On today's episode, Jamie interviews one half of the dynamic duo from the Loser Kids Pinball Podcast. Everybody put your hands together and welcome in my friend, Josh Rupp on the JBS Show. Hello and welcome to another edition of the JBS Show and I'm excited. Josh Rube, Loser Kid Pinball Hanging out with me tonight, thank you so much sir For sure Pleasure for you to invite me on And come hang out with you man We have a good friend in common, Glenn Glenn Waechter Who does My intro music And my announcing now Yep Yeah he's kind of a secret weapon in the pinball industry And I wish like He would be utilized more But like he does so much for the podcast It's ridiculous Like that dude, if he ever starts charging, man, we're in trouble. We're in deep trouble. We're in deep trouble. He's, he's fantastic. Great dude. I talked to him almost once a week and just bullshit with him and we have a good time. You know, he's a good dude. He is. I talked to him probably weekly as well. Oh yeah. Good. Yeah. We both have something else in common. We both hosted the Twippies. Yes, that's true. We have, I totally forgot about doing that in 2023. and then like i got a reminder because for some odd reason like so we switched from soundcloud was our hosting thing and we switched to zencaster because that's what we were using anyway so it was like why why would you not so we switched to zencaster well it finally like renewed this year and it took all of our old episodes and re-uploaded them to youtube like all 180 some odd episodes and one of them that popped up was twippies because uh we had foo fighters music in it and YouTube's like, whoa, you can't be using this because it's copyright infringement. I was like, we went through this like a year ago. What is going on? And so come to find out, yeah. I totally forgot about doing that. Yeah. So they just added to it. Did you watch it? I skimmed it. I'm not going to lie. It was really good, but the problem is it came out on Valentine's Day, and I didn't really watch it that day. and then i kept forgetting and then during the work week like people kept asking me like what was the results for the twippies i'm like i don't know so i finally what i do is i while i work i put a youtube episode on so when i say skimmed it's more like i have it on the background while i'm fixing a furnace or a water heater whatever it is so yeah i watched they did a fantastic job bash like yeah above and beyond of like the quality yeah it was just fantastic they're both audio engineers and they're amazing so yeah you know you can see that they're good at what they do we did a little review on the round table on the twippies and then i got myself in trouble again so you guys don't get in trouble at loser kid we do um it's just not very public okay we get in trouble the pinball round table with me and kale and retro rough we get in a lot of trouble and uh we have it for a bit and i'm assuming because um i'm not i'm not gonna hash all that oh no you're not trouble with um but uh yeah i get you though i i there it's weird um especially when you say something that you don't mean offensively or whatnot right call or you get the message and you're like like i think i think i talk about this opening now because the game released and everything like that when teenage mutant turtles was being rumored that was a dream theme for me and i was so excited i had loser kid at the time and it would have been 2019 2020 somewhere around there and it's when jeff patterson was still running this week in pinball and uh he was doing a news article but like on top of that if you paid for his extra stuff he was giving little juicy secrets behind the scenes and i got mixed up that one of the secrets he'd given was not public yet i thought it was part of his new les news letter and uh the rumor was that zombie yeti was doing artwork and which made me ecstatic because i love zombie yeti so we announced it on the podcast and not even 24 hours later i get a call and it is why did you guys do that what's i'm like dude honest mistake i didn't realize that was not public knowledge i'm like i can go redact that real quick it's not a big deal i guess he had received a call from someone at stern yeah that was like yeah you need to redact that you need to do it now you know and well you seem to be uh you seem to mend those fences pretty well since you have such a good relationship with stern right now yeah that's true well patterson still doesn't talk to me so i don't know i actually called him last week it was and i know it's his phone number because i left a message and say hey jeff this is jeff patterson dude's probably busy he probably doesn't have He doesn't have any time for pinball left, you know? Yeah, that's too bad. But all the other beefs I've ever had, they've all been squashed. We're good. Okay, that's good. They're all misunderstandings. They really, really are. Okay. You know, Gail and Ralph and I are good dudes, and we're not trying to cause really any problems. We're just three idiots having a podcast. So, anyway, Glenn told me something about you. He says you're a big guitar player. Yes. And you've got a ton of guitars. How many do you have? 10 i want to say do you have a favorite one uh the one i just picked up from daniel clark from sathara guitars he made me a loser kid guitar so uh it's got it's got earth shaker play filled as the body it's got the actual logo uh and the fretboard at the 12th fret uh it plays smooth it's exactly what i've wanted it's i don't know it's just it's a great it's got the dual humbuckers with a top humbucker you can split the coil so you get like that single action like you would like it's a Fender Strat or a Tele. Yeah, it just sounds so good. I love it. So I got into acoustic playing during COVID. That was my thing. Nice. Trying to loop a couple of LBs and play the guitar. And I'm stuck on GC and D songs. That's it, dude. You know? I grew up with, like, I wanted to be – I don't know if your fans like some 41 or blink 22 or yeah, they have a lot of that, like finger picking it's it's single notes played in succession really fast. And so I liked a lot of that. So that's what I learned it. Learning the actual chords didn't come to much later. Cause I was just more like three chords in the truth. Like I learned the power chords and called it good. And so it's funny. Cause even like when I have to, like, I have to really think about it. Glenn was playing guitar with me at expo and he's like, give me an E and like, give me a second. Okay. Yes. you know what i'm saying but yeah if you give me single notes and stuff like that i i have a blast with those i was in a band for 10 years i actually was let's talk about it what kind of band was it it was a pop punk band of the 2000s persuasion so and you opened for some pretty good bands didn't you yeah um taking back sunday uh may the spill canvas uh terrible things I mean there was a handful of them that we just had a blast with yeah that's awesome dude well you see you're younger than me so I you know your music love is going to be different than mine right I don't know so my stepfather when he moved into the family he brought his record collection and his CDs and stuff so I grew up on ACDC I grew up on the 80s metal all that stuff I love the 90s and 2000s is my pocket but like i have an appreciation respect for the earlier stuff and even some of the older stuff or the newer stuff that's come along too so i can talk music with you i listen to about 35 to 40 minutes every night before i go to bed nice just on apple music just rocking something trying not to do too much metallica because i'm trying to go to bed but uh uh, uh, my algorithm is intact. It's really good. Speaking of algorithms, you're like a guru with the YouTube algorithm. All right. I don't know about that. I think that's pretty good. You and Ralph, those are the guys. Like, have you studied it? Are you a studier of the algorithm itself and, and views and that sort of thing? I just take the numbers that I see through loser kid. And I, I mess with stuff. Like I, I'm always trying something different with it and whatnot. And so I don't know if I'm a guru, but I think I found a groove. That's definitely – I know there is a lot of people that's like, I'm always seeing your content. I'm like, I don't know how because I'm just doing what I've – I don't know. We started on YouTube about two years ago, and so it's been like a learning curve. But what I do find interesting is there has been a ton of growth in YouTube for us versus even just like our normal podcast. Granted we do have plenty of followers Via our old school podcast But it's like Just last year we went from 700 on YouTube To 2500 It's incredible I've had a good YouTube run We're doing okay right Yeah For starting a brand new channel two years ago Because I had to start over you know But yeah you're killing it I love the reels Keep the shorts coming They're fun I'm trying to keep up and they're great I love them It's fun and it's been interesting So originally What I was doing was a short About every three days But now actually I'm doing a short Every single day of the week I wish I had the time I started a new gig and it's just I'm working my ass off It can be exhausting but my edit day Usually my edit day Used to be only about an hour or two At the most It's now doubled but then again I have content for the next two weeks So like we're running the Pokemon Stuff right now and that's still Booked out until the middle of next week I think If I remember correctly Can we talk about Pokemon a little bit You get So you do have a phenomenal relationship with Storm because you get to Get it all you're the get You get all the interviews Of all the The new game right How did that come about? When did that start? So originally, back when we started in 2019, we reached out to Elwin. It was after we did our Eric Meniere interview for, I think we just interviewed him. It wasn't for a game or anything like that. Elwin and I had Iron Maiden out. Rumors of Jurassic Park were floating. I think it was within a month or so they were going to reveal it. So he came on, and we just, he teased the heck out of it. We talked about Data East, Jurassic Park a ton, and it was hilarious because it was like, yeah, I've played Jurassic Park. I'm like, really? And he's like, yeah, Data East from, you know, and then like a month later they released Jurassic Park. It was just hilarious. But we really grew a trust with Zach Sharp and with Keith Owen. And then we just started having having those guys on as because their people love. I think, I mean, it's not the biggest view getter, but people definitely do want to see behind the scenes, and they want to see kind of how the sausage is made. Yeah. And we've just kind of done that. I look forward to every release podcast by the Loser Kit. I think that's the staple, isn't it? I mean, if you're a pinball podcasting listener, you're going to listen to this, because you really guys do a really good job. I think you guys have a good ham and egg, if you will. Yeah. You know, interview style. So we try. We definitely – it's been grown and fostered over years. There's kind of a rhythm to it. Yeah. The biggest secret to interviews is if anyone wants to do interviews, the biggest secret is answer the question, get out of the way. Yeah, I suck at that. Okay. But I think people, you know, they listen because they kind of like me. But, you know, as a recruiter, I know I need to get the hell out of the way, right? But as a personality, I just can't. Josh, I can't. Try. It's funny, though. Like, so we did an interview. I'm not going to say who it is, but they were they were looking for work in the industry. I'll put it that way. And they knew of us and we we loved this person. Like, so we did an interview with them and it was funny because, like, I felt like we failed them because that the the YouTube did terribly. And podcast numbers were were pretty average. but it was funny because like the dude got like two or three jobs out of it and someone contacted us personally to get his number so they could get work for him and so it was like well it was successful so i think that's the thing too is like people have found value in what we offer for loser kid um and i think that's also why like we've been the reveal day podcast now like this whole last year i think we revealed every single game except for star wars and that was kind of like a weird thought sorry you're right that whole that whole star wars thing was weird anyway right the nda and then accidental leagues and yeah it was kind of goofy we had everything lined up ready to go um well i can tell you what it was um sadly uh i i don't know it i don't bring this person up because of their political figure i bring it up for the fact that it happened right at star wars is Charlie Kirk was shot. Yeah. And there was a lot of turmoil, I think. So there were some people shook at Stern. And I don't know if it was because it was essentially a public execution or what it was, but it was one of those things where our interview got pushed back and then stuff started happening with the license and it just became this whole, like, two weeks later we recorded a Ford. But, yeah, it was a really weird time around that time. Yeah. So. So, but, but can I ask this question for you here? How, when you have such a great relationship with them, do you think it impacts your ability to be fair and balanced? Right. I think so. I think, I think one thing that we've proved, we're willing to ask the hard questions. And I think this is where people get confused too, because there's times where people are like, why are there such softball questions? I feel like it depends on the interview, right? Like if we have Seth Davis on, I'm going to ask him hard hitting questions. He's the president. He has to answer to everything, right? When we have Keith Elwin on and it's a release day for King Kong, I'm not going to ask him why like the BOM is a certain way. You know what I'm saying? Like there's this like weird like, well, you didn't ask why, you know, it's weird. It's almost like people want us to be like, why is Stern screwing us over with these releases? And it's like I'm not asking him that. He's excited about his project he released. I just feel really awkward being like you know even like how do I put it like some of the releases that don't really hit when they reveal and I'm not going to point at any specific one but I'm not going to be like telling that designer when we're doing the reveal podcast like you know this reveal sucks why did you even why did you even do it this way you know what I'm saying yeah so that was a brick fest you know I mean how do you you're interviewing and And your job as well is to inform the public of what you're bringing us behind the scenes. And that's what I really like, right? I like This Week in Baseball when I was a kid. I'm a big baseball fan. And I can't help myself. So I love This Week in Baseball. I love behind baseball crap. And so you do a good job of that. But it is hard. I have really good friends at Multimorphic now and really good friends at Barrels of Fun. I don't want to say anything bad about them. Good people. Well, that's why with Gomez, I think we have him on once a year where it's not really related to release. That's where I'm going to ask the hard-hitting questions. That's where I'm going to ask, why is Stern doing this a certain way? We've even asked Seth Davis, because there's been that whole thing of Disney's taken over and Disney actually controls Stern now. And Disney demands certain licenses a year. And I think we asked that question pretty much like, does Disney control what releases you receive? I can't remember exactly how the question was. It's been a year and a half now. And he answered. And he's like, no, we have a relationship with Disney because of the licenses that we do release. But they do not negate what we do. They do not say, hey, you can or cannot do this outside of their license, right? So, like I said, I think it went on release day. I just don't think it's the same with like we've had Multimorphicon. we helped him release portal last year yeah i'm not gonna be on there being like like when we had jerry on two weeks before that sure i'm asking the hard-hitting questions obviously the dave fix interview is pretty infamous that we did yeah like and i didn't know this till later but i guess he actually learned during that interview he took a call during that interview and that's when he learned that he got laid off and like everyone else and so it was kind of like he came back somber and I didn't notice someone pointed out later on. But I still asked Dave the hard-hitting questions and someone had put like, dang, he keeps receipts. And it's like, I'm willing to ask those questions because I think personally me, any manufacturer out there should be willing to answer those questions and they should have those answers on their mind already because you're trying to grow your company, right? You see your hurdles and it's not good to shy away from that. It doesn't build trust with the community, right? So a lot of these people bring on the hard questions because we want to answer them so the community has faith in us to keep supporting us as we move forward. It's a tough gig. Yeah. Tough gig, man. You know, you've built a great little podcast that could. Thank you. By being genuine. So that's what it's about, brother. So congrats on that. But how the hell do you keep these secrets? How do you do that? um i just don't think the problem is it's like it's funny so i did i did an episode way on early on loser kid and one of my favorite guys was martin uh martin robbins with head to head right he ended up going to that now defunct company called haggis yeah um but he asked me a question that time like do you feel like you know more secrets now that you own a podcast than before you had the podcast and now today i can confidence 100 say yes yeah and i think the reason i'm able to keep them is because it's it's paid off in the long run like i've gained very much a lot of trust from stern uh i don't know if we've said this publicly but it's still one of my favorite stories i do tell behind the scenes um we did an interview with Steve Ritchie right before he got fired from or whatever was fired or let go from stern it you know the story varies you know um but And we were talking to him, and out of the middle of nowhere, Steve Ritchie's like, come here, come here. And he brings over this guy, and Jack Danger leans into frame, and he's like, hey, Internet. And I'm like, hey, Jack, how you doing? So we did this little banter for like two, three minutes, and Steve's like, this is my guy. He's awesome. He's a great designer and da-da-da-da-da. So he walks off frame. and the next morning this was before he was revealed as a designer this was before jurassic park home edition was revealed like no one knew and i didn't think twice about it because jack had already done like a lot of streaming with stern with spooky like it was not weird for him to be in in the building at stern right so the next morning i also my phone starts blowing up i'm getting messages from designers down at stern coders zach sharps messaging me and they're all like so zach sharp says anything danger related needs to go it cut it out and i'm like okay okay not a big deal and then like the other messages like what did you guys talk about in the podcast like what happened well it didn't dawn on me till that moment jack must actually officially work there now and we need this months before this was ever revealed and so like we cut it out and then we just kept quiet about we didn't sign an nda or anything like that but it was one of those things where it's like it's not our place to say and if they're not willing like ready to say it and so i remember them revealing and then it was at expo that they had jp there and i was there and i went over to jack i'm like you know how hard it was to not say anything he's like yeah he's like thanks buddy for not saying anything. Cause like it's their livelihood, right? Like it's not my place to like reveal their secrets. And so I don't know. I think that's just, I think that was kind of the pivot moment for us. When Stern there were, there was early on Stern with, they had us submit every interview and like they have to review it and stuff like that And then it turned into this like we trust you don worry about it oh that nice yeah so i know there still people doing some stuff with stern where they still have to submit and stuff like that like keep going you guys it great like it's good you're doing that so we i'm rambling i'm rambling it's great it's absolutely great when uh we did a round table real early on and ralph got pinched for uh saying something you should have said that was the only time i had to take something out yep yeah i had to take it but you you can't just take something out of youtube that that feed is gone there goes that one so yeah that is the nice part about a traditional podcast you can replace the file so like you can totally replace the file yeah so it's not a big deal everything stays up there you're just essentially just so yeah it's totally gone but not with youtube so we have to take it out and edit it and this is ralph in his big mouth so which is great though okay here's the thing about ralph i love ralph and yeah he must truly love pinball and the reason i say that is from a man that came from arcade arcade gets a ton more views than pinball it makes no sense to me but like we had him at expo like interview us and interview like joel and jared from uh flipping out channel and he said I went from making money to like now I pay to be in pinball and you know he has and it's true he must truly love it because if he didn't he would not still be here you know what I'm saying and he's just infatuated with it yeah he is he's all in I think he's the guy that could bridge that gap between the retro arcade and pinball and he's the perfect one to do it. And, you know, he's just killing it. He's killing it on Facebook. Oh, yeah. Like, he's murdering it. And he's doing really phenomenal on YouTube. He's always done real well on YouTube. He's got like 78,000 subscribers, right? Yeah. But killing it on these reels on Facebook lately. Good for you, Ralph. Well, and I remember listening to one of your guys' episodes and him saying, I think there is an actual threshold where like pinball caps out at and it's just because it's pinball it's not like it's because like the algorithms against us or anything like that it's just there's such a learning curve to pinball right like i remember when i first got in i felt overwhelmed by learning attack from mars and meeple madness and now i look back at them like those are two of some of the easiest games to learn in pinball yeah it's just like if i felt overwhelmed then you know i'm saying and so there is a steep learning curve to being a pinball podcaster i can tell you that i started in 2020 so it is a steep learning curve knowing the differences between the machines knowing all the manufacturers we got to know all this stuff because i'll tell you what the minute you don't guess who's going to tell you everyone everyone yep that's what's so great about our hobby right they just let you know well and what's funny is like i just kind of ignore those comments like I either like give them a thumbs up and like move on or like, it amazes me like how many people on the internet think they know best for like Stern's marketing strategy or how I should be writing my content or, you know what I'm saying? Like it just, Oh yeah. And it's just like, cool. Like I'm lucky because I think people know I'm sensitive. So they leave me alone. I think they know Jamie's got anxiety. He's sensitive. We'll leave this dude alone for a little bit. So maybe I, and like I said, we get some, but it's, it's one out of 100, right? Yeah. Two out of 50, whatever it is. It's, it's very far and few in between. Yeah. And I also realized people have their own opinions. Like I'm not going to change your reality by starting a, starting a comment thread, you know, attacking you or whatever. So we get the comments and once in a while, but it doesn't bother me. You know, I'm just like, thanks for letting me know, or thanks for watching. you know i have to respond something i can't help myself i'm just a wise ass so i can't i just can't help myself josh there's we did that episode with triple drain back in december and i yeah i can't remember if someone said something about tom i can't even remember what they said and man tom went off on them by sorry to hear about your gonorrhea or something like that and the comment got deleted and like but tom like had screenshotted it and put it off Fox cities. I was like, you got to be careful with commenting. You don't mess with the silent assassin, Tom. You don't. That's the sweetest pie. Why would you say anything bad about Tom? He's like the nicest guy in the world. I agree. He helped me so much when I first started because I was streaming in the beginning more than a podcast, and he was just phenomenal. What a good dude. I didn't say anything bad about that guy. He's a dentist. you know i learned that people in pinball are really good and i i think when it hit me when i first got in i was very competitive like i really wanted to go to state champions and okay the problem is i don't live very close and so it's always a travel to go do that and i just never obtained that right but my very first big tournament we had bow and kerns there and i was like this guy isn't gonna want to help me and uh he came over he's like you look frustrated i was like i've never played starship troopers he's like oh it's easy do these two things and i can't remember what they were it was like shoot the left ramp so like multi balls ready and then start multiball there's something silly like that right i'm like okay and so i went did that and i blew up the game and i came back and i came where my score was like so how'd you do and i'm like well this is my score i'm going on the ball too he's like it's what that's like that's what it is and he's like you've never played this game before he's like no but it was that thing of like here's a top tier player that easily could destroy me on rules but it was that whole mentality of like if you're good i want to i want to go against you because like i don't want to win because you just don't know the game you know what i'm saying yeah do you still play competitively at all or is there's no places by you right it's no places by me and i just if i wanted to start up a group i could here in my town but i just between everything else i'm doing i don't have time to start up a tournament yeah i know but competitive pinball is really fun it really is I got addicted to trying to be Sub thousand That was my goal one year And I'm just not good enough I just don't have The reflexes that These kids have right And that other people have Like I'll just watch that ball just go right down the middle And just laugh at it Man what the hell is that I didn't even try And I was going to say I've talked to some really top competitive players and they said anyone could be top 1,000, it's just playing the right tournaments. Yeah. You don't have to finish in them. You just place like 10th or above. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, but that's not going to happen for James. I know my role, okay? I know my lane. You can do it. I'm 4,300 in the world. All right, now that's pretty good if you think. That is. Okay. It's better than me. You know, whatever. But 4,300 in the world, and that's my plateau, I think. I think a plateau. I can't even remember the highest I've ever went But It is one of those things, there's a lot of dedication, right? Yeah I go to this place, Eureka Heights There's the hat, I go there And I I'm playing the games to have fun And I'm playing the games To learn what I need to do in a tournament Right? Tonight I went just to have fun And I spent an hour Before the podcast tonight Before we recorded And I was just like, I need to flip some pinball. And Iron Maiden's been great, but it's the only one I can fit in my house. I got a little bungalow in this hipster part of town in Houston, dude. So I don't have the collection that you guys can be rocking out there. So you could start a league in your garage, couldn't you? Oh, yeah, I could definitely. Well, my basement has. What was your basement? Ten machines. Somewhere around there. Nine, eight, nine, ten. Somewhere around there. So the obligatory, what was the first one? Amazing Spider-Man by Gottlieb from 1981. Okay, that's a rare one. Right. Yeah, I got it for $400. Put a new circuit board in it. Got Stan Lee to sign it. And then I sold it and got a Fishtails for it or something like that. There you go. And then it just starts, right? Yeah. It just... I got frustrated with it because it didn't have multiball. I remember that. So it's like a game that has multiball. So I started researching what game had multiball. I like soccer, so World Cup soccer, which still sits next to me to this day. It's just right off the screen here. You know, that's my first game that I ever bought. I did not. It's the only game I own. Dude, it's so good. It's such a good game. Dog soccer is the absolute best, dude. Yes. And the Houston community is really cool, and I will lend out games to people. and my former IT director of my podcast. He needed a machine, and I was like, I didn't have anywhere to house it, and I wanted a newer stern, and so he's housing it and keeping great care of it. Brandon, thank you so much. But it's about to come home because I miss it. It's such a good game. And it must be good because I've had it in my collection since. So I got Amazing Spider-Man for Labor Day, and then I got World Cup Soccer that January, January, February. And it came from an arcade that did not love it, and it was missing a soundboard, and it was – Always all messed up, I'm sure. I dropped about $1,000 of parts into it, but I got it for $600. So, yeah, I can't complain. I paid a heck of a lot more for mine, and it was just my first machine. I walked up to it at a place in the game preserve up north, and it was the first game I had in a tournament, my first tournament. And I went, yeah, okay, now we're talking. It's so good. That scoop is a pain in the ass, but I'll tell you, when you hit it, it's just, yeah, baby, let's go. So if you can learn how to backhand it, that's definitely the way to go. It's the way to go. Mine plays so perfectly. It is so dialed in by the techs and friends here that you can totally backhand that scoop perfectly. It's so great. And I like moving cities. I get addicted to moving cities. I like my tickets. I want to get to Germany, the grand prize Germany, not the end of the real Germany. Yep. where it's that awesome 20 ball, 30 ball, just keeps coming and keeps coming and coming. Oh, that's the best part. Oh, it really is. It is so good. The funny part is, like, so I got to sit down with Larry DeMar a couple years ago for Expo, and we did that interview, and I didn't realize that that – because that game's a Papaduke game. Yeah. But what's interesting is when I was talking to Larry, he's like, Papaduke's name is on it, but like he had to leave for like a family, like his father wasn't doing well or something. So it was like Larry DeMar and like the rest of the team there finished it for him. And I'm like, it's, it's a very unique game. Cause like the, the ramps are very Papa do ask, but like everything else doesn't feel like a John Papadiuk. It is a fresh, it's, it was his first one. Right. So maybe that's part of why it felt, feels different compared to the rest of his games. But I, I jokingly call it like the poor man's medieval madness because like it's half the price of a medieval madness but it still gives you that whole like yeah pass the goalie it instantly rewards you by yelling goal like you feel like king kong on steroids it's it's just it really when people come over and they come to my collection that's the first one i point them to and they go no we want to play godzilla or jaws because you know they know those franchises and then they get on world cup and like we don't want to leave this game it's amazing telling you my kids that's the one they miss and that's why it's coming back you know because i'm an empty Nestor now. I'm a little older than you, so I have a grandkid, and he will love the heck out of World Cup Soccer. So, since you're a little younger than me, what themes resonate with you the most? You already said Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Is there an ideal theme that has been made that just resonates with you big time? Hands down, would be Legend of Zelda. Yeah. I think if they made a Legend of Zelda game, I couldn't say no. And so, yeah. That's probably one thing that... I don't know. The problem is... With the music, oh, that'd be pretty good, right? Yes, yes. I think Legend of Zelda would be the one. So, I like obscure stuff, though. Scott Pilgrim vs. the World. Yeah. I've been told by multiple manufacturers that one's kind of out of the pocket now. It's kind of way from... I don't know. They just released the animated series, though, like last year on Netflix. but I still think it's one of those it's pretty niche it's probably one that like spooky or someone would have to pick up that they're only going to make like 800 it'd be worth their time so I don't know selfishly for me like I enjoy Pokemon but the thing is is like I want it to be successful for Nintendo to be like oh this is a thing we can keep going with let's start Mario yeah let's do Mario let's do Zelda I can't even say it right Because I say Mario Because I'm from Long Island Whatever I just can't help it But I sure as heck would love a Super Mario game That would be unbelievable Same here I wish Those old Mario games are fine by Gottlieb They're really not terrible But they're definitely focused towards kids They feel like pinball with the bumpers on The bowling bumpers on They're not bad I don't want the movie I don't want Chris Pratt's voice. I want the original Mario, you know, something pretty cool. But if they did the movie, I would probably have to be good enough, I guess. Well, it's funny, too, because, like, my kids are in that era right now, right? Like, I got twins that turn seven in May. My oldest is 15. We're way into video games. We play Mario Kart together. Like, I guess we're not – okay. Video games are a part of our life. They're not the focus of our life. Okay. Okay. okay but the problem is is like my kids love pokemon and so my the boy twin he's autistic and if you know anything about autism like when they focus on something they focus on it like for days weeks whatever on end for days now he's like so when's pokemon getting here i'm like i haven't even bought it and he's like okay so tomorrow no okay so next week it's like no they're not even making them yet and he's like okay and it that's seriously the conversation every morning when he gets ready for school it's like so when's it getting here i don't know because i have are you gonna get one i might yeah so what would you get the pro premium because you're not getting the le because yeah that's already gone yeah i passed on the on the le but i kind of wish i would have got it and like as people don't want to hear this i would have got it and flipped it and then paid for like a premium. Yeah. So. I mean, they're getting 20 to 25 right now. Yeah. There was an official confirmed sell today for $24,000. Yep. So. Yeah. I know someone who sold one for 23.5. Golly. I mean, it's insane. It's like. That's insanity, right? Yeah. Like, well, but like Logan Paul just sold that like. Yeah. He could shoot Illustrated card this week for 16 million or whatever it was. Yeah. There's money to be had out there by Pokemon I mean it is the biggest license What did they say 288 Or 283 288 billion Bills Yeah there you go Yeah they definitely know how to Merchandise that company It's like not even a quarter of it Comes from video game sales I know are you watching the Olympics at all A little bit here and there I like snowboarding. It's on a Pokemon commercial. Yeah. Yeah. It's their 30th year because it came out in 1996. And yeah, it's weird to see it so pop culture now. Because when I was growing up, I had the blue cartridge. I played the game. When I got closer to high school, Pokemon wasn't cool anymore. So it was like shunned if you had Pokemon. I remember, I feel guilty now. Well, not guilty. I'm like kicking myself because like I felt so embarrassed to have Pokemon cards that like I essentially gave them away. Right. At high school. Yeah. And I had I had all the first 151 sleeved and everything. And I had a foil Charizard. I'm like, I hit up my teacher that I gave it to. And I'm like, where did those go? And he's like, I don't know. I'm like, I bet you don't. Yeah. Yeah. Don't. He went to Orlando on it. He probably sat on them, and now he retired and doesn't. No, I don't know. Yeah. Yeah, I never collected cards. My brother collected baseball cards, but that's, you know, 80s, right? Yeah. That's still a thing, too, though. I know some people that are, man, they are massively into baseball cards. I've got a friend that's like, dude, I bought this Blastoids card because it's cool. I'm like, don't you collect baseball cards? He's like, yeah, but I just saw this card. I thought it was cool. I was like, okay, so are you into Pokemon now? No, I just like this one card. Once they started putting little jerseys and pieces of the jersey of LeBron James and stuff in those cards, NBA cards went bananas, MLB cards went bananas. They're just smart. They know what they're doing. They know what they're doing. All right, let's talk video games for just one second. Okay. All right. I'm going to tell you a bad parenting story. Okay, go for it. So I'm a video game nut. But, you know, I started with an Atari like every 70s kid and then went to the 80s and NES. And I can name every console I've had. And I have an Xbox Series X right here, right? Okay. So every console, my wife would not let me, let's just say that she would persuade me not to let the kids play the games that I was playing, right? So, obviously, I played terrible games, and they weren't allowed in the room for some of them. I'm not going to even name them, but you can figure those out. And Halo came out. Okay. Right? And so I let my – these kids were like eight, and I let them start playing Halo. Okay. Because my assumption, Josh, was that these are aliens and that they deserve to die. Okay. And would it be terrible if we helped kill them? And so, come on, boys, let's go get these aliens. And that started the bad decisions, a rung of bad decisions. Because then Gears of War came out later, and that was really violent. Yeah, that's really violent. I know. But we were playing it, and it went down a bad rum for me, and it's one of my biggest regrets. Sorry about that, kiddos. It can't be that bad. Like, I remember my stepdad when I was growing up would play Duke Nukem. Yeah, sure. And he'd be like, come here and see this. And you'd pay the stripper a dollar bill and she'd flash you, which was raunchy back then. But it's like three squares for a nipple or whatever it is. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, exactly. There's nothing there. There's nothing there. It's funny. But I get you. So with my 15-year-old, I let him go through the whole Halo series last year and the year before. But I have the same mentality. It's like, they're not real. They're aliens. But yeah, he hasn't played Gears of War yet. I do have limited edition Gears of War Globes shoes, which I was into that stuff back in the day, man. Yeah, Gears of War? Yeah. Oh, my God. I played online exclusively. Did you play online? Yep. Modern Warfare was my, Modern Warfare 2. Yes. It's where I peeked out at. I ended up calling it a nuke like twice. I was like, and I'm done. I know but Modern Warfare So I got Really bananas on Medal of Honor For a while I thought the Medal of Honor series was a little better But they just blew that series And so I switched to Modern Warfare and COD And I have Modern Warfare 7 right now And I getting my hiney kicked All over the place I getting headshot just nonstop I so bad at it Yeah that why I like I just don play online anymore My wife, one day, was like, Josh, if it's making you this mad, it's not a video game. Like, it's not a game anymore. It's just like. Oh, yeah. I broke a few controllers over here. You know, all of a sudden, you come around the corner, and you just chainsawed. I mean, that hurts feelings. and you might throw a controller once in a while. So sorry about that. Yeah. So, yeah, that's why we focus mainly on Mario Kart, which still can be frustrating. Yeah. But it's wholesome. Wholesome. Yeah. Yep. That's a much better parenting move. Yeah, you're not chainsawing people in half. You're just throwing turtle shells at them, you know. You're just throwing turtle shells, stars. You're doing fine. Yeah. We played Lego. I'm not going to say we played nothing but shoot games. We played a lot of the Lego games, and they're really fun, and Mario and all those great games. But there's just something about Halo. My son and I just completed – have you ever heard of It Takes Two? No. It's a really fantastic game. It's two-player. You have to play with two-player. But what it is is these two parents decide they're going to tell their daughter they're getting a divorce. and the daughter cries and wishes that like tells her toy uh that she wishes they don't get a divorce and so it's called the book of love ends up transforming the parents into a Joshua Clay doll and a a yarn doll and you play as the parents and you're trying to get back to the daughter and it forces you into situations where you have to work and by the end of the game they realize they rekindle their relationship and they realize like it's better to work together it's just this wonderful game and my son and i finished it he's like that was so wonderful it was like it was it was pretty cool like how old is he he's 15 now okay that's sweet so i guarantee you i couldn't get my two-year-old to sit back and play like he's like that are we gonna play gears or what what's going on here it's very platformer but the cool part is it's like each person gets a special ability each new level and so like it's just so unique and random all the stuff that you learn and sweet and it just showed you what a better person you are i appreciate that well i also showed my son resident evil recently too so i don't know all right well there you go that was a big one i was growing up i remember when the first one came out when i was like eight i remember me and my friends scrounging all the quarters we could out of the couch hanging on the kmart and buying it and still to this day i was like i was eight years old i was so afraid when i was growing up of zombies i would sleep under my bed like in covers all the way over my head but my lips would be out just so i could breathe but i figured if they couldn't see me they couldn't eat me i don't know it was just i don't like zombies either but i i liked walking dead walking dead was good until negan yeah and i stopped watching that was too much for me i i think that's about where we got too as well like fourth season really got bloody like it was like yeah yeah zoom up as they were bashing a zombie and you're like it was too much i was like when did this go from team to mature and it still was rated team and then finally like no no this is mature it's like yeah it was just too much even for me and i love that crap well even thinking about like carl killing his mom and then cutting out his baby sister up his mom's body like i was just like this whole thing is kind of like getting dark like you know i'm saying like yeah it got dark it got dark this sure as hell did so halo as a pinball machine we'll keep our pinball talk that's gotta be a winner right if that happens yeah yeah well and the rumor is cgc has it right that's the rumor yeah prevailing theory right now um i'm excited man because like pulp fiction was fantastic and uh did you really like Pulp Fiction. I enjoyed it for what it was, yes. I don't like Pulp Fiction at all. It's one of those ones, if you put yourself in the mindset of, like, this is a game from the 80s, and it's that brutality of the 80s, like... Yeah. I didn't like Pinball in the 80s because it was too brutal for me. That's why. I love the charm of that. I just... I don't know. I think the game is just too hard. Okay? I think it's too difficult to start a mode. I think you can backhand that but it's such a hard backhand it is so difficult uh the call outs are brilliant yes brilliant yes but that's where i say the game ends i can't take it i would have a tough time doing their debut podcast on the jbs show and holding my excitement for that if i on fall fix we'll have to applaud them for the fact that like i feel like they did more with that sound package because they really had to work that sound package with only having alphanumeric for their displays. Like it just, they had to work so hard to, and they proved that it's not necessarily about what's on the display. It's like what's under the glass mixed with sound. So I don't know. I'm excited for Halo. And when we did that podcast for Pulp Fiction, there was a lot of restrictions there. Quentin Tarantino did not want anything modern. He did not want ramps on it. He did not want, you know. And so there was quite a bit of restriction for Mark Ritchie to make that game. So I applaud them for being able to make a modern game that felt really good with the restrictions. It's hard to compete in this day and age with 80s material. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, it is. That's a movie based in the 80s. It's a great movie. Great movie. And here's another terrible story. my son was like 12 or 13 and he goes he goes dad can you watch uh can i watch all fiction i'm like yeah great movie you're gonna love it and he comes up to me later and he goes um dad uh you want to talk about the gimp and i go oh my god i totally i do not forgot totally forgot I totally forgot dude And I go no We're not going to talk about that Okay we're just not going to talk about that And don't Tell your mother See my son's 15 now And it's like we still are hesitant Like I don't think I've ever watched Awesome Powers now because I'm just like It's funny but there's a lot of Like I don't know he probably hears it at high school I don't know You know I was raised Catholic I'm not a good person. I'm trying. God darn it, I'm trying, Josh. I'm one of those parents where it's like, if they don't learn it from me, they're going to learn it from someone else. I prefer to somewhat help with the narrative. Because if they're learning it from their friends, they probably don't know it very well either. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, exactly. Maybe Swell was a little young for the gimp. I agree with that. I will not disagree with your statement. I apologize to you. And, you know, you could tell Dr. Phil one day. Real quick, I would be remiss. I want to go around the horn real quick, and we'll do some pinball-related conversation and end this thing, because I only wanted to take an hour of your time. But talk to me. In 2020, you started a charity. And can you explain this charity for us? Because people that don't know you, which is not anyone listening to this podcast, but anyway, tell them about this charity. I know it's near and dear to you. So it was just an event. So in 2020, my son was diagnosed with autism. A year later, I had reached out to Zach Minia, Flip N Out Pinball, and I said, hey, I want to do something. At the time, there was still the pinball channel, the pinball network. That's right. And I said, is it fine if I team up with you guys? And he's like, you're going to have to ask the network. He's like, I just kind of helped brought that together. It's not like my thing. we said flipping out would be happy to to support you guys in that and it kind of snowballed it was it was pretty insane like um we announced it in may of 21 and then we just we've landed on everyone's already in chicago for expo we can really get people to rally about behind us we've taken the idea from a special one lit because they did like a 24 hour straight stream where It was like you could donate during the stream. And I was like, I don't think we could get away with 24 hours. We just did 12. And I asked Ken, you're fine if we're selling this concept. He's like, if you want to do it, good luck and go for it. Because it's a lot of work. It's a lot of work. And like I said, it just snowballed. We got a call from Steve Drublonsky, which is the composer of the Transformers movies. And Michael Bay. And they're like, we want to support you. This is what we're willing to offer. Okay. and then uh Eric Meunier of jersey jack called and he's like slash has heard of your cause he's excited for it he wants to donate these items i was like okay thank you gosh and then Marc Silk called us and he's like i'm gonna he's like i was debating whether to come to expert or not but if you guys are doing this i want to be there to support and i was like well can you be one of the people we interview because it would be great to have you on and then i i wanted to also help shine a light on the community right and so that's why i was like so what we did is we did 12 hours streaming straight but it was we switched hosts every hour to hour and a half and then those hosts got a guest and so i just kind of lined up people that i had um grown a relationship with in in the media and and i suited a host that i felt like worked well with them right and uh and i was like if anyone says no like we can find someone else or whatever we didn't have a single nail like everyone was very happy with who they got great uh we raised i think the very end of it when everything was said and done we raised twenty seven thousand dollars is what we did for unbelievable for uh autism um we did it for a group called uh learning solutions at the time so they are now called boundless behavior and they've they've definitely grown and it's great to see how they're helping those with autism so they're they're a group that helps people with aba therapy so aba is to help um control and regulate emotion and how to be able to because people with autism can't really like gauge social cues and so like they teach them social cues and how to acknowledge them and how to control like uh emotions because a lot of times they're either non-verbal or uh they can really explode and they they just teach them how to refrain from you know blowing and stuff like that so what a great cause man yeah that's fantastic twenty something thousand dollars that's that's amazing it was cool because like stirred and flipping out at one point kind of got in like a bidding match of like well that's what they're providing we'll provide this and then like he was like well that's what they're providing we'll provide this and i was like guys calm down like so stern and flip out did great but like the really cool part about like i feel bad um someone stole from our booth like we wrapped everything up yeah we had someone at the very end steal some stuff and seriously jockton from pin shades he offered to cover the stuff that was stolen um american dude he is american pinball so dave fix He actually offered to cover the stuff that was stolen as well. So we actually got more stuff to give away essentially. And yeah, everything was covered and taken care of. And like even the – I think it was like Legends of a Hollowback Classic got stolen or something like that. So when they sent him the new one, they had signed the whole thing from the whole company. And so the person even got even more than they had bargained for, you know? Yeah. So it was a really cool experience. It was a lot of work. I get people asking me if I'm ever going to do it again. Never say never. I just don't hold my feet to the fire. Well, it's a beautiful cause, and if you could ever raise more awareness, if you ever find the time to do it, let us know what you need. If I do it again, I really think we do it around expo time. Just like I said, there's so many people in Chicago at the same time. That went so smooth, that part of it. There's a lot of people that were very happy with helping, and they said we'd be more than happy like you just say you do it on the floor yeah we did it on the floor we had george fisher from don't panic flip he streamed the whole thing non-stop for us and i was like dude i can take over he's like no that's good i'll take george is one of the nicest guys i've ever met and like george is just i don't know if you know george fisher but like i don't such a great dude check out his channel don't panic flip he's just such a good dude um yeah and Amanda Hamilton I don't know if you know her and her husband Michael but they helped out as well they used to do her and Bill Webb did a podcast and she's going to kick my trash but I cannot remember the name of it but yeah they were on the pinball network as well well congrats on that little acorn turns into a nice tree so there you go yeah if you watch that again it's still I think on the pinball network or now it's the pinball show whatever it's been swapped to now okay but I You catch me crying at the end because we got that very last moment. Someone said, we're sending you a $10,000 check. Oh, my God. We had it verified because I wasn't going to announce this on stream. And the person, Zach Menny, was nice enough to say, I know this guy. He's legit. He will send you a $10,000 check. That's fantastic. Dude, it was insane. And so we announced at the very end, and I started crying. I covered my face because I'm just like, I can't. Yeah. You know? No, because it's a real cause for you, and congrats on that. That's awesome. Yeah. The money ended up going to – so it costs a lot of money to get diagnosed because the thing is if you're diagnosed, it is legally required to cover your expenses from an insurance company without extra due whatever. So it takes a lot of money up front to get diagnosed. And we helped 33 families get their diagnosis taken care of and out of the way. and those families were able to then get the therapy that they need for their child. So, yeah, we were pretty proud of the whole situation. As you should be. As you should be. Congrats on that. And, you know, Zach helping you. You guys have a great relationship with Zach. I mean, you've been involved with him for how many years? We've known him since we started. He's actually the one that encouraged me to do Loser Kid. And then, yeah, he started sponsoring us maybe two years into this. I can't remember. It's been so long. yeah it seems like it's been a long-standing nice relationship there you go what it's always funny to me because i'm like zach are you sure you want to like because every year we talk about are we renewing or anything it's never been a question it's like yeah we're good don't worry about it i'm like are you sure like but yeah great every year that's all i have a terrible zach meaning story i'm gonna tell it to you because it's embarrassing before and i self-deprecating humor self-deprecating humor is funny to me so i start streaming right yeah i've told this before long long time ago and i'm like all right i'm ready to join tpn okay okay so i just send an email to tpn saying hi i'm jamie from my former joint and i'm ready to uh join tpn and they're like who the hell are you right yeah i'm like i'm jamie tpn jamie virgil jamie from the whatever i was like you know i'm ready and they're like um we're good but i had just started right i just started the podcast too i think and uh just the guts i had to just go hey i'm ready are you guys ready for me you know but it was i i liked his explanation of he he's so controlling over it that he had a tough time doing you know adding all the the different shows that they had on there i missed tpn i liked it as a as a content listener i was kind of bummed when it went away okay yeah it was it was pretty cool um i'll well i'll tell you a related story so when when tfpn started uh i was actually kind of offended because i thought we'd grown this great relationship with zach and everything like this i know i've said this story publicly before but uh i reached out to zach i was like dude why didn't you ask us to join because loser kid was established at that point i think we got a year or two in right and he's like dude you've already established your brand you're already like he's like we didn't approach you because we figure you just say no because it's like you already have loser kid going why would you need to join the pinball network to further your you know further loser kid i was like i guess i never thought of it that way so yeah but there you go you got you're too good to get in and i was too little so there we go i don't know if you're too good but yeah i i think he just didn't approach people that already had their stuff going because it was oh yeah no it was it it fueled me for a little bit i was like all right damn it i gotta get some good content out here i gotta put some good stuff and then i went crazy on the cameras and the multiple rigs and all this crap that i was doing at the old joint and uh yeah but i podcasting is my favorite so yeah that's the lane i really want to be in that and reels and have some fun with it so yeah all right let's go around the horn okay Stern, we've got Pokemon Looks like a good release Things look good there You know, we're hearing That it's a fun shooter, it's a little long But I think it's going to be fun, right? It's definitely I like it because I feel like it's a modern day Bally Williams I feel like Yeah, this game looks fantastic I can't wait to get more time on it They're shipping out here in March Or something like that, I think yeah the other thing too I don't know if this has been said publicly yet or not I've heard it behind the scenes this can be exclusive for you maybe it's already been said so we already know that the LE sold out right like they were sold out before they even revealed the whole first run is already sold out as well too for for Pokemon so that hasn't happened since Godzilla back in 2021 if I remember correctly and then you know we're hearing Transformers yep which that Does that resonate with you? Are you too young for it? I grew up on Transformers, but it never resonated with me. I'm excited to see it. I'm excited to see Elliot Elliot Eismin's next game. Because John Wick was decent. And now I feel like it's the first game. It's one of mine that I don't like. And so if I ever meet Elliot, I'm sorry. It's a brick fest for me. I can't hit it. I can't hit it. It's not my favorite either. But I'm excited to see where he goes because I felt like the first one. When we did that reveal podcast, we did it with Gomez. We didn't even do it with Elliot. And I felt bad because there was a part where, like, Gomez had said, by the end of the second design, Gomez had told him, like, either do this, like, do one that we can use, or you're not going to do this. And I was like, wow, that's, you know, hot take, you know? Yeah. So I just, I hope that, like, this next game shows more of what Elliot is because I felt like John Wick was kind of straightforward. There was some innovation in there. uh, with the toys, the, the chest and whatnot. But to me, it felt like a design that was hampered a little bit. And I don't know if it was because of the process or whatnot. So I'm excited to see what he, cause it's been, it's been a minute since John Witt came out. So hopefully he's had enough time to cook. Cause that was what year and a half ago. Well, he's got a heck of a theme. It was a year and a half ago. Yeah. May 2023, I think. Yeah. So he's got a huge, a nice theme going and, uh, good luck with it. I can't wait to see that one. And then we've got Fallout, which... People keep saying L1, but I really think this is going to... And I could be entirely wrong. This is just my gut, right? I really think it's Eddie and Dwight. And the reason I say that is because Fallout is an RPG game, and Dwight has really been hitting the RPG theme for the last couple of titles. I'm hearing it's L1 pretty confidently, and that they're pretty excited about it. I'm hearing it's pretty good. Okay. Someone told me, or I know who told me, but I don't know if he wants me to reveal it, but, or Cale said it on the roundtable, that Brian Eddy's next game is somewhat of an original theme. Okay. So that's interesting, if that's true, right? And then we've got, well, we've got Steve Ritchie's Sonic the Hedgehog, which is it got to be the original Sonic though Yep N None of this movie No offense to Jim Carrey He seems lovely but I don want to see that Yeah I think you have to go original video game Yeah. Genesis. Rings, and when you drain, your rings fly up on the screen. I mean, that's got to happen. How hilarious is it that Sonic the Hedgehog is getting its own game before Dragon Ball Z? Because you know that story there, right? Yeah. So Sonic is like the literal rip off Of Dragon Ball Z It is an absolute rip off Of Dragon Ball Z Yeah Have you ever read the book Console Wars Oh it's been years ago but yeah I have Ladies and gentlemen Console Wars if you grew up in the 90's Playing video games okay Nintendo vs Sega How they did it Why Sonic is released Why games are released on Tuesdays It goes through all of that lore. And, yeah, that's got to be a banger, I think. And I know people who've seen the art. That's all they've seen. But they say it's pretty good. Well, Kaneda said that. He said it's really good. I'm sorry. I don't listen to Kaneda. Oh, okay. I talk to him once a week. Awesome. Hey, whatever floats your boat, man. Whatever floats your boat. I don't know. He makes me laugh. Hey, good. He makes me laugh. We're both New Yorkers. We can't help ourselves. Nothing wrong with that. There we go. All right. We'll move on from him very quickly. It doesn't bother me one bit. No, no, no, no. I just, the problem is I don't listen to Chris. Like we've, we've, we've talked, we talk about our families. Like we chit-chatted at Expo. I have nothing against Chris. I just, I just, it's hard to talk about someone you don't truly know and talk to a lot. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I've gotten to really know him. And, you know, I think a lot of it is just bravado. And, you know, but when you sit down at a Japanese sushi bar with him and jazz bar is really what it was. Yeah. I had a blast with the dude. I had so much fun. He was so kind to my wife, Janine, and our friends. And it was really fun. He's a good dude. He's a good dude. I promise you, he really is a good dude. Every interaction I've had with him in person, I've really enjoyed. Yeah. That's the way he is. He's just different behind this mic, man. He's a different dude behind the mic. All right, what else we got? Real quick, because we're wrapping up. Okay. American Pinball, you want to talk about those shenanigans? You know, it was interesting that Melvin is going over there. Yes. I think that's a good move, though. Yeah. It depends what games they put out. They're not going to put out Raza, right? Who knows? so i doesn't melvin own the rights for like rosa and alice in wonderland and that's the rumor a third um i know that's what colin had had said in kineticist a really great article if you haven't checked that one out but it's it's it's a really good history kind of i was thinking the same thing and then colin released this article and it's like how weird full circle is this right like John Papadiuk was the reason american started because he tried to do houdini and then they scrapped it and they hired Joe Balcer to make a houdini and it just it kind of went around this whole circle right now we're back to melvin owns the right to the j-pop games and it's back in american it's all started you know yeah so well they went on a couple of podcasts and uh the new owner right and the logo is garbage they got to get rid of that logo it's terrible there's nothing wrong with the original logo i don't understand that it looks like an ai made logo but that's just me don't worry about josh you don't need to comment on the logo and uh but They went on a couple of podcasts and said that they were going to do some re-envisioned Bally Williams, but nobody wants that, really. Do they? Depends on the Bally Williams game. I know, but Progetti's already doing it, so why are you... Here's my concern. Like, what titles can they possibly get right now? Like, the defunct Haggis ones? Like, here's the thing. I'm going to try to be as gentle about this as possible. Okay, please. so it makes me nervous when i hear a company now get the planetary pinball licenses so that's the people that own the bally williams stuff that's right um the reason being is is because obviously it's a business and so they want to make money but it concerns me when we've went through four or five companies now yeah have made remakes and we're we see this pattern of they jump on board they make anywhere from one to five and then they don't try to make them at all anymore and and so like because like stern was originally the one that was working with cgc on those medieval madness right like it was churchill cabinets all that jazz right and then they split off and they got cgc to do it cgc made four games and now they kind of they'll remake the licenses they've already made but they're kind of like refusing to do anything else outside of that and then haggis well they got i got huge ones i mean they got what monster bash medieval madness attack from mars cactus canyon yeah so they obviously they obviously got the best the the best pick of the litter right yeah and really do you need to make anything outside of that i mean medieval madness is still out in less than 24 hours years later at $13,000. You know what I'm saying? You don't need to, what, Totan is the other one we keep hearing? Yeah. Is there a clamor in so much for Totan that we've got to? I think there is so long as the code is more developed. I think that's the problem with Totan and with Theater of Magic. The problem was those games were kind of getting less and less flesh out as Bally Williams was starting to die off, right? Right. And there's not a lot of depth. You're right. There's not a lot of depth to both of those games. There's only so much that you can do. But like I was saying, my problem is this licensing. This licensing has only been around for like a decade now. We've went through Stern slash Churchill cabinets to now CGC. And then Haggis had some licensing. Now Pedretti has some licensing. And now American has some license. Like, it's just how many of these games can we remake? And I just, I feel like it's a pattern. I hope they don't do it. I'll just put it that way. I hope they don't do it. I hope they go out and get some, and secure some good themes. Yeah. Because I liked American Pinball. Okay? I liked them. I liked Houdini. It's a little hard. But I liked Oktoberfest. I liked Valhalla, which wasn't their game, but it was still fun. Yep. but they had two stinkers and they went out of business almost, right? So now this new guy comes in and don't make a game about me, dude. That's not going to work. I will tell you I am excited that we do have a new owner just because I feel like a lot of the turmoil came from Amatron. Yeah. I do feel bad that the people that got let go that was excited to reveal. Can we even say Cuphead? You're the only one who's seen it. I know we're not the only one. But you're one. I'm good. Now everyone is seeing it. Well, I don't know if everyone's seeing it. Well, I know that like Don from Don's Pinball Podcast actually went and played in person. Yes. There's a handful of us that have actually seen it, right? Yeah. But like that whole ending to that whole saga, like I feel bad. I hope one day that Ryan McQuay gets to release that game, whether it's, you know, I don't know. I don't know what the licensing restriction is, but I don't know. I just feel bad. Can you not release that podcast? Can you not release it? What podcast? I don't know what you're talking about. Okay. I wish you would release it. So let's say hypothetically there is a Cuphead Pinball podcast out there. Okay, hold on. No, no, no. I'm sorry. Let's hypothetically say there is a Cuphead Pinball machine. We're all going hypothetically right now. All right. And then let's say hypothetically there was a podcast about the hypothetical pinball machine. And let's say I hypothetically had some talks with the people behind who recorded that podcast, and they told me, please do not. Because the problem is they had a lot of marketing material and stuff hypothetically ready to go for this game. And for reasons that are unbeknownst to the public, it just kept being pushed back and pushed back. and uh well we kind of know what what's happened to american now but it's a bummer it's one of those things i think the licensor really had their toes stepped on uh because uh the licensor did a lot of work for that game and they didn't meet deadlines and i think it became i think that's another reason why american got sold off is because there was a lot like we did that interview with day fix and then we were already asking about lawsuits and stuff then between the burial stuff and there was other stuff with Galactic Tank Force, and it just seemed like every game was starting to have issues with rumors of lawsuits falling in suit. And then American got, you know, sidelined, and then there was more lawsuits. And it's just like, I think the reason it got sold off is because it was just, yeah, it was just becoming a cluster. I hope they can make it. You know, I like pinball. I want to see more pinball companies. I don't want to see anybody go out of business, right? Unless they warrant it, unless they're just putting out absolute garbage. And the last two were not good. So hopefully they can shake that off, and hopefully Melvin can come in and give them some bangers. Yeah. I agree. Because I like the way they shoot, man. I do. My only concern is we now have an owner who does work in production, but I don't think he's ever produced pinball, with the president being a gentleman who was over American for a year when they did absolutely nothing and the six months before was the salesperson for american and then i think the most ron had done at american during that time he was president was like kind of fire sell and get he he was selling off what was in stock to kind of help to balance the books right and there's a gap too yeah and so like kudos to him like that's that's awesome that he was able to do that and like there's a lot of businesses decisions you have to make like people kind of make fun of like oh look at their fire selling because they well you need money to keep a business going you know what i'm saying and so like i applaud ron for doing what he needed to do to keep that business doors open and so like but i question moving forward like exactly i i just i'm concerned because between the and then like melvin melvin's biggest accomplishment at DPX was essentially the Funhaus 2.0 kit. He did do Alice, but it wasn't received really well, and I don't think that game's really shipped, has it? There's a handful of them out there? Is that what it is? I know a couple of people that have one. If I would have had that layout, and this is armchair quarterback, right? I would have got an actual designer. I guess J-Pop is an actual designer. I would have had someone go over it with a fine-tooth comb. It didn't play great when I was at Expo, and I felt like they were trying to sell it based off of the lore behind it than they were more of the game for the game. You know what I'm saying? So those are just my three concerns as an American. Yeah, very fair. Very fair, Josh. Very fair criticism for them, and I hope they make it. I hope they make some bangers. There we go. I think it's smart to go with the remake thing because you don't really have to pay a designer to do that. You can emulate the old software. If you do it right, you can do it with a rack. Yeah, but who wants Centaur, right? Like, who wants it? Well, who wanted Funhaus? And Pedretti came out with it. I wanted Funhaus. I have one sitting right here. Yeah. So it's all about a game of numbers, right? It depends on how many you're looking to sell. How many can you sell? So you know Spooky's very comfortable At 800, 900 Nothing wrong with that you know You just gotta know where your goals are at And uh Spooky's come a long way from Domino's And from you know House And they definitely I think Halloween hurt them a little bit And they learned from that and they kept going right Like if you really think about it Yeah they got their butt kicked from Ultraman I mean Ultraman they lost money on right They didn't make a lot of money on Ultraman's Well it just wasn't that right They still have Looney Tunes and Scooby Doo Still set in stock right I think you have one really good hit And it kind of erases the past For people's memories True Evil Dead is a fantastic machine And I know people Played At the Beetlejuice and they love it So look how quick that sold out And if they have Goonies forget about it Oh yeah Goonies and what else is some of the other I think Remlins was another yeah it's the other rumor for that yeah yeah you can't go wrong two two nice years in a row they should be all right yeah I think Spooky's doing just fine for themselves yeah they're doing good and that's that thing right like pinball means something different to everyone else and so I enjoy like L1 games obviously I've got a couple behind me but I feel like because of the way he does his code and the way he does his layouts right and uh it's the thing with spooky man they do such great theme immersion like evil dead may not be like everyone's cup of tea when it comes to a layout but that theme immersion i think that's what everyone aims for when they're making a pinball game or should be aiming for because it just you are in the movies and don't you think what will end with barrels don't you I think they've done a really good job with theme immersion. Yes. Winchester, that game gets me excited to see what else Carl D'Python Anghelo is cooking up. And I can't remember if they've said this publicly or not. If not, oh, well, I'll get in trouble. Carl actually helped with some of the design of Doom as well. That was kept up under wraps because they didn't want anyone to know Carl had done some of that because they didn't want them thinking, wait, is he creating another game? And so now that he's officially announced that he's working for Barrels, Like they're like, yeah, he did actually do some of the stuff on Dune as well. So. Well, Dune, you know, bad launch. We know. But what a comeback story. Okay. Comeback player of the year. Yeah. Well, it wasn't just that. They've had some hurdles behind the scenes. This whole tariff thing really kills a lot of momentum. I know they've talked about it. I know Dutch has talked about it. It's just this really big hurdle that – that people really need to be taking consideration of when manufacturing. And I know a lot of companies are trying to move as much in-house as they can. Yeah. So I think that was part of the reason Dune had a really big uphill battle. Yeah. But you know what? Perseverance, and they put out and made it better and better and better. I like Dune more than Winchester. No offense to Carl, I like Winchester. It's just harder for me than Dune. I can get a little bit of a flow in the Dune. I've enjoyed it. There's a couple on location in Houston, so we're kind of lucky here. I haven't played Dune since, well, I guess Expo. It's such a good game, though. It's a good game. My boy Travis Travis Moseman, that's the boy I want to shout out to. He's one of the co-designers. I want to shout out to Jeff Dodson, man. His sound packages. next level. That's a good dude. Have you gotten a chance to meet him? Yes. He's a wonderful dude. What a good dude. Yeah. Barrels has got so much working for him right now. I'm just like, and it's funny because we talked about Spooky, right? And it's like, I wonder what convinced David David Van Es to move away? Because he was working for Spooky and he's like, I'm going to start my own company. It's like, you know, it seems like at first I don't know. It's paying off dividends. They've done a fantastic job. Labyrinth came out of nowhere, remember? I mean, they just came out of nowhere. But Dune is a good movie. I know you can't get them anymore, and you can't get any Winchesters, but we'll see what they have up their sleeve. I hope it's not Neverending Story. Why not? I don't care about Falkor. He seems like a lovely dragon, but it's just not interesting to me. But the swamp with the horse scene, You don't want to have to save the horse? No, I'm good. You don't want childhood trauma coming up over and over again? That's hardcore. God bless them, but I just don't want to see it on a pinball machine. But if they do it, I'm sure it'll be great. It's just that that theme doesn't resonate with me. Well, one thing I know they've said publicly now is like the themes that they've revealed from now is all things they had done before they even revealed as a company. and the themes they have been offered now that they've revealed as a company and the success that they've had. Like, if you think we had good themes before, just wait until you see what we have coming. Good. And so I can't wait to see what they got. I can't either, and no one over there tells me a thing, and I play pinball with the line workers, and they don't tell me a thing of what's going on. I actually enjoy that they don't tell me anything, because then I don't have to worry about it slipping out on a podcast. Yeah, that's true. I don't want to know anything because my big mouth I'll say something if they came up to me and was like we have Super Mario Brothers I'd be like son of a how do I not say anything about that we'd have to write that out we just got the license so this isn't coming out for another 28 months and it's like no yeah that would be hard alright Josh thank you so much man I had a blast with you today just talking pinball and bologna and cheesing is fun for me and that's, you know, I appreciate you so much. I love what you're doing. Keep up the market trends too. Those are really good. Those are fun to watch. I really enjoy those. When those come out and I get that notification, I'm like, oh, I got to see what Josh put together. I want to see how the market's doing. I love doing it. And, man, it's funny because, like, Ted Finley reached out. He's on that one, SpinballPrices.com. He's like, I want to help this. This is pretty cool. This is what I've been trying to do. and man that man is a wealth of data he sends me over his spreadsheet every like three months insanity but it's opened my eyes too it's funny because like um i've loved doing it like it's definitely something i've wanted to do for a while i actually asked zach many i was like i want to do this but i don't want to step on your toes because he's i was going to ask you that because it you know yeah but it's different it's it's different enough where it's really cool that you do it and And he's doing it on a dealer perspective, and you're doing it on a buyer perspective and a seller perspective. And I like that. Well, mine's exclusively used market. And I've said this before. I have no access to those numbers from dealers because they're not going to give those to me. They're not going to tell me how much they're selling. And I wouldn't ask. That's their own business. No, that's their business. Yeah. But I love it. I really do. Keep those coming, man. Those are fun. Yeah, they're a hoot. They're definitely very intriguing. Like I said, I just like doing it because, like I said, I've done it a little over a year now. It's super eye-opening to see all the numbers behind the scenes, what's going on. Well, follow Josh and his co-captain, Scott Larson, on Loser Kid Pinball Podcast. You know where it is. It's all over YouTube. It's all over Spotify. You'll find it. And LoserKidPinball at gmail.com to send them an email. They'd love to hear from you. LoserKidPinball podcast. Podcast. Damn it, Jim. That was back when we first started, so I'm like, I kind of wish we would have dropped the podcast. Yeah. That's okay. You still have the Gmail. You got it. Yeah. I guess I still could. Thanks so much. You're welcome, man. I really appreciate you, and thank you so much for taking an hour of your time with me tonight. Thanks, brother. Yeah. All right. We'll talk to you guys soon. We'll be right back.