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Episode 267: Holly Koskinen

Pinball Profile·podcast_episode·37m 25s·analyzed·Jul 7, 2020
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.032

TL;DR

Holly Koskinen discusses her Whipped win, Lyme disease journey, LGBTQ+ advocacy, and Columbus pinball leagues.

Summary

Jeff Teolis interviews Holly Koskinen, the 2020 Whipped Championship winner, discussing her recent competitive pinball victory at a major tournament, her diagnosis and ongoing treatment for Lyme disease, her advocacy for LGBTQ+ equality and social justice in the pinball community, and the vibrant competitive pinball scene in Columbus, Ohio, with extensive discussion of local leagues and women's pinball organizations.

Key Claims

  • Holly Koskinen won the Whipped Championship (128 women competitors) at an event, defeating players including Rachel, Priyanka, and Carrie in the finals

    high confidence · Direct discussion of her winning Whipped Championship; Whipped is identified as a women's pinball tournament format

  • Holly was diagnosed with Lyme disease after approximately 6 years of undiagnosed symptoms, following what should have been an optimistic start to her 30s

    high confidence · Detailed personal account of Lyme disease diagnosis and treatment journey; she mentions 'six years of my life trying to figure out what was wrong' and began treatment around 6 months prior to the podcast recording

  • Lyme disease is difficult to diagnose because it mimics other conditions (MS, rheumatoid arthritis, Alzheimer's) and hides in areas of existing inflammation

    high confidence · Holly explains Lyme as 'the great imitator' and describes its complex presentation patterns; mentions she was also exposed to mold which complicates clearing Lyme

  • Holly tested positive for Rocky Mountain spotted fever, West Nile virus, and other tick-borne illnesses in addition to Lyme

    high confidence · Holly states: 'I ended up testing positive for Rocky Mountain spotted fever... At one point I had West Nile virus'

  • Pinball testing at the Whipped Championship required her to play machines she had never played before, including Solar Ride, Wonka, Spanish Eyes, and an EM machine

    high confidence · Holly recounts: 'I had never played Solar Ride. I had not seen Wonka up until that point... Spanish Eyes... never played that before either'

  • Columbus, Ohio has a vibrant pinball community with large leagues including Level One (70+ players on Mondays) and multiple women's pinball organizations

    high confidence · Jeff mentions Level One with 70+ people; Holly describes Wednesday night women's league and Bells and Chimes chapter run by Jen Rupert, Rhonda Wamsley, and Tish Edwards

  • Holly experienced homophobic harassment including being called a pedophile while trying to help raise two boys as part of a same-sex relationship

Notable Quotes

  • “I won. And that could have all shaken out so many different ways, obviously. You know, Priyanka and Carrie are both phenomenal players, too. So to be up there with that kind of caliber of people for my kind of first Pinberg go, it was very humbling.”

    Holly Koskinen @ ~10:00 — Describes her emotional reaction to winning the Whipped Championship and the caliber of competition she faced in her first Pinburgh tournament

  • “Lyme is what is known as the great imitator. So Lyme can present neurological problems. It can present arthritic problems. It can present like MS... you can have memory loss, you can have cognitive function problems like I've had speech problems. It's just everything.”

    Holly Koskinen @ ~24:00 — Explains why Lyme disease is so difficult to diagnose, a key theme of the interview

  • “I do not understand hate. It takes a lot. It's wasted energy. I don't get it.”

    Holly Koskinen @ ~47:00 — Core statement of her philosophy on equality and social justice in the context of Pride Month and pinball community values

  • “This is the game of life and we have to play better.”

    Holly Koskinen @ ~55:00 — Connects pinball community values ('play better') to broader social justice context

  • “Tish is like my pinball fairy godmother. She started our women's league a long time ago... we've got, like, this super awesome girl gang... cool chicks with good beer and good times, good conversations... and killer pinball playing.”

    Holly Koskinen @ ~60:00 — Describes the importance and culture of the women's pinball community in Columbus

  • “You're a survivor... there are others in your situation and there are others that struggle with Lyme disease... you offer a solution and a light at the end of the tunnel that things will get better.”

    Jeff Teolis @ ~28:00 — Acknowledges Holly's role as an advocate and inspiration for others dealing with Lyme disease

Entities

Holly KoskinenpersonJeff TeolispersonWhipped ChampionshipeventPinburgheventBells and ChimesorganizationRachelpersonTish EdwardspersonJen Rupertperson

Signals

  • ?

    community_signal: Columbus, Ohio hosts multiple large pinball leagues including Level One (70+ players Mondays), women's leagues, and Bells and Chimes chapter with strong participation and community culture

    high · Jeff mentions Level One with 70+ people; Holly describes vibrant women's league culture with regular meetings and strong player retention

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Strong positive sentiment toward Pinball Profile podcast host Jeff Teolis in the community, with recognition of his commitment to diversity and inclusion initiatives (Pride Month logo support)

    high · Jeff mentions supporting Pride Month and receiving criticism from intolerant community members; Holly supports his diversity initiatives

  • ?

    community_signal: Lyme disease presents as significant health issue affecting multiple competitive pinball players; Holly's diagnosis and advocacy potentially raising awareness within community

    medium · Holly mentions 'fellow limey pinballers out there' and encourages them to reach out; describes tournament experience when herbal treatment dosage caused coordination loss

  • ?

    community_signal: Women's pinball community in Columbus demonstrates strong mentorship and organizational structure with leadership from Tish Edwards, Jen Rupert, and Rhonda Wamsley spanning years before Bells and Chimes national organization

    high · Holly describes Tish as 'pinball fairy godmother' who started women's league; Jen running podcast; multiple leaders helping organize league activities

  • $

    market_signal: LGBTQ+ inclusion and diversity advocacy becoming explicit community value in pinball, with specific podcast episodes and community leaders addressing social justice and equality

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.112

0:00
Come on, people now. Smile on your brother and everybody get together. Try to love one another right now. It's time for another Pinball Profile. I'm your host, Jeff Teolas. You can find our group on Facebook, but we're also on pinballprofile.com. That's where you can find your podcast feed and all past episodes as well. Check us out on Twitter and Instagram at pinballprofile. Email us, pinballprofile at gmail.com. It's a pleasure to be talking to a woman I haven't seen in quite some time, but then again, you know, none of us have really seen anybody. But I did last year at Cleepin in the fall last year, and it was great to talk to, once again, your reigning whipped champion, Holly Koskinen joins us right now. Hey, Holly, how are you? Hey, Jeff, how are you? I'm great, and it's a pleasure to be talking to you again. As mentioned, saw you at Cleepin, and it was nice to see you in such great spirits there. had to be very euphoric winning that whipped championship. And then people like myself coming up to you at this major Stern Pro Circuit event saying, hey, congrats, and you were glowing that day, I remember. That day is still something where I have to convince myself. I'm like, no, this is not a figment of your imagination. Yeah, and that was crazy because it's like you came up to me and I'm like, I don't know who this guy is. He seems very nice and wants to talk to me, but I'm like, I really want to make sure these other women get their money.
1:24
You know, yeah, it was a good day. I wish there was Pinberg this year for a lot of reasons, but I know you do too, because there's going to be a big name on a banner that's going to be there forever. That's pretty cool. I know. I was really, you know, I was really looking forward to, you know, coming back from Denver and, you know, just kind of like getting into it again, you know, and getting ready for the season. Obviously, I think everybody was kind of in that boat mentally, and it was not even like a week or two after we got back, things went amiss. And yeah, I've definitely missed it. It has definitely made me heavily consider getting a machine. I will tell you that. Yeah, I mean, I imagine there's a lot of people in your shoes, maybe even the majority that are really looking forward to having a machine just because there is that void right now, let alone competition. But just to get their hands on a machine, it's important. But we are seeing things open up again. And, you know, we'll talk a little bit about Columbus, Ohio, and the many leagues that are there. It's a real hotbed for pinball. And when you won, I just remember at ReplayFX seeing a lot of different people that I knew from the Ohio area going, yeah, we're not surprised about Holly winning this, you know, lights out. And just to recall, for those that don't remember, you were winning on machines you had never played before. Yeah, that was, gosh, even sitting here talking about this with you, like my hands, I'm like sitting here like touching my hands, already like getting clammy.

high confidence · Holly recounts: 'same guy came up to me... eventually told me that I was a pedophile to my face because I was trying to help raise two boys'

  • Columbus has city-level LGBTQ+ employment protections, but nearby areas like Westerville have no protections

    medium confidence · Holly states: 'Columbus City proper, we did not have... some some city based ordinance of protection. but when I had previously worked in Westerville, I had no protection at all'

    • Rhonda Wamsley
    person
    Columbus, Ohiolocation
    Level One Leagueorganization
    Dr. Richard Horowitzperson
    Pinball Profileorganization
    Lyme diseaseproduct
    Priyankaperson
    Carrieperson

    high · Jeff posted Pride Month logo on Pinball Profile, received negative responses; references Back Box Pinball podcast episode on diversity; Holly discusses need for education and allyship

  • ?

    event_signal: Pinburgh tournament was not held in 2020 (implied postponement due to COVID-19), preventing Holly from defending her Whipped Championship title and delaying placement of her name on commemorative banner

    high · Holly states: 'I wish there was Pinberg this year for a lot of reasons'; Jeff mentions banner that would be 'forever' at Pinburgh for Whipped winner

  • ?

    community_signal: Jen Rupert expanding content beyond podcast to include Facebook Live maintenance tutorials demonstrating commitment to women player education in pinball

    medium · Holly mentions: 'she actually was doing, I don't think this actually ended up becoming like a video of her podcast per se, but I think it was more like a Facebook Live... where she had rented a maiden. And so she was showing how to do some of the maintenance'

  • ?

    community_signal: Holly leveraged athletic background and mental discipline to compete successfully on unfamiliar machines at high-level tournament, using fundamental pinball skills rather than game-specific rule knowledge

    high · Holly describes competing on machines she'd never played before; credits athletic background for managing nerves; uses basic keep-the-ball-up strategy on Spanish Eyes

    • 2:59
    But yeah, like when I got up there, when they actually went and moved us on stage for like that, what was it, like that semi, kind of semi-final round, yeah, I had never played Solar Ride. I had not seen Wonka up until that point, and for the love of God, I could not figure out that Godstopper. So little lessons learned there, but I'm trying to think what else. There was another machine that was out there that was an old EM that I don't remember what that was called, but I never played that before either. And then, of course, I never played Spanish Eyes. And, you know, I am actually keeping my eyes peeled for one of those and one that's working and all that jazz. It was Spanish Eyes, I definitely remember, because that was a clinic. Thank you. So I've heard. it's an enjoyable game but it was one of those things that you know I feel my old athletic background really kind of really lended me a hand there with trying to be able to control my thoughts control my emotions control my you know my nerves um and just really try to allow myself to sit in and sit with the kind of discomfort that I was in and say okay like we we just got to do this and we've got like basically one you get like one big maybe bad ball to like figure out this game or to try to get a handle on it to where you feel like you can play it and then since i didn't really know the game you know it went back to a very primitive form of pinball of like just keep the ball up not a bad idea when you don't know the game though that was pretty much my only tactic i had so it wasn't uh it wasn't a lot in the arsenal what was in the arsenal and you alluded to it a little bit was your athletic background. So you're used to competing at high levels. A lot of people, when they get on that big stage or they make it to a final in pinball event, the nerves really kick in. And you said that wasn't a factor at all. It's more after the fact. Yeah, after the fact, it was one of those kind of like taken back, holy peat moments like this happened, right? And all four girls, like Priyanka and Carrie and Rachel, all four of us were really up there duking it out to the best of our abilities. And I knew that Rachel was going to be tough to beat. You know, I hadn't met her up until that time, but I heard that she was a very good player. And when she happened to tilt, I literally sat on the couch and I was like, holy crap, I won.
    5:35
    And that could have all shaken out so many different ways, obviously. You know, Priyanka and Carrie are both phenomenal players, too. So to be up there with that kind of caliber of people for my kind of first Pinberg go, it was very humbling. Yeah, pretty good debut, I'd say, at Pinberg, for sure. Thank you. What makes Whip so tough, 128 women going at it, was that the playoff schedule is a little different because of time limitations. and you really have to be, once you get to the playoffs, which is not an easy task, you have to be the best. It's only going to work out for one person, in this case you, Holly. I was glad to take it home and represent the group. There were a lot of folks who stuck around to cheer me on or people were listening in their car while they were driving back from Pinnberg. And I just really have appreciated all the love and support from everybody near and far that are not only from my state, but people like yourself and everyone else. So it's been really nice, and there is part of me that's grateful that I've got another year to practice to defend my title, I guess. You get to be a champ for an extra year. There's nothing wrong with that. We've got to skip year. We'll have to figure out what to put in the fill gap spot, maybe something funny. We'll maybe put Wonder Woman in or something, But, you know, we'll figure out something to put in the middle there in between the years, not just, you know, hopefully two dashes where it's like, oh, we're just, or we may not even just list that year, but let's just skip over it. Just fast forward through this and be done. Escher's been the Papa Champ since 2017, so you're allowed to have at least one extra year. That's fine. Okay, good. Good. Good to know. Thanks, Jeff.
    7:21
    It's one of the reasons I named you as the Pinball Profile Top 10 Most Intriguing People of 2019. Your story fascinated me, and there was a different side to your story, too. And you're very, very active on social media, and you posted an emotional video, something I had no idea which I was going to watch. But you discussed your struggle and diagnosis with Lyme disease. That came out of nowhere. I mean, you knew you weren't feeling well, but to get that diagnosis, as you explained in your video, I mean, a life changer for sure. Yeah, it's something that definitely will even still choke me up now when I think about it. It was just, I spent a lot, a lot, a lot of time, like I said to you earlier before we kind of started the show, that, you know, I kind of had a rough go in my 20s, just kind of like normal life growing up pains and getting out of the younger level naivety. I kind of grew up where my parents weren't like helicopter parents, but I was definitely kept in a bubble. So kind of getting out of that naivety, becoming a full-fledged adult, right, and then going through breakups and all that other hoopla that we all go through. But I finally had gotten to the point where I had turned 30, and I thought, all right, my 30s are going to be my jam. And two months later, that's when my health started to take a turn, and I spent the next six years of my life trying to figure out what was wrong. I had doctors tell me almost verbatim that I should go get my head examined because having all these physical symptoms was not in actuality a possibility. It was just a lot to deal with knowing that something, that multiple things, I kept saying multiple things are wrong, multiple things are wrong, and I had only two physicians believe me and stand by me with what I was saying and back me up and that meant so much When you say there were only two that kind of gave you that support and were really listening to you were the others thinking oh she a hypochondriac this is in her head this is whatever the case may be Yep. And obviously that's not the case. It makes me wonder why there was any, if, distrust by the others or lack of figuring out, hey, this might be Lyme disease. What makes Lyme disease so difficult to diagnose? Because Lyme is what is known as the great imitator. So Lyme can present neurological problems. It can present arthritic problems. It can present like MS. It can, you know, plenty of people get misdiagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis. I think the actor's name is Chris Christopherson, but he was actually misdiagnosed with Alzheimer's disease and they came to find out that he had Lyme. So, you know, you can have memory loss, you can have cognitive function problems like I've had speech problems. It's just everything. And Lyme likes to go into places in the body where there's already existing inflammation because it makes it a good hiding spot. so I already had like different things happening with my gut health that were not in place and so I was trying to figure that out and and previously you know later on I came to find out that I also was exposed to mold so mold mold and lime seem to go hand in hand and they both kind of activate one another and if you don't clear mold you will not clear lime as far as from what I've read. So it's been a definite interesting journey. Like I actually had discovered there's a thing called a VCS test and it tests your visual contrast to see if you've been exposed to biotoxin illness. And I had happened to find that a long time ago, like very early on in my journey. And I thought, well, shoot, it's like 15 bucks. Like I'll take this test. It's online and you have to sit a certain distance away from your computer and do this visual test. And you're shown basically like a bunch of different images and eventually it, you know, lowers the contrast to see like how well you can see. And I had passed it the first time despite it saying, okay, well, you kind of have some symptoms here. Well, I took the test again. I had to take the test again recently before I had seen my Lyme physician for the first time back in October. And I had failed that test at that point. So lots of things that I never thought in my wildest dreams that I would learn, but here we are. And, you know, I've been treating since around six months now and, you know, definitely, definitely starting to see some improvements like cognitive function wise, like I'm much more kind of on the ball, you know, not so much of a, like I would have a lot of like word recall problems or I would be really kind of spacey within conversation and personality. Lyme can also cause depression. So I've been suffering with depression for the last several years as well. So I'm starting to see some of that lift at some point, which is a huge gift. So I'm very, very grateful. But yeah, I used to spend like three, four hours a night, just like endlessly rabbit holing until I got tired and went to bed. That was what I would do. Boy. Lots of time lost, you know, and it got to the point where I essentially lost my identity. But Holly, in hearing your story and seeing the months that have happened since, I don't know if I know a bigger warrior than yourself. And it's the reason I wanted to contact you. Thank you. Because whether or not you realize it, there are others in your situation and there are others that struggle with Lyme disease, with being in the rabbit hole, as you say. Yep. And you offer a solution and a light at the end of the tunnel that things will get better. Obviously, your life has changed significantly. Right. But you're a survivor. Yeah, you know, I mean, initially getting that diagnosis was scary because, you know, you do a lot of things of, like, people have died from it. There are definitely more kind of rare instances of an immediate fatality. Usually that only occurs if Lyme gets into the heart, and that's called Lyme carditis, and then that can be fatal. So another thing that I had was I ended up testing positive for Rocky Mountain spotted fever. So that was a very definitive confirmation that I had indeed gotten bit by a tick. That left untreated can also kill you. I at one point had, I guess, dang fever. At one point I had West Nile virus. So to say I'm still standing, you know, it's like, okay, well, I'm obviously hopefully meant to still do something because I'm still here. You know, and I know to my friends I probably sound like a broken record with this thing, but it's been funny. Like I've encountered people even in the short period of time frame where like even when I went to go get my blood drawn, like last Saturday, the lady who took my blood, we got talking and, you know, happened to mention something about Lyme. And she was like, oh, she's like, you know, people thought I had that, too. And then I got diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis. And I was like, it was a huge red flag for me. And so I just spent the next hour while she's sitting here doing the rest of my blood vials to have a basic conversation with her. And she ended up taking down my doctor's info. So the testing, unfortunately, is not foolproof. It's not great. I can go on and on for this. Obviously, this is about pinball, though. No, it's about you, Holly. And this is certainly a life changer for you. But you can find out more information on great websites. I know I've looked at the mayoclinic.org for symptoms and causes, and I know you're a big fan of Dr. Richard Horowitz. Yes. Dr. Horowitz is a prominent Lyme physician in upstate New York. Dr. Rawls, William Rawls, is also outstanding. Stephen Brunner is also huge in the community, too, as he's a master herbalist. There's so many things that I've learned now about, like, I think a lot of people look at herbal remedies as kind of like, oh, they're a crock. And I'm like, or which doctor kind of thing? Yeah. And it's, you know, and it's been interesting because that's been my main priority area of treatment. And I initially thought too, I'm like, oh, I don't really know how well this is going to work. Cause my, my doctor, she had said, okay, well you need to get up to like 20 drops of this stuff twice a day. She's like, most people have a hard time getting up to five. And I was like, yeah, yeah. Okay. It's fine. And then one day out of a very stupid moment, I decided like, oh, well, let's just take 10 drops and see what happens. Totally bad idea. I was at a pinball tournament. Actually, this was like way before all this COVID stuff. I was down in Canal Street down in Dayton. They have an awesome like, you know, small arcade, good machines, well-maintained, cute little bar, good food, and was down there, and I just got real tired. I was like, why do I feel like I need to take a three-hour, like, Gilligan's Island nap right now. I was like, I don't know what's going on. And, you know, I ended up like losing a lot of my hand-eye coordination. Like I just could not, my reflexes were gone. I was out of the tournament first. And then it finally dawned on me. I was like, oh, this is also why you're stuttering. You can't think right now. I was like, let's not do this ever again.
    16:41
    So you, you live and you learn through these processes, I guess. But, you know, There's fellow limey pinballers out there. I would love to meet you. And then, of course, you add on to the fact that here we are dealing with COVID-19. So I imagine that doesn't help someone like you in your situation. It doesn't help anybody. But what has COVID-19 meant for you? It's been challenging. I want to say, you know, I've been very lucky enough to still have a job and still be working from home. We basically all switched over from working from home. I think one of the main things that really kind of caught me off guard was that in the very, very beginning, when everything was on on super, super lockdown of not being able to go anywhere like I can work from home. No problem. You know, I've done it before for like my freelance stuff. I did that when I was on my own for a while. That was cake. That was fine. You know, but then it was still like, oh, I can't go anywhere. You know, I can't see my friends. Right. And so the whole the whole not being able to go anywhere thing was really starting to get to me at one point because I realized that I kind of had some un like kind of unresolved trauma from Lyme of when initially I had gotten sick and I was like literally physically too sick to go anywhere. I would have to use the old people handle that was still in my shower. And that thing ended up saving my butt because I could not stand really long enough to shower without it. So it triggered something in me to say, oh, we're really this sick again. This is why we can't leave. We're really this sick again. And that's what was in my brain. And I'm like, no, that's not true. but I realized okay this is like unresolved emotional stuff that I have to deal with that I didn't deal with before so it's like growing pains like anything it just being aware of where your emotions come from and understanding their their point of place and healing that here we are now several weeks into the coronavirus and restrictions everywhere It may have been the craziest month I have ever seen in my life, and I'm hoping some good will come out of this. I know I've, again, watched your social media, and in Columbus a lot of protesting has happened, certainly looking for some changes to injustices. And I've said this before and I'll say it again, Protesting many times results in change. So I just think with the COVID-19 virus out there, this is such an important issue that people are willing to risk their health and their lives to see these kind of changes happen. And, you know, you're no different in that situation. Yeah, I mean, you know, if anything, if we've learned anything through history, unfortunately, you know, it seems that America doesn't listen when you ask nicely. I mean, the Stonewall riots, you know, something that I feel I can speak to, right? Because I, you know, obviously I'm white. I don't want to speak for my friends of color and what they're feeling right now. I know that it's been tough on them. I've checked in on several of them, and they're hurting. They're in pain. So I think it's just all of us trying to be aware and be better allies. But yeah, with regards to Stonewall, a black trans woman is the one who really was the proliferation of us getting our start to our equality and our rights. You know, Marsha Johnson. I mean, she was a pioneer for her time, as were the many who fought alongside her. And I applaud that. And I have what rights I have right now because of all of them. So, you know, I'm really hoping that we can all collectively come together as people to try to help right the wrongs that have been done of our ancestors past and be able to start making some real positive change. I've said this to others. I'll say it to you. I'll say it publicly. I do not understand hate. It takes a lot. It's wasted energy. I don't get it. And I'll tell you this. I posted on Pinball Profile at the start of Pride Month. a logo in which I put the rainbow colors inside the pinball profile logo. I appreciate that. Well, I immediately saw a handful of people say so long. I don't want to be associated with that. And to that, I say thank you. I don't want you part of this community either if you can't see the good in everyone. Yeah, I in my lifetime have had those kinds of so longs of different things related to things like that. and while Columbus for the most part has been a very tolerant city, you know, I have had a couple instances that were not kind. I'd say probably the most kind of prolific one was when I was dating my ex who had two kids who were both like toddler boys and, you know, sometimes, you know, you happen to get into conversations with random people, right, and then they're kind of on the other side of the fence with that But they're willing to ask questions and have a dialogue. So then I feel like, okay, it's my place to step in here and represent my people kind of thing. And, you know, we had an okay discussion the one night. But it was Halloween and I was in a dress and I was in heels. I was a vampire victim for my friend who was a military paratrooper at the time. And then the next night I was back and in totally different garb of like more of like a tie and a dress shirt kind of thing. and same guy came up to me, started the same kind of conversation. I thought it was going to be fine and he eventually told me that I was a pedophile to my face because I was trying to help raise two boys into decent human beings at the time and I was floored. I was absolutely crushed. I went home and cried the entire night. I was so angry. I'm so sorry you had to go through that. You know, I think I would be surprised to hear if any gay person didn't go through something like that. You know, but we got to be better. We do. And it doesn't matter where you come from. I'm a white, male, heterosexual man that wants to learn about everyone. And I think that's what we need to do and understand the struggles and plights. And why is equality such a hard thing to grasp? Makes perfect sense. Why shouldn't that be for everyone? I don't know, man. I ask myself that question a heck of a lot more often than I feel I should. Well, in June, I mean, thank God the Supreme Court ruling was what it was. But that's scary that it even went there. Yep. Yeah. In Columbus, you know, in Columbus City proper, we did not have I want to say that we had some some city based ordinance of protection. but when I had previously worked in Westerville, I had no protection at all. But then again, you've got at-will things and all other stuff that employers can kind of pick and choose from if they want. But it's good to have that protection status, because unfortunately there are still people who don't understand, and sometimes that causes issues. I work in radio and one of the many stations that I work for is talk radio and some of the topics came up. So I remember years ago, you know, the issue of should a gay couple be allowed to adopt? And I didn't even have to hear the pros and cons of either side to realize, wait a second here. Why should a kid who's at an orphanage not have a chance to have two loving parents? Put up your hand if you think that's wrong. I don't get that. I would love to have two loving parents. We all would love to have two loving parents. Why deny that? Well, I'm very lucky enough to say that I that I do have two loving parents. So, you know, I know that there's several members of my community who cannot say that or say they have any family for that matter. But, you know, I myself am not not somebody who's necessarily into into having kids on my own. But, yeah, I mean, if there's people out there to try to give kids a better life than being passed around from place to place, then I think everybody deserves a stable home. Hear, hear. I agree. You talked about some of the issues that you've had there in Ohio. Let me just tell you, in talking with people all around the world and even close to where I live in Hamilton, Ontario, There were some people that had done some of these protests you talked about at the local city hall. Easily white supremacists. It's everywhere. And I know nearby where you live, you can see some of that activity as well. Yeah, Columbus, we definitely have some known white supremacy groups around town. I know that there's a group in Worthington. Yeah, it just makes things difficult. It is everywhere, not just in your area too. I do want to point that out. I'm sure that Kim Irwana or Steve Bowden could elaborate on those things, or Lauren Gray much, much better than I can. But yeah, just from my own neck of the woods, people are standing up for equality. Yeah, those people you mentioned, check out the Back Box Pinball podcast for really one of the best episodes you'll hear anywhere. Yes. And it really does matter, too, for people to hear that, if you're in the pinball community, to know who are your brothers and sisters. Yeah, I think that whole podcast episode that that Lauren did on diversity was outstanding. I really appreciated what Juana had to say and what Steve had to say, you know, and I think it's important that we turn to them to to listen. And, you know, also to understand that while they're our friends. Right. Like we also have to understand that there's a responsibility that we must take for ourselves to educate ourselves on what we have not learned, right? And how we can do better, right? Like we always want to talk about this aspect in pinball, right? The whole joking phrase of play better, right? Well, this is the game of life and we have to play better. Good point. I agree. You know? And speaking of playing, especially with everything going on in the world, you know, for me, pinball is a great escape. You know, we work hard, we deal with what we have to financially, with family, with health. But when you get to pinball, whether it's a competition, whether it's a league or just behind a machine, even for that brief moment, it seems to go away, or at least I hope it does. And it brings such great enjoyment. And the nice thing about where you live, they have huge, huge leagues. I know you're a part of a few of them. Kim Martinez runs level one on Mondays. That's a great league. 70 plus people. Yep. Yeah. I mean, we've got a herd in there every Monday and I miss going in there because it's literally like a little honeybee nest. Like you get in there and it like everybody like family and you all kind of buzzing around talking to this person that person saying hi to this person getting your drink like getting warmed up And the energy is real good And everybody's everybody's really there to try to play their best each time and show up and show out. And I think that's I think that's awesome. I'm assuming that you guys have pretty I've heard that you guys have had pretty big leagues up in Canada, too. I know particularly Toronto, right? Toronto's, the T-O-P-L, Topple, Toronto Ontario Pinball League, has been running for years and years and years and 20-plus years. One of the biggest leagues in Ontario is what got me into pinball, the London Ontario Pinball League. And we've had as many as, I don't know, 80-plus members at one time, which is pretty good. In fact, these are all at people's homes, not at locations, so you have to split them up in shifts. Oh, wow. Yeah, so we're obviously a ways from that happening again. But, I mean, Columbus has really got some great pinball players and the leagues, too. Of course, there's a Bells and Chimes chapter. That's run by Jen Rupert, Rhonda Wamsley, and Tish Edwards. Yeah. I mean, Tish is everything. Tish is like my pinball fairy godmother.
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    She started our women's league a long time ago. Like, this was, like, way before the whole Bells and Chimes thing got spun up around the country. So, like, Tish had just started a women's, like, Wednesday night league, and we just all started getting together playing, and some people have kind of come and gone in between that time. But we've also had a lot of people who have stayed over the years, and so now we've got, like, this super awesome girl gang. I want to think of it as, like, kind of like a Golden Girls gang on, you know, steroids. But it's just, like, cool chicks with good beer and good times, good conversations. conversations so and and killer pinball playing so and with tish some amazing pinball dancing like nobody else uh yeah so yeah it's it's it's interesting like tish and jen have like very similar like play styles if you watch them play like they're both like very kind of physical players and uh ronda wansley also helps run our league too and uh me and ronald will sit there and look at the other two and be like i i don't know what they're doing but we're just gonna sit over here and laugh and enjoy it you know so um it's it's a fun bunch for sure it's got to be nice for you and your other league members to see what jen's been doing on youtube yeah i mean you know i was able to be on her i think i was like the second second episode right so she's been out doing her thing and talking to all kinds of women from around pinball i think even i don't think it's just necessarily only women but yeah she's had a lot of cool episodes on her on her podcast And I know that recently, it wasn't too long ago, she actually was doing, I don't think this actually ended up becoming like a video of her podcast per se, but I think it was more like a Facebook Live, if I remember, where she had rented a maiden. And so she was showing how to do some of the maintenance and stuff on it. And I really need to get a maintenance crash course 101 for dummies. So my next thing on my to-do list. Well, check out NoCoinDropRequired from Jen, and you'll see some great guests and some good conversations as well, too. By the way, how is your cat, Bebe, doing? She's good. She's ignoring me right now, but no, I mean, she's been fine. Thank you for asking. Yeah, my cat likes to do these things every couple years where she's just like, I need to spend a bunch of money. And I was like, girl, no. No. You know, of course, it's like I was like, oh, things are going pretty good. I'm going to sit here and buy myself a little gift of some AirPod Pros. So I'm like, I can go out and work, you know, other places and still be able to do conference calls. So I'm like, of course, I buy that. And then the one day I just kind of noticed, I'm like, she still had food in her bowl. And she's like a vacuum. Like she will suck food up so fast sometimes, like it'll just come right back up. She's just one of those cats. She just gets so excited about food. And the one day she was like, still have food in her bowl. And then like I'm trying to make some lunch and I was trying to make some tuna salad, which was kind of strange because I've been, I kind of switched my diet. I've been about like 80% vegan the last like probably two months. So I'm sitting here trying to make tuna salad. And of course, as soon as you open the can for anything, normally she'd be like right there. No interest. And then by like Tuesday night, she was just real lethargic. And long story short, three days and $2,500 in ICU and found out that she had a gallbladder infection. And so now we're on antibiotics and we're happy and we're scarfing down food again. So right back where we started, full circle. How dare you buy those iBuds? I know. Well, I'm like, yeah, I don't feel like I need to be that person, right? Like I work in the digital user experience space. And previously I was helping a team with mobile app development as far as like from a creative user experience standpoint. And, you know, everybody had some kind of like tech watch, whether it was Apple Watch or a Fitbit or something. And I'm just like, why do I feel this unnecessary pressure to get this watch that I don't need? And so I never got into that. So then I was like, well, at least with the headphones, if I decide to go run or like I said, you know, primarily for work, if I'm, you know, we have like a common space down in my apartment complex that I can go to. And, you know, the noise canceling is very effective for that. So I got suckered in. I'm a Mac person. I can't help it. So what's it like in Ohio as far as things opening up and getting back to places like level one? Things are opening. Things are still a bit slow. I think people are taking their precautionary measures. Restaurants seem to be open. They're starting to, I know, Sideswipe, our one brewery that's with Arcade Super Awesome, I know that they just posted that they're going back to their regular business hours, which will be great. So I'm not sure when Arcade Super Awesome is going to open, so leave that as a to-be-determined. But I know Level 1 is open and J&D's is open, So I've been to both of those places for pinball a couple times. It's been really weird because, like, the first time I played it, it just, in so long, it really felt foreign. Like, I almost felt like I had somebody else's hands, and it's like, what are you doing?
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    How was it from a safety standpoint? I mean, there's been nobody in there, you know. And so for, at least with level one in particular, we had, they had at one point at least every other machine turned off, so that way you were distanced. And I know that the next time I went in there, the ones that were on before were off, and so they kind of were alternating things. So they're still spaced out. And then they've got a few pinball games on the other side. So there's a set of four that's kind of split off from the main group. But really, I mean, this place is a pretty decent size, and there was maybe seven people in there, but I was the only one playing pinball for most of the time. So I had all the games to myself for the most part. That's one positive, I guess, but I liked hearing that they were kind of every other game off and just kind of making sure that they were aware of it. I'm sure they were doing some great cleaning and sterilizing. So that's what these places need to do right now, and I'm sure they're doing it. So hopefully, fingers crossed, I'll be seeing you sometime in Ohio, whether it's an event like Kleepin or just it's a short drive for me, and it's a place I certainly enjoy, and I've got to get to Columbus. I would love to have you come down here and check our spaces out. Obviously, you know, it would be nice, you know, if you could see it in full swing whenever we get back to that sense of that level of play again. But, yeah, like Level 1's done a great job. They've had all their kind of tables spread out. Like they suggest, you know, if you're not playing in a machine to be seated and they've got kind of cards on the table of which, you know, if the cards are green, that means that it's been cleaned and it's ready for somebody to sit down. And if it's not, the card is flipped up red, and so you're supposed to go to another table until they clean that one, and they're all super on the ball with everything. So it's been a good first experience. Very comforting. That's good. Good to hear. Holly, I appreciate talking to you once again. I look forward to seeing you soon. Look forward to talking to you again and seeing you at hopefully another tournament maybe in the future. Only if you go easy on me. All right. we'll see if Spanish eyes is there forget it I'm just going to participate and watch that's a fair statement you can crack me up Jeff that's funny all the best Holly alright thank you Jeff this has been your Pinball Profile you can find everything on pinballprofile.com don't forget to check us out on Twitter and Instagram at pinballprofile email us pinballprofile at gmail.com I'm Jeff Teolas
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    Ain't no river wide enough to keep me from getting to you, baby. Remember the day I set you free.