Warning, the following episode contains adult language and screaming goats. Listener discretion is advised. The Pinball Network is online. Launching The Pinball Show. Love is in the air this Valentine's Day over here at The Pinball Show. And by love, I mean Dennis not being amused at all with my ideas and him attempting to put me in my place regarding competitive pinball and its associated flaws to help grow this hobby. We also chat about a recent Cornerstone tutorial of Rush Pinball by Raymond Davidson. Super stern sleuth Craig Bobby bringing the goods regarding an upcoming pinball topper and the potential for a return of the king. We talk shoopies, a Buffalo Pinball podcast appearance, a new old stock game designer for American Pinball, Din Din Tapping That Glass, and many of you trending down this week. It's all on episode 91 of your favorite pinball podcast, The Pinball Show. Pinball is a game of skill. For some, it's a passion and a lifestyle. It's time for The Pinball Show. It's pinball with personality. It's episode 91 of The Pinball Show, and we're here, Dennis Creasel and Zach Minney, to amuse you this week with all of the pinball news. What a horrible opening. This is horrible. Can we send back our award? No shit. Sorry about phoning it in there, Zach. Episode 91, what were you doing in 1991? Drugs. I'm sorry. I was in middle school in 19- You said I was age seven. Well, I was watching the Soviet Union fall. I remember that. I thought I was going to go into Sino-Soviet studies, and I was like, well, there went my dream. Couldn't even hold their communist empire together for 100 years. I was watching the Disney cartoons instead of the manly G.I. Joes and Transformers of the world. I was like, gummy bears, rusting here and there. Baby. Remember that show? The song rings a bell, but no, I don't. Adventures of the Gummy Bears? No. You know, back... Oh, gosh. What was I... What cartoons would I... You're like, I had hair on my balls by that time. Well, I'm trying to think. I'm trying to think what cartoons are out then. I guess that. Animaniacs? Oh, that's right. I didn't watch that as much, but all my friends were into it. That was a good one. That was a good one. We still need some of those cartoon pins to make their way into... Well, I think they will, Dennis and listeners. but we're still waiting on that generational trend to set. We've still got maybe five years, ten years or so before we start the 90s become what the 80s are in pinball. Yeah, the Easy Bake Oven hasn't quite finished that cake. There you go. We've still got some rock bands to churn out. Yeah, yeah. There's still plenty of dad rock. Tony, there's still plenty of dad rock that can be done. And plenty of dad films, too. I mean, we've still got Karate Kid. You know, I prefer the dad films to the dad rock. I do as well. I'm a film guy. But I want another Back to the Future. Oh. I want us to do films that have never had a pinball machine. I'm at peace, actually, with Back to the Future. Dennis, you want to know why? Well, you love Back to the Future. Yeah, but I'm at peace if it never gets made. Have you? Have you achieved peace? I've achieved peace because I have committed to myself that if it does not get made, I will simply make it. Oh. Yeah. So once you find acceptance there, you're all good. That's where I'm at. Same with the Goonies. I don't care if they don't make it. I'll make it. Yeah, you'll make it. That's what they call an ego, ladies and gentlemen. Dennis, we have today, for people listening on release day here at the Pinball Show, it's Valentine's Day. The love is in the air, except with the IFPA, who I just got off the phone with, and I'm afraid you've been permabanned from ever discussing competitive pinball by yourself ever. Time to have a chaperone. Yes, yes, yes. That's a great tie-in to the holiday. A nice little leash that they pull real tight. I'm afraid you've gotten a little handsy with any talks of competitive pimp-ballers. Carl D'Python Anghelo's rage. We can't trust you with those topics by yourself. I'm only reporting facts here. People don't like the harsh truth, but it is what it is. We'll get into that later. Are you doing anything special today on Valentine's Day? No, unfortunately. Thankfully, we've been recording before this. I got a surprise meeting planned, so I will be dealing with next stages to get us out of the pandemic. That's what the discussion is. Huge discussion. We've been waiting for it. No hot date, huh? No. No. That's sad. That's probably for the best. I have a date today with an electrician. Oh, yeah. Do you think that you'll see sparks? Get my voltmeter out. I still don't know how to work one of those things. Do you know how to work a voltage meter? You mean a multimeter? Multimeter, yeah. I have no clue how to work one. Yeah, but I mean, I don't use all the settings on them. There are only a few you need. I mostly just try and check and make sure. I mostly use it where I just turn the tone on and make sure that the circuit's completing. Yeah, exactly. To test fuses. That's what I mostly use it for. Yeah, that's what I've done, too. Or, like, if you have two flippers, I'll measure one, and then whatever numbers it says, I'm like, I should have the same over here. Now, I have before gone through and used it and done the capacitor test to see if any capacitors are bad. Very tedious, but I did do that once before. It was actually pretty easy once I got going. So I have a date with an electrician. I'm going to check out the flipping out building and help us out there. He's going to freak when I tell him how many outlets we need and how much. Oh, gosh. He's going to go like that. We don't. That's beyond all the codes. We're going to need a bigger fuse panel. But then your games won't be touching each other in the lineup, because I know some have been concerned about the photos they've seen of your lineup. I did not think your games were excessively close together. They are. I mean, they are. They're closer than I'd like to have them, but at this point in time, I've got like... Well, mine are too, but it's like, do I want six games or do I want seven? I've got like 26 shoved into my basement right now, and I just need my building done. What a great time, by the way, to have chosen to build. It's supposed to be done this summer, and... It's summer? I know this is like a barn. Why isn't it up yet? The Amish should have gotten this up over the weekend. Well, the Amish are coming in to do the kitchen, but that's not until May. I looked at a kitchen table that was done by the Amish, but it was about, what, five times more than a commercially made table. I was like, no, I don't think I'm going to spend that much. Just like the typical work day, they put in time and a half as they'll do Sunday on the call. Well, it was all handmade, so I understood it. I was just like, eh, I think I could have gotten a machine to stand that a little better. Oh, Valentine's Day. A lot of pensiders right now sitting by themselves in their favorite reclining chair with a bottle of Juergens and a box of Kleenexes. And if you're listening to this while doing so, you're fucking sick. But I still respect you. Oh, man. I wanted to do something really inappropriate there, I'm trying to think. Yeah, and that wasn't. Well, was that inappropriate? I mean, it was. Not like Dennis was going to tell you to edit it out. I was going to go with like, hold it, hold it, don't finish, don't finish, no, no, don't. Should I edit that out? So it wins us the glass. I will edit that one out. Okay. All right. Bud Valentine's Day. It's a day to rejoice the love that you have with one another or with yourself, as we were talking about. I've got somebody really, really special in my life. I need to thank that doesn't get enough thanks, Dennis. And for Valentine's Day, I want to give a shout out to the love of my life, to my best friend, to Nicole Lee Menny. What's her favorite song? What dad rock band does she want? No, she's a mom rap fan. Now, did you know this? There's a lot of dad rock, but then we got those 90s moms that they're referred to as what I call mom rap. No, I did not know about that. Yes, just wait. They're coming. Bunch of Karens out there listening to Master P and Snoop Dogg. She listens to everything. She listens to country and pop. She listens to Taylor Swift. She'll listen to Christian music. She listens to everything. The juxtaposition between listening to some Hillsong Christian and then all of a sudden I hear Make Em Say Uh. So, yeah, she's an eclectic gal, and I love her for it, as well as many other things I love about this woman. And I wanted to remind everybody, for those of you who do enjoy what I do, whether it's video stuff or audio stuff, podcasting, award shows, distribution, I promise you and I swear to you that I would be able to do none of that if it wasn't for Nicole. But she's just as much to think about this because, you know this, I couldn't do any of this if it wasn't for the tolerance she has with me, with our business, and with the community. So, Nicole, happy Valentine's Day. I love you. It's time for TPN Industry News. News. Hello and welcome to the Pinball Show's Stern News Update. I'm Craig Bobby. Well, tons of speculation and rumors swirling around the Pinside Stern News Forum this week. No, not around Stern's next title release, but over the upcoming Mandalorian Topper due out any day now. Why all the fuss? Well, it all got started after pin-side user Torpedo2K from Cumming, Georgia, did a little poking around on his recent Mandalorian Pro Edition to discover a mysterious HDMI port that, once hooked up to an external monitor, outputs different Star Wars-related logos and art, but in reverse. Hmm. Art that looks strangely like the holographic images that projected from the Bounty Hunter puck seen on the Mandalorian TV show. So much for the owner of Surprise. It was speculated that if you pair that image through an inexpensive 3D holographic fan, you could have the makings of a pretty neat 3D holographic effect that could conceivably project out of a Mando-style helmet or other object from the show. What's your cut? For those not familiar with the Mandalorian TV show, a holo-puck, also known as a holographic puck or referred to as a bounty puck, was a small, simple holographic device utilized by the Bounty Hunters Guild that identified a quarry that was wanted. By taking the puck, the hunter accepted the bounty. Needless to say, the discovery of this feature has amped up fans on myth titles in new heights as buyers ready themselves again to folk over more dough for the must-have chopper accessory of the year. Fine, I'll take them all. And speaking of speculation, with the announcement and trailer of the Amazon-produced Lord of the Rings Rings of Power TV show, which aired this past weekend during the Super Bowl, does it not make sense that this license will find its way once again into the capable hands of Stern Pinball for either a Lord of the Rings vault or a brand new Lord of the Rings machine seen specifically after this show, which is boasting the most expensive TV series of all time, coming in at a record $465 million to produce. Wow! Could this rumor new title already be in development, much like Stern's last TV license hit with The Mandalorian? Well, we shall have to wait and see. And a quick congratulations to Rebecca Hinsdale, as she was the winner on Stern's Heads Up Invitational, hosted once again by Emoto Harney, Tim Sexton, and Jack Danger that aired this past weekend. Rebecca, who is also one of the lovely hosts from the Hot Nudge Pinball stream, beat out seven other capable competitors to win herself her very own Elvira's House of Horrors pinball machine. Wow! Way to go, Rebecca! Well, that's all for this week for the Pinball Show. I'm Craig Bobby. Catch you on the flip side. Okay, Craig, Bobby, thank you so much. Yes, thanks, Craig, for being the one person who followed through. That's a good thing. Well, and I feel bad for the other guys. They really don't have news. But I thought you believed that they need to go out and get the news. Like, squeeze that news out like it's fresh OJ. Yeah, we'll do some investigative work here. But no, it's okay. Sometimes they do. Last week, we had a lot of production updates. And I wondered, and I asked the listener, do you guys enjoy production updates? We're not really going to get these from other podcasters just based on kind of the position I'm in in the industry. Do you guys like it? I think the majority really do appreciate and like it. Did you get that sense, Dennis? Yeah. Yeah. I actually only remember seeing one person say they didn't really care for it. Do you care for it? I think it's a good service to provide. Like, if I had my druthers, I would eliminate pinball market trends and allow production updates to be the replacement segment. Oh, production updates. But the thing is that, you know, production updates probably aren't warranted every single episode either. Yeah, that's true. How often does it change? And, you know, it's always a balance. Like, do you need to run through the entire schedule or whatnot? Well, yeah. Normally they're pretty short. We try to do it if there's changes, we'll bring them up. The only thing this week, listener, is we were talking about Godzilla accessories coming out and shipping very soon. The Art Blades are shipping now. Well, the good thing is that we don't have any code updates to discuss. I know. That's why I'm so happy today. That is the good thing. Now, you have not played Rush quite yet, have you? No, I've not seen one in our area yet, though I'm sure Arrival must be imminent. It's got to be coming up soon. Where are you at, Nubs or Pizza East? Yeah, unless it's there. I won't get there until I should be there next weekend. So here in about five or six days, I'm hoping to hit both of those locations. But it was not at 403 last week. Tony from the Eclectic Gamers podcast seems like he's on a bit of a hot streak when it comes to competitive pinball. Maybe he'll tear some shit up. Well, I mean, I don't know why you're saying it like that since I did better on all the recent ones myself. But if you don't play them up, that's fine. Well, no, I don't. Believe me, I don't want to. Please, tell me about competitive pinball, Zach. Well, we do have some news about Rush. Raymond Davidson, coder and programming extraordinaire and, you know, the number one pinball player in the world, he visited Joel Engelbert from the Flip N Out Pinball stream this past week and gave a super thorough explanation of the rules and code to Rush. Oh, that's cool. Does Joel play competitive pinball? I thought he had before, but, you know, I don't know. We don't travel in the same circles. You know, Joel is doing the Joel thing. He's such a Joel. I'm out here in the real world. Very different. Does his name ever make you feel like he should be a villain in The Princess Bride? Because that's what I always think of. Inconsistable. That's fair. Man, that's a show that I don't need to see again. Overrated. Oh, now you see that would be a decent thing for a pinball machine, too. It is with Monty Python Films, and people give it so much credit for being hilarious. Except it's not. Really? Except it's not. Well, I never thought of it as a funny movie. But it's approachable by all ages. It's got action. It's got some comedy. It's got adventure. That's not really... Really? It's not... It's got R.O.U.S.'s. No, surely you know. The Princess Bride. He's going... He's got the mask. And you remember The Inconceivable. It's got Andre the Giant. Yeah, that's a comedy. Man with six fingers. No, it's not. It's a fun action, fun movie. What? It's got some comedic elements to it. but so do most movies, horror movies. I thought it was trying to be funny. The scene with Billy Crystal, yeah, but... Yeah, I mean, you can't have a... Come on. What film has Billy Crystal been on that isn't a comedy? Oh, God. Princess Bride. Now all the people are thinking, oh, there's this, this, this, and whatever. Well, I mean, it's not City Slickers. It's not... Where the hell did we go? So, anyway, Raymond Davidson... So, go and go, Bruce. They were talking about rules and... You want Princess Bride pinball machine? Just wait a little bit. We'll get one. Here. There's your nugget for this week. We better get one before another Back to the Future. As I wish. Coach Rade helped enthusiasts really understand the depth of this new Rush game. And once again, Sexton-Rade collaboration seems to be building into another tournament darling. And nobody knows tournament and competition pinball like yours truly. Yes, tell us about that. Tell us about that. I'll give you any recap you want. I'll do any of it. I'm already hearing Rush is the new mystery castle. If you want to fix your competitive pinball scene, reach out to me. I'll do some consultation work. You guys are doing so well right now, let me tell you. The listeners don't understand just how much I have seen the word mystery and castle side by side over the last week. It has been nauseating. No joke. Travis Meary can do a reaction trailer to Rush, and they get more views than the biggest tournaments of the year. What's that tell you? Just saying, it could, you know, a little flair there. You guys got to go check out the VOD of this, because if you do care about Rush and you want to know how to play it, I learned a crap load of stuff, and I've been playing that game, and I was like, oh, that's what that does. Oh, okay. Which kind of worries me, because I'm like, if you can't understand it that easily, then maybe that's a problem. Well, that's a big debate amongst even competitive people. So do I have to go and watch a video to understand the rules? I'll give you a case in point. I was playing Godzilla in tournament last weekend, and I, for a little bit, I saw the little action button flashing. I forgot I had to hold it down. Oh, yeah, for the Tesla. And then I was going along, and then I remembered because I had seen a video. I go, oh, wait, no, this one I have to hold down to get it to 100% to actually blast. And then I was able to win on that. Well, we're getting to the point, Dennis, I'm fearful that we're getting to the point that we're trying to, we as, you know, Royal We, trying to get as much different features into that selectable one button on the lockdown bar. I worry about that because, for the most part, flipper buttons are responsible for flippers, lane changes, choices when the screen is static or the bowl is static. But, man, you've got levels to this action button thing. It's starting to worry me a little bit. That, I think, is a very fair concern. In fact, the case in point one I would point to was Black Knight Sword of Rage. I saw so many inexperienced people who would see that button flashing and at the start of their game blow their MagnaSafe. Oh, yeah. Because, like, well, it's flashing at me. I'm supposed to hit it, right? And it's like, oh, what a terror. That one was, that was terrible. That was a terrible implementation. Well, and like on the newest Rush game, I like that there's options and choices. But it's like, well, if you hit it once, then you use your weapon. But if you hold it, then you use the diverter. But if you hit it twice in a Brian Morris code fashion, then you pull up your second round of weapons, and it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. And pretty soon we'll need an Xbox controller. Yeah, it's just, I don't know. And they're trying to do it based on colors. Like, well, if you hit it twice, then you go into a different. Yeah, I get it. I get it. But it's, honestly, the solution would be to add more action buttons on top if you're wanting to go this route and make them different and labeled. Riverboat Gambler it, huh? Yes, Riverboat Gambler it. Shout out to Insanity Falls. Yeah, so I don't know. But the game is a blast to shoot. You'll have fun playing it. It is challenging, as we talked about last week. As Borg layouts often are. As they often are. I'm digging the game. I just have to figure it out a little bit more. Have you downloaded all the Rush albums now? I very much, very much like Metallica. I enjoy that music because of this pinball machine. So it worked. I only downloaded Limelight. I have a really whiny voice, so I feel I can basically sing these songs. I had a listener message giving some criticism. They said, really, Zach, you could have put in any song and you went with Limelight during your last program. Like, come on. I like Limelight. I do, too. I liked it, too. But I guess they were saying. Their criticism is unfounded. That's right. Nothing is unfounded with Craig Bobby. He's reporting some very interesting details about the unreleased Mandalorian topper, as well as some questions to a Lord of the Rings vault. Mmm. Double. Yeah, double. We talked about it last week a little bit with this Mandalorian topper that's supposed to be huge. Pinside user has hooked up their Mandalorian game to an external monitor via an HDMI output on that board, and they found images and video that is mirrored. So it's kind of backwards and stuff. Oh, okay. Craig Vaughn is suggesting that this is somewhat or something kind of holographic or maybe even projection-based, which works to the theming of The Mandalorian with the bounty puck on that series. Yes, yes. That would make a lot of sense. So, yeah. That would be a pretty cool topper. Yeah, absolutely. And then we'll maybe talk about projections and uses of screen later in the program. Oh, maybe. Uh-huh. But, uh, so maybe that's, that would be, that would be big. Craig's also pondering about the return of a Lord of the Rings pinball machine after hearing about the upcoming series, Lord of the Rings, Rings of Power, I believe it's called, which is going to be the most expensive television series ever made. Or the most epic WWE matchup ever. Ding, ding, ding, ding. Get into the Rings of Power. Have you, I don't know much about this new series. I haven't been following, I've seen a little bit, but I haven't been following it. You and I will definitely watch it. Oh, probably. Yeah, we're big fans of that franchise. Do you think that Stern takes the risk on an unproven series like this, maybe to make their own, maybe either re-theming it or making its own pinball machine? If it's truly like a vault, even if it's a different art of Lord of the Rings, is it really a risk? It's not. I don't think it would be as beloved, regardless of how it is. No, no. But there are some people that just want that game because they want that game. They want that gameplay. You can rename the modes. I'm thinking like Comic Spider-Man. Yeah, there will be people that will miss the change in the call-outs and stuff. But it will sell. It would sell better than Comic Spider-Man did. Sure. I mean, Spider-Man in and of itself is a very respected game. But it's no Lord of the Rings. That's a good point. Yeah, I think you just keep it separate. If I were them I would see about getting the rights just to do the movie version and maybe you drop it around the time of the series to hope for perhaps a little bit of uptick interest But bottom line, a movie, Peter Jackson-based, Lord of the Rings Vault, at any time would sell units. The only thing at this point, there's only two issues. One, you've got such a deep backlog right now. I think you're actually, because Lord of the Rings is going to be attractive mostly to pinheads, do you really want the PR issue of, oh, well, let's throw another thing on the line even though we're behind because it looks bad. Sure. And then the other thing which I've always pointed out is, Stern has never vaulted White Star, and I still don't think they're going to go to the trouble of converting it to a Spike or a Sam or anything. I just don't think they're going to do it. One of your points has nothing to do with The Hobbit being a flop? No. Okay. No. Well, I mean, it didn't Hobbit recently as a game for Jersey Jack, even though the movies were bloated and extremely disappointing. The movies were still good, but... Yeah. The movies aren't horrible. My video game analogy would be Mass Effect Andromeda. It wasn't a bad game, but it was pretty poor for a Mass Effect game. So people didn't buy it. I see. Like me. You stand your ground and don't buy a lot of things. That's true. I am pretty cheap. Man, you being a fanboy of Microsoft on EGP lately. Whoa. I'm just pointing out who's winning. Wow. Hey, you want a PS5. I don't stand in the way of that is the right system for people. People that don't want access to games, I guess. They're calling me a shill. Times have changed. Dennis is ready to burn down Sony. He's waiting for them to buy Sony and be done with it. Not all of Sony. They don't want the movie side. They don't want to lose money. They just buy the gaming department. Poor Bungie. They're trying and shit. No, Bungie. All right. It's not really relevant to our ongoing discussion. Here's the thing. I can relate to Bungie. Bungie wants to be independent, and they can't hack it. So they were by themselves, and then they were with Microsoft, and then they got upset with how Microsoft treated them. Yeah, don't take their creative control. Were fair complaints. Fair complaints. I'm not, like, Bungie, I understood. So Bungie breaks away, does their Destiny thing, and then it's like, oh, we need someone. So then they go to Activision. Then they get mad at Activision. So they leave Activision, and now here they are in cahoots with Sony. So you tell me how long before they sever this relationship because Sony tells them to do something and they get grumpy. Well, look, you cannot cage a peacock. It's got to fly. You got to let it fly. Yes. It's made to fly, baby. It's with the beautiful feathers. Is it bungie or bungee? Bungee, like bungee jumping. Isn't something in Australia bungie? Talking about genitals, a bungie? I don't really know much about Australia. Oh, boy, oh, boy. So I don't know what's coming. This last weekend we've seen the shoopies. That's a thing now. You're welcome, people. Shoopies. Shoopies, shoopies. Still sounds dirty. I'm afraid the only thing I saw was one post of one poster of the players. And that was all I saw one time. We're referring to, listener, the CERN Heads Up Invitational, this time that was battling on Elvira's House of Horrors. They also, I do like that they had the Mistress of Darkness herself, Elvira, doing some segments for that program. So you got some cut sequences kind of like in the game, but her referencing tongue-in-cheek the production stuff. That was cool. I really liked that. It was localized still, so still eight people from Chicago. Deadflip Studio, they were recording there and battling it out. And spoiler alert, Hot Nudge wins another pinball machine. So last year, Anna Neal, I believe, of Hot Nudge, I think it was Anna Neal, won a pinball machine. And this year, it was Rebecca Hensdale winning a brand-new Elvirus House of Horse pinball machine. Those are hard to come by. Yes. How did she get that then? So how was Shoopy viewership, Zach? Overall, I think it was multicasting on a variety of things. I like to see that Stern was casting from Facebook on their Facebook page, and I believe their YouTube page as well. It was on the Deadflip, so it gives a lot more exposure through Deadflip pinball streaming as one would imagine on Twitch. Oh, yes. I'm a big fan of multicasting. Yeah, yeah. I don't know how that worked. Jack was playing it on Twitch stream. He was on the, like, a green screen kind of giving commentary to the commentary. So you guys can check that VOD out, whether it's on Stern Pinball or Jack's Twitch feed. But another highly produced piece from Emoto and company over there, Tim Spexton and Jack Danger hosting the event. Go check it out. Speaking of content creators, I myself was on the Buffalo Pinball podcast a couple of days ago with co-guest Ryan Wanger. Oh, the Comet Pinball guy. Absolutely, co-owner of Comet Pinball. And he routes a lot of games as well. Yes, that's true. I didn't think he has an arcade now. Ryan's doing a lot of things over there. Yeah, I think when the pandemic came, I thought they stepped in and took over a place. I don't remember. It's been a while. That was early in the pandemic. He's over in Colorado. we were asked to come on to the Buffalo show to discuss the business of pinball, a really interesting discussion about operating games on location and kind of the ins and outs of pinball distribution. Both Comet Pinball and Flip N Out Pinball are sponsors of the Buffalo program, so we all came together and talked more of a very serious kind of discussion about what the pandemic has done, where we're at now, where we're going in the future, the pluses and minuses of both respective businesses and positions in the industry, And I would highly recommend it, not only because I was in it, but it was a really good program. We need more of that kind of stuff out there. And during that broadcast, I probably said some things that were pretty strong. So you guys will like that. I probably said some stupid stuff in which I'll have to correct. But kind of like last week, I said something I have to make a correction this week. Like, remember, listener, when I was talking about Barry Engler leaving JJP and running parts and stuff over at American Pinball? They were a member. Yeah, I got it wrong. Member Bears. They were spoiled. Member Bears were rotten on that one. Barry Engler is not running the service department like he did in the past. He's actually, his title is now Senior Production Manager. So he's in the production side of things. So I guess Dave Jeff Brenner is safe for now. Okay. Everyone was worried because Dave's very popular. I know. I love me some Jeff Brenner. Speaking of American Pinball, they added a new designer because they were desperately in need of one, of course. Barry Oursler added to the team as a game designer over in American Pinball. That's another deep root take. That's right. His next game is slated to be released in 2028. So American Pinball now has Steven Bowden, Barry Osler, and Dennis Nordman, who are all associated with Deep Root Pinball. As well as the, they said Riot Pinball will probably make another game for them. So I don't know what Barry, it's kind of perplexing, almost like the JJP thing where they've got four designers, and it's like, well, one every two years means that each designer is going to get eight years. Like, I don't, it's a head scratcher. They seem a little top-heavy on designers, and by a little, I mean tremendously. That's right. But I'm all about some Barry Osler. I like his games. So anytime he can put some more work into the industry, I'm game. I'm ready for it. I'm waiting for Dave Fix to come out and say he's going to design a pin. Really follow that Robert Mueller track. I'm waiting for them to actually accomplish the release schedule that he's been saying. I think that's a fair request. I think I'm always fair. That's fair. the second annual pinball industry awards you're tired of hearing about it yet listener they are yeah i'm not going to go into it much but i did it was nice to see some of the recipients of the crystals on social media sharing some photos of their glass zombie yeti was sharing some kind words to the industry a lot of people are so because of course he's basically worshiped at this point is he not worthy of that worship well you know i'm not saying that it's it's full on cult-like, but I get an impression that if I were in person talking to you and Zombie Yeti came up, I would have to cover my heart as a prophet. Because you'd be all like... Hold that thought, Dennis. Jeremy! Bullerum, zombie-um. No, I mean... Temple of Doom reference for this, I don't know. I mean JP or Ty. I'd give them the cool head nod. Sup, bro? Yeah, I'd play it off cool, you know. The Zombie Yeti sharing some love. Dennis Kreisel sharing some love. That was a pretty trophy you had there. They're so heavy. Do you have it on your mantle? I have it. No, not. I have a shelf. Well, I have a part in my game room that functions as a shelf, and that's where I put my pinball trophies and stuff. Did it share the pillow at least one night? No. Damn it. I get poked. It's got a pokey poke. It's very pokey, isn't it? It poked my eye out. I mean, it's a Christmas story, but I wouldn't be able to enjoy it when they finally released that game because I'd have no depth perception anymore. Poke your eye out, kid. Poke. Mike Vinikour also showing some love. I haven't seen that one. Yep. He did all the lighting on Led Zeppelin, the expression lighting. That's right. One of the few wins over Godzilla. Deservedly so, in my opinion. Absolutely. So we get a lot of love there. Probably more to come. It was fun because I did, I wanted to assist Pays on Shipping, so I sent a dozen or so of those. We went up to Chicago, dropped off the crystals at the Stern Pinball Factory last Tuesday, and I went and handed it to my buddy up there who works at Stern, and they weren't expecting a box of crystals to which you should see his face. He took it. He was like, no, I can hand it. I was like, all right, here you go. He's like, oh, gosh. He sat it down very quick. Wow. So this was Jody Dankberg? It was not Jody. Oh, that's my guess. Jody may have been there. This was Ryan. Ryan with parts. Parts department. Oh, parts Ryan, yeah. Yep, he's responsible for running all the parts and accessories and got to stay close with my topper guy there. Yeah, we delivered that. Real fun story, though. So quickly we kind of had a buddy with me, so we looked around the place. Everybody was gone. It was like 6.30, 7 at night. And sorry, Ryan, if you're getting in trouble because of this. So we were perusing through the different factory and whatnot, and nobody was there. The motion lights had to come on whenever you were in certain areas. But then I heard some sound, almost the sound of a 2112. I got some Bastille. I heard Rush, and I'm like, where is that coming from? And there he was, surrounded by like 12 Rush LEs, all the hoods up. He was tinkering around. legendary designer, John Borg. Oh. After hours, just sitting there just working away, trying to, you know, trying to tweak things. I thought, damn, that guy's cool. That is so nice. What was that, Tuesday? Tuesday night, like 7 o'clock. There he was just working away, big old smile on his face. We chatted for a little bit. He was just loving life. And I thought, man, that's good stuff right there, seeing Borg out there working when he doesn't have to. Maybe he came in late that day. I don't know. Elliot Elliot Eismin was there, too. I think you could say hi to him. Elliot, I love your engineering. You don't get enough love. Poor Elliot. When are the engineers going to get the love they deserve? Harrison Drake. I mean, come on, people. Those are the household names we need to be talking about. People already struggle remembering the names of the designer, artist, and software rules folks. So, you know, I think the brain just doesn't want to remember that many names. To me, Harrison Drake is the Scotty Pippen. You got Michael Jordan, Keith Elwin. You know, with his big old cape that covers up everything. But damn it, Rick Nagle and Harrison Drake are people too. Do you herald this thing as the greatest of all time, this Godzilla? Well, it wasn't just Keefie. I'm trying to think, if he's a goat, what would they be? Sheep? No, that's a Nagle. A lamb chop. Lamb chop? No, not a lamb chop. I'm a puppet. I'm a lamb chop. I don't even remember what lamb chop sounds like. Never mind. This is a song that never ends. Oh, man, I grew up on lamb chop. I know all about lamb chop. Now that song is going to be stuck in my head. And, listener, I missed the last couple weeks here to talk about the announcement of Multimorphic's Flipper Foxtrot Rhythm Explosion, now available for sale. I guess a... It's a third-party game that doesn't require a new module, so it's a downloadable game. A downloadable game. If you have the relevant module. And this is from Nick Baldrige from the Bingo podcast, I think. Oh, gosh. I'm trying to remember the full name of the podcast. Pinball Bingo Podcast. It's so wrong. I can't. It's like the EM and Bingo Pinball podcast, I think. Oh, I see. Okay. This game is a rhythm-based game, kind of like your Dance Dance Revolution, but for pinball, I think. And 27 different tracks, five unique difficulties. Do you know much about this game? I mean, I haven't played it. So only basically what was read. A little bit about how you're doing the rhythm with the buttons, and then certain things happen. and the ball comes into play, and then you need to try and deal with the pinball aspect. So it's got like a video game element and a pinball element to it. Okay, and you're using the flipper buttons as kind of the steps too, aren't you? Yeah, I think so. See, I'm more familiar with rhythm games where you do use the controller for your steps. To me, that's what I think of along those lines, because I'm trying to think if I've never gone to an arcade and played DDR on the big pad and everything. Now, Nick has that stuff. Like, he has a whole DDR setup. Oh, because that makes sense why he was interested in this. You guys can go watch the Vodda Gamma Goat, I believe, streamed one of the first streams of this. Buffalo probably at this point, they're close to multi-morphic, probably has a stream or so. But check that out. My first impressions and thoughts are it's just another additional cool thing for multi-morphic owners to buy, I guess. I mean, honestly, I don't really get it. If I'm being honest, I don't know. Yeah, I mean, I would say I don't think it moves units in terms of, like, selling P3 machines. Of course. Because it's another game that isn't traditional pinball. And it's interesting because Multimorphics P3 platform really allows a lot of people to be creative. And these sort of things, I think, are very creative for the pinball space. But what's the biggest complaint that I've heard from people that have looked at P3 is they've wanted more traditional pinball games. Now, that may be something that you just need to rely on first-party development of because, obviously, those people that want to develop like a homebrew style and put something out on P3 are going to do what they're interested and passionate about. Mm-hmm. Yeah. To me, some of the biggest complaints about pinball is that the game's on the play field. I shouldn't be looking at the display the whole time. I don't care about your jack 27-inch displays. I don't look at it. And then they also say, I hate that damn action button. I don't know why everybody's southern. I hate that action button. You've got two flippers. I've got two hands. I've got two flippers. I don't need that action button. This seems like the worst of both. You've got to look at the screen, and then you're using your flipper buttons for rhythm-based stuff, but you're still also trying to flip balls. It looks like a game that would anger me. Because it's like, well, what am I supposed to do? Am I supposed to be playing pinball? Maybe you need to take the unique difficulty level of one. Yeah, I don't. I want this platform to do something. It's just, I don't know. There you go. Sorry. Well, if you thought that won't go over well, wait until we talk about it. Well, last episode, I brought up a topic that I felt strongly about, still feel strongly about. No one understands why you feel strongly, but continue. you? Because, you know, I feel strongly about pinball and moving it forward. Have you ever heard, there's an expression, it has to do with, with like highways, you know, they got, what are the things you drive in? What are those called? Cars? No, no, no, no, no. And you keep the cars in what? Garage? On a highway. A highway. Stay in your lane? Oh, you know it. Oh, okay. Stay in your lane. You know it. Wow. Again, the peacock, man. There's no lanes where I fly. Well, we're going and we don't need lanes. But when the peacock flies into an alligator's mouth, why is it shocked when it gets bit? You're like, that swamp is mine. And the alligators are like, nope. I was simply bringing up things that I thought were of interest. to the in-disc coverage and the way tournament pinball in general is not only played and performed based on rules for, but consumed. And I knew I'd get a strong reaction from the public, and I have many, I will say many, Dennis, many supportive of my statements. No. Yes. And a lot of people. Percentage-wise, it was minuscule. I saw publicly the outpouring of hate. It was an 80-20. I'll take it. 20 is being generous. Give me 10. Give me 1%. Maybe 10. Maybe 10. The non-tournament people who replied to you, some of them may have agreed with you. The thing is, and we've said it before, Dennis, prior to any awards we may have earned. Yes, that happens to us every year. I say us because then I get messages like, why didn't you stop him? Like, well, I wasn't there. Sometimes pioneers, they run into these struggles on their question journey to help the whole industry. And that happens. And we've got to take the chips on our shoulders, and we've got to know that you all mean well when you come at me negatively saying, I don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Yeah, they all meant well. They did not mean well. Yeah, I think they meant fairly well. Even our closest people. 20% well. Within the Discord channel, they were the most active of the individuals were, I think, probably within our own team. Shut up, Zach. There were a lot of TPN participants that play in tournament pinball. In fact, I would say Raymond Davidson might have been the kindest one to you. He's such a sweetheart. He gets it. But, I mean, so here's the, I swear we had this discussion before, but here's the thing. So I get it. I get it. See, I'm an understanding person. Really? Okay. Yes. I like that. Yes. In fact, I think I was one of the more tame ones, probably because I missed most of the discussion. I just came in at the end and threw some. I'm not going to read that. Well, because they're two pieces. Because the way the discussion, and obviously people haven't seen everything we're talking about. They can only go off of what you said and what they might have seen on places like Pennside. Mm-hmm. So in my view, some of the individuals are overly crediting. There are two pieces. There's the piece you mostly focused on, and then part of our discussion kind of delved into what makes the – what's the growth of streaming? What's the growth of watching tournaments? And I think some people are giving a little too much credit to things like production of, like, camera quality and stuff and not really thinking. Like most streamers, in my view, and maybe I'm wrong, but I think is a good case in point of like Jack Danger, for example. It's the personality that drives a lot of that. That's something you have emphasized about like commentary at tournaments, about the importance of having interesting personalities having the discussions. That's where I think you have a good point. Okay. The problem is, in my view, and I think in the view of most that responded, is despite your purported passion for pinball, which I think is genuine. Despite my nose cut off, my face was cut off. You don't and have never sought to understand the tournament player perspective. Oh, here we go. So you go in, bull in a china shop, talking all about the growth of pinball. Like, why would that even need to be their agenda? Like, they're there to play and have fun. You seem completely dismissive about it. And instead, you're just like, this is what we need to do to get more people to watch. It's like, do you even know if most of those people care how many people watch? The strong take I had to our Discord channel was, I don't care what the players think and what the players want. I don't care. You don't. No, I don't. And the thing is, I think to most, though many of them did not articulate it. It's not a personal thing. No, I get that, but I think they did not articulate this as well as I'm going to, and that is, if you don't care what the players think, then why would they continue to play tournament pinball if we were to implement your reforms? Because people want things that they don't know they want until they're presented to them. It's almost like I'm looking out for these tournament players. I love it, only because of how patronizing it is. Yes, you know, I'm looking out for them. I can see. I'm like the great eye of Sauron. And, you know, they're feeble-minded, at times selfish hobbits that aren't seeing the forest through the trees. Man, that was a perfect reference. Fucking sack. Nailed it. As a quick recap for those listeners in here, I was basically saying the in-disc finals were awesome, and it was highly viewed, and the commentary was awesome, the production level was awesome. It had a lot going for it. It's probably and arguably one of the biggest representations of competitive pinball that you're going to see throughout the entire year. However, the finals, the Super Bowl, the Grand Slam, the final four people that were competing against three pinball machines, those three pinball machines were not relevant. They were old. They were unbalanced. And there are games, in general, Mystery Castle, that people that just dive into this, what is this, pinball stuff, they're not going to be able to play. They can't purchase. They were shit games. And I think having that as the grand finale is a poor way to push pinball forward. And if I'm a sponsor of this program, i.e. American Pinball, Stern Pinball, I would damn well have some kind of agreement that you can have all the shit games you want because that's what makes Indy smash you. God, I'm going to puke if I hear that again. That's what makes Indy smash you. It's not a tournament. I'm not asking to have these awesome new games throughout the tournament, for God's sakes, being more balanced than some of these shit Gottliebs they put in there. You can have your little eclectic, you know, West Coast, oh, everything's funky, hipster-y and cool. That's fine. Have it. But during that final game when we have the most exposure and the most ability Dennis and listener to kind of recap and have one segment to put on a grander scale whether it be ESPN or another news outlet can we not have something a little bit more relevant that people can say, hey, I can identify with Avengers Infinity Quest or I can identify with Stranger Things or some type of intellectual property that has the capacity to actually pull people in instead of pushing them away whenever some of the best players in the world are trapping up on an old Alvin G game that nobody gives two shits about. That was a quick recap as to what my argument was, and the blowback I received was, you don't know competitive pinball. Maybe if you played in a tournament, you'd understand. Maybe. I think at this point, I don't even advocate that you do it, because I think you're so set that your opinion's right that you'd refuse to change it even in the face of playing. So I don't see the reason for you to waste your money. What the fuck is it going down to the local watering hole and playing a game in a tournament They're going to make me see different. That will change nothing. Because, well, the only thing that would, in my view, would be whether or not you actually got into playing tournament pinball. That's really what it would come down to. Because if doing it wouldn't change that stance, then I really don't think your views would change. And for those that, I mean, I think your recap was very good about basically what you argued for and what you argued against. I'm poking the bear again. Sure, sure, of course. Exaggerating. And where I think it frustrates tournament people is just like, well, like, if you're going in and you're doing placements, you're doing qualifying, whatever, however the tournaments are set up. So, you know, and different tournaments are different ways, of course. But it's like one of the core tenets in many of these things is what's the value of being well-seeded, you know, going into these things, being rewarded for your victories, being rewarded for your good qualifying. It's driving the bus. But Zach's solution is, once we get to finals, there is no bus anymore. You're on rails. It's a train, and your rails are going to take you to everything that Flip N Out Pinball sells. I could see somebody's argument there. Then the other item that they raised with you as a concern, which I think is legitimate, is how many randos out there who don't know anything about pinballs stumble into a tournament stream during finals finals and go, oh gosh, this could have looked cool, but I saw Mystery Castle. I guess I'm not interested anymore. The consumption of streamed pinball in a tournament setting, which quite frankly, outside of tournaments, I think is pretty dang boring to watch in terms of you're not into tournaments. I just don't see why you would watch it. I do. The audience is small. We saw people in our TPN Discord praising that it had 1,000 concurrent viewers. Do you know how small that is, how small fry that is? Yes, I do. It's shocking that people, I get it because I've streamed pinball before. I do get why it's exciting to see that number in pinball. But you got to understand, like, D-tier video games played by not that great players break those numbers. So it's just not, that's not a lot of people, it's not enough to do, your whole reform thing doesn't make any sense from a tournament player's perspective. Because you're asking them to sacrifice all of their fun for people who aren't even going to be there to watch. That's a blank statement. Number one, no, you have to start somewhere. That would be my argument. Just because it's not getting the numbers now doesn't mean you shouldn't continue to pursue. That's number one. Number two, so the pinball players can't enjoy the way. Oh, they've enjoyed three days worth of competition the way they want it. No, and you want to change it at the end? I mean, think about that. The tournament all the way up to then was playing in all eras, and now the finals are going to be decided on long-ass playing sterns? And see, that's the other argument that's just total bullshit. What makes an older game shorter playing than the newer game? It just means that you haven't adjusted it well enough to make it more competitive. That's all. And if you were a tournament player, you would know the frustrations and complaints that many, not all, but many tournament players have with brutalizing games to the degree that they are now no longer fun to play because you can't accomplish anything. Why don't you go in and make Lord of the Rings play where you get less than a minute a ball? It sucks. No one wants to play it because you can't accomplish anything at that point. The other thing to counter your argument is then you're going to just wait until the finals, and then you're going to change it, and there is no more bus. The bus is in the repo station. Yes. If you've got the four greatest players in that whole damn place, when it comes to the finals, I'm pretty sure they're good enough to adapt. It's not necessarily that about adapting, But let's go back to, let's take a, I mean, it could be any tournament. But let's say hypothetically that you're, because many of these tournaments work on this, where you have, let's say, unlimited qualifying and you pay for your ticket. Okay. And I don't remember the exact model that Indus does. I think, or like a pump and dump. I think Indus does all an entire, I don't remember. They do the old Papa system or not. I don't want to speak out of turn. You get your tickets and cards and stuff. But if you're not getting a reward for being number one, you're asking them to sacrifice their own prize pools. What do they win whenever they win this whole thing? Do they take home anything, or do they just go home with the medal? In most tournaments, there's at least cash. And then there might be a pinball machine if it's sponsored. But what about the end disc one? They take home the prize pool. The bulk of it goes to the first player. What was the end disc? What do you win as the end disc champion? Again, I don't know. I don't care enough to have gone and looked. A new Stern premium pinball machine. Do they not win money as well? They might win money, but prize pools are big. A new Stern Premium $9,000 pinball machine. You know that a lot of times they don't take home the pin, right? You do understand that they sell it. The point being, you're going to bring in and making proposals that are going to cost them thousands of dollars in entries. Because people are like, it doesn't matter if I'm first or eighth. I'm going to be stuck playing Rush. See, I don't think it would affect anything because most people don't think they're going to get into the finals of the finals of the finals. But we're talking about the best of the best. And the best of the best know. Ask Raymond. Ask him. Yeah, I would ask Raymond. Does he want to be able to pick which games he gets to play? That's what they play for because it matters that much. All four of those players would still be in that tournament if they couldn't pick if they were in first place in the last finals. That's how much these players want to compete. The selection determines whether they'll win. What do you mean? There are games where someone like a Tim Sexton or a Raymond Davidson know they have a better shot against Keith Elwin on than others. They want the right to pick those games. But you're going in saying, well, the only thing in finals will be the games that are when designed. No, it doesn't have to be that. It's just relevant games that people can play. I'm using some hyperbole here to overemphasize my point. But you're going in saying, again, and logically from a quote-unquote sport perspective, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me, I think to an outsider, for you to argue it's fine if you're qualifying on classics and System 11s and stuff. But once you get to the finals, the landscape's totally different now. All I said was I want relevant games. There are some System 11s that are very relevant. There are EMs that are very relevant. Then you should love Pinball Expo with its Sternament tournament, which is one of the worst high-level tournaments that there is. I'm not saying every game has to be that. I'm just saying maybe one game be a new Stern. Maybe one game. My understanding is there were new Sterns there. People just didn't choose them. They shouldn't have that option of choosing. If they can't choose something that's for the greater good of the industry, I see what you're saying, but I don't think you're actually going to really advance the industry that much with these modifications that you're proposing, but you'll definitely piss off the... I mean, pinball tournaments are so unwatchable as it is. You'd have to dramatically reform the game to make them on a truly competitive level. I completely agree. So I just don't think that it makes sense to focus that way. Being stagnant and doing nothing, you've already got data for that. And how well is that working for you? It's not. tournament, but tournaments, they see it from the success of the tournament. And the tournaments are becoming more popular, more people are signing up for tournaments, and more people are playing. So from their perspective, it's working just fine. At a snail's pace. Wonderful. But they can only hold so much capacity. I mean, remember, look at when we had Pinburgh. The limiting factor was the number of games. It's easy enough to design a tournament that can easily hit the level that your games can support. This can't grow ad infinitum. We don't have enough product and enough space and enough coordinators to do it. Tell me this, Dennis. Hypothetical scenario here. If I had a tournament once a year, it's known as the biggest pinball tournament of the entire year, and the winner takes home $100,000, do you think that player is going to be concerned if in the last set of games, if they make it into that final championship round, that they can no longer pick what game that they want to play as the bus driver? You think they could overlook that for a $100,000 prize pool? I think if you went in and said, here's the tournament, here are the rules, there will be no bus driving, and the grand prize is $100,000, yes. Yes. Okay. But you can't do that. That's my point. You can't deliver it. Bullshit. The only way we can deliver is if we compromise certain things. Who would be stupid enough to give $100,000 for a pinball tournament as a reward? The back end value as a sponsor of that is you'd never get enough out of it. Right now? No. But if we push forward progressively to get to that point, we could get there. This current model will not get there. No. No. What do you think about that, listeners? Your model won't get it there either. It will never get there. Talk about doubling down. My ass will triple down on this shit. I know you will because you want to be right, but logistically, this is not going to happen. Pinball will never be that big. And the execs and marketing over at Stern Pinball, I love and respect you guys. What the hell? You're giving these people money and shit? If you're going to sponsor their thing, I would be driving home, hey, you need to have my product in the finals. This is just not where the energy should be focused. You're coming up with these weird hypotheticals that we require. I mean, look at all the growth we've had in pinball in terms of collectors, location players, all of it. And why is that? And, no, I'm not, quit interrupting with your dumb questions. We're going through my point. And my point is, even after all this time, we think about this huge resurgence, which I think you and I have both agreed we would kind of credit back to 2012. We still only have one truly serious manufacturer in play here. That part needs to be solved first before you start obsessing over the best way to get exposure for the broad audience at tournaments. We can't even get the production right. We've got companies promising two to three games a year that struggle to even do one. I agree. They struggled before the pandemic, and they struggle still here at the end of it. It's just we've got other problems. We've got bigger problems, Zach, than you trying to, quote, unquote, fix tournaments. You made a really good point, and then we'll get off this. There's so many stupid responses I've received in reference to this idiotic, hyperbole, taking things out of context. It was fun to argue because it was so illogical. But you brought up a good point, and you said, why does the tournament player, if they enjoy doing what they're doing, why should they have to compromise that for the greater good? Maybe they just want to play in a pinball tournament. And that one's hard to refute. Oh, man, that was my – you had mentioned – this was in a discussion where you had mentioned – called them selfish. Yes. And it's like – but that's how all tournaments and everything – like, they do it for them. So to me it was, you're not wrong in saying it's selfish, but that's how – that's the only reason anyone would do something like a tournament, was for selfish reasons, for your own personal enjoyment. That's why I play. And I simply use that term as a... Oh, yeah, no, and you clarified that. You weren't trying to be demeaning, but you were trying to think about the greater good. Because I kept being told, you can't speak because you don't know, because you've never played in a tournament. And I think that's the loosest, most belligerent argument that I've ever heard. I think you can. I don't think you have to have done something in order to speak. I think I've mentioned that before when you've gotten in hot water on these topics. but because you don't have the experience, there seem to be certain aspects to the player enjoyment side that you don't factor in. And I think if you do a bunch of changes where the top players are like, I won't have any control, I don't know if they all play still. Maybe because they're so good. But what about the ones that are just a little bit, you know, it's just, that's not how tournaments work because it's not fun for people. There's all sorts of changes I'd love to do to tournaments personally, and we discuss those locally in the Kansas City area, But I often have to point out, hey, I don't like this and this and this because it inconveniences me or I philosophically don't like this approach. But I understand you guys have chosen to do it this way because more players like it this way than Dennis's way. And that's just how it is. And the one question during all of our discussion behind the scenes and publicly in the different forums, the one question that nobody will answer is, OK, you guys are arguing for Mystery Castle. So you're telling me Mystery Castle is a great representation and a well-balanced game for the final round championship of a large major tournament. Nobody will answer that. And I think I know why. I thought it was weird that someone who owns Popeye's criticized Mystery Castle, but I didn't bring that up. Love you, Barry. I'm even scared to go into this segment right now. I've got people surrounding the building right now. They've upgraded from pitchforks to spades. Is that a garden tool still? A spade? Yeah. Okay. You guys are going to have to wait because I know you poo-poo my opinions and my thoughts on progressing this industry into something I'd like to refer to as the pinball holy land. That's fine if you don't want to come with me. The pearly gates are open. I'm going to win you back with none other than your love of everything pinball show and pinball market trends. Yeah, I've won them back. Their hearts are full again, Dennis. I am determined players have long memories. Maybe. Maybe. You can stack and multiply this market trends. It's great. Training up this week is the Chicago Gaming Company remakes. These things are hot again. I don't know if it's because Cactus Gaming is about to come out and people are trying to collect them all. But right now, Alien, Monster Bash, and Medieval Madness are at it again. Remember when the Royals were going for like $20,000? Now we are seeing the SEs, the Special Edition. Not even Alley's, but the ESPY's jumping up into the $12,000, $13,000, $14,000, even $15,000 ranges. Some of these are new in box, but still, my point holds true. Turning up are the remakes. You can't beat that type of fun. Lord knows if we put that in the finals, oh, jeez. I don't want to put that in the final. Too many people know what that game is, actually. It's too enjoyable. We don't want enjoyables. I'll get off this. I'll get off this sub box. CGC remakes are up right now. If you guys are looking for one, don't overpay. I'd wait until Cactus Canyon comes out. Some people are going to jump ship on all the other stuff. So hold on. But then again, I just bought an MMR and a Tank from Marsh. But you get my drift on that. Turning up is that. They're going to be high right now. I've seen recently, Dennis, even when it comes to these toppers, I've seen a couple of LE toppers go on sale. I think the LE owners of like, not Medieval Madness, because you could have bought that as an accessory piece, the King of Pain topper. But the Attack from Mars, Ellie topper, the Bouncing Alien, and the Medieval Madness custom molded the band, if you will. Can you believe the Ellie owners are like, well, shit, this market's that high? I want to cash out on this topper. I don't need this topper. Can you imagine getting rid of that piece if you had an Ellie? Oh, yeah. Really? You would consider it? I mean, I don't even know if that piece would fit under where my ceiling is for my games. Oh, I see. The Walking Dead one actually can scrape the ceiling, so I had to take it off. You have the going rate for a CGC LE topper of Attack from Mars or Monster Bash. Any guess, Dennis, what the going rate is for one of those toppers? $3,000. $3,000 would be a steal. If you guys have a $3,000 Alien or Monster Bash topper, email me at thepinballnetwork at gmail.com. I'll be happy to purchase that. $5,000. $5,000 for each one of those. If I had an Attack from Earth topper of $5,000, I would sell it before this program's over. That's what it is. All's training up this week is another unobtainium topper at this point. Iron Maiden, the game. Not the topper. If it comes with a topper, that's a bonus. But Iron Maiden, the game. I told you guys weeks back. I'm not going to make this in 2022, so be on the lookout for these. I didn't think they would increase this quick. But, yeah, with people like Philemon, I'm trying to sell the damn thing. Iron Maiden is on the up and up. I recently seen an LE, new in box. Who in the hell sells a new in box LE? They posted it for a remarkable $27,000, which I thought was preposterous. And then the next day it was marked as sold. Now, I don't know if they got the $27,000. Yeah, maybe it was an Iron Maiden 40th. An LE, new in box, $27,000 came marked sold. Even if it went for $25,000. Yowzers. It makes you wonder how much the premium is. We're seeing those go for listing for $13,000 now. It's used, Dennis. Used premiums. Yeah. It's very regular now to see a used Stern premium of a highly sought-after game at $12,000. That's normal and typical now. $12,000. Wow. These prices are getting insane for me, even. Makes it hard to run a business, too, anytime you list something like that. You'll just have to quit taking in games on trade. No shit. Damn. I've got to show my receipts. Yeah, people. I brought it in for $10. I'm trying to sell it for $11. No, they don't sell it at all. Help a guy off. $1,000. Also trending up this week is a TV series that I fell in love with so much so that, you know what, went back in the bullpen besides David Dennis. Ozark went in the bullpen for now. And so did Oba Fett. The Book of Boba Fett in the bullpen. For one show and one show only, I cannot recommend this thing enough. Thank you, Greg Bone, for making me push through the first two episodes. It's The Witcher. The Witcher is some of the greatest television that I have seen. It is dynamic. It is original. The writing is, some of it is hokey. The first couple episodes, you're like, shit. Am I really getting stuck in a CW television show? I do not want this. But no, push through and you're going to find yourself one of the most captivating, one of the great character development group of people. I like horror films, Dennis. You like horror films as well. That's why you love your Halloween. I love horror films. But I don't get scared. Horror films don't really scare me. You're dead inside. Right, right, right. I'm a tough, I'm a tough, hairy-chested man. Five hairs. I don't get scared. There were a couple moments. I like to call them, you know, moments. There were a couple moments. So Dwight's all, how do you create the Witcher TV series? There's a couple screaming moments here that were some of the most jarring and truly horrific scary television I've seen in a long, long time. Really, really well done series here. And, yeah, I thought it was going to be hokey bullshit. We've got Henry Cavill that's in it, and I can't say enough about him. He's kind of hidden. He's the main feature, but it doesn't look like him. Oh, that's what I say. It's the Gilmore Girls with swords. It's kind of romance. It's a romance. It's an action. This has your name written all over it. I'm going to have to get you a Netflix subscription so you can watch this because your hard-headed ass will never subscribe. The Witcher. Email us at thepinballnetwork at gmail.com if you've been watching The Witcher and you agree or disagree. Just be careful, because if you disagree, I'll prove you wrong. Talk about Mystery Castle some more. That's right. You like Mystery Castle. That's the secret. Wait till I hear about it. Man, if I could turn anything down, it would be Mystery Castle. I have never heard such crap being on Alvin G in all my life. We make three games. Yeah, that's why normally people don't criticize it. Actually, I think most of the reason when you were asking people whether or not it was a well-balanced game, but they didn't answer because they don't know. Exactly. No one's played it. It's a mystery. Man, Jeff Teolis was throwing some punches. It's tough. You go in the ring with a Jeff Teolis, you better be prepared. He will put on the gloves. He will come swinging. That's what I love about that man. Yeah, if I could trend down Mystery Castle anymore, I would. But trending down this week is Yegpin. No! Oh, no! Another competition. Oh, God. Man. You point your ears. Gosh, I'm going to be banned from these conventions. And this isn't a naughty one. I'm not being mean to Yank Penn. They had some trouble this last week as they opened up ticket sales for their annual tournament. Yeah, too much demand. Too much demand. Shut down the servers or something, and they had to postpone buying Yank Penn tournament tickets. I believe that's what it was, right? Yeah, and I think they said something like within a week or so. It sounded like it was going to take a few days because there were some system issues that they needed to sort out. So they acknowledged, I think, pretty quickly and put out a statement that it wasn't going to be, like they weren't going to get it back up this day, the day it went down. So all the preparation they could have done, still people wanted in there, and they jumped in there like a Pinburgh ticket and shut it all down. Yeah. Ever since Pinburgh went away, there are these other tournaments that are kind of now experiencing these rapid sales surges People are desperate to not be waitlisted, so they're trying really hard to get on as soon as possible. Sure, sure. So, Yagpin, I've heard great things about Yagpin and at some point would like to cross the border and visit. But, yeah, so they ran into some troubles. We feel their pain. I hate to see that happen to the group up there because I've heard they run a good program. But hopefully they'll get those ticket sales back up and everybody can get them that wants to go and all will be well. But for now, that poor server is turning down. Also trending down this week, this doesn't really fit anywhere into market trends and doesn't really fit anywhere into the news. No, don't do it! Didn't know where to put it, so I'm going to put it here. Trending down, for many of you, is Star Wars Episode I. Hell, it's the Pinball 2000, the new operating system that was Pinball 2000 in general. It changed a lot of things on that game. What was going to go forward is valid. So you guys would trend this down. But I am here to trend you down. That's right, I'm going to trend you down because you guys lied to me. You had me convinced that Pinball 2000 was the reason that Bally Williams went under. You had me convinced that Star Wars Episode I was a shit game You had me convinced of all of these things and I blindly took the bait I was guilty of it and I here to admit that Usually I you know as I said the true pioneer and the true leader of the pinball people and I have to convince you guys over years that I'm right, but you guys had me on this one, and you're training down because of it. Because I recently picked up a Pinball 2000 combo, right? We have it for sale. Revenge from Mars, Star Wars Episode I And I've got to tell you This is a fascinating device A wonderfully crafted machine Ahead of its time, absolutely But I think a lot of people, Dennis Nowadays, when they shit on this game And in particular, Star Wars Episode I They're getting hung up On the remarks of yesteryears I truly think that I think it's a fun thing to do I think it's the Popeye I think it's the Rick and Morty. I think it's all of these games like Stranger Things and The Hobbit that you guys all shat on, and you shat on not because you've actually played them and understood them, it's because your fellow pinhead was shatting on them as well. I'm here to tell you, you guys are wrong. Pinball 2000 is not only great, but Star Wars Episode I is beautiful, it is jam-packed and loaded, although symmetrical, the layout is superb, and until you get to that final wizard mode, please tell me it's a shit game. Vince, do you have any time on Star Wars Episode I? I do. Tell me how horrible it is. It's bad. Why is it bad? It's too easy. Too easy? That would probably be my biggest complaint. Yeah, the layout is incredibly forgiving. Revenge from Mars is a far better game. Pinball 2000 is a nice system. But Star Wars Episode I is not a fun game. Not a fun game. It's a really long player. I've played it at numerous shows. I've always found it overly easy and wanted to walk away. I'd mostly compare it to South Park, actually, except South Park earns money on location, so at least it has value. Wow. So an easy shooter. I think so. It seems incredibly forgiving. Maybe that's been my experience, but I played it multiple times. No, it's an easier shooter. And it was designed to be a more approachable shooter. I get it. I mean, Revenge from Mars I think is a lot of fun. So I wouldn't mind having a Revenge from Mars. It's not a game I'm in the market for, but I mean, I wouldn't mind having it. Star Wars Episode I, setting aside anything about the movie itself, which, of course, has been more disliked over time, really, other than the initial excitement when it came out. Yeah, it's just how it plays. It's just super. I mean, it's a fan layout where you can do a lot of the same shots and make progress. It's just, yeah, there have been far better fan layouts executed than that game. It's just not great. When you say easy, you mean easy shooter because the rules themselves to get to that final wizard mode, I don't know a lot of people that could do that. Sure. I've not been to the final wizard mode, so per you, I don't have any place to really speak on that, on having an opinion on it. But then again, I don't take orders from people that judge tournaments without playing in them. Yeah. You've got to play in tournaments to know if games are good now. It's bullshit. It's bullshit, people. I hope you get a mystery castle on trade and then learn to love it. You know what? I'm not going to take a mystery castle in on trade. It ain't never going to happen. I hope it's your new pinball bounty. But I'm glad I took a risk here on Pinball 2000. Star Wars Episode I, dare I say, you turn off that monitor, and maybe the rules in Revenge from Mars are better. That's fine. I don't have enough time in Revenge from Mars either. But if you look at that layout, I would argue the central feature of Star Wars Episode I, is a way better mech than what they're doing in Revenge from Mars. Revenge from Mars, you've got a pretty boring, straight-up-the-middle bank of stand-up targets, which simply do nothing. Then you've got a ramp flap that helps the ball fly up into the air. Okay. Well, everybody loves Attack from Mars and the triple bank right there that comes up and comes down, and then you get that feedback. Guys, that's what Star Wars Episode I has, too. But what Star Wars Episode I also has is drop targets that block the ramps, which is pretty phenomenal. and a magnet that is utilized so well and nobody ever mentions how wonderful the use of that magnet is in that game. Nobody says anything about it. That's a disgrace. The beauty of that game. That game is bonafide beautiful. I don't know who the artist was, but that is a beauty of a game. As is Revenge for Mars. I don't know. I think we've shit on this unjustly is what I'm saying. And if there was an opportunity for a super nice home use only Pinball 2000, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. And I haven't pulled the Star Wars Episode I play field in exchange for the revenge from ours. It's still sitting there collecting dust. Because I'm still enjoying Star Wars. Bit of a grinder. I get that. It is an easier shooter. But until I beat it, hmm. Speaking of under-loved and under-appreciated, deal of the week this week is going out to Spooky Pinball. Bye, bye, bye! A little game they have that's called America's Most Haunted. You ever heard of that one? Mm-hmm. Yeah, I've played it a few times. It's trending up here recently because of the medicinal mods package that had that limited run of medicinal mods visually. Aesthetically, just changed that game. Love that. Can't get those anymore. But there's one on Pennside right now. Right outside of Georgia. Atlanta. ATL. Hotlanta. There's only like 100 and something plays on this thing. Listed it for trade value, $6,000. And it does have the upgraded color display. It's like a brand new game. Very rare game. Only 150 units produced, I think. $6,000? looking for a nice Ironman at the moment, but open to a lot of other possibilities. So they're open. This is a steal. This is a really good deal here. Buy, buy, buy! Sure, it has the ugliest back glass known in pinball history, but it's a good game. It's a really good, underappreciated game, and for $6,000, you can't buy shit. You can't even buy a CERN Pro for $6,000 right now. And if you're willing to tinker, take a look at this America's Most Haunted. No screaming goat deals this week, but I want to thank you guys again, as I shared on social media for fulfilling that pinball bounty for me and getting that beautiful HEP restored whitewater into my collection. What do you think about that, Den Den? Yeah, it looks really nice. I still can't believe you put it right next to Popeye, though. Baby's first HEP. Why, why, why, why, why? What's wrong with sitting next to Popeye? They're both similar years. You look at this whole lineup of really collectible, popular Williams games, and there's Popeye right there. Your best looking game. I'm just sad. It's just that. Museum quality Corvette. It's your collection. You do what you want. You do you. The chrome trim is still sitting under Popeye. I've got to give it a chance. I hate the rails. Those rails, they use the putty, and you've got to heat them up, and then you've got to get a little putty knife. I hate that. Stern's just a couple of screws. Done. And as a reminder, the next Pinball Bounty is open for you to claim. Remember, the reward is $1,000. or, like the individual did on Pennside, threaten me and use me for a favor in the future, in which I will be terrified. But I'll fulfill it. I'll fulfill that bounty as well. Creature from Black Lagoon. Creech, find me a nice super minty Creech out there, people. Make it worth your while. Where else can you listen to a podcast and make $1,000? Yeah, absolutely, Dennis. Couldn't have said it better myself. And as always, I'm just here to report facts, people. Don't throw your tomatoes, because numbers do not lie here on the Pinball Show's Pinball Market Trends. Well, Dennis, I hope you enjoy your Valentine's Day, my friend. Yay. And you get to spend it here with me. Yeah, it was an interesting day with no news. Podcasting, partner in crime. Are we going to hang out at TPF? I don't know. Now, you're not getting a booth this year, are you? I'm not. I'm all yours. Wow. You didn't see a point in getting a booth for three days so you can sell out of Escaleras in 20 minutes? No shit. No shit. No, we had a booth, and then I just, I want to hang out. I haven't hung out for three years now that we've been in the business. Three years at Flip N Out Pinball. That's right. It's been three years, long years. I just want to hang out. Difficult years. Driving a truck down there for like a handful of games. Yeah. Like Star Wars Episode I Just like why Why would you But no we're just going to have a TPM booth I'm still finding a way Jeff Patterson if you listen to this I want to weigh How do I get in row one of those Twippies I'm looking forward to the Twippies I want to sit there and watch those Those are always fun Why do you want the front row Really Isn't the answer just get in line early I don't want Oh, you're used to FastPass. Yes, I am. Last time I was at the Twippy's, I was in the... Somebody's used to their money solving their problems. I got to go through the backstage and host the fucking thing. No, but I still respect and love the thing enough. I'd like to sit in the front row. Is that too much to ask? Am I not like in the alumni or something? Do I get nothing? Yeah, I don't think... I mean, hasn't it always just been randos that get in line first get to be in the front room? Maybe I get to grease the door person or something. Yeah, the bodyguard bouncer type. Maybe they'll let you in. It's like the club. Yeah, if anybody does get in the front row, please save a seat for your man. Or claim your seat bounty for $1,000. Zach will buy the seat from you. Ooh, not for $1,000. Or for a favor. I hope the person who bountyed your whitewater, I hope their favor is that they demand the very first pro that you get allocated. Oh. And then you'll be like, well, but Stern says they're supposed to go to Los Angeles. It's not always been the excuse I've been given. But then you have to keep your word, so you do honor the bounty. And then I find out and I go, that's not nice. You're dead to me. Jeff, reach out to me. Let me know how I can. I mean, Jeff's got a crystal now. Maybe that will be some brownie points for us. Are you going to go to the Twippies if you go? Yeah, I think so. Okay. Maybe we can sit together. I'm not planning to be in the front row. Nope. You're so not a front row person. I'm going to be back by the bar. Dennis, where can people reach you? Well, they can always email at collectedgamerspodcast.gmail.com or go to facebook.com slash collectedgamerspodcast and shoot a message. And those are the easiest ways to directly reach me. And you guys got to go follow, subscribe, and like Collected Gamers Podcast because objectively, they've been on fire lately. Really enjoyable program over there. So go check them out if you haven't yet. If you haven't. That's because there are no other podcasts left. It doesn't feel like that to you Well it does feel like that to me But Actually you know what we'll jump into it right now TPN this next week We do have another final round pinball podcast The hiatus I believe May be over We got a super bowl of ads and sponsors That was very enjoyable This last week from final round A little Canadian bird told me That we're going to get another final round pinball podcast This week as well as a Triple Dream Pinball Podcast episode. Oh, exciting. Yeah, two heavy hitters there. Where you at, Free Play? Oh, they're normally so good. Yeah. Amanda's been pretty busy, though. Yeah, she has been. She has been. Also coming up with TPN, we get the fourth annual Winter 2X Tournaments, February 19th at District 82. It's going to be streamed on Fox Cities Pinball at twitch.tv slash foxcitiespinball. Always follow, like, and subscribe to TPN. They've been making a big name for themselves for quality tournament streaming. They absolutely have. Maybe I can offer some, you know. Yeah, you can offer some advice. Yeah. I can come in there and, you know, throw a little razzle-dazzle in there. Throw some glitter in the screen. We got this. We got this. Why can't anybody give me a chance? That's all I'm asking for. Why do I always have to build my own stages for chances? Shit. That's all I'm asking. Damn. Must I always do everything myself if I have creativity? I just want to be asked every once in a while. That's all. Let this peacock fly. You know, you remind me of, this is so mean. You remind me of the stereotypes of those, like, millennials, Gen Zs that, like, go and apply to be CEO of a corporation. And they're like, why are you applying? You have, like, you made fries part-time for three years while you were in school. And you're all like, oh, because I'm a dreamer and I've got big ideas and people just need to give me a chance. and seniority doesn't mean anything and experience isn't relevant as long as I have passion. Seniority means jack shit. It means complacency, usually. Let somebody fired up. Experience can be overrated. Exactly. But I probably would want someone that had some familiarity of actually doing something hands-on. So maybe you need to run your own tournament first. A little baby tournament. Zach's baby tournament. That's the only way I ever get a shot at these things. The only way I get a shot is to create it myself. And you all shit on pinball crips. Lord knows what I'm going to do. I'm going to do it myself when I'm getting by. Because the world has been clamoring. I love it. It's been, what, three years since someone asked you for a new episode, and here you are latching on to it. Fucking Rodney Dangerfield of pinball over here. Let's give a sponsor plug. Sponsor plug is Flimmin' Out Pinball. Hot damn. Product showcase this week is an Insider Connected kit from Stern Pinball. You want to get online? Do it now. Do it in a big way. Insider Connected. We got the pro kits. pro kids and stuff. Yeah, I saw you had like a pile of them. Yeah, we barely fulfilled. So we got a couple extra units left, but we had a lot on order. I have a lot of premium people that are emailing me every godforsaken day saying, I ordered one where they are. I think they're coming this week. That's what I've been told by Stern Pinball. They're coming this week. Honestly, for some of you guys that are going to mount yours to a premium door, like some people are optioning out, putting it on the coin door, The Pro is fine. You can just order a Pro kit or just tell me if you have one in order. We can send you a Pro kit. It's the same thing. You're just not getting the apron, right? So the premium kits are the same thing minus an apron. So if you guys don't want to wait this week or two weeks or whatever it may be, you can get the Pro kit and just take that and attach it into your premium apron. It's already set up for that. You may need like some screws or something, but technically it will work if you don't want to wait. So, you know. Just your hack of the week kind of thing. Also in stock at Flip N Out Pinball Pinballs, Guns N' Roses LE by Jersey Jack Pinball. Or a Batman 66 LE pre-owned. Still got that. Maybe I have to reduce price of that shit. Batman 66 Premium New in Box? It's got a little ding to the cabinet decal. It's funny when a scratch and dent is more than MSRP of New in Box. Yes, yes. No one will point that out to you. That's why I did Godzilla Pro pre-owned is up in Chicago right now BD and Bill and them are going to start streaming that But it's for sale so if you guys are up in that area And you want to pick it up go ahead Star Wars the pin comic book new in box As well as the premium pin The most preferred version Pre-owned we got that as well as the topper We have Elvira 40th anniversary If you want one of those Cactus Cane and get your pre-orders in for the SE SE plus as well as alien pre-orders LV plus no it's SV Godzilla pre-orders You're going to wait But might as well get in queue It's not going to cost you anything Even the accessories If you want the Art Blades Go on the FlippinOutPinball.com And order those Art Blades They are shipping already For the armor and for the shooter rod We still got a couple weeks for those But we got the topper reveal coming soon Rush topper reveal coming soon So let's get you in queue for those Elite Pinball IJ Deluxe Topper I've still got some Remember those were limited Once they're gone, they're going forever And speaking of elite pinball topper, a little nugget here. Wait till you see what his next game release is. I think this IJ one with the hand-gilded 24 karat gold is juicy. We've got movement, people. Banners, banners. Who's got those banners? Rush banners should be coming in soon. We've got more Godzilla banners coming in. Deadpool banners. I think I need some more Deadpool banners recently. Dennis, you need a Deadpool banner. Merchandise. I don't know what I'd do with it. Generally, people hang them up. Merchandise people buy a t-shirt. Buy Nordman. Or don't, actually. Yeah, I don't think you easily can anymore. A little bit more stuff's going into that. Buy a collector's edition, limited edition decal. Holographic. Just like that Mando top. Escalator turnaround is forever. But again, if you want one, it's not going to get any quicker. You might as well get in line. I think that's it. Straight down the middle if you want to see a teaser trailer video of Jurassic Park Dominion. You still haven't seen it, did you? You got to watch it. It's not that long, Dennis. I'm not watching non-pinball straight down the middle videos until you do the rubber band episode. Until I'm playing in a tournament. Then I would understand how to do a teaser trailer reaction video. My son found out about that and then will leave. And he's very millennial. I mean, he's 16. He is the damn kid nowadays. and he just said one word after finding out that we have branched out inside of pinball and we've done a teaser reaction video. He said, Dad, why? He was so ashamed. Oh. Almost like I just seen subconsciously him saying, I've got to explain this to my friends. Yeah, because they all watch. They all subscribe. Hey, congratulations on hitting 10,000, by the way. Oh, thank you. Thank you. And I had my hat on backwards, and he's like, Dad, please, please, why? You're old. Please stop. We are all infected with that stuff. That's why I do the YouTube. It puts you through college, kid. You want to go to state school? You want to go to private school? Where do you want to go? Community college for your ass if you keep on chatting. Let Dad do his thing. Mm-hmm. That taught him. Not getting very many views on that one, but slow burn, slow burn. Just like my competition series. It's weird with mine. The ones that, like, I do a first thoughts thing on a watch, and I get over 1,000 views in, like, two days. And then I do a really detailed review I work hard on, and I get 80. I know. What the hell? And it's like, okay, well, it's just to have some creative fun. That's what I tell me. That's what I tell me, too. That's what I tell me as I cry into my pillow. Tournament pinball people are chasing me away, so I might as well jump into other avenues. Yeah, rubber bands. It's a safe space, I hear. I even had somebody reach out. Bouncy space. I won't even say who it was. And they were like, hey, I've talked to Carl D'Python Anghelo, and I'm so upset about this that I asked for him to come on to talk some sense into you. Would you be willing to do a podcast episode with him? I'm like, what is going on? I want to go to Carl. I didn't ask for this. I'm not requesting somebody ask you to meet with me. Like, I don't need this. I'd be happy to chat, but no. Poor Carl. he's like I don't even know who this guy is please for Dennis Creasel I'm Zach Minow and remember if you're looking for someone to completely dramatically and substantially reform your entire competitive scene Zach Minow is the person to contact just email the pinball network at gmail.com and always practice safe pinball and when surrounded in a room full of crows never succumb to the caw let those bold beautiful peacock feathers fly proudly in the name of pinball. Happy Valentine's Day. Don't get an STD. My law rep. Toss a coin to your witcher, O Valley of Plenty. And I can't put my space heater on during recording. No, because I'll hear it. The Iceman cometh. That's from Batman and Robin. What gives the dinosaurs the Ice Age? Nope. I don't know. Really? You ever seen it? What's that one? Still Batman and Robin? Yes. These are all Arnold Schwarzenegger. Can't you tell from my perfect impression? Yeah, I suppose so. Oh, my gosh. Never mind. But somebody did recently purchase a Nordman hoodie. And the problem is they flagged that now because they were like, it's too similar to the Batman logo. I'm like, mother fucker. Stop. You son of a bitch. It is pretty similar. Well, I mean, I really... But I think the argument under fair use stuff would be, would this ever jeopardize, at least with the videos and stuff, I'm sure as you know from your straight down the middle of everything is, would this cost them any sales of Batman merch? And the answer is no, because no one buys Nordman as Batman. Come on. Yes, hold on. Anaconda? That's right. My anaconda don't. Your youngest son is busy going on about Lawrence of Arabia. And you're like, yes! You don't even know what World War I was. Spartacus. And he's all like, Daddy, I'm in the desert. The movie's overrated, too. Well, that's really carried by its music. Was it Batman and Robin? I believe that was the name of it Forever You know, maybe it was forever It's the one with the bat nipples The Clooney nips? Yes Clooney nips I wonder how Robert Pattinson's name is I don't know, is he on Sparkle? Isn't that where he's from, Twilight? Twilight, that's right Because someone told me, oh yeah, he was in the other movie I was like, I don't know, I thought this was a new actor I'm like, no, he's in the vampire thing he's trying to do his best Christian Bale who are you? vengeance I could have done that I'm the shadow of the night I lurk in the shadows I hang upside down like Spiderman but I won't French kiss you because you're a bad guy who harasses falafel dealers remember the falafel cart? I guess he's not really a dealer I guess he's just a seller fuck you I can't believe you see what I can do with this one you