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Tribe Multiball with Rachel and Tim, Episode 26: Getting Sloppy with Ian

Poor Man's Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·analyzed·Apr 24, 2022
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.034

TL;DR

Rachel shares Great Lakes Pinball Open success; Tim discusses Pin Brew Show attendance and fan meetups; Scott Ian joins for casual community chat.

Summary

Rachel and Tim host a "Tribe Multiball" episode featuring Scott Ian Haberman, co-founder of Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. They discuss their recent experiences at Pin Brew Show and Great Lakes Pinball Open, including Rachel's impressive tournament performance (tied 13th of 130 players, beat top-ranked players Raymond Davidson and Escher Lefkoff), Tim's social meetups with fans and industry figures, and upcoming MGC Open tournament planning. The conversation includes casual banter about drinks, animals, and community dynamics.

Key Claims

  • Rachel tied 13th overall out of 130 players at Great Lakes Pinball Open and earned 31.5 WPPR points

    high confidence · Rachel speaking about her tournament results: 'I tied 13th overall out of 100, 30 players... 31 and a half WPPR'

  • Rachel beat Raymond Davidson (ranked #1 world player) and Escher Lefkoff (#2 world player) on Cyclone at the tournament

    high confidence · Rachel: 'But I also beat the number one and number two pinball players in the world on Cyclone'

  • Great Lakes Pinball Open had 130 players competing in 5 tournaments over 3 days

    high confidence · Rachel: 'Five tournaments in three days... There were 130 players, Tim'

  • Pin Brew Show free play area had approximately 95-100 pristine A-tier rare pinball machines

    high confidence · Tim: 'they might have had around 100, and 95 of those were just perfect'

  • Tim met a superfan named 'Dan the Man' at Pin Brew who had traveled from Ohio specifically to meet tribe members and had listened to every Poor Man's Pinball episode

    high confidence · Tim describing Dan: 'He has listened to every single episode of Scott Ian and Drew's show. Every one'

  • Rachel is organizing the MGC Open tournament with 64 players and has 12 games committed from volunteers

    high confidence · Rachel: 'I am running the Open Tournament at MGC... asking, not begging, but pleading with people to bring their games, which I now have 12 of'

  • Rachel improved her classic pinball play by learning to use hand-slapping nudge technique from observing other tournament players

    high confidence · Rachel: 'I noticed that a lot of players do much more of, like, a slapping of their hands on top of the game... I went the first, second, and third game with no strikes'

  • Tim traded his Taxi machine for The Munsters pinball game

    high confidence · Tim: 'I got tired of Taxi, and I traded my taxi for a The Munsters'

Notable Quotes

  • “I tied 13th overall out of 100, 30 players... 31 and a half WPPR. That's enormous in terms of points.”

    Rachel @ ~28:15 — Highlighting Rachel's competitive achievement at the Great Lakes Pinball Open tournament

  • “I beat the number one and number two pinball players in the world on Cyclone. So thank you.”

    Rachel @ ~29:45 — Major competitive accomplishment against Raymond Davidson and Escher Lefkoff

  • “There was a round of applause. And that, and that's just, yes. And that's beautiful.”

    Rachel @ ~31:00 — Emotional moment reflecting community support and competitive atmosphere

  • “I think that there was one other woman that was still standing... So I still feel really good about that.”

    Rachel @ ~31:15 — Rachel noting her achievement as a woman competitor in a male-dominated tournament space

  • “The free play area at Pinbrew had all A-tier titles that were absolutely pristine... 95 of those were just perfect.”

    Tim @ ~20:30 — High praise for Pin Brew Show's curated machine selection and condition

  • “Tim Dan Lee sucks at pinball... I didn't put it together when I first heard your name.”

    Dave from Oregon (fan) @ ~15:45 — Fan interaction demonstrating the podcast's reach and community awareness of running jokes

  • “My plane tickets are booked. Hotel's ready to go. I'll see you at Pinbrew.”

    Dan the Man (superfan) @ ~17:20 — Demonstrates deep fan commitment and podcast impact on community engagement

  • “Every game you play no matter when is a practice game for the next game because you're always learning something”

    Rachel @ ~23:45 — Reflecting mindfulness approach recommended by Raymond Davidson that improved her tournament play

  • “They really do want to build each other up because the better that you get, the better competition they are for you”

Entities

RachelpersonTim Dan LeepersonScott Ian HabermanpersonRaymond DavidsonpersonEscher LefkoffpersonChristopher FranchipersonStephen Cameron SilverpersonDan the Manperson

Signals

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Rachel achieved 13th place (tied) out of 130 players at Great Lakes Pinball Open, earned 31.5 WPPR points, and defeated world-ranked players Raymond Davidson (#1) and Escher Lefkoff (#2) on Cyclone. She improved classic game play by adopting hand-slapping nudge technique observed from elite players.

    high · Rachel: 'I tied 13th overall out of 100, 30 players... I also beat the number one and number two pinball players in the world on Cyclone'

  • ?

    event_signal: Great Lakes Pinball Open was a successfully executed 5-tournament series over 3 days at District 82 with 130 players. Venue made infrastructure changes (removed tables, added outdoor space with tents, food trucks). No negative feedback reported from participants.

    high · Rachel: 'Five tournaments in three days... There were 130 players... I don't think I have heard anything negative about that tournament series at all'

  • ?

    venue_signal: Pin Brew Show in Ohio received high praise for free play area featuring approximately 95-100 pristine A-tier rare machines. District 82 made major infrastructure innovations for Great Lakes Pinball Open including outdoor tent space and food trucks.

    high · Tim: 'The free play area at Pinbrew had all A-tier titles that were absolutely pristine... 95 of those were just perfect'

  • ?

    community_signal: Poor Man's Pinball Podcast Network has significant reach and dedicated fan base. 'Dan the Man' superfan traveled from Ohio specifically to meet podcast tribe members at Pin Brew Show; has listened to every episode of network. Multiple other fans recognized Tim and Rachel at events.

    high · Tim describing Dan: 'He has listened to every single episode of Scott Ian and Drew's show. Every one... they came to meet as many tribe members as they could'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.335

0:00
Hey, 4-Man Tribe and listeners, this is Glennie Rogers, and you're listening to the 4-Man Tribe multiple podcast with Rachel and Tim. 4-Man Tribe's the thing, that is who we are. They're not in this thing, so how could it go wrong? Flip away with us, to an old bar cave. And then we'll learn about each other, and I'm all From two minutes to another, uh-huh Rachel and Tim, who do we have on the show today?
0:40
Hello friends, welcome to Rachel Risto's Tribe Member Multiball Just kidding, just kidding Welcome to Tribe Multiball with Tim and Rachel A pinball podcast that focuses on a dynamic group of pinball players people that love pinball, that are into the game, into collecting games, just really are fans of pinball, that all are part of the Tribe of the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast. Welcome to the show. How are you doing today, Tim? I'm doing great, Rachel. How are you? I'm doing pretty good. That was just a little reference to Drew's last podcast where he totally cuts you out of Tribe Multi-Ball. How do you feel about that? Yeah, Drew sucks at pinball. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't I think he said he sucked at pinball, but he did say he didn't use maybe one or two other curse words. It was pretty funny. I've got to give him a shout-out. I love that stuff. He's out of my will. Out of the will? Oh, man. Am I still in pencil? Yep. You're still there. Okay. That's good. All right. I'm not upgraded to ink yet, but maybe another year. We'll see, right? Yeah, exactly. I can take that beautiful Guns N' Roses of yours then. Are you going to will that to me? Yep. It's willed to you. Okay. I might put Drew back in. He gets Halloween. Oh.
1:57
All right. Well, what's been going on with you? What's your pinball news? Well, a lot has been going on. I actually got a new game. I am no longer clean. Oh, man. I got tired of Taxi, and I traded my taxi for a Munsters. Oh. I really enjoy the Munsters. It kind of reminds me of my dad. My dad and I used to watch that show as a child. And it's very simple, just like Taxi. So a friend of mine had one, and we did a little swap, and now I have Munsters instead of Taxi. Yeah, that's a pretty fun game. It's been a while since I've played that, though. I really like the black and white edition that they have of that. To me, that makes it really, really feel like that show, just eliminating all the color. But it's a fun game. Yeah, it's got good theme integration. And then the other thing I did is I attended the Pin Brew Show in Ohio. And I went with my buddy, Justin. I'll give him a real quick plug. Pinball at Wise Trailer. He sells. He's a multimorphic distributor. And he asked me to go help with the show. And we took Weird Al. And we had, you know, all I'll say about Weird Al is you need to play it. It was nonstop from the time we turned it on before the doors opened, people playing it. And we actually had to stay a few hours after the vendor area closed just to let people play it. Most of the people loved it. I'd say 99% of the people had good things to say about it. Of course, a couple people had mentioned the flippers where there's two buttons. People don't like that. So guess what we did? We switched it for them so they could see it and play it both ways. Really well received. Nobody really said anything negative. A couple folks said it's not for them when I asked them. But it was well-received. It was a good time. And so that's why I was there. As you can imagine, I did some socializing. No, come on. Get out. No way. And some beer drinking. I did a little beer drinking. Oh, okay. You're working on those pinball relationships one IPA at a time? Yeah, yeah. You put craft brew and pinball together, and it's a tribe member's nightmare. Or actually, tribe member heaven. So I want to give a few shout-outs. Yeah. Yeah, do it. Give your show notes. I love it. Some members of the tribe with her I got to hang out with. I got to talk and hang out with Chris Franchi. He was doing autographs most of the time, so we didn't get to really hang out and do stuff. But I got to talk to Chris. Chris is a good dude. We both made fun of Drew for about five or ten minutes. Was that your first time meeting him? No, that was my second time. I had met him. I haven't met him yet. Yep, yep. Nice guy. I got to meet Tish again. I got to hang out with Tish. And Tish and I had a good time. We played a couple of games against each other. She is very into the game like you are. Yes. I love playing with Tish. She's got the moves. She's into it. You know, she's good. And it was a really good time. And we hugged and, you know, had a real good time. She introduced me to some of her friends. Really cool stuff there. and then I got to hang out with Steven Silver the entire weekend. Oh, man, I haven't met him yet. Yeah, yeah. Steven flew in from Texas to be there at the P3 booth, but I got to have waffles and bacon with Steven at 1 a.m. in some waffle house in the middle of nowhere, and we were starving. I spent a lot of quality time with Steven. I told Drew he might be my new best pinball friend. I wish he would have recorded that conversation at 1 a.m. at a Waffle House with Steven Silver in the middle of nowhere. Because I bet it was amazing. He's a very, very funny guy.

District 82 removed all regular tables and created outdoor space with tents and food trucks for the Great Lakes Pinball Open

high confidence · Rachel: 'Eric took all the tables out of District 82... you also had an extra outdoor space with the tent and chairs'

  • Christopher Franchi (Spooky Pinball artist) was at Pin Brew doing autographs

    high confidence · Tim: 'I got to talk and hang out with Christopher Franchi (Spooky Pinball Pinball artist)... doing autographs most of the time'

    • Rachel @ ~32:00 — Observation about collaborative competitive pinball culture

  • “I am so, so grateful for all the people that will be volunteering, that have chosen to bring a game, that believe in me”

    Rachel @ ~38:50 — Rachel's appreciation for community support in organizing MGC Open tournament

    • John Delzacco
    person
    Drewperson
    Amy Kestingperson
    Great Lakes Pinball Openevent
    Pin Brew Showevent
    District 82venue
    MGC Openevent
    Weird Algame
    The Munstersgame
    Pinball Maniagame
    Cyclonegame
    Poor Man's Pinball Podcast Networkorganization
    Multimorphiccompany
    Spooky Pinballcompany
    ~

    sentiment_shift: Rachel received notable community recognition and applause after competing in Great Lakes Pinball Open final rounds. She noted being one of few women still standing in late tournament rounds. Community demonstrated supportive attitude toward female competitive players.

    high · Rachel: 'when I turned to look at her, when I drained and people started clapping... when I struck out that there was a round of applause... And that's just, yes. And that's beautiful'

  • ?

    event_signal: Rachel is organizing MGC Open tournament with 64 players and has secured 12 games from volunteer contributors. Tournament scheduled to coincide with podcast release. Rachel expressed some nervousness about managing event of this scale.

    high · Rachel: 'I am running the Open Tournament at MGC... I've never run an event with 64 players... I now have 12 of'

  • ?

    gameplay_signal: Rachel improved her classic pinball performance by adopting hand-slapping nudge technique observed from elite tournament players. She went first three games of eight-strike tournament with no strikes and won on Pinball Mania, Viking, and Trident using new technique.

    high · Rachel: 'I noticed that a lot of players do much more of, like, a slapping of their hands on top of the game... I went the first, second, and third game with no strikes'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Rachel expressed preference for classic pinball games (likes 'ding ding ding' sounds, floaty ball action, small flippers) despite playing modern games (Stern, Jersey Jack) more effectively. She praised Pinball Mania's horseshoe shot mechanics and theme integration.

    high · Rachel: 'I really like the ding, ding, ding, and... I love the feel of it, the ball... I love Pinball Mania so much... there's something about that horseshoe'

  • ?

    operational_signal: District 82 implemented innovative infrastructure for large tournament: removed all regular tables to create uncluttered space, added outdoor tent area with seating, provided food trucks. Approach was well-received by 130 competing players.

    high · Rachel: 'Eric took all the tables out of District 82... you also had an extra outdoor space with the tent and chairs and so forth. And that was the first time he did that. He also had food trucks'

  • ?

    product_launch: Multimorphic's Weird Al machine demonstrated at Pin Brew Show received extremely positive reception (99% positive feedback from attendees). Tim and Multimorphic rep stayed hours after vendor area closed to accommodate player demand. Minor feedback on dual flipper button configuration.

    high · Tim: 'you need to play it. It was nonstop from the time we turned it on... 99% of the people had good things to say about it... A couple people had mentioned the flippers where there's two buttons'

  • ?

    content_signal: Poor Man's Pinball Podcast Network demonstrates growing audience awareness and fan loyalty. Podcast content creates community recognition moments where listeners identify hosts at pinball events. Multiple superfans traveling to events specifically to meet podcast tribe members.

    high · Tim: 'a guy came up, and he looked at me, and he said, Tim Dan Lee sucks at pinball... I listened to the show... he had like two friends and I'm like, okay, well, it's going to be somebody that listens to the show'

    • 5:46
    He's incredibly talented, too, but I think he's just very funny. I like his personality a lot. He's a hip dude. My son got to meet him. Steven and my son got along well. My son loved him. Steven's just a really good dude. So I got to hang out with some tribe members, and something happened. Now, Drew said this had happened to him before, but it finally happened to me. Everywhere I go, it's Rachel, Rachel, Rachel. Everybody loves Rachel. Just kidding. See, that's crazy. I mean, I love that. That's amazing. And I love the people that listen to our show. And it's kind of embarrassing at the same time, too, you know? I still haven't gotten and figured out how to handle that. But, Tim, come on. I never believed that. But, come on. You've got to have. There's got to be a Tim Lee doesn't suck at pinball fans out there, right? Well, I was standing at Pin Brew, and a guy came up, and he looked at me, and he said, Tim Lee sucks at pinball. And I was like, yes. And he said, I didn't put it together when I first heard your name. He said, I listened to the show. And so that was Dave from Oregon. And then another fan of the show, Dan. Dan had actually bought a machine from me a while ago. Him and his wife came to the show. They're from Ohio. he listens to every episode and he had his daughter there so Dan and I hung out for three days got to do a lot of talking with Dan but that's not the Dan that you saw on Facebook there's another Dan that I got to meet who's a fan of the show I got a message before Pinbrew and it was from a guy with a profile with no picture and it said are you going to be at Pinbrew with Drew and I clicked on his profile and he had like two friends and I'm like, okay, well, it's got to be somebody that listens to the show. So I said, yeah, I'll be at pin brew. And then he said, okay, I really wanted to meet some of the tribe members. So I messaged Drew and Drew's like, I don't know who that is. I'm like, well, this guy's got two friends. I don't know what's going on here. And then the guy changed his profile picture to a little kid with a dunce cap on. And he sent me another message. He said, My plane tickets are booked. Hotel's ready to go. I'll see you at Pinbrew. And I'm like, okay. But by then, he had friended Drew because Drew will friend anybody on Facebook. So I didn't know anything about Dan the Man. That was his profile, Dan the Man. So somebody came up to me and said, did you see this dude over there with the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast shirt on? And I'm like, no. But I immediately went over thinking it might be Dan the Man. And I went over and I looked and he knew me before I knew him. And he said, Tim Lee. And I said, I said, you are Dan. He's like, yeah, Dan, the man. And I'm like, OK, I'm like, I thought you were going to kill me. But he had his poor man shirt on. His wife was there. His sister-in-law and brother-in-law were there. His in-laws were there. And they came to meet as many tribe members as they could. To support Dan the Man. And these folks don't live local. No, they're from Ohio. Yeah, they're from Ohio. They came home to visit family, and in the interim, they made it so that they come to Pinbrew to meet some of the tribe and to meet you, Tim. Now, that's pretty freaking awesome. That's cool. So he said he wanted Drew to be there, but he planned his trip around coming home around Pinbrew, and he is a super fan. He has listened to every single episode of Ian and Drew's show. Every one. He has listened to all of our shows. He's listened to Martin's show. And he just started rambling off all this poor man's trivia. I said to his wife, I'm like, you've got to give him some tips on creating a profile. She's like, I told him that nobody was going to friend you with like three friends on Facebook. They're all going to think you're a creeper. But Dan's wife, Rachel, is her name. Dan, the super fan of the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast Network. Is that what we are? Yes, we are. Great dude. Great dude. I told him to come to MGC. He's a bastard.
    10:01
    His mother-in-law's birthday is the weekend at MGC, and his wife's like, he's thinking of going, but I told him he's not allowed to go.
    10:11
    Dan the man, Poor Man's Podcast super Superfan, great dude, lovely wife, lovely family. Turned out not to be weird at all. Turned out to be a fantastic dude. His wife's like, can you take a picture with him because he's afraid to ask. Aw, that's so sweet. I love that. Well, from one Rachel to another, that's so awesome. And that's so cool. It's really, really neat. It sounded like a really amazing weekend for you. Yeah, it was a good weekend. Met a lot of other people. Played a lot of pinball. Great show. I will say one thing about the show. I've been to Expo. I've been to Allentown and York. Those are good shows. The free play area at Pinbrew had all A-tier titles that were absolutely pristine. I think every person with a beautiful A-tier rare title brought their game to Pinbrew. I was highly impressed with the quality. I mean, they didn't have 400 games, but they might have had 100, and 95 of those were just perfect. Wow. So that's what I did. What about you? Well, that same weekend that you were having fun at Pin Brew, I attended this thing called the Great Lakes Pinball Open at District 82. Okay. It was five tournaments in three days. Five tournaments in three days. It was an incredible amount of pinball. Wow. I played about 30 hours of pinball, and that was 30 hours of tournament playing, I should say. It was pretty insane. District 82, all the folks there from Eric to the scorekeepers, Beth and Tony, and all the staff and all the other people that just volunteered, which is a lot of the people that are in that District 82 community that play league there and tournaments on a regular basis, all the folks that helped out, they did such an amazing job. It was just really an unbelievable type of event. I've never played any type of tournament series, much less that much pinball in that amount of time. And I will tell you, I was trashed on Sunday. I was just trashed, but I still went and played. You know, I have one more tournament to play on Sunday, and so I did. It was really amazing. And as you recall, we had Raymond Davidson on our last podcast, right? And that Friday morning, as we started playing, he actually sent me a message. and told me that I was doing really good that morning. And that was really helpful that he did that because I really took to heart the things that he said while we were chit-chatting about competitive tournament playing and the Mindzen thing that I've been trying to work on and trying to process. And so I did a really good job the whole day Friday just thinking every game is a practice game because that's really what it is at the end of the day. every game you play no matter when is a practice game for the next game because you're always learning something and so I think I went in with really the right attitude so the Friday during the day I think it was maybe it was like a 13 round or something and I did okay just fair middling and in the evening I was definitely my best of the whole weekend and I want to just chit chat about that because for me as a competitive player it was by far the best pinball I've ever played against incredible players from all over the world. There was a John Simon Peel came from Australia. Phil Birnbaum came down from Canada. There were folks that came from New York and California and all in Texas, all over the place to come play at District 82. There was 130 players, Tim. That's a lot. There were no tables. Eric took all the tables out of District 82. There was no place to really set your stuff, but it was great because you also add an extra outdoor space to the tent and chairs and so forth. And that was the first time he did that. He also had food trucks. It was quite an overall event. But anyways. Sounds amazing. It really was unbelievable. And I think that if you ask any player that attended, that they would tell you the same thing. I don't think I have heard anything negative about that tournament series at all. The weather actually was probably a little chillier for most people, but it was a pretty typical Wisconsin spring, so it was nice to get outside too. But I wanted just to chitchat a little bit about the Friday night tournament, which was an eight-strike classics tournament. Now, I don't know if you know this, Tim, but I really am a better modern pinball player. Like, I play a Stern, you know, a JJP. I can play their games because maybe they're faster or whatever, and my brain just calculates better. But as Rachel, I really like classic games better in terms of I like the ding, ding, ding, and sitting behind me is my, you know, sky jump right now. And I love the feel of it, the ball, how it can be so floaty, and sometimes you get these little baby flippers, you know, on a pinball machine. I love that stuff. So for me, I really like that. But I don't play them very well. And I think part of it is because I'm too reactive to the ball or I'm not doing the right type of nudging. So during that tournament, I was really trying to pay attention to some of how – during the day, the tournament before, I was trying to pay attention to somehow of how the other players from other states, wherever, came in and how they were playing those types of games. And I noticed that a lot of players do much more of, like, a slapping of their hands on top of the game and rattling the glass.
    15:40
    And our guest is like, he's making me laugh. That's great. That's fantastic. I can't wait until we get him on. We'll get going there. Flapping the top of the pinball game seems to be a better way to nudge, especially when it's like a wire form that's forming between your in lane and out lane. So I'm learning things as I'm watching these other players. Anyway, so I get to Friday night, and it's all classics. So I just kept applying that method. So I went the first, second, and third game with no strikes. Nice. I think I came in first in Viking, Trident, and Silver Ball Mania, and that was pretty awesome. I'm like, okay. And I just want to mention I love Silver Ball Mania so much. I don't care. I don't mind the art even. It's funny because it's that time period, but, man, there's something about that horseshoe and getting the ball and being able to catch the ball and just backhanding that horseshoe over and over and over and getting your multiplier running. To me, that is just such a cool shot on a game.
    16:40
    Last night I digressed. So it's an eight-strike tournament. I finally took two strikes, I think, into my fourth round. So I'm playing a while. And as I notice, I'm like, okay, well, I win one here, win one there. I'm doing okay. And then I have, I don't even know, like five strikes. And I have to go play Cyclone. So I've already played against my friend Matt McCarty and my buddy Sean Davis, Mark Tenhaken and Escher Lefkoff who is currently the number two player in the world right? So I'm thinking okay you know I'm just looking around it's getting to be less people. Finally I look at the next match and here I'm playing Cyclone against Raymond Davidson and it was my first time ever playing against him Escher Lefkoff and Alberto Santana and it was amazing because I have to brag about myself because that was not a very good game on Cyclone for me, but I did get the skill shot three times, which is great, and that can be very lucrative. But I also beat the number one and number two pinball players in the world on Cyclone. So thank you.
    17:52
    Oh, that's great. Thanks for helping him. To get to the end of that story. But I was really excited about that because, and even afterwards I said to Raymond and asked him for a hug, and he gladly gave me one. But I thanked him because what he had told me, I really took that to heart, I guess, in my brain, really trying to work on the Zen thing. And so that really seemed to help. I ended up striking out two rounds later, but I was also playing John Delzacco, who went on to win that tournament, Escher again, and David Riel, who's also an incredible player. He almost rolled Harlem Globetrotters. But the coolest thing about that, I tied 13th overall out of 100, 30 players. It was, I think, 31 and a half whoppers. That's enormous in terms of points. Sure. But the coolest thing about all of that, Tim, is when I struck out that there was a round of applause. And that, and that's just, yes. And that's beautiful. It was really beautiful. And I think that there was one other woman that was still standing. And there was one other player from District 82 that was still standing. So I still feel really good. I feel really good about that. It was just really neat that there was appreciation that when you got that far, people, they recognized that, that, you know, it was a long night. I mean, I didn't get to bed. I almost slept four hours that night and had to get up and go play two more tournaments the next day, and I played like garbage, you know. The rest of the people were not garbage, but I didn't play hot because I was exhausted. What was really cool, too, about that is, like, Alberto, the next day, which I played against him on that Cyclone game as well. He was like, hey, champ. So things like that. That's part of the reason why I love the competitive pinball community so much is because they really do want to build each other up because the better that you get, the better competition they are for you or for them. And there's a lot of fun in that. I had such a blast. Like I said, I got very little sleep. I met people, new people that came to District 82 for the first time. I saw people that came back that were there for the Super Series, and for some of them they felt like they were coming home. So it's becoming like this family environment there when he's hosting these really large tournaments. It was amazing. That is a fantastic memory. Wow. Did you choke up? Did you tear up when they clapped?
    20:19
    Well, I will say my cousin Amy Kesting, she came to play from Ohio, And she had been struck out, and the last four rounds I played, she hung out with me, and she squeezed my hand, she massaged my hands, which was great, because my hands were so sore from playing, and hitting, like I said, the tops of the games and pushing them, and massaging my palms, and she sat there and encouraged me with every game. It was amazing. But when I turned to look at her, when I drained and people started clapping, she just had her arms open, and I gave her a hug. So I was able to avoid crying because Tim, you know me so well. Yes, I know you very well. It's an overwhelming thing. Listen, you know, I'm a girl. You know, I have my shirt now that says there's no crying in pinball. It's my new ladies' flip shirt. And I was wearing that shirt. It's now my lucky shirt. But I will say, but I am a person that I cry when I'm happy, when I'm mad, when I'm glad, when I'm sad, when I'm overwhelmed, when I'm full of joy, all of those things. You know what? There's no shame in my crying game. No, nope. because that just makes me a better human. So that's it. All right. That's all I got. That's a lot from both of us. Oh, I should mention that I am running the Open Tournament at MGC, and that is coming up, and this podcast will probably release probably right before it. I'm pretty nervous about it. I've never run an Open event. I've never run an event with 64 players, much less, you know, begging, Begging, not begging, but pleading with people to bring their games, which I now have 12 of. I am so, so grateful for all the people that will be volunteering, that have chosen to bring a game, that believe in me that I can actually do something on this scale. So wish me luck.
    22:05
    You don't need luck. You're going to kill it. You're too kind. All the other ones have went super well, and this one's going to go even better. Oh, thanks, Tim. And you'll be there. Can't wait to see it. Yep. Yeah, you'll be there. And I anticipate the tribe folks will, like, they'll wander by. Because I'll be in the tournament area all day on Saturday. So I anticipate some of the tribe folks will stop by. But maybe somebody will bring me, like, a flask. Or, like, you know. I know, guy. Or, like, you know, or, like, fireball. So I'm just, like, you know, just going to put that idea out there. Local tribe members. Jello shots. Fireball. Yep. Yeah. Which, you know, I really don't drink much, but, you know, one little shot of Fireball may help to, like, you know, keep the nerves under control. I'm looking at you, Scoots. You're in charge of the Fireball.
    22:56
    And the cannolis. Yeah. And I want one of each cookie from his deli. That's the other thing. And a Tim the Tuna Melt special sandwich. Maybe he should bring some of those. Tuna. It was good. I enjoyed it. All right. We're very long-winded. I think we're getting our notes. That's okay.
    23:15
    That's okay. We had a lot to get through. We knew that. So, all right. Well, I would like to introduce to Try Multiball, one of the founders of the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast, Ian Haberman. Welcome. Hey, Ian. Thanks for having me on. My name's Ian Haberman. I am also a crier. I cry all the time. sensitive man, but yes, crying school, man. All the cool kids cry now. Yeah, I'd cry if I were Drew's best friend.
    23:51
    Hey man, someone's got to take up that mantle. I've got to put up with him for quite a few years. You guys can play with him more now.
    24:00
    Tim. I try. How are you guys doing? More importantly, how's everything going on in your worlds? I don't know, man. Just plugging along. I'm having fun. Yeah, that's good. That's the most important thing. The pinball tournament planning and stuff, it can be a little stressful because I want it all to come together, but I am having fun. And I know once that day arrives, it's going to be a freaking blast. I know. I know.
    24:26
    Not bad. I loved your episode last week with Ray Day. That was cool. He's going to have his pinball celebrity on our podcast. That worked.
    24:36
    You're the best follow-up to it. Yeah, no doubt. I also started with a black rose, so we can talk more about that later. That's the only similarity that Ray Day and I have.
    24:48
    That's it. Well, here's the thing. The reason why, it was my first game I ever played against Raymond, and I beat him. Now, Tim and I also talked in our previous episode about how Tim brings that he can beat anybody. Yeah, I heard that. So, Tim, I have faith in you. Raymond does come to MGC. You'll have to do that little, you know, five-game bet there thing. That bet is on, but you ticked him off, so now he's going to destroy me. I know.
    25:17
    Raymond's like, he's just the nicest guy. He really is. That's the reason he's going to destroy you, Tim. Sure, buddy. That's the one. You nailed it, man. Of course. That's exactly what's going to happen. I'm very self-aware. I'm sure you are my man I'm sorry I mispronounced your last name what's my last name Haberman it doesn't matter the name of Ian Haberman you'd think I'd have anyone pronounce my name right my whole life I'm used to it here's the important question what are you drinking I see you're pouring something I'm going to finish a bottle of larceny tonight it's almost dead It's called Larceny. I got it for my birthday in August, and I've been pretty – maybe it was a Christmas present. I don't know. It's really good. That's why I don't remember.
    26:10
    So it's just one of the – ooh, I thought it said multiball in there. It just says mash bill. I don't know what that means in the whiskey world. But anyway, yeah, it's supposedly akin to the Eagle Rare, which we had on the show quite a bit, and that was fun to do. But it's delicious. It's very good. It's good for you. No, I don't think that's true, actually. Don't quote me on that, people. Don't drink that to help your heart. I think it's really bad for your heart.
    26:37
    The Surgeon General does not approve of this shit. So what else we got? Tim, what are you drinking? I am drinking the standard Coke and Fireball every episode. Coke and Fireball.
    26:49
    I'm on a Fireball. You know, not too long ago I won. This is the funniest thing. I won the most gigantic thing of fireball at a pinball thing. And I left it in my freezer, and I finally finished it. And after a year of podcasting, I finished it. So I'm not very pumped for that.
    27:07
    It's funny how that works. The podcasting and drinking go hand in hand. Yes, for sure. My bar was getting a little depleted there when we started podcasting. And now it's because we're not podcasting right now, the bar has just, like, there's booze everywhere now. So it's almost overwhelming. Like, my bar is a mess. It's all booze now. So we're going to have to figure out a way to get rid of some of this stuff. It's gotten fat. Start podcasting again. You'll get rid of it. Yeah, that's true. That's true. I'm drinking Loon Juice Grow-A-Pair hard cider. Jesus, that's a name. Is that a hand word That not the most Wisconsin name for a beer I ever heard Or cider Well it a hard cider Hard cider Loon Juice Grow a Pear I like pear vodka I like pear-flavored things. Jesus. I like pears. That's two dudes on a boat trying to, like, come up with a name of their cider.
    28:09
    You're in loons and, yeah. I've played that game before. That's a dangerous game, too. I don't mess with loons. Well, that sounds like a really fun game to me. Yeah, you don't want to screw with moons. Geese are even scary. I read something about how men – what is it? Oh, man, what was the stat? It was like 90% of American men think they can fight a goose, but like only 40% of Canadian men think they can fight a goose.
    28:38
    When I thought about it, I was like, yeah, I've actually threatened geese before. I will fight a goose. I saw this one video where a woman was just walking and this goose was hissing at her, and she literally grabbed him by the neck and just walked away with him. And I said, holy shit, there's a million times where I talk a tough game, but there's a million times where a goose hisses at me. I'm like, uh-uh, no way. I go the opposite way. I go a long way around a goose. I don't mess with goose. What is it with hissing? Hissing is like the worst thing an animal could do to scare the crap out of me. Like a snake hissing, a goose, my daughter. Like, I don't mess with it. Anytime there's a hiss, I'm out. I'm going away. I'm with you, dude. A cat hissing, does that bother you, too? Who's that? A cat hissing? Oh, I don't know what those are.
    29:28
    I'm not a cat guy. No. My sister has a lot of cats, and we grew up with a lot of cats. I do like cats, though. I was just acting tough there, Rachel.
    29:38
    You know what's funny about cats hissing? they're just too damn adorable where I go, shut up, man. I know what you're doing. You were yawning a second ago. You're not mad. You get so used to a cat hissing because they're always pissed off. So you're like, well, fuck it. All right. You're mad. I'm mad. And then I give them a belly rub. Let's just turn your day upside, your day around, buddy, and make you smile. Only if they like a belly rub. Not all cats like a belly rub. My cat Rigby hates it. She'll cut you. I never said they liked it. I just said I do. Yeah. Whether you like it or not, you're getting it. Yeah. Rachel, I'm kind of a badass when it comes to little cats.
    30:16
    Kitten badass. So that's my story, man. I'm sticking with it. That's Ian versus the animals. I don't mess with animals too much, but cats, yeah, they're fair game. Well, that's good. I mean, I'm happy to know that.
    30:30
    There was a time when I was younger that I said we were going to start an animal fight club, but it was going to be me and a goose in a garage so he couldn't fly away.
    30:39
    And the problem was we were too scared to grab the goose. The other thing, too, is my buddy said, no, dude, they got claws. They'll mess you up. And I said, what? They have claws? They're like little – they'll hook onto you and they won't let go. And I said, oh, well, that's a whole other ballgame. I thought they were just lucky things.
    30:59
    Oh, yeah. Yeah. So make sure you email PETA and say, Ian from the Poor Man Spinball podcast wants to fight geese.
    31:09
    He hasn't done it yet, but he wants to. You can see us on poormanspinball at gmail.com. That's poormanspinball at gmail.com. Drew will love to hear from you.
    31:20
    I love that. That would be great. All right. You guys keep going. This is your show. No, we're having a good time already. I'm already wound up on the larceny. I guess, then my first question is, what are you currently doing in your pinball world?
    31:36
    What's going on with Ian? Nobody's heard from Ian in a while. Yeah, no, I've taken time, time away from it all.
    31:46
    I'm happy for you. Trying to be like super dad, right? Because my daughter's in this awesome age where she just turned four in April, the 14th, this past 14th. So she's just so much fun. So I find it hard to do anything. If she's available, I'm playing with her. That's all there is to it. My days really for pinball are once my daughter goes down and sleeps. If I'm awake enough, which, all right, I'm 40, turning 41 this year. I get tired all the time. I don't know what to do. Bedtime. I'm exhausted. Eight o'clock, I talk a tough game. I put my daughter down. it's nine o'clock and i'm like oh my god well you know maybe i could catch up on uh you know whatever shows on moon night right um but no like i come down here and i play i'll play some some deadpool every once in a while the creature every time i play it there's always just like it's still not dialed in perfectly right so it's like one light is not working right now and i have to like replace the socket and it's just the thing about dusting off the soldering iron i have all the parts it's a 10 minute repair i'm going to bed that's too much i know exactly what you mean yes yep for a man who puts as much time and money into these machines as i have already you almost think oh how is this thing not perfect yet like you think about it you're like son of a gun come on man why does things keep popping up i know it's a you know uh what is it 30 year old machine but come on let's let's get crazy here and work for for a change but now creature has been good to me deadpool is solid stern makes good stuff they really do yeah stern makes solid games like i i have i have been abusing deadpool i'm not gonna lie uh rachel you were talking about nudging and the art of nudging. Yes. My best nudges are when Drew plays pinball and I kick the machine.
    33:52
    Those are my best nudges. Like, wait, while he's playing? Well, yeah, while he's playing. I'm not a mean person, but, yeah, when we play down here, it's usually when we're – we shouldn't be standing, let alone playing. So let's not say this was super competitive. This is Ian and Drew drooling on each other, trying to play a game of pinball. That's how we love it. So, funny story. Might not be funny to some pinball people, because some pinball people are very, very protective of their machines, but not this guy.
    34:27
    So, Drew's playing, and he's kicking my ass. And in typical Ian drunk style, I was like, oh, I'm going to nudge this thing so hard. He's not going to see this. He's going to tilt. And my stuff is set loose, baby. It is not going to tilt usually.
    34:44
    So I went to think, I think I'm slick, right? I'm like, oh, yeah, Drew, I'm coming closer. I'm like, oh, I see you're doing really good over here. Oh, you just beat my score. That's cool. And then I went to kick the machine just slightly. It was a tap. You know, I don't forward. One, I'm not that athletic, too. I don't know karate. So when I say kick, it's not a pretty kick whatsoever, people. So don't get mad. But I totally missed the machine because, A, I was super drunk. And, B, again, I'm not in karate. And the only thing I managed to kick was the damn key in the lock. And I broke the key in the lock. And I said, well, you know what? That suits me. That's what I get. That's my punishment. I have, like, six locks. I can replace it. But you know what? I have the keys right here just to remind me that I have a broken key now. It's still in the lock. And that will teach me. I've learned a valuable lesson. Oh, another thing, too. I know Bill Webb, if he listens to this, he's probably cringing. I don't kick anybody else's games. I don't do that. I don't play that. I don't kick people's machines when it's serious.
    35:50
    But when it's in my basement, in my dungeon, you better believe it. So Deadpool and Creature are both for sale.
    36:00
    No, that's my pinball story. I mean, we've been going. All right, so I went to the last MGC, which didn't seem like that long ago to me. so I got caught up on all the new stuff that was really fun um and uh you know we still every once in a while uh Drew and I will go out to the bars and the bars we usually frequent have pinball so uh we were at Blackbird not too long ago and uh what was the game I was playing because it was new over there um shoot what was it well they do have an Elvira there they did oh my god that game Elvira is such a good game, man. I can't get enough of Elvira.
    36:37
    What else was I playing? You were playing Theater of Magic? No, they didn't have a Theater of Magic. They got rid of their taxi almost instantly. I was a little mad about that.
    36:47
    I don't know. It'll come to me, guys. It'll come to me. That's all right. That's my pinball life right now. It was a new release?
    36:54
    Rush? No, no, no, no. It was a 90s classic, and I was just drooling over it because it's something you didn't see very often. It was a circus back there. Terminator 2.
    37:05
    It doesn't matter. Anyway, so I just love playing games on location, try to support the local guys there. Was it a Star Trek Next Generation? They did have a Star Trek Next Generation, and I did play the hell out of that because it works really well. I know that's one of those games that's hard to keep going. Every year that passes, it's like, you know, there's just a lot of things that go wrong with that game. And it's notorious for breakdowns. But, no, it was working really good and had a lot of fun with – that's such a good game too, man. Steve Rich did a good job with that game. I love that game, and I love the theme. I watched that show religiously with my father, my sister.
    37:48
    So, to me, like, I'd love to own that game, but that's a hesitation there, man. A lot of upkeep. Yeah, a lot of upkeep. My skills aren't there yet. It's one of those games where every shot feels so good. You're going, ooh, look what that ball's doing now, you know.
    38:03
    And I think I like the call-outs and all the audio to it. I think it's just amazing. Yeah, it's a pretty cool game. That game at Blackbeard was the first game Drew and I played against each other. Blackbird. Is it Blackbird? Yeah, Blackbird. Oh, Blackbird. Like, argh. Oh, I was thinking like. I don't know. Drew and Jeremy took me there, and we had that drunken night where nobody was really serious. I think Jeremy was serious, but Drew and I were pretty wasted. Jeremy's tough. Jeremy is, he can be serious on the outside, but on the inside he's a little kid. You just got to poke the bear a little bit. Yeah, way to get that. At least that's what I do. I would agree. And he can be a hard read. I love Jeremy. Absolutely. I can't wait to see him. It's been a while since I've seen him, too. I'm so excited to see him for that reason, too, just to see all the tribe folks that will be there. Yeah. But he can be a little bit of a tough read. But, yeah, he's like a little kid inside. He's kind of like Drew that way where he's like a 12-year-old boy inside. Drew is a 12-year-old boy outside, inside, out. I don't think on the outside. Drew, no. You got to see him at his worst. He's always a 12-year-old boy. He's amazing. Love that. Okay, all right. Drew or Jeremy? No, Jeremy. Now, Jeremy, the trick with Jeremy is if he's starting to get tough on you, you just give him that long, awkward hug until he's like, I don't like this anymore. he wasn't tough on me. He just wanted to beat me. Yeah, he's like, oh, I suck at pinball. And then he says, amazing. And I'm like, you're such a dick.
    39:37
    We split the games. We had a good time. We hugged it out in the end. We both destroyed Drew. But, yeah, both of those guys, really, really fun to hang out with. Does Drew wear those, like, little pajamas at night with the feet if he's a 12-year-old? Like, I feel like Drew's running around his house right now with the little pajamas with the feet. right he has to right yeah i have slept in the same bed of drew with drew bovair approximately probably about five times and i can confirm he does not have the footy hoodie footy pajama thing um it's way worse than that i do remember one time uh we were in we went to mardi gras and his wife gave us she gave everyone who was spending the night in the hotel earplugs. I didn't know what for.
    40:32
    And even when I was blackout drunk, his snoring kept me up all night. I was like, where are those effing earplugs?
    40:40
    So Kathleen, thank you still. Thank you. I would never have slept if it wasn't for you. And her thoughtfulness. We love you, Kathleen. Drew sucks at pinball. He really does. I'm not much better, but I'm better than Drew. Yeah.
    40:58
    All right. So you'll be at MGC this year, right? In two weeks? The plan is, so I'm off on Friday. So I'm going to try to hang out as much as I can on Friday. Friday night, obviously.
    41:09
    Saturday I am working. But, you know, boss man has to work sometimes. So there I am. But Saturday night I'm open all night to hang out. And then Sunday all day I plan on being at MGC. So I plan on being around, guys. So I hope to see everyone there. And if you do see me, say hi, because I will take you to the bar right across the street, and we will have fun. All right. Okay. Is it okay if I hug you as soon as I see you? You can hug me. If you want to lightly cut my buttocks, it's fine. I am 100% planning on doing that with you. Probably not the product thing because I'm married, but I'm giving out hugs whether I ask or not. Okay. All right. Good. I'm a hugger. Me too. Rachel, I think we were both huggers when we met at District 82. Yes, we were. And had a whole conversation about being huggers. We did. And I should go back and listen to that or watch that because I'm sure that that's saved on Fox City's – I've had a couple drinks. I'm about three as well. On Fox City's pinball stream. but that was a really amazing day, Ian, when I met you and Drew. It really was. It was like this pinball thing and people were itchy to watch something and play and the two, you and Drew, had no clue really what was going on. Nope. I mean... That's like what we usually do, yeah. Right, but you're the best commentary because like, okay, let's figure out what's going on in the game and we have like the rules, Like, they have to do certain achievements on the game or whatever. And so we talked about it, and then we'd be watching, and watching the four players, and we'd chit-chat about stuff, and be like, okay, guys, this is what we're trying to do here on the game. Yeah. The invite for Drew and I to host or whatever was, hey, you don't need to know anything about pinball. You just need to be yourselves. And I thought, Drew, we should do that because that would be a lot of fun. Yeah. And we get on there, and I think the first comment we saw that was like, ooh, ouch, was Zach Minigore, not these two clowns.
    43:21
    Zach, come on, man. That's why we're going to try a little bit, maybe. Yeah, that was a very hot day that day during that summer, but that was such a fun time, and it gave me an opportunity to meet the two of you and to be exposed to the Poor Man's Pinball podcast and also to podcasts in general, because that's something in the pinball world I haven't really looked at. But thanks, man, because you, I think I've said this to Drew as well. If not, well, you know, screw him because he's not here.
    43:53
    He wasn't invited. Screw him, yeah. No, but Ian, I hope you understand that through doing the podcast and everything, it's helped to open other doors for me to do other things. And so I have, like, so much gratitude for you and Drew. and I think about that day at District 82 with such love, you know, because you were so funny. You were funnier than Drew, I thought. When I left that day, I thought you were so freaking hilarious and Drew was kind of like, eh, but maybe you were more drunk than he was.
    44:26
    First off, that's true. Both parts. Well, yeah, you know, that's why it's hard to carry a podcast with him for three years. it's all coming out I love you buddy you know I love you it was a good time you know and like Rachel thank you very much that was very kind I would say that you know there's been a lot of people that we have brought into our tribe or just interacted with and it's they're always very positive interactions and you know the tribe and the fans in general are so nice and the community is so nice to us. You know, it's funny, for what we are, we get very little. We never got hate mail. And we would always hear some of these really good podcasts that are very polished get so much hate mail, and we're like, huh, we get a lot of positive stuff. So I thought that was really telling of just like, okay, because we're genuine and we're just trying to have fun with our podcast, and it really helped. But to your point, though, I think that, you know, of all the people, you know, we can only like, hey, you know, check out our show or hey, I hope you kind of enjoy it. And maybe maybe we can hang out or or, you know, we can only show you like who we are. And then, you know, but you were awesome enough to like embrace how ridiculous the show is. And that speaks a lot for you. I'm sorry. That's really bad for you. But no, no, I think that's what I love. The both of you are so authentic. Tim's authentic, too, and we're just being ourselves, and I think that's the best part of it. We're not putting on any facades for anybody, and we also, each person, you can laugh, we can make jokes and whatever, but each person is kind. We're kind people, and we're good people, and we're quality people, and that's what I love about it. We're all people that are doing our own crap in our life, but we're also passionate about pinball and we get together and chat about it or play and i think it's amazing so here's here's we're all very positive like it might be a train wreck we might not know what we're talking about but the entire group is a very positive group i mean lord knows if we know we don't know what we're talking about but we're all very positive and just a good group of, you know, fun-loving people. Yeah, right. Well, Tim, are we fluff? Is our podcast fluff? I'm not going to fluff inside. I think we're fluff, but we love it. Exactly. I'm like, you've got to have marshmallow fluff in life too, right? We can be that as a podcast. I don't care. But I think we're positive, and I love that. And Poor Men and Foghorn Leghorn were all, I think, positive and upbeat. And I think that is what sets us apart a little bit, too. But that is because of you, Ian, and because of Drew. Okay. So, boom. Okay, enough. Let's get off the love train.
    47:33
    Nobody wants to listen to how awesome I am. I'm sorry. Ian's like, talk for another ten minutes. Keep going. I'm going to come with this larceny over here. Keep going. Tell me about it. Tell me about how much more funny I am than Drew.
    47:50
    That was a five-hour podcast. I listened to all five hours. All right. What else we got? What other questions? Shoot me some questions. Well, I did talk to Drew a little bit today about you coming on our podcast, and he wanted me to voice one question to you. Oh. He'd like me to ask you why you only record one four-minute episode in an entire year.
    48:15
    First off, he's just jealous that that four-minute episode outdid him in all the stats, by the way. Hell yeah. I'm joking.
    48:34
    It's wimpy-worthy. It was wimpy-worthy. I was all jacked up because I heard Orbital Elbert back on the air, and I was just like, oh, for the love of God, that's amazing. I miss him so much. Those are one of those guys that you just love to listen to. And I was listening to him. I'm like, yeah, I got to do something.
    48:53
    Not to divulge, because we don't have any set plans right now for my future in podcasting. I will be starting a new position with my company in about a month. So I am hoping that frees up my time big time. So if I can be free again and have more time for podcasting, because that was always a problem because um even though it didn't seem like our show was much but we i definitely liked um it was definitely more of a creative outlet for me and uh drew just loves pinball and that's that's the beauty of drew i love that about drew uh for me though i really liked uh i was always such a creative person and when you get stuck in a job where you're just working and working and working and you forget to create things every once in a while and so when we started to do the podcast Yes, I thought of it, and I was just so hooked because I could be creative again. You know, that was the whole thing. Yeah. And my creative juices are just going crazy right now, and they have been for some time, and I would love to go back behind the microphone, you know, weekly or even biweekly, whatever. But the new job has to – or the new position in my company has to happen first, and I've got to get a good feeling of free time, right? For sure. So tell Drew, tell him, tell him, tell him, Drew, fuck you.
    50:16
    I only listened to Drew's like the first 15 minutes of the night drone off because, man, that guy can just dabba dabba dabba dabba dab. And I'm like, what are you talking about? What's the point? I listened to one and I gave him shit for it. But he was just like he was talking about Weird Al's. And it was a good episode. It really was. I listened to the whole thing. And he was so positive about it. And I really like that about Drew because he's such a positive person. And we play well off of that because sometimes I'm more of a negative Nancy and he's such a positive person. But sometimes I'm a little bit more critical. And so when he was going on and on about how amazing everything is about Weird Al and how he's really excited about it, at the end of the episode, he's like, so if you don't like my opinion, you know, you can send me an email. And I don't give a fuck because it's my podcast. Mr. Controversy over here, okay? You didn't say anything negative whatsoever. You didn't have anything critique-wise for Weird Al. You were super positive. It was like Bob Ross doing a podcast about pinball. It was so chill. I was like, okay, Drew, you need me, buddy.
    51:25
    I love when Drew says, oh, I'm going to edit that out, but he doesn't edit it out. He says it like once a podcast. He's like, I'm going to edit that out. Yeah, he has editing powers now. So when I was on the Poor Man's Spinball podcast last time, he edited half my crap out because I went on a few good rants. I thought they were juicy rants. And I watched it. I was like, oh, man, you edited me out. I got edited in my own podcast.
    51:52
    So now you can tell who does the editing and who doesn't because I always left those juicy points in because I thought that was funny. But Drew, no, Drew won't have it. So here we go. I think it is healthy to have some criticism when there is a game. And I always like you brought that to the table. Absolutely the opposite of him in terms of the way that you do a game. You'd be like, eh, but what about this or about that? And Drew just sees, shiny, you know. I don't know if I've ever thought of it as like, I don't want to say that I look for faults in every game. What happens is, in my head, I'll just let you go inside Ian's head for a second. It's scary in there. but let's just take a breath, take a step back. So in Ian's head, when they announce a game, like, in my head, I have that game already planned out in my head. Like, I have so many expectations. And it doesn't matter if it's Jurassic Park or Weird Al. Like, I have these things in my head that just go off. I'm sure I'm not alone. So then when I see the product, I thought I was pretty fair. When I saw something that I was like, whoa, way better than I was thinking, like Godzilla, way better than I thought it was ever going to be. um keith elwin did so so good um but like you know and even like we um uh elvira i always thought wow that was such a cool cool game you know um but like there was like and then there was times where i was totally wrong like deadpool i was way off on deadpool you know it's it's funny when you record your opinions on on a podcast and then you you get the game you're like oh shit i'm an idiot it's true though I always like Jurassic Park was that is a big one for me because I always just you know and you think Jurassic Park you have all these iconic images in your head and when Stern delivered it it's not it's not an Elwynn thing at all it's it was just the Stern package it's licensing it's what they could get in there I get it I understand it but you know I was critical of the artwork because I'm like oh come on man this it just seems so generic to me. It seemed like a generic artwork package for such an iconic franchise. But yeah, you're right. Drew sees the box of lights. He's like, oh, look at these giant things.
    54:04
    It has three ramps and three pop bumpers. Yeah, Drew, they all do. You ask Drew and he says, Drew, what do you think of the game? And he'll be like, I think this might be the greatest game ever. Whether it's Borg Yeah, Borg or Elwynn This might be the greatest game ever Alright He always starts it off Okay guys, listen So, you know, I've said this in the past But I really mean it this time This will be the game That sets Stern apart From everyone else Okay dude But some games you have to play though You know, it's unfair to like judge it just based on like their releases you know like i was really really excited about teenage ninja turtles and then borg blew it out of the water with just the whole package it looks great and then when i played it i was like huh it's just not as much fun as i thought it would be but then like mandalorian which i looked at it i was like huh interesting but then when i played mandalorian i was like oh this is fun stranger things is another one that really surprised me like um looking at it you're like oh it's okay and then when you play it you're like oh my god this is so much fun. So it's really hard to judge a game based on how much fun it's going to be until you actually play it. So it's a little tough when you're a podcast and you're trying to be the first one on the scene and give your opinion. But until you play it, it's really hard because playing them really sets it apart and you can really tell really good games from bad games instantly. And you need about 20 to 30 games on it. You really do. You need a lot of games. And the funny thing about Mandalorian is I like Mandalorian I got it for my kids Here the thing about pinball folks They always want something different Right And they gave you something completely different in Mandalorian and people are like oh my goodness this thing clunky It doesn't shoot well. And I'm like, well, it's different. It's different. Yeah, and it's grown on me. I was just talking to Jonathan Hall about it last week. I really, really enjoy it now. But it's different. It's stop and go. It's a good home game. But like you said, yeah, and back to Drew. Drew tried to convince me one day. He called me when I was on the road and tried to convince me. This is a true story that Led Zeppelin was one of the greatest games ever made.
    56:24
    Okay. I might be embellishing, but he's like, it's him, this is an awesome game. And I'm like, I don't know, Drew.
    56:30
    Well, I think the premium and the LE where it has the gate that comes up in the middle. Yeah, he was playing the premium. Yeah, that is what I think makes the game. I think the LE has the additional light show that goes on with it. And so the LE, I think, is actually, I mean, it is a fun game. I do like the rule set. But the Pro, like, they left a lot to be desired on that game, on the Pro. Yeah, sure. I understand why they do that and put certain mechs into different games. But that's, like, a really big one to not have on the Pro. Not even something similar to it. Because, like, at least on Godzilla, you still get the tower, even if the tower doesn't move. So, yeah. well it's frustrating being drew's friend sometimes because when you go to mgc and he shows you all the new games like he did last time with me and and he was so excited but he was like you know this is guns and roses it's really good and then he goes over to he like kind of skips it and then he goes cactus canyon and i'm like so i play cactus canyon i'm like holy crap i'm having a lot of fun he's like hold on you haven't seen nothing yet and then he takes me You know, Led Zeppelin, I'm like, dude, if you go from Cactus Canyon and Guns N' Roses to Led Zeppelin, and I'm sorry, Led Zeppelin fans, you go, well, where's the rest of it? I would love to see what's going on in this game. That's right. And then you don't want to shoot your best friend down, right? You don't want to go, oh, Drew, why? You know what I said? I said, oh, Drew, why?
    58:02
    And I think that's when he called me that night, yeah. Yeah. I just go, true. And then he showed me Godzilla, and he was so hyped about it.
    58:10
    And this is something I work on as a person, by the way. We're going to go in deep in my head. If someone is super excited about something, I instantly am, like, ultra critical, which is a fault. Those are the worst people, by the way. And I try not to be that guy. And I recognize that. So he's super, like, excited about Godzilla. I'm like, I don't know. Let me try it. And I try it. And I'm like, it's good. And then he leaves, and I play, like, three more games. I'm like, fuck, this is a really good game. Now how do I tell Drew?
    58:41
    But then I tell him, like, dude, it's an awesome game. I'm glad you got one because, yeah, it's a fantastic – Godzilla is a killer game, dude. Yeah, best game. But it's also hard when you, like, really love the manufacturer and you're not a big fan of the game. And I try not to be too harsh on certain guys. and I'm like, oh, man, I hope they turn it around. Man, I will say this, though. Cactus Canyon I thought was really, really good. I really liked it. You guys, have you guys got some time on that? I have. Yeah, I just put about 10 games on it at Pimbrew, maybe 15.
    59:18
    I love it. It's so much fun. I love the game, too. It's so much fun. The call-outs are great. I like the way that it's lit. It's just so much fun just to play. I got to play it at my lady's slip that I had at District 1 brewing up in Stevens Point that just got the game in. So I was really excited to play. That's even the best, is like when it's a brand new game out of the box, and you're only like, this is like the 30th game on it, and everything's just so sparkly and shiny. Where's Drew? You know? But yeah, Cactus Canyon, I think, is such a fun game. It's so much fun. I gotta ask you guys this, because this is something that I deal with, and I wonder if you guys deal with this. So, I have yet, and this is not against the manufacturer at all. This is an Ian thing. I have yet to have a really good game on any JJP machine.
    60:08
    And you know what that is? Like, what is that? Do you guys understand that? So I think it's when they are in the wild. For some reason, when JJP games are in the wild, I do terrible. But my friend Justin brought over Willy Wonka to me and put it in my house. I went from despising the game to absolutely loving it because it was just set up level. And then I have a Guns in my house that I got for Amy and I really enjoy it. But I've played it in the wild and they set them up fairly steep. And I don't think JJP games are meant to be set up as steep as people have them. But any time I've played a JJP in the wild, I've struggled every single time. If I play it in somebody's home, I really enjoy it. I would agree with that. When I played a J.J.P., Wonka, Pirates in a Person's Home, I think they definitely played better. But I think that their games, do you mean, Ian, that they're just a tough shooter? Well, hell, I can shoot pretty good. But for whatever reason, maybe it's because they're so nice and so much to them that I freeze up. but I have never had a good game on a JJP machine, and I was just wondering if I was the only one. Because, like, Eric, a tribe member, Eric, tribe member three or four, I don't know. But he has a Willy Wonka in his house. I get my ass kicked every time. We went to MGC. I was playing Guns N' Roses for the first time. Oh, my God, that game. We could talk about that. But I was playing with Eric again, and then designer Eric. Minear. Eric Minier. So we were playing. All three of us were playing. And man, dude. Oh, even the Willy Wonka reveal when I was on the stream for that. Oh.
    62:04
    It was like a triple drain. And I haven't gotten one ounce better. Like, I can play Sterns all day. I can play CGC all day. I can play all the old stuff all day long. But when I get in front of that beautiful JJP, I go, I'm not worthy of this masterpiece. Like, it's so, so, everything. Like, my brain stops working. And I'm like, I'm a brick fest.
    62:34
    You got to figure out the zen. You got to figure out the zen in your head when you play JJP is what you're saying. Is that it? Yeah, man. The zen thing? It's the zen thing, yeah. You know, I haven't been known for my zen thing. Me neither. Yeah.
    62:49
    I just told you I kick my machine when Drew plays. I'm kind of the opposite of that. Maybe that's it. I love them. Man, I love them. Like, it's so hard. I don't know. If you guys, I don't know. Tim, have you owned any? You've had some JJP in your home, right? So, Mistress Anne has had Guns N' Roses in our house for a year and a half. Yes. And she still plays it all the time. It's just a fantastic show. We enjoy it. I take a break from every game. Like, even Godzilla, I took, like, a two-week break from. But it's – our Guns N' Roses is in our family room. Amy liked it so much, she said – her exact words were – or Mr. Sand said, get it out of the dingy basement and bring it up here where people can see it and we can play it. Yeah. That's the only one I've had that I own. But Justin dropped his off for a month. It's got to be hard, though. I always found it very hard when JJP releases a game. And I had this happen, and I think I talked about it on the podcast, but when JJP releases a game, they're so polished and they're so beautiful and there's so much to them, it's almost kind of hard to, like, go to a CERN and play them and be like, huh, this is only a couple thousand dollar difference, you know? Yeah. It's kind of crazy because I was playing, I think it was Willy Wonka an Oktoberfest back-to-back, and I was like, nothing really compares to a JJP in a way, and I just think it's very interesting. Just build quality, you know, and the things they put in it. I love all pinball, but I don't discriminate. I can't afford a JJP, but I still think it's very interesting, though. I always thought that was very interesting about JJP, because they just make other games seem so, I don't want to say anything negative, but they're just different, you know? it's super different. It's super cool, though. It's a different experience. But I have to say that Godzilla kind of took Stern up a notch.
    64:53
    Like, in my mind, I think Godzilla was kind of a level above all other Sterns. No, I think I agree with that. I think I really love my Iron Maiden, though, you know, so much. You know, you know, you know. I'm going to say that 12,000 times so Tim can edit that out. I know. I know. I'm not taking this out. Drew and I were sitting there, and we were playing Iron Maiden and Metallica, and he was such a Metallica just junkie, and he wanted a Metallica in his home, and I convinced him on the Iron Maiden because, listen, I got to tell you, Iron Maiden is still one of the best shooters I've ever done. Yes. It's still the best shooter. I love the game so much, but Godzilla smacks so hard. like it's just that game every time i play it i'm discovering something new yes and that's what i love about it that floating flipper is so mind-blowing i just love it it really is a floating flipper i love it it's mind-blowing i love the looping that you could get into that with that flipper just that game is fantastic and and i want everybody here to know that the song Godzilla by Blue Oyster Cult by B.O.C. I have some name for karaoke. I'm a big B.O.C. fan. B.O.C.
    66:15
    First off, I have never heard anyone call it the B.O.C. Number one. Number two. If you're singing karaoke, you better be calling it B.O.C. I'm telling you. I love this song. The first time I opened that multi-ball, I couldn't even focus on what was going on with the tower because it was so jacked up with the song playing so yeah yeah godzilla is really good guys i would say you know with with all sterns i mean it's it's it's it's it's all about presentation at the end of the day i love how they know it's sorry let me reverse that it's all it's all about their shots at the end of the day and they have stern still has the best shooters man they just are yeah you know it bugs me when you pay that much and you get like these cheap little plastic things you know And it's like, that's supposed to be a building, dude. And you go, ah, son of a bitch.
    67:10
    However, however, once you start, once you press that play button and you plunge, it's over, man. You don't care much about that kind of stuff. You just play. That's what Deadpool taught me, you know. It's who gives a shit about the plastics. It doesn't matter. what's the difference of a plastic Deadpool versus a full on G.I. Joe Deadpool sitting there spread eagle I don't care but the shots are still amazing and George R.R. Martin deserves a lot of credit for that kid by the way but I would say no for Godzilla yeah when I looked at it I was like oh okay it looks like a stern again but you shoot it and then you shoot it again and then you shoot it one more time and you go shit this is a really good game. Anyone who got that on order, congratulations. You're going to love that game forever. I guarantee it. I'm bold to... Hey, Rachel, back to the BOC. I have two games that... I have two... The BOC!
    68:14
    I have two games in my basement that play BOC songs. What's the other one? Halloween plays the song The Reaper. Oh, really? Yeah, yeah. I'm like, I don't know how I got two songs with the B.O.C. in the basement, but I do. So, Tim, why don't you – what's the other game, by the way? Godzilla. Okay. So, Tim – I didn't know. Tim, what games do you own? Because every time I talk to you, you've got something different. So what do you have right now? No, Godzilla's kind of operator friend Mike's. I still have Stranger Things. I have Mandalorian.
    68:50
    I have Batman. The Dark Knight, Stern Pirates, World Cup Soccer, Halloween, Munsters, and then Guns N' Roses. I have nine now. Jesus Christ. Not all of them are mine. No, I get it. Yep, yep. So how does Halloween stack up with all the other ones? What's your take on Halloween? I will be honest. I did not like Halloween to start. it just was not set up well. It had some issues. We worked through the issues. I told my buddy that I'm going to duct tape the game together just to keep Amy happy because she absolutely loves it. But just last week, and my buddy Justin was over tonight, we were talking about this. I finally got it set up playing well, where you can hit the middle ramp and you can just, the game, it doesn't really flow great, but you can play a game and you can have fun. So, it's not my favorite game. I probably wouldn't own it without Mr. Sand. She loves it, but I'm finally starting to have fun with it because it's set up well. But it took a while to get there. It was, you know, they have the greatest shot in pinball, the butt pretzel. And that top play field, there's a little figure eight that you can just rip like three times in a row. It's a phenomenal shot. I haven't seen a shot that's more fun in pinball. It was really hard to get there. We couldn't hit our middle ramp and kept rejecting. But with pin side, pin side can be good. About five guys on the pin side threads helped me work through getting my ramp adjusted. Now I can get it up there, and it's a lot of fun. Pin side's good stuff. I like pin side for the most. Like, you've got to just have an edit button, and that's all, in your head, when you go through it. Yeah, when I played, I played Halloween at MGC, and I just had a really hard time tracking the ball. Now, granted, I played two games, so totally with a lot of salt. But, like, I had a hard time. I had no idea where that ball was coming. I'm sure you're going to figure it out with more games, and I think that's a design thing. You know, I could see Bug designing it just like I would design something, and then you play it more and more and more. You know where the balls are coming from. But as a first-time player, it's almost like the ball shoots over from the left, and you're like, shit, what? And then it just drains, and you're like, oh, there's no lights. But then there was lights, but they're not bright enough. And I love the theme. Flashing in the inlay when it feeds you the ball onto your flipper and getting used to that. I think it doesn't have, like, the tilt warnings, though, right above the flipper, I think, right? It's very – I don't know, man. It just wasn't noticeable, I think. I mean, when I went and played Legends of Valhalla, which I didn't think was a bad game at all. I actually liked how it shot. But you could tell where the ball was coming from at all times. And I think that was one thing I was like, if I could change anything from Halloween, it would have been that or if they had. But that's something that's like software. Like, you can fix that, you know. But the shots in Halloween were interesting. I never got to the pretzel shot. But, you know what, that's awesome, though, because, you know, Bug can see that and say, shit, man, I'm going to do some more pretzel stuff, you know. it's good stuff you know and I really like that um and that's what we're all about just getting better and you know I love spooky to death so um if you ever get into Wisconsin and you want to tour their facility they're super cool about it and and uh Charlie and Bug and and all the folks there they're they're very down to earth they're so they're so cool you would be shocked because if you go to Benton, Wisconsin, there's a bar, which is awesome, by the way, and then a church, and then Spooky.
    72:51
    I think there's a factory across the street, and all they do is make ramps for Spooky. I think that's what their gig is now.
    73:00
    And then Drew bought, I think he bought Alice Cooper. It was funny. We went there, did the tour. We interviewed Bug and Charlie, and they were the sweetest men ever. But we were ready to, like, load up Alice Cooper. And, oh, Drew had a Hobbit that we were trading in. And the funniest story was, like, we're trading in this Hobbit. We had this rental van. The license plates were, like, from Kansas. So everyone was treating us really nice because they thought we drove all the way from Kansas.
    73:31
    Like, no, dude, we're from Milwaukee. Like, it wasn't that far. We're good. And then, but Charlie did one of those, like, mafia claps, or, like, it was his wife, I think, who did the mafia clap. And I had two or three of the youngest studs you've ever seen go, go, I'll lift your pinball machine for you and unload this and load it up. And we're like, sweet, man. They opened up the trunk or whatever, and it was the Hobbit. They go, oh, son of a bitch. and every one of those young bucks were like oh man seriously and but they were sweet they were really funny about it they grabbed it they loaded the alice cooper up and uh uh but yeah the rest is history but yeah i strongly encourage if you're ever going to buy a a game from spooky see if you can pick it up from their their location because they'll give you a tour and It's really cool, man. It's cool to see pinball being made. They're fantastic folks. They really are. Yeah, I met Bug and Spooky Luke at Allentown last year, and they were two really good dudes, so I'll have to do that. By the way, the next game on Mistress Anne's hit list is Alice Cooper's Nightmare Castle. She keeps talking about that one. I don't know. She loves it. Yeah, I played it quite a bit at Jerusalem. We played it at MGC for the first time. It was really funny because we were playing it. This was right when we started our podcast. To your point, Rachel, when it came to, like, people recognizing you for the first time for your pinball podcast. Oh, God. We weren't used to it, right? So we're sitting there, and we're just in line for Alice Cooper. And of all people, it was Chris Haper, who was also a tribe member. But he's behind us, and he was doing Slap Save at the time. And they were, like, a really big podcast at the time. and he's right behind us. I heard his voice. He goes, Ian and Drew, man, we had been on the air for maybe a month, and he knew exactly who we were, which was really cool, Chris, by the way, if you're listening, but super cool. But we all played a game at Alice Cooper, and I was like, wait a second, how is this not the game of the year? That year we played all the games, but Alice Cooper was far beyond all the others. I thought Alice Cooper was a great game. Super fun to play.
    75:58
    We like it. Amy likes it a lot. Hey, by the way, I had Jonathan Hall convinced this week that I also purchased an Ultraman. And he kept sending me a message. He's like, you're not dumb enough to buy two games with the same layout. And I'm like, maybe. And he kept sending me messages saying, I don't know if you're serious or not. But he's like, I've gotten to know you, Tim. You might do something that crazy. I didn't. I just had him convinced that I did. Thanks, John Hall. Thank you for that reassurance that I'm crazy.
    76:30
    So, Ian, you said earlier that you share the same factoid as Raymond Davidson, that your first pinball machine was Black Rose. Oh, yeah. Can you tell us a little bit about how you got into pinball? Yeah, you want to get into the back story? I want the origin story. The origin story of the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast, all encompassed in one. Of Ian. Real quick, it's not that interesting. So Drew and I both graduated high school In 2000 we were born in 1980 and 1981 Respectively I'm just kidding I'm not going that far back But the The whole thing Was we got into Arcade games restoration And we've talked about this like I actually I'm embarrassed to tell you guys but I know so much more about arcade Games than I do about pinball and it's not Even close like the arcade game thing and I know so much that I hate them you know because I just think arcade games at the end of the day when you play enough of them you realize they were just gambling for children you realize they just were designed to suck your quarters that's all they were for and they were you know they were no good for anybody sure there was a point where they were actually pretty fair unless you learned like you know you learned the little tricks like you ever hear like the tricks on how to play Pac-Man. It's insane, right? But once you get to that insert a quarter to continue your game, you realize it was 100% a gambling thing. And it's very sad. And I really don't like arcade games as much anymore, but I love the art and the cabinets and how they were all put together. And I thought that was the coolest part of arcade collecting. So Drew kind of got me into that a little bit. He had an arcade machine that he had bought, but then he tried to turn it into a main machine, which is like an arcade emulator. I eventually took over that project from him because, you know, Drew's got a lot of things going on. He's super busy. He's very popular.
    78:35
    I decided to take it on, and it was like I was like the party house, man. I had an arcade machine in my apartment. it was the coolest thing so uh everybody wanted to play the arcade machine and that got me thinking about you know touch screen jukeboxes and i was playing i was making those and and then i was building you know more uh main machines and upgrading the one i had anyway fast forward i'm doing all this arcade stuff arcade restoration and i get to the point in my life where i'm like you know i actually had a very deep conversation with ken cromwell from uh you know back in the day and we were talking about arcade machine restorations and we were we were totally different we were divided he was super into like you take an old machine and you make it like it came right off the dock like you gotta make it beautiful but then i was like no no you don't because i was more of a if i got an arcade machine with like cigarette burns on it on the on the control panel i was like super like that's history man or if somebody has their their high score on the side of the cabinet I was like I'm not getting rid of that that's beautiful that's awesome you know and Ken and Cromwell and I would go back and forth a little bit about it but uh there was eventually a point where I was selling arcade machines a lot more because barcades were starting to become popular I was making a lot more money on them not that I was like in it for the money but it just like it was stupid i would take a game from someone's basement i would fix it up to where i thought it was beautiful um it may not have been perfect but it was like it had the history with it and everything and then uh but like these bar caves would open and they would like ask for you know there'd be bidding wars and i'd all all of a sudden i'd be making more money than i even needed and i was thinking like wow this is crazy this is just stupid like i just want this to go to a good home and then barcades are a good home because i want people to play them so i eventually got my teeth sunk into a a friend of mine his brother bought a uh nintendo punch out and it was um in his brother's basement for god 10 years and his whole goal was to get it to work again and then i went down there and now if you don't know nintendo punch out it has two monitors it has a monitor like eye level other than there's a monitor on top so you play the game but it has all the stats up on top real waste of monitor space if you ask me doesn't matter the thing was like the top monitor barely worked bottom monitor was bright green you know and all the buttons were missing and he's like i'm gonna fix it up i'm like i'll give you two hundred dollars because i know i'm gonna put eight hundred dollars into this dumb thing and i'll be lucky if i can sell it for a thousand like i just just help me out here you know and he goes i'd rather it get fixed up the right way blah blah blah well it turned out like the artwork on there was like super rare and i didn't know that at the time because i was just there to like i just wanted to maintain i didn't want to like strip it and then make it all perfect again so um so i worked with a lot of it was cool because i worked with a lot of different websites that restore artwork for arcade machines And that was one they didn't have. So I got to scan it and send it to everybody. It was super cool. And then I redid everything. I actually have an arcade repair. I have a TV repair shop down the road from me, a rare one, because they don't have those anymore. And I gave them my old monitors. And there was like this 70-year-old man that only worked weekends. He goes, Ian, what do you got for me? This is bullshit. What are we doing here? I don't know, Frank. It's a bunch of bullshit monitors, man. Just make them look halfway decent. Could you do that? I'll make them look perfect, but this is bullshit. I don't want to do this anymore. I'm like, what are you doing, Frank? What are you doing on the weekends, man? What is this thing? What is your part-time job? It's to make these monitors look good again. Oh, whatever. You know, guys, this is a Midwestern thing. You know, you fight with the old folks, and then they fight back, and then they love you at the end of the day. so here we are I get this thing going blah blah blah blah I'm thinking all right I'm gonna post it for a thousand bucks I have eight hundred dollars in this damn thing and uh some guy showed up and he's like I'll give you 2,500 bucks for it I have an arcade that's opening up in in Minnesota and I said okay all right here we go and uh that gave me the funds to buy my first pinball machine So I bought a Black Rose just because I love pirates. So I bought the Black Rose. So I was super pumped, man. It was like $2,200, which is more than I ever spent on any machine I've ever seen. And so I bought this machine and the Black Rose and all its beauty I go in this guy garage and i have to be i have to be full full transparency the arcade community with with the with all the people with their man caves they just there was a lot of uh man they got hostile you know you start a hobby and everyone's super cool and then you get all these newcomers and they're very hostile they want perfect machines and it's very frustrating when you're like listen this is this is a really good example of a nintendo popeye or whatever and then you know you get all this oh man this is terrible why would i pay 800 for this and you go man it's worth it it's 100 worth it it's a great game you're gonna love it and it looks fantastic i put a lot of work into this so it kind of i got real sick of it so long story short when I met the guy who sold me the black rose he was absolutely amazing he was in Illinois and he had been working on pinball machines for the last 30 years and he walked me through the black rose purchase he walked me through all the good stuff all the stuff I need to do to like maintain the machine he had a smaller garage but it was 100 pinball repair dedicated he had he had he had parts everywhere he had he had these cool play fields hanging on the ceiling you know like it's just just like district 82 Rachel love it when you see that artwork you're like oh man this is cool yeah it's unbelievable Ian you have to come up there again because Eric keeps finding new things to put up. It's just, I swear, not just the playfields and the back boxes that are all lit up going around everywhere, but he has all these gigantic, huge banners like, Play More Pinball! And Stay Sharp with an E, you know? It's just really kind of surreal. And I forget. The thing is I forget because I also walk in and I'm like, Oh my God, look at the 110 different pinball machines there. And then people look up and they're like, Oh my God, look at all the playfields that are here. You know, it It just blows. It is so mind-blowing. I had a couple of people say over that weekend that they've never seen anything like this, and they feel so fortunate to be there. But don't travel from Australia. You've got to travel from Australia to play at District 82. That's bonkers. I love you, Simon. I'm already long-winded about this, but I got a Black Rose, and that's what got Drew into it, and the rest is kind of history. The Black Rose, the beauty of that game is, one, it's a clear mech, right, in the middle, the cannon shot, right? Yep. It's a very clear, distinct mech. It was like the perfect game to get. First game, it's a perfect game because you have ramps you have to hit. You have a fun mech right in the middle, center of your eye. There's some cool stuff that goes in the back of the back box and then shoots the cannon shot back to you. And it's just a lot of fun, that game. And it was also the first game that had, you know, the mini game modes. And it's, you know, some people are like, eh, about them. But I thought it was really cool. And the guy hooked up a really cool button switch on there. So, like, when you hit the fire button, that's in the center. Everyone's used to it being like the boom button from Deadpool, that center, stern button. But back in the day when Williams did it, it was just like a contact on a little miniature circuit board thing. And those went bad really quickly. So he hooked it up to be just a micro switch. And it worked great. So I had a ton of fun with Black Rose. Great theme. and then it helped that Zach was talking it up when I had it because then I was able to sell it for a monster bash and then kind of the rest is history but Drew played Black Rose because he was also in the arcade thing and he was like yeah this is a lot better than After Burner 2 because pinball what's the big difference between pinball and arcade and it's a huge difference is it's a skilled game it's a skill game it's not a game that's set up for you to fail it's a game that's set up where you can kind of control your own destiny you go as far as you your skills allow whereas arcade it's like they up the difficulty to the point where it's stupid it's like okay put another quarter and now you suck and it's like nah it just got dumb you know so that's that's kind of the story how we got into pinball drew and i but black rose uh fantastic game still i play it on uh what is pinball fx i mean the sound effects and the music get to me like hardcore but uh the shots are still good man and ramey davidson's right man he even helped me with that game because there's certain things you can do on that game that not a lot of people know how to play that game correctly so you know it's when you have that cannon loaded everyone wants to shoot for the very center to hit dead on broadside right but the real thing you want to do is hit the stand-up targets and have them ricochet so if you hit one and it ricochets to the next it hit it ricochets to the next one now you've just uh opened up the game to like just get blown up so if you have a black rose that is definitely the way to play that game just aim for those stand up targets guys you're going to get it I'll try playing that way yeah I was in my buddy's house earlier today and he had a black rose so I'll get to put some good time on it a couple of things about your story I think I said this on the last episode my son had to do a a presentation in college and he had to essentially he was attempting to get somebody to change their mind and he decided to talk about why pinball is better or more fun and better to play than arcade games. And he asked me my opinion and I told him two things. I said, one, it's physics. Every game is different. You know, you are playing the game. It's not a pattern. And I said, two,
    90:04
    I don't know how you work this into this, this, um, I forget what they call it, a persuasive speech, I said, but the community, I said, there is a public pinball community where people get together. You just can't be, it's not online with a headset. It's an actual legit community where people fly all over the country, you know, to, uh, to talk to and get together. And the other thing I wanted to say about your origin story, which has nothing to do with pinball, but your little segment on the Midwestern dudes, Drew took me to Roman's Tavern. Oh, my God, you went to Romans? Yeah. Dude, where was I during that? That's awesome. We're sitting at Romans Tavern, and I said, why did Ian come out? Drew's like, oh, I forgot to tell him. So it was not Tim Lee. I did a last-minute trip to Wisconsin. I didn't get to meet the lovely Rachel. It was like my work said you were going to Wisconsin, and I called Drew. And anyways, Mike, he badgered me the whole time I was there about Pittsburgh. Good for Mike. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Badgered me the whole time. Then he got me a beer. He gave me a beer in the house. No! You got a beer in the house from Mike Roman? I got a beer in the house from Mike Roman. I call bullshit. He has never given a free beer in his fucking life. Maybe you should treat him better. Oh, you know, funny about Mike Roman, and nobody cares about this story, but my dad would go over there all the time and mike would give my dad so much shit and my dad would be giving him shit and then mike would just why are you here george why do you keep coming to my bar my dad was like i don't know you're so mean to me it reminds me of home that's my joke but yeah that was my dad though uh all right if you ever thought oh no ian you're wrong arcade games are not designed to steal money from your pocket here's a great test if you played if you were ever a player of street fighter 2 and everyone that just just listened to this shut their heads because if you played like the sega genesis or super nintendo version of street fighter 2 you have a clear progression from the very first opponent to the very last boss there's a clear progression for sure you actually owned the arcade game and i'm not talking about playing it at the arcade and i beat so and so and it's great no if you own the arcade game and you put credits in that arcade game in your own home and you're like i'm gonna i'm gonna do the progression you realize the first opponent's super easy the second opponent it's a little difficult The third opponent Is damn near impossible No matter who it is Because they cheat Because they want to take your credit They want your credit Your quarter So it's dirty And Mortal Kombat is the same way And a lot of those games are designed that way And the more you play them you realize The older arcade games are great The After the era of you know insert to continue you know insert to insert another quarter to continue it just it's 100 a scam um i will challenge you though timley the arcade community is immense it's huge it's probably i don't want to i don't want to say it's double the pinball community but it's it's more accessible because it's cheaper sure the arcade community they they they will travel for some arcade games, for sure. Okay. And they're very passionate about the arcade games. But, you know what? It's, again, it's not just the game itself, though. It's the nostalgia. It's artwork. It's the machines themselves. It's the cabinets. It's rare games. There's a lot that goes into arcade machines that Pinball has it and kind of has it. But pinball, what pinball has going for it, though, is whether it's an early pinball machine, which is just a nudger, or if it's a later stern, it's still 100% a skill game, which is a beautiful thing. That's why we can have legit tournaments. That's why we can have such amazing community support where we go, oh, you had a bad game? That's okay. We all have bad games. I have a lot of them. What did you learn? Yeah. And we're still making pinball, right? Nobody's really making arcade games besides Raw Thrills. So this is late breaking. First, I want to make a public service announcement. We've picked on Drew a lot this episode. Not enough. All the new fans know everybody on this podcast absolutely loves Drew. That's all. We can go back to – Yeah, yeah. Tim, do you have any bills over bashing Drew? I think we're very mild. I consider Drew one of my best friends, but I bash on him all the time. I wouldn't be opposed to starting a whole podcast about just dissing Drew. Yeah.
    95:32
    There's a reason I brought up the public service announcement, because I just got a text from Drew. Ah, he won. I am just going to read it. it says ask Kaneda Jr. about his new car. Oh, my gosh.
    95:47
    Drew, you're trying to get me in trouble? You don't have to answer, but that just came in. Yeah, today I bought a new car, and I went to Carvana, which was so cool. If you – it's a dangerous site, though.
    96:05
    But I was – so my whole life – all right. I'll give you a little back. Minimal. So real quick. My whole life I had a very sensible car. Just once, Ian. Yeah, for once I'll shut the F up.
    96:23
    I've been very sensible with my car purchases all the time since I was 16 because at the end of the day I'm kind of a cheap bastard in a way. Hence the poor man's pinball podcast. Trouble, baby. Um, the, the, you know, shit, my whole driving career when it came to just like, all right, once you get past that, that, that shit box phase and you're driving shit boxes and you're just hoping it starts, you know, so you can go to your one time job. Um, I would, I went to a Honda Civic and it, it ran a hundred or what it was a 300,000 miles or on, on, it was a 96 Honda Civic and I loved it. And then I got a, oh, shit, 2006 Honda Civic. And then I got a 2019 Honda Civic. And there was a time, there was just a few weeks ago where I was thinking to myself, I was like, man, there'd be just, it'd be nice to have a little bit of balls in my car. Like, I would just, I just want, you know, everyone's going to electric, which is amazing, by the way. I don't want to say it's not a good thing. Like, I love that people are going more with their gas mileage, but because, like I said earlier, someone's really excited about something, I'm going to be very negative about it. I'm going to go with the opposite. It's just me. I'm still working on me, guys. So if everyone goes, hey, man, I'm getting 36 miles to the gallon on my car. So what did I do? I went out and I bought a, pause for dramatic effect, I bought a V8 Dodge Challenger TA 2017.
    97:56
    yeah ta plus it's nice gas guzzling fucking nine miles or nine gallons or nine miles per gallon just a fucking beast i know i know my wife is like what the fuck are you doing i'm like i don't know is this the midlife crisis people talk about i don't know but you know what i got it today and i drove it around the block and drove it around to get a haircut and i drove it around to get my daughter and I drove it around all over and all I could do was smile it brought so much joy I have never all right a little background I have I was obsessed with the 1970 and my wife knows this that's why she's so cool with this but I was obsessed with the 1970 Dodge Challenger from Vanishing Point I loved that movie as a kid and grew up loving that movie and I always thought that was such a cool car um and I was always obsessed with Dodge Challengers and I always thought I would get an original 1970 Dodge Challenger and at the time I really was gung-ho about it. It was like, shoot. I mean, it was like $25,000 to get it. Now to get a Dodge Challenger from 1970, it's like $40,000 to $60,000. Probably $80,000 now. I knew that the Dodge Challenger was going to Dodge is discontinuing that car next year. So I was like, this is kind of my last fucking, fuck it, let's do it. Let's get crazy. So I got a car that screams and is mean. And I know Drew always likes to link me to Kaneda because he also has a Honda Civic, but he has, like, the fancy version. And then he also has, like, the Dodge Challenger, but it's the fancy version. And then Drew thinks I'm like a mini Canada in a way. But, you know, whatever. Fuck you, Drew. You drive nothing. Who's Canada? Yeah, yeah. Canada? Well, yeah. Well, congrats. And, damn, Mistress Anne was telling me over the weekend that she wants a challenger. So as soon as she hears you say that, yeah. Oh, no. Oh, yeah. You're going to like Amy way more than me at the MGZ show. I can't wait. Yeah. Like everybody, well, maybe because she drank like eight of those. White Claws? Yeah, she drank like eight White Claws and 12 Jell-O shots. And I had like one White Claw, so everybody kind of liked her more. But you're going to like her more than me. But, yeah, she wants to challenge her bad. So I'll tell you something about me, Tim. I have a superpower, and it's getting people to drink. Tim, you're going to like, you're going to come to Milwaukee, and you'll be like, oh, what a nice city. and then you're going to meet me, right? And then you're going to wake up in Pittsburgh.
    100:56
    You know, what happened? Didn't MGC happen? And you were like, and Mr. Santa's like, oh, you met Ian. Oh, yeah. He's trouble. And that's why Rachel's smiling right now. But, yeah, that's my goal. But, no, the Challengers, see, when they came out with the Challenger, like, there were so many cool cars at that era, and it was, like, So Dodge just threw something out there, and I don't know what it is about that body style, but the 2008, when they came out with the Dodge Challenger, it didn't look right to me. And then as the years went on, it got closer and closer to that classic look. And I know that most companies are going to go electric, So I thought this is my last chance to get a gas guzzling, fricking no 40 year old, no person should literally own this vehicle. Cause it makes no financial sense. I was like, I'm on it. I'm doing it. So it's like stupid. It's like, it's like, it's so easy. They like, they literally drop it off at your doorstep and they're like, here you go, bro. Just sign here. And you're like,
    102:11
    wait a second, hold on. Time out. Seriously? And they go, yeah, dude, we're going to take your Honda Civic. You're going to take this. And everyone's happy. I'm like, no.
    102:26
    Beware of Carvana. It's terrible. It's like Amazon, but cars. What color is it? Oh, you'll like it, Rachel. I don't know why I said that, but I'm assuming you'd like it. Because we're very similar, I think, in our own ways. Yeah, I think so. Most Dodge Challengers are very, like, brightly colored. They're, like, orange or green or purple, and that's kind of classic. I'm kind of, like, old school in a way where I'm, like, I love those bright colors, but I don't know if I can do it. You know, like, I don't know if I'd love it every day, right? So I was – I saw this car and driver was – yeah, that's the name. but they had this review of a 2017 Dodge Challenger and it was like a dark it was like a it wasn't a battleship gray it was like kind of a warmer gray it had a little bit of gold to it it was like a grayish gold a warm gray with a lot of the satin black racing stripes and all that stuff and it was like this really like the way they had it filmed I'm telling you Rachel it looked like the DB5 of Austin Powers, what the hell, James Bond, like Thunderball or, you know, Goldfinger. It just gave that really that classic vibe. And it just so happened on Carvana it came up. And I was like, I have to get it. And my wife didn't know at the time. I was like, I'm going to get this, motherfucker. It's happening because it just looked very, yeah, it looked like an Aston Martin kind of color scheme. I don't know why. Because the Aston Martin is silver. But this had this dark grayish goldish hue with these black accents. So it's very, I'd say, classic. Do you feel like James Bond when you drive it? No, I felt like a badass when I drove it.
    104:25
    I'm telling you what, Tim Lee, my balls grew twice the size today, bro. Nice. Hey. I'm ready to impregnate my wife. I'm sorry. You can edit that out. I think my load will be doubled.
    104:40
    Oh my god. My load is V8. I have a friend who has a Dodge Challenger, and there's only two other people that he's let drive it. His dad, to an oil change, as well as his girlfriend. But for my birthday a couple years ago, we've done this a couple years in a row, where he'll give me the keys and we'll go out for lunch, so I get to take it for a spin. And I like that rumble between the thighs. Not gonna lie. myself as well girl myself as well it's amazing anyone wants to drive my car at MGC no fuck you but if I love you yes absolutely Rachel you want to take us to lunch let's do it but uh I'm bringing it to MGC but I am uh ooh it just clicks some buttons for me today I've been on uh F-chan 5 Drew's 90s own business, by the way. Yeah, yeah. Hey, that was late-breaking. He texted that to me. I'm actually a little worried you're going to get me too drunk, and I'm going to wake up in bed with Drew and be like, what did we do?
    105:45
    I mean, it's not that bad. Yeah, I'll be like, damn it, Ian. He does have these little footsies on. You won't notice. You'll have earplugs in. You'll be fine. All right. I don't know where to go from there. All right. Should we just end it? Should we end it? It's been a long – this is a long episode, guys. Yeah. I'm a talker. I didn't know if you knew that. No, I didn't know that. No. I've never heard you talk before. I thought for sure you guys should have just started me in the beginning, and we could have just – this could have been an entire episode, by the way. Not that I didn't enjoy all of your personal pinball news, because it was really interesting. And Rachel, good job, man. I was applauding for you in spirit with that. God bless you, man. I knew you. I knew you were a player. When you knew all the rules from when I first met, I was like, damn, this girl knows what she's talking about. I felt like an aunt next to you. But you're a pinball goddess to me. But, yeah, so it doesn't surprise me at all that they would be impressed with your skills. Absolutely. Tim, you still suck at pinball, too. I need a pinball shirt where it's like Drew and Tim suck at pinball. Because that's what we need, Rachel. I think that's what we need in our lives. All right. Well, is this last call? Is this what we call last call? Oh, I don't care. Last call. I don't care. I can talk for another three hours. No, I think we're good.
    107:20
    It's been a great show. Dude, it has been fantastic to talk to you. It's been too long. So amazing. I've got shit to say.
    107:32
    You're welcome on our show anytime. We love you. Yeah. Well, thank you so much. Thank you so much for bringing me on. I always love shooting the shit, having a cocktail, and talking good old-fashioned pinball and life, and just enjoying the hobby and bringing all that joy to everybody. It's super cool. and I'm still shocked that we have a fucking network. It's crazy to me. I'm sorry. I had no idea that your show was going to be better than ours.
    108:05
    It's not. But it's cool to watch you guys go every time. And Drew's trying. He's trying. But I will get on the air sooner than later. I just got to work it out with Drew. We got to figure it out. Give me a month or two, guys. We'll figure it out. It's a thing. But we love you all. Love you too. Love you all. Happy Christmas. And Drew sucks at pinball.
    108:53
    Thank you. Four Man's Tribe presents Six Shows of Genius Today we salute you Sloppy and podcast on the internet The Four Man's Pinball Podcast While other content creators are focused on the hard-hitting pinball news You're giving us what we really want Eboo Wars, Moon Pie Tasting Begging for cancer sponsorships and big weights Bruce Bakes is red already You've come a long way from puking in urinals And the skit-faced interviewing of Dan Lucent. Now, you show a live stream where your drunk tribe members shit all over your content.
    110:01
    Who's gonna clean this up? Why even analyze pinball when Ian hates them all? And Drew just wants to buy them all. Cause nothing beats a three-fountain-dollar laser war. Nobody wanna talk about pinball? Shut up, bitches. This is homeboy Ian. And he's gonna talk about clear coat while Drew plays with his devil. My daughter asked what the light here. Like a regular year. Lower in the galleries. What is the best thing about dating a homeless woman? Using drop her off anywhere.
    110:32
    80 plus episodes of this dick show won't fit in one segment. This extended cut brought to you by Moscow Mules, Skull Vodka, Screwball, and Poor Man's Whiskey. They put an expensive stick around the Kessler's. No pinball news this week? No worries. Ian and Drew will tell us all about their origin stories. a freaky felon threesome to make us all wonder why we're wasting our quantifiable heart-gives on this shit. The Cops Fuckin' Friday! Want to know what's inside the old butthole? You can't start a news session so Dr. John can tell us what's inside your anal canal. How did these guys ever get sponsored? Still not uncomfortable? Well how about some love letters from a snacky-talking robot? Drew can tell us all about PR porn. Or maybe we'll just get a couple perverse puppets to do the intro. Ian wins the kill for the ladies. It's last call, so raise your glass of screwball, my friend, and celebrate the fact that our other pod, Patrick, man, the poor man created a tribe.
    111:29
    Truth and Fault of America's Dairyland, by Stuart George and Sherry and Madeline.