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Let's Play Plants vs Zombies and Ms. Splosion Man pinball

BlahCade Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·1h 2m·held·Jan 9, 2023
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

BlahCade hosts discuss Zen cabinet plans and play legacy PinballFX2 tables unlikely to return.

Summary

Chris Friebus and Jared Morgan discuss Zen Studios' upcoming pinball cabinet plans, noting Arcade 1-Up's absence of a pinball machine announcement at CES 2023, and speculate about alternative manufacturing partners. They then play through Plants vs Zombies and Ms. Splosion Man pinball tables from Pinball FX2, discussing design choices, licensing barriers (Walking Dead, Portal), and the tables' unlikely return to future Zen releases.

Key Claims

  • Mel (Zen Studios) is planning titles approximately 2025, with numerous licensing agreements to manage

    high confidence · Chris Friebus discussing previous interview with Mel about licensing volume and planning horizon

  • Arcade 1-Up did not announce a new pinball cabinet at CES 2023

    high confidence · Chris and Jared noting Arcade 1-Up's CES announcement lineup lacked pinball; confirmed they announced Pac-Man, Wheel of Fortune, Mortal Kombat cabinets only

  • Zen's internal cabinet prototype build was meant to experiment with cabinet design approaches for future retail products

    medium confidence · Jared citing Mel's disclosure that Zen's cabinet build house was experimental in nature

  • Walking Dead pinball table will not be released in future Zen platforms due to licensing deal failure

    medium confidence · Chris and Jared discussing licensors (Telltale/Steam unclear) preventing Walking Dead re-release; Chris notes some leaked deals have fallen through

  • Portal pinball table will not return to future Zen platforms

    medium confidence · Chris and Jared confirming Portal licensing cannot be secured for future releases

  • Ms. Splosion Man is published by Xbox Game Studios / Twisted Pixel Games, released 2013, exclusively on Xbox

    high confidence · Jared confirming Xbox exclusivity as reason it won't appear in Pinball FX; verified game was never on PlayStation

  • Plants vs Zombies pinball table had significant visibility design issues on 2D displays due to color blending between playfield levels

    high confidence · Chris noting green ramps and upper playfield blend together; states it was solved when viewed in 3D on PS3

  • Pinball Pass subscription will likely be required for future Zen retail cabinet products due to inability to transfer digital purchases across platforms

    medium confidence · Chris and Jared speculating that Pinball Pass subscription is logical solution given removal of in-game currency system

Notable Quotes

  • “When you're planning that far in advance, you probably go, oh, hang on, what licenses can I talk about and can't talk about and what ones are just in planning stages?”

    Jared Morgan @ ~early in episode — Explains Zen's secretive approach to licensing and announcement strategy

  • “There's been a few titles that he's leaked to us that the deal fell apart and went away. So it's there's a good reason why you don't hint at things because any number of things are tentative.”

    Chris Friebus @ ~early discussion — Confirms licensing deals can collapse even after being leaked to media

  • “I find that very interesting that Arcade 1-Up didn't have a new cabinet to announce. It makes you think who it's going to be.”

    Chris Friebus @ ~mid-show — Signals uncertainty about next retail pinball cabinet manufacturer

  • “All they need is somebody that can slap some wood together and slap a monitor in, and ta-da, away you go.”

    Chris Friebus @ ~mid-show — Describes minimal requirements for a cabinet manufacturer to partner with Zen

  • “It's just one of those combo shots that's just like good luck ever getting it.”

    Chris Friebus @ ~Plants vs Zombies gameplay — Commentary on poorly balanced shot difficulty in Plants vs Zombies table design

  • “This is a layout that I would... I wouldn't mind Zen recycling this with a different theme.”

    Chris Friebus @ ~Ms. Splosion Man gameplay — Praise for the Ms. Splosion Man playfield layout mechanics despite licensing barrier

Entities

Chris FriebuspersonJared MorganpersonMelpersonZen StudioscompanyArcade 1-UpcompanyPlants vs ZombiesgameMs. Splosion MangameWalking DeadgamePortalgame

Signals

  • ?

    product_strategy: Zen Studios appears to be seeking alternative manufacturing partners beyond Arcade 1-Up for retail pinball cabinet production, with focus on stateside or European manufacturers to address shipping/supply chain issues

    high · Chris and Jared's extended discussion of Zen's need for a manufacturer with 'good track record with shipping worldwide' and speculation about 'a brand new player' or stateside/European partner; notes Arcade 1-Up's absence from CES 2023 announcement despite previous cabinet releases

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Multiple digital pinball licensing deals are fragile and can collapse during development or between releases, affecting platform availability and title portability

    high · Chris explicitly states 'there's been a few titles that he's leaked to us that the deal fell apart and went away' and discusses Walking Dead, Portal titles as casualties; Mel keeps licensing details confidential due to deal uncertainty

  • ?

    product_concern: Plants vs Zombies pinball table has significant visual design issues on 2D displays due to color blending between playfield levels, partially resolved through 3D display format

    high · Chris notes 'green on the upper play field and the ramps as you do on the lower therefore making it very difficult to know what level your ball is on' and confirms 3D PS3 version resolved the issue

  • ?

    supply_chain_signal: Shipping and logistics remain critical constraints on retail pinball cabinet availability and manufacturing partner selection, with particular challenges for international distribution

    high · Chris: 'sure, pandemic was chips, et cetera, but it's the shipping of these things all around the world'; discussion centers on need for 'manufacturing partner that has a good track record with shipping worldwide' with 'relationships with the complexities of moving stuff around the world'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.188

0:00
blockade pinball podcast this is the blockade pinball podcast i'm your host chris freebus aka shut your trap joining me as always halfway across the world is jared morgan hello everyone how you going happy new year happy new year did you have uh loud concussion bombs going off for your new years yes we did loud concussion bombs all over the place we um you know people always light off the fireworks at new year's uh to be expected but this year i don't know what the heck they were launching but so my car although it technically has a car alarm it's not like an actual car alarm It's what came installed with the car, so that if somebody's really trying to jimmy the lock, then it'll, you know, honk and go to shut off, right? But otherwise, it's not a typical car alarm, right?
1:06
The things that they were launching were even setting my car off. Wow. Like, that's how much of a rattle it was giving my car. They must have been mortars. Pretty much. I mean, it sounded like it, so. Yeah. Yeah, it was good times there.
1:22
last time on the show, we had a chat with Mel. Glad all of you were able to check that out. It's always a good time, right, Jared?
1:31
Oh, it always is, yeah. Yeah, yeah. He's always really generous with his time for us. Every six months or so, we usually catch up with him. And the thing is with Mel, yes, it's a lot about what he says, but it's also a little bit about what he doesn't say. Oh, it's very much about what he doesn't say. Always. Because there's things that he just can't touch upon. And, you know, we try to poke and prod and get him to spill the beans on things. But, obviously, he's been holding it closer to the vest these days.
Pinball FX3
product
Pinball FX2product
Pinball Passproduct
Pinball Effectsproduct
Twisted Pixel Gamescompany
PopCapcompany
Steve Ritchieperson
CES 2023event
BlahCade Pinball Podcastorganization
  • $

    market_signal: Zen Studios planning retail pinball cabinet for 2023+ with focus on lower price points and multiple form factors (tabletop, smaller cabinet) to increase shelf availability at retail outlets like Target

    medium · Jared references Toy Shock's multi-form-factor strategy; Chris notes Target unwillingness to shelf large cabinet packaging; speculation about multiple SKUs at different price points to reach more homes

  • ?

    product_strategy: Pinball Pass subscription likely to be required for future Zen retail cabinet products due to removal of in-game currency system and inability to transfer purchases across platforms

    medium · Chris: 'if you're not having that, so it's either you're going to repurchase all the tables on Android or you're going to pay for Pinball Pass'; Jared: 'it seems logical' and 'I wouldn't be surprised in the least about that'

  • ?

    technology_signal: Zen Studios testing pinball effects engine on commodity hardware (low-end Asus-equivalent specs) and iPad M1 chips, suggesting flexible platform deployment strategy for retail cabinet

    medium · Jared notes Mel mentioned running pinball effects on 'low-end computer specs from Asus'; Chris confirms iPads 'with the M1 chip in them' are 'absolute beasts' and Zen is exploring iPad compatibility

  • ?

    regulatory_signal: Xbox Game Studios exclusivity and licensing restrictions prevent Ms. Splosion Man from appearing on PlayStation-based Zen platforms

    high · Jared: 'This was an Xbox Game Studios game... That's why we're not going to see it in Pinball FX'; Chris confirms 'This was never on PlayStation. This was only on Xbox.'

  • ?

    industry_signal: Zen Studios managing extensive licensing portfolio with deals in various planning stages, creating uncertainty around long-term product availability and announcements

    high · Chris and Jared discussing how Mel 'keeps it closer to the vest these days' due to 'sheer volume of licensing agreements'; Mel planning 'what, 2025?' with multiple moving parts

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Ms. Splosion Man pinball table demonstrates well-received playfield layout design (flowing mechanics, upper right flipper placement) despite IP licensing barriers, suggesting layout could be recycled with different theme

    medium · Chris: 'This is a layout that I would... I wouldn't mind Zen recycling this with a different theme'; Jared confirming 'It's flowy' and praising upper flipper design; Chris noting 'Steve Ritchie vibes'

  • ?

    gameplay_signal: Plants vs Zombies pinball features poorly balanced shot difficulty, including a flower pot combo shot described as nearly impossible to hit and a hurry-up flower pot target that's extremely tight

    high · Chris: 'That is not an easy angle to get into... It's ridiculously tight... That's bad'; 'I'm never going to get that flower pot. That's just like... That's so odd. No way, no how.'

  • ?

    content_signal: Pinball content community watches gameplay streams for clues about future announcements and corporate decisions, generating speculation from seemingly unrelated content choices

    medium · Jared: 'Love how people watch us to see like they get clues about what may or may not be happening in the game'; Chris receiving Steam notifications from viewers questioning why they're playing these specific legacy tables

    • 2:07
    He's used to our sort of tricks. But it's not just that he's used to our tricks. I think because of the sheer volume of licensing agreements that they've got on, you heard him, he's got a plan for, like, what, 2025?
    2:24
    Yeah. When you're planning that far in advance, you don't want to push anybody off the wire. Uh-uh, no. And the problem is, like, if you're planning that far in advance, you probably go, oh, hang on, what licenses can I talk about and can't talk about and what ones are just in planning stages? It would be a mind-blowing for a few to mention things that might not be happening. Yeah, I mean, even the discussions that we've had with him where sometimes he leaks us information that obviously we have to sit on.
    3:06
    But there's been a few titles that he's leaked to us that the deal fell apart and went away. So it was like, there's a good reason why you don't hint at things because any number of things are tentative. Sometimes it doesn't happen. Yeah, sometimes it doesn't happen.
    3:25
    What was the other thing that I was finding interesting about upcoming that he mentioned? I think folks were really interested and happy to hear about the VR aspect.
    3:39
    Well, I think they want more information about the VR aspect. Yeah, well, the fact that it's actually probably going to be a thing in 2023 at some point, based on what Mel was hinting at, is great.
    3:54
    I think it might actually overtake the attraction of cabinets for a lot of people with VR headsets. And also on PSVR as well, being on the consoles, that will be a really amazing experience. Yeah, so speaking of cabinets, CES just happened in Las Vegas, and Arcade 1-Up was there.
    4:17
    And if you look at what Arcade 1-Up's lineup announcement was, they're doing more Pac-Man machines, deluxe size. For only $500, I'm just like, wow, you guys really, really love to recycle those. Yeah, they got the Wheel of Fortune poker machine, Vegas casino machine, if you will. There was a Mortal Kombat machine.
    4:45
    What kind of machine didn't they make mention of, Jared? Pinball machine. I find that very interesting because we asked Mel about the retail presence, and he seemed to indicate that thumbs up, things were going to go. So I'm wondering what in the world is going on here?
    5:10
    Obviously it's not going to be with Arcade 1-Up. I was going to say, is Arcade 1-Up out? I reckon. I can't imagine that Arcade 1-Up is holding things close to their vest because this was like their announcement for the year, basically. If they were going to announce a cabinet, it would be there. Yeah, I mean that's where they announced the original product. Yeah. And as we said, last year we weren't expecting a cabinet, but we certainly were expecting that we're going to get something this year.
    5:37
    So I find that very interesting. We're going to have to keep our ears open and see if there's, I don't know, some new contender out there.
    5:48
    I don't know. I know that obviously when the cabinets were released, that was right at the start of COVID and the shipping became an issue. and customers were not able to get theirs, and then it fell into the price hike, which I know that that ruffled feathers over at Zen.
    6:10
    So it's curious. We'll see. But obviously, the other factor is you've got to believe that they're going to make this work with pinball effects.
    6:24
    And that means wireless integration. so that we're connected via Wi-Fi because I have a feeling this is where pinball pass is going to be a huge factor.
    6:38
    I think so. Because this is where you're going to be able to just have probably, it's probably going to have to be a PC or maybe a really high-end Android build or something like that. Yeah, I would say high-end Android. It's going to be high-end. Because I think Mel was saying that in his interview that he's been running pinball effects on what essentially is one of those low-end computer specs from Asus, I think he said. So it's possible to run it on commodity hardware.
    7:13
    So put that into a cabinet and there you go. There's your platform. Yeah, so what's interesting is here we go back around to our what would we like to see in a cabinet. and it becomes that whole idea of, well, we want a 1080p play field.
    7:34
    Yes, we do. We want a back glass with video because, obviously, you need it with video for all the new tables that Zen is making. It would be ideal if we had a third monitor for just 3 screens. obviously Wi-Fi connectivity I always think that's like the default build now what's that? it's got to be a three screen build and people will pay the money and that's what I'm thinking based off of all the mods that people have done to either their arcade one up machine or their at games machine I think it's pretty clear what we want yeah people have shown then what they want and I think you only have to look at their own cabinet build that they did to see what they're looking at doing in cabinets, you know. Because that was another thing that Mel brought up. Like that cabinet build house was to experiment with how cabinet builds work.
    8:37
    And so look to that and you should get some clues. Be curious to know, too, if they've had any kind of thought.
    8:47
    Mel was talking about how the game runs really well. I actually didn't say it runs great on iPad. He was just saying that iPads are extremely powerful now. Oh, yeah, with the M1 chip in them. Yes. All the new generation iPads are absolute beasts. Yeah, and remember we got sent, one of our viewers sent us a prototype for a machine that he was making, a little tabletop machine that you just slide the iPad right into to play? Yeah. It makes me wonder if, because I haven't heard anything more about that, and I know that we kind of told him, hey, you might want to talk to Zen because if they like your product, they'll help promote your product.
    9:30
    It makes me wonder maybe Zen will go for even that kind of a price point. I think they probably would have learned from what other manufacturers are doing as well. Have a look at the likes of Toy Shock with their different form factors and different price points for their product offerings, even though it was far side spilled. Right.
    9:54
    The idea they had about doing a tabletop version, a smaller cabinet, and different sort of product offerings, it just means that you'll be able to get your cabinet product in more houses, and that's what they want.
    10:09
    Well, I know those are the kind of things that, like, Target is much more willing to put on their shelf than this giant packaging that Target never carried in their shelves. you know what's really funny though like whenever I saw those 1UP Arcade pins Arcade 1UP sorry I flipped between the two right there's an arcade here called 1UP Arcade and I always get it's Arcade 1UP that's the cabinet building but there's I forgot my train of thought now okay it probably wasn't yep Anyway, we'll have to keep an eye out on that kind of thing. See what's going on, because I find that very curious that Arcade 1-Up didn't have a new cabinet to announce.
    11:04
    It makes you think who it's going to be. Who are the players out there? It might be a brand new player. You think about it, if all Zen really needs is a manufacturer for a cabinet. That's all they need. They've already got the software. They've already got the chipset for what they need. So all they need is somebody that can slap some wood together and slap a monitor in, and ta-da, away you go.
    11:32
    There's where it would be interesting, too, if they would be able to find maybe a manufacturer that is stateside, a manufacturer that's in Europe, so that they're not having to deal with the slow boat from China.
    11:49
    Oh, absolutely. You know. Yeah. And I think that's been the major problem. Like, sure, pandemic was chips, et cetera, but it's the shipping of these things all around the world. And I really think that what they really need to have is a manufacturing partner that has a good track record with shipping worldwide. they need to have a partner that has those relationships with the complexities of moving stuff around the world because it's not easy and I really do think that they're probably going to build a one machine like I said, it's one machine and then you'll be able to have the tables on it and again, that's why I would not be surprised if it is that it will require a Pinball Pass subscription. I wouldn't be surprised in the least about that.
    12:51
    It seems logical. Just because, obviously, you're not going to... Thanks, guys. Obviously, we can't transfer purchases.
    12:59
    Yeah, thank you. Wouldn't that have been wonderful if we still had the in-game currency that all you people complained about, so therefore we don't have that. Can't have nice things. So the only thing, so if you're not having that, so it's either you're going to repurchase all the tables on Android or you're going to pay for Pinball Pass and just have all the tables there. Or it's in a completely different shop or storefront. Like they might have their own digital storefront for this new pinball cabinet. Like who knows? Yeah. I don't know. Anyway, something to think about, keep an eye out, and see where we're going from there.
    13:44
    All right, so what are we doing today? We're going to play some pinball. We promised you that, hey, what the heck, let's go revisit some of these pinball effects 2 tables that never came into FX3.
    14:01
    Today we're going to play 2 that I don't think will make it into pinball effects either. unless you all are screaming for them and give Zen every reason in the world to go, all right, fine, we'll look up that license again. These ain't coming back. So that's what we're going to be doing. Let me load up the old Steam here, and we'll get this thing going on.
    14:33
    Now, this is the first time I've ever seen these games. Is it really? because I've never played them on Dimblefix 2 it was before my time on PC so um look at it burning it in there burning the image in alright so well let me ask you what you want to start with there Jared do you want to start with PVZ or Explosion Man yeah Plants vs Zombies is always one I've been interested in seeing okay Clans versus zombies.
    15:11
    Let's let the scroll over go. Brains. Are you seeing where an issue is already, Jared? Uh. No. No? So you have the exact same green on the upper play field and the ramps as you do on the lower therefore making it very difficult to know what level your ball is on Right Okay so it very much just a green mess It's a green mess. Here, I'll just go into our standard mode. Let me get my view into what I like. View two. So there you go. There's your... Oh, jeez, okay. Uh-huh. See why it's... The only thing that's helping you realize what the difference between levels are is the brown edges to the ramps. Yeah. Wow, okay. So when I finally, this table was available on the PS3 in 3D. When I saw it in 3D, it suddenly went, oh, I understand now. Yeah. That makes more sense. But where it, there's just areas of here that are just so. this whole habit trail just blends right in and this right there is that the upper? I mean it goes it's the ramp that goes up and then it's up yeah it's kind of brutal yeah brutal to look at but alright I'll get playing what's a green payee that you play with?
    16:57
    that's nice who is that voice that's in the game where's crazy Dave he'll come eventually alright I have to do things okay if you're thinking that for a second that I remember how to do things you've got everything coming yeah I do like the theme integration looks great oh the theme integration is fantastic yeah it's like totally plans versus zombies oh and you even have the little sunflowers spitting out suns mhm and what's the mechanic with that um good question so I'm obviously collecting suns yeah for whatever purpose I'm trying to see what happens when you shoot the lane I'm gonna that's my challenge hole to start a challenge There is Crazy Dave. There's Crazy Dave.
    18:03
    Nope. Bye Dave. Ah yes, it's all coming back to me as far as this game goes. Love it. Oh I like the corn cannon as a plunger.
    18:19
    See they really have done theme integration well here. Kill the zombies. So, if you think about it, a lot of the things that happened in here wound up being... Well, I shouldn't say a lot of, but with the zombies applied to Walking Dead.
    18:39
    Yes. Another table that we won't be getting in Pinball FX 3 or in Pinball FX. Yeah, sorry about that. Telltale games are not really keen on it.
    18:50
    Is it less Telltale and more... Steam, I thought. Oh, really? I thought that was the deal. Am I wrong? I don't know.
    19:03
    I thought it was just Telltale. I couldn't strike a deal with him. Why do I want to... Oh, excuse me. It's Portal that I'm thinking we're never going to see again. Portal, yeah. Portal. You know what? That means maybe... Maybe there's a chance of... Maybe.
    19:18
    So, when you do that... That... What would you call it? World Cup Soccer 94 launch loop, you can actually drop it in one of those three slots. Oh, is that what it is? The skill shot? Yeah, well, it looks like it. I don't know. It looks like coin toss.
    19:36
    Alright, let's see if we can activate Dave. So you've got to whack the car? Yeah, you've got to pummel his car. Oh, open his boot. There we go. Oh, nice.
    19:48
    Use slippers to select items. I hate stores. I never understood what that's it well it's insufficient here I have enough for that this is why I don't like the stories because you have to A have money and B it's on a timer and it's like yeah I don't like it I need time to read that to know what I can actually purchase and Zen has done that on a couple of tables and I really don't like it well we have discussed at length how we do not like fast scrolling messages on the uh dmd oh but i'm just talking about how i don't care for the store um all right the only one that does it right is epic quest yes wow what are you doing it oh so the are the suns the things that let you buy the things i don't know is it there's money i can't look at the uh dmd i'm trying to work it out like and it's a blind leading the blind here because i don't i've never played the gang. So I'm just... This is a table that I just tend to flip and things happen. Pretty much. And then eventually I start going, oh yeah, that's the area that I needed to go.
    21:10
    Because there's... How do I get to that upper flipper? Oh, I gotta just decide. Oh, would it be... Maybe the sun comes into play when you're doing a main battle? Like a challenge?
    21:24
    Ball three? I don't know about ball three. All right, let's try again. So, where it says sun at that center hole... Yeah, sun. If you shoot that tree, it vomits out the sun. Oh, okay. Is that what it does? I don't know. Hey, look, I'm asking. I don't know. So, launch ball. Is there a skill shot?
    21:48
    Doesn't look like it. Just launch it. Yeah. Well, maybe there is. It just doesn't tell you, which is bad. Oh, got it. Oh, man.
    22:05
    Oh, this. Okay, that hurry up into the flower pot. Did you see how fast that was? No. Okay. So, that hurry up was it lit this, my flower pot.
    22:16
    Okay? Okay. Literally, it is, you get one shot. The ball comes down, you have to hit it in rotation, right? That is not an easy angle to get into because you just typically shoot the slingshot instead. It's late on the flipper. Yeah, so I'm sitting there, even, come on. Even if you're not doing it on the fly. Yeah, so I'm trying to right now.
    22:43
    No. I'm going to try it again. It's like ridiculously tight. Oh, that's bad. That's bad. It's just one of those combo shots that's just like good luck ever getting it. One, two, three.
    23:06
    Okay. I reckon there is a skill shot to be had. There is. I realized. Hold on, see if I can... There it is. Whack the zombie on the head for skill shot.
    23:19
    What zombie? Yeah. Is it... Maybe there's a zombie in the water? Maybe. We'll have to have a look next time it comes up.
    23:33
    We'll have to work this out. Okay. Okay, here it goes. my fire class flashing here we go and that note what so what okay well today something's happening ordered something issued eating zombies looks like zombies of so good figure what can black well here's the points I think it's that we get coins for killing zombies.
    24:11
    Yeah, well, in the game they normally sort of pop out randomly. Normally if you get a really big zombie.
    24:23
    Oh, he's getting close. He did. I'm assuming that if they hit me, it's not good. But I also don't know. about to find out though yeah hey there we go oh that's a double yeah gee they keep coming geez double tap well because you're gonna get 14 out of 18 zombies yeah 16 zombies one more 17. I got a bucket head to get. Oh no. Oh! We got saved. I like the end music. Got the climb. I imagine the more missions you do the harder they get. Combo! You laughing at the ka-ka-ka combo? Yeah.
    25:29
    Well, that's the only thing we can afford. Twin Sunflowers. Suns worth twice as much. Twin Suns. Nope. Oh, nope.
    25:45
    That's what I'm saying. It's pretty slow, though. It's not too bad with the flow, but that shot is... Horrible. What does that shock give you, though? I have no idea.
    26:04
    Alright, so the pop-pumps are in there. Okay. We don't even know. Nope. Hidden pop-pumpers. That one said jackpot increased, so... Is it that the sun's increased jackpot? Do you think?
    26:23
    Maybe. I don't know. Let me hit Sun over there and find out. Let's see. Oh, no. It's just... I guess it's looking like it's adding whatever.
    26:37
    It's just... I don't... I'm really struggling to work out what the Sun... I mean... In the game, obviously, the Sun's let you buy... you'll let you equip your plants and buy plants so I would assume that it has something to do with when you're in a mode it makes it easier or something Take your pick for the flower pot.
    27:10
    Wabby Wobble. Do you want to hit, do you? Oh wait, the flower pot's open. What does the flower pot do?
    27:22
    Stinky the snail. Zamba test. Oh, okay. Diggers on the ground. Sure. Why not? Please. Cliff a button.
    27:44
    Okay. What are you supposed to do? Hit the flashing shots. Oh, right. So not the zombies, but the flashing. Of course, can't hit it. Of course not. Can hit other things, but not that. Got that one. There you go. Well, it looks like I lost the mode. Yep. There you go. Easy. Uh oh. Oh, I see the zombie now. He's got the mask on. So you've got to shoot it. That's going to be a hard one then.
    28:36
    Bonk. Oh, yeah, you got him. So in a lot of ways, you're right there that it is a coin toss. Totally coin tossed.
    28:58
    Sun Frenzy on two more. So shoot whatever you just did on... And get Sun Frenzy. Sounds like a multi-ball.
    29:12
    And I didn't shoot it. Is that the sun shot? I don't know. Oh, it's where the... You see how the star is flashing? It's a shot. Oh, yeah.
    29:21
    It's that. And it's moving. Hurry up. Shoot the flower. I'm never going to get that flower pot. That's just like... That's so odd. No way, no how.
    29:43
    Oh, I actually got it. Oh. Oh, wow. Oh, repeat module. Cool. She's flushing mines. Oh, that voice. But that's actually in the game.
    30:03
    Is it? Yeah. I've never heard that voice in the game. I could swear it's from the game. Nah. The only voice you hear is Crazy Dead going, Wah, wah, wah! Hmm.
    30:19
    Which is all you really need. Tells you how much I've played, like, for a little bit. All the sons. He just got squashed. Yep. With a squash.
    30:42
    Alright. I was like, I have to have a kickback by this point, right? Yeah, exactly. I was like, I wasn't even going to bother trying to save that. This is a good... Oh, okay. Okay, something happened. Okay going nuts Sure Okay Okay what are we doing Oh no you got cone coneheads Ooh and fog Survive the invasion Fog is fun Oh jeez
    31:26
    I like fog. Like... This is cool. It'd be really cool if the fog actually left, uh, you know, trails from the ball. Oh yeah, and let the ball just... Like it swirled? I'd be able to do that on my F-X. Mm-hmm. But not F-X, too. Because that's what we've been saying, like, you could do rain effects or... Yeah. Things like that. Aw. I failed the mode. Uh-oh.
    31:50
    Did you? Uh-oh. Jeez. Oh, I like how it fades away. And that's really cool. Okay. Alright. Well, there you go. There's a sense of Plants vs. Zombies for you, Jared. That's cool.
    32:08
    I can imagine it gets a bit long in the tooth after a while. It does. And... Jeez, look at those scores.
    32:18
    No, not 191. Millions. My best is 28 million. That's quite a slog. Yikes. Sorry, 191 million. You're right. Jeez. All right, let's take a look at Miss Explosion. Okay, so if you thought that that voice was annoying... It's strapping because it's getting wild. No, I didn't want a hot seat. Yeah, you're going to love this, Jared.
    32:51
    Apparently this was a Wii game, I think. It's based on a video game. It's based on a video game that I think was actually also a comic book? Possibly? Because if I'm not mistaken, I thought that this had a Marvel license attached to it too, but I could be way off.
    33:14
    Wow, this looks like a busy table. Yep. Why is she doing the Macarena? Exactly. You tell me. And why is she facing away from you?
    33:39
    as the player character. Who's she looking at? Oh, I guess the big Smash dude. You're going to hear Cotton Candy Pandy a lot, Jared. Just so you know.
    34:04
    Sounds like Rainbow Dash. Yep. Now what I will give this table is it is flowy. Whoa, that's cool. It's got the Steve Ritchie vibes all over it. It's with that upper right flipper that we all love.
    34:37
    No bueno. So check out the kickback lane here. It's like a moving conveyor belt. Yeah, it's a moving conveyor belt.
    34:49
    That's cool. I actually want you to drain. Down the left only. What? Oh, wow. It comes down fast. Okay, let's see if I can start the mode. There we go. Ooh, that's a... Oh, it's Revenge of the Robobot.
    35:29
    So, you see there's these little walls here, and you have to smash through them. them but you can only smash them forward you can't smash them on the backside okay just kind of an interesting dynamic yeah that's good they're gonna hit the glance them there we go is there another one I think there is right oh no excellent over oh got it all glass checkpoint reach Wow whoa geez okay now I gotta hit these bombs Oh bombs no missed double old double but there you go up okay that's cool there is that cool I should the honestly still better put that another game with you it's a sector was lit I don't know where the all I can right Oh, no, not there. Is it that hole? Yeah, it's that hole. Oh.
    36:56
    But, hey, we'll just start another mode instead. There's a thing. Yeah, what do I need to do? Hit the flashing light.
    37:13
    Which one? All the flashing lights? Just hit anything. Pretty much. And I'm failing miserably at it. Is this a... I'm not looking. Is there a hurry up?
    37:27
    There was a hurry up. Hit the flashing lane. So... Yeah, yeah. Which one? They're all flashing. Okay, but it's not giving me a countdown.
    37:40
    No. Okay, good. That's what I wanted to do. Which means it's going to give me time to hit all these flashing lanes.
    37:48
    It's sort of like the antithesis of a hurry up. It's the take your time and shoot the shots up. You know what? I'm fine with that because I needed to actually figure out what the heck to aim at.
    38:01
    Oh, man, you're right. This is flow as heck. Oh, man, look at this. This is great. Oh, jeez, yeah. Oh, look, it's the... it's a corkscrew from N-Bot hooray look at that a nice call out Jared oops bye bye but it was like thank you for that call out and telling me that I have an extra ball that I hit it yeah that's you know that's nice huh alright so is it slowed again yeah or shoot again spload again. At least it didn't say splooge again. Alright. This is a layout that I would... The toy is the layout... I wouldn't mind Zen recycling this with a different theme.
    39:15
    Okay, so you can buy Ms. Explosion Man now on Steam for, in Australia land, $14.50. Oh, the actual game? Yeah, the actual game. I'm just looking at the... it's a platformer okay right okay you get 50 levels of single-player action oh it's yeah okay I can see where a lot of the tropes coming from just from the trailer alone well that's like it's a platform but everything is super zoomed out
    39:56
    interesting okay What am I doing again? Trying to hit... Something. Okay, so... This was an Xbox Game Studios game. Or it's a publisher. Oh, okay. Well, there you go. That's why we're not going to see it in BenFX. Yep. And it was produced by Twisted Pixel Games.
    40:24
    Released all the way back in 2013. Because this was never on PlayStation. This was only on Xbox. Xbox, yeah.
    40:41
    Okay. Alright, I'm going to switch back to watching the game now. But yeah, that's... it looks interesting.
    40:56
    Oh nice, okay. a little hidden capture and you knock it free hey she moved now she's still doing the Macarena what is going on with that oh so you can add even more balls just be thankful that they didn't have that music in the game Imagine that thing if you were the Macarena. I would be turning off the music so fast you wouldn't even be amazed. The only thing that could make it worse is if it was the chicken dance. Oh yeah, well... Like, they could do like the world's most annoying music game, or like, music table, and it would be like, Macarena, chicken dance, Mambo No. 5... The ketchup song? It's like all those things that you hear at weddings and you just go, really? It's the only place you're ever going to hear this. Yeah, not Bush City Limits.
    42:03
    So meanwhile I still have really no clue what's going on. But apparently I've completed two modes. So how do I know that? Because hey, look at that, inserts that tell you where you are in your game. Oh yes.
    42:20
    I like that. So the big boss dude actually pokes his head up through the playfield, from the back of the playfield.
    42:37
    I like that. Well, now you get to shoot his mouth. Yeah. For locking the balls, maybe? No, it's for starting the mode. You hit him twice, I think. And there you go.
    42:50
    Then he spits it back out at you. Oh. Are we playing cyberball now? Things. Oh, and you can only hit them from behind. Where their little blue butts expose. Yes. Get a...
    43:06
    Shoot the blue butt. Get the boons. Yep. zapped again zapped there we go like roll him out of time she's still doing the necker oh no she's doing something now okay bombs
    43:47
    nice Is there another one? What do I need to hit? Oh, I see it. Where? Oh, no. She's holding it. Okay. No, I don't know where. Never mind.
    44:09
    Whoa, whoa. Oh, hello. What is this? I don't know. I had no clue what I was aiming at. What were you supposed to shoot?
    44:30
    Treadmill. Okay, so now we've got both kickbacks gone. Yeah. Except for the treadmills. It's funny that the ball doesn't seem to go down there that much. Nope.
    44:42
    You can keep the ball in play on this table. that's the only I'm not going to say it's the only downfall of this table see there we do see that was heaps easier to aim yes without it being in first person mode right now you've got an oscillating light on the ramp see how it's like super jackpots roll over barrel surprise oh okay so let's see did it give you anything no well not Visibly You can keep the ball in play A long Long Time Yeah So here's a case where Oops But you get to explode again Oh man What's going on Oh wow Okay so you're kicking the bombs Into old mate's face Wow You're just nailing it I like the Max Hedgeroom vibe of the voiceover. Great.
    45:55
    I think you just beat someone. Did I just beat something? I just heard a boom. Oh, that could have been a Steam notification. Oh, yeah, it was a Steam notification.
    46:07
    Yes, people are going, hey, what are you playing? Why are you playing this? Whenever I play... Oh, so it times out. I can't flip.
    46:16
    Oh, okay. Oh, God, you're still on ball one. Am I really? Oh, jeez. Yes. Far out. Okay, well, if Pinball Wizard's ball was 126-something and change on the other one, this one would be, like, billions.
    46:35
    Yeah, whenever I play... FX2. I will get notifications from people going wait. What do you know why you're playing this? Don't really yeah, they all think that I'm doing it for a reason Love how people watch us to see like they get clues about what may or may not be happening in the game I just realized did you see the red figure that was dancing around
    47:02
    No. Stop messaging us, Pinball Whiz. Yeah. Guaranteed it'll be Pinball Whiz. It is. Yeah. The red guy that was dancing around, that's Explosion Man. Oh, that's... Yeah, so we have Miss Explosion Man, who's pink, and then the red guy, if you see him again, is just Explosion Man.
    47:27
    Okay. This is hilarious. I'm still on ball one. I'm going to wizard it on ball one. I like that, that each time you capture the ball, it... It announces it? Well, no, that it gives you another ball. So you can keep on increasing how many balls you have in multi-ball.
    48:15
    So... Right. Up to a maximum number? So there you go. So I knocked that one out. Okay. So if I lock another one... There we go. And it gives me now another one. I wonder how many I can do.
    48:30
    Help, help. Come on. Don't die. That couldn't help that one. Okay. I imagine it's going to get to the point that it Can't handle any more balls than the playfield. It's gotta be captain six or something. Nope, it didn't let me go that one. Nah, you've had enough. Oh, probably I've worn out my welcome on the mode. Yeah, probably.
    49:16
    Okay, back to our regular programming. Let's take care of the view. Stormball 1. There we go. All right. This should be the final mode. Well. Oh, no, it started over again. I'm on unbreakable walls now.
    49:33
    So I did. I wizarded it. You actually did everything. I actually did everything on ball 1. Without even realizing it. Yes.
    49:41
    You wizard-moded. So, you can see that where the faults are on the table. Well, yeah, it's a grind fest. Yes. Well, it's not that it's a grind fest. It's that you don't feel any sense of advancement.
    49:56
    No. Just things happen, and then you go, oh, wow, apparently I've done something. There's no intention to what you're doing, per se. Hmm. which is a shame because I mean the shot selection is really fun there's a lot going on it looks great you know what would be really cool just take this layout and reuse it that's what I'm saying completely reuse it on a future table any of those tables that you can't bring over just re-theme them do a classic pinball manufacturer trick just re-theme it do like an Eldorado City of Gold and Solar whatever it is and maybe make it harder well and that's the other thing that you know now I'm look at that I've got a 10 times multiplier I've wizarded I'm still on ball 1 on the first ball I'm on the first ball but now that I'm starting over the modes it's not like they're gonna get necessarily harder no back to unbreakable walls she's doing a really good impersonation of peter garrett dancing from midnight oil How can we help when these walls aren't breaking?
    51:40
    Yeah, that's right. You asked for it, Thaz. You know, I do have to say, Midnight Oil is an incredibly underrated band for the songs they had.
    51:53
    They're really catchy, but they're also so political. But because here in the States we have no clue what the politics are, it never registers.
    52:05
    No. And it wasn't literally until years later that I was listening and I had some sense of the issues with the history with how Aboriginals were treated and their lands that I went, ooh, wow. Okay. He's really digging in on this, isn't he? Oh, yeah. they didn't muck around oh so you've actually got a drain hole save as well yeah because why not keep the ball in going it's literally going to be like impossible can you even lose a ball like lose a ball Chris on purpose actually drain how do I do that don't flip don't flip alright I'm gonna not flip don't flip drama Alright. Ten times multipliers.
    52:59
    Wow. Uh-huh. Jeez! Okay. Here we go again. Back to it. So, yeah. I'm just gonna dream. Yeah. There's no... I will be here for hours. No one's ever watched an eight-hour stream.
    53:25
    Which I think is legitimately my problem with this table, that eventually I just go, I'm done. I don't got anything to do with this.
    53:35
    Hold on, I can't go until the ball save is turned off. You just have to take the ball save and end the torture.
    53:54
    Whip it good. I can stand a Devo table with an energy dome that winds up being the loop up, right? Yeah. Come on.
    54:10
    There's a music table I can get behind. Okay, so I didn't beat my high score. Okay. Well, okay. Ricardo, you're an absolute sucker. Yeah, because I only did 200 million as opposed to the apparently time I did 528 million.
    54:32
    So you're second in the leaderboard. Yeah. Boy, that would have been... Actually, that would have been such a long game. Yeah. Because we were only here for like, what, 15 minutes? About, yeah. So you could probably get the top score in about an hour. Yeah. Maybe? alright I think that's going to be it for our play time now should we revisit the South Park tables at some point yeah probably yeah we could just to take a look because I think those well I mean yeah because those never made it over to FX3 either no they didn't so there might be some people that have never seen so good well the Butters table is good I don't care for the I don't care for South Park but the South Park Butters table that's that's where it's at the layout on south park table was good yes i think they should reuse it just the spellerama wasn't oh yeah well my opinion about spelleramas is no one all right so there we go folks that was uh your look at two tables that are probably never going to see the light of day again unless they re-theme them opportunity there yeah and the good Well, here's the thing. Like I said, I think Misplosion Man, re-theme, with a wild ball, maybe those outlines become dangerous. Make the outlines wider. Make it harder to get kickbacks. Well, it's not that make it harder to get kickbacks. It's make it harder or easier for the ball to actually go down the lane. It just never went over there.
    56:12
    No, they're very, very conservative. Sorry, liberal. outlines. Um, you know, and then, so I think that that one could easily use a re-theme. The PVZ table,
    56:26
    I don't know that I want to see that layout on something else. They did the theme really, really well. It just needs a different coat of paint. Um, so, okay.
    56:40
    Different coat of paint so that the, the visually it's easier to understand where you're going. Um, right. You know, make, make clear plastic ramps. For the uppers, I don't know. Anything of that nature. Yeah, they don't need to be texted like that. No.
    56:53
    And then make the, you've got to change up the rules. You've got to make it more interesting. Again, I was just flipping around. I didn't quite understand where or what I was doing. And that's, I think that's the sum of both these tables, that there's just no sense of progression that you're going anywhere. No drive. It's accidental progression. Yeah, yeah. there's no it's not like you're like oh i gotta get this i gotta get now i gotta collect this one oh now i gotta there's no road it's like i'm done yeah um so that would be the that'd be the task if they were to do pvz don't just do a port change up the rules change up your code um leave the theming theming is great yeah the theme integration is amazing yeah you know Make Plants vs. Zombies 2.
    57:45
    Use that excuse. I don't know. It makes me want to go back to Plants vs. Zombies. It's the game. Then I realize it's not PopCap anymore. It's EA Sports. And that's gross.
    57:58
    That is true. Which I don't know exactly how much of a... Well, because PopCap doesn't exist anymore, huh?
    58:06
    No, they got bought out by EA. So you would be having to deal with EA. And then EA put a whole lot of Smurfberries in it.
    58:15
    Smurfberry Crunch. Okay, hold on. I'm going to... I just want to quickly look and see.
    58:29
    Oh, no. It was nothing. It wasn't asking about what I was playing. Oh, okay. I just wanted to see what the messages were that were popping up yeah so what are we going to do next time Jared don't know maybe comment on the next pinball show when they release it later on in the month maybe if they do I think because the next pinball show should give us more details about Adam's family I imagine I think so based on what Mel was saying he couldn't steal the thunder of his marketing team but we're going to see some extra stuff and I think it's probably going to relate to gold mode ooh gold mode yes I think so that's what he was sort of you know hinting yeah let us know via the old twitter or you can comment here on youtube what do you think is going on with the oh yeah or discord I always forget about discord I forget about discord what do you guys think about what's your prediction for cabinet that you can go out and purchase obviously I don't think we're going to hear really anything about it until Zen announces cabinet mode and hammers that kind of stuff out because I think it'll go part and parcel with whatever they're able to actually do in cabinet mode. That's what they're going to do on a physical machine.
    60:12
    Do you know that we've already seen some collaborations on really high-end cabinets? Like, remember that one was like, what, $8,000 or $9,000 US? With all the flashy lights? Yeah. Well, no, because, I mean, you understand what Mel was hinting when he was saying that he had celebrities that were asking for machines. And he was talking about how it would, you know, oh, and it's got LED with, you know, all some Star Wars is playing, and then it goes to, you know, something. I'm like, that's that cabinet was in Dave and Buster's. The Dave and Buster's. Yeah. So. So they've done a redo of that. Maybe they're, yeah, making a commercial version of that. That thing is going to be a pretty penny. If they're making that, that's a high-end machine right there. That'll be the cost of a new in-box stern. Yeah. So, yeah, save up your dollar bucks for that.
    61:07
    Dollar dues. All right. Well, yeah, so maybe we'll comment about that. If not, again, we'll maybe do another one of these playthroughs. Maybe we'll do the South Park tables. Or, please, feel free, folks. Give us suggestions. What is it you want to see me play?
    61:25
    Give me two tables. because basically if we do two per show, that's a good combo. So, yeah, ask what is it you want to see play. Maybe it's something you've never purchased. Maybe it's an old table. Like, well, we're kind of hammering through them all now. But even if it's you want to see the difference between FX2 version and FX3, any of those things. We also have the Snoopy table we need to take a look at. I don't think either of us have taken a look at that in depth.
    61:58
    We can possibly look at some of the DreamWorks tables, but I know that we've done those before. Yeah.
    62:07
    Well, I know we did it on the mobile version because I linked it up to here. That's right. You made it work on the iPad. I made it work on the iPad, yes.
    62:18
    We'll take a look at Snoopy for sure also. So other than that, it's Jared's favorites. It'll be stuff and things, stuff and things for you. Until next time, folks. Bye-bye.