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Rachel and Cale of The Electric Bat Cast Podcast - Episode 25

JBS Show·podcast_episode·1h 2m·analyzed·Apr 25, 2024
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.031

TL;DR

Electric Bat founders share origin stories and how they built Arizona's pinball scene.

Summary

Rachel and Cale of Electric Bat Arcade discuss their origin stories, how they grew the Phoenix pinball scene, and the creation and operation of their arcade venue and podcast. They cover their backgrounds in art and music, their transition from Marco Specialties into arcade ownership, the explosive growth of Arizona's pinball community, and their approach to social media and podcast production.

Key Claims

  • Electric Bat Arcade has 62 pinball machines and operates the largest single-location pinball league in the world with 100-120 players per Tuesday night

    high confidence · Rachel and Cale directly state they have 62 pins and have asked around to verify their league size claim

  • Rachel and Cale met while working at Marco Specialties and started Electric Bat about 5.5 years ago

    high confidence · Direct statement: 'the arcade is about five and a half years old' and met at Marco

  • Electric Bat's Tuesday league runs 5 rounds of group match play from 6:30 PM to 9 PM with a 6-week series leading to top-24 finals

    high confidence · Cale provides specific operational details about league structure

  • Arizona has grown to support pinball leagues every night of the week with multiple competing leagues on the same nights

    high confidence · Rachel states 'you can play a league every night of the week' and 'some nights you have to choose'

  • Electric Bat Flagstaff location has about a dozen pinball machines and operates as location pinball in a bar

    high confidence · Cale: 'In Flagstaff, there's like a dozen or so. That's a much smaller – the Flagstaff location is more like location pinball in a bar'

  • Rachel designed the iconic Electric Bat logo in one evening without extensive planning

    high confidence · Rachel: 'I drew a couple things out one night just real quick. And then the next day, the chef in the kitchen at the time...was like, that's the one'

  • Ray Davis visited during a league night after asking how many people would show up

    high confidence · Cale describes Ray Day (likely Ray Davis) asking 'how many people would show up' and being told '100 to 120'

  • Cale co-founded ZapCon pinball and arcade show in Arizona, which helped grow the local scene

    high confidence · Cale states: 'I also co-founded ZapCon which is the pinball and arcade show out here'

Notable Quotes

  • “I believe we are the largest single-location pinball league in the entire world.”

    Rachel or Cale @ not specified — Major claim about Electric Bat's league dominance; they note they've asked people and looked at data to verify

  • “If you want to open an arcade, you have to be an enthusiast. I think we've all seen those arcades where it's just some rich guy who bought a bunch of LEs and they play like shit because he's not an enthusiast.”

    Cale @ not specified — Philosophy on arcade operation; critique of wealthy buyers without passion

  • “I think there was just a lot of things coming together at once. I think we certainly played a part in it. One thing that I know that I did kind of by accident is after I started Electric Bat, there was a lot of guys around town that just, you know, word got back to us that they're like, well, if Rachel can do it, then we can do it.”

    Cale @ not specified — Demonstrates Rachel's impact as inspiration for arcade entrepreneurship in Phoenix

  • “Living out of a van... is super fun when you're 18 years old. Wouldn't want to do it now.”

    Cale @ not specified — Reflects on his music touring experience before arcade work

  • “When the sun is not out 110 out here is totally fine and pleasant but 83 degrees in intense sun out here like you are starting to get like it hurts it physically hurts”

    Cale @ not specified — Describes Arizona desert climate intensity; distinguishes dry heat from humidity

  • “There's paintings that I spent like a thousand hours on...but you know again this this logo that i kind of like just drew without even thinking about it there's like dozens of people that have it tattooed on them”

    Rachel @ not specified — Reflects on the unexpected success of simple creative work vs. elaborate efforts

  • “I love social media. I love interacting with people. I love, I want to make people laugh. I want to entertain people.”

    Cale @ not specified — Explains his approach to Electric Bat's social media presence and philosophy

Entities

Electric Bat ArcadecompanyRachelpersonCalepersonMarco SpecialtiescompanyWormhole ArcadecompanyJamie BirchallpersonDonovan Wadeperson

Signals

  • ?

    community_signal: Electric Bat Arcade hosting largest single-location pinball league globally (100-120 weekly players) with structured tournament format and massive participation

    high · Rachel/Cale claim verified through asking around; Tuesday league structure with 5 rounds, 6-week series, top-24 finals

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Strong positive sentiment toward Electric Bat as inspiration; other arcade operators cite Rachel's success as motivation for opening competing venues

    high · Cale: 'word got back to us that they're like, well, if Rachel can do it, then we can do it' leading to multiple arcade openings in Phoenix

  • ?

    content_signal: Electric Bat Cast positioning as operator-focused alternative to rumor/news-heavy pinball media; audience explicitly requesting 'nuts and bolts' operational content over speculation

    high · Cale: 'So many people reached out and said they were really sick and tired of pinball news, pinball opinions, and pinball rumors. and we were giving them the real nuts and bolts'

  • $

    market_signal: Arizona pinball market saturated with league options; players can choose between multiple leagues on same nights with daily tournament/event opportunities

    high · Rachel: 'you can play a league every night of the week' with 'two leagues on the same night' requiring player choice

  • ?

    operational_signal: Marco Specialties employees and contacts create tight-knit pinball community with strong personal relationships facilitating business partnerships and ventures

    high · Emoto recruited at show, moved to Marco; Rachel/Cale met at Marco; multiple ongoing friendships with industry figures

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.186

0:00
Primus. There you go. Just say Primus. We just saw Primus. We did see Primus last week. Oh, nice to see Primus. Yeah, it was a main. You guys game? Yeah, we have to agree to something before I know what it is. It's like reassociating, right? The first one we received just didn't work. It was, it was just, it was terrible. It was terrible. You've got to think between Kale and I.
0:36
Hello, my name is Jamie Birchall, and you are listening to and are watching our podcast called Wormhole Pimple Presents. And today I am very excited to be joined by my co-host, Donovan Wade. That's me. And two awesome guests all the way from Arizona, Rachel and Kale of the Electric Backcast Podcast. How are you? Good. How are you? We are so excited. He's nervous. He's a little nervous. Don't be nervous. Because he's been fanboy. He's your fanboy. He loves you two. Oh, thank you. So that's why you're doing this. I want you guys to interact with him. He loves all your shit. He is fanboy. Now, I love you. Jamie has no idea who we are. No, I know who you are. I'm just saying that this guy really knows who you are. Okay. You ready? Yeah, I'm ready. So this is the first podcast that we've done. This is actually exciting for us because it's number 25. What a century. So it's what we thought, since there's four of us, that we would alternate between Donovan and I just asking you guys informal questions and just go from there, if that's okay. Yeah. All right. I like to start with origin stories when I interview people. All right. And I know you both worked at Marco Specialties. I know it's where you both met. but when did you both discover pinball?
1:59
90s, the 90s. But I don't think I really, you know, I didn't get into it hardcore until maybe 10, 15 years ago.
2:10
Right. I remember back in the day when I was a little, little kid, I had a neighbor who had a pinball machine in the garage, and I wish I could remember what it was. So I remember kind of like, you know, just hitting the ball here and there. But like Rachel, I didn't really get into pinball until high school. So, you know, around like 91 or so, you know, when everybody got into pinball, it was like the pinball boom, you know, with Adam's Family, Twilight Zone, Judge Dredd, Indiana Jones. I grew up in a rural area of South Carolina, so we didn't have much going on there. But video gambling was very huge. And so there was a local, a little shady gambling spot. And that's really where all the money came in. But, you know, the front was they would rent VHS tapes and they had a small arcade where we'd play, you know, Neo Geo and, you know, the cool pinball machines at the time.

  • Phoenix experiences extreme summer heat (110+ degrees) making outdoor activity dangerous, with March and October as peak tourism/event months

    high confidence · Cale: 'there are like two months where it's like living on Mars. You have to stay indoors. It's not safe to be outside.' March/October described as 'insane months'

  • Electric Bat Cast Podcast started when Cale convinced Rachel to do one episode on his birthday after Jason took a break from Pinball Party podcast

    high confidence · Cale: 'We did one episode. Rachel wasn't even really into it...It was my birthday...I said, sit down right here'

  • “So many people reached out and said they were really sick and tired of pinball news, pinball opinions, and pinball rumors. and we were giving them the real nuts and bolts.”

    Cale @ not specified — Describes Electric Bat Cast's unique positioning as operator-focused content vs. industry rumor/news

  • “I walked out, and I opened the door. This is the middle of the day. There's only like two or three people playing in the arcade. And I look in there, and I'm like, I close the door. I walk back in. I was like, Rachel, Ray Day is in there playing Rick and Morty.”

    Cale @ not specified — Anecdote about pro player Ray Davis visiting Electric Bat unannounced during league night setup

  • “The first one we received just didn't work. It was, it was just, it was terrible.”

    Rachel or Cale @ beginning of episode — Reference to machine quality issue, though context is unclear from transcript

    • Arizona Pinball Players League
    organization
    ZapConevent
    Pinball Party podcastmedia
    Electric Bat Cast Podcastmedia
    Ray Davisperson
    Markperson
    John Schoppelperson
    Chewyperson
    Emotoperson
    Nancy and Mark Mandeltortperson
    Paul Mandeltortperson
    Houston Arcade Expoevent
    Colorado Riverlocation
  • ?

    content_signal: Quick, simple social media content consistently outperforms elaborate edited posts with production value

    medium · Cale notes 'quick and dirty, dumbest thing you can think of ends up being the most popular thing' vs week-long production efforts getting minimal engagement

  • ?

    venue_signal: Electric Bat reaching physical capacity at Tempe location (62 machines max) and may need to sell machines due to new game influx from multiple manufacturers

    high · Cale states 'we're going to have to sell some machines to make room' due to number of manufacturers making games

  • ?

    venue_signal: Electric Bat successfully operating dual locations with different business models: Tempe as dedicated arcade (62 pins) vs Flagstaff as location pinball in bar (~12 pins)

    high · Cale describes operational differences and expansion of Tempe location three times since opening

    • 3:16
    So how did you go from working for Marco to starting an arcade in what year was that? Like, how do you make that jump? Well, actually, it overlapped. So I started, the arcade is about five and a half years old. Okay. About five and a half years ago.
    3:36
    There is a dive bar, Yucca Tap Room, and they wanted to have an arcade. They wanted to have pinball and all that stuff as a way to keep people drinking. And so they asked around and kept trying to find somebody that would that could do this. And everybody just kept pointing them to me. They came to me and I I eventually acquiesced and said, OK, at first I didn't want to do it because, you know, it's a it is a ton of work. And I was already, you know, I had a full time painting career. I didn't have any interest in in switching gears, but something happened. I said yes, and then the rest is history. A couple months after that, Kale came along.
    4:22
    I mean, you know, and yeah. All right, Donovan, your turn. So I don't think I've ever heard you guys explain, where does the name Electric Bat Arcade come from?
    4:35
    I don't know if you can tell by looking, but I kind of like dark things, old school goth. and so bats are kind of natural but pinball it's it's an electric bat flipper bat yeah oh flipper bats okay cute uh and logo i mean i love the logo uh you know it's it's kind of like iconic i mean and you know i told jamie when we first started and we were you know kind of building things up you know we're never gonna be big until we have a logo he told me just wait we should probably We got something coming. And people are always asking, you know, where do we get merch? You know, they can grasp onto the logo. And I think yours is just like that. I mean, I know at Houston Arcade Expo this last year, I saw tons of electric bat stuff there. So, Rachel, I know you're in art. Were you in charge of that design? Yeah. I drew a couple things out one night just real quick. And then the next day, the chef in the kitchen at the time, this, like, metal rocker guy was like, hey, Tim, which ones of these do you like best? He's like, that's the one. I mean, it was really just, it was very quick. It came in, you know, an evening. Yeah.
    5:55
    Well, why Arizona? I mean, like I say, I know, Kyle, you were born in New Orleans. Is that correct? You guys have done your research, huh?
    6:05
    The rest of the Wikipedia is. I'm telling you. I'm the editor of the Wikipedia. He's your fanboy. If you go missing, and I'll get you all the information because that's who took you. Yeah. So I was born in New Orleans, and I spent most of my entire life in the southeast. I spent most of my childhood in New Orleans, moved to Atlanta, Charlotte, and then ended up in Columbia, South Carolina, where I actually Lexington, South Carolina, which is a suburb of Columbia, both very small places. But anyway, I went to high school there and did a bunch of stuff. After high school, like as soon as I got out of high school, I formed a band with some friends. And I did that for a decade. We actually toured around. And it was really fun, quite an experience. All of my other friends were going to college, right? And I'm like basically in a circus. And I survived that. and I'm glad I got it out of my system early on because I would never want to do that. I mean, it's just living out of a van. It's super fun when you're 18 years old. Wouldn't want to do it now. And that's the only way to make money in music. You have to tour. Yeah.
    7:30
    So me and you have both done the weird artist lifestyle. So we've certainly been on the beans and rice side of things. or the rock stop.
    7:41
    And then, so the band, we got a lot of label interest, but we wanted to do things independently, and I'm glad we did because nobody could tell us what to do. And after 10 years, we were just tired of it and stopped. And a lot of our bandmates have gone on to do things like work with Phish and a lot of other huge rock acts. And I went a different direction uh work uh i was a personal assistant to a nationally known attorney for a while and got to see a lot of crazy stuff and then um i i i didn't have a job for a second i was i was hanging out of the house living off some savings and a friend of mine said man i i she was uh selling dumpsters. And she walked in this place and talked to a lady about a dumpster service, trash service for them, and they said they were looking for a graphic designer. And I worked as an art director. I passed up that part. I was an art director for a while at a Christian packaging place, which was kind of weird for me, but it was a lot of fun. And so. Ducking some little wrapping paper. I hid all kinds of stuff in there. That was fun. but my friend comes over to my house and is like, there is a place right around the corner from you that is looking for a graphic designer, and you're going to freak out. I was like, what do they do? And they said they sell pinball parts. And I was like, that's still a thing?
    9:17
    You know, where I lived, there was no place to play pinball. You know, after the 90s, during the boom, I thought pinball was dead. And so they're like, they want to talk to you now. So I got in the car and went there. I met Nancy and Mark Mandeltort and they brought me in and it was it's just this nondescript warehouse, just this white warehouse. It didn't even say Marco anywhere. I walked in there. I was like, holy shit, what is this? And they said that we are the biggest pinball parts distributor and manufacturer in the world. and I was like this is this is insane I started working for him that week and I was um I was re doing a lot of artwork um you know a lot of stuff you can't find anymore a lot of the stuff they still sell at Marco I was the one who redrew all that stuff um and then we started working closely with Stern I got to know a lot of Stern folks and um that's where I ended up meeting rachel and the question was why arizona and it was because i had started the arcade like really right when we met and the arcade was in phoenix and then we got married a couple weeks later and then um he you know we kind of i did the back and forth thing for about a year yeah and then it it was crazy it didn't make sense to do that anymore so one of us had to move somewhere so he needed to come to arizona i'm in arizona because i've lived here since my parents moved me here in 1981.
    10:47
    Yeah. I gladly moved out here. It's, you know, I lived in a, like, super, super conservative area, and this was a breath of fresh air. This Phoenix is beautiful. So you have two locations, right? You have one in Tempe and Flagstaff, and there's about 160 miles difference. It's about a two and a half hour drive. So it's like a podcast and a half. And 8,000 feet. Oh, and, yeah, well, the elevation, yeah, we go from like 1,200 to 7,500 feet in elevation. So I love Flagstaff. That is one of my favorite cities. I've never been to Tempe or Phoenix, but I did go to the Grand Canyon a few times, and we stayed at Flagstaff. It's pretty amazing, right? Have you been to the Grand Canyon? Oh, yeah. Yes. So we, okay, just wait. Give me 20 seconds. By the way, I like how you measure things in podcast. That's good.
    11:47
    So during COVID, him and Christine, who are the owners of the wormhole, they went to and did the 15 day Colorado River. Oh, amazing. That is an experience. Your dad's doing that. My dad's doing that in another like a couple of weeks from now. Well, I'm doing it again in 2025. that's how unbelievable it is. I went, I did eight days. We walked down Bright Angel and met them after they were gone seven days. My wife and I, she just doesn't want to go outside in the toilet in the grouper for 15 days. It's called the grouper.
    12:27
    We've been talking about it with my dad for a while about the peeing and pooping. You know what? They filled you with so much coffee you're going to hit the grouper at 6 a.m. It is clockwork. I'm telling you. It's no worries. And it's so amazing that two years later we were able to get to Phantom Ranch. So we got a cabin at Phantom.
    12:50
    And then that was so amazing. We fished the Colorado. I caught rainbow trout and brown trout. I mean, come on. Right? Yeah. And then we're going again. Now we're going to do 15. So I convinced Janine. So it's me, Janine, my wife, and then Tim and Christine. and then John Spates is going. So the whole warm hole five of us are going to do the Colorado river again and that grand Canyon. Yes. So anybody listening right now, you have to stop what you're doing and plan a trip to the grand Canyon because photos and videos do it. No justice. Yeah. If you get chills standing on the edge, I mean, it's like the difference between like seeing a movie of somebody getting sucked up by a spaceship and being the person sucked up. It's not even comparable, seeing it in images. It's a spiritual place for me to geek out. One more minute. It really, really is. That's why I keep going back. I've walked down Kaibab. My wife and Christine both did a Rim to Rim from North Kaibab to Bright Angel. In one day, they did it, those two. and I've walked down Kaibab. I'll never walk up Kaibab. That's ridiculous. But I've walked up Friday. Anyway, thank you for dealing with me in the Grand Canyon.
    14:20
    National Park Talk. That's good. Damn, I love that place. Okay. How many shows a year did you do at Marco?
    14:28
    Gosh, I think in the peak, like 16 shows a year. I mean, I was on the road all the time. So what was your favorite show? Oh, depends on the year. Okay. And I know they're different for us. Any standout? How about that? Yeah.
    14:48
    TPF, Northwest, Expo. I mean, all for different reasons. And probably California Extreme and Pinnagogo. I've never been to the Houston show. Caveat. Those are all your favorites. And I've never done, shit, what's the one that's on the East Coast with the Amish? Oh, that's in Allentown. Yes, I've never done Allentown. What's it called, Pissast or something like that? That's a great one. I have a clear favorite and it Houston Arcade Expo I mean that is if it has a different there no show that has a vibe like that Hanging out with like Charlie and Keith all night long I mean, that's a show where you get one hour of sleep, get up, meet up at the buffet and do it again. I mean, it is, I don't know how. It's my favorite. Well, I'm biased. Okay. I think that show always conflicted with whatever show I was doing on the West Coast. They would send the party team to that show. Yeah, I'm not in the party team. Yeah, you would go to the team.
    16:02
    Hey, I'm the one that makes sure that everything happens. My second favorite show was MGC, but before it moved. Back when it was in the hotel. Playing in the bathroom. Yeah, the games in the bathroom. They would take over a hotel. Right, right, right, right. That too. But that was such an amazing vibe. And it's not the same since they moved to a big convention center.
    16:31
    Because it felt like the Houston show. It was just a bunch of people getting together and partying all night long. And we'd all end up in the basement playing werewolves. And I remember I got a chair thrown at me one time.
    16:45
    They thought I cheated. But I just told them I cheated to try to solve the mystery. And one guy got mad and threw a chair at me, and me and Marco kind of ducked, and everybody went about their business. Oh, I'm excited to play Werewolf because we have game night here at the Wormhole. Oh, that's what you guys were talking about. Yeah, I'm going to play Werewolf.
    17:04
    Hopefully no one throws a chair at us. Bolt them down. All right, your turn, sir. So tell me a little bit about the scene in Phoenix. I mean, has it always been this big or do you think you guys have like, is it blown up since you started, like say a few years back? I think like maybe pre-COVID versus where you guys are now.
    17:26
    Ten years ago, more than 10 years ago, a little over 10 years ago, I joined the Arizona Pinball Players League, which was the local league. And it was capped at 30 people and you go around, you know, a different house each month. and we at the beginning of that I don't think there was even 30 people in it but the guys that started that I think that was really the seeds of what exploded later but around that time I also co-founded ZapCon which is the pinball and arcade show out here and that also helped to grow it I think that there was just a lot of things coming together at once. I think we certainly played a part in it. One thing that I know that I did kind of by accident is after I started Electric Bat,
    18:21
    there was a lot of guys around town that just, you know, word got back to us that they're like, well, if Rachel can do it, then we can do it, which, you know, is a bit of an insult. But it's just a tiny. Some are still around and some aren't. them or not um yeah so so there was a lot of like whoa man she's doing it she's living the dream so like why not me and so a lot of places opened up fairly shortly after we did and i know that that some of that was time you know there was a lot of different things that went into that um but now there are so many different arcades just in the phoenix area you can play a league every night of the week um and some nights you have to choose if you want to be in a There are two leagues on the same night. So there's tons of leagues, tons of events, tournaments every single day of the month.
    19:14
    Ours are huge. Our league night is gigantic. How many? Between 100 and 120 people every single day. Gemini Christmas.
    19:25
    How long does that take? It's five rounds of group match play. So unless somebody has an insanely long game, we go from like 630 to nine. We do a six-week series, and then the top 24 battle it out in the finals. That's awesome. That's like a whopper farm. It's about 85 whoppers to the winner. Yeah.
    19:49
    And as far as we know, I mean, we've asked people and we've looked at some data. I believe we are the largest single-location pinball league in the entire world. There are, I think in the Northwest, there are bigger leagues, but they're spread out for multiple locations.
    20:07
    Yeah, so we just, what was it like yesterday or the day before? We were in the office, and I walked out, and I opened the door. This is the middle of the day. There's only like two or three people playing in the arcade. And I look in there, and I'm like, I close the door. I walk back in. I was like, Rachel, Ray Day is in there playing Rick and Morty. Are you sure? Yeah, she runs out there. So we talked to him, and we tell him. It was our league night. They were like, hey, will you please play? And he's like, yeah, well, I might. No, no, no. He had to go do something. He asked about how many people would show up. They were like anywhere from 100 to 120. He's like, how? On a Tuesday? We're like, yeah. That's it. All you had to do was catch a plane. Yeah. Stop. Negotiable. And, you know, Ray Day is a very analytical person. He's like, man, that's like 80-something whoppers, you know. Yeah. So I think this is one of the biggest whopper farms around. Awesome. Do things like ever, you know, I know we're in the south here, so there's not really seasons, but do things ever, you know, fluctuate between winter and summer? I know out there you guys have a lot of big events, like you had the Final Four, and you'd mentioned spring training baseball. Like, are there any times of the year where you see more traffic than? March and October are just insane months in Phoenix. It's like everybody's doing everything all the time. so you i mean there's just going to be a lot of things going on and also february and november summertime people don't plan much of anything big that would be crazy you know it's 120 degrees it's hard to even just like get from your house to your car um we still keep league going and people show up uh but we don't do any big events and nobody nobody does right yeah it'd be like yeah that's something i really had to get used to because you know i grew up in the south and people say it's hot. That's not hot. I mean, this is, there are like two months where it's like living on Mars. You have to stay indoors. It's not safe to be outside. Same as Minnesota in January. Well, right.
    22:15
    It's pretty hot here. It's pretty humid, too. It'll punch you right in the mouth. We have no humidity. It is different. And people think that that's better, and it night it like when the sun is not out 110 out here is totally fine and pleasant but 83 degrees in intense sun out here like you are starting to get like like it it hurts it physically hurts um so yeah it's all different and people people love it when i talk about the weather no that's yeah you ever read a song yeah so uh i i know you mentioned on one of your recent podcast that you're kind of at capacity in Tempe. What is your max machines you guys can put in there? Well, right now we have just pinball. We have some other, we have rhythm games and some stand-up arcades. And because of the layout of the arcade, it would be really difficult to switch those to pins just because of the width of those rooms. I think there are 62 pinball machines on the floor right now. And, yeah, we could mess around with some configurations, but that's really about the max. In Flagstaff, I lay there? Flagstaff, there's like a dozen or so. That's a much smaller – the Flagstaff location is more like location pinball in a bar. The Tempe location is like a self-enclosed – it's an arcade. That is a special, special place. You go there and you know that you are in an electric bat. But we are running into an issue with, I mean, there's so many manufacturers making games.
    23:58
    We're going to, we don't usually do this, but there's going to be a point where we're going to have to sell some machines to make room.
    24:06
    And that's going to be tough. I don't know that that's going to happen. I might just start soldiering.
    24:13
    Getting some racks. Well, speaking of those non-pins, I mean, you'd mentioned rhythm games. What is the deal with those? I tried to play one the other day. Then you just start like, yeah, they're hard. I cannot do them. They're like a younger person's game or someone more coordinated than myself.
    24:34
    Our friend Chewy runs all of the – they're all Japanese rhythm games, and I'm always just amazed when I see people playing them. I don't know how your hand-eye coordination – Like, I can't even see as quickly as what they're, like, seeing and pushing the buttons or, you know, depending on the game, whatever they're doing. I don't know how you do it, but it's impressive. It's cool to watch. And it's funny to try. If you're not good at it, then it's really fun to get a group of, like, four of you that just really suck and, you know, make fools of yourself. And it's so interesting to have that in the electric bat also because that scene is so very different than the pinballers. and the rhythm kids have come in and tried to get in the pinball.
    25:19
    There's a few, but most of them just die hard just slamming quarters into these Japanese machines. Yeah.
    25:29
    Is there a lot of maintenance that goes into those? I mean, I know you guys take a lot of your games. Do you have other techs that come in and work on the pinball machines or other techs that need to work on those things? So the rhythm games, Chewy handles all of the tech side of that. I mean, if it's coin jams and stuff, I'll take care of it. Or simple, like, you know, if it's something physical that I can, you know, replace a button, something like that. That's obvious. But a lot of it is, like, server-side issues and software-based stuff. And I have no idea what's going on there. And I'm not any of the account holders for any of that stuff. So he handles it and he's very good and very on top of stuff. So we're super grateful for him. For the pins, Cale and I are the main techs for it. And then our friend Mark, who is one of the co-founders of that original Arizona Pinball League that I joined a long time ago. So we've been friends for a while. He's got some machines in Electric Bat, and he helps tech. And then also our friend John Schoppel, who is a brilliant, brilliant tech. And he comes in. He's our Wednesday relief. So on Wednesdays, we get to be talking to you right now because he's there making things work. Trying to get Looney Tunes to work.
    26:50
    We're working the bugs out. Oh, nice. It is a fun shooter, though. Whenever it gets all smoothed out, I will feel good about it.
    27:03
    All right, my turn, right? I had a moto on the podcast a couple of weeks ago. Do you guys still keep in touch with the friends that you made at Marco? 100%. Yeah, she was out not too long ago. So I have a funny story about why Emoto is working at Marco. What show were we at? Nashville. We were in Nashville. Which was the same show that you and I met at in person. Right, right. This was a magical weekend. Yes, so. In November of 2018. Yeah, I had a room all to myself. And I talked Emoto into coming to the show, and I was like, there's an extra bed. You can stay in my room. And so we did our thing, did the booth and all that good stuff, and she was just there to hang out.
    27:50
    But Paul Mandeltort at Marco Specialties hired a video guy, an audiovisual guy, to start to document some of the stuff that was going on and to interview his dad, Mark, and so then that's Emoto's background so I was like would you please like come back to South Carolina with us and help us with this project like I'll talk to I'll get you some money for it and all this stuff and so I ended up kidnapping her bringing her to mark those specialties and then she's been there ever since and she worked on the documentary with those folks and we had a great time I remember it was you guys all stayed at my house. It was you, Emoto, and Antoinette. Yep. And we spent the weekend together, and that's where I got to know Rachel. Yeah. That is just bringing the world together. Right. Yeah, and Emoto and I had already known each other previously, so Emoto and I were already friends, and Cale and Emoto were already friends. So, I mean, it all just worked out. It was a really, that was such a cool time. All right, Donovan, your turn.
    29:04
    All right. So I know you guys from social media mostly, but when I started our Instagram, you guys were obviously one of the first people we followed. I remember we were doing one of our first streams and there was a guy in the chat and he was like, oh, you know, I love this place. I wish I lived closer to you guys. bubble and I was like where do you live he's like I just moved to Phoenix I was like you need to go to Electric Bell so I know I've been following you guys for a while but social media what are your feelings on it do you think it's fun I mean you guys post a lot of stuff or is it just kind of a necessary evil to get your name out there and no I uh that's all me it is 99.5 percent kale and I um yeah if you ask us each of that question it's very different answers. I'm not as much of a people person as Cale. I mean, I like people fine, but I'm just not outgoing in the same way that he is.
    30:02
    My relationship with social media is more like, I know I'm supposed to do this. And sometimes it's fun. I'm talking about my personal stuff, but I tend to be more like keep to myself. And then when Cale came along, man, that is the greatest thing that ever happened to me and Electric Matt. No, I absolutely love it. And I think to be a good social media person, you have to love it. Just like with pinball, if you want to open an arcade, you have to be an enthusiast. I think we've all seen those arcades where it's just some rich guy who bought a bunch of LEs and they play like shit because he's not an enthusiast. But I love social media. I love interacting with people. I love, I want to make people laugh. I want to entertain people. And I've been that way my whole life. I was the class clown. I was the one that they had to put out in the hallway you know on my desk you know and I was out there with you man We still doing and and I was out there with you Yeah I was out there with you And I started doing this on MySpace to promote my band So it was like, I've been doing this for a long, long time. I mean, it's like kind of one of the pioneers of social media marketing. I was the first one was Photoshop and doing, you know, crazy, you know, photos and videos on myspace and now i now i get to do it here and and you know blow this stuff up and just show people what fun it is to hang out at a pinball arcade you know and i you know promote you know all kinds of arcades i just want people to go out and find their local pinball arcade and just and then play the shit out of these things yeah does it surprise you sometimes the things you post what people like and what people don't like. Because I know you had Jen Rupon a few months ago. She mentioned something that really hit home with me. And I'll come up with these posts that are elaborate and it's got edits and it's got music and this and that. And then I'll post a video of somebody who's dancing while playing a game. Like, like, like, like, like. Yes. All right. Yeah, it's usually the quick and dirty, dumbest thing you can think of ends up being the most popular thing. And you're like, you know, something you worked a week on. Yeah, it's like, you know, like 10 likes, you know, like, what the hell? I can't look at it anymore. So same thing with with anything, though. I imagine the same thing happens in music. I know it happens in art. There's paintings that I spent like a thousand hours on. And, you know, people appreciate it like, oh, that's really great or whatever. but you know again this this logo that i kind of like just drew without even thinking about it there's like dozens of people that have it tattooed on them and you know i see shirts everywhere and i'm like man this is like i didn't even think about this like it was just you know and i think that you know it just came out and uh of all of the things uh you know of the career that's the most notable. Wow, that's bizarre. It does cross over to other areas. About the podcast, like I said, I followed you on social media. I think the first time I probably heard you guys was on Jason's podcast before you guys started coming out with you. What was the impetus to branch out on your own? Well, Jason took a break and it was great. We hooked up with Jason And people really enjoyed the view of the pinball operator. Nobody was doing it.
    33:46
    And so once Jason was like, you know, I'm going to take a break, guys. So we bought some equipment. Well, actually, we already had some equipment from doing this stuff with Jason. And we decided to do our own thing. We did one episode.
    34:01
    Rachel wasn't even really into it. I set everything up, and she had the day off, and I was like, sit down. It was my birthday. It was your birthday. And I said, sit down right here, and I'm going to ask you some questions. And I already had questions from viewers from the Pinball Party podcast. So I just used those, and people really liked it. And the best thing is so many people reached out and said they were really sick and tired of pinball news, pinball opinions, and pinball rumors. and we were giving them the real nuts and bolts. Yeah. And luckily, you know, after we did it, the Wedgehead podcast guys do it, and that's great. Go check them out. And you guys are doing a similar thing. It's not just like rumors. It's stuff we know about. Getting to know folks in the industry. And I love the way Pinball Media is headed. I do too. I wish it paid a little more. so i love the idea of the earnings report when did you come up with that was i doing that on pinball party i think i was you know jason just asked if i came up with it or he asked yeah it just seemed i mean i keep track of all kinds of data anyway i just love data so just a matter of looking it up sharing it with everybody and it's been really fun to to publicly share that we had some people in the arcade yesterday they came up to me and were talking about how you know they like they enjoy the podcast and really love the earnings report and it was a couple and they listened to it together and it was like oh yeah those top ones those are the ones that we go and like we're the ones affecting the earnings report and uh it's funny to see how people feel about it too whether or not they're surprised or or make sense yeah Or how Godzilla could always stay at the top. And it's fun to talk to operators to see how similar or different their earnings are. We'll talk about that later because I have John's earning report. This has got 21 machines. So I said, hey, give me your earning report. He goes, well, give me your earning report. You know what I'm talking about. You know, I think that is important to keep in mind, you know, being an operator. I know we had Nick Lane down here a few weeks ago. Yeah. And I was, like, bouncing ideas for games. That was another fanboy for you. I love Nick Lane. Yeah, he's a good guy. I wish they did their podcast more often. It's like once a month. What are they doing? I'm waiting for the new one. Come on, Nick. Let's go. Come on, bro. Let's go. that is a good good pie i love the way nick just he doesn't hold anything back well here's my question here's my question okay you're too few in the park uh i have a tough time mentioning pinball companies okay uh especially like we got a new in box game didn't work properly all right you guys do not have that problem uh has a manufacturer reached out to you directly and said, hey, I heard your comments?
    37:14
    Yes. Oh, big time. Yeah. And we talked about it on the podcast. I mean, American Pinball. I don't even know how they're still around. But when we – Can I say that the comments of Rachel and Cale do not necessarily reflect those of the Wormhole. And I will make that known in the – Yeah. All right. Continue. All right. My bad. Sorry about that. So, yeah. so we got a Galactic Tank Force the first one we received just didn't work it was just it was terrible you gotta think between Cale and I and doing all of the show circuit we have unboxed we have personally unboxed hundreds well actually in one night at MGC it was an 18 wheeler full of NIB Stern Iron Maidens. Black Knights.
    38:11
    No, we did Iron Maidens one time. We bought an 18-wheeler full of them. Regardless, we've done this a lot. We did with Black Knight, too. So we've seen occasionally games, there's issues with some games out of the box. I mean, it's just happens. Most of them are very fixable quickly with some parts. This Galactic Tank Force was unlike anything either of us had ever seen. I mean, it was unplayable in so many different facets. I mean, it was just like the lemon of all lemons.
    38:48
    We've played Homebrews more reliable than this thing. Homebrews, yes. I mean, you get the point. And they reached out to us, and we ended up getting a replacement game because this one – and you've heard other people talk about Galactic Take Force. We reached out to them to try to get it fixed, and they refused. Many times. And then David Fix called us. After we called him twice and he ghosted us, he said, my friends have been listening to your podcast and heard about your terrible ordeal. I want to fix it. I'm shipping you a brand-new machine.
    39:29
    Kudos. very rarely will a manufacturer do that at all we didn't even have to return the other one there's like here we're sending you this well the distributor returned it we didn't have well exactly they didn't let us keep it but it wasn't like hey we're going to wait until we get the other one they were just like here take it and now that's the one we have I'm going to tell you our black bang for a story okay and so we get Tim and Christine get the signature edition number four comes in. And we like unboxings. We don't do it like you guys do all the time. So we do an unboxing. And Donovan's got his – we're kicking ass on this unboxing, which we go to put the turret head on. Oh, yeah.
    40:23
    We go to put the turret head on. We can't get it on. we can't get it on because they gave us the wrong screws right okay we're not putting the turret on tonight no big deal let's put the what are the side things on little threads okay let's put the threads on so we get the instructions it was as if someone printed them off on their home computer and they lost the color and it's just like the pink you know what i'm saying yeah it's like a big meter graph and so i'm like all right how do you put this together well thank god we had some engineers here that nine g one of them works for another and uh we got it together we got it to work so we texted david fix christine texted david fix to send us the wrong screws fedex one day we got the screws right and then we had a lot of issues. We couldn't... The virtual locks aren't working. Every game that comes through the warm wall, guys, it has to play in tournaments because that's all we're open for. And for rentals, that's it. That's our business model. So it has to be banged on in tournaments. And it can't be banged on when the virtual locks aren't working and the lab shot's not working. It's the same for you guys. You're out of location. Yeah, same thing, right? It's got to work. You're not in your house. So we were at TPF, and we saw David Fix, and he said, look, I know you're having these issues. Thank you for working with us. The new code update, 24-8-whatever, is going to fix all these. And God bless him. It does. And, you know, we're banging the hell out of it. I put four games on it before I got here just to make sure. Everything's good? Everything's really good. So it sounds like you think it was more of a manufacturing issue, like something was just put together wrong on this. The first one, yes. The second one, the issues, we have the same issues that everybody had, right? You had to put it on virtual locks because the physical locks did not work. Right. And we updated to the new code as well, and so now we have physical locks. It's still buggy. Our games are on for 20 to 22 hours a day, so that's a lot to ask of some electronics. and so I think that's the origin of a lot of the issues that we see that other people don't see. It does occasionally lock up. Yesterday I had to – it was kind of freaking out and I had to restart it and refund some people, but they did get many of the – the locks work now, I guess we'll say that. I don't know how much more. We don't use it in tournaments. It's still not reliable enough for me to use in tournaments, but I think it's such a for me it's such a cool looking game and I really enjoy the theme and I just want it to work so bad yeah things will work this one is it is it's paints it's got little paint everywhere and it's got the signatures and it really is a beautiful machine and Tim is and you I mean you love Oktoberfest and another thing about Oktoberfest We have an Oktoberfest. The board popped out. Maurice, I know Maurice is getting a lot of crap from some other podcasts. Maurice sent a new Oktoberfest board for us. So John's going to put that out on location. So it is what, you know, God bless him. Yeah, yeah. We rolled the dice on Galactic Tank Force. Actually, I mean, we were actually really excited about it because our last American pinball machine was Hot Wheels. And that was one of the most reliable machines we've ever had, but it was built by a completely different team. I don't think anybody from the company is still there from Hot Wheels. Hot Wheels was so reliable when the – what was the resort that called us? The Phoenician. The Phoenician called us because there was a VIP staying there from the NFL, and they wanted a pinball machine. And I didn't feel like moving it, so I gave them some outrageous price. I was like, yeah, I'll do it for $800 a month. And they were like, can you come today? And I was like, oh, shit. yet now you're gone no so we took hot wheels hot wheels down there for five months we took hot wheels that had it on free play kids were you know beating the shit out of this thing never an issue all i had to do was rebuild the flippers um but the thing just ran it was a tank clean it yeah i'd like to be a pinball consultant that's my next job oh geez i heard this you heard this the other day don't you think i could do it i go to these companies and i go all right here's a deal, American Pinball, you have a guy named Steve Bowden that works there, right? I know Steve Bowden. I've met Steve Bowden. I've called tournaments next to Steve Bowden. This guy's brilliant. Yes. Okay? Let's unleash Steve Bowden in American Pinball, and let's let Steve Bowden decide a game. I don't know. That's my personal opinion, and for that, you owe me $350 an hour. Right, right. Yeah, we had the same conversation on our last podcast because of the rumors that they have the masters of the universe my yeah i heard you had a panic attack yes not just i mean yes a lot no it's okay you know i was like we were listening i was driving back from mideola with john spates and we were listening to it and john pauses and goes oh she's not happy yeah still that rachel really does want to help them she even reached out to them when we got galactic cane force was like oh man these guys need some help and uh you know i mean they're not going to take it. But you're right. I mean, your point, it is the weirdest thing. We have spent a lot of time with Steve Bowden. He knows what's good, and he knows what's bad. And it's weird that he doesn't have more input there. They need a Chris Turner.
    46:18
    Oh, Chris Turner is amazing. So I just interviewed Chris, and this is another shameless plug for me. But you know what Chris does Chris comes up and he says hey this is a whiteboard A whiteboard It a whiteboard Whatever Yeah okay Okay Here give us advice Hammer me And he takes it I can take it Shut up. You talk too much on the podcast. I'm done for two weeks. We met him at Expo when he first showed off. And I'm sorry.
    46:51
    What's the ninja name? Ninja Eclipse. The one without the coin door. and we talked to him for a while and we were both impressed like he really wanted our input and we're like no coin door is a deal breaker um and i can't remember what else we said but he like he really did all the stuff i mean he he was like okay i'm going back to the drawing board and yeah and uh you know fixing these issues it's important to be able to check your ego i think something I don't know about Chris Turner like personally, but I imagine just from other people that I know that he has something else that he does really well and can take pride in. So he's a lot more, you know, people that can do that are more receptive to like, here's this other thing I'm interested in. And it doesn't matter if people tell me this is not good because I know I'm really, really good at this other thing. So this is not hurting my ego. This is really helping me become a better whatever I'm trying to do. Well said. I want to play a little game with you guys if you want it.
    47:57
    Going back to I loved when Jason on the Pinball Party podcast, he kind of does some fun stuff. So you guys game? I have to agree to something before I know what it is. It's rapid reassociation, right? We're just going to ask you a question. Go ahead, ask the first question, and then... So just imagine you're at your psychiatrist's office. You've just done your reward fact test. It's just free association. I'm going to throw a couple things out. You tell me whatever comes to mind first. Give me one word. You can elaborate. Okay, we'll go with it, all right? You ready? This is great. Let's go.
    48:32
    Elwynn or Papaduke? Elwynn. Oh, yeah, Elwynn. Yeah, I'm Papaduke. Me too. Yeah, I am. All right, harder pin to work on, Doctor Who or Whitewater? we actually uh jesus that's gotta be dr that elevator yeah whitewater's gonna take you forever but dr who's gonna take your hand off all right so this isn't the best band pinball machine i want to know what is the best band that has a pinball machine well we have very different musical tastes I'm curious to see what you will say I mean I have to say Rush I mean Maiden you think Maiden? I mean I like Maiden too but like technically I mean Rush technically is not what pays the bills it's like does it get you going Right, right, right. Yeah. Okay, mine was worst band to get their own pinball machine.
    49:39
    Ooh. Primus. There you go. Just say Primus. We just saw Primus. Yeah, it was Maynard from Tool. It was his 60th birthday party. It was Pussifer, Primus and A Perfect Circle. Amazing show. It was an incredible show. Yeah.
    50:00
    Sorry, I shit all over them. All right, your turn. Oh, they didn't answer. Oh, yeah. What's your worst? I don't know.
    50:09
    Aerosmith? For me, my least liked is Aerosmith. Yeah. Oh. Yeah. That's a winner. All right. Worst summer, Phoenix, Arizona, or New Orleans, Louisiana? Phoenix.
    50:23
    Yeah, it's got to be Phoenix. You can't even go outside. At least, you know, when it's 100 degrees in New Orleans, even though it's 100% humidity, at least you can go outside.
    50:34
    Best pinball show. You're not going to hurt feelings, Tom. I'll say, mine's Houston. Awesome. Yeah. Way to go, Keith Christensen. I'll say Zapcon because that's where all my friends are. I was going to eliminate that. I don't give a plug. All right. Action button, yay or nay? Yay. Love it. Yeah. I can't do it. I say no on the action button. I'm so bad at pinball. All right. What Coen Brothers movie would make a good pinball machine? Besides Lebowski.
    51:16
    Did they do Raisin Arizona? Yeah. Well, there you go. Yeah. Circle. That's a done deal, right? That would hurt. Unless you think a circle is a funny shape. That would hurt my bank account. Janine loves that movie. Number scoop to hit when you have to. Is it a scoop on World Cup soccer or Metallica?
    51:43
    Metallica. I can hit Metallica pretty easy. I think it's World Cup. And we just got a World Cup, so I'm glad you're bringing it up. I know it's Jamie's favorite pin. Oh, boy. Do I love World Cup soccer? It's a cool one. And I am a big Papa Duke fan, but she is not, so she won't let me. I've wanted a Circus Voltaire forever. She won't let me get it. I've kind of warmed her up to Tales of Arabian Nights. Well, Tales of Arabian Nights is cool, but it's kind of a – it's not – like, for me, it's not a fun game to play after a fairly short one. So we have a world – we have a dog soccer, and I'm enjoying it. Dog soccer's great. All right. Oh, yeah, Sun Devils or Wildcats? Sun Devils.
    52:27
    I went to, that's ASU. I don't even know what you're talking about. That's where I went to college. It's down the street from our arcade.
    52:35
    You're a foosball or bubble hockey? Bubble hockey. Thank you. I'm bubble hockey. So our bubble hockey, I rethemed. I took all the little guys, and one side I made the misfits, so they're all painted like the misfits, and the band, not like just ragtag people. and the other team is the zombies so i like you know dremeled off their heads and you know painted them all bloody gory so our bubble hockey school i like the usa versus ussr back in the day yeah canada that's a good one yeah yeah yeah we'll get that down here um yeah good thing you didn't retheme that tour uh arizona coyotes sorry about that a game that you yeah what's a game that you've never had at the bat that you'd love to have? Vikings. Viking, okay.
    53:26
    I want a Black Fever. He likes those. Yeah, he likes it. Did you see the – 20 seconds. Did you see the information I sent you guys of Tim's hands? Yes, yes, the link to his collection. Yeah, amazing. Did you look at any of those? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I can't. We'll geek about that. Brian, my editor, you have to cut that part out.
    53:52
    No. Okay, so more problematic He-Man character. Fisto or Tongue Lasher? I mean, Fisto is really, that's, you know. I have no idea what you're talking about. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a lot of, you know, He-Man is like, yeah, just. That's a Ram Man. I had him. I actually had that figure.
    54:22
    Yeah. Alright, last one. Best earning non-pinball machine. Suck it up. In other news of things you'd Yeah, it's our redemption machine. It's called a suck it up because instead of a claw, it has a vacuum.
    54:41
    Cool. It's like a little suction cup and we put all kinds of stuff. We put, what can we call those things? Water pipes? Yeah, fancy vases. Fancy smoking vases.
    54:55
    We used to have sex toys in there, but we stopped that. This is the best place on the planet. I have to get there.
    55:04
    This is a no-brainer for me. Do you see some toys? No. There's closer places to get those, I'm sure. Although, I haven't seen the laws about taxes. Well, you come in, You see the Grand Canyon. I'm going to go. Yeah, I'm definitely going to the Grand Canyon. So I'm definitely going to go there. And please come on a Tuesday night. League night will blow your mind. Absolutely. We're a three-hour side trip from the Grand Canyon. That's a no-brainer. That's a no-brainer for us. We'll definitely go. All right, thank you for playing that. That was fun. I appreciate that.
    55:37
    Last thing, John Spates is one of our founders of the Wormhole, and he's got 21 out. He wanted me to give you his three biggest earners. All right. So he's got Jaws Pro is number one.
    55:49
    Godzilla Premium is number two. But the surprise here is Rick and Morty. And Rick and Morty beat out Stranger Things, Star Wars, Deadpool, and Valhalla, believe it or not. I do believe that. Yeah. Are Rick and Morty. I was being a joke about the Kung Fu.
    56:11
    I threw that at you and you didn't catch it. You caught it. He did that. Well, I was like, wow, I don't see how that is, but okay.
    56:22
    Rick and Morty casuals love it, and it's so funny. Like, the call-outs are so good on that. Yeah, it prints money for them. He really, really likes it. They're actively looking for new bars and restaurants to put pins in. Any advice you can give them while we're winding down? A place where the bars and restaurants, the staff there, a place where those people also want it. Because the support of your staff and your team that isn't necessarily you fixing things, it's going to be the most important people to have on your side to help make it successful.
    56:58
    Yep. That is very, very, very good advice. Adequate power also. Yeah. Check that. Yeah. The last thing you want is throwing breakers all over the place. Right. That's no bueno. Please follow Electric Backcast on all socials and check out our latest episode, number 14, and you posted that just last week. You both have an absolute open invite to Houston, and I can't wait to go to Arizona and see you both and play. Please mark your calendars for the 2026 opening of the museum. We'll have 125 machines there. Very rare. It'll be about 13,000 square feet. Wow, that'll be great. Awesome. Can't wait. Yeah, I think it's going to be really, really awesome. So, Cale and Rachel, thank you so much. Continued success to you both. What a pleasure. This was great. Awesome. Are you okay? Did you do good? Bats were about. You all right? I'm good. I was worried about him today. He got stuck at the train, so he's running a little late. They came in all flustered. I'm like, listen, I know they're going to be cool. Don't worry about it.
    58:09
    Thank you so much for having us. This has been awesome. It was a lot of fun. I really appreciate it. Thank you for all you do for promoting pinball. And we really appreciate that. And we really appreciate your time. Thank you, guys. Thanks, guys. Thank you.
    58:24
    Wow, that was fun. What do you think? Jeez, great guys there. Great guys. I'm sorry. Oh, no, no, no, no. We're from New York. We say guys. Hey, guys, yeah. We can't help it. We don't mean anything by it. I do say y'all sometimes. I don't know.
    58:37
    Get out of here. My parents don't like it. You say y'all? I do. I say yous. You guys. I don't say the guys. So what are you guys doing? What are you guys doing? No, they were great. I mean, they're very open. They're very honest. They're very candid. They're very fun. They're just – You know, every podcast we do, I tell them I'm going, and now I'm going to Germany, and I'm going to Wisconsin. You actually aren't going to Arizona. But I really am going to Arizona anyway because I'm going to go on the Grand Canyon. So we're going to definitely put Electric Bat on the – we're going to go on 2025. But that would be something I'd love to go on a Tuesday soon, right? I mean, that would be an absolute blast. Even better any day. It seems like a – I just want to hang with them. Yeah, nice vibe. What do you think of my little script? Thanks. I like it. First time you saw the script. Get me on track there. Yeah, well, I got a script a couple times. but you did good yeah i like it so when are we taking that american pinball thing and putting it behind a paywall and putting it on patreon when are we doing a patreon thing let's do it now you want to do a patreon let's hit it up no not on your patreon but i i'm not disparaging anyone that does a patreon canada can do a patreon okay he's got you know a lot of money doing it and he hosts a lot and God bless them. I don't disparage anyone that does it. It's something that we're never going to do. Some people kind of do this for a living. I mean, and if you kind of do it for a living, you got to make some money somehow. I mean, I'd like to pay for the ZB ones. That would be nice.
    60:13
    What's in the next podcast? Choose successful women in pinball. I'm figuring out their schedules. I might go back to back. so 26 and 27 but I don't know who's going to be 26 and 27 so I can't announce that yet oh they're not coming on together did I not explain that very well not really I didn't but this is number 25 could you imagine that quick so please like subscribe all that crap you do a lot of work let's get some likes you do a lot of work let's pat each other on the back a little more how about discord If you're interested in joining our Discord, hit us up at wormholepinball at gmail.com, and I will send you a Discord invite. Just change your name so we know who you are. Okay.
    61:05
    You know, I don't want to have a Frogger. I don't know who the Frogger is, but, you know. I know who Frogger is. I do, too.
    61:12
    That's all she wrote, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you so much, man. I really appreciate that. Yeah. And we've got two more podcasts. And what's coming up stream-wise? We've got the 4X. Oh, Monday. So did we decide? I think it's Guns N' Roses, but it might be Rick and Morty. Oh, yeah. So we'll figure that out. Okay.
    61:32
    Of what we're going to stream next Monday. And then the 4X is coming up next, the first May, whatever, the first Saturday and back. Yeah. That's all she wrote. And our Toy Story we did the other day. That'll be up in a day or two. Yeah. And this will be up Friday the 26th. Awesome. All right. Thank you, Donovan. Appreciate it. That was great. Thank you to Rachel and Cale. That was awesome as well.