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Pinball Junk Drawer Episode 79 - Gomez Interview, Gottlieb Golden Arrow and BEER!

Poor Man's Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·26m 7s·analyzed·Aug 14, 2025
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.025

TL;DR

Gomez interview analysis, Golden Arrow restoration updates, brewery recommendations

Summary

In episode 79 of Pinball Junk Drawer, hosts discuss George Gomez's recent interview on Loser Kid, Stern's use of Insider Connect data for code updates, and their ongoing restoration of a Gottlieb Golden Arrow (1977). The episode includes Craft Brew Sally's segment covering Tumbled Rock Brewery in Baraboo, Wisconsin.

Key Claims

  • George Gomez explained that Stern uses Insider Connect feedback to drive future code updates for machines shipped with early code versions (.7/.8)

    high confidence · Host references Gomez explaining why machines ship with incomplete code and how feedback loop works for improvements

  • The Golden Arrow is a 1977 Gottlieb wedgehead pinball machine acquired locally and in complete but dirty condition

    high confidence · Host provides detailed restoration narrative about the specific machine, its condition, and ongoing work

  • Gottlieb Golden Arrow manual rights are owned and sold for $32 for a 12-page PDF, not available free online

    high confidence · Host searched for manual online, found rights were purchased and exclusive seller charges $32

  • The Gottlieb EM Facebook group is responsive and helpful for restoration information and parts identification

    medium confidence · Host reports joining group and praising their quick answers and helpfulness

  • Tumbled Rock Brewery in Baraboo has approximately 12 different beers on tap including multiple stouts and IPAs

    medium confidence · Craft Brew Sally estimates 12 beers available; also mentions food items like bison meatloaf and wood-fired pizza

Notable Quotes

  • “we take information we get from Insider Connect and we get all this feedback. And that helps drive future updates to make the best machine you could”

    George Gomez (cited by host) @ ~8:30 — Explains Stern's rationale for shipping games with early code versions and commitment to post-release updates based on player data

  • “it was in storage for 100 years. It was very dirty, but complete... it's a time capsule except for the top part, which is so strange”

    Host (describing Golden Arrow) @ ~16:45 — Characterizes the restoration challenge and unique state of the machine

  • “my brain immediately goes to, let's make this perfect. Let's re-buy the stencils from Pinball Pimp and buy all this crap. I was like, why would I spend a $4,000 EM? It's a nice one. Clean it up. Get it running and just play the hell out of it”

    Host @ ~21:00 — Reflects on mod mentality and restraint in restoration approach

  • “That's what I kind of wanted... I think it's running into some stuff that's causing errors and causing issues, but that's to be expected”

    Host @ ~15:30 — Acknowledges working machine issues are part of EM restoration appeal

  • “if I could steal the PDF, I would just print it and it would be there. But literally, it's like the person that bought the rights owns the rights to those and sells them for $32 bucks”

    Host @ ~24:15 — Commentary on IP rights and pricing for vintage documentation

Entities

George GomezpersonFoghorn LeghornpersonCraft Brew SallypersonGary SternpersonGottlieb Golden ArrowgamePinball Junk DrawerorganizationInsider ConnectproductTumbled Rock Brewery and KitchenorganizationMarco Specialtiesorganization

Signals

  • ?

    community_signal: Gottlieb EM restoration community via Facebook group is responsive, helpful, and well-organized for troubleshooting

    high · Host praises group for quick answers and general coolness; describes joining and getting immediate help with restoration questions

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Mod-oriented collector mentality vs. preservation approach: tension between 'tasteful' modifications and maintaining original character of vintage machines

    medium · Host explicitly addresses internal struggle between upgrading Golden Arrow and keeping it clean/original; discusses speaker upgrades and cosmetic modifications

  • ?

    community_signal: Host had historical ambitions to create documentary about pinball industry during revival period; interviewed multiple industry figures but project never completed

    medium · Host describes 2011-2012 Korea trip that interrupted video interview project; explains how pinball's return to popularity made documentary motivation unclear

  • ?

    product_strategy: Stern uses Insider Connect feedback system to drive post-release code updates, with early .7/.8 versions intentionally shipped to gather data from players

    high · George Gomez interview cited explaining Insider Connect feedback driving future updates for machines shipped with incomplete code

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.078

0:00
Now who's responsible for this unwarranted attack on my person? I say, I say, I say, pay attention now, boy. This is, of course, Foghorn Leghorn presents the Pinball Junk Drawer. You all asked for it. I say, you all asked for it. Now you're gonna get it. Boy, oh boy, are you gonna get it. Go, I say, go away, boy, you bother me.
0:25
And we are back. It's the only pinball podcast for your ears and your butt. We have to hurry through this one before Craft Bruce Alley runs off and joins the circus at Baraboo, Wisconsin. My name is Foghorn Leghorn. With me, as always, Craft Bruce Alley. Are you going to be like a fire breather or maybe like a knife thrower? What are you thinking? Clown? Are you going to be a clown? No, I'm not going to be a clown.
0:49
There's already one of those in this family. A trapeze artist. I don't think you are going to do that. I think you lack the upper body strength and that's not a knock against you but you have to be really strong to do that maybe in your younger days always dashing my dreams that's what I'm here for, to ground everyone's expectations anyway, it's a pinball podcast it has nothing to do with carny folk or clowns although we talk about them often so you know the saga continues we just recently got a oh but I guess before we talk about the Golden Arrow project we are gearing up for expo you know yes and like okay we made sure we have enough of our shiny stickers but i was like i was i'm trying to like find something like to that i can get buy a pack of obviously shipped from china you know a box of 500 of something that's that has our branding on it that we can like give out and hand and leave on the the poor man's table I don't like it's it's so weird I like I tried to I almost went for like like one of these things this uh this kind of bottle metal bottle opener where it's like kind of classy and nice those are expensive I was like no I'm not doing that what about those plastic ones that they gave out at the stern wedding like the round yeah that's an option yeah um but there's like I was I started looking at those and I was like well there's so many of those it wouldn't stand out do you know what I mean like I have a ton of those dumb things you know it's just like you want to do something that's kind of cool and fun but this is a giveaway freebie thing just to kind of get the pinball junk drawer name out there I don't know what's good I mean there was like talk about being a stereotype for a while I was a marketing person it seems to be the way it goes I was in graphics then I my job got shipped to India so then I became a marketing manager and then I was like wow this sucks and now I'm back into graphics so for four years I was doing that kind of stuff promo stuff and you know I had a couple high profile clients that would every now and then have like a media event or have something like that like you know I remember I did for the FedEx purple celebration so I know like some of the stuff that they got but they're ordering like $20,000 or $50,000 so they're getting huge discounts you know so and I'm looking like well can I get $100 and they'll be like then it's $70 a piece I don't want that I don't think that's good I don't know what about buttons maybe I don't know like I'd like to do something cool if you have an idea send us an email pinballjd at gmail.com there you go and just put promo idea and realize that we're on the poor man's pinball network and realize that I haven't made hardly anything ever for anything we don't make any money at all on this so in the same breath I will say thank you for those people that are ordering our shirts and getting our stuff because it's cool this week someone in Racine bought a shirt thank you Racine And if you want a shiny sticker to go along with that, shoot us an email and we'll send you off a free of charge, big, shiny, awesome sticker. Or come by the tent in Expo and, you know, you'll be glad you did. Enough of that nonsense.
Pinball Resource
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Gottlieb EM Facebook grouporganization
Loser Kid Pinball Podcastorganization
Poor Man's Pinball Networkorganization
Pinball Expoevent
Spike 3product
Pinball Pimporganization
4:32
I listened to a really good Loser Kid interviewed George Gomez from Stern. And that was cool. He talked about the upcoming, they did a really good interview with him. And he talked a little bit about the Spike 3 that's coming up and all that kind of stuff. And it was funny. Afterwards, I was going to email him and kind of say, hey, that was a really awesome interview and all that kind of stuff. And then I looked and it was like, well, July 22nd, 2020, I wrote him basically the same thing that was in my head. And I said, I just listened to your interview on Super Awesome Pinball Show. and it was great hearing your perspective. So I was like, you know, if I just keep writing the same guy this same thing, I think it's going to lose its meaning. So I didn't write. It was so funny. I was like, I don't think I ever wrote George. And I started typing his name to write him because we're friends on Facebook. It pulled up the exact same thing. Like, I really liked your interview. I was like, you know what? Yeah, maybe I shouldn't. Maybe we'll just talk about it here and maybe he'll hear it. He will not hear it. Hey, you never know. George Goldsmith spends a lot of time listening to the podcast. Maybe he does. Who knows? You never know. Yeah, he's a cool guy. I always, I do very much enjoy, because I just, this is hot off the heels of listening to a, Gary Stern did an interview for Replay.
5:56
And Gary Stern is, for as wacky and wild as he is, he's also very guarded and intelligent. Like, these guys know the game, you know. No.
6:06
He knows the. if you ask him and I think every time we hear him in an interview or at one of the expos what's your favorite machine it's always the one that's on the line we were young and dumb and we asked him that one time oh that's what he says every time but it was neat when you hear these guys talk and you realize oh there is intelligent discussion and logic in this world Because they very open and honest about some things Where they're kind of just saying, look, we use this information and we want it to be. Because one of the hot topics is like, oh, why don't they ship with better code?
6:51
Because games get sent out with whatever, .8 code or .7. And then they get to 1.0 is supposed to be done. Yeah. Which isn't always done done, but you know what I mean. Yeah. And George Gomez was kind of saying, hey, you know, we take information we get from Insider Connect and we get all this feedback. And that helps drive future updates to make the best machine you could. And I was like, well, yeah, that's obviously you'd want to do that. You have all that data out there. That's why you have Insider Connect. So you have data. Right. To use it for benefit, you know. And so you hear that kind of talking like, oh, wow, that was really interesting. It was fun, you know. And then I started thinking, we should do interviews. And I was like, no, I'm not doing any interviews. That never, I don't think that's going to work out well. I did a few. Yeah. There was some. If you listen to the earlier Pinball Junk Driller shows, there's Dirty Donnie. And who's that guy that got besmirched?
7:48
Oh, goodness. Billy Mitchell. Yeah, Billy Mitchell. And we did a Stern interview. all the wackiness that this abides I think that Dirty Donnie was one of my favorites that was a great interview we have a Tim, what's that guy's name from the Pinball Hall of Fame that was not such a great interview I don't think that's ever going to see the light of day it's a video one it was pretty interesting I got back from Korea I was in Korea from 2011 to 2012 and um no was it before we went before remember no we went before korea because i do remember this i had because pinball was kind of on the way out yeah and i was trying to do these video interviews with people in the industry to put together a documentary and then i went to korea from 2011 to 2012 and i was like i really missed pinball there was some when you go like to a foreign country and you don't you don't know a single person you're like really honestly on your own like you're alone, you really shake out what you miss. You know, I missed my garage and I missed pinball. You know, now, obviously, I'm not including you. Like, I mean, you miss your family and your friends. But I mean, like, the things you miss. Like, I didn't miss driving cars, which I thought I would. Of course, I missed the cats. Of course, I missed you. But, like, I couldn't find a pinball machine. And it drove me nuts. And I missed my vinyl records.
9:18
And I missed those. And you don't want to be too attached to things, but Pinball was one of the things where I was like, I really, really missed it. You know, I could play arcade games all over the place, you know, but it's just. So when I got back, I was kind of like reinvigorated to do this documentary, but then it like took off. So then like it became, it came back from the brink of extinction virtually, you know. And now it's like, and I was like, well, then I just didn't even follow up with any more interviews. Because you're like, well, now it's out there again. You know, so it kind of became me. So I have this very long winded, poorly shot. It was like behind the building. The first building. Up against a truck or something like that. I was like, where can we set up? He's like, I don't know. He's outside.
10:05
And it was, it was very, it was an odd interview. And I thought I was prepared and I was not. Yeah. Well, it doesn't matter. You never know. It may be one day it'll, it'll go somewhere with it, but I doubt it. I still have the signed thing, the release, so I can use it. That's important. Oh, yeah, yeah. Because he'll sue you. Yeah, I don't know about that. I don't know how litigious he is. I wouldn't do it in a bad light anyway. I try not to be a jerk to anybody. Even when people deserve it, I try not to be. So the big news, obviously, we did the, I think I talked about getting the golden arrow last week, right? Wasn't that, we talked about the new project that came in in-house? Let me check my notes. Let me move my cat first. Yes. The filing system is wherever the notes are, that's where the cat's butt is. Yes. So according to the cat butt notes, we did not talk about it. So I thought we did, but I'm trusting your note taking. Probably on radio shows. Like Shockey Bombago, one of our radio shows. So I ended up getting locally, I found a Golden Arrow, a Gottlieb Golden Arrow. Got it in-house. Settled on a decent price. I did send my price to Mr. Finley for the pinballprices.com, but he never wrote back. Very strange. So if you're listening, that is a real entry. So, you know, it was in decent shape, but obviously very, it was in storage for 100 years. It was very dirty, but complete. So I started tearing it down and started working on it. And I put an order in to Marco's for, you know, this thing had like tape and rubber bands, like actual rubber bands holding it together on the top. I'm like, what the hell? It was like, what the hell? I'm literally like, what? But when you lift it up, nobody did anything to this thing. It's a time capsule except for the top part, which is so strange. But whatever. So I've been working on it. It is a really nice project.
12:06
I got the top stripped down and polished the leg, did the whole soak the legs in vinegar one at a time and buff those out so the chrome came back out and doing the little stuff like it's in a really nice shape but it's you know now I have it to the point where I can play it except I'm missing one of the tents I ordered from the pinball resource and first I was hoping they could tell me what I needed and they didn't then I found a parts list so then I told them what I needed and they said okay and they said they shipped it and then when I'm putting it together I'm missing one of the main lane tents and I was like I swear I counted everything so I think I got it and lost it as dumb as that sounds so now I have to reorder a place that I have to write a check to and I'm like oh my god kill me but so now I'm going to put together like a couple other things and I going to you know like put it in another order at this resource place but and it great having this project because I do like it And it is a very solid cool old wedgehead pinball machine from 1977
13:11
And I think it's running into some stuff that's causing errors and causing issues, but that's to be expected. That's what I kind of wanted. Yeah. It did immediately, my brain is immediately like, oh, I could strip this and do a hard top, and I could get a whole new, you know, brand new back glass because there's slight chipping. And I'm like, this is the problem with my brain. Like, I think I can make this perfect. Why would I do that? Why would you bother? Like, make it a very solid, great playing game. Make sure everything works. Make sure it's nice and bright. Like, I put in the Comet bulbs that are kind of the same, a little bit brighter. They run LED, so they're nice and cool. They're cooler than the original iridescent bulbs, and they're more reliable. So as I'm doing this, I was like, my brain immediately goes to, let's make this perfect. Let's re-buy the stencils from Pinball Pimp and buy all this crap. I was like, why would I spend a $4,000 EM?
14:12
It's a nice one. Clean it up. Get it running and just play the hell out of it. And that's what I'm trying to keep myself honest. Like our $3,800, $1,800 Dr. Toot. Well, Dr. Dude's a bro. You got to bro the bro, bro. So, you know, I didn't mind doing that one. That was like a fun, cool project. Yeah, it was. This one, I'm trying to keep myself honest. And that's with every machine. You know, like you walk up to our new current machines, like our Godzilla or the Elvira. You can go nuts. You can buy a subwoofer and the new audio and switch out the speakers and switch out the things and make this and that. You can spend another $20,000 on every machine, and that's fine, but you don't have to.
14:58
I'm on the fence about, oh, I should really do that audio, switch out the speakers and put in nicer speakers. It's an easy upgrade. It isn't crazy money, but it's money.
15:09
And it'll sound so much better. I'm like, yeah, because my ears can really hear it. I don't know. I can hear it, but you're just playing a pinball machine. There's a point where you're like, well... How far is too far? Yeah, how far is too far? You know, I don't really mod a lot, but I do. I try to, I say tastefully mod, but there's no such... I don't think there is such a thing. You know, you're still gluing shit into a machine.
15:34
Some stuff makes sense, you know, to me. And that's the thing. Everyone has their own level of what makes sense. Probably to you, it's all insanity.
15:44
Like, you should just, like, open this up and just play it. And don't just clean it sometimes, maybe, you know. Well, this one that we got really needed it. Which one? It needed some TLC, the Golden Arrow. Oh, yeah, yeah. That one needs it, but I mean. This only just started. This is the cosmetic crap to make it playable and pretty. Well. I have to lift it up and do real, actual work. I'm going to switch the fuses out. I want to get a chime rebuild kit because it works, and it does work, and it's awesome hearing that old, I love the old sound of those old machines, the reels clicking and the chimes going. So a rebuild kit is literally just to make sure it keeps doing what it's supposed to. It's not like an upgrade. It's just there it is. The other thing I ran into with this, because it has an envelope full of all the different score cards in it, and it has the schematics. It doesn't have the manual. And I was like, damn it. So I started looking around online for a PDF of it, just so I can get the numbers. Well, guess, nope. Because the rights were bought, I'd have to buy a 12-page manual for $32. And I'm like, no. I don't think I'm doing that. Maybe that'll be a Christmas present.
17:01
I can't do it. I work at a place that prints things. If I could steal the PDF, I would just print it and it would be there. But literally, it's like the person that bought the rights owns the rights to those and sells them for $32. bucks I'm like man it's a small manual it's not even like a bit like 12 pages is what I was like that's that's the going rate but that's uh not for me I guess I'm like no that 32 bucks will go for some of the other parts I need not the not the manual right I even like kind of like was like hey does anybody have this and they're like no it's not online I was like okay that that That told me all I needed to know.
17:44
Yuck. But the pinball book is online that you can print. Well, I don't know. It's all who owns the copyrights, I guess, and how litigious they are. And that's, look, if somebody owns the rights, they own the rights. That's not, like, as dejected as I am because I would just print it out and use it, that's illegal. They own the rights, and that's the reality of it, you know. So you just go, okay, whatever. it's one of those things where you kind of go really from like that old well that's who would need it how many times have I opened up the book for Godzilla never it's still working you need the older stuff the group I joined I immediately joined the Facebook group for the Gottlieb EM stuff so they're a huge help that is a very great group they're very quick with answers they seem pretty cool I haven't run into any goofiness with it or anything like that it's really a great source of information I think I'll learn a lot and whether it makes it down the steps or not that remains to be seen we have a rule in this house that once it comes down the steps unless times get real tough it ain't going back up the steps so I think this one's going to hang out in our garage for a while after it's up and running and kind of almost complete maybe a couple of drunken weekends to see how much do you really like it, you know. Right. Because it might not make it down the steps, although it probably will.
19:15
I have a feeling it will. Yeah, you see. Because we don't have one down here, like one of the older ones. The EMs, yeah, I know, you know. It's like I do love those, and I can't get some. Like there's a couple that I would really love to get, but you just can't. Like Senate Grade 37 is one I would love to get but those are really sought after and expensive Like the other one I like Strange World Odd World Odd World I think I don know I love it so much I can't remember the name of it.
19:42
Whoops. All right. Do you have anything else for our wonderful, whatchamacallit, wonderful show here? I do not. You're going to run off and join the carnival? Oh, no, wait. You still owe us a segment, don't you? It's everyone's favorite segment from what I understand. Craft Brew Selling!
19:59
Gonna have to put your journal down Crepe brew Sally Child You've been to all the breweries around You've been running all over the town Tell me what to drink until I fall on the ground Yeah That's right, people.
20:29
And we're back. What do you got, Crafter Sally? So today we went to, well, I did with my parents because they're here visiting for two weeks. We went to the Devil's Lake State Park in Baraboo, which is...
20:50
Carny City. Circuit City. Circus. Circus Dulé City. What is it? it is the home of the circus world carnival from hbo no but after we walked around the lake for a while we went to tumbled rock brewery and kitchen oh before you get into it did you see the devil was he there i didn't see him i was looking he's probably out doing running errands maybe so so what tumble we tumbled rock tumbled rock brewery and kitchen why have i seen i've seen that logo before haven't yes okay it was they were at the uh craft brew at the automobile museum oh okay yeah yeah yeah because there's a bumper stickers there's a car museum that like up in green bay that like once a year has the craft brew and look at our awesome cars event yes and we usually do that and it's very fun but they were there so that's why and you i think they we got bumper stickers from them i do because that's we're out in my garage somewhere because as soon as you said i was like we've been there haven't we no no we haven't we haven't been there but we went today and um i was the driver so i only had one beer i didn't have a flight i was responsible um it's fun huh huh it's fun huh uh-huh but i did try my mom's she had the otters up cream ale which was pretty good that's the most wisconsin thing i've ever heard and then the one that i had was a quartzite crush which was an ipa nice we're good there are they good yeah i did try i sampled one because i was thinking about maybe bringing some home because I only got to have one, but I didn't care for it very much. It was another, it was like a double IPA, which some of the doubles you can. Get a wacky. Yeah. Just the, you can just taste the booze. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And they're not enjoyable. Yeah. So it's like that really strong alcohol flavor. But it was only, it said it was like 8.3, which isn't terrible, but. All the work without any of the benefit. Yeah. No good. Yeah. there's not much out in Baraboo. Yeah. Did they have a lot of different kinds of beer? Or was it kind of those places that had like four or five? No, they had, I want to say like 12. Okay. They had a bunch of stouts, which I'm not a huge stout drinker. Yeah. So, of course, I went for an IPA because that's my favorite kind.
23:38
And. Good stuff? Yeah, I thought it was good. I would have liked to try more of them, but... Now, was there others in the area, or was it just that one place? Because sometimes there's a whole, like, craft route district kind of thing going on, where there's like three or four where you can kind of... I honestly don't know. This was all by itself on the way up the S-turns. Oh, okay. To the... Yeah. It was like you had to drive past it to get to the state park, so... Gotcha. We just stopped there for lunch on the way back. Their food was really good, though. Yeah. My dad had like a bison meatloaf. Huh. Yeah. I don't think I would order that. Not that I'm against it, but I don't. I'd be like, eh. It was good. I tried it. He's like, hmm, I wasn't sure if I would. You want to try it? Why not? Sure. And then my mom had crab cakes.
24:34
What did you have? And I had a pear gorgonzola prosciutto pizza. Wow, there's so many words in that sentence. I don't know. Like a fire pizza. Fire. Wood fire pizza.
24:53
But everything was really tasty. Cool. Mm-hmm. So if you ever drive to Devil's Lake. Devil's Lake or the Clown College out there. stop and get a booze and some pear prosciutto bison pizza pan pizza slices. Right? Sure.
25:16
Tumbled Rock Brewery and Kitchen. And Bisonry. They're like right before all the S-turns. Tumbled Rocks, S-turns and Bisonry Brewery. Yes. For your butt.
25:30
Alright, got anything else before we sign off? No. I'm going to go sharpen up my throwing knives for that wheel. We're going to put you on one of those spinning wheels. No, no. I'd rather chew the trapeze.
25:43
Oh, man. Oh, man, indeed. Well, this has been the Pinball Junk Jore Big Show 79. We'll see you next time for Show 80, God willing. We out? We're out. See you next time, everyone.
25:57
That's it, man. Game over, man. Game over.