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FNO Pinball Ep 21: Star Wars The Pin w/ George Gomez (Designer) from Stern Pinball LIVE In Studio

Flip n Out Pinball·video·2h 7m·analyzed·Sep 24, 2019
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.036

TL;DR

George Gomez demos Star Wars The Pin, discusses Stern's market expansion strategy and accessibility-focused design philosophy.

Summary

George Gomez, legendary Stern Pinball designer, appeared on Flip n Out Pinball's Monday Night Pinball stream to demo and discuss Star Wars The Pin, a new lower-priced pinball machine designed to expand Stern's market reach beyond premium segments. Gomez explained the design philosophy emphasizing accessibility for newer players, easier Death Star multiball mode, and the reuse of proven code bases and playfield derivatives from previous games like Spider-Man and Supreme. The discussion covered Stern's expansion into diverse market segments, connectivity roadmap, code update efforts (particularly Ghostbusters), and challenges in producing classic game remakes due to component costs.

Key Claims

  • Star Wars The Pin is positioned as a lower-priced product designed to teach people pinball and be more reliable, intended for new market segments beyond Stern's traditional premium buyers

    high confidence · George Gomez: 'this particular product is a lower-priced product. It's intended to go into places where it's the first pinball machine designed to cost less money, be friendlier, teach people the game, and be more reliable.'

  • The Death Star multiball on Star Wars The Pin was intentionally made easier than the commercial version because it was too difficult for players to complete

    high confidence · George Gomez: 'My feeling when I played the big games, the commercial games, was that it was too hard to blow up the desktop... So I just felt like for this particular product, it had to be easier.'

  • Star Wars The Pin playfield shares some design elements with Spider-Man and Supreme, but has been significantly evolved with nearly everything repositioned

    high confidence · George Gomez: 'Nothing was in the same place... I moved every time I evolved them.' Discussing the playfield derivatives from original Spidey design.

  • Stern is planning major connectivity features for its product line in the coming year that will impact all products including home machines

    high confidence · George Gomez: 'one of the most exciting things is connectivity and the impact that that's going to have on all the products... it's going to permeate the product line.'

  • Stern has outgrown its current facility and is planning for expansion, with long-term planning discussions ongoing about facility needs

    high confidence · George Gomez: 'We have absolutely outgrown it' (referring to current facility). Ken: 'You're going to end up outgrowing the new place.'

  • A Stern Classics line would be challenging to price competitively because reproducing classic games with modern components costs as much as building new Pro models

    high confidence · George Gomez: 'we're challenged because all those games have to be targeted... it's not going to cost you less than a pro to build... you're making physical changes to the play field... the devices we have today are different than the devices we have then.'

Notable Quotes

  • “this particular product is a lower-priced product. It's intended to go into places where it's the first pinball machine designed to cost less money, be friendlier, teach people the game, and be more reliable.”

    George Gomez@ 12:00 — Core statement of Star Wars The Pin's market positioning and design intent; explains why it exists as a product line expansion

  • “My feeling when I played the big games, the commercial games, was that it was too hard to blow up the desktop... So I just felt like for this particular product, it had to be easier.”

    George Gomez@ 17:41 — Design philosophy insight: accessibility and player success are prioritized over hardcore challenge in the entry-level pin

  • “I never imagined, when we did that game, I never imagined that we were ever going to see him again... That's all very cool. It gives another generation a chance.”

    George Gomez@ 24:23 — On Chicago Gaming's Monster Bash remake; shows designer perspective on legacy games being revisited by other manufacturers

  • “We have absolutely outgrown it. I know. You've been out of notice part for what it seems like a few years, and now here you are.”

    George Gomez / Ken@ 26:34 — Indicates Stern's facility constraints and growth trajectory; signals potential future expansion announcement

  • “Nothing was in the same place... I moved every time I evolved them.”

    George Gomez@ 29:33 — Design evolution philosophy: even when reusing code bases, playfield geometry is substantially reimagined for each iteration

  • “we're challenged because all those games have to be targeted. Right, it's not going to cost you less than a pro to build.”

Entities

George GomezpersonStern PinballcompanyStar Wars The PingameKen CromwellpersonDean GroverpersonSpider-MangameSupremegame

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Classic game remakes (like Beatles) face economic challenges because modern component costs don't decrease despite using existing designs; licensing adds substantial cost

    high · George Gomez: 'we're challenged because all those games have to be targeted... it's not going to cost you less than a pro to build... the Beatles... that license wasn't cheap... eight Beatles songs... it's expensive'

  • ?

    business_signal: Stern has outgrown its current facility and is engaging in long-term expansion planning; suggests significant production scaling and continued market growth

    high · George Gomez: 'We have absolutely outgrown it' and mentions long-term planning discussions about facility needs

  • ?

    community_signal: Stern actively streaming live gameplay and designer participation on podcast platforms; direct engagement with community through shows like Monday Night Pinball

    high · George Gomez in-studio guest demo; participation in extended gameplay and Q&A session with chat

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Positive community response to accessibility-focused design; chat participants and hosts express enthusiasm about ease of entry and quick multiball access for newer players

    high · Ken: 'it plays great... it doesn't feel like a lessened experience at all... You can get into a multiball fairly quickly if you want to... nothing more thrilling than seeing more than one ball on the play field'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Playfield reuse strategy: Star Wars The Pin derived from Spider-Man/Supreme platform but playfield significantly evolved with nearly all elements repositioned; code base and character structure (four characters) provide framework but geometry is novel

Transcript

youtube_groq_whisper · $0.384

0:00
you Thank you. Well, it's a Monday night. The new week has begun. I turn on the switch. First, I'm still from off of. The drink is cold. I'm back to high. I'm in my dream. In hell and sea. Make me tell the truth. I'm from Chicago. I'm here to take a ride. It's Monday night pinball. Come on tonight.
10:22
Are you ready for the pinball? It's a Monday night party. Yeah. Come on down, come on down, come on down Hey, what's going on, Pinball Land? Welcome to Monday Night Pinball. Myself, Ken Caramo, with Steve Beattie and Bill Webb. Welcome. Very special guests from Stern Pinball. Joining us on the program today, Mr. George Gomez. George, welcome to the show. Welcome to the show.
11:17
Hello, everybody. Hello, Internet. Yeah, we're going to have some fun tonight. George is going to be walking us through Star Wars Pin, the newest offering from Stern Pinball in a different format. We're excited to share the game with you tonight. And, of course, George is going to be a little bit gracious with his time tonight. We're going to be answering. He's going to answer questions in chat. And then, hopefully, a little call-in segment later before he has to skedaddle. Now, full disclosure, he's got a pretty long ride home, so we're not going to keep him here too long. We're just appreciative that he's here. So thanks, George. Yes, thank you. Not a problem. So what can you tell us about Star Wars Pin before we jump into it? Yeah, so I think you guys know we've been trying to crack into different segments of the market, and this particular product is a lower-priced product. It's intended to go into places where it's the first pinball machine designed to cost less money, be friendlier, teach people the game, and be more reliable.

  • Star Wars The Pin will be available at Pinball Expo, with multiple units on the floor

    high confidence · George Gomez responding to Chris Depends: 'Yes, they will be. Yeah, we'll have a bunch of them there.'

  • The next Stern home game will likely arrive next year, though the specific title was not revealed

    medium confidence · George Gomez: 'probably next year you'll see something... you'll have to imagine what title it could be.'

    • George Gomez@ 36:37 — Explains economic barrier to classic game remakes; manufacturing costs don't reduce despite design being existing IP

  • “one of the most exciting things is connectivity and the impact that that's going to have on all the products... it's going to permeate the product line.”

    George Gomez@ 14:16 — Forward-looking statement on Stern's digital strategy; connectivity will be key product differentiator in coming year

    • Monster Bashgame
    Beatlesgame
    Ghostbustersgame
    Deadpoolgame
    Steve Ritchieperson
    Comic-Conevent
    Pinball Expoevent
    Flip n Out Pinballcompany
    Marco Specialtiescompany
    Tanyaperson
    Kerry Hardyperson
    Jack Dangerperson
    Chicago Gaming Companycompany

    high · George Gomez: 'Nothing was in the same place... I moved every time I evolved them... I did have the code base in mind when I designed it... There were four characters in Spider-Man. There's four characters in Star Wars'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: George Gomez emphasizes accessibility and player success in entry-level design; Death Star made intentionally easier than commercial version to ensure newer players can complete core objective

    high · George Gomez: 'My feeling when I played the big games... was that it was too hard to blow up the desktop... for this particular product, it had to be easier'

  • ?

    event_signal: Stern planning significant presence at Pinball Expo including Elvira Halloween party, multiple Star Wars The Pin units, potential new Ghostbusters code debut, partnership with Marco Specialties

    high · George Gomez: 'Yes, they will be... we'll have a bunch of them there... big Elvira party... we may even have some Ghostbusters with that new code'

  • ?

    announcement: Next Stern home game expected next year but specific title not revealed; hints at mystery title to be announced

    medium · George Gomez: 'probably next year you'll see something... you'll have to imagine what title it could be'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Recent Ghostbusters code update (v10) was substantial effort requiring significant programmer support; indicates Stern's commitment to post-release game improvement

    high · George Gomez on Ghostbusters update: 'It was a lot of work... Tanya did a lot of heavy lifting... lead programmer gets a lot of credit but there's big support staff behind there'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Stern's connectivity feature is positioned as major product differentiator launching within next year across entire product line including home machines

    high · George Gomez: 'one of the most exciting things is connectivity and the impact that that's going to have on all the products... it's going to permeate the product line'

  • ?

    business_signal: Stern deliberately targeting new market segments below Pro tier with Star Wars The Pin; signals strategy to grow overall addressable market rather than chase premium-only positioning

    high · George Gomez: 'this particular product is a lower-priced product... we've explored the top of the market, and now we're exploring price points down from our pro product... this may not be the lowest price point we explore'

  • ?

    technology_signal: Star Wars The Pin uses standard Spike system and modern components; represents accessibility/reliability focus over cutting-edge mechanical innovation

    medium · George Gomez: 'It's got spike to system... All that stuff costs money between the transporters, the boards. None of that stuff ever comes cheap.'

    • 12:21
    And it's a brand-new game. and of course it takes advantage of things like the Star Wars license and it leverages a lot of the assets that we created when we did the commercial games. But this game will be sold in new places to new people and it's about growing the hobby.
    12:44
    We've sort of explored the high end of the market. Yeah, absolutely. We've made a $15,000 Batman. Yeah, right, right. And they sell them. And you have a little Elvirus signature edition that just hit the market. Right, that signature edition, you know, it's like you tell people it's 50 games. Well, you know, I mean, now all of a sudden it's instantly in demand. Absolutely, absolutely. Especially, you know, with a solid product, right, like that. So, you know, we're exploring. We've explored the top of the market, and now we're exploring price points down from our pro product.
    13:17
    So you'll see, I mean, you're going to see all kinds of interesting things from us, you know. this may not be the lowest price point we explore. I remember when you were on our show, when we were initially kind of discussing on launch Star Wars pin, I remember you saying that there's going to be different outlets and avenues that you're going to be exploring to kind of see what clicks and what doesn't. You know, I mean, everybody out there, you know, we want to be all things pinball, right? You know, we are trying to drive our accessory business, our parts business. Our parts business has to come into the, you know, 21st century. And, you know, we have to make it easier for people to acquire stuff. Yeah. And, you know, we're looking into, you know, I mean, we are, you've seen us do events. You've seen us do tournaments. Yeah, we're all prevalent. Yeah. So we're basically rounding all this stuff out. You know, you're going to see a bigger digital presence from us. and then this coming year. I mean, one of the most exciting things is connectivity and the impact that that's going to have on all the products. And you would say that there will be connectivity with this pinball machine as well, right? Absolutely. Even though it's maybe a home machine that's still going to have it. Yep, it's ready for it, and, you know, it's ready for it. And when we get to that place, then it's going to permeate the product line. Okay. Yeah. Well, let's do this. We'll take care of some quick business here. I wanted to thank Scott from Pin Stadium for helping us illuminate our stream with the Extreme Kit. I want to thank Neil from PinQuest. We're going to go over the PinQuest challenges in a week, but I wanted to thank PinQuest Pinball for the 2,500 bits and Rebel Guitars for the resub and Super Mario Brothers here in studio. Now, you're familiar with PinQuest a little bit, not? A little bit. Let's go ahead. Let's introduce those PinQuest challenges of the week.
    15:12
    Now, the pin quest challenges of the week are actually, George Gomez helped us out with these because, full disclosure, we weren't really sure what was going to be challenging it on. So just a couple quick five that we took from his list. Hit the Jedi's heel shot, which I think George can walk us through here in a second. Destroy the Death Star, 500 bits. Hit all combos, 500 bits. Start all multiballs, 500 bits. And collect all rebels, 500 bits. For a total possible 500 bits, as we look at it. Hey, there she is. That was the pin.
    15:38
    There's some tough ones in there. that combo one can be challenging and so we'll see. We'll see. Thanks, Harry Hart, for the 100 bits. We have some time on the game and I can safely say that it does not feel and we were talking about this earlier, it doesn't feel like a lessened experience at all. It feels like a pinball machine. Absolutely. So we're excited to do it. Why don't we start a four-player game and as we kind of rotate through, if you don't mind, we'll answer some questions in chat. And then guys, listen, we're not going to go super long tonight, so maybe we do four-player action until maybe a quarter to seven or so, and then we might have George for a little bit for some call-ins before he's got to head out. So we'll be quick and efficient with this stream tonight. Sound good? Sounds good. You want to fire up for four? Yeah, do you want to go in this order? How about, you want to start us off, George? Is that fine? Perfect. Awesome. Sweet. George Gomez! Hey!
    16:30
    Monday Night Pinball, baby. Monday Night Pinball. Alright, so, you guys hear me okay? Yeah, I'll turn you up a little bit. Sure, yeah.
    16:43
    All right, so it's all about collecting the Rebels, right? And if you collect the Rebels ahead of blowing up the Death Star, your Death Star score is going to be that much bigger.
    16:56
    The Death Star is available anytime. So basically, initially, take down the three drop targets, and we'll start a Death Star multiball. it's a very interesting multiball it's a multiball that when you're down to your last ball we'll start strobing we'll start a timer and we'll start strobing the Death Star and it's supposed to simulate you being Luke in the trench with the opportunity to make the one shot that's going to destroy the Death Star so like I said And I think you can do that at any time. It's just that it's worth a lot more if you go into it with all the rebels.
    17:41
    My feeling when I played the big games, the commercial games, was that it was too hard to blow up the desktop. Yeah, right. It's like the experience you want in the pen and you very rarely get there. So I just felt like for this particular product, it had to be easier. For this particular product, it has to be easier. Right. So Jedi skill shot, if you don't move, don't touch the buttons, wherever the light is, you've got to get the ball through there. Okay. The other skill shot, if you hold the left flipper button, Dean will light the TIE fighter, and you come around the left flipper, nail the TIE fighter, that's the TIE fighter skill shot. And then the most basic skill shot, if you blow the Jedi skill shot, you can still move the light and get to the ultimate. Ah, right. You know, Willie skill shot. Top lane. Yeah. Cool. So let's see if I can do a Jedi skill shot. There we go. No pressure.
    18:32
    Hey, welcome. That's all right. Good try. Too late. Welcome, everybody, in the chat. George Gomez is here, and he's demoing Star Wars, the pin with us. We are going to be playing a little four-player action tonight. One thing about this. So I don't know if you noticed, but that's essentially two popovers, or two coils driving all three pop-up groups. Two coil guys driving all three pops. So, you know, actually simultaneously. Most people can't tell the difference. That's all I tell them. Yeah, right, yeah, right. Or unless they're paying attention.
    19:08
    Right away people think that, oh, there's a bad switch, right? That's how pop-up groups would react, right? So, who's up?
    19:17
    Let's just go this way, right? Yeah, you want to go next, Steve? Yep. So the first shot you make, the first rebel shot you make, is basically going to enable that rebel.
    19:32
    And so if you make a loop shot, you're going to have loop lit. Sure. To light additional rebels, you've got to spell force. You've got to spell force. Yeah. But you can work that one rebel, and if while you're working that rebel you manage to light force, it'll give you two rebels. Very cool. All right, I'm going to do the same and go for... What's up, Kerry Hardy? Kerry Hardy. Kerry Hardy, what's up, Scott D'Amesi? What's up, Sicky Sour? What's up, 42 Gits? Everybody's in shape tonight. Christian Pinson, thanks for the bits. Kerry Hardy, thanks for the bits.
    20:07
    Good times tonight. And then, of course, you got... I left your ball in the lock, so you can steal my lock. All right. Lock stealing? What? R2 multiball. There we go. So do it. Do it. There you go.
    20:20
    And then you hit that target, which added a ball. Gotcha. So we're watching George Gomez walk us through Star Wars 10. For those of you just joining us here on Monday Night Pinball. So again, you know, remember that this is a non-concept. This game is intended to teach you non-concept pinball. So things like an easy, bulky ball, making it easy to blow up the net star, a toy that everybody can get to in that high fire. Right.
    20:51
    Right, right. Well, keeping everybody engaged, you know. It might make us look a bit decent. I think this will make us look a lot better.
    21:00
    Yeah. You've got R2, and now you need to start working for us. Start working for us. Yeah, in order to light. There you go.
    21:13
    Hey, Desert One says thanks for coming out, George. You're welcome. There you go. You can actually lock two there and leave two there. Wow.
    21:27
    So one of the things about this is any reflection will get you there. So if you have it on this flipper, try to get that rubber up to the targets and come back. You can do that. Say what? In other words, you can do that. Like kind of try? Yeah.
    21:47
    And, of course, where's your orange drink being asked here in chat? So your slings are on the double. Yeah, the slings are tied together. The entire thing uses eight coil drives. Wow. So the slings are tied together and two of the pop-up are tied together. And that's what that's about. Have no fear. That looks different.
    22:09
    Yeah, we started early tonight. Started early tonight. Hey, what's up, Ryan? How are you, man? Lord Helmet, it's a Starbucks because I needed a little bit of caffeine today. It was a long day. Hey, you got a little danger zone there, huh? Yeah, I got a... Yeah, you left it for Ken to steal. Ah, good stuff.
    22:30
    Adam, yeah, George does have a mic. He'll sit in a few minutes. All right, guys, this is my first time playing, and this thing plays great. Yeah. It plays great. Dude, it looks like it shoots like a champ, dude.
    22:44
    Nice. So Ken just got the tie fighter skill shot. Which is actually kind of tough. Yeah. He makes us all look good.
    22:53
    So at the end of the night when we're missing all the challenges, he's the one that kind of brings it all home. He's our anchor for bowling and pinball. That is not correct.
    23:08
    Whenever Bill's playing, though, make sure you say his name. Yeah, real loud. Multiple times, real loud. He plays best. I'm so used to playing at home, though, in a basement when no one's there. Yeah, sure, sure, sure, sure.
    23:23
    Chris depends here and asks, will this be at Expo, George? Yes, they will be. Yes. Yeah, we'll have a bunch of them there.
    23:32
    That's real. Hey, what's up, Dennis? Whoop. Zach likes the spinner sound. Spinner sounds are huge. Yeah, you know. It's like such an appealing thing. I had such fun with the Deadpool spinner that when we were doing this, I said, hey, we've got to do another spinner sound. Yeah, having the disco multiball with that spinner on Deadpool is cool. It was very old school. Oh, it's awesome. You know my thoughts on Deadpool.
    23:58
    I've been driving the Deadpool train for a long, long time. It's my current game on the digits. Yeah, it's a great game.
    24:08
    We've got a couple of your games down here tonight, actually, now that I look at the lineup. Yeah, you've got to lower the rings and you've got a monster bash. What are your thoughts on a game that you designed being redone by another manufacturer? Does that blow your mind a little bit? It does. I never imagined, when we did that game, I never imagined that we were ever going to see him again.
    24:31
    That's all very cool. It gives another generation a chance. Exactly. 42 Gibson's looking forward to Expo. What kind of setup will Stern be setting up this year? You know, you're teaming up with Marco, right, for like a big... Yeah, I mean, you know, we have... So we're going to have a big, you know, big Elvira party for sure. That is going to be fun. Halloween party, you know. And then, of course, you know, we'll have the entire lineup. So we'll have a bunch of Jurassic. Yeah, we'll have... By then, you know, we'll have some premiums probably on the floor. Yep. And we'll have, you know, in the course of 10, we'll have some monsters. I mean, we may even have some, you know, I mean, we may even have some Ghostbusters with that new code. Yeah. Awesome. It's exciting that that code was such a, I mean, such a huge change to 10. Yeah. Man, it was a lot of work. Yeah. It sounds like it. You know, right? So I can use a vacation now, right? Just take a couple days off. And, you know, Tanya did a lot of heavy lifting. Yeah, I know. A lot of heavy lifting. Yeah. So. So it's like, you know, it's interesting you say that because the lead programmer obviously gets a lot of the credit because their name is on it. But there's a big support staff behind there that does a lot of the legwork, too. You know, and it's like, you know, we know, you know, a lot of times we know we got to fix stuff. And, you know, we're trying to stay alive just like everybody else. Right. We make, you know, we make the business makes decisions. Sure. By nature of what it is. Yep. Understandable. But, you know, we want, you know, we're passionate about the games. There are games. We want them to be right. That's good. You never know when a code update is going to come get you. Absolutely. I mean, you never do know. Yeah, we do. And, you know, we have a lot of interesting stuff going on, you know, mostly new stuff. But you guys, I mean, I'm very proud of the studio. I'm very proud of the role we've been in. Sure. You know, and guys are having a lot of fun making games, and it clearly shows. Oh, it totally shows. Look at it. I mean, the string of hits is like, you know. You're going to end up outgrowing the new place. You're going to need a satellite. We have outgrown it. I know. You've been out of notice part for what it seems like a few years, and now here you are. We have absolutely outgrown it. That's amazing. It's amazing. There's guys that do, you know, we have guys do long-term planning, right? And that's kind of stuff they're talking about. Like, okay, what do we do? It's crazy. You ready to show us how it's done here? Are we back up? Here we go. The master here. Leave me something. I don't know what the master is. The master. And the lock balls and the lock balls. Hey, Dr. John, thanks for the resub. Tier one, four months. Nice, David. Dr. John from Australia says, hello, all, and hello, George. Hello.
    27:11
    Dr. John. Desert One says, my Ghostbusters is ready and waiting for the update. Really looking forward to that dropping. It looks like a huge effort was put into it. Absolutely.
    27:21
    Yeah, it looks awesome. Sicky Sour. Any interest in more vintage-style games like One L for beginners and older folks? we will ask George that when he comes back he gave that pin an old slap right there you can beat it like it's a commercial unit so that's for sure it's withstanding it that's what I get for not setting a tilt on the one in my office yeah Imota Harney says hello from San Francisco was just talking about this pin she's excited that we're streaming it So we're excited to be streaming it, too.
    27:59
    It seems like there's general interest in seeing this stream. So I know when it was debuted, I think Jack Danger streamed it. Where was that? That was at Comic-Con. That's right. That's where we debuted it. Yeah.
    28:10
    But, you know, I mean, the Comic-Con scenario is different, right? Just because of what Comic-Con is. So you can't do an in-depth stream relative to it. Right. It's mayhem there. It's a different audience. Yeah. The floor is just nuts. What was the thought process when you knew, I mean, when did you know that Star Wars was going to be the title that was going to get this new model? I mean, was it just because of the popularity and all the assets that you had? Yeah, we knew right away. I mean, I think that it's not a stretch to imagine that the pin titles are going to leverage assets from the big games, right? Right. They're not always going to be this play field, right? I've gotten a lot of mileage out of derivatives of this play field and derivatives of this rule set, right? This play field and rule set originally was from the original Spidey, which was by design sort of intended to be a very small run to help us understand the market, the price point, how we would sell it, all this kind of stuff. So we purposely had a very small run.
    29:15
    And so we did that. And then when Supreme approached us, we had no time to develop a game, so we packaged up the Spidey as the Supreme. Right. I did evolve it. So it's like everybody says it's the same playthrough. You know what I'm saying? If I showed you all three drawings and I overlapped them all, they're all different. I moved every time I evolved them. Well, in this one, in general, I think you said just hardly anything was left in the same place. Nothing was in the same place. I mean, it's like it takes advantage of – I did have the code base in mind when I designed it, right? Okay. And there were some things that sort of fit, right? There were four characters in Spider-Man. There's four characters in Star Wars. Sure, sure. There were some things that fit. And, you know, my partner on this was Dean Grover, and Dean was the coder on all of those models, right? So we said, let's take, you know, let's take the basic, you know, code base, which was Because, like, I mean, the Supremes, if you've ever played one, you know, they're incredibly fun. I've never played a Supreme. I haven't found one on location yet. Maybe we'll stream one later. I did find a Munsters Premium on location in Hoffman Estates, though. Yeah. Well, so the Supremes, you know, I mean, the response is so positive to the way they're being played. And the ones that we know on location earn a lot of money. So we said, hey, you know what, let's kind of, like, let's build on that. Yeah. Like I said about the Death Star, I really wanted a more accessible Death Star. Yep. And I wanted the show to be a bigger deal. Well, it's nice, too, because, I mean, you can get into a multiball fairly quickly if you want to. And I think for somebody that's walking up to a machine, there's nothing more thrilling than seeing more than one ball on the play field at one time. I mean, that's impactful. It leaves an impression. Little kids. I want to catch, you know, I want someone to take this home. I want little kids to play it. I want them to have fun with it. You know, when I was younger, I used to play T2 down the street. And T2, you know, hit the skull twice and make sure you hit one shot and you got a multi-ball. Hey, I'm a winner. Yeah. You know. So.
    31:24
    Very fun game, guys. Oh, yeah. This is a little bigger than the Transformers, the pin, right? Yeah, those were completely different. Those were really small. This is a full-size blade shield. It's all like standard. I mean, that bottom is my standard bottom. It's pretty much a Deadpool bottom. There's nothing different about it. The wall on the bottom arch is a little closer to the flippers on this than it is on a big game But that because on this game you don have to worry about it not going to earn money It not about earning money so you don have to worry about those bang bags and stuff like that
    32:07
    Well, that's nice, too, because the coin door is a little... Yeah, I mean, the coin door is really just a functional accessibility thing. Yeah, it's just a switchband. And there's people that say, oh, you know, it needs a coin door because it's a pinball machine. That is a really nice spinner sound. It's awesome. Yeah. And the spinner's fast.
    32:32
    So I'm getting caught up in chat here. I don't know if you got a chance to rename those, George. I have not. Sidekick Pinballer. Answer the question. I don't know. I don't see where it is.
    32:44
    It's in pink underneath 42 gigs. Sidekick Pinballer. Martin Robbins brought up an interesting point for Avira. Did Stern leverage any mechanics from Batman 66?
    32:55
    Not really, no. I didn't think you would, but I didn't want to answer that and then find out I'm wrong. Uh-uh. No, no. I mean, there's really, I can't think of anything from Batman 66. No. I didn't see a crane in the virus, so, yeah, you know.
    33:14
    Thank you, Lord Helmet. Wow, that was horrible. Yeah, the blank coin door definitely looks a lot more streamlined.
    33:22
    Sure. Yeah, I mean, for what you get in this game, though, I mean, that's insane. Yeah, I mean, it's, you know, everybody has to have, you know, it's got to be a business for everybody, right? The dealers and distributors have to make money also, and, you know, we have to, and we also have to make money. So it's like, you know, it's like... Oh, yeah. It has, you know, it's got a spike to system. It's got, you know, it's got. It's not cheap. No, it's got stern, you know, it's got stern stopping. Oh, yeah. All that stuff costs money between the transporters, the boards.
    34:03
    None of that stuff ever comes cheap. I mean, we're definitely a different market. It feels like a full-fledged game. Oh, yeah. First time playing it. Well, here. You light it up.
    34:17
    Like I said, he's our boat anchor. So the one thing is, so R2-D2 multiball, we were getting a lot of R2-D2 multiballs, and we decided that whenever you have a ball in the lock and you started one of the other multiballs, we don't start R2-D2. Okay. That ball just contributes to the multiball that you're in. Gotcha. So if you're in desktop multiball and you have a ball in the lock, If you free that ball as a function of that multi-ball, you now have four balls on the play zone. Yeah.
    34:51
    This thing flows. Yeah. Doesn't it? I mean, it feels great. If you can hold two shots together, it feels awesome. No, you're right. You're right. And it's quick. And I remember, like, in the original Star Wars, like, you have that quick little interloop that Steve Ritchie kind of had. I mean, I kind of get a feel for that on the right. Yeah. Yeah, I like it. Good times. Comes back quick right there. When is the next home game, someone's asking. You know, probably next year you'll see something. Yeah, you'll see, I don't know, you'll have to imagine what title it could be. Whatever works.
    35:27
    You think we'll see, not to get off topic, but I mean, so we'll see which was kind of transformed into a new Beatles. You think we'll see another older pin that gets a new facelift, so to speak? The biggest issue with those old games is the cost of some of those parts, like drop targets. Yeah. Drop targets, drop target assemblies are some of the most expensive things we put on a game, right? So when you have a game with a bunch of drop targets and a motor and a spinner and this and that and the other thing, and it adds up quick. Sure. And the problem is that everybody tells us that they don't want to pay that kind of money for something like that. So that's where we run into that problem, right? I mean, in the case of the Beatles, we also had, you know, we had that license wasn't cheap. Yeah. Right. I mean, putting eight Beatles songs, nine Beatles songs in a game. It's just Beatles. It's not like they're anything. I mean, it's expensive. Right. So that's and that's the challenge. Yeah. But I mean, we would love, you know, we've talked a lot about a Stern Classics line. The biggest issue is that I don't think people want to pay. You know, I mean, they say, well, it's got to cost less than a pro. Well, it's got to cost less than a pro. we're challenged because all those games have to be targeted. Right, it's not going to cost you less than a pro to build. I think a lot of people would try to think, well, I mean, okay, so the design's already there. You don't need the R&D anymore. But, I mean, it's not because you're making physical changes to the play field, right? Yeah, and the devices we have today are different than the devices we have then. And honestly, I mean, if you've played a Beatles, I don't know if any of you have played a Beatles. We love the Beatles. And I'm not blowing my own horn here, but I improved on what he did in that game. I mean, you can make some of those shots from the bottom that you couldn't in his original game, right? And so I basically did the same thing anybody would do, right? Here's another bite at the apple. Let's fix the stuff we don't like. Yeah, it makes sense. Right, so I had a bunch of guys. I had Zach and I had Keith and a bunch of serious shooters come in. And I said, okay, guys, you guys are intimately familiar with Sea Witch. What should I fix? And they just gave me a laundry list. I didn't get a call on that, George. I don't know what happened. They gave me a laundry list. Yeah, right, right. So I was like, all right, I think I can do that. And then all the way along, they came in and shot Whitewoods, right? Yeah. So it was like, what do you think about this? Oh, yeah, no, not easy. You know, it's still too hard. Okay, all right. So if you look at that game, it's the same thing. If I gave you the CAD for that game and I gave you the CAD for Sea Witch, you'd find that I moved everything. Yeah, right, right, right. Well, because you move one thing and then geometrically everything else is. And parts are different, right? I mean, the stuff we use today is different than. It's like moving the flippers on Ghostbusters in April the 10th, right? It's no problem. Yeah, I wish we could. I might actually be able to play that game. Yeah, oh, it's too early. Mike Williams, 1371, thanks for the follow. Good times. Are we back up on fall three here, George? Are you? I think so. I believe so. Ready to rock it out?
    38:31
    And we'll get caught up in the chat here, guys. Sorry, guys. We're getting caught up. I'm in conversation. I'm forgetting the ideas. Hey, that's fine design. Sorry. Collectively, we might be able to take you down here, George.
    38:47
    All right. Good times. So, as a Beatles owner, I disagree. It should cost less than a pro. It's an awesome game, says Chrome Candy Pinball.
    38:58
    42 gets I Play the Crap out of my Ghostbusters. I think it's fun. I really like Ghostbusters. The new code is killer.
    39:04
    Oh, man, what is up with that? I barely touched it. Oh, no. Let's splash those pin codes down here again. No, George, hit. Just a minute now. I'm going to open that coin door and see what's going on there. Have we hit any of these yet? We didn't hit the Jedi skill shot. Yeah, we've hit the Jedi skill shot a bunch of times. We did hit Jedi skill shot. Yeah. Okay, so that's great. So that's 500 bits. The Death Star's still out there. Yeah, Death Star. And actually, that's when I was going to work. I was just going to take the Death Star. Take the Death Star down? It's pretty easy, but... I was close. Yeah. Combos, third, all multiballs. So how many multiballs are in the pin? So there are... Okay, so there's a TIE Fighter multiball, Death Star multiball. There's a Jedi multiball, if you get all the characters. and the R2-D2 multiball. So there's four multiballs. And this is a four-ball game, so you can have four balls in the play field. You can add a ball on the R2s. And then, like I said, if you're working any of the other multiballs and you have a ball locked in the R2 lock, it basically just gets added to your multiball. Awesome. So you can stack multiballs. Yeah, you can except for, like I said, the R2-1 was so, it was happening so often that we decided, you know, We've got to turn the dial back on. Yeah, I got it. You're always in multiple. The problem is that when you have a physical, that lock is pretty cool, that physical lock. Yeah. The problem is that you have no control of the physical lock. Exactly. You know, in other words, in code, we have no control of the physical lock. All we know is there's a ball there or it's not. Yeah. So we can't prevent the ball from going in there. So, man, it's Tilt City over here. Well, we earned one of the challenges, the pink bus challenge, so the Jedi skill shot is locked in. Let's see if we can take that off. See, I'm not a tilter, so I haven't set that off once yet. But I don't believe in shaking games. Yeah. And like I said, I'm going to run back to the one in my office and set the tilt. Blow it up. Set the tilt.
    40:57
    Well, Steve over here, every once in a while we'll catch him dancing with a machine if the tilt's not on.
    41:01
    Yeah, you need that tilt on a little more. Oh, yeah. Keep working those drop cards. Go in there. Yep. Yeah. I'll dance with him. Bill will just straight up turn it off. Oh, yeah. Middle of the game.
    41:21
    Oh, my gosh. Fun game, though, guys. See, I'm shaking it. It's not a game. Those are games, yeah. There are some tight tilts in this basement. Yeah. I'm gentle. Keep our games. Bring back Lord of the Rings for those of us who missed it. Obviously, you know. Well, you're here to announce the Vault Edition Lord of the Rings tonight, right, George?
    41:38
    heard it here folks heard it folks right exactly I'm splitting this theme on a future release in a cornerstone what I mean is have a version done in rebel artwork maybe another version in imperial artwork interesting concept I'll tell you that I will say that to you interesting concept so kind of like Transformers had kind of different very interesting concept right and we did it with X-Men also right we had a Wolverine and a Magneto right Yeah, so, and then, you know, Transformers had the Autobots and Decepticons. Absolutely, absolutely. And then a combined version. So, yeah, it's a great concept. Star Wars lends itself well to something similar. It sure does. You never know. You might see something like that one day. Oh, see? You never know. He's dangling the carrot a little bit. You never know. Sidekick Pinballer is asking, George, how many pinball machines are in development today at Stern? Right. So, a bunch. More than one. So there are four Cornerstone teams, even though we only do three a year. There's four teams working on Cornerstones. And then, of course, we do things like Elvira, which basically we call that a studio game. Studio game. Yeah. That's kind of the first time I heard the term studio game. Yeah. Yeah, so we, honestly, Batman was supposed to be, you know, a studio game only because the license came in from the outside. That was the problem. Yeah, but the reality is that the work was done inside. So, yeah, studio games, and then we do, you know, we do private label games. Okay, yeah. So, you know, like a brand will approach us and say, you know, we want to do.
    43:22
    And then, of course, these things will, you know, at some point right now, I'm the dad of this, you know. But, I mean, at some point, it's like if this becomes, if the demand for this grows the way we anticipate it's going to, there will be a team dedicated to this. For this edition. Yeah. There will be, like, there will be guys working on basically pins. You know, every year we're going to do X number of pins. And so, yeah. Awesome. And in this particular game, too, you said there's a lot of add-on accessories that will be available. Yeah, it's kind of cool. So we did a truly sound-engineered speaker package for it. Right. And it all plugs and plays. All the connectors are there already when you get your game. And so you'll be able to drop all that stuff in. All you've got to do is bolt it in. And right now, the game ships with a single speaker. So those add-on accessories are not meant to have huge technical prowess as far as pinball goes. I mean, it's for the average consumer that just wants to add on to their game. Yeah, you still need to screw them all together.
    44:27
    Screwdriver, most people can handle. Yeah, yeah. You're not soldering anything in. Most people have at least a screwdriver. Level one. So there's a speaker set. There's a Millennium Falcon that goes by the Millennium Falcon ramp. It's the Millennium Falcon from the commercial games with the lights in the back. And that's illuminated, right? Yeah, the back illuminates, and the connectors are there. So, you know, it screws in, and you plug it in. And the pin was designed with that in mind. It wasn't like an afterthought. So it's already pretty ready to kind of go in there. There's the Stormtrooper head, which basically you unscrew the Rebel logo on the shooter. Oh, cool. I don't know if you guys noticed that. That's nice, just to be able to unscrew a shooter. Did you guys notice that shooter? Yeah, it's like all comes out in one single housing. It's associated to the play field. It bolts into the play field, zero adjustment. It's interesting. And the game ships, gets to the location, and guess what? It's perfectly adjusted because it's always registered to the play field. It never gets out of alignment. And so we love that, and this platform ends up being a great proving ground because if we see something that we like in this platform, it might migrate to the big games, right? Right. You also saw the rails instead of the machine shooter groove, right, to protect the shooter groove, right? Because the shooter groove, you know, we see all the complaints, our own games. Right, it's a vulnerable spot. Yeah, hard-coded eventually chips and wears away, and you get that black spot, right, from the steel. Yep. And so imagine that, right? You know, it works great. Yeah. And if we did it on the commercial games, we'd make it so that they were totally replaceable, right? Yeah. Attack from Mark. Mark cheered 100 bets. Thank you, buddy. Thank you. So, yeah, there's that. There's Art Blades for it. And then if we ever see the fabled R2 Topper, it plugs and plays. And all the code is there.
    46:21
    And we're going to be giving away two of those tonight. Just kidding. Let's do another four-player game. We'll keep it going. Yeah, let's do it. You got time for another game? Absolutely. All right. I'm having fun. You want to keep the rotation? Somebody's got to blow up the desk. Yeah, we're going to blow it up. We're blowing that desk up. I can't talk and play. Well, don't. Yeah, Bill doesn't like that. Do you want to keep the same order? We can keep the same order or we can reverse order. I can start off and we can come this way. Yeah, why don't you do it? Yeah, yeah. You know, the one thing I do have today is last night I was putting in Art Blades in Jurassic Park. Pro? All good. Yep. And, you know, there was two connectors, play field, you know, two connectors and a cable. Yeah. Came right out. I was like, wow. This is the same way.
    47:01
    Anyone in the free world could do art blades now. Yeah, this play field is fairly light. Yeah. So, you know, basically it comes right out and it lifts up just like the other games. Yeah. Well, it's not like doing, you know, yanking the play field on some of the old Williams stuff. We had a hundred connectors. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Yeah, right. You know, I told the wife, give me a couple hours downstairs. I've got to throw my blades in, my pin stadiums, some other add-ons. You know, an hour later, I'm like, what do I do now? I can't go upstairs. I mean, I've got free time now. I can't tell you how many times I've had to really look hard to plug my Willie games back together. Oh, my gosh. Oh, yeah.
    47:43
    Tell me one of those was a Monster Bash or something you designed. You're like, I designed this thing. I didn't know where it was. You've done it so many times.
    47:53
    And I thought to myself, I've only done this like a million times. Right? I can't, how do I not remember where this goes?
    48:04
    Well, and some of the innovations that, you know, you've been a part of over time, you know, like, you know, people keep chiming in with Pinball 2000. Yeah. You know, just the story of you and Pat building it in the garage. I mean, so you're not a novice when it comes to this stuff. No, I've done a few of them. Yeah.
    48:22
    All right, I'm going to get caught up in Chad here. Yeah, right in the book. All right, it looks like he's, yeah, it looks like he's in desktop multiball. He just has to get it. When he gets down to one ball, he'll start that timer.
    48:34
    And there it is. Okay. All right. You're Luke in the trench. Oh, there it is. Makes it look easy.
    48:42
    All right. Well, thanks for coming by, George. Thanks, everybody. See you later. All right. So back in chat here.
    48:54
    Let's see here. What are we going to jump in? All right. So our buddy Kerry Hardy asked a question. What is the most challenging part of your job at Stern?
    49:04
    Wow. It's really keeping all the plates in the air. I mean, really, it's like my days are pretty insane, right? It's like, you know, sort of like keeping the design teams kind of on track, fixing their problems, trying to help them do their jobs, and dealing with, like, some of the strategy stuff on a company. Where's the company going? like sort of big picture stuff that is like down the road, doesn't really relate to a particular game or theme, but like sort of background to, you know, what we want to be when we grow up kind of thing, you know. So it's a lot of stuff. And then, of course, there's production problems, right? There's all kinds of issues that are the nature of the business, you know. You know, like stuff goes wrong. You didn't plan it. You've got to solve a problem.
    49:53
    Well, a lot of the problems today are not the problems that they were 20 years ago. No, I mean, the product, first of all, the product's really a lot more complex. Yeah. And so we put a lot, you know, we put a lot more depth in the games. The development cycles are more complicated. Just the addition of the LCD, right? I mean, you guys have had Chuck here. Oh, yeah. I hope he talks a little bit about, you know, his process. Oh, for sure, yes. Right? Yeah.
    50:18
    Especially when he's trying to tell Steve Ritchie what he doesn't want in animation, and then Steve Ritchie automatically wants what Chuck doesn't want to have to animate. So it's a fun time. So those kinds of things, you know, it's like I've tried to surround myself with really strong leaders.
    50:34
    It really helps me do my job, right? And they take some amount of the pressure. And then, you know, at the end of the day, they know that if they lock horns, then I'm going to have to go in there and make a decision one way or the other, right? So it's a fun job. It's a lot of work. It's not an eight to five, nine to five? No, it's not. Is this your dream job? Is there something else if you weren't in pinball that you would find yourself doing? You know, I can't imagine, really. I don't know. I mean, it's like I really don't know. I've been in this so long. It's just, it's in my blood. And my days are just really long and full. Yeah, right. I get it. People tell me that, you know, they say. You should see the life of a streamer, George. Someday. You know, they say, someday you're going to miss this. And I'm like, someday, you know, they tell me that on a day when my world is just freaking insane. I got red-eyed. Thanks for the thousand-bit fight. Really? I'm going to miss this insanity?
    51:37
    Yeah, but that's what keeps you going, though, you know? Yeah. All those fires of, you know. The resurgence is so exciting right now, though, too, because it's like nothing ceases to amaze me. Like, when something comes out, something immediately follows. and there's just this cadence of just content that's being provided by, you know, people all over the place. It's a fun time to be involved. Yeah, we're trying really hard. We're working our asses off, but it's all good. No, you're on the product. Boogie Man, thank you for the 400 bets. You want to take a player three here? Sure, sure. We'll see you. Well, you got the Death Star, I think, right? You did get the Death Star, right? All right, Death Star. Was that an R2, or did you get the Death Star? Oh, was it R2? Maybe it was R2. I wasn't paying attention. Did anybody see a Death Star explode? Because when I looked up at the screen, I didn't see it. I just thought I crushed it. Maybe not.
    52:29
    Appreciate the bits, guys. Yeah, thank you very much, guys. Captain Red Eye and Boogie Man, thank you so much. We're trying to keep up with chat, too, but there's just so much that we're trying to cover. So, you know, it's not a lot of conversation, guys. It's just a crazy day, you know, with questions. For those that might have just tuned in, we're streaming Star Wars Pin, which is the home edition version of Star Wars, and streaming it with us tonight is Mr. George Gomez from Stern Pinball.
    52:55
    It's what happens down here. We do not play well on stream. Something with Ken's basement. It is. Everything's getting out of the basement. We're in transition period. There's bad luck down here with pinball. I don't understand.
    53:09
    As long as the machines aren't breaking. That hasn't happened. We'll see. It was R2-Multi-Pump. It was R2? Okay.
    53:18
    Oh, hey, what's up, Dwight? Zachary, I imagine that might be Dwight Sullivan. Yeah. Dwight's up in here. Congratulations on your Ghostbusters update, man. Yeah, buddy. And Game of Thrones.
    53:31
    Yep, it's Dwight. Dwight's been a little busy. Dwight's been a little busy, right? Yeah. And he's working on his next thing, you know? Well, when can we expect the Star Wars code update, Dwight?
    53:43
    I'm just kidding. Ooh. Right down the middle. Just a little. No. Hey, it's okay. That's all right. Just a little one. I thought George beat the hell out of this game, and it took it, so go for it.
    53:58
    It's me now, huh? It is you. It is me. Yeah, Dwight doesn't seem to ever take a minute, man. Every time you talk to him, he's leaving work at 9 o'clock or going in on Sunday. Yeah, right? All right. Cardi, Cardi wants to know if we can anticipate more sequels to games of the past.
    54:19
    Probably not anytime soon. Yeah, probably not anytime soon. I mean, you guys are playing so far in advance. Yeah, we definitely, like, we know what we're doing. Like, probably to, like, 21. Wow. If I get a vote, though, I would love to see a getaway three.
    54:40
    You know, just saying. Bill's vote, getaway three. I know I might not be the popular vote on that one, but that's okay. I'll take it.
    54:54
    All right, so getting caught up here in chat. Yep, yep. Arcademaster, thanks for subscribing with Twitch Prime. Thank you, Arcademaster. Creepy Tom asked a question. I don't know if you wanted to address it. What was it? Any Kapow titles? No.
    55:12
    Maybe. I don't know. You know, maybe. You got it? Yeah, we got it. All right. That star is done. Nice little light shoulder. We can leave that right there so we don't have to address it anymore. Competition Perfect Pins, with a team of coders constantly supporting them in order to grow. So, Spectator Pinball, the unthemed, unbranded madness.
    55:36
    Don't hold your breath. And that is Dennis Creasel of the Complexion Gamers Podcast, and occasionally he co-hosts this week in Pinball Podcast, too. Right. So, I know you're a big listener of podcasts. I'm just kidding. I have no idea if you listen to podcasts. I think I listen when, like, some of my guys are on. Yeah.
    55:59
    I do. Did you listen to ours when you were on? Yes, I did. There we go. Yes, I did. George Gomez, official listener of Special Olympic Podcast.
    56:08
    Will I design any more cornerstones? Maybe. Yeah, maybe. Maybe. Man, they're just trying to pull everything out of you tonight, huh?
    56:17
    So, your last cornerstone. All right, here's another one. There we go. There you go. Yeah, my last cornerstone was Deadpool, yep.
    56:26
    Katana shot, one of the most fun freaking shots. Yeah, I had a good time. Shots and locks on that game. I had a good time with that. I had a good time with the snick shot. The snick shot is... So this is the thing. A lot of people think it's impossible, but if you just concentrate on that shot and you get it down, you can get that multiplier up. I do it all the time. Yeah, yeah. Game's got to be set up properly, though, because if you're off... Yeah, but it's not even that finicky. Right. You just dial in the shot. Yeah.
    56:55
    All right. That star is no more. That star is crushed. So we've got another pin post out. Two of five. Not bad right now.
    57:08
    Jobbridge, I like your question. I don't think I'm going to answer that, though. Deadpool's a great game, says Chrome Candy Pinball.
    57:15
    Yeah, I like it. No, but Batman is wildly popular. Yeah, Batman. Batman 66. You know, it's that Lyman magic, right? Is that what it is? I think so, yeah. I think it's like his magnum opus.
    57:36
    Thank you, Pink Quest, for the 500 bits for the Death Star. Well, you guys did that game in record time, too, right? Yeah, we were stressed on that. That one was not as much fun as Deadpool. It was a lot of work in a very short period of time and with a lot of pressure on all of us from different places.
    58:06
    So, you know, I mean, it just kind of, it was not something I want to repeat anytime soon, even though the game came out, like, amazing, you know. Well, now correct me if I'm wrong, but I know that the artwork was, like, done like a month or something before, and literally before you guys showed those games. I hated it.
    58:25
    You hated the game or the artwork? No, I hated the artwork, and that's how we found Mr. Franchise. Oh, okay. Because basically the artwork was, like, you know, I just couldn't, I couldn't, I feel like I'm sorry, we just can't ship this. Oh, wow. Yeah, so like Greg and I online, you know, like searching for like somebody that could be the Batman artist. And he stumbled on some of his work and then like. On Fiverr? Moved quickly. Yeah. Chris works pretty fast. I mean, he's being tough. Yeah. And he had, you know, he had a bunch of that stuff kind of from previous work that he had done. Yeah. He knew the brand really well. he could bring a lot of power to bear quickly. So, yeah.
    59:17
    But, yeah, I wasn't, like you said, I don't know if it was a month out. It was probably a couple months out, but it was not, you know, it was a bad direction. Well, I just heard the stories that you guys were putting the decals on, like days before Expo when you guys were going to show it, and I was like, wow, you'd have to be pulling your hair out to be under that. Oh, yeah, no, I mean, the Expo crunch was insane. Yeah, it was real. So, hey, you're going to bring another game to Expo this year, too, with Elvira, which is going to be pretty awesome. That one is much further along than Batman was. Makes sense. Not so much of a crunch. Right, right. Actually, you know, we're going to stream that this week. Yes, you are. Right. Is that Wednesday or Thursday? Yeah, Wednesday. 25th, 7 o'clock. Deadclip. Yep, deadclip. Check it out. I mean, the game is pretty cool. It's the Elvira you imagine it is. I'm a big Elvira fan. I'm a big Greg Ferreris fan, too. We'll be tuning in. We will be tuning in. And at some point, we'll have that pin here, I'm sure, so we'll stream it. Yeah, I mean, Greg really outdid himself. And, you know, Lyman, you know, I mean, is coding the thing. So, I mean, that's a... It's exciting. Yeah. It's like everything's converging. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You ready for your ball? Is that me again? It's you. You're good. We'll finish this game, and then we can take a couple calls. and get Mr. Gomez on his way here. So we are... Yeah, and Lord Helmet, I saw your question about asking what George's background was, so when he jumps back on the mic, feel free to message that again, because, you know, any questions we can answer, let's get them answered. Hey, Taco Pizza! We got ourselves a little bit of a place. Taco Pizza, brother. Nicely done. Making me hungry. Cheers. I love Taco Pizza.
    61:00
    What we'll do, too, is for those of you that want to come in and actually you can call and talk to George on the phone. and for after hours though tonight, again this is going to be an abbreviated stream, we're not going to run too late but when you call in have your question ready and let's ask it to George and have a little back and forth and let's get to another caller, let's try to work quickly tonight so we can get as many people in before George has to hightail out because he's got a pretty long ride home yeah, we don't want to keep him forever, we're just grateful that he made it out absolutely he literally drove the opposite way to his house by a lot Yeah, right here. Quite a lot. Absolutely. Hey, what's up, Kaz? How are you? What's going on?
    61:38
    And we've got a little bit of everybody in chat tonight. We've got Jack Bennett from Flippin' Out and Swift from Straight Down the Middle. We've got Dennis Creasel from Eclectic Gamers Podcast. Kaz, special correspondent. We've got Albert from Pinball Nerds Podcast here. We've got Zachary. Zachary is Mr. Dwight Sullivan. Dwight, the master of code over there at Stern Pinball. what up Dwight Zach's recommending that we or Zachary Dwight's recommending that we stream Elvira at some point with Greg Ferris it'd be fun Greg's been here absolutely he's here and played on my Skirt Stiff yep and it was so cool to see like the guy who's like his passion's all involved oh my god have you seen the detail he's put into this game I mean yeah he's like you know yeah it's like nuts I mean it's like you need a magnifying glass to find all the crap he's put in the game it's hard to see it in person Oh, yeah. Are you ready? Yes, I am. Lord Helmut was going to send another question because he had a question about George's background, and I didn't want to get ignored. Oh, sure. So he says, George, just curious, what is your background? Engineer, what pulled you into pinball? Right. So I have a degree in industrial design. So I'm a product designer by trade, and my career started out working on video games. I worked on Spy Hunter and Tron back in the late 70s, early 80s in Midway Games. I was a toy inventor at a consulting firm all we did was invent toys and sell them to all the big toy oh wow that was my job after Midway I was at Midway about seven years and then worked for this consulting firm for about five years that was fun designing all kinds of toys I love looking at your sketches because they're still like they look like pieces of art well I mean that's what designers do right I like it a lot and you share that stuff online too oh yeah and if you Facebook friend me all that stuff's up there yeah And then I, somewhere along the line, I looked at, I mean, I did novelty games, you know, like I did all kinds of redemption type novelty games.
    63:41
    While I was doing that, I sort of, the Williams guys noticed me and I thought, you know, Pinball Machine looks like a big giant toy. I think it would be fun to design those. So then I went to work at Willie and you know I did all the games I did when I was there And so yeah Pinball Machines are big toys toys Yeah they are Yep One of the craziest stories that I heard you tell and I can remember where so forgive me for that, was your idea on how you came across how to do NBA Fast Break. You were in the middle of doing a redemption game. Yeah. Yeah, we were doing a head-to-head game with cannons. It started out with flippers and pinball, right? And you had as many balls as you could have, and it was sort of video game rules. You had a tank, and I had a tank, and the tank was sort of laid out in insert from the center of the play field. Okay. And when there were targets, the targets up play field were all tanks. And so when you blew up a tank, you were basically, eventually I lost pieces of my life, right? Okay. Like the tanks, their lights started at the tank in the back, and it started moving towards you. And if you didn't blow him up and that light got to your tank, you're dead. Yeah, okay. You lost a piece of your life. You got like a rapid fire. That actually sounds, I kind of would like to see that now. Yeah. And somebody out there at the Whitewoods, I've seen the Whitewoods out in the lines. Somebody's got it. What's the name of this game? It was called, at the time it was called Arms are Dangerous. And then we went, the flipper thing, we couldn't make it work. The timing was just off. It wasn't, I couldn't have constant balls. They would, like, balls would be coming back, and it just wasn't, we needed to have instant firepower. Yeah, yeah. So then we took the tanks and we made the tanks, we made a cannon, and the cannon fired a one-inch nylon ball through the air. And you took out these tanks with the nylon ball. And the two games were linked together, right? So basically the tanks on your game were mine, and the tanks on my game were yours, right? Yeah. And it was the head-to-head concept, right? But the sales guys came down and looked at the game at one of the reviews, and they said, you know, we just don't know what to do with this.
    65:54
    But they said, but if you start a pinball machine, if you just start a pinball design tomorrow, we know what to do with that. Like they killed the game. So I was like, okay. So I had to start a pinball design right away, and I didn't have a lot of time. It's the story of my life. I always end up, I'm the guy with the compressed schedule every time. And so, but I never say no. And so I, you know, I said, okay, go get me an NBA license. And I knew, sort of knew in my head, I'd had, for a long time, I'd had this idea about a defender and working against the shot clock and being able to pass the ball back and forth, you know, like fast break, right? And so I started that. And then as we, right away, the team focused on getting the whitewood up and getting the pinball machine built. And a little bit as we progressed, one day we started thinking, hey, how do we salvage all that linking stuff that we did? Yeah. For, you know. Sure. You know, and it was like Eureka. You know, and I mean, it works because of the basketball scoring. Yeah. Right. One, twos and threes. You know, you get that. It's a relatable score. And Tim Kitzler, the announcer, right, keeping the pace, four quarters of basketball, 32 second shot clock or, you know, 20 second shot clock. You know, I mean, it's like the 24-second chalk clock, all that stuff is like the magic, right? Well, I mean, that was ahead of its time. And here you were in Chicago in the 90s, so, I mean, it was Bulls fever. Everyone was watching the NBA. It was a lot of fun, yeah. And the guys across, you know, the guys, you know, at that time, Midway and Valley were one company, and Williams were all one company. And my good friend Mark Trammell had just done NBA Jam. So we had an NBA relationship.
    67:47
    I was watching what he was doing, right? So it was like, oh, NBA is perfect. You know, I'll do a pinball version.
    67:55
    And, yeah, so. We need that. We need the linked NBA jams. NBA fast breaks. Yeah, we need that. NBA fast breaks, yeah.
    68:06
    Pinball machine. I've had one. Yeah, I mean, you know what? They all hold a special place in my heart because I put everything I am into them. And even when you don't like them, even when you hate them, I put everything I have into them. So they're all like that snapshot in time. Sure. And, you know, I have to say right now I'm very enamored with Deadpool. Yeah. But, you know, I'm still very enamored with my Monster Bash. And, you know, on certain days, my Lord of the Rings speaks to me, right? And so it's kind of like, you know, I mean, it's – and, you know, there's days where I'm like, wow, you know, Johnny Mnemonic, what an amazing – you know, it's like I had so much fun with that. That was one of the funniest stories I think I've ever heard. You tell the – once again, I don't know where it's from, but, you know, you went to go see the premiere of Johnny Mnemonic, and you were like, this is the – Yeah, I called the factory and said, we got to get out of this. We've got to get out. We've got to get out now. And now that's like a cult game. You know, everyone wants that game. What game is that? Johnny and I'm on it. Oh, Johnny and I'm on it. The movie studio, we were hassling them, you know, come on, you guys got to show us the movie. And I knew, you know, I was a fan of William Gibson. I read the short story, and the short story was cool. Yeah. And so I thought, you know, and Neil McCaster was running. And William, at the time, he said, you've got to do this. Sony's going to put $100 million into this. And I was like, okay. Which makes complete sense, though. Yeah, it makes complete sense. And then we kept saying, show us something. Show us something. We're at the end of the development cycle. I mean, we've got our pinball machine basically built. And they said, okay, come fly to Hollywood. So I flew to Hollywood. And they screened the movie for me. and I ran out of the movie theater, called Chicago. Can we get out of this?
    70:09
    That's horrible. Oh, man. Well, that's the risky run, right? Right, absolutely. Let's name it something else.
    70:20
    Retheme the sucker. Whoa, Nelly. Big Juicy Melons, man. Redo it. That's crazy. But you know what? Even now, though, you've got those people that are diehard Johnny Mnemonic fans. I love the game we made more money with the game than they did with the movie that's awesome thank you guys we've had fencing pinball stones for two months appreciate it favorite game that I wasn't involved in I like a lot of the same stuff you guys like I like Attack from Mars I like Medieval Madness I love Terminator 2 I mean I have You know what? Right now, I'm going to own a Jurassic Park. I'm personally going to own a Jurassic Park. My own hard-earned money is going to go to a Jurassic Park. Right, right. I help those guys a little bit with their dinosaur. And your Jeep, too, right? Yeah, and I think they knocked it out of the park. So I think it's a solid. I think those premiums are, like, premium LEs are just so solid. But we have an LE here we unboxed it Friday. Because we've been shooting the pro for a few weeks. And, man, I mean, the fun factor is there. But you get all the other stuff that's added on. You know what you're going to get? And you're going to get a lot cooler dyno behavior. Yeah, right. Like some of the updates that those guys are working on are a bunch of cool, like a lot more. Coming down the road. Yeah, man, I bought the Pro. That was my first new in box. And you're going to make me sell it. No, I mean, you know what? I'm going to make you sell it. The Pro is a solid game. It is a solid game. I know, I know. It's a solid game. It is. So, George, Kid Caruso asks, how many games do you currently own? So I own everything I have. Everything you made. Yeah, everything I made. I have a Terminator 2. I have a Medieval Madness. I have, I'm trying to think.
    72:14
    Yeah, so, I mean, everything I made basically means I don't have any room for games. Yeah. Well, we know how that goes. Yes, Brian Eddy is hard at work. Yes, yes. Flipping out. Yes, he is. I can't wait to see what Brian Eddy's working on. Yeah. All right, one question, and we'll let you shoot. Which Transformers version do you have? Okay. The LE? The Recepticon? Yeah. I have a Recepticon. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
    72:42
    We'll leave that alone. All right. Trending up. Just added you to the Transformers Recepticon. I have, I will own a Batman 66. I have yet to take it home.
    72:54
    That's cool. Storage issues. It's a real thing. Pace issues, man. We all have them. I mean, I paid a store, games. I mean, they're brand new in the box. I have no place to put them. Sure. See a little storage unit going? Storing a unit? You've got to start storing them at your sister's or brother's house. That's what I do. I'm starting to foster. What are some of these other questions? What am I catching here?
    73:23
    Let's see. Do you have a Batman the Dark Knight? Yeah, I do. Actually, I had both versions. I did a stripped-down version, and I donated that. So you donated that one to Project Nemo. Yeah, to Project Nemo. And somehow I had ended up with two regular ones, and I don't remember why. I think one of them was like a parts game or something, you know, like pieces and pieces.
    74:03
    And I put it all back together, ended up auctioning it to a charity at a charity event, and it went for like more money than you can imagine. Wow. Very cool. That's awesome. You can help people out like that. Yeah. Help charities. I mean, you got to. You just got to. Oh, yeah. I've been really fortunate. I mean, I'm blessed to have spent a career making fun stuff. And, you know, you can't.
    74:33
    I think about, man, what my life could have been. Well, I mean, if you think about it this way, George, we'll let you take your turn. I mean, nothing rounds out your career like showing up on the Flippin' Up streaming channel. I mean, this is it now. It's like a pinnacle of a very established player. I appreciate the invite. No, we appreciate that you came on. I'm having a good time. Good times. Let's wrap this game up. Do you want to take a couple calls before you close out? Sure, absolutely, yeah. Are you up?
    75:03
    You are up. What do we got score-wise up here? This is a bad one. This game shoots a lot better after you had me set it up properly, by the way. I had that set at like five and a half degrees. You mean when you set a game up, it actually plays better? George is like, you can put a little more pitch on it. I think it'll play a little faster. And he's like, it seems a little floaty. I'm like, all right, it's at like five and a half. Where do you want it? He's like, how about seven? I'm like, oh, snap, I'm down there. Oh, yeah. It plays good. I spent a good amount of time underneath that pinball machine trying to get that thing set up. It's playing fun. And there is a tilt bob in this. The only game we didn't have that tilt bob in was the Oktoberfest. Right? No, I think it was in there. But it had something blocking it. Oh, yeah.
    75:48
    What was the game that Chuck was trying to tilt out when he was here? And we couldn't do it because the manager... Oh, did you tilt out?
    75:55
    You've got to put a tilt in your office now because you're just breathing on it. You looked at it and it tilted.
    76:03
    So what's the record number of games Stern has, like, title-wise, Stern's put out a year? Not number-wise, not quantities, but, like, as far as, like, titles. No idea. No idea? Yeah. I mean, I'm trying to remember.
    76:17
    I mean, I don't know. I mean, it's like. That's a question from Pins Rule with Dr. John out of all skills. And, you know, the year's not out. Yeah, I know. Well, see, that's it. Now, last year you guys snuck a couple titles in at the end of the year where I was like, whoa, I didn't see that coming. So we do. So a lot of that is about the European market. Yeah. Because we've got to get games on the water. Right. So, yeah, so December, a lot of the December intros are more intended to go overseas. Yep. Yeah. And then you guys see them, like, usually in January of the following year. So we're in September. We've got October, November, December. So potentially four or five more releases this year. Well, there's, you know, there's Christmas coming. I know, I know. A little holiday cheer. Got to have some fun stuff. I couldn't agree anymore. Any more? Can you box me out of there? I'm sorry. Yes, I can. I'm sorry. Thank you. No, you're good. You're good. It's too long for me to walk over there, Bill. Grand champ. I'm tired.
    77:17
    I'm tired. What was that story? George brought over fresh code on this today, right? Yeah, I did. We're going to do another release soon. This release, I was telling these guys, I hate to tease you with the notion of the Star Wars topper, but this release actually has a bunch of code that had I been able to bring you a topper. Oh, yeah. Well, you know what? Lionel would have been out the door to look at the copper, so it probably best we would have had a traffic issue. Yeah. High score number three, who was that, for player two? Yeah.
    77:47
    That was George. Oh. Okay. I don't know if you want to enter your initials. Just box me out. Nope. Okay. We're going to go into after hours here in a second. And after hours is fun, George, because we just essentially just take a couple calls. It's all good. Well, we'll get as many people in. You got another 15, 20 minutes before you got a skedaddle, or what are you thinking? It's 7-15. I know you're tight on time. I'm good. Just let's bring it. Let's give people what they want. Let's bring it. Oh, I like that. Pins rule. You got good taste. Deadpool and Batman 66. Yeah.
    78:24
    I'd be surprised if a game comes out after Elvira says El Anonymous. Never say never. You never know.
    78:33
    467. Thank you. All right. Let's get into a little after hours here. Before we do that, we're going to pay some bills.
    78:48
    After Hours is here. Actually, I think we have another. Do we have another graphic for this? Hey, there he is. That's George Gomez. He's there. We're going to open up the call here in a second. Typically, we have a lot of regulars that call in, and these guys bring it every single week. So let's see if we can have some fun as I set up the hotline here. And we'll get back to chat here in just a second.
    79:09
    So beer with me. I'll set up the beer with you. Yeah, beer with me. Dude, we're catching like a tan from this TV with the white screen there. Hey, that's what it's all about.
    79:21
    Be helpful in winter. So the number is 630-283-2888. All we ask is that you be kind and courteous, ask a good question, and let's get people in and out so that we can get as many people in to talk to George while he's still here.
    79:35
    And that's the number. Live Catch Pinball, have you already selected, closed the seven themes for the year? How much time do you need in advance to launch a theme?
    79:45
    Read that again? Sorry. No, you're good. The question is, have you already selected or closed the seven themes for the next year? Yeah. And how much time do you need in advance to launch a theme? So I guess is your schedule all the way? So the dev schedules are, I mean, we know we're making probably through 2021.
    80:06
    Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. And it's because, you know, it's because the different licenses and different approvals. Absolutely. And we have to plan, right? I mean, we have to. Yeah. So we know a lot of the stuff that we're making. The dev cycle on a game is roughly 14 months. Okay. Something like that. Right. So, you know, depending on the designer, depending on the challenges that he runs into along the way. And so, yeah. Good times. Caller, welcome to the Flippin' On Streaming Network. You're on with George Gomez.
    80:42
    Hey, how's it going, guys? Hey! What's up, man? You're on with George, Zach. Oh, my God. George Gomez is there? Yes, he's here. I didn't believe it until he pulled up.
    80:54
    It was a nice experience. How's it going? me how's it how's it going george all good brother all good so we had fun tonight streaming yeah thanks again for coming and hanging out with the guys there uh and representing star wars the pin uh i played the heck out of that thing before i shipped it up to those guys and i gotta say the layout is tight it's fast serious it's so much fun man excellent job thank you i had a lot of fun making it um and like i said it's a lot of people said you know It's the same as the Supreme or the Spidey, but the reality is that it's all different. Right. It is very, you know, are there similarities? Absolutely. But no two posts are in the same place.
    81:37
    You know, it's an opportunity to make it better, so why wouldn't you do it? I agree. It's fun, too, Zach, because, and you played it, we're just getting games under our belt, but I was saying earlier, it doesn't feel like it's not a pinball experience. It just feels like it's a different layout of Star Wars. It's a fun machine. It does.
    81:56
    Absolutely. The fun thing about this machine is that the affordability on it, now I can, as a dealer, distributor, I can take it to doctor's offices and pitch it. I can take it to office break rooms, rec rooms. Oh, good point. Everywhere. This thing fits perfect. And that's, I mean, that's the hope, right? The hope is that not only will you get it into new places, but it'll introduce new people into the hobby, right? And little kids, it's friendly. It's not a horrible master bedroom pin either, like if you just needed to have something. After we talk the wife into it. Right. That's right. It's like, we're going to put this in the corner. We just put it up there. You don't have to.
    82:33
    Especially like everybody in chat right now, think of how great this would be if you went to work tomorrow morning and this pin was sitting in your break room. You'd be playing the hell out of this thing. So you need to pitch it to whoever's running that business. If it's you, get one of these in your break room. Pitch it to my boss. It's the way to go. Seriously. Easy to maintain, too. He was talking about accessories. There are add-ons, obviously, that you can put into the pin, seamlessly integrated. So it's not anything overly complex.
    83:01
    One quick question for George, and I'll leave you guys alone so everybody else can call. George, some of my favorite ramp shots in pinball history were designed by you. They were the left ramp on Monster Bash and the left ramp, the Legolas, on Lord of the Rings. from the play field straight to wire form. Do you see yourself ever utilizing that design feature in another cornerstone pin? Sure. And there's one on this pin, right? Yeah. Yes, there is. Yep, absolutely. And I gave you two ways up on this one. Yes, you did. So, yeah, I think I love that design. I think it makes for some really fast ramps. Absolutely. And, you know, you can do – you can get a lot of speed, and you can get the ball on the guide long before you hit the wire, and that's the magic, right? That's really the magic. It just – it's so smooth. Yeah. Well, thanks again, George. I appreciate it. Thank you. Ken, Bill, Beatty, love you guys. I'll talk to you guys later. Thanks, man. I appreciate it, man.
    84:06
    See you. Yeah. Peace. See you, too. So that opens up the line, 630-283-2888. On with George Gomez, Stern Pinball. And actually, George, you brought a couple of flyers, Star Wars flyers that you signed that you can give away tonight, right? Yeah, we've got five flyers to give away. So we'll have to give something away. Thanks for calling the Flippin' On Streaming Network. You're on with George Gomez.
    84:26
    Good afternoon. Good evening. Good morning from here. Hey, what's up, Dr. John? How's Australia today?
    84:34
    It's good. I've got the flu, but that's okay. Oh, jeez. Life with children, that's just what it is. I'm sorry. I'm a doctor of truth myself. That's OK. I just wanted to say to George, mainly congratulations to Stern on coming out of the dark ages with coding. The feeling I've got is, you know, two years ago, so many games came out with such early code that they weren't appreciated. They were getting bad reviews. Batman 66 got a hell of a hard time when it first came out. But with all the new stuff that you're employing, now do you ever... I think, and Dwight doing his updates with Game of Thrones and Ghostbusters, do you think we see the end of days with games coming out with incomplete code? Well, I'll tell you that. Thanks for the call, Dr. Jeff. I'll tell you that we don't want to ship incomplete code anymore than you want to get incomplete code.
    85:28
    Our environment is not as nice, neat, and predictable as you imagine it is, meaning that things happen, you know, like licensing things happen, issues happen with the product itself, meaning that, you know, maybe a device required a lot more driver design than it would have normally, you know, than you anticipated, et cetera. Sure, that makes sense. And even with all that being said, we're still a very small shop. Yeah. I mean, you know, you guys think I've added like 30 coders. I haven't. But you have increased staff there, though. We have. Yeah, we have. You addressed that. We have increased staff. And we've always been a self-funded business, meaning that the business of the company is what funds R&D. It's what funds growth. It's what funds survival. And, you know, guys, we have to do what we have to do to survive. Right. And so it it's it it is the success, you know, that we you know, we've had. I mean, you know, when I started when I took over product development in 2011, there were nine nine guys in the company. Right. And and we were we went into we went into the business of making, you know, cornerstones three, you know, three distinct models, price points and three a year with with. with a very, very reduced staff, right? So you can imagine the challenges. Stresses, yeah. And so it's kind of like it's that growth out that has allowed us to, you know,
    87:15
    ship the games in a more finished fashion. You know, we don't. Hey, we pay for the games with our own money, the guys in product development, and we all own games. We all buy them. Yep. And we don't want unfinished games anymore, and you want them. So, you know, we get it. And I feel your pain, and I'm sorry that we had to ship some of the games we did the way they were. I can tell you that there's lots of stuff behind the scenes that you don't see, challenges, that when we do something and it's maybe not real clear to you why, And as a company, we're not in the business of, you know, we're very passionate about the games we make. Right. And we want them to be great. We get it. Well, everything's done with a reason. It's not just because it's willy-nilly. Let's just get it out now. Yeah.
    88:12
    Perfect. Collar, you still there? That's good. Can I have my one brick shot at George? Sure. I don't know. Absolutely. All right. Bring it. Have you ever tried to play the Deadpool Alley record that came with the Alley?
    88:27
    No, because I have all those songs on my phone. Like my iTunes. Yeah. Right. I'll give you the tip. When you next make an Alley to give away, an LP to give away at the pinball machine, could you put separation grooves between the tracks? Because it's all one track on each side. It's the Extended Club remix. You're one of them. You can't pick it. It's intentional.
    88:55
    L-E-L-P, baby. Well, there's the brick shot, Dr. Donald. We're going to let you go, but I hope you feel better, buddy.
    89:01
    Get better. I will, Mike. Thanks very much for the stream. All right, so we've got a little album conversation. Taco Pizza wants to know when we're going to get a toll-free number. Is there such a thing as a toll-free number? I ran out of 1010, 811 minutes, international tools. Let's see. Dave Fulgren heard birds. That was Dr. John on hold. So that's how that worked out.
    89:28
    Any chance for Nintendo-themed games in the future? Hypercoaster 200. Have you ever had to think about working with Nintendo as a license? Is that something you could talk about? You know, I mean, I'm trying to think. I'm sure there were Nintendo conversations long before my time. Like back in the day, these days, I don't I don't have anything against anything. I mean, there's no conceptually nothing against it. But do you think like a video game could make for a good pinball? You know, we we pick we pick themes based on what we think the largest demographic. Yeah. Largest demographic, largest audience. We every once in a while we can take we can do what we call a niche game, you know, where we can take a shot at something that maybe is not so obvious. Right. Or that we think there's a large enough audience for it, even if it doesn't like cover our normal. Sure. You know, it's right. I'm thinking of like, for example, you know, Iron Maiden. Right. So it's Iron Maiden huge in Europe. Right. We knew that there were pockets of the states we weren't going to penetrate. And, you know, it's that's but yeah, I mean, that ended up being widely popular game here. Yeah, yeah. So I think that you have nothing against Nintendo. I mean, seriously, we could, you know. You never know. Don't rule it out. You never know. Caller, thanks for calling in to the Flippin' Out Streaming Network. Monday Night Pinball, you're on with George Gomez.
    91:02
    What's up, you maniacs? Hey, Dave. Dave Gomez. Mr. Gomez, one of the kings of the maniacs over there. Thank you so much for everything, all your contributions and all your mad contraptions that you've thrown in front of me over the years. We appreciate it. Thank you. My question is, and you don't have to answer if you don't want to, but I know there was a little controversy towards the beginning of the year about the Beetlejuice pin and how it wasn't made, and you had made a comment saying that you don't get into it,
    91:34
    that basically none of the teams were interested in it. How does that go down? I mean, how – you don't have to be specific on that, but, I mean, how does that happen?
    91:43
    Yeah, I mean, so, okay, so it's important for the teams to be passionate about the products they're making, right? Yeah. That's really – you know, because I don't want to work on something I'm not interested in. So why would I – You don't want to feel obligated. You want to feel more involved. For a year, 14 months, sure. I get it. So if, you know, that product, that concept that you're referring to was one of, you know, I don't know, 50 licenses that we look at. And it didn't really go as far as you think it did. It did, meaning that, you know, Joe Kamikawa Kapow had a relationship with the licensor because I think, you know, he had helped them with some or he had gotten them into some slot machine stuff. Absolutely. And, you know, he said to us, you know, what do you guys think about this? And he thought it was a strong candidate.
    92:42
    Our issues weren't and no conceptual problem with the license. I mean, it's an absolutely valid license. It's an awesome property.
    92:54
    But at the same time, it's kind of like you have to say, this is the stuff that's on our plate. Do we prefer this over this, right? And that's really how that happened. It's just it wasn't – It's an interesting point, too, because if it's one thing, if you're not behind a license, it's not that you're going to phone it in, but to be on that license for 14 months is a huge chunk of your life on something that you're not really passionate about. I mean, do you know anybody who creates things that creates good things if they're not interested in the thing? Yeah, I get it. So are you going in front of the group saying, okay, we've got these five titles, or how does that – I'm just kind of interrupted in the process. Yeah, license selection. Yeah, so the license selection, it's – I mean, it's discussed not only in product development. It's discussed – I mean, it starts out as a discussion in the executive team. Right. So the sales and marketing guys, the licensing guys, the you know, the executive, the rest of the executives in the company eventually, you know, at some point I represent product development. Right. So I take I take the license back to my guys and I say, hey, these are you know, this is what's on the table. Is anyone raising their hands for this stuff? And people go, yeah, I really want to I really want that. or I'm not interested in that or that's not me. I mean, because you know my guys, you know a lot of my guys, and you know that certain things fit certain guys. And myself included. I'm like, I want to work on stuff that I think is cool, that I can envision doing something with. Right? So it's really that. And so then I go back to that committee that selects licenses, And I'd say, this designer, this designer, that designer, raise their hand for this. We'll have to have them fight it out or whatever. We'll see. The other element that is very significant is you may have a team that's very interested, but it doesn't fit in their schedule, right? Because they're off doing something, and they're not going to be free when that particular property has to be made. And sometimes the has to be made is not something that it's a combination, right? The licensor has a lot to say about when they want their property in the world, right? And it's not always open-ended. It's not always like you can do it whenever you want. So sometimes the pressure is also maybe you want to coattail on something they're doing. Okay, yeah. Like, you know, whatever, a band's going on tour or a movie's coming out or something. You know, there's some event so that you want to leverage marketing-wise. So, I mean, that's really the deal. Does that answer your question there, Dave?
    95:47
    Yes. Thank you so much. And one last thing, fast break. Oh, yeah. Good times brother Thanks for calling in Thanks for calling in Dave All right What a fast break reference that taking the world by storm here I don know I guess people like that game People like the fast break That great Good times All right. Catching up on chat here a little bit. What do we have going on here?
    96:09
    A little animated chat today. Yeah. We got a little people going back and forth. Lord of the Rings is the greatest game of all time.
    96:21
    There it is. I happen to have one right here right now. Do you have a nickname, George? Anybody? No. No? I mean, it's like sometimes they use my initials, right? I hear, like, you know, Gigi, you know, say.
    96:35
    Did you? So have you? Anybody talk to Gigi about this? No, I know, right? Okay. Have you been, in your career then, like, because you're talking about passion behind things, have you ever been asked to put a lot, dedicate a lot of time and effort into something that you just weren't behind? I'll tell you. I'll tell you an interesting story. I had read, you know, the Lord of the Rings fiction. Yeah. You know, when I was in high school.
    96:58
    And when they brought me that, when Gary called me and he wanted me to work on that, at the time, the first Matrix movie had just come out, you know. And I wanted him to go get me a Matrix. Yeah, you wanted a Matrix. Yeah. And boy, did I dodge that bullet, right?
    97:16
    Matrix would be decent. Right. And I think that – I also think that Keith Johnson was way more into the theme than I was.
    97:27
    And so I think that – and really the depth in that game is – and the things that people like revel in, stuff on top of stuff on top of stuff. Yeah, yeah. And like all of those threads, that's really Keith, right? I mean, it's like did his enthusiasm kind of pull you in? Yeah. I mean, I think that I think that, you know, that there's a point where a team has to, like, collaborate. Yeah. You know, and it's like it like everybody. The ideas come from a lot of places and then everybody splits up and everybody does their part. And then they come back together, you know, and it's that's just the process. Right. And so, you know, we there's a lot of things that were like a conversation that, you know, it's like, OK, now I have to go make this. Yeah. Real. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Like, you know, I have to catch the ball in this magnet through the air, catch it in this magnet. You know, yeah, it sounds really easy. Right. Well, I'll tell you what it, you know, a lot of late nights for him and a lot of late nights for me on how to make that happen. And every great team that I've been a part of, that's been the interaction, right? The Monster Bash interaction between London and I was that, and the Deadpool interaction between Taddeo and I was that. And so that's what it takes. It's perfect. We've got another caller here. You're on with George Gomez. Hey, first off, I want to say thanks to everybody on there, especially having George out here. This is Lord Helmet. I thought I'd call in. What's up, Lord Helmet? Lord Helmet. What up, brother?
    99:20
    I've got a question, George. How is it decided what themes are the ones that Stern deems worthy of going after, and how many other people are involved in that process, and what does there say? I'm not sure if you can even answer that. Well, you know, I think I just hit that. Yeah, just kind of touched on that for sure. Yeah, like five minutes ago I just touched on that. But to reiterate, so we look at everything. Some of the licenses are licenses that we go after, meaning that we think this would be viable, this would be a great license for us to do as a company.
    99:58
    Sometimes the desire comes out of the development teams, you know, go get me this. Right. And sometimes we have dedicated licensing people that are exposed to everything, right? They go to the licensing show. They're showing everything. They put together a report, a regular report that basically says this is what, you know, this company is doing. This is what they're bringing out. This is the money they're putting behind it. These are the actors involved. This is when it's happening. And we do that for everything. You know, it could be sports. It could be music. It could be, you know, it's basically about being, you know, having your finger on the pulse of popular culture, right? And so it's like we want stuff that's culturally relevant, and that's how you do it. So that gets discussed in the teams. And then, you know, I said earlier it's really important that the teams be passionate about the products they're building. And so they get a big vote. And, you know, and then sometimes the schedule, like you may have guys that raise their hands for a license and the schedule doesn't allow them because of the schedule they're on, doesn't allow them to work on that game because that game, that particular license, the licensor says or it makes sense for it to come out at a different time because it's a movie launch or a band tour or whatever. Yeah. So. A lot of factors. Does that answer your question there, Lauren Helmet?
    101:28
    Yeah, it does. And sorry to make you reiterate, I probably muted my stereo. No, no worries. We were talking about that. It's important stuff. I hear that question a lot. So that's why I said I don't mind covering it again because I get asked that question all the time. All right, man. Thanks for calling in. I appreciate it.
    101:45
    Thanks. Maybe get one or two more and then we'll get you on your way here. You're good. A couple quick questions in chat. Will Stern introduce any new artists in 2020?
    101:56
    Yeah, he might. Yes. Yes, absolutely. Okay. Well, that's perfect. MonsterBash98 wrote, what is your favorite game and why is it MonsterBash? I thought that was kind of clever, so I kept that one in my mind to ask you to make sure it got on the screen. You know, I'm not an amazing pinball player, and so I need games that are accessible. You're in the right place, George. We're not amazing pinball players. I like games that are accessible, right? And so when I play games like, you know, there's a premium Deadpool in the Stern Arcade. And every night on my way out, I play that thing. And sometimes in the middle of the day, I play that thing. And sometimes in the lunch hour, whatever. And the thing is that, like, I'll have, like, you know, I'll have eight crap games. Yeah. And then I'll have, like, one amazing game. Below it all, right. that makes me feel like, okay, I can do that again. I want to do that again. No one does that to me. They have eight more crap ones. And, you know, it's like, yeah, and then eight more crap ones, you might do it. You ever golf? No, I don't golf. Like 108 shots, three of them were decent, so I think I can beat Tiger Woods. But, you know, it's funny because, like, the high score table at Skarn, it's a tough crowd, right? When you say tough, you mean like impossible, right? Yeah, you're not getting up there.
    103:25
    So it's very – it was really funny because one day, you know, I put up, like, a big score on Deadpool. And I stood back and I was like, holy crap, look who's below me, right? And that lasted, like, an hour.
    103:42
    Because then I mentioned it on something, you know, and then they all – Oh, we better go take them down. Yeah, then they all lined up and then it was like, you know, buried it, right? So, yeah. I like accessible games. My Monster Bash is that. My Deadpool.
    103:57
    My Deadpool is challenging because some of the shots are hard, and yet they're really rewarding when you make them.
    104:04
    And so, you know, yeah. All right, we'll take one more call for George. We'll let him get on his way. He's generous with his time tonight, and we actually have been keeping you longer than we had anticipated. No problem. So we'll see what happens. Can you talk about the depth of Elvira House of Horrors, rules and code, more accessible, more depth, multi-ball heavy, mode-based, any general overview of what we can expect? Yeah, definitely mode-based. Definitely, you know, Lyman and Greg really going to town and having a good time. Really fun stuff on screen. You know, she did a bunch of custom stuff. Yeah, that's true. So I think that stuff. And they've actually got some really cool things I can't, like, I want them to tell you. Yep. But they've got a couple of really cool features that I think you guys are going to really like that are fresh. And so it's a very friendly play field to shoot. It's, you know, it's originally that game started, it was a little bit tougher. And as the Whitewoods evolved, it got, it really got sweet. And it shoots really nice. Yeah. And, you know, I'll tell you what, the pictures don't do it justice. Okay. It's going to blow your eyes out of your head. I like that. The pictures don't do it justice.
    105:49
    It's like full metal Ferris. It's just like the dude went out of his mind. I mean, he just went out of his mind.
    106:02
    I look forward to playing it. I can't wait. Yeah. Is Expo, is that going to be, other than the dead flip stream, is that going to be the first time the public will really kind of be able to put their hands on it? Will anything ship prior to Expo? Can you talk about that at all? You know, I don't, I mean.
    106:17
    Because we've got those signature editions and you've got the LEDs, right? Yeah. And, I mean, I don't know when they're going to get into people's hands, to tell you the truth. Yeah, I got you. I know that you will see, you will definitely, you know, I mean, it's going to be, I think it's going to be the hit of Expo. I think that, I think, you know, tune in Wednesday night, Deadflip. Those guys are streaming it.
    106:43
    Jack, Lyman, Greg, you know. Dennis might be in the house for that. Oh, a little Dennis Norman appearance. Yeah, Dennis might be in the house for that. Very nice.
    106:55
    Yeah, so, I mean. So, it's fun. Something to look forward to. Well, listen, we are going to shut this thing down tonight. I want to say thanks so much for taking your time and coming in. Star Wars, the pin is something that I didn't realize that we were going to have hands-on experience with. And then to have it with the designer here is like it's been an honor. Thanks, guys. Thanks. I wish, you know, definitely the stream is distracting relative to play. No, believe me. I'm still trying to figure it out. And unfortunately, I don't do either very well. We know. Our streaming team has a pinball problem. It's not our pinball team. You don't know. No problem.
    107:33
    Everybody's safe and sound with the high scores. That's for sure. I was like, wait. And I dragged one of those things into my office today. I said, I've got to play and tune up. Get all prepped up for those two games. We put on no tilt in there. I was doing just fine back in the office. Well, I was doing all right. And then you came over and made me increase the pitch by two degrees. So, like, all my shots were off. Yeah, a bit outside. But it's fun. It's not difficult to find your shots regardless of what pitch you're at, but it's been fun. I want to thank the sponsors tonight, Scott from Penn Stadium, for illuminating this pin tonight for streaming with the extremes, for the professional streamer. And I want to thank Neil from PennQuest. We hit two of the PennQuest challenges tonight, so rocking and rolling. Thank you guys for your support. I want to thank everybody in chat that's been here. I want to thank Zach and Nicole from Flippin' Out Pinball for allowing us the opportunity to stream these new games, help further the exposure of these games, and to just in general share our enthusiasm with pinball. And then finally, I want to thank Stern Pinball and George Gomez for your time. Thanks a lot, guys. Thanks for having me on. Something to kind of check off the streaming bucket list. Really fun. We'll do it again. Absolutely. Looking forward to it. All right. For Ken Cromwell, Bill Webb, and George Gomez. Bye, Internet. Everybody have a good morning, good afternoon, good evening. And don't forget to take some time out of your day and play some pinball. So long, everybody.
    108:56
    you
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    you