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Saucy Sounds from Stepansky

BlahCade Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·48m 38s·analyzed·Jan 13, 2018
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.036

TL;DR

FarSight discusses Switch PA launch, Sorcerer table, EM design, and indie pinball ecosystem.

Summary

Norman Stepanski from FarSight Studios discusses Pinball Arcade development, the new Nintendo Switch port with real-time lighting, upcoming table additions (Sorcerer confirmed), and reflects on EM table design philosophy. He also shares enthusiasm for emerging manufacturers like Multimorphic P3 and smaller independents like Quoxtall Pinball (Captain Nemo), while defending three-tier pricing models as necessary business strategy.

Key Claims

  • Stern Pinball Arcade on Nintendo Switch features real-time lighting, a first for the platform

    high confidence · Norman Stepanski confirmed Switch is 'the only handheld that has real-time lighting on it' and called it 'a first for us'

  • Sorcerer will be the next Pinball Arcade table release (monthly hint confirmed)

    high confidence · Norman confirmed the table hint 'S-O-R-C-E-R-E-R' was 'so blatantly obvious' and acknowledged they built it using observation at Banning Pinball Museum and sourced sound from Space Shuttle arcade system

  • Portrait mode support is planned for Stern Pinball Arcade on Switch

    high confidence · Norman stated 'Yes. Okay, good' when asked about portrait mode, then clarified 'Just no time... The time frame should not be long'

  • Pinball Arcade will come to Nintendo Switch as regular Pinball Arcade (separate from Stern Pinball Arcade app)

    high confidence · Norman: 'Are you planning on also having just regular Pinball Arcade come to Switch? Yes, absolutely. Yeah, that's a no-brainer. That will happen.'

  • Only Ace High and Jive Time remain from original Gottlieb and Williams EM collections to be redone for Pinball Arcade

    high confidence · Norman: 'So this with Sorcerer, that leaves only the tables from the original Gottlieb and from Williams that have not been redone being Ace High and Jive Time'

  • Big Bear Pinball League is FarSight Studios-sponsored with 6 teams (~14-16 players) playing weekly at Sandy's bar

    high confidence · Norman: 'we are IFPA sanctioned' with 'four tables going in a league... about five to four person teams... six teams... 14 to 16' players

  • Multimorphic P3 uses fully modular, interchangeable playfield components (side banks, pullouts, video center) enabling rapid game reconfiguration

    high confidence · Norman described P3 platform: 'all the parts are on top of the playfield... rollover... two banks... pull-outs... you just pick up these elements, you put them in a suitcase... you've got a whole new pinball machine'

Notable Quotes

  • “We're very excited about the Switch, mostly because it's the only handheld that has real-time lighting on it. That's a first for us, and that's just super awesome.”

    Norman Stepanski — Confirms major technical achievement for Stern Pinball Arcade Switch port; real-time lighting a platform first

  • “It looks like the future of pinball to me.”

    Norman Stepanski — Strong endorsement of Multimorphic P3 platform; reflects industry sentiment toward modular, developer-friendly architectures

  • “The amount of maintenance that a handful of tables need, if you want them all to be working all the time, is like that. You've got to play them. You've got to have somebody playing them all the time who cares that they're working.”

    Norman Stepanski — Articulates operational insight: preventive play-testing beats reactive repair; professional arcade operations require dedicated technicians actively playing machines

  • “There's nowhere to hide on an EM table. You either have a nice table design... This is a delicate balance of reward and failure... There's no music or VO or entertainment except for the design of that game.”

    Chris Frebus (via Norman's response) — Design philosophy observation: EM tables expose fundamental game design quality; mechanic balance critical without production/audio/narrative masking

  • “Not everything that has to do with marketing or revenue or whatever is sinister... companies have to have models that work so they can make money so they can keep doing it.”

    Norman Stepanski — Defense of three-tier pricing strategy; acknowledges community skepticism while asserting business model necessity for operational sustainability

  • “Big Shot consistently is in the top ten tables played, always. That's crazy to me.”

    Norman Stepanski — Surprising empirical observation about enduring EM table popularity; suggests simplicity/drop-target focus resonates with players

  • “He has machines before he sells them. It's just a very, very nice, friendly, good business model.”

    Norman Stepanski — Praise for Multimorphic business model (build first, sell later); contrasts with traditional pre-order/funding dependent manufacturers

Entities

Norman StepanskipersonFarSight StudioscompanyChris FrebuspersonJared MorganpersonMultimorphic P3productStern Pinball ArcadeproductPinball ArcadeproductNintendo SwitchproductBig Bear Pinball League

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Three-tier Pro/Premium/LE feature tiering creates variable gameplay impact across games; Star Wars/Game of Thrones show 'gigantic difference' vs. Guardians 'minimal impact'; potential market concern about sustainability

    high · Norman defended model as necessary: 'companies have to have models that work so they can make money... it's about working hard... making sure your company and your people are getting paid'

  • ?

    business_signal: Multimorphic business model prioritizes machine production before sales (not pre-order dependent); positions as 'very nice, friendly, good business model' contrasting with traditional manufacturer approach

    high · Norman: 'He is not taking money from people. He has machines before he sells them. It's just a very, very nice, friendly, good business model'

  • ?

    community_signal: Stern code updates will be incorporated into Pinball Arcade when released; Guardians of the Galaxy received recent update; rollout strategy under Stern discretion but commitment confirmed

    medium · Norman: 'if they do a major change, certainly if it's a fix... we will get that in... I believe that Stern updates, maybe not all... their plan might not be to every single one as they come out'

  • ?

    event_signal: Big Bear Pinball League (FarSight-sponsored, IFPA-sanctioned) completed first full season with ~6 teams, 14-16 players, weekly play at Sandy's bar; Norman considering transition to league attendant role in year 2

    high · Norman: 'we've done our first full league season... we've got 15 pinball tables set up... about 14 to 16... six teams... I got kicked out of the B division... next year I might not be a participant. I might actually go in as an attendant'

  • ?

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.146

0:00
this is the blockade podcast with your hosts chris and jared you are listening to the blockade pinball podcast i'm your host chris rebus aka shut your trap not joining me from halfway over across the world is jared morgan because he's working. But instead, we have a special guest visitor from up the mountain. That would be Norman Stepanski, one of the producers of Pinball Arcade up there at Farsight. Hey, how are you? I'm doing well. I mentioned you actually got some snow finally. Yeah, we did. Some of us are happy about it. Some of us are not so happy about it. If you have to move a pinball table in the snow, then you're one of the ones who are not happy about it. So, you know, but yes, it's very white up here. It's very nice, very clean, crisp, you know, that kind of stuff. For those that don't live in Southern California, we haven't had rain in I don't know how long, but definitely nothing that would produce snow until just two days ago.
1:13
That's right. It's been very cold up here, but we haven't gotten any snow. Yeah. Well, good. I'm glad it's a nice and white and crisp up there now. moving pinball tables is that moving them from the building or moving them into the building actually this time it was moving them into the building um because there was a uh technical thing going on where you know um i was going to mention during the podcast that we finally got our um big bear pinball league going oh fantastic we've done our first full uh league season of Big Bear Pinball. We've got 15 pinball tables set up at Sandy's at a local bar down here, a local sports bar. One of them I needed to do something with. It's kind of the same system as something we might be doing. I had to get it and bring it back here. Not the best planning. Now you're a pinball operator. uh yeah getting your flatbed out there and then working it um that so how did you you'd called me a while back and had asked for tips on how uh different leagues that i'm familiar with what did you wind up settling on for running your your pinball league for scoring purposes you know i don't know if i can answer that one because i'm not the one who decided on what that was but we're FPA sanctioned and I'm trying to What is the format of your play? Let's put it to you that way. We have four tables going in a league. We've got about five four people teams going. So we play four games per.

Stern code updates will be incorporated into Pinball Arcade when they occur, with specific rollout strategy pending

medium confidence · Norman: 'if they do a major change, certainly if it's a fix... we will get that in... Stern updates, maybe not all... their plan might not be to every single one as they come out'

  • Three-tier Pro/Premium/LE pricing model is necessary for company sustainability and employee compensation

    high confidence · Norman defended model: 'companies have to have models that work so they can make money... it's about working hard and making sure your company and your people are getting paid'

  • FarSight Studios currently maintains approximately 25 active playable tables on-site (down from 60-70 previously)

    high confidence · Norman: 'we probably have, you know, if people have been following what we've been doing for a long time, you know that we've had upwards of, you know, 60, 70 tables... now... we probably have about 25 set up'

  • “Three years from now, there's going to be people with a bunch of physical pinball tables out because, you know, this guy and other people like him are figuring out business models that you don't need an army or a warehouse.”

    Norman Stepanski — Prediction: emergence of small-batch indie pinball manufacturers competing with established makers; market democratization forecast

    • event
    Banning Pinball Museumorganization
    Sorcerergame
    Quarter Worldorganization
    Antonio Artunoperson
    Captain Nemogame
    Quoxtall Pinballcompany
    Big Shotgame
    Fireballgame
    Sandy'sorganization
    Williams Pinball Hall of Fameproduct
    Highway Pinballcompany
    Ghostbustersgame
    Guardians of the Galaxygame
    Star Warsgame
    Game of Thronesgame

    design_philosophy: Multimorphic P3 platform represents future of pinball through fully modular, tool-free interchangeable components (side banks, pullouts, video center); open developer model encouraging third-party games

    high · Norman: 'It looks like the future of pinball to me... fully modular machine... all the parts are on top of the playfield... he wants other people to be making games for his platform'

  • $

    market_signal: Small-batch indie pinball manufacturing entering viable market phase; emerging designers (Captain Nemo/Quoxtall, Highway Pinball Full Throttle) proving business models requiring 'dedication and good designer' rather than 'army or warehouse'

    medium · Norman: 'There's more people than we know... Three years from now, there's going to be people with a bunch of physical pinball tables... you don't need an army or a warehouse. Just need a lot of dedication and be a good designer'

  • ?

    operational_signal: Preventive play-testing (active technician testing ~10 machines daily) prevents 19 missed-experience scenarios vs. reactive repair model; observed at Quarter World (Portland) arcade

    high · Norman: 'She would just plug in some quarters and plunge and flip... finds problems... corrects it... this is her job... 19 people have played that table and not enjoyed it and they didn't know why'

  • ?

    announcement: Sorcerer confirmed as next Pinball Arcade table release; built from observation at Banning Pinball Museum using Space Shuttle arcade system for sound ROM sourcing

    high · Norman: 'I think the table hint for next month was so blatantly obvious... it's Sorcerer... we were able to do the table mostly because... we already had Sorcerer... we did this mostly by observation at the Banning Pinball Museum'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Pinball Arcade remaining EM tables (Ace High, Jive Time) unlikely to be released individually; Norman suggests bundling Jive Time (Williams) with 'two good Gottlieb EMs' to increase appeal

    medium · Norman: 'I don't think anybody's actually clamoring for those tables... Maybe if you package it with two good Gottlieb EMs... then we can be happy... We'll have to discuss the possibilities'

  • ?

    product_concern: EM table design quality directly exposed without production/audio masking; simplicity (drop-targets) essential for player retention; games without strong mechanic balance 'turned to dust' operationally

    medium · Norman: 'Jive Time kind of turned to dust... There's nowhere to hide on an EM table... if you get a nice table design... if you can balance it... that's when things really start to happen'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Regular Pinball Arcade separate Switch release planned; will follow console submission process similar to Xbox/PS4; UI on Switch differs from Steam version

    high · Norman: 'Are you planning on also having just regular Pinball Arcade come to Switch? Yes, absolutely... you can consider this a console... we'll hope that that's the case going forward'

  • ?

    technology_signal: Nintendo Switch launch for Stern Pinball Arcade featuring real-time lighting (platform first), portrait mode support in development, rapid submission process with Nintendo

    high · Norman: 'it's the only handheld that has real-time lighting on it. That's a first for us... Yes [to portrait mode]... The time frame should not be long... Nintendo is being expediting things very quick'

    • 2:57
    As far as how we do this we are at a bar so we're doing coin drop for the games. I'm trying to think what else would be it's all pretty standard stuff.
    3:10
    We, like I said, we just had our finals. I got kicked out of the B division right at the end. I did not get to compete for the big prize, but, but that's about how we're doing it. Like I said, four, four games, you know, four tables a night.
    3:26
    How many players did you wind up getting? I think we've got six. Let's see. I think we've got 16. Okay. You know, 12, Some people are dropping in and out, but we've got basically 14, 16. That's a good start for a small community. We're really happy with how it's going, and it was real fun. We had a great time, and we gave away some nice trophies, and we're really hot to have some of these tables out in the world. So if anybody is looking at the leagues around the world, the Big Bear Pinball League is definitely sponsored by Farsight Studios.
    4:04
    That's the officially sanctioned league. Yeah, the Farsight Studios, yeah. I'm guessing then the tables are not set up to tournament. I mean, you haven't done anything other than what they are in just the regular wild for play purposes. Yeah, and we use the regular rules for that, that if you get an extra ball that you shouldn't get, you let it drain, all that stuff. But there hasn't been a lot of problems. I think maybe we have a couple of tables that are set up in tournament that won't do any of that stuff. OK, but I'm not positive. I know that we have a rule set so that you can get through that stuff. Awesome. Are you guys responsible for then maintaining the machines also? Yeah. Yeah. So next year I might not be a participant. I might actually go in as an attendant. Right. Because I think every time, you know, pinball tables, 15 of them standing there a week being being hit, you know, go back in and do a league. Something is wrong. And the league guys are the ones that will definitely find something wrong. I mean, yeah. And again, you know, there's. we have a guy that will go in there once a week and make sure from here that we'll go in there once a week and absolutely make sure that the things are working well. But as handy and technical and wonderful as this guy is, as a arcade repair person, he doesn't play games.
    5:37
    And so some things that will work perfectly, but will not feel as well as they should feel, he might not come across and we find them when we're in the league right and so anyway next year i think i'm just going to go in there and hang out uh with the people and uh if something goes wrong there will be someone there to deal with it rather than someone who's on a team right so that's what i'm going to do i think i'm going to enjoy it a little bit more going in for the you know for an hour and a half as an attendant yeah and not actually but i might miss uh getting my ranking and all that stuff. So we'll see. Yeah, I had mentioned in a previous podcast when I was going up to Oregon for work, and I'd gone to this place called Quarter World up there in Portland. Yeah, yeah. And the thing that impressed me absolutely the most about this arcade was, well, for one, all the rubbers felt really fresh, and all the tables seemed to be strong flippers, all that going. and there was an attendant, or not an attendant, a tech, you might say, walking around. And she would just plug in some quarters and plunge and flip and have a game and then move on to the next table. And so I kind of asked her what she was doing and what was going on. And she said, this is her job. Every day she comes in, basically picks about 10 tables and just goes through them and plays them as a real person would play them, tries to find problems. And if she finds anything, then corrects it. And if the table's not balanced, like it's draining too easily or not draining enough, then she'll go in and tweak those settings and everything. Let's hope that's a trend.
    7:19
    What's that? I said let's hope that's a trend. Well, I don't know. I mean, but they played phenomenal. I mean, it was great. It was just like no matter how old the table was, it was rocking. We probably have, you know, if people have been following what we've been doing for a long time, you know that we've had upwards of, you know, 60, 70 tables set up at one time in building. Right. But now with things that are going on and reasons we need a little more room and blah, blah, blah. A lot of the tables are now on their heads and we probably have about 25 set up. So we've got about 25 set up. You know, my TX sector is up. my uh eight ball deluxe is up you know somebody else's uh star trek uh you know the newer star trek table is up you know so you know the ones we really like are up right but even at the at the level they get played which is not that much around here people you know people play pinball but it's not like it's an arcade but something will be broken every single week or weakened every single week they will not be running in perfect shape the person who loves that table will come up to me and go, hey, this just happened, right? And then they'll wait a couple of days, and hopefully we'll get to it and fix their table. But, you know, the amount of maintenance that a handful of tables need, if you want them all to be working all the time, is like that. You've got to play them. You've got to have somebody playing them all the time who cares that they're working. You shouldn't be waiting for someone to say this doesn't work, because 19 people have played that table and not enjoyed it, and they didn't know why. Are you finding that to even be the case with the newer stern tables that you guys have? What's that now? Are you finding that to also be the case even with the newer stern tables that you have? What exactly? In terms of maintenance, they're constantly needing futzing with, as the older tables are. At this point, no. But again, the whole the whole push towards Spike and where they are now is so that, you know, anybody who's seen Spike knows that a pinball table now looks like a TV set. There's just nothing there inside. It's a little circuit board that controls everything that break down. Right. There's just there's so many things that are certainly there's mechanical things. other people who are listening to this podcast are already typing to send about their spare machine and how they feel but at this point with the machines we have here with the with the amount of use they've gotten no it's the x sectors that smoke right range things right it's the uh eight ball deluxes it's uh you know all of those it's the medieval madnesses and everything and you can see why these are old tables it's old technology a lot of moving parts a lot of that has been knocked down over the years. So at this point, yes, Stern tables seem to be very, very reliable. So speaking of Stern tables, let's shift a little bit into Stern Pinball Arcade. Oh, no. What? Oh, yeah, we can talk things.
    10:28
    Stern obviously is still updating code on various tables, and I would think Ghostbusters would be one that would definitely be maybe still getting updates. I don't know if it is or not. How are you guys going to handle that if an update comes from Stern? Are you going to then do a patch for the game and have the newest version come in? Yes.
    10:50
    Yeah, I mean, it really depends on what, again, I'm only slightly close to this, but certainly if they do a major change, certainly if it's a fix, if there's something that's broken, we will get that in. And I don't think there's any, you know, I don't want to get in trouble for this, but yes, I believe that Stern updates, maybe not all, you know, their plan might not to be every single one as they come out. Right. And, you know, I can't really speak to exactly what the rollout is going to be for that. But the intention certainly, and there's no reason that we can't update code. I mean, it came to mind just because I saw that once again, Guardians of the Galaxy has an update available. I think it was today or yesterday. and I mean obviously that's a fresh fresh table that's out there so there's going to be those kind of updates happening constantly with them but I was just curious to know if you know again I could be wrong I'm going to get struck down with a lightning bolt but I believe that's already taken place that there's already been some code updates that have come through that people either notice or don't notice okay Also And I was able to Mess around with this over the holiday The Stern Pinball Arcade app Came out on the Nintendo Switch Yep And right away I went hey this doesn quite look the same as it is on Steam and iOS mainly in that you guys updated the UI big time. It looks good. It functions well. Is that going to be coming to the other systems eventually, I hope? Now, I asked about this, and I believe the UI on the Switch is not a revamped UI. It's the old UI.
    12:45
    No, I mean, it's got basically it looks like you're standing in the middle of a circle of tables, and you select the table, you know, the tables rotate in so you know what the next table is.
    12:56
    I got it. It sounds like the original Stern UI. Okay. And so you're in a center of tables that cycles around you. Yes.
    13:09
    As opposed to on Steam where it's the grid, you might say. It's just the first two tables are here's what your free tables are, and then here's the various tables below it. Yeah. Actually, I asked about this on purpose, and I actually got misinformed about this. And so I will have to defer that one because I don't know what's about to happen with that. Okay. I apologize because you asked me.
    13:34
    I did throw that one into you in advance. I think I am misinformed, and it's probably my fault. One of the other ones, and I'll just tell this for people that don't have a Switch because, I don't know, maybe everybody did get one for Christmas, but I don't know. One of the other nice things is that because the Stern app, it takes a little, you select the table, there's a load screen. It takes a little while for the tables to load. and rather than just having to see the boring loading words across the screen, you guys actually put in the flyer art for each machine, which I thought was a nice touch. Just one of those things that you get to see and look.
    14:09
    And it made me, when I went back to the Steam version, go, oh, it's not there anymore. We're very excited about the Switch, mostly because it's the only handheld that has real-time lighting on it. That's a first for us, and that's just super awesome. It looks awesome.
    14:28
    Yeah, are you guys – I mean, it definitely looks exactly like what I see on Steam. I didn't notice any huge difference in appearance there at all. That coming from a handheld is quite a statement. Yeah. Are you guys planning on utilizing the availability of the portrait mode with the Switch? Yes.
    14:49
    Okay, good. The answer to that is yeah. Yeah. Just no time. At some point, it is basically... Time frame, you know, I don't think I will get in trouble with this. The time frame should not be long. Okay. It's something that's happening.
    15:05
    Okay, that's good to hear, too, just for those that like to play it that way. The only bummer with that, and I discovered this trying it out with the Zen Spinball FX3, is that it becomes a touchscreen button push, which I'm not a fan of using my thumbs to flip flippers.
    15:26
    But actually, there's probably no other way to do it because just how the controller is set up when you go into portrait mode. That was the same issue that we had with the PSP and all of the devices. You end up coming up with something that works pretty well once you get used to it, but it would always be nice to have buttons on the side. Why don't they do that?
    15:51
    How dare they? Don't they know what game we want to play on there? Are you planning on also having just regular pinball arcade come to Switch?
    16:04
    Yes, absolutely. Yeah, that's a no-brainer. That will happen. And is it with Switch, Is it going to be more day and date with the mobile and Steam in terms of release date, or is it going to follow more of the Xbox and PS4 where it's updates maybe twice a year kind of thing? You know, without speculating anything that would be wrong, I think we can consider this a console. Okay. You know what I mean? This is a console. It's a little cool, but it's a console. And so, yeah. Yeah, I the the role to the submission process that happens with consoles is basically going to be in place with this also. Absolutely. Now, my impression of this was that it was not very hard and it went through very quickly. And then Nintendo is being, you know, is expediting things very quick because they want games out there. And everything is going very nicely. And I haven't gotten the feeling that it's a, you know, like we like we always talk about that. Sometimes the console process is a little gating takes time. That might be true with this thing, too. However, the impression so far is that the wheels are moving smoothly and it didn't take long to get, you know, to get things through. You know, so we'll hope that that's the case going forward. OK, moving on. I think the the table hint for next month was so blatantly obvious that we'll just go ahead and say, hey, it's Sorcerer.
    17:28
    Was it what I mean? Was it. Did you have to think about it even for a second? No. When it said Fawson, E-R-E-R, you're just going to go, okay, yeah.
    17:38
    You don't watch TV or you live in Borneo or something. Did you guys wind up having to buy this again? If I'm not mistaken, this is one of the tables that you sold off after the initial Williams Pinball Hall of Fame. Actually, there are several tables that we did buy again, mostly the early ones. Right. because we sold those off and we went, oh boy, we want Medieval Madness back again, don't we? And so we re-bought everything like that. However, this time around, we were able to do the table mostly because, remember, we already had Sorcerer. Yeah. We just had to, it mostly had to be, certainly it had to be, a lot of things had to be done to it, but we have already done it. So we did this mostly by observation at the Banning Pinball Museum. Right. I was going to say, I wondered if there was going to be – The carpentry is down there. I actually, if anybody is interested in the sausage you're making, I actually got the sound for it using a space shuttle table. Oh. Right. because they're the same system. And I have a custom chip for the space shuttle table, and I move the ROMs for the Sourcer into it, and I can run my custom chip on the space shuttle table. Oh, nice. Right. And so I had to bring the space shuttle table back from Sandy's in the snow. Now you've got the entire story. There we go. It all comes together. So this with Sorcerer, that leaves only the tables from the original Gottlieb and from Williams that have not been redone being Ace High and Jive Time.
    19:32
    Let's talk about Ace High and Jive Time, shall we? Please, please, because I know my opinion of those, but maybe we can just settle this once and for all. I have to play Jive Time. Truthfully, I have to play Jive Time again. And Jive Time kind of turned to dust, so we don't actually have a Jive Time table any longer. That turned to dust not too long after we actually made it.
    19:57
    But I have to play it again because I have a much higher appreciation of EM tables in every way. You know what I mean? I may like it better than I seem to remember. Right? Jive Time. I don't know if anybody – I have to ask people if anybody's asking for jive time. Well, what people are asking is that they go, oh, well, if I want to completely – basically, if they want to be able to completely discard their prior discs and – Right. It's, oh, so we're going to get ace high in jive time at some point, right? I don't think anybody's actually clamoring for those tables, but I think it's the completionist in them that is asking the question. Yeah. I'll have to get back to you on that one. Jive Time. Not sure if it'll be a big seller. We could package it with something and force people to buy it, right? Well, package it with, like, because Jive Time, that's a Williams table, correct?
    20:52
    Yes. So maybe if you package it with two good Gottlieb EMs, which most Gottlieb EMs are, then we can be happy.
    21:02
    Maybe. We'll have to discuss the possibilities. whenever we get the the yearly uh em announcement i'm always just like crossing my fingers okay this is the one time i will ask for a gottlieb and then this last time we got williams i was like no and and just so i don't get too many letters i i really like ems boy i'm a big fan these days but uh yeah those those two tables have never really uh been really high on my list and when we made them we really you know had no real good sensibility in the in the early gottlieb connection collection, what we were actually picking and why. We're much better at that now.
    21:40
    You being, having gotten into EMs, I think what I've discovered with EMs is basically the only way that I prefer them is if they have a lot of drop targets. Because if it's just nothing but a bunch of lanes, well, that to me reminds me of modern tables and modern tables have so many more things to do that then I get bored quickly with EM. But if it's a lot of drop targets, I don't get bored of drop targets because that's aiming practice. Yeah, and that's why people like Big Shot so much.
    22:08
    Big Shot, I think I probably said this if I've done another thing with you guys, but Big Shot consistently is in the top ten tables played, always. That's crazy to me.
    22:21
    But as you say, sometimes it's nice to go to Big Shot because it doesn't scream at you, it doesn't have big music, and it doesn't go jackpot. And so, you know, that it's you just hear the ball rolling around. You just have bells going off and it's nice. And as you say, it's a target shooter with full size flippers. Yeah. Let's remember, it's an EM with full size flippers. Right. This is what I think people really like. But Fireball, right, is a fantastic table. It's amazing. It can be mean and it can be unfriendly and unforgiving. Right. But Fireball is a wonderful design that is just a great table. And so when you get all the way back to EMs, there's nowhere to hide. You either have a nice table design, which, you know, and the way I always like to describe this, not just in pinball, but any kind of game design, right? This is a delicate balance of reward and failure. A game that gives you too much reward is not fun. A game that gives you too much failure is not fun. But when you can balance it out so it frustrates you and then you conquer it, you know, you get that balance right, that's when things really start to happen. And there's no hiding on an EM table. It has to be a good game. There's no music or VO or entertainment except for the design of that game. Right. And that's why there's a couple of VOs, I mean, sorry, EMs that are not so great because they weren't so great. And there's nothing to hide behind. But, you know, Mata Hari is a great table, right? It's just a great – the original Mata Hari is a great table. I don't know if you want to agree with me or not. I don't have an opinion on Mata Hari. Really? Oh, okay. Yeah, I've had some great – I mean I probably seen it but I don know if for a fact that I ever played it Yeah well yeah That one reason we lucky to have the Banning Pinball Museum so close Yeah yeah These guys have an EM room that will kill you And if anybody who listening to this thing is anywhere near the Banning Pinball Museum you haven't been to one of their events yet. Which they have one coming up. I know there's one right away. I think it's a tournament of some sort. It never rains in Southern California. That's the joke. It never drains in Southern California. That's the tournament. Thank you for that. And they're doing a three-day event. I believe it's next weekend.
    24:49
    Tickets pre-order right now are $20 per day or $50 for the entire weekend if you purchased early. Thanks for remembering that to all our good friends at the Banning Pinball Museum. But anybody who is nearby that place, if you haven't seen it, that's 550, probably more now, pinball machines, 450 arcade machines. Nice setup. Just awesome. It was featured Norman Reedus, the guy from Walking Dead, plays Daryl. He has a show on AMC called Ride, where he basically pops out as far as he can and goes around. And they went to the Banning Museum of Pinball and checked it out. So if you want to see it for yourself in motion form, look up one of the episodes for Norman Reedus' Ride. And there's also great pictures of it in all sorts of different years on our website and on our Facebook.
    25:51
    It's a rather fantastic place. What has got you excited in pinball these days? What has gotten me excited? I like pinball, so there's a lot of things. And you get to go to a lot of the shows. I do. So sometimes, for instance, have you gotten your hands on any of these not quite released machines? You know, things like Alien or Big Lebowski or Big Lebowski I've seen and Big Lebowski I've seen. And it's a it's a it's a pretty nice playing table. You know, it's you know, it was a while ago. I didn't get to play it much. But yes, all the new tables are coming out are really, really nice. People are really thinking. Of the things that stick out that I get excited about at the expos is, first of all, multimorphic, P3. Oh, yeah, okay. Right. I don't know how many people who have experienced what this guy has been doing and what his business model has been. And he is not taking money from people. He has machines before he sells them. It's just a very, very nice, friendly, good business model. And it's a fully modular machine. We know what we're talking about here. Do your listeners know about this? I know that we've discussed it before, but it's basically all the parts are on top of the play field. So picture this. Picture a play field that is a video machine in the middle, that is a gym. in the middle. So it has all of that, but it has rollover. So you can have something on there that you can roll over and hit, right? And then all along the sides, there's two banks that can be picked up that are side banks that could be entry to a ramp, it could be a drop target, it could be a hole, whatever that game wants. And then there are pull-outs that are in the back, that are runarounds or, you know, or a trap or kickbacks or, you know, whatever. And so the idea is, is that you just pick up these elements, you put them in a suitcase, you pick up other elements, you drop them in the table, you've got a whole new pinball machine, right? But the interesting part is just the design of the games and the way that he's getting this to work and the open way that he's dealing with developers, that he wants other people to be making games for his platform. So it's just that one really gets me. It looks like the future of pinball to me. That having been said, what I was saying before I started saying that, the newer tables, the Stern tables are super impressive and fun. They are just, I'm really enjoying them. I like, you know, Ghostbusters. I mean, people have different opinions about what they think about that table. But that table is deep. Yeah. People haven't realized they played it and they go, oh, OK, it's tricky. And it's easy to walk away thinking that it's it's frill. You know what I mean? But it is very deep and it gets it gets crazy. And then Highway Pinball, Full Throttle is awesome. right and I don't know if you guys have been exposed to that yet but um I have not seen one of those in person yet you know and I guess that would be he's going to be coming out with the alien table at some point or maybe he already has I've kind of lost track they ran into some financial issues and had to reorganize and apparently now they're way back on track and producing I don't know if anything's been delivered yet though um I'm trying to remember this guy's name.
    29:47
    Antonio, I think. Antonio Artuno. A guy came to visit us a little while ago along these lines about new tables that are out. Antonio Artuno. And his place is called, I think it's...
    30:02
    He's the guy who developed the Captain Nemo table. Have you seen it? No. he's from Spain and he's got one table at Captain Nemo and it's really great. And he has a great story and he's, he's putting together a real nice company and they, him and his cousin came to visit us just because he's a fan. Right. And you know, it's Captain Nemo is, is a lovely table and he made 30 and sold 30. Wow. And it's, it's just a, he's, you know, anyway, if anybody's listening, you know, They should go to his website. I believe it's – I should have written it down in front of me.
    30:46
    Quoxtal Pinball. Anyway, just look up Captain Nemo Pinball. It will bring you right to him, right? But this – you know, there are people out there making pinball tables. There's more people than we know. No, it's crazy. Three years from now, there's going to be people with a bunch of physical pinball tables out because, you know, this guy and other people like him. are figuring out business models that you don't need an army or a warehouse. You just need a lot of dedication and be a good designer. Yeah. And this guy's a good designer, you know. And there's some great, you know, as you say, there's some great exciting things coming out. Do you get frustrated by the, well, Stern's mainly the one that's doing this, where the difference between the pro models and the premium editions, where all of a sudden it's like for some reason a spinner is a premium only thing.
    31:40
    And on a table like Guardians of the Galaxy, me and Jared were discussing this, the differences actually didn't affect the game. But then you look at Star Wars and it's a huge difference between,
    31:52
    or Game of Thrones, where it's this gigantic difference between how they play and what you want to shoot for. Does that, how does that rub you?
    32:05
    you know, in the, in the sense that, um, that the, you know, again, I can't really speak to that. We only have one version of the game here. Yeah.
    32:16
    That's a good one. I played, and I played the limited version of, um, of, uh, a friend of mine has a limited version of, um, uh, Ghostbusters. And I played it for, you know, a couple of seconds before I went, Hey, no magnets. Hey, you know, and, uh, you know, that, uh, you know, the holograms in there. Hey, you know, that kind of stuff. Um, but yes, uh, like I said, it did not change the gameplay, at least at that point. Um, for me, it was plenty fun. It seems to me to be a good thing to give people low cost, you know, alternatives so they can get, you know, so they can get into the game. Um, but, uh, to speak to, you know, just me talking, you know, just to speak to the, uh, possibility that maybe some games are unbalanced with, how much you really need that feature in some games. That sounds like a learning curve on their marketing.
    33:12
    You know what I mean? And either they just – there probably is a sweet spot of where you want to put those things. It's kind of like – and again, I saw you laugh a little bit.
    33:23
    This is a point that I want to make after 12 years in the game business and longer than that in other businesses that are kind of like this. Right. And that's that not everything that has to do with marketing or revenue or whatever is sinister. Right. OK. It's not always sinister because you got to remember that companies have to have models that work so they can make money so they can keep doing it.
    33:50
    You know, it's not about rolling in dough, you know, and laughing to the like that at all. It's about working hard and making sure your company and your people are getting paid. And that your users are getting a product that you're proud of. Right. People can people start to write letters to me right now about that, you know, about the product you can be proud of part. Right. But I'm extremely proud of Pinball Arcade. I mean, I couldn't be prouder of Pinball Arcade. You know, there's there's some anybody who's talked to me at an expo knows this. Right. Yes. And but when I say something like if, you know, there is a sweet spot in the Stern business model of what they put in certain tiers to give the people in lower tiers what they need, but still entice people to to come to the next tier up. right it's kind of like a friendly tv station that has a tier that that has no sports in it or a tv station that has a tier that has you know just enough that if you sports you know you're okay and if you're heavy you have to go to that you know what i mean these are business models and they're not necessarily sinister and it goes all the way back to tearing down the gates of the rock the rock and roll show and running in because music should be free but there's sound guys to be paid and the guys who put the stage up and there's you know you know what i mean there's an i do know what you mean here that wants everything to just be all user-centric but there really has to be some the and larger your company gets and we are very small right yeah be extremely small for the footprint that we have right yeah so but but it's not always sinister the bottom line is to deliver a good product, right? And if you knew the entire history of Farsight and what Jay has been through to keep this thing going, to keep paying people and to keep, you know, and to keep the product going out, you would know that there's nothing sinister going down here. This is a real act of passion. Always has been.
    36:00
    And I always try to tell people that if you ever met any of the guys from Farsight, you would understand that passion. A lot of them have at the expos. I think we make a good case for ourselves when they come see us. Yeah. It's hard to walk away with a cynicism still in your mind after talking to one of you guys.
    36:19
    Good. Glad to hear it. About that. With Pinball Arcade and I know I had this discussion with you many times but let get it actually out of your mouth and into people ears Because everybody always wondering when is it going to end When is enough enough? Are we just going for the hundreds? People are already writing posts of, well, is there going to be a season eight? Because then they get worried, especially with Stern Pinball Arcade, where Ghostbusters was the only release last year. And so then they start being fearful and, oh, no, now they're getting another platform, blah, blah, blah. What is and I already know the answer to this, but what is the game plan for how many tables you produce or how long you keep on pumping out Pinball Arcade? You know, again, I'm just not I'm not prepared to absolutely commit myself on what's coming. Right. But the conversation about about ending Pinball Arcade has is not come across me yet. Right. So and it would. Right. So. And what is it you always you always tell me that so long as there's a demand, you guys will meet it. I will. And again, we're talking about a company. Do you do you just say, never mind, we don't want you to buy this from us when we know you're about to buy this from us? Right. So, you know, that's really the thinking. But I think I think the to answer the question the best I can right now, because, you know, details are being figured out right now about what what to do next. You know, technologies are changing. You know, everybody knows the issue of licensing and that we are either going to there certainly will be inroads into licensing that we haven't made before. Right. But there won't be inroads into licensing and places we've never been able to get. You know, so all of that is going to just continue to flesh out as the years roll out. And so, you know, but obviously we have a lot of tables out in the world and we have to be smart about how we what we offer in the in the next seasons that come forward. So but but I think the easy way to answer the question is that a pinball arcade. I don't hear the brakes screeching on pinball arcade yet. And so, you know, just we'll we'll, you know, and yeah, there you go, folks. That's that's really the best I can do. I mean, yeah, that's the best I can do right now. Just don't worry. There'll be some out there. There you go. Me and Jared are always kings of speculation, but I like now and then to actually drop an actual truth nugget. So is there any chance in hell of a Jersey Jack pinball coming to Farsight? You know, there certainly isn't one now. Right. A Jersey Jack, we see him at the at the Expos. We saw him in Pittsburgh. And super friendly guy. Nice guy. We did back-to-back presentations at the, you know, speeches, you know, panels. Yeah. And super nice guy. I talk to him when I'm there.
    39:31
    And what I've always said about that is that everybody's real friendly about the idea. And one of these days there would be, I can't imagine that there would not be a reason that he would want to put one of his tables in Pimble Arcade. There's just, one of these days it just will happen. Right. And but right now, nobody's really talking about it. He's got his own thing going on. I'm sure he's busy planning his next one, whatever he's doing. But until it gets to a point where he sees that as something that he that he wants to get into, hopefully it's you know, this is just me talking. This is not Farsight anyway. You know, I want dialed in. Yeah, that's that's all I want. I could care less about the other. And dialed in would be a great one because, you know, it's it's a non-licensed property. Yeah. You know. So, you know, again, a nice bunch of people over there who and we've had nothing but friendly conversations. And so, you know, it's it's just I just look forward to it showing up one of these days.
    40:31
    Yeah, it would be nice. It absolutely would be no reason to stop it, though. Yeah, okay, great. Okay, good. Glad to hear that. Anything else that's come across your mind that you want to share with anybody? Well, yeah, just for kicks. There's just a few things. I was looking back through some of the change logs over the months, and if anybody missed some of these things, if they're interested, they might want to go back and look at some tables that had some changes. that if they hadn't noticed that we made some changes, they might want to go back and see.
    41:05
    One of them is there were a lot of, for PC people on DX11, there was a lot of lighting changes that actually looked like they were fixes on Big Shot.
    41:20
    So the people who liked Big Shot, who noticed that there might have been some lights that were tied together in strange places only on DX11, that looked like a long enough list of fixes that they got in a while ago it's been in there for a while but they might want to go back and look at Big Shot and take a look at that I noticed you guys are going back in and this is mainly with season 1 and 2 tables that some of the lighting changes you're basically getting rid of the baked in lighting that you had done pre-DX11 to try and fake that look but then when you put VX11 on top of it it looked horrible like Bright of Pimbop was a prime example where it looked horrible and then since then it's been completely redone with lighting and now it looks really fantastic and I'm looking at a list of about I don't know off the top of my it looks like 30 tables maybe 35 that has had the treatment and they are being you know I'm not sure if they're all I don't know exactly when I don't have this list dated but you know if we put them all in at the same time you know there'd be a download from hell right and so uh and so we've been filtering them in over time for all i know they're all in already right okay anybody who hasn't if there was anything uh there's a lot of tables that have been upgraded for dx11 and continue to be upgraded for dx11 uh in case they i have to ask somebody to see if they finish that by now but yeah my guess is they haven't finished it by now but um but uh the point is is that uh you know lots and lots the tables. Whitewater Theater, Magic Taxi,
    42:55
    Arabian Nights, Sacramars, Circus of the Terror, Champion Pub, blah, blah, blah. Firepower. You had mentioned before the podcast that one of the ones that I think would gameplay-wise change was Going Nuts, which is a table I never touch. And so before this broadcast, I went ahead and I threw it in. And right off the bat, I noticed that usually when it would do the launching of the balls, two of the balls would want to drain almost instantly just because of the path that they would seemingly take. You should nudge out of that, by the way. What's that? You should nudge out of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not a nudger. But I noticed that that wasn't no longer the case, that immediately the balls, they launched, and they had a random kind of bounce. And then I played another game after that, and they bounced in a completely different fashion. So I was like, hey, look at that. It's not so much a railroad of where they're going. There's actual variations that are happening. So here's the thing. Going nuts is the one I'm most excited about because I love that table. And Going Nuts I really like because there's only nine in the world. What a good use of Pinball Arcade to get Going Nuts into it, right? And it's kind of a strange game, but it is really fun. It's not easy, but it's fun. But the point is that if anybody has not seen Going Nuts, the way it works is that it launches into a three-ball multi-ball. You start with a three-ball multi-ball. There is a timer that begins to count up that you get time. you know, seconds. And as long as you're in three ball or two ball, multi ball, that timer continues to count up. When you go to single ball, that timer starts to count down. You've got to restart multi ball or you're going to run out of time and you go into a tilt situation and you lose your ball.
    44:36
    So when you want to restart multi ball, it was almost impossible. Right. And to be fair, I think it was almost impossible on the real table. Right. So I think our tuning actually was not so bad. for real life, right? But it just wasn't fun for a game. And so now it is a lot easier to get that multi-ball start again. Still not easy, but it's possible. And the ball bounces up into areas that it didn't used to so that you get a possibility of getting your game from two ball to three ball multi-ball or from one ball back up to three ball multi-ball. Anyway, it's awesome. So if people haven't looked at going nuts in a long time, you really should take another look at it because it's super fun. It's one of my favorites. It really is. Yeah, and we were going to have Mike Lindsay on the podcast along with you, but he is in Las Vegas right now for the Consumer Electronics Show, of which there is where the Pinball Hall of Fame is, of which has going nuts there. So maybe he's also doing some just additional recon to make sure that you nailed it.
    45:45
    I hope so. We don't know if it's on its feet. It's a crap shoot. If Going Nuts is up on its feet when you get to the Pinball Hall of Fame. A couple of other tables just for fun.
    45:57
    Scared Stiff is one of the ones that had DX11 pass and it had a tuning pass on it. Medial of a Madness has had a tuning pass.
    46:06
    T2 and might get a little more. Let's see. Theater of Magic, Circus Voltaire. Bride of Pinbot. Creature.
    46:19
    Yeah, that's enough for now. Yeah. Any of those tables, if you haven't seen them for a long time, you might want to go back. There might be some toony changes that you like.
    46:28
    Good stuff all around. All right, Norman, we have taken up more than enough of your time and completely enjoy it when you come on here because you're just a ball to chat pinball with. folks why don't you go ahead and check out the blockade pinball website that is blockadepinball.com there you'll find all of our past shows you can download one of the things we are going to be migrating the site to another site and when that happens we'll be putting on our new logo if you didn't get a chance to vote for which logo you liked better visually you can still find it on our twitter feed although the verdict has pretty much already come down. So we'll talk about that another time. Also make sure that you follow the Twitter feed in general. That is at blockade. You can follow myself at shut your traps. Jared is at Jared Morgan. Norman, you don't have a Twitter handle, do you? I do not. Okay. Don't follow Norman then, but you can follow pinball arcade.
    47:34
    Pinball arcade is on Twitter and it's good to follow them because they always do. announce when new tables are coming out. Sometimes I'll announce tournaments that are happening with Major League Pinball.
    47:46
    Just good things to keep your eyes open for. Alright, Norman. We'll look forward to talking to you again in the future when you've got more good news to drop on us. As always, thank you so much. And thank you to everybody for listening. We'll catch you next time on the Blockade Pinball Podcast.
    48:05
    WizardAmusement.com The site to visit for custom pinball shooter modes. Easy to install, totally unique. Mention Blockade Podcast for 10% off your order. Withremusement.com. Sales, restoration, customization.
    48:20
    Don't forget to leave a review on iTunes or your favorite podcast hosting service that Blockade is delivered to. We can't improve unless you tell us how. Now stop listening and play some pinball.