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Kaneda & Cengiz Chat on The Godfather Reveal Day

Kaneda's Pinball Podcast (Patreon feed)·podcast_episode·34m 48s·analyzed·Mar 11, 2023
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 (batch) · $0.024

TL;DR

Kaneda & Cengiz analyze JJP's Godfather reveal, pricing, and market concerns

Summary

Kaneda and Cengiz discuss the official reveal of Jersey Jack Pinball's Godfather game on reveal day. They analyze the marketing approach, game design, theme integration, pricing strategy, and the broader market dynamics affecting collector purchases. Key tensions emerge around JJP's refusal to send Collector's Edition units to Denmark, the complexity of the ruleset, and concerns about whether premium pricing ($15k+) will impact sales in a buyer's market where operators are increasingly priced out.

Key Claims

  • Jersey Jack Pinball confirmed Godfather roughly a year ago before official reveal

    high confidence · Kaneda stated 'You told us about this a year ago. You confirmed this a year ago.'

  • JJP built 100 units of Godfather for pickup on reveal day

    high confidence · Kaneda: 'They built 100. So we are going to see streams of this game any minute now'

  • JJP will not send Collector's Edition units to Denmark due to distributor restrictions

    high confidence · Cengiz: 'JJP won't send CE to Denmark... Because of my bro's distro here' and 'They did exactly the same thing when G&R came out'

  • Godfather CE pricing remains identical to Toy Story CE pricing

    high confidence · Kaneda: 'Let's talk about their LE and CE pricing, which remains the same as Toy Story'

  • Stern is not yet implementing non-refundable deposits on new game preorders

    medium confidence · Cengiz: 'Stern is not non-refundable yet' in contrast to JJP's policy

  • Multiple distributors are claiming Godfather CEs are 'gone' in secondary sales listings

    medium confidence · Cengiz witnessed multiple distros advertising on Facebook 'CE gone,' though Kaneda verified CEs are still available on JJP website

  • JJP is rumored to be holding back more CEs than previous releases to maximize direct sales

    medium confidence · Kaneda: 'I hear Jersey Jack might be holding back more CEs than they did last time. And so like, who knows? I mean, they make more money when they sell them directly.'

  • Eric Meunier is the designer primarily responsible for Godfather's completion

    high confidence · Kaneda: 'Eric finished this game. He has so much time... He's very prolific. He's very efficient.'

  • JJP never finishes code updates for older machines (Guns N' Roses, Pirates)

    high confidence · Kaneda: 'Jersey Jack Pinball never finishes their code... If you're a Guns N' Roses owner, where's the final code? If you're a Pirates owner, years go by.'

Notable Quotes

  • “I just didn't expect this. I was just blown away. But I was constantly thinking, when is Zack's video going to come out? Because we all know how it works with J.J.P.”

    Kaneda — Highlights the community expectation that Zach Sharpe's video will be the primary marketing vehicle for JJP announcements, raising questions about JJP's own marketing effectiveness

  • “From a marketing standpoint, the one-minute sizzle video, you need that. No one's going to sit down. You can't casually send people a 20-minute video to deep dive into interviews with Keith and Eric.”

    Kaneda — Defends JJP's short teaser video format as necessary for casual audience reach, contrasting with specialist content creators

  • “I want to listen to what's inside. What are you listening to when you start a game, when you play, when you go into multiple, what's going on?”

    Cengiz — Emphasizes the audio design as a critical unknown factor for home collectors making $15k+ purchasing decisions pre-stream

  • “This is why it's a really tough theme for pinball... Nothing's not there that you want it to be there because we can't even imagine what we wanted there.”

    Kaneda — Articulates why Godfather's abstract crime theme makes it harder to judge incomplete theme integration versus concrete IP like Toy Story or Pirates

  • “Avoid red and blue shots. Shoot blinking lights, avoid red and blue shots. That's the worst thing you can do in a pinball machine.”

    Cengiz — Criticizes code design that requires players to read backglass/LCD instructions rather than play intuitively, a common complaint about complex JJP ruleset design

  • “Jersey Jack owners are not like Stern owners. The rule sets in their games are way more complex. The only way to enjoy a Jersey Jack machine is if you really learn the rule sets.”

    Kaneda — Defends JJP's design philosophy as intentionally targeting depth-oriented players, acknowledging the market segmentation between JJP and Stern buyers

  • “I love Lamborghini and Ferrari. You know why? Because I never have to make the decision on whether or not I should buy one... It's really easy to appreciate things when you know you're not going to have to make the stressful decision whether or not to financially pull the trigger on it.”

Entities

Jersey Jack PinballcompanyGodfathergameEric MeunierpersonKanedapersonCengizpersonZach Sharpeperson

Signals

  • $

    market_signal: Premium pricing at $15k-$16.5k per machine creating buyer's market where previous 2-machine buyers now purchase 1, and 1-machine buyers purchase 0, waiting for used market deals instead

    high · Kaneda: 'at these prices where people used to buy two machines, they're going to buy one. Where people used to buy one, they're not going to buy any... It's a buyer's market... FOMO day one sellouts are not going to happen unless you have something as powerful as a Back to the Future license'

  • ?

    operator_signal: Location operators increasingly priced out of premium JJP games at $12k+ entry point; ROI calculation shows 6,000-play deficit versus cheaper Stern Pro models; shifting operator preference toward Stern and simpler games

    high · Kaneda: 'If you buy a $12,000 Godfather, you're starting out 6,000 plays behind someone who buys a Stern Pro' and 'operators are not buying these games at these prices now'

  • ?

    product_strategy: JJP rumored to be withholding more Collector's Edition units than previous releases to maximize direct-to-consumer sales margin; regional distribution restrictions enforced despite distributor showroom demand

    medium · Kaneda: 'I hear Jersey Jack might be holding back more CEs than they did last time... they make more money when they sell them directly' and Cengiz testimony that CE units restricted to Denmark despite distributor infrastructure

  • ?

    gameplay_signal: Godfather code includes mode requiring players to avoid red/blue shots while shooting blinking lights, necessitating backglass/LCD reading during play; creates friction for casual/location players unfamiliar with complex rulesets

    high · Cengiz critique: 'avoid red and blue shots. That's the worst thing you can do in a pinball machine... you don't look at the back glass when you play. 99% doesn't look at the back glass'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.023

0:00
All right. Oh, yes. Metro Django from Denmark and my boy Caneta from New York City is back on again. Let's do this. Yeah, the birthplace of the mafia. I don't know if that's true. It's probably Sicily, but then they came here. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Chris, finally, JJP8 is out. What do you think, my friend? Well, I'm just glad it's out, right? We knew about this game for, what, a little over a year? It's confirmed it's not Harry Potter. All the Harry Potter fans are crying. I'm glad it's out. It's always fun to get a new pinball machine to analyze, to talk about, and now the speculation is over. So, super happy they got it out the door. Absolutely, man. You told us about this a year ago. You confirmed this a year ago. Thank you for that. And the game is finally out.
0:56
Yeah. What was your first thoughts when you watched that one-minute J.J.P. clip? Yeah, no, I was like, it's very Italian, gaudy, ostentatious. I felt like I was walking in, you know, whether it's Trump Towers or an Italian restaurant, you know, I thought it was like, it was, it screamed red and gold and all this ornate stuff going on. And so that was my first reaction is like, wow, like this. And I will say it wasn't what I was expecting because Godfather, I feel like is a little bit more subdued, a little bit more classy, like piano black and gold. So I don't know. I don't know. I was a little bit blown away by how vibrant it was. What about you?
1:48
Let me tell it this way. I saw that first minute video and I was stunned. I thought it looked amazing. The music was amazing. I was just I didn't expect this. I was just blown away. Really enjoyed it. But I was constantly thinking, when is Zack's video going to come out? Because we all know how it works with J.J.P. And then, I don't know, one hour later, Zack's video hit the market. And I'm telling you, I don't understand why JJP uses time and energy on their own one minute trailer. Just give everything to Zach, pay Zach a lot of money because that guy can just edit and put on a great show. It was about 25 minutes video and it was so enjoyable. I love the game, but I'm really angry at JJP. So I'm going to start with talking about that and then we can talk about the game. Is it okay with you? Yeah. Before we move on, I just want to say from a marketing standpoint, the one-minute sizzle video, you need that. No one's going to sit down. You can't casually send people a 20-minute video to deep dive into interviews with Keith and Eric. That sizzle video with the high polish is meant to be passed around Facebook to introduce this game to people for the first time. I think sometimes there's this, you know, people don't understand that a lot of people who buy these games are not on Pinside. They're not on Facebook. They don't have 20 minutes to sit down and hear about the rule sets of the game. So I just want to say I'm more excited by the sizzle and the firework kind of stuff. And then then I just want to see the game played like streamed by someone who's playing it. Because the one thing I still don't feel we got after both the Zach video and the JJP video, I still have not seen what it's like to just play this game for five minutes. And they're already asking people for non-refundable deposits. I have a big issue with that. We can talk about it later. But tell me what is bothering you about Jerser Jack Pinball not sending you a collector's edition to Denmark. I just spoiled it. Go on. Yes, because yesterday we talked to each other and we talked a few minutes and as soon as we went into details I said stop. We can't talk about this stuff. We have to have it on a proper way on a video. So I don't know your thoughts about this game. You don't know mine yet. So we have this genuine video telling everything. I heard by another content creator that you made three or four shows about this game. Live shows, I didn't watch them. So I don't know what your thoughts are. I think this is the best way to interact. Let get into it What up So what up What with the preamble No one needs this Edit that out No you should keep it and people will be like Genghis stop rambling Go on No no My issue is I love this theme I love this theme I love the movies I love everything about it And I want the CE version Okay. Absolutely the CE version and JJP won't send CE to Denmark. Why? Why? Why?

  • At current premium pricing ($15k-$16.5k per machine), home collectors are buying fewer machines and operators are increasingly priced out

    high confidence · Kaneda: 'at these prices where people used to buy two machines, they're going to buy one. Where people used to buy one, they're not going to buy any' and 'operators are not buying these games at these prices now'

    • Kaneda — Explains why positive reception doesn't translate to purchase intent at premium pricing—psychological distance from decision removes critical friction

  • “If you bought a $12,000 Godfather, you're starting out 6,000 plays behind someone who buys a Stern Pro. Yeah. 6,000.”

    Kaneda — Quantifies the operator ROI problem: JJP premium pricing requires significantly more plays to break even versus cheaper Stern equivalents

  • “You can't enjoy a Jersey Jack game on location other than really Guns N' Roses... You're really going to have to play it in a home environment, understand it.”

    Kaneda — Identifies structural market problem: complex JJP games are fundamentally incompatible with location/casual play, limiting operator appeal

  • “Pinball needs to be a little bit more like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat. And you can get deeper into it, but it doesn't need to be too complex.”

    Kaneda — Advocates for immediate accessibility balanced with depth potential, positioning Stern's design philosophy as more market-aligned than JJP's

    • Toy Story
    game
    Guns N' Rosesgame
    Pirates of the Caribbeangame
    Foo Fightersgame
    Scooby-Doogame
    Stern Pinballcompany
    David Fixperson
    Jack Barvenue
    American Pinballcompany
    Cupheadgame
    Keith Elwinperson
    Flip N Out Pinballcompany
    Naps Arcadeperson
    Steve Ritchieperson
    Sunshine Laundromatvenue
    Pat Lawlorperson
    Robert Englundperson
  • ?

    design_philosophy: JJP and Stern occupy divergent market positions: JJP prioritizes deep ruleset complexity targeting home enthusiasts with learning curve; Stern prioritizes accessibility and arcade simplicity. JJP games underperform in location/casual settings

    high · Kaneda: 'Jersey Jack owners are not like Stern owners... You can't enjoy a Jersey Jack game on location other than really Guns N' Roses... pinball needs to be like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat, accessible but deeper'

  • ?

    product_concern: JJP historically fails to complete code updates for released machines; Guns N' Roses (2020) and Pirates still receiving updates years after release, suggesting code is never officially finished

    high · Kaneda: 'Jersey Jack Pinball never finishes their code... If you're a Guns N' Roses owner, where's the final code? If you're a Pirates owner, years go by. Years go by'

  • ?

    content_signal: Community perceives Zach Sharpe's independent reveal video as more effective marketing than JJP's official 1-minute teaser; Kaneda suggests JJP should outsource marketing entirely to Sharpe

    high · Kaneda: 'when is Zack's video going to come out? Because we all know how it works with J.J.P... Just give everything to Zach, pay Zach a lot of money because that guy can just edit and put on a great show'

  • $

    market_signal: Significant uptick in used pinball machines listed for sale across Facebook groups and distributor ads; indicates collector capital reallocation and trading down rather than new purchases

    high · Kaneda: 'Of course, it's a combination of Foo Fighters and Disco. So many pinball machines are up for sale this week... people have to make room, not only room, they need to free up capital'

  • ?

    design_innovation: Godfather features distinct playfield artwork for LE vs CE variants (Don Corleone figure placement differs); JJP provides greater art package differentiation between editions than Stern premium/LE models

    high · Kaneda: 'Jersey Jack always switches up the playfield art between the LE and the CE. They give you more like they give you more between models than Stern does'

  • ?

    business_signal: American Pinball's Cuphead release scheduled after TPF (next week), putting it weeks behind Godfather and Foo Fighters reveal; raises questions about whether delayed launch timing undermines competitive position

    medium · Kaneda: 'David Fix is releasing this Saturday... Do you think American Pinball waited too long? Absolutely'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Community praise for Godfather design ('amazing, instant classic, Eric killed it') decouples from actual purchase intent; premium pricing psychological distance removes decision friction, enabling appreciation without commitment

    high · Kaneda: 'everyone's like game's amazing, instant classic... And then like well you buying one, like no way man 15 is too much... It's really easy to appreciate things when you know you're not going to have to make the stressful decision'

  • ?

    theme_integration_signal: Godfather's crime/business theme lacks tangible physical playfield elements compared to concrete movie IPs; difficult to judge incomplete theme integration because audience cannot visualize missing elements like they can with Toy Story or Pirates

    medium · Kaneda: 'Nothing's not there that you want it to be there because we can't even imagine what we wanted there. With Toy Story, we're like, it's missing the claw... But nobody wanted just like Ford'

  • ?

    manufacturing_signal: JJP manufactured 100 Godfather units on reveal day for immediate distributor and location pickup; enabling rapid stream availability and gameplay verification before market commitment

    high · Kaneda: 'They built 100. So we are going to see streams of this game any minute now, which is good'

    • 5:21
    I can't tell you why. What does it make so sense? What do you mean you can't say why? Because of my bro's distro here. So nobody in Denmark can get a CE? No. No one. No.
    5:37
    And my brother, he puts out these games in the biggest showroom here in Scandinavia where everybody can check it out, enjoy it and play it. But no CE to us. They did exactly the same thing when G&R came out. All the LEs we want, but no C.E. And this pin, look at this pin. You can't buy the limited edition of Godfather. Just look at how the C looks, man. I love all the gold. I love Don Vito Corleone. I love everything about it. And the LE looks like a Stern Pro with that black armor, nothing in it. No, it doesn't. No, there's nothing. No gold, no nothing. The CE looks really nice. It looks, you know, the topper, the armor. But the LE is not, like, barren. You're not missing anything when you're standing over the game playing. And actually, in the LE's defense, which I rarely do, and I would not buy an LE, by the way, because I think they're going to just lose value because they announced they're making $5. I actually like the Ellie's sculpt of the mobster up the middle. There are two different sculpts. You notice that? The CE guy's wearing a hat. I still think both sculpts look a little bit like Bugs Bunny mobsters from Looney Tunes, but we can talk about that because I think they tried something here with trying to recreate human beings as pinball sculpts, and it's hard to do that. We see it with Incredible Hulk or Scooby-Doo, but when you try to make a human look authentic to what they look like in the movie, it can easily get very cartoony and campy looking, which I think is happening here. So you love the look of the game. You love the gaudiness. You saw the videos. Do you think we've seen enough, though, to buy it already? Well, I'm a huge audio guy. I need to have the audio experience. I need to know about the audio package. I know Naps Arcade, he has written some info about it. I know in that interview he tells about the audio part is amazing, but it's just so important to me. And not knowing about how the audio package under gameplay is is a huge miss for me. The reason why I really like this, why I want to spend $15,000, it's about $20,000 here in Denmark. Yeah, but Jangers, let me cut you off real quick. You're an audiophile. What are you expecting from music and Godfather, bro? There's like one theme song and what else? Like this isn't – what are you expecting to be hit with? Yes, exactly. They can't run the theme song all the time. It's not going to be like James Bond. I mean, it's not going to be one tune all the time. I want to listen to what's inside. What are you listening to when you start a game, when you play, when you go into multiple, what's going on? So you don't know what that's going to be, but you still want to buy one, but you still want to buy it. Yes, that's because the theme is just so cool. I love the theme. And if you ask me, the best designer that can integrate a theme is just Eric Minier. Let me ask you some questions because theme integration is something I harp on about a lot. Where are you seeing the Godfather movie integrated into the design of the game? The reason I'm so much in love with the CE version is when we see those two different cabinets.
    9:25
    Yeah. I mean the CE with golden lion and gold armor, everything gold. It looks so cool. So what's outside the glass is really where you're seeing it. Okay, that's great. Yeah, it's a pin I can have as a one pin at the corner of my living room. But it not a piece of furniture It a pinball But I saying what from the movies when you look underneath the glass what are you seeing Okay so like okay let me you know I don know when I think of theme integration I think oh you got the rocking ship from the Black Pearl You got the whirlpool from the movie You got Slimer You got a Godzilla bridge and building You've got a T-Rex in Jurassic Park that's integrating the theme into the physical game. But what in this game, from a design standpoint, is integrating The Godfather, which you love the movie, into pinball format?
    10:28
    Chris! No, this is why it's a really tough theme for pinball. And I'm not saying – I don't know what you would do, to be honest. Do you have the car that his wife gets – the car bomb explodes? Do you have the horse head? Do you have Don Corleone's office? Like that's why as a theme, it's like no one's seeing what's not in the game that they want it to be in the game because it's such a weird theme to integrate into pinball. And so that's why I think people are kind of really kind to it because they're not missing something they wanted to see. Like when we see Toy Story, we're like, it's missing the claw. It's missing Buzz Lightyear and Woody and the Army Man and like the Etch-A-Sketch. It's missing everything we loved about Toy Story 1, right? Nobody wanted just like Ford. But I think when you see Godfather, nothing's not there that you want it to be there because we can't even imagine what we wanted there. And I think that's why I was just wanted to ask you, what would you want to see integrated? And you're just like the cabinet legs, Chris. But Chris, something has happened at JJP. JJP as a company is not the same company that made Pirates. Yeah. And do you mean that in a good way or bad way? I don't know what you mean by that though. In a very bad way. When you mention Pirates, Pirates, I mean, that's just theme integration. Everything is just, it's filled up. It's so cool. It's stuff that we just love. Yeah. But as you mentioned, Tor Story, everything was ripped out. Everything was just off and that game was off, audio package was off, everything was off. Yeah. But this one has got a little bit more in it than the Tor Story. It's not empty like Tor Story. It has got, you know, it has got the horse's head. It has got the water fountain at the pop-up bar. It has got Don Corriano sculpture. You talked about the sculptures. I like the sculptures. They're fine, but I think, I feel like the size of the sculptures, they're just so much, look at how little Don Corleone is next to the mob guy next to him. I mean, it's all proportions. Well, I mean, like sculptures are always out of proportion, you know. It's two guys so close to each other, you know. Yeah, it's fine. It's fine. Like, I don't have an issue with that so much. The fountain would be the size of eight pinball machines if he went to scale.
    12:59
    When you talk about Jersey Jack, and I think it's an interesting discussion because I was a little worried that this game would be built during the Pat Lawler era in which he was yanking stuff out. And I do think that Pat was still the creative director when this game was made. It definitely looks like the bomb on this game is nowhere near what it was on games like Pirates. And look, I'm going to play devil's advocate. There's a lot of people out there who remember the Jersey Jack period when they were loading these games up. They were highly problematic. Operators didn't want them. Games were breaking down left and right. The more you put in, the more issues you might have. And I think they were trying to find that middle ground where we still want to give more than Stern, but we can't have a game that's impossible for our people to build because it's too complex. That's going to break down all the time. And then we've got nothing but complaints coming in from both homeowners and operators. So I think they've been trying to find that middle ground. And I would say this like Toy Story. We all know. Right. We're not going to go down that road. Oh, I'd like. But here's what I think with like looking at the stream so far of Godfather yesterday, I haven't really seen anything in the game like mechanically yet. That's like kind of blowing my mind like we saw with the T-Rex or the Godzilla building.
    14:20
    And I will you know, everyone's talking about the twenty nine ball pathways and the diverters, you know, and ripping them spinners is the new mech and pinball these days. But I will say this, all the diverters in the world and all the different pathways that do kaboom jump. I like stuff like that, you know, not that I don't love Toy Story, but I think it's more fun to jump a ball from the lower part of the play. I feel to the upper part than it is to just always get diverted in different ways Now look different strokes for different folks But I think we need to see we need to see Godfather though I need to see the way it all works how fast is because the other part when I watched the video I thought it looked slow But then I hear from people who played it and they say it fast And this will be settled when they stream the game It not going to be settled by watching any of the content we have so far Have they mentioned when they will stream it? Well, look, people have it. People are getting the games. They're that distributor in, I think it's in France. They just unboxed one or England. So this game is being picked up at Jersey Jack Pinball today. They built 100. So we are going to see streams of this game any minute now, which is good. And I also think people should wait to see that before they order the game. That's my big thing in 2023. Wait and see, people. You're going to be able to get one. Only Genghis can't get a CE. Everyone else will be able to get a CE.
    15:48
    And I don't want the LE. That's my issue. Let's talk about that. Let's talk about their LE and CE pricing, which remains the same as Toy Story. Do you think it's like a mistake? Should they have adjusted it based on the Toy Story feedback? What do you think? Well, Toy Story sales were just, it just went down the toilet. I think they should adjust it a bit down. But as I'm hearing right now, the C's are gone. I don't know if it's true. No, they're not. They're for sale right now on Jersey Jack's website. So who told you that? Because if you're going to make a statement like that and not even check jerseyjack.com right now, you're just making stuff up.
    16:28
    No, no, no. I haven't checked their page. When I'm scrolling on my phone watching different Facebook groups, a lot of distros, they have their – I don't want to say spamming. They are, what's it called? Advertising for sale. And a lot of them, they're writing, buy this game today, early version, CE, gone. Right, right. Multiple distros are writing that.
    16:57
    Well, here's what I heard. And again, this is just rumor. I hear Jersey Jack might be holding back more CEs than they did last time. And so like, who knows? I mean, they make more money when they sell them directly. I have a hard time believing that a thousand of these sold at 15k. Can you hear the fire alarm going off by the way? Like it's going off. Okay. I hear it. Typical New York. Yeah. No, I don't know. They always do this. Like I'm going to try to not go out and listen to the fire safety protocol. Yeah, okay. Chris, so no audio, no gameplay, no nothing. Okay, so I watched this gameplay video and I watched the coders, Keith, he was talking about his multiples, multiples, multiples. Please don't ruin this game with multiple heavy stuff. But one thing, at the back glass, there was this little text that said, this mode is going on. And then on that text, it said, avoid red and blue shots. Shoot blinking lights, avoid red and blue shots. That's the worst thing you can do in a pinball machine. Just like on the Pimball Brothers Aliens, I was in a mission and you don't look at the back glass when you play. 99% doesn't look at the back glass. We're looking directly down on the play field. This light is blinking and I want to shoot that. On a Jersey Jack game, every light is blinking in different multiple lights and then I have to avoid red and blue shots. I hope Adminio watches this and removes all BS like that. I don't understand.
    18:44
    Why? Because if this is programmed by a gamer that plays Pimball, this is made by a programmer. He wants to make some difficult software programming, but a real Keefe Elwin would never allow something like this. Because real gamers doesn't look at the fact that I kind of... No, but here's the thing. Everyone who owns a Jersey Jack machine, first of all, I disagree with you that avoiding shots isn't a fun thing to code into a game. It is. Secondarily, secondarily, Jersey Jack owners are not like Stern owners. The rule sets in their games are way more complex. The only way to enjoy a Jerserick machine is if you really learn the rule sets. So you will learn in that mode that that's what those lights mean. And then you won't even have to look up at the back glass or the trans light, you know, or the LCD. And that's the key to all Jerserick enjoyment. And I think it's debatable whether or not they make their games too complex and there's too much of a learning curve. But I think for the Jersey Jack fanboys I know, they get off on this stuff. They love the deep rules. And so they really, really, really don't have a problem with it. So I just want to say, I don't agree with you. I think that can be a fun mode. And I think it's too early to say they need to re-yank that out of the game. And also, we know, by the way, Jerser Jack Pinball never finishes their code. So get ready. If you're a Guns N' Roses owner, where's the final code? If you're a Pirates owner, years go by. Years go by. And it kind of annoys me about that. It's like, what else are you working on, guys? Finish these codes. Yeah, yeah, that's just a fair point, man. But I don't understand why they don't finish this course because when Eric Minier was talking about 16 LEDs in that fountain and he used different molding stuff and blah, blah, blah, I feel like this guy had three years making this. How boring, how boring that would be. No, no, no. Eric finished this game. He has so much time. No, no, no. Eric probably made this game. Gundon Roses is from 2020, right? Yeah, but you have to understand. He finished Guns N' Roses a good year before it came out. He's finished this game a good year before it came out. He's already, I would assume, 80% through his next game if it's not already done. He's very prolific. He's very efficient. And Jersey Jack Pinball's launches are so delayed that they're probably way ahead of schedule on R&D and development of future titles because of that. Now, I also fully expect – But it must be boring. Come on. Yeah, look, I think – just imagine – I never understand, you know, what happens on a random Wednesday in a pinball company when you know your game is three years away, right? Talk about a job in which you might be able to just coast a few weeks and no one's really noticing. Hey, Eric, how's Avatar 2 coming along? Yeah, man, cool. We just spent 40 hours getting the diverter to work properly. Who's even like, I don't know. And I imagine Steve Ritchie is really anxious to get his game out. I think we're going to see Ritchie's game at the end of the year. I think we're going to finally see two Jersey Jack new games in one year. Oh, that could be so cool, man. I hope so, but I don't think so. I don't think so. You know how, was it last year they said two games a year or was it the year before? Well, Jack's been saying it every year for like seven years now. Okay, that's true. Well, there you go. Well, on the playfield, the CE version has got glitter and all that pretty, pretty stuff that we all love, but it also has Don Vito Corleone down at the flippers. Yes, it looks so so so I'm so happy with their they're having two different artworks for these games. They're not just standard playfields. So it's not just the external. It's not just only the cabinet. The playfield. They always do that, though. Jersey Jack always switches up the playfield art between the LE and the CE. They give you more like they give you more between models than Stern does on a premium and an LE. They absolutely do. Another reason to get the CE. Yeah, but here's the hard part, man. And I've been hearing people like this has been, and you know, Kaneda is the bad guy in the hobby. I don't mind taking the arrows in the back. Why? I'm hearing everybody being like, game's amazing, instant classic, Eric killed it. Yeah yeah yeah Everyone like praising praising praising And then like well you buying one like no way man 15 is too much It like it not And here the thing And I mean this when something is out of your price range it a lot easier to enjoy it I love Lamborghini and Ferrari. You know why? Because I never have to make the decision on whether or not I should buy one. And it's really easy. You don't know, brother. No, but it's really easy to appreciate things when you know you're not going to have to make the It's a stressful decision whether or not to financially pull the trigger on it. And I think that's why a lot of people, they have low expectations of the game. It didn't come in looking like Thunderbirds, right? And it works. The game looks fine. It's fine. It's everything about it. Nothing is like, but no one really cared that much. It doesn't offend anybody. And I think a lot of people just are not going to buy it, but they can appreciate what Eric did. And I actually like that. I think we need to get back to this period where we can celebrate something but not run to buy it. And at these prices, it's not even if Kaneda's feedback making people behave that way. It's just everyone is feeling financially strapped. Like if you just bought a Scooby-Doo and Foo Fighter and this game, let's think about if you bought all three games in their top trim. If you bought a Scooby-Doo with Butter Cabinet fully loaded, if you bought a James Bond and you bought a Godfather CE, Let's add that up right now. James Bond 60th? No, I won't even talk about that one. $13,500 for Scooby-Doo with Butter Cabinet with tax to your door. $13,500. James Bond would be $14,500. So what is that? That's $27,000, $28,000. $28,000 plus $16,500 for Godfather with tax and shipping.
    25:26
    What is that? $37,000? $38,000? No, it's more than that. It's like 43,000. And I have to pay 25% on top of that. On top of that. So what is going to happen now is at these prices where people used to buy two machines, they're going to buy one. Where people used to buy one, they're not going to buy any. They're going to wait for it to be maybe used and they're going to just enjoy what they have. And I think it's an interesting – it's a buyer's market. And I keep saying it. Instantly, it's flipped. Like the FOMO day one sellouts are not going to happen unless you have something as powerful as a Back to the Future license or an Indiana Jones or a Matrix. Stuff like Godfather will never sell a thousand at 15K a pop instantly. But have you seen all the Facebook groups, pinball sales groups? Oh my God. I don't know. Of course, it's a combination of Foo Fighters and Disco. So many pinball machines are up for sale this week. It's totally a bias market. Yeah, because people have to make room, not only room, they need to free up capital. And I don't know, maybe I'm wrong and I'm the poorest man in America. But unless you're like making a million dollars a year, you are not throwing down $30,000 on pinball machines in one month. And there's just no way. And, you know, you might have money saved up. And again, you might want to do that. You might see the value in it. But I think a lot of people, you know, they're just going to they're going to wait. And as more games go on the used market, more deals will be had. And this is going to be an interesting test because Toy Story flopped for other reasons It flopped because nobody wanted Toy Story 4 and it was empty Godfather is I think a real good test because it arguably much more in it than Toy Story It's not as offensive to people who love the theme. We'll see what happens, right? We'll see what happens. How long will Foo Fighter hype last? I think it looks great. What looks better, Foo Fighters or this?
    27:42
    Oh. So, looks or what I want? Looks better from an aesthetic standpoint. Looks, it's Godfather CE. Aesthetically. Because I love all the gold. I love Don Corleone. I love all that. But the game that I want, the game that I want to play, it's 100% Foo Fighters. Because I'm a real stern playing guy, stern code, stern flipper, stern everything. I love that stuff.
    28:20
    But this is not a bad game and I would unbox it if they will send a couple of Cs to Denmark. I will unbox and show everything and I can't share all the details why and I think those details are just so idiotic details. I'm so sorry, but I feel like Eric, when I watched that video, he explained you have to do all the different tasks, really decode everything, and then at the end you have to kiss the ring. It was so cool, and I was so engaged. I was like, I want this. Call my bro here in Denmark. Jay, I want this. And he said, no CEs to Denmark again. Now, have you guys ever got CEs? Oh, we have got pirate CEs here. We have got – on our show – his showroom, he has got Willy Wonka CE. Oh, Willy Wonka CE with all that light underneath. So why can't you tell us? I mean is it really like a weird reason or are you going to like burn your relationship? That's distro info that – I mean I – you know how I am. I share nothing. I'm just closed. I mean, look, if anyone at Jersey Jack Pinball is listening to this, you have a CE sold in Denmark if you want to actualize that sale too. Two today, yes. Well, look, man, I think it's a good day. What do you think? Okay, let's end this show, which has been fun. I love your enthusiasm. American Pinball. What are they doing? Can they follow all of these games and find buyers?
    29:58
    They're too laid out, man. Okay, let's be honest. Everybody has seen the pictures. Everybody knows how it looks. That's not true. I think you're absolutely wrong. I think 99% of people watching this will not have seen. But anyway, having seen it, what do you think is going to happen? Do they have enough in that game to get buyers away from Foo Fighters, Godfather, Final Resistance? I don't know if we should talk about the game when it's not out. I don't know.
    30:34
    We're not talking about the game. I'm asking you, do you think American Pinball waited too long? Absolutely. I mean, absolutely. And with all these non-refundable BS, Stern is not non-refundable yet, but I mean, they're just so laid out to the game and they should release what? I know that David Fix is releasing this Saturday before TPF which is next Saturday not this one He mailing games to different locations so they will have it for play It will be at Jack Bar in New York City. I will get to play it. This is the other thing I'm a little sad about Godfather Prices is a lot of operators are not buying these games at these prices now. So in all of New York City, there's nowhere for me to play Scooby-Doo. There's nowhere for me to play Godfather. I'm not sure. Maybe Sunshine Laundromat is putting them out. But I'm hearing from more operators too. They're priced out. Because think about it. If you buy a $12,000 Godfather, you're starting out 6,000 plays behind someone who buys a Stern Pro. Yeah. 6,000. Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. No-brainer. No-brainer. So, Jack Pah bought American Pinball and they didn't buy Scooby-Doo and Godfather? No, I think David Fix is sending him one. I don't think he even has to buy it. I think it's just, you know, it'll be put out as a marketing and promotional item. And he doesn't want to buy the Godfather? He didn't buy Scooby-Doo. He's not buying Godfather at 12, I don't think. Because of the price? Yeah, it's the price. It's the price. Also, if you look at the underside of that playfield, it's just not the best game to have on the list. So here's the thing, too. When you look at a Jersey Jack game, and I was telling my friend Derek this, who loves Jersey Jack, he loves the deep rule sets, he loves all this stuff. You can't enjoy a Jersey Jack game on location other than really Guns N' Roses. And because Guns N' Roses is like, you know, it's like you're playing a jukebox and you get right into the song. But the other machines, the rule sets, maybe, you know, sorry, maybe Toy Story because it's simpler, but a complex rule set or a deep one like Godfather. You're really going to have to play it in a home environment, understand it. You can already see it by all this stuff happening on the LCD. That's way too much to absorb. And then look at like Foo Fighters, how simple it is, like their animations, all of it. It's like watching a Saturday morning cartoon. That's what most people think about when they think about what should be on a pinball screen. And, you know, I see Jersey Jack's doing it again, like Hobbit-like, where there's like four or five different windows. And again, for the neophyte like me, it's overwhelming and it turns me off. For the nerds who love that stuff, because I always say Jersey Jack pinball is like role-playing games of video games. They're like a role-playing game. You didn't go to the arcade to play Final Fantasy or Zelda. You went to the arcade to play Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat. And I think pinball needs to be a little bit more like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat. And you can get deeper into it, but it doesn't need to be too complex. So that's why I think a lot of operators are like, if I want to make money, I'm not going to put Godfather Pinball in my location. I put a Scooby freaking do. No, not a Scooby-Doo. Are you crazy with all the mechanical issues they're having? That's a topic for another time. Jengiz, always a pleasure. I hope you get your godfather CE. Come on, Jen and Jack and Abs. Come on, we got billionaires over there. They can afford to. You'll pay for the freight, right? If you direct freight it, will you pay it? We just take it by air so we could have it tomorrow. There we go. Let's do it. Get this man his CE. Maybe this will help. Boxing video, man. That's it. See you, buddy. Have a great day out there. Bye.