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The Pinball Show Ep 116: Fashionably Informative

The Pinball Show·podcast_episode·1h 47m·analyzed·Nov 9, 2022
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.036

TL;DR

Production delays, Alien ranking controversy, and Bond 60th Anniversary reveal timing dominate Stern Pinball industry discussion.

Summary

The Pinball Show discusses Halloween, holiday traditions, and Stern Pinball production updates. Craig Bobby delivers industry news covering the Alien pinball controversy on Pinside Top 100 rankings, Mandalorian code updates, and James Bond 60th Anniversary delays. Hosts speculate on production timelines for James Bond, TMNT final runs, and discuss Godzilla Premium pre-order backlogs and secondary market pricing pressures.

Key Claims

  • Alien LE owners have artificially inflated Alien's Pinside Top 100 ranking to 9.32, pulling it ahead of Godzilla (9.18), while standard Alien versions rate 8.24-8.43

    high confidence · Craig Bobby cites specific Pinside rating data showing 32 Alien LE owners giving inflated scores

  • Mandalorian topper at $2,000 is being restocked Monday November 7th at 10am central through official Stern store for All Access members only

    high confidence · Craig Bobby reports official Stern store pre-sale details with specific timing and membership requirement

  • James Bond second run of pros targeting late January 2023, second run premiums targeting February 2023

    high confidence · Zach Minney as dealer reporting tentative production timeline discussions with Stern, noting prior false April reporting

  • Godzilla Premium pre-orders at Flippin' Out equal the combined pre-orders of all other Stern games including Elvira

    high confidence · Zach Minney reports pre-order backlog data for his dealership, describing Godzilla Premium as longest list

  • TMNT receiving last call/final production run before vault, with pros and premiums shipping but not full allotment yet

    high confidence · Zach Minney reports Stern social media announcement and current shipping status

  • Bond 60th Anniversary reveal expected before end of 2022, but production timeline may slip to 2023

    medium confidence · Dennis Creasel speculates on production timing based on pattern analysis; no official Stern confirmation provided

  • Stern may be delaying Bond 60th Anniversary reveal until current LE production/sales complete to avoid cannibalizing current sales

    medium confidence · Zach Minney proposes theory based on dialogue in hobbyist community; explicitly labeled as speculation

  • Alien widebody machines play slower/floatier compared to standard body machines like Godzilla or Deadpool

    medium confidence · Craig Bobby reports personal impression from playing Alien at Chicago Pinball Expo, comparing to other recent releases

Notable Quotes

  • “So come on, all you overly zealous alien LE owners. It's okay. Ease your hands off the wheel and take a deep breath. Yes, you waited way too long, and frankly, you overpaid for your machines, but is it really the best pinball machine ever made? You're just crazy.”

    Craig Bobby @ ~18:30 — Direct criticism of Alien LE owner bias inflating Top 100 ratings; calls out market behavior and pricing issues

  • “Godzilla Premium, based on pre-orders, not what I have ordered, but based on people expecting games from Flippin' Out Pinball, is probably still right at the list of every other game, including Elvira, combined.”

    Zach Minney @ ~45:00 — Quantifies unprecedented pre-order demand disparity for Godzilla Premium relative to other Stern titles

  • “It wouldn't be the first time I am incorrect. But my understanding is this is why they have historically stuck to this philosophy, and not just them but pretty much all the pinball manufacturers, about not revealing the themes until essentially you're about ready to put that on the line next.”

    Zach Minney @ ~40:00 — Explains industry-wide reveal timing strategy to protect current sales; acknowledges Stern broke this rule with Bond announcement

  • “I think there was a – if there was a window of a plan, and I don't – I feel like I've spoken ad nauseum about how I don't understand what this marketing and reveal strategy is for Bond other than I think it looks really poor.”

    Dennis Creasel @ ~41:30 — Expresses skepticism about Stern's Bond 60th Anniversary marketing execution; suggests external factors or internal mismanagement

  • “Yes, it's a gorgeous game, no doubt, but I'd argue suffers the same way most widebodies tend to, in that it's extremely floaty compared to a standard body machine, which feels like you're almost playing pinball in slow motion after coming off an action-packed shooter like Medieval Madness, Deadpool, Jurassic Park, or even Godzilla.”

    Craig Bobby @ ~16:30 — Articulates design criticism of Alien widebody playfield feel; compares unfavorably to popular narrowbody competitors

  • “Well, they broke their own rule already. But maybe they did that, though, because they didn't want people really getting pissed off because they've experienced that in the past.”

Entities

Stern PinballcompanyCraig BobbypersonZach MinneypersonDennis CreaselpersonPinball BrotherscompanyAlien Ripley editiongameJames Bond 007 60th Anniversary EditiongameGodzillagameTeenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (TMNT)

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Mandalorian topper at $2,000 generating strong demand and restock activity; topper sales model proving viable despite high price point

    high · Craig Bobby reports Mandalorian topper widely heralded as one of industry's greatest offerings; official Stern store scheduling dedicated restock event

  • ?

    community_signal: Post-Chicago Expo period marked by controversy over Halloween SDTM review and Pinside shenanigans alongside Alien Top 100 manipulation concerns

    medium · Zach Minney references biggest beef being halo haters of SDTM review and Pinside shenanigans; Craig Bobby documents Alien rating manipulation details

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Alien LE owner bias inflating Pinside Top 100 rankings; 32 owners giving 9.32 rating placing it ahead of Godzilla (9.18) despite standard versions rating 8.24-8.43

    high · Craig Bobby provides specific Pinside rating data and calls out overly zealous alien LE owners for manipulating rankings despite overpaying for machines

  • ?

    manufacturing_signal: TMNT final production run ('last call') shipping pros and premiums; full allotment not yet received; game entering vault status

    high · Zach Minney reports Stern social media announcement of last call and current shipping status with incomplete allotment

  • $

    market_signal: Godzilla Premium pre-orders equal combined orders of all other Stern titles, indicating sustained demand surge and potential scarcity-driven secondary market inflation

    high · Zach Minney reports Godzilla Premium backlog equals every other game combined including Elvira; still receiving daily pre-orders at rate matching other Stern products

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.322

0:00
Warning, the following episode contains adult language and screaming goats. Listener discretion is advised.
0:12
The Pinball Network is online. Launching the Pinball Show. This week on the Pinball Show we celebrate Halloween. Candy shortages. Updates to Stern Pinball production scheduling. viewing the landscape of future Stern releases and rumored games, finding rumors in the darkest, most dank back alleys, Alien topping the charts, but I thought numbers don't lie, Multimorphics 2023 plans, SDTM getting the old Goldilocks treatment for their Halloween review, the upcoming Happy Gilmore game, Dream Theme, Pinball Awards season, Pinball Market Trends, and counting my eggs before the bounty. And that's just the tip as we jam-pack the darkest holes in episode 116.
1:04
Pinball is a game of skill. For some, it's a passion and a lifestyle. I don't want a lot for Christmas.
1:17
There is just one thing I need. I don't care about the presents underneath the Christmas tree. I just want you for my own more than you could ever know.
1:37
Make my wish come true. All I want for Christmas. It's time for the pinball show. It's Pinball with Personality.
2:03
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, it's Christmas time! Already? Oh my gosh, it's Zach Minney with Dennis Creasel here. We're the hosts of the Pinball Show. Dennis, it's Christmas time, and all I want for Christmas, my little din-din, is you!

  • Stern has experienced parts delays affecting Iron Maiden toppers (announced August, still not available) and James Bond production schedules

    high confidence · Zach Minney directly references ongoing parts delays as factor in production scheduling changes

  • Star Wars and Jurassic Park home editions expected to ship throughout November and into December

    medium confidence · Zach Minney projects based on typical home edition Christmas sales pattern but no official confirmation

    • Dennis Creasel @ ~42:00 — References past negative customer reaction to simultaneous product announcements; explains Bond announcement rationale

  • “I still have Godzilla Premium, we're still, Dennis, getting just as many orders of Godzilla Premium as we are any other Stern Pinball product at this time.”

    Zach Minney @ ~46:30 — Emphasizes sustained demand surge for Godzilla Premium across multiple weeks despite no new production announcement

    • game
    Mandaloriangame
    Flippin' Out Pinballcompany
    Pinside Top 100organization
    Keith Elwinperson
    Pedretti Gamingcompany
    Chicago Pinball Expoevent
    Elviragame
    Dunegame
    Sigourney Weaverperson
    Iron Maidengame
    The Pinball Showorganization
  • $

    market_signal: Stern's Bond 60th Anniversary reveal strategy criticized as out-of-step with industry norms; possible strategy of delaying reveal until current LE sales complete to avoid cannibalization

    medium · Zach Minney proposes theory of waiting for LE production/sales completion; dialogue in hobbyist community suggests this reasoning; Stern departed from historical non-announcement philosophy

  • $

    market_signal: Secondary market price increases on Godzilla Premium creating customer backlash; pre-order list holders experiencing delayed gratification as production cannot meet demand

    high · Zach Minney reports receiving emails daily about price increases from waiting customers; describes large recent Godzilla Premium run as insufficient for backlog

  • ?

    product_strategy: James Bond 60th Anniversary remains unrevealed past anniversary date; production timeline may slip from late 2022 to 2023; marketing strategy criticized as poor execution

    high · Craig Bobby notes eerie silence since Chicago Expo; Dennis Creasel expresses confusion about reveal strategy; Zach Minney acknowledges possible 2023 slip without surprise

  • ?

    product_concern: Alien widebody playfield criticized as too floaty/slow compared to narrowbody competitors; playfield design fundamentally different gameplay feel despite nice theme integration

    medium · Craig Bobby describes Alien as extremely floaty compared to Medieval Madness, Deadpool, Jurassic Park, Godzilla; feels like playing in slow motion

  • ?

    product_strategy: James Bond second run pros targeting late January 2023, second run premiums targeting February 2023 based on dealer discussions with Stern

    medium · Zach Minney reports tentative production timeline discussions; explicitly labels as subject to change; corrects prior false April reporting

  • ?

    technology_signal: Parts delays impacting multiple products; Iron Maiden toppers announced August still unavailable; James Bond production schedule changes attributed to supply chain constraints

    high · Zach Minney directly references parts delays as cause of James Bond production schedule changes and reasons for uncertainty on accessory timelines

    • 2:19
    You know I get this way this time of year. Once Halloween is over. You're one of those Christmas people. Oh, Nicole's already got the tree up. We've got decorations throughout the entire house. Oh, my gosh. We've already been sitting down by the fireplace, playing board games, sitting by the Christmas tree. It's like 80 degrees out. Well, it is a little warm, but we... Are you going to do like a big bonfire for Christmas? Are you going to burn down your pin barn? No. I can't do that. Why not? Well, it does probably violate several EPA standards. Oh, yeah, and county standards for that matter.
    2:56
    UAS, I'm sure you know all about those now. Geez, don't want that one neighbor. Oh, they're having a good time again. I shall report this.
    3:06
    Yes, and call the marshal, the fire marshal. All the marshals. Tommy Lee Jones shows up. I want you to search every pin barn, pin house. And speaking of spreading Christmas cheer, Dennis, I get to tonight, after we get done with the podcasting here, get to take the family out to a little event north of here. Applebee's? No.
    3:31
    Sorry, which is the most Indiana thing I've thought of. Eating good in the Christmas head. No, it's I'm going to be riding alongside the Polar Express. What? We got our tickets. There's a local thing up here with the train. and you get the family and you're dressing your jammies and you get hot chocolate and you ride an old-fashioned train through the town of Christmasland. Okay, I think my niece has done that before. It's so nice. I love this time of year. Is it a little too early, though?
    4:00
    Well, you know, I'm afraid I do fall into that camp, the camp of why are we doing this right after Halloween? But, I mean, it's a battle that I and my like ilk have lost. I mean, there was Christmas stuff up at the grocery store before the Halloween candy section was taken down. Oh, wow. They just shrunk the candy section more and more. Are you more of a Halloweener?
    4:27
    I mean, I don't decorate for Halloween, so I wouldn't say that I'm more of a Halloween person. I don't really do a lot for any of the holidays. I might put up the tree. I did not last year. I didn't want to. No tree? Well, the problem is that when I'm putting it up, I just think, oh, yeah, I have to take it down. That's true. And I sort of – I think I got out some of the other – like the little stockings and stuff, but I don't think I did the tree. I think I did some other stuff. Did you? I don't usually host Christmas. Actually, I never host Christmas at my house anyway. It's always someone else in the family that will host it. Do you ever put exterior lights up? That's one thing I haven't done. No. I do not. My parents do. My dad designed, after he retired, he's got little hooks outside, and he's got the lights prearranged on wood boards. So he just goes out and hangs them on the hooks, and it only takes a few minutes. That's really smart. They're all wired together, so then he links it all up. And then that way, if he has to fix them, he doesn't have to fix them outside, and it doesn't take very long to put up or put down. Freaking electrical engineers, man. It's his way. Their brain is on a different planet.
    5:36
    That's why they're all in pinball. That's right. Or everyone in pinball thinks they are one. I don't know. Do you observe the Thanksgiving? Yes. Okay. I do like the Thanksgiving.
    5:48
    Yeah, I don't decorate for it, but I mean, I'll help make stuff. Or during COVID, I went and got the stuff and made Thanksgiving stuff. My favorite food in general is not pizza. It's not ice cream. It is actually like the Thanksgiving meal. the meat the potatoes yes the gravy the the freaking dressing like i can't get it's my favorite meal of the year see okay that's why i do that's why i'll do it even if i'm like trapped with covid i will get turkey i will get stuffing i'll get mashed potatoes and make my own yes with the little with the giblets that's right i use my little baby you've probably seen in the photos i have my little baby hand that's the part i use to stuff it i use my little baby hand i don't know what that is, but I'll lick it anyway. You know, a lot of people are kind of intimidated about making a turkey, but really it's very simple. You just have to know the anatomy of a turkey, and it's got over here just the tiniest little stink hole, but it's big enough to get your hand right up inside it.
    6:53
    Stuff the shit out of it. I cook it with all the giblets, the penises and the gynies, and now a lot of people like to baste their turkeys, but I use this.
    7:04
    I lick like that and get into the little hiney-hiney hole. That's nice and good. I don't know what the hell that is, but I lick it anyway. Up and down. Then I like to dip that right on there. Do you think anybody knows the reference to that film? No, but I'm sure there's at least one person who will come into our thread on Pennside and talk about how we referenced obscure movies and how that was inappropriate. Yeah, that will come. You know, the biggest beef that I had with this year's Halloween, it wasn't all the halo haters of the SDTM review. It wasn't even the pin side shenanigans that occurred. It's the choice and options that I found in my children's trigger treat baskets and bags and pillowcases this year.
    7:50
    What happened to the variety and diversity of the Halloween candies? Oh, it wasn't very different. Well, I know I probably didn't help that. I can. Here's what I'm guessing that you bought if you did pre-purchase. Well, I don't know. You're kind of Scrooge or Grinch. So you probably did black licorice. But no, I guarantee you had Snickers, Milky Way and Skittles and maybe a Twix. But that's probably the general branding of the candy you purchased. Well, you got I did have Snickers. Of course, I did Snickers and Heath bars. See, that's a little diversity. I didn't see any of that. Because I did full-size bars.
    8:35
    You're such a Halloween pimp. Historically, I have a housemate. He saw that I had bought, because I put them in a bowl the day before. Because I didn't buy candy until maybe three days before Halloween. And then he threw in the little Milky Ways and stuff. because he said it looked like you couldn't find Halloween candy at the store.
    8:59
    Because he's like, why do you have full-size bars? I didn't even know they make full-size Heath Bars. I found the full-size bars, but I did actually specifically look for them. So if you mix them together, it was everything you said, except there were no Skittles in the mix. Yeah, no sugar-sweet kind of non-chocolatey thing? No.
    9:17
    Historically, I do buy variety bags, and I like to get the ones that have Nerds and stuff in them. Yes. no nerds, no Starbursts this year. But you see, the thing is, I like to eat those. So then if I buy them, then I put them in the bowl, and then I start picking out all the Twizzlers and the Nerds and the Sweet Tarts, and I start eating all those because I actually prefer pure sugar candies to chocolate. Yeah, I see no bottle caps, no pixie sticks, no nothing. And I'm thinking there's some monopolization going on. Well, I'm saying. Hershey Company might be mobilizing to crush the opposition, and the hard candy and other confectionery opposition. It's business. I get it. It is. This year, Halloween was big for me. I had to dress in not one, not two, but I had three costumes this year. That's a bit overboard, right? Yes. That's more than the zero I do, yes. I went with the Brat Balthazar from Despicable Me 3. Okay, I don't know that movie. That's a great one. And don't send it to me for Christmas. No, I certainly will. Then I went for as Roger Rabbit. Okay, I know Roger. Yeah. I saw the photo of that one. Yeah. That's the only one I knew you had done. Jessica Rabbit. I think we pulled that off quite nicely. And I don't half-ass these. I mean, I piecemeal them and put them together like a true artist. And then for the SDTM review of Halloween, I went as Dr. Loomis. Oh, that's right. I did see that, too, because I watched your video. I forgot about that, though. I didn't count that as a costume because I just thought of that as a video outfit. Well, yeah. I just, you know, not that I like dressing up. Why'd you put on the bald cap? Well, he has like the horseshoe hair thing. Yeah, but so do you.
    11:06
    Snoop Dogg! God, dude. Second row. too soon oh too good i was gonna surprise greg by shaving the majority of my head and videotaping his reaction to seeing me really fucking fully commit but then i was like yeah i thought about well i am thinning and it might not grow back so i know you're like no i can't do it i can't do that wow that was way too good of a joke for us to... I'm sorry. It was kind of mean, so I will also partially apologize for it. No, you shouldn't. That was a good joke. No, I'm not here to hurt you. I'm not here to hurt Joel. I'm not here to hurt anyone. I wonder what Craig Bobby dressed as this year for Halloween. Do they celebrate Halloween up in Canada? Because I know they don't in Australia. Surely they do, and they might hold it on a different day, like their Thanksgiving's on a different day. I bet he dressed up as a giant tongue. and he twerked and it made the sound yes yes he twerked he could have just went as the mahogany desk too yeah that's true Hello and welcome to the Pinball Show's Top Stories. I'm Craig Bobby. Well, as the dust has now finally settled on the social and event-heavy Chicago Pinball Expo and sobriety con crud and that horrible sense of post-show reality has settled into attendees' lives, let's take a quick look at what's new in the world of pinball in the past couple of weeks.
    13:00
    Yes, listeners, an eerie, deafening silence has taken hold of the pinball landscape as the chaotic James Bond release by Stern has virtually killed off any real excitement for that title, which continues to bleed into the remaining anticipation for the reveal of the Elwynn 60th Edition single playfield version of the James Bond machine. I think almost out of sheer self-defense, Stern has gone radio silent once again, as whatever reveal date that may have been optimistically tabled a while back has come and gone, with no new date even being mentioned these days. Never before in recent Stern history has there been an almost hesitant excitement in a new pinball title, as most of the hobby seems almost afraid to look, knowing the title is being helmed by Keith Elwin, who is arguably the most popular designer in the hobby today, but sadly, due to its highly acclaimed status and limited production, the machine will be financially out of reach for 99% of potential owners who might otherwise want to purchase the game. But until it's revealed and until we officially know, you guessed it, we shall have to wait and see. But have no fear, listeners, for there's a few little tidbits of news that are percolating around the hobby as industry leader Stern Pimball released new Mandalorian code V1.40 for all models as Dwight Sullivan's newly released Mandalorian Topper Masterpiece gets additional code support including new modes like Beskar Bonanza, Mandalorian Madness, new ambush rules, and supported display of players' insider-connected stats and game progress. The expensive $2,000 Disney-licensed topper continues to be a hit with owners and collectors of the Mandalorian machine, as it's now widely being heralded as one of the industry's greatest topper offerings in a close tie with Stern's own Black Knight sort of rage topper that is more mechanical but ultimately less interactive and informative versus the Mandalorian. Having a hard time finding a Mando topper anywhere? Well, keep an eye on the official Stern store As the countdown clock has commenced For a chance to purchase one at 10am central on Monday, November 7th However, be advised, only registered All Access members Will have the ability to make a purchase while supplies last Speaking of topper news, courtesy of the Nap Arcade website We have news that Italian manufacturer Pedretti Gaming is teasing a new topper for its Funhaus 2.0 Rudy's Nightmare kits. While nothing other than a few shrink-wrap boxes on shipping pallets have been shown, it will be interesting to see what price point Bedretti puts on these toppers after Stern shocked and amazed the pinball world with its recent $2,000 aforementioned Mandalorian topper that was revealed at the start of the 2022 Pinball Expo in Chicago. In other news, the Pinball Brothers' well-reviewed and received Alien Pinball Machine has taken over the Pinside Top 100 as alien owners literally hijacked the Pinside Top 100 review process with ridiculously high and biased reviews of the game to thrust Alien Pinball, I believe unfairly, ahead of the long-reigning Elwynn Design's Stern Pinball's Godzilla as the best machine of all time. Say what? Now I had a chance to play Alien at this year's Chicago Pinball Expo for the first time, and I will say it's a nice machine. Good theme integration if you don't mind seeing an Alien-themed machine without any images of the iconic Sigourney Weaver, who plays the main character and heroine Ripley, in the Aliens film franchise. Yes, it's a gorgeous game, no doubt, but I'd argue suffers the same way most widebodies tend to, in that it's extremely floaty compared to a standard body machine, which feels like you're almost playing pinball in slow motion after coming off an action-packed shooter like Medieval Madness, Deadpool, Jurassic Park, or even Godzilla. Is Alien even in the top 10? Well, if you look closely at the pin-side ratings for the game, 32 owners of Alien LE versions mistakenly think so and have given it a ranking of 9.32, pulling it ahead of Godzilla, which sits at 9.18. But if you look closely beyond the limited edition, the standard and the 2017 version of the Alien game get a measly 8.24 to 8.43 ranking, which would put the game more realistically in the low 30s in the top 100. So come on, all you overly zealous alien LE owners. It's okay. Ease your hands off the wheel and take a deep breath. Yes, you waited way too long, and frankly, you overpaid for your machines, but is it really the best pinball machine ever made?
    17:50
    You're just crazy. You know what I'm saying? Well, that's all for this week for the Pinball Show. I'm Craig Bobby. Catch you on the flip side. well thanks craig for all that industry news yeah that was that was good stuff there when we have some industry news of our own as we jump in to the king of pinball that is stern pinball what do we want to we want to talk about some production updates people seem to like those yes people love the production updates so i don't know what's going on with turtles i've been hearing a lot about the tweedles oh yeah good call uh so we do know that teenage mutant ninja turtles was receiving its last call. So last production run of TMNT over at Stern Pinball. They had some social media video content showcasing that as well. But they've been shipping out from the mothership this past week. We've received pros and premiums, but not our full allotment yet. So I'm anticipating that we're going to probably see more of those shipping this coming week as well. So that's Turtles. And then last call for that poor thing. Yep. It's finally going to go into the vault. Will you ever own a Turtles? uh i probably not i wouldn't mind having more time on it and we do have one on location so i have faced it in tournament a few times uh very very challenging game that wouldn't preclude me from buying it of course i have other challenging games it's just it's not a theme that i felt really strongly on and okay i just i don't know it's like it's one of those games i'm like it's like for me it's like it's kind of like rush not quite entirely sure what i'm doing on it it's it's not bad to shoot uh but i i'm not in love with it the the layout feels like rush i think rush feels like an easier i think rush feels like an easier layout than tmnt though i i have better ball times on rush than i do tmnt oh that van shot friday shout out buddy i've been trying to play a lot of rush this week as we got one in on trade so i'm trying to play a lot of rush for an upcoming review but yeah so we're likely to see some more team and t's trickle out and i would not be surprised denison listener if some james bond 007 pros didn't make their way onto the production line or a production line this week in preparation for those export markets well i mean november was the was the month yep so i think we're getting close we're going to see probably that we haven't received a a stern stern update but uh i'm thinking that's about where we're going to fall Thus, domestic pros would be that following week. So if we see some export pros this week on the line, this is just me hypothesizing here. Right, you're guessing. Yeah, just some theory craft. Then, yeah, maybe on the line next week for domestic. And then end of next week into the following, maybe we'll see some trickle out into the arcades around the country. So based off of that, just natural extension of the logic, what do you think is going to happen with the LEs and the premiums? So, good call. I think the LE production would then, if that is correct, if then, what am I doing here? Is that trig? That's not trig. Calculus. If then. Is that what calculus is? Well, you're doing a conditional statement now. I haven't done calc in since high school. If then. If then, the LE production would land around early December, I think. Okay. Early December. So, they might be able to get it under the tree. Possibly LEs. premiums is going to be a trickier one. I'm thinking late December for premiums. But keep in mind, we're seeing accessories getting announced like, oh, Iron Maiden toppers coming out in August. We still haven't seen that. We're having parts delays. We are hearing that. That's why we've seen some of the delays with announcement production of James Bond and all of the changes in the production schedules in general at Stern Pinball. I would not be surprised to see those premiums fall into 2023. That first run, honestly, seems hard to believe, but I could see. No, no, I could. Based off of everything given the, yeah, I don't think it's too, I don't think it's unreasonable. And then everybody's like, oh, what about the home editions? I thought they were making some of those this year. Yeah, normally don't they make them in time for Christmas, the home editions? It seems like they usually do like a fall run. That is their best-selling time. That is every product, I think, but especially so those. So you're going to see some sprinklings of Star Wars Home Editions and Jurassic Park Home Editions probably throughout this month and maybe into next month as well. So that's pretty good. And for all of those, I get it. Where's the Bond 60th Anniversary Edition by Keith Elwin? When's that reveal coming? Where's it at? The answer, Dennis, no clue.
    22:37
    Well, I mean, I'm not surprised you don't have any production info because the reveal hasn't happened. I don't even know when the reveal is happening. So imminent, though. So imminent. But Stern Pinball has not told us of any changes. They originally said late 2022 production on that 60th anniversary, that unseen game. Then again, you're not going to hear me emit the trademarked creasal gasp if production did fall into 2023 for that 60th anniversary. Yeah, I'm not going to gasp either. I was going to say I was waiting for the gasp. No, because I don't think it's surprising. I think there was a – if there was a window of a plan, and I don't – I feel like I've spoken ad nauseum about how I don't understand what this marketing and reveal strategy is for Bond other than I think it looks really poor.
    23:27
    But just like compared to what Stern normally does, this feels like miss after miss after miss. It has to be due to some external factors. I can't imagine they just all of a sudden got this bad at it internally. But all that said, we're past the 60th anniversary date when all the other people that had their, let's politely say, crap together did their big limited reveals and stuff. So we're so far past that now that it's like, I'm still thinking they will get the reveal out before the end of the year. I have no assumptions about the actual production of the game. Some dialogue throughout the hobbyist community suggests that what they may be doing is waiting until all of those LEs are produced, they got money for them, they're shipping, then reveal another product that those LE buyers may additionally want. Instead of announcing now and making some buyers say, wait a minute, I don't know about my LE. Maybe I want this one or vice versa. But the mere fact that they've already acknowledged the existence of the 60th anniversary raises that question. That's been my understanding, perhaps wrong. It wouldn't be the first time I am incorrect. But my understanding is this is why they have historically stuck to this philosophy, and not just them but pretty much all the pinball manufacturers, about not revealing the themes until essentially you're about ready to put that on the line next. That's going to undermine what's currently on the line. Well, they broke their own rule already. But maybe they did that, though, because they didn't want people really getting pissed off because they've experienced that in the past. Their soft launch was like, hey, just to let you all know that you're deciding to buy these because there is going to be an L-160. I do believe that it was the right decision to announce the 60th as coming out when they announced everything else. I do think that was right. But I also do not agree with this philosophy that the line is greatly impacted by not confirming Venom is coming or whatnot and that they would actually be able to pull a page from video games and generate a lot more longer-term sustained hype if they were a little more open about what they're planning to make.
    25:46
    I still disagree, but I don't have a good argument as to right now. Well, the argument I would use if I were you is, well, it's a big jump between a $60 video game and a $6,000 pinball machine. Yeah, it's low-hanging fruit. I have to have something more substantial. No, but that might be the logic. Could be. But I don't know. We're not in the operator market anymore where they play these games because operators are trying to think about who's going to drop the quarters, and they don't buy every release. And now we've got a bunch of people that buy every release. We got people that buy games, keep them for two weeks, and then sell them, and then bring them back into their house, and all sorts of other stuff that makes no sense to me. So it's just a different world. He is new to TPN. I don't know why you're throwing rocks over at Jason at Pinball Party. What are you talking about? Figure it out. Yeah, figure it out. You know, speaking of that, if we have the creasal gasp, what is the opposite of a creasal gasp? Because you're not sucking and you're blowing out. Is it like an exasperated sigh? What is... I don Maybe there is no opposite I think that is it The Zach sigh No the Creasle sigh because I heard that from you as well All right let see if I can mess this next part up I kind of messed up whenever we launched saying, oh, they're only going to operators. Not so fast. What I can say is that there have been some discussions, some tentative, always possibly changing, I will preface, timelines for the additional Bond 007 production runs. That is the second run of pros and the second run of premiums. Prior to this public statement here by yours truly, we simply as dealers didn't really know when the second. We don't know anything into 2023 timeline wise. So it was very tough and we know that they were going to fall into that. So I think you may be seeing the second run of bond pros coming late January. So we've got initial pro run November. and instead of the previously falsely reported April by me, they have changed things around. Right now they would like it to be late January and the second run of premiums to be in February.
    27:56
    Okay. Well, I have a question for you, though. It's not directly related to that decision, though obviously the timeline shifts potential or otherwise may impact, of course, the other games. What's going on with the Godzillas? Are there any more Godzillas being made this year? This year, I would say no.
    28:15
    I do not see – That's a lot of price increases on people that are waiting. I know. Believe me, I get the emails every day. Have you gotten some emails? Just a couple. Just a couple emails. Over the last two weeks, they had a huge run of Godzilla premiums. So much so that many of the smaller dealers that I still stick my nose up to as to why they're even receiving any games. You are very snooty about that. If they don't have people pre-ordered for them, but I don't know. Let's reward the people that don't sell as much. But they sent out a shitload of them. We got a shitload of them. That being said, it wasn't the mother load that I needed, but we got quite a lot of handfuls of them. But we still have a growing list.
    29:01
    Let me ask you something. Yes. And, of course, don't answer it if you're not comfortable answering it. is Godzilla Premium still your longest list, including Bond? I would say Godzilla Premium, based on pre-orders, not what I have ordered, but based on people expecting games from Flippin' Out Pinball, is probably still right at the list of every other game, including Elvira, combined. Oh, wow. Yeah.
    29:31
    It's still a lot. The second would be Elvira. We have a ton of Elvira. And that's the thing where when you were mentioning the stuff about the premiums and the LEs and like when they reveal of the 60th anniversary bond will come out and then, of course, when it will be produced. And your note that they haven't changed what they've said before. I'm like, yes. But I also remember like they didn't even change the pricing on Elvira premium for like three years because they weren't making any and they didn't update it. They still have told, like I've asked them, and they said no, there's still not a dedicated price to the next Elvira run. So I don't know. So, yeah, without a doubt, we still, and this is just me as a dealer, our company still receives more. And we make it very clear that we have no clue when they will get their Godzilla premium. I would guess very, very much late, well into 2023. we're still, Dennis, getting just as many orders of Godzilla Premium as we are any other Stern Pinball product at this time. I wonder why that is. Even including Bond, including Rush, because it's one of the greatest, if not the greatest, fucking game ever made.
    30:42
    That is true. That's a good point. Blew mine up the other day. I got a GC. Oh, don't you hate? Look, I hate when this happens. So I've been doing the family thing. I've been trying to focus more on family and stuff because I get lost in the weeds and business and stuff. That's why you call upstairs and tell them to quit jumping and having fun. Be quiet. So ball one, I had like 800 million. Oh, wow. And I was like, holy shit, I had an extra ball. So extra ball, ball two and three. But dinner was ready. And what do you do? Do you forego and get into trouble the dinner? Don't go have family dinner. This is a once-in-a-lifetime. You're not going to be able to sustain this in the zone kind of feeling. You're well on your way to G-seeing it, well on your way to multiple billions. Or do you just pause it, hope that it doesn't freeze up, go have dinner, and then hours later come back? Hmm. Well, I don't normally need hours to eat. Well, yeah, but that rolls into cleanup. It rolls into, you know, homework and getting everyone ready. I would have paused it. I would have paused it and thought, you know what? I've already got a great score going on here. I've not had them lock up on me, leaving it like that. That's true. So I'd be like, yeah, no, granted, I'll probably come back. Now, something I would consider if I was going to be gone for over an hour would be leaving it, pausing it, and then firing up another game to warm me up before I go back into continuing. What? Oh, like a different game in general. Yeah, like because I step away for a couple hours. I'm like, oh, gosh, I'm afraid I'm not going to be in the zone. I'm going to be like, you know what? Let's fire up some Walking Dead, and I'm going to play a couple of games on it and get back into the groove, and then I'm going to go back over to Godzilla. That is a competitive mindset in you because I didn't even think of that. I did pause it, listener. I'd love to know what you listeners would have done. Email us at thepenballnetwork at gmail.com. Yeah, I paused it, came back about four or five hours later, and proceeded to fucking tank the rest of the balls. Aw. Mom, but you got your new GC. I got to Monster Zero in Ball 1. Come on. That's very good. Very, very good.
    32:57
    Sure, I got a GC, but it was just barely over a billion. It just, I hate that. I freaking hate that. You know what would be nice? If you could pause your process software-wise and fucking game. That would be cool. And then come back to it. Or you could pause your family. Nicole, I just wanted to see if I could pause that divorce settlement that you had your attorney send me. Pause the dinner. Just sort of like keep everything on simmer. That's right.
    33:27
    Children are in mid-jump. Pause those homework videos, please. Land on the floor. Yeah. So I don't know why I got off on a tangent, but there's that. So let's see. Third runs. What about third? When are the third runs of James Bond Pro and Premiums coming? I would guess a good hypothesis would be early summer 2023 so a good rollout looking at the production landscape altogether Dennis I think that it would be safe to say that the first cornerstone product game reveal usually we see those end of December beginning of January I don't think we're going to do that this year I'm going to predict that we're going to see Stern's next title be released and revealed late February That would be my guess. That makes sense though, right? Yeah, it does. Let me ask you a question that relates to that then. Do you believe that Stern is only doing two cornerstones in 2023?
    34:24
    I don't know if they even know because of parts. They have them backlogged. They've got games ready. They have established contracts with IPs too though. But those have been adjusted based on parts delays in the past. I would say if we took a snapshot today and used that data to suggest what the company needs to do next year, yes, only to with an additional specialty pin, whether it's a retheme, a revolt, or a studio capow or something. Sure. And that would be just based off of what you have indicated regarding your own distributorship and the status on the Godzilla premiums. They're clearly still not caught up. And especially coupled with how this Bond rollout has been going, it's like they waited a really long time to do their second cornerstone of the year, and it's been sloppy. I think it's fair to say it's been very sloppy. I think so. And maybe the production won't be as sloppy as the reveal, but I'm concerned, and I'm hoping that they thought that they needed to give up more than just one cornerstone to get caught up from back when. I'm assuming they start to put these plans together when they're like, holy crap, we got 5,000 game backlog here. That is – it's a serious problem. Well, they know that – it doesn't take a genius and market expert to know that the market is softening substantially. They know the analyses that they see for the worldwide and the domestic market in general. So they know that there is going to be some softening. I think that they have caught up a lot from where they were at a year ago. So they are catching up. It's not like they're still spinning their wheels. Because I do see some tiny dealers saying, hey, got in some Godzilla premiums if anybody needs. I see that. Don't agree with it. I see that. So they are catching up substantially. They know the market is softening. And they also know that they need to clear some space, which is why you see all of these last calls, the lead zeppelins of the world, the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, the rumored Star Wars, not confirmed, but rumored, the pushing of Elvira. So it would not surprise me if they change things up if they do have an upcoming flop, making a shorter run and pushing, you know, hey, we got enough in the catalog. We need to get rid of, terminate the production of. Maybe what I'm saying is, listener, maybe it's not based so much on the IP contract length of time, rather efficiency of what is selling and what is not selling. Does that make sense?
    37:07
    It does. For me, obviously, the fact that there's still a sizable number of people that are waiting. Granted, they made great end roads. But also, I'm factoring in that because Stern is that company that, when January 1 rolls around, and all these older premiums go up to this very high new premium price, you might lose customers for life that were maybe first-time buyers, and they get hit with that new bill. I don't agree with that. It's going to – but that's the thing they've always done. And so – Because you're not going to lose them for life because if somebody is – No, I think there are a lot of people buying Godzilla that would not – that have not normally bought pens before new. And I think this will sour them to it if they thought they got the price at, what, nine or whatever, and then it's going to go up so much. Ninety-seven, yeah. Ninety-seven. Thank you. I couldn't remember. And they are thinning people, thinning purchases, doing such. But what I'm saying is they get another flop or they get another less than desirable sales. And I'll say it. For us, it was kind of Led Zeppelin. They get another one of those. And, okay, I could see three cornerstones next year. Hmm. I could see that. So do you think anything's going to flop coming up? Well, rumor on the street right now is that this is a rumor. The next cornerstone design is coming from Jack Danger, his first cornerstone design. He did the home model of Jurassic Park. so the rumor is he's up next and the most heavily rumored theme for his game would be foo fighters okay well music pins are the i i tend to and maybe i'm wrong on this they tend to be the most polarizing when it comes to theme i think because people feel so strongly one way or another regarding bands i don't really have a lot of thought on foo fighters it wasn't one of my bands listen to they keep producing band pins because band pins sell sure i mean look at rush yep But ACDC, Metallica, there's so many, and they've felt all of that success, which reinvigorated their entire company back in, what, 2012 and 13 with things like ACDC and Metallica that I think they're still kind of stuck in that. Regardless of if they have a flop or two music-wise, they're going to keep producing them because there's so much nostalgia built in there. There are certain advantages to a music. I've wondered, and I don't know this, I've wondered, though, if the licensing costs on the bands is a lot less than shows. That's a great point, yeah. Because I've wondered that. The other thing is, and I don't know if it saves them – this will be an interesting discussion with their coders. Is it easier to code the music pins because they don't tell a story? Oh, that is interesting. I don't – yeah. I've wondered. I've wondered it because it's always usually like, well, we just have a bunch of modes and stuff, but we don't have to unify it around any sort of story. That's true. I wonder if that means it's easier to come up with how you're going to do it. Sadly, to jump off of that, that's sometimes why it's hard for me to enjoy band pins as much as other themed games. Because I don't feel that story or that progression or that immersion. I might feel it for the GNR when I play it and it feels like a fucking concert in a box. But I don't know if I feel like I'm really bringing the band back together or having an encore performance. well I've never felt that way about it I mean I've never owned any band pin oh that is really interesting never some I like to shoot and stuff but nope I've never owned a single one is there a music based dream theme that you do have would it be Fleetwood Mac I mean I would really like to see Fleetwood Mac done I think it would make a lot of sense given how big they are I think Prince would be a good one I don't know. Obviously, I don't know if any of these would ever happen. But there's not a band that I would just buy because it's a band. I finally got a pen. But I don't do that with any theme, as you know. I've had other themes that are some of my favorites, like Alien, that I have no interest in owning that game because of how it plays. We'll talk about that coming up. Other trending rumors in the upcoming Stern catalog include Brian Eddy on a comic themed Venom. I've been hearing that one a while. That's what they're suggesting. and a summer blockbuster release if we do see that third cornerstone of Jaws by Keith Elwin.
    41:27
    I hope that one is true. Generic shark. You know what's crazy too? Jaws, to me, theme-wise, is similar to that, for me, of Alien. It's a badass theme. I can totally get behind it. But growing up or spending the energy that I do have mentally, it was never into those to Jaws or Alien. They are dynamite and they fit into my collection. I like the themes, but I'm not like a dedicated, true, true lover of those themes like many people are. But Jaws and Keith Elwin, we would have another freaking backup for three years again. I mean, it's a risk with anything that Elwin works on now. Sure. I mean, because think about it, because Godzilla, it's a well-known license, but I can't say that it's beloved in the States. And because Avengers was based on the comic book, same thing, in my opinion. Jurassic Park was it, but it was just the world of, plus an entry. It was who you barely hear in it. Iron Maiden? You see, that's an example when I was talking about bands and polarized formats when you go with music, because I know people that love how Iron Maiden plays, but they would never own it. And it may be more of a preference for Keith. I don't know why I've kind of heard that in the past to do more general environmental theming than something so pinpointed. Like, could you imagine Keith Elwin using all of the assets and everything that Stranger Things had? What would that look like? Or Guardians of the Galaxy? Do you think it's a preference that he does the whole welcome to the world of Jurassic Park? rather than Timmy is getting shocked on the damn gates and flying back. Right, right. No, I think that comes down to the licensing. Okay. And, you know, just sort of like, I don't think Steve Ritchie, when he was at Stern Pinball, deliberately said, hey, I want to have the worst art package of every game ever, but it's just what he got stuck with. Like, I don't think it was his fault. I just think those were licensing limitations that said, you're going to have the Lunchbox Star Wars back box, and you're going to like it. So much cool stuff coming from Stern Pinball. You want to hear something off the wall, Dennis? Sure, I love walls. Look, I've heard this a couple of times now, listener. I don't know if there's any truth to it, but it would throw a wrench in things. I promise that. I don't think there's any way it's true unless it is, but there's a rumor that I've heard in the – I'm going to call them the back alleys. These are rumors that the public – Rumor alley, huh? Yeah. The public don't hear of these things. They're so dark and murky. But sometimes they're dark and murky because they're true. But there is a rumor swirling in the back alleys where you can catch something. Watch out for the needles. Is that Stern Pinball may have plans to dip their toes back into a previously made game from the Sam System era, shining it off in a contemporary Spike fashion, but also keeping the theme and the design. That is all I'm going to say. Here's a kicker. it's not Tron Legacy or Lord of the Rings. Well, Lord of the Rings isn't saying it. I know. I knew you were going to say that, and I almost didn't put it in there. Then why did you even mention it? But everybody is thinking about those being the re-themes, so I had to include it here so people would be like, what are you talking about, Lord?
    44:52
    So what do you mean by Sam era shining it off as a contemporary? Damn it, you're poking now. I don't want to give any more. What does that mean? Theme and design. So does that just mean giving it an LCD screen and that's it? And Insider Connected? Because that's what it sounds like. Well, we have a SAM system that has a DMD, and then you have an LCD, and you have all-new code. Well, you said keeping the design, though.
    45:13
    Keeping the physical design. So it's the same layout. So why would they change the rules? Similar layout. Yeah, it's keeping the same layout. So is this back, Ali, needle-infested rumor that, like, a Batman 66 is to Batman the Dark Knight? or is it like a vault but with better hardware and putting in the tech of Spike? What I have heard is very similar to the former, something like the Batman, but keeping the layout more similar than they did before. All right, so less deviation, but there may be some mechanical modification? Yes, and total transformation of code. Okay. Oh. Damn. Interesting. I mean, yeah, I agree with you. I don't, I don't, this rumor sounds super fake. I'm amazed it hasn't been on Rumor Corner. This one sounds so bad.
    46:09
    You're going to get your J's dirty going in the alleys on this one. It sounds so pointless. You want me to name a game and it's not Tron Legacy. I'm not going to honor Lord of the Rings. I'm going to say ACDC given how many times they've vaulted the thing. I'm not going to answer anything. Let's do ACDC and then they can have an LCD screen to cover up all the faces no one likes. Anybody know about new code? Mandalorian got new code 1.40. No one cares. New ambush rules, Dennis. I don't know what ambush rules were before that. White and blue. Oh. Topper support. Integration. A topper. I hear it's been selling pretty good for people. Why doesn't Alien have a topper? It doesn't? Oh, it's got the beacons. That's right. The only reason I bring that up is because this last week, Pinball Brothers' Alien pinball machine topped the charts. Charts? That's kind of been the media buzz this week. Yeah, Alien lands in the number one spot on the Pennside Top 100. Okay. Now, my question to you, Dennis, is, look, the numbers are there. They had a lot of reviews of this game. The deviation between the LV and the SV are pretty substantial, as Craig Bobby pointed out, making only aesthetic changes between the two. And if you consider the latter, the SV, it would be in the 30s range, which seems more appropriate to me. Do numbers actually lie? oh well uh they maybe people who put them into maybe like that as an answer i mean this is something that has it's commonplace for the pinside top 100 especially new games it used to be almost a running gag that whatever the latest stern or jjp was going to be is going to move up to number one wasn't there a time when kind of out of the blue heist all of a sudden was number one i this this happens like people people who are big into the game are the ones that initially do all the reviews. They finally hit the threshold, because no one notices until the threshold's hit, of course. The game becomes number one or somewhere in the top ten. The public looks. They do a gasp. And then they go in, and then they put it in its place. And in some cases, they do that by overly review-bombing it. We might see that this following week. Oh, yeah. No, I'm sure it will get review-bombed. What I'm saying is the numbers are much more substantial in quantity than oftentimes when you see a heist bump barely meeting that threshold. This threshold has been well met. I wonder if there was a campaign behind the scenes that got a lot of people to rate it within a week, and that's why you saw that. I mean, it would not surprise me with smaller manufacturers that, and I'm not saying the manufacturers are the ones doing it. It could just be the fans, but they do this, like they instigate. This is how they, this is how some people, well, I'm going to use the term, I know it's a little derogatory, fanboys. This is how fanboys manipulate things to try and get positive attention because they are so sensitive to perceived slights. This is what they do. And that's already on top of everything else where people who have bought these games don't want the values to be diminished. You and Greg recently did a review that we're going to talk about later in the episode. But I recall seeing someone share with me a screenshot of a person who was very, very negative towards what you said because it wasn't glowing enough. Yes. I got a lot of shit about that. Yeah. Oh, you don't sell this game, so that's why you're shitting all over it. And I'm like, what? And my point is simply that had it been a stern, that message would not have come. Absolutely.
    49:35
    Because all of my friends, such as yourself and Joel and a lot of the TPM people in the Discord, you guys were like, come on, Zach. D minus, really? Like, you guys were giving me a hard time with the other end. But yeah, okay. So, all right. So, Alien, number one. Interesting. It's not a number one game. Come on, people. Guess what? I sell it too. And if you're thinking this is going to be the number one game, it may be for you personally. But objectively, it is not the best game ever made. That's probably the part that confuses – I mean, yeah, I get it. And people like to have conversations. And sometimes people will take a harder take to raise a little bit of discussion and all that. But when I – on this show and my other podcasts will say, like, I don't like this game. I don't like this game. that's not I'm not trying to upset folks just kind of like let it go and recognize that just because someone says a game is bad you can still think it's good and completely disagree and you don't have to make a big deal about it and vice versa if I really really like playing hoops and someone else is like hoops is stupid hurry up only bunch of crap game I don't reply to them and say well you're wrong let me say why it's just like whatever They don't have to like it. So you're saying that there could have been an underground campaign in the same alleys where I got that Stern rumor.
    50:55
    I'm only saying that because of your mentioning that it had so many votes all of a sudden. That, to me, suggests that it was coordinated by someone. Hey, look. People buying votes is nothing. I don't even know if it was bought. It might have just been going into an owner's club and saying, hey, guys, we're getting really close to finally having our game rated. And then that just triggered a whole bunch of people. Like 15 of them went in and voted. No, I say that because it's like the – I don't know if this rumor has caught past your thing yet, but there's like the Twippy stuff. My thing? You mean Rumor Corner, the greatest segment in all of pinball podcasting? Whatever that thing is. Yeah, but like somebody bought 1,000 votes on the Twippies last year.
    51:36
    Oh, I hadn't heard that one. You hadn't heard that one? I had not heard that one specifically. I don't know whether to believe it or not, but yeah, there's some documents out there. I don't know. Evidential documents. I can't recall ever getting one of these – an email like this to EGP. However, I have heard from another content creator that they did get contacted by a vote-buying – a group that arranges for people to go and vote on your behalf for money, offering to do Twippy intervention for them. At a cost of – I don't remember if it was a certain amount of money for every 50 votes. This is part of the reason – we're still in the Pinball Brothers section, so I apologize for the digression. But this is part of the reason why I do not like people's choice award style voting in anything and why I think in most industries it's not seen as a very respected version compared to other formats because it's so easy to manipulate. And it's not the award group's fault. It's just so hard to control because you think you're going to do like IP checks and stuff and stop robots. It's not robots anymore. These people arrange. They get folks to do it for them. They get paid. Like you pay us money, and then we get real people in real cities at different IPs with real email addresses to do it, and the people doing it get some compensation in return. And that's how it works. Yeah, it's hard to validate all of that. I don't think there is a way to control for it. If real people are doing it, I can't think of a way. I can't think of a solution. So I don't – be it the Twippies or any other people's choice thing, I don't hold it against those groups because what can they do? Unless it's a person voting for themselves, what can they really do? Well, hold up. That's pretty dichotomous though. What do you mean? That's suggesting that they're doing everything they can do. Well, no.
    53:25
    I would need to know – well, I mean part of that might be because I can't think of like what more would you be able to do to – There's ways to make it better. So without making it a selective thing, I don't know how to do it. There ways to get a public opinion Oh speaking of side note listener I did reach out to Will O who the operator of the Twippies and I said, hey, any interest in either selling or collaborating?
    53:53
    Maybe I can be a part of this year's Twippie so it doesn't go to hell in a handbasket again. Zero interest.
    53:59
    Well, they may already have plans in place. Oh, whatever. I know. You just let it go. Zero interest. Let it go. Man, zero interest. Let it go. am i fucking stained what am i honestly i just wanted i wanted to find a way to like mix the twippies and industry awards like that was my devious plan let's actually have there be one award show and everybody put in together on it and make it the best thing possible to get to to uh celebrate pinball yeah it's a that's an interesting idea but both awards function in such dramatically different ways that i don't know how easy that would be i'm not saying it's impossible i'm just I mean, they operate on very, very different models. Hashtag I tried. You want to talk about multimorphic? Speaking of hashtag I tried.
    54:45
    Best fucking segue of the year. Right in directly to Zach because I don't want to hear any feedback. Damn, that was such a good segue. That was fucking, if we were doing a Twibby segue of the year, that was me right there. I don't know. You guys heard it here. Fucking segues. Why don't we vote on segues? Six-time segue winner.
    55:03
    Multimorphics in the news this week. I'm a pistol today. Jerry Stellenberg, owner of Multimorphics, stated publicly that in 2023, Dennis, we're going to be seeing the release of two new modules, which means games, of course, as well. Probably more games, but the modules are important for the P3 platform because they're new. They're the back third that makes the new two of them. Do you believe it? I noted this in an update weeks ago. This isn't new. Oh. Well, I forgot. Well, maybe he re-mentioned it. You just didn't see the original announcement. Yeah, but two, do you think that can happen? But they're also advertising 11 to 12 months if you buy a Multimorphic today, if you buy a P3. Oh, I see what you're saying. Okay. Could they reveal the two new modules in 2023? Yes. Okay. Do I think they should if they're still going to be like over half a year behind on getting someone a P3 that orders it? No, I would not do that. I would not do the reveal would be my recommendation because I think, again, it gets back to like what we were talking about with Stern. I just sitting on and people don't like to wait. It's just not a good look. Even if you're being upfront about it, it's like I just I wouldn't because you're busy. You're already busy. But I would say, Jerry, see last March when you announced Weird Al. But they might have license agreements and such that will force their hand. So they might have no choice. And in which case, then absolutely, they'll reveal the two. I mean, too many variables, too many variables to know. What about Nick Baldrige, though? Because I thought he's working on his own module. Might that be one to count as these one of two? No. No? I believe in the original announcement that you weren't familiar with, I believe Multimorphic indicated these two new modules are first-party developed. And they flat-out noted that doesn't count any third-party development. But what if Nick Baldrige did a contracted piece for him? I'm in one of Nick's Discord so I don't think I'm it's not private ones I don't think I'm revealing anything here that's secret but I think Nick's made it very clear all of his stuff he's been at least that he's been talking about on this is like his other games they're third party developed Multimorphic reviews them and has to sign off on them and all of that but it's his development I only wonder because this will be Nick's first time to actually develop a module Right, but the way the system works is independent third parties are allowed to develop modules. It's just obviously easier for folks to work with an existing module because then they don't have to deal with the hardware. So does Nick have to manufacture said modules? He has to figure out how it will be manufactured. And I know he's been working on actually having prototypes made because he has to test them. Oh, interesting. Okay.
    57:50
    Oh. It's fascinating. If I was into game development, you could really – at least I could really see the attraction of working where you've already got the platform and doing the development through the module stuff. Like from a developer standpoint, it gives you so many solves as long as obviously you're not wanting to mess with where the screen is. Of course, you can extend things, components down onto that, but they are extensions. But if you're comfortable with the screen and wanted to develop the back third, obviously, it's like, okay, well, all this other stuff's there, and you'd have a company you could talk to about selling the product. And it's not like what Scott had to do, Scott Denisey with TNA, where it's like, okay, we have to find someone to construct everything from scratch and all of that. So anyway, it's interesting. But no, I do think – I don't know when Nick's planning to have his game come out, but it wouldn't count towards these two is my understanding. I see. And there may be other third parties making modules also. I don't know. I won't say that they won't reveal two new modules next year. I'm with you. I'm with you again. I think they shouldn't reveal – unless for some reason they've found some straight line to parts and manufacturing resources. But yeah, I don't see it. don't Dave fix it Jerry from the prior update that they released it doesn't sound like a parts issue for them it's just simply the manpower of getting the build so if they do get caught up I think it's fine it's just again I know I've whined about this with Stern a whole lot I just I don't like building up backlogs I don't think it does anyone any favors I don't think it looks good so if they chip that down then yeah I think it makes sense if they don't chip it down if they have the ability to hold I mean that would be if I was an advisor that would be my advice but I'm just one person.
    59:39
    I'm just one lovely podcast. I don't work in manufacturing. I'm just a simple non-profit sort of person who gives away full-size Snickers bars for Halloween. Heath bars. I don't know where you found them. Did you go to Sam's Club? I found them next to the Snickers bars. Oh, let me tell you a Halloween story. I should have done this in the intro. I'm going to tell you this Halloween story. All right. So I had, this must have been a record number of kids. So I think I had over 30, which is good. Yeah, that's a lot. Which is good that there were the other bags, the little candy bars because I only I bought 36 candy bars that's how many I had oh boy well but I ate some of them before the Halloween so I think I was down to 32 anyway well I couldn't help it because I like Snickers bar so so this little girl comes up I can't remember what she was dressed as I think probably a pixie or something like that real little though like two or three okay Tinkerbell comes up to your door yeah yeah so she's like a little three-year-old and I'm and she's like happy halloween i'm like here you go and i hand her a snickers bar and she looks at it and then eyeballs me and says i don't want it and then she grabbed my bowl because i have this big white plastic bowl and she yanks it down to look in and her mom and dad are behind her i'm assuming her mom and dad whoever she was with and she yanks it down she looks in the bowl and she's staring in the ball and i said i'm sorry i'm putting the other loose candy uh that my house had picked up because i'm like i because i do all that he's in his room i do all my hell i do the i run hallow i run halloween yeah i run i'm in the living room i'm watching the original halloween because it's one of my favorite movies um and and i'm giving out candy and i said i'm sorry picky pixie i'm sorry little little pixie picky pixie but they're all snickers bars all the heath bars were gone by this point. She came late. Which is odd that your area picked Heath over Snickers, but okay. I didn't let them pick. I gave them all the Heath bars because I like the Snickers bars and I wanted to have the Snickers bars. She didn't get the options. She didn't get the choice. Her dad over her head, he goes, here, give her this. And he hands me this little teeny candy. But it's also a Snickers. It's one of those square ones. Okay. So I'm like, okay, well, she said she didn't like Snickers, but I think it's like, okay, she doesn't like that there's this huge thing. and so i say here you go little picky pixie and she takes it and she looks at it and she goes no i don't like it wow you can't trick her she hates snickers she's the one child in america who hates snickers pixie pixie and i said okay well let me go into the kitchen and let me see if i've got something now her parents are apologizing like oh my god we're so sorry why are you doing this this is because i'm nice i'm nice this is how i am on this show and how I am in real life. I am the second nicest person in Kansas. And so I go up and I get the other candy out that my housemate bought. And I was like, I didn't think I was going to have to open this stuff. And I'm like, whatever. He's like, what the fuck, man? No, he doesn't know what's going on. And so, because he's in his room playing video games. And I'm like, whatever. I just pour them all in the bag. And I'm like, here you go. And so because they're small, I give her three. Because that's why I got the full size. Because normally I give like three candy bars to kids when they're the Halloween size. Because I'm nice. Did she accept that? The queen? She took them, and then she's walking away, because she wanted the Nestle. They were crunch bars. So she's like, I like the blue ones. So I gave her three blue ones. And then as she's walking away, she hands two of them to her dad, and she goes, I only want one. Oh, wow. Dad taxed it, too.
    63:06
    Except he got her conditioned so that she knows she just has to volunteer the tax. Why were they enabling that little shit? He had a Snickers bar in hand ready. A little Snickers square, but she hates Snickers. Well, I hate that kid. She didn't like Snickers. Her bowl was like empty too. Like the poor Snickers bar, the big one I gave her, like filled the whole bowl. I would have slowly, methodically opened that Snickers bar, took a big chomp out of it, and mumbled, happy fucking Halloween. And I would have slammed the door. Get the fuck off my property. I just, I don't, I don't know what the deal is. It was. Parent better. What is that? It was, it was weird. Good for you, bitch. I'm like, maybe I need to just go back to buying the mixed bags of Halloween size so I have more variety. Because it's not unusual for me to have kids try and grab the bowl and look and pick their own candy out. Sure, but not in the gesture that she did. She used some Hulk strength, too, and ripped it down. I was like, holy crap, what does she do? Are steroids?
    64:05
    What is this? I don't know. I mean, it was so warm out. I mean, the teenagers weren't even like that. There were teenagers coming around wearing masks that they couldn't even see out of bumping into stuff trying to get candy. You should have just went back to the fridge and got her a half-consumed bottle of mustard. I care, you little shit. I like to have my mustard. Nobody likes mustard. I do. Mustard, yes, but mustard, don't let's be silly. Especially on hot dogs. Anyway, sorry for the digression. That was more intro-appropriate. That was actually very welcomed. I don't know why I'm so angered at that little girl. I don't know. So let's talk about your Halloween, and by that I mean straight down the middle reviewing Halloween the Pinball Machine. That was very spooky. Yeah, spooky pinball. That might be a better transition than the transition you thought was the best transition of all time. No, the whole multi-morphic transition was the greatest. No, write into the pinballnetwork at gmail.com and say which one actually felt more natural and appropriate. It was a nod for our truest fans. No. No, I think that my transition ties in succinctly to your very generous review of Halloween.
    65:12
    Did you watch it? No. I did. Oh, did you? Yeah. I fast forward through the part where you explain all the shots. But I watched the actual review. I get that. I watched the review part. We always wonder whether we should even include those anymore. I gave you a thumbs up on the video. Oh. Because I'm nice. I'm a full-size candy bar, snicker wheeling, nice person. You didn't push the little pixie off your front porch. Now this? No. What is up with you? I'm always nice. I thought you were pure evil. No. How was my impersonation of Dr. Wink? It wasn't bad, right? It was okay. Yeah, it was all right. I was using it as a – It's like your B tier, but – It was like my SNL approach. It was more a caricature of. Because it's not fair because Greg's impression was better because he took a non-speaking role and just swung a knife around a bunch. Yeah. The slashes were pretty good though. Yeah. We did review Straight Down the Middle Halloween and a lot of acclaim from people. People did consume that review as they oftentimes do, but very polarizing. in that, yeah, a lot of people said we hyped it too much and were too nice, but then if you go into the Halloween thread on Pinside, they got their pitchforks out and said, Zach, you evil, maniacal bastard. You weren't nice enough to it still. You don't sell this game, so of course you're shitting on it. Son of a bitch. And then in the same breath, you go over to the TPN thread, or the SDTM thread, and they're like, where does this son of a bitch get off? We know that he's just trying to hype this game to sell these machines. oh you can't win these assholes you just you cannot win but uh the review was fun and i like the game greg loves the game i gave it probably one of the lowest if not the lowest uh layout and design that i've given any pinball machine that i've reviewed formally a c minus on that but overall uh came out to be a b minus and that's kind of what it feels like feels like a c plus b minus game to me. I have a lot of fun with it. I am going to give a shout out to some of those knuckleheads over in the spooky pinball thread because they were like, Zach, you're bitching about the scoop, rejecting because it is a horrible design scoop. Until they were like, just push the hood down a little bit. Yeah, just bend the hood. Fucking fixed it 100%. I'm not too proud to say that I did, and it did. It worked. That doesn't make up for the geometry. You need to go and re-evaluate. No. You re-evaluated? They called for that, but it's not happening. Oh, of course they did. Of course they did. The scoop was only one portion of my assessment. Let's talk about it. If we want to talk about scoops, why do we need four scoops? We'll start there. If we want to talk about that. Because Kellogg's Raisin Bran has two, and they had to double up. Middle-ramp diverter that doesn't work. No.
    68:00
    Believe me. I was being decent. A B- is not a bad score. I don't. No. I think, you know, I'm trying to be fair, but then again, I'm trying to fucking sell machines. You did sell one online. I saw. Oh, and you sold it cheap. Somebody got so mad about that. Oh, you sold it cheap. I was hyping up something one night trying to draw the price up. I thought it was a fair price. And people bitch if it's a fair price. I did sell it, though. You're undervaluing their own games by what you do. Yeah, I guess that's what I did. I just got it on trade-in and I was like, okay, well, I need to move some inventory here. I need you to play more Halloween. people are still not you know what we're not going to get it on location around here it's we wouldn't make any money i i might try it again at another show which is where i last played it but man i hope one of your friends gets it or something locally that you can really get some time i don't have any friends nobody likes me i thought tiny would buy one no halloween no Oh, no. If he was going to buy, he would buy Ultraman, and he's not going to buy Ultraman. Oh, my prediction did come true. Halloween is holding so much better than Ultraman now, even if there was more made. Oh, poor Ultraman is tanked. Tank, tank. Well, you know, they can't all win, especially with the softening now in the market. You're going to have to – you've got to be a step above if you want to hold up. These days of just anything with a decent art package selling, I think, are gone. Did you say a decent art package? Yeah. Come on. The Playfield art package is not. I think the Playfield art package is okay if it's like a hit or miss. I think the cabinet and Translight look great. They look better than most. But there's no reason to buy a game for their art package. You could just buy the Translight and put it on your wall if you want the Translight. Absolutely. But the cabinet holds up. That's why I don't buy games off art. If I want to buy art, I'd buy art. commercial devices. Speaking of boutique pinball, see, I did it again. Fucking A plus. That was pretty good, but I don't know yet what we're transitioning to because you're too busy paying yourself on the back. Courtesy of Nap Arcade, I seen him talking about Brian Soares. I'd go with Soares.
    70:19
    Right? Would you go with Soares if you were... I'd just say Soares and then have him correct me when I'm wrong. Brian Soares and Rebecca Hardy, known for their Ferris Bueller's Day Off custom pinball machine from last year. Remember, that was a big hit. They teased their next creation coming in 2023, which is one of my freaking dream themes, Happy Gilmore Pinball. Now, didn't someone else do a Happy Gilmore custom? They did Billy Madison. Oh, thank you, Billy Madison. Yeah, so we're getting all my dream themes are being made by other people.
    70:54
    Jack and Jill's right around the corner. Stop it. We did at least get a little ninky before that. Oh, you'd probably give that a B- too. This upcoming game also produced in conjunction with Tim Kitzrow. Boom shakalaka. The voice actor of NBA Jam fame and former NBA player himself and pinball enthusiast, a friend, Todd McCullough. Todd, write into the pinballnetwork at gmail.com and say if you like Zach or me more.
    71:22
    Did you see? I've got to pull that up right now. We did get Steve. No, I did not. He emailed back. Maybe he just emailed my personal. Let's see. He probably just emailed you because you're friends. Which does suggest that I'm better friends with him than you, but whatever. I'm not friends with him at all. I didn't ask that. I asked who he liked more, not who was his friend. Yeah, he did reply. My good bud Steve did email me, said, hey, Zach, catching up on my podcast listening this morning. Heard you give me a shout out. Thanks, man. Very cool of you. Appreciate that. And as far as who I like better, I mean, it kind of has to be you. Could Dennis hook me up with a Jaws LE? I don't think so. Smiley. See what he's doing there?
    72:08
    Seriously, though, you both are awesome together. I love the show, and I love you both, all caps, equally. There's no favorites here.
    72:20
    Equal? Don't do equal here. Steve, write into the pinball.org at gmail.com and answer the question. If Zach and I were both drowning in a river floating away from you and we were equidistant apart, which one would you swim and save? Keep in mind, Steve, that he's floating upon a log and I'm floating upon your Jaws, Ellie.
    72:41
    Your rumored Jaws, Ellie. If you need a Jaws, rumored Jaws, Ellie, you let me know. And if you don't mind getting a shipment from Coin Taker, I can make miracles happen. Why take other people's coins when you can give them? Coin giver, ding. He did go on to say, and this is for listeners, this is Steve Jablonski, the iconic musical film composer for Michael Bay films.
    73:07
    He's well-versed and one of the best composers of all time in film. So he went on to say, I think Dennis asked for a signed Event Horizon CD, lol. Well, I did not work on that movie, but if he'd like, I can scribble Event Horizon on one of my soundtracks and send it to him.
    73:28
    Have an awesome Halloween, you guys. Steve. You see, you're his favorite. He said equal, so bullshit. Yeah, but that was after the winky face. Event Horizon. See, that should have turned him off right there. He should have been like, Interstellar's way better. oh my god the sound mix on interstellar in the theater was so bad oh that's not the composer's fault that's the local theater well no no this was it had to do with however they did it digitally it was widespread across chains it was really bad it's really bad people that don't know how to play the masterpiece that was the interstellar score that's all Matthew McConaughey, if you listen to the show right here to the Pimplot Network at cmail.com and just explain to Zach that the mix was really bad. I can guarantee you that Steve would appreciate Interstellar more so than Everett Horizon because he was a little biased. He worked under the even more iconic Hans Zimmer who did score and compose the Interstellar. Oh, Hans Zimmer. I love a lot of Hans Zimmer scores. So, you see, it wasn't Hans Zimmer's fault. It was all of these shit-ass outdated theaters. Hey, theaters, figure it out. Maybe that's why you're going out of business.
    74:48
    I bet the HBO Maxes and the Netflixes sound just fine, though. What is your favorite Hans Zimmer score? Honestly, it probably would be Interstellar. because I just, I love the organ use in that so much that it's always kind of been, but dude, he did freaking so many of them. Yeah, yeah, it would be tough for me. Inception was great. Yeah, a lot of whams in that. I'd say a lot of wham. Dark Knight. Of course, that's just the sound effects. No, I would say it would be tough for me with both Gladiator, which is his, And I also really, really like his score for The Last Samurai. Oh, that was a deeper cut. No, the music is my favorite thing about that. I thought go with The Rock, pushy. Oh, The Rock, best action movie of all time. Oh, man. People may make fun of a lot of what Michael Bay does, but The Rock is a choice action movie. I wish he would do R-rated action movies more. All the money's in PG. I would think for creativity's sake and originality, maybe Pirates of the Caribbean.
    76:04
    Da Vinci's always been good. And he's still active. And he still did horror films, too. The Ring? He did The Ring. I would say of Mr. Jablonski's scores, which I'm more familiar with Hans Zimmer's work, I'd probably say Ender's Game was the one. There's a little deep cut there. Okay. But, yeah, which movie-wise, and unlike everyone else in the world that I know, I never read Ender's Game. I only saw the movie. Oh, I've not seen that movie. But, you know, as I recall, the soundtrack I enjoyed on that. Maybe he was thinking, you were thinking Deepwater Horizon instead of Event Horizon.
    76:44
    No, no, no. Now, with Deepwater Horizon, which I have not seen, of course, I would think Deep Star Six, which is a real janky 80s horror movie. I see.
    76:55
    Yeah, I'd go with, man, he had some good ones in there. Jeez. Battleship was a badass movie. I don't care what anybody says. I like that movie. Oh, my God. With Rihanna. That was good.
    77:06
    Hey, you know what, though? Like, of all of the reboot, because Steve did a lot of the horror reboot scores, your Texas Chainsaw Massacre, your Friday the 13th, your Nightmare on Elm Street, I'm giving a lot of credit for film to the Texas Chainsaw Massacre, the reboot in 2003. I believe I have seen that, and it was well put together. Yeah, yeah. I guess maybe it's just how dated Texas Chainsaw Massacre the original was based on my age, but I really liked how that was redone. All right. We've digressed a lot. Everyone's complained. I don't even know where we left off. We were talking about, oh, yeah, Happy Gilmore. Yeah, we were just talking about how you were going to give Jack and Jill a B+. You're not going to make this putt, jackass. Have you seen Happy Gilmore at least? Please. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. It's great. Chubbs, Crazy Chubbs. Oh, come on. Yeah, Happy Gilmore would make an awesome pinball machine.
    77:59
    I hope that there's a clown in there that spits the ball back out. I'm going to die, clown. Or the opening scene where he sings, I want to kiss you all over and over and again. And then the lady comes in and she's like, you want breakfast? I want to kiss you all over. Dun, dun, dun Till the night closes in Todd McCullough, email, message. I think Todd's on Facebook. I was going to message him and be like, dude, let me buy one of these. I couldn't even find him on Facebook. Maybe he has me blocked.
    78:39
    Now I've got that song stuck in my head, Dennis. Dun, dun, dun Till the night closes in I'm sorry, don't hang up. It's Pinball Market Trends!
    78:56
    Did you miss it, Dennis? No. Let's get through it. Let's trend up all the stuff you've been reviewing.
    79:05
    Trending up this week like when I wake up and take a pee. It's the Mandalorian! Wait a minute. Can that really be trending up? The price is maybe not so much, but look, we got a new code. We got a new topper. We've got new sales. Numbers don't lie. You're selling more games out of nowhere. That's a trend. Mandalorians are actually selling. Thank God. Baby Yoda is happy. Grow gulaki. The Mandalorian, a lot of people talking about it. The whole, honestly, it wasn't so much the topper. a lot of pinhead pinheads, whether it's competitive players, whether it's deeper enthusiasts, they're talking about that code update that fixes Ambush. That was a big part of that game. So the game is trending up. Also trending up. This is like upside down day. Also trending up this week, Spooky Pinball's Halloween. What? The recently reviewed and B- and B- received Halloween? The darkest horse.
    80:10
    Halloween trending up. It's got to. You want to know why? No, I don't. Because people are talking about it. There's been more buzz about Halloween in the last week than there has been since it was released. I don't know about that. But numbers don't lie. I only report the facts. Contact a couple dealers right now. I did this past week and I said hey just gauging the market here Any uptick in Halloween sales And both of the ones that I reached out to both of them said you know what Matter of fact yeah Haven't sold a Halloween in a long time. Sold two or three this week. That might just be because of the holiday. It might be because of the holiday. Maybe. Why do you like Kermit T. Frogged me?
    80:53
    That's kind of mean. No Snickers bar for you. So Halloween is trending up. I thought it was a little bit rough around the edges on the game here and there. But boy, oh boy, did I give a voice to all of the Halo lovers out there. I thought the world was just full of Halo haters. Travis Meary, Joe Lingleberth, Tom Graff. I don't know. I saw someone who hasn't been saying positive things who's like, maybe I should give it another chance. I'm like, dude, you've given it three chances. Just, like, believe in yourself. Come back to us. Michael finds his way home shunt you is shunt a word shunt shall you not shunt shant don't shant your pants this game is decent this game is glory decent look if you want a pin that looks beautiful a pin that sounds beautiful a pin that pulls you into the immersive experience of everything horror then you'll like Halloween but if you have objection to you know game crashes and stuff who does the call outs in the game as Dr. Loomis because that person is really good it's so good I don't know who does it I want that person to do Escape from New York Donald Pleasance Escape from New York Donald Pleasance as the president and when you put a high score I want it to say you're the Duke you're A number one you're the Duke I want to go watch that movie again now it's a good movie it's another John Carpenter film I want to watch all of Donald Platt's movies now Halloween is training up people are talking about it people are giving it another chance and it's finding we're in the midst of an onset of a re-emergence here a re-emergence you make it sound like the locusts from Gears of War a re-emergence people are talking that's all I'm saying or maybe it's just because people like Greg Bones so much that when he writes something high, they're like, that dude Greg Bones is just on. I don't know. At the end, I thought he kind of got a little preachy slash defensive in the review. Basically saying if you don't like the game, it's just because you don't get the theme. Ooh. I thought, you know what, Greg? I have to disagree. I'm a pretty big, in my view, I'm a pretty big Halloween fan. I'm very, very familiar with the first film, and there are elements of the game I just can't get behind. And I don't know if my fandom should get to be challenged like that. I mean, it's fair for him to challenge it. I'm not going to write in and complain. I do think that there are certain games, Halloween being one of them, and Stranger Things being another, you just can't play it on location or at a show.
    83:43
    There's different environments in which to play games. Such a gatekeeping statement. Like Rush? Eh. Play it in a competition. Play it on location. It's a band pin. Yeah, well, I mean, a music pin. No one cares. Yeah, you know, music pins. Damn, I hope Ray Day's on something different this time.
    84:03
    No, I want him to only ever be on music pins. I want him to be typecast into, here you go, make your convoluted music rules. You can't tell a story, so here you go. And I like to imagine at night he's like writing scripts. Like, I'm going to prove I can tell a story. Tap, tap, tap. I imagine him using an old-timey typewriter. Tap, tap, tap. Return of airport modes. Yes. You get to play it. Also training up this week apparently is Greg Bones' Toy Story 4 LE. Wow. Talk about the hottest thread on Pennside for the last week. That poor guy got raked over the coals trying to sell that Toy Story of his. I thought everybody liked Greg. Guess not. in the Toy Story 4 thread. Not ever since he signed on to Flippin' Up Pinball.
    84:49
    You're just part of the problem, you son of a bitch. You were one of us. For those of you wanting a good laugh, go into that. That poor guy got called every name under the book and he was just trying to sell his Toy Story.
    85:04
    Well, at least the company owner hasn't contacted him saying, what are you doing? I'm assuming. If he has, Greg, email the pinball network at gmail.com and let us know if that happened. I don't think they have, but you never know. You never know, back channel discussions. In the darkest of alleys.
    85:23
    In the darkest corners of New Jersey. Oh my gosh, yeah, go check it out. Also trending up this week, I just feel festive, so I'm giving everything away, because it's season screenings, baby! And if I could give you one treat this year, listener, it's give yourself time and subscription to go watch season one of rings of power on amazon prime rings of power the lord of the rings this the season one was better than the hobbit trilogy i'm saying it i'm putting it out there i'm gonna also put out there this week trending up is rings of power so much so that it was better than season one of house of the dragon fight me i don't care objectively it was it just was there wasn't no sex or not much violence in Rings of Power. You know why, people? It didn't need it.
    86:16
    It's called storytelling. It's called cinematography. Actual good CGI. Character development. It doesn't have to rely on boobies and wieners. Now look, I liked House of the Dragon. I liked it quite fondly. But looking at all of these numbers that people talk about, all these ratings and... It's bullshit. Numbers do lie. Because Rings of Power, way better. than House of the Dragon. Dennis, did you have any feelings about the Rings of Power season one? Yeah, I liked it. Really? That's it? Yeah. You liked it? I don't know. What do you want me to... That last episode didn't get you so freaking fired up? I had already figured it out, but... Well, because you read the books. Well. Fucking Tom Bombadil. They are deviating a bit in some areas, which, of course, that might be part of the issue is it's upsetting some purists who are really hung up on it having to follow the... It's too hard to keep everything following. This is true for any story. Everyone gets upset. I mean, I agree with everything you said. It's stronger than the Hobbit trilogy. It's stronger than House of the Dragon. I thought House of the Dragon did a surprisingly good job with the number of time jumps they had to embed to still actually tell a coherent story. It's pretty entertaining. Way better than the last season of Game of Thrones was. So last season of Game of Thrones is awful. But Rings of Power is just – it's more enjoyable, I would say. The biggest thing to know about going in is I felt very overwhelmed for probably the first two to three episodes just by the sheer number of characters that are involved. And you're not yet sure who you're going to follow. But it does sort itself out, and it is not nearly as overwhelming as it feels at first when you're like, am I going to have to know about every single Hobbit or what's going on? We know that this series is going to go into five seasons, and I just think their planning for it is so smart. They gave you so much still in season one that it didn't feel like they were going to have to drag on to season three to catch on to what's – it's just – it's an epic, magnificent visual spectacle. I loved it. If it's going to get a pinball machine, I'm just saying if, they need to get the Galadriel voice actress to do the call-outs, and I want everything to be as over-the-top and elaborate as it is for her lines in the show. Everything that might be mundane that is said – this is another fun thing. See, I didn't touch it. No, because it's all of the proper language that Tolkien used. But listen to how – because she's the elf. Listen to how she explains even the most mundane things. In fact, you could probably make a drinking game of it. Just imagine how Galadriel was – if someone was in the show to ask her, what would you like for breakfast? And she'd probably say something like, the jam on toast does not idly fall upon the lands of Lothlorien.
    89:03
    If you would just but believe in yourself, you could become the chef of all time. Oh, man. She seduced me. She has all the best lines in the show. They gave her all the good dialogue. She's such the best lead badass. Badass. Hmm? Yeah, she gets... It's like, she's the fun character. They give her everything to do. Without it being like Star Trek Discovery, where it feels like you're watching the Michael Burnham show and no one else matters. That's a Star Trek Discovery reference for anyone who's watching that show. No clue, dude. This doesn't feel like that. It's still an ensemble cast, and other people are doing very important things. It's not just the Galadriel show. But she's the most fun character, in my view. All right, let's be a dick this week. Trending down is Jersey Jack Pinball's Toy Story. Uh-oh. Greg's was trending off. that was more his thread oh you're trying to help your flipping out employee yeah by turning it down sorry Greg you already trended it up I trended up his you can't have both you can't have second breakfast his nice I like that it was like more the thread that was trending up the game itself numbers don't lie I only report the facts and I've been told numerous times that I'll never trend down anything I sell even though week after week I trend down things that I sell Toy Story is trending down Look at the secondary listings for this game. Come on. There's no arguing to it. This game is $12,000. They're sitting at $10,200. That's a fact. Selling around $10,000. That's a $2,000 difference. The CEs, I don't think the CEs are taking as much of a hit right now because not all of them are produced. I think only half of them are produced at this point. Maybe not even half of them are produced. I anticipate if we continue down this same path, we're going to see the same thing for the CEs. I have seen some CEs sell for much under $15,000. So it's already showing to be that case. Does it take the fall that Ultraman and Halloween have taken ratio-wise? Maybe. But thankfully, Halloween's trading back up. Hopefully, once people get time to play it. We did see a little bit of a resurgence on opinions of it following Expo when larger groups of people were able to play it. But the numbers aren't there yet on sales. It's not showing that. It's just not. And that's why, sad to say, but I've got Toy Story Ellie sitting, and it is trending down. Also trending down is apparently trying to sell a Halloween pinball machine trade-in for too cheap a price. Yes, very cheap. Too cheap. How dare you lower the market on this? I knew you'd do this shit. Pump it up, and then you shit it out.
    91:37
    Sad. In retrospect, probably sold it too cheap. I sold it for what, $74? I don't know. I didn't look at the ad. I saw someone. Whatever. My comp, I looked at the comps, and I guess the comps I looked at were a bit dated when it was at the bottom of the well gasping for air. Like a poor fish out of a tank. But I should have left money on the table. Sue me, people. Shit. I can't win. I tried to save people money, Dennis. And I'm going to do it again. I'm a giver. In this week's Deals of the Week. Buy, buy, buy. Deal of the week this week coming from Flippin' Out Pinball. Why shouldn't it? Shield, shield, shield, motherfucker.
    92:18
    Can't win. I got a Mary Shelley's Frankenstein. Not a very good game. You know what, though? Not a horrible game. No. A bit of a grinder. Getting those modes enabled. Yeah. For the stand-up targets to feel like I'm playing Oktoberfest. But not a horrible game. Yeah, I agree. Art package on the cabin is beautiful. Yeah. The play field is Sega. I mean, it just is what it is. Yeah, very Sega. I've got one. Very nedry little baby hand. Making your mashed potatoes and stuffing your giblets. Finger nubs. These got the size of fingers as that little impatient pixie did.
    92:52
    She had like a vice grip. Probably turned that poor Snickers into paste with her little death claw. You've got little numb bruises on your wrist. Probably she did not grab me.
    93:05
    I don't know how I would have reacted to someone laying hands on me, even if they are three. The parents were like, just give her a Snickers. I did. I gave her the biggest Snickers ever. She likes the small ones. I don't want it. I don't want it now, Papa. Mary Shelley's Frankenstein. I had listed for like $4,700 because it's the nicest example I've seen of one. It's got the XL color DMD, which is freaking amazing in person. It was super nice, but I've lowered it for you guys for the deal of the week. $42.99. Bye, bye, bye. Can you pass up that $42.99 for probably the nicest example you've seen? Come on. I'll be passing it up, but someone else might not. Someone else might like it. Fine. $41.99. Fine, fine, fine. Just go pick it up. Thank you. I don't want to drive out there. You think they'd buy it for $4,000? I'm like Greg of Kansas. I don't want to go anywhere. I love that I'm just lowering it like $800 here. Yeah, that's fine. $4,099 since Dennis still isn't a fan. That can be like the deal, the what the fuck, too. Like, damn, Zach is such a coin giver. Pinball bounty. I got some bad, sad news to report, Dennis. Oh, no. You're out of topics.
    94:19
    No more games to bounty. I'm going to reprise a title that was once retired from the pinball bounty. Radical? Your boy counted one's eggs before thine house. Oh, the Dolly Parton. The Dolly Parton is going back onto the pinball bounty list because I spoke too soon.
    94:39
    And her eggs will not be coming home. The person backed out of the trade. Trade. Shipping. Michelle's set up. And for personal reasons and nostalgic reasons, he was very sorry and couldn't do it. dolly had her little finger nubs bruised up against his wrist too don't let me go darling i know what that's x gonna do to me right he's gonna leave me on running nine to five oh better than all the transitions you've done no no my segues are still better today your segues are not better i'm not event horizon it's not objectively not and as always ladies and Gentlemen, find me a Dolly Parton because we need your back. I'm just here to report the fact. Get me a Dolly because numbers don't lie. On Unequivocally, the best segment, much better than Rumor Corner. Much better than Rumor Corner. What's that bullshit that Triple Drain does? Triple combo.
    95:52
    The intro is better than the entire segment? Yeah. Which is 50 minutes of us explaining a game without it in front of you. We should call that segment the Charlie Brown adult effect. Wah, wah, wah, wah, wah, wah, wah. And then when you get to ball two, wah, wah, wah, wah, wah, wah. I don't know if they could even save that segment with a video.
    96:16
    I don't know. I'm just joking. I do love that segment. It's almost as good as the Slam Tilts. Would you or would you not buy that? Yeah, I figured you'd like that segment. That's another one that expects you to be looking, though. They do a pretty good job of explaining visually. Ron does really focus on saying, where's the back glass? It's all just a flake. He didn't take the glass off? Because I never load them up. I only just use my imagination when I listen to that. Bruce's penis inverts whenever they use LEDs on an EM or an early solid state.
    96:48
    No! Dennis, where can people catch you? They can always email me at eclecticgamerspodcast.gmail.com or go to facebook.com slash eclecticgamerspodcast and use the Messenger tool to send me a message. If you want to get a hold of me, you can do so by emailing thepinballnetwork at gmail.com. We have a lot of exciting stuff coming up.
    97:08
    A lot of, yeah, a lot of exciting stuff coming up. SDTM, a video series. Go like, subscribe, follow that as well. That's TPN stuff, social medias, the Instagrams, the chit-chats, the, is there a chit-chats? That's a TikToks. I don't know.
    97:24
    Twitch. You know what I'm thinking about doing? Joel and I have been discussing. He's going to be doing Flippin' Out Pinball streaming next year as well. We're thinking about taking our services maybe over to YouTube. What do you think about that? It makes a lot of sense for the VODs in particular.
    97:42
    Something we're thinking about. Flippin' Out Pinball product showcase this week is a Teenage Mutant Ninja Toadles premium. Got a couple left in stock. I think pros, too. Come get them, people. It's the last call, last chance to get one. And while you're there, you might as well get a top or two. I mean, come on. You may see this week on Joel's stream, speaking of, maybe he has a new accessory for his TMNT, and they aren't them fucking metal flippers again. People are writing and asking about that. He's got Travis talking about those now.
    98:12
    What is going on? Part of that, I blame myself for part of it, and I did issue a quasi-apology to Joel. Such as? What do you mean? Well, because I feel he's really sensitive, because I've referred to them as training wheels. I was sensitive to that and I don't even endorse the product. And I still think it is. I don't think they'll make you a better player because I think they'll teach you things that are not actually real-world pinball relevant. But anyone should always set up their personal games any way they want. Oh, I didn't see that. It's not my goal to make people feel bad about making their lives easier. But it's the same thing as taking the tilt ball about and then thinking like you're some sort of badass because you're doing slide saves all over the place. I'm like, you're nothing. You're tangoing. Your skill is nothing. But if that's what makes you happy, do it. Just don't think that it made you a good player because, if anything, it made you pick up some bad habits. What about the five ballers? Again, you want to progress through the game, and it's not about getting better at the game. Do what you need to do. Did you notice his eyes twitching?
    99:13
    Do what you need to do. What about people lower the posts all the way down? Sure. Do what you need to do. You should be having fun. Prioritize having fun. But there are two different things between having more fun and getting better at playing. So decide what you want to do because some of the choices are mutually exclusive. Not all of them, but some of them. Now, I'm going to give a shout-out to Pinball Party this last week. I messaged Jason over there, and he kind of fucked my whole world up. Really? He gave my mindset a twirl. I've been just behind The Walking Dead Pro as the superior trim level for that game for years. You know them. and I swore behind it. It's pro or nothing. Either you have a shit left ramp or you have one that's one of the best in pinball. Sure, you don't get the walk bombs and stuff, but I can't even give him credit because he's made me start second guessing myself on maybe he is right. Maybe the premium LE is the way to go. It does have a lot more features. It is more immersive. The code is better. I mean, the code's better because of the walker bombs. Yes, yeah. And it is an advantage. I mean, for me, they've always been a bit of a wash. I do own a Pro. I had spent a lot of time on an LE. I probably, until I owned my Pro, would say I had more time on an LE than anything. It's just so, like, the Walker bombs obviously are great.
    100:37
    I don't think that the magnet with the well walker adds anything. I think the crossbow is not a good toy.
    100:48
    If anything, it makes it easier to get the drops. So the Bicycle Girl, the pop-up ramp, the ramp is worse, and all you do is lose control when it's open, whereas it actually makes sense to play Bicycle Girl on the Pro. So overall, while I think that the Premium LE looks a lot better as a game, I do – walker bombs aside, I think I favor just about everything that the Pro did. I think so too. So I'm going to stick with Pro. But lighting. He has some solid points, and the lighting was a good example. It is, especially when you consider it being one of the best games ever with wizard modes and those immersive moments.
    101:26
    And then the thing that really struck me is I've contacted certain in the past coders and I said, hey, is there any way that I can take my pro and wire up an action button and put the premium code on it just so that there is a walker bomb? Like I was invested into this and they were like, no, Zach, you can't do it. There is no way to do that. I was like, shit, hashtag firmware, whatever. But then when he dropped the bomb of, if somebody was that worried about it, why wouldn't they just get a premium LE and put a pro left ramp in? And I was like, holy shit, I could do that.
    102:05
    Now, many of you that are well into Walking Dead that understand that game are thinking to yourself, well, no, you can't do that because there's a switch when the ramp flips up and you bash the bicycle girl, right? But you could set up a bracket with a secondary switch on that left ramp because when you hit that left ramp anyway right now, and it's during bicycle girl and what is it, CDC, you get credit for those two shots with one shot, so you can just hook up another switch. That's kind of rocked my world. I'm considering it, just not the premium because it's, why would you have a fish tank topper on the back? That makes no sense. It'd be the LE. All right, where am I at? James Bond. Bye, James Bond, from Flippin' Out Pinball, please. If you want a limited edition 60th anniversary, I don't know what to tell you. We're making a list. We've got the Vault. We added that Black Knight Swords of Rage limited edition vinyl. Just in, we've got a Mandalorian Pro pre-owned in stock, an Ultraman NIB, an Iron Maiden Pro. I can't believe that thing hasn't sold pre-owned yet. Toy Story 4 LE in stock. We've got some spaces available for the CE model. Cactus Canyon Remake SE is in stock. We're taking orders for the SE+. Oktoberfest Classic in stock. Mando's in stock. Rush is in stock. Star Wars is in stock. Led Zeppelin is in stock. GNR is in stock. People, there's no more complaining that you want a pinball machine and you can't get one. There's plenty here. We even have a Batman Forever right now. $4,200. One of the funnest flipping playing wide bodies in existence. We've got Insider Connected kits and the Star Wars specialty aprons, as well as Alien pre-orders we're taking and Queen pre-orders. We're all Thrills Machines. Golden Tee 2022, both new and used. I think we're taking orders for the PGA model as well. We've got accessories at the Ying Yang. We got motors in, shaker motors for Stern and CGC now. Banners, escalaras. TPN last week, Dennis, we had Pinball Party Podcast, episodes 9 and 10, as well as the Triple Drain Pinball Podcast. Both really, really good, good episodes, both 9, 10, and the Triple Dream Show. Those are like must-plays whenever I see them pop up. So nicely done, gentlemen. TPN this week, we have a final round pinball podcast. I think TLS and Marty were trying to squeeze one out this week, but it's going to be early this coming week. So you're going to hear that very soon. For Dennis Creasel, as always, I am Zach Manning. Folks, just remember, I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Atari pinball machines on fire in the arcades of California. I watched Gottlieb's glitter in the dark near the bowling alley gates. All of those moments will be lost in time like tears in the rain. Time to drain.
    104:46
    And always practice safe pinball and stay out of my way. Or you'll pay. Listen to what I say. Is that a happy Gilmore reference? Yeah, that's right. Why don't I go eat some hay? I can make things out of clay and lay by the bay. I just, hey, what do you say?
    105:04
    See you guys next week. Or probably two weeks, to be honest. Why are people just... Are you going to go out to your... What is that thumping? They were thumping on the upstairs. Oh, it's that Christmas... They got the Christmas spirit. No, I'm co-thumping. They got the Christmas spirit. Hey, be quiet!
    105:33
    Sadly, to piggyback off of that, I hate the fucking word piggyback. Piggyback! Did you watch the last episode of House of Dragons? Yeah, yeah, I'm all caught up. I didn't realize there were bigger dragons.
    105:48
    When they're old, they're big. Is that? I thought they might have been a different species of dragon. That was one of the oldest dragons. Is there just one species of dragon? You know, I think they're all technically the same species, but when the kids are flying around on dragons that were eggs when they were born, and another one goes and finds the dragon that his aunt was riding that was already full-grown when she tamed it, it was just the older the bigger. I hate that little bastard, too. The little patch on his eye. Zeppi, Raph. Video game people will know the reference when they see him. You know what the problem is with Game of Thrones? Nope. House of Dragon. There's not a character I can get behind. I really don't like any of them. Oh, they're all kind of written to be unlikable. Yeah, well, HBO successfully did that with Succession. All pieces of shit characters, all lovable, still the same.
    106:43
    I got a call in a call telling me to get the kids to be quiet. You're doing that with a power. So 21st century. Hey, can you get the kids to stop jumping?
    106:54
    Thank you. Bye. They're working on their cheers. They probably are. But dad doesn't like any happiness. There will be no joy except Christmas joy.
    107:25
    you