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The Great British Pinball Podcast Pinfest Special Episode 14

The Great British Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·1h 2m·analyzed·Aug 15, 2024
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

Great British Pinball hosts preview Pinfest 2024 schedule, games, and tournament logistics.

Summary

Neil McRae and Scott Rundell preview Pinfest 2024 in Daventry, covering the event schedule, tournament formats, presentations, and detailed game lineup. They discuss logistics, criticize some tournament scheduling decisions, and provide personal recommendations on which games to play, highlighting both underrated titles (Venom, Barbecue) and classics worth experiencing.

Key Claims

  • American Pinball sales in the UK are not strong, with few games available for purchase at reasonable prices

    medium confidence · Neil discussing difficulty acquiring American Pinball games for Pinfest; attempted purchases faced high asking prices and low availability

  • Godfather at Jersey Jack has excellent playfield layout but terrible, overly complex code with excessive menus

    high confidence · Neil detailed description of Godfather's design: 'great layout' but 'less menus in an internet firewall than in this game'

  • Venom Premium is underrated and deserves to be played despite negative perception; it's easy for new players and has wide-open shots

    high confidence · Neil's direct challenge to listeners: 'Venom gets such a bad you know you read about it you think it was the worst game ever made it's utter bollocks it's a freaking great game'

  • Tron LE is a good Stern game from the noughties era but not worth the hype; market downturn has affected its resale value

    high confidence · Neil and Scott discussion of Tron availability at good price due to 'cost of living crisis' and market softness

  • Legends of Valhalla is 'the worst game I've ever played' and was torture to play at Pinball World Cup

    high confidence · Neil's strong opinion: 'we had to play it non-stop at the Pinball World Cup... I was trying my hardest to lose the ball because the torture of playing this game was making me cry'

  • Gary Flowers runs the real UK Pinball Hall of Fame but some folks created a 'fake' competing awards, causing confusion

    high confidence · Neil's criticism of the situation: 'there's this weird thing about the UK Pinball Hall of Fame Awards... they've got this kind of fake awards and I kind of it feels a bit flimsy to me'

  • Tournament scheduling is problematic: Open qualifying ends at 6pm Saturday with playoffs at 7pm, clashing with other events and Saturday night fun

    high confidence · Neil's detailed critique: 'you've got an hour to grab your curry because the playoffs start at 7pm on Saturday night. I think that's completely mental'

Notable Quotes

  • “Venom gets such a bad you know you read about it you think it was the worst game ever made it's utter bollocks it's a freaking great game please go and play it”

    Neil McRae @ ~30:00 — Direct challenge to community perception; positioning underrated game as worth experiencing

  • “Godfather is a great game overlaid by the worst most complex code that could ever have been written... I've seen less menus in an internet firewall than in this game”

    Neil McRae @ ~18:00 — Detailed criticism of Jersey Jack code design philosophy; highlights disconnect between mechanics and UX

  • “In a world where pinball was kind of not in a great place, they just nailed that. The back glass is awesome. The music is amazing.”

    Neil McRae @ ~45:00 — High praise for Robocop's design excellence as a historical reference point

  • “Legends of Valhalla we had to play it non-stop at the Pinball World Cup Right And actually I was trying my hardest to lose the ball because the torture of playing this game was making me cry basically”

    Neil McRae @ ~42:00 — Extreme negative assessment of a game; sets up expectation management for attendees

  • “you've got an hour to grab your curry because the playoffs start at 7pm on Saturday night. I think that's completely mental”

    Neil McRae @ ~12:00 — Critique of Pinfest 2024 tournament scheduling logistics

  • “George Gomez his mantra is ball and flippers... get that right then I then add the as he calls it the garnish”

    Neil McRae @ ~22:00 — Design philosophy reference; establishes design prioritization framework used by industry

  • “I'm sure Holly wouldn't. She's going to be like, it's just not the real thing... something about pinball it's that kinetic feeling that you get from the game you're never going to get”

    Scott Rundell @ ~07:00 — Commentary on virtual pinball vs real machines; highlights experiential divide

Entities

Neil McRaepersonScott RundellpersonPinfest 2024eventDavid FixpersonAmerican PinballcompanyGary FlowerspersonToby SixtopersonAlan O'Gradyperson

Signals

  • ?

    community_signal: UK Pinball Hall of Fame governance dispute; competing awards system created despite Gary Flowers owning legitimate trademark and being well-regarded by industry

    high · Neil criticizing the 'weird thing' and 'fake awards' while praising Gary Flowers as industry connector and 'nicest guy I've ever met'

  • ?

    event_signal: Charity gaming event: Neil and Alan O'Grady organizing midnight Godzilla matches at Pinfest with £200 combined donation to Chris B's charity

    high · Neil detailing 'midnight madness on Saturday in the hotel foyer' with 'three games first to three wins' and both donating £100

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Jersey Jack demonstrates preference for complex code and RGB-heavy aesthetics over streamlined rules; contrast with Stern's George Gomez 'ball and flippers first' approach

    medium · Godfather having 'worst most complex code' with excessive menus; Elton John noted as simplification improvement; Guardians integration criticized as 'laziest theme integration'

  • ?

    event_signal: Pinfest 2024 tournament scheduling creates logistical conflicts: Open qualifying ends 6pm Saturday with playoffs at 7pm same day; Ladies tournament finals clash with Open finals

    high · Neil's detailed critique of 'hour to grab your curry' and scheduling being 'completely mental' and 'nuts'

  • $

    market_signal: Tron LE selling at reduced price despite being a good game, indicating market softness and cost-of-living pressure on pinball collecting

    medium · Neil noting Tron sale at 'fairly good price' with comment 'there was a day where that game would have gone instantly... but it's just it is what it is right we're living in a bit of a cost of living crisis'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.187

0:00
Welcome to the Great British Pinball Podcast, and here are your hosts Scott Rundell and Neil McRae. Welcome, ladies and gentlemen. It's the big one you've been waiting for. You're getting in your car, you've got pingeries all over from loading the van with games, you've cursed yourself for forgetting something as you drive down the motorway, and why are we driving down the motorway, Scott?
0:41
Because we're going to Pinfest. It is that time of the year, it is Pinfest 2024. I am Neil McRae and I'm joined, as always,
0:50
by Scott Rondo. How are you doing, Neil? I'm good my friend and first of all I'm going to call out right away we were supposed to record this yesterday and I screwed up and Scott has got out of bed early to record this appreciated Scott because we couldn't leave the punters without anything to listen to on their epic journeys from all over the country heading to a place called Daventry a place that you would never go to unless you were going to Pimpin because let's say It's not on the tourist map. It's a backboard speaking nothing.
1:24
But what it does have, it has a great big hotel with a great big car park and a function room that can fill up with pinball. What it doesn't have is a bar that doesn't run out of beer.
1:36
But that seems to be a common thing at hotels because the UK Open Hotel ran out of beer as well. Oh, really? Yes. Well, it ran out of one type of beer. and it's so this is I don't know the fifth time or sixth time I've been at a pin fest big fill in the team you know last year I thought they did a great job making the thing a bit bigger taking over the whole hotel still hotel niggles though but no it wasn't as bad as previous years it's definitely better you still get random people coming into your room with your £10,000 worth of camera gear my wife's looking at them thinking what?

  • Robocop (Data East, early 90s) is a standout classic with excellent back glass and music despite being alphanumeric rather than DMD

    high confidence · Neil's recommendation: 'In a world where pinball was kind of not in a great place, they just nailed that. The back glass is awesome. The music is amazing.'

    • Dennis Nordman
    person
    George Gomezperson
    Jersey Jack Pinballcompany
    Stern Pinballcompany
    Venom Premiumproduct
    Godfatherproduct
    Galactic Tank Forceproduct
    Barbecueproduct
    Legends of Valhallaproduct
    Robocopproduct
    Elton Johnproduct
    Tron LEproduct
    Data Eastcompany
    Brian Allenperson
    Chris Bperson
    Keithperson
    Steve Ritchieperson
  • ?

    community_signal: Community perception issue: underrated games like Venom need active defense by respected voices; negative narratives spreading despite game quality

    medium · Neil's challenge to listeners to play Venom, noting people 'read about it you think it was the worst game ever made' despite it being 'phenomenal'

  • $

    market_signal: American Pinball games struggling to sell in UK market; high asking prices and low availability affecting collector interest despite quality products

    medium · Neil attempting to purchase American Pinball games but finding 'ridiculous money' asking prices and minimal availability at Pinfest

  • ?

    product_strategy: Godfather has excellent playfield mechanics but completely undermined by overcomplicated code; mechanical design insufficient to overcome UX problems

    high · Neil praising layout and TAPMEC design but criticizing menu-heavy code; noting simple ruleset version would 'sell like hotcakes'

  • ?

    product_concern: Legends of Valhalla described as unplayable; created negative play-testing experience at Pinball World Cup despite being brought to Pinfest

    high · Neil: 'we had to play it non-stop... I was trying my hardest to lose the ball because the torture of playing this game was making me cry'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Venom Premium experiencing negative community sentiment that hosts argue is undeserved; game is actually well-designed and accessible

    high · Neil's direct challenge: 'Venom gets such a bad... it's utter bollocks it's a freaking great game' and Scott's confirmation of enjoying it

    • 2:19
    This time I've just got a kind of my Glock 55 on a string so if anyone opens the door they just get shot. That's just a joke folks.
    2:28
    Because under this government you can be arrested and jailed for saying such things now. Which is ridiculous. Mere thoughts are prohibited. Absolutely. The thoughts police are after us. So Luke, we're going to cover a couple of things. We'll probably do about an hour.
    2:48
    We're going to do a couple of things and then wrap up with a couple of topics that are bubbling under right now. But the first thing we're going to cover is the schedule of UK Pinbacks, which is helpfully on Pinball Forum. And if you're not banned like I am, you can read it. Unfortunately, I'm banned, so I can't read it. Phil, it'd be nice if you put the schedule on the website, because I think it would be useful for people who um are not uh members of that uh fraternal fantastic forum so look we got um there's a bunch of things i think i'll just call out um the first actually i'm going to start kind of in reverse um so years ago we did some talks and presentations um at pin fest and actually the presentations have always been a bit ropey in my view, but for a variety of reasons, just because it comes at the end, everyone's knackered, wants to go home, et cetera. But so, and also there's some questions about who, the UK Pinball Hall of Fame and who really runs it and who owns it. And it's a bit murky and a bit ridiculous, frankly. anyway um first thing is is david fix from american pinball really nice bloke is flying all the way over um probably to hear about how little people buy his games unfortunately um yeah because i think american sales here are not great actually i was trying to buy a couple of american pinball games um so that his games would be here i think most of them are going to be here anyway luckily. I wasn't able to buy any. Well, one, people wanted ridiculous money for them.
    4:36
    And two, there wasn't that many up for sale. So, I know there's a Hot Wheels. I think there's a Houdini. Yeah, I think Phil Palmer's bringing Valhalla, right? Yeah, I think there's a couple of games. But go and meet David Fix. He's a really, really nice guy.
    4:54
    And he tries... He works flat out at American Pinball. He took a bunch of us, thanks to Alan O'Grady down at the factory a couple of years ago.
    5:05
    And, you know, we got to see, actually, the barbecue pin before they released it. And actually, I thought the barbecue was just like a code name. I didn't actually think that they would launch barbecue as a theme. but nonetheless I like the game I know a lot of people don't but I think it's a lot of fun, if there's one there definitely go play it hopefully they've got one where the flippers are set up because the game suffers, if the flippers aren't spot on you can't hit the ramp and that makes it a bit rubbish but I like it, I think it's a good game I like Galactic Tank Force Do you know what, I was going to get one a long time ago but it was just that when they first came out, do you remember the big issue with the tank and the targets were like just ricocheting the ball, flying over the flipper and that just put me off.
    6:06
    Yeah, I mean I think unfortunately this is the thing with America, they kind of get so close but the last few inches don't nail it. Do you know what I mean? and it's like a barbecue where you can smell it, but you don't get to eat it.
    6:30
    Where you've got, you know, I mean, the Collective Tank Force, the artwork, the back glass, the story, it was a bit cheesy. Well, the video assets were really good as well, I thought. You know, it reminds me of the days of Command and Conquer. Do you remember that? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. That's what I thought. So I thought Command and Conquer and I thought kind of British humour, Something like David Croft, you know, the guy that did Ain't Half Hot Mom and a bunch of other kind of probably stuff you can't watch now, but in good taste. I thought it was pretty good. I thought they put a lot of effort into it. Dennis Nordman always usually does a great game. I think this is not his best, unfortunately.
    7:11
    You know, Indy 500's a Nordman game. Elvira's a Nordman game. so you kind of you know you kind of expect to get um some good stuff i feel like the focus was on the cabinet making it yeah the tank i know well this is the thing um you know george gomez i've said this before in a podcast but you know his mantra is ball and flippers um you know get that right then i then add the as he calls it the garnish um right okay uh but if you you know You can have a great theme. Sometimes you can have a great theme and get away with not such a great game. Ghostbusters, for example.
    7:52
    TBL, for example. You know, not great games. I'll probably get a riot for saying that. And actually, if you're thinking that TBL is a great game, have a game of it. If there's one at Pinfest, I don't know if there is. If there is one at Pinfest, have a game of it. and then go look for a medieval madness and have a game of medieval madness. I don't actually, unfortunately, I think there's a medieval madness there, but literally TBL is a ripoff of medieval madness in terms of rules and gameplay. And medieval madness does that a lot better, in my view.
    8:25
    But, yeah, so ball and flippers, focus on that. And actually, I think Norman normally gets that. You know, I mean, Elvira, I love that game. I know people think it's easy, but I kind of love it. and also because Lyman was involved in it. But, you know, focus on both of those, then do everything else.
    8:47
    Artwork, sound, for me, sound is super important. I think that's the case for a lot of people. But go meet David Fix. He's a great guy. I'm sure he'll be signing flyers and stuff, so go grab one. Then, actually, I don't know this guy, Toby Sixto, from the v-pin workshop is going to talk about v-pins um so i think that room will be absolutely rammed at that point and no disrespect but i just wonder if v-pins is the right theme to thing to be talking about pin fest for me i find it yeah it's kind of a weird one isn't it i mean like for me i don't mind virtual pins i think like they they fill a gap when you haven't got access to games that you're never going to be able to get easily, like Big Bang Bar as an example. If you want to experience that game, a pro-v-pin is going to be the way to do it. But I think it just doesn't compare to the real thing. And it never will. Would you give up one of your slots in your game room for a v-pin?
    9:50
    I wouldn't. And I've got 20 slots. I think I would. But I think Holly wouldn't. She's going to be like,
    9:58
    it's just not the real thing. there's something about pinball it's that kinetic feeling that you get from the game you're never going to get well this is the thing i think so i think you i think you say yes now right but then if something came along um like a big bang bar or a game that you wanted oh how are we going to fit this in we'll get rid of the v-pin oh yeah that would be the first on the chopping block without a doubt yeah um anyway look i think i'm sure it'll be interesting um i I did a bit of Googling on Toby. I don't know.
    10:31
    But I think it would be. I think a talk on, like, building your own Google machine would have probably been more apt. Yeah, yeah. And, actually, I mean, VPNs, I didn't realize quite how big they are. So, as you know, I'm in a Scorbet.
    10:48
    Scorbet have got support for VPNs, and it's huge. Okay. There's more traffic on the Scorbid Discord about V-pins than there's about real pins.
    10:58
    And then we've got the awards and presentations. I have to say, this bit for me is a bit frustrating because there's this weird thing about the UK Pinball Hall of Fame Awards. So the real UK Pinball Hall of Fame is run by Gary Flowers. And a bunch of folks have basically said, screw you, Gary. We're going to set up a different one because I don't know why. Because Gary's the nicest guy I've ever met in my life. and they've got this kind of fake awards and I kind of it feels a bit flimsy to me especially, I mean Gary Flower I have to say when I first heard about them I never met the guys like who is he but let me tell you the guys in the pinball industry they love them and so I'll give an example last year at Chicago, he hosted two different seminars for pinball manufacturers.
    11:57
    He is super plugged in to all the pinball manufacturers, all the pinball folks, the sharps, etc. He's such a nice guy. He did me a massive favor at an issue at Expo. He sorted it all out for me.
    12:16
    I think he's a really nice bloke and he owns a trademark for the UK Pinball Hall of Fame and I wish they'd just fix it and get him back involved not quite sure why it's gone the way it's gone but anyway what else have we got going on of course there's free play there's over 100 games and you've got VIP access which I recommend, well I recommend everyone buys it except I don't want everyone to buy it because it gets too busy um don't go encouraging things like that neil no but the show so so the show opens at 7 p.m on friday night but it doesn't let me come back and see why and then and then you've got vip access to 11 um and then at 11 karaoke starts and and let me tell you pin fest karaoke is a dream event that everyone needs to attend um i have got a special track that i'm going to sing everyone will be pleased to know um and then and then on saturday um you know don't go to bed too late because we're up at 10 a.m um for free play and saturday i'll be rammed um i'll be very busy i'm sure hopefully it's cold outside so we don't all die from heat exhaustion the show runs 10 to 6 and then you've got the evening vip again and then you've got sunday 10 to 4 but this year things are a little bit different the tournament is running on Friday so if you're a desperate pinball player you can come at 10am on Friday morning and play in the tournament and it's kind of a weird one I have to say and I get why but I think something needs to be rethought of this so you've got the open tournament starts at 10am and qualifying finishes 6pm on Saturday.
    14:18
    So then you've got an hour to grab your curry because the playoffs start at 7pm on Saturday night. I think that's completely mental.
    14:31
    Seems a bit tardy. It just seems, it's insane. For me, you know, Saturday night is a bit of fun. It clashes with, I think it's going to clash with Stolball. It clashes with other things. I just don't think that's a great decision. I get why, and I'll explain at least why I think, but I think that needs to be thought about. And then you've got the finals continue at 2 p.m. and run to 4.30 on Sunday. But then you've also got a classic tournament. This is the wackiest thing. A classic's from 10 till 6, and then nothing in the evening on both Friday and Saturday. And then the finals are in the morning on Sunday. and I'm like why? It just feels bizarre to me I suspect it's because the people who are running it want to have a few beers on Saturday night and Friday night which is fine, I get that but I think there's ways you can keep that running without necessarily giving up the running of it so anyway there also the ladies tournament which kind of starts on Friday night at 7 where all the ladies lock themselves in a cupboard and get their Anne Summers catalogues. I'm just kidding.
    15:49
    No, actually, it also runs this. It's a great, great gig, and it's great. And then there's ladies qualifying 10 till 2, and in finals 7.30 till 10 on Saturday. So if you qualify for the ladies' finals and you qualify for the open finals, you're screwed.
    16:08
    To me, that's nuts. I just honestly don't understand why you would do that. But it is what it is. You've then got the NBA challenge. Have you done the NBA challenge, Scott?
    16:22
    Holly always says to me to go try it, and I keep forgetting every time. I just look too busy, I'll come back later and then I forget about it so I'll try it this time you should try and do it, it's like basically two NBA games yeah linked together, it's pretty cool it's quite cool it's a lot of fun then if you've got a VIP ticket you can access Stolbol, it's never been as good as since I left, let's face it Mike and the machine they're playing on is Twilight Zone ouch I mean it's got a fair amount of locks on it in all fairness I think Shadow's better It's Twilight Zone though And then there's the UK League Finals also on I don't know what to say about that but basically you can just randomly qualify in different parts of the country and claim to be the UK League champion it's just a nonsense in my view but apparently it's what everyone likes so good luck but the key thing though is free play and VIP access if you're there there's so many great games, we're going to talk about games Starball actually it's a lot of fun go join it for sure all the tournaments are a lot of fun, actually if you've never played in a tournament, don't worry about the fact you've never played in a tournament so I'll give an example, my Bond 60th is in the Open tournament, lots of people are going to want to play it, just buy a ticket and go have a game of it won't cost you anything it's five quid for a ticket on the tournament you can have a game of it um and you know you if you want to play that game and any of the other games are in the tournament same with classics buy a ticket um or an entry you go play all the games uh there's a there's a great game called meteor and space actually there's another game i've got a really good got web game in the classics tournament uh that i highly recommend you play um but i'm really excited about the tournaments as always I'm excited about something that isn't actually on the schedule.
    18:28
    So last year, myself and Alan O'Grady, Atlantis on the forum, he challenges me to a game of Godzilla.
    18:41
    And I was like, I'm only going to challenge you if it's worth something. so we put three of us put 150 quid in to play Godzilla and I was actually a bit conned by it because unbeknownst to me there was no tilt bob in this Godzilla anyway the good news is I won and actually it wasn't for charity then but I gave all the money to charity Alan has agreed to do a rematch so midnight madness on Saturday in the hotel foyer Alan and I will be fighting it out for I don't know the cojones of winning against each other and we're going to play three games first to three wins and we're both donating 100 quid each to the charity that Chris B is running which I can't remember what it is but Chris always picks a good charity so hopefully that'll be a bit of fun it was a real laugh last year Alan managed to actually play skiing with the Godzilla because it had no tilt bob I was actually on the last ball he was moving it around so much that some people thought the power cord was going to come out which would have suited me because I was way ahead of him but he was catching up he actually played a strategy that when I realised what he was doing, I was thinking, oh, I'm in trouble. Anyway, I won it. And I was very happy about that.
    20:21
    But Alan and the guys from Ireland, the good guys, go chat to them. Buy them a beer. In fact, buy them lots of beer. If you see Alan, hand them a beer. Make sure he's pasted before he starts. I'm so freaking hammered that I can win with one hand. That's what I really want. right um so let's go on to the games um speaking of which quickly on that charity thing yeah um we should make a note to everyone bring cash ah yes cash bring pound coins grab some if you want to play on those charity pins you'll need coins you need to bring cash i mean typically for anything pinball related bring cash for anything hotel related they'll take your cards um yeah That's a really good point Scott Thank you for that So Let me just get the list of games That's currently on And there's some updated news because Matt and I Decided what we were bringing Because some games we didn't have Or didn't arrive So I ordered a Jaws Premium that was basically Going to be unboxed at the event Unfortunately it didn't arrive So That's a bit of a downer but let's go so Scott why don't we start reception area talk us through those games we've got Venom Premium we've got Tron LE we've got either James Bond Premium or Stranger Things and we've got Godfather yeah Tron LE is going to be interesting because obviously that's up for sale as well at a fairly good price on my ad considering it is a Tron I mean there's a day where that game would have gone instantly oh man this was covid days that i'm sure that would have been gone at that price already um but it's just it is what it is right we're living in a bit of a what's the word they keep using now cost of living crisis phrase i think that's what it is isn't it i i call that normal reality yeah i think that's it the bubble has burst world but yeah it it's just anyway back on the game i I suppose, because it's focused on that. To me, it's a good game. It's one of Stern's... You know when they did that kind of noughties era where they didn't have many good games? It was really just what's good. Tron, Ellie. Tron and Spider-Man and probably Lord of the Rings, and that's it.
    22:48
    I know you don't like Lord of the Rings. I don't like Lord of the Rings. I find that a bit repetitive. But yeah, it's okay. It's not a terrible game. I don't think it's worth the hype that it gets. No, probably it depends on if you're a fan of the license it's a typical Gomez game it feels like a Gomez game oh yeah, it's definitely got Gomez bends on it have you played Godfather?
    23:12
    have I played Godfather? No I haven't ok I mean I definitely recommend having a game of it, I think there's a great is that going to be there? Yeah apparently it's going to be there in this group Godfather is a great game overlaid by the worst most complex code that could ever have been written. Yeah, is it a bit like a board game or something like that? It's kind of. You kind of go on missions and stuff, but honestly, I've seen less menus in an internet firewall than in this game. It's just ridiculous. And it's a shame because I actually think the layout is a great layout. It's got this really cool kind of tip, I call it the tip for TAPMEC, that I thought was an ingenious design. Eric, actually Eric talked me through it Eric Minu talked me through it at TPF when they launched it and I was impressed by it but then you get this menu, you're like why am I selecting things from menus, fucking hell I think for me it was like it's just the theme I don't think Godfather suits a pinball world I mean I think that was a bit of Jersey Jack likes Godfather and wanted to do his own Godfather game that's my take on it but the Grover game of it I think it's I think if they were to bin the code and do a really simple rule set that game would sell like hotcakes and pointing in Chase, Elton John it's got a much simpler code than Godfather and it's their best game ever basically so I'm excited about Venom Premium so this is my other challenge for everyone Venom gets such a bad you know you read about it you think it was the worst game ever made it's utter bollocks it's a freaking great game please go and play it I played it around yours and I really enjoyed it and actually I was going to bring my LE until I noticed the premium was coming because it's such a good game it's fun especially if you're a noob to pinball please play this game because it's really easy to pick up all you have to do is shoot the same coloured shot, that's it and the shots are wide open, they're very easy, backhand them if you really don't want to lose the ball it is a phenomenal game and again, it does not deserve the shit show that it kind of has right now I think it's affected by the pricing, if I'm honest with you, I mean people look at it and go there's not much in the play field looks kind of barren and then it's got a high price tag 100 percent um and then of course bond premium or stranger things le both great games um yeah i love stranger things yeah i mean you can't go wrong with stranger things um basically okay um the the the we'll quickly cover the the uh tournament games as a whole so games that I'm looking forward to playing well I wish I was in the ladies tournament because they've got a Medusa and Star Trek and I really like those games and Jurassic Park Matt Vince though this is glorious actually Lucy Vince has put in Gigi now I really wish I hope everyone gets a chance to play Gigi because it's hilarious. It's literally a complete luck game. You get five balls and you've never seen a game like it. Have you seen GG, Scott? No. No?
    27:00
    Go look for it. It's an old EM. Matt has brung it to the league finals, which I kind of think is hilarious.
    27:09
    Actually, Lucy picked it because she won the South East thing there's a couple of games in there that are horrible Guardians, Avatar Centaur, Kiss and there's a Brave Choice, Cactus Canyon Continued that's always a bit wobbly that game just because the way the P-Rock stuff works but it's fun definitely fun anything in that list that tickles your fancy I don't know what Big House is, I don't think I've played that.
    27:44
    It's interesting when you say, why do you not like Guardians then for a tournament play? For tournament it's a great game but I just think for Guardians as a theme they couldn't have done a cheaper like if they literally picked up the Guardians theme in a ball and threw it on a pinball machine. There was no proper theme integration.
    28:10
    There's no, you know, it literally oh the theme integration will play a video in a mode uh it's bollocks it's it's the it's the laziest theme integration and i like guardians as a theme i've got a guardian sure galaxy pro um and um it's it's very metallica like um but i just as a theme integration i mean the great thing is is you can buy or you can buy so you actually don't have to even pay for it you can download a new code that improves it with music and I think Jim at My Pinballs has got a theme, there's Cleland, but nah, it's a bit disappointing. Okay.
    28:55
    Classics, you're not big on the classics Scott, are you? No, mate, they're not even on my radar. I'm going to pick a classic for you to play, there's two that you've got to try and figure out how you play. Okay. Stern Meteor, actually the good news is there'll be two Stern Meteors, There'll be one on the... I'm bringing my Meteor that's just had a new playfield put in by Keith. Thank you, Keith. So you can play that on the Pinball Republic stand. And there's another great game called Super Orbit.
    29:23
    It is worth an entry into the tournament to play that. But also you get a possibility of playing Viking and...
    29:36
    And... If Kevlar brings Flight 2000, it's worth playing that. But Super Orbit, it's a got the ad game. It's a funny game. I definitely recommend it.
    29:48
    And then the main room. So we got 104 games for the main room. I'm going to pick out two games that I would apply petrol to. two games I love and two games that I haven't played or I can't remember playing that I want to play again so I don't see a roadshow which is great news it's a happy news I swear to god there was one on there but I think it's died oh ok so that's good news but look there's a game Legends of Valhalla Phil's bringing it because David's here it is the worst game I've ever played so are you bringing your fear of magic? I am yes so I was going to come to that come on then I jumped ahead sorry they just stuck out on the list there yeah sorry it was a last minute decision I'll explain why in a moment but so Legends of Valhalla we had to play it non-stop at the Pinball World Cup Right And actually I was trying my hardest to lose the ball because the torture of playing this game was making me cry basically it just shockingly bad the next worst game that I'm picking out Spinal Tap, sorry David he's probably not going to disagree even though he's asked to sell the damn thing it's absolutely shocking I just remember it last year and you kept hearing that woman on the call out going oh my god I'm going to kill myself that stupid woman every time she's greeting people because it's like one of the first modes you get to it's terrible right two great games I'm going to pick games that aren't mine so the kind of great game that I'm going to call out is game number 36, Robocop.
    32:07
    It is... In a world where pinball was kind of not in a great place, they just nailed that. The back glass is awesome. The music is amazing. Remember, it's a very early pin, early 90s, I think.
    32:24
    One of Data East's first games. It doesn't have a DMD. It's alphanumeric. If you can get there early, play it. The music's great in it, and unfortunately you're not going to hear the music. That's the sad thing about it. It's going to get so bombarded by other sounds, isn't it?
    32:43
    But it's a glorious game. The end of game music is one of the best. Go have a listen to it on YouTube. So that's my that's one of my kind of big picks. The other big pick I'm going to go with is Elton John.
    33:00
    And it is a very very good game Steve Ritchie very Star Trek like someone told me it was like Star Wars I was like yeah okay I think you mean Star Trek because it's nothing like Star Wars but it is a phenomenal game and just really good again the sound might be drowned out a bit which is a shame but I would absolutely love that and then two games that I haven't played these are probably going to be older games my god someone's bringing a v-pin oh dear so I'm probably going to I'd love to have a go Lady Luck I have played this before it's quite a difficult game Dave's bringing Lady Luck I definitely want to have a player that and also the Funhouse remake yeah I saw that on the list there I do want to see what that's like I played Funhouse, it's not a favourite of mine, it's ok I just want to see what Brian Allen as in Flyland Designs is done with the playfield artwork.
    34:28
    Absolutely. That interests me. And actually, Brian is doing the UK Open t-shirt this year. Oh, is he? He is, yes. Well, I'll be getting one of those. We might give one away on the show next time.
    34:44
    But yeah, I mean, there's some other great games, Walking Dead, Farfalla, Matt's bringing, someone's bringing one of them,
    34:52
    Twister, Bond Premium, Bride of Pinball, it's not the best game in the world but it's got a lot of nostalgia because there's so many of them Scott, what's your two horribles on this?
    35:06
    I'm not going to say two horribles because I think that's a bit divisive I'm going to say least desirable for me to play is probably Fishtails because I've just played that game so many damn times I'm bored of it, I will probably not even play it yeah i'll look at it and go yeah it's another fish tales yeah i just i know people love that game i know it's got a special place in their heart because it is it's a fun figure of eight shooter you can keep you know shooting left ramp right ramp to the to the cows come home but it's just boring um probably other least desirable for me it's going to be lady luck i don't feel I've got to bother with that. Have you played it before? I have, and I just, no, it didn't do nothing for me. There you go. Well, there's a polarized view. Yeah. Maybe I'll come back and, I mean, I haven't played it for a while.
    36:01
    Maybe I'll come back and see. The most desirable for me to play is going to be Galactic Tank Force and Labyrinth, because I haven't played them. You haven't played them. Have you played Calvin John?
    36:12
    No, but the theme does nothing for me. Ah, okay. I mean I'm like I will play it but it's I would never own one because it's just it's a bit too I don't know it looks a bit garish I wouldn't have that in my lineup it's like a store firm it's like a bloody unicorn puke all over it it's just like nah I'm alright I do agree with you on that I mean that's typical JGP though it's like even Godfather it's like oh you've just killed someone rainbows it's just like yeah they seem to like rgb a bit too much but there we go basically um so look uh uh great choice um what are two what's the kind of two games on here that you haven't played i haven't played valhalla either and barrio's barbecue there there's to be fair right this lineup and it's thankful for people like atlantis and pimple heaven for bringing those games i really appreciate that because you've got games on there that I just never probably going to be able to play anywhere else. I could see them there, like Toy Story 4, Barry O's Barbecue, Legends of Valhalla. It's like these are expensive games, and I think people need to recognise that. These are damn expensive games. Actually, I was going to make a note of that, especially after what happened to one of your games last year. Yeah.
    37:33
    Folks, if you're drinking near a pinball machine, be fucking careful. and sorry to swear but last year there was a couple of incidents that were just not on yeah don't put drinks on glass on the games if you're not playing the game don't lean on it you know these games are 10,000 just assume every game is worth 20 grand right and treat every game like it's worth 20 grand because to the owners, some of these games are worth 20 grand. Some of them will be priceless to them, I think. It depends on what they've done to them. They're all people's pride and joys, and you need to treat them as such. Last year, I was like, and actually it did make me think, do I want to go through the pain of bringing games? I initially pulled my game from the list. I hadn't actually wanted to take it because I was a bit put off last year. what happened obviously beer got pulled down the side of the decals luckily right it washed off i mean that's the nice thing about vinyl it's it's somewhat resilient to this stuff but you just think you spend hundreds of hours doing these games up and then someone tips beer on it it's a bit disrespectful it's unnecessary yeah and it's totally outrageous frankly yeah but uh yeah let's just see what happens and say i think like it's up to the organizers to make sure that people run a clean you know clean ship whatever the word is i want them to make sure that anybody who looks like they're becoming a bit of a nuisance yeah they have a quick stern word with them and if they keep it up they get kicked absolutely simple as that 100 um i mean i know phil tries to get that balance right it's not easy by the way no it's not especially i imagine it's going to be pretty busy right it's hard to actually tell whether or not it will be really busy or not because this normally falls on a bank holiday weekend. Exactly. And it's the week before this time around. So it'll be interesting to see what this does to the entries, so to speak. Yeah, I mean, I think I meant to ask Phil about that, but I didn't get a chance to. But anyway, like I say, folks, if you want people to bring their best games to play, I mean, this is a great line-up. There's a great line-up, yeah. But if word gets out that people are just not respecting the games, like, you know, I mean, I think David's nuts. he's bringing a Beatles Diamond Edition.
    40:02
    It's a 20 grand pit. Well, actually, I'm doing the same. I'm bringing my Bond. Well, you're all nuts, if you ask me. It's what it is, right? We spend a fortune on these games. But I just say, as long as people, and it's hard to say, right, people listening to this podcast, I think it's not the audience, really, we want to be targeting at. It's the general audience that don't play pinball a lot, that just come to the show because they've heard about it. And hopefully, they come in with good spirits and they're not sat there. There was one little angry little guy. Do you remember last year? Yeah. He was kicking the legs and stuff like that, and you just think, what are you doing? Are you taking it out on the machines? I mean, I did kind of stare at that guy and tell him he should get a life, basically. It's probably him that poured the beer down the side of it. But anyway, no, I mean, I'm just kidding.
    40:54
    Look, treat a game with respect, because if you don't, people just won't bring them. I mean, if anything happens to any of my games, that's it. I'm done. I'm not bringing anything.
    41:03
    And we at Pinball Republic, we're bringing 24 games. Yeah, it's a lot, man. Appreciate that. So, you know, and they're all great games.
    41:15
    That's what I mean. Except for Star Wars Episode I, Matt. I did try and talk them out of it. I mean, last year we had probably games that I would say that caught fire, which they did. Yes. this year, there's a lot of games that have been released in the last five years. That's really good for people. I mean, they've got to really appreciate that, actually. This show, this lineup has got some games you're just never going to be playing anywhere else. I think this is a great thing about it. I mean, there's some people who bring the same games year in, year out, which is fine. That's cool. But I have to say this year feels like a very different set of lineup of games. Much more modern, right? It feels a little bit like, you know,
    41:57
    we're not near like the days of US pin fest, but we're definitely got a respectable lineup there. Yeah, I think it's different. I mean, I'm annoyed that Jaws, so either Jaws Premium I bought for the club that I was going to bring, it hasn't arrived. I was also going to bring my John Wick LE. If it had arrived, I was going to bring that. It's not here. I heard some rumors about that the Carco crate that's got those chores on there is missing, but who knows what reaction. Who surprised me? So, John Wick, you're so irritating. Today I got an email from Stern. Oh, more John Wick missions.
    42:33
    Here's your fucking mission. Get me my bloody pin. I paid for it like a month ago. What the hell is going on, Stern? Welcome to Pinball, where you pay money for empty space. It's a joke. I mean, honestly, it is an utter... So this is the same.
    42:49
    Like, if you're buying LEs now, Stern insists that you pay for them. Literally when they ship. Oh, when they ship. Okay. So, actually, maybe before they ship. But anyway, it's long before you get the freaking game, right? And it's infuriating. So, John Wick, when did that come out? Like, months ago? I don't know. It feels like old news now, doesn't it? For this country, it's still new. It's infuriating. They'll be announcing the next Cornerstone before you get that. I'll tell you who has got it. They've got it in the Electrocoin Arcade in London. and they've got John Wick Premium there. Oh, that's nice. Why don't you fly my freaking LE over, ElectroCoin?
    43:31
    Sorry, man. And Phil, you know, he's at his wit's end because he just doesn't get any information about what's going on. Yeah.
    43:39
    It's a shame, actually, because if Jaws was in that list, it would have pipped my... I would have gone straight to that game, I think. And interestingly, there isn't going to be a Jaws there. Is that right? I don't see one. Yeah. Maybe I should bring my Jaws LE. Oh, wow. It would be very good of you to do it, Neil, but I say it's an LE. Actually, no, no. Actually, I'm not going to because it's in bits because I've been installing mods on it. So, actually, I'll never get it back. You're as bad as Ant. Do you know, it's like he says it because I got that alien. And I said to him, have you got to this mission yet? He goes, mine's still in bits. It's literally just bits. Like, he's had it in bits for, like, about eight months now. So I took mine apart. I got the spinners from the US, the really nice precision spinners. Okay.
    44:30
    I'm not a fan of precision flippers, as you know, although they're very well made. But I just think they're unnecessary. Actually, if you want to improve your flippers, get the new Stern Bouchon on Sterns. It makes a massive difference. Yeah, they're blingy, but they just make the game completely different to how the designer wanted them. but the spinners, the reason I get them is because the spinners on Jaws especially the premium where you've got two they're piss poor they've been made at a cost point and they just detract from the game so I've replaced them with the precision ones and actually John let's do a shout out to John because he's done these two cool mods, if you're watching on YouTube you'll see them that sit on the top of the spinners. Oh, that's nice. I've got to install these. This one's, that one's nice. This one's beautiful. This is, I just showed a wheel that sits on top of the spinner. And this one, which is the, which is kind of based on the fishing rod that, what's his name? I forget. I always forget the character's name. Mate, don't ask me. I can't remember. No, anyway. I should know, but I don't know. It's so well balanced, well designed.
    45:49
    That's the reason why I can't bring my jaws, because it's in bits, because I'm trying to fit these. Shout out to John, who's doing those. If you want them, they're on Pinside.
    45:59
    Spinner toppers, go look for them. Because, unfortunately, Stern decided to rivet the tops to the old mech. So you've either got to file it. It's a nightmare to try, and they're not very good. They don't look great. These are much better. interesting to use rivets I mean people who use rivets should be riveted to the wall rivets serve a purpose like ramp flaps you don't want them coming loose but like mechs and that should be just standard you should build an aircraft carrier or a rocket to the moon that's where you need rivets right another thing I'm going to quickly cover so the pinfist open competition Everyone should enter it for a laugh If nothing else Just buy one ticket go play a game So World Cup Soccer great game Creature eh
    46:53
    Jackpot, eh. It's okay. I will say, that's a pretty tough lineup you've got there. It is. It's a very tough lineup, I have to say. And it's five card. I mean, like, Walking Dead, it's like, dear God, that game's going to be a trainer. Yeah. I mean, what I'm looking at from my kind of ticket is probably Flash Gordon, Walking Dead, Bond 60th, Iron Maiden, and Tron. That's probably what I'm... See, I would have played it safe if I'd not just gone down Black Knight.
    47:24
    Yeah, unfortunately, Black Knight's... It's hard, but if you know what you're doing, and I think you do, you could probably do well out of that. Yeah, it's just... just, yeah, could be an option.
    47:40
    Because people who don't know what they're doing on that game, they're going to drink pretty fast. The other game that's a potential is Paragon.
    47:47
    If you can have a good game of Paragon, it's a tough game. If you can have a good game of Paragon, it could be good. I would encourage everyone to avoid, if you want to die quickly, mousing around in Taxi.
    48:04
    Yes, I agree. I played a lot of Taxi it's a good game it's so hard I mean that era Taxi, Diner Mouse and Around that kind of era of games they were pretty brutal coin munchers weren't they that's why they were made brutal it was because people wanted to make money out of these games the operators were complaining games took too long so Jetspin, I don't know what that is actually it's been put down as a reserve it could be interesting and just trying to have a look there's a few other kind of games spattered around Orbiter 1, always a bit of a laugh if you haven't played it it's one that's got a kind of a what's the word the play feels like the surface of the moon yeah yeah weird game who ever thought that was tripping yeah indeed um well i think that was the last game star made before they went they closed the doors on star electronics so not unsurprising um and i think yeah i mean there's a well actually one other game i'll call out um it's worth playing it's a tough game um techno play space team this is a carrier a very rare game. It's brutally hard though, but go have a look at it. It's an interesting game.
    49:39
    And Woe Nelly, if you haven't played Woe Nelly, it's a fun game. Yeah, I've played it. It's good. I like the way it's got the crate.
    49:47
    You know what I mean? The prop for the legs. It's weird. Indeed. And I think, I mean, the key thing is pinfests about the people.
    49:59
    The games are just a valiant excuse to stand around and have an excuse to get together so make sure you enjoy it and go talk to folks and have a lot of fun and a big shout out to Phil and team for running it it's a thankless task yeah I imagine as well some of those games keeping them up and running over this weekend all the kind of people fixing games and working on games the vendors who are bringing games and selling stuff thanks for bringing stuff because again that's a bollock just loading up stuff to bring and try and sell yeah but a huge thanks to those that do that when did you get there Scott?
    50:56
    so I'm planning to get there probably I don't know what time I feel is apt I might get there like mid afternoon Friday to set up you know what I mean get out of the way so I'm because I've got games in the tournament I'm going up Thursday actually we're going to Pinball Republic after this I'm heading to Pinball Republic to load up the vans and just a quick update on Pinball Republic things have gone slow the last couple of weeks predominantly because most of the helpers have been on holiday. Right. So a huge shout out to Tom Shine.
    51:36
    He, him and his guys did us a massive favor on doing all the electrics. Oh, nice. Massive thanks, Tom. because basically he saved us a load of money that we didn't have anyway.
    51:58
    So a huge thanks to Tom Shine. Tom's an electrician. If you need an electrician, I highly recommend him. He's done a great work at the club for us. And actually quite challenging circumstances because you've got the health and safety folks of the shopping mall and these guys just bang through it. done us a great, I mean a super solid on it and then we basically pretty much all of the games actually not all of them but probably 90% of the games are there and actually we have a problem, we've got too many games and we're going to have to prioritise some of the games and kind of juggle them around a bit so interesting problem to have but we open, so there's a members only event on Thursday the 22nd. So if you're a member, as a kind of thank you, we're doing a members-only event before we open up on the 22nd. And then our official opening up is the 24th, Saturday the 24th of August. We'll be open all day. And then on Sunday the 25th, we're running a tournament
    53:12
    to kind of get back into the tournament side of it. and then we're going to open as usual. We've still got lots to do. It's not perfect, but we're heading in the right direction and we will need help to, you know, people to open and stuff like that. We've got a lot more kind of flexibility in what we do here. It's great having a loading bay. You've no idea how great that is. And it's sheltered. So normally, when we're at the club, when we're loading up, it pisses down with rain. This time it doesn't matter because we've got a nice loading bay. Encourage everyone to come down.
    53:55
    And, look, the club, if folks, if we don't, if people don't come and pay to play the games, you know, we'll be here a year and we'll shut down. So we've got a lot. Hopefully that's not the case. No, I hope, look, I don't think it will be. I hope it isn't, but, you know, it's kind of use it or lose it. Sure. When do you open now? What's your planned date for opening? No, so the planned date is Saturday the 24th of August. That is the opening. It's not far away. It's a couple of weeks. So, honestly, we wanted to be opening in July before August. Sure. Unfortunately, the lease just, honestly, I'm going to write, my memoirs will have a chapter on this whole lease process actually I noticed on the forum that Luke is talking about setting up a club in Blackpool I just wanted to comment, I would love to have replied to it but obviously I'm banned from the forum I'm going to cry but so he's talking about trying to set up an event sorry a club and I highly recommend them. One thing I'd say, Luke, is you're committing to a two-year lease.
    55:15
    I would suggest you don't do that. I would suggest that you commit to a five-year lease with a one-year lease break. So you're committed for one year. If it doesn't work out, you can bail out. But what you do not want is, at the end of two years, to have to potentially find a new venue. it will kill you so but Luke wish you well if there's any advice anything we can do at Pinball Republic to help let us know you can break even on this so good luck folks in the north around Blackpool you know now's your time to put your money where your mouth is I know that's difficult for Northerners.
    56:05
    It's even more difficult for us Scotsmen, but if he's going to do it, then he's going to do it. And then finally,
    56:15
    a farewell to Haggis. Yes. I think they had best intentions in the world. I think so. I genuinely think, looking at the stories of what happened, like Kane, he tried to send pre-populated playfields. I don't know if you heard that whole thing, crazy what they tried to do, but you try to use friction material between the top layer and the wood to keep the overlay effectively, the actual part, the playing part of the playfield attached to the wood. So it's a bit like an acrylic top. And it's like, and it's obviously side lifting because of heat changes in transport and going across like cargo freights and God knows what else. but it's just like if it ain't broke don't fix it is a very good term to use just bloody hell print to wood put a clear coat on it the city part is right the guy used to make uh the playfields that i do for like my cyberpunk and my bsd and that he's in australia he could have talked to that guy that clear coat is as good as cruiseman's coat it's rock solid like that thing i haven't got a single dent on my uh cyberpunk now for those that don't know johnny mnemonic it froze balls around like no tomorrow there's a part on the playfield that literally just drops a ball at height onto the onto the playfield it does it from the glove and it does it from a ramp that should be a crater by now given like you know standard playfields at least merco playfields but because it's got this like rock solid clear coat on it it's not a single dent on it yeah i mean it's again, it's like highway.
    57:55
    It's like, well, I can do this better, right? Yeah. And look, I get that, but you've got to survive first. And it goes back to the George Gomez, ball and flippers.
    58:06
    That's what counts in pinball. It's not your bozo manufacturing process. So get some games out the door.
    58:13
    I think he spent too much money on the internals as well. And you looked at how immaculate it sounded. 100%. But that's the thing. No one needs a flashing light. no one in pinball really gives two hoots about an under game like I'm sorry they just don't so why waste loads of time on it it's the same with Highway we're going to have this cabinet the cabinet on Highway is a freaking nightmare it's huge, it weighs a ton it's an absolute it's over engineered isn't it same with Deep Root oh we got this thing that goes up and down they never got it to work right because they could never build it was like their pod didn't they call it? the transport pod for pinball machines what? is there a market for that? I would buy one of them for sure is it going to make your pinball companies five? no freaking way focus on the ball every one of these people that have gone under it's about ball and flippers and also if you're going to license themes, you need volume I just insane you need volume, you need massive volume I want to shout out to Marty who worked at Haggis and worked a lot I actually don't think he was paid very much Marty's a great friend of mine I thought he was even paid at all near the end but he loves pinball So, Marty, we're thinking of you. I hope you're well, mate.
    59:52
    Certainly a challenging time. And, you know, Luke, lots of people, hindsight's 20-20, right? But there are certain things, you know, if you're thinking about setting up a pinball company, well, you're probably not listening to this podcast, but if you are, go read the pin side threads and all the stories of the kind of last four that have bit the dust. And there's a common theme. One, a leader that isn't capable, right, makes bad decisions. Two, not focused on the people buying the game. And actually, there's some big companies that I think need to rethink that. JGP and Stern, I think, are, you know, I'm like, why do I buy LEs? I get it. It takes forever. I have to pay in front. And then some bozo releases a premium black and white that might be better.
    60:41
    You know, I just think of the customer. Think of the customer. and too many of these companies just don't do that basically and it's infuriating anyway Luke we're up against time we are I'm very mindful of the clock I've got one minute so Luke Scott again appreciate you joining this looking forward to seeing everyone at Pinfest if you didn't like the podcast let us know why if you did tell your friends we'll get this up and running so that you can listen to it on your favourite device on the way to Pinfest come and see us at the Pinball Republic stand Scott's bringing, what game are you bringing? I bring Cyberpunk you have to go see that folks it's amazingly done the artwork is stunning the whole build of it is fantastic and the game it's based on is a good game as well so make sure people see that when you play it, it's a float monster now I can tell you that much so look, enjoy Pinfest make sure you say thanks to everyone don't put beers on games come and join us for the karaoke come and join us for the midnight madness and have a great time is the key thing make sure you go home thinking everyone's mission is to go home wanting a game that they didn't think they would want so go play things you haven't played on that, Scott, I will see you soon Take care. See everyone at Pinfest. Have a great trip. Safe journeys to everybody.
    62:17
    Bye-bye.