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We Are Pinball #30 "Jamie Burchell second half!!"

We Are Pinball (WAP)·podcast_episode·1h 14m·analyzed·Apr 11, 2025
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.038

TL;DR

Jamie Burchill discusses solo podcast launch, upcoming JJP/Stern releases, and tariff impact on pinball pricing.

Summary

In We Are Pinball episode #30, hosts Don and Genghis continue a cross-podcast conversation with Jamie Burchill from the JBS show. Jamie discusses his recent departure from Wormhole Pinball to launch independent content focusing on pinball, rafting, and commentary. The conversation covers upcoming game releases (Harry Potter, King Kong), pricing pressures from tariffs affecting European and US markets, code quality issues with recent Stern releases, and the impact of import duties on pre-orders like Dutch Pinball's Alice's Adventures in Amsterdam.

Key Claims

  • Jamie owns only one pinball machine: World Cup Soccer, and lets friends borrow it

    high confidence · Jamie directly states this when asked about his first machine

  • David Thiel (David Deal) is working on audio for Harry Potter pinball

    medium confidence · Jamie heard this name 'thrown around' regarding Harry Potter audio package; not officially confirmed

  • Dutch Pinball's Alice's Adventures in Amsterdam has not shipped despite deposits placed; US tariffs add ~$2,500 import duty on top of $12,500 game

    high confidence · Don received news release from Dutch Pinball about shipping delays and tariff impacts; discussed as confirmed industry development

  • Harry Potter pinball will use timed/limited order window (possibly 90 days) rather than fixed unit numbers

    medium confidence · Don states 'This is all rumor. Nothing's confirmed' but speculates on JJP's strategy

  • Uncanny X-Men has a mechanical flaw where the breaking arm stops the ball mid-mode, causing player frustration

    high confidence · Multiple speakers describe this issue; mentioned as needing code fix

  • European buyers now face 25% VAT plus shipping plus potential tariffs on new pinball machines, totaling ~$18,500+ for $15k games

    high confidence · Jamie (Denmark-based) provides specific VAT and import cost breakdown

  • Stern price increases historically occur at $100 increments on Pro models, but recent jump from Godzilla onwards has been larger ($2,500+ jumps)

    medium confidence · Retro Ralph discusses historical pricing patterns; predicts larger increases coming due to tariffs

  • King Kong will remain in production for at least five years with potential black and white and SLE variants

    medium confidence · Retro Ralph speculates on long-term production strategy based on Stern's history

Notable Quotes

  • “There's only so many times you can kick Germany's ass”

    Jamie Burchill @ early — Humorous comment about owning only World Cup Soccer pinball and getting bored with it

  • “I'm going to be downloading a bunch of podcasts and just really – the Grand Canyon is like a spiritual place for me”

    Jamie Burchill @ mid-early — Personal context: Jamie is taking a 15-day Grand Canyon float trip and will be offline from pinball

  • “How is that company a business?”

    Retro Ralph (Ralph) @ mid — Critical comment about Blues Brothers Home Pin topper quality and the company's business model

  • “They spent $4 million on a license that they got to recruit money back”

    Jamie Burchill @ mid — Suggests JJP's investment in Harry Potter IP justifies aggressive pricing/marketing strategies

  • “If this game comes out for maybe $9,000, I think it will hurt the sales of the LE”

    Jamie Burchill @ mid — Prediction about Harry Potter arcade version impact on Limited Edition sales if priced sub-$10k

  • “Operators can't recoup their money on a $15,000 machine. They just can't.”

    Jamie Burchill @ mid — Industry pain point: location operators need sub-$10k games for viable ROI

  • “Welcome to the jungle baby us europeans have been doing that for years”

    Jamie Burchill @ mid — European perspective: tariffs/VAT making US prices seem suddenly high

  • “I'm 100% expecting [a Stern price increase]”

    Retro Ralph @ late — Confident prediction of imminent Pro/LE price increases from Stern due to tariff environment

  • “When this terror stuff comes out, I'm telling you, people are done over here buying new in-box games”

    Jamie Burchill — European market sentiment: tariffs killing demand for new machines; used market rising

Entities

Jamie BurchillpersonDonpersonGenghispersonRetro RalphpersonJack DangerpersonGeorge GomezpersonJersey Jack PinballcompanyStern Pinballcompany

Signals

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Location operators and broader market expressing concern about unsustainable pinball pricing; sub-$10k games now essential for operator viability; Stern Pro increases expected despite historic $100 increments

    high · Jamie: 'Operators can't recoup their money on a $15,000 machine. They just can't. And so a $10,000 machine, they could run some ROIs and say, yeah, hell, I could do this.' Retro Ralph predicting $800-900 Pro increases coming.

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Jack Danger's X-Men criticized for shallow, arcadey code with limited strategic variety (all players forced to New Orleans first) compared to D&D's forced randomness

    medium · Retro Ralph: 'the code was so similar... after a while, you end up always going to New Orleans first. Every game you play, you're playing it the same way... Dungeons and Dragons turns out on its head when you're forced to travel to a different town... every game does play differently.'

  • ?

    licensing_signal: JJP confirmed to have spent ~$4 million on Harry Potter licensing; suggests aggressive pricing/production strategy necessary to recoup IP investment

    medium · Jamie: 'I think they spent $4 million on a license that they got to recruit money back. So if that's the case, you better do whatever the hell you got to do to get that money back.'

  • $

    market_signal: European used pinball market expected to rise in value as tariff-burdened new game purchases collapse; demand destruction in Europe for new machines

    medium · Jamie: 'the used market will get a kick over here, and the used games will rise in value because we will stop buying used games... most people in this hobby we have a lot of games and we're like enough is enough.'

  • ?

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.224

0:00
oh and why the sounds of the 70s dad rock i can tell it's time for wop episode number 30 with special extra special guest directly from the jbs podcast jamie birchall myself retro jango hello gentlemen let's continue our conversation hello boys i'm uh so happy to be here this is Part two of our podcast, We Are Pinball and the JBS show.
0:31
I don't know what we're doing. Just two podcasts together. That's perfect, yeah. So the first part of this conversation has already occurred over at Jamie Burchill's JBS podcast. And now we're going to continue with the WAP. Hello, Genghis. How you doing, buddy? Yeah, this is the hello, guys. Oh, we got Robo Genghis there. Come back again. Robo. We're doing this first part. I love Robo Genghis so much, man. If this was going well, I don't even think this would be a WAP episode. Yeah, for sure. For sure. You know, you didn't robo-djeng us one time on mine. This is great.
1:04
Jamie, we are so happy to have you here. Welcome, buddy. You have just been WAPed also. It's beautiful. It's nice to have you here. So now everybody has heard part one at your channel. Now they're going to listen to part two, and we have some questions. Because here, when we have guests over, we always do the, who's your daddy? And what does he do? Part. So, Jamie, we have to ask you, how long time have you been into pinball machines? When did you start this madness? Yeah, I started in like 2018. I got really hooked on the Houston community, and it's just been going ever since. Yeah, I got hooked in 2018. Yeah, so are you originally from the Houston area? Did you move there? Are you a transplant? No, no, yeah, I'm a transplant. Oh, okay. I'm a New Yorker, and I moved to Florida when I was 16 years old. Okay, so you're quite the gumbo of different cultures here then. Yeah, I went to New York, Florida, and then Houston.
2:08
@ late

  • “Jack Danger, he is the reason that I started streaming in the first place. He is the godfather of pinball streams.”

    Don @ mid — Attribution of Jack Danger's influence on pinball streaming culture

    • Spooky Pinballcompany
    Dutch Pinballcompany
    Wormhole Pinballorganization
    Harry Potter pinballgame
    King Kong pinballgame
    Uncanny X-Mengame
    Foo Fightersgame
    Pirates of the Caribbeangame
    Guns N' Rosesgame
    Alice's Adventures in Amsterdamgame
    Evil Dead IIgame
    Cale Hernandezperson
    David Thielperson
    Elliot Eismanperson
    Ericperson
    Eureka Heightsorganization
    The JBS Showmedia

    community_signal: Jamie Burchill has departed Wormhole Pinball to launch independent podcast/content brand focusing on pinball, rafting, and hot takes

    high · Jamie directly states 'I'm really happy with what you two are doing... wish me luck in the future, man. I'm pumped. I'm really, really pumped, man. And to be out on my own and just to be Jamie from Jamie is pretty damn exciting.' Don notes Jamie was heavily involved in Wormhole tournaments and community presence.

  • ?

    personnel_signal: George Gomez maintains approval authority over all new Stern designer games; historical approval requirement of 3+ redesigns noted (John Wick example)

    high · Jamie: 'before any designer's game comes out, George has to do that stamp thing... George Gomez said [Elliot Eisman's John Wick] needs to redesign it three times before the game could be released.'

  • $

    market_signal: Tariff impacts causing 15-25% price increases internationally; Dutch Pinball adding $2,500 import duty to US orders; European market showing signs of demand collapse for new machines

    high · Don: 'people are going to have to go and pay that import duty... they're going to have to fork over a $2,500 check to get your game out of impound.' Jamie (Denmark): 'When this terror stuff comes out, I'm telling you, people are done over here buying new in-box games... the used market will get a kick over here.'

  • ?

    announcement: Harry Potter pinball from JJP officially confirmed; expected May release; using timed/limited order window model; sub-$10k arcade version planned

    high · Retro Ralph: 'So Harry Potter is confirmed. Let's talk about Harry Potter.' Discussion of 90-day timed release window and $10k arcade version as industry strategy to enable location operators.

  • ?

    product_strategy: Dutch Pinball's Alice's Adventures in Amsterdam has not shipped despite pre-orders placed; company delaying US shipments to prioritize other markets and let tariff situation resolve

    high · Don: 'We're into April. Still none have shipped. If they don't ship by the end of the year, you get your money back... Dutch Pinball is going to focus on shipping other markets first before the U.S. I think they're hoping that in a couple of weeks it will all reverse again.'

  • ?

    product_concern: Uncanny X-Men has persistent mechanical flaw where breaking arm stops ball during mode, causing player frustration and game redundancy in rules (always plays same path)

    high · Jamie: 'you hit the shot you'll qualify the mode then you go to shoot the shot where you should be starting that mode but then it breaks instead... I don't want to have to like line this up and hit it again you know like that's frustrating.' Retro Ralph: 'you figure out who's strapped, man. All of a sudden, you hit a shot, and you just get screwed.'

  • ?

    product_strategy: King Kong expected 5+ year production run with black and white and SLE variant editions planned; premium positioning between Jurassic Park and Jaws in Stern lineup

    medium · Retro Ralph: 'If it slots in between Jurassic Park and Jaws it's perfect. But realistically this is a game that will be in production for at least five years plus it will have a black and white edition at some point probably an SLE too.'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Market sentiment on Jack Danger's recent games declining (Foo Fighters and X-Men losing value quickly after launch) despite his strong reputation and streaming influence

    medium · Jamie: 'Foo Fighters... was pretty much popular right out of the gate... and then it's like, okay, well, what's next?... race to the bottom with the prices.' Retro Ralph: 'I don't get why that LE should cost only $9,000 after a month.'

    • What was the first football machine you bought, Jamie? First love. World Cup soccer. Do you still have it? Yeah, it's the only game I own.
    2:18
    Oh, okay, okay. I only own one game, and it's World Cup soccer, and I let my friends borrow it because I get sick of it. There's only so many times you can kick Germany's ass. All right, all right. So are you at the lookout for anything else or upcoming games? Are you at the lookout for Harry Potter?
    2:38
    My friends, you know, like get all the newest games at Eureka Heights, which is a bar really near us. So I really don't have to buy anything. I can just go drop a few quarters at Evil Dead two minutes from my house. So it just doesn't make sense for me to spend all that money. You know, I'm going to the Grand Canyon this year. Hell yeah. And I'm floating the Grand Canyon for 15 days in a couple of weeks.
    3:06
    And I'm going to be out of cell service. I'm going to be out of everything, out of pinball. So I got to, you guys need to put as many podcasts out as you can so I can download them and listen to them in the bottom of the Grand Canyon. Can you do that for me? Can we do a two-week live stream? You can just play constantly in the canyon there. I love it. Have you been there before? Now I'm intrigued. Yeah, this will be my third time to the Grand Canyon. Okay, perfect. I've stayed at Phantom Ranch. If anyone knows what Phantom Ranch is, it's a ranch at the bottom of the Grand Canyon. I've probably seen it because I've been to the rim several times. Both rims. I've been to both rims. My wife did a Rim to Rim from the North Rim, which is North Kaibab, which you know, and then all the way down to the South Rim up in Bright Angel Creek. This is not a pinball podcast, ladies and gentlemen. We're talking Grand Canyon. Yeah, no. And I've done an eight-day river float. It's not a float. I mean, these rapids are a real deal. But now I'm going to do an entire 15-day. Now, is it like a bougie glamping thing where, like, every day when you stop, like, there's someone there supplying you with food and barbecue and wine and cheese and stuff? Yeah, yeah. I can't go to the Grand Canyon without some charcut, man. I've got to have that charcut. No, it's a little bougie. It's not full bougie, but it's not full pinball machine bougie. Like, you're spending it, but I could probably buy a Stern Pro for what I'm paying for. Who was that guy that had a fishtails, like, sitting in the creek, and they were fly fishing next to it and they ran an extension cord out and were playing pinball in the water. I saw that. That was pretty funny. What a freaking legend. How – can you really be off pinball buttons for 15 days or will it tickle in your stomach? No, I'm seriously going to be downloading a bunch of podcasts and just really – the Grand Canyon, to go off subject, the Grand Canyon is like a spiritual place for me. And it is just I need to decompress for 15 days with all the crap that's going on in the world and just in my life. And just it couldn't come at a better time in June to be away for a long time. I'm pretty damn pumped up. The whole pinball industry is curious. They're like, what's going on? Because Jamie, Jamie is wormhole Jamie. You know, we all know him from Wormhole, right? Right. So, yeah, all of a sudden you write to us. You're not a part of that anymore. You just started your own show right now. But everybody's curious what's going on. And we're proud to have you here. No one's curious.
    5:53
    Everybody's curious what's going on with JB. Come on, JB. As I said earlier, it's a bomb. Get down. You have to share with us what happened. Because Wormhole, you were holding the twippies there and tournaments there. And I actually thought that you owned Wormhole, man. I think Jamie was a Wormhole, you know. No, you know. You put Wormhole on the map. I have a nonrefundable deposit on the hotel across the street for the Twippies for next year, man. And I'm nonrefundable. They didn't even book a date, Don, so don't worry about that. It's open-ended. And the Twippies are going to be fine. We're talking to the Twippie committee, looking at different locations.
    6:34
    The Twippies aren't going anywhere. We're going to continue the Twippies I mean they're going somewhere But we're going to continue what we started Which is rebranding the Twippies And I thought the Twippies were great Yeah the internet went out in the area But what the hell There's nothing I can do about that It doesn't matter if you're there live Which everybody should be Like I was thinking What happened Can we hear Nothing happened This is so stupid. We need a tea. Who slept with who? What happened? No one slept with anyone. It's pinball. We know what happened. Just tell us. We're friends here. No one's going to hear this. Just tell us. We are friends. I like you both very, very much. What I can tell you is I'm really happy with what you two are doing. It's fantastic. Congratulations, WAP. And just wish me luck in the future, man. I'm pumped. I'm really, really pumped, man. And to be out on my own and just to be Jamie from Jamie is pretty damn exciting. Yeah. And that's really what I wanted to do. Pinball content, rafting content, canyon views and hot takes. That's what we want. That's all we listen to. If you've never been to the canyon, though, ladies and gentlemen, it is pretty damn magical. There's something about that place. Like the first time you walk up to the rim and you're like, this looks like a painting. How is this real? I've never seen this much negative space in front of me before. Right? Yeah. We were staying at Phantom Ranch. It's a stupid canyon story. We're staying in Phantom Ranch, and we had to walk up Bright Angel Creek, which is eight miles up. And I was not in the best shape, so I was walking my butt up there, and I was struggling the last mile and a half. And a guy comes down with a one leg, and he's got crutches, and he's walking down Bright Angel Creek, Don, okay? and he goes you only have a mile to go and he hobbles one by me and i was like if i if this guy can come down surely my fat ass can get up so now he didn't he didn't whoever that guy was congratulations for walking he was like damien tell me about your problems he probably lost that leg on the way up is what happened i don't know what the hell happened to him but he was hobbling right past me and he was hauling ass and i was like well if this guy can do it i i got another mile left in me so absolutely man but jimmy it's also a perfect time to start a brand new podcast for you because we just got a bunch of game come just came out and you know a lot of new games are on the horizon the 15th the 17th and may we will get harry potter also so great time you have so much content you can do so i want to hear theme wise theme wise only not designer not nothing which games are you really interested in is it portal is it evil dead is it harry potter is it king kong you know it had to be blues brothers it had to be blues brothers home pin when i played that i said wow for five thousand dollars i could take a piece of garbage home with Yeah, and one of the most garbage toppers of all time. Animated, even. Did you see that? How is that company a business? I'm not sure I call it a company, really. But, yeah, I can't imagine. But isn't it like that company is interested in people like you two? That's true. They are the company. And who are they interested in? People that don't like pinball. Non-pinball buying people or something, I don't know. They've cornered that market. No weird pinball manufacturer is targeting people that hate pinball. So who's the real genius? That's true. That's a good move. We're going to market to people that only hate pinball. Big brain. Big brain energy.
    10:30
    Good move. Do you think they'll spin a lot of those games? I like Stern. I'm a fan. I definitely have enjoyed going up there and meeting everyone up there. I do love the way that they shoot. I mean, there's something pretty magical about a brand-new Stern. Yeah, yeah. Absolutely, man. And they have been in the business for so many years. And they have George Gomez in there. I mean, before any designer's game comes out, George has to do that stamp thing. And he has so much experience. You can just feel it on all of their games. What did George Gomez, he said, like, when they, when, what was the designer's name of John Wick? Elliot Eisman. Elliot Eisman, yeah. George Gomez said he needs to redesign it three times before the game could be released, right? Three white woods.
    11:27
    So, yeah, Stern games are just next level, and they have a lot of talent in there. And, yeah, they're flippers. Strength, everything is just next level. Their designers are awesome. Their new designer, Jack Danger, awesome. The only thing, Jack Danger, he came out with that Jurassic Park game. He came out with, what was the game? Foo Fighters. Foo Fighters, yeah. Foo Fighters came out. It was popular, and then it just lost everything, and it lost the support. It lost the value. I don't get it. I don't get why that LE should cost only $9,000 after a month. And then he came out with X-Men. Great design. I reviewed it. I like the game, but you have seen what's going on with X-Men also. but I'm rooting for this guy. I think he's one of the greatest designers, man. What do you guys think about his design, his games? Jack Danger's. I like his games. I'm a fan of Jack Danger. I've gotten to meet him a bunch of times. Can't be a nicer dude. He is the reason that I started streaming in the first place. He is the godfather of pinball streams. Without him, there's no people doing Twitch. There's no, you know, he's just been phenomenal. And, you know, I'm sure he could make a hell of a lot more money just continuing to do his Twitch streams than it would to have to deal with people hearing about his machines. He's very, very good. I think he's outstanding. Yeah, okay, so he took a little bit from Gold Wings. That's pretty awesome. And I think the community should give Jack a little slack because I think what he does is just awesome. So us three, we agree on his games are awesome. I enjoy them. Yeah, I like X-Men. I like Uncanny X-Men. It's a fun game. I put a lot of quarters into it, and I'm going to continue to dump a lot of quarters into it. I would like to see the final boss. I would like to see some more of that, but they'll get it. I mean, look at 007. That didn't do anything in the beginning. That was garbage. And then all of a sudden the code updates, and it made it money. Yeah, but why do you think this happens? I mean, why did his games lose this much interest all of a sudden and value all of a sudden? I think in terms of Foo Fighters, it was pretty much popular right out of the gate. It was a music pin, but it told a story, like an original one, too. It had a fun take. It had some humor in it. It had some good voice call-outs and things. And everybody got it. And then everybody played it 500 times. And then it's like, okay, well, what's next? I want to move this for something else. And then the whole market started doing that all at the same time. And then it was kind of a race to the bottom with the prices. And I think that's part of why that happened. It was almost like a victim of its initial success. X-Men, that shooter rattle, that problem that it had when it launched, and the fact that the code was so similar, and it played so similar to Foo Fighters, where it was shoot two white shots and then start a mode, pick which one you want to start with. And then after a while, you end up always going to New Orleans first. Every game you play, you're playing it the same way. so there wasn't like a randomness to encounter. Dungeons and Dragons turns out on its head when you're forced to travel to a different town full of different modes and things so every game does play differently and I think that's what we wanted to see with X-Men. We wanted to, when we rescued one of the X-Men from the past to use in the future, we wanted to make more of an obvious difference so it was a strategy like I played this guy. I would have liked to pick my X-Men and unlock other ones and level them up and equip them and do all that kind of stuff but It seems like the code is looked at just being more approachable and a little more shallow and arcadey than I would like, and maybe that's part of it. Do you think the competitive pinballers, right? I know both of you don't really play competition pinball, but they get a little chapped because you hit a good shot, it gets stuck up top there, it stops, and then the whole thing breaks, and then it drains down the middle. Do you think that pisses people off too? Because you get kind of – the problem with Uncanny X-Men is you get screwed by hitting a good shot, and that pisses people off. Oh, I do hate that. I mean, competition or not, I think everybody hates that, especially on location when people put in $3, plays a game, and they make a great shot, and it goes straight down the toilet. That's not a good idea. But I think it was Donnie that said that you have to put that – set that game up perfect. then it will work fine with that breaking arm yeah and you said it donnie i've been waiting for the code to fix this too because you'll hit the shot you'll qualify the mode then you go to shoot the shot where you should be starting that mode but then it breaks instead and then it's like but i made it i want to start the mode i don't want to have to like line this up and hit it again you know like like that's frustrating and i think that's one of the points towards why the pro is probably seen as more favored because it doesn't do that you know but as far as in tournaments It's everybody's playing the same game, so the same risk is there for everybody. Don't make that shot. Yeah, you figure out who's strapped, man. All of a sudden, you hit a shot, and you just get screwed. It pisses people off. Yeah, that happened to me with – So – Yeah, drained. Oh, my God. Go ahead.
    16:47
    Yeah. So Harry Potter is confirmed. Let's talk about Harry Potter. Are you guys into J.J.P. games, J.J.P. codes?
    16:58
    Have you played a lot of J.J.P.? yeah i played every jjp um okay i haven't put a ton of time in godfather i'm not gonna lie to you okay how about you know one of their best games is um pirates of the caribbean right yeah yeah so you start up you start a multi-ball from you know it has got five different multi-balls or four or five i don't remember now you start a multi-ball for the second movie and then while you're in that multiball if you make some shots you will start movie number four multiball and movie number one multiball and you have multiball on top of multiball this was the first thing i was thinking about when we got harry for harry potter confirmed aren't there like eight harry potter movies yeah i'll blow the fire multiball harry yeah how about the designer is the same If the coder is the same and they have got this eight multiple modes that just starts up and everything, do you think that that coder that I don't know the name of, do you think that he has been listening to the people's feedback? Because a lot of people are looking forward to Harry Potter. Same designer. Different. Yeah, Eric did Guns N' Roses. And I think the new code update on Guns N' Roses really helped that because that was multiball nutty.
    18:23
    So I think that's going to definitely, look, yes, you could have a Goblet of Fire multiball. You could have a Quidditch multiball. You could have a Sorting Hat multiball. I mean you could just do a thousand different things there I don know I listened to you guys a while ago and don was saying that you could should break it up into like two or three different pins you know maybe go all the way up to um yeah the third movie and and then go from there but i i have no idea how they're going to do it he says he has all the assets i mean he says uh don't buy anything we'll see what he's got i don't know you know i i can tell that that wasn't a planned launch or reveal that they had because they had nothing to follow it up with but i wish like in the last week or so they would have put together at least a little bit more from us or for us you know just just give me who's on uh you know music sound who's on uh design officially you think they'll get the what is who does the sound is it's not john williams is it uh for harry potter was it like for the for the film i'll have to check um but i heard i heard david deal's name thrown around and i hope that's the case i have heard david david deal is making the you know audio package for harry potter and if that's true then we're gonna win her yeah i mean absolutely thing that guy touches turns on to gold man i love what last game he made was fiction fiction right yeah and look look at the audio package of that game yeah yeah yeah it's crazy yeah but i i think it's clever that they They will first release it to May, so we will get all the Kong purchases out. Because no matter what, no matter who says don't buy anything, when Kong comes out, keep helping game. I think Jamie will buy it.
    20:15
    So when it comes to the sense of urgency, we've got these games launching on top of each other, and we're all in a frenzy like, what's my shot? Do I try to find a way to afford multiple pins? Which one should I start with? King Kong's going to be successful It's L1, he's never had a bad title If it slots in between Jurassic Park and Jaws It's perfect But realistically this is a game that will be in production For at least five years Plus it will have a black and white edition at some point Probably an SLE too If it's really successful So I guess the urgency with Kong Is if you want it absolutely soon Then you're going to have to shell out some money But this is a game you'll be able to get down the road later If you want to get a routed pro later on when the premiums are releasing, you could easily walk in and do that. With Harry Potter, there's an urgency only if you want that collector's edition with the cool topper it's going to have, because I guess you're going to have a limited time that that one's available. But, you know, this is a game. They're doing a time frame, right, Donnie? They're doing a. . . This is all rumor. Nothing's confirmed. But, yeah, rather than say we're going to do 1,000, they'll be like, I don't know, for the next 90 days, if it's the only window you can order one, and maybe they'll sell 1,700 or something. But, I mean, if they sell. . . Is that good? Jamie, do you think it's a good idea? Timed, limited? Well, I think they spent $4 million on a license that they got to recruit money back. So if that's the case, you better do whatever the hell you got to do to get that money back so that we can keep getting these great licenses. How about the arcade version? Because he said that not much would be removed from the play field, and the arcade version would be sub $10,000. Well, they have to do that. But, you know, I know my friend Cale Hernandez was telling them what they should be doing, and I'm glad they listened to my buddy because we need more JJPs out on location for people. Yes. And operators can't recoup their money on a $15,000 machine. They just can't. And so a $10,000 machine, they could run some ROIs and say, yeah, hell, I could do this. I mean, we have Guns N' Roses out on location. It doesn't matter if it's the LE or the, what was it called? They ran an arcade type, too, on Guns N' Roses. I think it was called Standard Edition. I think it cost like $5,700 or something. And that arcade version is as popular as the Limited Edition or the Collector's Edition. People don't care. It was sub $6,000. So if this game comes out for maybe $9,000, we don't know. It could be everything, right? If this game comes out with an identical play field for $9,000, I think it will hurt the sales of the LE. Probably. I think people, because you know how the world economy is. You know how the terrorists are hitting us. I see on the American pinball pages that you guys are writing, what a thirteen thousand dollar game we have to pay fifteen thousand now and i'm like welcome to the jungle baby us europeans have been doing that for years what's going on there's tariffs what's going on oh yeah i only listen to pinball podcasts there's something going on in the world jesus christ i mean the world is on fire jamie let me let me tell you what's going on in europe all talk to me goose all the european heads are sitting down right now and they're they're you calculating how high of a tariff they will hit back on the U.S. So it's a money war going on out there, and it's just so lame because who is winning? I looked this morning. I have lost so much money on my stocks again. I don't know if you guys are investing money, but it's just red numbers. The numbers are just like the numbers on American pinball numbers. Oh, my goodness.
    24:10
    That was savage, man. That was savage. Oh, Jesus. The rip, man. Yes, I was having conversations last night. Now, we just got a news release from Dutch Pinball. I saw this coming. Probably others did, too. But Alice's Adventures in Amsterdam, the $12,500 game that looks amazing and is kind of okay to play. You had to put a deposit down. We're into April. Still none have shipped. If they don't ship by the end of the year, you get your money back. $300 or so went to the U.S. And I win $10 if they don't ship by the end of the year from my friend Joe from the Degenerates. All right, get ready. Pick out what you're getting at TJ Maxx because you've got $10 coming to you in December. You're right, I do. Okay, so you've got your money deposit on here. With the tariff imposed by the United States now, people, if they take delivery of their game, they're going to have to go and pay that import duty. Like if they bought direct from Dutch, they're going to be the importer. So they're going to have to pay a $2,500 import duty on top of their $12,500 game now. And Dutch was like, listen, this is what's happening. So we're going to focus on shipping other markets first before the U.S. I think they're hoping that in a couple of weeks it will all reverse again because it seems how things have been happening. No one knows for sure which is contributing to the troubles in the market or whatever. But, you know, people are seeing this and they're saying, look, if Dutch Pinball is going to raise the price, then they violated my contract. I want my deposit back. And it's like Dutch Pinball doesn't have anything to do with it. They're still honoring their contract. This is your own import duty if you live in the U.S. that you're going to have to go and shell out as a ransom, you know. And people didn't seem to kind of understand, like, that aspect of it. Yeah, I feel sorry for my buddy, Clint, who bought one, like, day one. He was one of the first 50. And now he has the decision to make, do I pay this extra tariff, if you will? Do I pay this extra or do I just scrap it and just say it's sunk cost? Yeah, and even if you just paid in full and you're like, Dutch, when you're ready, just send me the game. It's already paid. We're good. They'll do that. But you're going to have to go down to the import someone and fork over a $2,500 check to get your game out of impound. Or if you ordered through Cointaker, Cointaker would have to front that money and then pass that on to the consumer. So, like, yeah, it just completely sucks. It's not good for anybody. And while this is a game that I wasn't excited enough in to go ahead and purchase one, like, it sucks for everybody that did that they have to deal with this now. Yeah, there's still 500 that did it, Don. Yeah. I mean, there's still 500 people that shilled it out, and now they're saying, hey, Euros, get it first. Yeah, that would chap me. Yeah.
    26:52
    Yeah, so, I mean. But it's not their fault, right? So, I'd be pissed, but, I mean, what am I going to do? go protest? Yes. What am I going to do? This is America and we hold our politicians to account. If they do one thing we don't like, we need to take it to them and influence them to straighten their act up. I'll go get a banner out and I'll just stand on the corner and say stop my tariffs for pinball. Us here in Europe, when we bought collector's edition for $15,000 MSRP, we fly it home $1,000 on top of that And then on top of that, we pay 25% VAT. So it costs like $18,500 for a CE game, right? What is VAT? VAT, that's just everything we buy. The great state of Denmark wants to have 25% of that money. It's kind of how they're set up in lieu of traditional income tax like we do in the U.S. They have a value-added tax. So the more you're purchasing from other countries, the more you're paying that penalty. But in exchange for that, that's what funds health care and education and roads and bikes and all this other stuff. These tariffs on Dutch pinball, when they come to the U.S., what's that money going to? You know, if they were saying, we're going to take this money and we're going to build children's hospitals, so, like, no kid will be without insurance, like, fine, I could get behind that. But we have no idea where in the shadow government this money is going to go to, you know. And so while it sucks to pay value-added tax, at least there's a tangible benefit that you're getting from that. With this, it's like, where is it? We're happy to pay VAT over here. We also pay 50% of our income each month. But we are the happiest country in the world every year almost. And we have clean roads and free school, free hospital. Everything is free here. But, of course, we pay the 50%, of course. But here in Denmark, we're happy about it. We do it with a smile. But this, when this terror stuff comes out, I'm telling you, people are done over here buying new in-box games. I mean, it's the worst time to release games right now. They're just done. And the cool part is we think that the used market will get a kick over here, and the used games will rise in value because we will stop buying used games. we have one guy we have one guy here who is a huge fan of the evil dead movies he ordered the evil dead from us with topper with the border cabinet everything and we were like how about the vet and he's like i don't care about the vet and he should just pay the deposit two thousand dollars for something he was like no i will just pay the full game get with that darn game right now spooky so he paid in full he doesn't care so we have people like that also he doesn't care that whatever tariff give it to me so i mean we have fans like that that's that's beautiful you know but most people in this hobby we have a lot of games and we're like enough is enough right just enough is enough man and you know stern there were some rumors about price increase a couple of months ago. I don't think that will happen now. I thought they would. I thought Stern... I'm 100% expecting it. I'm expecting it. Now? Me and Don... Yeah, I'm expecting it now. Wow. On top of everything. I think you probably see the most increase on the Pro because the LE does have such a margin already built into it that it can probably absorb a little bit. Maybe the LEs go $500, but the Pros go $800, $900.
    30:36
    Usually, when they do this, the pro only goes up $100. It has been like that for the last 10 years or something, $100, $100, until we got the Godzilla. Then it jumped from like $8,000, $9,000 to like $10,500. That was crazy. And the next game from $10,500 jumped up to $13,000. That was a rush, I think. But all that in between, the pro just jumped $100, $100. Because, as Jamie said, the pro is a location owner's game, right? We cannot – I mean, we have to hold it down under $7,000. So, Don, don't talk about pros getting up and – I'm just saying what's probably going to happen. I think it's going to happen too, and I think it's going to be more than $100. In today's climate, how could they – they need to make money. And they have every excuse that people would stomach too. Oh, my God. They have an entire PowerPoint presentation of why they're... I don't want this to happen. I want prizes to go the other direction, but this is me being realistic, Don, here. So you're telling me that spooky games will not be under $10,000 next time?
    31:50
    Come on. It has to be under $10,000. That's the magical number, man. Gosh. They want to keep it under. They're stubborn enough. They'll probably do it anyway just to spite everybody. Our games are still under $10,000. But if you want the butter, if you want the top, or if you want the ghost glass, those will all be upgrades, and that's how they'll probably try to bundle it together. I'll tell you what, though. There's not a company that's putting as much value in there other than maybe barrels, because they're bundling Invisiglass now and Shaker Motors. They've talked to me, and they're really focused on trying to put the value into the game. So for the collector, it's not like you have to get a game. Like when I buy a Stern Premium, I've got to put in the glass, the art blades, the expression lights, the cabinet lights, the shaker motor, the knocker. I've got to put all that stuff in there. And so if they can just deliver it from the factory like we're doing one trim level, here's everything you need. It's already powder coated. Just have a great game. Fine. Like I think that's kind of their angle there.
    32:46
    Nice. All right. Let's jump over and talk some pinball rumors if you're down for that. Oh, gosh, I love rumors. Let's go. Yeah, let's go. So let's start with Stern's upcoming cornerstone. Jamie, do you know what game it is? Yeah, we're hearing Pokemon, right? I think that thing will print money. You put that on location. You go collect your Pokemons or whatever the hell you do with Insider Connect, and I think that's going to print money. Perfect. And I have heard the designer of that game is Jack Danger. Jack Danger is what we're hearing. Yes, please. So that's just awesome. I think it's perfect for him. Yeah, and it will print money on location. I don't think what we've seen is. How about the next remastered game? Have you heard what that is? Yeah, so we're hearing what? Walking Dead.
    33:38
    Walking Dead was such a good show, wasn't it? Did you like Walking Dead? I love that show. I love it. You know when I stopped watching? Did you stop watching when Negan killed Glenn? That's when I went. Spoilers, you guys. That's like season four or something. Come on. I know. Ten, eleven seasons. Yeah, I stopped watching. Once he killed him, I went, that's it. That was, that was. It was too sad. And Negan was too evil. It made him too evil. That's like, you know, but if you put Negan on the pin and you upgrade the pin instead of just AMC on the side and you can do some more art. Absolutely. 100%. Because the game's layout is fun. It's unique. It's got a couple of bash toys. It's got some fun shots. It's got a crossbow. But, yeah, when I walk up to it, you look at the back glass and you look at the cabinet and you're like, well, this was the licensors that just stamped their name on it. It's like this is what you can use. And so I would like to see an interpretation. Like, you know, let's elevate Walking Dead to a modern release. Do you think they will put in, you know, instead of the first four, Do you think they will put in all 10, 11 seasons in there and code update it with new modes, new video, bigger screen? I think they will. I think they'll put a big screen in.
    35:02
    They would have to. Why would you make the change? Why would you buy the upgraded version? They did that with Metallica. They put new songs in there. They put new graphics in there. Yeah, they just released a new Metallica code update to 1.0 with a whole bunch of concert footage and everything in it. So my gut tells me Stern knows what they're doing, and they'll put in a lot more assets into the new Walking Dead. Now, do you buy the pro, or do you buy the – they won't do a pro, right? It'll just be the premium so that you'll be stuck with that damn bicycle girl that every time you hit her, she goes right down the middle. That'll piss you off. They need to make a pro this time. I was actually – I was so sad about they didn't make a pro on Metallica because I think the Metallica pro is a much faster shooting game. And I don't like that hammer in the middle of – I don't like it. But on Walking Dead, I really hope they do a pro because, as you guys are saying, updated artwork. Heck, yeah. We need it. We need all the seasons. Heck, yeah. Big screen. And also, it came out with this, its audio package was not good, but there is an alternative. I don't know if you guys have heard that. You can put in an alternative, and it's with Negan, and it's like, suck my balls, and all that, when you hit the pop-bombers. Have you heard that version? No. Oh, oh, oh, then you haven't experienced that game. You need that alternative package. It's amazing. It just flips the game over. I'm sure my wife would love that Negan edition It's good It's out there I don't like Negan I just told you Negan scared the hell out of me But he is just teasing you while you're gaming It's just like you know When Steve Ritchie is teasing you On the Black Knight game And this is with Negan This is with Negan Suck my balls That's great stuff But I hope they will make the pro But the pro is missing the best shot in the middle that Wall Walker is missing on the pro, if you remember.
    37:10
    Wait, like the big half-dead zombie guy is not in it? Yeah, yeah, he's not there on the pro. Yeah he is isn he No you don have that magnet You only have the magnet at the bar and at the backside He missing on the pro I have to take a look All right I think you going to get some e on this
    37:28
    I think I'm more excited about wearepinball69 at gmail.com and tell Genghis how wrong he is, ladies and gentlemen. I'm more excited for these remasters than the Cornerstones at this point because these remasters are like the definitive edition of that game, and the code is actually pretty complete. The code is amazing on that game. It's one of Lyman's best codes, man. Have you played it? Have you really played that game? Just locations. Yeah. No, I've really played it. I housed one for about six months during COVID, and I got really all the way through it. I mean, those drop targets to the left are vitally important. And, you know, once you start learning all that and learning the modes and getting the CDC and all these different things, I think what they're going to do with it is going to be really fun. And I wonder if you could change CDC because that's just like a season one thing. Maybe add some more modes besides just the prison.
    38:29
    Which version did you have? I had an LE. I was hosting for a little while. Nice. So you had that walk-up bombs. you could press on that button up top, bam. Yeah.
    38:41
    That's missing on the Pro also. Yeah. Yeah, that's missing. And the crossbow is awesome, man, when you make the shots. It's a real feel-good shot when you make the shots with the crossbow. Yeah, and then it goes right down the middle. Yeah, yeah. That's a possibility also. Once you hit a bicycle, girl. But it'll be fun, you know, and then you're hearing what? Ghostbusters is next, which, you know, if they could take out Ghostbusters 2 out of that and just make it Ghostbusters 1. We're hearing Tron. Oh, you are? I heard Tron bumped it. There's a new movie coming out. Oh, there is a new movie with NIN.
    39:19
    Nine Inch Nails is doing the music for that. So what if you added some Nine Inch Nails music? Maybe that would finally get me to like Tron.
    39:28
    Yeah, Tron doesn't do anything for me. I love the game, but it's kind of like, you know, I used to have a segment called Shitty Movie, Great Pinball Machine. Oh, God, it's like every one of them. Shout out to Shadow. It's like Tron, Johnny Mnemonic, you know, Congo. Shadow, Last Action Hero. Yeah. Last Action Hero. You can just keep going, right? That's a great movie. You can just keep, you're out of your mind. He likes Arnold. He's biased. He's an Arnold bias. Chill, chill. He'll pass, guys. He's a chill one last time.
    40:00
    Well, yeah, Tron, let's see what they do. I don't know. Is there a clamoring to remaster Tron? Seems to be, although I don't know if I've ever met any one of these people. Is Tron expensive in the U.S. right now? Tron LE, is it over $10K? Do you guys know that?
    40:19
    No idea. Do you know it, Donnie? I'm looking it up. He's going to go to Pinside right now. Because usually, usually people at Stern, they're like, which games are selling for like $15K? and let's just, they did it with Elvira. That was an expensive game. Guess what? There's two. What? There's two Tron LEs. One's at 15K, the other one's 17.5 or best offer. That's all you need. As soon as Stern sees that, they're like, yep, remake it, man. Tron LEs inbound.
    40:53
    Yeah, I understand. It's okay. So it's a great welcome. Come on, man, come on. Was there only a pro and an LE for Tron? It looks like there was only a pro and an LE. Yeah, I don't think there was a premium. Okay. And so the pros, who's got a pro for 11,000 firm? Who the hell is this guy?
    41:14
    Some people put those LE lights on the ramp. Oh, okay. So there's an 8,300, a 9,800, and 8,000. Okay, so for a pro game, yeah, these are going for high. There's only four of them on Pinside, 8,000, 9,800, 8,300, and this Joker at the end. So, okay, there you go. That's why I try. There you go. Yeah, yeah. Next, next one. But first, The Walking Dead. And I'm very excited for that. I'm also excited for Dune.
    41:41
    Look, I said on part one of this podcast, gentlemen, that I think it's going to probably be a banger.
    41:49
    And, you know, I know everybody that puts every nut and bolt in those machines. All right? Call me a shill. I don't care. They're good people. and I think they're going to come up with a phenomenal pin. I really do. And if the theme doesn't do anything for you, Labyrinth didn't do anything for me. It's not like I was like, oh, God. Give me that bulge. Look at that bulge on David Bowie. I can't wait to see this. But, I mean, it didn't matter to me. I loved it, and I like doing the modes on that. I like going through the bog of stench. It's fun. Yeah. And, you know, those guys aren't going to want to spend all this time in development just to come out with, like, an ABBA. you know, like just a lackluster one ramp, couple of drop target game. Like it's going to be some kind of magical world, probably sand themed. But, yeah, I'm excited. We're going to walk in there and we're going to be able to see this thing. They're not going to tell us beforehand. They're going to do a sheet poll and be like, here it is. This is coming out Friday.
    42:47
    What's the day on Friday, the 12th or the 11th? And then I'm going to see you on the 15th, Donnie. Yeah, yeah. I'll be heading out to Pentastic on Friday when this drops. And then, yeah, that Tuesday is – You're going to Pentastic too? Absolutely. Dang it. How does he do all this? So, okay, so I'm going – Nobody knows, ladies and gentlemen. How does a guy that works – that runs a Burger King do all this stuff? So here's what's happening. I'm going to Pentastic, and then I've got to flight down to Orlando for a day or two. And then I'll be going over to Barrels, and then up to Stern, out to Spooky. It's a whole thing that's happening. You are still married, right? technically yeah i asked him the same question because i met her and she's absolutely lovely i got to meet her at expo and next when i see her at expo this year i'm gonna go are you okay is everything all right at home okay this guy when he calls me he's like dude let's go to japan together let's go to australia together let's just fly there there's a show over there let's just do it he's just full of life and energy he is living the moment ladies and gentlemen And he is living the moment. Congratulations. We are pinball. I love you, Donnie. This is fantastic. I want to do a WAP day this summer in Copenhagen. We could all just go hang out, play some games, go to Tivoli. Sure. I'll just jump on a plane to Copenhagen. That's no big deal. Come on, guys. You know what they say. COPE is dope. So I think that's our slogan. That would be awesome. We have actually been talking about that. That could be nice. There you go.
    44:22
    Setting stuff up. WAP Expo 2027. Let's make it happen. Yeah. And people are like, because we have been writing on Patreon how and why with Jamie, because yesterday we said, you know, we will have Jamie on the show.
    44:36
    So let's explain it over here on part two also so everybody can be on par with what's going on. So Jamie was at a great show with Retro Ralph. And you all guys, you know about Retro Ralph, such a cool guy. and he mentioned us he said that he really enjoyed our podcast show and i was like we need this guy on our show also and as you have been hearing for the last 30 minutes he's just like us laid back happy positive with the great vibes so uh jamie this has been beautiful to have you here i hope you will visit us again oh listen guys i really do like your podcast i'm not just saying that i really enjoy it you guys crack me up in this world of uncertainty in this world of chaos and burning around us to stay pinball positive is fun because again people i don't think people want to listen to just negativity on and on and on about how crappy our our hobby is i don't want to listen to that i want to listen to how great our hobby is because it is great it's going to be trying There's some crazy crap going on here, and we've got three or four launches coming in the next few weeks, and let's just enjoy them, man. Yeah, we're excited about it. Okay, pinball costs a bit much maybe, but... Don't buy it. It costs a dollar to go play a pinball machine. That's the point. Maybe $1.50 somewhere else. At Eureka Heist, they charge $1.50. All hobbies cost money. It is what it is. And 99% of hobbies, when you buy something you like, you will lose money when you sell it. So why should pinball be any different? Because I think that there was a time where you could buy a machine, hold on to it, put 500 plays on it, 1,000 plays on it, and then dump it and not lose that much money. Those days are gone, right? Those days are over. Yeah. Okay? Those days are over. We had a good run. Enjoy it. We had a good run. You know what, though? Even, like, somebody picking up Godfather today, right, is not going to be out that much. You could do it now with the games that have come out over the last two years, you know? Going in new and box, you're going to lose that money. But there's so much that's out there right now. Go pick up a Foo Fighters. Go get a Venom LE for $7,000. It's a hell of a $7,000 game. There you go. So, yeah. There you go. It changes. I need to give a shout-out to Retro Ralph. He did something that just cracked me up. I need to give a shout-out to my buddy.
    47:15
    He's listening. So when we do these shows, we just got another Patreon supporter. I just saw it. Holy crap. Cool. Look at them printing money as we speak. All right, forget it. We're going new in box everything this year, man. Let's go. So, guys, when we do this, we share the video. Oh, RoboJingus, come back, buddy.
    47:41
    RoboJingus. The link on YouTube. Can you hear me? What's going on? Okay, now go. I'll edit that out.
    47:50
    Am I back? Okay, you're back, but you're killing Donnie because Donnie doesn't have an editor, okay? We talked about this on one. You guys need an editor. I need an editor, man. I'm going to put you up with Ryan Gregg, and he's going to start helping you guys out. Oh, yeah. That could be perfect. But, Donnie, you love Hulk Hogan. You love WWF, right? Wrestling. It's so cool. WrestleMania. So I shared the WAP show on Facebook. And Rachel Ralph, he puts up, do you remember back in 1991, the ultimate warrior. This guy had a blade on his arms and eagle on his face. We lost Donnie. Donnie, are you back? Yeah. He had everything. This Ultimate Warrior just pumped up And Just under my link Retro Ralph he takes this Meme of Ultimate Warrior Holding the What are those called around the ring Ring The rope Yeah the rope The ultimate warrior He's just shaking those ropes And Retro Ralph is writing This is me every time Wap drops a new episode So I was eating with the family. I was just laughing. I was like, what is it? I was like, I cannot explain it. Darn it, Ralph. I was like, yeah.
    49:14
    Guys, thank you so much for this. I really had fun with you guys. Thanks for doing this. Pinball bringing people together, boys. Jamie, where do people find you? Look at the friendship, man, through this hobby. Isn't it awesome? You know, where people find me, just simply virtual at Mac. I've continued the same RSS feed for the JBS show, so that's going to be very easy. And then just type in the JBS show on YouTube, and I'm going to load up a bunch of content there. And I'm just Jamie Virtual on Instagram and Facebook. Hit me up. Jamie Virtual, number one in our hearts, buddy. WAP, episode 30, man. We're killing it. Third of the way through 100. So many cool guests. So much more fun stuff to come. Email us at wearegmail at WAP.com.
    50:05
    I got to go to bed, man. Go to bed. The guy works five different jobs, ladies and gentlemen, so he can go to all these shows. I got to close the Burger King tonight. Help him out. He's got to close the Burger King, and then he's making dough tomorrow at Aunt Annie's. So all is good. Thanks, gents, so much. I had a great time. Anytime, buddy. Thank you, brother. Anytime, Jamie. You're always welcome, buddy. Absolutely. All right, boys. Was that any good?
    50:39
    I hit record again just in case Jamie wants to drop any bangers. Like, what the hell's going on with the freaking wormhole, man?
    50:46
    Nothing is going. I can't. Come on, dude. All right, all right, all right. I've only heard rumors and stuff. But, like, you're good, right? You're not, like, getting witness relocated protection or anything. You're not testifying against some agent. There wasn't a meth lab found in the bathroom or nothing?
    51:01
    No. I am in good shape. I'm fine. I'm just a technical recruiter that lives in Houston, Texas that loves pinball. He's going to climb down from mountains, man. He's in great shape. Drinks 10 cokes a day. No trouble. No problem. What's going to absorb here in the Houston area? Because Wormhole is going to not be a place, right? That nice little hole in the wall? I have no idea what they're going to do, what the owner wants to do with the joint. And I'm just going to go to different places and keep enjoying the Houston community. We still have a phenomenal community. Eureka is still going to be good, right? Eureka Brewing? Oh, hell yeah. I'll go to Eureka a lot. Yeah, that place is amazing. And it's fun. Yeah, it's fun. That's what I'm going to do. All right, so Houston's scene is on lock. It's good. We're going to find a location for Twippies. 2026 Twippies are going to be the shit. Or 2025, what year are we in? Wait, was it this year?
    51:54
    This is 2025. That'll be 26, yeah. All right, so we can look forward to that. Awesome, man. That's good. I'm glad. All right, gents. I actually have to work. All right, well, we're going to kick you out of here because we listened to you enough today. So you go do some work. That's enough, man. That's enough Jamie Birchall. You don't need it. That's too much Jamie Birchall. Perfect. We enjoyed it, man. We enjoyed it, brother. All right, boys. God bless you. All right, later. You too, brother. All right, see you. See you.
    52:20
    Hey, Genghis. What up, buddy? Call me real quick. Let's switch over to the other thing. Okay, okay. So you have the recording now so I can exit this? Yeah, meet me over on Messenger. Let's keep doing Patreon stuff. I'll do it in a second. Okay. All right. All right, boys. Later, guy.
    52:39
    Hi, this is Don. We're doing solo stuff here. How are you? How is your mom? How's your mom doing? We're loading. We're going to get Jenga's on here. One second. One second, Jamie. Where's Ching is? There he is.
    53:01
    All right, man. What's up? What up, Donnie? All right. Sweet. We're good. Okay. Look, we can just keep going on here then. I'm still recording.
    53:09
    Are you still recording? Yes, absolutely. 100%, dude. Oh, that's nice, man. Hey, this is the first time I met Jamie. What a nice guy, man. What a nice guy, right? Wow. What a nice guy. But the way he talks, he's positive. He has pinball in his heart. What a laid-back, nice, nice guy. That was awesome. But on that show, I mean, we cannot end the show before thanking our Patreon supporters. We got so many. Who's the new dude? I got this notification while we were recording. Who's the new person?
    53:41
    I mean, so yesterday when we recorded, we got Ray Woods, right? So we said, thank you. but it was a short show telling people that we will make a show today, the day after, with Jamie. Ray Woods, you got your WAP shirt coming out to you. He bought some Dungeons & Dragons mods, so those are coming out. Oh, nice, man. Welcome to the team, Ray. Absolutely. Oh! That's it. Oh!
    54:10
    Is that the new sound clip? That's the new sound clip, yeah. Let me hear it again. Oh! Let me hear it again. Oh!
    54:17
    That was at the end of the show when I said, you know, Transformers is coming, and you're just like, ooh. It sounds like a Japanese howl from the bamboo forests of the demons or something. Listen to that. Yeah, ooh, you don't want to go out in the woods tonight. Something's out there. Wild Jenga.
    54:35
    Donnie, we shared a lot of great stuff on our yesterday's patron episode. I think, I don't know, do you want to discuss all those rumors here or should it be patron exclusive? The Patreon team did listen to it. Before you answer that, we have to say congratulations to us because we got another supporter on Patreon.
    54:59
    Who's the new dude? Jay 2. What? I don't know this person. Jay 2 is the new dude, a pro level. His name is Jay 2. So welcome, Jay. Nice to have you on the team. Beautiful. And we got another supporter again today. and his name is Brandon Gravy. Oh, hell yeah. The Gravy Boat is what they call him. Gravy, oh, okay, he's a pro level supporter. Oh, okay, he doesn't get a nickname yet. If he ups his support to the next level, that Gravy, that reminds me of General Gravis from Star Wars.
    55:38
    So, Brandon, if you up your support, we will thank you on each show and call you the General Paul Gravis. Oh, I see. J2. Wow, dude. That's awesome. Yeah, J2. All right. Shout out to J2. You'll always be J1 in my heart.
    55:54
    Oh, nice, man. Shout out to J. Shout out to Brandon Shout out to Ray Isn it like every time we make a new show we have new supporters on Patreon I know And well yeah let just keep doing it Why wouldn there be man The word's getting out. We're having a good time. We do all kinds of – we do bonus content almost after every freaking show. And a lot of times the bonus show is longer than the regular one. So, like, Jamie had a good point. He asked us, you know, why don't you guys just go completely behind the paywall? and I think if we had 5,000 people listening every episode, we could do that. But we're still growing. We're in the growing phase here. We don't want to lock it down. We're new. We started this like six months ago or something. But the support, the support is just – I didn't think it would be like – Okay, Brandon. I welcome Brandon.
    56:44
    Welcome to the WAP team, buddy. Love to have you here. And Brandon, he answers, thank you. proud to support and be a part of the community you guys are the best i mean this is how the support goes it's just like this is therapeutic this is so positive this is so good and yeah we just had jamie on the show and jamie he actually he asks us a lot of interesting questions but one of them was like did you think that you will have this kind of support on patreon i didn't it's just It's magical, man. Those numbers, I mean, wow. And what are we doing right, Donnie? What should we do more of? Don't even question it. We're just going to be our authentic selves. We're not going to try to be people we aren't. We're having fun with some pinball. We're calling out the bullshit. We're calling out the hot shit. We're tapping asses and taking names. I don't know where I'm going with this. But remember, I've been up for 24 hours here again. I have fun playing pinball I have fun modding pinball I want to hook my homies up I'm going to the freaking Stern thing and I'm bringing people with me now to go in there as my plus ones this is secret information I got an email sitting in my hot email box from Jersey Jack about coming to see their new game I haven't read it yet so it may say fuck no we're not doing it but I'm trying every day to like can we set up an event how can I help more people come in this? Because if I'm going there, I'm bringing people with me. So that's what I'm looking for. Great ambassador for this hobby. I love it, man. People also like that this show is like two friends just talking about this beautiful hobby. And we have full transparency. I mean, last month I just showed you on my phone how much we did, how much because we're getting Patreon support. We're selling T-shirts. We're getting PayPal support. Here, read it. Here is the number this month. Can you see it? Holy shit. Is that in real money or is that in kroners? It's in dollars, man. You can see it. What does it say? That's four figures, man. That's like $1,400. Holy shit. We're going to get you a new mixer, my buddy. $1,410. And people like the transparency. We're just saying as it is. And for 2025, our goal on WAP show here with Patreon support is actually to get more money than Don's Pinball Podcast main show. All right. And guys, guys, listen to this part. I just checked it while Donnie was talking. So right now on Patreon, we're getting 500 bucks, right? So beautiful. Thank you, guys. I mean, for a brand new show, I cannot read it. Yeah, 500. That's so cool, Donnie. But I can see on Don's show he's getting $550. So, yeah, Donnie, Donnie, Donnie, Donnie, Donnie. It's only one premium supporter on this show. It's only one premium supporter.
    59:58
    Fucking Robo Genghis is breaking a circuit right here. Dude, I got to start shilling hard on the Don's Pinball Podcast so I can get some more people over there. But I'm spending all my fun time here. We need one more premium supporter here. All right. Who's going to be the one?
    60:15
    Should I give a T-shirt to the next premium supporter that puts us over the top? Do you think it will be a premium supporter, or do you think it will be a pro supporter that will upgrade to premium? Well, with all the fire that we're kicking here, it could be either way, to be honest. Yeah, man. Wow. We have to say thank you to Jeremy Ford, the Mustang.
    60:36
    What a cool guy. Jeremy, thank you for the continuous support, buddy. We love you so much to have you here. Also, Enzo Ferrari! Woo-hoo!
    60:52
    People are going to get so sick of that new noise. Oh, man, I love you some, Enzo. Thank you for the premium level support, Enzo. We got an App Arcade update right now. Jersey Jack Pinball tells dealers to start taking deposits for Harry Potter.
    61:07
    Heck, yeah. All right, it's coming, dude. it's coming yeah yeah but it's it's coming in may not not not april no that's now is that the reveal they should just reveal it now say fuck it you know what yeah everybody knows just fuck it just come before june before kong that that that would be the greatest thing to do but just just now right now anthony marua antonio banderas premium supporter Golden Snitch Shooter Rod Look at that Beautiful, beautiful man I was going to talk about this We got Arcade Edition, we got Limited Edition We got Collector's Edition On Harry Potter, right? So I think the way to go is get that Arcade Edition or Get the Collector's Edition I think the Limited Edition is going to be the one that Gets shit on the most, right? Because if you're paying more for the game, get the fucking game that's got everything. The cool topper, the excellent back glass, the lights, whatever, the fucking golden stitch shooter rod, all that shit. Why do you want to pay more than the arcade? Because you're not getting any more gameplay on it. You're just going to get art blades and powder coat, and you can go powder coat and put art blades on the arcade edition and get a limited edition. So I think, based on nothing at all, that if you don't get the arcade edition, or if you don't get the collectors and go for it, then just get the arcade one and say, forget the LE. Go turn an arcade into an LE. If there's nothing different on the frickin' play field. Boom. That's a hot take.
    62:42
    Will they hold the prices? That's another thing. It's a thought, yeah. Will the arcade be under $10,000 and then the LE like $14,000 and the CE like $18,000? Oh, fuck, dude. Do you think they will hold the prices? If that CE is not $15,000, I'm not buying it. I don't care. No, I'm not doing like a... Ah, you're buying it. I'm not buying an $18,000. We have to think about what we get for our money, plus with that, plus with tariff, right? And if the rumors are true with the arcade version being for, like, I hope 9K, and having the same play field as the collector's edition, then I'm all in for the arcade, man. I don't care about the power code. We can fix that. Topper, we cannot fix that. But maybe Don can make a Don's custom topper. I'm getting better with the toppers every iteration. Oh, I love your Don's Customs. Unless the Collectors is still $15,000 and looks completely amazing, I would get an arcade and make it look like the Collectors. Dude, I have heard about the Collectors Edition. I mean, it's going to be a looker, like crazy, next-level looking game. So, yeah, it's going to be so beautiful.
    63:57
    There's going to be decals on the Arcade Edition. It's not going to have the radcals, I bet. I mean, isn't that okay? Yeah, but it's nice to have. But, again, if you won't care about that stuff. $5,000. You have it in between two games. You don't see those sides. You're talking sense. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just saying I don't want to do that.
    64:21
    But right now with what's going on with pinball prices going down, with tariffs and everything, with stock market crashing, then $5,000 is $5,000 Tony. If I get the same playfield I mean, yeah, right? Same playfield, same screen, yeah. Yeah, same side screen, same animation. If you're going to earn money on this game, absolutely get the arcade one. Of course, and put mirror blades in it so it'll be pretty durable and there you go. You're good. Yeah, oh my location the locations in the malls that has cinemas next to it. Oh, it's going to be Harry Potter everywhere. And the music is in there. And it's David Hill that broke. They need to reveal this game like now. And then start shipping them in May. That's what they should do. It's probably on the line right now. Yeah. I got to read this email from Ken, dude. I can't wait. What the fuck? Talk amongst yourselves. Read it loud. No, dude. I don't want to piss him off. This is supposed to be like hush hush. If this was a Patreon episode, I just emailed him to kind of follow up like, hey, by the way, I'm going to be in Chicago. Can I stop by? And he said he's checking on it and he'll let me know.
    65:37
    Oh, okay. That's literally all it said. So, okay, good, cool. I got the message out there. I'm trying for everybody. The info I have is it will come out in May, which is clever. Don't release it next to Kong, right? Don't release it next to him. Listen, Kong is coming out on the 17th is the media day. They'll probably reveal a little bit before then. But essentially, May is just two more weeks. So I think that's fine.
    66:05
    Yeah. But two weeks in this hobby is at the release. I mean, most of the sales is happening at the release day or the day after because it has got this hype. It has got this FOMO. Unless it's a title I don't want to mention right now. But big titles, they do sell out at the beginning. I've already bought Kong so it's so great I love it man it's an Elwynn why not buy it come on of course it's Elwynn I'm going to unbox it no matter what it's Elwynn man in Elwynn we trust right absolutely Donnie I have ruined it for you because on all the shows people are like Donnie all the time and we just had Jamie on and I said Jamie it's a bomb get out of there i hope when he's at a show somebody will stop jamie i like jamie it's a bomb how funny is that dude i hope it's the same shit will happen to him now oh my god i'm fucking exhausted jesus flipping shit um yeah tariffs holy shit what a what a year 2025 is turning out to be oh my god i mean europe will hit back with double tariffs right now so what's gonna happen donnie i don't know if we won't be able to send no games to you know in two weeks the tariffs might be gone trump will come out and he'll say the tariffs were a complete success and they were so great they're now gone and then that's probably what's going to happen he'll claim victory they'll be gone we're back to where we were our heads are still spinning. I'll tell you what, though. So whatever. I'm so done with the tariffs. I don't know what's going to happen. None of us do. And, you know, people are getting upset.
    67:55
    Spooky Pinball, I heard, their last couple games that distributors sold actually were above MSRP. So distributors that had their last one, I think they were charging like $1,000 extra for them.
    68:12
    Don't share this, because if Spooky hears this and says, okay, let's remove all this Jengi's wish with all games under 10K. If they pump up to 11K, I will be devastated. Oh, Anthony Maru is writing to us, Donny. Josh Cox is writing to us. We need to thank Josh Cox also, man. Oh, gosh, Cox, man. Donny, 150 bucks support. We got to get him on here. He's got a mic now. And so we got to coordinate. I want to see some Josh Cox. I do, man. I mean, wow, man. He's a collector. Maybe we can get Hot Cox on the next show this week or something in a couple days.
    68:55
    So thank you, Josh. We love you, buddy. Or as you say, the real Velvet Steve. The real Velvet Steve, yeah. Yeah, yeah. C-level supporter. We also have Charles Angelsman, Charles Forrester. I want to play that when Transformers comes out and see if you're still as excited.
    69:25
    Oh, that Transformers you shared on Patreon, man. This is open show. No, this is Patreon. Is this Patreon? This is Patreon.
    69:36
    Is it? I thought this was open. No, no, no. We're just doing bullshit for Patreon, man. Okay, okay, let's do that, man. Why not? You were thanking Patreon people, and I was like, okay, I'll push the button. I don't care. I love Josh Thomas.
    69:51
    Yeah. Who do you think that will design Transformers? Do you think it will be Josh Gomez again? No. No, only if a project is in trouble will he do one again, I think. We know what happened. Bond was in trouble. and I think was it that one guy was designing it and they're like, we're starting over. We're starting over. He did Deadpool, though. How did he get on Deadpool? Was that another one where there was a problem? Deadpool was that fuckhead that went to jail. Oh, okay. Maybe that's what it was then. Then what happened with 007? Was he just like... 007 was a great guy and his name is Steve Ritchie. Okay, all right. Yeah, so he actually had a design, But when George Gomez took over, he was like, nope, I will start from scratch. But I'm still thinking, how was that designed, Danny? It was probably Elton John. Can you imagine?
    70:47
    The piano was like, was James Bond on the table with a laser or something? Shake and not start. But, yeah, I still hope that it will be George Gomez that makes the Transformers. I don't know if I have a George Gomez game that I really love. wait uh wait wait wait monster bash that's george gomez yeah monster bash is good but like monster bash is great but like deadpool is like i appreciate it but like i don't want to own it you know jim's bond do you like deadpool jim's bond not really i mean i play it on location i get that the code's fun but like i don't really want to have one i don't find any of the shots really good for me you know okay another one johnny mnemonic okay i don't i don't have enough time on a Johnny Mnemonic. I played one recently. Corvette? That's a weird game. Alright, alright. But like, yeah, I'm not drawn to it though. You know, I'll play it. This one, this one, this one. I'm not sure, but Batman 60 sucks. Oh, fuck hell, dude. Oh, you know what? My first game was a George Gomez. Dark Knight. He did Dark Knight. Right? Batman, Dark Knight. Yeah, yeah. So my first game was a George Gomez game, but I can't say that like i have a gomez game that's like one of my favorites i think yeah for whatever reason our wavelengths are just slightly out of skew um but like elwyn's how about this one how about this one richie's my homie all right well go ahead how about this one lord of the rings okay so lord of the rings feels so much like batman dark knight to me because like that upper play field works the same way where like it's the path of souls on the left it's the fucking something can get the Something that turns, the bell rock turns also. And then you hit that big ramp, and it just goes over to the teeter-totter over on the left side. Lord of the Rings is definitely better. It's probably my favorite one from him. I can't really fault it.
    72:42
    Yeah. I mean, I don't see it as the greatest game of all time, like some people do, but I do like the theme, and it does have a cool layout. So it's probably my favorite Gomez, then. We'll go with that. Thank you, Genghis. Okay, okay. Just a little history here. Yeah, if you talk about old games, old shit, then I'm there, man.
    72:59
    I love everything. Oh, hey, did you hear? I got this message from Arnold Schwarzenegger I want to play for you. My brother Sengez, I need you to do my voices. I don't trust the pinball brother to do my movies. I would rather fight the Team 1000 than end up like Abba. Come on. We ain't got time to bleed. Tugman Broar. Oh, Tugman Broar. Yeah, dude. Hell yeah. I mean, I don't have time to bleed.
    73:29
    Abba. Like Abba. That April Fool thing that, you know, it's living its own life. People are like, Genghis for Arnold call-outs. You know this guy, right? You know the pinball orphan. Talk some sense into him. What's his deal? Does he have a whole team, or is it just this one guy? What's going on?
    73:51
    Who's designing his stuff? Genghis froze again. I guess I'll just talk to myself. Thank you Patreon members for being so awesome And accommodating And being like the raddest people in the world If Genghis comes back We'll talk to him Otherwise I'm so damn exhausted I gotta get this uploaded He says you have a bad connection Okay you're back I can hear you again Genghis And we're bad connecting again I think we should wrap it up I'm losing my signal here And I'm about to fall asleep Alright we lost Genghis Okay, Patreon people, you fuel me. You know that. Enjoy this content. I hope it's better than what my brain is interpreting it to be. Thanks for being members. Velvet Steve, Jeremy Ford, Enzo, all the rest. You guys are great. We'll get a Jenga scream and we'll be out.