with a very cool double-tap badge. That was cool that they did that. Yes. Because the LE has a badge. That was cool. And I think it says, like, double tap edition or something, right? Right, right. That's cool. Yeah, and I just had to bring this up. These guys are doing incredible stuff. I can't wait to see what they're doing in the future. This is a quality topper, and we're having a lot of fun with it, and people are talking about it a lot. Thumbs up to the crew over at Electric Playground. There you go, Robin and crew. Congrats. All right, Ralph, your turn, sir. Product placement service, whatever that you'd like to. Mine's super easy, actually. It's this Klein digital angle gauge. I love this thing. I just left the arcade, and I used that because we pulled the machine out from the back, and I had to use it. I love that thing. It's so cool. It's great. So you put it on your machine, right, Jamie? Because Kayler knows what it is. You put it on your machine and, like, you know, if you want to set it to 7, 7-5. I've been really anal about where I set this stuff because I try to set up my games up now similar to the bat just because I play there, you know. So I'm trying to figure that out, although I haven't gone in a couple weeks. And so this is nice because, I don't know, you can't go by the bubble. I mean, because, like, if someone says, oh, put the bubble here, I don't feel like the bubble is the most accurate thing. So just using this is awesome. and plus with the bubble you're guessing that you're at seven because someone will go oh if the bubbles between these lines it's seven two but sometimes it's not accurate so this is great this is awesome i love this thing it's not even that expensive honestly it's like 30 bucks it's like 29 bucks or something and you know why i love it um well you know i started using it because i saw jack danger using one in his videos years ago really okay before he started working at stern he would show and I was like oh I have to get one of those but I love when people are at the arcade and they say a table is not level I love pulling that thing out yeah well and you can use it quick use it quick and it's got a magnet so it'll stick to whatever it is just to be accurate I take the glass off and put it on the play field no it's awesome man this has been one of those things where I sometimes move my games around a little bit in the garage if I'm like working on something. So to be able to like set them back up quick and make sure they're good. I'm really weird about it though. Like I'm really weird about the, the, the pitch and making sure it's like exactly leveled. The only problem with that is because my garage floor is a little interesting. Like if I'm nudging a game too much and I, because the floor in certain parts of my garage slopes down a little bit. So sometimes I have to readjust, but I'm really weird about that. I, it does make me wonder though, like do people at home, I mean, We could get into this later, but do people at home actually set up their games right? Do they do all this stuff to make sure it's playing the best it can play? I don't know. That would be interesting to know whether they do or don't. But sometimes games don't play right at the wrong pitch. Yeah, for sure. I hope they do because they're not enjoying it. Okay, now we have to get into this because there's no wrong pitch. Well, I mean like there was a couple of games like Uncanny X-Men when I first got it. was like, I don't know if mine was weird, but like when I called Stern, they were like, actually, we probably put it more 7-2 and then test. And I had better results. He's like, yeah, leave it at 7-2 then if it's playing better at 7-2. But most of the time, yeah, you could have it at the standard pitch and you should be good, right, for most of the – at least the Stern stuff. Well, there's no – I don't know. Well, 6-8 is their recommendation, right? That's bullshit. Well, it says it on the game at least Yeah, but it doesn't mean anything I mean, here's what I mean, people argue about this I mean, it's ridiculous You can put your game at whatever pitch There's no right pitch It depends how you want it to play Yeah, right You know, if you go to InDisc You know, they put four-inch leg levelers On the back of the legs I mean, some of those things are like nine degrees I mean, and they make it that hard because you have the best players in the world showing up. Yeah. Also, you want to, and Elwin has talked about this, you really want to throw off professional players. Put it out like a. Make the game completely flat. Yeah. Because you get more side to side movement. Like you get in the slings. It goes nuts, right? Yeah. Because you have that east west if it's too sloped too low. Yeah. So, yeah, and I've talked to people that make these machines at Stern. You know, I've helped them set. I've been on the circuit and helped them set it up, helped them set the booth. They're not, like, measuring anything. These games play. They play at any damn. It just depends on how you want it to play and what you like. Yeah, this is more of a look into my weird brain, though. Yeah, there's technically no, like, correct pitch. Yeah, right. Exactly. Yeah. It's whatever feels good to you, really. Although I will say, not to doggone them, but you guys always get me into trouble. My Barrels of Fun Labyrinth was very temperamental. Like it had to be, you almost had to like talk sexy to it and like go in the room and be like, hey, baby, I'm going to play you later. Like you had to really finesse it and then it would play great. But you had to like really whisper sweet nothings into the backbox. But anyways, sorry, Jamie. What's your product? My product is going to go from this segment to the next segment. It's a perfect – what would you say? It's a perfect lead-in. Segway. Yeah. Okay? Have you guys ever been on a Segway? No, I'd fall. I've been on one. Wouldn't you like to? Ralph, have you ridden on one? Yeah. You mean like the – well, which one? Like the ones with the stick? The two-wheel, the actual Segways. Yeah, yeah, 100%. Do you have one? I don't have one. My son had a – he had all the knockoff ones, but I've been on an actual Segway one. And the one that doesn't have the pole, it goes in between. It's like a mini cycle. It's really hard to steer this ship when we get through these waters. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. We went through that hole. It's hard because we go through these – Can we go – when Jamie's in town, can we go rent Segways and drive? There's a thing in Scottsdale where they do Segway tours. How did Jamie Dyeway come to Arizona? I did it with my daughter. It's a Segway tour. You go to all these. Yeah, but I don't want a tour. I want to do our own thing. I think we can rent them. Yeah, we can just rent them. In Scottsdale, there's my favorite ice cream joint. We can go get ice cream on the Segways. Dude, let's do it. Okay. So, ladies and gentlemen, what they're talking about. My wife is out of town for an entire month, and I'm bored out of my mind, and I bought a $138 plane ticket back to and from Houston to Tempe, Phoenix, and I'm going to the bat. I'm going to hang out with these two idiots for the entire Labor Day weekend, whether they like it or not, because I'm coming. So we're going to do Chewy's famous all classics bounty knockout, and you can check me out on the stream there too with Cale and Serge. Hopefully Serge is there because he's the best of the best. Yeah, he'll be there. And then I'll do the Tuesday night bat league and get my ass kicked and do a lot of walking. So you'll definitely see my steps increase on that tournament. Good deal. All right. My product is very simple. It's a headset. It's a headset. It's a headset that I use for pinball podcasting. It's called an Audio Technica, and it's attached to the Rodecaster 2. And I also have a camera, a Sony ZV-1. Now, all this in is a little expensive, right? But what I like Stern to do is maybe invest so that when one of your top employees goes on a podcast called Loser Kid he doesn sound like he talking in a phone booth okay A bathroom A bathroom A phone booth would actually maybe have sounded better. It probably would have sounded better, right? And all of this, he doesn't need all of this, okay? He can go with a Rodecaster Duo, which is like $199. He doesn't need the Audio-Technica. Does he, Ralph? No. I don't think so, no. I think you need a better camera, but that's fine. Forget the camera. Okay? When you sound like you're in a phone booth, it's hard for people to listen to, and he's so good at what he does. And he has so much good stuff to say on that show, too. And it's so great, right? I had to jack up the audio, and so. Right. And then when, like, Josh comes in, it blows your damn eardrums out. I don't. This is a problem. I talked about this. I don't know if I necessarily called the Stern guys out, but it's a reoccurring issue with them. It happens when Keith goes on Lose a Kid. Michael, is his name Michael Grant? Is that right? Yeah, Michael Grant from Stern Army. He went on one of them, and they're all just using the audio from their laptop. Yeah, it sounds like shit. And here's the deal, Stern. You sound like shit. I'm sorry. Kyle. Kyle's a boy. Kyle Kyle Spiteri, and he went on Jeff's podcast. And they don't have to – what Jamie has is basically professional gear, and you don't really have to do that. Last time I talked about this topic on the bad cast, I brought up – there's a brand called Fifine, F-I-F-I-N-E. they make a great usb or xlr mic that you can use either one depending on what kind of quality you want and it has uh on board monitoring so you just get a headset that's a it's a 50 microphone they don't have to spend that much it's crazy and i think they should spend that much if okay they're stern you can afford five to seven hundred dollars let's start sounding better on our podcasts that you go on you could put it in the room right there at stern you know that's right room it's fantastic you said i mean it would be a podcast center don't you think they do enough this would be a total jack danger like thing to work on like don't you think they do enough social like why not just build a little podcast room that's already ready and they and they just say look when you're doing interviews we want you to use this room because you guys sound great it can have some strong branding behind it like boom that's easy now everyone's gonna pick apart any audio issues that we have but no we'll take it right okay but i mean come on am i right am i right yeah yeah yeah yeah sorry i'm sorry i had to say it someone had to say it all right and riverside is it i don't know if josh and if they're using riverside as a it's an excellent tool by the way that's another one thing that they should look at not the loser kid anyone should look at is if you're doing a podcast, use Riverside.fm. It'll fix your audio levels. It'll fix cancellations, auto, everything. Yeah. I'm leaving my body right now. I'm getting a little technical on me right now. I know. Yeah, who we're really reaching out to here is Matthew, their new CMO. I mean, he could spearhead something like this. I mean, these guys have to sound professional. Yeah. They have to. Yeah, for sure. All right. Thank you very much. That was our public service announcement. Pinball podcast you should be listening to. Cale, start us off your show. We're going to give a shout out to a couple of pinball podcasts that we listen to. Me on my long walks. Yeah. So, aside from our own, obviously. Yeah, for real. And the reason I wanted to bring this up, I see the comments. You know, I'm always on rpinball on Reddit. and it's been fun to see that community grow over the years. I remember, I mean, like eight years ago when I used to check it out, there would be like maybe two posts a week. I mean, now every day people are posting. And you hear a lot of, I finished my pinball podcast. Are there any other ones? These are like new people in the pinball. Are there any other ones you like? And I thought this would be great. Each one of us could take a couple of podcasts. and I am nominating Bro, Do You Even Talk Pinball? They just dropped a new episode. Man, I love listening to these guys. I like Kevin. He riles Nick up. Yes, totally. And Nick doesn't care. He'll say anything. He's very much like you. I think that's why I love it. you know a game nick i i just listened to an episode where he's talking about john wick and he's like telling he does this whole diatribe about how everyone else is nuts for saying john wick isn't a good game it's a great game yeah see we're so alike me and nick it's a shitty game hey do you think that when he comes out we can make him a fan of the game somehow when he comes out oh we're going to because i'm gonna get surge to explain it to him search and sell any game and tell you how wonderful don't go to the nightclub don't go to all these things he'll tell you everything can't wait for it that's going to be my favorite part of the trip we'll stream a tutorial and it's all about us selling you the game that's a good idea he's kind of salty today I am salty I didn't get a nap today can I be honest with you I didn't get a nap. I knew something was different. I tried and tried. So, Kato, so bro, do you even pinball? Are we doing two each? Yeah, we're doing two. And the second one is this is – it's not even an argument. This is the best pinball podcast. This is the heavyweight best pinball podcast ever, and it's the Wedgehead pinball podcast. These guys are absolutely unbelievable. Nothing's behind a paywall. It's all out there. You can donate to them. They have a little website where you can donate to them for their pinball trips. They do their homework. I have learned so much about pinball history, even though I knew a lot of it, but they go into detail, and this is some of the best scripted stuff. I mean, they really do their homework and pour their heart into this podcast. And if you are not checking it out, there's a great back catalog. Like, go through all of them. They are amazing. If you are just getting into it, just go back to, like, a couple of episodes where they do one. Alan does one on the economics of running a pinball arcade. And because that's my line of work, everything he says is 100 percent accurate and spot on. I mean, he nails it. And then after that, they get into the history of pinball, history of Stern pinball from, you know, from Data East Sega to the Stern we know today. They have some great guests on there that I can't recall his name, but particularly they had a guest on the past few shows that was involved in pinball for a while. He was a programmer doing a lot of the DMD animation programming. And he goes all the way to like the tail end when pinball was starting to fall apart and kind of like disappeared. You know, almost everything disappeared except for Stern Pinball. You know, Gary kept things going, you know, with Data East Saga and then the Stern we know today. But those guys are doing some excellent work. And everybody, if you love pinball, you need to be listening to the way. I don't listen to them enough. I need to check them out. Thank you. Yeah, I need to check them out. And, of course, you know, I love Nick Lane and those guys. Those are Kevin. They're awesome. So those are your two. Ralph, what are your two? Yeah. Real quick, though, Kale got me into Wedgehead. So the last episode I listened to was when I was driving up to Sedona when I was losing my mind from trying to be like my buddy Jamie over here. But it was all about John Papadu as a designer. It was really cool. That one was really good. I liked that one a lot. But every one I listen to them, I always pick up something new because I don't know the historical stuff as deeply as you guys. I probably know it at a surface level and it's been pretty cool like to learn a lot about some of the older games you know like and some things where like I might not have picked up something in a game and they're breaking down that game and I was like oh crap I don't even really think or maybe the copy I played was broken and that thing doesn't work in because they were talking about mechs a lot in that in that episode so it's pretty cool but my um mine I so I have two One is like a newer one, and it's just because I'm a Ken Cromwell fanboy. So I really built a good relationship with Ken. He's a really nice guy. And I think he's – Ken's perspective from being at a manufacturer I'm very interested in. Like anytime I'm talking to him on the phone, I'm kind of always asking him those kinds of questions because I always want to know like behind the curtain what actually goes on at Stern or JJP and like why do they make these decisions. And oftentimes it's never the reason why we think that they did, right? So they just started that Flip N Out Pinball podcast with Ken and Greg Bone, and I enjoy it so far. So there's been a couple of – they've been getting better, though. The last one they did, it was about what things do you want to see evolve in pinball? What could they do more? If you just look at it today, what with technology could they do? Sort of like almost going down the P3 multimorphic route, but going crazy. If cost wasn't an issue, what could we do? So that was kind of fun to hear what people thought. And then I was going to give – this one was tough because I feel like I wanted to give props to the pinball studio who sent everybody. Like he sent everybody. You guys got stuff too, right? Yeah. Didn't he send – yeah. I had him on the podcast recently. He's a great dude. Sterling is – Sterling Martin? Sterling Martin. I had him on Arcades Across America. Yeah, so this – but I also – that wasn't going to be my – because I feel bad because I have – I can't open it. I'm making a bunch of noise, aren't I? Okay, I can't open it. Anyway, good call, studio. There it is. I couldn't open the damn package. No, he's a good dude, and good luck in this new podcast. Did you get some Ghostbusters mods? No. I saw a Ghostbusters thing in there. Never mind. No, there is a Ghostbusters. I don't know, actually. You know what? This bag is definitely not good for the microphone. It's like crinkling. He sent us a Gremlin. Oh, that's cool. See, I didn't get that. That's cool. That's very nice. and yeah some shirts uh ghost a mod for our ghostbusters that's cool yeah there you go um yeah and it was i was gonna mention uh loser kid just because i just feel like when i'm looking for someone that's doing like modern interviews with you know current manufacturers and stuff like that i feel like he does they do a good job doing the rounds on that and then of course i don't know i feel like you only said two but triple drain i listen to a lot too i'm probably taking yours Jamie. Did I? Sorry. He's like, you can get two, and I'm like, here's four. He gave four. Sorry. I get excited. I got to say, I'm sorry. I definitely love, like, on my walk, if Triple Drain puts a show out, boom. Pinball show, boom. But I'm going to highlight, and then Loser Kid, boom. But I'm going to highlight two, all right? I love what Jeff from Dirty Pinball is doing I really do, I like what he's doing I like his interview style Dirty Pool not Dirty Pinball man I do it all the time, I fuck this up all the time where's Dirty Pinball I think his name is Jeff Rudolph isn't it that was a joke from earlier Jeff from Dirty Pool Pinball I really enjoy his interviews and his audio is always perfect, so listen to him, okay? Well, he's a sound engineer. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. He better be good. You know, if his sound like shit, that would be bad. And he's a good time. He's just... His vibe is great. I like him. He's new to pinball and I'm very happy that he found us and, you know, I know he's doing some side work on barrels and good for him. He is very good. He's good as an interviewer. Not interviewee. Interviewer, yeah. He is a good interviewer And he does such a good job I'm not doing as much You know what Jeff go You're doing good dude Just go You and He's just doing good And then I have to give a shout out to my boy Right Orbital Albert Orbital Albert I love Albert When he drops an episode I get that Spotify boom I listen to it, right? And he absolutely cracks me up. I love what he does. And he just, you know, sometimes he rambles. He knows he rambles, okay? But I like him. I really dig him. He's such a kind person. And he has the, what is it, the Angry Alpaca Coffee? Yeah. He's got the Angry Alpaca Coffee. He's got tea, I think, as well. I have one problem with him. Uh-oh. Can I bring it up? No. Great. Go ahead. It's your episode. His best podcast ever was the rant about Stern and not getting invited to the factory. I never got to hear it. He pulled it down, right? I never got to hear it either. That's the problem. It is one of the greatest things you've ever heard in your life, and it's gone. Oh, man. He removed it, and that's the problem. this is funny thing like the guys at stern have told me when that dropped they passed it all they like you got they sent the links they you have to listen to this this is the most amazing i make it don't make fun of them right no they thought it was great it's absolutely fabulous it i mean i thought the same thing i first learned about it from a jason from the pinball party sent it to me And he was like, you have to listen to this. This is the best thing on the radio right now. So why did he take it off? Is it because he felt like? I think he was just a little maybe embarrassed. I don't know. We all have moments like that. We all have moments like that. What he should do is put it up. Behind a paywall. Behind a paywall. Let us pay $1.99 or $2 or $5 to listen to it, right? Do an intro. Preface it. Preface that this is cringy for you. Maybe this wasn't my finest moment. Whatever he wants to say. And then put play and let us listen to it. It's pinball history, and it touched so many people. He has to bring it back. Ralph hasn't heard it. I'd pay $5 for it. I haven't heard it. Right now. Orbital Albert, I would pay you $5 to listen to it. I'll pay. I've already heard it. I'll pay $5. That's $15. Come on, Albert. Come on. Come on, Albert. He listens to this. He'll do it. Albert. I'm sorry. Albert. Did he announce? He was going to announce who gave him the mic. Did he announce that yet? uh i think he did he sounds so much better oh my can i reveal it yeah reveal it you i got him mike yeah what you you are an angel well i was listening to one of his shows and and he we we had been talking about something we were just like bullshitting back and forth and it was one of the shows where he was doing uh he was doing this uh sorting hat impression from Harry Potter. And I was like, dude, that impression was actually pretty good. Like, I honestly thought it sounded similar to Marc Silk. And he's like, really think so? It's good. And I go, hey, man, you were talking about that microphone. And I had bought a microphone. It was the Shure, like the USB version of the Shure. It does. It does XLR, too. And it's been sitting in his back room forever. I can't return it at this point. I was like, I'm going to send it to this dude. So I just sent it. Yeah, I don't know if he is like the onboard monitoring. Like you just plug an eighth inch? I think so, yeah. I think it does. He sounds great now. He sounds really good. Well, thank you for giving that to him. He's a great dude. Please listen to him on the Pinball Nerds podcast. And then, real quick, there's another show on the Pinball Nerds podcast. Is it called the Pinball Nerds? I thought it was the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. Does he go by that name anymore, though? I don't even know, actually. I think I follow like 12 of his podcast ventures and just whatever one pops up, I listen to it. I don't even know what it's called now. I'm pretty sure it's a Pinball Nerds podcast. Poor Man's Pinball Network. Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. Network or something. They started a network. You know what? Who the hell cares? He doesn't care. It's Orbital Rudolph on Spotify. Orbital Rudolph on Spotify, and you're going to love it. All right. Next topic. We have two choices here. We can go. We're already at 41 minutes. I think we should go to this main topic here. Okay. And that is, is Keith Elwin leaving Stern to go to JJP? Busy. Wow. That's a big one. This is a big topic. This is Kale's show. I want to reiterate that this is Kale's show. No, no, no. Okay. The reason I had this. Where is this coming from? So go ahead. But we've added this to the notes. Okay, there was rumors, I mean, I think even like a couple of years ago that JJP was trying to woo him over there. You know, they had gotten Steve Ritchie, and then you didn't hear anything. But now there's more rumblings, right? And I've actually heard it from real reliable sources. I mean, almost straight from the horse's mouth. Not Keith, but from, yeah. And supposedly there are negotiations. I don't know. So the rumor is, to set up the rumor, is that the rumor that was speculated on another show and is that Keith's last game that he will fulfill his contract with Stern, complete his one more game, and then will be wooed over potentially to JJP. That's the rumor, right? That JJP's trying to woo him after his contract ends? And particularly like Keith and his whole team. Oh, okay. Oh, wow. So, you know, and we're going to talk about what that would look like. Is that a good idea? Is that a bad idea? You know, does it matter? Go. Okay, you guys go. Let me know what you think. I mean, it's kind of a shocking when you first hear it. It's kind of shocking because you kind of just associate him with Stern. You know what I mean? Like Stern's guy. and and i think people have also probably made that association of him and stern pinball like that's his company right that that he works for i don't know i mean here's the thing i i think if i would if i were to say i if like let's just say all things aside i don't care where he is but what value does he bring i think if you know obviously he's a great designer we all we pretty much all as a community love all of his games right and if right and if there's a game we don't love it's it's like it's like still better than a lot of other games that we would they would put in that mix so i just think his like experience in how he designs play playfield layouts he just designs fun games so if you're jersey jack you're now adopting a designer that everyone really loves the games he makes so that's a plus and then he just happens to have an awesome team of coders behind him so usually the code matches the layout and you end up with this like great overall package so i mean i think that would obviously be a gigantic gain for jersey jack And I also think we've talked about this before, probably offline together, but not on the podcast, is we've always said that JJP doesn't seem to have like a George Gomez kind of person there that can like kind of be the final stamp. Or when you're going through the process, be like, hey, guys, this isn't really you're going down the wrong path. You should probably do this. They don't have that person, or at least I don't feel like they have that person. No, you're right. So he could go over and be a designer and sort of take like a leadership role. He's like running the studio. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm taking this from a recruiter perspective. Right. I own a recruiting company. Right. This is what I do for a living. So let's let's pretend I'm the recruiter and the headhunter trying to get Keith to go to JJP. OK. All right. Can you also just weave in? Can we add to your little thing? Can you do you deal with like contractual agreements? because I'd love to know. Maybe we could speculate a little bit on like. Well, I deal with non-competes all the time. Okay, Eric, go. I'm sorry. I'm a non-compete expert. And I would say that they probably don't have him to a non-compete. This is all speculation, ladies and gentlemen. We're dealing with rumors. We're not journalists. We're chitchat. We're chitchat. Just let's relax for a second. Let's relax. I'm telling you, just hold on a second. Just relax. I'm just going to use my expertise here. He probably doesn't have a non-compete because he was designing pinball machines before he came over to Stern. He designed his own pinball machine. So a non-compete would not probably hold up in a court of law. He might have a six-month window where he can't design a pinball machine or one year where he can go to another pinball manufacturer with a different role, let's say. Which is fine because it takes Jersey Jack forever. Yeah, so he'd be fine there. As far as if I was the headhunter, why would he leave? So I would come at it as, like, this is an opportunity to come to Jersey Jack to be their main designer with Eric. Because obviously we have another great designer that's retiring. We have another great upcoming designer. Put out a good game in Avatar. We'd like you to be the George Gomez. I think that is the pitch that could get him to make a move. But just to come over to a lateral move, why would he do that? but as a recruiter, Jamie, you might say like, what what you might ask him like what your motivator And he might answer I really want the Toledo studio Like maybe that is his motivation Truly You totally right As a recruiter, my first move is, what would it take to get you to move? Right? That's one of my first questions. You know, how happy are you? What would it take to get you to move? What does that look like? And then I would then build a package for him and present it to JGP and say, this is what it would take to get Keith Elwin. that's what I would do if I was the headhunter. Now, they don't need a headhunter. It's not a very big market. But, you know, I think he would probably want to go. I would want to go and be the George Gomez of J.J.P. Totally. I think that's a great move. Sure. Fix the flippers would be nice, you know, so that they have the same flipper feel. I'm not saying they're flippers or shit. I'm just saying if. Oh, man, we're going to derail the whole podcast. cast is going to get derailed now because we're going to all argue about the flippers i'm not saying that i didn't say it i just said you know some of the mechanisms that they have don't feel like the sterns and he might want to make some of those changes and i know there's no boards and all that shit that has to go into it but uh you know he he handled the quality handled the whole the Be George Gomez. But if that were to happen and you're Stern, Stern can't let him go, right? Well, also, wouldn't you be nervous about this part? This is because, you know, Jersey Jack could argue that 10 years ago they gave – they built their – or however long I guess it was now. They built their vision of what, like, they thought a pinball machine should be, right, with probably some updated tech, and they used better lighting and things like that. But now with Stern Spike 3, this is how I would think as someone that works for an engineering company. I'd be like, we can't let him go. He knows the roadmap for Spike 3 because you know he probably knows it because he probably is building his next game on it. That would make me nervous because I'd look at it and go, well, he could probably fix all the things that a lot of people complain about with Jersey Jack, and he kind of knows what we're thinking about doing, I would think. I don't know how far out Stern is. With Jack Danger stepping down, gents, from a designer role, you can't afford, if you're Stern, to lose two designers right off the bat. That is a big blow. Now that I'm letting this sink in a little bit, that's kind of a big effing deal, right? It's not going to happen. I don't think it's going to happen. I think Stern is going to do everything they can to keep Keith Elwin. Yeah, well, they may do it, but it's like I don't think Keith is motivated by money. Okay, so it's not a money decision probably. Yeah, I don't think it's a – I mean you have to think, and I don't have any inside knowledge of this, But I just I've I'm a human being who's worked at small family run organizations and more corporate organizations. And you have to think these guys have been at Stern for a while now. They've seen a shift, you know, where it was very much it felt like a family run operation. The factory before this one was a small place, you know, and, you know, Gare Bear was running the whole thing. You know, Shirley. I mean, everybody. It was a small. It was a different place than what it is now. And so it went from a more family feel to now we have a big time CEO. We have a CMO. So it's getting more of that corporate feel that some people don't like, especially creative people. But we don't know if Keith Elwin falls on that, but we're saying some people might not like that. But it's a good – I mean it's a very viable – it could actually be the – it's a viable theory. That could be true, I guess. But I mean we had – my company I worked for was a startup, and when it was a startup, it was way different than it is now. I mean we've become – we're publicly traded now and all that stuff. And there are people that just loved the startup culture, which is really similar to that way you're saying. Kelly, it was a super family. It felt like you knew everybody, right? Yeah. We're doing this. We're excited to be on site. And then the bobs come in. We have to cut costs. We have to do things differently. And that's when it gets to be not fun. Yeah. The shark's not going to be able to eat the ball. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's an interesting conversation, right, Ralph? It's interesting to see if this rumor is true. I think it's very interesting. Yeah, and I think we win, us, the fans, I think we win either way. You know, if he sticks with Stern and keeps making these banger games with Gomez, how long Gomez is going to be there, we don't know. Cool. If he goes to JJP, still cool. Because they're going to offer him – he's going to be able to do things he wasn't able to do at Stern, an unlimited bomb. I mean you know they're going to throw that at him. We'll let you do whatever you want. Yeah. Dude, we've got to figure out how to cryogenically freeze George Gomez. Like that guy is so effing cool, dude. No, I like him. He's the coolest freaking guy. Oh, you mean like to preserve him? Yes. We need to preserve him. Not like a Han Solo type thing. Wait, what? Not like a Han Solo type thing. No, no, no. We need to be able to unthaw him. No, we need to be able to thaw him out, for sure. But, like, we need to, like, freeze him for a little while, right? And be like, George, just give us, like, some good ideas for a little while. Because we need you to live longer, and then we'll just freeze him. We'll just get him in a better mic, and he can just talk it through. Because I don't want, like, then it's going to, because, you know, really what, like, a young kid would say, be like, oh, let's just train a long-language model on George, and then we'll have an AI George. But, like, I don't want AI George. I want George. He has locks in his hands. Real quick, that could be a good move for Stern is to say, hey, you're the heir apparent, Keith Elwin. Yeah. Imagine if they had a whole ceremony and they bestow on him the responsibilities. I'd stay then. That'd be pretty cool. Hey, Ralph, since you brought up AI, have you seen this new thing? I think ChatGPT is offering it. It's an on-board. It's like a computer for your desk where you're not having to talk to the ChatGPT servers anymore. Like everything's – the computation is going to be on site. Look at Jamie. Jamie's starting to fall asleep. I'm not falling asleep. I'm just trying to keep this on track. I don't know, but you need to tell me what that – I'm going to go look that up because that sounds cool. Okay, thank you. Okay, continue. So anyway, put a bow in it. That's an interesting rumor. Again, it is just a rumor. Are you going to put a bow in it? A bow in it. Bow on it. Just to put a bow on this conversation. I didn't hear what you said either. I was like, what is he putting? A bow on this conversation. We have no real knowledge if he's leaving or going, but it is fun to talk about. I feel like Jamie's a part – honestly, Cale, he's like having a legal team. He does the disclaimers on – I love this because actually there's no confirmation of anything that was said. I have a topic that we can talk about, but it's not on this. It's not your show. It's not my show, so I'll wait for the live show. Okay. But about disclaimers, I'm going to be doing disclaimers now. Okay. Okay. Cool. Thanks for letting us know. Oh, what the hell? We're going to talk about it. We're only an hour in. What do you mean? Can I veer a topic real quick and talk about disclaimers? We don't do anything quick. All right. But we can. I mean, it's not up to me. You don't have to ask Gail. It's his show. It is your show. Save it for the live. Because we have a lot more to talk about. You're right. But the disclaimer conversation is good. All right. Do we need more behind-the-scenes of pinball design and manufacturing so that mechs – do we need mechs to have an overhaul? Do we need more behind-the-scenes in pinball design and manufacturing? You just mixed two topics. Yeah, I did. That's two different topics. Shit. I didn't get the nap, boys. I didn't get the nap. Which one do you want to do, pinball and mechs need an overhaul? I don't know. I feel like that one's too techie. Kale, if we go down there, Jamie's falling asleep 1,000%. There's not even a chance he'll stay awake. You want to do Beetlejuice? Let's do Beetlejuice. Okay. So the rumor that we know is that Spooky's next pinball machine is Beetlejuice. That's the rumor. That's what we're all hearing. They're taking deposits on the damn thing, so it probably is it. No, no, no. They're not taking deposits. They're doing sign-up lists, not deposits, not taking money. All right. Okay, good call. I'm on the list, by the way. Good catch. Good catch. So, Beetlejuice, do we want it to be the movies or do we want it to be the cartoon that came out? We want this to be the cartoon. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, I wouldn't have answered that way. Why? Could you imagine how fun that would be? Do you remember how quirky and weird that was? And then you have the animation. I didn't really gig on the cartoon that much. I was watching G.I. Joe. Maybe I need to go back. Maybe this is like another one of those homework things where you need to go back and watch it because – The cartoon is excellent. It is absolutely excellent. It's weird. It's funny. And you have a – and it's just so much more colorful and it's just cool. What if they did the second movie? Oh, that would be horrible. I didn't even see the second movie. It would be like Toy Story 4, right? Yeah, I didn't even know there was a second movie. Or like choose the first or the second movie like they did with Evil Dead. So will you be disappointed if it is the first movie? No, I won't be disappointed either way. Okay. But you're saying it would be better as the cartoon, more content. I think it would be great. It would be fun. Franchi would kick ass on that art, you know. All the animations on the DMD, not DMD, the LCD would be freaking amazing. All the sound. I'm sitting here trying to remember it, Kale. I just don't remember the cartoon that much. Go to YouTube and check out the intro and all that. It's cool. Yeah. So what else are we hearing? Fallout. We watched Fallout. I didn't watch it. I still haven't watched it. It's on my list. So Chaos is giving us a watch, you know, things that we need to watch because the rumor is that Fallout is coming from Stern. Is that the rumor? Yeah, that's happening. Who do we think is designing that one? I have no clue. No idea. I heard that some – because Harry Hardy did a thing on it where he – Harry Hardy is designing? it? No. Kerry Hardy is a pinball content creator, Kale. Yes. Kerry Hardy did a video where he listed Stern's next six machines. I think he did a duel with Don from Don's Pinball Podcast. Then he heard from somebody at Stern and they said, you're 50% right, 50% off. Fallout might be one of those that might not be coming up. No, Fallout's not one of the wrong ones. I think maybe Transformers or something. But I've heard Fallout is 100% happening. So, Ralph, you haven't seen the show? No. You didn't play the video game? I failed on that. No, I don't know. So I didn't play the video game. My kids played it. Both my boys played it. So they were all over me to watch the show. And I didn't do it. And then Kale yelled at me, and I was like, all right, I'll watch it. It's great. Dude, it's a banger, man. That show's fantastic. Fantastic. Right. If they do it based on the – do you think it will be on the video game or on the show, though? I think it kind of has to be on the show. Yeah. Because they need Walter Goggins. Yes. Right? Because he's such an unbelievable character on that show. The personalities and also it's been – only one season is out. It's on Amazon Prime. It's already been renewed for two more seasons. so the you can have a lot of updates this game is going to have legs yeah i i hope they do it because it's such a good show ralph you're going to really like it actually it's on the list i we we get yeah we went down we started watching some other thing but i'm going to get i'm going to get to it i promise the one of the cool mechs that you could totally see is that mega suit dude right Raquel, that's going to be a multiball. That's a no-brainer. Are we done on, did we tie off on Beetlejuice, you think? I don't know. I think it has to be the movie. I think it has to be. Uh-oh. What? My battery's dead. Battery in what? What? Jamie, again? This is the thing. Is it the camera battery? Why don't you have one of the dummy batteries in there? Why do you not have them plugged in? What is this, amateur night? Jamie, you have those. I've seen them. I know. I'm the one that turned them on. This is a ZV-1. Oh, my gosh. He's been here telling people that they should sound better. And you've done this twice. You've done this before. I know. I don't even remember how I turn off the camera while recording. You're off. I didn't realize a nap messes you up this much. Fs me up. Hold on. I'm going to have to stop recording. So we have to incorporate maps into your trip. I wonder if I could just plug it in. All right. When are we getting into how do we get more people in the pinball? Let's do it right now. Am I going to see you? Yeah. I'm fixing the camera. There we go. You're keeping all this in, right? You have to. No. No. Yeah, you do. You have to, Jamie. Could you turn into the freaking bars? Yeah, yeah. Let me tell you what I think about America. It won't go to the FaceTime camera. Jamie, what are you doing? How do I change this to the FaceTime camera? Come on. On your laptop? Yeah. Are you stressed out over there? Go to the little gear at the top right. Go to the little gear, and you can go to your options. You see the little gear? We're looking at your camera settings. Yeah, I know, dude. New York to Bogota. There you go. Oh, there he is. All right, now you have to keep all this in there because this is great. You're sitting there telling people how to look better on their podcast, telling all the current guys. And then not only do you shit the bed, but you roll around in it and get it in your hair. It's all over yourself. We have to take you outside and hose you down. I'm going to tell you how I fucked this up. I'm sorry, Jamie, but you're not giving me up, dude. This is a ZV-1X. This isn't the ZV-1. This is a cheaper ZV-1. The audience doesn't want to hear this. I don't have a dumb battery for the cheaper ZV-1. I just don't. I don't. And it exhausts the battery, and this is what happens to it. Okay, so it's my show. Here we go. You ready? Do I need to recover from all this? We're recovered. I'm going to edit this. No, you're not. No, no, you can't, Jamie. I'm going to stop right now. All right, fine. How do we get more people into pinball? Better mics. Yeah, and better batteries for your camera, obviously. Obviously. I didn't say this on any podcast, but I talked to you guys about it, how important it is, especially nowadays with social media, with the Internet, with the World Wide Web, how important it is for companies to have a face, to have a personality. And it's something that's been majorly lacking in the pinball space except for spooky pinball. they they they're doing you know you know bug and luke absolutely and they they put themselves out there yeah stern who's stern i don't know wow you know danger well it is now and that's what we're getting into uh this is a uh this is a genius move you know i don't know who we can uh pat on the back for this whether it's matthew the new cmo or a combination of Matthew and Jack. This, making him the face of Stern is something that this company has needed for a long time. They need the personality. This is a great, great thing. I don't know what's planned, but I know he said he's going to be streaming more. He's going to be playing more of a role with their social media. but to get people into pinball you you have to have a personality like this and i mean that i think the template is already there basically you need to do what anthony bourdain did with uh no reservations or um and then he moved to cnn i can't remember what the name of that show was But basically, Jack just needs to travel around with a crew of one guy with a camera and go to different pinball locations. And there's your show. I wanted to do this show. I wanted Arcades Across America to be the show, right, where I would go across America and do arcades. The problem is there's no money in it. No network's going to pick it up. And, you know, Ralph can talk about this as well. I'd love to hear your opinion, Ralph, on a network or even a streaming service picking up a show where there's no bad guy, right? There's no – Yeah, I tried. Ralph tried, right? It's just – but as far as not a television show, I mean, you could do a web series. What I think they really need to do is Jack needs to do a podcast as well, all on Stern Insider Connect. The only way you can listen to it, right? Give us Stern Insider Connect content a couple of days before it goes on YouTube and goes on Spotify or something, right? And really pump up the Stern Insider Connected app because they used to do the interviews with – what's his name? Oh, how could I forget his name? Famous old pinball podcaster now does travel sites. People are screaming at their phones. Fine. I'm sorry. I forgot his name. I'm not familiar. But, you know, I think Stern needs – You come on Nate Shivers? Yeah, Nate. Okay. Yeah. I mean, they used to do Stern podcasts on their Insider Connect. They're not doing those anymore. It was supposed to, and then they passed the torch to Tim, and then Tim left. Oh, okay. Yeah, Tim was supposed to do it, and the only reason I know that is because he got in touch with us about doing the first episode, and then he went to, what, Play Mechanics? Yeah, CGC, yeah. Yeah. So that is something Stern wants to do. Oh, good. Yeah. Well, they should. I mean, he's the GOAT, right? I mean, I got into this because of Jack Danger. I saw Jack Danger. We had a wormhole. We had a place, and we were like, we could do this. He gave us the blueprint, for God's sakes. It's not like he kept it a secret. And I think it's just fantastic what he's doing for Stern. I think it's going to be awesome. I can't wait. I hope he has a good shoulder surgery and everything goes well. Yeah. No, he's the perfect person to do this, and not just for Stern, for pinball. The ambassador, I mean, he could be the evangelist for pinball. And him traveling around and showing people, people need to see how much fun this is. Because even, it is hard. Have you ever watched a pinball stream from somebody that's never played pinball? I mean, they're just like, what the fuck is going on? Yeah, the flappers. The flappers. Yeah. And then they beat you, and then you turn around, they all of a sudden just got multiball and whipped your ass. Sure, sure. And, you know, I'm in the fighting, right? I go to MMA gym. I participate in it. I've sparred with UFC fighters. Whenever you follow a fight, and I think it's the same thing with boxing, like you're not invested, you're not into it until you know a little background on the fighters. And I think that's what needs to happen. But you need, like, Jack going around and hanging out with some of these, like, top-rated players or just, you know, players. You know, guys at the bat. You always hear about Ty Bull and Mark Pearson. You know, when people get invested in this, when they are introduced to the players' personalities. Yeah. And I think that's what will get people into it. I want to watch streams more because explaining pinball to people. I know people that play pinball every day and explaining some of these rules to them. They're just like, what the hell is going on? I can't. Just tell me, like, how to start one mode. This is a very – it doesn't translate really easily, but what does translate very easily are people's personalities, and that's what they need to focus on. Yeah. No, you're so right about the – you build a connection with like a brand through someone or – and it was funny because this is a little unrelated but kind of is. I was – remember when the Mike Tyson fight happened, when they aired that? The most recent one? Yeah, the most recent one. yeah yeah the old well well during that fight the the most interesting fight of that whole night was katie taylor versus amanda serrano yes and i got so invested in that and i wanted amanda to win that fight i was just like i want i'm and then when she got when she got cut open and she lost the fight i was like they're gonna have to have a rematch but i was invested because then i went and like learned the story of those two and how they had fought before but like that's i mean like I'm not a gigantic boxing fan, but they hooked me. Like their story hooked me. And I think, yeah, if you can tell how fun and interesting pinball is through Jack Danger, who is a great person to do it, yeah, he can get people to come along for the ride for sure. But I do think he should do something like that if they don't have it already planned already. I don't know. I hope so. I wish them nothing but luck. He's a great dude. Everybody likes him. He's very charismatic, and he's a very good pinball player and designer. My God, that's the perfect choice. So congrats to him on his new role and feel better. And can't wait to see you out there. Real quick, do you guys think that Stern, this is their second year at San Diego Comic-Con, do you think that translates to sales? I mean, because that's a different audience, right? I mean they into a lot of the IPs that pinball has but do you think that it translates to because I mean that has to be the reason why they going right just to see if they can tap into some audience that likes nerdy stuff or likes John I think it was was it John Wick last year had launched I think Keanu Reeves came and played it, which everyone was like freaking out about. Yeah. That was San Diego Comic-Con, right? I'm pretty sure. I mean, do you think that's, I mean, that's kind of a little bit of an out of the box thing, right? To go to an event? Yeah, but it's so, does it translate to sales? I don't know. It's so hard to say because these damn things are so expensive. Yeah, but they're doing the right thing, right? Caleb and Ralph, by going there, Stern's number one role is to increase pinball. That's what the CMO told us when he sat down with us and Gary introduced him to us, was my role is to increase pinball. And by going to these Comic-Cons and by doing Jack and by doing all these great things, So hopefully they're doing it. Yeah. I mean, and I think having Star Wars at Costco is doing a little more getting the word out than Comic-Con. Have you gone to Costco to get your Insider Connected badge? I have not. I went to our Costco, and our friend said it was there. And Rachel and I looked all over the place, and we couldn't find it. Yeah. Yeah, but so speaking of Costco, you know, George Gomez on that Loser Kids stream podcast, he says, did you guys catch this? He says something really interesting. We're going to see a new home edition pin. I think he said next year. Yeah, and it sounded like it was not a game that you're making into a home edition, but like a unique game. Yeah, I think that's Call of Duty. That would be a great one to throw in a Costco, though. Right, because when the rumors first started, the chatter first started coming out about Call of Duty, it was it's not going to be a cornerstone and it's going to be like a limited kind of run. So you could think it's kind of like the Primus game or something like that. But I think it might be the new Costco game. What was the metal one? What was metal? Twisted. No, heavy metal. Heavy metal. Yeah, they only made 100 of those, right? If that. Yeah. Those were real expensive. Those were like $8,000 or $9,000. Okay. I was playing that at Wormhole when you were there, Jamie. I actually had a lot of – it's very simple, but I had a lot of fun with it. I was having a ton of fun playing it. It was like three or four of us were just playing it. I enjoyed every metal. Yeah. Another reason I think it might be Call of Duty, and this is just me speculating. I don't know. You guys tell me what you think. Also, Matthew, it was Matthew Geyer. He came from the video game world. Yeah, that's right. He was running like the game studio for WWE or something for all their games, I think. Yeah, so he may have connections, know some guys at Activision. Hey, let's team up. Let's do this. I mean, that would look really cool at Costco. A Call of Duty pinball machine. I would want Call of Duty as a flag. You'd be pissed, though, because you would want it. I'd want it. Yeah. It's a full-size play field. What would they do with it? World War II? No. You'd have to do modern warfare. Yeah, modern warfare for sure. That's the most popular flavor of Call of Duty. I was not thinking that, Cale. That's kind of interesting that that's what you thought would be Call of Duty. But now that you said that, I'm like, man, I can see that, though. Like I could see that at Costco. It would have to be Modern Warfare, the newer. I think it really doesn't make sense as a cornerstone. I don't think it does. What do you do? Like calling your airstrikes? Yeah. Yeah. You all call on your airstrike multiball. Yeah. I think you dig it, dude. I might have to get one. Well, it kind of reminds me of like Halo. If CGC is. Well, that sounds like that's pretty much everyone agrees that rumors true. But man, I. Yeah. Yeah, all my sources tell me that's what's coming, and I'm getting on the list. Are you for Halo? Hell yeah. Too much jumping in that game. I feel like Halo would do really good at the bat. Don't you think? Yeah, it would crush. Yeah. If it's good, it'll totally crush. Yeah. For sure. I don't know about Halo. I mean, they tried to do, Microsoft tried to do that Halo TV show that sucked. Dude, think about the theme, like the lobby song. Like, imagine press the start button and it does that. That's pretty cool. I used to run around with that sword. You know, that double sword? But the part you're not thinking about, Jamie, is think about the team. I got you, Jamie. It's a good sword. Yeah, the sword's great. But think about the team that would be putting this thing together. It's the team that did Pulp Fiction. Man, it's a super reliable game with incredible rules. Do you think Pulp Fiction has incredible rules? Yes. I totally disagree. I agree. We'll go over it when you come into town. I need to go over that one too because I suck at Pulp Fiction. I put up $500,000 and I'm happy. That's an amazing game. I'm going to let Jamie fall on the sword on this one, even though I was talking to him the other day about my feelings on Pulp Fiction. I actually really do like the game, but I have – and maybe I'm just playing it all wrong, and maybe you can help us both, Cale, because I play it and I'm like, Like, is this game just unnecessarily hard? Like, it seems so difficult. And I don't know what that, like, the most that I would get, I don't know, it just seems like I was never getting better at it. I'm like, what is going on with this game? I have to start a mode. It's all about the modes on the right orbit. It is, it's a very hard backhandable shot. It's a very fast game. Yeah, the callouts and the art and everything is GD beautiful. Dude, I had a goddamn, I had like, I almost was like going to celebrate. I was going to have like a family over and fly him into Arizona because when I finished my first mode finally on that game, like the pawn shop thing, it took me freaking forever. I'm like – And that guy is like camera act, losing light here. People are panicked like a lunatic, and I can't get it. I start freaking out. See, that's the problem. We got to breathe. We need to give you more time, dude. There's not enough time. Okay, we have to be quiet. The game is perfect. We'll go over it. When I'm with you guys, we'll go over it. there's so many ways to play it you know you can you can full plunge and go up and try to get in the saucer to collect the characters i mean when you get character chaos it feels so freaking good i can't complete a mode i can't i definitely have not seen character chaos there's no way i watched john from uh eureka heights blows that game up because he's constantly in modes and he's constantly blowing spinners but here's okay cgc first of all i think it's it's too play mechanics all right cgc built it play mechanics designed it all right well i need a code update on a couple things one when you do the full skill shot you hold the left flipper down it comes all the way around if you hit the watch guess what your skill shot is nothing zero that's ridiculous. You know how hard it is to hit that watch? You know how hard it is to hit that watch? It's hard. It's coming all around. It's humming. And I hit the watch, I should get 100,000 points. So let's fix that. Let Tim Sexton know. Alright, Tim, let's work on it, dude. There's another thing. You got Tim working on Halo. I guess Josh is working on some rules. And then you have Mark Ritchie designing the layout. Halo is going to be a banger. mark my words I'm telling you I think it probably will too I really do think it's going to be really good when is it coming out 2032 when are you going to get one well wait I think do you think do you think we'll actually see it at do you think we'll see it at pinball expo no is that too early no way damn it I was kind of hoping there would be one I'm hoping they cook this thing right not in a bad way like they bake this thing because they worked on They were working on Pulp Fiction, I think, like before COVID. Oh, man. So you think we're not seeing this thing until like late 2027 or something? And Pulp Fiction, you can't even change the modes. It's totally random, right? You're talking about when you knock down the drop target on the right. Yeah. There's no rhyme or reason. Look, I'm 3,800th in the world, okay? I'm not good at pinball, obviously. Okay? I'm just saying, help a brother out, right? Remember that time you thought we were the same? Like, you looked at my rank and you looked at the wrong number? That was good, right? That was good. You're 900. You're sub-thousand. I am not. I am not sub-thousand. I am much higher. They're kind of anti-ball save in that game, too. Like, you get a little bit, but not much. It's a tease. It's a tease. No, yeah. It's like, you're not getting a ball save. You're not getting a ball save. It's too hard. They should work on that. It's like Jersey Jack in a lot of their games. They're anti-ball safe. I don't know why. Like, at some of their games, I'm like, okay. But then I can have a ball that lasts, like, 15 minutes. So I don't know. I can't have a ball that lasts 15 minutes on Pulp Fiction. No, not for me either. Ever. 15 minutes? No way. That game will get me so pissed off in about five seconds. I like it, though. You sold it, though, right? I did. Yeah. But here, my logic on this is that sometimes if there's a game that I sell, I think to myself, can I play it at the bat? if I can. I'm like, alright, they have one. It's all good. I did break that rule with some games, but that's a game where I feel like I can get my fill by playing it on location every now and then and I'm good. I'm not throwing shade at you. I'm sorry. I'm just trying to get someone behind me. Now I'm wondering if you are. No, I'm just saying Pulp is not that good. It's just okay. It's a great game. Next. Wait, do we want to... Do you think that, like, I don't know, we were talking about new ways to get people into pinball. This was an idea. Don't think this is something that I want to do. I'm just saying it's an idea. Could you do something? We can end on this because we're at 80 minutes. Oh, no, no, no, it's worth ending on. It's a lot of pressure. We're going, dude. No, no, no. No, let's not. I can do it quick. All right, just say yes, no, if you agree to this. And, again, this was just an idea I had. It's not like I'm married to it. But what if we did, and maybe Bat already does this, and I'm just unaware. What if you had some beginner-friendly leagues for people to bring in only newbies to check out pinball? So they're not playing a tournament. They're playing a tournament, but with people of their skill level, pretty much, just to kind of get into the hobby so they don't feel intimidated. Or is that stupid? No, it's not stupid at all. I think you'd have a tough time getting a day on it and getting more than 10 to 15 people, depending on your location because some people, you know, leagues only have like 20 to 25 people. So that might be a challenge. But I have heard leagues that, you know, maybe charge a $5 cover, but if you're sub, if you're over 5,000 IFPA ranking, you come in free. Oh, that doesn't, yeah. Okay, so that you don't have to, you know. I'm just wondering if like psychologically, if you give them a tournament that's like lower pressure first, if they'll be more – they'll act like normal human beings and not like Jamie and I. I don't know. It's like you graduate into the other tournament. I don't know. Maybe it's a dumb idea because you have to then figure out how do you get the – well, how do you get the new people? That's the whole challenge. That's what John does at Eureka. He literally walks up to people and says, hey, we're having a pinball tournament. You want to play? Does he really? Yeah, all the time. Oh, that's cool. And that's how you do it. And I'm sure you do too, Cale. hey you want to play and they're like i'm not really that good yet it doesn't matter we don't do it anymore because oh you have 120 yeah you yeah we have like 130 people showing we we did that to get to 120 130 people yeah i mean that's that's how it works man you just like we we talked i think we talked about this on the last backcast um or the one before the last one uh because somebody was asking about kind of like what you were talking about, Ralph, like, you know, ways to get people into playing these tournaments. And it's just, it's selling it as a good time hanging out with cool people. That's the thing that, that's the message you have to get across. You know, it's not some stuffy, hyper-competitive thing. Like John, like you're talking about, John is like a great guy. He's like, you know, you want to have a good time? I mean, you know, that's the guy you want selling this tournament in this good time. And you have to be that kind of person. He's fantastic at it. And I just love all the new faces. And one of the things that I love about pinball, and maybe we can end this, is that the diversity that you see at a pinball tournament, no matter how divisive we are in this world, right, no matter what tribe we live on, When we walk into the arcade or pub and go play pinball, everybody tends to leave that shit at the door and just play with the most random people. You couldn't even put a census on the type of people that we get, and it's so great. I love it so much. I love the diversity of pinball, and no one cares. We just want to play. And you know what we care about? Pinball. Yeah. We love it, and we just want to spread the word. And that's all we're doing here. We're having some goes, and we're making fun of people's mics, and I'm sorry about that. Dude, you know what you made me think of? It's like I hear this a lot. I get this comment a ton on my videos. I get it a lot actually, and I'll say something like, oh, this hobby is for really wealthy people. I get it all the time, and I'm like my response is always this. This hobby can cost you a dollar a play. You just have to go find a location, and I go, go on Pinball Map, find one near you, because it frustrates me that someone thinks you have to buy one. Like honestly, you don't have to buy one. You don't even need to own a pinball machine at all. It's like that part bothers me that they don't – maybe they just don't know. I don't know. We are – especially in the valley here, we are very lucky. There are a lot of pinball deserts out there. Yeah, that's true too. Yeah, and I don't know how you get around that. I mean, we're doing our part, me and Rachel, trying to get people to put machines on the streets, and it's working. I mean, we've heard from a lot of people. Yeah, I just listened. That was fantastic. Yeah. Every podcast, it's like every time that happens. Yeah, there are people around the world who are operating machines because of our message. That's cool. But it's going to take a long damn time before, you know, there's a pinball on every street. But we're going to work on it. We're going to try. So, gentlemen. in a French maid outfit. I mean, that's just the kind of – and we're not talking about politics. We're talking about football and having a good time, having a beer, having fun, man. That's what it's all about. It's so true, man. He probably is a regular at the bat, but we were on Iron Man, and we clearly – it was just funny. He was kind of – your first description of someone was kind of him. Yeah. And we were just talking. He's like, hey, man, you ever play Iron Man before? I'm like, yeah, I played it. He's like, man, when that ball – he said this really weird – it was the weirdest analogy, but I couldn't stop laughing, and I can't remember it now. It was like some weird thing, like a saying like that – this isn't what he said, but like that guy's breath is like a buzzard on a shit wagon, like some weird saying. You're like, what does that even mean? But it was like that. He's like, that ball comes back faster than – I don't even know. It was like a sexual reference, I think. He said like – I think he said like a venereal disease in the 80s or something. It was just weird. But anyways, what the hell are we talking about? We're talking about Godzilla and how the ball is longer than a Monday. I don't even know what the guy said, but he was awesome. But you're right. There's so many different people that go to these of all walks of life, everybody that's into lots of different stuff. And you know what is cool is, like, where else would you end up being maybe all in the same room together, too? I know. Because I'll tell you one quick one. I was at Game Room Goodies, right, which is your sponsor of the Batcast. and I'm there and it was when Avatar first came out because he was the only one that had it here in Arizona at first and I was playing it with him talking with Aaron, super cool guy and this guy comes like it was like 10 minutes before Aaron was closing and he just like busted, it was like the door busted wide open and he was wearing like a full suit and he was kind of like sweaty pits, he's like hey man is it too late to play Avatar and I'm like that's awesome, this dude is fully suited up, sweating his ass off trying to get it to Aaron gets Aaron to play a game. You can have anybody from the suit guy, blue collar, white collar, whatever. Everybody enjoys it. It's cool. Guys, thank you so much. I'm going to cut it. Hour and a half. Not bad. Pretty good podcast, I think. Thanks. Thanks, Jamie. We thought it was good, too. Again, thank you to Glenn Glenn Waechter. I hope I'm saying your name correctly because I've been butchering names today. But your intros and outros have just been fantastic. And I'd love to send this to you and see what the hell you do for an intro for next podcast. I think next time is Ralph's turn, right? I think so. Yeah, we're coming back around. So we're going to do this. Are we doing yours live? Oh, I don't know. We haven't talked about that. I think we are. Oh, wow. So what day do we want to do this? Let's talk this out. Are we recording right now still? Yeah. Oh, we're talking now with everybody. Yeah, we're talking it out with everybody. Let's just talk it out. A post-production meeting with the people. Hey, let's take this to Patreon. And one of the behind the scenes. No, what I'm thinking is I'm going to go up Labor Day weekend. I want to come to Ralph's house once and kick his ass on Evil Dead on a stream. Yeah, and I got to get you guys all there because Kale still hasn't played Harry Potter yet. And I'm looking forward to it. So we're going to go play that, and you're going to have that streamed, right? We're going to stream that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll stream it. We'll have it all ready to go. I would love that. That'll be an absolute. What day is this? I think Saturday night, so make sure you run this by Kim. The 30th of August, right? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, no problem. And then Sunday, we're going to play Chewy's event. Done. Okay. And then Monday for Labor Day, I don't know what the hell we're doing. Probably sit by the pool. Yeah, we're going swimming. We're going swimming. But we could do a live episode that Monday. We could do a poolside podcast. Poolside podcast because the condo I'm renting has a pool and a hot tub again. Nice. I don't know if we do an after dark hot tub show. That could be weird. Nobody wants to see what's underneath this. Nobody wants to see that. I got to do a lot more walks before I go there. And then Tuesday, electric bat weekly. That's not stream, but I'm going to kick some ass in that tournament. I want to be doing very well. So I'm really pumped. Can't wait. So that's what we've got going on here to follow Retro Ralph. How do you follow you, sir? Oh, yeah. Just go to Retro Ralph on YouTube or Retro Ralph Live on YouTube. And the Flipside podcast is both on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and the video versions on Retro Ralph Live. But, yeah, that's it. There you go. And then KL, of course, Electric Backcast on Spotify. You can watch it on Spotify as well. on YouTube, right, sir? You can watch on your PlayStation. That's pretty cool. I'm an Xbox guy. Yeah, we're on, you know, just go to the website, electricbatarcade.com. There's links to our Facebook, links to our Instagram. Instagram is where it's really popping off. We're doing stuff. Yeah, you're doing great stuff on Instagram. Yeah, your Instagram stuff's killing it. Thank you. Thank you very much. Also, there's the shop there where you can support us by buying some merch. Absolutely. Follow me. You guys have cool merch, too, the glow-in-the-dark stuff. I almost wore one today, but I wanted to shout out the Loser Kids. And then, of course, you can follow me, Jamie underscore Bertrell, on all the socials, and then the JBS show on YouTube and where you find podcasts. And do me a favor. Click the subscribe. For God's sakes, we need to get those numbers up. Yeah, get them up to 1,000. That's what you want. I mean, come on. Help me out. I'm not asking for money or anything. Just give me a subscribe. Let's go. and then I've got that good podcast with Jerry and Multimorph coming out this Thursday so this is released tomorrow what time should I release this? does it matter? do you already have it in the can? no, I'm not going to edit anything, it's going to take me about 15 minutes tonight has this thing been freaking out the whole time? it dropped in the morning what thing? I feel like this thing is wigging out has this been wigging out the whole time? this thing behind me? but it was doing that the whole time? I don't know No one's going to be annoyed by that No one's going to be annoyed with you You're the best Alright, Kent, thank you so much We're still recording Thank you for letting me host the show You're welcome, it's your turn I thought I had some great notes And I just want to leave everybody With a little nugget of wisdom If there is anything You should stop wearing It's the weight Of other people's opinions thank you for coming out people we had a great time we're gonna end with that that's fantastic thank you so much everyone thank you for subscribing take care and applause yeah he's got the road casters that's awesome we gotta send we gotta send all the specs to Stern so we'll get that done and start a whole podcast studio thank you guys so much appreciate it love you both thank you it's been an absolute slice see you guys I'll see you next time.