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The Spinner Is Lit - Episode 53 The Fallout Shelter

The Spinner Is Lit Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·1h 31m·analyzed·Feb 8, 2023
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TL;DR

Reno pinball community growth via tournament structure and venue excellence at Press Start.

Summary

Episode 53 of The Spinner Is Lit Pinball Podcast features interviews with Jim Martin, the head game tech and tournament organizer at Press Start Reno Arcade, and discussions of the Reno Pinball League's growth and success. The episode covers tournament formats, local competitive pinball development, venue management, and Reno's recent State Championship qualifiers, highlighting how focused tournament organization and player development have grown the community from struggling to field teams to sending eight competitors to state finals.

Key Claims

  • Press Start Reno has machines priced at 50 cents or less per play, which is unusual for location games

    high confidence · Dan, discussing his visit to Press Start

  • Jim Martin's Reno Pinball League has grown from struggling to field 4 players in 2018 to running tournaments with 34-40 players regularly in 2024

    high confidence · Jim Martin, describing tournament growth metrics

  • Reno sent eight competitors to the 2024 California State Finals (6 men, 2 women)

    high confidence · Jim Martin, listing qualifiers

  • Jim Martin's current personal collection contains 18+ pinball machines

    high confidence · Jim Martin, self-reported

  • Capital Corridor Pinball League's interleague finals used a ladder bracket format with 24 qualifiers and 18 attendees

    high confidence · Dan, describing the tournament structure

  • Reno tournaments have had four different winners in four weeks of the new finals format

    high confidence · Jim Martin, reporting recent tournament results

  • Press Start Reno's Twilight Zone machine is in excellent working condition, which is noteworthy because that game 'never works right on location'

    high confidence · Spencer, praising venue maintenance

  • Jim Martin switched from a 'first to 16 points' match play format to a five-round qualifying + top-8 finals format for Tuesday tournaments

    high confidence · Jim Martin, explaining tournament format evolution

  • State Championship game selection included Jersey Jack machines, Godzilla, and Deadpool, but no EMs

    high confidence · Jim Martin, critiquing state tournament game selection

  • Jim Martin prioritizes fun > venue support > IFPA points in tournament organization hierarchy

Notable Quotes

  • “It's important to me because my history with pinball tournaments is I played in a tournament at California Extreme, was the first pinball tournament I ever played in. And I don't know, I literally knew nobody. But I also didn't really know what I was doing. And I didn't feel like anybody wanted to tell me. I was like, okay, I really felt like I was out on an island.”

    Jim Martin@ 9:56 — Establishes Jim's motivation for creating welcoming, well-structured tournaments

  • “I think it's important for people to hear the rules, understand the rules, and know that, like in life, there are no dumb questions. If you don't know what you're doing, I want you to raise your hand and get a clear answer.”

    Jim Martin@ 13:02 — Describes Jim's philosophy on inclusive tournament management

  • “Where I think a lot of people go wrong is they put that points as the first priority. And I think if points are your first priority, you're probably not going to succeed long term.”

    Jim Martin@ 26:23 — Core philosophy about tournament priorities and long-term sustainability

  • “You guys deserve kudos, Jim, you really do. Your group, Press Start, not only, like Dan said, the variety of pins you have, but the fact that every pin there at the time was clean, working, well lit.”

    Spencer@ 20:41 — External validation of Press Start's venue quality and maintenance standards

  • “That game never works right on location. And so kudos to you, you know, and your team for all you do, because there's nothing worse than when you talk to somebody and they go on location, they play a pinball game and, you know, nothing's working.”

    Spencer@ 21:24 — Highlights Twilight Zone as a litmus test for venue maintenance quality

  • “People are coming back and that is kind of a good problem to have, but it's like we always are hitting 40 because the people are not turned away and they have the opportunity to continue and get better.”

Entities

Jim MartinpersonSpencerpersonDanpersonMarkpersonPress Start RenoorganizationReno Pinball LeagueorganizationPress Start Reno Arcade LoungeorganizationCapital Corridor Pinball LeagueorganizationCalifornia ExtremeeventCalifornia State Finals

Signals

  • ?

    community_signal: Reno Pinball League has grown from struggling to field 4 players in 2018 to consistently running tournaments with 34-40 players, with four different winners in recent weeks indicating competitive depth beyond a single dominant player

    high · Jim Martin: 'The very first year that I started doing tournaments...we had to scrape together players occasionally...And to think about where that started and now where it is now where...36, 34, 40 players and last this week was 39 players.'

  • ?

    operational_signal: Jim Martin's tournament philosophy prioritizes player experience and venue support above IFPA points accumulation, uses rule clarity and inclusive communication, and has evolved from match-play to finals-bracket format to increase competitiveness and socialization

    high · Jim Martin: 'The order of importance is number one, people need to have fun. Number two, we need to make sure we're supporting Reno Pinball...And then number three, and a very distant number three, is we want to make IFPA Whopper points.'

  • ?

    venue_signal: Press Start Reno operates with exceptional game maintenance, diverse collection, and affordable pricing (50 cents or less per play), making it a regional model venue and attracting players from across Northern California

    high · Dan: 'everything's 50 cents or less a play, which you just do not see in location games these days'; Spencer: 'And it shows your twilight zone played perfect. I mean, as good as any home collection one I've ever played.'

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Reno sent 8 competitors to 2024 California State Finals (6 men, 2 women), demonstrating the region's capacity to produce multiple competitive players beyond a single representative

    high · Jim Martin: 'we also had two women who played Sunday in the Women's State Championship, Daniella and Michelle. So all together, I guess you say we had eight people down there playing in the state championships, two in the women's championships and six in the men's.'

Topics

Tournament format design and evolutionprimaryLocal pinball community growth in RenoprimaryVenue management and game maintenanceprimaryTournament organization best practicesprimaryCompetitive player development and retentionprimaryState championship experiences and game selectionsecondaryRegional tournament coordination (Capital Corridor League)secondaryGame licensing and availability at tournamentsmentioned

Sentiment

positive(0.88)— Overwhelmingly positive episode celebrating community growth, venue excellence, and inclusive tournament management. Hosts and guest express genuine appreciation for Jim Martin's work and the Reno pinball ecosystem. Minor criticism of state championship game selection (lack of EMs) is constructive rather than hostile.

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.274

0:00
Welcome to the Spinner's Lit Pinball Podcast, episode 53, the Fallout Shelter. I'm your host Spencer and with me are my co-hosts, Dan. Hey, what's going on guys?
0:31
And Mark. Hello everyone. Thanks for listening. And our very special guest, Jim Martin. Hello everybody. Thank you for having me. I want to get really deep into this, but before I do, I'm going to quick segue and because you and Mark are going to fill up most of tonight's episode. So Dan, give me an update on what you've been doing since last month. Oh, sure. Well, I was actually just up at Press Start the other day, and I got a chance to check out some of Jim's handiwork firsthand.
1:06
It's, you know, it's an amazing venue and they've got an amazing selection of games. I'm always really, really, really, really glad to go up there and play. And I think that the most amazing thing is they have just a huge range of machines. You know, you'll go in there, they'll have EMs right up to the very newest, best and brightest. And I think everything's 50 cents or less a play, which you just do not see in location games these days. But for myself, I just finished interleague finals for the Capital Corridor Pinball League, which is our local pinball league.
1:44
And I got there, I slimed in by taking a third place finish a couple of seasons ago and I did not win. Just so you know, our man Hector Villalobos from Norsac League, he won, so congratulations to him. And the definitely gutsiest performance of the whole day went to Jeff Claybaugh, who came in ranked last and endured 10 or 11 rounds before they finally managed to knock him out.

high confidence · Jim Martin, stating tournament priorities

Mark@ 13:31 — Describes the success of Reno's growth and retention strategy

  • “Jim went down to cheer us on. He didn't even play in the tournament, because he is sacrificing his time and his leadership”

    Speaker (appears to be describing Jim's State Championship involvement)@ 29:14 — Demonstrates Jim's commitment to community above personal competition

  • “I'm kind of, I feel like I'm kind of the father of this Northern Nevada pinball tournament stuff, so I wanted to go down there and support my guys and I wanted to see how it was run.”

    Jim Martin@ 31:04 — Jim's reflection on his role in building Northern Nevada's pinball infrastructure

  • “It's really exciting because, you know, again, you look at a guy like, like Jeff Klebaugh, he came in and just, you know, became the star of the show because, you know, everybody wanted to see somebody go, you know, run the Royal Rumble from 1st to 30th, right?”

    Dan@ 4:01 — Describes the appeal and drama of ladder bracket tournament formats

  • “Every time you turn around, he's picked up some other cool, weird game. But yeah, it was a really fun, you know, a really fun format.”

    Dan@ 4:39 — References Shannon's extensive home collection and its appeal as tournament venue

    • event
    Hector Villalobosperson
    Jeff Claybaughperson
    David Hosierperson
    David Randolphperson
    Shannonperson
    Kevin Woodsperson
    John Simpsonperson
    Kendraperson
    Ben Hokeperson
    Ted McGintyperson
  • ?

    product_strategy: Jim Martin shifted from Swiss-pairing match-play (first to 16 points) to a five-round qualifying + top-8 finals format to increase social interaction, competitive pressure, and tournament hardening for players preparing for state-level competition

    high · Jim Martin: 'Because I let the software handle tiebreakers...the problem was it turned a little less social...So I just wanted to change that up. So this year I added a finals component.'

  • ?

    community_signal: Reno Pinball League demonstrates structured player development with newcomers progressing from nervous novice level to top-three finishes within 1-3 seasons, indicating effective coaching and encouragement from organizers

    high · Spencer: 'Some of them had just recently discovered pinball. We'll come to a league or a tournament, a little nervous, and you give them a season or two or three, and they're finishing in the top five or the top three.'

  • ?

    operational_signal: Capital Corridor Pinball League's interleague finals used ladder bracket format with 24 qualifiers and up to 40 simultaneous players, creating a gauntlet-style tournament with high variance in outcome and star potential for unexpected winners

    medium · Dan: 'it was hosted by our man, Shannon...we had 24 qualifiers, I think 18 showed up...Jeff Klebaugh, he came in ranked last and endured 10 or 11 rounds before they finally managed to knock him out.'

  • ?

    gameplay_signal: State championship featured Jersey Jack machines (multiple titles), Godzilla, and Deadpool, with Avengers exhibiting strong flipper response but inconsistent shot mechanics (tower lock shot unreliable); Banzai Run was expected as a 'ringer' but Reno players had prior familiarity

    high · Jim Martin: 'There was no EM represented, and that was a real downfall...They had a Godzilla and...Deadpool...we had had a Banzai Run at Press Start for years and years.'; Mark: 'He slayed me on Avengers...there was one shot I could not hit...the lock shot up in the tower shot.'

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Best-of-seven bracket format used at state championship created high-pressure sequential play and comeback opportunities, with tied scores (3-3) providing dramatic finales; format contrasts with alternative three-game elimination

    medium · Mark: 'it was a lot of pressure when it was like one zero, one one, two one, two two...we're tied three three. This is going to determine who gets it...it allowed players to have a chance to catch up.'

  • ?

    organizational_signal: Jim Martin attended California State Finals solely to support Reno players rather than competing himself, demonstrating commitment to team mentality and infrastructure building over personal achievement

    high · Speaker: 'Jim went down to cheer us on. He didn't even play in the tournament, because he is sacrificing his time and his leadership'; Jim: 'I'm kind of, I feel like I'm kind of the father of this Northern Nevada pinball tournament stuff.'

  • ?

    venue_signal: Collector-hosted tournaments (Shannon's home) are becoming viable tournament venues, with collectors investing in game curation and tournament infrastructure to support competitive play

    medium · Dan: 'He's got such a, such a crazy, cool game selection. The Treehouse Spectacular. His collection is going nuts. Like, just every time you turn around, he's picked up some other cool, weird game.'

    • 2:16
    Be responsible for making the Facebook PMZ And myself, I manage Lodi, and then David Hosier manages Folsom, and David Randolph is the manager of North Sac these days.
    2:54
    Besides that, not too much. I did just get a twinkling backboard mod from my Pirates of the Caribbean I'll have to install here in the next few days. Oh, nice. Nice. So you did fairly well, then it sounds like, Dan. I came in like in the second round, so I came in pretty low, and I think I might have lasted three rounds. I didn't win anything. I just got bounced right out. However, afterwards, we started playing dollar games, and I started kicking ass. I probably won five in a row.
    3:25
    Story of my life, man. I really like that format. Huh? I really like that ladder bracket style format. I think it's a fun format. Yeah, you know, it's brutal when you come in at the bottom, right? It's a gauntlet. It's endurance. It's a gauntlet. And that's... But then if you come in in the middle, you kind of come in cold and you're like, okay, and you could have one, you can be one and done. Exactly. So there's a lot of pressure. There's a lot of pressure. Yeah, that happened over and over. So there's, there's, you know, two ways to really look at it too. As like you said, if you come in early, you know, you, you can flame out.
    3:58
    If you come in late, you can get iced. And I think it's really exciting because, you know, again, you look at a guy like, like Jeff Klebaugh, he came in and just, you know, became the star of the show because, you know, everybody wanted to see somebody go, you know, run the Royal Rumble from 1st to 30th, right? And I think we had, uh, we had 24 qualifiers, I think 18 showed up. And so, you know, there was, there was a pretty big field for this. Oh, and it was, it was hosted by our man, Shannon.
    4:30
    Uh, we didn't do it at Mike's house this year. We did it at Shannon's. And of course he's got such a, such a crazy, cool game selection. The Treehouse Spectacular. His collection is going nuts. Like, just every time you turn around, he's picked up some other cool, weird game. But yeah, it was a really fun, you know, a really fun format. And finals, you know, there's no Whoppers on the line in finals. All our Whoppers are regular season. You know, you're pretty much just playing for glory and for the trophy. So, winner takes all.
    5:00
    But yeah, it's a really fun day. So, Mark, why don't you tell us, introduce Jim properly and tell us how you got, you know, just give us a little review. All right. So I got a great friend of mine, Jim Martin. He's happy to be on the show today. And it's awesome because he runs everything over at Press Start. Adam Bielczyk, Kevin Woods, Kevin M. V. He is in charge of making sure all the games work properly along with Kevin Woods. Those two work really well together to keep those games in perfect shape so that when
    5:35
    we have our tournaments and for the public that comes in to press start, they're always guaranteed to have those games running perfectly. Jim I've known for a couple of years now. I met him over at a party over at Rick Bartlett. He had a little pinball get together and I got to meet him face to face and from that day on we became friends and he's come a long way from having just a small collection to having a collection now that is twice if not three times the size and also making pinball happen in Reno.
    6:12
    I started it off and kind of kick started it to get people interested with league and And now Jim is doing an amazing job spreading that news to everybody and every single time we get new players and he's going to talk a lot about that, of how our pinball community is growing in Reno and it is growing leaps and bounds. So Jim, thanks a lot for being on the show and glad that you're here to talk about everything that's happening in Reno with pinball. Yeah, thanks Mark, thanks Dan, thanks Spencer, thanks for having me.
    6:44
    It's a pleasure to be here. As Mark said, I am an employee at Press Start Reno. I am the main game tech there. So I'm responsible for upkeep on all the games. I help decide what games we should try and bring in, make sure all the games are running good, and do game rotation and set up. And then I also have my own shop where I do game restoration and I have, as Mark said,
    7:14
    I have 18 plus games currently in my personal collection. But yeah, most of my daytime is spent at press start. You don't really see me there because I'm there in the morning getting everything ready and then hopefully when I leave they open up and everything runs well for the day. That's my goal. That's a good goal. And that's kind of one of the things that I want to throw you big props for is you're the manager, the head of the Reno Pinball League, right? And I've played in several of your Tuesday night events and I think one or two of your...
    7:46
    Yeah, you've come up to the Tuesdays for sure. Have you played in one of the Saturdays as well? Yeah, we made it out there for at least one of them. I know we brought a whole bunch of NorCal people that day and... That's correct. Actually, that was the day I wasn't there. It is just always a really good time. They get groups of up to 40 people and, you know, the vibe is super good. Everyone's having a lot of fun. You know the cost to enter is not expensive and there's a lot of pinball included.
    8:17
    So if you are in the Reno or the Northern California area and you feel like just checking out the Reno Pinball League for some of their events, it's worth a couple hours driving. I'll give it a lot of credit for that. So, appreciate that. It's so awesome. It's so much fun. And what's so great is Jim has a way of being or is he has a great way of Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi,
    8:51
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, What is expected before we start this tournament? And that's when we run into less problems because they say, if you didn't listen to what we were doing, I'm sorry, but those are the rules. And most people comply to it. And there's not any issues. Um, and the other thing I commend you is that when there are decisions that have to be made, you basically just say, Hey, this is it.
    9:23
    This is the way it goes and live with it, deal with it. And they usually do. And you can move on. I mean, I screwed up one time. I played out of order. I'm saying it right on the air, but I did. I played out of order. I wasn't paying attention. I was supposed to play on an EM. And I had to get a zero. So, yeah, it happens. But it's really appreciative that you do a great job in encouraging new players and also solidifying the expectations whenever we have a large gathering of people playing competitively.
    9:56
    Yeah, it's important to me because my history with pinball tournaments is I played in a tournament at California Extreme, was the first pinball tournament I ever played in. And I don't know, I literally knew nobody. But I also didn't really know what I was doing. And I didn't feel like anybody wanted to tell me. I was like, okay, I really felt like I was out on an island. And so when I started, when I started wanting to do tournaments, you know, Mark, you and I, we, when Press Start first opened, we started to think about what we wanted to do and we started with a league and then we kind of quickly realized that there just, there aren't a lot of points to be made, right?
    10:44
    There aren't a lot of whopper points to be made in a league as opposed to having multiple Steven Sharpe, Justin P telefonism.com, Babel soy.com,
    11:24
    I was very much expected of them, that it was the same, it was very consistent from tournament to tournament. And I wanted them to feel like if they went to another tournament, a more, went to a national tournament or even, you know, just a Sacramento tournament or what have you, that they wouldn't feel like they were a small fish in a big pond, that they would understand what tournament play was. That was my goal going in. And I think I've done a pretty good job of executing on that goal. The very first year that I started doing tournaments, which was of course pre-pandemic, so 2018 pinball year, we actually did qualify I think two or three players to go and play in the state finals.
    12:07
    And that to me was a huge win, you know, and that was a tough year. You know, in the start of the year, you know, we had to scrape together players occasionally. Occasionally I'd even have to make, you know, enter myself in and I'd be the fourth player We're just so we could get four players in a tournament sometimes. And to think about where that started and now where it is now where, you know, yeah, just this year, so we've had four tournaments this year. We've had new people every time. We've had 36, 34, 40 players and last this week was 39 players.
    12:43
    So those are huge numbers. And again, brand new people every single time. That is amazing to me. Like you said, my speech at the beginning, occasionally I get to the point where I wish I wouldn't have any new players, because if I didn't have any new players, I could maybe not say the speech every time. But I think it's important. I think it's important for people to hear the rules, understand the rules, and know that, like in life, there are no dumb questions. If you don't know what you're doing, I want you to raise your hand and get a clear answer.
    13:15
    I don't want you to move forward and play a pinball game where you're not understanding, Because if you don't understand what you're doing, you're not going to have any fun. And if you don't have any fun, you're not coming back. For sure. And I think that's so true with what you're saying because that is exactly what's happening. People are coming back and that is kind of a good problem to have, but it's like we always are hitting 40 because the people are not turned away and they have the opportunity to continue and get better. And one of the things that we've always had arguments with other people that have looked at it in a negative light is that if there's somebody who always wins, then it turns people away and they don't want to come back.
    13:57
    But I'm seeing more and more people who started off pretty much at a novice level are becoming really good players. And having that desire to try to get in the top eight or whatever is really motivating for them instead of the outlook of saying, well, this person's always going to win, so I shouldn't even bother coming. That's not what I see at Press Start. I see people wanting to play better.
    14:28
    And not only that, but they're encouraged to come in outside of the tournament time and practice. And that brings business and coin drops and whatever, or getting some drinks to keep the business going. So that's really nice that you do that. Yeah, and I think this year, so all of last year, my Tuesday night tournaments, my goal was to make it so it was fast, basically. I wanted people to know that they could get in and out. It's a work day for everybody for the most part, so I tried to end it pretty
    15:02
    I was doing a target match play tournament. So the first person to 16 points, tournament's over. We used pop-a-scoring and it was good, it was fine. But because I let the software handle tiebreakers and I used Swiss pairing, the problem was it turned a little less social because you ended up playing the same four or six people all tournament because you'd have the same scores. And the winner came from kind of a pool of six people-ish, you know.
    15:36
    So I just wanted to change that up. So this year I added a finals component to my tournaments. So now there's five rounds of qualifying and then the top eight people qualify for finals. And that allowed me to, number one, I could now do a balanced pairing of players. So you were playing more people, you were playing new people, there was a little more John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade,
    16:07
    Ballywin, Straight Down the Middle, Ballywin, John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    16:44
    The top eight points goes into finals and now there's that pressure of like, oh, now these games matter. Not that the other games don't matter, but you know what I mean. Some people, they don't really start paying attention until they get some kind of pressure. And I think it's going to really kind of tournament harden our players. You know, I feel like a couple of people that went down to the state finals this year, they maybe weren't quite ready for that tournament hardened feeling. And I hope that this new tournament style that I'm running now will give them that weekly pressure and let them get used to that.
    17:19
    Because it truly is a different feeling when you're playing under the kind of pressure of finals. Similar to what we were talking about, Dan, with your ladder tournaments. It's like there's a lot of pressure to say, okay, I've sat here for four games, now I've got to jump in, I'm player four, and I've got to perform right now or I'm done. You know, for a social environment, I really liked your first to 16 format. I mean, it did sort of feel like we're playing, we're playing, we're playing. Oh, we're done. But there was something to be said for, you know, you know, watching, watching the standings and, and maybe even being able to sneak in there if you weren't the leader.
    17:53
    Like when I, one of the times that I went, I took a, I took a podium finish, but the other guy with us did, did too. I don't, I remember who won. I think it was one of your regulars. And it was really exciting because I guess he was a guy who played with you guys a lot and didn't often win. So it's always amazing to see somebody that isn't usually a winner come up. We had a lady take first in our last league night at Lodi, Kendra, who normally, you know, she's a solid player, but she's, you know, usually not a top half player.
    18:26
    And you know, it's really exciting for someone unexpected to win. I like the fact that now you guys have a playoff format because it's going to definitely, you know, mix it up. You're going to get people. It's not just going to be, you know, a mark running to the end and us just sort of trying to get into his slipstream. But, you know, we're going to have to get in there and earn it. Yeah, I really like it. And like I said, we've had four weeks, we've had four different winners. So I can't ask for anything more. That's a really good point. You know, Dan made a good point.
    18:58
    You're all making good points. This is really cool. When you talked about, you know, going to, and California Experience is a pretty major, John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, Raydaypinball, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, Straight Out the Middle, The first year they had had a tournament, that was, oh gosh, about 12 years ago. Like you, knew nobody. But luckily, Johnny O, local tournament guy out of the Bay Area, had the same kind of
    19:28
    philosophy he did. He was like, it's great for beginners. And we did pinball, which was really fun. So I kind of got the bug there and started going from there on. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, You know, people are like, oh yeah, just, you know, this is basically how you do it. Like, oh, okay. And they kind of walk you through it because, you know, you were new. So you weren't just kind of a fish out of water.
    19:58
    I want to key on something real quick. I've been doing a lot of travel in the last, I don't know, what, since 2019 when my wife and I decided that we're going to leave California. So I've been to pinball everywhere we travel. Well, it's like, okay, well, on the map, we're going to go to these pinball locations. And I finally got to get out to Press Start last January. And Dan and I met in Sacramento, because that's where I used to live.
    20:29
    And I had to fly out for business. And then we drove up, Dan drove us up, and we met up with Mark, and we finally got to see your location. And I've been to a lot of locations all the way out into the Midwest. And you guys deserve, you deserve kudos, Jim, you really do. Your group, Press Start, not only, like Dan said, the variety of pins you have, but the fact that every pin there at the time was clean, working, well lit.
    21:03
    You know, I've played a lot of games all over, just different collectors' homes, on location And it shows your twilight zone played perfect. I mean, as good as any home collection one I've ever played. And that's saying something, because that game never works right on location. And so kudos to you, you know, and your team for all you do, because there's nothing worse than when you talk to somebody and they go on location, they play a pinball game and, you know, nothing's working. The flippers aren't working right. You know, you've been there, you've seen it yourself.
    21:35
    And it can really sour people. And I don't like pinballing. You know, they're broken, they never work. You know, it's a rip-off. And so when people come in and they play games that are well-lit, that are clean, that are working properly, and they relax in a fun environment, that's, you know, really, really stepping up and being a good ambassador for the sport and the hobby of pinball. So kudos to you, sir. I had another point because Mark, I was going to dovetail off Mark, but it's been a long day, so I'm going to let you get back to it. Well, I just want to say thanks a lot for that.
    22:07
    And it can't be said enough that we are lucky here in Reno that we have a great partner in Press Start, the Press Start Reno Arcade Lounge. They care. They care that the people who come in want to have a good time. They want them to have a good time. And I think that we really benefit from the owner-operator scenario. There isn't a middleman that we have to deal with. John Popadiuk Bob Betor Knapp Arcade We play for our tournaments So you pay your buy on a Tuesday night and you going to play pinball for three or four hours on that All the practice time there no coin drop whatsoever The only coin drop is at the end of the night I will put the games back on to coin play and then people will you know usually play stall ball or dollar games But yeah you know we are very lucky to have John Simpson as the owner there and we very very lucky to have him
    23:16
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    23:46
    Mark It's pretty close to back to normal and we have 40 people showing up to have fun playing competitive pinball. It's just amazing to see what's happening in the growth of players and taking pinball seriously, but at the same time having fun, but learning real competition pinball and being prepared so when they go to other places, they know what to expect. So that's awesome. Steven Thank you, Mark. You made another great point and you reminded me of what I forgot.
    24:19
    We were talking about, you know, we were, Dan and both of us were talking about, you know, how it's not, you know, the same four or six people always in the finals again and again and again. And I was just, I was actually, Kendra hit me up the other night, you know, telling me about her first place. I said, no, you know, it's like, you know, I've seen tremendous growth from you and a lot of other players, which is really neat. They'll come into a league, not a lot of experience. Some of them had just recently discovered pinball. We'll come to a league or a tournament, a little nervous, and you give them a season or two or three, and they're finishing in the top five or the top three on a night or two of a league night or a tournament.
    24:56
    And occasionally, you'll even see them finish a season in the top three, take home a trophy. So it's really nice to see it. It's nice to...and you can't, you know, I always make sure to make it a point and go, check you out, man. Your third season here, and you finished third for the season. That's awesome. You know, or something like that, or just look at that, you know, you, you finished in the top five twice this season. That's great. And remind them, hey, you're, you're improving, you're getting better. And the most important thing is that they're still having a good time because at the end of the day, man, you know, except for what, you know, for Jim, this is kind of your, well, this is your, your, your, you know, how you make a living. For all the rest of us, this is just what we do for fun. So, but even though you're doing it for a living, it's great to have a job where you get to have fun doing what you do.
    25:41
    It certainly is, that's for sure. I fell into this, really surprised me, but yeah, it's worked out pretty good for me. And with that said, I try and, you know, because I'm trying to get some people trained up to have some other people who can help direct tournaments and do some co-directing with me. And I tell them that it's, that the order of importance is number one, people need to have fun. Number two, we need to make sure we're supporting Reno Pinball and supporting Press Start Reno and providing a good light on them.
    26:16
    And then number three, and a very distant number three, is we want to make IFPA Whopper points to qualify. Where I think a lot of people go wrong is they put that points as the first priority. And I think if points are your first priority, you're probably not going to succeed long term. Exactly. And the thing that I've found is you came up with... The thing I like about you, Jim, is you're willing to try something, and if it doesn't work or if it needs to be improved, you find a way to make it happen.
    26:49
    And one of the things that I saw that was really impressive is you found a format that works, that gives us a pretty good number of IFPA points. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    27:27
    Tim, how did you succeed or fail there? Well I think we have major competition here in the tournaments themselves. As we know, we really fought hard to get those points and be able to get up in that top 16. And it was wonderful to have six people go down, including myself, that, if I got that number right, I hope I'm right. That's correct, six. Okay. We went down there and we were able to represent Reno.
    27:59
    And what was great about it before I go into the actual competition is we all encouraged each other and we all cheered each other on and we went down almost like a family. It was, we were going down there to have fun. We knew that the pressure was on to really see if we could basically go against Vegas and see how we can do competitively against them on their machines, on their own home turf. And it was really great to see, even though not all of us made it to the finals or the top four, we all at least made it in the top 16.
    28:35
    And it was wonderful because even though I unfortunately got out in the first round, I had to play Dan from Reno. The other players played players from Las Vegas. So it was a little difficult for me to get in that competitive spirit because I was kind of playing my opponent, but he was my friend at the same time, so I didn't let up. He played better than me, there's just no doubt about it, and I was really happy to see him move on and not have any grudges like,
    29:07
    oh man, I didn't make it. I was upset at myself, but I was cheering on Dan to move on to the next level, onto the next round. Jim went down to cheer us on. He didn't even play in the tournament, because he is sacrificing his time and his leadership John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, Ballywin, John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade,
    29:43
    Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    30:18
    A lot of people got to play it and they had to dial in. And those are two Jersey Jacks that were represented and that was fun. Of course they had some that we had at press start. They had a Godzilla and the other one was a Deadpool, but we played that before in the past when it was at press start. It's not there anymore, but definitely we've had experience with that machine. And even No Good Gophers we had one time. It's kind of funny, some of the games that we had in the past We got to play there at the tournament.
    30:51
    But it was just a nice way to have fun, but at the same time play as best as we could. And thanks Jim for cheering us on. Thank you and it was important to me to go because I did want to show support. You know, I'm kind of, I feel like I'm kind of the father of this Northern Nevada pinball tournament stuff, so I wanted to go down there and support my guys and I wanted to see how it was run. The Wally Winka Show, Knapp Arcade, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Knapp Arcade, The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    31:43
    The women that qualified would be Ben Hoke, Mark, you of course, Mark Scoff, Dan Armstrong, David Mosher, Ted McGinty, and Brad Lampkin. And let's not forget as well, we also had two women who played Sunday in the Women's State Championship, Daniella and Michelle. So all together, I guess you say we had eight people down there playing in the state championships, two in the women's championships and six in the men's, in the open championship.
    32:19
    But yeah, I think it was interesting. The game selection was very interesting. It had a lot to be desired from my perspective. There was no EM represented, and that was a real downfall. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, And then I thought it was interesting that they, I feel like they brought in what they thought was going to be a ringer, which was Banzai Run. Little did they know that we had had a Banzai Run at Press Start for years and years.
    32:52
    So I think that surprised them when every time they picked Banzai Run with one of our players, they all knew how to play it. So, you know, there's a little bit of that stuff going on, but I like that kind of competitiveness. —大家好 وهrahno Hetsanamani Lakancesiti Adhik Нетznoswe K기ha Dor不会 Met Khome' socials platform Hetsanamani Lakанный, Kigoski Dzobs feeling ao to mentoski dikatani melc cœur. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    33:50
    The best of seven bracket tournament. So it was two player games and you had to win four games to move on. How did you feel about that format, Mark? I liked the opportunity to play seven games, but it was a lot of pressure when it was like one zero, one one, two one, two two, and that's what happened when I played against Dan. So it was kind of like, oh my gosh, we're tied three three. This is going to determine who gets it. And it was really neat to have it go back and forth to really to up the ante in the competitive nature to play as best as you could.
    34:27
    And it's make it or break it. I know I had an issue with, well, let's just put it this way. He slayed me on Avengers. And that was the other one. That was the one I meant to say that's already a press start to is Avengers. And that played really well. It had strong flippers. We made the shots pretty easy, except there was one shot I could not hit, and it just did not stick, and that was the lock shot up in the tower shot. That was not working for me, and Dan killed it on his first ball. He had something like over $175 million.
    35:05
    I was kind of getting worried when I saw that happen and I was like, uh oh, I'm going to have a hard time catching up to this so I got to really have a good ball. And unfortunately I had a house ball on my first ball and that didn't help. So I knew I was in real trouble and eventually he took it and that sealed the deal and he was able to move on. So it was very great to see that seven game format because it allowed players to have a chance to catch up if they were falling a little behind.
    35:40
    Rather than just a three game and you're done, it gave you a little more chance to catch up and be able to tie up or at least get a couple wins under your belt to get a good lead. But it was, there's always a possibility of being able to catch up to the person and either tie it or get to a total of seven games that you play. Some, maybe you could have a blowout and just be done in four, but that didn't happen much. Most of the matches that I saw were all close matches that were pretty much down to the wire to determine who would win to move on to the next round.
    36:18
    I think sometimes it can work in your favor and sometimes it can work not in your favor, but that's a game that actually Dan owns at his house. So for me, it's always hard to play a game in a tournament that I own because as we all know, no two games shoot the same. But at least it gives you a leg up on a game that is so dense with its rules as Avengers. There's a certainly, I would assume, gave him a pretty big leg up on just rules knowledge. Yes, and the other thing too is I did not do a great job in strategically picking games.
    36:55
    There was times where I picked a game and I maybe should have got that one out of the way, not realizing that when he started playing, I go, oh shoot, that's right, Dan Owens, Avengers, and I wasn't thinking. And that's probably the thing that I had struggled with was to be strategically making the right decisions to pick games that would work for me better than my opponent. And that's probably what caused me to not do as well as I wanted to. You're just trying to psych him out, Mark.
    37:25
    You're like, I'm so confident, I'm going to choose your home arena. It didn't work for me. No game. And then when you got smashed, you were like, well, that did not work out. No. And the funny thing is the games I picked, I won on and the games that he picked and I or I deferred and did just second player, I lost. So go figure. That's pinball for you. You know, I always wonder, is it better in a tournament setting or like in league finals? You know, we do a lot of that in where you pick the game or position.
    38:04
    Is it better to pick the game you like and are good at or a game that you know your opponent hates and sucks at? Yeah, if I could do it over, I should have picked Paragon because that would have been a much more level playing field. But when I was seeing him practice it, he was playing it pretty well. So Dan, the bottom line is Dan played better than me and he deserved to win. That's the bottom line. I have no excuses to say I could have played better. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle,
    38:36
    Knapp Arcade, John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Renal Kinko, Knapp Arcade, The Winner of the Winner of the Winner is Ted McGinty from Northern Nevada.
    39:27
    We're playing exceptionally well that day. It's not to take anything away from the Vegas players, but they just were feeling it. Every game they played, they were scoring monster scores on, and they went to seven games in their match to get to the ultimate championship game, which was Sean Stewart and Ted McGinty, and Ted McGinty took that in seven games. So that was a great finish, a great result for us up here in Reno pinball land. And the exciting news that comes from that is that means that the Nevada State Pinball Championship next year will be in Reno, Nevada.
    40:05
    And that is huge news. Yes! That is awesome news. It got confirmed today that we will be hosting the Nevada State Championships next year. That's going to be amazing. Yes! And we're going to definitely make it really fun beyond just what it is for the state championships. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    40:55
    And Dan, you know that the collection of the people have up here, we're going to have a bunch of games that are going to be, you know, available to be played in tournaments. And I'm really looking forward to really making this a destination pinball event next year for the Nevada State. You guys have a wonderful one-two punch. And it's that you have collectors with varied and outstanding collections who are also into competitive pinball. And you often don't get both of those.
    41:26
    I mean, you'll get collectors who are into competitive pinball, but usually not at the level that you guys have some guys. So you guys are going to have some great venues and some outstanding opportunities to show your stuff, which I'm sure that everyone's going to rise to the occasion. Yeah, I can't wait. Which means we're going to have a good variety of games of all eras, including EMs, which I'm really excited to see you. There's certainly going to be an EM. Go ahead and count it now, Mark.
    41:57
    There will be an EM in the state championship. Speaking of our rater games. Yeah. There may be five. I mean, maybe we'll do all EMs. Hey, there you go. Just kidding. There you go. I would like that. Well, as long as Jeffrey's not in there, then we're good. No, everybody's really playing well at the EMs, too. Did he qualify? Did he go to state? Yeah. Jeffrey did qualify. It was actually the number one qualifier, but he did not attend the state championship. Oh, that's a shame, man. That dude's a badass.
    42:28
    He is. The game collection selection, though, probably would not have catered very well to him. Like I said, I wasn't extremely excited about the game choices available. It definitely skewed new. There were three Jersey Jacks, three new Sterns, you know, a couple DMD games, contaminated
    43:06
    biodiversity Expedition Uh, Willy Wonka. Oh yeah, Willy Wonka, thank you. That's right. You forgot Willy Wonka, but you remembered Toy Story. Toy Story's the new one. I know. Yeah, yeah, that's right, it's Willy Wonka. Willy Wonka dialed in and Toy Story 4. All the Lawlers. Yep. Not much, not much imagination there. All the Lawlers. Yeah, it's interesting. Pure imagination, actually. Wah, wah. You needed a Guns N' Roses in there just to really throw everyone for a loop, because
    43:39
    nobody knows how to play that game. That game's great. We don't want to play our game. That's true. It'll keep you going. It will. Yeah. So it was awesome when Ted won. We all celebrated. We went to this really awesome Mexican restaurant. I still can't remember what it's called, but it was fun. We had margaritas and it was authentic Mexican food. And like Jim jokes about, it didn't say authentic Mexican food, so we knew it was. There you go. That's a good point. It was fun.
    44:09
    It was a good time. It really was great. And the one thing I have to give credit is that we did have a chance to practice a lot on the games before the tournament started. So we were getting familiar with the shots and the layout and how they were set. And most of it stayed the same. Some of the tilts were tight, but it wasn't like over tight. Games played pretty well. There weren't that many that broke down. There was one issue we had on no good gophers of the lock not working or something like that, right, Jim?
    44:43
    I can't remember exactly what that was. Yeah, it was you make a little orbit which unlocks the lock shot and it wasn't counting the orbit so you could never activate the lock shot. But that's, yeah, I'm not 100% familiar with it either, but yeah, it was something of that. And he just played on, right? I think that was what the ruling was. Just play on. No, it was not. That was not the ruling. Oh, it wasn't. Okay, what was the ruling? The ruling was that he could choose to play on or they could open the game up, try and fix the switch, and then he could have one ball to add to his score.
    45:24
    Okay, okay, good. Glad you clarified that because I wasn't sure exactly what happened. And that's what he chose to do. That's what he chose to do. He chose to have it fixed? So they ended that game basically and then he added a ball to the end of his game. Okay that good and did he do well on that Did he win in that one I can remember No No he lost that game which I think is you know I mean you could have almost called because as soon as something like that happens, it kind of takes you out, you know, takes your mind out of the game.
    45:55
    So it's always, for me, my experience is it's hard to recover on that game from something that totally interrupts your flow and kind of breaks your game. It makes for a hard, hard comeback. But luckily that was taken. and Teddy, so luckily he bounced back and I think that was indeed that was game three of the finals I believe. Okay, well I commend Ted for not having that take away his concentration and move on. I know if that happened to me I probably, it probably would break my concentration and I probably just pretty much just self-destruct after that.
    46:31
    So that's where Ted is really a good competitive player and he just knows how to train his mind to not let that upset him and he moved on which is awesome. And the other thing too is Sean Stewart was the winner of the Nevada State Championships in the past so having Ted against the top person in Vegas was very fitting and it worked out well for us here in Reno. Yeah, I believe Sean is the is a four time Nevada state champ and he is was the was the reigning champ at the time. Yes.
    47:08
    Mm hmm. And now we took the trophy home here in our hometown, which is awesome. That is awesome. So you've secured the state championship for 2023, which is awesome. Congrats for that. What else do you have on the plate for growing a tournament play or league or just growing pinball arena? Well, again, I do my Tuesday tournaments, Tuesday pinball. I do, I won't say every Tuesday because there'll be a few skipped weeks here and there, but for the most part we do a Tuesday pinball every week.
    47:52
    I do once a month I do a tournament on Saturday. Starting in February I skipped January because we were all gone at the state finals. And I'll skip a few other months where it doesn't make sense. Like I'll probably skip May because we'll all be down at Golden State for that. But yeah, so I do that tournament and that tournament's going to be interesting because we were doing a Flipper Frenzy tournament last year. Because of the way that the point calculation system changed, we won't be doing a Flip Frenzy tournament this year in 2023.
    48:32
    But we use the software MatchPlay to do all of our tournaments, and he's created a new tournament type where it's basically a round robin. The only difference is it doesn't list all the games at once. So you just, you still, so it's very much like a Flipper Frenzy. The only thing is it guarantees that you all play the same number of games because that's what was wrong. Or that's what has been changed with the Flipper Frenzy ruling is you need to play the same number of games.
    49:06
    So we'll be testing that out in February. Hopefully it runs smooth and everything works out great because I really enjoyed the Flipper Frenzy tournament because it was more of a self-managed tournament. So it was one of the few tournaments in the year that I played that everybody got to play because just that type of a tournament doesn't really necessarily need a tournament director walking around getting scores and such. So hopefully this tournament goes just as smooth and then we'll move forward with that same tournament style for the rest of the year on our monthly tournaments.
    49:42
    ,phen Round T audio the Along with those two tournaments, the other things that I have going on is one thing that I, you know, I'm in contact with, of course, the bartenders and the other people that work at Press Start.
    50:18
    And what I hear from them is that people are intimidated to come and play on Tuesday nights. So I'm trying to get together what I'm calling a newcomers league where people can come in and maybe it's not even IFPA. Maybe it's just a small little tournament that's just for fun, just to get people a feel for it. And I'm trying to get enough people to sign up for that. And my idea is that it would be almost more like a league. So they might sign up for six tournaments.
    50:49
    And we run those maybe every other Thursday or something. And I figure, well, after that amount of time, then they should know. If they're ready to move up to play in our standard IFBA tournament, great. And then I would start like another round of newcomers. And I just thought it might be a way for people to not feel intimidated by the group. So far, and this is a little bit, you know, pie in the sky, out of my head idea right now, because right now I don't really have enough people to start it yet, but I'm hopefully going to get enough people in the future and I can start this newcomer pinball tournament
    51:27
    and move pinball forward in that way. Like a rookie's division. Like a rookie's division, yeah. Which is a great idea. I mean, honestly, your group is so friendly, I can't really see how anybody would be intimidated, but they have to be willing to stick a toe in the water. Exactly. And so maybe if you just legitimately say to them, it's like, hey, this is, you know, all first-timers, you know, first-year players, brand new, you know, brand new registrants, maybe they have to have a certain amount of time played or something.
    51:58
    Yeah, that's a great idea. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    52:29
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, Pinball Machine, I'm a big fan of the Reno area and I think, and to the point, you know, we've had new people every time. So it is literally just a type of person who is a little bit afraid because we do have a pretty welcoming group. And like I said, at $5, nobody should complain if they don't win because, you know, like
    53:03
    I try and tell people, you know, I've wasted $5 on a lot less fun things. Yeah, exactly. Well, you know, I mean, a cup of coffee is more than five bucks now. And that's the funnest, cheapest entertainment. And you're looking at what, three to four hours on a Tuesday night? Yeah, about three hours. That's about what league goes or used to go when I was in the capital quarter of pinball league. Dan, you guys still run about two to three hours on average on a standard league run?
    53:35
    No, we're a lot faster than that. We're going to have you here flapping your lips. We just fly right through. No, I asked a great point actually is it's just like we run into this question a lot is it's just like why don't we charge more you know we charge 20 bucks for a season and that's six sessions and a playoff and it's because when the stakes are low you don't you don't feel like you have something on the line and you don't get too bitter like you know we have people who you know their competitive fire gets away from them you know hats get thrown and uh you know legs get kicked and people get
    54:11
    You know, kindly reminded to calm the F down. But in general, I think that one of the interesting things about competitive pinball is while it is competitive, I think it's intensely social because when you're not playing, hopefully you're standing back and you're chatting with, you know, the other players in your group and, and, you know, you're not sitting there with a scowl on your face, you know, praying for your opponent to lose, which I call the Dan technique. I've said competitive pinball makes me a terrible person because I want to see everybody win so much, but when they're playing against me, I just want you to lose so bad.
    54:49
    And it's just one of those things where, yeah, I hope that everybody... When I went to Reno, I think I popped in for just a random Tuesday night and I knew you, Jim, and I think Mark was probably there and he knew me and Jason, I know some people up I'm a big fan of your guys' group, but like in general, you know, it couldn't have been a more welcoming group. And, you know, when I, cause I think my very first one, I actually, you know, made a pretty good run at it and I had a pretty good finish. You know, everybody was very complimentary. Everybody was, was, you know, very glad to see somebody coming and win.
    55:24
    It wasn't like, you know, I think to an extent, you know, we're talking about us versus them and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And maybe people think that it gets kind of clannish and it's really not. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Larry K. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    56:02
    I've lost to most of them, but I got them once. Yeah, and the interesting thing is actually it's a little bit of the opposite. It's almost now it's like, oh, well, I lost to Ted, but I was like, well, yeah, but you lost to the state champion. You know? That's right. It almost doesn't feel as bad because you're like, oh, I get who he is now. It's not... And when you beat him, you're like, oh! Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, the first night, the first night, the first Tuesday after he won, it was whoever beats Ted, Ted has to buy a beer all night.
    56:35
    Oh, that's funny. He didn't lose one match. He's like, watch this, kids. It's like nobody's getting a free beer off me, man. Yeah. That's another prize I give. And for every tournament I ever do, anybody who, the last place person always gets a free beer. That's cool. Well, shoot, man. I need to start taking some pinball games on up in Reno. That's the best part. You didn't say anything.
    57:06
    No, no. No sandbagging. Life don't get much better than this. People hear this, show up like 50 new people and they're going, I really suck at pinball, where's my free beer? Maybe that's what's bringing 40 people. No, I'm just kidding. I'm sorry Jim, it's been the spinner is lit all along. All 60 of us are Facebook followers. Actually I think we might be up to 65. You know, people want to Facebook. Be an old, use Facebook. Yeah, yeah, will do, will do. You know, what's funny about that is I used to go, when I was still living north
    57:38
    of Sacramento in the Chico area, we would take my two oldest kids who are grown now, we would take them to Chico Outlaw games, who has a local farm club, baseball. And the Chico team, because it wasn't a lot to do in Chico really, it's a small town, And so it was a lot of fun. It was inexpensive. It was very affordable for families to go. And I talked with, you know, guys in the club and like that. I was like, yeah, Chico's the only team that really does well, like, you know, because people really appreciate having
    58:12
    a baseball team in our little town to go see and enjoy in the summer. So the Reno team, the only night they do well is when they play on, it was like Mondays or Tuesdays, because I felt it was dollar beer night. I'm like well alright, if it gets from there. But anyway back to pinball. It's like, having played league and tournaments with Dan for several years. It is competitive it's always a fun and everybody cheers everybody on no matter what.
    58:44
    It's a low key thing and I believe that's when people discover that they go, Okay, it's not like it's competitive, but it's not like, like super competitive. People aren't like getting angry or anything else. It's like, oh, this is a fun laid back environment. And it became and even more than the competitive. I do miss that with the league is is just the social aspect, the friendships. And we all still keep in touch. Right. And that's what it is like and playing in tournaments. And when we went down to Vegas, it's like I said, it's a huge family and it's there's nothing more I look forward to.
    59:18
    I've been to the pinball shows more than Tuesday night and seeing everybody and playing pinball. It's always like, oh, I can't wait till work is done. I want to get out of here, especially with my class this year. It's like, oh yeah, this is a nice escape to have fun. The thing is, you go in there and you're guaranteed to have those games working and they work just as good as if it is somebody's private collection. You've nailed it on the head. Spencer, you said it, or maybe it was Dan, but it's so true that those games play like they're a private collection.
    59:53
    And I know that, Jim, you also have a collection as well. But one thing I want to mention about Jim is he's not only great at running tournaments, but he has a huge talent in designing the graphics and the graphic arts for Reno Pinball. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade,
    60:30
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, I'm a pinball shop and if you go to renopinball.com there's a link that goes to my page and my shop and games that I've worked on, games that I've restored. But you know, mostly for me, you know, that's not what I consider a job as far as that goes. What I try and do is my goal is that if I can just make the restoration part of what I do, pay for my shop, pay for this location and my collection to be available to play in tournaments
    61:06
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    61:36
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, Ballywin, Straight Down the Middle, Ballywin, You know, it's something that I enjoy. It's what got me into the hobby. When I was, it was probably about 2005, 2006, I saw a picture online of this cool car that
    62:08
    looked like a monster. And I thought, oh, that's neat, I'd like to have that, hang that in my garage or something. And the more research I did, I realized it was a pinball machine and it was a backglass for a nitro ground shaker. Zach Meny,kon espeich researcher, Sync Million Probatives, deci.com Texально рубricis, and投 sindia.com
    62:44
    ności. trzeba So dumb question, what was your first game? Was it a nitro ground shaker? It was not because I was raising three kids and I didn't have any money. So I had to start at the bottom. So my very first game was a big Indian. Nice. Yeah. That was a basket that came in like six containers. It was $50, $50 out of somebody's shed.
    63:17
    And my whole goal at the time was, well, I'll just fix this up and then I'll try and trade up, right? I'll fix this up, sell it or trade it for something that's a little better and try to get my way up to one nice good game. And my background, as far as a hobby goes, would be automotive and motorcycle work. I've built several Volkswagens. I'm an air-cooled guy, so I've built several motorcycles and I've built several Volkswagens from the ground up.
    63:49
    And I got to the age where I was looking for a hobby where I didn't have to crawl around in the oil all weekend. I thought, ah, pinballs are cool. I can work on them inside. It could be air-conditioned or it could be heated. I'm not going to smell like oil at the end of my day. So I got this old E.M. Pinball machine and I literally knew nothing. But it wasn't daunting to me because of my background and I think the great thing about an E.M. Pinball machine is you don't even have to know what those relays do. You just have to know that it's supposed to do this when it's in one position and it's
    64:20
    supposed to do this when it's in the other opposite position. If you make every single relay just do that, you're going to have a pretty good chance that it works. Well, no matter where you started, right, in pinball, nobody knew anything at first. Right, yeah. You know, we've all started somewhere. I started with a WPC and it was the same thing. My buddy, Will, who's a mechanic, just literally said, it's like, look, there's nothing on this thing that's broken that we can't fix. We just can't be afraid to go in there and do it. And if you're gonna own one of these, you better know your way around it.
    64:52
    Yeah, that's for sure. You better learn to solder, boy. So that's how my collection started was I just got one game and then I fixed it up and then I... What I found real quickly was that pinball machines are lonely and they don't like to be alone. Pinball machines always like to have a friend pinball machine to be with them. So I ended up not getting rid of it for a while and getting another game and I got, you know, tried to move up. I got a System 11 game. I got a Road Kings that I needed to do a full place to field restore on.
    65:27
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    65:57
    I was a pinball machine because I knew that I had $3 and if I played Donkey Kong I could play $3 for most of the night. If I played pinball I'd have to leave in five minutes. I was afraid of those pinball machines. So I never played it as a kid. Literally seeing that art on Nitro Ground Shaker is what started my, launched me off into the world of pinball. And now, thankfully, I do own a Nitro Ground Shaker. Because that would be a sad ending to that story if I hadn't owned one of those. So, thankfully, I do own that game now, and I'm pretty happy about that.
    66:29
    And it's a fantastic game. That would be a great game to have in our Nevada State Championships. That would be a great one. But yeah, it's really fun to play, and it's a good rule set, and I love those spinners. Yeah, I've got a pretty diverse collection of my own. I try and span all the eras. I have several EMs and several solid states. I think my favorite, somebody once, I think I saw a thing, what two years, if you could only pick two years of pinball, which two years would they be?
    67:00
    And mine would definitely be probably 79, 80. I love my Viking and my Countdown and Nitro Groundshaker. That's definitely my era. And that'd be a really good show topic, Jim. We'll have to bring you back for it. Yeah. Yeah, because if you can only pick two years, We can have pinballs from two consecutive years and that's it. Those are the only pinball machines you can have. Which two years would you pick? That's a good one. So what's your favorite game? It's like my favorite child, right?
    67:31
    I could give you a favorite game from different eras, but I don't think you could compare a Jurassic Park premium to say a Cam-Bam. Which one gets you right now? Which one gets me right now? I have to say I always come back to it and it's Alien Star. Nice. And it's because it's got one thing to do. It's really simple. It's really hard. And it feels so good when you do it. Good answer. I'm getting a chubby. I know exactly what he's saying. This is pinball porn.
    68:02
    Rip that spinner. We were playing to warm up last night, you know, before we went off to league. We were playing Alien Star over at George's house. And yeah, just how great of a game, right? In fact, I think the first time I ever hung out with the Reno pinball guys, we were playing Alien Star. Mike Huntsman, of course, had to describe how to play the world's simplest game in minute detail. He's a teacher. He is He is Yeah but then there games that I think get a bad rap I for whatever reason I have a weird love for the Data East game The Valley Company Subsidiary of Walter Kidde Co Inc Mirco Playfields Tim Kitzrow Scott Danesi
    69:00
    That was what they released opposite Twilight Zone. So they had to go out of their minds, you know, six balls and shakers and magnets and laser kickers and cranes and licensed music and just everything that they could do. And I actually liked the movie too, so that's just a personal defect of mine. It's one of the few, one of the few. Good movie. I've been down the Last Action Hero road a couple times. I buy it and I play it and I feel like I played it out and I get rid of it and I'm always like, ah, I really want to hear that really terrible rendition of Queensryche again.
    69:40
    Yeah. Lord of the Rings holds a special place kind of in my heart and in my pinball history because I was just knocking the ball around and then I went somewhere, again, some arcade and a casino and they had a Lord of the Rings. And that was a game that I played and it was the very, very first time that it clicked in my head, oh, this game wants me to actually do something. This game actually wants me to complete a task instead of just banging the ball around.
    70:10
    So for that, I own a Lord of the Rings, a very nice Lord of the Rings, and I have that one basically for that reason. It's kind of that, it's that touchstone for me that, oh, pinball is more than just, more than just a ball. It's about doing something. You know the game that gave me that epiphany? You mentioned it earlier, was Jurassic Park by Data East. It was the first time I ever realized, oh, there's rules. Like I'm supposed to like do this and do that and hit this to start that and then I do this and I play a part of the movie.
    70:41
    Plus, I think it was the first game I remember that had a ball saver, so that really helped. Well, it was the first game that I played that had its great trick was easy to do. Like, you could get it pretty quickly into the dinosaur's mouth and you're like, that's amazing. Yeah, absolutely. That was so cool. And it like ate the ball and then all of a sudden the ball just disappeared. I don't think games do that as well nowadays. I don't think games give you their cool trick easy enough the first time anymore. Well, besides Godzilla, like what was the last game to have a big, super crazy mechanical feature?
    71:13
    Tim Kitzrow and I became a help from a Kanita fanatical person one season ago. The weg a gran americano, dando a diamaca grande cita sobre plays delBAI, of há? 9es? The Old Boys are the Coolest
    71:43
    Yeah, I mean, the old boys are the coolest, and you could tell in the 90s that they were in an arms war to come up with the biggest, fanciest mechanism. And Data East, for all of their woes, they did such a great job with the toys. Oh, they made some great games. They did a lot of exciting things, you know, big licensed themes, big licensed music. I mean, they brought us Star Wars, you know? They brought us Batman. Think about R2-D2, that's better than the topper. Right.
    72:13
    That was in the left side. Oh yeah. In the way of Data East games. I still, I still miss Lethal Weapon 3 and Royal Rumble, and I still love both those games. Royal Rumble's a fantastic game. Royal Rumble's fantastic and you know, Tales from the Crypt is an amazing game just all around. Yeah. Royal Rumble might be one of the most underrated games ever made. Just because of the WWF theme. Yeah. There's a lot in that game. So is the Data or Data East Guns N' Roses. They packed a lot in those games. It had tons of snakes and naked checks on it.
    72:44
    There you go. What more do you need? Not much. Dan, you bring up such a great point, though. It's like they're doing great stuff with pinball today, but there's something... I felt like this, too. Like, you know, I love all the new games, but I guess with a few exceptions like Godzilla, you know, where they went, damn, now they're doing something with that game. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    73:35
    Hello, gentlemen, you know. Yeah, and that's, I'd like to see more of that. Like, oh, gosh, like the first time, you know, the first time you played Getaway, you know, and you get the ball or two or three balls up in that supercharger, and you're just like, yeah, man, this is... Oh, that's the best. I love that. Yeah, exactly. You know, or the, the sinking ship on the Stern Pirates of the Caribbean. Love sinking that thing, you know. Well, I think the one thing that I found that has the wow factor for me recently is Godzilla.
    74:07
    I mean, that climax of when the building collapses and the balls get released, that's super cool. But really, when I can think about it, I mean, Guardians is kind of cool how Groot shoots the balls out, but that's kind of like what we've seen before with Funhaus. There's just certain things that I don't see anything like unique to the point of that wow factor of mechs that I wish I could see in games. And I don't know, it's just because the bill of materials is too expensive or they just want to produce as many games as possible and just leave that out.
    74:46
    I was listening to an interview with John Borg on one of the podcasts and it was really interesting about what he was going to do with monsters John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Larry K. Sheats Jr.,
    75:17
    W Marshall ka Nikeabow laurear. I just thought you said you liked my growing up on the gaming theses ... Jeff Scott. Fuckosa, deskshacknob arity animals. Well, but even Jersey Jack has gone away, you know, from kind of the debacle of Pirates of the Caribbean, where they just couldn't get those games working as right as they needed to work.
    75:47
    And they were just taking a pounding from everybody on every every angle. I think they just want to make things that are safe, that are going to work when they get to people's houses, because the people don't have the patience and the technical expertise that the ops had. I'm not saying ops were patient for things to not work, but they understood that they would probably have to tweak them. So it's sad, but at least every once in a while, you know, we get a big mechanism like a pirate ship or like, you know, the Godzilla building and or like the Scooby Doo schlong flippers, you know.
    76:25
    So hopefully, we'll continue to see more exciting new features now that they've kind of dialed back to production somewhat and they're focusing on making hopefully less better games versus more cookie cutter games. Right, good point. And the thing that I found is you still have that wow factor in some games, you do. But yeah, I'm waiting for somebody to come up with an innovative mech that's never been done before. Now, Spooky is starting to do it.
    76:55
    And they have the ball locks in the apron. That's unique. And they did do the lifters for the Halloween where you have no clue where the ball's coming from. What would an innovative mech that's never been done before do? It would just manipulate the ball, right? I mean, you know, if you go to some games like, you know, Pinball Magic, right? Like that game, that game is wonderful at manipulating the ball, you know, and giving you cool things to shoot at. But it's not really a great game. It's just cool to watch the ball do things on.
    77:25
    Yeah. When you look at something like Iron Maiden, right? Iron Maiden's basically got nothing to it. I guess you can kind of on the premium count the weird little like secret passage that the ball goes into. Sarcophagus lock. Yeah. But it doesn't really have any fancy toys. It's just, you know, a great shooting, great rules, great art. It just does everything well. I would rather have an Iron Maiden than a Pinball Magic unless I was a filthy casual because the filthy casual just wants to see the toy golf.
    77:59
    And they want us. And I was that guy once, man. I would plug 50 cents into Adam's family because I just wanted to see thing reach out and grab the ball. Every time I saw that happen, you know, as a, as a, probably like a 15 year old kid, I was just like, that is the coolest thing. I can't believe that, you know, some genius thought of putting that in a pinball machine. I think what blew me away for me as far as the wow factor was Rudy talking. Yeah, Rudy was...
    78:29
    And watching the ball. We were talking about that at... Watching the ball was just creepy, but so cool. We were talking about that last night at League for 1990s technology, 1990 technology in fact, John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    79:10
    Although it would have been cool if Data East managed to make the Alfred E. Newman that they were thinking about doing for MAD. That would have been dope! Yeah, that would have been dope. Yeah, absolutely. That would have been amazing. You know, it's really funny, if you talk about Godzilla, you know, how he'd do Metallica. This is how weird I am. The stuff that most people really go after, I'm like, yeah, that's cool. But then there's the minor stuff that I go, now that's really cool, I like that better. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Larry Kizrow,
    79:41
    Knapp Arcade, and then like the metallopremium and all the Metallica premium or le it's not the hammer that does it for me it's the cross that raises when you get with cemetery multiball hello that's oh yeah yeah that's the one that where I just get so excited when that cross the lights come on the strobes and the cross raises up I'm like yeah that's your pro
    80:12
    I don't know if I would spend the hundreds of dollars that it no doubt costs, but that would be cool. Yeah. Well, you like with the spinners, you can add the spinners to the pro too. You know, I have those, but I've never done it because I think it's going to fundamentally change the gameplay too much. Cause they don't work like they work on the premium. Yeah, I did that to my pro and you have to decide where you're going to tie the points into. Yeah. Someone says you best, it's best to do it on like the, the pick shot. The Stand Up by The Ram.
    80:44
    That's the best way to do it because of the sound, because it's the drum sound. So you get the rolling drum sound, which is a very cool sound. But the problem is then when you want on that game was not to get too deep in the woods, but I did do that to my Metallica. And, uh, the problem is then it becomes so easy to get that pick lock to do the add a ball on the snake multiball, because all you gotta do is hit the spinner. I will, I will have to talk to you about this more, Jim, because I've, I've been looking at those things for over a year. We're just being like, ah, should I do this?
    81:15
    Should I not do this? I really want them. I will admit, I really want them. Real quick thought, will that affect the Linked Metallica gameplay? Who cares? I don't know, I just ask. I don't see how it would affect the Linked Metallica gameplay. It wouldn't affect it. Since you're not playing for points in that case, You're just playing to kick your opponent right in the nuts. I can't wait till that happens again.
    81:45
    I want to play that so bad. That was so much fun. I want to see people go without sleep to play that thing for three straight days. Yup. It's so fun. It's like, when's the last time you slept, man? I don't know. What day is it? It's like, you've been here for two straight days? Go get a shower and eat something. And we're only 106 days away, so. I can't wait. So good. I'm so excited. So good. It's coming down. We're coming up on the hour 30 mark, which is usually where we try to cut it off, because
    82:17
    we do a three and a half hour show. People curse at us and send hate mail. Good. I love hate mail. Send your hate mail to TheSpinnerIsLit at what's our? Gmail.com. And before we wrap it up, just please interact with us on Facebook. We're trying really hard to establish that. Do some reviews on iTunes. I know it sounds like shameless begging from the, you know, like every podcast does, but you know, we're working really hard to bring you guys a quality product, although it is
    82:51
    free entertainment. So don't think we're too good. But yeah, unlike Disney, we're still free. So free. Yeah. And easy. We are free. Yup. Free and easy. So, yeah. It's pretty easy. So, yeah, thank you for bringing that up, Dan. Yeah, just give us a shout out, man. Go on to our Facebook page, say hi, give us a shout out. Jim, you got anything else you want to throw out there? I'll just say thanks for having me on.
    83:23
    It was a joy to be here to talk to you guys about pinball for a little while. If anybody's interested in what I've got going on, if you go to RENOPINBALL, R-E-N-O-P-I-N-B-A-L-L www.renopinball.com You can see links there to all of my tournament information, some old streams that we used to do that I'd like to do again, and there's a link in there to my merchandise. If you want to rep Reno Pinball, you can wear us, and a link to my Tilt Shop page. So just renopinball.com.
    83:56
    We hope to see you at tournaments in the future. All right. How do they find Press Start? Press Start is pressstartreno.com. And the best place to look if you're, you know, I try and update the pinball map application on your phone. So anytime I bring a game in or pull a game out, I always keep my pinball map page updated. That's the best place to make sure you know exactly what games are available to be played there. It's right next to Brothers Barbecue. You can't miss it. Right next to Brothers Barbecue, right down the street from the Wild Orchid.
    84:30
    Yeah, always check us out because we always talk about Reno Pinball. We talk about Mark's latest exploits, you know, we talk about the cool things you guys are doing, we talk about what's going on at Press Start because we definitely... Well, I appreciate that. We used to be a Northern California podcast, but now we're a Northern California, Reno, Wyoming podcast. Which is awesome, and it's neat because Spencer's trying to grow pinball there, and we're growing, And we started off real small at the beginning.
    85:01
    I remember when we started just doing tournaments and league, we only had like 12, 16 people at the most. And now it's leaps and bounds and that's because, like Jim said during this whole podcast, the tournament format really works really well because then people don't have to be committed to coming six weeks or seven weeks in a row. And I'm just trying to run pinball into the ground here in Northern California and it just won't die. I don't know. You're doing a pretty good job. What's up, man? You're doing a great job. I'm running it into the ground? Thanks.
    85:31
    And like I said ... Yeah. You're doing it. Just keep running it into the ground. All I hear is bad things. Good job. We do what we can. It's not an easy job either. So for everybody who runs a league or organizes a tournament, has a location, has a game I'm not at their house. My house is off to you because it's never easy. Do a podcast, you know. I bounce off my co-hosts because it's much easier for me. I've done solo shows. It is really hard. But even doing it with a group, it's not easy. It takes, we make it sound easy-ish, but it's not.
    86:13
    Yeah, man. Yeah. So we're going to go ahead and start taking us out. Jim Martin, thank you again for coming on the show. Mark, thanks for being on the show. You gotta have me back again soon and keep us posted on what's going on even though Mark does too. But yeah, we can talk a lot more about all kinds of pinball stuff. Mark, why don't you give us thank you shout outs. Well, I want to give a shout out. Jim, thanks for being on the show. Thanks for everything you do. I know we spoke a lot about you here on the show, but I can't thank you enough. And thanks to all the new players that come and learn the game, learn the tournament strategy, and having fun at the same time and coming back. So if you're listening and you're a new pinball player, thank you so much for trying it out and sticking with it.
    87:05
    And some of you who may be listening on a regular basis, you started off at the beginning as a novice and you're starting to really improve in your skills. So keep that up and eventually we can beat Ted and Jeffrey. Aim high, America. So, Dan, what you got for us? Hey, big thanks to you guys as always. You know, it's a pleasure to do this with you guys. Huge thanks to Jim for everything he does out there in Reno and for joining us tonight.
    87:38
    As always, thanks to the CCPL, Mark, David, other David, you know, you guys are keeping pinball going here up in our area. And to everybody who plays in arcades, plays at our events, owns machines, buys parts, whatever it takes, you know, let's just keep pinball alive. I like it. Yeah, no, that's keeping pinball alive. I'm trying to do that to keep my games alive. I had two down, got one fixed, and then another one went down. Got the parks last night, so we'll get it going.
    88:11
    But hey, we just got an Aerosmith in the bowling alley down the street from the house. So they added a second game, Jurassic Park, and now the Aerosmith's in the house. She's pumping quarters into a third. Maybe they will. That would be nice. That wouldn't suck. So we're getting it going. So yeah, I just have a lot going on, which is on the plate lately. So I changed the name of the studio from The Dungeon because that sounded like, damn, bro, that sounds a little creepy, man. It really does. So I'm in my basement in my house in Casper, Wyoming, and I picked up on eBay an old, it's actually a reproduction, but it looks like an original, a fallout shelter sign.
    88:52
    John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    89:38
    We're here to help people listen around the world. Yes, we even have listeners in the Soviet Union, Russia, all over the place, man, Canada, Australia. So to all of you folks that listen and support what we do, go on our Facebook page, say something, give us a review, even if it sucks. Thank you to Jim for coming on the show tonight. I want to shout out to three of our good friends and listeners, Adam Holder, Eric Sieper, and Mark Sparky-Mohmberg, who's been posting stuff lately on the channel.
    90:09
    Oh, and also Shannon, Shizinehneh. Shout out to you, brother. Yeah, you can reach us on our Facebook page, spinnerslit.com backslash, forward slash, I don't know, man. It's just going to Facebook, go spinnerslit.com. You're a professional. Email us at the spinnerslit.com. I am professional. As spinnerslit at gmail.com is our email address. Our flagship where you can find us is at SoundCloud and we're also on iTunes.
    90:41
    And again, you know, from the home base at Casper, Wyoming, it's the Fallout Shelter Recording Studios. This has been episode 53 of the Spinners Lit Pinball Podcast. And let's take us out, boys. Play pinball. Keep America strong. Karka strong.