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051: What if You're The Best Around

Punk Rock Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·39m 52s·analyzed·Jun 10, 2026
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

Punk Rock Pinball discusses elite player skills, local tournaments, and dream comedy themes.

Summary

Hosts Stephanie and Mike discuss pinball skills and the challenges of being an elite player, including whether extreme skill makes the game less fun. They also cover local tournament activity (a two-on-two team strikes tournament), Pokémon pinball code rumors (specifically a desired Pokédex feature), dream themes from listener Ryan Pinto (including Dr. Strangelove, The Shining, and Rocky Horror), and bemoan the lack of comedy-themed pinball machines, particularly The Office.

Key Claims

  • There is new Pokemon pinball code coming, allegedly

    medium confidence · Stephanie and Mike discuss rumored Pokemon code update; they mention wanting a Pokedex feature in Insider Connected

  • Someone at Stern had the Pokedex feature on their phone when the hosts visited Stern a couple months ago

    medium confidence · Stephanie states: 'But they had it. The Pokedex was there. So I have to believe that it was just waiting the Pokemon companies A-OK.'

  • Elite pinball players may gravitate toward classic/EM games because modern games can take too long if played at high skill level

    medium confidence · Hosts speculate that top players prefer classics because modern games lack safe shots and can extend gameplay indefinitely for skilled players

  • Kevin won the finals of the Pokemon Lodge tournament; host Stephanie won the qualifying round

    high confidence · Direct statement: 'Kevin won the finals of that tournament, the Pokemon Lodge. He won the tournament? Yeah.'

  • Comedy is the most underrepresented major genre in pinball machines

    low confidence · Stephanie's opinion: 'I still believe that the comedy genre is probably the most underrepresented major genre in pinball'

Notable Quotes

  • “How good is like too good at pinball? Yeah. So we'll talk about that too.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~0:05:00 — Sets up the episode's main topic about elite player skill and whether extreme ability diminishes enjoyment

  • “All I know Chris O'Brien wants and Shelly Sharp and Kat and basically everybody is the Pokedex. We want the Pokedex.”

    Stephanie @ ~0:26:00 — Identifies a specific community desire for Pokemon code update feature; names community members

  • “A bad game for them is like one of our better games. And I'm hesitant to push start because if I have a good game, it's going to take too long.”

    Mike @ ~0:39:00 — Core observation about the skill-to-enjoyment tradeoff for elite players versus casual/mid-level players

  • “If you're that good, is it still fun or is it a different type of fun? Let us know in the comments below if you are that good.”

    Stephanie @ ~0:42:00 — Poses the central question of the episode to the community, inviting feedback from elite players

  • “I would plunge, if I was an elite player, top 50 player, I would always plunge my first two balls. Just plunge the first two and then go ball three see what you can do.”

    Mike @ ~1:01:00 — Hypothetical strategy suggestion for how elite players could handicap themselves in casual play for engagement

  • “There's no comedy machines. Well, I mean, you could say that Family Guy is a comedy. Yeah. How old is that, though?”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~1:09:00 — Identifies the absence of modern comedy-themed pinball as a gap in the market

Entities

StephaniepersonMikepersonKevinperson[name withheld pending review]personZach McCarthypersonKeith ElwinpersonZach SharpepersonKaylaperson

Signals

  • ?

    code_update: Rumored new Pokemon pinball code update; community strongly desires Pokedex feature for Insider Connected app to track caught Pokemon

    medium · Hosts mention 'new code coming. Allegedly, there's new Pokemon pinball code' and cite seeing Pokedex on Stern employee phones during recent facility visit; describe widespread community desire for feature

  • ?

    community_signal: Community discussion about whether elite skill level diminishes gameplay enjoyment; tension between skill mastery and game engagement for top-tier players

    medium · Extended discussion about whether extreme pinball skill makes the game less fun; hosts speculate elite players may avoid casual tournament play or prefer classic/EM games

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Local venue experimented with two-on-two team strikes tournament format as alternative to standard bracket play

    high · Hosts ran team strikes tournament at their venue with 10 participants; described as engaging and generating different type of competitive pressure

  • ?

    game_design_philosophy: Discussion of how modern pinball's safe shot architecture (ramps that return ball to flipper) enables indefinite skilled play, contrasting with classic/EM era where shots are riskier

    medium · Hosts theorize elite players gravitate toward classics because modern games lack safe shots, allowing skilled players to extend gameplay indefinitely

  • $

    market_signal: Identified gap in pinball market: comedy genre is severely underrepresented; only recent comedy game is Big Lebowski by Jersey Jack Pinball

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.120

0:00
Hello. Hi there. Welcome to the Punk Rock Pinball Podcast Episode 51. I might sneeze. I'm Stephanie. And you might sneeze. And that's my dog heard that and he walked away because he doesn't like when I sneeze. He doesn't like when I sneeze. He doesn't like flies in the house. I think we have a fly in the house. It's like code red. So it's a bad evening for Marshall on this Tuesday evening, June 9th. Terrified of flies. We're doing it on Tuesday because we have a Wednesday show now. Yeah, we changed it. It's summer hours. Yeah. So what are we going to talk about today? Well, you know, I think we should talk about a couple happenings that have been happening around town. And some funtivities. Okay. And then we were just talking in the car on our way back from Show the Logo, Pop Up, Chicken Shop. Mom and Pop Shop. Mom and Pop Shop here in Bloomington, Illinois, about really how much fun is it to be a great player? Yeah, like, excuse me, how good is like too good at pinball? Yeah. So we'll talk about that too. Yeah, we'll get into that. Yeah, and a fun thing we did yesterday at the club, and we have some viewer mail here. Oh, we do? From our friend Ryan Pinto, who we talked about last episode was sending some messages along the way. He was really early on in the episodes, and he just goes by Pinto, sounds like. Peace, punk, and pinball he signed off.
1:50
But he's sandwiching, so he just watched the one where we talked about him. So he's going like from early episodes to recent episodes? Yeah. Oh, interesting. So there's still a chance we could lose him along the way somewhere because he hasn't heard them all. But he says he's enjoying it more and more. Thank you, Ryan. Thanks for the feedback, Ryan. And he had some dream themes. I'm not going to read them all. He listed a bunch. Okay.
2:13
If you'd like us to read your dream themes on the show, you can just comment below or send me an email, mike at livefromtherockroom.com. Or just go to the website and submit a note. Or go to the website and hit the contact us on punkrockpinball.com. And if you've got some cool dream themes, I'll read them on the show. Okay, so what's he got?
Rob
person
Lucasperson
Raymond Davidsonperson
[name withheld pending review]person
Chris O'Brienperson
Shelly Sharpperson
[name withheld pending review]person
Punk Rock Pinball Podcastorganization
Pokemon Pinballgame
Godzillagame
James Bond 007game
Jawsgame
Rollergamesgame
Deadpoolgame
Big Lebowskigame
Stern Pinballcompany
Fox Cities Pinballorganization

medium · Hosts note lack of comedy-themed pinball machines; discuss The Office, Office Space, You Should Leave as potential themes; only recent example is Big Lebowski

  • ?

    rumor_hype: Reference to previous episode's unspecified dream theme discussion that hosts believe would be 'favorite pinball machine of all time' and 'scariest pinball machine ever made'; theme being made by Barrels of Fun not Spooky

    low · Hosts mention 'dream theme we talked about last week' but explicitly state they won't discuss it; note Barrels of Fun is making it instead of Spooky; express disappointment community didn't engage more

  • ?

    collector_signal: Host made and lost $10 bet on Pokemon Pinball Limited Edition pricing; believed LE wouldn't drop below $13,500 within 6 months but lost when one listed below that price

    high · Host admits: 'I did bet somebody that within six months the LE would not be under 13,5 or whatever, but there's one for sale under that. So I did lose that bet'

  • ?

    venue_signal: Local pinball venue (Rock Room in Bloomington, Illinois) runs regular Monday night open play with ~10-11 participants and periodic team tournaments

    high · Hosts describe Monday open play sessions, team strikes tournament with mixed-skill participants, and upcoming Saturday tournament

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Carl D'Anghelo identified as designer of Winchester Mystery House; implied as potential designer of future dream themes

    medium · Hosts reference 'the guy who did Winchester' as someone who could design dream themes; eventually identify him as Carl D'Anghelo

  • ?

    product_concern: Host hesitates to play certain machines (Bond, Jaws) because well-played games require too much time, affecting casual play frequency

    medium · Host states: 'I was playing it less' and 'I'm hesitant to push start because if I have a good game, it's going to take too long'

    • 2:35
    Here's a really cool one. He's got a bunch on the list, but my favorite, I think, on this list is Dr. Strangelove. Great movie. Awesome movie. Would be like a super cool pinball machine. It really would be. So it's kind of hard to believe there is there aren't any that are on Stanley Kubrick films, are there? Well, he's probably he's such a he was such a psycho. Marshall agrees. Dog's barking. He was such a such a psycho. He probably when he was alive wouldn't have been very easy to work with. He probably wouldn't have been easy to work with. And I bet his estate is probably not very easy to work with. They may not may not be. But I love the idea. It's a great movie. Yeah, Dr. Strangelove would be really cool. I feel like when we watched all of the Kubrick movies, I feel like you ranked that one number one.
    3:31
    I can't remember. I do like that one. We watched and ranked every Stanley Kubrick movie. Not on our podcast, just for fun. Yeah, just we had a list between us. We did the Coen brothers. Yeah. We did a couple others, and then we kind of lost our way. Some directors it was too hard to get to. Paul Thomas Anderson really was, it was hard. Yeah, PTA, he kind of took us down. Like, we never finished it. Like, he did take us down. Yeah, he had some good ones, but man, some of his movies are tough to get through. I just want to see if I did that. But while Steph's looking that up, Pinto would also like to see an NHL game a la Fast Breaker World Cup, but for hockey. That'd be cool. He says Futurama. Okay. The Fifth Element, I've seen other people mention that movie. I think A Clockwork Orange could be really cool if we're talking Kubrick. Yeah, that one is like a little, and maybe Dr. Strangelove also is the same way. It just, it was made in a time that it couldn't be made today. Yeah. The Shining could be a cool horror-themed one. Spooky should grab The Shining and do that one. Yeah, work with Stephen King. Yeah, because you wouldn't necessarily need, I mean, if you had the film clips, that would be great, but that license for the film would probably be impossible. But it would be great. But you could do The Shining, the book. Mrs. Torrance. Stephen King's got to be okay to deal with for licensing, I would imagine. I feel like he licensed all kinds of stuff. He loves to do made-for-TV movies that end up being kind of shitty. Or It. Yeah. I'm surprised there's not an It pinball, actually, because It's had the big comeback with the new movies. Maximum Overdrive. And you got the Clown, which is like the toppers just right there for you, the clown head. Maximum Overdrive every time I'm driving by myself on the expressway at night and it's just me and truckers, I do have a little bit of fear. You're worried about that truck coming up behind you? Uh huh. Yeah. It's scary.
    5:45
    But yeah, thanks to Ryan Pinto for writing and thanks for your dream themes. I want to see what else. Rocky Horror also. Oh yeah, Rocky Horror would be a good one. Would be pretty dang cool. Yeah. Good list, Ryan. But we did a thing last night. Well, wait a second before we do that. He mentioned his dream themes. I can't believe nobody commented on the dream theme we talked about last week, Last week, which we don't even need to mention again because apparently other people didn't get as excited as we did towards the end of last week's episode. Yeah, I thought we had like a hit right there. I don't know if anybody commented about that specifically. Maybe it's because Spooky's silencing everyone. Could be. Because they're not doing it.
    6:31
    Are they not doing it? No. It's gonna be... Oh yeah, Barrels of Fun is doing it. Barrels of Fun. Yeah. That's right. You have to listen to the end of last week's episode about there's a dream theme revisited. It would be possibly potential to be like our favorite pinball machine of all time if they made it. And maybe the scariest pinball machine ever made. Could be the scariest pinball machine ever made. Okay, we're not going to talk about it. What did we do at the club yesterday? Okay, so on Monday nights, we just kind of have open play, open hours. I don't know. It's like an all skate. Everybody can come and hang out and play some pinball. And I don't know, we had about 10 people there, 11 people there last night. And Mike and Kevin have been doing this, like, they've been challenging each other head to head and doing a lot of like two player co-op on Mando and FALL of the EMPIRE. Yep. And so Mike had the idea, what if we did a strikes tournament, a short strikes tournament, but instead of individuals, we did it as teams, like two-player teams. Yeah, like two-on-two. So a four-player game, you and your partner, total score against me and my partner, total score. It's not a revolutionary thing. I don't think we made it up. No. Kevin's been wanting to do it. And then he was all grumpy about it when I pulled him over like, hey, we're going to do some two-on-two. He's like, yeah, okay. It's like, this is what you wanted to do. Well, he's just sometimes a little crabby. He's all grumpy about it. Well, anyway, so we decided to make it fair. We put everybody's name in the wheel of names online, spun the wheel to figure out the pairings. We had 10 people participate and Mike and Kevin, who've been beasting together on these co-op things, get paired together and I wanted to re-spin it and everyone was like, no, let them be together. Uh-huh. So, we did. We let you guys be together. And we, it was three strikes that lasted eight rounds. Mm-hmm. And Kayla and Rob took you out. They did. Well, they didn't eliminate us, but they gave us a couple of the strikes. Who took you out? We were taken out by Steve and Vincent. Oh, that's right. On Deadpool. That's right. And, you know, one person on our team had a terrible game. I won't say who. But yeah, me and Kevin struggled. We had two strikes right off the bat. We started on Funhaus, not my best game. Kayla and Rob just owned you. They destroyed us. And then we had Kayla and Rob again because we're using the wheel for the matchups. I think next time we'll put it in match play. Then we had them on Rocky and Bullwinkle and me and Kevin are pretty good at that game. Not yesterday. No. We got smoked on that. And then we had, so we had two strikes. It's only a three strike deal. Then you played me and Marcus. We went against the wall and then we played you and Lucas and we beat you. Lucas had never played roller games before. Yeah. He had some pretty good balls on there. I will also he did have some pretty for his like first time playing it he had a pretty good score The rest of us pretty pathetic I will say Like we better than that Lucas had a critical error because he doesn know roller games
    10:05
    If Lucas knew roller games, you guys probably would have won the match. Because there were two balls locked, you can steal the multi-balls on roller games. He had the magnet lit. If you don't know Roller Games, there's a shot you hit up into this little saucer and then it kicks it up over to the upper flipper and it will stay on the magnet, essentially giving you the locked ball shot.
    10:31
    You need to know that when it kicks around to the magnet, don't flip. The game says it. Yeah, it's loud also. And it says flip. But we had music playing and stuff. Because there were two balls locked. He had the lock lit. He hits the magnet shot. J.J. comes around to the upper flipper and he flipped and missed it. J.J. He forgot. J.J. If he was educated on the game, you guys probably would have won that match because it was very close. J.J. It was pretty close. J.J. But it's cool to see Kayla and Rob win and Kayla was just shredding on stuff. J.J. She was so fun to watch play. She was just like killing it. J.J. But I would say if you're just hanging around and you've got a group somewhere, like Got 10, 12, like an even number of people.
    11:19
    Do some two-on-two team competition. Yeah, it was very fun. I think everybody had a good time, too. I feel like it's like a different kind of pressure. I was just going to say that. Right. Because when you're just letting yourself down, okay, whatever. But then you've got this teammate that you're like, all right, I'm going to do my best for you. Yeah, you're trying to win for the team. And you feel bad if you do Crap Ball and like you let them down. Well, it's true. I would like, I thought these teams were pretty good. I almost feel like if we get the same group, we should just rerun it with those teams. I want another chance with me and Kev. No, that's not how it works. But Kayla and Rob will defend the crown. If you want to play with Kevin again, you're going to have to get him in the draw. You're going to have to win and then you have to defend your honor. Okay. Yeah, we did decide if we do it again, since Kayla and Rob were the champions, they get to remain a team next time and the rest of us go into the pool on the wheel. Yeah.
    12:25
    But it did work out pretty balanced in the matches. I don't think anybody got three strikes straight in a row. Like everybody won at least a match. Yeah. So that was pretty good. Yeah, it was very fun. So just kind of unofficial pinball play there. Yeah, I loved it. And I kind of enjoyed it more than a regular tournament. I mean, a smaller group, less intense, and it kind of, it didn't move super fast. I mean, there was still some waiting. I've got some waiting, but I just liked that there was, because there's no like, I don't know, specific rules you have to adhere to because it's not sanctioned by anybody, you know. It's just a for fun for bragging rights tournament. So you're just kind of winging it. Speaking of bragging rights, guess who won a gold pin last week? Yeah. Me. You did. I won the qualifying at the first Friday at the Pokemon launch.
    13:34
    Thank you. Good job. Thank you. I made it to the finals. Yeah, I did not. But I didn't make it to the, I made it to the semifinals, not the finals. Right, you made the finals cut. And then there were two matches because they're the top eight. And you got bounced. I don't even care because I got the pin. I'm the first one in this house to get a pin. Because we give the gold punk rock pinball pin to the winner of qualifying because for tournaments around here, that's who won like the punk rock pinball tournament for us. Mm hmm. It was me. Other scenes may do it in a different way.
    14:11
    Wow. Why am I losing my voice? Well, we have a tournament this Saturday, so maybe you can win one. Unlikely. Well, with that attitude. You never know. With that attitude, you're certainly not going to win. I was playing pretty poorly yesterday. Well, sometimes it happens. You're up, you're down. Kevin won the finals of that tournament, the Pokemon Lodge. He won the tournament? Yeah. Mm-hmm. You won the Punk Rock Pinball section. Kev won the main event. He got the plaque. Mm-hmm. I already have one, but I haven't gotten it yet. Right. Speaking of Pokemon, I heard that there's new code coming. Allegedly, there's new Pokemon pinball code. Do you think, have you heard any rumblings on what could be in it? All right, well, all I know I want, all I know Chris O'Brien wants and Shelly Sharp and Kat and basically everybody is the Pokedex. We want the Pokedex. You want to be able to pull up that Insider Connected and look at which guys you've caught. That's all I want. And achievements. I care less about achievements. Yeah, I don't even look at the achievements either. I want to see my guys. I mean, I like when it dings when I earn them on the game, but after that I don't care. Yeah, it's just a satisfying like bing. Yeah. That's not the sound it makes. No, not at all. But we want the Pokedex. That's what I want. And I really want to see... This probably won't be in that. You go ahead. No, go ahead. Because on the play field, if you look at it in the middle, there's a Mewtwo mode of some sort. Is that like the big cat? We have him on the, he's one of the best guys in Pokemon Go. Well, that's what I meant. He's like made in a lab. Is he a cat? Like, he's made in a lab? Yeah, he was made in a lab, Mewtwo was. He was like, yeah, and he's a tough guy. Or gal, I don't know the gender of the Mewtwo. I think they could be any gender. But yeah, the Mewtwo... Oh, he's on the back glass. Is that a cat? I don't know that that's a cat. It looks like a cat. It stands on the hind legs though. So? What is Mewtwo? What kind of species? It's a Mewtwo. Mew, Mew, Mew. It's a Mewtwo. Yeah, I think it's part cat. It could be part cat. But it's its own species. The species is Mewtwo. Yeah, it's on the back glass. Mm-hmm. And they're on the play field. Well. There's like an insert with the profile of Mewtwo. Maybe that's coming in the next code. Probably not. Let's get that Pokedex though. That Pokedex is definitely going to happen because we know when we were at Stern a couple months ago and we saw this machine, somebody at Stern had the Pokedex on their phone. Our dog is upstairs. Digging. Digging in the carpet. Somewhere he's digging. I think he's in that room. Okay. I think he heard a fly. So he's trying to dig under the carpet probably and cover himself. But go ahead. But they had it. The Pokedex was there. So I have to believe that it was just waiting the Pokemon companies A-OK. Yeah, like it's just all licensing stuff. I believe that probably most of the code to the game is done. If I was like a betting person, even though I did, I, somebody tagged me today. I did bet somebody that within six months the LE would not be under 13,5 or whatever, but there's one for sale under that. So I did lose that bet. So what do you owe them? $10. Did you pay it? They commented I don't have to pay them. I said I'll pay. So I'm going to need them to send me their PayPal info. I pay my debts. Yeah, you're like a Lannister. Yeah, we pay around here. Okay, there's a bet. I made the bet. I didn't think it would want me to go for 13k this soon. So you're losing money on your Ellie and you lose money out of the checking account. It's a double whammy. That's why you shouldn't gamble, kids. Yeah, don't gamble. Don't gamble. All right. So, skills. Pinball skills. Okay, we're moving on to that. I'm moving to that. Okay. Yeah, we thought it'd be fun to talk about, like, being an elite pinball player. Maybe if you're watching, maybe you haven't seen some of these folks. Because not everyone has seen, like, people that are in, like, the top 50 in the world. Because when you're that elite, it's like a different game. Well, like, where are you seeing these people, first of all? You can watch them on, like, the Fox Cities pinball stream. Mm-hmm. They just streamed the World Championships, the Pinball World Championships. But you could go onto their channel on Twitch or YouTube and pull up any of the major tournaments that they've streamed and then, like, fast-forward to the finals for the major, major tournaments. And you'll see folks like Raymond Davidson and Zach McCarthy. Those guys weren't in the world championships. I can't remember the names of the folks that won that, but like any of those like top 50 type players. Like if you that good is it still fun And how good is too good at pinball before it ceases to be as fun as it is for like a mid player like us Well, I don't know the answer to that question because I am not an elite player. Mm-hmm. But it's maybe a different kind of fun. And maybe you're really playing against yourself even more than ever. Yeah. I just think about it because we've gotten much better. We're still very mid, especially compared to the likes of those folks. Yeah. And we'll never be at that level. Not with that attitude. We've gotten good enough to where there are certain games in the collection that I have to think about before I hit start if I want to take that journey because it might take a while if I do good.
    20:52
    Does that mean it's time to get rid of those machines? One of them is the Bond game. Oh. And I still love to play it, but when we had it before we traded it out, even though it was broke for a little bit, like I was playing it less. Because to have a good game on Bond, like what would be for me a good game, it would. And I'm not saying I would have a good game every time. I'm very capable of going up to James Bond and shooting like 20 million, having it be quick, which is not satisfying. I mean, like a good game is satisfying, right? A good game for you. But if you're going to have a good game for you on Bond or if you're going to have a good game for you on Jaws, not that you do it every time, but it's going to be a long game.
    21:43
    Yeah. And then we have a house rule that at the end of the game, if you match, the numbers match your score at the end of the game, house rule here, you must play another game. You have to do it again. You don't have to try. No, but you have to play another one. You have to do it. And after you do a banger of a game on Jaws or Bond and it matches, it's just like, I feel like we always look at each other like, do I really have to? And the answer is always yes, you do.
    22:11
    Yeah, so I understand that. Like sometimes it is a journey. And if that is how you always play that game, because to your point, like, it's not every game that you just blow it up. Yeah. You're trying to, but you don't always get the shots that you need to. I don't know, is that fun? And you think if you're at the level of some of those guys, a bad game for them is like one of our better games. And I'm hesitant to push start because if I have a good game, it's going to take too long. And for these folks, like one of my best games would probably be a mid to not very good game for them, you know? Yeah, and it's not even that like, even though they have like sniper skills when it comes to making the shots, it still takes them a while to achieve those scores. Like when we watched Zach McCarthy at last year's, I think Silver Ball, and he was tearing it up on Godzilla. It took like an hour. Yeah. And they tapped him out. Yeah, they eventually tapped him out. I think they tapped him out eventually. And the round took an hour or an hour or 20. It was very long. And so like if you're that good, is it still fun or is it a different type of fun? Let us know in the comments below if you are that good, if you still think it's fun. I'm sure it's fun to win. It's always fun to win. And I would like to be better than I am currently, but I don't know if you're as good as those guys if it's still fun in the same way because it's not as challenging. Is that why? Maybe it's fun when you play other top players at World, but if you have to play against me, like when I played with Zach McCarthy on Labyrinth, and he was not really trying his hardest. He's the smartest, let's be real. And he had a really great score and I told him I didn't know that the numbers went that high on Labyrinth. Like that is probably like not fun. That's probably not fun for him. Just to stomp these like noob players. Yeah, some old lady. Uh huh. That's why we need the seniors division. Mm hmm. We need the seniors division. We do. That's why pinball needs to get bigger so you can have like different divisions. Where it's like fun for everyone, but there's just not enough participants to slice and dice it in that way for the most part. No, more people need to play. I also wonder, is that why a lot of these top, you know, super elite players, is that why a lot of them gravitate more towards the classics? Because even though they're great at some of the EMs in the early solid state games, it's just impossible for one of those games to last as long as a modern game where you have, you know, like firepower, there's not a safe shot on the game that will reliably return the ball to its specific point. Right. All the modern games you have a ramp that will give the ball back to a flipper. Mm-hmm. And so if you're super elite with your shots you can do that forever. Yeah. Uh, but take, you know, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Firepower, Gorgar, there aren't safe shots in those games where it's like just hit this all day and you're good to go. Mm-mm. So is that why many of the, it seems like many of the top players and then the better as people's skills increase that's why they gravitate towards those classics because it's harder and the game's not going to take you two hours if you blow it up. Could be. You know you just don't have to invest as much physically or mentally into the game to have like a good game.
    26:16
    That could be true. I don't know. What do you think? Yeah, what do you all think? If you're like a higher level player and because I think that would apply to even players that aren't elite, but just players that are super good. Like if you're a person that routinely can reach like a billion on the modern sterns, you might, you know, if you have the games, you might hesitate for hitting start if you're thinking, I need to shoot a billion. I'm not going to be satisfied. And I don't have time and I don't want to do all the shots it takes to get to a billion. So I'll just play firepower instead. Just give me close encounters. Uh huh. You know? Yeah, it's a quick game. You can play a few of them. Just see how many times you get your bonus multiplier maxed up. Mm hmm. So yeah, I guess that's kind of probably the appeal to the classics for the high level pinballers. It could be. I bet the high level players also like enjoy playing the other high level. I mean, it's like a strongman contest, basically. Yeah. But that, I mean, that would be fun. I think just for average or above average players, that just can't be fun for them. Maybe it is. Maybe some people. What, to just play people like us? Mm-hmm. It might be fun. Just to, like, watch dreams die? To just, like, smoke people.
    27:44
    I wouldn't like that. I wouldn't like doing that. No, I mean, they win enough, so it's not like they're hurting for being able to win. Yeah, I just don't think that would be fun. Yeah. Yeah, I guess it would mean that participating in your random local leagues and tournaments would, Probably be less enjoyable. Yeah, so how do you keep your skills honed? If you're that good, like, we have some good players like in our league.
    28:14
    A few that are routinely at the top. None of them I don't think are super close to being like top 50 level players.
    28:25
    So if you brought like a top 50, top 25 person down into our league, we'd probably just smoke everybody. Mm-hmm. And how is that fun? Yeah. And are you are they even trying? Are you even trying? Like you probably just sort of half ass and you probably make up some random objectives in your head of like, I'm going to just try to get to this specific mode. Yeah. And do this one thing in the game. And if I get there, I'll feel like like I succeeded. Maybe. Probably. I mean, that would be a way to do it. Right. Mm hmm. Like if you're playing Jaws, you'd maybe be like, I want to catch a thresher shark.
    29:05
    And so I'm going to play Jaws with the goal of catching a thresher shark. And then when I do that, I'll sort of quit trying and win the game anyway. Okay. That could be. I don't know. Next time we see an elite player, we'll have to ask him. Yeah, like what do you do if you're in just a league that's full of sort of regular human level players? Yeah, how do you adjust your strategy? Uh-huh. Yeah. Or are you just always trying your hardest because that's what you're going to have to do, you know, when it comes to the big tournament? Yeah. I would plunge, if I was an elite player, top 50 player, I would always plunge my first two balls. Just plunge the first two and then go ball three see what you can do That would be that what I would do That would be fun Right Uh huh Like your one ball versus everyone else three Mm hmm See if anybody can get you Yeah. Because you could get unlucky and have a bad dream. You could. One ball. I've seen all those guys have like a bad ball. It happens to everyone. You rarely see them have like a bad game. But you'll see a bad ball like a lot. Totally. Yeah, plunge your first two and see what you can do. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I guess, I mean, for that, that question can only be answered by an elite few, so maybe it's not the best topic because none of us will ever know if it's fun to be that good. I'm sure it is fun. It's like the top probably 1% or less than 1% are that good. Like, after, like, when you are, like, an elite player, then do you, like, go and try to find other hobbies? Like, yeah, I do pinball because, like, I'm awesome at it, but, you know, I also like to, I don't know, some other thing. I guess a lot of them end up working at Stern, or some of them, like Nick Wena. He's in the top 50, isn't he? Yeah, he's a really great player. Raymond Davidson is up there. Zach Sharp's a really good player. I don't think he's top 50. He's top in Illinois, I believe. So a lot of great players, players that are, or Keith Elwin was the best player in the world for a long time. Maybe still is, I don't know. I guess you're just becoming like a designer. And to be that good, your understanding of the rules and the depth of the code and the shots has to be super high level, so you might as well put that to work by designing them. Yeah.
    31:46
    And our guy that's going to design your dream theme, what's his name again? Why is it escaping me? I know his name. When you get older, your brain stops. The guy who did Winchester. Yeah, your brain stops working and I know his name. I want to say the wrong name. I know. I gotta look it up.
    32:09
    It's on the tip of my brain, not my tongue. Yeah, I mean, this feels stupid because I watch this person's streams all the time. Carl D'Angelo. Oh yeah, Carl D'Angelo. Not to be confused with D'Angelo Vickers. Not D'Angelo Vickers. Carl D'Angelo. But you could put D'Angelo Vickers, would he make the cut in an office pinball machine? He should. Just a little side quest mode, D'Angelo Vickers. If you want the modes that you get like through the drop targets or something, it's not a main mode. No, just like something. Just like, you do something and it's like D'Angelo Vickers and then, yeah. I would love that. Uh huh. Mm-hmm. If we're not on a ball save on the office one, it's I send it back. Mm-hmm. That's not the dream theme we talked about last week. No, it was not the office, but that is a dream theme, which I think we've covered in the dream themes when we used to talk about those. Yeah. The office was one. It's shocking that there's not an office pinball machine. I feel like Ricky Gervais would really appreciate it. He's a fun guy. And I still believe that the comedy genre is probably the most underrepresented major genre in pinball. There's no comedy machines. Well, I mean, you could say that Family Guy is a comedy. Yeah. How old is that, though? That game? I mean, not new. It's not new. There's nothing new. You're right. There's nothing new. The newest one is Big Lebowski, which is by a boutique pinball manufacturer. Jack Pinball Manufacturer is a great game. Jack Pinball. Great movie. Ranked very high on our Coen Brothers list. Jack Pinball. Love the game. Love the machine. Jone, shall we have it? That's probably the newest. Because you could argue like, well, Deadpool has some humor, but that's not a comedy. That's like a Marvel thing. Jack Pinball. Yeah, that's a comic. Jack Pinball. But there are no other main comedy movies or shows that have a pinball. And comedy would be fun.
    34:30
    Mm-hmm. And funny. Mm-hmm. You've got The Office just right there. Just right there. Office Space could do that one. It's a funny show. It is a funny show. Could do The Chair Company. Nobody's doing that. I think You Should Leave would be great. I mean, that's a dream thing. Also wouldn't get made, but like, I think The Office is like, would be a surefire like hit. Well, I think you should leave. We should leave. We really want to do a homebrew. I guess we're just not like, we just have not started it. We've done a lot of talking, not me and you, but like me and Chad and Chris O'Brien. We've talked a lot about this homebrew we want to do. Maybe we can take this lost world and turn it into it. Oh. You could. That one's almost a playfield might be too nice on that one. It is too nice. And it's not my machine. You need a crappier playfield that you wouldn't feel bad about just sanding. Yeah, true. And redoing. But something like that? Yeah. Find yourself a nice... You'd almost have to get one where the playfield's just almost trashed. Yeah, but we have ideas for an I-think-you-should-leave-pinball machine. Mm-hmm. But I kind of also want it to be like the Dr. Dude era where there's some ramps and like you could do some fun things. Dr. Dude could be a good one to re-theme into I Think You Should Leave. Yeah. It's got a cool layout. It's got some cool kind of gimmicks that might be easy to modify. Mm-hmm. You know? That's a Nordman. Is it? Yeah.
    36:15
    Jeff says it's probably too nice to do that too. No, we need something banged up. Yeah. All right. Find a Dr. Dude. Piece of crap, Dr. Dude. Anybody, if you got a lead on a Dr. – banged up Dr. Dude. Who's going to do the work on this thing? Well, we haven't figured that piece out.
    36:35
    That's the missing piece. We haven't figured that piece out before you get the machine and go to town on it. Well, yeah, we can't go to town because we just are talkers. I still think a Stern like the, what is the Sam, you could call it Spike 1, those 2000s Sterns would be cool because you have a DMD and allegedly they're pretty easy to do the coding on. Like a Ripley's? Like a Ripley's. We're not doing that to Ripley's. Not to, no. But that's what the, like the person that did like the Happy Gilmore that was like one of those Sterns. Can't remember which one. I mean, there's a lot to think about. We just need a little guidance. We don't know really where to start. I'm speaking on behalf of the three of us. I mean, you really just, somebody has to figure out the code. Chad and Rich think they can figure this out. And then you've got to find an artist. I feel like I could find an artist. And then that's... But it's got to be cool. Mostly all you need. And then you could take everything off of the playfield.
    37:43
    Yeah, I could do that. You know, you could get the playfield like stripped for the artist and then just have somebody put it all back together. Yeah, it's a putting it all back together piece that like... Well, we can hire Jeff to put it all back together. We might need Jeff on this deal. Once I could get all the art and everything done and then have Jeff reassemble it. But then he would probably have to unassemble it so he knows. Yeah, maybe. Yeah, we'll have to figure that out. Logistics. Yeah, logistics. I do like the, I would like to get a cool artist like that Cramps pinball was really cool. That was cool.
    38:17
    I know it's not like I think you should leave theme, but like it was cool. Mm-hmm. Hmm. I don't know.
    38:25
    Marshall doesn't care? No, he doesn't care at all. I think I don't have anything else to say on these topics. Anything else left?
    38:37
    If anybody's made it this far, comment the password, Shrek, and we'll send you something in the mail. Will you? I will. You sure about that? It might take me a little bit.
    38:54
    It might take six to 12 months. The first Shrek in the comments. Email it to Steph at LifeFromTheRockRoom.com and she can forward it to Shelly. It's S-T-E-P-H. Steph at LifeFromTheRockRoom.com, email the password Shrek. And then we'll commission Shelly.
    39:18
    Shelly's on call. She's on vacation, but... She'll be back. Yeah, they're about to be back. They'll be back from vacation quicker than you would ever ship something. Oh, without a doubt. I'm not even gonna, yeah, without a doubt. It took me like three months to give Retro Ralph his and it's only because we saw him in person. Mm-hmm. Comment Shrek below. No, don't comment it below. Email it. S-T-E-P-H at? Livefromtherockroom.com Toodaloo. Bye.