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Episode 38 - Die on this Hill: Orbitor 1

Wedgehead Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·38m 25s·analyzed·Jul 8, 2024
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

Jeff Johnson defends Orbiter One's skill depth against harsh reviews, revealing designer aerospace credentials.

Summary

Wedgehead Pinball Podcast's 'Die on this Hill' episode features Blueberry Jeff Johnson defending Orbiter One, a notoriously unpopular 1982 Stern Electronics game ranked #285 of 293 on Pinside. Jeff argues the game has deep mechanical skill and control via floating flippers on a 3D vacuum-formed playfield, revealing that designers Al Gross and Dixie Reinhardt were NASA aerospace engineers who invented the space toilet. The hosts read negative Pinside reviews and Jeff counters misconceptions about playability, physics, and game depth.

Key Claims

  • Orbiter One is about to double in price

    medium confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson, opening statement; no specific pricing source cited

  • The designers (Al Gross and Dixie Reinhardt) were NASA aerospace engineers who developed the space toilet and a space glove with haptic feedback

    medium confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson; claims to have done extensive research including library microfiche

  • Orbiter One was the first game to have ball save that stops timers when the ball is trapped

    medium confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson; compared to modern games like Pulp Fiction

  • The game has no kickers, slings, bumpers, or pops—only spinning rubber discs and drop targets

    high confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson describing playfield mechanics

  • The bonus multiplier on Orbiter One goes up to 15x

    high confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson, confirmed after clarification with hosts

  • Orbiter One has floating flippers that can catch the ball due to the parabolic playfield shape, providing full control

    high confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson emphasizing this is the key skill mechanic most players miss

  • Al Gross and Dixie Reinhardt designed rubber soles for Nike

    low confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson; speculative connection to their work on spinner rubber components

  • Steve Young was approached to remake Orbiter One motors but declined because only 15 orders existed

    high confidence · Blueberry Jeff Johnson, direct personal anecdote about conversation with Steve Young

Notable Quotes

  • “I was telling Alan and Alex that Orbiter One is about to double in price. All right, I'm rich!”

    Blueberry Jeff Johnson @ early episode — Sets up the value proposition argument; deflates with humor

  • “They figured out how astronauts can shit in space. They came up with the space toilet.”

    Blueberry Jeff Johnson @ mid-episode — Reveals surprising designer background; shifts perception of game as serious engineering attempt

  • “The point is because you can grab the ball, dude. I'm telling you, it's the most controllable game.”

    Blueberry Jeff Johnson @ mid-episode — Core defense mechanic; counter to 'floaty' criticism

  • “If you look at it as a game, which most people don't, Alex included. They look at it as some weirdo art project.”

    Blueberry Jeff Johnson @ mid-episode — Identifies the perception gap between serious players and novelty-seekers

  • “Watching the ball orbit around my flippers and drain is the most fun I've ever had losing an American pinball game.”

    Caucasian_Two_Step (Pinside reviewer) @ review reading section — Acknowledges the game's unique entertainment value despite poor play rating

  • “Orbiter's worth about three minutes of novelty... this is just one of the worst pins ever to get the green light for production.”

    Johnny Pinball (Pinside reviewer) @ review reading section — Harshest review; establishes the game as a failure in mainstream perception

  • “You owe some respect. I know what they're doing with that plunger. I fucking love it.”

    Blueberry Jeff Johnson @ late episode — Defends even confusing design choices as intentional engineering by aerospace experts

  • “I've offered to trade you Whodunit and three ice-cold beers with the broken spitter motor that you cannot get anymore that Steve Young will rebuild.”

    Blueberry Jeff Johnson — Shows extreme commitment to acquiring the machine; reveals rarity and fragility

Entities

Orbiter OnegameStern ElectronicscompanyBlueberry Jeff JohnsonpersonJoe Juice Jr.personAl GrosspersonDixie ReinhardtpersonSteve YoungpersonGary Sternperson

Signals

  • ?

    rumor_hype: Jeff Johnson claims Orbiter One is 'about to double in price' but provides no source or timeline

    low · Opening claim; no pricing data or market signals cited

  • ?

    collector_signal: Orbiter One machines are rare and fragile; Jeff spent years hunting one; previously modded unit owned by Travis

    high · Jeff describes extensive search effort; mentions specific machines and owners; references rarity in reviews

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Orbiter One prioritizes mechanical innovation (3D playfield, floating flippers, no bumpers/slings) over conventional pinball ease-of-play; designers were aerospace engineers not pinball professionals

    high · Al Gross and Dixie Reinhardt background; design choices documented; Jeff's argument that skill emerges only after extended play

  • ?

    community_signal: Massive disconnect between core Orbiter One enthusiasts (Jeff, Alan) and mainstream community; ranked #285/293 on Pinside; reviews overwhelmingly negative but defenders claim reviewers haven't invested time

    high · Pinside ranking; multiple reviews stating 'one game and walk away'; Jeff's repeated argument that novelty converts to skill with practice

  • ?

    gameplay_signal: Orbiter One's key mechanic is floating flippers on parabolic playfield that allow catching and controlling the ball; most players unaware of this; Jeff emphasizes this is what separates 'art piece' from 'game of skill'

    high · Jeff repeatedly explains flipper catch mechanics; contrasts player experience of 'erratic' ball vs. controllable with skill; Johnny Pinball review mentions 'floaty' as flaw; Jeff counters this is by design

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.115

0:00
You signed your real name? Of course I did. If you believe in something, you sign your name to it. Alright, I'm gonna tell you right now. I ain't crazy.
0:08
This is the ground you'll die on. Are you sure? Oh my god, are you serious? Son, people can see you. I don't tell you what to do with your money. Don't fucking tell me what to do with mine, okay? I'm not as dumb as you think I am. I will defend myself. He means it, sweetheart. Well, that's because you're an idiot. I will fight and win because I am the most intelligent. You sure about that? I got something I want to say. Well, you motherfuckers think you know who Kenny Powers is. Well, I'm here today to tell you all you don't know shit. Oh, I give up. You're going to get yourself killed, and this time I won't be able to save you. I make you laugh. I'm a clown. I amuse you. I'm here to fucking amuse you. Come on, don't bullshit me. Go ahead and go, but I'm not going to stop yelling, because then that'll mean I lost the fight. So, please leave a T under the mat. I love y'all very much. Peace out.
1:10
Serenity now! Serenity now! What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul. Okay, a simple wrong would have done just fine, but this makes no sense.
1:41
Hello everybody, and welcome to another episode of the Wedgehead Pinball Podcast. We're doing another edition of our popular Die on this Hill series. We got a special guest joining us today. But first, I'm going to throw it over to my co-host, Alex the Waterboy. How you doing? I'm doing pretty good today. Yeah, like you mentioned, we got our buddy with us again. This is Jeff Johnson from LA. He's the owner of Walt's, the coolest pinball bar I've not been to. Jeff, how you doing? I'm good. How are you guys? Doing well. What game are you here to defend? Arbiter 1. Duh. Yeah, he might need a little defense. All right, I'll give the listener a little background on Orbiter One, in case you've never run into it. Orbiter One was released by Stern Electronics in 1982. It has the somewhat dubious honor of being the last pinball machine that that company ever made. It was designed by Joe Juice Jr., who we talked about on our podcast episode about Stern Electronics, the miracle 1980 year. He also designed games like Quicksilver and Dragon Fist, most notably. and then he transitioned into a mechanical engineering role over at Williams in the late 1980s. It also has two people listed with concept credits, which I thought was interesting. Somebody named Art Myers and Dixie Reinhart. I hadn't heard of them before, but it appears after doing more research that this is their only pinball credit at all for both of them. I bet they came over from the arcade side of Stern. They must have. And so if any vintage arcade fans, they know about them. I'm sure maybe they've heard about them, but like this is their only thing that they've done in the world of pinball. Kind of makes sense. Orbiter famously has a vacuum formed play field of Martian like terrain. And it's got kind of a parabolic surface on which the ball rolls around like a big bowl. It's invisible or somewhat indiscernible to the player when you're playing it. It's essentially like an optical illusion and it's super trippy to play. It has its fans like Jeff, who's here to defend it. but it is currently ranked number 285 out of 293 eligible games on the Pinside Top 100 list. That's officially the lowest game that we've ever covered on this show thus far. So, Jeff, tell us why Orbiter 1 does not suck and is, in fact, awesome. I was telling Alan and Alex that Orbiter 1 is about to double in price. All right, I'm rich! Dude, straight up. So, 1982, Widebody started. We have a three-dimensional shaped plate field, right? Al Gross. Okay, so let me give you the backstory. That Art Myers guy, that's not a real guy. The guy's name was Al Gross. Okay. And his partner, Dixie Reinhart. So those guys were, they came up with the concept. They knew nothing about pinball. That seems clear.
@ mid-episode
Alan
person
Alex (Alex the Waterboy)person
Rodesyperson
Next Levelvenue
Walt's Barvenue
Wedgehead Pinball Podcastorganization
Pinside Top 100product
Caucasian_Two_Stepperson
Johnny Pinballperson
Charlie's Angelsgame
Gottlieb Black Holegame
Pulp Fictiongame
Whodunitgame
Popeyegame
  • ?

    product_concern: Orbiter One machines have widespread motor/parts failures; Steve Young declined to manufacture replacement motors due to low demand (15 orders); Jeff hunting for working machines

    high · Steve Young anecdote about motor remake; Jeff's difficulty acquiring a working unit; references to 'broken spitter motor'; multiple machines in non-playable condition

  • ?

    historical_signal: Orbiter One is Stern Electronics' last arcade pinball machine; its commercial failure contributed to Stern exiting the pinball market (shifted focus to electronic pinball and arcade games)

    high · Explicitly stated in episode; Caucasian_Two_Step review: 'Orbiter One is the game that broke Stern's back'

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Joe Juice Jr., primary designer of Orbiter One, transitioned to mechanical engineering role at Williams in late 1980s after Stern experience

    high · Episode background provided; Joe Juice Jr. also designed Quicksilver and Dragon Fist

  • ?

    venue_signal: Jeff repeatedly places Orbiter One in Walt's Bar; players consistently reject it after 3 weeks; preference shifts to other games (Popeye); Jeff continues to reintroduce it despite poor reception

    high · Jeff: 'Whenever I put it in there, it lasts like three weeks max... they're just like, I'm gonna go play Popeye'

  • ?

    design_innovation: Orbiter One was first pinball game to implement ball-save timer that stops when ball is trapped/controlled; precedes modern conventions seen in games like Pulp Fiction

    medium · Jeff claims this was first; compares to Pulp Fiction; hosts discuss but don't independently verify

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Al Gross and Dixie Reinhardt's NASA/aerospace backgrounds and Nike design work suggest Orbiter One was funded or approved as part of broader design/engineering portfolio work

    low · Jeff speculates about Nike rubber sole application; unclear if official NASA project or side work; not independently verified

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: During episode, hosts move from skepticism to willingness to revisit game; Alan commits to playing Orbiter One again at Next Level; Alex acknowledges new information about ball control changes his perspective

    high · Alex: 'my biggest complaint was I just felt like I was fucking standing there... If you're telling me I can actually catch the ball and make shots, it's now like I'm like, fuck, I want to go try this thing again'

    • 4:35
    They were NASA aerospace engineers. the two of those guys like they figured out how astronauts can shit in space they came up with the space toll what no way are you serious no fucking way i swear yep and the they also i haven't found much information i've gone down such a like wormhole i've gone to like libraries and gone to the microfiche about these guys whoa they also developed a glove a space glove where you can feel some sensation from the thumb and the index they're like they're big time nasty okay how'd they end up at stern what happened so they they saw something at like a fair and it was like weird and they were like oh we should make a pinball machine that they like pinball but they didn't know anything about it so they come up with this concept they brought it to to gary stirred he was like show me more so they built one and they brought it to him and he was like let's do it it's kind of like black hole is the same thing the gotley game right similar story like it was developed by an outside like fucking weirdo right and then sold to gotley interesting yeah so these guys had had nothing to do with pinball and this is their one and only attempt you know at pinball So they brought it and then like, you know, like Joe Juice like designed it and he did all the mechanics. Right. Because he's a mechanical engineer. Yeah. And it was a fucking total failure. Yeah. I mean, it was. I don't know how many units they sold, but it was not a great game. And to this day, it's a game. I think mainly now because. You're supposed to be doubling the value of this thing right now. Yeah, Jim. Come on, man. I thought you loved this game. oh i'm about to okay everybody hates it for tournaments because it has like this like timer countdown thing yep you know about that yeah it has like a minimum play time right like it just keeps giving you the ball back if you're not doing good enough right yeah so like on on tournament it's like all three and just like keep shooting out more balls more balls more balls until your timer goes down but crazy thing about is you know like how like new games have if you trap the ball and then the timer stops this was the first game to do that oh interesting which is kind of cool you know like uh we were talking about pulp fiction yeah you know like it stops the mode right the craziest thing about this game that no that nobody knows is that you can catch the ball yeah of course you can well can you because i thought the flippers were floating i thought it would roll off the back. It's been a while since I played it. They are floating, but the way the play field is shaped, if you hold the flipper up, it catches the ball. So you have total control. You can slow everything down. So you have that first shot, right? You lock the ball, and then... Yeah, it's got a multiball, everybody. Anyone that's listening that has never seen the multiball, the main objective of Orbiter 1 is to get to the multiball. Yep. So you get multiball, right? You lock that first ball and then you want to drop down all the... So there's a big bank of targets up top that spell orbiter. And once you get all those down, you release the multiball. But there's also a gate to the right of the right flipper. And the ball will like roll below the flippers and you can hold the flipper up. It's total control. If you spend like an hour with this game, you'll master it. and you will not... You'll just keep playing and playing and playing. It's so sick. You light the spitter with those drop targets. There's no kickers on the game. Yep. Oh. Yeah, no slings. No slings, nothing. No pops. No pop bumpers either. No pops. The bonus multiplier goes up to 15,000, dude.
    8:51
    You need a bonus... The multiplier goes up to 15,000? No, no, no. Not 15,000. That's 15x. Okay. Okay, that makes more sense. That's still a lot. The bonus multiplier goes up to 150 points.
    9:05
    Hmm. All right, bonus multiplier goes up to 15x, and that's from the two bank targets. I'm just – I'm closing my eyes right now. I can't even remember how – Just imagining that beautiful play field. Oh, dude, dude, they have the hardest extra ball shot and the hardest special shot ever in pinball. But are they hittable from the flippers, or are they luck? Yes, they are. Okay. Yeah. So you have to knock down the O and the B and the T That doesn sound so hard While you in multi You have to knock just those three down and then there's a stand-up. There's stand-ups behind the drop crampons, and you have to go through a spinner, rip the spinner, and hit the T to get extra ball. This seems like such a convoluted, like... And you've got to remember, You can't actually aim for shit. Yes, you can. This is what Jeff is saying is yes, you can. The point is because you can grab the ball, dude. I'm telling you, it's the most controllable game. Everybody's just like, ow, are there magnets in this thing? Oh, stop.
    10:16
    It's got the spinners in the middle, right, that, like, are actually, you know, these guys also designed um they have like six pads for uh rubber uh shoe soles for nike okay this tracks yeah seems like something they'd get into uh alberos and and dixie reinhart have like if you if you look them up they're like all over nike uh so they use their rubber sole for those spinners that you know the rubber that goes around those things yeah no shit which steve young is like oh i fuck andrew i only i wanted your pinball resource i'm just saying for the listener yeah shout out to steve what up steve wall says hi that's my dad's home he was like so close to remaking the motors for uh orbiter one but he only had like 15 orders so he's like I can't do it, Jeff.
    11:15
    I won't let you in your body. I'm like, fuck, but so many of them are broken. He's like, I'm not about to sit on 150 motors, man. But so I think he does have the, they're not the Nike rubbers that go on the spitters, but they're similar. Okay, close enough. Close enough. Funny. The special shot is even harder. It's the same scene as the extra ball, but it's the art trying to get. Dude, it is art fucking game, man. It is hard to do if you look at it as a game, which most people don't, Alex included. They look at it as some weirdo art project, and we'll get into the bad reviews here in a moment. If you're looking at it as a game where you as a pinball player, most of the time when you walk up to a pinball machine, you're like, okay, I get it. Two flippers. They're pretty much all the same size. they're usually in the same configuration if we're talking about games from like 1960 onwards yeah right or you know at least the late 70s like onwards have at least full-size three-inch flippers and the same you know and you're like okay it's a slanted board um you know like i i get how to play pinball and then this gives you so many curveballs because it has the flippers but like like i said it has this like martian vacuum form terrain but then over the top of it it's got this clear lexan plastic that has multiple different divots and bowls around these spinning rubber discs where pops would usually be on a pinball play field and they kind of whip the ball around and they it's just such a trip to play the sound design on this thing is so sick it's like in my dreams every night I mean, I know it's not even really a pinball machine. It's like people would argue that it's just like this fucking art piece. But like, dude, it is so dope. And like when I put it in the bar, everyone's just like, whoa, what the fuck? It's a it's a cool like it does lure people in. It does. I've had to argue with Alex about whether or not Orbiter One is fun. And I have said, Orbiter 1 is fun, and I play it every time I see it. And he's the opposite.
    13:42
    You just don't see it. You don't get it, man. You don't get it. You've got to open your third eye, dude. That's maybe why, though, Jeff, because we have one at next level. So it's like we have the opportunity to play it anytime we're out there. Oh, really? Yeah. I don't. Alan does. I do.
    14:02
    Alan beelines for Orbiter 1. He's just like, this is what I'm here for, baby. Orphaner 1. Jeff and I have the same love of mechanical games. He grew up, if you listened to the last episode, he grew up with his dad teaching him how to fix games, old pinball machines, work on cars. Jeff still will send me, you sent me a message today about a new metal stamping machine you got that stamps these little aluminum discs. and and we have we both have the same mechanical clown ziggy that dispenses little cheap trinkets right he's like come talk to me see what you can get and rodesy my business partner the other half of wedget he loves all that shit too like that's fine but it's supposed to be a pinball machine and it's a really bad one well okay we're gonna get into these reviews jeff are you ready i'm gonna start reading we're gonna alternate reading these reviews and we want to hear your opinion on all right these reviews yeah you get to review the reviews yeah all right so jor 08 22 says this is just a gimmick it can hardly even be considered a pinball machine play it once to check it off the list and then never look back want to kill all humans sounds like you wrote this review alex it sounds like your similar statement a lot of yeah it'd be a lot of that so do you think it's just a gimmick jeff no it is a pinball machine and it's not like it doesn't have a flat play field i get that but there's still a game i wouldn't even do dollar games i'd do a hundred dollar games oh yeah so you're like this is a game of skill orbiter one is a game of skill okay that's you know i think that's a good argument to try and make and i believe it so if anyone actually has spent time playing it that you're gonna have a big advantage over anyone else because it's definitely not like anything else i tell people that all the time about ems at wedgehead when they complain about playing an em in a tournament or something i'm like if you think that game's a coin flip i will take as much money off of you as you're willing to lose like i will absolutely beat your ass on one of these old ems like if you think it's just luck and they're just house balls dude alan straight up they're like all the flippers are tiny it's like what are you fucking kidding me you know how you don't think gap actually is when the flippers are lush dude come on like orbiter one fucking all day like best fucking game ever okay next review it's from bach 13 he says i get it that it's different and that they were trying something different but this game was just annoying spinning pops were neat and maybe could be used elsewhere but i couldn't wait to walk away from this one let's go get drunk because he only played one fucking game i mean i think that's a common theme with the people that don't like this game yeah they don't give it that's maybe my problem you know we'll get here's another one cyber bear says totally pointless. Bored after one shot. Not a looker. Oh, here comes violence!
    17:18
    So now he's trashing the way the game looks. Dude, alright, this guy's don't even get me started. We're trying to get you started. Yeah, we're just getting going. We got like ten more. That black and white cabinet, the fucking back, do you form fucking back? Like, come on. It doesn't look good. He said something about one shot. That's probably all he does. Yeah, I think the game looks good. That's subjective. Dude, it's fucking sick. Dude, you put this in a row of machines, and then you told non-pinball people to pick out which one looks the most interesting. I don't care what you put next to it. They're going to think that this is the most interesting game. I mean, if you get ten cute babies and one really ugly one, and ask for the most interesting baby, everyone's going to pick the ugly one. No, it's not ugly at all, dude. it's so beautiful it's not ugly at all it's like such a psycho analogy okay next next review next review we got to keep going kde cgp says what a weird machine if you see it you should play it it's just so damn bizarre i came into it knowing the name but never seen it it looks like an aquarium my first impressions were that the machine ate my quarter but i just needed to replunge i'm saying this again it's a very weird machine you can get into it and ball times can stretch out but don't expect depth that dirty double crossing bastard sounds like they had a weak shooter spring see that seemed like a fairly fairly complimentary you know that was not too bad all right roll bar 45 says this game is awful neat idea but it's just awful awful if you want children beaten you have to do it yourself whoa i know what whoa i are you surprised jeff are you like are you genuine you know this game's hated right or or is this like the first time you're hearing the hate no i know about okay you know like i'm well aware like dude you guys i've been looking for an order for so fucking long and rats had one forever but it's kind of mode that's missing i've offered to trade now travis owns it and i've been like dude i'll trade you whodunit and three ice cold beers with the broken spitter motor that you cannot get anymore that steve young will rebuild oh yeah and he's like nope i'm not a big fan of this game as you know at this point i really genuinely respect you hunting down something knowing that it's not a popular game and like putting in that much work to find one because these things are rare and uh fragile yeah it's kind of nuts oh yeah this is a crazy one to hunt down we got another big review this is from a regular cm a lot i'm dying this hill he reviews a lot of games he's got the best username on pin side caucasian two-step he says caucasian two-step says orbiter one from what i understand is the game that broke stern's back this is a big chance to take on all sorts of new things in a pinball game the gamble did not pay off. The pros, you will never ever play another pinball game like Orbiter 1. The 3D vacuum form backdrop is a great effect. Spinning bumpers are great in adding a random factor to the ball's trajectory. Watching the ball orbit around my flippers and drain is the most fun I've ever had losing a pinball in a game. The cons, novelty wears off quickly. The takeaway, this game deserves a place in a collector's home who appreciates the unusual nature and place in pinball history that this game holds. I give the novelty rating high marks for being unique and play rating low marks due to the strangeness of play oh great now you tell me when the ball goes down you just hold the opposite flipper up or or the you hold the flipper up that the ball's coming down yeah and that flip and it comes right back up to your fucking flip and then you save it it's kind of like when you see someone so sick when you were a kid and you saw someone sleep a yo-yo for the first time and you're like what is this sorcery like what alan exactly dude i get jeff me and jeff understand each other dude you are go play that fucking game tomorrow yes dude oh and tell me it's not a shit once you realize like oh shit i can cat i can fucking do sorcery on the flippers like like it's gonna come back up like don't even look at that hole down there that drain hole is non-existent and it it will never go down there if you don't look at it it's probably true that was kind of my experience on the game it's very long playing it's so thick dude all right from the pin side says a true novelty game if there ever was one of the coolest looking games ever too bad it's one of the worst playing pinball games of all time Compel your lives to mine and then kill yourselves. It truly is a pain to play it, and there isn't much to do at all. It seems to be more about luck and less about skill. There's a reason why this game flopped. I will say that this game is better than Charlie's Angels, but only for novelty and looks. Charlie's Angels catching strays.
    22:40
    Dude, that's a sick review. I'm just saying I give that a thumbs up. But it's pretty sick. I love whenever random games catch strays in the comments of a different game. Like, clearly this guy's like, okay, Charlie's Angels is definitely the worst pinball machine of all time. Yeah, we all agree. Everybody knows Charlie's Angels' worst game of all time. And you're like, what? I've never, like. That might be the best review of all time. That's insane.
    23:09
    All right. Glenn Peter says, the only good thing I could possibly say for this game is that there are undoubtedly people out there that like it. I, however, am not one of those people. But even so, I'd still recommend you play a game or two just to see what all the fuss is about. If for nothing else, just the novelty. Beyond that, though, I'm afraid you're on your own. Hey, I've had it up to here with this place. It's so weird that everyone's talking about how it's a novelty game. And I get it. It is, obviously. there's there are no other fucking play fields there like that yeah but uh but i don't i feel like if you play one that plays good that has a fucking clean flippery bill super juicy fucking icy play field like spinner rips yeah drop targets everything works it is blast dude and like when the shooter works just nice so it plunges a little too hard for the skill shot so it doesn't hit it every time you gotta back off a little bit yeah like dude i dream i literally dream about that fucking game and then and then i put it in the wallet and everyone's like fuck this age you go through years hunting one down whenever i put it in there it lasts like three weeks max I love how you keep trying though you're like it's going back in dude I keep trying I throw it back in one of these days the kids will like it I'm like no but check it out and nobody listens to me I love that they're just like I'm gonna go play pot pot okay we got a big review from someone that it looks like actually has played the game this is from uh johnny o he says orbiter's worth about three minutes of novelty like everyone else when my friends and i first laid eyes on it we were wowed and had to play it right away that quickly turned into head-scratching confusion like maybe we just didn't get it but ball three it was clear that we did get it and this is just one of the worst pins ever to get the green light for production. This pin is so bad that when the three of us played something else, the punishment for coming in last was to play a game of Orbiter. The flippers are almost unnecessary as the ball's movement is so erratic they'll help very little. Lies! When you actually are allowed a shot, where you shoot doesn't matter. You just try to send it back up the playfield. In a nutshell, it has the depth of strategy of a pachinko machine. Lies and slander! The sounds are horrible. The ball in play sounds sorry it keeps going the sounds are horrible the ball and play sounds are similar to someone trying to tune in am stations in the middle of nowhere the synthesized speech is cute for a couple games but quickly grows annoying whoa whoa whoa whoa you're a very good player the worst is being in a room full of pins and having to hear this thing in the background all night i wouldn't be surprised if the pin requires very little maintenance though there's very few objects on the play field and none of them are going to be hit with any frequency likewise the game will sit unplayed the majority of the time so there's that too oh wait you're serious let me laugh even harder with novelty as its only saving grace this is a pin for collectors only not for players oh my god dude that was you gotta end on that that was like now that's an epic review that's a fucking hatchet job dude he went after everything that's so brutal dude i love i do like the punishment for getting last is having to go play orbiter i know i can mean i know like that's what we should do with other things jade that was i mean as much as that breaks my heart that was like yeah what about the the one thing i want to ask you about specifically what about the call outs because i can't remember the call outs i do remember they're horrible it's just hurly-nurly like okay shoot again shoot again that's what i remember again the shoot again is the one i remember in that might be why i hated it is at next level when i played it for the first time it was next to something i really wanted to play and kids kept starting games and walking away and it would just keep repeating shoot again And so I was like, okay, I'll go plunge this game out, and it's a five-ball game. And so there's a set to five-ball, and then it has that auto, like it saves the ball over and over and over, and it just kept saying shoot again. And I eventually just turned it off and back on because it was just driving me fucking nuts. But, like, it's so weird because the plunger is, like, 12 inches below the top of the cabinet.
    28:06
    And it goes up right to, and you can't see the ball. so it's like it's so confusing to people these are nasa engineers here man they don't really it makes no sense dude you're talking about the guys that designed the space toilet you go some respect i know what they're doing that plunger lane i fucking love it all right we got two more reviews jeff so ts4z says i believe this is the most original least fun pinball machine i've ever played. The 3D playfield is a neat gimmick, but it's nearly impossible to perceive its depth, so it impossible to predict a shot There are a few targets probably a reasonable number but the playfield looks so bleak it hard to realize that they are even there Worse they impossible to hit because the playfield is warped My favorite weirdness, the ball in the shooter lane light, because otherwise you just can't tell since the shooter is below playfield level. It does have that little light that flashes that says, ball in shooter.
    29:14
    that's the only way it's the only way you can tell but it's also like there should be a huge arrow that says shooter is like 16 inches down that's a good review art well it's not over it also says art is bland sound is mostly indecipherable but you can tell when one is nearby if it's in a quiet room it will be saying shoot pinball again over and over as players start a game hate it and then walk away surely this is an interesting game but it's definitely not a fun one would you kindly shut your noise hole oh um hang on well i mean i can't i mean people just they gotta open up to some new shit i i mean you guys know i mean come on i know i know alan i know alex you're fucking you're gonna get down with it next time you play it well we got one more review i get down with it i want to say one more review here it says the best thing about orbiter one is that there aren't many out there left in playable condition watching the ball spin around the playfield devoid of any control from the player no nudging no flipping just watching it's the definition of pinball purgatory you don't hear me not complaining taking one of the most common criticisms of a bad game floaty and basing an entire design off of it could only yield a result as bad as this the game right on the game came with a five ball option and a minimum playtime ball save obviously in hopes that a stockholm type syndrome would have been to form if the player was forced to stand in front of the machine long enough you got it genius this freak show shows just how far designers can fall when tasked with designing something different in order to try and save a failing company. If Orbiter One was supposed to be Stern's future, I thank God it didn't succeed. Dream on, Skintube! Wow. It's still more fun than Popeye. Oh! No way. Is it really, Sten and I? Yeah. But I wrote that one. But he wrote that review. Alex wrote that review. Goddammit, Alex. That's so sick. dude that's so great i gotta say though that's a plus if you're telling me you can actually make shots so i've played this game i think maybe twice in my life and i really really my biggest complaint was i just felt like i was fucking standing there and the game wouldn't end if you're telling me i can actually catch the ball and make shots it's now like i'm like that is new information to me i really want to go play it and i'm not even like i'm not saying that just for the podcast sake like i'm like fuck i want to go try this thing again because i feel dumb here's what we need to do we need to go down to la we need to play jeff at orbiter one and he'll just take hundred dollar bills off you until you concede hundreds quick i'll play fives i'll play five or one and see how many lessons it takes do you have one our location up there yeah we have one at next level the big pinball museum out in hillsborough dude go catch the fucking baltimore I'll go play it. I'm going to go next time on my next level. I'll play Orbiter 1. I'll shoot you a message on Instagram when I love it. No, get that over from Ali. Yeah, sounds good. I need to start harassing you as well.
    32:38
    Ali gets too much shit from me. Dude, I'm telling you, ball control is nuts, dude. It's an all-time machine. i gotta try it again man i i do think there's something like satisfying the first time you go up and play and you're watching the ball swoop around and it's like skating a bowl or something it's cool yeah you're like that flow that's it's so unique i mean that it is unique and one of those reviews was like i think it was caucasian two steps review was like the ball coming up and around and then back into the drain is the most fun i've had losing in pinball like it made the drain fun and that's because he didn't even know that like oh well you could save that ball because this is the shape of the play wheel right like i do think it plays it doesn't need to be a five ball game when the ball the ball will go out through that gate knock a drop target down and then you hold like whatever side is going down that flipper goes up and the other flipper goes down and make a little path for it is yeah you make a little path and as soon as it comes onto that flipper dude you hold that flipper up and it's like it's like a fucking magnet dude it just like it catches like i want to go play it so bad right now so fucking crazy you've been sourced old alex now dude he was so against this game i well i think the biggest thing is i really feel like my biggest gripe is feeling like you're not in control you're just kind of watching it and that's why like jeff just being like i mean that's what everybody feels that's what the problem is it's not right dave do i promise the other big gripe is that it does play long i'm like if you could set it to three ball i would probably like it more and like take away the minimum and you might be able to yeah it's gotta be it's always on three ball oh okay i'm pretty sure do they have it on five ball yeah oh that's fucked yeah and it has the minimum all time on the last ball or whatever and so it's like that was the thing like i just remember being like why won't this game end i don't know i know you you can't change that but there's uh there's a guy on pin side that aftermarket rom or something i think he has a on this fuck dude the modding community is strong for orbiter one dude alice if you can find that can you say it's me because i found it one night and then like i was on acid and then like i fucking can't find it the best way with your shopping for Orbiter 1 parts. I know, dude, and now it's gone. It vanished. I was like, did I make that up?
    35:20
    That's what I'm saying. Alex, you don't do enough acid and play enough Orbiter 1. That's the problem. That's true, man. Gotta open up your third eye, dude, I'm telling you that. This level has way too many little kids around. I would not be having a good time.
    35:34
    I'll come down to L.A. Yeah, dude. sick oh you guys jeff it was wonderful to have you on the show i this was an enlightening experience i loved having you on for any of the listeners out there orbiter one is the most if you couldn't tell by the reviews it's insane it's so different it's the most different game it's as different as a pinball machine can get while still being a pinball machine and some people will even argue like well it's not even pinball still but of course it is i mean it's just insane it's a total trip if you live in the portland area you can go out to next level and play it anywhere else if you see it you see it at a show typically one of these one up at any of the big shows or any of the big pinball museums across this country usually have one since it's such a unique rare game go up and play it and play it with the concept of like oh there is a game to this i would say i got better at this game when I took a low crouch position and stretched my arms out and looked at it from a lower angle because then you can see how the play field actually is warped and bold then you can understand where your shot's going because if you kind of stand straight up and play it all you're seeing is the vacuum formed like mountains and craters under the play field which are just a total mindfuck. And it feels totally crazy and uncontrollable. But go out, give Orbiter One another shot. Tell us what you think. You can message us on Instagram when this episode launches. I'm going to be asking for everyone's opinions on it. You can voice your own, or you can send us an email. Maybe we'll read a follow-up. Once we get enough of these Die on the Hill games, I want to hear some more. I want to hear what the worst Die on the Hill game we've ever reviewed was, what the best one is. but for everyone else that is listening go out and play an orbiter of one if you can they are rare so if you don't have one near you go out and play something else support your local operator wrong fucking get on a plane go to la well he doesn't have one right now no well i'm sure he'll bring one up for you habitus is in discharge okay so he does have one it's your okay it'll come back good good good all right so play orbiter one when you get a chance and make up your own mind. It's unlike any other pinball machine that's ever been made. And until next time, good luck. Don't suck.