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Tribe Multiball with Rachel and Tim, Episode 39: Rachel found Waldo!

Poor Man's Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·analyzed·Nov 19, 2023
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.033

TL;DR

Tim and Rachel return with collection updates, tournament wins, and Expo impressions on new games.

Summary

Tim Dan Lee and Rachel Risto discuss their pinball activities over a 4-5 month absence from podcasting. Tim sold 10 games and bought 4 new ones (Iron Maiden Pro, Foo Fighters Premium, Walking Dead), while building a local location presence and resuming tournament play. Rachel traveled to Sweden and the UK for competitive pinball, won a tournament after 17 months, and attended Pinball Expo where she played new releases like Elton John and Labyrinth, offering cautious enthusiasm about Spooky's first-run reliability.

Key Claims

  • Tim sold 10 games in 2023 and only replaced 4, currently owns 10 total machines

    high confidence · Tim Dan Lee stated directly in episode

  • Tim purchased only two new machines in 2023: Star Wars Pro and Iron Maiden Pro, both from Zach at Flippin' Out

    high confidence · Tim Dan Lee confirmed, later mentioned Star Wars was resold

  • Rachel won a tournament at District 82 after 17 months without a win

    high confidence · Rachel Risto stated directly

  • Rachel traveled to Sweden and the UK to play in back-to-back competitive pinball tournaments

    high confidence · Rachel Risto described trip details

  • A new location called Kavacade opened 15 minutes from Tim's house in Duncansville, Pennsylvania with 10-14 games including a newly delivered Venom Premium

    high confidence · Tim Dan Lee described the location, gentleman operator, and recent delivery

  • Rachel finished third in a small 12-person IFPA-certified tournament and plans to compete in the Helicon Open in December

    high confidence · Tim Dan Lee reported Rachel's results

  • Spooky's Labyrinth showed code bugs and left outlane drain issues during Expo play, though the game held up structurally

    high confidence · Rachel Risto described specific issues observed during extended play at Lumberjack Dining launch party and Expo

  • Rachel has concerns about first-run reliability with non-Stern manufacturers based on past experience

    high confidence · Rachel stated: 'I have no luck with any manufacturer but Stern on first runs of games'

  • Pinball Expo 2024 will celebrate its 40th anniversary next year

    high confidence · Rachel mentioned 40th anniversary context for next year's Expo

  • Tim's son runs cross country collegiately and Tim coaches track and field, which limited podcast availability April-June and again in fall

Notable Quotes

  • “I sold 10 games... and I only replaced four of them... I'm down to ten.”

    Tim Dan Lee @ early in episode — Major collection downsizing signal; Tim consolidating toward quality over quantity and higher price points

  • “I'm back to pro level... the prices are just crazy”

    Tim Dan Lee @ mid-episode — Market signal about pricing pressures affecting collector buying patterns; shift away from Premium/LE tiers

  • “I spent three hours there last Friday... I couldn't play for 24 hours afterwards... the scores were really low, so I kept getting free games.”

    Tim Dan Lee @ venue discussion — Community support behavior and location enthusiasm signal; willingness to subsidize new operator

  • “I don't look at the score on purpose... it bothers me when I look at the score because it makes me nervous”

    Rachel Risto @ competitive play discussion — Competitive psychology insight; mental game discipline for tournament play

  • “I played about as well as I thought I was going to. The most important thing is I had so much fun.”

    Rachel Risto @ UK trip reflection — Balance between competitive ambition and experiential value in pinball travel

  • “I have no luck with any manufacturer but Stern on first runs of games.”

    Rachel Risto @ Labyrinth discussion — Critical assessment of manufacturing reliability across industry; Stern reliability premium

  • “I saw a lot of code bugs... I didn't like the left out lane it was a drain monster”

    Rachel Risto @ Labyrinth hands-on assessment — Early reliability concerns about Spooky's Labyrinth; specific mechanical/code issues identified

  • “If you are at all remotely a fan of Jim Henson, this is the game for you”

    Rachel Risto @ Labyrinth final assessment — Theme integration praise despite mechanical concerns; target audience recommendation

Entities

Tim Dan LeepersonRachel RistopersonZach MinneypersonGlennie RogerspersonHolly KoskinenpersonJeff TeolispersonChris ChandlerpersonJoe HoodpersonStephen John StephenpersonStern Pinballcompany

Signals

  • $

    market_signal: Tim reports prices are 'crazy' and 'ten thousand dollars and above,' causing him to slow purchasing and focus on Pro-level games rather than Premium/LE tiers

    high · Tim: 'the prices are just crazy and i'm back to pro level... i just kind of slowed down'

  • ?

    collector_signal: Tim sold 10 games in 2023, keeping only 10 total, aiming to reach 8; major shift toward quality over quantity; broke even financially

    high · Tim sold 10 games for 4 net additions; targeting 8-game collection focused on newer titles

  • ?

    venue_signal: New pinball location 'Kavacade' opened in Duncansville, PA with 10-14 modern Stern games; Tim visited 3+ hours and actively supported operator via donated quarters

    high · Tim spent 3 hours at location, felt wrist pain, left free games, deliberately contributed quarters to support operator

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Rachel won tournament at District 82 after 17-month drought; completed international tournament circuit (Sweden/UK); Tim resumed local tournament play after absence

    high · Rachel: 'I finally won a tournament that's what i was just gonna say you won that's awesome yes it took me 17 months'; Tim: 'For the first time since December last year, I played in a small house tournament'

  • ?

    product_concern: Rachel reports experiencing code bugs and mechanical issues with Spooky's Labyrinth during Expo and location play; expresses pattern of unreliability with non-Stern manufacturers on first runs

    high · Rachel: 'I saw a lot of code bugs... I didn't like the left out lane it was a drain monster' and 'I have no luck with any manufacturer but Stern on first runs of games'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.164

0:00
Hey, Poor Man Tribe and listeners, this is Glennie Rogers, and you're listening to the Tribe Multiple Podcast with Rachel and Tim. Poor Man Tribe's the thing, that is who we are. It is true. They're not in this thing, so how could it go wrong? Flip away with us, to an old barcade, and then we'll learn about each other. From two pennants to another Uh-huh Hello everyone and welcome to Tribe Multiball episode 39. I am one of the co-hosts, Tim Lee, and I'm here with my other co-hosts. Rachel Risto. Hey, Rachel. How are you? Hey, does this thing work? Tap, tap, tap. Yeah. I'm great, Tim Lee. How are you? Oh, I had some struggles getting back online, but I'm here.
0:59
Where did I go? Did anybody miss me? We're back. I missed you. I missed you, Tim Lee. You know that. Did anyone know I was gone?
1:10
Yes, they did. And I will tell you why. Because on my world travels since the last time we've chatted, I know. So fancy. I'm an international competitive pinball player. What's that? I don't know. uh player of mystery yeah sure i'll take it um i totally lost my train of thought so we're off to a really good start i don't know what i'm saying you're in the united kingdom did you see somebody as sexy as tim connery oh gosh oh yeah so on my world travels thank you got us back there i think thanks sean connery but on my world travels i did have um people near and far asked when we're going to record another episode so here we are yeah i had i had more people than i anticipated reaching out and ask when i'm going to do an episode with you so that's awesome yeah like it's up to tim lee it's up to tim lee so why were we gone whose fault was i don't know you start you start first i'll just tell everyone yeah i'll just tell everyone it was a planned absence to begin with because I coach track and field. I do a club team and we go over the place and my son runs collegiately and my daughter runs in high school. So I knew from April, May and June, I was going to be really hard to get a hold of to podcast. I told you that. Yes. Well, then I kind of got in the groove of not podcasting and then I decided to podcast and there wasn't anything going on. There was like literally nothing going on in the pinball world, and then cross country kicked in, and it's over now. My son runs collegiately. So I told you a while ago that I was ready to go again once you got back from England. So I'm excited, and I'm a little wound up. What are you drinking? I am having Fireball, if you can hear that. Fireball, I put it on ice, and then I decided maybe it was a little too stiff because it was probably like two and a half shots in my cup, maybe three. And then I decided I have some cranberry lime seltzer. So the cinnamon and cranberry are fantastic together. What are you drinking, Tim Lee? I am drinking, it's called Eight Days a Week. It's a micro brew from Southern Tier. I don't know where Southern Tier is at, but that's what I'm drinking. Eight Days a Week. Yeah, it's really good. okay it's a great name it's also a wonderful song anyways so you want to talk about what we've been up to okay you go first okay you go first timley tell me what you've been up to besides cross country and family things and with your wonderful mistress ann and all the wonderful things you've got going on there what have you been up to in your pinball world phyllis shockingly not a lot but a lot so i'll tell you what that means so you're gonna find this a little bit crazy but since we last talked i sold 10 games what 10 games oh okay and okay i only replaced four of them what yes you got rid of 10 games and you only replaced four so how many are in your collection oh boy let me count four eight ten i'm down to ten okay i got oh i got up pretty high now i'd like to get down to eight so i'll run through real quick i've only purchased two new machines in 2023 i got them both from from zach at flipping out i got a star wars and an iron maiden pros premiums or le's pros the the prices are just crazy and i'm i'm back to pro level tim Yeah, that's fine. And Iron Maiden Pro is fantastic. I think still is the Star Wars Pro is fantastic. You don't need the Hyperboost. Well, here's the funny thing. I already sold Star Wars. Oh.

high confidence · Tim Dan Lee explained his absence due to coaching and family commitments

  • “I need to get like a – I don't have the right kind of keyboard to get on it. I swear there are pictures on there.”

    Tim Dan Lee @ Elton John concert anecdote — Humorous personal aside; demonstrates long-running marital debate about concert attendance

  • “It held up... I really wish them the best of luck. I know a whole bunch of people that are involved in that secretively”

    Rachel Risto @ Labyrinth reflection — Guarded optimism about Spooky; hints at inside industry knowledge about game development

    • Spooky Pinball
    company
    Flippin' Out Pinballcompany
    Poor Man's Pinball Podcastorganization
    Pinball Expo 2024event
    Kavacadevenue
    Plymouth Tapvenue
    District 82venue
    Helicon Openevent
    Star Wars Proproduct
    Iron Maiden Proproduct
    Foo Fighters Premiumproduct
    Walking Deadproduct
    Labyrinthproduct
    Venom Premiumproduct
    Elton Johnproduct
  • ?

    technology_signal: Labyrinth exhibited observable code bugs and balance issues (left outlane drain) early in production run at Pinball Expo

    high · Rachel: 'I saw a lot of code bugs... there was that big gap and... it kept going down the side'

  • ?

    community_signal: Rachel's Europe trip (Sweden/UK) resulted in multiple media appearances (Pinball Profile, Ray Ray Show) and significant community connection building; 40th Pinball Expo planned for next year

    high · Rachel: 'I got to meet people from all over Europe... I might cry... it was really incredible' and Expo 40th anniversary mention

  • ?

    content_signal: Multiple podcast and media opportunities surfaced for Rachel in 2024: Pinball Profile appearance, Ray Ray Show episodes, Super Series commentary (40 hours)

    high · Rachel: 'I was on episode of Pinball Profile' and 'I did commentary for the Super Series... that was like 40 hours of chatting'

  • ?

    design_innovation: Labyrinth features notable left-side mechanical trap elements (small forks that trap ball) integrated with gameplay; praised for intuitive layout and ramp returns

    medium · Rachel: 'like, on the left-hand side where, like, the little forks come up to trap the ball... I really liked the game quite a bit... the layout, the ramp returns'

  • ?

    operational_signal: Tim demonstrates proactive community support for new operator at Kavacade; operator building route with Tim's used games and modern titles

    high · Tim visited 3+ hours, spent quarters deliberately to support operator, maintains high score challenges via weekly leaderboards

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Rachel expresses cautious optimism about Spooky's future despite first-run concerns; indicates inside knowledge of game development and hiring efforts

    medium · Rachel: 'I really wish them the best of luck. I know a whole bunch of people that are involved in that secretively' combined with code bug observations

  • ?

    business_signal: Spooky Pinball reported to be hiring production staff to build/manufacture games (mentioned in 'one show the one podcast')

    medium · Rachel: 'they're hiring some people... to start to build these things... hopefully they can train those folks well'

    • 5:02
    Sounds about right. So I sold Star Wars and I sold my heist module to buy a Foo Fighters Premium that somebody gave me at a fantastic deal. So I just told you I'm just buying new in-box Pros, but I got a really good deal on a Premium. And I couldn't pass it up, so I let those go.
    5:23
    Okay. The other thing I did. Do you like Foo Fighters? I love it. It is hard. Yeah. Yeah, it is hard. I think yes and no. I think that if you can find the shots, there's so much flow in the game. I have a fun time every time that I play it. But there's a lot of players out there, too, that think that it's hard, that it drains a lot to the outlings, I guess. I don't know. I heard Dennis Creasel say that it was long playing, and I'm like, dude, I'm a suck at pinball because my games are all really, really fast. But yeah, so I got a Food Fighters Premium, and I said this on the last time we recorded like three years ago that I did get a Walking Dead from a friend of mine. yeah i actually sold a game to buy an elvira to help out a buddy and then a month later i sold the elvira okay nice did you like uh house of horrors yes did you like that game i really liked it you really liked it oh man damn man's gonna love you'd love to hear that yeah i'm just like i'm like i feel kind of lukewarm about the game i think it's something about the way that it feeds out the pops i think i said that before um yeah well and then the walk is your walking dead a fancy one with the crossbow it is yes it is okay i finally got to play one of those um at the uk open i don't think i've ever played one with a fancy crossbow before that's a cool super cool feature on the game yeah i'll give you a hint we'll talk about that one a little later okay so So I sold my Dark Knight to get the Elvira. I had sold my Mando to get Star Wars to also get – to bridge the gap on the Walking Dead. I sold part of my Cosmic Carnival, if you remember. I owned like half of it. Oh, that's right. Yeah, yeah. Yes. I sold Amy's Dream theme, James Bond.
    7:16
    Oh. Yeah. You still have the GNR? Yes. Still have GNR. And I noticed Amy wasn't playing Bond, and I'm like, why are you playing this? It's your dream thing. And she's like, the shots, I just can't find them. She's like, it's a lot more fun than it used to be. She's like, but those side shots, I can't find them, and I'd rather play Halloween and Walking Dead. And she still plays a lot. So I'm like, well, I said, do you want to sell it? She said, yeah. So we sold it, and I pocketed that money. It's one of the games I just put the money back in the old savings account. Nice. That's awesome. Yeah. And then sitting there, something else comes up down the line that you're looking at. Yeah. So I also sold High Speed and Cyclone. I had those two old games.
    8:02
    I'm surprised by that. Yeah. Because that Cyclone, wasn't that like an OG game for you? Yes, it was. It was my favorite game as a child, but I played it so much for three months. I just got tired of it. And I just went through this phase. I'm like, you know what? I have too many games, and games are really expensive, and I didn't really lose any money on them. Kind of broke even on them all. Yeah. So. All right. Yeah, Elvira, High Speed, Cyclone, Star Wars, Heist. I sold Guardians of the Galaxy. I forgot to mention that one. Bond, a third of a Cosmic Carnival, Dark Knight, and Mando, all in 2023.
    8:42
    And I picked up a Maiden. We talked about that in June. um you and i talked personally about that and then i have a foo fighters and walking dead those are really the three net additions i had in 23 because i did buy the star wars and i sold it so you're making excuses for all the trading back and forth and you did in 2022 i don't know because like i don't care tim you go crazy i love i love it i love it i think it's well i think it's good i think 10's a perfect number but you know i'm gonna say here but you got rid of you don't have any classics or ems or anything now right yeah we're gonna have to change that yeah you're something a little bit older i always say that though but that's why i always look to play first yeah so yeah i just haven't been i just haven't had the desire to buy with the price is going crazy and everything being ten thousand dollars and above it's it is what it is so i just kind of slowed down that's okay um before we i don't want to forget to talk about it but my collection is very small i sold my mouse and around emma air made in pro this year and i just have my sunday card tricks my little add a ball so um i love yeah i love that game so that's fun to just have here at home and i'm right there the reason i mentioned it right away right here is because prices i'm not quite ready to pay for a new box game but i know that's going to be the next step it's going to be in 2024 i'm sure prices are just going to go up and I don't even know if that's a rumor. I don't know because I don't pay attention to any of that kind of stuff. But, you know, that's been my hesitation is, well, let's see what comes out in 2024 as well if there's something I really like. But since they are, like, rerunning Deadpool and Stranger Things, right? Yeah. So I thought about getting one of those because I love both of those games. But I also thought, well, I should look at the used market, you know, like for a newer title, Deadpool or something like that. So, again, it's or even a Rush. I know something that's actually going to be selling a Rush. So I'm thinking about that a little bit, too. I love Rush. But I'm just not at the point. I'm not at the point yet to pull the trigger. I figured, can I make it through the year without getting a new game? I'm hoping so. We'll see. Yeah, you're blessed with a location or two or three that you can play at. Two, right. I have Plymouth Tap. That's 15 minutes away. He has a Wonka and 12, I think it's 12 Sterns he has there, new Sterns. So I get to play those, which are great. He keeps them in great condition. And, of course, District 82 has 115 games. That's an hour away. So, yes, Tim, I am very lucky. But, again, all I really want here in my home someday is, like, a room full of old junk.
    11:17
    Classics, EM, solid states, please. Step right to the front. But that's the way I am. But, anyways, lest I digress, go on. What else is going on with you? Guess what? What? We have a location now here about 15 minutes from my house. Come on. So three of the games that I sold, a gentleman who started a location here and now, I guess it's Duncansville, Pennsylvania, bought three of my games. Nice. Like right in a row. He won in modern games. I think he's up to somewhere between 10 and 14 games. He just took delivery yesterday of a Venom Premium.
    11:54
    It's called Kavacade. I guess there's a drink that's kind of like a wine that relaxes you. I don't know anything about it, but he serves these like drinks on tap that are called kava. I know nothing about them. I think it's a natural herb. Yeah. I am. Yeah. Amy Lee tries that stuff. I stick to my beer and water.
    12:17
    That's fine. And fireball sometimes. Yeah. Well, that's awesome. Good for you because you're living like in a dead zone for a while, right? Yeah. I spent three hours there last Friday. Holy cow. My wrist was killing me. I couldn't play for 24 hours afterwards, and I just sat there and I played. And the scores were really low, so I kept getting free games. And I left a bunch of free games there. And when I was done, I like to support the operators. I thought, I only spent half the money I anticipated. So I just took my quarters and put them in every game. Oh, I love that. And he's like, why are you doing that? I'm like, I just – I don't know. I'm decent. I'm better than Drew. I'm decent. but it's like i said i came here to spend this money on on your location i'm appreciative of you opening it up so yeah so i just put them in the game and if you're in the duncansville outtuna area go to kawake so you can look it up on the stern insider connected map oh and probably on the pin map as well yep i would assume and if you do go like grand champion and kick tim lee's score to the curb. I'd love to hear about that. What happens on the show? He does weekly leaderboard contests, and you know me, I'm addicted. I know you are. He has my cell phone because he got my games and I said if somebody beats all of my scores because you can only count one I said if I fall off of number one for the week let me know and I will be down within an hour to try to beat it I'm addicted to the leaderboards, but I held on to one this week. I got to go tomorrow. That's good. Well, there you go. Go have some fun. The only other thing going on is for the first time since December last year, I played in a small house tournament. Awesome. It was IFPA certified, and I think there was 12 people. I finished third, but it got me back in it. They're having one in two weeks, and then the Helicon Open, which is a three-day tournament in Pittsburgh, starts in December. So I wanted to get warmed up, so I went and played in the tournament. You're going to play the Helicon Open? Yeah, I played in it last year. I finished fifth, which was shocking. Well, yeah, that's right. I didn't know that. Yeah, I got kind of lucky. That's awesome. Yeah, you should be warming up. And what you should do if you're really the competitive player is you should look if you can find out what the game list is going to be at Helicon or if you know what the games are ahead of time. And the ones that you do not know or you're uncomfortable with, you should look at tutorials, video tutorials, and do some research or look at pen tips and so forth and learn how to play them. I assume you know how to play most of them, Tim, but you never know. They could bring you to Congo. I don't know. Have you played a Congo? Probably. I did it in Dave Brennan's basement. Oh, but you remember how to play it. You know, it's things like that. Like, you know, you've got to sort it out and figure it out ahead of time. I try to do that. I'm a little bit lazy. Maybe I'll do what I did at AK's tournament. Remember, I just called you and Glenn between rounds? Yes. I said, hey, tell me how to play this game. You can phone a friend. You can phone me anytime. Text me anytime. I always try to help. It's funny because I've run into a couple newer people in the hobby, and I always tell them that, too. I'm like, I'm not trying to, like, pin-splain anything, but if you do want to know i can at least give you like surface level things to do and shoot you know yeah y'all were very beneficial so that's it that's all i've been doing i kind of figured you would be shocked that i sold so many games i am totally shocked that you know you've been doing a lot more than me a lot you know well how's life going great things are good i don't even know where to start um so i took this little trip to i took this little trip to sweden and to london okay and i played two weekends of competitive pinball back to back and if you'd like to hear all about it you can listen to that on the ray ray show we released an episode talking about the uk open uh it was amazing i had the best trip of my life holly koskinen that i traveled with She's an amazing travel partner. I played about as well as I thought I was going to. The most important thing is I had so much fun. I celebrated a birthday while I was there. I got to meet people from all over Europe and so many folks in the Netherlands. I don't even know, Tim. I might cry. I don't want to cry.
    16:41
    It was really incredible looking back because it's been a little bit of time now since I've been home. and uh yeah just my word it's unbelievable to think that all happened this year uh and i look forward to doing some kind of like little travel scrapbook uh with some of my stubs and pictures and stuff yeah because i think that's that's a nice way to kind of write down some of the memories and stuff too so thanks again to the tribe you all are so awesome so i did that um well hold up hold up you and holly were also on pinball profile oh my god yes we were oh my god Jeff Teolis, I love you. Yes, I was on episode of Pinball Profile. It was a good one. Oh, it was a great one. This year has been nuts in terms of the really cool opportunities that have been presented to me. That was so much fun. That was after having my birthday meal and quite a few beers. And then we recorded that. So I felt right at home. just just like today having a couple um little trickies here so yeah i did that i don't even know tim i've been playing you know district 82 i finally won a tournament that's what i was just gonna say you won that's awesome yes it took me 17 months i've won three times and my last one was 17 months and it was a side tournament district 82 this time as well it was the last the time before we also covered that in another episode of the ray ray show if you want to hear about that win so it's just um I feel good that I've been playing better it's weird because pinball is a weird thing like I just want to have fun and playing in terms of like competing and then I sometimes think maybe the idea of competing is not for me and I should just go and play my games and not really care I don't know it's like it's the mental game is a lot harder Tim like when I really have to think about it when I have to process how many points I need or the score I need or what i need to do i don't know i'm still having fun don't get me wrong you know what's bizarre what i sometimes and actually by sometimes a lot i don't look at the score on purpose i i usually don't yeah it bothers me when i look at the score because it makes me nervous yeah i know what the score is where i'm starting when i'm starting let's say ball two yeah yeah exactly look at the score until i'm done until i drain and then i look up as the bonus is counting you know that's usually the first time i actually glance at the score because i'm like i don't want to set i don't want to set that in my head you can usually tell by the way you're playing if you're doing the thing or not you know and so if you're yeah so like mandalorian if you go into a multi-ball with no mode you know that you're only going to score 20 million points you know it's going to be small potatoes really generally it's going to be small potatoes but if you go in there with the mode you know you're going to get uh much bigger jackpots and you know that you can light a super, you can light a super in a fancy way there, etc.
    19:35
    So anyways. I also, let's see, oh, I did commentary for the Super Series. That was like 40 hours of chatting.
    19:43
    So thanks to everybody out there that popped up in chat and listened and said hey. Hey back. That was always so much, so, so much fun. I think that's about it. So I saw the games and playing a couple episodes with Raymond. I don't know. I'm just enjoying life. I've been busy with other stuff. I had a great summer of kayaking and just enjoying life and getting excited for my trip and then being sad that I got home from my trip.
    20:11
    All those kind of things in between. It was good to take a break on the podcast. I did a lot of fun things. We did a family trip to see Guns N' Roses. Oh, yeah, that's right. The whole family. My daughter didn't want to go, but I looked over during the concert, and she was like tapping and singing and I'm like you having fun she's like I didn't know they sang all these songs she's like I know them all but we had a good time Amy and I went to see Queen that was our anniversary trip this year we Queen with uh Adam Lambert and we had a yeah great time and afterwards I forgot we went to the York pinball show afterwards it was fun it's kind of small yeah it's it's kind of small but it was you know I got to play a bit of premium yeah but oh The other thing I did was Pinball Expo. Oh, yeah. I don't have to think about it. Yeah, so we should probably talk about Pinball Expo because there was a Poor Man's Pinball Podcast booth. And I had a very fun time. I got to meet tribe member Chris Chandler for the first time. And he is a funny SOB. He brought all sorts of cool stuff from Bucky's.
    21:15
    He brought me specifically jerky because I thought, you know, I know I'm going to be having some drinkies and hanging out and stuff, but let's maybe have him bring some protein instead of just all junk food. I don't know. That's what I went with it. But I enjoyed all the other stuff he brought, too. I had the opportunity to do an ice cream social again with Burrs, and I also dragged Joe Hood along to that, and also Stephen John Stephen. You know who I'm talking about? Oh, yeah, Stephen John.
    21:47
    So we went to this ice cream social, and it was great because Joe was wearing his badass Uncle Joe he was wearing his Tampax t-shirt and it was like it's such a good shirt only a badass can pull that off right and it's like it's great because Steve John Steve John and I was sitting there and Steve John Steve John and Joe was waiting for his ice cream because he wanted a different flavor but I didn't know if Joe was going to make it because he was swaying there a little bit So the point is, is we were having a good time. We had a fun, really, really fun time that, that, um, that whole weekend with them. I didn't play any competitive pinball. I just hung out with the tribe, hung out with other friends. I played a ton of pinball, played the new Elton John game. That was amazing. I thought it was a lot of fun in terms of it's a cool show. It's like GNR is a beautiful game. Elton John's a beautiful game the same way.
    22:40
    I played, I think you played Labyrinth. Have you played Labyrinth yet or Elton John? I did, but let's back up to Elton John. Did I ever tell you my Elton John story? You should. I'm going to have a big swig here. Yep, tell me. Go away, Tim. It has nothing to do with pinball.
    22:55
    Even better. Amy and I – Let's get way off tangent, way off track. Let's do it. Yeah. Amy and I have been fighting for 20 years about this. Oh, I thought you were just – Okay, that got me a little nervous there. No. You're giving me a confessional. This has been an argument in many parties. Yes. Amy claims that I went to see Elton John with her.
    23:18
    I have zero recollection of seeing Elton John. I like Elton John. I like Elton John's music. The concert was apparently pretty wild because he puts on a pretty darn good show. I have no recollection. I think she took somebody else. She said it was after our wedding. I'm like, I think she took another dude, but we – I'm like, this is the wrong boyfriend. She's like, we were married. I'm like, no. Did she dream it? I don't know. Does she have ticket stops? I don't know. There's a computer. There's an old computer. I got to get on it. I need to get like a – I don't have the right kind of keyboard to get on it. I swear there are pictures on there. Or no, she swears. I didn't go. I'm almost certain. But yeah, she's been telling me I went to this concert. We've argued about it at least 75 times in our language. Okay, well, your task this winter, if you have to do anything else this winter, is you've got to figure out how to get that computer working and your keyboard and whatever junk and get those photos obtained. I need to know. We need to know. The listeners need to know who was right and who was wrong. I have never been wrong at anything.
    24:31
    Oh, man, I could say something there. I'm going to bite my tongue. I would think if I saw Elton John I would remember who knows maybe you were roofied or something I don't know maybe I've never seen Elton John I would love to I think it would be fantastic I would like to see him as well I was very tired it was the last thing I did on Saturday Night Expo I did it with Rebecca Salem it was great she actually sat in a chair the whole time in the line she just moved her chair up because she was pooped out she'd been competitive you know competing and there's a pinball olympic gang they use that as a bird must be the fireball and uh but anyways it was a really great time but yeah next year is the 40th anniversary of pinball expo so maybe you'll come next year tim lee yeah i love that i i want to make it there i was actually i had things booked everything was booked but my son's championship cross-country race um for his college team was the same day that's more important yeah That's more important. He'll only be doing it one more year next year. Sure. Absolutely. We hope to get back next year. Now, I won't talk about this much because Eric wants to do a podcast again. The other podcast, you and Rayma were doing one. Eric and I did a couple. We kind of went somewhere together. We went to play Labyrinth at Cointaker about three weeks ago.
    25:56
    Oh. So. No, here's a side story for you. last winter i watched labyrinth for the first time and forever before i even knew that it was coming out as a game and obviously and uh i really loved the movie i forgot how much i loved it for my childhood so when i went to go play it i thought that the theme totally came out what did you think about the game what do you think about it as a shooter so i like the movie as a kid i couldn't get through it as an adult amy likes it and my kids like it like the movie great It's funny. But I will tell you, you know me. It's all about gameplay. I have themes here that I play, I love. I don't even like the show The Walking Dead, but I have the game. Yeah, the gameplay is awesome. Yeah. But if you like the Labyrinth theme and you like Pinball, you're going to like that game. It just had a lot of cool stuff on it. I'll just leave it at that. I thought the theme integration was really good as long as – one thing people keep saying is that it held up at Expo. But one of the things I think at the back of my head, I've had no luck with any manufacturer but Stern on first runs of games. So that is what it is. You know, they're smaller shops. They have a lot more to overcome. I played one on location. We'll track it along and see how it goes. At the new Lumberjack Dining in Appleton, I went to a women's launch party, a Venom launch party recently. And I played Labyrinth there for the first time And I thought the game itself unfortunately the audio was too low so I couldn really hear all the callouts and such and it a lot to read the screen while you playing and so forth but I thought the game was kind of intuitive shot-wise. And I thought what was really neat is, like, on the left-hand side where, like, the little forks come up to trap the ball. Yeah. And that used that. I think that was also, like, the super jackpot shot. I really liked the game quite a bit, like, the terms of the layout, the ramp returns, and so forth. So I didn't have a chance to play more than like two and a half games on it, but I hope that I can spend like an hour on it sooner than later. And I really hope that the game stands up, you know, to the test of time with people whacking on it. So, yeah. We played it for an hour. We only know. And I really wish them the best of luck. I know a whole bunch of people that are involved in that secretively and got a wish and good luck, you know. Cool. Cool-ass game. Yeah, we played for an hour. like i said i'll do the the deep dive with with eric when when we record um but it held up i saw a lot of code bugs i the only thing i really didn't like and i can say this is i didn't like the left out lane it was a drain monster there was that big gap and and you know there was that short out lane and it kept going down the side but i thought it was fun now the people that made got the games ready for expo in these first few sites i'm sure they're not the ones manufacturing it i'm sure i'm sure they'll be working on other things right like the next game and you know doing their day jobs so i'm sure yeah for sure they're hiring some people they said on the one show the one podcast that they're hiring people you know to start to build these things i believe so hopefully they can train those folks well to to keep it going i didn't go in on it i'm just halloween halloween has tested me rachel yeah but okay but the thing is is we're comparing apples and oranges here tim yeah i know but fuki is a whole other company you know yeah but all these companies every game but stern that i've got a first run i've spent way more time working on them so i would be interested in the labyrinth at like number 750 as opposed to the first 100 that makes sense okay yeah i get that that's like a later run yes if you really want one or and so forth yeah that makes sense there's somebody else that's owned it for a year and King's Tale or something like that. I'm not saying I would never buy one. I'm just saying I need to... I've put a lot of tech time into some of these games so I just want to go to the back of the list. Right. Sure. I can understand that. And for me, who has zero tech skills, absolutely zero, I want a game that definitely is going to play good or if it's something very minimal like the ramp return needs to be adjusted, I can take off the glass and do that and just shift it over or whatever. It should be screw it or whatever, I can do that. But, like, anything major, no, just can't do it. So, no, I'm right there with you. I can understand that. I thought it was a really pretty game. I thought it was really fun to play. Yeah, and you would agree, right? If you're a fan of Labyrinth and you're a fan of pinball, this is the game for you. This is the game for you. Like, this is, if you are at all remotely a fan of Jim Henson, this is the game for you, my friends. Like, people that design this definitely have that, bringing that theme to mind. I think it's just really spectacular. But again, that's just a handful of games on it. But I am H-O, my humble opinion, right? Yep. Oh, you know what else I played on location? Venom? No, I played GTF again. So remember I gave GTF a terrible review? Yeah. Well, I went this summer, and I played it at Helicon. It was actually the one that I played at Pinbrew, but the Helicon techs had it working like a champ. I fell in love with it and then I I played it at coin taker then because we went to coin taker a few times and I fell in love with it I'm like I need gtf and then I went back and played it on another location and it was just a disaster oh no like it was broken and kept breaking I'm like all right I don't need a gtf so I went from disliking gtf to loving it to now I'm just like okay I I don't want it anymore like the second time I played it everything was wrong okay that's Or actually, the second time I played it, the second time I disliked it. The second time I played it, I played like a champ. So I'm off the GTF bandwagon now. Okay. You know, and the thing is, like, for me, I'm not looking to, like, purchase a game. So I don't really, like, think about any of that, right? So for me, like, GTF, I think about the game in terms of it's a really pretty game. I like that there's, like, clear plastics in it. I don't really know how to play the game, so I just shoot the middle over and over and over and blow things up.
    32:03
    But I do find, and I do like the different other little ball save things underneath the flipper and such. I mean, it's got really cool, it's a really cool design, and I like the theme. I like how campy it is in terms of the content that's in it. So I can't really say anything that's wrong with it, but I've heard the same thing from other people, which is hard because, you know, you want a game that's going to stand up to the test of time where you can play 1,000 games on it, you know? Yeah, it's fun. Like my card tricks. My card tricks has, I think, like 9,000 games on it or whatever the case could be. It's got to be more than that. 89,000. I don't know. I'll have to go look at the counter. Yeah, it's fun. I just need somebody else to do the maintenance on it. To do the tech. Yeah, you got to hire a tech guy. That's what I have to do.
    32:47
    So anyways, I think, is there anything else? Did you play Venom? Do you want to talk about Venom? I did play Venom. Yeah. I probably only have 30 to 40 games on it between the pro and premium. Yeah. I, I liked it. I mean, it's backhandable. You can shoot everything as a backhand, everything, unless the game was going to be pitched too steep. You might not be able to backhand the left ramp, but everything was backhandable on the game, which I thought was remarkable. Yeah. I'm not one of these Jonathan Hall elitist that always have to have the premium. love you jay hall love love you jay hall now him and i argue about this once a week pro versus premium but i gotta tell you there is no contest between the premium and the pro on this one the premium is so much better oh yeah i would agree with that so much better agree with that just it's just like the led zepp the premium is better than the pro same thing yeah but i i enjoyed it i good i didn't really i kept building my level and carrying it over and i liked that but i didn't really get into that i found myself playing it more like if i were just playing from scratch like just trying to you know chase the blinky lights yeah that's what you should be doing generally yep get the multi balls so what i did like though is there's this cool video mode with i you know i don't really pay attention to characters names i'm so sorry to all the people that work so hard on the games i'm kind of like oblivious to that but the cool video mode where you're like you're whipping your arms and you're destroying the doppelgangers or i don't know what they are you're destroying them that's really cool that's a cool ass video mode one of the coolest video modes i've seen in a long time you know yeah so i need to see that and i didn't think i was gonna like the game i actually you know when i saw it i'm like eh but I really enjoyed it. I think they did a good job. I don't know if I would buy it. I mean, like I said, the fact that the premium's close to $10,000, like all these games, you know, Toy Story and Godfather and Elton John being $12,000 to $15,000, I just don't have much desire to buy them. I love pinball. I still want to buy more games. If there's a distributor out there listening and wants to give me crazy-ass deals on things, I'll take them. I'll be buying your premiums but 10 grand well if we're dropping things so if anybody in southeastern Wisconsin or in Wisconsin wants me to pin set their game I'd be happy to anyway okay so I think that's all my pinball news and all yours too we actually have actual stuff to like business to talk about today is it business? no I don't know so have you read the kineticist have you read it i have are you familiar with the kineticist i am like the word you say it you say the word kineticist kineticist kineticist am i saying it right i think so i don't say anything right me neither me neither okay so we've been asked to list our five favorite games currently our five favorite games and then also talk about why we love pinball okay so this is that's the intro to that okay so do you wanna what do you want to do go one at a time top five um i don't know we could you know you could do your top five and i'll do my top five and i'll ask you why you love pinball and then you'll ask me okay okay it's been so long i don't know you're the driver's seat this time all right let's do top five and let's do this we'll go back and forth i'll give you my five you give me your five then four then four we'll start and count down to number one okay all right sounds good so number five number five my number five actually i had a really hard time with number five it is like a 30-way tie for number five for me but i eventually decided on batman 66 okay and great game i i got kind of tired of the dark knight but i really like batman 66 i'm a huge batman fan you know it's my favorite comic book superhero and i like the dark knight more that's my favorite movie you know the dark knight but yes i really like the old batman I like kind of the campiness to it. The artwork was great. I, you know, you just, I kind of looked at, I approached my list as to what games I just play when I see them. Which games I really want. So that's kind of why Batman was on it. It's fun. Great code. So that's how it got there.
    37:45
    What about you? Batman 66. It's number five. Number five. Well, Tim, it's usually my answer is when anybody asks me what my favorite game is, my answer always is whatever I'm currently playing. but so I'm telling you Colin this is really hard for me to like decide it down but I have to say at number five we have Dolly I first played Dolly at my cousin's records shop in Columbus Ohio Amy Custing and that was one of the first pinball games that I played and then I also rented it for a little bit at the beginning of the pandemic in district 82 and that game I just love it um the art on it is so beautiful some of the history of the game they are so neat it's a game where left flipper does this right flipper does that um and i just i love it so for me i think and anytime i see the game and even at the uk open i played one classics card and the only part i played dolly was on it because i wanted to play that game so yeah definitely that's also how i approached the list was what are the games that i want to play when i see them so yeah my number five is dolly yeah i had no doubt dolly dolly was going to be on your list no doubt for sure it's our theme song it is absolutely uh pinheads you know number four okay now number four is a game that a lot of people dislike and they like dislike this version of it but i like this game because my family loves the theme in the game. I like the theme in the game, and that's Black Knight Sword of Rage Premium.
    39:21
    I like the game, Tim, for the record, and I like it with the upper play field for the record. I think it's more fun to play that way, frankly. Yeah, I had a Black Knight 2000. My son was so – he had a Black Knight 2000 t-shirt. For some reason, I decided it was a good idea to sell it, and he was mad at me. Both of my kids like Black Knight. Both of my kids like Anthrax, and I like Anthrax. And the score from the game, the songs, the music from the game was written by Scott Ian, who was the guitarist for Anthrax. So I love that my kids love it, and I enjoy it. It's not the best shooter in the world, but I enjoy it. I like the modern version of a nostalgic game. So that's kind of how it got on the list. I play it every time I see it, and I play it as much as I can.
    40:16
    Nice. That's a great choice. Solid. And people that don't like that, well, they can just stick it. Stick it. They can stick it, and they can come up with their own list, right? Yep, yep. All right. What do you got? Number four.
    40:29
    Deadpool. Definitely Deadpool, and it can be a pro. To me, it doesn't matter if it's a pro or premium there. hear that j-hall it could be a pro uh you can make it a pro meal we've talked about that um no i think that game i just never get tired of playing it like that's a game that if i have a bad game on it say i put two bucks in it and i don't get a replay i'm gonna put another two bucks into it yeah uh just just i i find the shots fun i think it's i like the different modes in the game I like the stacking capabilities in the game with all sorts of stuff running If you brave enough I just really really enjoy it So i think number four definitely is deadpool i always play it when i see it yeah the snick shot is it snick snick it stick nick stick sure yeah love that shot yeah it's weird the geometry is neat you know that kind of stuff so yeah it's best multiplier in pinball i think yeah right it's Super cool. Yep. Number three. This one's kind of an easy one. Godzilla.
    41:34
    For all the reasons that everybody loves Godzilla, the premium. You know, I had a limited edition, sold it, and got a premium. Just like it. Like everything about it. It's got the cool mechs. It's got the great shots. It's got great rules. People love it. You know, a big part of me liking games is when people love it. and uh no just it's just godzilla keith elwynn masterpiece right well we'll see i've got other games on my list yet all right but it is a master i guess masterpiece yes i would definitely agree it's a fantastic game but is it elwynn's best game i don't know i don't know uh i really do like it though quite a bit uh for me number three would be any em now listen before you come at me y'all and say that I'm supposed to pick one game. It's that's so difficult for me to do when I think about that era, you know, I did pick Dolly, but like, you know, I love Harlem Globetrotters, great game, stars, Trident, biking, you know, it goes on. There's all these great classic games that are out there.
    42:42
    I love that straight shooter that my friend Dave Anderson has. There are so many games that just, and that's such an old game where, you know, you load the ball. I love the older the game the mustier and you know stinkier it is I guess I don't know the more smoke stain on the cab it is uh I want to play it so it's the those are the games that if you invite me to your homes those are the games I'm going to go look for I probably play first in any collection that I go to uh or any location I go to is I try to seek out the oldest games and that's what I want to play first and I think what it is is it's something about the simplicity of the game because it's just you have to take like simplicity because it's x y and z it's not deep code it's not you have to stack a whole bunch of stuff it's like you want to get your play field multiplier bonus multiplier and you want to score points and you want to do this to get an extra ball you know it's just so straightforward so for me in my brain i love ems that's number one and the number two is the sound i cannot get enough of the sound yes whenever i've been at a classics tournament i really the next time i'm at one i need to walk around or just tell everybody to please be quiet i was gonna say shut up just please be quiet for five minutes so i can walk around not even for one minute walk around with my phone and record the audio because i love love the sound of bells and chimes so so my number three is really any em that i come across is going to be my favorite. So I'm curious if that screws up any type of listing that may go on with all this information that's being gathered. And that might be the only person that answers that way. I don't know, but that's what it is for me. So, Tim, you're number two. Okay, my number two. I already teased this one. This is a game where I don't really like the theme, and that's The Walking Dead.
    44:43
    I actually got – I got the Cleland code that I downloaded onto mine and I'd never seen the show, but I got kind of like, I kept doing hearing the sayings and Amy wouldn't tell me what they meant. So I watched the show far enough that I got to hear every sound that was on the pinball machine. And then after that, I was like so tired of the show. It wasn't bad that I watched the remaining seasons, 15 minutes at a time. I would fast forward to the important part, watch the important part, and I would fast forward. And I did it all in one. I watched like six seasons in a month. Amy sat down with me one time and she's like, you're an idiot. It was pretty much she said, you're an idiot. Like you're fast forwarding through everything. And I'm like, I just want to see what happens. And Amy told me, like I won't ruin it for anyone, but Amy kind of like hinted that there was a specific ending and it never happened. She lied to me just to get me to watch the show. So, you know, I, but back to the game. Maybe you skipped it. Maybe you skipped the ending. I don't know. It's quite possible. No, I did watch the full last. There was an ending. It just wasn't with the one that I thought was coming. I love that this is on your list because you don't necessarily care for the theme, but you love the game and the layout. And that speaks volumes about what pinball really is to each person individually. That's awesome. Yeah, I like John Borg games. I really do. I just like – I like the layout. I like the ramp that goes up and down with the bash toy in the middle. There's three bash toys on it, two magnets. It's got – I don't know. It's just got a lot of really cool things on it. I'm sitting here looking at it, and it's got the crossbow, which I don't like as much. I love the rules. It's got really good rules and just generally love the game. I could play it all night. So what's your number two?
    46:49
    My number two should come as no surprise. Iron Maiden. Shock! and i think there's several reasons for one when i first started really getting into the hobby there was one on location near me so i played the ever-living crap out of it and then i and then i bought one uh when i moved into my place here and i absolutely love that game anytime there is one i want to go play it i never want to play it in um competition because sometimes it can psych me out because I've played a thousand games on it you know yeah uh but uh I just I never it's a game too like Deadpool I never get bored of um Iron Maiden I think to me is a better game than Godzilla even though Godzilla's got a much deeper code and xyz I think just Iron Maiden is just a great shooter uh I love the little baby flipper and so forth so yeah that's and I think again it's one of those things where I have like personal connection to the game that's what's making it number two on my list. So what is number one for you? Okay, before we get to number one, Iron Maiden was the one that was tied for Batman 66. I had a really hard time choosing between the two, so both great games.
    48:04
    So number one. I'll tell you a little story about number one. The first time I ever played it, it was I think one of the first 11 ever made, and it was at Helicon Brewery. And it was right beside the bar. And one of the bartenders there was just sitting there kind of looking at me weird. The entire time I played, I was laughing. I was just laughing and smiling. And she came over and she's like, Tim, you really like that game. I said, I just love it. And it kept breaking because it was one of the first 11 ever made. And I would just put in another dollar and play it again. I never made it through a whole game. But I just thought. I love the movie.
    48:50
    It's the best theme integration I've ever seen, and I just like the way it shoots, and that's The Big Lebowski.
    48:56
    Really? I just love that game. I just had a smile, huge smile, and she kept laughing and Amy kept laughing. I love the game. I like everything about The Big Lebowski. Okay, so I have two thoughts. One, have you ever owned the game? Nope. Okay. and then two i actually watched the big lebelski for the first time this past week and part of it is because yes and part of it's because of the pinball machine and i played a whole bunch of big lebelski at the uk open they had like a little hall like their free warm-up area and that game was there so i got to figure out how to play it and the game was i thought it was a fantastic fun playing game yeah yeah but why don't you have a big lebelski we gotta get one in your collection you know i've been going to coin taker and i think they're still like back ordered if i would show up and they would have one there and offer me one i would probably buy it and i'd probably sell two machines just to get it it's just i don't like to wait just yeah i know you're a little impatient it's okay yeah i don't i don't the only game i've really ever ordered is pulp fiction and i'm tired of waiting on it like i don't even i don't even know if i want it anymore you and everybody else it'll be worth it it'll be worth the wait i think that game's definitely worth the wait yeah so there it is number one the big lebowski love it I love it. All right. What's your number one?
    50:17
    Da-da-da-dun. I knew that one. Da-da-da-dun. They're creepy and they're kooky. They're serious and spooky. They're all together kooky. The Addams Family. Yep. So Addams Family. First, it's still a grail game for me. First game I ever played. Every time I play, every time I see it anywhere, I have to play it. Just such an enjoyable game. I just, just some, it's the nostalgic factor for me is a big part of it. So I think that's, it has to be my number one current favorite game and probably all time favorite forever. Yeah. Never, never, never. It's a fantastic game. So Tim Lee, I have one more question for you. Okay. Why do you love pinball?
    51:01
    So, you know, if anybody's ever listened to the show, they know my answer. It's not that it's because I'm one of the premier pinball players in the country. Nope. We all know that Drew sucks at pinball.
    51:16
    I am. What are we talking about? I actually suck as well. So it's not that. It has nothing to do with skills. I really got into pinball because I just enjoyed playing it. I just loved playing it. I just enjoy the game. but what really got me into the hobby is the people you know me you always joke that i go to tournaments and i don't even pay attention like sometimes they're like tim you're up because i'm too busy talking to to joe or heather about you know pinball and everything else right i am 100 invested for the people and like the camaraderie and just pinball bringing people together oh man i love that that's what i like about you so i guess my answer is i guess it would be similar to yours there's two ways to answer it right one absolutely it's all about the people in pinball we all know that about me but what i really love about pinball about the the hobby of activity of playing a game itself is that it's a puzzle every game is a puzzle and i love puzzles and trying to figure out how the ball is going to feed how to catch the ball how to do this differently I love the active learning that comes through it to me that's like that's the biggest draw to the hobby or to the game of pinball but to the hobby of pinball 100 bazillion percent about the people um I've hugged so many pinball people in 2023 uh I have and I feel so fortunate for that I've gained more people like, you know, my social media friends list and so forth is probably three fourths of it now is pinball people that I've met this morning. For example, I had a conversation with a friend in Australia, a friend in Arizona, you know, and a friend here in Wisconsin, you know, like people from all over that were chit chatting about pinball stuff. So yeah, it's definitely the people. So I'm so glad that I found the hobby, the poor man's pinball podcast. I'm so glad that I found you, Tim Lee. Oh, thank you. I'm glad I found you. No, it's been great. And Drew sucks at pinball. Yep, Drew sucks at pinball. So bad. So, so bad. Okay. This has been an excellent episode. I'm so glad that we dusted off the microphones.
    53:39
    We're back. And we found the time. We're back. Are we back? Don't say that. Because who knows? But hopefully we'll get back to recording another episode soon again in the future. and all that jazz. Yeah, would you say this isn't the last time you'll hear it? No, hopefully not. Yep. Don't jinx us. All right. Yeah. All right, Rachel. Happy flipping. Drew sucks at pinball.
    54:19
    We'll be right back. you