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Pinball Magazine & Pinball News PINcast July 2021 recap

Pinball News & Pinball Magazine Pincast·podcast_episode·3h 4m·analyzed·Aug 5, 2021
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.028

TL;DR

Steve Ritchie joins Jersey Jack Pinball from Stern; JJP accelerates production plans.

Summary

In July 2021, legendary pinball designer Steve Ritchie departed Stern Pinball to join Jersey Jack Pinball as a third designer alongside Pat Lawlor and Eric Meunier. Jack Raniéri confirmed the move was driven by longstanding friendship and opportunity timing, with Ritchie finishing his final Stern project (Whitewoods) before transitioning. JJP plans to accelerate production with multiple assembly lines and increase game release frequency beyond one per year. The episode also covers PinFest attendance, playfield quality issues with Guns N' Roses, and industry rumors about facility relocations.

Key Claims

  • Steve Ritchie resigned from Stern Pinball on July 26, 2021, after completing Whitewoods

    high confidence · Martin Lamb states he was contacted by Steve Ritchie on July 27th, 'a day after he apparently finished the Whitewoods for his upcoming game at Stern and packed his stuff, left his office'

  • Ritchie's employment contract with Stern contained no non-compete clause

    medium confidence · Jonathan and Martin discuss surprise that 'apparently there's also no non-compete in place' despite it being standard industry practice

  • Jersey Jack Pinball plans to release more than one game per year moving forward

    high confidence · Jack Raniéri states: 'Ideally, certainly more than one game a year, yes.'

  • JJP is developing a second production assembly line, possibly a third

    high confidence · Jack Raniéri: 'we're working on... developing that second assembly line, possibly a third assembly line, bring more people into the company'

  • Guns N' Roses will remain JJP's only game in production until before end of 2021

    high confidence · Jack Raniéri: 'I think before the end of this year we'll be in production of that game, probably on the second line'

  • Steve Ritchie and Jack Raniéri have been close friends for over 20 years

    high confidence · Jack Raniéri: 'everybody that knows me or Steve knows that we've been really close friends for over 20 years'

  • JJP had discussed hiring Steve Ritchie around 2010 when the company was starting but it did not materialize

    high confidence · Jack Raniéri: 'when you were first starting the company and getting Wizard of Oz into production there was certain discussions then with Steve about getting him to join the company, which never came to anything'

  • JJP is offering special pricing on replacement playfields to address quality concerns with Guns N' Roses

    high confidence · Jack Raniéri: 'we've made offers to sell playfields at a special price so if somebody feels the need that they want an extra a playfield, at the end of the run of Guns N' Roses, they can buy a playfield at a special price'

Notable Quotes

  • “Steve finished his next game for the company he works for and it was done, done, done... Steve would never leave anywhere unless his job work was completely done because he has amazing pride and passion for what he does”

    Jack Raniéri @ ~13:30 — Explains the timing of Ritchie's departure and his professional character

  • “when the old thing you say, when opportunity knocks, you answer the door. And Steve is an unbelievable talent.”

    Jack Raniéri @ ~18:00 — Explains JJP's decision to hire Ritchie despite not immediately needing a third designer

  • “I would save my money for the one he's doing for us.”

    Jack Raniéri @ ~21:00 — Humorous competitive commentary comparing Ritchie's future JJP game to his final Stern title

  • “We're not a public company. We're a private company. We don't really need to tell anybody anything except that we have some great games and we support them.”

    Jack Raniéri @ ~27:00 — Explains JJP's philosophy on limiting public disclosures of internal structure

  • “I think it's great. gives people something to do while they're waiting for their games to arrive, I guess... If nobody talks about you, that's when you really have to worry.”

    Jack Raniéri @ ~30:00 — Raniéri's perspective on industry rumors and speculation

  • “as a group, we know a lot more than as individuals and we're a lot stronger as a team. So the fact of collaboration and sharing and communicating is extremely important”

    Jack Raniéri @ ~39:00 — Describes collaborative design philosophy with three senior designers

  • “It was like the old times... before I could even think about putting a mask on, there were people hugging me and shaking hands”

    Jack Raniéri @ ~48:00 — Describes post-COVID atmosphere at PinFest indicating industry recovery

Entities

Steve RitchiepersonJersey Jack PinballcompanyStern PinballcompanyJack RaniéripersonPat LawlorpersonEric MeunierpersonKen CromwellpersonJonathan EustonpersonMartin Lamb

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Jersey Jack Pinball planning significant production expansion with multiple assembly lines and increased staff

    high · Jack Raniéri discusses 'developing that second assembly line, possibly a third assembly line, bring more people into the company' to meet demand

  • ?

    community_signal: Post-COVID recovery evident at PinFest with high attendance and normal social interactions despite vaccination concerns

    high · Jack Raniéri reports 'It was like the old times' with people hugging and shaking hands, estimated only 10 people wore masks out of large crowd

  • $

    market_signal: Rumor of competing pinball factory relocation near JJP's Lunt Avenue facility; development pressure on industrial area

    medium · Jack mentions hearing 'another factory that's located nearby that may be moving' and speculation about building demolition and development of warehouse/server farm facilities

  • ?

    event_signal: Pinball Expo October 2021 will be first year with JJP factory in close proximity; potential for enhanced factory tours and participation

    medium · Jonathan asks about 'Enhanced participation by JJP this year at Pinball Expo' and Jack defers to Rob Burke while noting factory proximity

  • $

    market_signal: Jersey Jack Pinball experiencing strong demand requiring production acceleration; mentions 'great demand for our product' driving expansion

    high · Jack Raniéri states: 'there is, thankfully, a great demand for our product, and we want to meet that'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.553

0:00
Steve Ritchie leaves Stern for Jersey Jack Spooky Pinball launches Halloween and Ultraman Museum of Pinball to auction their entire collection
0:20
Hi, my name is Jonathan Euston, I'm the editor of Pinball Magazine and I'm joined here with... I'm Martin Lamb and I'm the editor of Pinball News. And we're here with our July 2021 Pincast to look back at all the Pinball World events from the previous month. And we are now a little bit later than usual because we're recording this on the 4th of August. Normally we do it on the 1st, but there was some particular news we wanted to cover. And we had some people we wanted to speak to as well, as you'll hear a little bit later. and for that reason we're, well, despite those headlines that we mentioned earlier, we're also going to have two interviews with various people. Possibly three. Oh, three, yes, you're right, yes.
1:08
It's so much going on this month that I'm losing track of what it is we've done. So we might as well dive straight in and stop prevaricating and start with the main headline this month which is the news from Jersey Jack Pinball. Right, and you might wonder why it's in the previous month. Actually, we knew about this last month already. And with last month, I mean, I was contacted by Steve Ritchie, I think, July 27th, which is a day after he apparently finished the Whitewoods for his upcoming game at Stern and packed his stuff, left his office, packed up his office, left, and the next day he texted me that he was going to be joining Jersey Jack Pingle. Yes, he resigned from Stern, which we believe on the Monday, the 26th. Yes.
2:10
Officially, he gave notice. I guess he didn't need to give, you know, like 30 days notice of quitting. If you're Steve Ritchie, you probably don't. And apparently there's also no non-compete in place. Yeah, that's a surprise. Yeah, you would think that would be standard, but I guess when you're in that lofty position in the company, you can negotiate certain things into your contract and certain things out of it. Right.
person
Guns N' Rosesgame
Whitewoodsgame
Wizard of Ozgame
Roger Sharpperson
PinFestevent
Pinball Expoevent
Lucasperson
Rob Burkeperson
Raw Thrillscompany
  • ?

    community_signal: Designer collaboration structure expanding at JJP with three senior designers (Lawlor, Meunier, Ritchie) emphasizing team-based approach

    high · Jack Raniéri discusses importance of collaboration: 'as a group, we know a lot more than as individuals and we're a lot stronger as a team'

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Steve Ritchie transitions from Stern Pinball to Jersey Jack Pinball as third core designer

    high · Jack Raniéri confirms Ritchie's arrival and discusses 20+ year friendship, noting timing aligned with Ritchie completing Whitewoods for Stern

  • ?

    product_concern: Guns N' Roses experiencing playfield quality issues with customers reporting damage; JJP offering special replacement pricing

    high · Jack Raniéri acknowledges 'certain number of people who have not had a positive customer service experience' and offers special playfield pricing; Martin notes this is 'Achilles heel' and concern about washers not solving problems

    • 2:36
    Now, there's good news and bad news. Yeah. The good news is Steve Ritchie told me right away he wants to come on our podcast.
    2:48
    The bad news is that still has to wait a little bit because Ken Cromwell, who is the media manager at Jersey Jack Pingball, also has a podcast, apparently, and he wants to be the first to have Steve Ritchie on, but he's on vacation this week.
    3:09
    Ken is, not Steve. Yes, Ken is. Now I can Respect that someone is on vacation But if you know up front That Steve Ritchie is going to be jumping ship He could have recorded that podcast The week prior I suppose And not expect the world to stop turning Because obviously everybody wants to talk to Steve Ritchie Right now and basically they're telling everybody No Yes it's a problem So basically you won't hear anything From Steve on social media in terms of interviews, this week. Right. That's the way until next week. Next week will be the earliest, and then we'll see who we will be talking to. But we got the guarantee from Jack Ranieri that Steve will be coming on our podcast, and it will be very, very interesting, I suppose. Yeah, and Steve wants to come on our podcast as well, so it's a done deal. The only question is when. So I guess we will be doing a bonus podcast, at some point over the next week or so. Right. But in the meantime, we did talk to Jack Rognieri.
    4:20
    Shall we listen to that now? Yeah, I think so, because there are certain things that we need to keep in reserve, so questions which only Steve can answer. But there's an awful lot which Jack can talk about, and not just about Steve's new role and how that came to happen, but also about what's happening at the Jersey Jack Pinball Factory and in the management and also ongoing issues with existing games and what their plans are for the future. So, yeah, we have a lot to talk to Jack about. Okay, so let's give Jack a call. Okay. Oh, good old Gary. I knew he'd make an appearance somewhere. How are you, Jack? I'm very well, thank you. How are you guys doing? Pretty good. I guess you got back from Chicago the other day. You went up a great long way. It was a matter of hours. I had a bunch of stuff to do yesterday, so I needed to get back. And it was a great trip. It was a lot of fun. There's millions of people traveling. It's very exciting to see airports full of people again. Is it healthy?
    5:46
    And healthy, right? Well, is it? Is it? That's what we're wondering. Well, that's another show. Okay.
    5:56
    Okay, so you're up in Chicago for, well, in Elk Grove Village for a main reason, which I think we're all familiar with now, and you welcomed Steve Ritchie to the company. As he turned up, it is trademark Shade, and was introduced to Pat and Eric and Keith and everybody else at the factory. How was that whole experience? It was awesome.
    6:31
    Steve came to the airport to pick me up. I was going to take an Uber, and he insisted on picking me up. My flight was delayed about an hour because of air traffic and all of that kind of stuff. And, you know, he pulled up in his black car. That would make sense that he has a black car. and he jumped out of the car and ran over and we hugged each other and he said, we're making it happen.
    7:03
    And I said, we certainly are. And we got in the car and we drove right to Jersey Jack Pinball. Right. So obviously this was the culmination of some negotiations and some contacts that led up to that. how did that all happen? What was the impetus? Did Steve reach out to you, to Brett or Leonard, or was it contact the other way around? Well, you know, I think everybody that knows me or Steve knows that we've been really close friends for over 20 years. And at shows and things like that, It's not uncommon to see us joking around or having lunch together or having dinner together, having breakfast together. So, you know, I've loved Steve as a person and as a great designer for many, many years. And, you know, on Father's Day, this past Father's Day, we exchanged good wishes for Happy Father's Day. and then we exchanged a few more texts and it was clear that Steve was interested in furthering his career by being with the company that would enable him to make really great games and that's how it began.
    8:34
    Right, okay. So not a direct approach from more a sort of conversational occurrence, I suppose, we could probably call it. It wasn't... I mean, I guess you've known that Steve had not been entirely happy with his current, previous employer, I could say.
    9:00
    And I don't think Steve had necessarily made that too much of a secret. So I'm surprised that you hadn't kept that conversation going, because I know right back ten years ago when you were first starting the company and getting Wizard of Oz into production there was certain discussions then with Steve about getting him to join the company, which never came to anything for various reasons. But has that been something that's been sort of on the back of your mind all those years? Or is it something that wasn't even a consideration up until more recently?
    9:41
    Yeah, you know me pretty well. And when I have something in my mind that I really like to accomplish,
    9:50
    it's really hard for me to let it go. and you know Steve wasn't I'm not making Steve into like a bucket list item or anything like that because he needs to decide what he needs to do for himself and I respected his wishes before things had to fit certain things work at certain times perhaps in 2010 when I was thinking of starting Jersey Jack Pinball and Steve actually was not working for any pinball company at the time And, you know, we couldn't really get it together. He had an idea of what he wanted. I had an idea of what things should be. It was a startup. And, you know, we kind of agreed not to disagree or not to be together at that point. And so now it comes full circle. And now is really a great time. Steve completed his next game for the company he works for and it was done, done, done you know not that I'm telling tales out of school but people know that Steve would never leave anywhere unless his job work was completely done because he has amazing pride and passion for what he does so So if you're going to hire somebody that goes between projects, whoever it is, you really need to do it during that little window between the time they finish something and between the time they start something else. And that time was now. Right. So was there anybody at this old company that knew that he was going, or did he keep it to himself? I don't know. You know, that's a Steve question. So I know you're going to do an interview soon with Steve. Hopefully, yes. So some of the things, well, hopefully, you're going to do an interview with Steve. And I know you're going to ask him a lot of questions.
    12:01
    Ken Cromwell is doing the first interview with Steve because Ken works for Jersey Jack and Ball. Well, it would seem right, quote-unquote, that Jersey Jack Pinball gets the first interview with Steve. I think that's a good thing. But you guys have access all the time. And I know the questions you ask will probably be a little different than the questions Ken might ask. So it gives listeners a great opportunity to get a full circle of information. Right. Well, we appreciate that we will have Steve on the show shortly. We'd love to have him this week, but I've understood that's not possible.
    12:45
    Be that as it may. Well, you stuck with me. I'm sorry. I'm more than happy. But when we do finally get Steve on and introduce him, what's his job title?
    13:02
    He'll share that with you. Oh, I see. Okay. I don't want to take too much away from Steve. No, no, don't worry. We've got plenty to ask. Bill is on there. I know you guys are accumulating a lot of questions for Steve, and he's very well versed in how to answer questions. So he does not have to be coached on answering anything. He's his own guy. Right, sure. We're just interested more in the structure of the company really now because you clearly have three main designers all producing, all designing games and with Pat and Eric and Steve now all there.
    13:42
    Having designers is really important. It's not the only thing that we're working on. Certainly we're working to increase production. We're working on different issues that we have. We'll probably always have issues. We strive for excellence. We may not ever get there, but what this does, it actually puts a little bit of pressure on other parts of the company to pick up the pace, build more games a day, develop that second assembly line, possibly a third assembly line,
    14:17
    bring more people into the company, more resources, more ability to satisfy the demand for Jersey Jack games because there is, thankfully, a great demand for our product, and we want to meet that.
    14:34
    So how much longer do you think Guns N' Roses will be the only game in production? I think before the end of this year we'll be in production of that game, probably on the second line, and maybe some other things on the second line too. So we're working on a lot of different things at the same time. I don't think that's a big secret. Right. So you mentioned that Steve finished the game that he was working on for his previous employer.
    15:07
    He starts, well, we're assuming that he will be designing games for you, but we don't know the timeline in which his previous employer will be releasing that game. So in theory, it could be that Steve's New Jersey Jack game might be competing. I know where you're going, Jonathan. I know where you're going. You might be competing against his own game. Yeah, well, maybe.
    15:33
    Maybe. I can tell you, I would save my money for the one he's doing for us. That's what I would say.
    15:42
    Okay. I understand why you would say that. Does Steve come to you with an idea for a game straight away, or is that something you're still going to do? Hold that, put that in the other column Martin, for us, the question Okay Well, I suppose my next question then would be Do you have a target For how Frequently you want to release New games Now you've got more people designing And it's Classically been quite a long time Between each release Yeah Do you want to bring that down? Do you have a, well, I guess you want to bring it down, but do you have an idea how one game a year, one game every eight months, that kind of a thing?
    16:32
    Ideally, certainly more than one game a year, yes. And we've talked about it before, and sometimes the best plans that you make are interrupted. You know, we wanted to get everybody under one roof, and we made the big move to Chicago, Elk Grove Village to have everybody under one roof. And then guess what? COVID came along and made sure that not only could we have everybody under one roof, but we couldn't even have anybody under one roof because of what happened. So sometimes you can plan. It's great to plan. I like to plan way ahead, as a lot of people in the company like to do. But you have to have a contingency plan, plan B. You have to have a window, a door, you know, a different way to get out of the house.
    17:25
    So we'll just keep trying to improve everything that we can. I mean, we can't make everything a priority, right, because then nothing's a priority. But there's a lot of thought and a lot of resources going into a lot of different parts of the company to be better.
    17:44
    Right. All right. So what I'm curious about, and this is a question that you probably can answer. I'm not sure whether you want to answer it. So, as you just told us, you've been texting with Steve since Father's Day, and he indicates he wants to come over. I'm sure you discussed that internally with upper management, I suppose, we can call it.
    18:09
    So we have a chance to get Steve Ritchie. Was there anybody who was like, well, do we need a third designer at the moment? Or was there anybody like, well, now is not a good time? Or was it like, if we can get Steve Richie, let's get him?
    18:27
    Yeah, it was the latter. Because, you know, being part of upper management, we talk about a million things all the time.
    18:40
    There's always things in play. and certainly there's never a bad time to bring a great person into the company.
    18:49
    So when the old thing you say, when opportunity knocks, you answer the door. And Steve is an unbelievable talent. He brings amazing things with him. just as Pat did when I hired him in 2013 and brought him back to pinball. It's an amazing opportunity to do a lot of different things and bring that resource to the company. So if I had an opportunity to do that, I'm certainly going to promote that.
    19:28
    Okay. Looking at the larger company structure, I suppose, is probably the best way to describe it. You did have Jim Patler working as chief operating officer for a while, but after he left, I don't think anybody replaced him in that particular role. Is that correct? And if so, is that role not needed? Was that more to do with setting up a company in the new facility, or are you still looking to further COO? no I think some of the things we've decided is that some titles and announcing some people in certain titles it just elevates them to a point where there are other people that put a target on their back and they're I don't want to telegraph what we're doing to our competitors whether they're friendly or not friendly and And in the very beginning of the company, you know, if a flipper coil fell off the shelf, we did a press release about it. So it was important at the time to tell people what we were doing.
    20:38
    But we're not a public company. We're a private company. We don't really need to tell anybody anything except that we have some great games and we support them. And we want to build more of them and make our customers happy and have fun and all of that. So, in the markings of the company, who's doing what, when, I know it might be interesting for pinball historians such as yourself and others to speculate on. It's just going to be a point of speculation and give you guys something to do. Because if I told you everything, I'd ruin it for you.
    21:17
    Right. Okay. Now, I'm not sure whether you can or want to answer the next question, but Steve's move sort of had been rumored about for a week before it actually was announced.
    21:33
    But as a pimple company, you can understand you don't want certain rumors. And so how do you respond or deal with such information leaking?
    21:45
    It's great. I think it's great. gives people something to do while they're waiting for their games to arrive, I guess.
    21:56
    It gives people something to talk about. I think if nobody talks about you, that's when you really have to worry. When people are talking about you and they're doing all kinds of things and coming up with all kinds of theories and scenarios and what if and how come and why didn't they do this and I could do it better and armchair quarterback and everything like that. I love it. It's great. Keep talking.
    22:25
    Yeah, but not all commentary is necessarily positive, and particularly the issues you had recently with Playfields, and you're not alone in that either, but that seems to be your Achilles heel at the moment, and people are talking about that, and not in a good way, and I don't think that's not something which is very positive towards the company, is it? well look um things happen in pinball and we have a reputation for many years of taking care of the customer and i'm pretty sure um the few people that have problems um you know we we've made offers to sell playfields at a special price so if somebody feels the need that they want an extra a playfield, at the end of the run of Guns N' Roses, they can buy a playfield at a special price. So we've been very accommodating to our customer base, very respectful of them, and we wanted to build on that. I mean, the whole company was built on taking care of the customer, and I don't think that really changed. I think possibly there are some playfields where people may have done something to the playfield to cause damage. I don't really know. I've seen some pictures where, you know, as a technician and somebody in the business for, dare I say, like 46 years, I really wanted to have the damage occurred. I don't know. And I'm not accusing anybody of anything. I'm not saying anything. I'm just making a casual observance. We have a great customer service department with Ken and Steve, and it's headed up by Barry. So anybody that has a question or a problem or something like that,
    24:17
    the resource is there for customers to reach out to. I've certainly seen plenty of people, and obviously this is a small number from the large number of machines that you sell, but a certain number of people who have not had a positive customer service experience and obviously are vocal about it on various forums and they're worried. They're worried about their game. They don't think that putting washers under posts is actually going to solve the problems that they're getting.
    24:53
    In a way, I kind of sympathise with both sides because I know once you've built a game and you can't just change the playfield. It takes an entire production line to build up the game and to swap it out for a replacement playfield by one person doing that by themselves is a huge undertaking. So just having a spare playfield isn't a solution in those circumstances.
    25:20
    But anyway, we don't want to get too stuck on the playfield issue because that's something we've addressed before and not what I asked you about before. So I suppose one of the questions I wanted to ask, and you may not, again, want to address this, is now you've got Pat, Steve and Eric all designing games. Are there any changes to... I mean, Pat is head of game design, as I understand it. Is there any changes to Pat's role or Pat's responsibilities as a result of having a larger group?
    25:57
    I don't see that at all. No? Okay. Just wondered whether you had any... Because I know when Dennis joined over at American Fiddle, part of his responsibilities was to nurture junior designers and to bring them on in the business. And I don't know whether you have a similar program, even though you've got three designers. It goes without saying that the more experienced should teach the, quote-unquote, less experienced. But being somebody who was less experienced at a lot of different things, I found the learning and the teaching, it goes both ways. Because some people have ideas that can teach each other. And as a group, we know a lot more than as individuals and we're a lot stronger as a team. So the fact of collaboration and sharing and communicating is extremely important pretty much in everything, in a marriage and friendships and certainly in a pinball company.
    27:10
    Right. So obviously we know about the current design team being Pat, Eric and Steve recently added to that. is there also, let's call it, junior designers that we don't know about yet?
    27:33
    Not that I know of, no. Well, it could have been. I mean, as a junior designer, it would be a great place. Are you auditioning to build a pinball machine, Jonathan? Is that your way of saying you'd like to design a game? Oh, I can't. If I've been designing a game, I'd love to be mentored by Steve and Pat. that's what I'm saying that's a great point you know so any aspiring pinball designer I would say not sure whether there is a vacancy or an internship or whatever you want to call it but getting mentored by Pat and Steve and Eric Marnier I may add that sounds like an awesome internship to me too so never say never so you never know. Right. So, on a completely different topic, focusing more on you, Jack, I understand you've been working with a Polish reporter to sort of document a part of your history in the coin-op industry before starting Jersey Jack. Is there anything you can tell about that? well Lucas in Poland from the pinball club he's been a friend for many many years and one day out of the blue a few weeks ago he said would you answer some questions and he sent maybe I don't know 10 questions and I answered them and then he said okay that's good and then he asked me follow up questions to the 10 with about another 25 questions and I answered those, and about another dozen or two questions came, and I answered those. I wondered, you know, why all this information, why all this question, you know. But I, you know, I answered him, and I didn't know if he was just curious on his own or what he's going to do with this information. So I guess you know better than me what he's doing. Well, I don't know what he's doing, but I have been in contact with Lucas, and he mentioned that he was sort of doing an interview with you.
    29:51
    As a reporter, definitely I'm interested in reading about your history and I might as well be interested in publishing it. So we'll just have to see. If it's anything that interests you, I was, you know, I was, some of the questions were really funny to me, but, you know, some of them, I think I answered most all of them that he asked me. Okay. so we finally get to find out what the color of your toothbrush is that was a question on the list no it wasn't a question on the list but it was almost a question on the list I guess he asked things like that did you help him with those questions? no I didn't, he's creative on his own well he's very interesting So looking ahead now do you have any plans for any overseas trips? Jack, now you're saying that air travel is back and as busy as ever will we be seeing you in foreign countries? Yes I would expect to go to the show in London in January Phil Palmer will probably have his fan there and we'll probably get to see each other at that show, I would hope. Awesome. We have my hotel. We'll look for that. There you go. So that would be good. We kick off next year with that show and try to get back to whatever normal is. Hopefully we don't have the Epsilon virus or whatever it's going to be after the Delta, but whatever's going on, just everybody needs to stay safe and follow whatever health guidelines are in the area that they're in. It's a bit strange at the moment because you are allowed to come over here, but I'm not allowed to come over there. No.
    31:53
    Yeah, it is kind of strange. You know, I have my Aruba trip in a little while, in a couple weeks, and when you go to a foreign country, you need to test before you go. You can't get on the plane, and then when you are ready to come home, you need to test before you come home because if you have it, you know, the United States doesn't want you back in the country, even if you're a citizen. Could be a little today.
    32:23
    Well, you know, I don't want to be stuck there, but there are worse places you could be stuck probably. Right, right. So, one other thing. If I'm not mistaken, you were at Pinkfest last weekend, weren't you? Yes, it was great. I was only there on Friday because I had a previous engagement on Saturday, but it was kind of like old times. It was really great to see everybody after almost two years.
    32:49
    What was the kind of atmosphere there like? Was it with people still a bit guarded about social contact or close social contact, or was it really like the old times? So it was like the old times, Martin. It was, you know, I thought, well, maybe I should wear a mask or, you know, not shake hands and not, you know, if somebody's going to hug you or whatever. But before I could even think about putting a mask on, there were people hugging me and shaking hands and all of that. And I said, okay, well, I guess I think I counted about 10 people with masks the whole day.
    33:32
    You know, my guess is that pretty much everybody was vaccinated. You know, you don't know, but I didn't hear of people getting sick after the show. You know, it was last Friday, I guess. So it might be too soon.
    33:51
    Yeah, I mean, I mean, who knows? But everybody was in a great mood. Everybody was happy to see everybody. I saw a lot of things being sold, whether they were mods or games. There was a good selection of games to be played. It was a lot of fun. The food across the street is great at the farmer's market. That was going on full blast. So, you know, it wasn't a concert event like Lollapalooza that they just had this past weekend with 100,000 people all crammed together.
    34:30
    So, you know, you measure your risk. And if you feel like social distance in a way or put your mask on or whatever it was, I mean, typical for shows, we use a lot of hand sanitizer. So I've done that way before COVID, you know, because you're shaking people's hands and you're touching things and you don't want to, you know, you want to be clean. So that was, you had actually, some booths had hand sanitizer and some had it if you asked them. So there's some, I guess, some difference of how people feel that they're feeling. Well on that kind of topic And shows in general One in particular Looking forward to Pinball Expo In October The end of October This will be the first year of Pinball Expo Where the Jersey Jack factory Will be pretty close by And presumably In full swing producing games Will there be any sort of Enhanced participation by JJP this year at Pinball Expo as far as the factory tours, but any promotions going on relating to that show? Well, I would defer to Rob Burke because it's his show, so I don't want to take away anything that he's planning to do. So I'll just let him reply. But, yeah, I mean, the factory is nearby, and from what I heard, another factory may be moving by that time, so I don't really know about that. Somebody was telling me about that the other day. Which factory are we talking about? Hot off the press.
    36:21
    Well, I heard that there's another factory that's located nearby that may be moving. It was a rumor. Yeah, I'd heard that they wanted to demolish that whole side of Lunt Avenue and build it up. But they did it on the opposite side with huge great warehouses and server farms and things like that. And they were looking for the opportunity to develop that whole side. But I hadn't heard it was definitely happening, but I had heard there was a clock ticking. Yeah, I don't want to get into the rumor of the rumor of the rumor, but, you know, that's, I guess those are the threads that tie the hobby and industry together, the rumor mill. But that's how it starts. You get three or four people say something, and all of a sudden it becomes true.
    37:13
    That's how you get a good long lease on your place, on Greenleaf, then. Greenleaf. That's such a cool name, Greenleaf.
    37:22
    And so inappropriate, given the area. Well, if it was brown leaves, that wouldn't be so cool. That was just so industrialized and a business park, really. It does have nice trees. A big tree out there full of cicadas chirping all the time.
    37:43
    It's kind of interesting. Right. So, in other news this week, we learned that there will be a movie on the story of Roger Sharp saving Pinball. We'll be Talking to Roger in our podcast as well But it also Made me wonder Would your story be interesting To become a Full length movie at some point Yeah it would probably be interesting If you want to fall asleep I guess Yeah I think it would put me to sleep You could probably Do a movie about anybody And congratulations to Roger He well deserves a movie, certainly.
    38:29
    And, you know, I've been friends with Roger so many years, and he's contributed so much to pinball as well as many other things. With all the licenses he does, I don't think in the industry you'd have companies like Raw Thrills and other companies that he does licenses for even be able to produce the games that they're producing. so it's very cool yeah it's very unusual to have somebody who works across so many different companies and so many different aspects of the coin op and entertainment I mean all the contributions and all the companies he's been with all the time and everything all the help he's given, design ideas and marketing ideas and everything else so he certainly deserves maybe, you know, the movie might be too little, but he certainly deserves that. Congratulations to him and his family.
    39:32
    Right. Thanks, Sánchez. Well, in attendance of the interview with Steve Ritchie that we will be doing, hopefully very, very soon, I suppose we sort of touched on all topics that we had in mind to discuss. or is there anything else that you would like to bring up?
    39:57
    You know, I think you covered everything for the moment. I'm happy that you forced me to be, I mean, you asked me to be on the show.
    40:07
    You gave away all our secrets. It will be strange not having you on the show. You guys are like putting on a pair of my favorite sneakers, You know, my favorite running shoes because I'm very comfortable with you both. I know you have the best interest in mind of the industry. You want to promote things in a transparent way. And it's great. You know, you don't have any special agenda. You just want to see everybody do well. And I appreciate that.
    40:45
    Well, we appreciate that you appreciate it. now where's Gary's flower oh that's what we're always wondering you never know where he is or when he pops up but he always manages to I love Gary is the best when I was inducted into the pinball hall of fame Gary did a great intro and he's forever a really great friend and you should really try to communicate with him and get him on your show once in a while. We try. We keep trying.
    41:22
    It's so difficult to get him on. I have no idea how to explain it to our listeners. We try and try every month. He's like the Scarlet Pimpernel of the pinball. We seek him here, we seek him there. I could see people googling that right now, because they don't know who that is and what that is. We try and add a little educational value to this we were occasionally we were very close and then technical difficulties things that are out of our own control prevent us from having Gary Plowman on the show with all the technological breakthroughs that we have today it's just amazing to me that the communication just can't work, doesn't work won't work, you know, it's just amazing That's always the way, you know, it's like when you're organizing a party and you say, you know, be there at 8 in the evening, then everybody from, you know, 100, 200, 300 miles away will be there at 8 and the only person who turns up late is the person who lives just down the street.
    42:34
    That's kind of the communication that we have with Gary. Yeah, I see that. You know, Martin, I'm thinking about London and I'm thinking about a really great TV show on Apple+. have you guys ever seen Ted Lasso?
    42:49
    I have not no so on Apple Plus there's this amazing award winning show co-created by Jason Sudeikis who's a big pinball person and a friend and he's won a Peabody he's won a Golden Globe they've been nominated for 20 Emmy Awards something that never happened with a brand new show.
    43:17
    And season one, you know, was last year, and they filmed it in London, and it's about a football team, and it's about an American football coach coming to London to coach a soccer team, and he doesn't know anything about soccer. And it's a really cool show, but how it goes back to pinball, not just that Jason Sudeikis loves pinball, but already in the second episode, which season two on Apple started the 23rd of July, and in the second episode that was the 30th of July, there's a Wizard of Oz pinball machine in the pub where everybody goes back to or cheers on team in the background. So I would say to watch that show. Not only because it's an amazing show and a really great show, but perhaps the game might get played during this season. Who knows? We'll see what happens. But I want to thank, really, Phil Palmer for getting the game there and lending it to them and everything like that. So it's great to get pinball into a show like that where millions of people are going to see it. and who knows, maybe some members of the show get to play the game too as we go along. I don't really know. I don't know. Jason hasn't told me. I think it's kind of a surprise between he and I, but I'm glad it was in the second episode of season two already. That would be a nice press release for the company then, rather than a coil falling off a shelf. You better be on the high end of the game. Who cares about press releases if we don't get them?
    45:11
    Well, yeah, it's Apple TV and it's Warner Brothers Television, so certainly to get clearance for Wizard of Oz game through Warner Brothers Television was like a headsail ride through. And you know something about the press release? I have to apologize because I guess I got to look into it. We used the e-mail list that we created years ago, And apparently, you know, our employees weren't on the list and certain certain different pinball media wasn't on the list. I don't think I didn't see it. But yesterday I got I got calls from different people, people at Replay Magazine and other other places that asked me. This was actually Monday night that I got calls and some into yesterday So I got to be like Santa Claus I got to check the list twice and make sure that all the naughty and nice people are on it I thought you hired somebody to do that.
    46:14
    Yeah, well, we'll find out, and we'll find out. I'll give you a full report, okay? I'll come back and report on what I find and what I don't find. Okay, but remember, people, getting back to what we were talking about, where you heard it first, Ted Lasso could be an upcoming JJP pinball machine title.
    46:37
    And that's how Rumors gets started. There you go. Sorry, I couldn't resist. Old talk is good talk.
    46:48
    Yeah. Maybe. Well, we didn't get a denial, or, um, so maybe pick what you want. Yeah, I didn't really think about that. That's what I would say as well, Jack. Well done, well done.
    47:10
    So if we do a Ted Lasso pinball machine, I guess you want, like, one of the games giving me the idea, right?
    47:18
    I'm not going to say no. Yeah. Okay, I'll arm wrestle you for it. oh that's okay crazy things have happened right crazy things have happened I started a pinball account right so if we're going arm wrestling we need somebody to video it because that would be great content for YouTube I might send in a proxy for me like in the old days when they had a duel you know you get somebody to stand in for you I remember years ago, I'll finish up with this story. I remember years ago, it was fantastic. Joe DeRusso's son, Joey, Joe from Pen Graphics, his son Joey, there was a really long hallway in Sturbridge at the hotel where the show is. It looked like it was a mile-long hallway.
    48:15
    And Joey says to me, hey, Jersey Jack, you want to race? I'm like, what do you mean you want to race? The kid's like, I don't know, 12 years old. I don't know how old he was. He's like, you want to race? I was like, race? What are you talking about? So he taps me and he says, you're it. And he takes off down the hallway.
    48:35
    And I look and I say, well, I guess I'm racing this kid. So I ran down the hallway as fast as I could and I actually beat him. And we were all hysterical laughing.
    48:45
    And his dad, Joe, says, you know, he's the fastest kid in the school. He's on the track team. I said, okay, that's great. So, you know, I saw him, little Joe, he ain't so little anymore. He's taller than me. And I saw him at Allentown at the show the other day. And I said to him, listen, I don't think I want a rematch because I don't think I'll beat you. I'll just rest on my laurels that I beat you when you were, you know, 12 years old or whatever. So, like I said before, everything's got timing. and I felt like Kramer and Seinfeld, which you guys may or may not know. I know.
    49:23
    Kramer was beating up the little kids in the dojo in karate. I beat the kid when he was little. Now that he can really run, I'm not giving him a rematch. So, I guess the moral of the story is quill all your head, I guess. Quill all your head. Yeah. Interesting. Interesting thought to end on Thank you very much for joining us Jack And giving us all the latest On the events at Jersey Jack Nimble Thank you guys I really appreciate it Be well and I wish the best for everybody listening And be safe And that's Jack Ranieri Thank you for coming on the show Jack Yeah that was great A lot of good stuff there I think Yeah For the audio quality There seemed to be a little hiccup in there That sort of split words And then it continued But everything is there So It's always good to have Jack on Because he can give us a different perspective On the pinball industry And what's happening At Jersey Jack Pinball as well Right, yeah Well there's obviously more news From Jersey Jack as well So let's quickly go through dead as well. Yes, as happens from time to time, they have these factory finds, as they call them, which I'm not sure exactly whether it really means that they're going through opening crates and finding parts which they didn't know they had, or whether they're just doing a sort of promotion on a particular item, but in July, there were two items that were available as part of their factory I think the third one didn't come up until a bit later, but at the beginning of the month, well, there was the playfield protectors were available for the Wizard of Oz playfields and mini playfields, and printed manuals for the game dialed in were both available, but they both sold out very quickly, actually, to be fair. So unless you were across that social media and got in quickly, you wouldn't have got those, so they've been sold out. But subsequent to that, there have also been, if you know the game The Hobbit, but when the ball rolls through one of the in-lanes, a character pops up out of the playfield like a troll from Medieval Madness, and there are four of those. And if you want to buy, or wanted to buy, it may have gone by now, but I don't think so, I think that's still available, wanted to buy those faces, which are on the targets which pop up, four of them, you could buy those for $39, which is a pretty good deal, I'd say. They are things which are shot from very close to the flippers, so they're liable to suffer damage over time. Definitely worth having a spare set if you've got a Hobbit game, and yeah, nice to just pop on the desk and as a talking point for when people go back to the office for their co-workers to ask what on earth those are. $39 for the four from available through the new Jersey Jack Pinball shopfront at pinballwizard.com all one word pinballwizard and that, so they are still they are operating two storefronts effectively they've got pinballwizard.com and there's also a store on the jerseyjackpinball.com site which sells more specific parts for you and spares for individual games they haven't united those yet or combined and it should make sense, I guess everything should be in one place to avoid confusion. But, so go to the josephjepinball.com at the top, it's the next store, and you can find some game specific parts like balls and ramp protectors and things like that. Hmm, okay, well, and what's also interesting to note, Jen Guarnieri, that's Jack's daughter, she sent out a note, I believe to Discomputers which was saying that Guns N' Roses playfields will be available for purchase after the end of the production which is expected to be in the summer of 2022. So basically that means that Jersey Jack Pimble will be running Guns N' Roses at least for another year. Yeah, looks like it. Well, at least 10 months, with the summer being, I guess, June, July and August. So, yeah, it could be that long. Yeah, but it doesn't mean that we won't see a new game from Jersey Jack Pinball coming out in a couple of months. Oh, no. As we heard from Jack, he said they're looking at setting up a second line and running other products. Maybe even a third one. May you be the third, yeah.
    54:19
    So it doesn't necessarily mean we won't see another title or another product coming out from Jersey Jack. But, yes, if you were hanging your hopes on getting a replacement playfield for Guns N' Roses to sort any of the playfield problems out we talked about, or even just to hang on the wall as a bit of memorabilia, then you don't have to wait the first part of a year for that. Right. Oh well, I think that sums it up for Dirty Jack Pinball. Yeah, it's been a very busy month for them. So, less busy, one street away at Stern Pinball.
    55:01
    They didn't comment on the loss of Steve Ritchie. Yeah, some say that's not surprising. on the other hand, I think it would be classy to publicly announce and wish Steve the best in his future endeavors. Yeah, I mean as I've mentioned before, you know it's a relatively small business the pinball industry and just because people are working in one company now doesn't mean they're going to be working there forever and people move between various pinball manufacturers and now there are more of them. So it's basically you don't want to burn your bridges do you when you leave a company and as you say if you can keep on good terms with people even if they depart it could come in handy later if they were to have a return. Well if Steve was on good terms with certain people I think he'd still be at certain pinball but yeah I'll see Steve shortly, so hopefully he can elaborate on that. What I do find interesting is, obviously, and this is also something that we'll be asking Steve in the upcoming interview that we'll be doing, obviously, Steve by himself is not a pinball design team. He needs more people. So the question is, what is Tim Saxon going to be doing? And some other people at Sam Pinball, Will they also jump ship?
    56:30
    Or is Steve going to be contracting people from somewhere else? Well, it is interesting because Jack did mention that pinball design is more than one person and they need to have a team to support their increased number of designers. So they will need more programmers, more artists, more sound people, more mechanical engineers, everything. Exactly, yeah. Yeah, it goes into building a game. So whether they will be recruiting or whether they already have that capability, we don't know at the moment. But Steve will ask Steve about that when we get to talk to him. Okay, so Steve left Stern.
    57:15
    So let's see what other news there is to report on Stern Pimble. Yes, I suppose it's one of those things which we knew, but we haven't reported and it kind of assumed that other people knew but apparently it wasn't the case. But Steve is some of his greatest games, I'd say, you know, like ACDC and what else would you possibly say would be a great game from Steve? Yeah, to think about great games from Steve. So many. Depictron, that's the thing. but yes his great collaborator on pinball games over there most successful you might argue is Lyman Sheets as far as the software development goes and they produce some great work together and Lyman actually left Stern Pinball at the end of last year I think it was November I think he wanted to keep it quiet, I think Stern didn't want to make an announcement about help for obvious reasons. But there were a lot of people, I think, who were waiting for software updates that would have had the polish and finesse that Lyman would have applied to them to finish off the software in various games. Right. Well, it can mean two things, actually. Because Lyman is known for working on game software in his own time. He certainly is, yeah. Yeah. So either it can mean that CERN is no longer going to be updating that software,
    58:56
    or it can mean that Lyman might be doing it on his own time. Or it could be under contract, of course, because CERN might be coming back and doing contract work for him. We don't know the conditions that Lyman left CERN, if he left on good conditions or whether he burned some bridges. We don't know that. We don't, that's true, but we can hope. I mean, we're not entirely sure exactly where he's gone and what he's working on at the moment. Although there have been rumours that he might be working on Chicago Gaming's next remake title, which also have been denied by Chicago Gaming. Yeah, so we'll take it from them that he's not working on that. but there were certainly some unfinished issues in ACDC which people were hoping would be completed and bring it up to the same level of completeness as, I suppose, Spider-Man was the classic combination of the two, which seems to be a complete and fully-rounded package. Right. So, you know, we can hope that Lyman stays within the pinball industry, wherever it is he's working, because he's obviously got a huge talent when it comes to understanding rule sets. But he also, and I don't know whether this is one of the reasons that he did leave, but he was instrumental in developing the firmware for the various board systems that Stern people have used over the years. And I guess they're not planning on producing a new version of the hardware, the board set and the controller. So maybe that level of work isn't there anymore.
    60:52
    As far as I understand it, he'd been kind of kicking his heels for a while and didn't really have a particular project. He was never the programmer on any one game. I don't think he wanted to be, either.
    61:03
    So it's probably for the best, really, that if he could find something which is more to his liking than hanging around and picking up bits and pieces. Yeah, well, I'm not very close to Lyman. We met a couple of times in the past, but I certainly got the feeling that he wasn't very happy in the position that he was in the last time I saw him, and that was like Expo two years ago. Yeah, so to say, probably for the best for everyone really. But anyway, he did leave, and it's a shame for those who are looking forward to seeing more Pingball software from Lyman because he had that skill that he could come in and not just finesse but in some cases completely rewrite the rules of the game which was not considered that exciting. So it could completely transform the game from a mediocre one to a very well regarded one. Oh yes, absolutely.
    62:08
    Let's hope he can do that in the future as well. Right. So, but, well, although Lyman left a couple of months ago already, it must be tough for Stern Pinball to see two of these top talents go.
    62:24
    Yes, although we don't know the terms under which they left. So, you know, we don't know whether it was of their own choosing to leave or whether, you know, the company was looking to move in a different direction. Right. anyway so other news from Stern yeah well I think we mentioned this a while ago that Walmart were offering a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle goodie box which included a whole bunch of things like magnets and hats and keychains and a t-shirt and a shredder action figure well apparently Stern are now offering those as well I don't know whether Walmart have stopped doing that or whether Walmart had an exclusive on it originally and now it's become non-exclusive and others can offer it as well but of course it includes Jeremy Packer's artwork which is so distinctive as seen, of the style seen on the game I should say not the same artwork but yeah, so if you want to get that then you can head over to the Stern shop on sternpinwall.com and you can buy it from them directly, and I don't know whether it would be available from distributors around the world, or whether you have to go directly to Stern, but maybe worth inquiring with your distributor to see if they've got it. And apparently they only have 100 units. I don't think the box was limited to 100 units, but apparently the Stern shop only has 100. Okay, yeah, maybe that's why they ordered in their first batch, and they'll see how it goes. Or guess how many leftovers they could find from various Walmarts that were cleaning out the aisles and, oh, we got this, and they put it all in one warehouse, and, okay, who wants them? Maybe, but I had the impression that they were selling very fast in Walmart. They were a very sought-after item, and people were scouring around multiple different places. Well, there's a lot of Walmarts, so if you collect them and there's one left in every three Walmarts, then, well, you might easily get to 100 easily. I'm not sure how many Walmarts there are, but anyway, it doesn't matter. If you're interested in that kit, then head to the Stern shop and order one for yourself. Yeah, in other Stern news, Stern Pinball, the Heads Up Pinball Invitational Tournament, which was held a while ago, and I think we mentioned it on this pin cast as well, But it actually was recorded and it's being shown in the US on the ESPN8 channel, which I think is almost like a pop-up channel, which is not there permanently, but shows some more eclectic sports and competition events. Well, it's back, and on Friday the 6th of August at 2.30pm Eastern Time in the US, They will be showing the stern heads up in the invitational wasn't that that tournament that we were wondering like, okay There's only a handful of yeah competitors and everybody can basically
    65:41
    It looked like If you were a good pinball player, you had a very good chance to winning a pinball machine Yes, that's right. I think I can't remember exactly how many players were at the time. There was eight but
    65:54
    Numbers seem to spring to mind. But yes, it was you know, the clues in the word invitational So it wasn't open to everybody. But I think the intention is to make it more open and allow more people to sort of qualify for the finals through various stages. Right, okay. And then we also have some new code from Stern for a couple of games. Yeah, I'm really excited by that. Yeah. Let me grab my pillow.
    66:25
    Okay, well, I'll do the duty then. Led Zeppelin, a couple of updates in July on the 13th was version 1.04 22nd version 1.05 the first one, 1.04, was quite a large update with new speech and changes to scoring and rules new multi-ball jackpots, quite a few tweaks down the menus and light indicators and player selection things were but the latter one was just fixed a couple of bugs that were introduced in the earlier one so 1.05, latest at the moment on Led Zeppelin and Mandalorian, the current title from Stern that's on version 0.97 as of the 13th of July as you'd expect in these fairly early days there's quite a lot of changes going on so there are new rules and features combos, hurry ups, new multi-ball mode adjustments to scoring and of course the usual bunch of bug fixes so it's 0.97 on the Mandalorian and it probably won't be long before it's up to version one. Right. Now, speaking of The Mandalorian, did you happen to see the Grogu update, the Baby Yoda doll?
    67:38
    It's not a Baby Yoda. Well, whatever it is. Yeah, the child. The child, whatever it's called. I don't watch the show. I know you do, so you would be... I just started watching it, actually. I just watched the first three episodes because I thought I ought to know something about it before I actually get to play the game. and it's got me a bit worried. It started off interesting, but when it got to the third episode, I think, and now I'm worried it's going in a direction that I'm not going to enjoy. But we'll see. I think I probably learned enough from the first two episodes to actually understand the entire game. Right. But yes. But so, to give credit where credit is due, I think it was Joe Abate who modded the Mandalorian game, with a moving Grogu doll, and I have to say, it looks absolutely stunning.
    68:33
    It really makes me wonder, assuming it's a Bill of Materials matter, how can you not put in that doll?
    68:44
    Because I can only imagine you'd sell hundreds, if not thousands of more games with a moving doll instead of a static doll. Was this using a sort of production model of the doll, of a moving doll? Yeah. Like you could buy the toy shelf or... It's an off-the-shelf toy which is wired, and it was just wired to a couple of switches in the game, and it moves, you know. It doesn't do anything. It doesn't grab the ball or it doesn't juggle with it or what have you, but it's so freaking cute.
    69:22
    And interactive as well, which is the key thing. Yeah, exactly. When you hit the right switch, something happens. I mean, if I would be an operator, I would be really disappointed at the door not moving because it could be very attractive to get people to play the game.
    69:44
    Yeah, even in attract mode, it would be good. Yeah, exactly. You could just move and turn. So if people wanted to look at this, and possibly if they have a Mandalorian and wanted to fix this themselves, where would they find the information? I think the best chance you have is search for Joe Abate on Facebook. That's where I saw it. I think there's a couple of, or there is a pinball modders group as well, which shared it. And you might even find it on the Stern Pinball Page, although I'm not sure whether they do Yeah, I doubt they do that But Absolutely, I take my hat off to Joe For implementing that Doll, because To me, it looks like something That should have been in the game from day one I think you're right, I think a lot of people Have been saying that Good, okay, so I think that's all our news from Stern Pinball. So, where shall we go next? Australia, mate. Australia, okay. So,
    70:54
    I assume we must be talking about Haggis Pinball, and their well, I suppose we're talking about their clan Haggis Goods. Yes. Yeah. I think last time what we reported is they have been sending out goodies, but not everything was in-house. So they have been sending out the second batch of Stuff So that people have everything that they Ordered Or were expecting from becoming a Clan Hangers member Yeah I think it was only a couple Of small items like a pin badge And maybe A decal or a Magna or something but it was They always had supply issues which is A phrase we are Hearing a lot of and will doubtless be Hearing a lot of over the coming months as well But thankfully they sorted that out And a small little package of those extra items Has been sent to everybody who signed up for the Panhagis So congratulations to them and to Haggis for doing that Right And while we're on the other side of the world Let's move north a little bit To Taiwan Where Homepin is located And we know that Homepin is working on a licensed pinball title We do, because we heard it from Mike Yes, and the game should be coming out this year And actually Mike has been teasing September For a review And he's also been teasing a little bit What the license might be Yeah, there's been a couple of images Well, one video and one image Posted recently One homemade video Which talks about taking your pinball to 11. Yes. And, um... The 11th floor, that is. Yes. And then just, I think yesterday, there was a tease of a 7-11 logo, the convenience store chain.
    72:55
    So more about the number 11. But that's all so far, and people have been speculating as to what, which 11 they're talking about, whether it's Ocean's 11 or what. Right. So, yeah, I don't know. Well, I do know. It could be a good floor to toss your game out the window and see how it crashes. Not necessarily saying you should do that with the upcoming game from Homepin. Not at all. But, well, I mean, 11th floor makes sense to me. I mean... But more news from Homepin. They posted some pictures on their Facebook page, I think. of a new metal lock bar they're planning to use on their upcoming game. The previous one in Thunderbirds was a plastic one with a metal rod inside, and the new one is all metal and red powder coated, which looks very nice. Right. So personally, I have to say, the plastic lock bar wasn't an issue for me. No, I don't think it was really. It's just something that people could mention about. you know, just they're talking about cost-cutting or lack of, I wouldn't say lack of quality, because it was a perfectly serviceable part, but if they wanted to beat Home Pin around the head with something, they had the plastic lock bar that they could use. But now the next one will have a red metal powder coated lock bar. It looks to be latched inside the cabinet, similar to what Stern games, Stern Pro games are currently... I think all games are now, to be honest. Yeah, it was a nation once. I think so, yeah. They also showed an up-kicker mechanism as well from this upcoming licensed game, but if you looked in the background of the image, there was a UK flag which was a bit out of focus, but I don't know why that would be there, maybe it was a clue to the theme of the game that's coming up. Don't know. I thought Britain had invaded Taiwan.
    75:15
    Well, I haven't checked the news lately, but not last time I looked. But it's tend to find with Mike that he doesn't tend to put things out unless they have a reason. He's very precise about his use of words and images. So, yeah, Just put that out there and make your own mind up. Hold on. I got a call coming in from our good friend Gary. Gary? Gary Stern?
    75:45
    I hope it's not a disappointment, but it's Gary Flower. Oh, okay. Well, that's never a disappointment. Okay, let's see what Gary has to say. Gary's Gary Flower. And maybe he has some information from Stern. Well, usually he has, so it's a good reason for him to call in. Yes, let's get him on. Yeah, come on, bring it on. That's where he runs off. Hi, Gary. Hi there. I just thought I'd ring. I'm actually at a gig at the moment, but I thought I'd just ring and tell you about the new James and Sterling. But it's getting too noisy.
    76:21
    I've had to call you back. See you. Okay. I suppose he's gone. That's it. He was in, I don't know, some sort of event. I don't know. Yeah, the gig, you said. so I didn't know he was going to a gig, but okay. Oh.
    76:38
    Well, we'll try and bring him back. You didn't know he was allowed again. Yeah, they started up again over here. So, well, we'll try and bring him back. He seems to be in quite a rush.
    76:47
    Yeah, he always is. So if he's available to come back and there's a quieter period, maybe he can call back and we'll put him straight on again. Right, okay. July was the month where we were expecting to get an update on the latest development at Deep Root Pinball Because Robert Mueller, who's the head there, said they would produce an update And bring everybody up to date on what's been going on with the development of Raza Soon after the July 4th weekend holiday Right and well So what did we find out? Well, they had to wait a little bit after the 4th of July they had to wait until the 30th actually almost the last day of the month one day to go but it was one of those sort of Friday afternoon let's put out a message before anybody can get back to us or ring us up and ask what's going on so basically break bad news on the last thing on a Friday afternoon in this case the bad news was that there's no news really all that Robert had to impart was that from his last offer of refund to people who couldn't wait any longer, three people got those refunds, not to say that only three people applied, so only three got them those refunds are no longer available so the number of razors to be produced is reduced by three, I guess, if they ever are produced.
    78:27
    And unfortunately due to some undisclosed legal challenge to the game, it can't give an update on development or part supply or certification or production plans or indeed even give a date for when the next update is going to be. So undisclosed legal challenge. What does that mean? We don't know it's undisclosed. it could be anything from well it's a legal challenge so it's not so much a part supply but legal I tend to think in terms of creative ownership or something the intellectual property so could it be that they are facing an intellectual property cease and desist of some kind? Possible. The only person who I thought would have been in a position to do that directly was Bill Brand, who bought the rights to build the games from John Popaduke originally, and then we saw the Magic Girl game turn up at Seattle.
    79:49
    Excuse me there. I'm not coughing, I haven't got anything. But then Bill has posted on Peter's side to say that it's nothing to do with him and he'd never do that, wouldn't hold up production of the games in that way. So it's apparently not him. So we don't know exactly who it is and what their claim is. It may actually be nothing directly related to the game in that way and it could be about the office or the facility that they're working in that they're not allowed to do manufacturing in it or it could be that they're not allowed to use certain parts which they thought they were going to be able to use because they're Bally Williams parts and they're not licensed or I don't know. There's so many things that that undisclosed legal challenge could cover and of course that's the intention. Somebody patented the pin bar without them knowing it? Well, maybe. Maybe somebody's got the name and is not allowing them to use it. I don't know. It could be somebody who was involved in producing some artwork or something as part of Deep Root Studios, or an outside contractor who didn't get paid or is challenging the payments. so many things could be included it's a good thing that Robert Mueller is a lawyer then yes absolutely if you want anybody on the case he's the guy Robert to the rescue I did reach out to Robert to ask if he wanted to come on to our pin cast and give us any update and didn't get a reply on that so I guess not I guess he didn't want to say anything more about it other than what he's already announced Okay, so when do we expect to hear from Deep Root?
    81:46
    We don't The new updates, we don't No data So you'll find out when you find out I think is the answer And if it's a legal challenge If it really is a legal challenge It could be months It could be months, it could be years Yeah Well, okay So, moving on, obviously in Texas, well, hopefully there will be news soon, but for now let's move on to other pinball companies that are actually producing games. well, Kimball Brothers didn't have any news necessarily but they did post a video or actually their playfield supplier posted a video of an alien playfield being waxed and buffed or whatever you call it although I have to say it looked shiny before they started polishing it, and then it became a sort of dull. So I'm not sure whether that was the entire process or... No, I don't think so. No, I think it was just partial.
    83:00
    Yeah. Right. So, yeah, well, it showed the same process for a number of Bally Williams playfields as well.
    83:08
    My conclusion watching that video is it's very time-consuming. Yeah. Yeah, so it looked like, well we've seen that to a degree when we were at Chicago Gaming, when they were producing the playfields, we saw how long those took. I don't think they were doing quite the same level of polishing on them that Brunner and Talzon, who are the playfield manufacturers for the Alien playfields, put into theirs. Right. But don't you think there is a way to sort of automate that process? Like put something together where you have like ten buffers clustered together that are all being driven at the same time. Yeah.
    83:56
    You know, so it takes a lot less time, because I think it took like five minutes to buff one playfield. Well, I wonder whether that is a sort of a special case for certain playfields where a more automated process didn't produce quite the result or there was a flaw in them, so they were polishing it out.
    84:17
    It may not be they did that for every single one, because you're right, it wouldn't get... Well, even so, if it takes five minutes, even if it takes ten minutes and you can produce six an hour, you're still producing play fields faster than they produce games.
    84:32
    So that's the only requirement, really, isn't it? Right, OK. So moving on to our second headline Yeah Well we spoke about it really At least some of it In last month's Pinkast Which was the launch of the Halloween game From Spooky Pinball Yeah well the game was sort of To remind everybody The title was announced But we had not seen any images of the game And there was a rumor That there would be a second game Using the same layout But that wasn't confirmed either So we just had to wait And then Spooky surprised everybody I suppose Yeah Well Halloween we knew And the number was 1,250 of those were going to be built Initially they announced 1,000 then it was up to 1,250 And yeah The second title came out and it was Ultraman For which 500 games will be built And And, well, to me, Ultraman is complete non-theme, because I have no idea what it is. It's not part of my childhood, but apparently for those growing up in America, it was very popular as a sort of Saturday morning children's cartoon series. Yeah, but then again, a rather odd one, I have to say. I did watch a couple of episodes just to satisfy my curiosity. I'm not sure which is more violent, Ultraman or Halloween. I mean, seriously, obviously Halloween is a horror movie and several people die and get stabbed and what have you. I've never seen the movie, so I wouldn't know. And no intention either to watch the movie because I'm really not into horror movies or whatever. so Ultraman is a sort of kids or a show for kids and I saw an episode where a couple of people who tried to rescue something on an island or what have you eventually got trapped with some months of being on that island and And then Ultraman comes to the rescue, and he has this big circular saw that he basically frisbees to the monsters, cutting off their arms or splitting them in half or cutting off their heads.
    87:14
    Obviously, you can clearly see these are dolls or what have you. But if you think about it, the violence, oh my God. How can that be a children's show? I mean, cutting someone in half Or chopping off a head I mean, it sounds like a series that could have been easily That you might expect in, I don't know Afghanistan or something like that But this is American TV And apparently it's considered to be amusement Yeah, for kids, I suppose Yeah I was sort of, well, I wouldn't say in shock But I did raise my eyebrows like, really? Okay. So I'm not sure which is the more violent game, but either way.
    88:02
    In both cases, Spooky came up with a very interesting or cool-looking topper, I have to say. On Halloween, the stabbing knife. And on Ultraman, the razor's edge frisbee or whatever you want to call it, metal blade that's circling around. So, oh well. And, well, the good news for Spooky, both games sold out in a matter of hours. Yes, an unusual option on three different versions in that there's the standard Bloodsucker edition, which as we saw on Rick and Morty, and a collected edition, but there's no fixed split between them. So, although there's 1,750, whatever is ordered, that's however many of each edition are made. So, if all 1,750 are collected editions, then that's what they'll make, and none of the others. Right. So, actually, we should probably reach out to Spooky Pimble, because I'm actually curious how these numbers are split up.
    89:12
    Yeah. On the other hand, I can very well understand if they don't want to make that public, because once you know how these numbers are divided, you also know how much money they made and or money will be coming in and so on. You might consider that information you don't want to make public. That's true. And I guess there might actually be some, I say wiggle room, some opportunity for people to change their minds as well. You know, they might have ordered the standard, but when it comes, the standards have been made last. So I think they might decide, well, OK, maybe I'll move that up to a bloodsucker edition that I can get in a bit earlier and get the extra features that come with that.
    89:59
    It may not be locked down from the moment of purchase, you know. And people might want to, you know, trade. They might decide they want to have one, but then think, well, actually, no, I think I'd rather have another one, but once they've seen them.
    90:12
    So it may not be a fixed number yet. Right. Okay, so now everybody is curious to see gameplay video of both Ultraman and Halloween. So far there have been no official streams, but that shouldn't take long. There has been a video of two guys playing at, I believe it was a horror event or something like that Where the Halloween game was set up Not sure whether you've seen it Yes, I did see that actually They were apparently actors from horror films who were playing it But I don't know who they are, not being a horror fan so it didn't mean a lot to me and we didn't actually get to see very much of it because the way it was shot was more from the side you couldn't really see much of the play field right, so what I found rather interesting is the music is very well it's probably the original music from the movie which reminded me a lot of Two Rebels by Mike Oldfield which was a successful album at that time so it's not a surprise that similar style of music was used in that movie, and then the bimble machine. But it didn't strike me as bimble music, to be completely honest.
    91:49
    It's just a scary tune, no drums or what have you. It was just these sort of tubular bells sound that melody and yeah it has a certain vibe to it but it not the vibe that would get me excited playing pinball I mean it not total nuclear annihilation or something like that No Far from it But talking about machines that were actually out there for people to see the Ultraman machine turned up at the Pinfest in Allentown last weekend. Now, obviously, these games are being supplied by Spooky, but they're not a marketing exercise because all the games are already sold. so really they're just out there in order for people to enjoy them and to spread word about the upcoming games that people start to see here's what you missed out on yeah that's right or here's what you bought and now you finally get to see it yeah yes indeed so that was well I'm sure you will see either or both of those games either Halloween or Ultraman turning up at some of the big game shows such as the Southern Pride Gaming Expo in Atlanta in Georgia, which is later this month, on the 20th to the 22nd where Charlie Emery will be presenting a seminar talking about Spooky and no doubt talking about Halloween and Ultraman games so I'm sure he will bring some games along with him for people to enjoy Yeah, most likely so, and in other news, apparently Spooky started a new technical service line or a phone, that is, so you can call with a real person answering your technical questions, I suppose. And if you feel the need to do that, then the number is 815-541-4940.
    93:52
    And if you didn't get that down, I'm sure if you go to spookypinball.com, you will find the details on there as well. Right. So, okay, and that rounds it up for Spooky Pinball. Congratulations on selling out both Halloween and Ultraman. Yes, good to see you. And the good news is production has already started. Yes, anticipated to last 12 months, I think, to produce all those. So,
    94:21
    not that, I guess that's going to be, what's that, 150 a month, I suppose. around about that. Well, that's very ambitious for a small company, but hey, if they can do it, it goes for them. Yep. Pretty good. Right, so moving on to, well, let's go to Chicago Gaming. Right. You found something interesting I hadn't heard about, so I'll let you discuss that. Yes.
    94:49
    There apparently have been some scam emails which appear to have come from Chicago Gaming asking people to make payments on games. in fact this is a message from Ryan White there who said it's come to my attention that a specific email address within Chicago Gaming may have been compromised I'm not sure that's entirely true because it goes on to say that somebody posing as from the Chicago Gaming Company office have been requesting funds to be wired to them for payment on games and they are using a cloned pro forma invoice request which I guess they must have had access to at some point so either they're a previous customer or have managed to hack into Chicago Gaming Systems it says that potential scammers are promising medieval madness Attack from Mars and Monster Bash with a prepayment wire directly to them and they have copied signatures of the staff and are using a domain called Chicago-Gamnig.com So easily mistaken for ChicagoGaming.com He says, should you receive an email from this domain, it is not from Chicago Gaming.
    96:11
    And they said they only sell their games to authorized dealers and do not sell direct to the community. So you will get anything from Chicago, apparently to come from Chicago Gaming, saying they will sell you a game cheap, it's a scam. Okay? Right. Okay. And there's more news regarding Chicago Gaming. I did call Ryan White to basically check with him whether there was any news or updates, and he did have some interesting news to share with me. You just mentioned the Solar Sprite Gaming Expo taking place later this month And Ryan basically confirmed to me that he will be doing a seminar on the history of Chicago Gaming and Churchill Cabinets Which is, as you may know, a very long history in the coin-op amusement industry Yes, they have been producing cabinets and playfields for pinball machines, but also video games and what have you. And, well, Ryan is going to be talking about that and probably a lot more at his seminar, which I believe is supposed to be on Friday at the, like I said, Southern Pride Gaming Expo. Yes. If you happen to attend, then make sure that you visit Brian's seminar as well. Yeah, they haven't actually published the schedule of events yet for that, so we can't say exactly when it's going to be, but both he and Charlie will be there presenting. So, yeah, it should be a good show. It's always a good show, and another couple of good reasons to attend, if you possibly can. I haven't been there, but I'd love to go. Yes, me too. I would probably have gone this year. But sadly, not to me. Right, okay. So, well, usually you give the next manufacturer to me, that's Pinball. But you had actually some news that I didn't know about, so I'll let you handle this one. Okay, well, I just saw that, I don't know if you know that for the Big Lebowski game, you have the option to buy an illuminated apron, which is the one that's not the same as the one which is on the Achiever model, but it's similar. So basically the apron has inserts in it which light up and twinkle and that kind of thing. So those are available. That apron is available as an extra, but there have been some delays in making those available because of supply chain delays. So back to that again. When it comes to the actual inserts, not the metal frame, but just getting the inserts made. So apparently it's not going to take long and they should be available within the next month or so. But at the moment, if you wanted one of those, you can't get it just yet. Right, yes. I talked to Barry as well for the same reason I talked to Ryan, just to check up and see whether there's any news And basically Barry said there's no news to report. They are still building games, but due to the supply chain delays, not yet at the pace that they would like to see. But they definitely aren't, well, they're still manufacturing games. That's the most important part. So hopefully it will be solved. But then again, I understand that they have the option to choose from different suppliers for certain parts. and in some cases the desired manufacturer has a delivery time or a production schedule where the requested part will be taken into production in 51 weeks, which is a total year. So that's not what you want to wait for. So the alternatives are being found.
    100:36
    But it's keeping very, very busy. I did make a suggestion to him where he might be able to find some parts, and hopefully that will lead to shorter delivery times. Let's put it like that. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Okay. Well. So that's all the news I could find on Dutch Pinball as well.
    101:03
    Okay. so let's head back across the Atlantic then and see what American people will have been up to. Last time we spoke to David Fix, he was expecting to release their next, or announce their next title during the summer.
    101:21
    There was already two episodes ago, if I'm not mistaken. Yes, that's right. Yeah, we were expecting it to be in June, and it didn't happen. And also, it didn't happen in July either. So we haven't got any coverage in this particular pincast about what their next title is. Although there have been rumours. Well, yeah, we hear a lot about it's going to be a re-themed version of the Legends of Valhalla game. But no confirmation on that, and it's one of those cases that we won't know until it's announced. Okay. Well, then we just have to wait and see. Yeah, I would agree with that. well, let's move on immediately to the next manufacturer. How about Multimorphic in Texas? Well, I haven't found any news from them either. They've been hunting around, haven't heard any announcements about any more games, although they've been pretty busy recently with their mini-games,
    102:23
    mainly coming from Nick Baldred with the Silver Falls game. and preceded by Reindeer in the Ruins. So I've been busy recently, but in the past month I couldn't find any more information.
    102:41
    Right, okay. There's just one extra item I'd like to address regarding Dutch Pinball. Oh, yeah. Which I just remembered. I haven't told you either, but the southern part of the Netherlands,
    102:56
    which I suppose the province of Limburg, which is where Dutch Pimbel is located, suffered heavy floods in parts of Germany and Belgium.
    103:09
    So I reached out to Barry because Roermond, the city where they are located, was actually also partly flooded. But luckily for Barry and, well, people waiting for a game, their current building is nowhere near the river or anything like that so they were able to keep their feet dry oh good yes there's been some horrendous flooding particularly in Germany but yes in the whole area right so I just remembered so I figured I'd mention that as well good point well let's move to probably our last I'll say pinball manufacturer, but we haven't actually manufactured any games.
    103:59
    But nowhere near. We still have the third headline to come. Well, we do, but I was going through the manufacturers. Yes. And one who are a wannabe manufacturer, and that's Pinball Adventures. We mentioned last month that their website seems to have been taken down, and we're expecting a revamped version. Well, it's still down, and there's no news on when it's going to come back. so it's surprising so all the stuff about Plenty Factory and subsequent titles is no longer there although as we said last time if you look on the Wayback Machine which is archive.org and have a look at pinballbuzz.com then you can actually browse older versions of the website and find some of that stuff which is being archived away by them Right. There might still be some news in the sense that... Oh, hold on.
    104:58
    No, no news. I was just looking on Facebook on the page of Team Pinball, but I couldn't find it, although I just did. But it wasn't the first hit, so I was wondering. For a second, I had the impression that that site was down as well, but it's not. It's still there. Good. Good. Okay. because they're working on the second game and potentially other projects, which we can't talk about at the moment, but might be able to soon. They are very, very exciting, and we can't wait to tell you all about it. Yes, well, we will. So, yes, our third headline then, which relates to the Museum of Pinball in Banning in California. Yes, and it's very sad news I suppose, unless you're looking to buy a game. But the museum is closing down and they will auction off their entire collection. Yes, I can't remember if they had any mention of it last time or not, but the museum was planning to move, or had plans to move, to Pass Springs, to a nice refurbished building there,
    106:16
    and where they'll be able to open seven days a week, as opposed to about the four or five times a year that they are allowed to open in their existing location in Banning. And because Banning is kind of out in the desert a bit and doesn't have anything like the same kind of facilities that they could have had nearby if they were in Palm Springs. Well, unfortunately all that fell apart. It would take an awful lot longer and an awful lot more money to get the Palm Springs base going and get it refurbished up to the standard they need for the museum. And it basically became a non-starter. So then the option was, well what can they do? Because they had already promised, probably signed a contract to lease out the building that the museum currently lives in. They are going to lease that out to a company that produces marijuana, which is legal there. So they are moving in. And apparently very profitable. Yes, yes, no surprise, far more profitable than a museum of pinball. So basically the museum has to be out by October. And we know nowhere to go and nowhere to store the games and they decided that, well the owners which are John and Jonathan Weeks, basically decided they were going to sell the whole lot off and close it all down. So that's what they're doing, all the machines that are in the museum and the ones that are in storage as well in separate buildings. And that's about 900 pinballs in the museum.
    108:02
    Is that right? It's over 40,000 square feet of 1100 rare vintage and modern pinball machines and classic arcade games. That's how it's advertised on the auction poster or brochure, if you want to call it, which I just happened to stumble upon.
    108:26
    There's two big weekends where this auction will take place. The first weekend is September 10 to 12, and the second weekend is September 24 to 26, which is awfully close to the 1st of October, I would say. Yes, so two weeks apart. It's being run by Captain's Auction, I believe. Is that right? Yes. It will be both on-site and online, so you will be able to bid on those games without actually having to go to banning. But that said, they will have to clear the site very quickly afterwards. So you need to be able to make arrangements for your purchases to be picked up and removed from the site as soon as possible. Right. So that must be a terrible site. Building up such a collection takes, obviously, years and years and years. And then two weekends and everything will be gone. I know. There's so much work gone into restoring those and keep them up and running and building the collection. It's just such a shame.
    109:30
    We've both been there, and it is an amazing collection. Some of the older games are in there as well. You can find machines that you just won't see in any other location. Right. So I'm very curious how this will play out, so to speak, because usually these auctions, I mean, with pinball, there's always a it's a matter of the demand and what's available but in this case there's so much available that usually results in rather low prices for games and I don't expect any of the current Stern or JCAP games to go for very much well they're not they won't be going for $2,000 or less but with all the electromechanical games in that collection I fear you might be picking up many of those for bargain prices unless there is a certain reserve but then again I don't know what I can't do that can I? because I have to sell them right but they could work with the reserve the first weekend and then the second weekend maybe lose the reserve and hopefully sell the games and I still wonder what will happen to the games that are not being sold.
    110:55
    Hmm. Yeah, perhaps everything has to be sold. There are no reserves at all. It's generally the case that the prices are high initially, and then as the auction continues, people who are looking to buy have probably bought everything they wanted to buy, and there are fewer bidders towards the tail end of the list of items. So that's where you can get the good bargains. That's certainly the case in the auctions I've been to. I haven't been to any of these auctions, but I do remember that the David Silverman collection was being auctioned, and those prices were far from what originally was being paid for those games, I suppose. Hmm, yes, another National Pinball Museum that was. That was another sad story, but yeah, and what with the closing of the Papa, the replay effects collection as well. You didn't keep an eye on the prices of those games, but... No, they were mostly sold privately, I think.
    112:05
    The prices that were being asked were very high, and I don't know how... They certainly weren't all achieved. And after that, there were some job lots of games available at cheaper prices.
    112:22
    So, yeah, we are losing the big collections. It's only really the Hall of Fame now in Las Vegas, which is going the other direction. Right. And then there is the Pacific Pinball Museum, but they don't have the space to publicly exhibit that collection. No, they've been thinning out their collection as well by doing their warehouse sales. So they're getting rid of duplicates and ones that require too much restoration.
    112:54
    So, yeah, they're downsizing, have been downsizing over the past couple of years. So, let's hope we get some more huge collections out there for people to play and enjoy.
    113:11
    Right. And then, getting back to the other news, well, let's stick to the museums for a little bit. I'm not sure if you heard about this, but the Pimble Hall of Fame in Las Vegas had their grand opening the evening of July 1st.
    113:38
    And the event was sort of overshadowed by the news that their contractor had made a mistake. And apparently the new building is eight feet on the land of their neighbor. which happens to be the Dream Hotel Corporation or whatever it's called. Apparently a company with lots of money, lawyers, and well, okay, you get the idea. It's going to be a very pleasant experience, I suppose, for Tim Arnold. I'm not sure whether there is any chance of them solving this without going to court. But obviously this is a huge mistake because the Museum of... Sorry, the Flemish Hall of Fame is blaming their contractor and...
    114:30
    Well, so who is suing who and what will be the outcome? Well, it could well be that it's the surveyors and they've made a mistake and then it will be down to whether they have insurance in order to... liability insurance in case they do make these kind of mistakes. And the biggest thing is how are the neighbours whose land they are on going to react? Are they going to say, OK, we'll sell you the land in that case, whether it's a going rate or a premium price, or are they going to fight and say... Or lease it to them. Yeah, try to lease it, which of course is just what Tim doesn't want. They have 95% or 98% of the land owned, and that little 2% or 5% they have to lease at a variable rate.
    115:32
    That's kind of the whole point of owning the land and owning the building outright, is to avoid all that. Right. Oh, well. So I haven't seen any news on it other than the opening weekend, but I'm sure we'll be talking about this in the future yeah I'm sure it will have to come to a resolution one way or the other before too long but as we mentioned earlier when we were talking about deep root and legal matters none of this tends to get resolved very quickly right oh well I suppose we should go to our next interview really Well, yeah. So, surprise, surprise, people, we have another interview coming.
    116:21
    And the occasion is, we all remember probably the story of how Roger Sharp saved pinball in the United States with a demonstration for the New York City Council, where he basically called his shot, plunging the ball and announcing in which top lane the ball would end up, which happened to be the case. And I'm not sure whether that was a spoiler or not. No, no, not at all. No, well, so basically that story is the main ingredient, I suppose, for a movie about Roger Sharp and his life in Pinball. Yes, it's going to be called Pinball, the man who saved the game. And it's going to be made by MPI Original Films. It's a dramatic comedy, apparently. based on the true story of Roger Sharp, writer and pinball wizard and that it doesn't just cover that fateful day in April 1976 in front of the six members of the committee from the New York council but it actually looks back at his whole life how he got involved in pinball writing the book learning to play before that, the people he interviewed, and then how he became, how it was that he was called in front of the committee to help support the motion to overturn the ban on pinball within New York City, which, as Jonathan just said, he did by demonstrating that as a game of skill and calling which shot he was going to punt the ball into, which resulted in the committee saying they've seen enough ban voting 6-0 to overturn that ban. The ban, which was repealed when the law overturning it came into effect on the 1st of August in 1976, Roger Sharp's birthday.
    118:46
    Right, okay. So, well, let's give Roger a call and ask him about the movie and how he's involved and what have you. Yeah, okay.
    119:05
    Hello, hello. Hello, Roger. Hi. First of all, congratulations on your birthday the other day. Hope you had a good day. I did, as a matter of fact. Thank you. It was a day spent with the families. Josh and Amanda and Colin and Charlotte and Evan in the morning, and then late afternoon, early evening with Zachary, Crystal, and Benson. Right, right. It was all good.
    119:39
    Thoroughly enjoyed it. Okay. Well, it's quite the family already. It is. I guess, you know, everybody gets to keep me on my toes, so to speak, and not able to actually sleep in for what the day was. But well worth the sacrifice. Right, okay. If you don't mind me asking, you had a little health care last year, if I'm not mistaking. How is your health?
    120:08
    It's good. Other than most recently, I sprained a tricep. So I've had to delay getting back out on the golf course. for the next week or so. But otherwise, you know, knock on wood, I'm in decent shape, all things being you. So thank you for having me. Glad to hear that. Yes, absolutely. You recently did a, or last week I should say, you did a very interesting podcast interview with Jeff Teodes and Ryan, who's over in Australia, where you discussed a lot of aspects of licensing So we're not going to dive into that. But I suppose the big news, aside from your birthday during the weekend, last week was sort of announced that there will be a movie about the story of you saving pinball. Yes, kind of strange that somebody would actually think that that is worthwhile to be a movie. Well, you obviously haven't been to the cinemas lately because these days you need a lot less plot line to already have a movie. There you go.
    121:32
    But what I understand is you're involved in the project in some way yourself as well. What can you tell us? Yeah, most definitely. well admittedly it's not a documentary which I think on first blush might have been a thought it's not an animated movie nor is it a big budget spectacular special effects film I'm not going off of this phase no I was contacted the early part of last year which is amazing by Meredith Bragg and his brother Austin who very talented filmmakers and they had this notion that maybe doing a movie about me would be of interest to not only them creatively because they're acting as not only the writers but also the directors of the film and we began this process of communicating on a fairly regular basis going over the script. I am the executive producer. I am putting, I guess, my take on everything in regard to what effectively is going to be probably about a three-year period of time in my life as we recount all the events leading up to and subsequently what wound up happening on August 3rd, or August, April 3rd, if I'm not mistaken, or April 2nd, 1976. and see where things take us. And going through the casting process now, and the announcement, I guess, that came out last week was the leads. Joel Courtney gets to play a young me. Allison Reed gets to play a younger Ellen. And the casting continues. So, yes. Oh, so there's still parts to put us in.
    123:35
    Absolutely. There are. So if you're still ready. Can you tell us a little about the format of this movie? Is it like a full-length feature? Is it short? Is it in episodes? How's it going to be released? It is actually a full-length feature. I've gone through. We have the last draft, which is a 110-page script.
    124:01
    I guess on last count, there are about 48 speaking parts. Wow. as the casting goes on. And, yeah, I mean, this is an actual real movie. I guess that's the best way to describe it. Okay, so does that mean that the actors that are going to be playing you and Ellen will be in costumes dating back to 1976, and that if there's a scene where you'd be walking on the street, for example, that there's only cars in there that could have been around in 1976, States or is that too far fetched? No, you are absolutely correct and it's interesting because it is going to be historically accurate and authentic so yes, there will be that taking place. The machines, because obviously there's going to be pinball machines and very specific ones, are going to be included into the movie so there will be an outreach to see.
    125:08
    Right now, we're looking at pre-production to start in about a month and a half. Actual filming is going to be the middle of October to the middle of November. It's going to be in and around Hudson Valley in New York State. So, there are directors of photography that are out there scouting locations.
    125:36
    And so, yeah, I mean, whatever help the community is able to provide in terms of specifics for machines, I believe the IFPA next week, if I'm not mistaken, on the website, will be posting a release actually from Meredith in Austin asking for some help.
    126:03
    Really? We can have some authentic, you know, machines and other things. So to answer your question a little bit more succinctly, Joel and Alice and Crystal will be definitely dressed in the appropriate attire. Whether or not Joel has the wherewithal, we haven't had a chance to really connect yet. He's currently working on a movie. but as soon as he gets a little bit of break in the action plan on getting on a call and talking and I can joke to find out if he's planning on starting his own mustache or if it's going to be something that they will actually plaster on his face for him so we'll see how it goes sounds great but it's also built in the announcement that you made last week or the weekend but it's a dramatic comedy. So what's the comedic angle in all this? I think it's some of the interchange that goes on.
    127:09
    Our son, or Ellen's son, Seth, is very much a part of this process, going back to the beginning of our relationship together. And there are some moments, absolutely, where I guess there is a sense of comedy. I've never thought of my life as being necessarily comedic. But the creative and writing skills of Austin and Meredith have brought some new dimensionality to my life. I don't care if you like my books. So the question then would be how much has been added to it for cinematic effect?
    127:50
    I think truthfully it's a good question, Martin. Thank you. I think it really is pretty much accurate. We kind of went through it all, kind of drilled down, I won't say on a day-by-day basis, you know, going back 40 years. But truthfully, very much in line chronologically in regard to, you know, what wound up occurring. And, you know, that called those chapters out of my life. You know, I will share with everybody that the first reaction that I had is really going to be one of the very first scenes in the movie, which is, and we're still waiting and hoping that our first choice will actually come to fruition, to play as we affectionately call it in the script, Mr. Sharp. That is the older me. Right. But the opening scene is me being asked, you know, about having a movie made. And it's like, really? Why would anybody be interested in a movie about me? And that's kind of like the takeoff point in a lot of flashbacks, if you will. And, yeah, so the story unfolds pretty much, you know, dead on. There's a lot of things in there that I think many people are not aware of in terms of my life. A lot of things that... Well, not everybody reads Bingle Magazine, of course. Well, absolutely. But I think that more on a personal level, Jonathan, there's a lot of things that come to light that, you know, I was conflicted about. But I understood for the authenticity of the movie and what needed to be done to really kind of give a fuller picture of the lead character, that some of these things absolutely needed to be portrayed on screen. So does the sort of romantic side of it The relationship between you and Ellen Is that in the same kind of timeline as actually happened Or does it necessarily need to be sort of conflated So it fits within the scope of the movie No, it actually is very much on target We were very precise In regard to the nature of that relationship The importance of Ellen and the overall process of whatever was happening in my life back then, look, you know, it takes me from my last days, if you will, or the last few years in college on through. So, you know, it takes me through my career in advertising, through my career at GQ magazine, and on through to, you know, the book and subsequently, you know, the court case. Right, so the whole story about you going out to try to buy a Pimmel machine for yourself, which was basically how you got at GQ and so on, that's all going to be part of this film. Absolutely, Jonathan, you are correct. and James Hamilton's character plays an integral part as well. I mean, there are going to be individuals in the movie that suddenly people will say, oh, wow, that's right, I forgot it, even to the point of some of the interview subjects for the pinball book.
    131:34
    And so, you know, Harry Williams, Sam Stern, Alvin Gottlieb, Sam Ginsberg, Herb Jones, that list is included and embraced within the context of the overall story. Well, those people are going to appear in the movie, are they? Yeah, as I said, we are absolutely going through a very deliberate process in regard to identifying specific talent for all of these characters and even more.
    132:09
    This, of course, is not the first time that, well, at least the latter part of the story has been portrayed on the screen, albeit the small screen. You have appeared as a subject of a drunk history episode, of course.
    132:27
    You didn't have any involvement in that, did you? I did not, not drunk history. Mysteries of the Museum on History Channel, I did have.
    132:39
    Unfortunately, we were not able to schedule things where I was actually going to be the person on screen in that, so they wanted to get me an actor to portray me. But, Martin, you are correct. I mean, there have been any number of documentaries. We all know them. Yeah. And of course, they have different news accounts. Yeah, and in print as well, of course, including, as Jonathan was saying, in Pimple Magazine. Yes, the penultimate one of me in total embrace. So, yes. See what happens when you get featured in Pimble Magazine. Next thing you know, they make a movie about your life. That's what I'm saying. I mean, that's probably the only reason. They wound up seeing it and said, my God, if this person is alive. Probably not the only one. I'm trying to be modest here, but I do see a certain correlation.
    133:32
    Yes. You're perhaps trying, but you're not succeeding too well. So is the movie sort of being funded in a traditional way by a studio, or is it self-funded, or is there a fundraiser campaign for it, or how is it coming out? I don't know if folks are familiar with Moving Picture Institute, but the Moving Picture Institute is the production company behind all of this. They have set up a fairly significant budget. Again, it's not a special effects-laden movie, but it's a significant budget to make this happen. And, you know, whether or not they work with another distributor and how this plays out, you know, in this day and age, it's kind of interesting.
    134:27
    We're looking at the release of this could be admittedly next year. I don't know the time frame exactly.
    134:34
    Meredith and Austin have won awards. I highly recommend if people have not had a chance, and I think you can access it. It's a very, very short film that they did called A Piece of Cake.
    134:47
    And the star, God, I forget his name. My apologies on that. It's Summers, and I can't remember his first name, but he was one of the stars on the television series Mad Men. And he played the star in this short little film. But it's won accolades. It's been at film festivals and what have you. And if you do any kind of check on Meredith and Austin, it would even suggest at some point in time you may have a desire to actually want to talk to them. But they've been very celebrated. These are not just, you know, a couple of guys off the street. I was overwhelmed and impressed by all of what they've achieved to date and the fact that they would deem my story to be something that they'd want to actually bring to fruition but yeah, I think that right now I'll go back to it whether it becomes something that is in theaters based on what's happening with theaters whether it becomes a mix and a match of theatrical release and Netflix or one of the other streaming services don't know I mean that's still somewhat yet to be determined but I think that given the talent that has currently been cast as well as what's going to be coming up I think all of that will play out so no this is not a kickstarter kind of thing where it's a wink and a hope and a prayer. This is a legitimate undertaking, if you will. It's definitely happening. Yeah, and look, I don't think that they would turn down any company, studio, or whatever else that would want to step in to say, hi, we'd like to join in this.
    136:48
    MPI has been incredibly successful doing any number of film projects. If you go to their website, I truly was overwhelmed by what they have accomplished and the awards and accolades that they have garnered. So I'm in incredibly good company and very humbled by it all. Okay. so given the accolades that you just mentioned for the filmmakers is this a film that's also going to be in the running for film festival awards and that kind of stuff prizes or is that not something that you can comment on or don't know no I think that I mean I can't comment specifically I don't want to put words into either Austin or Meredith's mouth or that of MPI, but I would believe that it's probably going to be an undertaking that will find its way into that pathway of various film festivals and what have you as we go forward. You know, more information on that to come, since we're still very much in the pseudo-preliminary stages. the script is basically done now we gone through a number of rewrites over these past many months and again it now just a question of locking in talent and there be more announcements as they come Right. From a very personal point of view, I would also ask whether it would be possible to get this movie released on some kind of physical media, be it DVD, Blu-ray, because you know how people like to collect pinball memorabilia. And of course, this is going to be a hot collectible item for anybody who's a completist who's got to have all the pinball movies, the books and other publications. So I'm sure people want to buy this as a physical product as well as, you know, being able to send them on a real stream. I'm assuming that they'll probably do something like that. I mean, most movies today are available in those various mediums. so great let's hope so okay so so that brings me to uh um the following question um in the past you've mentioned that uh your pinball book uh which you did together with sorry james hamilton um originally it had like uh 300 something pages and a lot of that was actually cut and you've always wanted to do the book in the form that you originally intended it, wouldn't it be a great opportunity to do that together with tying in with the movie?
    139:50
    I hadn't thought of that, but you're probably on point to ask that question and bring it up as a possibility. I don't know. We'll see. You know, obviously with my son Josh's urging, the interviews have now been placed in a medium other than in small little cassettes that he was fearful would have dried out and not been able to be reclaimed. And I know with Nate Shivers, we've done a couple of those to have people actually hear the voice of Harry Williams or the voice of Sam Stern and Alvin Gottlieb and others. More to come. So I think the idea of maybe bringing to life the original book and the pictures could well be an option.
    140:54
    Don't know. I have not thought about it until you just planted that small little seed. Can we, while we're going back in time a little bit, can we do a similar thing, go back to that time in April of 1976, when you were at the New York City Council meeting, the committee meeting there. Could you possibly have imagined then that the events of that day would all this time later still be talked about and have such significance in Pinball's history that it turned into a movie?
    141:34
    Not in my wildest imagination, Martin. And it's interesting. I for one we just kind of mentioned about people in the hobby who are ardent collectors of anything and everything pinball I have court documents from other cases you know going back into the 30s and what have you the one I do not have is the one from New York you know I have never stopped being overwhelmed by the fact that it has endured and remained. I think on the same level, and this may sound somewhat strange in context, I never thought that the pinball book would remain what it has been. And, you know, I did that truly as a labor of love and wanting to give a voice and a face in some cases to the people responsible for creating something that I fell in love with, pinball. And I think the court case, you know, and I've been asked a question over time and I've talked about it and you guys know this. I think the fact that it was New York City was the fact that it stood out more so than, and I wasn't involved in 72 in Los Angeles. I wasn't directly involved in Chicago, the latter part of 76.
    143:14
    But I did testify in other cases that proved to turn bands around. but I think it was New York and I think it was that seminal moment of what happened James being there at least one of the people to capture the moment on film so yeah you know I have said and I truly believe this in my heart that I never assumed that my legacy would have been pinball and more that it would have inspired in some ways and motivated both of my sons to become so deeply entrenched in in the industry obviously joshua with raw thrills being a video game company but jackery heading up marketing at stern you know i am incredibly immensely proud of both of them and i guess that's a gift that i'm giving so um so yeah i am for one of the few times i am actually in a way speechless although i'm not not speaking if that makes sense at all. Right, right, right. So you mentioned you'll be in the opening scene of the movie as yourself, I suppose, as Mr. Shaw. No, I'm not. Oh. That's going to be an actor who's going to be portraying me. Ah, okay. So that brings me to the question, will you be doing a cameo in the movie? The plan right now, and I will share with you, I have been hibernating, I guess is the best way to describe it. I have not traveled. I did not go to the recent coin-operated amusement game show.
    144:59
    For Pinball Expo that's coming up, literally in my own backyard, I'm on the fence regarding protocols. I know that it's going to be indoors.
    145:10
    You know, I don't know if I'm ready to do that yet, but we still have some time, and we'll see. if that's going to be possible. I'm not planning on doing any travel for the balance of this year. There's a couple of major trade shows and events that I have gone to for decades, literally.
    145:31
    My plan was maybe to start again sometime in January and begin my cycle of travel, but now it looks like sometime in October I'm going to bite the bullet and head to Hudson Valley in New York. And, yes, I am planning on, I think somebody called it either a Stanley moment or an Alfred Hitchcock moment somewhere on screen where, yes, I will be there. And the guy in front of me knows what. Right. So Roger Sharp will be the Stanley of Finville. There you go. Yes. Kind of walking across the screen. Alfred Hitchcock used to do his moments as well. So we're talking about that. We're also talking about, and I'll share with you, the possibility of other folks maybe making cameos as well. So there could be an opportunity, Martin and Jonathan, for both of you, depending on your travel,
    146:29
    to actually be in the movie in some spot somewhere in one of the scenes. If I would be any of the managers or owners of pinball companies currently around, I would definitely try to get in there in some way or capacity, maybe playing a part as somebody on the city council, listening to or watching you play or something like that. But that's me. That's what I would do. I'm not saying that anybody else would do that, but I see possibilities. I think I know who I'd like to be. I mean, we're going to see. We're going to see what we can do. Obviously, this is a professional undertaking, but if there are ways to maybe do things that are more or less visual Easter eggs for us in the football community, I have discussed that with Meredith in Austin, and I mean they're kind of up for it all things being considered and within reasonable limitations but they like the idea of having some surprises. Well there has to be a cow in there somewhere.
    147:50
    Yes, I think if I was in there I'd probably be one of the press scrum who was taking the photograph of you during the hearing while you were playing the machine. There you go. That would be a great one to be on. Okay. Well, I'm sure that, you know, Meredith and Austin will listen to this when it becomes live and we'll see what notes they take and what kind of roles they'll meet out for both of you. Excellent. Well, fingers crossed that by October we'll be allowed to come to America and who knows, it may just fit in with our schedule of travel as well. Well, that and hopefully by coming here you won't have to quarantine for 14 days. Yes, that's right. That's the big one. Yeah. Well, I mean, this is all very exciting. And you're looking at tentatively a release in the middle of next year for this. I would think. I mean, that we have not really gone through yet. I'll follow the guidelines of whatever MPI has in terms of scheduling and what's best for them but I have to believe that post production will probably be at least 6 to 8 to 9 months so kind of work it out from there as I said it's not as if we're doing lots of special effects and I know them I wanted to speak Well, you see, it's more than just a small filter to get that 70s vibe.
    149:30
    Well, that and truthfully, look, one of the keys, and I've listed out for MPI and for the Braggs, the games that I think are most relevant in my life that I need to have be in place for various scenes, not the least of which obviously is going to be El Dorado. The inspect show. Yeah, for the court scene. But, you know, even the inspiration for Sharpshooter being Free Falls slash Sky Jump and Satin Doll, you know, the pinball community kind of knows those games that, you know, were very instrumental for me, whether it's Hurdy Gurdy and Subway and cowpoke and majorettes from that era. So we're going to have to do, you know, some deep diving and God willing be able to find, you know, the appropriate machines. I think the other part, in all honesty, is, you know, some of what has been recounted,
    150:37
    the machines that were closed down in New York City that started all of this process going in the first place. And it needs some machines not to be destroyed necessarily. This is not going to be a feeding frenzy as was the case in the movie Tommy, where I still remember Alvin Gottlieb and I talking and Alvin sharing with me how his heart was breaking along with Judd when they saw the movie and saw that those were real machines that Ken Russell had destroyed as part of the movie, throwing them over when they were showing the destruction of games back in the early 40s as part of the movie. It wasn't just little cardboard boxes that were colored. Those were real games. And if you go back, for those who have even the curiosity to do so, So you can see that, man, those are the inner workings. Look at all those relay banks and things. Those are real back glasses and real play fields that they just destroyed. Oh, yeah. So, you know, Frankie, want to be as careful as possible in terms of any damage that either needs to be done and will do things appropriately and or games that need to really be in somewhat pristine condition because it could be a 40-year-old game that's going to need to look like it's four days old. Yeah, sounds like somebody should get the list of games that are coming up for auction at the Museum of Pinball and see if there are any titles there that would be suitable and maybe either buy them or contact the owners who do buy them and see if they'd be willing to lend them for use in the movie. No, that's a great idea. And it really is unfortunate I guess with John's collection As to you know whatever is going to happen To it That was a remarkable Venue Well if I recall correctly It only had games From 1965 And up So that would actually Well Not sure about the hurdy-gurdy But I think you might even find that in there And I think that there were some. I remember when I went out for the first year, I think, that he was staging it. And as I affectionately think of it, seeing some of my old friends that I hadn't seen or played in a long time. And Sid was around working feverishly to fix games along with the other guys. And it was wonderful. It was kind of a throwback to another year. so yes that is something that we're going to be looking at and I am sure that we will probably get a point and maybe it is going to be in this release that's coming up on the IFPA website from Meredith and Austin that will list out some of the games that I have shared with them as to what I believe are going to be really important to have so getting back to the movie is it going to stop at the story of you testifying at city council or is also the development of sharpshooter and other games that you were involved in is it also going to be featured in the movie at the end possibly I think there will be an epilogue of sorts so that I just don't drift off in the distance at the courtroom right okay well all I can say is congratulations thank you it's a very exciting project and we look forward to following how it goes you and me both there was a sense of incredulousness to it in the beginning and it was like yeah right and then suddenly it was a little bit more real and a little bit more real and lo and behold here we are on the precipice so it's exciting and I'm hoping that folks specifically in the pinball community will like it the outside world whatever level of curiosity or interest they may have about somebody like me that's anybody's guess but we'll see what happens and maybe Martin going back to your question before as to that I ever envisioned things being what they are with the court case. No. So I cannot even fathom whatever the reaction may be going forward about this end quotes feature film. Well, it's good that the film is being made by non-Pindle people, so it has much more of a mainstream slant to it rather than being just one for the fans. this is a much more a much broader appeal I think that's the way it will be made I'm sure. No I think so and I think that again the core of it though is going to be the celebration of not only a person's life but more importantly how pinball helps define that life And there you have it Thank you very much indeed Roger That's great So yeah well good news for Roger and we're very happy and obviously this is what's probably going to be a 2023 movie I suppose with all the editing and so on but I look forward to seeing it I know so it's going to be in the summer of next year you said so that's when they stop filming or when the filming has to be done but then they still have to do the editing and it could be easily like 8 months or so I don't know we will keep you updated on that as we said we'll check back with Roger regularly to see how the progress is going right, ok, now since we're doing interviews ok there is another event that is definitely worth mentioning and that's Wayne Nyans 103rd birthday yes, congratulations Wayne yes, as you may know Wayne Nyans is featured, well his entire career in pinball is featured in Pinball Magazine number 5 Wayne used to be the game designer at Godleap and later chief engineer and he's been involved in 180 games or so and well he's still alive he's 103 years old and he's still sharp as a knife now I obviously interviewed and visited Wayne a couple of times for Pimble Magazine No. 5, but I kept in contact with Wayne, and I gave him a call the evening before his 103rd birthday.
    157:57
    Without Wayne knowing it, I recorded that call, and I edited out some elements, which I would like to join or to share with you and everybody else. So let's take a listen to my conversation with Wayne Lyons. Okay.
    158:15
    I told you a day ahead to congratulate you on your 103rd birthday. Isn't that amazing? It is amazing, yes. Do you know Will White?
    158:28
    Yes, I know Will White. He said he's right across the table from here. Okay. That's very nice. Hello, Will. Hi there. Well, we're just sitting down to eat dinner. Okay, so am I interrupting? Well, you never interrupt. You know, you're one of those kind of guys that are welcome to talk at any time, any time, any place. Okay, well, I don't want your dinner to get cold.
    158:54
    Well, we're just starting dinner, so... But I'm sure glad you called out. Well, 103, Wayne, you're the oldest living pinball designer ever.
    159:09
    True. That's true. Yeah. And I'm very happy to still have you around. I'm sure glad you did call and you remembered, and that's great. You know, I really appreciate it.
    159:24
    I got a lot of cards from people and telephone calls. Well, I figured that you'd be busy tomorrow, so I called a day ahead. I'm glad you did. But I can't imagine 103. well if anybody can you should be I can't imagine what time is it over there it must be morning it's 2.30 at night 2.30 oh my goodness why aren't you in bed well I figured I'd give you a call over here it's already your birthday Wayne so I wanted to be the first wonderful that's so nice I really appreciate it, Jonathan.
    160:08
    So how's your health these days? Oh, I don't know. It's deteriorating, you know, but I don't know. I feel I have another year. At least. I have a friend here in town who said on my 100th birthday he got up and made a little speech, and he said, when is it going to make 104 years old? Right. And I laughed at him, you know. Of course, now every time I see him, he says, well, you're getting there.
    160:41
    So I don't know, maybe I'll make 104. Well, we're expecting you to make 104 and hopefully even 105 and beyond.
    160:52
    No. I tell you, Will and I are sitting here eating and talking and having fun. And we're laughing about different guys and different features of games and what we like and what Parker liked and what Parker did with the glasses and so on. And we're having a ball. Excellent. Are your daughters coming over for your birthday? One of them is already here. The other one is not going to come because she just had her hip operated on and she can't drive. Ah, okay. She's not going to make it. My son can't make it. He's not well either. When your kids are in their 70s, you know, it's terrible. They have problems of their own. I suppose that's true. It's hard to understand that your daughter has hip operations. Why? How did that happen? Your son's got a bad back. He can't sit very long. You know, it's amazing how they get old and they have troubles, and I keep going. Well, you're an inspiration to everybody.
    162:02
    I don't know about that, but I try. I have one question for you, Jonathan. Sure, Will. Go ahead. Are you and Martin coming over in 2021 to the U.S.? We are hoping that we can make it to Pinball Expo in October. Oh, great. Okay. But so far, there's a travel ban. And even if we want to, we can't travel to the U.S. from Europe. And that's basically being prohibited. And the COVID virus is actually spreading again here in Europe. So I don't think it will be very likely. We're trying to, but I sort of hope for March 2022. Good. Well, whenever you make it, if you're here in the U.S., I'll follow your travels based on your Internet information and try to come see you guys. Much appreciated, Will.
    163:00
    The stuff you put out every month is very fun to read, so I appreciate that. I appreciate you letting me know. All righty. Well, too bad you're not here to hear these stories that Wayne and I are laughing at. I know Wayne's stories are great, so you must be having a ball. It's harder for me to think of stories that I haven't told him already. But I've got to save a few for another year.
    163:28
    Well, Will, bring him a pinball machine. Next year I've got to have another story for him. Right. So is anybody going to bring you a pinball machine just to fix the rubbers to keep you busy?
    163:41
    Well, you know, I'd love to work on another game, I guess, but I don't know. My eyesight isn't too good anymore, but my mind is still good. That's what I'm most happy about, that my mind is still good. I can calculate things and do things, but my memory is the worst part. You know how come that happened? No. Because you stopped playing pinball.
    164:11
    Well, you're not going to believe this, but I think of pinballs and dream of them at night, even today. If you wake up in the middle of the night with an idea for a pinball game, make sure you have pen and paper ready to draw it down.
    164:30
    Okay, I'll do that. I'll do that, Jonathan. Okay. I hear Stern Pinball has a job opening for a pinball designer. You want me to put a good word in for you? Yeah, do that. well I'm afraid it's an era that's gone past you know it was an era in the span of about 20 years that pinballs were the best and now and then they went off right away there's no pinball to mount anything today they make a few you know here and there but they're not like we were making hundreds of thousands of the number well some sell well But they're nothing compared to, well, it's a completely different world right now. The games of today are so different than the games that you used to design. Yeah, it's a different game, entirely different.
    165:27
    But you still have two bats to beat the ball around, so that stayed the same. Yeah. I'm about ready to hang it up, I think. You just promised to make it 104. Well, I'm going to give it a shot, 104. That's what you said last year when I was here for your 102nd. Yeah, that's what the name down here said, 104. And I thought, oh, I can't believe it. But here I'm at 103 already. Yeah, but that must be horrible because the closer you get, you never know when is it going to end. You never know. What keeps me here, I don't understand. and the water. I think it's just, I'm only here just to irritate my friend here.
    166:19
    Something tells me that you're probably, well, you stopped designing pinball machines, but maybe you're not done yet. And they keep you here as long as, until you finish the job. I'd sure like to design another game, I tell you. But that's out of the question. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. All you have to do is design it on paper and then we'll find people to turn it into a reality. Well, I'd sure like to do it. I think of it every night, you know. Okay. I dream simple. Write down your ideas. I'm so curious to see what you're coming up with.
    166:55
    Well, Jonathan, I'm what you call over the hill. Well... Way over the hill. I'm not sure how to put this, but... Well, you can always get back on the hill.
    167:07
    What do you think? You can get back on the hill there. Jonathan, you come over here to Mountain Home and you start a pinball company, and I'll be sure and get Wayne to design the game. I'll set him down with a slide rule and some tools, but first you've got to put the pinball machine here in Mountain Home. Okay? I was hoping you brought one.
    167:31
    No, he didn't bring any games with him. Too bad. I still feel you never should have departed with that Spirit of 76. That was a game, wasn't it? Oh, yeah. And you were quite good at it. Yeah, I was pretty good at that game. You heard about the time I switched the flippers around, didn't you? Yes. Ever hear that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember that story. Michael Shalhoub.
    167:56
    Yeah, old Michael. He was hurt. He was really hurt. Because, you know, he is a top player. and a nice guy too. It's a good prank, Wayne. You're a good pranker. Yeah.
    168:11
    But anyway, we have fun. Right. What a fun industry. What a fun job to have and all my life I had fun. Maybe that's why I live so long. Well, maybe that's the secret to getting old. Just make sure you have plenty of fun. You know, it may have a lot to do with it. It might have a lot to do with it. then I foresee that I might be getting very old as well. There you go. Now all I need to do is start designing pinball machines. Jonathan, how old are you? I turned 50 this year. Oh, you're just a kid. Yeah, just a kid. Oh, my goodness. Oh, to be 50 years old again. Enjoy. Well, Wayne, you still have the spirit of a 50-year-old. Yeah, I think I do. I try to keep my spirits up, and I look at the bright side of everything. I don't go around moping or anything. I think I keep it up a good outlook. Don't I? You have a good sense of humor. That's what counts. Yeah, I can crack a joke once in a while.
    169:15
    You remember something crazy that happened, you know. Please give my regards to Will and your daughter. And it's been a pleasure talking to you again, Wayne. Okay, it's my pleasure. My pleasure. and I appreciate the call. Thank you very much. Okay. Bye-bye. So, what can I tell you? He's still very witty and energetic and, well, like he said himself, he has the mind of a 50-year-old, but, unfortunately, his body is a little bit older.
    169:53
    But he's still very, well, how do you say, in good spirits. he's very upbeat and having a good time enjoying himself although the physical discomfort of being 103 is not always that enjoyable of course well based on what you said there I think maybe you should qualify what you said earlier that Pinball Magazine number 5 includes Wayne Nyland's entire career in pinball up until now well You never know. I keep pushing Wayne to come up with new designs. I mean, he may not be able to complete the design, but if he comes up with a good idea, we can still find the people to make it happen.
    170:45
    Yeah, well, as you said, we know there's an opening now for a game designer. Well, if a big name leaves, it's best to fill it up to replace it with another big name. Yeah, that's right. Yeah.
    171:01
    Okay. So, congratulations again to Wayne and we look forward to celebrating his 104th birthday this time next year. Right. Now, we mentioned that August the 1st was the date on which New York passed into law the legalization of pinball and it was also Roger Sharp's birthday. Well, it was also August 1st this year was the date at which the IFPA reinstated accreditation of pinball tournaments around the world, which means that you can start earning your WPPR or WAPA points again. And there was a big rush of tournaments on that date and very soon afterwards for people to start earning those points again, having been denied them over the past year or more. I feel that they should do some sort of deal with Burger King If you compete That you get a discount on Your next Whopper meal Yeah, well it would certainly make sense Should be a great Publicity stunt for pinball as well Yeah, well the more publicity The better, as we've been talking about So anyway From now on, if you're running a tournament You will be able to award Whopper points to those Well there's I think two items left one item left on the list yeah really so a final item last but not least Brian Allen who has been doing some artwork for pinball as you may remember doing some mashups and so on he announced a new Williams mashup art yes featuring numerous characters from Valley Williams Games. It's all licensed through Planetary Pinball. And it basically crams in a huge number of different characters from various games into a single art piece, so a Translight-sized piece. Oh, Translight-shaped, I suppose. It could be made in multiple sizes. But, yeah, you could have fun going through there and trying to name all the different characters and the games once they appear. Right, yeah. I'm still not sure why he officially licensed them, because if he's doing his own interpretation, I don't think that's necessary. But then again, if he's working with PPS,
    173:29
    and that gets him to make sure that he's not into trouble, then he's afraid, I suppose. I think that's the reason, yeah. I mean, it may not be absolutely legal requirement, but avoids any complications.
    173:43
    Makes it easier for everybody all around. Okay, so how many did you recognize? I didn't actually have a chance to go through them all, but I don't think there were any I didn't recognize. Right, okay. From a first glance, put it that way. Yeah, okay. So from the top of my head, I remember Dr. Dude being on there and the Barry Cora head being the centerpiece.
    174:07
    Yeah, I haven't got it in front of me, so I can't remember it. It was certainly a very interesting piece. and, you know, I say Brian always produces some very, very clever and stylized pieces, and this is no exception. Right. So you mentioned that was the last piece of news, but there was one more item, of course.
    174:30
    What did it mean? Well, we were talking earlier about Deep Root and the Razor game there, which, of course, is a John Popperduke development. Ah, right. Yeah, I know where you're going. Yeah, now it wasn't originally slated, but when it was with Zidware, that would be the first game to be produced. The first game to be manufactured was Magic Girl. And of course it was actually manufactured eventually in one form or another. It was built at the American Pinball Factory as it was the American Pinball Factory then. Of course they moved since then. Right. And I forget exactly how many, it was about 26 or something, of those machines? I think originally John sold 25 games, and in the end I think they built 19 or so. Okay. So it's a very limited game, of course, and I know where you're heading at.
    175:33
    Last month I mentioned that Gerard of the Dutch Pinball Museum posted a photo of himself standing next to three Magic Girl games at a location which turned out to be in the Netherlands. And in the meantime, I've been in contact with the owners of these games who claim that they got the game working.
    175:58
    And last week I had the good fortune to actually visit them, see the game in person play it and I must say it's a very interesting game and they told me the story of all the technical solutions they came up with to get the game working which is quite impressive and well the main reason to tell you this because a lot of people have been asking or don't even believe that this is happening or that they did what they claimed that they did. So they asked for a video footage, and the good news is I will be going back to actually host a video in which we will be showing all the technical developments that they went through to get the game working where you can start various multiballs and have balls locked and what have you. I was really impressed with what they did and some of the solutions that they came up with.
    177:11
    The idea is that we'll be shooting that video this month, but it still needs to be edited. And I think we can expect it to be made public by the end of September. That's a very rough deadline, I would say, but that's sort of what I got the feeling is the goal. The goal is to publish such video at the end of September, but it's going to be edited and narrated and what have you. So it should be a good quality video highlighting, well, it's going to be sort of like the story of what the original buyers eventually got and what it is now. Yeah, it's probably worth going back and recapping and saying that the game as manufactured at American Pinball by John and the team was actually missing huge amounts of mechanisms and also some of the bits and pieces simply didn't work. It looked beautiful and had great lighting but it was fundamentally flawed and it wasn't in actual fact a playable game. You could shoot, you could flip the ball around and make a couple of shots, but it really wasn't working at all. Yeah, there was no possibility to lock balls, for example, so you could never start a multi-ball. And, well, there were other aspects, I mean, there's a mini playfield that has magnets on there, but, well, if you can't get the ball up the mini playfield... That's right, there's no means of actually getting up there. Right. And they fixed that. And it's quite an enjoyable game, what it is so far. And they're still working on some tweaks, things that they need to finish.
    179:08
    And this is a homebrew project. It's not something that's going to be commercially available for... No, I don't think so. the other few owners of those games to purchase the kit or indeed to have their machine sent to these guys and have the mods applied. Well, what I've seen it's not like, oh here's a couple of parts and if you screw these here and there and then you're all set. No, it's absolutely not like that. they really did some very impressive modifications to the game. One I can, for example, I think it's interesting to mention, if you are familiar with the layout of Magic Girl, it has a, in the center of the playfield, there is a sort of a mini playfield with two magnets, similar to the mini-playfield of Twilight Zone, but because the game has an LCD as a back panel, it's blocking part of the LCD screen, and especially there's a diverter with a coil on top of that ramp that's really blocking your view. But they came up with a modification to put that coil on the underside of the ramp, So it's actually, first of all it's working, and second it's no longer blocking your view. They also raised the LCD I think by half an inch or something like that. So all sorts of mechanical changes I suppose to the game. So it's not something that you can easily do with a kit so to speak, like if you go ahead and fix your game. And I think it's also, well, if a kit would be an option, I mean, there's 19 of these games available or in existence around the world. That's hardly commercial viable to make such a kit, I suppose, if it was even an option. No, I was asking whether people would be able to send their games, if they had them, to the team and get all these changes applied. What a such a game as in Australia. Yeah, well, it's a rare enough game, it's going to have a lot of value. But none of this has been achieved in conjunction with John Papaduke, is that right? As far as I know, not yet, or no. So they basically Are trying to Stay as close And authentic To what John had in mind with the game But obviously they are facing Technical challenges To get certain Things to work So they try to Stay as close as John intended it For as far as they can see How John intended it Okay Great. Well, I look forward to seeing more of that and the video when that eventually comes out. Right. So that will be something that I'm working on. And I don't want to leave you here hanging with a teaser, but it will be an interesting project. Yeah. Sounds like it. Yeah. And I suppose that rounds it up for the month of July and the first week of August. I think it does yes I think we've covered quite a lot in this one and it's as you can see it's all here it's been a busy time and some exciting news and some interesting staff moves as well right as well as the new games coming out so that is it for July 2021 we will be back at the end of this month to look we will be back sooner with Steve Ritchie You're right. I was forgetting myself. I'm forgetting Steve. Yep. If all goes to plan, we will, and there's no guarantee of anything at the moment, but if it does go to plan, then we will be back with a special bonus recording of podcast with Steve Ritchie telling us all about his new role at Jersey Jack Pimble. And after that, we will be back at the end of August, sorry, end of August, the start of September, to look back at the rest of August and everything that happened in the dimple world there. So, until then, from myself, Martin L. and from me, Jonathan Euston, we wish you a very happy August, and we'll see you at the end of it. Or prior to that. Yeah, for the interview. Yes, exactly. So, until then, stay safe. Bye-bye. Bye.
    184:15
    Thank you.