Warning, the following episode contains adult language and screaming goats. Listener discretion is advised. I gotta tell you people, the pinball show is coming. I'm super excited. It's Dennis, it's myself, Zach, and this week, Dennis, we've got a big one. We do? Yeah. Do we ever come out and say we've got a small one, it's not going to be great, shriveled? It's cold out. No, but we have admitted in retrospect when we've been like, you know what? Weaker episode. You know what? Not our strongest, but it's still going to be good. Speaking of weaker, Zach, this actually reminds me of something. I was just thinking today about how many years have you owned Flip N Out Pinball at this point? It's been a while. 2019, I think seven years. Right. I was just thinking I've got – so I bought my Godzilla through you. Buy, buy, buy. Buy, buy, buy. You're very kind, and I got Deadpool. I got Iron Man. I got Jaws. Stern fanboy, you. I have received four pins from flipping out pinball. Four. Four. I don't think I've ever. Not three. Four. Four. And I've never discussed all the concerns. Oh, no. Oh, no. No. Did I ship it to the wrong person? place no well you see well you see zach uh they showed up in front of the garage and not in front of the back door uh and you about killed a fedex driver pinning them between your car and your uh the pallet that was his own fault that was his own fault you cannot moonwalk out of my house staring at the pinball machines and then next thing you know falling onto the hood of my car they said the grade of your uh of your driveway was one i mean i don't change the oil in my driveway because it is at a slope you wouldn't be able to measure it right but um it's not like you don't need the parking brake level of grade sort of thing but so so what what do we have for this episode oh my gosh the thing so it's gonna be exciting we are going to give you first we're going to give you some penistry news this week in a ween no it's right we do have some american Pinball news. Valentine's ween. No. All right. I need to get Nicole something. No, we've got, besides the pinistry news, we've got a year in review of 2025 and 2026 predictions from Dennis and Zach. Number four will amaze us? I have to go see number four. I don't know. What's our fourth prediction? Oh, we'll get to it. Okay. That's a stern prediction. Ooh, some good ones there. Some good ones. We'll also quickly review how we did with predicting 2025. Oh, now we're keeping score. Well, don't we always. So we've got to start with the king of pinball, Stern Pinball Production Updates. Last couple of weeks they've been building, not last couple of weeks, the last week or so, they've been building Stranger Things. So we're going to see those roll off the line this week as they start to ship both pro and premium models. Now, I don't know if they're planning on making that one again. or if they do win. So, yeah, Stranger Things is it. Right. Still a hot title, especially with the last season rolling out from Netflix. Also in January, I still think we're going to see a Cornerstone-ish. We don't got a lot of days left, Zach. A lot of days. All right, prediction time. I know. So by see, what do you mean? Do you mean the teaser trailer or that we actually see the game? I think we ran into this before is the teaser well that's why I'm seeking clarification because the last time we had this conversation was X-Men and we had the debate I say kinda because ultimately you went and indicated that no when you had said the reveal you meant the full game but we did have a bit of a back and forth because the teaser did show one of the major mechs of the game which wasn't something that's always in a teaser it was a hybrid, it was a tough one I think that my prediction is we will hear by the end of the month what the new game is. Okay. That's what my prediction is. We still haven't been told. I know, and I do think they really want to say it in January. I don't know why really at this point. I don't think there needs to be a pride reason to do it. Because of the last how many years they have in January. Yes, and that's where I think there's maybe this internal pressure to do it, but the fact that they haven't done it yet is It's odd. I don't know. Maybe I'll have some thoughts on that in my predictions for Stern for 2026. Stay tuned. February, we're going to see the majority of that cornerstone being made. The only thing I think in January that we still have to be made, maybe Metallica remastered premiums, possibly. And then we've talked about March, April Q2, Q3, Q4, and other episodes. So I'll spare you with those details. Okay, so that's Stern pinball for the most part. All right. news alert. We have an American pinball discussion to be had here. Big news. American pinball. A week or two ago, it was announced that there was new ownership to American pinball. How about that? A Texan. Yee-haw. But I think it's going to stay in Chicago. Yes, from what I've seen, I think I saw Map Arcade had some additional Because I got immediately told after I did Eclectic Gamers podcast and we had a whole conversation, Tony and I, about do we think they're going to move it or what? And then it's like, didn't you check NAP Arcade? He already asked the guy. I'm like, no, we're independent. We did all my excuses for not doing any research besides reading the press release. I need to figure it out. Because the press release didn't say. It just said an investor was buying it or had bought it, bought the assets. So, yeah, this last week, I think it was credit where credit is due, even if we don't get it in return. I think Nap Arcade, Kineticist, they had some interviews that they did, like written interviews with Brian Vincent and I think somebody, Ron Linderman, who was there with the previous ownership, right? Okay, I haven't read that one. I only read the one with Brian. Flip N Out Pinball Podcast with Ken and Greg did an audio interview with Brian Vincent, the new owner. Oh. Sadly, you won't see that on NAP or Kineticist, but one day. We're working hard to get on those feeds, but not yet. Sorry, guys. Sorry, Joel. Joel. Joel didn't do the interview. No. Joel's got Stern sharing his stuff, but that's it. Really? Really? Hey, you used to have that problem. So now you've got – you see? They don't share my stuff. Do you think we talked – is that because we – didn't we talk about that on the last episode how Sheet Stern doesn't share any of your stuff? They don't. Not me. They don't share me, but they share Joel. I'm not bitter. No. No one will get that impression whatsoever. Just logic is weird in this industry. Okay. New owner Brian Vincent visits the guys over flipping out pinball. and very interesting interview from all of the different places, a lot of information from the written interviews, the flipping out audio interview. So definitely go listen to those. There may have been – I'm brain farting. There may have been another audio interview done by somebody. My apologies, but I forget who. But a lot of interesting information. We're just going to touch on some of it. Before we get into the tidbits, did you see the new ownership? Did you see that coming? I didn't see a resurrection of American pinball. No. I thought it was kind of smoldering. That Amtron was willing to sell it? Absolutely. No way surprised. In fact, I want to think we had maybe heard a rumor that they were trying to over a year ago. However, that they actually found someone who was willing to buy it. Yes, I was surprised at that. I was as well. I've since been able to talk to Brian Vincent great conversation on the phone and yes I'm pretty excited but I excite easy so temper your expectations because anything shiny and new I love until I'm 60,000 in the hole from an Australian manufacturer saying they're going to remake games so temper have you ever heard from Damien ever again? not a fucking word Not a word. I thought I'd ask. I might. Seems like a really screw gel over there. Do you think he's selling hydrofoils now with Andrew, by the way? I think he's selling something. But it's lies. He's selling lies. There's only, again, I mean no offense because I know a lot of people in pinball are entrepreneurs. So apologies if this gets taken too harshly. But if there's anything I've ever learned from an entrepreneur, Zach, is that when they fail, they think they can still do it again in something else. So that's how it is. Not wrong. So back to this non-failure of a business at this point. So I got excited talking with him and, as I do, offered some discussion points that I think. I value I value my experience and my consultation stuff in this industry and whatever I always tell these people look I want you to do well because if you do really well that means I do really well so I'm going to give you the advice which I think you're going to do really well and I'm going to give you advice on stay away from this because if you do that I'm not going to do very well so please don't do that and sometimes i listen sometimes i don't i'm not saying i'm the end all be all but i'm saying i'm pretty fucking great at my job that's all but what to do first this is terrifying brian what to do first he said let's finish the code to galactic tank force oh i saw this one okay so i could tell from your time okay good all right we're in alignment on this because I read this one in the NAP interview, and I thought of all the things to prioritize. And I kind of get it. I kind of get it from this idea of you're wanting to get like you want if you want the community to trust that American Pinball is going to be OK. OK. Showing support for existing products. I could see where one's brain would say, let's do that. The thing is, I never and I don't know. Neglect to take force and you sell them. So correct me if I'm wrong that I hadn't been hearing like this was the wheel of fortune of American pinball where it's like, why isn't this done? Or the Pirates of the Caribbean of America. Why isn't this done? This code needs to be finished. We can't get anywhere in this game. It's incomplete and frustrating. I haven't heard that about Galactic Tank Force. So that the idea of wrapping up the code, I think, is fine. I just I don't know that I'd lead with it. But I'm not an entrepreneur. I'm a simple person with a simple podcast. I'm not a journalist. I just sit here with my microphone and I just pontificate. So what do you think of my iffications? I think that as a business person, I'm not crazy about the move from a community perspective and trust. Yeah, the people. PR, sure. All right. I think it makes sense because if you don't have a product ready to go, all right, we're not going to twiddle our thumbs over here, guys. Let's do something. And maybe if you need to pull in coders and programmers for your upcoming products, why not first have them learn the system that you're implementing, utilizing the GTF? Like, let's get our feet wet here with GTF because, no, not everybody is, like, clamoring for a GTF update. However, things could be fixed, and fixes can be done skeleton-wise to be better for the next product they have. Because if there's any issues that I hear with code, it's more an American pinball framework kind of thing, where it can be glitchy. It can freeze up. It doesn't like starting four players if all of these events line up just perfect. Like there's just a buggy more than anything. So, but selfishly, as a lover of GTF, sign me up. I'm absolutely, I would love a GTF code update. Yeah, because I love that game. So, love's a strong word. I'm really fond of that game. And it's sitting in a game room. It's sitting in a game room will kind of make most of your other games look like poop. It just will. That's how beautiful and cool. Look at this. We got one in, a signature edition, flipping out pinball, and we're getting ready to post it for sale. And I showed this to Nicole, and I said, look, I don't care what anybody says. This has got to be one of the most beautiful, coolest-ass games ever. Look at this. Look at that, Dennis. That is a badass pinball product. Badass. Is that a tank for ants? Yeah, it's a tank for toddlers I would love to see a little person Just pop out of the turret That's like the size proportion of it, right? You're not going to get my big six foot ass in there But like a little person Oh my god Post something with your son That works too But either my son or a little person With the Dayfix hat on And the mustache I'm back Is Brian hiring Dave Fixback? I hope not No, I'm sorry I'm not mean, mean Dave That was kind of mean No, I didn't It just spit out Okay Building trust with team members And most importantly The hobby community Is the goals of Brian Which was commendable I like that Ron Lindeman Will be designated as president of the company I guess that answers the question He was the fill-in or the replacement of a Dave Fix, senior vice president of sales or something, but now president of the company. There are some team members being transferred to the new company that are currently there. I didn't think there was many. I was going to say, again, not to make it sound too mean, but how many team members were left? Yeah, I don't know. They did purchase certain assets but not liabilities. Okay. Makes sense. Yeah, I guess. But AIMTRON clearly was like, whatever. If they were like that, you don't have to take the liabilities. Interesting enough, they are leasing the building from AIMTRON and negotiated some purchasing agreements for board sets that are made by AIMTRON. I was a little surprised at that at first. I guess, though, it actually does make sense because I assume in the current climate, AIMTRON isn't exactly needing the space for anything else. So why not? Why not lease it? Yeah, great point. the board set stuff doesn't surprise me. I'm, I'm, I think Ametron's whole thing about getting into pinball with American pinball was, they just thought it would be a great way to sell more boards. Um, yeah, but I like that, uh, on the, on this podcast that flipping out did Greg and Ken, they, because, you know, Greg's been dealing with stuff for the last couple of years with American pinball. Cause he does a lot of the tech warranty stuff. So, you know, it's been tough at times. So they ask him some pretty tough questions, especially coming from a business partner slash distributor of them. So I'm proud of them, but also like, whoa, damn. Now, have you talked with Brian yet? I have on the phone, yes. Okay. Have you had any conversations with him about what his views are on tortuous interference? That didn't get brought up. You might want to bring that up on call, too. I didn't get that text message. You might want to let him know about this show in case. I think we did is American Pinball suing Zach? I think we did that yes we did but I don't assume that he's aware it might be helpful for him to know hey one of your distributors does have a show and sometimes doesn't always say the nicest things I think that Brian and I's relationship will be great and I think the future for American Pinball in partnership with the sales of Flip N Out Pinball will be very fruitful. I'm excited about what he told me. Okay. So far, the let's finish GTF code, very exciting. That's fine. But just with what his overall goals are, how he implements them, that's on him. But his overall goals, I think, are at least ten times better than the vision of American pinball since its conception. So, I'm good. And I think he's got some money to spend, too. So, this shit could work. Okay. When asked if American pinball was on the brink of going under, this is what I was talking about. Like, that's some hard questions. While Brian wasn't able to answer that directly with details, of course, He did say there was some lack of investing into the business at that point. So they were done kind of spending money on it. Okay, another interesting way that he's looking into manufacturing, bespoke modeling games. I like the word bespoke. You know, diamond hands here. I know you do. It's great when it comes to suits. And Porsches. And, yeah. And watches. but when it comes to It's rarer in watches. And it's very rare in pinball. It's non-existent in pinball. There have been companies that have tried this. Spooky used to have all that a la carte stuff. Not to the degree of calling it bespoke. Well, that's just because they're from Wisconsin and that is a bourgeois term that you know Bug and Luke aren't going to be going around calling things bespoke. I'm not saying they couldn't. I'm just saying it doesn't fit the culture. You want a custom badge? We can do it. Yeah, custom ad. You want custom ad? Yeah, we can do it. You want some cheese curds with that? Like, that's them. It's not. I haven't talked to them in a long time. Oh, yes. Well, let me get your measurements. I want to perfectly position these leg bolts for this, you know, very well gold trimmed, you know, we'll nickel plate the threads on each. Dennis, you should go up there with me. I want to go up back up to Conson. It's too cold right now. What would I do in Wisconsin? I don't know. I just want to go hang out. I love hanging out up there. Spooky Luke and Bug. Can I come up? I want to play the new games you've got brewing. Let's do it. All right. Bespoke modeling games. Back to American Pinball. Deciding different unique options for your game. Online options. Selecting your dealer in an online thing. And you're building your own Corvette. Not that I do that once a week. One day I'll get it. But you're building your own stuff. Changing trim colors, materials, art packages, et cetera. Sounds cool as shit. but from a manufacturing standpoint sounds like a nightmare. I was thinking from a management, like just tracking it, you know, logistically that I think that's why so many companies have, when they played with it, they, they backed off and Hey, maybe he's got, maybe he's done this in one of his other businesses and he like has a way where he thinks that the workflow will be easy for them to do. Possibly. He came from selling recently, selling a very successful top of the industry kind of led commercial lighting company. Oh, no wonder he loves pinball. That's right. Look, if they have LED issues in this game, I'm going to be like, never let it down. Let's see. They do hope to have game one out. Oh, no. Don't say to Tom like, no. They got to wet the appetite, Zach. It's wet. They have to wet my beak. They have to have game one out before. They'd like to have it out before the end of the year. That should be pretty easy if it's Cuphead. And would like it to, Cupdead, and would like it to be before Q4. The one reason to buy American Pinball's assets. No shareholders or anything to make happy, he said. Right. He answers to himself. Cuphead status, they did ask about that. He said, quote, kind of dead. So Cupdead, very clever. But the door is not necessarily closed. He cannot share all the details on the project, the history of it. But he said, you know, it's a really cool game, so he would hate to see it. Maybe that was an understatement. And I get there's added complexity with it versus other stuff. But saying that Cuphead would be coming out would be a better building trust thing than updating GTF's code, in my opinion. A bigger project, too, though. And this is pinball. Everyone loves a good Lazarus in pinball. So being able to bring it back from the ashes. But I wonder if, because what was that? Canada leaked personal conversation with the designer of Cuphead saying that company's garbage. Don't work there and stuff like that. And I don't know if that was prior to, I think it was prior to knowledge of the new ownership. But nonetheless, Ryan McQuaid. Forgetting it. But do they bring Ryan McQuaid back? Like, do they find a different design? I thought that the design was done. Well, no, I'm saying in general. Do you bring some of those? Do you ask some of those laid-off people to join the new? Remember, Dave Fix will talk about it in the year in review. He was really saying, hey, act now. You can have the whole gang back. So he – Do they have an obligation so that they can win over the trust and love of the community? No. No obligation. I would say no obligation. Here's the – because here's the rub. We've talked at length about Dave Fix, and it's kind of buck stops here sort of stuff for a lot of the reasoning why at least my motivation for framing a lot of things around being under his leadership and guidance. however for brian he doesn't know what variables were working necessarily doesn't know what variables in the past of american menball were working and what variables were not so what i'm saying is again without a desire i'm not trying to be mean but we don't know if that past team is good enough to like why would you go back to them they didn't their stuff wasn't selling Yeah, and if you don't know if it was a leadership thing or if it was a creativity or production, you don't know. So that's my thing is this is like whatever it was, the mix and the management combined didn't work. So why would you – there's definitely no obligation to go and try and get the old crew back together. And it's like how far back do you go? Are we calling Joe Balcer now? Hello. And I'm not saying that some of those pieces don't make sense, but it's like – The coogler. There's all of that. And that's even before you get to the question of would any – how many of those people would be like, you know what? I don't want to take another chance. I need a stable job right now. My love of pinball was a spark, a small spark, and you smothered it. Like I would assume some percentage of those people will never want to work in pinball again. Like this was just too negative. Ouch. Maybe. Yeah, I don't think there's an obligation that you have to bring them back to get the community behind your back. They're two different teams. There's the fixed team and there's the balser team. And there are different people that are liked from both of those teams. That's true. And before that, it was like the, what was it? The John Papadiuk team. the one where they even lost yeah brian don't don't bring in papadu no obligation to bring the team back um there may be good candidates there there may not be i don't know um and frankly the hobby community i don't have much loyalty to like you know you're i don't you will be a a day maybe a week's positive story uh they don't care they'll they're going to get behind you if you sell a product they like for better or worse now other question that i had and i'm glad the fellas asked american pinball turned into like what was it fun sup manufacturer turned into orbit games turned into like they started doing other stuff contract manufacturer helping polycade they They had an agreement with Polycade to help, I don't think manufacture, but maybe distribute some stuff. Whirloball? They developed Whirloball? That was a mess at Expo. But where's that stuff? They have a claw game around the theme of Showplace Pizza? Or is it Showplace? Yeah, Showplace Pizza. Does all that stay with Ametron? Or is Ametron even in entertainment coin stuff anymore or does it get transferred over to American Pinball If so why is it still called American pinball and not something that you know like barrels of fun Sure Uh and they said he Brian said he does have the assets to whirl a ball stuff, but does not, didn't sound like a focus for them right now. Uh, also they're going to be keeping the polycade agreement under American pinball still. So it sounds like everything kind of just shifted over. Okay. I wish him the best of luck. I'll even say this for these viewers of ours I should say it behind the paywall but I'll say it to them here if he's able to launch and come out with the first product not only will I be a buyer I will look forward to it and it will go right into my collection and yeah if it is good I told him, I said, it'll be a really good seller. That'll be a really good seller. So congratulations on that. That was my only question about GTF because they've sold all their signature editions. I don't think they have any LEs left. I don't know. I think I have two left. Two signatures. Woo-hoo. Okay. Now we transition over into a year in review. But before that, I forgot to tell these people. I had one person ask, hey, you guys gave all, like, the sales stuff and you gave all of the numbers and all that, but you didn't give whether or not the channel here, the pinball show, especially after separating from the pinball network, closing the doors there, like, are your numbers up? Are they down? Are they the same? Oh, I have no idea. I have no idea. I know. So the one thing that Dennis and I, you know, whenever we're starting this, how many years have we been doing that? We've been doing this for a long time, years upon years. But that was a thing that I would look, I would follow. Are we progressing? Are we doing good? What's hitting? What's not hitting? I would follow all of those patterns so that we can make it better. But then we reached like a threshold. It seems like a consumption threshold, which was highest probably among the hobby. So it was like, okay, well, you know, unless you drastically change the formatting and everything about this brand and show, that's probably the best you're going to see. Um, so looking at numbers, thankfully, to answer that viewer's question with now YouTube and the audio only podcast, the combination of that, we are seeing higher numbers than we were typically seeing with audio only. if we measured probably a year ago, which is good. I don't know what that means because they're combined, but we're at 6,000 to 7,000 views or listens or consumption plays. I don't know how to measure it between YouTube and audio things. I think for this industry, that's good. For us, that's very good. We're happy with that, but to answer that guy's question, And that's kind of where we're at. All right. Yeah, we have to add them separate now because the YouTube is its own hosted feed, own hosted – because things like – sometimes people ask about Spotify and iTunes and all that. All that stuff, it's downloaded directly from our host. So we just pull the – we were in the past able just to pull the Podbean numbers. Now, a lot of those sites will track their own numbers. Some of them track in really weird ways. We've talked before about iTunes' tracking is ridiculous. They count people thinking about listening as a listener. They'll probably say we have like 100,000 listeners or something. Yeah, it all goes to RSS. RSS will give you a number for audio, and then YouTube does a video. Right, but YouTube, yeah, because it's directly uploaded to YouTube. We have to pull that separately. Yeah, I quit pulling the data for EGP too because I'm too lazy to want to pull the annual for YouTube and then add it into the IU SoundCloud over there. And we kind of know where you know where it's going to be. Yeah, where that and for comparison's sake, just, you know, when you mentioned the six to seven thousand, it would be typical for EGP to pull a thousand to thirteen hundred is a very small podcast. It's been consistent, though, but consistent. Yeah. And we've typically seen over the last time I looked, we would see some growth. But I mean, we're talking like single digit percentage growth year on year. Cool. All right. So to answer, I didn't want to forget that. All right. 2025. That wasn't a prediction. That was the past. I would have predicted that we would stay pretty consistent being the go-to podcast for Pimble. Love you. But now we're on video, baby. Okay. How's that done for us? Do people like the video? People like video. It's kind of split. So we're getting equal, I think probably actually more video views than we are audio views, which is surprising because we came from audio only. So I think technically the majority of people have transferred over to video. That's good. So, yeah, people like the video. And I've got some ideas. I don't want to pitch to Dennis too much. I don't want to ask too much. But 2026 ideas on the video. I'm already tired because people judge my facial expressions now. And you can't just sound like you're engaged. You have to look like you're engaged. I think that's why people love this, though. Guys, come on. It's three hours of sitting here trying to look how you expect me to sound. And it's absolutely fatiguing. So we need more screaming goats if they want that. Okay. Speaking of, shout out to Barrels of Fun. What do they do now? I finally got my first flipper code. I've never had a flipper code. Ever. Well, you always refuse to ask for one. Well, because I think one should earn one. Everyone else has become hat in hand. Hey, sir, son, please, sir, may I have a flipper code? I ain't like that. I'm hard to get. You know, a little sex pistol. If you want some of this, you know, there ain't no begging. Either I earn it or I don't. But Barrels of Fun, to my knowledge, is the first person that was kind enough to say, yeah, we got you a flipper code because I found it in Winchester. So ZLM is a high score. I don't have a flipper coat. What the fuck? No, I don't. I just have a high score. If you put ZLM in the high score, you get a special little treat. So maybe that's a programmed. It is an Easter egg. Hear that, Ray Day? Everybody neglected us, Dennis. Nobody gave a loser kid a coat. They didn't even post pictures of their pinball award. Hey gang, Jack Danger here. He got a fucking video. But us? No, no, no. I'm not bitter. This is like the way I used to be. Now I'm just like, it's a parody of that. But yeah, ZLM does something. Still don't have a flipper code. Spooky. Hear that, spooky? Spooky will come through. But yeah, so Carl D'Python Anghelo. I doubt Carl. Carl's probably like, whatever. but whoever I don't think he watches this show last year Stern Pinball we predicted we're going to see Spike 3 a bigger LCD ding we got that right faster processing ding stronger flippers no well yeah bushings and stuff power supply more consistent maybe more stamina more stamina King Kong we said would be coming out designed by the king of monsters himself Keith Elwin with Rick Nagel back on lead programming. Nailed it. Ghostbusters remastered? No. Didn't happen. We got The Walking Dead remastered. Yeah. Yeah. It's doing great. We said, might there be a price increase? I think we predicted there would not be. Right. Which was against everyone else. We were correct. Jersey Jack pinball. Sometimes all of your dreams do come true. Social media picture of founder Jack Guarnieri standing in front of licensed examples of Willy Wonka, Wizard of Oz, Harry Potter. So we said, yep, we think Harry Potter is going to be coming out based off the films. Remember that back and forth? There were people like, oh, it's Hogwarts. Return to Hogwarts. Yeah, nobody would have said Hogwarts Legacy. Well, Dennis Mayf. But I was firm. It's based off the films. Designed by Eric Meunier. We got that correct. Code by, we didn't know. I think I might have said Joe Katz, but I digress. And then we said, give yourself a spot. Well, I said Mark Seiden for design. Oh, did you? Okay. I more wanted to will it to be that. Oh, yeah, I remember that. What a great freshman game. And I was like, I ain't giving anyone. Spooky pinball. Spooky pinball, we said Goonies? Beetlejuice? another horror theme what are we going to see i forgot what we predicted but it was beetlejuice yeah i don't remember beetlejuice barrels of fun pinball are we going to see a release in march we didn't no scene it was uh april or something it was close i think they wanted march they had a big press it felt like they had a lot of space at texas pinball festival with nothing to show I mean, they had labyrinths there, but what was the point? Behind the scenes, there was discussion. Barrels of Fun. Dune. That was the rumor that happened. Chicago Gaming Company. Another run at MMR. We kind of knew that was going to happen. Pedretti Gaming. Social media teaser graphic with a caption, 2025 is going to be magic. We didn't get anything. Nothing was magic. No, we didn't get anything. I don't know. Yeah. So that didn't happen. Graphics showed fireworks from circus cannons, magic carpet, 11 bizarre tents, an arcade machine, a fortune teller. So we did this stuff on. Remember? An evil carnival. Teddy bear. Prize. Chasing a child. A distant Ferris wheel. An anthropomagic hot dog holding some balloons. Yeah. It was a step on. It was a step on. Yeah. So we didn't get anything. So we'll talk about what we predict next year. But Pinball Brothers, Predator was kind of the thing we were hearing that happened. American Pinball Cuphead didn't. Shifting to alternative goals such as arcade manufacturing, distribution, contract manufacturing, kind of. Kind of. If the alternate goal was going out of business, then yeah. They did shift. It wasn't alternative. Our last attempt. Dutch Pinball, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland. and then we said back to the drawing board to play on words there. I mean, I guess kind of true because Raza now. Yeah, that's true. We'll talk about that. Turner Pinball, new game reveal? This year they did. Merlin's Arcade. Okay. So we didn't, I don't think we did bad, but then again, we're kind of into the stream of consciousness of pinball. So let's review what 2025 was. January, Dungeons and Dragons, The Tyrant's Eye came out to surprise many with just the theme in and of itself. It pulled a lot of non-pinball people into the hobby from the D&D fandom, and successfully so. Both games kind of line up pretty well, modern pinball rules and stuff. But there was also a new shift of how Dwight Sullivan and Brian Eddy were approaching modern pinball code. So I think that was overall a success and something different, new and fresh. Sales were good on Dungeons and Dragons. They still sell. American Pinball's Day Fix announces his exit from the company and hypes Game 7 while he was taking stage left. Yes, it was. It was. It was. That was a very I forgot probably because Dungeons and Dragons was so much of the conversation. But that was a very interesting time because it was such an awkward approach to be like, yeah, I'm out. But it's going to be great. Have us back. But yeah, you can bring the team back later. Yeah, we'll talk about that. He spoke of the possibility for a GTF Classic model. Wow. hell. George Jack Pinball had Avatar CE on the line and prepping for shipment. This feels like forever ago. But it was. Well, because as of a couple months after that, they started, well, Jack started immediately sabotaging Avatar sales, telling people to wait for Harry Potter. We'll get to that. But only a year ago they had them on the line. They weren't even shipping. Crazy. Here's a long time. Chicago Gaming were shipping Pulp Fiction LEs, but they still weren't finished with them. I didn't think they were halfway. that's par for them Dutch Pinball was discussing delays with Alice as they were still setting up production and receiving parts but it felt like they were still on track to start production in February and overall a manageable time frame they felt wrong if the manageable time frame meant still getting them out by the end of 25 because they didn't spooky pinball planned to start shipping Evil Dead after pinball at the beach feels like that's what they're doing and they still weren't sold out I think people lose sight of that. It was not a fast seller right off the bat. I think it sold fine. It did. So that was two months post, and it was still not sold out. February comes along. Stern faced Dragon Gate. I don't remember the Dragon Gate. Remember a lot of them, like the node board? It was frying the node board. Oh, it was the board. That's right. Yeah, because it was like the wires would turn. Yeah, so it didn't have enough slack. Yep, not enough slack. I do remember now. That was the one time as a dealer we had to unbox games. And do the... That didn't sound fun. It was not. Rumors of the Walking Dead remastered started to surface. And I was like, really? Yeah. I'm still like, really? I'm still... But it was true. Dave Fix, he was on the tour. Speaking with podcasts. He loved going on the media junket stuff about how American Pinball was falling with no desire for R&D or staffing moving forward by the owners. Rather, they would just contract manufacturer moving forward, and they were open to selling entirely. He described the future of AP as, quote, kind of bleak at that point. He also made the pitch to buy, buy, buy to retain the same team to get that old gang back together. So even after he left, he was still doing these media tours of, let me tell you about American pinball, my friend. Pinball at the Beach was perceived as a success, a new show that was successful. and ramps pinball manufacturing showed off ramps road trip at the beach haven't heard anything since no we talked about it one episode and i don't think we've mentioned it until now since then and i think it pissed off that person that was not our intentions um oh were they mad i think so our intentions i think the only thing i remember i don't remember that game zach other than i think i started going rowdy ramps rowdy couldn't piss him off that's the best part of uh of that uh That was a massive account. I don't know. Don't be mad at us. We weren't intentionally trying. I'm not proud of you, Ram Browns. By February, Spooky Pinball had sold around 750 Evil Dead games, so still not sold out in February. Right. Someone posted a pic of the concept art for Pee Wee's Pinball Adventure in February by Christopher Franchi, and talk of AP just not following through that license, but a possibility over there. And then Fun's Up Manufacturing was announced in February. more delays from Dutch Pinball in February with parts not arriving until the second half of March now but they still believe that all Alice games were going to ship by the end of the year oops spoiler alert they were wrong March comes along spooky they sell out of Evil Dead at TPF yeah basically it was actually before the main show opened when I went to get my I don't know if I fully told this story I think I did on the Click to Gamers but just a quick nutshell uh so i went to get my registration badge for that evening that the friday and someone walked up and it's like why don't you have access now i'm like because i don't pay 60 to have three hours of access and i like let's just get you some passes because you know when you're a little fish in a littler pond you can sometimes get passes and then i found out there were media passes i didn't know about but anyway so did that and so i was able to went over to Spooky's booth and I played Evil Dead and while I was playing, Bud came up and he was super excited and he was like, we just sold the last one of the Evil Deads. They're gone. We don't have to stress about anything. We're not taking any of them back with us. Do you want to buy a Texas Chainsaw Massacre? That's right. Like, no. I want an Evil Dead. And then he gave me a hat that I still not add the bravery to wear on this podcast. I haven't either. I haven't either. But people haven't appreciated it because they didn't appreciate it with my TV. I wear a different hat each time. Oh, I've not noticed that. Well, because they're also samey. Okay, I need to... I don't collect hats. I get into a hat and I really get into that. I almost wore this, and this is a conflict because I'm wearing my Syracuse hoodie today because it's my zip hoodie. I almost just wore it with the hood because it's so cold. I have allegiance to both. I like a backwards cap at times Just really to show that I'm hunkered down in my new business. Because what? You're 17? That's right. Going on 60? Nothing turns on a woman like a – I'm telling you. If you're doing it right, lifting some weights, got a nice shirt on, you got a beard, you get that hat going backwards. Yeah. I'm sure you walk up with your skate deck upstairs and say, hello, fellow kids. Steve Buscemi, baby. But the problem is you never want a red backwards cap because then you're fucking limp biscuit. So that's not a good look, the old red backwards cap. Well, you do have prominently saying Hoosiers to make clear that it's. Who, who, who, Hoosiers? Oh, my gosh. Did you watch that game? No, I did not see it. Most watched college football. All right, this isn't a sports broadcast. All right. Portal and Merlin's Arcade were announced. Oh, yes. Yeah, so people got to play those at TPF. That was like... Portal went over very well at TPF. People liked that game. They're still kind of shipping those things out. I'd still like to speak with Multimorphic. Maybe I can speak with Kevin Manning, the new guy over at Multimorphic. Oh, I missed that news. Yep, Kevin Manning from Buffalo Pinball is now media... I don't know what his title is, but a friend of mine I would consider a friend. CGC announces Medieval Madness Remake Merlin Edition kind of took over the TPF show planning on making, initially just making a thousand units, priced them at $12,000, they wanted to build them starting in the summer and concluding into 2026, I think that was accurate, that's what they did the company also launches Cactus Canyon Remake Upgrade Kit with the accompanied feature that I was able to do years prior for just the CCR game, but it was nice to see Lyman Sheets get like this final interview kind of thing on video just a momentous occasion and honor to do all that so that's why I bring that up was it shared anywhere on the news sites? No I'm not bitter you're not you've moved past that part of your life I just don't understand you just hate somebody so much that you just I'm just saying maybe it's not news we'll talk about it here does that make you feel better? Jack Guarnieri from JJP told TPF attendees to save their money for the upcoming Harry Potter pinball machine. I understand it, except everyone's reaction was, why did you just cut the legs out from underneath Avatar? It was weird. It was very weird. So then the sales were like, wait, should we take that? Should we not take that? What are we doing? How are we doing? Can we? That was a damn mess. I get his instinct, though, in the sense that it was a crowded year. It worked. It was a crowded year. Yeah. In April, that's when we came up with the industry term Trough Jam 2025. That was your idea. It was very clever. A number of phases. Phase one of Trough Jam 2025 was Portal and Merlin's Arcade. You can also say Medieval Madness Merlin Edition, the phase of the Merlins there. All right. Also, April, the Pinball Network closes doors. Wah, wah. Many in the hobby at that time in April, many in the hobby, really pushing the idea of the prices and the interest in pinball had fallen. The tariffs were going to even further destroy the market. Remember that? People were like, this is doomed. Pinball's dead. This isn't pandemic times anymore. And there was some doom and gloom. Then I did give a pinball market trends of epic proportions, I might add, as I presented market psychology in pinball and how perceptions do not always match data and number patterns. You kind of shot it down. Ended up, I think we were kind of both correct, but I remember it being a really popular and good discussion on what the emotion from a hobby is interpreting versus the truth versus all of that. and then Trough Jam beguneth. Dune announced by Barrels of Fun Pinball, or Trough Jam Phase 2. Dune announced by Barrels of Fun Pinball and that was I think with some mixed reviews. Code wasn't far enough along really for the announcement but again, much like Jack and the whole thing with Save Your Money, I think Barrels was looking down the barrel here and they're like, oh my god, we know what's coming. It was coming. At that time, Predator's coming. King Kong. And they knew Elwynn's game was coming. It was coming faster. It was coming faster than they wanted. We got Dune, so we got to get this thing out there. It did surprise a lot of people with its immersive qualities and its mechs and stuff like that. And then the day after they announced Dune, King Kong, Myth of Terror Island was announced by Stern Pinball, Keith Elwin's next game. So that was a jam there. Overall game sales did see a significant spike with those releases. So it kind of balanced out what people were freaking out about. But people were still poo-pooing. Dune's not selling. King Kong's not selling. Everything sucks. May comes along. Kong's already started shipping. That's what we love about Stern Pinball. Stern showcases their new UI in the game menu system. Still mixed on that. Overall, positive reception of the game, King Kong. But there were notes that the code was early and some mixed on the art package overall. So, eh. Dune's already started to ship as well. if everybody remembers back in right when it was announced pretty much that month after they were starting to ship people were surprised by the immersion and features but early code did plague the sales of that game initially it has hit fire now but second half of the year evil dead started hitting the hype index after selling out the month before and now topping the pin side top 100 number 1 and then the fever really hit. The rumor of an upcoming Star Wars episodes 1 through 3 continue to swirl around the hobby chatter in May. June comes along. We're getting ready to say we've got summer here. Harry Potter's launched by Jersey Jack Pinball with just general overall praise and excitement. The CEs were the first on the production line and a week or two later we fall into the derpy Dragon Gate issue. It didn't really compromise sales much. It didn't, but there was a big, long, probably three-month discussion following about the topic of AI use in artwork and pinball. Ken Cromwell joined the Flip N Out Pinball team. Interesting transition from Jersey Jack, formerly, and people were like, oh, is it because of Derby? No, it's because... Yes, Ken, renowned artist for JJP. Excuse me. We're a renowned AI prompt generator for art. I know. He is a good AI prompt generator. But no, he stood at the meetings and said, it's either Derp the Magic Dragon or it's me. They're like, well, Ken, now you live by the sea. No, that's not the case. We were working on that prior to it. But it was an exciting move and one that the industry did kind of talk about. Wait a minute. What? Why would anyone go from a prestigious manufacturer to a distro? Dealer? Yeah. I should say hello. Predator was announced by Pinball Brothers, but no on the – We didn't know that at first, though. We didn't. That's a part we – Over time, we figured – Yeah that true Because like the first stream people are like oh no they not Arnold And then people saw the first stream of it I remember we had I think it was one of our Nord Manor screening We had a TPS happy hour and someone was like well no I watched the But that was not an official stream. That was a leaked. We only found that out the next day. Like this has just happened. So we had the thing that night, just coincidence. And someone was like, well, I was watching, and they had full-on shots with Arnold. Maybe it wasn't a lot of like close-ups of his face, but they had a lot of shots with him. And then it was like, oh, no, no, no. Pinball Brothers had to say that that footage was not the approved one. That was an early, you know, like proposed version. And then people also found out about the sound alike because they also didn't have his voice. Who's got that code out there? Somebody got that code? I don't remember who did that stream. If it was. I don't know. I don't recall if it was like at their – It's got to be out there somewhere. Mixed reception for the Predator game and below average sales. It was not a hit. The worst sound like a – Get to the chopper now, Doug. I like the arms. He's a red polo. You have super heroes. You have Carl Carl Weathers, and then you've got like my arm going. It was a little baby bicep. That's horrible. That's the best we could do. What do you expect? We're based out of Europe. July comes along. Trough Jam 2025 concludes with extra ball. Remember, there was a phase three was Harry Potter and with Predator. But I said that there was an extra ball phase coming, And that was as Stern Pinball launched in July, Joel's 50th anniversary edition with the LE features at the price of a premium model. Mixed initial reception, but some exceptional sales initially and thereafter. It just kept being a hit. Perception then changed within a few weeks. People were like, this is like a popsicle from July 4th. Yeah, bomb pops. Bomb pop. The side of the cab with all that extra sky did look a little bomb poppy. It did. I never really understood why there was so much excitement on it. I was glad, though, that they didn't do a black and white version like they've done for all the special editions. I was hoping for that black and white with the red accents. I know you were. Hey, it sold well with color, so maybe that's a lesson. Yeah, I'm so sad that we're about sold out of them. Like, it's a gift that was keeping on giving, Clark. August comes around, and I totaled the flipping out pinball van. Oh, yeah, that's right. Oh, man. I about died. No, I didn't. I didn't. A little sore, but some scratches. That poor van. I still haven't got it. I've got to design the wrap to redo the wrap. But I've been waiting for maybe the next turn release to put that artwork on there. Just saying. Star Wars Home Edition launches at Costco. George Gomez talks with the Loser Kids about the move and their goal to have another home edition game in 2026, which we here at the Pinball Show predicted at that time to be Pokemon. George also teased the upcoming Spike 3 system, spoke of Jack Danger moving to the head of community position at the company, and working with the team to finish an upcoming Cornerstone game. Also in August, the season of The List begins with the next rumored spooky pinball machine. And people were like, shit, Evil Dead is now bumping, like going up in price. They're all sold out. We need to get on the list. And then dealers were plagued with taking lists for whatever could be next. We really gave a popular bonus content episode to the supporters that we called The Tales of a Pinball Distributor. Very much behind the scenes. There was a lot of positive feedback on that. Yeah, we got that one and the follow-up to that we'll talk about later on. And we also got the follow-up, the dark tales of the pinball distributor, which Dennis still cackles about. I mean, I do feel bad because I understand it is really stressful. But from the outside, it is funny. Yeah, I know. That one was rough. Oh, my God. Damn. It's like whoever would think you don't open up a coin door and find used condoms in it. It's that level. I'm like, what? You've got to go listen. What happened to this thing? It rolled down a hill. What is this? The Pinball Brothers adjusted pricing in August of Predator to assist with tariff confusions. Additional confusion as to the future of American pinball. What's this, Orbit Games? Cuphead Labor Day blowout? Oktoberfest unretiring? It was a mess over there. Yeah, people at this point were – there were a lot of Cuphead – like content creators apparently had gotten to see – some of them at least, had gotten to see Cuphead and play around with it. So stuff started floating out there, I saw publicly, where people were like, well, now that whatever's going on with it, I don't know, maybe it was a desire. Like if enough of this, like if people had this groundswell of interest, it would help push American Pinball over and putting it into production. I don't know that it was really that much of an ulterior motive. I think maybe people were just like, well, if it's not going to come out, let's let people at least see what a great idea was. That's true. I don't know. And also that month, if you remember, Dennis, rumors of Sonic the Hedgehog started being the next JJP game kind of heating up. People are like, okay, Harry Potter is awesome. And everybody is like, Evil Dead is awesome. What's next from Spooky? Harry Potter is awesome. What's next from JJP? That's always been this hobby. Yep. You have like three days of talking about what just came out, and then it's immediately on to the next. And people at JJP can be kind of chatty. So that's what – there's a rumor. Is that why we always know everything they're doing? We're still kind of stuck with the rumor of Sonic the Hedgehog being the next Steve Ritchie kind of thing. But we'll talk about that in the predictions. I hope the topper is a chili dog. Another, let's see. Oh, September. Star Wars Follow the Empire launched by Stern Pinball. And our first more clear look into the Spike 3 system. Reception was mixed. Overall sales initially just average. Weren't horrible, weren't great. Good LE sales, but mixed overall. It was nice to see the confirmation that it wasn't episodes one through three, but that it was the same trilogy they always do. I'm still running for episodes one to three. Nobody cares. They're bad. No, they're not. Especially episode one. Episode one. Who is the protagonist of episode one, Zach? Doesn't need to be. We're just starting a story. You have to have a protagonist. There isn't one is the answer. You know, what's his name? a little boy yeah annie yeah why not a little evil annie annie let's try spinning that's a neat trick wow what was he full delivery or uh whatever happened to the kid black swan black swan was the protagonist in that right kill black swan what's her name um natalie portman uh what's her name pad one padway padme padme i knew the scenes weren't even her it was her double well she's doing black if you wish to discuss this in committee then i think we have to cough a new leadership oh yeah let's introduce a bunch of kids to uh to political parliamentary rules because that just goes over great and you had jedis on a motherfucking plane with samuel jackson come on with wind you mean it's this boy you re-watch it because you clearly don't remember I love it more every time. You clearly don't remember. And Yoda's like, trust not this fucker, I would. Like, evil bastard he is, I'm telling you. Liam Neeson not remembering how to sword fight? He starred in Rob Roy. How did he not remember how to duel? Hey, those still, compared to the new ones, those battle sequences with Darth Maul and stuff like that, pretty phenomenal. Phantom Menace has the best Duel of the Fates is the best Star Wars song ever to be done I will give that that's all you're giving? yes! Revenge of the Sith? it's fucking great I've been playing the Jedi Soul Survivor one of the video game Jedi games and every time I do something in it I go I'm just as obnoxious by myself as I am on this show and just make my own little sounds yeah I still think it needs to be done I still think it could be. I think it has aged very well. No. Even the branding has aged very well. Don't do it. Don't worry. I'm sure in five years, Stern will do the original trilogy again, and you'll say it's a good idea again. It is. Sex is always good. Sex always sells. But I've had sex before. Well, let's have more. I know you think this analogy is strong. It's not as strong as you think it is. I'm not going to go into it anymore. There were, in September, rumors of Transformers and Fallout games coming from Stern Pinball in the future. That's where they started brewing in September. Dutch Pinball Chatter from Canadian Pinball Podcast was around them banking on the success of the recently squeezed in, they were going to be squeezing in Raza to keep that company going. But we're still waiting for the Raza stuff. But interesting enough, September also, Medieval Madness Merlin and Cactus Kits started to ship. October, Winchester Mystery House comes out of nowhere by barrels of fun, surprises the entire hobby industry the best way ever, and new industry game designer Carl D'Python Anghelo, leading right up to the Pinball Expo convention. The game sold out immediately, within 24 hours, gone, 525 units. That was huge. Dennis and I dissect the release of that game and why and how that plan worked to find overnight success in a meaningly unknown licensed game. The talk of Expo was Winchester in October. Big Trouble in Little China was the homebrew that people were loving. Hexa Pinball announced the next theme of their game, Three Musketeers. Dutch Pinball announced 333 Razzas they were going to develop. and that if people don't bail on their Alice orders by the end of the year and get a refund, then they'll be the first in line for Back to the Future. And then CGC says, more Merlins are coming in January. Oh, and Whirlaball. Don't want to forget Whirlaball. Trending down in October and Expo in general was the internet pricing of that show. Oh, yes. $5,000 for a few days of booth connectivity. That used to, back in the day, get you a pro. Man, suck a D The spooky pinball memed out with Beetlejuice As a teaser for people to remember What was on the horizon Remember that? Winchester came out and they were like Don't forget about me Yeah, it did feel a little like it was time To try and cut the legs out from under Winchester But in a clunky Wisconsin way That's right We got add-ons We can make your legs look the color you want Bespoke That's right. Bee spokes. They never say bespoke. Yeah. I don't know about no bee spokes, but I've never put bee spokes on legs, but we can try it. Beetlejuice teaser, at the end of the month, we did see the Beetlejuice teaser and launched the game. Launching the game was going to be early November. Still really weird. Teaser came out so early for sales. Weeks before, yeah. Before reveal, I should say, because sales went a little weird on that game. Yeah, because that launched the whole frenzy of the equivalent of like Tickle Me Elmo melees from the 90s kind of things. And so it was almost sold out before it was sold. But first, The Walking Dead Remastered showed up in early November. It was announced below average reception and some controversy about the color palette used in the art package. And just overall questions on the licensing delays, maybe difficulties behind that title. as a reminder at this point last year we were at .96 on Metallica remastered what was Walking Dead's launch version I don't know we didn't see any they didn't even show us the code at first they didn't show us anything and then I had heard last I had heard and actually last I still heard was I don't know what new stuff's in it I don't think anything yet there's no new rules any yet. Again, I don't get it. I'm still holding out. I still think it's fucking dead. No, I'm not disputing that. I'm just like, why launch it at all? I don't know. That was a bit of a mess. It felt like Bond all over again with the licensing. But I don't know. That's just what I'm guessing. What else happened? Oh, Beetlejuice. Yeah, that was announced with a frenzy of anticipation and And essentially being sold out before the game was even launched or even shown at all. I said essentially because Spooky was taking orders on launch day. We were not taking money until launch day. But all the other dealers had sold out all of their stuff at the end of October. They did do a Midnight Madness event as well. Wasn't that Don? Yep. Don's Pinball Podcast idea. I was coordinating that. So that was cool. People liked that. I heard it went well. I think people are – they'll probably do that again for the next game if I had to guess. The Pinball Show presented popular discussions on FOMO versus NOMO. That was nicely done. People liked that. As we entered the whole over MSRP market with Beetlejuice, Evil Dead, Winchester Mystery House. We haven't been used to that in years of something that sells and sells. You can flip the spots. As well as an episode we titled Supply and Demand. How should the hobby handle extremely desirable future releases? and we had some help from the Pinball Show official club members for that episode. Hobbyists start to rally around the smaller pinball manufacturers. This happens in November, and we're still kind of feeling that in the talk space today. Poo-poo in the Kingstern. So December, we did our Season Shillings giveaway at the Pinball Show. George Gomez interview on Kerry Hardy was kind of a highlight of the year about the cabinets and stuff. JP DeWin out at JJP, and we discussed the sales and data trends from a business perspective here on the Pinball Show. That was 2025. What happened? It was a really intensive year. So what's going to happen in 2026? I think it's going to... You thought 2025 was good? I think 2026 is going to be good, too. We've talked about this a little bit, But we're going to give our predictions, viewer, on what's coming in 2026. Now, the majority of this is going to be done here for you frugal, money-conscious viewers, but for those ballers and sweet lovers of the pinball shows. We call supporters, true supporters. Some of it is going to be for the official club members. and you can sign up today by going to patreon.com slash the pinball show so that you don't have to miss anything you get all the juice we'll give some some squeezes in this episode but if you want no pulp full juice filtered wonderful nectar of the gods in in patreon so let's jump into Stern Pinball. I think it's safe to say that we're not going out on a limb guessing that Pokemon might be next from Stern Pinball. We don't know for sure. I've had some people saying not only is it Pokemon, but people have seen it. Dealers have seen it. I've seen some people start claiming that people have seen it. Dealers have been disgust everything about it. No. I mean, not me. Maybe I'm just being held out here. No, they're trying to stop you from leaking. I don't. I don't. I'm a juice squeezer, not a leaker. I can hold my liquids. I haven't seen anything. I don't know. But that's the story. And I think that's an accurate one. I would predict that Pokemon will. I mean, if you want specifics, like we talked about the head of the show, maybe we hear that it's Pokemon this week. Maybe we see it in February. There's some anniversary or something. I don't know. I truly don't know. But I think we're both in alignment on that prediction. Oh, yeah. Okay. Another prediction that I have, Dennis, I don't know if you agree or not. I think Jaws' 50th anniversary is going to hold value throughout the entirety of 2026. That is, whatever it's selling for now, it will not lose a dollar the entire year on the secondary market. Yeah. Yeah. I think the odds are pretty good. Okay. What do you think the odds are that it goes up in value? Oh, no, I think low possible, more likely that it would go up than it would go down. However, since they still make jaws games and this is only an aesthetic package difference. And honestly, I'm still going to argue not a particularly interesting change up that glitter play field. But I think a lot of people will still just go, you know what? I'll just buy a premium bronze wire forms. I know it's true. And we still have people buying the premiums over the Jaws 50th anniversary. Yeah, I mean, it's it's a nice looking game. So I just don't like that. Yeah. OK, I could see parts of the 50th that would excite people more, but they had plenty of time to get it. I just don't. And with another new in-box option, I just think people will turn to that than turning used. So we're saying it holds value, it doesn't go up in value. I wouldn't be surprised if it went up in value. No, I wouldn't either. I guess that it holds value. Another prediction I'm making is that King Kong dominates in 2026. I disagree. I got to go out on a limb on something here, Zach, or else we're going to look too samey. What's your limb here then? My limb is that I think King Kong goes down as one of Elwynn's less popular games, not the lowest, but it wouldn't surprise me if it maybe surpasses Avengers and then sits right there at the bottom. other than that? I think by the end of 2026, it will be still in the top 10 on the Pennside Top 100, and it'll be in the top 7. I'm going to say it'll be in the top 20, but beneath 10. Yeah, I think sales dominate this year with King Kong. I think there's too many games coming out that are going to It's not going to have time to breathe in that same way. It doesn't have geese ski on code like Jaws did. I don't think we're going to see enough significant improvement to the – I'm not saying that the code is bad. I'm just saying this coupled with a theme that people really didn't care about, anyone who's a hardcore Elwynn already bought it. That's – I just don't think it ends up – I just don't think it's – the mix of it all together just isn't exciting enough compared to some of the other things he's worked with. and a lot of it will be where does the rest of the code go sure i think it'll get better i think it'll be more i think the appreciation will go but some of that's you know how it is with the top 100 all the new stuff always gets loaded up the like evil dead was never going to stay at number one it never should have been number one it's a great game but not still in that top 10 and so you know there's just other stuff like pokemon's going to want to be in that top 10 It's going to like, this is how it is. Okay. I think we see a significant increase in game sales for 2026 from Stern pinball. And here's the big one. This should be behind patron. I'm calling it right now. They are going to get back to finding much more collectability with their LA models this year, whether it be one, whether it be all five or four or whatever they come out with. They're going to find that stride a hell of a lot better than they did in 2025. So do you think they sell more games in 2026 than they did 2025? Had a lot of bangers. Had a lot of bangers in 2025. There were a lot of bangers that weren't labeled Stern. Okay, that's fair. Yes, actually, I do think they will sell more. I think they're going to have a better lineup this year. Okay, I do too. All right. We ask this every year, a prediction, a price increase. We've not seen a price increase for how many years? Do we see a price increase? I think no. Hmm. I agree. I don't see a price increase. However, I do see them maybe launching an open-ended priced item again. they get hate for that but i can see them now yeah my my thought on the price increase is specific solely to the games me too i do think they may raise the price on the accessories again oh maybe not on the toppers but maybe the lighting kits and stuff maybe they bump those up and try and make up the profit margin on the accessories it'll be more palatable to the community um especially as people have started to go i want oem uh mods i don't want uh after market mods okay if they can get the production i think people's demand will be well i don't i don't want to have to keep waiting but if they you know they can speed that up i think that they could grow that and and hold the pricing the same on the games and and achieve whatever their goal is on profitability, but that's my thought. There are some other ones that we're going to do more predictions in the official club episode, such as there's rumblings of Transformers. When are we going to see that? Are we going to see that? A Pokemon Home Edition at Costco? We kind of made that prediction last year. When do we see Fallout? Do we see a fall out? The fall. I was trying to emphasize. Fall. Thank you, Dan. The next remastered. We've heard a lot of things. What is it? And another that I'm hearing rumblings about, not officially, but hearing rumblings from people and where there's smoke. Maybe there's a beacon of fire. But you've got to go to patreon.com slash the pinball show. So before we move on to another manufacturer, any other predictions you have about Stern, Pimble? George Gomez retires at the end of the year. God, don't do that. What the hell are you doing? You can't just throw that on people. You put me on the spot. Holy shit. You came out with a really good one, though. Damn. George Gomez retires at the end of the year. Spike 3's done I think he was trying to get through that and then he had to step in and help purportedly with the game that Jack was working on which we think is Pokemon I think by the end of the year I personally if I have to guess it would be closer to the end of the year but yeah I think it's a good position time for him to go ahead and leave Do you think there's any significant executive slash ownership changes from Stern Pinball in 2026? No. I'm going to say no. But I do think whoever replaces George, I think they're going to bring in an outsider. If he leaves, I think it's an outsider. That's all they've been doing recently. I just don't think there's anyone in house that that's going to move into that position and do that. That level of managerial work. Yeah, that's that is a lot. Who who is capable in this industry? I think that says a lot. I don't know if there's anybody that would be fully capable to step into the shoes of a George Thomas. I don't have a name. I'm not saying that there aren't. It's just whatever they've been currently doing, like we don't – like you want one? Elwin. I might argue that he doesn't have the capabilities yet. We don't know because we can only judge from the jobs they have. However, he's always been able to maintain a really tight team working on his games. Sure. And so if he manages his projects that well, he may be able to manage the multiple project teams. Yeah, but I don't think that would ever happen for two reasons. Number one, I don't think Keith Elwin wants that. And number two, I don't think Stern wants that because what happens whenever you take that position, you don't design as many games if at all. So unless they just deem everything moving forward to Keith Elwin game and he pretty much a co of every game from Stern Pinball moving forward This isn about me saying that I think this is again I already said I think they bring in an outsider However I will note as one pushback there unlike George Gomez we know Keith Elwin designs layouts fast He's noted repeatedly on interviews with Loser Kid that he is like three games ahead. I don't think it takes him as long to do layout design as it does the other designers. I think he's one of the fastest in the industry. and so he might be able to still work on a maybe it's not annual you know maybe he's like put me on an 18 month cycle i've got four kids and they all need to go to college one of them's already in college so this is fine he ain't done yet all right jersey jack pinball sonic the hedgehog that's the rumor do we think it happens but late like fall like Q3 there's so many potters still to build I think we may see I think we may see it announced by the summer and they won't build it until you don't want to announce too far ahead and have people wait you don't want to CGC this they said save your money for Harry Potter at TPF Jack did because Jack still goes rogue that's an announcement yes he goes rogue do we think Jack Guarnieri will hang it up by the end of the year I don't I think he'll still whatever he is is doing I don't think it's high stress okay do we think Sonic the Hedgehog is going to come out as a success or not before you answer we'll give that to the to the Patreon. Okay. Is it going to be a flop? Is it going to be the best seller of the year? Tune in to find out. Spooky Pinball, what do you think we get from Spooky this year? What's your prediction? Well, the biggest rumor has been Goonies. So I normally, being the plebe that I am, say whatever the rumor is I hear the most. And I've been hearing Goonies the most. I hear Gremlins a little bit, but mostly Goonies. I've heard those. Yeah. Do you think it will be a success? Yes, Zach. Well, it's the way of spooky. But just given that what ended up happening with the excitement after the evil dead sold out and what we saw with Beetlejuice, be it Gremlins or Goonies. I think it will. I think it will sell out. Okay. Financial success. Sure. What about perceived success from the community? Do you think people will like what is coming? Again, this is just prediction. We have no, we don't know. No, I haven't seen any of that. I don't know what the themes are. Like nobody, like spooky doesn't tell me anything. But their next game, do you think people will, will get behind and be like, this is, this is great. Like evil dead. This is great. Like Beetlejuice. Yes, I do. I predict the same And I will double down a little bit And I will say That people will like their next game This is Full transparency This is like This guess I don't know But I do know things So this is a guess based on Things I do know I'm not going to lie Based on what I know people will like this game even more than Beetlejuice. And I have, I really don't have any hesitation when we're talking about the game, the game, the mix, the layout, the game. Maybe even probably even more than evil dead. They might forget about evil dead. Maybe I feel really good about this next one. what else might they have up their sleeve? Tune in to the pinball show club to find out. We're making other predictions as well. Barrels of fun. I, I have no clue. I heard, I haven't heard a lot of rumors. I've heard a few and they're all over the board to another, like kids, kids theme thing to a nostalgia thing. You know, it's to a both. I mean, I guess they're all going to love. There's a number. They're tight-lipped. I don't know what the hell they're doing over there for their next game. I do think they will have another big game next year. Yeah, I agree. And we'll probably, let's see, Winchester's going to take them. I think we're going to be looking at like an expo thing again. What's your guess? If you had to guess any title? I'm literally just throwing a dart I have no clue G.I. Joe it's a good guess my guess is the Muppets that is my guess and one that I would buy I love the Muppets I like the idea I think the Muppets might actually be better for pinball than G.I. Joe which is kind of funny for me to say since I watched more G.I. Joe But because Muppets is owned by Disney, I don't know that they can get it. I see. Disney and Stern are who work together. But they did the Labyrinth. Henson. Right. But does Disney own the rights to the Labyrinth? Maybe they do. I don't remember. I thought Muppets got sold to Disney. I thought the only thing when Henson sold, it was only the Sesame Street stuff that he – and Disney wanted it. Eisner kept pushing him. Does Disney have Fraggle Rock too? I have to hop on the internet. I thought – I don't know because those were shows that had completed their run. But we have no clue what's coming from – it could be – I mean Fifth Element, Fraggle Rock, Dark Crystal, Neverending Story. Disney owns the classic Muppet characters. I'm sure of that. What about Muppet Babies? That was one of my favorites. Muppet Babies. Yes, they own Muppet Babies. Disney owns Fraggle. I know that song, but that was my jam, dude. Disney does not own Fraggle Rock. Oh, HBO does. I don't know. I'm not sure. This is AI, so we don't necessarily know. Let's see. It was created by Jim. It remains owned by the Jim Henson Company, though Disney bought the Muppet character separately, and Fraggle Rock content has aired on Disney. Disney has the Muppets and Bear in the Big Blue House. Sesame Street, Fraggle Rock, and other Henson properties stayed with the independent company and are now partners with Apple TV for new Fraggle Rock content. Okay. So, no. So I'm definitely going to stand by my statement then that it's a long shot for them to have Muppets given Stern's relationship with Disney. I'll stick with it because I don't know what else it could be. Okay. Okay. What else from barrels? Because we do know Carl D'Python Anghelo's over there. We'll give some more predictions in our official club. Patreon.com slash the pinball show. Chicago Gaming Company. We know they're making more Merlins. Medieval Madness Merlin. Do we see anything else from them? A remake? Another collab? Play mechanics? We'll make our predictions in the club. Pedretti Gaming. The rumor is they're working on another remake. We won't do everything behind the paywall. my prediction is they are doing another remake. Yes. I thought they hinted at it this year. Magic in 2025? Or last year, I should say. I have no clue what it is. What is your guess? Theater magic. You're going with theater? Yes. That's a good guess. I'll go with Totem, Tales of the Arabian Nights, because I'm 50-50 between that and theater. Right. There were some rumblings of Big Bang Bar. but I don't know. Nobody cares. That's people hoping for the next day. Look, let's sell it for $20,000. Yeah, that's true. But yeah, I'm going to pinball brothers. Are they going to do another one? And if so, is it going to be a rumored 80s title like people have been hinting at? I don't know. I don't know. We'll find out. We'll make our prediction. That was going to be another dart throw, people. American Pinball, are they going to get off the ground with a new game from new ownership in 2026? I know that was the expressed goal. I'm going to say no. Given that it was basically that, okay, we're not going to do competitive. Here's what the other thing means, Zach. and maybe it's a good thing i guess yeah okay so you want a game developed built and released in under a year what are we gotley premiere like do you really want do you really want sorry i saw you were drinking i should have waited i said no that was yeah you really what parallel development is that what you're asking for like no i don't think it's going to happen this year unless they had something ready to go and the thing that was ready to go was cuphead my prediction is they will announce and show something but sure whether they will ship i'm gonna i'm gonna say technically yeah they'll ship too what like what american pinball did with houdini when they shipped one at least four I don't think I don't feel great I don't know why you're predicting it because that's what I think is going to happen I might not agree with it a lot of what happens in this industry I do not agree with but nonetheless it still happens so that's our predictions on that do you think American Pinball will find do you think it will be perceived at the end of 2026 that American Pinball has found success? No because they're not going to have a game out. Okay. Return of the Cup. That's so stupid. That was a, what was that, like an early 2000s song, Return of the Mac? Remember that song? Sorry, not clicking. People know that are listening. Okay, I believe you. I went Return of the Cup. Man. I don't know why you're going with it. Return of the Cup? Do you think we see it? Return of the Cup. Now I feel stupid. I thought this was lame. Pinball machines with Star Wars are like sex. There's no such thing as bad sex. Ergo, there's no such thing as bad pinball if it's called Star Wars. Misa horny. Oh. Misa horny That's really funny That's really funny Misa horny That's a t-shirt Come on Misa horny Alright And then we have another Misa horny This is so dumb What is this show Why do people even listen to this Patreon.com Dutch Pinball. Dutch Pinball is not even going to make it into our Patreon. But do we see Rasa in 2026? And if so, do we see it shipping? All right. Yes. They have a built thing that they show off and saying we're taking orders. Yes. No. Okay. All right. Yes, we see it. No, they don't ship it. I agree. We see it. Do I think they ship any? what the hell else are they going to do? They've got like... They've got to finish building Atlas. I say they start shipping them. No, they've got to finish building Atlas. Here's what my prediction does say, though. What does your prediction say, Zach? We will not see until 2027 the Rosset Topper. It's doing it, Leo. It'll ship with the Back to the Future orders. but as long as you stay in on the rosa topper you can get to the top of the line that's everything's gonna be hinging on in order to not be last on back to the future you have everything else we do i think i hope it's a holographic projection of jaws that comes out of the topper it comes at you i want that whoever the lead alien guy was in in rosa i want it him Ned. Was it Ned? Ned. I wanted him walking out of his double wide trailer. It's like how American Pitbull tried to have this universe with their monkey until it got all abusive and inappropriate. Alice does aliens. This could be Dutch Pinball's thing. It's everything. Everything's basically going to have like this sort of trailer vibe. Oh, my gosh. This is fun. Turner Pinball do we see another game no oh okay it's a rebuilding year rebuilding I think we see another game oh what's it going to be another original theme my prediction I could see it I don't feel confident about my prediction here. I think we'll see another, and it'll be a better seller than Merlin's. I think it'll be their best seller yet, their next game. Because what did Ninja Eclipse was, is that 100? I don't recall. I think it'll be their most successful game yet. And then we have some general predictions that we'll maybe discuss. But again, patreon.com slash the pinball show. Because we're running long here. No pinball market trends again for you. You know what? If we keep on delaying this segment, it in and of itself is going to start trending up again. But I do predict that in 2026, we're going to have the same lovely group of Screaming Goat Club members with some newcomers as well. Thank you so much to all the Screaming Goats, including, but not limited to, yeah, limited to, Rodney. He's our bobcat. I think I predict this year that he's finally going to shoot this fucker. Oh, shoot that fucker! No, I think he'll always just talk about his plan to in a bobcat attack my wife. Rob, thank you so much. The Panther. Do you predict that it'll be higher than 80% of the time it works every time? Depends on the proof of the whiskey He provides you, keeps getting stronger and stronger. Oh, my gosh. Those make for very interesting happy hour hangouts. Thank you so much, Rob. I did have a glass, and I needed it. I saw that. I saw that. I needed it. That was another one of those dark tales. That was an intensive. The attendees, we had a really small group this last time, but they were really invested in your woes. Felt like a support group for me. Yeah. The first half was, because we went two hours, and the first half was pretty much support group time. It was. Frank thank you so much for the continued support The Falcon Do you think the Falcon In 2026 Finally gets the gig That he always wanted The voice over for the Screaming Eagle No Oh he gets snubbed Oscar snubs of 2026 He doesn't show up on Nap Arcade or Kineticist Shit Keep working Falcon I know it's news but not worthy Charlie thank you so much Charlie ding dong and thank you oh my god the bell alright sorry Charlie had a little laughing fit there Charlie thank you for the continued support Charlie I think I might see Charlie at Pinball at the Beach you're not going to Pinball at the Beach No, I set to go to TPF. I don't know if I'm going. You never go to TPF. You used to. Oh, the beach? You have your room and everything. I know. I got tickets. I got the room, but I don't know. There's snow. The people. The people want to see you. You might get a goat out of it if you go. Not like a literal goat, but like a financial goat. That would be awesome if I brought back a goat. Yeah. I think Nicole would love that. I think she might go with me. Would she take care of the goat? She would, but she wouldn't be happy about it. Yeah, she would not be happy about it. But she's sweet, so she would. William, thank you for all your dudeness. Do you think William will, in his dudification this year, stick to his resolution to not buy a new game in 2026? Nope. Nope. Nope. I think he's shipping as we speak. Shit. I think William bought a game and you didn't even know he bought. I can love that guy. I was like, hey, Dennis, you think William bought whatever the latest game is? I'm like, why are you even asking? Do I think it? Yes. He has become one of my favorite people I've met in pinball. One of my favorite. He's very, and it's a really good handle for him because he actually is super chill. Super chill, but not afraid to speak up if somebody pisses on his rug. You know, tied the room together. It did. Until you peed on it. Adam. Pee-a-ween. Sorry. Pee-a-ween. We've been recording too long. This is way too slap-heavy now. Pee-a-ween. Pee-a-ween. Trying to get rid of those barbecues. Basha. Adam, thank you so much for your support. I love you, but I love your baby more. He didn't show the baby on the happy hour. I was glad he didn't because I was afraid you would then make creepy remarks about wishing to possess that baby and raise it as your own. I wonder, because the baby was sick or was going through a sickness, I wonder if they had to use that brain sucker. Have you ever seen them? Do people still use that or is that like an old 80s thing? No, I think they still use it. Do they? They suck the boogers out of the baby. Yeah. I think people just don't have them in case they like it because the baby sticks things up its nose. Oh. Like you can use it to grab it and suction. Not that I ever as a small child did that with a peanut. A peanut is big. My nose is big. No, it's not. You have like a normal small nose. You have like a normal – you're like, look at that. I'm trying to think. I think you have a normal nose. A peanut? A whole peanut? Not like in the shell. Okay. That's what I was picturing. So, yeah, shell-less peanut. I was like, damn, man. You really got that thing lodged up in there. It was shelled peanut. Salty. The whole shell. You know what I do? Why is this hard for you to imagine? This isn't going to come out right, but when I go, like, Texas Roadhouse or something like that, I like sucking on the peanut enunciating. The whole shell. The salty exterior. I do. Okay. I cleanse my palate with that saltiness, and then I break open and eat said nut. Nobody needs to edit that. No, don't need that AI together. Thanks, Adam. Do we predict Papa to be times two by the end of 2020? No. Adam's like, please stop, Zach. I'm manifesting it. Okay. No. Remember, we have a happy hour hangout sometime in February. so sign up to patreon.com slash pinball show for anybody that's to that Nordman level or Screaming Goat Club we have a lot of fun and it has become a highlight for me truly was this last time where can people catch you? they can reach me directly they can email the Collective Gamers Podcast at gmail.com and you can email us at the pinball show at gmail.com go listen to the extra content now we've got what else? oh follow please right here on YouTube. If you've watched this long, we've given you a solid. A lot of entertainment. Mesa Horny is pretty classic and great. So follow, like, and subscribe here on the YouTube because we've got to get those numbers up. They're embarrassingly low. Just turn off notifications after you do it if you don't want to be notified. That's fine. This is for the numbers. It's free. Come on. we love algorithms. So come on. And then Facebook would be nice. I do a YouTube video series called straight down the middle. Um, and go follow, subscribe to that as well. And, uh, the sponsor of this show is, uh, in the best way, flipping out. When I buy my pinball, shit, I buy from flipping out. From toppers or play series, I've got it figured out. Flipping out, figured out. When I take a pinball, I think flipping out. product showcase this week not dune because uh we're now sold out of our dunes damn so i think there's some still around but that thing is trending in the right direction it's the hot fiery title right now so um well maybe you can't find one from us but Get yourself a Harry Potter. Get yourself a Stern game. Can't get a Beetlejuice. Get on some interested lists. Get some toppers. As of this recording, we are not currently doing sales in Hawaii or Alaska. You know what? It's not you. It's us. we just think it might be healthiest for us to take a break from Hawaii and Alaska at this time. That's all. And thanks for all the kind words. Anybody that speaks out about their positive experiences. Thank you so much. That is very helpful. Um, yeah. And it lets people know that they can trust a company that tries to bring the best. All right. So buy stuff from flipping out pinball. Keep us rolling and trade in games. Greg at flipping out pinball.com doing some trade evaluation. We've done a lot this January, a lot. So let's make February even bigger because you're going to have some games coming out that you're going to want, if not already. So we've got some cool, unique ways to make that process easier for you. So do that. Go check out Flip N Out Pinball's YouTube channel where Joel does tutorials. Joel's going to be doing some additional stuff. Be on the lookout for that, maybe with an external release. And does some live streams on Wednesday nights with Jared, his brother. and Flip N Out Pinball Podcast with Ken and Craig. Got some cool stuff coming from them this year as well. In the meantime, go listen to that American Pinball interview. All right, Dennis, teach these people a little something, something. I actually don't have anything. Oh, that's a first. We're going to keep it at that. Ladies and gentlemen, it's the first time in over 188 episodes that you don't have anything prepared unless this is a shtick. It's not. And always practice safe pinball. And Misa think an episode one through three would do really well in pinball. If you used to think that, email us at thepinballshow at gmail.com or comment in the YouTube. Hey, Misa might be horny, but Misa wants to get in on that. On that black swan. What's the kid's name again? Annie. Lisa thinks Annie's a fucking murderer. Trouble that little fucker will be. See you, Will. See you, Will. See you, Will.