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The Pinball Show Ep 179: Video Killed The Radio Star

The Pinball Show·podcast_episode·1h 51m·analyzed·Aug 12, 2025
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 (batch) · $0.022

TL;DR

The The Pinball Show returns with Stern production intel, Jaws 50th success, and Spike 3 speculation.

Summary

The The The Pinball Show returns after a month-long hiatus with a video experiment, discussing Stern's packed production schedule through 2025, including King Kong and Godzilla builds, multiple Jaws 50th anniversary runs, and speculation about Star Wars as the next cornerstone title. Host Zach details a serious van accident, while the team analyzes Jaws 50th anniversary sales success, George Gomez's interview about Spike 3 features rolling out gradually, and home edition strategies at Costco.

Key Claims

  • Stern is building King Kong in late July, with Godzilla (Premium/LE), D&D Pro/Premium, Uncanny X-X-Men, and Metallica Metallica Remastered (Premium/LE) scheduled for August

    high confidence · Host reports on Stern's production schedule for summer/fall 2025

  • Jaws 50th Anniversary will have three production runs: July (already completed), September, and December (final run), then discontinued

    high confidence · Zach Meny confirms manufacturing timeline based on dealer allocations

  • Star Wars is rumored as the next Stern cornerstone game in September, likely episodes 4-6 of the original trilogy

    medium confidence · Speculation based on timing, licensing re-up with Costco home version, anniversary dates, and Spike 3 platform showcase opportunity

  • The The Walking Dead is rumored as the October/November remaster title for 2025

    medium confidence · Host speculation about Q4 remaster announcement pattern; noted as unusual choice

  • Spike 3 will debut with the next cornerstone game, but full cabinet design upgrades (bigger screen, improved sound system, cabinet lighting) will arrive on the following release after that

    high confidence · George Gomez interview on Loser Kid Pinball Podcast as relayed by hosts

  • Jaws 50th Anniversary premium model features color powder coat and sparkle-infused playfield, features rarely seen on premium-tier Stern games

    high confidence · Zach notes this is exceptional value for $9,700 premium pricing

  • Star Wars (Home Edition) launched at Costco following success of Jurassic Park Home Pin; next home edition (fall 2026) will be a new, broad-appeal IP, possibly Pokémon

    medium confidence · George Gomez discussed in Loser Kid interview; hosts speculate on IP identity

  • Zach totaled the Flip N Out Pinball van in a car accident while moving his son to Purdue; no serious injuries sustained

    high confidence · Zach recounts personal incident; new Ram van from Astor Van being ordered with new wrap design

Notable Quotes

  • “I totaled the flipping out pinball van. And it's been one hell of a summer.”

    Zach Meny (host) @ Early segment — Personal incident announcement; context for van replacement and new wrap design discussion

  • “All pinball machines are limited because they're all eventually not produced by that logic.”

    Dennis (co-host) @ Jaws discussion — Philosophical take on scarcity and limited editions; challenges notion that 'non-limited' Jaws 50th is truly unlimited

  • “It's going to be a heavy, fulfilling month of August.”

    Zach Meny @ Production schedule section — Summarizes Stern's packed manufacturing pipeline

  • “So what better way to showcase a Star Wars license on a new operating system, a new platform, if you will?”

    [name withheld pending review] @ Star Wars speculation — Articulates reasoning for Star Wars as Spike 3 launch title

  • “No one, no one, people like you, Zach, are not articulating tangibly what meaningful improvement we as the player will see with Spike 3 versus Spike 2.”

    Dennis (co-host) @ Spike 3 discussion — Pragmatic pushback on Spike 3 hype; questions real player-facing benefits

  • “I just think this is going to be... we call this a non-limited product. But I do bring up this to the viewers and listeners out there. Is this limited, though? Is it not limited?”

    Zach Meny @ Jaws 50th discussion — Nuanced take on Jaws 50th scarcity despite 'non-limited' designation

  • “Fucking fantastic. It's selling wonderfully.”

    Zach Meny @ Jaws 50th sales report — Strong enthusiasm for Jaws 50th premium performance

Entities

Stern PinballcompanyZach MenypersonDennispersonGeorge GomezpersonFlip N Out PinballcompanyThe Pinball ShowmediaLoser Kid Pinball Podcastmedia

Signals

  • ?

    product_launch: Stern's August 2025 production schedule includes King Kong, Godzilla Premium, Dungeons and Dragons Pro/Premium, Uncanny X-Men Pro, and Metallica Remastered Premium

    high · Host provides specific manufacturing timeline confirmed by dealer relationship

  • $

    market_signal: Jaws 50th Anniversary premium sold out July allocation quickly; September and December allocations already committed with strong demand; Flippin' Out has 'big old order' placed

    high · Zach: 'We sold out pretty quick of what we were allocated for the month of July... they're going fast, too'

  • ?

    machine_intel: Star Wars rumored as September 2025 Stern cornerstone title, likely original trilogy episodes 4-6, with multiple supporting signals including home edition re-licensing, platform debut timing, and anniversary alignment

    medium · Multiple convergent signals: Costco home edition deal, timing before anniversary, Spike 3 platform showcase opportunity, historical pattern of platform debuts

  • ?

    product_strategy: Jaws 50th Anniversary branded 'non-limited' but constrained to three time-windows (July, Sept, Dec) across 2025 anniversary year; may exceed LE unit counts despite selling existing premium first

    high · Zach: 'Is this limited, though? Is it not limited?... at some point, if you're limiting it per time, it is limited'

  • ?

    technology_signal: Spike 3 components being drip-fed into recent Spike 2 games (power supply, menu system) before formal platform launch; full cabinet redesign will come second rather than first

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.075

0:00
Warning, the following episode contains adult language and screaming goats. Listener discretion is advised.
0:30
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, gather around the flame, the fire that is the pinball show. This is episode 179, I believe, and we've gone video. Dennis, well, again, have we gone video again? For, at least for today. We're experimenting, we're trying new things. It's been three hours of experiment. That's right. And so it may look, it may be non-existent next time. It may look different in the following episodes. But for now, just like good old times back in college, we are experimenting. Do you experiment a lot?
1:18
So intros. A lot of labs and science is what I was talking about. Yeah, yeah, I'm sure. Sure. I did social sciences. Yes, you use a lot of test tubes in that. Well, we did a lot of social psychology. So we, a lot of, what is it? That's a lot of waivers. You need a lot of permissions. You know, setting people up with electrodes and shocking them and, you know, testing the reaction. There are a couple people in pinball I'd like to do that too, but I digress. We've been gone for what, over a month? Yeah, I think we last recorded around, I think like June 28th or 29th or something. Totally my fault too on that one. I'll take that. It's been a lot. There's been a lot going on this summer. I've had NASCAR. I've had manifestation hypnosis during sleep. I don't know how familiar you are. Boating, County Fair, a couple of new pinball machines that I got. I totaled the flipping out pinball van. And it's been one hell of a summer. Wow.
2:19
All I know is you would say I'm too busy. Yeah. Okay. Too busy about to die. Well, yeah, I'm like, we're probably near the end of the life cycle for this show anyway. Are we getting closer? I don't know. I think it's getting healthier. I don't know. There's a flipping out podcast now and there's a lot of conflation. The audiences are conflating and you know what I think of the conflation. Conflating. Everything's conflated.

  • George Gomez just turned 70 and discussed how parts constraints in 2020 pandemic limited production despite high demand, whereas 2025 has better manufacturing capacity despite ongoing parts delays

    high confidence · George Gomez interview relayed by hosts comparing market conditions

  • Jaws 50th Anniversary premium sold out quickly in July allocation and still has high demand for September run, with possibility of exceeding regular premium sales or even LE unit counts

    high confidence · Zach Meny reports on Flip N Out Pinball sales and allocation status

    • Jaws 50th Anniversary
    game
    King Konggame
    Godzillagame
    Dungeons and Dragonsgame
    The Uncanny X-Mengame
    Metallica Remasteredgame
    Stranger Thingsgame
    Star Warsgame
    The Walking Deadgame
    Pokémongame
    Spike 3product
    Spike 2product
    Spike 1product
    Costcocompany
    Astor Vancompany
    Purdue Universityorganization
    State Farmcompany

    high · George Gomez confirmed components already appearing; cabinet upgrades (bigger screen, sound system, lighting) delayed to following release after Spike 3 cornerstone

  • ?

    product_concern: Unknown why Spike 3 launch cornerstone won't include full cabinet redesign; theories include inventory of current cabinets or game design constraints requiring current form factor

    medium · Dennis: 'They made too many of the current cabinet... Like, we've just got to get through these cabinets'

  • ?

    business_signal: Hosts note community claims pinball market is 'dead' while Stern continues heavy production; George Gomez addressed 2020 vs 2025 demand/capacity differences in recent interview

    medium · Host: 'People are still trying to convince everyone that the market is dead, though... Stern keeps on building them'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Stern expanding home pinball editions at Costco; Star Wars Home Edition rolling out after Jurassic Park success; next fall 2026 home edition will be new IP with broad mainstream appeal, possibly Pokémon

    medium · George Gomez indicated next home must be 'big IP that's very widespread, relatable to non-pinball people'; hosts speculate Pokémon based on broad appeal and 30th anniversary timing

  • ?

    product_launch: Walking Dead remaster rumored for October/November 2025 release, though hosts debate strategic fit versus other franchise candidates (Ghostbusters, Lord of the Rings)

    low · Rumor with no confirmation; hosts express skepticism about thematic choice given show's age and middling prior sales

  • ?

    design_innovation: Jaws 50th Anniversary premium includes color powder coat and sparkle-infused playfield, rare features for premium-tier Stern machines at same $9,700 MSRP as non-colored alternatives

    high · Zach: 'When have we seen a color-powder-coated premium game?... You don't even get sparkle-infused playfield on LEs of Stern. It's like the first time'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Jaws 50th Anniversary initial mixed reception on artwork/cabinet design (bomb-pop comparison, white space on sides) shifted to strong sales as community recognized premium features and value proposition

    high · Zach: 'A lot of mixed reactions... People didn't know about the artwork... And then all of a sudden... sales just shot up'

  • ?

    content_signal: The Pinball Show experimenting with video format for episode 179 after month-long hiatus; format may change or become non-existent next episode

    high · Host: 'We're experimenting, we're trying new things. It's been three hours of experiment... it may look, it may be non-existent next time'

    • 2:47
    A lot of conflating. They're a little conflated, but I think it's a few days. So what happened with the van? That's the only one I care about. This lady, out of nowhere. No. What'd she do? We got a lot of pinball stuff. No.
    3:01
    I was using the van for non-business purposes. We were moving my son. He's at Purdue, and he was in a little apartment, and then he's wanting to rent a house with a couple buddies. So we were going to transition everything from our house over the summer, all the items up there. So I had them all loaded up and was driving up there about five minutes from the place. And I was driving through and there's a yellow light and a lady in front of me was like, I want to do a U-turn. And I boot-cook-oom-ed her ass. And then that's what happened there. All the airbags deployed. Oh, wow. It was scary, Dennis. I was scared. Was your nose okay? Yeah.
    3:44
    Sometimes it's an airbag. Still bulbous as ever. Now I got some shrapnel and the airbags are what got me. Yeah, my arms and my shoulders and everything for insurance purposes at State Farm. I still have that neck thing. I mean, it's still, you know, they did offer me. Have you ever done that where they're like, what happened to you physically? And I was like, I guess I'm lacerating on here and here. And they're like, do you seek medical attention? No, no, no. Well, why not? I don't know. I just didn't feel like it. And they're like, okay, well, based on what you're reporting, we will offer you a claim of $1,050 to conclude any medical stuff. And I was like, oh, wait a minute. Let's see what you're doing there. You can't buy me off. My body is a temple. It's worth more than $1,050. Thank you.
    4:35
    That's where all those lawyers on the TV are like, you need to talk with us before you take their settlement. But actually, no, it's not happening because all my accidents I've been involved with are non-injury, so it's not even come up.
    4:50
    I refuse it because I was like, I'm a common sense kind of guy. I'm not hurt, guys. I don't need to take your money. It's fine. I'm good. And then if the pain manifests later, you can still go after him. Yeah, you got up to two years. That's just my own thing. No, I'll be a big boy. That's fine. Well, you never know. I didn't even pee-pee or poo-poo myself whenever I got in a wreck. I was pretty impressed.
    5:14
    Okay. Fowl's already in. So now, what's going on? Are they loading up the flipping out moped or what?
    5:22
    We're purchasing a new Ram from Astor Van, and that means only one thing, a new wrap. So now we've got to design a new wrap. What's it going to feature? Is it going to feature Jaws? Probably. No, no Jaws? John Wick. Oh. Yeah. Maybe not John Wick. Yeah. Because I'm guessing you're back. I will. The man. I'm on the band's back. I'm trying to tie it all together, but you're not making this easy. You're like, ooh, Jaws. So I'm trying to figure out what's going to be. I think maybe Jurassic Park, and I won't want to give away anything, but there is a Stern game coming up. We may see at the end of the month, listen. Viewer that maybe that gets featured on the side. We'll have to wait and see.
    6:13
    Stern Pinball. Dennis, let's jump into the news. We've been gone for a month. Stern Pinball has been heavily producing things. People are still trying to convince everyone that the market is dead, though.
    6:23
    So, I mean, suddenly mostly dead. Yeah, that's what they keep claiming that. Stern keeps on building them. I don't know where they're putting them if that's the case. This last week they've been building King Kongs. In August, busy month coming up in August, everybody. Godzilla Premiums, they're going to be building. Dungeons and Dragons Pro and Premium. Uncanny X-Men Pro and Metallica Remastered Premium.
    6:48
    It's going to be a heavy, fulfilling month of August. A lot of stuff going on. September comes along and we are going to get another run of Jaws 50th anniversary, which we will discuss since we've been back. That's been an announced game. Wait, wow. It's not black and white. There's that. It's been big. Should have been. Whatever. It's Jeff Sparkles. Jaws 50th anniversary. Another run is coming in September as well as Stranger Things Pro and potentially a new Cornerstone game. I think that's going to happen at this point. The rumor, Dennis, do you know what the rumor is right now? What's the rumor?
    7:25
    I mean, I've heard some people talking Star Wars again. That's what I'm hearing. It feels too soon. Borgie. Yeah. Where's Pokemon? Pokemon. Pokemon feels like 2026. Yeah, I agree. I wasn't hearing this year for it, but I just, I don't know, Star Wars already? We just stopped the last Star Wars. And it did so well. It did, and it went for a really long time. With this new one, what new thing will crack open like a Cadbury egg? We achieve victory.
    7:58
    It's not even Easter. John Borg did the Data East, the Data East version. I believe that's correct. So are we going to have something like that? Are we going to have R2 bounce from the end? Shoot the desktop! Shoot the desktop! No. No? How about no?
    8:12
    People don't know what version it's going to be. Are we going to get the prequels? Are we going to get the original four to six episodes? Are we going to get a Darth Vader dedicated game? What are we going to get?
    8:23
    Why not Andor? I mean, look, Andor's good. But is it enough for a game? I mean, King Kong's enough for a game, apparently, and that's not been relevant in a hot minute. That's more iconic than Andor. I agree, but... I don't. Maybe. Skeleton Crew.
    8:51
    It's alright. It's alright. I mean, it's more likely to happen than Goonies, and it's basically just a better version of Goonies.
    8:59
    Stupid. I'm not even taking it. I'm not even... I mean, why don't you, why don't you, why don't you bite? Why don't you bite? I think we may be seeing, here's my, I'm guessing episode, the original. I'm guessing episodes 4 through 6 because. Again? Numerous reasons. We've got anniversaries coming out of those, right? And they like to pitch something right before the year of, before the anniversary so that they can squeeze out an anniversary edition the following year. Okay. We just had, as we will discuss, Star Wars in the pinball news of launching the home version at Costco. Sure. Maybe re-upping that license.
    9:39
    Just a lot of things coming to a head here that make me wonder, make me think Star Wars is kind of probably going to be it. And also just timing wise, if we're looking at all of the screens and the red screens and such, we had the launch of that game, like you said, years back, Spike 2 system, LCD screen. There are talks that the next game is going to be a Spike 3 game. So what better way to showcase a Star Wars license on a new operating system, a new platform, if you will? I can see them saying, anytime we do a new platform, your ass better guarantee we're going to have Star Wars showcasing that. So that makes sense, too. All the timing makes sense.
    10:26
    I mean, okay. I feel like the Spike 3 thing, like, I don't know if there's any rhyme or reason to, like, what game is going to launch Spike 3. I mean, Spike 2 was launched with what? Batman 66, technically? I meant justification of doing another Star Wars title. Because a lot of people would say, well, it's too soon to do the original. Steve Ritchie already did one. Well, as long as the layout's different, I'm not too hung up on that. It's Star Wars. It's going to sell no matter what. Mm-hmm. So I think September we're going to see that stuff. Late October, November, I think we're going to see a remastered game as we did last year. The rumor is The Walking Dead remastered. I still think that's really weird from a theme standpoint to bother with. It's a strange one. I can just try to put myself in their shoes if it is The Walking Dead remastered. If they decided it's a couple years ago.
    11:17
    No, even then. The show's been off the air for years. For years. The comic finished before the show did.
    11:25
    It's old. It never sold great. It should have, but Lyman got the rules to a good place eventually. Lyman being on rules is the only reason that really makes sense to me. Like, the layout is interesting. I like the layout because it's very creative. It's not the greatest layout out there. But with how the rules use the layout, it plays really well. I'm not saying it wouldn't be a good game. It's just, like, versus a Ghostbusters or something. Like, there are so many other low-hanging fruits that would make more sense than Walking Dead.
    11:58
    You're right. That doesn't mean that they won't still come out beyond wicks. I know. Okay, well, we can look forward to a lighter-selling game, I guess. And the other thing is this, like, what if they're trying to strategically, now I don't think this is the case, but this helps the theory. What if they're trying to strategically place games based on their ability to produce and such, such as the following?
    12:25
    Like, they know if it is a rumor Star Wars is the cornerstone in September, they know they're going to be building a lot of games. So they're like, we don't want to really cut the legs out from under a Star Wars. So instead of pulling a Ghostbusters out of the or a Lord of the Rings or something big, maybe, you know, we've been working on a couple of remasters. Maybe we do a lighter remastered that's very different. And, you know, maybe we maybe we get it out of the way then instead of cutting our Star Wars sales. You know what I mean? So, yes, but why make a remaster? Why launch a remaster at all if that's the concern? Like, why not just let the cornerstone corner? It'll still sell better than most every other manufacturer launched games that they do for an entire year. No, I just, I agree. I just, I don't see it as a, it doesn't make sense to me as a strategy. And when are you going to throw that into the schedule? Because let's say we talk about January, the rumor being a Pokemon. You got Star Wars in the summer and Pokemon in the winter. Like, what the hell? If the executives and the owners say you've got to still push out this many products a year, what the hell are you going to put in the middle without them being just bogged down? If I'm picking a remaster that needs to do well but not just sensational? I just don't see the point in pushing out a set number of products a year. I thought the goal was to keep the line busy. So the line's busy with two games or five. Who cares? It's busy. And to argue the other way, they can produce so many games that it's hard for them to get bogged down in back orders. We do still have a lot of back orders with them. All right, so that Q4, Stranger Things Premium is still in discussion, and then also in Q4 is King Kong Premium. December is going to come along and we're going to see the final run of Jaws 50th anniversary. A lot of people were discussing that online. Are they going to make more runs? Are they not going to make more runs? I'm here to confirm that they made some when announced in July. I think they announced formally right before July 4th. They built a hell of a lot of games and then pretty much everybody's dried up on those games. September is going to be another run and then the final run is going to be in December. And then they have zero plans to, they're not going to, it's an anniversary run, so it's only going to be run throughout that year of the anniversary, and then it's done. Similar to, similar to, not King Kong. What's the other one? Not Joel. The prior anniversary, Godzilla. Godzilla, thank you. Godzilla.
    15:04
    And then January, that cornerstone. So we've got some exciting stuff coming from the King of Pinball Stern. Did y'all 50th anniversary was released since we've been here? We told them, Dennis, we told them. I know. We told them, don't do black and white anymore. It's tired. It's like the lazy approach to let's just desaturate everything. And they finally were like, yes, Dennis is right. So instead, we'll just have lots of white space. Initially, upon release, there were some mixed reactions, I would say. Not to the glitter. People like the glitteriness. People love, I call them sparkles, just more manly. Sure. Glitter. I mean, okay.
    15:50
    Sparkles right up there in the machismo factors. Great point. Well, your eyes glitter, your eyes sparkle. I like sparkle. It's like, oh, look, ribbons. And you're like, no, around here we call them streamers. Streamers, damn it. It says tough like pink streamers.
    16:09
    A lot of mixed reactions. What? I'm trying to think. I'm going to put some pink streamers on the new Flippin' Out van. My poor father that drives it.
    16:20
    I hate this truck. He needs a little bell. That would be fantastic. But mixed reactions because people didn't know about the artwork and the red powder coat.
    16:35
    I liked it initially, but a lot of people were like, do I want it to look like, what's that pop? What's the ice pop that you eat in the summer? The bomb pop. Oh, the bomb pops. Okay. It's very patriotic. The red, white, and blue kind of thing. And bomb. So it's all very American. Boom. See? I just had it to that. Did you feel mixed on it? Did you like it? I thought the art looked fine to me. It was very reminiscent of the poster. My only problem I had with the art package was because of the angling of the sides of the cabinet, you had a lot of literal white space because there's like, well, what do we do? We just got to make it more white because that's the top of the poster. And it just looked lopsided to me because of that. But I thought the armor colors, I thought the back box, I thought the lock bar, all the other glitter sparkles. The brass-ish wire form? Yeah, the brass wire form. I thought everything, I liked everything except the sides of the cabinet. They're too white. Yeah. So that's why people were mixed. They're like, is it really, do we need that much of the poster everywhere?
    17:55
    And that red is awfully loud. Do we need sparkles? And then people joked and made fun of that poor commemorative Jaws 50th anniversary Transite decal. And you know what? I didn't hear about that. Oh, they thought that because whenever they revealed this game, they really made that a thing. Like it's even got the 50th anniversary commemorative decal. It's like this little baby decal on the edge or the corner of the Translite. Baby's first decal. And they were so proud of that. And people were like, really? You have to be that proud of that? I would have been, damn it. Yeah, I think it's cool.
    18:31
    And so overall, kind of people were mixed on it. Especially, I liked that it had a lot of features. This was a non-limited game. It's a premium model. But that's where I thought people were, they were not giving it enough credit. Because here's Stern, always hears from us hobbyists, we want more, we want more, we want more. They come out with a fully powder-coated premium game, premium model, that when have we seen a color-powder-coated premium game? Is it Star Trek Premium maybe?
    19:07
    Yes, I recall that one being, but... That is a long time ago. And that is a pretty awesome feature to put on a premium because for the same price, you can get the regular Jaws premium and not get that colored powder coat. So I thought that was a pretty cool feature. You don't even get sparkle-infused playfield on LEs of Stern. It's like the first time they're really kind of, they may have done something with one of the Elvira versions. But was it the, because people say they've never done this before. I think they may have done it on the black and white Elvira regardless. You don't get that usually on a premium model game. So I felt like we were really getting a lot because push comes to shove, you're going to be spending $9,700 on a premium. This one has more than this one. It just is, that's. Well, just, I guess just tell us about how great it's selling, Zach. Fucking fantastic. It's selling wonderfully. Now, initially, I didn't know because it was, it mimicked that of the limited or the first reactions. People were kind of hesitant, like, eh, isn't that great? It was selling good, selling good. And then all of a sudden, I think people started to realize, like, okay, I was going to buy a Jaws. And now that I have the, which, yeah, I'm definitely going to buy this one. And then sales just shot up since then. We sold out pretty quick of what we were allocated for the month of July. And then we have full allocation in September. So that's already we put in a big old order and we still have spots for September. That is we as the flipping out Pimball, but they're going fast, too. And I just think this is going to be we call this a non-limited product. But I do bring up this to the viewers and listeners out there. Is this limited, though? Is it not limited? I know it's not supposed to be limited. They can make as many as they would like to make. But at some point, if you're limiting it per time, it is limited. Anything is limited. That's the thing. We've had this conversation before. All pinball machines are limited because they're all eventually not produced by that logic.
    21:20
    But I think we can, I think it'd be safe to say that this will be limited, more limited, They're going to be sold for years. Sure. Well, the regular premium will probably have more sales than this by the time this ends anyway.
    21:38
    Because it came out first and people that wanted the L1 games committed right away. They've already shipped more regular premiums. So the non-anniversary has a leg up on sales regardless. Do you think there will be less 50th anniversary additions than there are Ellie's? LEs, I believe, are roughly 1,000, if I remember correctly. Maybe a little less, I think. No, I think this maybe would top the LE count. Maybe. I think so. Yeah, I think it has the possibility, too, yeah. Interesting. No, no. It's hard to say. I mean, you know, L-Win title, very popular, popular license. This is a heavy year, though, for a lot of stuff. If people want to spend money, you definitely don't need to buy Jaws now because you know you can get it later. So that's the fact that works against it. You'd be like, well, but I've got the time-limited Harry Potter or maybe I want to get Dune or what, you know, there's just a lot of competition for the dollar this year. Next year I'll be much weaker, so. Do you think there are going to be more Jaws 50th anniversaries made than Godzilla 70th? No. No? No.
    22:48
    Hmm. Do you think that Stern will limit them in the sense of we're only going to make so many regardless of what dealers want to order? No.
    23:01
    From my perspective, I can see them. I don't know if it's true because the order that I placed has been accepted, but I could see a certain number. If I wanted, they would say, unfortunately at this time your allocation is this.
    23:20
    And they would walk away. We'll talk about this later, especially in our exclusive Patreon episode, about the inner workings of the dealership network, units made, manufacturers, their decision making. But a lot of interesting choices that you think are not just common sense kind of things. But a lot of companies will say we're only making so many even if it's a non-limited product and we're moving forward. We have other stuff on the slate. Speaking of other things on the slate, Stern Pinball announcing Star Wars Home Edition launching at Costco. Already in there. So just like the Jurassic Park Home Pin that came to the Costcos around the world, it might just be this country. I don't know. But that was last year. They claimed it to be successful so much so that they're rolling out Star Wars Home Edition at Costco for this calendar year. Are you interested? No. Neither am I. Okay. George Gomez did say, I think it was George Gomez, that we'll see another one next year. We'll see another home next year. And he did talk about, because we'll discuss that, he visited the Loser Kid Pinball podcast. Really awesome interview. Great job over there, fellas. And George Gomez, just such a likable, likable guy. Just turned 70.
    24:36
    I did not realize that he was that old. Man, I'd be blessed to have his current brain any time in a lifespan, much less at 70, just fucking rock star. But he was talking about that over there, and he said the next home version is going to be a big IP that's very widespread, Is it spread relatable to non-Pinball people yet again? We're going to see the same thing.
    25:02
    And I was thinking about that, and I'm like, okay, so if you're trying to do broad appeal IPs, you're not going to tell us? He also said, I think he said that we're going to see another home edition next fall, but it's going to be a new theme. So not a previous theme. Because I was thinking, all right, we've got Jurassic Park's big, we have Star Wars. What else is like big, big? They might be able to go Godzilla. They were asking about Dungeons and Dragons. He was like, yeah, I think it could work. But you know what is a big, broad appeal IP that would be a new theme for them?
    25:40
    Pocket Monsters. Elwin's Pocket Monster. That didn't sound right. George Gomez visited the Loser Kids. See, now we get your reactions in video. For those of you who can't see or are wondering what we're talking about, just go over to YouTube, the pinball show YouTube, and you can watch it there. I think that's where it will be. I don't know.
    26:06
    We really planned this out so well. We're doing a lot. This is going great. My wife was like, why don't you guys do like, why don't you just record this live so that people can join in? And I'm like, that's a live stream. 8 a.m. I do. I do a live stream at 10 a.m. on YouTube on Saturdays, and there ain't a lot of people that like to get on that early.
    26:30
    There's fun. He did say, I didn't notice this, the home version of Star Wars does have a bigger screen.
    26:38
    Got a bigger screen on it. And then they were asking him about the differences within the market and sales and stuff between 2020 pandemic times versus 2025. Is it dead like everybody wants it to be or everybody, a lot of people report it to be. He discussed the balance of demand in 2020.
    27:01
    And, yeah, it was interesting because he's like, okay, well, there was a ton of demand in 2020. But you've got to keep in mind that at that time, though, getting parts was more difficult. So how much more successful was it in 2020 if there was a delay with parts? If we were trying to get things that we were competing with Ford that makes the F-150 with certain electrical components that we were using for our machines, they were getting prioritization for that. The ability to actually turn around the games with the parts delays versus the better ability to them to produce now new factory parts. Still always going to be parts delays and parts issues and management of all that. But he just wanted to remind everybody, like everybody says, you know, these times were so great. And they were. The desire was super high. But don neglect the fact that we can crank them out now where we were stymied a lot in 2020 as well Spike 3 everybody wants to know about Spike 3 And he said what Dennis, you and I have been saying. A lot of components we're already seeing. We've already been seeing in a couple of recent releases some of these Spike 3 components such as a quieter and better power supply, new menu system. These things will be in Spike 3 and there will be main features in Spike 3, but we're already seeing them. So it sounds like they're rolling out features here and there, and they're going to kind of roll into a softer roll-in instead of this big grand reveal of Spike 3.
    28:35
    They are going to have a much improved sound system in Spike 3. Sounds like it may come standard, this new expanded sound system on LE models. So what I got from the interview, did you listen? I don't know if you got a chance. No, I haven't heard it. Okay, so it sounded as if Mr. Gomez was saying it's going to come standard on the LE models of the new Spike 3 games, but that other models, the Pro and Premiums, are going to be eligible for that upgrade as well. So if you want to expand your audio, and it's kind of like down the LEs now, you get the Kenwood speaker system rather than the other paper woofer. They're all kind of cheap speakers, but they do sound a little bit better. There are some cabinet improvements we're going to be seeing because of the improved sound and display.
    29:28
    Here's the odd part. All right, so I'll get to this. So display, it's going to be a bigger display as well. We're going to see that. What else? Let's see. Bigger display. Iteration is going to have expression. Cabinet lighting is also going to be on the new Spike 3, and it's even better. So better integration of that. What else was he talked about the breadth of games that they used Spike 2 creating Spike 2 but the flexibility and reliability of the system using node boards. A lot of improvements from Spike 3 are going to be with technology processing power, product refreshment, etc.
    30:10
    Wireless headphone compatibility, improved lighting overall, improved sound, graphics. So I think it is going to be significant, but it's not going to change the game entirely.
    30:26
    Here's the odd part. He said Spike 3, the plan is it's coming next game. It's next Cornerstone game.
    30:35
    But the cabinet and all of those iterations, the bigger screen and such, bigger sounds, that's going to be on the following release.
    30:46
    That's what confuses me. So why, what happened there? What do you think happened that they can't roll out Spike 3 as truly the Spike 3 and they're going to have this one,
    31:02
    I'm sorry if I offend all the red-headed stepchildren out there, but the one red-headed stepchild, is that still, can I say that or is that a bad thing? Have I just picked off a lot of red-headed stepchildren? I don't know. Okay. They made too many of the current cabinet. Productions, you know, dying games, bad sales, too many cabinets. Like, we've just got to get through these cabinets. It's not unusual for when we've seen board changes over the history of Pinball for there to be what I think has historically been called transition games where it's got part of something. And, like, we've seen experiments with, like, I think there were Bad Girls games that were made by Gatley that had the next system on them, and they were actually sold. Like, they were trying to figure out, like, they had some of the, you know, the new boards. Just like we started, what was it, Metallica Remastered, where we saw the new power supply come up. So we've already been drip-fed part of it. So supply-wise or another option is something about the current configuration of, say, the cabinet is necessary for the game that's coming out.
    32:14
    Like some aspect of it wouldn't work as well with whatever the new design is. Like the screen being bigger gets in the way of some feature or something. Could be.
    32:24
    I don't know. I mean, those are just blind guesses. I get like the little upgrades that we can't see. But once you call it a Spike 3, visually, I would think you'd want it to look the same. But the systems are about the guts, not the cabinets. It's like with Sega. We had some of those that had the marquee Translight and others that weren't the marquee. And we had some that had the big DMD and others. This desire, I think the desire to say that Spike 3 is going to look different than Spike 2 stems solely from the fact that Spike 2 is so obvious because it had the LCD screens and Spike 1 didn't. That's it. This is not a normal thing to think that the games are going to look different because there's a new board set. And that's all. I don't even understand why people care, quite frankly, because no one, no one, people like you, Zach, are not articulating tangibly what meaningful improvement we as the player will see with Spike 3 versus Spike 2. Where are we getting like the whole movie in there? Like, what more do you want? I want 4K resolution. You can't even tell on those baby screens. I can see pixels. You can't even tell on little baby screens. It's a baby screen. A little laptop screen. Why do you have to be so damn pragmatic?
    33:50
    Sure. I just like the fancy. I like the baby screens. No, I can understand people being interested, but let's not. You're trying to ascribe all these visual differences. Here we are talking about lighting and stuff. JJP's been outdoing them on lighting since the get-go. Are they going to finally be better than JJP at lighting? That's the only meaningful comparison that is of interest to me. You're right. He talked about remastering games and talked about a Lyman Sheets rule set. They asked him, like, balancing. You're going to remaster a game. You're going to take a Lyman masterpiece. How difficult is it to find that balance of leaving the masterpiece it is, maybe adding stuff to you. Leave it alone. What do you do? And he said, quote, it didn't escape us, end quote. Quote, he talked about the sensitivities of Lyman's exceptional work and being very cognizant of the consumers wanting, you know, players wanting that work to still be on the remastered game, but walking the tightrope of kind of adding more to a game at the same time. He went on to say, quote, the man created a lot of masterpiece work, but, you know, you just can't ignore that when you sit down to, I'm going to make another one of them.
    35:08
    Now, a weird syntax there in the way I quoted it word for word. It sounds weird, but it made me think, did he just insinuate that the next remaster is going to be a liming game? You can't ignore that when you sit down to make another one of them.
    35:27
    I'm going to offer out a hypothetical possibility that I've wondered about. And ultimately, I'll just say up front that I think the sales will be there no matter what. But because we'd already been hearing about the Walking Dead rumors and we know Metallica remastered alignment code game. Very well remastered process. I would say that Stern believes, and I believe it at least, though, this is my bias coming through, that the remastered games are really, they're not broad audience games in the same sense. They're really thinking about collectors that already know the classic stuff that are interested in, okay, let's celebrate this. Let's enhance something that we already know about. And that's what they're leaning in on with that. Hmm. I'm wondering, though, if the strategy has been the remasters are going to be Lyman games because collectors love Lyman and whether that's going to eventually come across as almost exploitative if they keep doing it.
    36:35
    Oh, I was following you until the end. And that's where I'm like, because let's say it is Walking Dead this year and let's say next year it's Tron. And then let's say it's Spider-Man. Like, there's one thing unifying all of this, and that's taking Lyman and selling stuff off of what he built.
    36:56
    Now, I think the sales are there, ultimately. I think the sales are there. But it's that I – and maybe, you know, and we all have our own interpretations. It's just like with CGC, with the Cactus remake and this insistence of calling it Lyman's rule set when he didn't work on very much of it. We don't know. I believe he worked a lot on it.
    37:22
    Then it makes it feel extra strange that we had to wait years for it to get finished. It was mostly completed. Well, again, it's like a, what are we, yeah, but that was emphasized. I can see that already. You see, you see, right, and Stern didn't do that with Metallica, like they didn't stress it in the materials. That's why I think it's probably fine here, but I'm just, I'm just raising the, I'm raising the specter of, are all the, is the remaster strategy to sell Lyman stuff? Is that really what it is? If I'm Stern, my argument is, well, believe what you want, Dennis, and hobbyists, but we're just selling the best games. So if that happens to be a Lyman game, then so be it. But it's hard to argue. Well, based off of sales and demand, I would expect to see a Ghostbusters in this list.
    38:11
    I think they want to make money. They will make a Ghostbusters. They will. I've told numerous manufacturers, non-Stern manufacturers, you need to be going out and getting Ghostbusters. Going out and getting it. Because I think that Stern's probably remaking it. So the title owners or the IP holders of Ghostbusters are going to tell you they're already working with the company. But you need to be checking that out because that is a top five license in pinball history. Like that is one of the – Well, but in the terms of the remaster, let me ask you this. While going in the areas of sensitivity, do you think Stern may be reluctant to remaster Ghostbusters because it is a Trudeau game?
    38:55
    I don't think so. I mean, I'm sure there's some apprehension. How could there not be? But from a business perspective, if he was the only one painting a Picasso, okay. But he's one of a ton of people. And no, that's not a change. I mean, I think, again, I think it sells regardless. I just was curious. I think that you – I bring it up because you mentioned like that the phrasing of the quote that you provided regarding Lyman was awkward. And I think that's because there is a – I think George Strens is – I mean, they were friends with him. There's a sensitivity to this when you start talking about working on someone's legacy. Yeah. And it may be nothing, but it sounded like they were saying they're going to make another one of them. But again, that would align with the rumor. I still don't understand Walking – I mean, don't get me wrong. Like, Walking is one of my favorite of all the games we know of that he worked on. But the community demand has always been for Tron. When we're talking about a Lyman game to be remade, it's always been Tron. Yeah. Lord of the Rings is the number one Stern remake that's desired, followed by Tron, if you're going to go with a Lyman. And then I would say followed by probably Ghostbusters. I still think Ghostbusters sells better than a Tron remake. I'm just saying, like, we're going with, like, what else is still out there with Lyman? There's Spider-Man, but they did a remake of it already. There's Iron Man, which they vaulted, like, 12,000 times. ACDC, which I think would be pretty smart because that's what put Stern back on the map was when ACDC came out. And there's Walking Dead, which was his last cornerstone. I think a lot of people don't remember that while Lyman worked for Stern for years after Walking Dead, he only did like the boutique premium plus stuff after Walking Dead. It was his last cornerstone.
    40:47
    Accessories asked about accessories. George Gomez said uncanny X-Men accessories hopefully before the end of the year. They're always – I don't even want to repeat it here because I've heard this for three years. We're trying to tighten the gap between the release scan, the blah, blah, blah. Sern, you can keep that as a talking point, but you've talked about it so much and it hasn't occurred that I don't care to hear about it anymore. Well, in this case, I do want to say let's give them credit. The accessories will be out before the code is 1.0. Okay. Nicely done. Uncanny X-Men accessories hopefully before the end of the year. And the topper alone is not going to disappoint.
    41:27
    It's not going to disappoint. I've been hearing the same. I don't know. It might disappoint your checkbook. Kind of a trending game right now is all I'm saying.
    41:41
    Sorry. I don't need to hop on the bandwagon because I'm driving the freight train ever since release. But hop aboard everybody because it is that good.
    41:52
    King Kong accessories maybe even before that. Wouldn't that be fitting? I swear X-Men is the slowest game to get across the pen. I thought nothing could do worse than Bond, but I just, I don't know. The thing is with Bond you know it was licensor stuff and with Uncanny X-Men you know it's not Because they've already said how easy it is to work with the comic side of Marvel with Deadpool. So you know it's not the licensor. Brings up a good point, though. What George did talk about is whenever they're making these accessories, I think he used the term hangover. They did have a hangover after designing this game and everything, and then...
    42:39
    Wow. Yes, I did. It sounded scary. Do you have Gorgar? I have Harry Potter. Gorgar speaks back there with his LED, rainbow LED.
    42:52
    He talks about the hangover of like making the accessories after you've just done all the game kind of thing.
    43:00
    So with Uncanny X-Men, we know that there was a bit of a falling out maybe with the code falling out. It's a weird term. There's been a delay more so than most. And they're using different people to come and resurrect and fill this game up. And maybe the same with the accessories. The reason I bring it up is because the fellows over at Loser Kid asked about the personnel changes for Stern Pinball. Jack Danger changing positions, Tim Sexton leaving. And George said when it comes to Tim leaving, like he just wanted to go do something else. So that is what it is. But with Jack Danger, Jack Danger was the designer on Uncanny X-Men. He was in the process of designing another game to be released. It sounded as if that would be the January release. He was in Q. But we know that Jack Danger has now changed positions at Stern Pinball to be the, what they're calling, head of community.
    44:01
    George said he missed streaming and content creation, interacting with the public. Now, prior to this interview, I had heard from, I think it was from Jack and different interview stuff that he was just kind of out and another team was going to come in and finish up the game design. That was my understanding. So I thought he was done. It almost sounded as if I don't know the ideology of what came and why, but it sounded as if Jack Danger was missing his old position and maybe overwhelmed with the duties of designer. Maybe he didn't like the process of designing pinball machines after he had not even a taste. I mean, he had full course meals when it comes to Foo Fighters and arguably the Jurassic Park home. His third one, he finally got across the finish line. Everybody shit on him and the coding team on that game. Did they? The coding team's not him, though, right? I mean, like, ultimately. He was in charge of the team. Now, the management side, and I know Loser Kids in a prior episode that I did hear discussed the notion of maybe it was the team management pieces. A piece that Elwin has said is actually the hardest for him is the sheer amount of project management work that goes into this. So he had that. I mean, and sure. He did crap on the plunge don't work. There's a flipper hop. And then Stern had to come back and make these kids. I like the tone. Like, those aren't actual legitimate complaints.
    45:41
    The Demi Gorgon doesn't eat the ball. No, that's fine. They don't need to eat the ball. Results vary.
    45:49
    Sure, just like the Demi Gorgons. Some of them I heard ate the ball. None of the early ones I played did, but I heard purportedly it was possible with a perfect setup. I am confident and confident enough to say that based on all of the Uncanny X-Men different variations I've seen, And I think that overall the complaints with Plunge and Flip-R-Hop and all that were exaggerated.
    46:16
    If that makes me get kicked back, so be it. That's just honestly how I feel. And I've played over 20 different versions of them. So at least my pool of data is larger than most. Sure, it is. I think for me, I'm not hung up. I haven't played an X-Men where I had a plunge problem or anything, for example.
    46:41
    I guess I'm – and every person is different, so I don't want to – this probably means nothing. But it's interesting to me, though, that it wouldn't be enough to do what Pat Lawler and Steve Ritchie have done, which is – like I think the way I've always interpreted from hearing them have analyzed their own successes, How good do my games sell? And Jax games sold well. So that's where I'm like, and I talked about this on a Collected Gamers podcast last week. I'm just like, I don't like Jax had a lot of success with his two cornerstones. They both sold very, very well, regardless of the after feedback. And so I, from Stern's perspective, I don't understand why they, why they would, again, it sounds like everything I've heard is this was all Jax's idea, Which totally makes sense to me because I'm like, if I was Stern corporate, I'd be like, I do not want you to not be a designer. The only one who's outselling you is Elwin. But we don't, it could, that's the problem. We don't know if it, was it Stern pushing him out? Was it, because there's more factors that go into that than just sales numbers. Like, there's a lot of factors in. I guess, but I mean, they put up with Richie, for example, for years, and, you know, everyone who was like on his software design team would just like, I mean, Dwight made no secret, like at the end of a project with Steve, they aren't talking anymore. Like they're not friends anymore. It's because Steve is difficult. In fact, Tim Sexton was supposedly the only one I'd ever really heard that regularly as a programmer, like could get along with him well enough to be willing to work multiple projects in a row with him. But, again, he was able to, regardless of how his project management style was, Steve lasted for years and years and years.
    48:35
    You're right. Sales-wise, from a business perspective, from a company standpoint, sold games. I was arguing on our, was it Happy Hour Hangout? Yeah, I think so. This guy got two subpar themes and sold the hell out of the games. X-Men's not a bad theme. Foo Fighters, I agree. That's a weak theme. X-Men's not a bad theme. The uncanny X-Men. No one cares about the word before it. They just care X-Men.
    49:07
    I think it hurts the branding putting that word in there. I mean, I guess, but it's like getting hung up on when they did the remake of Spider-Man and they did like the anorexic Spider-Man. Like, I don't remember the name of that art style one, but, you know, they went with a very specific style of Spider-Man that a lot of people weren't really familiar with. But the key thing was it was comic book experiment. That was that it was. I don't think it was as strong because it's been done before to to a large degree. It's not based on films. Sure. I just don't think it was a strong theme. So with what he did on the first two, I was so excited to see. And I when talking with executives at Stern, I'll I'll be happy to say this. Jack and I have had our differences in the past. I think that's a people that know publicly they know that, you know, there are certain things that have happened in the past for better or worse. And it's not just me, groups of people. And what I'm trying to say here, listener, is that we've had our differences of opinion very strongly towards one another. And I told an executive that they were just asking my opinion on things. And I told him that. I said, you gave that guy two themes that he still found a way to do sales. This was probably a couple months ago. And I guess in retrospect, it's funny now thinking what that guy probably thought when I told him, like, one of your gems is Jack Danger. Like I selfishly want him to create games moving forward as a top three designer in our industry. I was all in on Jack Danger as a designer because the two design games that he has, Uncanny X-Men and Foo Fighters, I'll leave Jurassic Park is what it is, Home Edition, whatever. But those two games I think are two of the greatest design Pinball machines of all time. And I'll stand by that. I have more fun playing on those. So selfishly, and from a business perspective too, sold a lot of games. So if it is him wanting to step away, that sucks. That sucks bad because it hurts my pocketbook and it hurts my collection. And that's coming from a guy that, like I said, has a history. We're good now.
    51:31
    So I think that that is the most unbiased. Well, maybe it's still biased because I'm still selling games. Damn it, I can't get out of it. I was wanting to prove a point of... No, you're too biased. I highly, I value his game, so I was freaking bummed hearing that. But then George Gomez in this interview, Dennis, says, quote, he's going to finish his game. I'm like, what? Wait, that contradicts what? I mean, it makes sense that he'll be involved in some capacity, but who knows how far along it is. They may be mostly already done, and the cleanup crew wasn't going to really do much. So, you know, whatever. It sounds like a team approach. It always is, though. It always is. Sometimes heavier than others.
    52:15
    But it always is. Where was I going with all of that? You were going to tell us about George's biggest accomplishment in his entire career.
    52:24
    Oh, yeah, they asked him that. What a question. How do you answer that? He said probably inventing Insider Connection. I wanted him to just say Corvette. Hey, I love it.
    52:36
    He's like, it's all been downhill since Corvette. The Tron cabinet, arcade cabinet. Yeah, my time at Midway. Like, hire me back Midway. I'll make slot machines, I don't care. Inventing Insider Connected, he believes probably is most impactful for people, but as a designer, maybe that's not his, like, favored or most rewarding, meaningful accomplishment. But he thinks his biggest impact will end up being his creation of Insider Connected Platform.
    53:08
    And I could see the argument. Like I said before, he turned 70 on June 1st. Is he going to retire? Is he not? What a legacy he has created thus far in Pinball and throughout our lifetime. I don't think we'll see another like it. So he is a goat.
    53:30
    Do you think his retirement's imminent? Like, when Spike Lee's launched, he's going to step down? Anytime somebody goes up to the age of 70 and they're still doing as much as he's doing, I have a hard time believing they're ever going to step away from it before they die. Because at this point, he could have walked away. Sure, but Gary Stern worked well past 70 and has stepped back finally. He's still working. He will be working. Yeah, but not near – he stepped – and again, like George could retire and be a contractor or consultant or go part-time. Who was it that did that? I think Wayne Nions when he was lead designer at Gottlieb after he went and started consulting with Gottlieb and did a few years like that once he was sort of like, yeah, I'm at retirement point, but I still want to kind of work. I know some people that that's the route they've gone where they've gotten to that 65, 70-year age range. And I worked with one for about a decade where I think he got to 62, retired, and then went on to 72 working like one day a week, which is just like – and then just only now retired a couple years ago, like truly, truly retired. That kind of work, though, continuing the work that you love will keep you alive. I do believe that. Yeah, that's where I can see where he doesn't want to be totally devoid from doing stuff that's – I mean, he's an engineer. Here is he not? Like wanting to continue to use that part of his mind to make sense to me. But only being one foot in or one day in a week, also the same type of personalities that become consumed and so passionate with things, it'd be hard just to put one foot in without diving all the way back in again and just doing it until you're dead. I don't know. I couldn't imagine just doing it one day. I mean, if they're letting Jack Danger invent like head of community and do that, I could see George saying, you know what, I'm done running everything. That's a, you know, it's a younger man's game. I want a deal where every 24 months I can have a game come out and I just design on the side.
    55:34
    Gets to use his engineering brain, doesn't have the same level of responsibility, and then he gets to go fish. I don't know if he likes to fish, but George feels like a fisher to me, so. Don't you think he's a better COO or leader than he is designer? Um I say yes just given that it seems like he does have really strong leadership qualities uh and we know of other people who are really good designers designers where we don know if they have good leadership qualities or not Like Keith seems to have a well machine with his team and he has a really consistent team I don't know if Keith is a great leader or not. Like I have no sense of it. He's clearly a great designer. His teams seem very happy. So I'm going to venture to say he's probably naturally pretty good. He's at the very least a competent leader. And you don't have to be the best. You just have to be good. Mm-hmm.
    56:25
    But for how much they put on those designers, more than most people probably realize, I think that only works when you have chief creative officers such as George Gomez. Here's what I think. From Stern's perspective, they would not want George to leave, just like they shouldn't want Jack to not be a designer. It's like it doesn't there's maybe there's someone who's been protezied, but that is that's some big that's some big shoes to fill. Well, thanks. So that actually I've got the ego. So you find a person like me. It's like anybody's going to do it. I can do it. Right. There's people out there. Yeah, but they would never hire you. No, I'm not talking about me in general. I'm talking about my personality type. If I'm doing something, I have full confidence that I'll do it as good, if not better than anybody. Oh, I see what you're saying. And now what I said sounds really mean. No, no. It's a fact that they'll never. I'll help you out, Dennis. You'll never be hired there. I'll help you out. If I was given that position within one year, I could do exceptional. How about that? See, so I helped you look better now because I look like a fool saying that I could do that. It would be interesting to sort of see them under the Zachmini business strategy approach. They would change a number of things up. They would succeed. That's what I'd be confident of. But you'd have to deal with the internal strife as they resisted you from within.
    57:50
    Either you want to make money or you don't. Follow me or don't. Interesting enough, if we're talking about Insider Connected, all tongue-in-cheek there, people, for the most part. I'm trying to entertain, but I am confident. They talked about Insider Connected, as we were talking about. A really interesting question they posed, and I'm sorry we're stuck on this, but this is really good content. And again, nicely done to loser kids for interviews. And maybe even more so to George Gomes for his continued transparency to the hobby. But they said, well, Insider Connected API or Application Programming Interface, are we ever going to see the API Insider Connected ever used by a third party?
    58:31
    Now, I figured you would find that an interesting question, Dennis. I'm surprised they asked, only because I would have assumed the answer would always be no. It was a bold question, a very bold question. And their response, I think, and I love them, I think their response indicated why they were brave enough to even ask in the first place. But George didn't turn them down. I like that he turned it back on them and said, okay, that's a tough question, but tell me, you know, answer the question if you're in a position like, what do you think it could be used for if you're going to ask that? Like now, again, I love them, but I think they totally blew the assignment there. And they pitched Josh and Scott. I love them. They pitched like, well, it's something about making loser kid stuff. And then they mentioned Pinquest. And I'm like, no, what are you doing? Oh, you were right there. You had the opportunity and you blew it. And, yeah, so after that, if I was George, I'd be like, so that's the reason it would be a no.
    59:42
    So he said it's not a no? He said it's not a no? Well, I think he was just being polite. Here's the thing. Like, if Stern was doing what Multimorphic did and had third-party people making games on the platform, there could be a value there to be able to build achievements and stuff. But short of selling Insider Connected kits to other manufacturers so that, hey, JJP, would you like to have Insider Connected to replace your whatever that – what was the thing they were using that before? There was that score sharing. Scorebit. Scorebit, yeah. Basically, as a competitor to Scorebit and be like, all right, we're going to license this out and let people do it. But it's like that's not their model. They don't sell accessories to other competitors, and they don't let third-party entities design games in a way where it wouldn't already have a coder at CERN putting the stuff in for Connected. Like, you know, how Dennis Nordman did the development for Elvira House of Horrors, but CERN's programmers are who built all the achievements and stuff in Insider Connect. There's just nothing. What I think you would more likely see is maybe people could reach out to CERN. And this might be the Zach Manny CEO challenge would be like, you know what, instead of promoting the next game, why can't there just be regular ads for like Pepsi showing on this stuff? Okay. I don't mind that. You ever seen the NBA game now? They got patches all over them like a different car. Yeah, branding, you know, offering sponsorship and licensing and advertising, really advertising, I feel, options there. But, again, it's not so much opening it up through API. That's really just using it as a platform in a broader way other than, hey, you know what, let's try and sell a $7,000 game to someone with this screen because I bet you they've made all of zero sales based off of doing that. It's just something to keep you to be, you know, entertaining while the game's in game over mode. As George Gomez's successor, I'll say this.
    61:52
    I would be interested. I think that there's some I think that this could work. I think that financially it would make a lot of sense to sell this platform to other to quote unquote competitors. I think that if I'm Spooky Pinball and I know if I'm Spooky Pinball, I'm years from this. I'm years from, if ever, anything like an insider connector, but I would love to use this in my products. So if I'm Spooky Pinball, I'm reaching out to Stern and saying, hey, what does that look like? What does that number look like per unit for us to, you know, negotiations would be that we don't have to call it Stern Insider Connected, but we'll gladly say equipped with Insider Connected and we'll run off the same API, the same platform, and we'll pay you royalties for every single unit that we place in a game and or accessory that we sell. There's a number there. I think there's a number there that makes sense for Spooky, and I think there's a number there that makes sense for Stern Pinball. I don't know what number it is, but that would be fun to sit down and negotiate. But I think that makes sense for both parties there and to the consumers that will be purchasing the products they go in.
    63:14
    I can see it. Especially if I'm Stern Pinball, I want to hit while the iron's hot because nobody's even close to second, third, or fourth place when it comes to this stuff. And we already see competitors trying to trickle in. And what they're going to do is you're going to see competitors try to trickle in and do everything non-stern. They've tried it with what we just talked about, scorebit thing. They're so far from it, and using it within different operating systems would be a bitch. But strike while the iron's hot. Do it now to lock in those and give those manufacturers no other reason. Now, a lot of those manufacturers are hard-headed, and they would never do that. But I think there's a number there.
    63:55
    Okay. I did see a Goldfinger mirrored back glass on George Gomez's desk, I'm just saying. I'm sure everybody else saw that. Yeah, I'm sure they entertained a lot of options when the LEs were being developed.
    64:07
    Future premium? 70th anniversary. Black and white with a Goldfinger transplant. I love gold. Okay, what else? I think that's about it with the George Gomez interview. Wonderful. Go listen to it. But Stern continues to bring that summer heat to us with more big code updates. New code updates since we've talked last. Metallica Remastered now at version 1.02. Star Wars version 1.29. Jaws 1.01. That's a hefty one there. The Uncanny X-Men, another big one. V 0.92. So much more and people are already raving. John Wick V 0.96. Getting close and that one's feeling much more secure with people. People like Flippin' Out Pinball has some gameplay videos I wanted to remind viewers of. The Jaws 50th, Jaws 50th anniversary with lead programmer Rick Nagel visited Joel and Jared over at Flippin' Out Pinball. That was highly entertaining. And of course we do giveaways and they always go overseas and it pisses me off and they get a kick out of it. The thing is just so cute and funny. I do not. You know how much it costs to ship cheap foam? I call cheap foam the player mat, fatigue mat. To Australia? Nope. Over $100.
    65:26
    I can't sell to people in Australia. So why are they eligible for giveaways? I don't know. I didn't make those rules.
    65:36
    I was thinking about Jack Danger's head of community. Do you think there's going to be an assistant to the head of the community?
    65:45
    No, I do not. What coder is going to be like, I'm done coding. I'm going to be the assistant to the head of the community. I mean, who's the one left that has streaming experience there? That would be Ray Day. Don't you do it, Ray Day.
    65:59
    We need you. Okay, and oh yeah, another gameplay video over at Flippin' Out Pinball YouTube. Go check it out. With Uncanny X-Men with the rules developer, Mike Finnicorn. Hmm. Yeah. Jersey Jack Pinball on the news. Potter continues to amaze, to dazzle, to wonder. Especially the dragon art.
    66:21
    Mmm, see here, the three-eyed dragon. It's a true abomination. What can your third eye do? We do have a new Straight Down the Middle review of Jersey Jack Pinball's Harry Potter. Go check that out. And they continue to build them. I'm going to give them credit. Jersey Jack Pinball. Nobody's complaining about the pace of what they're producing. They're producing at a really decent pace. A lot of games leaving the factory and no giant hiccups in production lately.
    66:56
    Nicely done. On the other hand, them communicating production timelines and allocations to their sales network, a bit of a frustrating place there for not only their sales network, But the consumer enthusiast community. So that's their only hang up and a big hang up to me. It is. Do you know what I mean by that, Dennis? No. If people ordered a game and they message their dealer and say, hey, when am I going to get my game? I don't know why they sound like that. Because they're excited and their voice went up because of it. And they say, hey, when am I going to get my game? What should my answer be?
    67:48
    Two weeks. Got me a good spit take there. Whoa. I was like, listen. I should have an answer. Now, some would argue, well, right when a game comes out, they don't know how many orders they have, so it's hard to project and all that stuff. This game's been out.
    68:12
    Yeah, but only for a little while. Months. Yes, it's a few months. I believe that consumers should be able to have some type of rough estimate at this point in time when their $15,000 pinball machine will arrive, even if it's a window. Even if it's a window. I think they deserve that. I think the sales network who have to answer that question 10 to 20 times a day, I think they deserve that as well. I think that without answers to rudimentary production questions and distribution questions as such, that all but one that I think of, manufacturer in the industry, does well, tell you when their game's coming or an estimate. Without that, it creates a lot of frustration.
    69:05
    And with frustration, it kills your brand. Not only Jersi Jack Pinball, but those associated with Jersi Jack Pinball, which is my company.
    69:15
    So when a business partner does not communicate adequately, it hurts everybody. And it's very inefficient.
    69:25
    We'll talk about this again. And like I said, we had a really fun, special, dedicated subscriber episode this month.
    69:34
    This month. And it talks about some of the – I'm trying to become a more efficient business owner, running and managing a business. I like to be efficient. I like to be transparent and honest with people. And I like for people to know and have expectations of what they're getting when they go, when they give money to another entity in this industry. I don't think it's too much to ask.
    70:02
    If you were to call a dealer right now, for the most part, and you said, if I order a Harry Potter today, when would it come? If that dealer has an answer for you, they are lying because they have no clue, to my knowledge, based on the data that I have. They have no clue.
    70:23
    Dennis, ask me, if you were to ask me, okay, that's fine, but what's Jersey Jack making next? Yeah, what is me making next? I think they're making collector's edition. Or was it the collector's edition? Yeah. No, I meant the next game. Oh, no. I'm talking about, like, what are they making right now? I think they're making Harry Potter Collector Edition. I think it's for the 220, the overseas. I think, just again, nothing official, but through the grapevine, that second half of August is going to be CEs. Have they officially told me, as one of their larger business partners, that they haven't? But if you said, okay, let's say that we're guessing that they're making CEs.
    71:06
    Do you know when I'm going to get mine? I don't know. Surely they've told you how many you're going to get from this batch. No. No clue.
    71:15
    Are you sure you're one of their larger dealers? Maybe I'm not. I don't know. Well, when are they making the arcade additions next? I don't know. When are they making the Wizards? I don't know. Well, could you, based on what you do know, can you just guess amount? I don't know if they're giving me one Wizard Edition and I don't know when. It could be a month. It could be a year. Whenever it does come a month or a year, they could give me one. They could give me 40. I have no clue.
    71:41
    So when somebody asked and I say, well, Dennis, your game's going to come any time between one week and 16 months.
    71:50
    Would that be true? That's pretty broad. Yeah, it'd piss you off. My point being is that's the frustration right now surrounding Harry Potter is just the lack of any type of just rough estimated schedule of anything.
    72:05
    And I'll leave that for the Patreon. So hopefully we get some updates so that because Spooky does a good job of that. They pretty much build an order. So you kind of know, like for example, right now they're shipping Evil Deads around number 340. There you go. All dealers know based on however many they order what numbers they have. So I know the list of, let's say, hypothetically I had 20 Evil Deads on order. I know all 20 different numbers so that I can kind of gauge when abouts customers would get them so I can ask for money and everything else. Stern, they produce so quickly that they're able to give really accurate estimates. Hey, we're building Jaws 50th in September. You have this many total on order. This many are going to come in September, and the remainder will come in December. Very nice. Dune, same thing. You have this many on order. Right now, based on the cadence of our production, you're going to be receiving this many a month. Right now, we're looking at the first week of every month is when your allocation will come. And they've hit that every single time throughout Labyrinth and throughout Dune so I can measure. When it comes to Harry Potter, they say, Zach, you've got a ton ordered, but then that is it. And then you hear crazy. It's tough. Spooky Pinball, the one newsworthy thing here, Evil Dead is still just freaking killing it. The damn things are selling for so much more than MSRP even on the secondary market used. Next game likely going to be a November release. I'm guessing.
    73:46
    And what I'm calling a list frenzy happened a couple of weeks ago. Did you hear about this controversy? I did not. So Pinball Star, one of their large dealers, they claim largest dealer. I'll say a large dealer. Pinball Star, very positive to the community in all the respects. He's a good dealer. He posted up, hey, we're now taking a list for their next game, Spooky Pinball's next game. So if you want a guaranteed game, get on the list.
    74:18
    That works. Because if you're a consumer, you see that and you're like, shit, I can get a guaranteed game if I act now. There are problems with that. What's the problem? I don't think there's necessarily any inherent problem. Because you all have like interested lists already and stuff. Interested list. Interested list frenzy. I'm now interested in Spooky Game No. 8 or whatever it is. That's why I don't think there's inherently a problem. Yeah. But when you're saying that you can put in the pre-order, even if you're not taking money, I don't think there's a problem. Oh, pre-order. Okay. The problem is that, in my opinion, if I'm Spooky Pinball, I'm being Spooky Pinball, and I sell direct. So if my competitors or my dealers, see that's the problem when you have this system where you're competing with your own sales force, they sell direct. So if all of these dealers are then publicly saying we're taking pre-orders, this was the Harry Potter thing. Remember Jack was like, yeah, order now, order now. Dealers can take money now. But let's say all these dealers start taking all these orders. Then if you're Spooky Pinball, you can't take orders now. You can't take pre-orders now. You can't list to be on the interested list. So you get behind all of your dealers on sales. So when this game comes out, you could have capitalized on a lot more sales, but dealers have sucked them all up. So I say it's potentially a problem when us dealers do this because it puts the manufacturer who is also a direct seller in a bit of a, you know. Okay, but do distributors like that manufacturer's direct sell? Because it just seems to take money off the table for the distribution network. We hate it. So this is a way to stick it to Spooky. Sorry, bug. What surprised me is Spooky is just so accepting and like, well, they shared Pinball Stars thing like, hey, get on Joe's list.
    76:25
    So now you need a list and that hints to Frenzy. Yes, hence the Frenzy. Are you Frenzing out? So, yeah, a lot of people on the list, but still sponsored. It also works if you have an allocation, you know about how many you can get. So you can communicate that with. See, it's all about communication. That's spooky pinball. People are frothing for this next release because this is the whole Rob Zombie thing again. The one was so scarce and everybody was able to oversell it for so much more that they jump in blindly to whatever's coming next, especially if the rumor is true.
    77:08
    So many people are predicting this will be an instant sellout. Okay. What do you think? You know, what are we going to say instant? Day one?
    77:25
    Then no, I don't think so. I don't. There are too many instances. Rob Zombie, you know, perfectly acceptable. But that happened. Spooky did that for a while because they had those. They were they've always done this L.E. approach where this is this raw, flat, limited count to the total number of games. And that works for them. But the speculation period, we saw that early on with not just Rob Zombie. The same thing, I think, happened with Alice Cooper. But you saw what happened with Halloween and stuff where people scooped all these up and then the values fell further than the percentages on a lot of other competing games. And that's, other than Evil Dead, which as you've noted is selling for more than MSRP right now, I don't think that's true for pretty much any other game of theirs. So it doesn't make sense, and I don't think the market will really behave that way overall for the next title. Now once the theme is known, that could, that's why I have to hedge. So, like, if the theme is Goonies or Beetlejuice, for example, then I could see it actually selling out day one, not because of the list and stuff, just the sheer demand for the theme. And the theme is Motorhead. They don't sell any.
    78:41
    They sell something. I'm just being mean. I know. You're entertaining. Yeah, I was talking to Spooky.
    78:49
    I talk to them often. And I have to be able to watch what I say because of what I know. But I always like under-promising and what was that? Under-promise and over-deliver? Thank you. That's what I like to do and a lot of what I do. So I told them, I know what you got. You know what you got.
    79:14
    But curb your expectations a little bit and be happy if it does happen. And because I reminded them that what games sell out on day one? They don't. They just don't. Stern games don't. Jersey Jack games don't. Like, one could argue that, okay, Chicago Gaming Company is Merlin edition. But that's a different, like. I don't even think it did. Evil Dead didn't sell out day one. I remember they were really happy at TPF. It was sold out. Like, at the start of TPF, they're like, we've already sold them all out. And they were really, really happy. And they sold out, which is a good reason to be happy. But no, it's not. It's not normal.
    79:51
    And again, I don't know how many of whatever the next game is going to be. They were really smart, I thought, with Evil Dead. They reduced the number further down than what they did with Looney Tunes in Texas.
    80:03
    Knowing what I know about their next game, I will say that it would not surprise me at all if it sold out day one. It wouldn't surprise me. No, not at all. It wouldn't surprise me. But do I think they will? I just think that's a tough thing to do. I would confidently say it's going to sell out way before Evil Dead did. Way before Evil Dead did. But day one, I would get scared if something sold out day one. Because then as a business I'm like, uh-oh, maybe I fucked up how I did that. Right, you could have made more. Yeah, something. Yeah.
    80:41
    All right. Barrels of Fun, Pimball. Well, continue to ship Dune, continue to receive that slow and steady sales with enormous help from recent code updates.
    80:52
    They've dumped a lot in this game. This is like this dark horse that keeps on creeping back. Usually it's that first week of sales and then we see nothing. But this one is like a nice little consistent seller, but nothing huge as a seller. Just nice and consistent. And the game is really showing well. It's around 90% complete now code-wise. It's got all six main modes, six harvester modes, two multi-ball modes, two mini wizard modes, the pain box save, five skill shots. It's got the call-outs now, tons of footage from the films, more immersive than a lot of pinball machines ever made. It's doing everything it's supposed to be doing and more. They plan on 100% of the rules being complete by the end of September, including additional wizard modes, the main wizard modes.
    81:45
    I think this will be a dark horse that people will love and respect for years to come. But the way they launched it with what they were launching, how they launched it, yeah, they stubbed their toe. Stubbed their toe on that one. And maybe they had to. Maybe they stubbed their toe in order to avoid getting hit by a train. But needless to say, they stumbled out of the gate, which has affected sales significantly. But I still think it's going to be overall a good-selling game because what, are they limiting them to 1,000, I think? 1,000.
    82:23
    Do they sell all 1,000? Maybe eventually. My advice to them would be once your next game's ready, make a surplus of them and just cut them off. Just cut them off and the secondary sales value will hold strong, which will then bleed into future products that you make. Because it's going to be a left game. Speaking of Dune, there's a flipping out pinball tutorial that Joel did. Thank you, Joel, for that. Go to YouTube and check that out.
    82:58
    We've got to give the people that pay something special to us. How do they pay us? Patreon.com slash the pinball show. I thought you were just going to give them your wire information. Yeah, let me put out the routing number and my account number onto this YouTube channel. I think it would be smart as well as your address. We want to come visit you. Yeah, patreon.com slash the pinball show. If you want to become a subscriber, a member, an official member of the pinball show, it helps us out a lot and we're going to give you the goods too. This week is going to be special. I'm going to call our special episode content The Tales of a Pinball Distributor. We've done this before, another iteration of it. Over the last month a lot of why I couldn record is because there a lot going on in the Flippin Out Pinball company and a lot that I like to share and just a lot of work and I think you guys would be very interested to hear the behind the scenes of how this works and all that a person all that a dealer does And a very niche kind of thing, I'm aware, but also one that our company just functions a little bit different. So we have things that we're doing that might differ significantly from other retailers. I think it's going to be a good time. I'll talk to you about what stresses me on a day-to-day basis. And maybe some of these things, honestly, like it surprises people to hear what a designer does. I think it would surprise even those that work in the industry. It would surprise them, the depths of what goes into selling pinball machines.
    84:44
    So please join us there. We're going to talk about used games. We're going to talk new games. We'll talk about shipping. We'll talk about growing a business. We'll discuss communications with customers as well as with manufacturers. We'll talk about adding to a product line, preparing an organization it takes to run a company such as this, media, marketing, advertising, and more.
    85:08
    Hop in. Let's go for a ride. We're going to thank some people. Who do you want to thank first? Maybe Rodney? Yeah, I probably should start with Rodney. Thanks, Rodney. Thank you. And now we can blow in kisses, too.
    85:23
    If you guys haven't watched it on video, do that. And this might be edited out because the video doesn't work, but who knows. But I think it'll work. Yeah, but I don't think most of these folks are going to switch over to watching video. The whole value to podcasting is to be able to listen to it while doing other stuff, like driving. YouTube Premium.
    85:41
    I mean, I don't even think our channels monetize the force. Well, YouTube may force ads on people when the channels are tiny. I think we do have a YouTube. Do we? I don't know. Anyway, you have to figure that out. I don't know. I'll figure it out. That's not Dennis' stuff. That's Zach's stuff.
    85:58
    There's a bobcat, and we're thankful for him. Not as much about the wife. Fend for yourself. Oh, shut the fuck up! Rob, thank you. Thank you for your continued support. I love you. You're our panther.
    86:12
    Snarl. Frank! Hey, Frank. Thank you. Truly thank you, Falcon, for the continued support. Cook. Charlie! You can always ring my bell, my friend. Thank you so much.
    86:31
    Clinkly clinks off to the, uh, Ding dong and thank you. William, the dude, thank you, brother. Oh, Hulk Hogan died, Dennis. Yes, I saw that.
    86:45
    Makes me sad. And then there's all kinds of political stuff. I was like, oh, I just want to celebrate Hulk Hogan, the character, please. Just let me have him. I don't care. Like, as a person, whatever. But rest in peace, Hulk Hogan.
    87:00
    Rest in peace. But William, you're alive. You're well. You're sexy. Youthful. Spry. Oh, nice moment.
    87:10
    William's, you would think William wasn't going to run out of room. Even William's running out of some room. He's got some games coming in. Time for an addition.
    87:22
    An addition to the addition? Just look. Just keep expanding. All it takes is land. Land ho. We have a new member of the Dreaming Club. We do. A person that I was, I mean, I've been waiting for this person to join. They were a Nordman level member for quite some time and they felt special. They felt like it's a new day and that they're coming to welcome us. Their name is Adam. Adam, welcome to the Screaming Goat Club. Hell yeah! We work on getting all the stuff and the shirts. But now he has direct access to us asking all the juicy behind-the-scenes questions. He can do that and all the other fun stuff that goes with it. But he also gets a nickname, a tough one. This one was a tough one because he is very normal. He can't really, and he's good looking, so there's nothing that you can like. It's not like he's got big ears or anything. There's nothing that we can make fun of.
    88:27
    He has a normal job that I know of, kind of private, so I don't know. But we do know one thing about him. And if he doesn't want us to let people know them, then we'll see him unsubscribe next month. But we know that Adam has recently become a father.
    88:47
    Yeah. And you know how much I love the babies, Dennis. I love them babies. You better not steal this baby. I want a baby.
    88:56
    On our happy hour hangout, he showed the baby. And I wanted that baby so bad. Yes, you did. I wanted to nestle with that baby, and I wanted to poke his little nose, and I want to bite it. I want to bite the baby.
    89:14
    Oh, my God. Just get us through this. It smells so good. I just... Trying to eat the babies. This Austin Powers nonsense. Faja.
    89:30
    Faja. Adam is now known as Papa. Adam is Papa. We could go so many ways with this, Dennis. Oh, the Pinnberg thing and the Papa. He's our Faja. He's everything to us and he'll forever be Big Papa over here.
    89:52
    So welcome Papa. You are like Papa! Oh, man. We're going to have fun with that one. The Papa. Papa Bear. He is the Papa Bear.
    90:03
    I bet he hasn't slept in three months. Maybe that's why he signed up. Because he was delusional. Oh, it was a mistake? Yeah. Yeah, he just was like, I don't care what is life anymore. I'll just sign up. I'll join a Patreon. Oh, my God. Again. For those of you who sign up to patreon.com slash the pinball show, you'll have access to our private-ish discord where we discuss things. And if they're super juicy, somebody's going to screenshot them and share them to call it shit. But, hey, that's part of the fun of it, isn't it? Man, I've been, like, going into other discords. I never go into discords just because I don't care enough. But I have lately. Whoa. There's some juicy discords out there. Some juicy, juicy discourse. We've got a happy hour hangout for those. Part of the Nordman and Screaming Goat Club levels. Come hang out. We do it once a month. We'll have it later on here in August.
    91:07
    And we can't go anywhere without giving the people the juice of this show. The low-rent version. No production. I know we're doing video, but this is no production. This is a podcast. This is what we do. This is Pinball Market Trends. It's a Bobcat Techno-Lord!
    91:30
    Turning up this week is everything Zach Stelling, starting with Jaws 50th anniversary. Basha! Turning up this week is Jaws 50th anniversary. I almost don't like this.
    91:43
    Oh, is that Randy Newman there? Oh, my God. The Plin. You've got a trend in me. Yeah. I wanted the Hulkster man. Hulk Hogan. Man, I loved Hulk. The character, people. I don't want letters. Turning up this week is Jaws 50th anniversary. It's a seller. It's a grower and a shower. It's a big. Look at that bomb pop.
    92:13
    That's a healthy one there. No! I love when people come out and they want to shoot on something and then it's super successful. It's almost like that Kiss Topper I just sold you. Man, people came with big rocks and they were going to try to throw it in. You son of a bitch, you're trying to sell that Kiss Topper for how much? You know how much it sold for, Dennis? Nope. They made, you know how many emojis, laugh emojis, you're crazy. I remember it was $300. Like yelling at clouds at me. I had a price for $3,500. $100. I know, that's the, yeah, people thought I was crazy. It sold. It sold. It sold. It sold.
    92:56
    So turning up maybe as a kiss topper, I don't know. Jaws 50th anniversary is turning up because this is going to be the one. If you're going to buy Jaws, people are buying this one. They like the red. Ain't that right, Papa? Papa? Jor 50th is trending in the right direction.
    93:17
    And needless to say, I think it's going to run in September. I think that's going to sell out pretty quick. And then December, that's going to sell out pretty quick, and it's going to be gone. I think people are learning from the Godzilla 70th thing because people would pay good money for a Godzilla 70th right now. All's trending up is Evil Dead. You see what those are going for? No. They're going for like $15,000. It's a $10,000 game. Yes. $15,000 for used evil dead?
    93:48
    Wowzers. That's nuts. I almost make everything else I don't mind to be honest with you. If anybody's interested in a used evil dead. But I think I want to keep an evil dead. I really do. But when I get an early one, and when you get the super early one you can't get a buttercab because you're just trying to get them out. Right. I do like butter. So maybe I sell mine and then get one with the butter.
    94:18
    I don't know. Turning down are the, God bless them. So many people that may be entering into the hobby or just they don't know enough about what games are going for what, I still get messages multiple week. Hey, can I get an Evil Dead please or can I be put on the list? And I'm like, March called and they said they're pregnant. They're late. There's a joke there, I think. But there's none. I'm sorry. There's no evil deeds. Okay, can you put me on a – here's the kicker. I might have talked about this before. They're like, can you put me on an overflow list? Here's me. AI. I need to learn AI because I have to type this all out multiple times a week. So I have to explain to them, okay, if I took an overflow list, here's how it would look. Nobody would ever get one because since they're selling on the secondary market for more than what they are MSRP, Anybody who on my list that already has an order, if they decide that they no longer want it, they're just going to sell it for a profit rather than lose a $1,000 non-refundable or $2,000 non-refundable deposit. Thus, I can put you on this list, but it really doesn't make any sense. And then they're like, well, you're an asshole. I'm just trying to, you know, like there's no reason to put on this. You just need templates. You need to have some files where you just open it up and cut and paste the answer for those things. That's not really an AI thing. You just need to have something that you can go and pull from a template. I need an algorithm, if then. Because then I'm opening file, clicking, dragging, popping, opening up another file. There's no way, I'm sure, to automate it with some keywords. The efficiency, Dennis. I'm dying with the efficiency. Just make him do all of this. He's too busy taking sales. Also turning up this week is, oh, yeah, it's his favorite game, Dintin, the Hobbit. Jersey Jack Pinball, the Hobbit. It's not their worst game. For whatever reason, now I'm trying to figure it out. Remind me on the Patreon and tell you about one of the trade-offs.
    96:18
    If I don't see another Woz, I'll be okay. The Hobbit, uh, yeah, for whatever reason, the Hobbits are selling for, like, a lot of money again. Like, nine grand again. What is that all about? Remember when back in our day there were like 6,500 and people made fun of them?
    96:38
    Yeah, I guess people like, I mean the dragons still look great because you can't hit them with the ball. Oh, I bet they still might not work. Wow.
    96:50
    I just remember the loud, obnoxious click, click, click of the individual control drops. That was their big show off thing for the skill shot. Sounds like a damn machine gun. Yep, I remember those. But the Hobbit, for whatever it is, what people, what collectors are really craving, they like that Smaug edition. They really like that. And if you can find a Smaug edition, lower plays, sub 500 plays with the rad cows on them, that was an accessory at that point in time. So it wasn't standard. That is like the primo. The low plays is pretty easy, though, because the games were like 30 minutes long. And they held up well. Those play fields held up well. But yeah, that's the primo. Like those go north of $10,000. That's a hobby. And they sell like that. I tried to overprice one because I kind of wanted to hang around. It just sold. But what comes up must come down. Trending down this week are the oddballs. That's not Dennis and I or other unnamed media providers. No, no. The oddballs. What I'm finding in the market right now, listeners, is that the oddball games that were once,
    98:08
    they piqued the interest of many collectors. They would take a risk on having something different. They're just not holding up on the secondary market with price or sometimes quality. What I mean by the oddballs, the examples trending down this week are Highways Alien. Remember the highway version of Alien? Yeah, yeah. Those are fucking dogs. They are dogs. Shit don't work. They don't hold up. They're horrible. But a lot of collectors, you know how it's like cars or anything else, like I don't care how shitty it is. It's rare.
    98:42
    The secondary market is not suggesting that hiring collectors care anymore. They don't. The prices are dropping on the oddballs. It's a highway alien. Haggis' Fathom revisited. People don't care how pretty it is. That damn thing is dirt cheap. Queen, to a certain extent. Queens. Nobody will even take a chance on a wonderful IP. They don't like the game. Funhouse Remake. I'm going to put that in this oddball discussion because prices are plummeting on that game. Every time we're getting them in a lot as trade and they are selling for very low amounts. Alice's Adventures in Wonderland? That damn thing ain't even produced yet, and it's already dropping in value before it even leaves the damn factory floor. I think they're selling pre-orders for less than, I mean, people are just trying to get out at a loss.
    99:32
    Delays after delays. Oh, is it the delays? I thought, did they finally come around on the art? I mean, that art went any more into its aesthetic. A tornado would be compelled to hit it.
    99:48
    Alice's Adventures in Wonderland. Yeah, that people just don't. I like hearing people try to argue like, oh, it's a ton of fun and stuff. I'm like, eh, eh. So is Dirty Harry, but I know that people like Dirty Harry. I just, it's not that fun. Ninja Eclipse. I'm throwing Ninja Eclipse in there. That is a game that people really like. They love Ninja Eclipse. They even like how it looks, Dennis. But on the secondary market, it was selling for low out of the gate, so it's maintaining that value. But there's just not, the hype isn't there. People don't care about these oddball games anymore. It just seems to me, just looking at the market every single day, multiple hours, that people still are there, They're like the enthusiast community and the collector, but they like the big dogs. They like the Stearns, the JJPs, the games that have been built in the thousands or the hundreds, some little high numbers. But they like the tried and true. And they like those rare editions or those top editions, those LIs. The dog balls, this ain't working no more. All's trending down this week. I've been out of it quite some time. The whole mod community thing and buying mods. Every once in a while there would be a Stumble or Mod or really a medicinal Mod, just the high quality stuff that I'll definitely purchase even if I don't own the game because I just expect the quality of work.
    101:16
    But I haven't looked into the Mod stuff as much. I did because of these issues. But I've been getting a lot of trade-ins and with these trade-ins come enhancements or additions or modifications or accessories that people add to their games. And what I want to relay to the community, nobody loves mods as much as yours truly. So I assure you, I love mods. But moving forward, for the majority, I've got to tell you guys, put down the mods, step away from the 3D printer. Please put them down. There's no use for some of these mods. Some of these mods are cash cards. Some of these mods are going to start your machine on fire.
    102:03
    I've never said, like, I get a trade-in, and mods generally aren't going to hurt the price. But I'm starting to question it, Dennis. There are so many atrocious, horrible mods. Like, when I lift the hood on a game, and I see fucking spaghetti of wires and alligator clips and, like, glue and shit, Like the LED strips that they got on this hokey-ass stadium lighting is hot to the touch. I'm smelling plastic. Like, guys, take this shit out of your game. It's like adding all of this junk to a beautiful sports car. No, no, we don't want stuff hanging in the rearview mirror. We don't want any of this. It's poorly done. So, so many of these mods now. I would say 75% of the mods that come out I think are tacky as fuck. They look like shit. They're making your game look like shit and they're making you look like shit because you bought it.
    103:06
    Get rid of them. Throw them away. I throw them away. I'm like, I could sell this for $10. Snicked. No thanks. 3D printed filament. Fuck off, you ugly mods. Have you not seen them, Dennis? I'll send you $45. No, it's fine. It's just so bad. People just refrain. They can't. They can't. Why are you trying to put all these businesses out? Sure. You're going to put them out. Sure. Either bring A products or go home. I'm going to start calling them out. They're so bad. Sorry, I've been in a tizzy because I just, I'm like, oh, look at this tchotchke-ass machine that I have to start stripping out. Fuck.
    103:55
    Don't get me started on these bootleg-ass art blades. Fuck, what is that? I don't know. I get so upset because it's the wiring. And they tap them, like, they'll jump into, like, original factory wiring. They will just tap right into it and I'm like, oh my god, I can't undo that. You know how much tape and electrical tape just to make a fucking Iron Man chest right now? Stop! We don't need War Machine to have the thing on his chest.
    104:32
    Baby Yoda can wave his arm. Yeah! I'm glad you thought that. I used to love that animated Grogman. I know you did. I used to love it. There is one in our showroom right now. And everybody's like, is that game broken? Well, it's off. But it's not broken. It's because when you have that animated Grogu tapped into, because people don't know how to, like, program anything. So they tap it into, like, an insert light. So in attract mode, all you hear is that godforsaken alien Yoda fucker in the back going, Zip, zip, zip, zip, zip, zip, zip, zip. And my father was like, Oh, God. In that game, I'm like, like, that's the world's strongest servo motor. How it's run continuously for weeks.
    105:26
    It's turned off. Damn. You're so bad. I'd never have it. It would dry. You know what? Get rid of the mods, people. There's... All right. I don't even know. I'm Fimble Mark. Fuck. Steals of the Week. Bye, bye, bye. Look, if you guys want these mods, I will start collecting them and I'll mail them. Maybe give them away on Joel's stream. You know what? Anybody that wins from Australia or Canada, you're going to get these industry-leading mods that, I don't even know if they burn. I would burn these things. They're so bad. We can showcase one every week. Look at the shitty work this is. Oh, so stupid. Okay, so put the mods down. Step away from the 3D printer, please. Even like the, I'm thinking right now, like some buttons, like they all break. It's just so bad.
    106:26
    So, deal of the week. Deal of the week is a queen. Speaking of turning down games and the oddballs that nobody wants, I've had a queen. We had it in the 6,000s and I marked it down on 5,900 and 5,700. I'll give this thing away for like $54.99. And I still take this thing, please. It's like in cricket condition, too. If anybody wants to see the Queen, not a bad game. But, yeah, people just don't like it. I'm sorry. My brain's still stuck on the... You got to move on. I can't. I'm just going to be... And as always, I'm just here to report the facts. Call it as it is, people. Numbers don't lie, and neither will lie. But some of these mods can start fires on Pinball Market Trends.
    107:09
    Damn. Where can people catch you? Make an email. Click the Gammers Podcast at gmail.com. Easiest way to reach out to me directly.
    107:18
    ThePinballShow at gmail.com. I sometimes check that, too. Thank you all for the support. Patreon.com slash ThePinballShow. Deeply appreciate it. We're going to continue experimenting here because we've been doing this long enough. We just want to have fun with it. And that's what we're going to do. Go check out Straight Down the Middle. Follow, subscribe, like there. And what do we have next? I think we're going to do a Who Wore It Best, an update to that. Stewie.
    107:43
    Oh, jeez. Stewie. I should have traded that down. We got one of those in on trade, those Whirlwind Evolution. 2.0 things, yeah. And Stewie came home, finally. I was waiting for him. I knew.
    107:57
    You know what? Not a horrible game, honestly. Not really that bad. I wouldn't want it on my Whirlwind, but it does spice things up. Kind of like that fun house, but I just, it's one of those things where it's so bad that it's kind of endearing. It's like the GTF kind of thing.
    108:18
    Sponsor, sponsor of this show is Flippin' Out Pinball. When I buy my pinball shit, I buy from Flippin' Out. From toppers, from materials, I got it. Flippin' Out, Flippin' Out. When I take a pinball, I think Flippin' Out. Flippin' Out, Flippin' Out. We're going to go to Expo. So the product showcase is come to Chicago Expo. Say hi to us. We're going to have a booth. We haven't had a booth in years, but Ken Cromwell's wanted to run a booth, so we're going to do that. Harry Potter's, you can order one from us, but I sure as hell don't know when you'll get it. Just being honest, you know how many sales we lost in the last couple weeks because we say we don't know? One. Too many. Yeah, I wish it was only one. One is too many. One is too many to write. King Kongs, Jaws, Dune. Oh, if you want to Jaws 50th? Mm-hmm. Bomb Pop Edition? Mm-hmm. We got some September spots. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dune? I can get you one right now. Not a lot of people can say that. Pre-owned games. Go to the Flippin' Out Pinball Facebook page for right now. We're going to have them on our website soon. We're just undergoing website. Oh, website. You're finally redoing it. We're going to. It's just going to cost me a second mortgage. Dungeons and Dragons Pro, Premium, Metallica, Remastered, Uncanny X-Men, The Loved One, John Wick, Godzilla, Jurassic Park, Labyrinth, Avatar, Elton John, James. But if you want a game, Flippin' Out Pinball is going to do everything we can to earn your business. Arcades, everything. Trade-ins, everything. Stair climbing hand trucks, you flip and name it, we want it. Toppers, accessories. I did get some new accessories and they're selling the King Kong banners. Banners, look at Banner Michael. Yeah, so if you want one of those, they're like a hundred bucks. Come purchase one. Flipping out media channels. Joel's doing some terrific work over there on the YouTube channel. Gameplay and tutorials, vodcast videos. So go subscribe. We're trying to get to 10,000. I gave him a go of 10,000 followers by the end of the year. And we're short. We're short. But I still think it can happen. Flipping Out Pinball Podcast with Ken and Greg. They've been on fire. Episodes 4 and 5. 4 was about controversial pinball opinions. And episode 5 covering what's missing in modern pinball.
    110:39
    So, yeah, a lot of fun stuff. But Joel, Ken, Greg, you know, these people. I missed you, Dennis. I've been working a lot, but I missed you. Can you just sell people something? The one piece that's not in your empire. Yeah, well, no, actually, I need them. Yeah, you can't, unfortunately. Yeah, well, I think I need the people to teach us something. Well, actually, to advise us on something. So email thepinballshow at gmail.com. What would we name, what should we name, Zach's mod segment? I lean towards the obvious alliteration, Minnie's mods, where he tears into one on a subsequent episode of his choice. But I feel like that also sounds too, because there's already like measles mods, like there are already alliterations there. So give us some ideas on what we could call the segment. So that's really it. I do like that.
    111:34
    And always practice safe pinball. And if anyone is going to be the successful successor of the goat, it is none other than the assistant to the goat, myself, Zach Manny. Bye-bye-bye. Bye, bye, bye. Step away from the mods, please.