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Episode 204 - Williams Same Player Shoots Again Schematic

For Amusement Only EM and Bingo Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·12m 45s·analyzed·Oct 1, 2015
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.016

TL;DR

Williams SPSA schematic analysis: relay logic that keeps extra ball light on until points score.

Summary

Nick Baldridge analyzes the Williams "Same Player Shoots Again" schematic from Strata Flight, explaining how Williams machines keep the extra ball light illuminated until a point is scored, contrasting this with Bally and Gottlieb designs. The discussion is driven by listener Tim's detailed schematic research and observation about the superiority of Williams' approach in multiplayer games. Nick walks through the relay logic and circuit paths that enable this feature, crediting Tim's contribution to the show.

Key Claims

  • Williams Same Player Shoots Again light stays on until any point is scored on the subsequent extra ball

    high confidence · Tim, listener who contributed schematic research and observation

  • Bally and Gottlieb turn off the extra ball light on a drain, which can lead to accidentally playing the next player's ball on multiplayer games

    high confidence · Tim's observation and Nick's confirmation

  • Williams achieves this feature through a normally closed switch on the ball index relay and a lock-in circuit on the extra ball relay

    high confidence · Nick's schematic analysis of Strata Flight

  • The ball index relay holds in through multiple paths: the extra ball relay normally closed switch, the out-hole relay normally open switch, and the point relay normally open switches

    medium confidence · Nick's detailed explanation of the circuit logic

  • Strata Flight does not have a shooter lane switch detector, unlike some other Williams games

    high confidence · Tim's observation and Nick's confirmation

Notable Quotes

  • “I always liked how the light stayed on for this feature after you lit this and until the next point was scored on the subsequent extra ball. This is great as the light is on when the ball is kicked back out to the shooter lane.”

    Tim @ mid-episode — Core technical observation that prompted the entire schematic discussion

  • “Bally and Gottlieb in comparison turned off the light on a drain. Of course on these, the player unit wouldn't change to the next player in a multiplayer game, but it's still easy to accidentally miss this and play the next player's ball on multiplayer games.”

    Tim @ mid-episode — Identifies a practical usability difference between manufacturers' approaches

  • “It's a minor difference, but I find the Williams design just fantastic.”

    Tim @ mid-episode — Listener preference and critique of design philosophy

  • “Thank you Tim for doing all that research. You're making my life a little too easy. I could get used to that.”

    Nick Baldridge @ mid-episode — Acknowledgment of listener contribution quality

  • “So when the out hole kicks the ball out, the ball index relay drops out, closing the normally closed ball index relay switch I mentioned. The extra ball relay is still active at this point. When a point scores the movement of the secondary circuit causes the extra ball relay to drop out stopping the lamp and removing the ability to just play forever.”

    Nick Baldridge @ late-episode — Clear explanation of the key circuit mechanism

Entities

Nick BaldridgepersonTimpersonStrata FlightgameWilliamscompanyBallycompanyGottliebcompanyFor Amusement Only EM and Bingo Pinball PodcastorganizationYork ShoweventLonnie Irvingperson

Signals

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Williams' design philosophy of maintaining illuminated extra ball light until point is scored represents a superior user experience in multiplayer games compared to Bally and Gottlieb's drain-based cancellation

    high · Tim's observation that Williams design prevents accidentally playing next player's ball; Nick's confirmation of the circuit logic

  • ?

    historical_signal: Documentary evidence of technical design differences between Williams, Bally, and Gottlieb in handling extra ball indicator logic during multiplayer gameplay

    high · Detailed schematic analysis and relay circuit comparison across manufacturers

  • ?

    content_signal: High-quality listener contribution of schematic research and technical observation that drives episode content and demonstrates community expertise

    high · Tim's detailed schematic analysis with labeled components and thoughtful circuit observation

  • ?

    community_signal: Active community members contributing detailed technical analysis and schematic reading to podcast, indicating strong knowledge base and engagement

    high · Tim's multiple contributions including schematic research and technical observations

  • ?

    event_signal: York Show scheduled for October 9-10 at York Fairgrounds with expected high attendance and significant bingo representation

    high · Nick's announcement of show dates, venue, and expectation of full space

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.038

0:00
What's that sound? It's 4 Amusement Only, the EM and Bingo Pinball Podcast. Welcome back to 4 Amusement Only. This is Nick Baldridge. A reminder that the York Show is coming up very soon. I am surprised that I'm not halfway up there already. I'm really excited. It's October 9th and 10th, Friday and Saturday at the York Fairgrounds in York, Pennsylvania. They're at the old main hall, which is a big space and it was pretty much full last year and from what I hear they're on track to be pretty much full this year and there will be an awful lot of bingo representation there. Also, I'll be there with bingos in tow, of course, but we'll be running a contest. Anyone who can make a four or five in a line on any of the bingos there will be able to win a chance to get an autographed copy of one of the Bally Bingo Pinball books. So please come by, play some bingo, say hello, and compete against a machine and see if you can win. Now I'll be running this contest until I run out of books. So, you know, it's not unfortunately an unlimited supply. But uh, well, for tonight's topic, I got an email from Tim who had mailed previously regarding the Lonnie Irving Pinball Machine song. And he says, Hi Nick, it's Tim again, the guy who talked with you a while back on the Lonnie Irving song. I was just playing my William Strata flight, which besides having an absolute great set The light on the pop bumpers with awesome action reminded me of the superiority of the Williams Same Player ShootsAgain light and cancellation feature. I always liked how the light stayed on for this feature after you lit this and until the next point was scored on the subsequent extra ball. This is great as the light is on when the ball is kicked back out to the shooter lane. Bally and Gottlieb in comparison turned off the light on a drain. Of course on these, the player unit wouldn't change to the next player in a multiplayer game, but it's still easy to accidentally miss this and play the next player's ball on multiplayer games. I've never researched the wiring differences on how Williams achieved this staying on, but I'm guessing a hold in with the ball index relay? My Spanish Sagasas and Sonics filled with Williams innards of course do the same and are absolutely some of my favorite EMs. Anyway keep up the shows and hope you can cover this sometime in the future Well thank you very much Tim I responded and let him know that on several of the Williams games there actually Shooter Lane Switch which would disable that extra ball light And I told him I would look up the schematics on Strataflight and see if I could figure out what exactly was going on Well Tim wouldn take that lying down and he actually sent me a copy of the The strataflight schematic with labeled areas with what he thought was going on. So he says, as I'm constantly trying to learn my schematic reading better, I took a look. If I can describe this right, here's what I observed on strataflight and additional Williams that don't have a shoot and lane switch detector. 1. The player achieves same player shootssAgain, usually lighting something on the playfield and backbox. 2. Ball drains. If machine has bonus it countsdown. Ball is then kicked back out to the shooter lane without incrementing the ball counter or player unit. Same player shootsagain remains lit. 3. When the ball is projected into play there is no ballgate switch, as I've seen on some older ballys, but instead same player shootsagain stays on until the player scores any switch or tilts the game. Again, this contrasts with Bally and Gottlieb where immediately after the ball drains, a bonus counts down and if you've achieved extra ball, the light goes out when the kicker from the out-hole puts the ball into the shooter lane. It's a minor difference, but I find the Williams design just fantastic. I'm personally a Bally guy who grew up on Williams EMs though. And he asks for my thoughts. So I'm looking at the snippet of the schematic for Strataflight and particularly the area, I don't have any context alphabetically, but it is on the side labeled score Motor and between 2 and 3. And thank you Tim for doing all that research. You're making my life a little too easy. I could get used to that. So Tim had labeled this schematic at points where he thought he could see what was going on and in this particular instance what he had labeled is a normally closed switch on the I'm a hundred point relay. And then a normally open switch on the extra ball relay. Now what you see in that particular area is if you score ten, a hundred, or a thousand points it's going to open up the path to that extra ball relay switch. And therefore open up the path to the extra ball relay coil which would open it up But as I told him there are actually two different paths So if you look at the extra ball relay which again is kind of the squiggly line on the right hand side in between the tilt relay and the one a relay if you follow that back to the left and down you'll see the extra ball relay switch that's a lock-in switch i was talking about in the ten hundred and a thousand point relay also in that circuit is the ball index relay which is normally open
7:15
The interesting thing, if you'll recall, is that there's a secondary path to that extra ball relay. And that's the normally closed switch on the ball index relay.
7:36
If you look at that particular path, it's a little easier to see due to the way that it's drawn. If you look two coils up from the extra ball relay, you'll see the ball index relay. And you carry that over to the left. And you can see that it's energized by the extra ball relay normally closed switch. The pinball is a single-pole, double-throw, tilt relay switch.
8:20
It can also be engaged with the ball index relay normally open switch, which itself is powered by the out-hole relay. Now that's a lock-in switch for that relay.
8:41
That normally Open Ball Index Relay Switch. But if you look further up the circuit, you'll see the ExtraBallRelayNormallyClosed Switch. It's important to know the state of the machine as the schematic is drawn, and that's with the ExtraBallRelay not active. So when you have an extra ball, that switch is open instead of closed, and the ball index relay holds in due to one of the other two paths. So when the out hole kicks the ball out, the ball index relay drops out, closing the normally closed ball index relay switch I mentioned. The extra ball relay is still active at this point When a point scores the movement of the secondary circuit causes the extra ball relay to drop out stopping the lamp and removing the ability to just play forever Now, you can see how the points are scored if you follow that ball index relay over. You have the ten hundred and a thousand point relays with normally open switches. So when those relays change state, those are going to close. And that provides current through the extra ball relay normally closed switch to the ball index relay. Remember that switch is open on the extra ball relay until you score a point.
10:25
Hopefully that's clear. I think it may have been clearer in my written explanation, but I guess we'll see. It's one of those things where if you're not looking at the schematic, it's hard to know what I'm talking about. But Tim's point is that this is very helpful in a multiplayer game because Okay, so I am making the slightly different images That clean your teammates pinch� OO Typing But, they were the exception and not the rule.
11:39
The bingos all have them because that's an integral part of the timing circuit. So! Hope that all makes sense. And thank you very much Tim for the shoeffotter here,
11:59
you're always welcome to contribute. I hope you're enjoying your strataflight. It sounds like a fun game. I've never played one of those. Well, thank you very much for joining me. My name again is Nick Baldridge. You can reach me at 4amusementonlypodcast at gmail.com or you can call me on the bingos line at 724- bingos1, 724-246- 4671. You can listen to us on iTunes, Stitcher, Pocket Cast, VRSS, I'm John Papadiuk, and I'll see you next time.