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Episode 316: Dr. John Cosson

Pinball Profile·podcast_episode·43m 1s·analyzed·Oct 1, 2021
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.032

TL;DR

Dr. John on Australian pinball scene, boutique manufacturers, and community bonds.

Summary

Dr. John Cosson, an Australian pinball collector, player, and Pinball Show correspondent, discusses his passion for pinball, recent tournament experiences at Brisbane Masters, his streaming partnership with daughter Emily, and his perspectives on boutique manufacturers Spooky and Haggis Pinball. The episode emphasizes community, travel, and the importance of volunteering at tournaments.

Key Claims

  • Dr. John has owned approximately 70 different pinball machines over his career

    high confidence · I've looked back through my history, and I've owned pretty much 70 different games now.

  • Brisbane Masters 2021 was impacted by COVID border closures in Queensland, limiting competitors to state residents only

    high confidence · There was a small COVID outbreak and Queensland snapped their border shut...The only competitors that could come in were Queenslanders and a couple of little sneaky Southerners that came up just before the border closed. But we still had 110 competitors for the main event.

  • Emily Cosson (Dr. John's daughter) placed third in the Queensland Women's Championships at Brisbane Masters after not competing for about a year

    high confidence · She managed to come third in the Queensland Women's Championships behind two other very good players.

  • Spooky Pinball has significantly improved build quality and connectors to industry standard, moving away from transport issues

    high confidence · The problem with spooky games in the past sometimes was transport, transport with connectors falling off...but with everything now up to industry standard with connectors on idcs and all sorts of stuff and molex connectors um they've really stepped up the mark to become a one of the top pinball companies

  • Haggis Pinball's Kelts machine has exceptional build quality, including an undentable acrylic playfield layer

    high confidence · I took a hammer to it, couldn't do a thing to it, and it shoots well too...best build quality I've ever seen.

  • Dr. John started streaming pinball with daughter Emily 4-5 years ago when she was 14-15 years old, at a time when only 2-3 pinball streaming channels existed

    high confidence · I think she was about 14 or 15 when we started, so four or five years ago. And it was just pinballs developed so much over the last 12 months to 18 months...it was probably only two or three streaming channels that covered pinball

  • Haggis Pinball has secured Bally licenses for remake titles including Fathom

    high confidence · I love that they got those Bally licenses because I think that's just brilliant to be able to remake those games

Notable Quotes

  • “The problem with spooky games in the past sometimes was transport, transport with connectors falling off and people getting their games and complaining they didn't work but with everything now up to industry standard with connectors on idcs and all sorts of stuff and molex connectors um they've really stepped up the mark to become a one of the top pinball companies”

    Dr. John Cosson @ ~45:00 mark (estimated) — Recognition of Spooky's quality improvements and manufacturing standardization

  • “The biggest thing is the socialising and getting together. We're not a big community pinball people. Wherever you travel in the world, especially US, Australia, New Zealand...it's the same people always turning up. And it's like getting together with old friends again.”

    Dr. John Cosson @ ~35:00 mark (estimated) — Insight into what drives competitive pinball participation beyond gameplay

  • “What I love about your quizzes, and I heard them on Slam Tilt...what I like about them is that they're fun for the listener to play along to.”

    Dr. John Cosson @ ~55:00 mark (estimated) — Appreciation for podcast content format and audience engagement

  • “Theme for me...There's not so much novelty and variety of shots anymore in pinball. It's how immersive is it for me.”

    Dr. John Cosson @ ~42:00 mark (estimated) — Perspective on modern game design priorities for experienced collectors

  • “I mean, who would have thought of that? We mentioned you talk about Spooky on the Pinball Show as one of the correspondents, but a company that has really started to remind me a lot of Spooky and that upfront, honest approach and here's where we are and they bring you along in the process is right there in Australia with Damien and Haggis.”

    Jeff Teolis @ ~48:00 mark (estimated) — Comparison of business transparency approaches between boutique manufacturers

Entities

Dr. John CossonpersonJeff TeolispersonEmily CossonpersonSpooky PinballcompanyHaggis PinballcompanyCharlie EmerypersonDamien Hartonperson

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Haggis Pinball is developing 4+ original titles in addition to Bally-licensed remakes over next 5-6 years; facing tyranny of distance and cost challenges requiring local component manufacturing

    high · He's got four more titles after that. So he's got a lot of work on his hands probably for the next five or six years...Damon's had to go on the invention train and worked out how to build all this stuff himself locally

  • ?

    community_signal: Streaming and digital media has expanded significantly over past 18 months with 24-hour pinball content availability on Twitch and YouTube; Dr. John co-hosting one of early channels (Emily and Dr. John started 4-5 years ago when only 2-3 existed)

    high · pinballs developed so much over the last 12 months to 18 months...it was probably only two or three streaming channels that covered pinball...now with 24 hour pinball streaming available on Twitch

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Strong community appreciation for boutique manufacturers' transparency and passion-driven approach; Dr. John sees Haggis as similar to Spooky in terms of upfront, honest business practices

    high · a company that has really started to remind me a lot of Spooky and that upfront, honest approach and here's where we are and they bring you along in the process is right there in Australia with Damien and Haggis

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Brisbane Masters tournament structure includes 10 days of competition across multiple championship categories (main event, Australian Arcade Championships, Donkey Kong Championships, warm-up events)

    high · it was all looking good right up until...we still had 110 competitors for the main event and it went swimmingly well and there was 10 days of competition including the Australian Arcade Championships and the Donkey Kong Championships, of course, six or seven different pinball warm-up events

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.129

0:00
it's time for another pinball profile i'm your host jeff teals you can find everything on pinballprofile.com all your subscriptions past episodes and more we're also on twitter and instagram at pinball profile email us pinballprofile at gmail.com we're going to australia right now well what's the big deal about doing that i do that every other week with marty robbins on final round. Well, this time a little bit better, and I'm sure he will tell us in a better part of their country too. We'll get to that. Dr. John Cosson joins us right now. Hello, Dr. John. Good day over there. That's my American impersonation of bad Australian accents that everyone seems to want to do. Don't you have to say the word Barbie?
0:44
And Fortnite. Oh, by the way, can we start with the, there was a young man called Jeff Teolis on a podcast last week that said, what's half a Fortnite, Marty? And I nearly broke my radio. Do you know what half a fortnight is, Jeff? No. A week, you dick.
1:02
I get that, but why do you want to get that news out of the way early? Sure, that's why. So if you call that a week, why can't you call a fortnight two weeks? Oh, that's forget about it. That's ridiculous. You can, but it takes too many syllables. The Australian accent, I put a lot of thought into this. It's got nothing to do with pinball, of course, as a good pinball podcast does. It starts out with nothing but pinball. The Australian accent developed because we have a lot of flies. So everything about Australian is you have to shorten every word and keep your lips closed so flies don't get in your mouth. So it's all about talking like that and a choppy Vicky, a larvae, a fortnight, and you mumble a lot or else the flies get in your mouth. So if you're going to impersonate us, all you people, keep your lips closed and don't say much. And you get an Australian accent. I get in trouble whenever I say Australia because Greg Silby's like, what's Australia? It's Australia. Too many syllables. Australia. It's not Melbourne. It's Melbourne. Beer. We don't bother with the R. You've got to open your mouth. And you're not in Brisbane. You're in Brisbane. Correct. Same as Melbourne. Brisbane. Yes, we're in the good bit of Australia, which you neglected to visit, but I'm sure you will be here in 2032. Well, I hope you will. 32? And I hope you'll be competing. How about 22? I forget 32. I'll come next year or the year after. One of the two. Because, yes, you have a lovely part there. Listen, I was only there for a little bit. I went to Perth. You can't deny how gorgeous Perth is. Yes, I can. No, no. spectacular sunsets, wonderful beaches. First wonderful up until 5.30 in the evening when it closes. No, I had a great time. And then went to Melbourne and then made the trip kind of, you know, left to right, wound up in Sydney. Not bad for about eight, nine days. I still have to see other parts. Yes, your beautiful Queensland. That's the one. Now you've said it. So what's so special about Brisbane? I mean, you've got Brisbane Masters. We know about that. Well, the thing about Queensland is it's not really about Brisbane. Brisbane's the capital of Queensland, but then the real Australia starts north of Brisbane. And if you look at a map of the US and a map of Australia, they're actually about the same size. How big is Canada compared to it all? I'll have to look it up. Bigger, baby. Bigger and better. Second biggest in the world. The distance from Melbourne to Brisbane is extended, again, the same amount north of Brisbane. and that's where the real Australia starts with the tropic north and everything that kills you actually lives north. So you've got the rainforests meeting the beach, birds that run up and kill you, the deadliest snake in the world, the inland Taipan. But apart from that, it's just magnificently beautiful. A lot of open space and, yeah, a lot to see. So it's not the cities in Australia that you want to go to. It's the bush, as they say. Anything that's not in a city is in the bush. I knew you were a doctor, but I didn't know you were a travel agent and an ambassador for Australia. Wow, what a nice ringing endorsement. These things will kill you. Okay, sure. Here's my money. Let's get on a plane. The last time I saw you was three weeks after we spent time at InDisc, and we'll talk about that in a second. But you came on my actual birthday for my 50th over a year ago, and that was a pleasant surprise. My wife, Anne, and I got off the plane, and look at that. There's Dr. John. I had no idea. You totally surprised us, and I was like, oh, what's going on? And you wanted to say hi, which I thought was so kind. I wanted to come down, meet Anne. I thought there must be something good about you, and it turns out it is your wife. My wife loves you. I'd love it right back. When we've done some FaceTimes, I think Anne was in her pajamas. I said, oh, she can't talk right now. She's in her pajamas. You go, that's okay. I'm a doctor. Great line.

  • Haggis Pinball has 4+ original games planned after their initial licensed titles

    high confidence · He's got four more titles after that. So he's got a lot of work on his hands probably for the next five or six years, I think. And original games as well.

    • Brisbane Masters
    event
    Bowen Kerinsperson
    Pinball Profilemedia
    Final Round Pinball Podcastmedia
    Emily and Dr. Johnmedia
    Indiscsevent
    Netherworldvenue
    Eric Stoneperson
    Esha Lefkoffperson
    Alice Coopergame
    Keltsgame
    Fathomgame
    Slam Tiltmedia
  • ?

    design_philosophy: Spooky Pinball design approach is passion-driven rather than market-driven; designers choose projects they personally love rather than following mass-market appeal

    high · every game they build they absolutely love that theme so they're not trying to make something for a mass market they're trying to make something that they themselves love and are passionate about

  • ?

    event_signal: Brisbane Masters 2021 successfully held with 110 competitors despite COVID border restrictions limiting interstate participation; approximately 16 Spooky machines expected to arrive in Australia post-event

    high · the only competitors that could come in were Queenslanders and a couple of little sneaky Southerners...we still had 110 competitors for the main event...about 16 copies coming to australia

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Haggis Pinball has secured multiple Bally licenses including Fathom, enabling remakes of classic titles with modernized rulesets

    high · I love that they got those Bally licenses because I think that's just brilliant to be able to remake those games

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Bowen Kerins designed Alice Cooper for Spooky with innovative rule mechanics (ball-hiding requirement); represents prominent designer-manufacturer collaboration

    high · It's probably the most original as far as shooting and rules go because of Bowen Kierens and what he did with it...no other game I can think of where one of the rules is you have to hide the ball from view for a certain amount of time to beat one of the monsters

  • ?

    product_strategy: Haggis Pinball's innovative undentable acrylic playfield layer represents significant build quality differentiation

    high · I took a hammer to it, couldn't do a thing to it...best build quality I've ever seen

  • ?

    product_concern: Spooky Pinball has solved previous transport and connector failure issues through standardized industrial-grade connectors

    high · The problem with spooky games in the past sometimes was transport, transport with connectors falling off...but with everything now up to industry standard with connectors on idcs and all sorts of stuff and molex connectors um they've really stepped up the mark

    • 4:40
    I think you rang me up mid-operation once for a chat. I did. to leave the operating theatre to tell a dirty joke to your father, if I remember.
    4:47
    That was so funny. That was good to catch up. I knew you were in town. I knew I probably wouldn't be seeing you again for a while. So my wife and daughters were away on a scrapbooking weekend, so I thought I'd just jump on a plane and pop down to Melbourne and spend the night at Ryan C's house, catch up with you and Anne and have a few gins and play some pinball. It was good. Got you a birthday present. You might remember what it was, but that's okay. I absolutely do. It's a Vegemite hat. A hat made of Vegemite. That's why your hair's growing so well. It's like fertilizer. I got a few gifts, so I got to remember who did what. Mick gave me some nice gifts. Marty and Ryan, now that I think about it, squat diddly. Nothing.
    5:26
    Bed and breakfast. That's fine. I took their whopper points. I don't know how, but I'm not allowed to say it. Oh, you didn't mention that, I thought. No idea, but I don't know what we're talking about. I have a reach around. Well, Emily has a reach around on the shelf behind me. Well, okay, so we're talking about my 50th, but Emily just had a big milestone, 18 years old, And for those who don't know what we're talking about when we say reach around, it's the award show we do on the Final Round Pinball Podcast. You know, there are nice established awards like the Twippies and the Pinball Industry Awards. We went the other way and did reach arounds. And in true award fashion, don't campaign for votes. Just buy them. So we actually sold the awards, and you and Emily purchased that. And Emily purchased one to make my partner not be able to drink for a month on stream. So Marty still hasn't cashed in on that where I'm not allowed to do a certain thing, talk about a certain tournament, which I won't. That's fine. Greg Silvey. The trophy by Stuart was absolutely wonderful. It takes pride of place on her massive trophy cabinet over below me, which is twice the size of mine, sadly. But that's the way she plays pinball. Well, enjoy it. There might not be another reach around. That was a lot of work. But we do catch you and Emily streaming on Emily and Dr. John. And that's been a lot of fun. You've been doing that for a long time. Yeah, I think we started, I think she was about 14 or 15 when we started, so four or five years ago. And it was just pinballs developed so much over the last 12 months to 18 months with all the things going on in the world. People have had more time to dedicate themselves to pinball. But back in those days, it was probably only two or three streaming channels that covered pinball, and there was none particularly designed just for kids. So I started that with Emily because she was just getting into tournament pinball at the time and I thought, well, if you're going to learn tournament pinball, might as well learn it live online and we would go through our collection of games and play a different game every week and she would often beat me, as she does still. Since then it's just blossomed now with 24 hour pinball streaming available on Twitch and tons of YouTube channels, but it was really good to be there at the start with her and gave me an excuse to travel the world and go to pinball shows all under the excuse of spending time with my children. You're a fine pinball player Dr. John, but Emily certainly has surpassed you. And I think of Adam Lefkoff, who's a great pinball player, and he has humbly now referred to himself as Escher's dad, because obviously Escher is a world-class player. Yet you still hang on to the Dr. John title and not call yourself Emily's dad. So I just want to say kudos to the Lefkoffs, and you are still trying to hang on to that glory, Even though we all know it's Emily. Hang on to the past memories. No, well, she's just completing her year 12 of studies. And in Australia, that's, I don't know how the college system works in the US and Canada, but this is her final year of high school. And she wants to get into university next year. So she's curtailed her pinball playing just a little bit this year. So we haven't been streaming that much. So she concentrates on the studies. She's pretty much straight A student. And we'll get into whatever she wants. At the moment, she's focusing on probably doing cybersecurity and computing, which I know very little about, but I think there's a lot of future in it. So that's what she's aiming for. But we mentioned the Brisbane Masters earlier, and we popped up to that a couple of weeks ago and competed. And after having not played competitive pinball for about a year, she managed to come third in the Queensland Women's Championships behind two other very good players. So she's still got the skills, which is good. I don't think she'll lose it, even though she's got some studies. And good on her for taking those cybersecurity. You're right, there could be a future in that. Who knows? I think she'll do fine. Tell us about Brisbane Masters. Obviously a little bit different and maybe a little bit disappointing too. I know it was just a matter of circumstance when it fell on the calendar, when IFPA opened up. The fact that borders are still closed in a lot of places, it's difficult for you in Australia to kind of go anywhere without some kind of, whether it's a vaccine passport or some kind of quarantine. So tell us what was Brisbane Masters like? It was a perfect storm of a weekend as far as everything not lining up exactly right. So as you said, it's been in the planning for the past year. Jimmy Nails, Jason Lambert, the crew from Netherworld and the Brisbane Arcade Collective, there are many people involved, Dave the Tech, but there's a new venue called Brew Dogs, which is a very large custom brewery located in Brisbane, just near the Gateway Bridge, which opened up their back area, which is a storeroom and expansion for brewing, and it has this massive space. And luckily the owners and the brewers all happen to love pinball. So they made it available to us. They set up about 60 machines there, and it was all looking good right up until the second last weekend when there was a small COVID outbreak and Queensland snapped their border shut because Queensland's been very lucky in Australia that we haven't had a massive COVID outbreak yet. So every time it happens a bit further south, we just tell everyone to stay away. So the only competitors that could come in were Queenslanders and a couple of little sneaky Southerners that came up just before the border closed. But we still had 110 competitors for the main event and it went swimmingly well and there was 10 days of competition including the Australian Arcade Championships and the Donkey Kong Championships, of course, six or seven different pinball warm-up events. So we got to get through them, stream them. People can see that all on the BPAC Twitch stream Our number one player Jason Lambert did come because he Brisbane and got to practice his skills to hopefully go over to the Worlds in Florida in May next year, I think that is, isn't it? Yeah, absolutely. So for those that don't know, in Australia, the quarantine's kind of, it's not about the country, it's about the individual states. So Queensland kind of shut everything else off for, say, Victoria and everywhere else in Australia. Yeah, that's too bad about the perfect storm, But you know it'll be back next year. Jimmy Nails and the staff does a wonderful job. And you know when it does come back next year, you're going to get a lot of those North Americans showing up. Well, we had the funniest quote from the Brisbane Masters two years ago when I arranged for Bowen Kerens to come over and got some sponsorship for him as our special guest. And, of course, we had two other little North Americans arrive on our doorstep as well, being Esha Lefkoff and Colin Urban. And I think of the six main events, It was taken out by either Colin or Esha with Bowen third, and Bowen thanked me kindly for inviting him over so he could get third in everything behind the young fellas. But, yeah, we really want quality players from US, Canada and Europe to hopefully come to the Brisbane Masters next year when everything opens up again, because it's a really well-run event. A lot of whoppers, of course, people chasing whoppers, but most of all a great time. And with this new venue, very comfortable. We have our own bar, we have our own beer garden out the back, we have our own custom brewed beer being made for the event so uh yeah hopefully get to see everyone next year boy that sounds exciting 10 days of pinball but when i go on vacation especially if queensland is everything you say it is i kind of want to see some of the sights maybe not some of those deadly vipers or anything like that but i certainly want to see the gold coast and other things too but it's so tempting with all those whoppers so yeah you're probably going to have a lot of people show up when it comes back in 2022 but we were talking earlier about indus that's the Last time we saw each other on a pinball basis, and that was when you, myself, Stephen Bowden, were commentating on IE Pinball for the finals of the IFPA Open in which Eric Stone was the big winner. That was a lot of fun and pretty exciting for a big tournament like that. Do you remember Diner breaking down a little bit and they had to fix that? It's all on the streams, and it was something to be a part of for sure for that first new major. Well, lucky being on the streams, I got to go back and watch the stream afterwards to see how our commentary went. It was interesting just how much comment was made about my chili dog eating while I wasn't at the microphone, but thank you. Okay, so here we go. We were talking about food, Stephen and I. I like to do that. Stephen certainly entertains me by following along, and we're talking about great food. You talked about eating a chili dog with a fork, and Steve and I were just, that's a foul. If this is soccer, yellow card at the very minimum. I think it's the fact I left it sitting there for half an hour before I got to eat it, So it turned into this massive, soggy mess of whatever it was supposed to be. You shovel it in. You don't grab a fork. Come on. That's just a... But that Indy's tournament, my gosh. I mean, it's so sad. I managed to go to Pinnberg twice and just loved it every time. And got to do the Indy's once. And, of course, they're both no more, which is... No, no, no, no. Don't say that. No, no, no. Sorry. Different venue, perhaps. Yes. Indy's will still be around. They're working hard on that. And maybe by the time this episode airs, things will have sorted out. No, it's not. We talked about Jimmy Nails, and I think of all the Papa Crew and InDisc, and everybody that puts on these massive tournaments, and you've been a part of that too. Boy, do not take these things for granted, and thank the people that are doing this for our enjoyment, and go one step further. Find out how you can help out. Maybe it's something as simple as scorekeeping. Maybe it's giving somebody a break. Whatever the case may be, if you can volunteer, It will be better for the entire pinball community, these tournaments, because it is a big, big operation. And these TDs, these volunteers, the techs, we can't do it without them.
    14:41
    Another thing we're missing, you and I both, outside of the United States, we're missing travel a little bit. I know for you, you like to travel to different tournaments. You mentioned the Pinbergs and Brisbane Masters, of course, right there, but Indisc. Going to tournaments, certainly fun to play pinball. But you and I can play pinball anywhere. We can play in leagues. We can play in local tournaments. It's the people we don't get to see normally that we've become friends and great acquaintances. And that's the thing I've been missing the most. That's right. I mean, the thing about the show is, you know, I've been lucky, as I said, in this pinberg, pintastic New England. That was a great show as well. We took the whole family to that. But not having the tournament scene for the last 12 months as such, I really didn't miss it. I didn't think I did until Pinclash came along and Carl put that on. I absolutely loved Pinclash. But going to these big shows, if you do the tournament, I tend to find there's a couple of things you miss out on. And one, of course, is playing all the games that you may not play normally because you're only playing tournament games. But the biggest thing is the socialising and getting together. We're not a big community pinball people. Wherever you travel in the world, especially US, Australia, New Zealand, I'm yet to do a lot in Europe, but it's the same people always turning up. And it's like getting together with old friends again. And if you're in a tournament, you don't get time just to sit down, chat, and every now and again someone has a drink. And that's the main part I miss, is missing out on not having the drinks with them, finding out what they're doing and getting to know them and getting to know their families. I mean, we see people stream, and it's like getting to know them on stream. But when you go meet them, you meet their kids, you meet their wives, you meet their husbands. You FaceTime their wives. I get it, yeah. Yeah.
    16:22
    I think when they're in their pajamas. By the way, she loves you so much, she even showed up on the FaceTime in her pajamas. So you've got that charm. Well done. And I'll just leave up there. Everyone's imagination of what that looks like. Anyway, but that's what's good about your podcast, Jeff, is I think you're my second favorite. I'll give you second, third. Anywhere in the top ten I'll take, sure. My first is still Slam Tilt. Oh, I love those guys. Simply because they're the only ones that cover tech. and one of my favourite passions in pinball is restoring older machines and repairing games. And I'll get called out to people's houses to repair games. I love it. And just hearing their tech tips, no one else does it. And that's why I love them. I love Final Round because of Marty. Me too. But this one especially because it's the people. It's you covering the people that are in the hobby and most of the people you speak to I know and most of the people you speak to, most of the people who have been in the hobby for a couple of years have met somewhere. And that's what I like about this podcast, which is why I've decided one thing I've been doing over the past 18 months, apart from the last four months, there was a lot of slowness in pinball news. So there were no games being released during the height of COVID. Nothing much was happening. So I started writing quizzes for podcasts, most of which were met with the initials WTF spring to mind for my quizzes. Because they were a little bit ambiguous. But I was bored. I wanted to make it something different. So for you, I've done a special quiz. Should we do the quiz now or should we save it for the end? Tease it. It's up to you. I've got a few more questions for you. I'll give you a clue. Okay. The quiz has nothing to do with pinball. Okay. So if you want to tune out afterwards. But I don't think you do because what I love about your quizzes, and I heard them on Slam Tilt. I loved it when you did that. I've definitely heard what you did on the pinball show. And what I like about them is that they're fun for the listener to play along to. I haven't looked at what you've sent me, and I know I'm going to fail miserably, but I don't care because it'll be fun for the people playing at home. So that's why I like these quizzes. But I did mention the pinball show, and you're a part of that. You're one of the correspondents for not only Spooky, but Haggis. Let's talk about Spooky first of all, a big summer for them with Halloween and Ultraman. I have yet to flip that. I still haven't flipped Rick and Morty. I'm dying to flip all three of those games. Your thoughts early on Halloween and Ultraman. Well done. That's all I can say. I mean, I first met Charlie at Texas Pinball Festival back in 2018 when America's Most Wanted first came out, and he had sold about 10 units and was about to cry and bought the game down to Texas Pinball Festival. And I flipped it and loved it and said, I'll take one and send it back to Australia, and they were appreciative. And I rang some people in Australia and said, get on this game, and I think we sent over about 12 copies. And after the show, it pretty much sold out. Once people got to flip it, it was good, and it was a great first effort. Nice and simple, street-level layout, but good rules, a bit fun, a bit quirky. And then I've bought every game by Spooky since then, except these last two titles, simply because Halloween wasn't a great appeal to me as a theme. And I've looked back through my history, and I've owned pretty much 70 different games now. So everything almost boils down to theme for me. There's not so much novelty and variety of shots anymore in pinball. It's how immersive is it for me. So Halloween wasn't my favourite meal, and unfortunately I've never heard of Ultraman. We didn't really get it in Australia. So I've subsequently seen Jack Danger's stream of the games, and congratulations to Bug and Lucas and David and Charlie, everyone involved. Those games look great. The rules look fun. The shots look fun. And they have bumped up their build quality like crazy, and I've talked to Charlie about that a fair bit. The problem with spooky games in the past sometimes was transport, transport with connectors falling off and people getting their games and complaining they didn't work but with everything now up to industry standard with connectors on idcs and all sorts of stuff and molex connectors um they've really stepped up the mark to become a one of the top pinball companies so congratulations to them and when we can travel i know there are about i think there are about 16 copies coming to australia that i know of including a few at netherworld with jimmy now so i'll be able to shoot it when they when they arrive here you might be kicking yourself for not getting that i mean i know but you can pick up anything on the secondhand market if you're willing to pay i remember when iron maiden came out for example people like i i do not like that band oh but darn it this is fun so i gotta admit what i saw too of halloween it looks very exciting and they've put a lot into that so with charlie and the whole emory family we want to see them do well because of their humble beginnings their expectations aren't as high as the big, big wigs. But boy, oh boy, they make great products, fun games, they shoot well, and I just want to see them do incredible for the years to come. And I don't think I have to worry that they won't because they know what they're doing and they expand and they know their limitations and they've made a lot of happy customers, that's for sure. I know Stern would say when they have a license they will go to their designers and say who interested in this and a designer won do the game unless he actually likes the theme now the good thing about spooky is every game they build they absolutely love that theme so they're not trying to make something for a mass market they're trying to make something that they themselves love and are passionate about and i think that shows in their games so the product speaks for itself my alice cooper is just a fantastic game. It's probably the most original as far as shooting and rules go because of Bowen Kierens and what he did with it. I mean, there's no other game I can think of where one of the rules is you have to hide the ball from view for a certain amount of time to beat one of the monsters. Who would have thought of that? We mentioned you talk about Spooky on the Pinball Show as one of the correspondents, but a company that has really started to remind me a lot of Spooky and that upfront, honest approach and here's where we are and they bring you along in the process is right there in Australia with Damien and Haggis. And I know you were the first ever Kelts customer and I know you're a fan of what they're doing, but don't you see a lot of similarities between them and Spooky? People going with their passion. They both had jobs in the past. They both got families and they've decided to go down the pinball line. And I remember speaking to Charlie and saying, what's the best advice you can give Damien in going into this pinball manufacturing? And he said, don't.
    22:48
    Damien's learning. We chat weekly about the process. It's fascinating. I don't know whether you've seen the latest Facebook post by Damien. I mean, who would have thought people not building a driveway correctly can affect your pinball manufacturing skills? So every little thing tends to be against you when you're trying to put pinball machines together. And, of course, Damien's got the problem of tyranny of distance and cost. So it's not like ringing up Pinball Life and saying, can you send me over another 20 coils? They take a long time to come over, and buying in small volumes is not economic. So Damon's had to go on the invention train and worked out how to build all this stuff himself locally so that he can get a regular supplier in good timing. And he's doing that. It will take a bit to get it smooth, but I've got my Kelts game behind me, and that's functioning very nicely, and the build quality is astounding. He's put so many little extra things in there. We all know about the play field and the acrylic layer to make it undentable, which it is. I took a hammer to it, couldn't do a thing to it, and it shoots well too. It should be brilliant. When you got your game, you mentioned having 70 games in and out there over the course of your pinball career. You said to me, the exact words were, best build quality I've ever seen. Yeah, absolutely astounding. And I'm sure Fathom will be the same. I'm in number one for Fathom. Nice. With the Mermaid Edition, so we'll have a look at that when that gets in, because I really like the old Solid State games. And with Marty's new rules, and he's given some hints about what's in there, that should be a lot of fun, I think. Get into it, Damien. I love that they got those Bally licenses because I think that's just brilliant to be able to remake those games and really change them a little bit. I said, for everyone who bought a Fathom Mermaid Edition, you just bought two games because you're going to have that great original code and then whatever Marty puts into it. I think that's fantastic. It's something to look forward to. And he's got four more titles after that. So he's got a lot of work on his hands probably for the next five or six years, I think. And original games as well. Don't think they're not going to be doing that. So big exciting things for Haggis as they continue to grow. So thanks for doing the correspondence with Spooky, with Haggis. We certainly enjoy that. I hope we can enjoy the next part of this podcast. Let's do your quiz. Okay. So you're the man that's spoken to everybody in pinball. What I want to know is, do you actually listen to them? Do you know them, Jeff? Do you really care about them at all? Listen, Jim, I definitely listen. Oh, is it John? Sorry.
    25:15
    I listen for sure. You know what? The best compliment I've ever been given about Pinball Profile was somebody who said, well, I don't know who that person is you're talking to, but you have a knack of making people I'm not interested in interesting. And that's not true. It's I find out stuff about the people and they have interesting qualities. We have the common bond of pinball, but everyone does something a little bit different, right? Yeah. Pinball people in the main are a little quirky. We're a bit funny. I mean, we socialize well. I find that we have a lot of introverts, we have a few extroverts, but we've all got our own things. So I've just done a little quiz. I've contacted a few of our mutual friends from around the world and just asked them a series of questions. Now, you don't need to see this, so you can play along in the car, and I think most people who listen to this podcast will know pretty much everyone I'm talking about. So you can have your own guesses as well. And it's a match game. So I'm going to read some names and some things, and you've just got to identify the person with the thing. So we'll start easy. Can you see the first one? Match the favorite song, Jeff. So here are the four people. Bruce Nightingale from Slam Tilt, Damien Harton from Haggis Pinball, Carl D'Angelo, i.e. Pinball, Never Drains, and the MIA, Jessie J. Where are you, Jessie? I know where she is. I do too, by the way. I want you to guess which one of them is their favorite song. And here's the list of songs. So we've got the four people. The songs are California Girls, the Van Halen version. It's a David Lee Roth version, by the way. It's not Van Halen. It was David Lee Solo. Come on. Get the quiz right. Oh, Nisendorma.
    26:57
    Nisendorma. That one. It's classical. Don't Bring Me Down by ELO. Yeah, that's Bruce Nightingale. We'll get that one out of the way right away. That's Bruce Nightingale. Don't Bring Me Down. And Layla. Do you know his name? Layla Jeff? Derek and the Dominoes. Well done. You wanted me to say Eric Clapton, didn't you? No, no, no. So you've got that. Yeah. So we've eliminated Don't Bring Me Down for Bruce Nightingale. So we have California Girls, Nissen Dormer, The Operatic Peace, and Layla. So who are you matching them to? You have Damien, Carl, and Jessie J. I've been to a concert with Carl D'Angelo, and we saw Queen in concert, and there's no Queen song on here. Damien. Hmm. I'm going to guess that Jesse J is the opera song. I'm going to guess that, and it's all guesswork. They said this on Pinball Profile? They did not. You're just making this up. No, they didn't say it on Pinball Profile. I asked them after having been guessed. Got you. I'll give Carl D'Angelo because he's over 40. I'll say Layla and, although that could be Damien too. Well, at the moment you're firing one for one, Jeff. Got Bruce right. Yeah, that's the one. Damien, Layla, Carl, California Girls, Jesse the opera song. Yep. Zero, apart from Bruce. Okay, who was what? So there you go, guests, Jeff never listens. Jessie J loves Derek and the Dominoes and Layla. Carl D'Angelo, he's a man of class and standing. Of course he loves operating music. Nissen Dormer. And Damien said anything by Van Halen, even though I said California Girls and it's overly rough. I put that in just to trick you. So there's your first one. So you failed miserably to start with. They get easier. Here's some more songs and favourite players. Now you've got to know these. Jack from Jersey Jack, Josh Sharp. I don't see the song Loser by Beck on there. That's interesting. Ryan C and Zach Many. Okay. And our songs, Fat Bottom Girls by Queen, Somewhere Over the Rainbow, and that's the ukulele version, by the way, Toxic by Britney Spears, and Unchained Melody by the Everly Brothers. You want me to say Jack for Somewhere Over the Rainbow because the first game was Wizard of Oz. I'll give you a point. Correct. If that song wasn't on there, I would have thrown Unchained Melody because it's an older song. So who is into Unchained Melody? I'm going to come back to that. Fat Bottom Girls. I'll go Zach. But I'll go Toxic with Ryan C. And therefore, Josh is Somewhere Over the Rainbow. I'm way off. No, I'm sorry again, Jeffrey. You can have your one point for Jack with Somewhere Over the Rainbow. And of course, Zach many loves Unchained Melody because he's just a romantic at heart. Ryan C. Fat Bottom Girls, baby. Anything by Queen, he told me. And Josh, Toxic, Britney. Can't you imagine Josh karaoke-ing along to Britney songs?
    29:40
    It's a great song. That's the one. Next one. Match the first job to the player. Mrs. Pin, Kate Martin, and we're back with Jessie J. And the jobs are fast food chicken seller, babysitter, and video store. Video store attendant, renting out videos in those days. I've got Mrs. Pin as the babysitter. I've got Kate as the fast food chicken seller and Jesse J a video store. You are the most consistent man in the world, Jeff. One point.
    30:11
    Mrs. Pin the babysitter. Agreed. Jesse J would sell fast food chicken and Kate used to rent out videos. Next question. I'm dying at these. Back to the same kind of question. Match the first job to the player. Zach Menny, Escher Lefkoff, Scott Denise, Carl D'Angelo, Ryan C. Match the first job to the player. and there are only three jobs here. And the three jobs are pinball tech, paper boy, table, cleaner, or bus boy. So two of them were bus boys, two of them were paper boys, and one was a pin tech. Carl's a paper boy because he's the oldest and no one buys the paper anymore. That's got to be right. You can tell me right now. I've got to be right. Zero. Damn it.
    30:53
    Zach is also a paper boy. Zero. I've got pinball tech for extra. Yes, correct. working with Comet Pinball right now. Okay, I got one right, so that means I'm going to screw up the other ones. Oh, okay, so Ryan sees a paperboy, and so does Denise. Yes, and Carl and Zach clean tables for restaurants and act as busboys. Match the breakfast to the player. By the way, none of these things are ever covered on Pinball Profile. None. None. This is from your personal interactions, Jeff. Now what we've done, we've moved to a restaurant with these people that you know and love. You've known them for years. So, first of all, we're going to have breakfast, and you're ordering. I've had breakfast with none of these people, I'll point out. That time you got out and shouted some. So you sit at the table and you say, it's okay, I've got this, folks. I'll do the ordering. So the people sitting at your table, number one, are, of course, Raymond Davidson, Ryan C., Scott Denisey, Damien from Haggis, and Esha. And your menu items are smashed avocado on toast, any sugary cereal that's supposed to be eaten by children, omelettes, and bacon and eggs. Who are you going to order for what? Raymond, you're getting the cereal. Correct. One. Ryan's kind of a healthy eater. I'm going to say the smashed avocado. Two. Scott and Denise, I don't think I've ever had a meal with Scott, but I go good American meal bacon and eggs No Close Omelet Damien Well if Ryan a smashed avocado maybe Damien is as well No And then Escher let go bacon and eggs Yes So Damien and Escher both bacon and eggs. That wasn't bad. You're not bad at ordering food. That's not too bad. These are crazy quizzes. Okay. What do you hate to eat that's popular? Carl D'Angelo, Mrs. Penn, Scott Denisey. What do they hate to eat that's popular? The choices are sandwiches, salt and vinegar chips, or hot dogs. Okay. Carl. I've had many meals with Carl, so I have to think about this. He took me to Gorilla Sushi in Vegas. That's an amazing place. We had a huge table. I think there was like 14 of us. When we go to TPF, we always find a great barbecue. He's an in-and-out burger guy, which is ridiculous. It's a Whataburger or nothing but. What have we never seen him eat? I don't think he eats hot dogs. He loves hot dogs. Oh, well, I stand corrected then. Mrs. Pin is the hot dog hater. Mrs. Pin hates hot dogs. Yep. She knows they're all lips and asses.
    33:18
    And, of course, Scott doesn't like salt and vinegar chips. I think he would have been kicked out of Wisconsin if he said he didn't like hot dogs, too. So, again, same category. What do you hate to eat that's popular? Bruce Dengel, Kate Martin, Josh Sharp, Zach, many. What do you hate that's popular? and the choices are goat cheese, lobster, cheese, and salad. You know Josh because you and Josh are like soul brothers. I've had many meals with Josh. I'll put it that way. What if you never bought Josh at a restaurant? A first place trophy. You wouldn't buy it for him. I know you wouldn't. Well, you're making it sound like I'm cheap, therefore lobster, but... Correct. One point. Okay. Kate, I will say...
    33:57
    I can't imagine she wouldn't eat a salad. I'm going to go goat cheese for Kate. Correct. Okay. Two for two. I want to get perfect on one. Bruce Nightingale, cheese or salad? Zach Minney, cheese or salad? Who would sing the Simpsons song, You don't make friends with salad, you don't make friends with salad?
    34:17
    Who sings every podcast? Come on, man. Bruce. No. Bruce does too. Bruce used to sing. He's been doing a lot more than. He can sing well. Okay, so Zach doesn't eat salad. Correct. And Bruce doesn't eat cheese. No, he doesn't like cheese. at all. Four for four. Favourite drink. You have like ten people on here. You don't have to list them all. Everyone put their favourite drink down. We have Pepsi or Sprite. We call them soft drinks. They call them pop or soda. We've got Thai tea. Freschetto, which is a sweet Italian wine. Coffee, water or Dr Pepper, preferably from Canada. I'll name them. You tell me what you're buying them for a drink. So you're going to buy Carl, of course. What are you going to buy Carl? Well, Carl, I'm not speaking out of turn, lost a lot of weight years ago and looks fantastic. So I'm going to say water. Oh, he throws his little finger in the air listening to Nissen Dormer while sipping. Oh, okay, the wine. Thai tea. Oh, the Thai tea, really? Yes. I'm going to have to call Carl out on this. Carl's got this image of, why is he friends with me?
    35:27
    We are complete opposites. And Ryan and Scott Denisey both want the same drink. They're happy. Ryan C. and Scott Denisey are both going to have, I'll say water. Correct. Scott would prefer his with bubbles. Bruce Nightingale? I think Bruce has got to be a Dr. Pepper guy. Come on, Bruce. He loves a good cup of coffee. Just tell me Josh's. You know him. He's a soul brother. Pepsi. Dr. Pepper from Canada. No kidding. Do you know how that was my poison for years? It was. Oh, boy. I had to stop because I was drinking all my calories, but that is the nectar of the gods. Okay, nice. Let's move on to the next one. What's your best sport as a child? We've got Scott Denisey, Bruce Nightingale, Josh Sharp, Jesse Jay, and Kate Martin. Jesse Jay 100% is boxing. Yes, Jesse Jay is boxing. Josh, you'll know. I think Josh is golf. Yes. I know Kate. Kate was a hockey player. Yes. So that leaves Bruce and Scott. And you can have baseball or soccer. I'm going to say Bruce was, what was it, baseball and soccer? Mm-hmm, for the perfect round. I'm going to say Bruce was baseball. Yes. And Scott was soccer. Perfect round at last.
    36:40
    What movie have these people seen more than 10 times? Ryan C., Escher Lefkoff, Mrs. Pinn, who's already the Goonies. I'll tell you that right now. Correct. Okay, Ryan C., is it Pulp Fiction, Fargo, or Star Wars Episode I? I think Escher's Star Wars. Correct. Yeah. He's a young guy, and that would have certainly appealed to a young Escher for sure. So Mrs. Pinn was Goonies. That leaves Fargo and Pulp Fiction. Ryan C.'s Pulp Fiction. Zach is Fargo. 100%. You're getting better, Jeffrey. I do know these people. I just haven't had meals with them or sung songs with them.
    37:18
    This is the thing. If you're still listening, by the way, if you're still listening, that's the fun thing about these quizzes. Now, pinball profiles really get to know these people. And, John, I appreciate you've taken so much time to put this together. And there's a lot of people that know everybody that we're mentioning here, certainly many of them. So we're learning a little bit about these people. I don't even have to do pinball profiles with them now. So thanks, John. You've done all the research. What movie have these people seen more than 10 times? Scott Denisey, Bruce Nightingale, or Josh Sharp? Okay, Bruce Nightingale. The movie is, I'm guessing, Airplane. The choices were Descendants 3, Back to the Future Part 1, and I think Bruce is Airplane. He likes that kind of humor. Correct. So Josh will be Descendants, Back to the Future. Josh Sharp, I'll say Back to the Future. I was wrong. So that would have been Scott the Niecy. And Descendants 3, I don't even know what Descendants 3 is. No idea, but apparently it's good. If you said Descendants 2, I definitely would have guessed Josh.
    38:16
    If you could be cast in a movie remake, what role would you take? We've got Mrs. Pinn, Jessie J, and Kate Martin. If you could be cast in a movie, and here are the choices. Dana from Ghostbusters, Hermione from Harry Potter, and Johnny Depp from Crybaby? Mrs. Pinn. I'm going to go with Jessie J, Johnny Depp in Crybaby. Am I getting a yes or no?
    38:41
    There's only three, so I'm not telling you until the end. Okay. Jessie J, I'll say Johnny Depp. Kate, I'll say, this is a tough one. Mrs. Pin, Jessie J, Kate Martin. Who wants to be Dana from Ghostbusters? Who wants to be Hermione? Who wants to be Johnny Depp in Crybaby? Why would you want to be Johnny Depp in Crybaby unless you have a crush on Johnny Depp? I've never seen the movie, so I don't even know what it's about. It's a teenage smoothie from what I could see. Mrs. Pin, you're Johnny Depp. Jessie J, you're Hermione. And Kate, you're Dana from Ghostbusters. I'm way off. You got Kate right. Mrs. Pin wants to be Hermione. And Jesse J. loves Johnny Depp in Cry Baby. Which I had originally, and I changed it. Yeah, you changed your mind. Talked us off out of it. Last question. Same thing, three other people. If you could be cast in a movie, what role would you take? We've got Bruce Nightingale, Ryan Seay, Scott Denisey. Jules from Pulp Fiction. I don't know why you'd want to be Jules. He doesn't really have a good scene there when he meets Zed. Kyle Edwards from Road Trip. And Danny from Grease. Ryan Seay's Jules from Pulp Fiction. Great. Yeah, it was his favorite movie, so that was an easy one. Bruce, does he want to be Kyle Edwards from Road Trip or Danny from Grease? He wants to be Danny from Grease. Scott Denise, he wants to be Kyle Edwards from Road Trip. 100%. Wow, I don't know Josh, apparently. I definitely don't know Carl D'Angelo. Who is this man? You have to spend some more time with people, Jeffrey. That's your trouble. Reach out to Carl. Every tournament I go to with him, we guarantee grab a meal. And it's never a sandwich. It's never a sandwich.
    40:15
    And we're not listening to opera. You're right. Well, John, that was fun. Hopefully you knew some. How long did it take you to put that together? Because you had to reach out to these people. Yeah, they were cooperative. It was good. Most people I'd reach out to and I'd get the answer back the next day. As I said, pinball's all about people, and pinball people love to have fun. And I said, we can pick on Jeff, make fun of him, and they said, we're in. So it was that easy. Because you contacted so many different people, that guarantees that I'll have, I don't know, about 10 people listening to this podcast. So thanks, John. A captive audience. We hope they listen anyway. Now I want to finish with a joke, Jeff. Okay, so that's why I reach out to John a lot, whether we do the FaceTimes. And when he came and visited me and Anne over with Marty and Ryan in Melbourne when I turned 50, the reason my wife fell in love with John is because he just went joke after joke after joke. And by the way, I'm the stand-up comedian. I'm the guy who did this for many, many years. And you come in and I looked at Anne and I'm like, I've never said anything funny remotely to her compared to this guy coming in. Who's this guy? All right, so give us a joke. Well, it's a true story, Jeff, of course, as most good jokes are. And it's a lesson for when you next come to visit, because there was a Canadian chap came over to Australia for a holiday. He came to Queensland, and he was a bit of a hunter. So he went to a swamp during duck hunting season. Duck took off, shot it, bang, right in the middle of the lake. First shot, drops the duck. He's wading out to the middle, and from the other side of the lake, he sees someone wading towards him in the other direction. And as they meet towards the middle, he goes, hello, sir. And the Australian guy goes, g'day. And he said, did you see the duck I shot? And the Australian goes, no, no, I shot that duck. And he said, I think you'll find that's my duck. And he said, well, you're in Australia now. Come to the shore and we'll show you how we sort it out. The Canadian thought that's a bit weird, so they went to the shore with the duck. And the Australian said, right, stand here, spread your legs. We're going to kick each other in the nuts until one of us gives up. And the Canadian said, really? He said, that's what we do in Australia. He said, I'll go first. The Canadian said, okay. Gave him a good swift kicking in the nads. The Canadian dropped to his knees, stood up, wiped his brow, and he said, my turn, buddy. The Australian said, nah, you can have the duck. Wow.
    42:24
    Oh, I love it. Is it clean enough? Yeah, we're good. Dr. John, all the best to you, to Emily, your family, and I hope to see you soon. Thanks very much, sir. Catch you next time. This has been your Pinball Profile. You can find everything on pinballprofile.com, all your subscriptions, past episodes and more. We're on Twitter and Instagram at pinballprofile, and you can email us at pinballprofile at gmail.com. I'm Jeff Fields.