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Ep 111 With Special Guest Rachel Bess

This Flippin' Podcast·podcast_episode·58m 56s·analyzed·Jun 16, 2021
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TL;DR

Rachel Bess on operating Electric Bat Arcade amid explosive Phoenix scene growth and balancing collector, operator, and artist identities.

Summary

Rachel Bess, owner-operator of Electric Bat Arcade (locations in Tempe and Flagstaff, Arizona), discusses her journey from hobbyist collector to arcade operator, the arcade's COVID-19 shutdown impact, the explosive growth of the Phoenix pinball scene, her pinball machine collection and rail-making business, and tournament operations. She reflects on balancing multiple ventures (painting, rail production, arcade ownership) and the challenge of maintaining a hobby identity while operating a commercial venue.

Key Claims

  • Phoenix area has approximately 40 different locations where you can play pinball

    high confidence · Rachel Bess, Electric Bat Arcade operator, discussing Phoenix pinball scene expansion

  • LED Zeppelin is the first game to surpass Rick and Morty in Coindrop earnings since Rick and Morty's release at Electric Bat

    high confidence · Rachel Bess reporting on location performance data

  • Electric Bat's Tuesday night league had 45 people participate last week

    high confidence · Rachel Bess discussing current tournament participation numbers

  • Rachel was previously working with Marco's Specialties and did 16 shows in the last year of that job

    high confidence · Rachel Bess describing her work history prior to full-time arcade operation

  • IFPA was not active at the time of recording but was expected to return in August

    high confidence · Host and Rachel Bess discussing tournament structure and IFPA restart timeline

  • Some tournament participants stopped competing during IFPA inactivity but resumed after announcement of return

    medium confidence · Rachel Bess reporting community tournament participation patterns

  • Rachel's rail-making business was affected by material shortages during COVID lockdown

    high confidence · Host discussing rail production challenges; Rachel confirming closure for six months due to humidity/material constraints

  • Electric Bat Flagstaff location was about to open when COVID shutdowns occurred

    high confidence · Rachel Bess describing timing of second location opening and state shutdown order

Notable Quotes

  • “The Phoenix area is, I think right now, the biggest scene in the country.”

    Rachel Bess @ N/A — Assertion about Phoenix's dominance in competitive pinball landscape

  • “I think Addams Family is the greatest game to introduce somebody to pinball.”

    Host @ N/A — Designer evaluation of gateway game appeal; confirmed by Rachel Bess

  • “Theme is the only thing that's gonna draw them in... if you've had three beers and are walking across the room you're gonna see Rick and Morty.”

    Rachel Bess @ N/A — Operator perspective on casual player motivation and theme-driven location performance

  • “I have no children. Like think about how much you spend on your kids every month. Like I don't have that expense.”

    Rachel Bess @ N/A — Commentary on financial capacity for large pinball collections and arcade operations

  • “The hobby is great, the people are by and large great, the machines are way too heavy – none of that changed.”

    Rachel Bess @ N/A — Reflection on how COVID shutdown didn't alter fundamental views of pinball hobby despite operational disruption

  • “If you get too much time not making stuff, you start to go crazy and you're not as fun to be around.”

    Rachel Bess @ N/A — Personal philosophy on creative work necessity; applies to both painting and rail-making

  • “LED Zeppelin has done crazy well for us... It's the first game to surpass Rick and Morty since Rick and Morty has come out.”

    Rachel Bess @ N/A — Operational performance data indicating strongest theme draw at location venue

  • “There were people that said that they didn't really want to compete if it wasn't for points. But then I found that most of those people got bored.”

    Rachel Bess @ N/A — Insight into competitive player motivation and IFPA points significance

Entities

Rachel BesspersonKale BesspersonElectric Bat ArcadecompanyYucca TaproomvenueYucca NorthvenueZapConeventMarco's SpecialtiescompanyLauren GraypersonRick and Mortygame

Signals

  • ?

    operational_signal: Phoenix pinball arcade scene has expanded from zero dedicated arcades to approximately 40 locations with playable pinball in roughly 4-5 years. Most are barcades, driven by collectors/enthusiasts transitioning to operators.

    high · Rachel Bess: 'right now, I want to say that there are like 40 different places you can play pinball in the Phoenix area' and history of Cobra Arcade opening first, followed by Electric Bat, then 'dominoes' of other operators

  • $

    market_signal: LED Zeppelin has become Electric Bat's top-earning game by Coindrop metrics, surpassing Rick and Morty's previous dominance. Theme-driven appeal (Rick and Morty, LED Zeppelin) outperforms skill-based themes (Joker Poker) for location casual play.

    high · Rachel Bess: 'LED Zeppelin has done crazy well for us... It's the first game to surpass Rick and Morty since Rick and Morty has come out in terms of Coindrop'

  • ?

    competitive_signal: IFPA inactivity caused temporary dip in tournament participation; players who claimed they needed IFPA points to stay motivated largely returned once the organization announced August restart. Current league participation strong (45+ players on Tuesday nights).

    high · Rachel Bess: 'There were people that said that they didn't really want to compete if it wasn't for points. But then I found that most of those people got bored of not competing and they've started to come back.'

  • ?

    operational_signal: Electric Bat runs weekly Tuesday league (match play, 5 rounds + finals), monthly pin golf, monthly bounty knockout, monthly high-score competition. Year-round championship belt (Electric Bat Heavyweight Belt) as grand prize. Mix of token/gift card and physical prizes.

    high · Rachel Bess detailed league structure: 'five rounds of match play... weekly prizes. You can win gift cards to the bar and tokens' and annual 'Electric Bat Heavyweight wrestling belt for the champion'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.177

0:00
The episode you are about to hear contains explicit words. The opinions within are those of the hosts and in no way imply that anyone listening to this podcast agrees with anything we say. Please send complaints to thisflippinpodcast at gmail.com You're listening to This Flippin' Podcast, episode 111. Special guest, Rachel Bess. Enjoy.
0:46
and I don't know why I got me 9 to 6. Get my levels. 9 to 6. I have your levels. I'm not professional.
0:55
Me neither, so this should go swimmingly. All right, we're going to dive in because you're a very busy person.
1:05
And so I'm super excited to have you on. I will say, like, I listened to the Backbox Pinball Podcast with Lauren. Oh, yeah. And I'm going to give her a shout because it was episode 23.
1:21
And Lauren and Rachel had a great, great episode. And I feel like I love I love Lauren's podcast because I just think, well, when I just think she's a very real person, she does a great job with the podcast. But unfortunately, she has a lot of people on that I would love to talk to. And I'm like, I just I'm not going to have a better interview than she has had. So it's like it's super intimidating. And I think, you know, one of the things with podcasts is like, you know, how do you create new content? Because there are so many podcasts now and I don't like being redundant because I don't see the point. but now that we're coming out of COVID and the world's kind of changed, I think it's kind of time to like refocus, like how we use our podcast. And one of the things that I think we can do is like reach out to operators and friends and kind of see like what people have done during COVID and how it's affected them, but also with coming out of COVID, like what people are looking forward to.
LED Zeppelin
game
Mandaloriangame
Addams Familygame
Joker Pokergame
Mark Pearsonperson
Chewyperson
Arizona State University (ASU)organization
New School for the Artsorganization
Coindroporganization
IFPAorganization
Cobra Arcadevenue
Backbox Pinball Podcastorganization
  • ?

    supply_chain_signal: Rachel's rail-making business (15-year operation) faced critical material shortages during COVID lockdowns. Humidity control critical for lacquer finishing (>70% humidity causes 'bloom'). She closed for six months and is attempting staged reopening as material availability stabilizes.

    high · Rachel: 'I've been closed for six months' and detailed humidity-dependent spray challenges: 'if you spray black lacquer when the humidity is too high it will – it'll look milky'

  • ?

    venue_signal: Electric Bat Tempe is housed within Yucca Taproom (operating since 1973); Flagstaff location integrated into Yucca North music venue. Venue events (4-5 shows/week in Tempe) drive arcade traffic from non-pinball audiences. Cross-promotion effect documented.

    high · Rachel Bess: 'shows have come back. So we've got shows maybe four to five nights a week, including like open mic type things. And each of those brings a whole different crowd of people'

  • ?

    content_signal: Rachel Bess guest appearance on Backbox Pinball Podcast (Lauren Gray, episode 23) generated visibility. Host references podcast's reach and quality, noting podcast saturation in pinball community creates redundancy challenges.

    medium · Host: 'I listened to the Backbox Pinball Podcast with Lauren... episode 23. And Lauren and Rachel had a great, great episode' and expressed concern about interview redundancy across growing podcast ecosystem

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Theme is primary driver of casual/new player engagement at location venues, more important than mechanical complexity or light shows. Established players prioritize depth and mechanics over IP. Addams Family cited as canonical introductory game.

    high · Rachel Bess: 'Theme is the only thing that's gonna draw them in... if you've had three beers and are walking across the room you're gonna see Rick and Morty' and host agreement: 'I think Addams Family is the greatest game to introduce somebody to pinball'

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Rachel Bess transitioned from traveling pinball parts sales (Marco's Specialties, 16 shows/year) to full-time arcade operation. Her husband Kale also transitioned to Arizona. Enables sustainable work-life balance after unsustainable travel schedule (living in AZ, working in SC, married in SC).

    high · Rachel: 'I was living in Arizona, had an arcade in Arizona, had a job in South Carolina and all over the country and a husband in South Carolina. It was just – my life was just an airport blur. So I would never recommend anybody do that.'

  • ?

    business_signal: Identified pattern: Most Phoenix operators are former hobbyists who transitioned because (a) collections exceeded home storage capacity, (b) desire to share machines with community, (c) ability to quit unsatisfying day jobs. Rare exceptions where people maintained parallel primary employment. Economic position and lack of dependents often prerequisites.

    medium · Rachel Bess: 'all of those things together just makes for more and more people to open up arcades' and host: 'most of these people were not in that position' (regarding having satisfying high-paying day jobs)

  • ?

    product_launch: Mandalorian pinball machine expected to arrive at Electric Bat within one week of recording. Rachel anticipates testing its casual-player draw potential post-LED Zeppelin and Rick and Morty.

    medium · Rachel Bess: 'I'm interested to see with Mandalorian – I think we should have that next week – um – how that will do'

    • 2:34
    Yeah, absolutely. COVID sucked for everybody. There was no real upside to that, I don't think, for any of us. It was rough. We were shut for a long time. We rented games out as a way to kind of cover basic bills, but we also didn't know how long we were going to be shut down. So you don't know, like, do I want to have my entire inventory out somewhere around the valley? You know, I don't have like a giant box truck. We've got a pickup truck. So it's not like it's not easy to to transport all these. So we did do that. I'll say that coming out of it has been has been fantastic. People are really ready to come out again. A lot of people, you know, it's been nice to see people. Obviously, you haven't seen in a year, but people are just like so excited to do things that there that there's just like an extra level of excitement around really everything, everything that we're doing. We're putting on all kinds of tournaments now. I think we were some of the only people in the in the nation to be running tournaments.
    3:44
    We had like full mask tournaments going on. We had every other machine. We did it as safe as we could and as much as the liquor board and the state would allow.
    3:57
    So now we're back to running full regular tournaments. We've got our league going, and people are really jazzed about it.
    4:06
    I don't know that there's anything. That's the upside. Yeah. So I'm talking to Rachel Bess, the owner-operator of the Electric Bat Arcade. You guys now have two locations, if I'm correct, right? You have one in Tempe, Arizona, and one in Flagstaff. I think when you were on Lauren's podcast, I don't know that the second location had opened. No, I think it hadn't. I think because we got shut down as we were training employees. Oh, wow. So we were supposed to open. It was either the next day or two days later, and then we got the word from the state that everything is shut down.
    4:43
    And you were all set up. We were all set up. We were paying all the bills, all of that stuff. So your relationship, like you have a really interesting relationship because your arcade, the original Electric Bat, is located in the Yucca Taproom, which is like a notorious bar in Tempe, right? Yeah. So Yucca Taproom has been around since 1973.
    5:08
    We have only been there the last three years. They knocked down a wall. We're in like what used to be the adjacent space. to Yucca Taproom. When we originally opened, it was just like a long galley arcade. It was really small. I think there was like 13 pins and seven or eight, maybe somewhere around there, 10 stand-up arcade games. And then we like tripled the size of it a year later.
    5:35
    And so our up north location is also, they opened a second Yucca North, a second Yucca Taproom location called Yucca North. and Flagstaff, and it's a huge music venue, will have all kinds of large touring bands, and then the arcade is integrated into the bar there. Now, is your arcade accessible if Yucca is closed? Can you guys be open? Like, do you guys have separate access or are you guys tied so much into them that it's one or the other? In Tempe, we could be open separately from them. And we did do that a little bit during the shutdown because the liquor licenses were, you know, it was really complicated. Right.
    6:29
    But up north, it's we couldn't. It's all kind of the same the same space. There's no door I can shut in Flagstaff. But in Tempe, we can. it's like a you know a doorway from the bar into into the arcade and there wouldn't really be any time i mean that bar is open 6 a.m to 2 a.m yeah 365 days a year there's no time that i want to be there that they're not open um and your and your operating background basically stem like i i one of the things that i think is really interesting is i have i've been in the hobby a while and seeing so many people who are hobbyists who've become operators, like it's just not something it's, it's something that I've considered just because I have friends who do it and like owning a bar or something like that would be, you know, kind of a dream situation for me, I guess, as a pinball person. Um, but the fact that so many hobbyists go into operate operating And I know I think in your situation, you've said that, you know, it was basically like it was a need because you had outgrown your collection, outgrown your personal space.
    7:46
    So I guess like during covid and, you know, like how has the relationship with being an operator, being a hobbyist, having to deal with kind of this business side of it, that's not really happening. How did that affect your view of the hobby? Does that make sense?
    8:05
    Um, I, Cale and I, my husband, Cale, um, a lot of people know him from the shows from working at the Marco booth as well. Um, we, we did a lot of streaming during, um, shutdown. So we tried to stay connected with everybody that way. And pinball was a great way to do that. It didn't really affect my view of the hobby. So my first route into pinball in public was there was a group of four of us that co-founded ZapCon, which is the Phoenix Arcade and Pinball Convention. That was 10 years ago. And we did that because there were no good places to play on location in the Valley. There were some bars with some broken machines, some amusement parks with some broken machines, but there were no arcades. Since then, several have popped up, but opening Electric Bat was also – it was part because I had too many machines for my house and storage units, but also part because there was a void in the Phoenix area for that. So it's I mean, always being able to share your machines is such a huge part of the hobby that during shutdown, I mean, that streaming was the way that we could we could share that.
    9:29
    It gave us a lot of time to fix some backlogs of issues for machines that we had in storage. but yeah that's really how for me the shutdown affected how I feel about the hobby is great, the people are by and large great the machines are way too heavy none of that changed I think for me it was tough for me because I do a lot of different things in the hobby but But the like as far as playing pinball, like I just like hanging out with friends and playing and I didn't have that. And so there wasn't really a lot that I it took me a while to even start playing again at home just because it just didn't feel the same. I see. And I think that, you know, like the more kind of tentacles you put out in the hobby, it kind of changes the hobby for you because it's no longer just a hobby. It's no longer like there's a big difference between somebody who goes on location and just drops a quarter and plays a game and complains about this game isn't working to, you know, somebody who might do a podcast or might, you know, like in my case, like I have a business where it's like, you know, I've been making rails for 15 years. And then when COVID hit and I couldn't buy material anymore, like that was it was just depressing, you know, so it's kind of like. It was depressing for us whenever I saw your post that you shut down because you can't get wood. It was such a roller coaster, but I think it's because the hobby of pinball becomes more integrated into your life.
    11:13
    I could see where as an operator not having that outlet of getting to hang out. You've created a space. You were in the middle of creating a new space. you know so the fact that you were less affected by that I guess I mean I'm sure like there were I mean we all had really tough times um yeah I don't know I think I I think that that's just kind of where I was going with that I know that like with the rail stuff they really like uh I think I was like at my I was at my kitchen table and I was like crying or something and my wife was like what's wrong with you and I was like I can't make rails anymore I was like I cannot I've had no material. And she was just like, I'm sorry. Like, you know, like she felt bad, but it was just like, it was just this feeling of like, this is just something that I do. Like I was losing a part of myself and, you know, especially like, you know, I know other people who operate and I think it's, it was just really difficult because it's so consuming, you know, because it is, it's like, you're always, you're all, there's always an expectation that you're going to get a call, something's going to go down. There's always, you know, something's got to get fixed. It becomes, um, people who don't, people who don't get that deep in the hobby. I don't necessarily think appreciate the fact that pinball kind of changes for you in a lot of ways, but I think it's great that it sounds like you guys were able to roll into another outlet. yeah i mean there was honestly there's just so many things that everybody as ourself included was thinking about i was focusing on making paintings for a lot of that you know there's a lot of other things that that i could be doing and and not being at the arcade six seven days a week yeah um you know working on various stuff you know i'll take a little break if it's if i know it's going to come back which of course that was also a big if we you know we didn't know what the, what the financial, how that was all going to work out, but it, it, it sucked, but, but, but the streaming was cool, like talking to everybody. And then that was neat because you got to talk to all of our friends all over, right? They were playing pinball with us, um, watching me beat the pants off kale every weekend.
    13:34
    Do you, do you have games at home? We do. Yeah. How many games do you have at home? uh right now four four games yeah right now how many games do you have on location at um i guess both locations right at the original pinball machines i think about 50 50 total wow and so and you i think i i think i read this somewhere do you share like you have other people who have games at your locations or are they all your games like are you so i have i have the majority of games, but I have a friend, Mark Pearson. Some people know him from the tournament circuit. He has some of the pinball machines in electric bat. And then I have another friend named Chewy who has, we have a couple of the Japanese rhythm games. We have four of those right now and those are his. Everything else is mine. Now, are you still doing work with Marco's Specialties? No, no, that ended several years ago. Okay. Yeah.
    14:38
    That a lot of time Yeah well When I was still working with them I was on the road I think the last year I worked with them I did 16 shows Yeah So each show figures five days of plus traveling And then also I was flying home in between that running the arcade going in and just doing you know fixing machines then going back on the road for a few days Then Marco is based in South Carolina, which is where Cale used to live. So we got married in that time also. So I was living in Arizona, had an arcade in Arizona, had a job in South Carolina and all over the country and a husband in South Carolina. It was just – my life was just an airport blur. So now that we're both here in Phoenix, it was – that was – I would never recommend anybody do that. Now, did that happen basically at the same time as the second location opening up or was it prior to that? No, no, no. The second location opened. We talked about the second location opening knowing that Cale and I were going to be moving out here. So there was no way because that's actually two to two and a half hours away from Phoenix. So we make that drive at least once a week, about once a week and go up there and work on those machines, make sure everything stays golden. And so that in combination with all the airplane stuff just wouldn't have been doable. So the operating scene, like what is – I guess you obviously run a lot of tournaments and stuff. Like are you guys a Coindrop location? Coindrop. Coindrop location. And so, I mean, you host tournaments and all that stuff. Like do you have just a regular – I mean I guess I'm not an operator, so I think it's always interesting to hear like what operators do to bring in business. I assume at this point you guys have been around long enough that you have like your locals and – Yeah. We're lucky. The Phoenix area is, I think right now, the biggest scene in the country. I mean, even if everywhere in the Northwest was to open up right today, last week there were six tournaments in seven days at five locations, I think. Wow. Four or five locations. And that's not even all of them. Like there's just – we hear about people opening up new arcades every week. Right now, I want to say that there are like 40 different places you can play pinball in the Phoenix area. I mean it's just – it's insane. And that all happened like within the last – do you think it was the success of your location that kind of spawned that? I think that people were ready for it. There was a pretty good tight-knit arcade scene here before arcades opened, like just between collectors. so then Cobra Arcade was really the first one to open up and it took him a long time it took him you know we were talking to him about it for four years before it finally all the paperwork and all that sort of stuff went through and then we opened up not too long after Cobra and then it just started Domino's all of our friends everybody has the same problem of I have way too many machines I have a lot of really nice machines I'd like to share them and I would like to quit my day job So all of those things together just makes for more and more people to open up arcades. And right now there seems to be enough people to support them. Phoenix is geographically really big, has a fairly large population. So for us, we have our regulars and they certainly travel around to various arcades. But then also because we're attached to a bar that is also a venue and we have shows right now, shows have come back. So we've got shows maybe four to five nights a week, including like open mic type things. And each of those brings a whole different crowd of people. So those people all come in and like, oh, dang, this is awesome. And then they come back. So it just is sort of the snowballing effect of people that get excited to be in the arcade and play the game. And most of the operators – so the arcades that are – like it's not an operator going into an existing location. It's actually the creation of a location, right? Correct. Okay. For the most part, barcades. A few are arcades without bars, but almost all of them that I'm thinking of are barcades of some sort. So at what point – you can speak from experience or from experiences you know about. Like at what point did people feel comfortable enough to do that? I mean it's like the point you – having a couple games on location to leaving your day job to run a place or open a place seems like a really big leap, right? Yeah. I only know of like a lot of the places that are open that people can play pins on location are people operating of the of the places that are just forget the day job. This is what I'm doing. I mean, there's a handful I can think of, maybe six or seven people that did it. But there's not a lot to lose, right? I guess unless you have some huge, amazing – if you love your day job and it pays a ton, then I guess that's a decision. But I think most of these people were not in that position. My day job before this, I started working at Marco because I had so many repair bills. And I got employee discounts and that all just kind of worked out really nicely. But my day job has always been – I taught art for eight years, I think. And then when I was 27 or 28, ever since then, I've just been a full-time painter. So I could still do my day job. This wasn't really going to affect it other than I had to watch my time a little bit differently. Yeah. But that's – I don't have any kids. I don't have a lot of responsibilities that I'm really worried about. Kids are the worst. I'm going to tell you.
    21:12
    That's what I hear. Somebody asked me at a tournament we were at this weekend, like, how do you have all those machines? I said, I have no children. Like think about how much you spend on your kids every month. Like I don't I don't have that expense. So I just like talk to my kids before I came down. I'm like, look, I'm doing an interview at two. Can you not start? Well, well, first I have a 15 year old and I'm like, please do your laundry. Please do your laundry. And then I had to go up and go, please don't do your laundry right now while I'm doing an interview because you could hear it in the background.
    21:48
    But no, I I do have I have a lot of friends who have incredible collections. And I will say that the majority of them do not have children. I'm like, man, but I mean, I feel like I spend the same amount of time and money on pinball that most parents spend on on kids. Right. I'm in there like fixing stuff, trying to make it do what it's what it needs to be doing. Kids are ridiculously expensive. Yeah. Kids are ridiculously expensive. I don't want to think about it. Now I like went back to my deep, dark depression. no but I have to say like um you mentioned being a painter and your work is incredible and I had like it was mentioned on the podcast you did with Lauren and I didn't I didn't I should have done a little more research because I have an art background and so um when I saw your work on Facebook finally I was just I was completely blown away so when Rachel just yeah when Rachel described yourself as a painter it's like classical I mean like your work I mean what would you describe your work I mean your painting style is very classic uh yeah figurative it's it's very realistic oil painting yeah of usually people usually kind of dark um yeah you can check out my instagram at rachel best art where did you um and where did you study or my thought no I Well, both, but I do have a degree in painting from ASU, of all places. Noted art school, Arizona State University.
    23:27
    And where did you teach? I taught at an arts school called New School for the Arts. Okay. Where is that? It's at P. It is? Okay. Yeah.
    23:39
    And so, like, during COVID, like, you got back to more painting? I mean, did you just – you had more time. So did you find yourself able to get back into it more or have you always just done that? You've always I mean, I've always like I mean, you as someone who makes things. No, it's like if you if you get if you spend too much time not making stuff, you start to go crazy and you're not as fun to be around. Yeah. So so it's always a battle of trying to make sure that I that I make the time to do those things because there is important to me both to make me feel good. But also, you know, so my husband will enjoy my company. And there's there's a myriad of reasons why I need to why those things need to be done. So, yeah, COVID COVID gave me a little bit of time to focus on that when I wasn't trying to figure out how to keep businesses running.
    24:32
    Yeah. How do we get you some wood? Well, I have no idea. I found I like I found some I found some at one point. Right. So what was really interesting is I, you know, I have a pin side thread and that's basically where I generate most of my my business. And so I posted on there that I was closed. I continue to take work because I would go out and I would search local spots where I could find material. And so I was able to, like, fulfill the orders. But if I was fully open, I would just I hate saying no to work. Sure. I'm I that's where I'm at. I'm right now. Like I fulfilled all my orders. I've been closed for six months. I've been closed. So so hopefully by the time the fall comes back around, I'll be able to get more material. So I kind of like may not skip a beat, but. okay you know but at the same time it's like i've been doing rails for 15 years and my background is fine art and i i like making other things you know so taking a break from making rails i it's not awful when it's like make other stuff when i can make other stuff when it's my choice when i was like oh i can't find any more wood and people are just like i want rails i want rails because everybody's home and wanting to do the restorations they've been sitting on for the last two years. Um, that was, that was tough, but I think I've, I think I've satisfied almost everybody. I still get like, please begging, please. I'm in the middle. So, you know, I get like the, I'm in the middle of a restoration. My play field just got here. I need some rails. And I'm like the humidity in central Virginia is at 90% right now. It's not, it's not that high today but it's like i can't spray lacquer like you know like with with paint i mean it's like stuff needs like there's different paints work differently and lacquer if it's above 70 degree 70 humidity it doesn't work it's like what happens does it get um like bump like orange peely or does it get like just sticky no so it takes longer to dry but if you um like if you spray black lacquer when the humidity is too high it will it'll look milky oh and so because it traps because lacquer dries so quickly it will trap the moisture in the air underneath your underneath the layer so it's almost like between the pigment and the clear it gets this milkiness and once you get that you can't you can't get it out you can't get rid of it so you have to sand it back out. Yeah. So the same thing happens whenever you're varnishing oil paintings, if they don't dry completely before you do get like, they call it bloom for an oil paint. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Same kind of thing. Yeah. So I had an issue, I had a set of rails and so I'm like a farmer. Like I watched the humidity, like I have like tracking apps, which will tell me if the humidity is correct for spraying. So I had this one, I'm like, I had this one set of rails I needed to get done for somebody and I'm, I'm watching the tracking app and it like, it dipped down to like, it said it was down to 50% and I have a humidity sensor in my, in my shop. So I went out there and I was like, Oh, I've got like a five minute window to spray. And so I sprayed and it blushed or yeah, blushed. Um, and so I was like, okay, sanded it all back down. But so what I figured my trick was this, I would, I had another window. So basically I couldn't let them dry in my shop. So I would spray it and then my daughter would open up the door. This is why kids are good. See, my daughter would open up the door between my shop and the house and I would come back into the house where it was lower humidity holding the rail on both sides. So it could dry enough that I would get past the blushing. Wow. Which is like so stupid. That's where I was just like, And then your house smells like lacquer for the next two days. And I have my respirator on, so I have no idea. Like, yeah, so then my wife would come home or she would be like, what is going on down there? And I'm like, I'm standing in the kitchen with the rail. And she's just like, okay. You know, she puts up with a lot. She puts up with a lot.
    29:22
    But oh your first game was Adam Family I have to mention that My first game was Adam Family Oh nice Yeah that still in the house too That not even at the arcade right now That's the game. I think, you know, I go back to like games that I would want back in my lineup. I think Adams Family is the greatest game to introduce somebody to pinball. I still think so. I think that like I've commented before on our podcast about I know you're a fan of Keith elwyn games i am as well yep um but one of the things like i think what's interesting about like adam's family verse like a lot of the elwyn games where it's like um adam's family is a great game because it's just like has those moments of celebration right it's like i think that pat lollard it is like the pinball celebration game because of the little moments that you get the multi-ball start is like maybe the greatest multi-ball start in pinball not maybe it definitely okay um but yeah so i think i think that that's like i know that you get a lot of the new games and is that like what do you see like as far as like what draws in a customer like two new games like is it for me it was adam's family i saw somebody play that at the arcade in the early 90s and i was like i have to go play that game yeah i think for us because that was what that was also a new game when we were playing in the arcades yeah um i see it really is theme like as much as people like to say come on come up with some original themes do if somebody is brand new to pinball they don't know you know a shooter rod from a flipper theme is the only thing that's gonna that's gonna like that's what's gonna draw them in like a light show is a light show and and those can be amazing um but like if you're if you're if you've had three beers and are walking across the the room you're gonna you see rick and morty you in here all of the the call outs you can identify with that you're like oh i want to see more about what's going on here um led zeppelin has done crazy well for us and i didn't i knew it would do well um it's the first game to surpass rick and morty since rick and morty has come out in terms of coin drop yeah which i thought was interesting um so so theme so i'm interested to see with mandalorian i think we should have that next week um how how that will do i mean And once you're dealing with the regular players, people that know what to look for and what to do, then theme, obviously, way, way less of an issue.
    32:15
    They want to do – I mean, Joker Poker is also one of our always busy games. Yeah, yeah. Do you have – and you said you host tournaments or league. How many nights a week?
    32:29
    Our Tuesday night league is every Tuesday night. we also host a few other one-off tournaments so we have a pin golf tournament once a month and we have a bounty knockout tournament once a month so every month we have at least six official tournaments and then sometimes there's some other stuff added on top of that plus we have a high score competition every month where you can win a vase oh i've seen the vase or a more family-friendly prize if that's what you prefer.
    33:08
    Most people seem to choose the vase. Everybody has so far. Everybody has chosen the vase. You can go to their Instagram, Electric Bat Arcade. They have a great Instagram, by the way. You can go and check out and you'll know what the vase is that people are choosing over family-friendly prizes. Have you found that with the IFPA not being active, like you've seen a dip in participation or do you think that – do you expect a growth when that starts back up in August?
    33:41
    There were – there was a dip for sure. There were people that said that they didn't really want to compete if it wasn't for points. But then I found that most of those people got bored of not competing and they've started to come back. And especially with the announcement that it's coming back, all these people need to make sure that they're back in practice. So we were getting a lot more people out. Our weekly league last week, it was 45 people tonight. I expect it to be bigger than that. Wow. So pretty. That's pretty impressive. How do you guys run your league? Like, yeah. How do you run your league? It's match play during during COVID. It was different. It was best game format and all that sort of stuff. But now that we're out of that, it's five rounds of match play. And then we will have finals at the end of each series. Since we weren't trying to maximize any points, this week or this series is like a seven week series. So there's weekly prizes. You can win gift cards to the bar and that tokens, that sort of stuff. And then there'll be bigger prizes for the finals for A division and B division at the end of each series. And at the end of the year this year, we are doing the electric bat heavyweight belt. So you may have seen the one from last year on our Instagram. We got it made and we're intending to do it for 2020, but 2020 didn't end so good. So we kept that. We thought we earned it for staying open. So every once in a while, Kale wears the electric bat belt around the house. It's pretty great. So we're doing a 2021 heavyweight wrestling belt for the champion of Tuesday nights from June onward. Wow, nice. That's awesome. Tommy does something. They do a belt in Indiana. It's like the Indiana State Champ, but it actually, I think they have something where like you can challenge the current champion and like it rotates around from people, but it's cool to kind of have that, yeah, that kind of like prize that you're working for. um yeah it's cool it's like now do you have like inter um arcade tournaments or leagues we don't now but we're talking about it yeah um yeah since since so many arcades have opened up we're talking about how we can figure that out how we can have like the electric bat team you know all the various arcades can can put together a team how many people that is what that looks like seems like we would model it after what they're doing in the pacific northwest West. They, they seem to do a pretty good job with all the home and away stuff. So that's in the works, but we, we haven't really finalized how we're going to do that just yet. Is there like a network of operators? Like, do you just know people? I mean, you've, you've, I mean, because of Marco, you've traveled a lot. So you've, your, your web of your network is huge, but is there a, if somebody was interested in operating or interested in, or if they were currently an operator but wanted to kind of get ideas as to how other operators are making it work because you you guys seem like you're really making it work where you are the fact that you can sustain so many different arcades um yeah is there is there are there resources that you would suggest that people who are looking into it or doing it could use to help them i don't know of any i mean for us it worked out because we were all kind of friends before we opened arcade so now You know, we just happen to be a little bit more supportive than other places are where it's just sort of what might feel like competitive businesses cropping up. So for us, you know, we had we had group text threads during COVID because we're all in different cities. So different cities had different rules about what you could and couldn't do. And, you know, liquor board came and shut so and so down today. Oh, for what? OK, well, let's go do. We were all trying to help each other through all of that. I don't know how other places do it. I don't know if you were just an operator and you wanted – if you like moved across the country and wanted to start operating somewhere else. I feel like it really helps to know all of the people that are there so you don't accidentally step on somebody's toes. Yeah. I know that, you know, we all try not have tournaments on top of each other. Just just kind of common courtesy things like that.
    38:27
    I wish that there was a better you know, there's there's large national organizations. Yeah. For that sort of thing. But I don't I don't think that's really what you're asking or particularly helpful in a specific way. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I think I don't know. I think the idea of like independent opera, I don't know if that's even the proper term, but like independent operators where I think like back in the day.
    38:50
    And I don't know, I'm ignorant to it, but my impression is like you had operators where it's like, this is my territory. You don't come in it. It's like really territorial, like nasty stuff happens behind the scenes. Like it seems to me like there is a there is a new breed of operator who is just functioning at a different, maybe friendlier level where it is more about like.
    39:20
    There's a love of pinball, and that's like your love of pinball led you down the road to where you were like, oh, this is a really good way to share what I have. opposed to, hey, pinball is a way that I can make money as an operator because I own – it's like I no longer have cigarette machines out on locations. You know what I mean? These aren't soda machines or rental cars for us. Right, yeah. And there still is stuff. I think you said it exactly right. I mean we still – I imagine every city has this, like the old school. I can think of the ones out here, the vending companies that I know people that tried to put pinball in bars.
    40:04
    But there was already an operator there. They didn't maybe even necessarily have pinball there, but they did the jukebox or whatever else. And then that operator will throw a fit and say, no, you can't have this other person there because somehow. Yeah, it gets really territorial and nasty. And those are the people that tend not to clean their machines or care if they are only standing on three legs and have one button.
    40:30
    And then there are the people that are, I think, our generation of operators that they're our personal machines, too. This isn't I'm not working for somebody else like cleaning. You know, I care that this thing works, one, because I enjoy playing it, two, because it's mine. Yeah. So so I I think you just kind of care about it a little bit more whenever it's the thing that you also do for fun. Do you find like with the the IFPA, the the state championship series, was that a big driving force behind a lot of the competitive pinball in in Arizona? I know it was big here. Like I feel like a lot of growth happened when. the idea of earning points. I mean, like when, when I started playing in Virginia there, I mean, in Northern Virginia, they had like, they had had a leak for a while, but there was an explosion of, of activity once the IFPA started the SES. Um, and there's been pushback like from different places because there's, you know, where does the money funnel and all that stuff? Has there ever been discussions amongst operators about doing something similar to a state championship that would funnel into a bigger thing? Or is that just – That's what we did for the electric bat belt because we didn't anticipate IFPA coming back this year at all. So we set that up before they announced – because that was going to be our version of a state championship. and now we've been wondering how it's going to work with so many yes to answer your question yes people really get into like if there's a way that you can that you can really chart out your progress and rank against other people then that's that propels you to to do more of it but now if there's going to be tournaments in our area if you can go to a tournament five nights a week for points, like you're very quickly either going to stop caring about points or like give up everything else in your life. Because I don't know how that's really going to work. Do you just go to the ones with the most points? If so, so-and-so could also, you know, a less skilled player could just make it up in volume. And are we going to see people at the state championship that really just were dedicated, not necessarily they didn't perform very well but they really went to every event they could and got enough points to be top 16 um i don't know i'm interested to see what will happen and there's certainly some people that are you know oh i'm not like who cares about points i hate points like it really takes the fun out of it now it's just for for you get all sides of it that's me Yeah, I mean – I feel like in Virginia, like our local scene, it was – like if you won our local house league, you would qualify for the state finals. Like that was how few events were happening, and now people are maxing out their events. And for me, like I qualified – I think I qualified like the first maybe two years, and then there were just too many events. And I was like, I can't compete. And I can't compete in enough sanctioned events to ever make it to the finals unless I won everything. And I'm not going to win everything.
    44:00
    Yeah, so I kind of like – I lost interest because I was like, what's the point? And when people are at tournaments like people are there to compete And so for me I like I like hanging out with all you guys but you you here like you you on a different level of seriousness than I am because I want to do well but I not like sweating. Like, is this going to get me the two points I need to jump into that 24 spot or something like that? Or yeah, so and so is coming to town. They're bringing their extra 2.14 points. Like I just can't, I can't wrap my head around it. And I think because, I mean, going back to why kids suck, it's, you know, it's like, I only have certain amount of time I can play. So, or I have enough, I have a certain amount of time I can dedicate towards pinball. So like, especially with like the rails or even like the podcast, it's like, there's a, you know, there's a point where you're like the balance between family and your hobby is just completely out of whack. And I've really tried to maintain that. So I have a happy family. And so I think like I definitely made a decision where I was like, I am not I don't care about tournaments anymore because it's just not the time I have to spend playing with other people. I want it to be in a more casual environment, you know, so I don't know. I think it's I think it's interesting as well, because I feel like not to get too deep into it. But I think, you know, one of the things about pinball that was always great was that you could have every walk of life come into an arcade or even my basement. and it didn't matter like your background or your politics or anything like that. It was just like everybody had a love of pinball. I think like with events over the last couple of years, like there's become an awareness as to the divisiveness that we have. And I know that as a person who hosts events in my basement, like I definitely got to a point where I was like, I don't know that I can just open it up to everybody because I don't know that I'm comfortable with anybody walking into my house. Does that make sense? Sure. Like have you seen that on an operator level as far as like that type of – I don't know. I'm not even sure like the tension, like social tension or political tension come to bear? I think with the masking and no masking thing, we did see a lot of it with people that really felt strongly one way or the other and were very vocal about it. Our position was always, you don't even have to know what I think about it, but you have to wear a mask. Otherwise, I get shut down. Yeah. So for us as owners, we I mean, I think we we did see a little bit of that. But I think also people were more accepting of everybody's viewpoint than I maybe would have expected. I think I think I would have expected there to be more vocal. You're an idiot. No, you're an idiot type stuff. And we did get some emails and some messages from people saying, as long as you support mask wearing, we will not come to your spot. It's like, okay, well, even regardless of my opinion, it's not an option. As the business owner, I don't have that choice even if I wanted to give it. But I think some of the other stuff, again, we were at another tournament and saw some people that were wearing some shirts that were really divergent from Cale and my personal views. It was funny. It was awesome. It was like, man, all these people are getting along, just blasting each other at pinball. So I do like that. I like that part of it. I like that it's something that we can all like come together over. Yeah.
    48:38
    But it's also in a business and not in my home. Yeah. So I guess, you know, I'm trying harder and harder as I get older to be more like everybody's coming at everything from, you know, 40 or 50 years of their personal experience, which has been different from mine. And so like, man, really try and see it from somebody else's point of view and just not mostly because I get too stressed out and worked up, but I need to for my own health. So like that's one of the things that I'm just personally trying to be different about.
    49:14
    But I know what you mean. And yeah, you do see it. But I mean, I and one of the reasons I asked is because Arizona is like just one of those states where you think about like there's just a lot. Arizona is in the news. Yeah. Yeah, we are. So it's kind of like, yeah, there's you know, it's it's just interesting to think about how that you don't see it a lot. You don't see it a lot in pinball, which is I think is fortunate. I mean, going to Pinnberg and seeing all those people who can are coming from all walks of life, being able to get together and celebrate pinball and not really have a ton of moments. But also as much as you see Arizona in the news for all of the vote counting and bamboo microscoping that's going on, like like that is really not like we don't see that dated. Like, oh, yeah, like 15 people somewhere else doing the weird thing. The rest of us are trying to stay in, like, just trying to stay cool enough to get to lunch.
    50:18
    Well, Rachel, I want to thank you for hanging out and talking today. You are, I know you've got a lot going on. And, but yeah, it's been a pleasure talking to you. I've, we've, we follow each other on Instagram for a really long time. And I kind of feel like I got to know you through that. I've known Kale. I don't even know remember how I hooked up with Kale like we started chatting at some point it might have been Instagram and then I met him I met Kale in person at Southern Pride game room and I may have met you but I just I didn't know I think we met in maybe Texas we met in Texas yeah we met in Texas but I have to say like the Marco people like because I went down to Southern Pride to help with the tournament. And so I was kind of like able to get in when Marco was setting up their wonderland and, um, they were the best, like the Marco family was just, I, I don't know. It's funny. Like I go back to like, when I first got into the hobby and Marco specialties, like was one of the only places you could get parts from, which was great. But then they redid their website and it was the worst website possible for ordering pinball parts. And so like there was like, I mean, I remember back like in the forums, like people are just like, what in the world? Like, why did they do that? Like, it is so like their search function doesn't work. And so I kind of like, I like turn my back on Marco and, um, and then, you know, yeah, going to shows and like, I will say like, I went to Southern Friday game room and I was just like, I met the nicest people possible who were just like, you look really thirsty here, have a water. And I was just like thank you like it was just it's just a very welcoming family um so i do have to give a shout out to marco specialties because i do think like um what they do as far as bringing tons of games to tournaments or to shows and stuff like that like it's just an incredible amount of work and knowing that you you know you you guys work with them back in the day like um yeah that's where we met that's where you guys met yeah it's so i oh i have to say um what is the show that you are looking forward to most coming forward? Cause in, in, and this is a good way to wrap it up. Cause in the interview with Lauren, she asked you, what was your favorite show?
    52:40
    So I think actually Kayla and I are going to try and get to Southern fried this year. It looks like, it looks like we might be able to, we might be able to swing that. So if you're, if you're going to be down there again, this is the end of August. Is it August 31st or is it, I don't remember the exact date. I'm going to Google it. So we have it. We can, yeah. We were going to try and fly back to South Carolina, visit his family and visit some people out there, and then drive back and time our drive back so that we could hit up Southern Fried because we both really miss – it'll be a lot of fun for us to be at shows that we're not working. All right. So Southern Fried Gaming Expo this year is Friday, August 20th to the 22nd. Okay. So mark that on your calendars. It is a great show. And I'm yeah, I love that show. That's the other thing. Like I'm I'm so excited about shows coming back. I know that the Allentown locally, the Allentown show is coming up soon. They did have a show in I don't remember where it was, but there has been. Oh, I think it was in Ohio. They had a show recently. But will that – will Southern Fried Game Room – is that the first show where you know of that big vendors will be attending like Marco?
    54:00
    Yeah, I assume Marco will be there because it's within driving distance for sure. So yeah, I think Southern Fried is the first one that I know of. There may be others, but that's really kind of pushing the timeline of being able to play on the show and have people attend it. So I assume it's the first one. I'm sure you'll hear if I'm wrong.
    54:26
    Yeah. So let me know if you decide or if you're able to go down there or any other future shows, because Cale and I would love to get up with you in person again. Oh, man, I would love that. I will have to look at my calendar because I do think my kids school this year starts that following Monday.
    54:44
    Southern Fright Game Room has always been a tough. It's like I think it's. it was always held the last going back to why kids suck. It goes, um, it was always the last week of their school. It was held, or it was the first week that they went back or something like that. And so this year they moved their school. So I don't know, I'll have to see, but yeah, it would be great to catch up with you guys. Um, so yeah, so tell, so how can people, um, check out so electric bat arcade on Instagram, electric bat arcade.com, electric bat arcade on Facebook, Instagram. We're pretty much, if you just search for Electric Bat Arcade, and it's just Cale and I running everything. So if you message us, you're either talking to myself or Cale. Cale does most of our social media. So it's a small operation and we're real easy to get in touch with.
    55:41
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    56:20
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    57:17
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    58:17
    We're the first to go, first to go, first to go, first to go, first to go Unless you think you