Episode 23 - How to Talk to an Operator

Wedgehead Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·47m 37s·analyzed·Mar 25, 2024

Buzzsprout-14692016

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.028

TL;DR

Guide to communicating with pinball operators: report issues clearly, build relationships, respect their work.

Summary

Alan and Alex from Wedgehead Pinball Podcast discuss how to approach and communicate with pinball machine operators on location. They cover why communication matters, how to report malfunctions, how to reset games, etiquette around watching technicians work, and nudging. The episode emphasizes that operators are often individual hobbyists or small business owners who appreciate feedback and that building relationships with them enhances the pinball experience.

Key Claims

Pinball on location remains the easiest, cheapest, and most rewarding entryway into the pinball hobby compared to home ownership
high confidence · Alan establishes foundational argument for why location play matters
Players make the best operators because they understand what makes a game function well and want to maintain quality
high confidence · Both hosts agree that operators who are pinball players create better experiences than those treating pinball as an afterthought
Any good operator should have a clear path of communication for reporting issues (phone, clipboard, QR code, etc.)
high confidence · Alan states this is a sign of a good operator; provides specific examples from Wedgehead
Dead flippers and snapped rubbers are critical issues that should result in game shutdown until fixed
high confidence · Alan responding to Peter Little's question about reportable issues
Modern Stern games can reset to zero by holding left flipper button and start button simultaneously
high confidence · Alex provides technical detail about new Stern features
Jersey Jack games come from factory with headphone jack; newer JJP games have built-in Bluetooth audio
high confidence · Alex responds to Peter's question about hearing game audio in loud venues
Spooky Pinball machines have superior built-in sound systems compared to most other manufacturers
medium confidence · Alex notes Spooky games can be heard over ambient noise due to better subwoofer design
Watching technicians work on games is acceptable if you introduce yourself and don't interrupt urgent repairs
high confidence · Alan provides clear guidance based on his experience as a tech

Notable Quotes

“Pinball has always been a commercial product from its earliest incarnations until today... Pinball on location still remains the easiest, cheapest, and most rewarding entryway into the hobby of pinball.”
Alan @ early — Sets up the foundational argument for why location play is important and accessible
“When I first got into the hobby I was like oh it's all the same shit that you know the guys that own the jukeboxes and the pool tables and it's some big company that doesn't care about me... and then once you've been in the hobby for a bit you realize that's just some guy.”
Alex @ early — Illustrates the revelation that operators are often individual entrepreneurs, not faceless corporations
“Players make the best operators because you are your own consumer you want the game to play well because you're going to play the game.”
Alan @ mid — Core philosophy about why player-operators maintain higher standards
“Any good operator will have a clear path of communication for you... that's honestly one of the best signs of a good operator is a very clear way to communicate with them.”
Alan @ mid — Establishes clear metric for evaluating operator quality
“Don't just do this at somebody else's place because it will piss people off... just because some arcades like if you go to a random bar and they see you messing with the button and you turn the game off and on they'll probably be like what the hell are you doing.”
Alan @ mid — Warning about power cycling etiquette and operator relationships
“There's a symbiotic relationship with operators and players... neither one can get what they want without the other.”
Alan @ late — Articulates fundamental interdependence between operators and players
“I don't mind if they just sit there and watch me and don't say anything. But I will say that if you're going to, I would just introduce yourself... Can I watch you work?”
Alan @ late — Clear guidance on how to respectfully engage with working technicians

Entities

AlanpersonAlexpersonWedgeheadorganizationErrolpersonPeter LittlepersonStern PinballcompanyJersey Jack PinballcompanySpooky PinballcompanyData Eastcompany

Signals

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community_signal: Wedgehead Podcast dedicates full episode to educating players on operator communication, addressing listener questions and establishing best practices
high · Episode structured around listener email from Peter Little with four detailed questions about operator etiquette; hosts provide comprehensive guidance
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sentiment_shift: Positive sentiment around pinball operator community; recognition that most operators are individuals/hobbyists who care about game quality and player experience
high · Both hosts emphasize operators want good player experiences; Alan states most are 'just some guy' who loves pinball, establishing relatable narrative
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community_signal: Growing pinball location scene with new arcades spreading across North America; operators increasingly are pinball enthusiasts rather than business-focused amusement companies
high · Alan states 'pinball is more popular now than it's been in at least 30 years and pinball on location is booming' and notes shift from corporate operators to hobbyist-players becoming operators
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operational_signal: Clear communication channels (phone, QR codes, clipboards, whiteboards) established by operators significantly improve player satisfaction and issue reporting
high · Alan identifies 'clear path of communication' as 'one of the best signs of a good operator'; Wedgehead uses phone number on every game
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product_strategy: Spooky Pinball games have noticeably superior audio systems with quality subwoofers, providing competitive advantage in location play

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.143

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E F F E C T a smooth operator operating correctly. Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of the Wedget Pinball Podcast. I'm your host, Alan, co-owner of the Portland Pinball Bar Wedgehead, and I'm in the basement studio of my co-host, Alex. What are we talking about this week? Today we're talking about a topic that's near and dear to Alan's heart, which is how to approach and talk to operators, the owners of the pinball machines on location that you might be playing. What are we going to cover exactly, Alan? We're going to talk about playing pinball in its natural habitat, which is on location. Pinball has always been a commercial product from its earliest incarnations until today. Even with the rise of home pinball ownership, you know, Alex here is a home collector himself. Pinball on location still remains the easiest, cheapest, and most rewarding entryway into the hobby of pinball. You can practice your skills, play in tournaments, and explore the thousands of unique machines that have been made over the decades, all without the need of a van, tools, thousands of dollars of disposable income, floor space, or a very, very supportive partner. and with the recent rise of pinball popularity we're seeing new arcades and pinball locations spreading like wildfire across North America. Pinball is more popular now than it's been in at least 30 years and pinball on location is booming. So today we're going to cover how to talk to an operator. It's a topic that I haven't seen answered particularly well anywhere else but it always seems to come up and that's why we wanted to discuss it. Yeah it's something that when you first get into the hobby you kind of assume there's some nameless you know faceless corporation that owns these games I feel like. When I first got into the hobby I was like oh it's all the same shit that you know the guys that own the jukeboxes and the pool tables and it's some big company that that doesn't care about me and you kind of like have this idea and then once you've been in the hobby for a bit you realize that's just some guy a lot of the time now it's just hobbyists. Occasionally you do see guys that do it as a full-time job and you know if they got a bigger route if they're in a big city but it's it's a lot of time it's just a guy it's probably a guy that you've seen in the bar, whether you knew it or not. And I think that's kind of the fun part about this and something you need to remind yourself when you're new to the hobby is that it's a small world. And that's kind of why we want to touch on this today. And I know we've had some requests from listeners to cover the topic. It's something that a lot of people are curious about. Yeah. And it's something I think you're really good at. You've befriended operators in different states. So obviously you and I are friends, but you also have a good friend, Errol in South Dakota that has an arcade and you befriended him as well. I became friends with Errol, the owner of 81 in South Dakota, Sioux Falls, South Dakota. It's a great little arcade. I guess it's not really that little anymore. And I was friends with him and I had come into it kind of from the arcade game side. And then he's actually kind of how I got into pinball. He gave me the opportunity to route a game at his location because he needed some more pins and had kind of come up unexpectedly that he had floor space. And so that's actually what got me into the hobby i owned a high speed probably i knew how to play two player games at that point but it was like really it's like i had just gotten into pinball yeah and i an opportunity you know the stars just aligned and it was great and so i'm always interested in talking to operators i like here in the business side i think a lot of our listeners do too and it's kind of just like a unique world that i think many of us didn't really know about didn't really exist and then it's like seen behind the curtain once you kind of learn about it and once you befriend them yeah and i think we should just kind of define operator operator just means the person that operates pinball machines on location so there's historically there were operators that would do all sorts of amusement devices and there still are so the people if you go to a place and it has a big buck hunter and it has a pool table has a jukebox and it has some pinball machines or whatever that's usually all one operator that operates amusement devices uh what you're seeing now in this kind of renaissance of location pinball around the country is you're seeing you know pinball people and hobbyists become operators yep and players that love pinball operating their own machines yeah which is really cool that's kind of what we'd love to see right especially they make the best operators you know players make the best operators we've said that in the past and i still think that's true is it because there are some people and especially historically by some people have an adversarial relationship with operators is they're talking to those guys that route pool tables and jukeboxes and stuff stuff that makes them money and doesn't break right they're annoyed by like pinball players right but it's like as a pinball player you know you want the game to work right like you want every shot to register you want you know right like you want flippers rebuilt you want the games to be clean you want all those things and and a player makes the best operator because you are your own consumer you want the game to play well because you're going to play the game yeah exactly because for a lot of for a big company the pinball is just kind of an afterthought it's something they have to offer or they offer just for the aesthetics or you know it's kind of an obligation it's not the money maker so it's the bottom of the pile so when you have someone that actually loves pinball that owns it they want the game to play good they want it to play as good as it can and i mean that's within reason we'll kind of get into that in this episode yeah i think things happen when you when you leave a game at a dive bar that's getting the you know shit kicked out of it by drunk college students seven days a week it's gonna be tough no matter how much you love that game and how much you want it to be perfect like you have to stay reasonable with with the location and with the route and there's a lot to kind of consider there you know so that's like what an operator is and does and then the next question is really like why would you need to talk to one yeah i guess why would you need i mean why do you need to talk to anybody you know for like human connection but if you're a robot and uh you need to talk to operators to let them know if games are misfunctioning or malfunctioning really that's kind of it yeah i guess that's the only reason you really need to talk to them is if you're like hey something's going wrong with your game hey i noticed this with your game that would be why you need to reach out yeah everyone has the same problem on location is who do i tell when the game malfunctions yep and so the thing is is like if you're going to a big arcade if your city or your region has like a big local arcade there's a good chance that the people that operate the games there are the owners yeah of that place like that's how it is at wedget like we own the place those are also our games we operate them now there are plenty of other locations where you go to say like a brewery on average again they could operate their own but oftentimes if you see some pins at a brewery for example that would be like someone else is operating those games as a separate location on their route yep so it's like if you're talking to the bartender who's pouring your beers they're not gonna know how to fix the game they're probably not even gonna have keys to the game or how to take the glass off even if they could unfree a stickball or whatever yeah and that's kind of our next question what are the what are the different methods to tell operators about problems that you might encounter on the games or how do you kind of know what to do in that situation let's say you're at a you're out of place and you notice that a switch isn't registering on a critical shot right there i guess number one would be like a stuck ball right yeah stuck ball i would always say like any good operator will have a clear path of communication for you yep so i would look at the machines or if there's a change machine there or any walls that would have signage because operators take feedback in different ways like you can do it with like a clipboard on the wall or a whiteboard or something you can also do like a QR code that's maybe on a game that you scan with your phone. It'll take you to a form and it'll email or message somebody. We do it with an old school telephone number, which is like the oldest operator way of doing it. But we have a tech line set up, our numbers on every game. What happens if you call that number? I always text it. You can call it. I won't answer it, but you can call it. Does it go through? I think so. I don't know if it has voicemail though. For other operators, we set, like I set it up as just a sort of like a separate uh data yep phone number what do you call that like a google phone number or something yeah i don't know it's like a proxy number yeah so it's like it still goes to my phone in an app uh but it's not my personal phone number that i'm just putting out there for the whole world yep and and i know i can kind of turn it on or off so like step number one is like looking at the game a lot of the time it'll be posted on the the back glass or a lot on the lockdown bar by like the price scene where you see the little three by five rules cards or whatever that's probably the most likely place it'll say yeah it could also be at the entrance or if they have a change machine where you get quarters or tokens out probably right there you know if they have a clipboard or whiteboard it's really on operators to do a good job of communicating this because us as operators we want to hear the feedback on the games like that's how we know when a game is working or not like we can't be there playing every game all the time So we do need your feedback and we just want you to be as really as specific as possible. Yep. Is also helpful. Like if you know what you're talking about, that's great. Like if you can say this switch on this ramp or orbit or you know the terminology, but even if you don't know the terminology, I always tell people pictures are appreciated, but we have a phone number where you could send a picture. Obviously not everywhere has that, but just using what's available to you is usually the best way to communicate. this is going to lead us into some listener questions we got an email from a listener peter little and so i think we're gonna if you want to read those out to me alex and then i'll try to answer them or start answering them yeah his first question was is it helpful or annoying to point out issues with the table to staff for example a dead flipper a snap band on a slingshot ball stuck in a saucer or a rollover switch dead outland kicker broken toy etc yeah i mean 100 100%. Yeah, I'd say those are almost listed in decreasing order of importance. I think all of these are like totally very legitimate problems that need to be pointed out. Yeah. Like Dead Flipper, obviously. That game should be turned off until it gets fixed. Snapped Rubber on a Slingshot, game should be turned off. Ball stuck in a saucer on a rollover switch. I mean, that's pretty much turned off because even if the boil can kick it out on ball search, if the switch doesn't register it's going to keep happening over and over again yeah and that's just miserable game for that's the thing like an operator doesn't want someone having that experience with their game for the most part everyone's not operators don't yes good operators the ones you should respect that's not what they want people to experience the only one i guess that stood out to me is a broken toy his example was like cabinet and theater of magic and that's kind of one of those things where it's like sometimes you see a theater of magic on location and they won't have the chest functioning for years because you can disable it in the menu as long as it registers uh shots to it that's what i was going to say as long as it's not functional yeah because that's the one where it's like if you go play a medieval madness in the castle animation you know how the castle moves when you blow it yeah hopefully if the castle animation doesn't work they probably are aware and they probably don't care and that's sad but yeah it's sad but that's what i'm that's where i'm like that's where i draw the line if it's something that affects the function of the game i report it if it's something cosmetic hopefully they notice it the next time they play the game if it's like that for years and you know them i wouldn't say years if it's like that if you know them then all bets are off you can talk about anything but as far as what's worth reporting to like a tech line i'd be like anything that affects the function of the game seriously the function of a game i guess that kind of answers that one yeah all those that not annoying at all and it is very helpful yes because like i said you need those reported it even and he says issues with the table to the staff so the only thing i would say is if you're at an arcade and they operate those games reporting directly to like a staff member like someone you see behind the bar or whatever again it's best if you see someone like maybe cleaning games or opening games like right like use your best judgment like a bartender is there to pour beers and make cocktails and stuff and take orders they're even in arcades they're not really the people that are going to be doing that like at wedgehead it's a little bit different like if you have a stuck ball i i always tell people i'm like check with the bartender all of our bartenders can pull the glass off free a stuck ball that kind of thing however they're not going to fix any of the problems and really i'd still rather you text those issues to me on the service line because that's not my staff shop right like it's kind of in a queue for the guy that actually has the ability to fix it it's not going down word of mouth and that's why you don't want them to forget it either i would say when you're at a place where its owner like where the where the location owns the games i think the best thing you can do in that situation is just ask them hey i noticed like i noticed an issue with this game how can i report who should i tell yes you have like you know you just ask do you have a number is there something i can send that in because yeah pictures are important and getting that information to the right person is important i think that's the best way to do it is, yes, it's important to talk to the staff member, but really just if you're unclear on how to report issues, or maybe even they'll hand you a pen and paper and they'll be like, why don't you write this down and I'll give it to the tech. But again, any good, any really good place should have a very clear way to communicate with you. That's honestly one of the best signs of a good operator is a very clear way to communicate with them. I would agree with that question number two from uh from peter he asked uh often i'll see a game or a row of games with nobody playing but a four-player game has been queued up i think people are matching the start button when nothing happens moving on to the next game is there any way for a player to reset a table without draining 12 balls yes so on most modern sterns factory default if they're set to i think anything but if they're set to free play for sure you can hold the left button or the left flipper button and the start button at the same time and it'll go back to the main menu if you play one ball on each player once you're on ball two you can just press start once and it'll start a single player game again assuming that there's a credit in the game or it's on free play you gotta press and hold start yep this is something that sounds like it happens like he's near a free play arcade that's what i would assume right and so wedgehead were a free play arcade and so i know this problem well you have people come in especially children mostly but also well-meaning uneducated adults oh you see adults do this every single day so they'll come in they'll start a four-player game or whatever and not play it all the way and then kind of move on how do you feel about uh as a as an owner how do you feel about like resetting games when they're sitting there with a four-player game and nobody's even plunged the first ball like power cycling yeah power cycling uh i'm fine with it okay so what i'm that's one thing i know that's always So one thing I'm going to say is I wouldn't recommend anyone does that unless you know the operator, which is the topic of this is how to talk to an operator. And it's important to build relationships with an operator, especially if it's a place you go to all the time. Yep. Right. Like if you go to the same places all the time, it's just helpful to know the operator because you can report issues. You can talk to them. And if you're that type of person that's like curious about how a game works or whatever, it's like they'll pop up the, you know, they'll pop up the play field. they'll talk to you while they work and all that kind of stuff but this is another one of those situations where i tell people this where i'm like hey you can power cycle a game it's not going to bother me but i always warn people don't just do this at somebody else's place because it will piss people off i have never power cycled a game outside of wedgehead probably and i only do it there on very rare circumstances like if we're playing a howdy partner and we need you get the show on the road because normally it's like okay i'll play a ball or whatever i do something else to avoid it just because i don't like doing it because i don't want other people to see it and think that's regular and take that behavior elsewhere just because some arcades like if you go to a random bar and they see you messing with the button and you turn the game off and on they'll probably be like what the hell are you doing get away from the pinball machine yeah especially if they're they don't know how the machines work right just looks sketchy and weird exactly i definitely don't here's another thing don't just turn a game off well that's a common that question comes up later okay so we'll get there as far as like resetting with like if you're in a free play spot and a bunch of games are started if you have credits on the machine or the machines are on free play which is what i'm assuming is happening here there's the middle four-player game you don't want to manually plunge all those balls out you need a power cycle game but also the new stern games take a couple of it is the power cycle right it's not instantaneous So I'll say that if you just press and hold the start button on any era of machine, it'll start you at player one, ball one, score at zero. That's only true once you're past ball one, though. But you only have to be on ball two of player one. So then you only have to flunge four balls. Sure. If they start a four-player game and they've only played one ball on player one, sure. But most of the time it's... Most of the time it's a kid or an adult, and they start a four-player game and they play three balls. they assume their game's over. So a lot of the time you see it sitting there, player four, ball one, and then it's like, okay, plunge one ball, start a game. I always tell people it's like, just press and hold the start button. It'll start you at zero. On new Sterns, you can hold the flipper button, the left flipper button, and press and hold start, and it'll just take you completely out of any game. Oh, that is so nice. That's the best thing Stern Pinball has done. That's the best version, but it's not on every game. If you just press and hold the start button, any era of game from ems to solid states it'll reset so i think that answers the question yeah we got into the weeds on that one because i think there's just different etiquette and there's different uh what we would do in each situation depending on the game in a lot of specifics number three uh you said i really like the sound and music of pinball games but usually the places i play are so loud it's hard to hear them i gather a player can't increase the sound on the table but is there anything a player can do to help with enjoying the sound package Yeah, so this is the one where, unfortunately, there's not really anything you can do about it. Jersey Jack games come from the factory with a headphone jack. Yeah, but phones don't even come with headphone jacks. Well, the modern ones now have built-in Bluetooth that you can access just from the normal menu, which is kind of cool. I've never done it. The one time I remembered to bring headphones, I specifically—so I used to own a Hobbit. This is some good Alex lore for the podcast. I owned a Hobbit, and every once in a while, it's like every six months, I miss it. and there's one that travels around location on town so i went there to play and i brought bluetooth headphones with me because i knew it was quiet and i actually like hearing that game because it's a big part of that game and then i remembered that hobbit is before the bluetooth and then you did the wired headphones i was like god damn it you didn't have them you never have the right ones in you but outside of jjps which you don't run into location much there's not much you can do if you know the place i'd say like this is again this is why it's important to talk to an operator if you learn an operator and you're a regular at the spot like if a regular comes up to me goes hey could you turn up the volume on getaway i will go oh yeah of course yeah right so it's like that's what the beauty of learning to foster relationships with the operators are i like to say like there's a problem with especially in a loud arcade is every game you can turn each game up but then you have to turn the one up that's next to you because when people It might be super loud when you're the only person playing a machine, and when others are playing, then it has to out-compete. And the sound systems on these pinball machines were not great. Like, the two tiny speakers in the back box and a sub on the bottom of the cabinet. Data East very proudly put in stereo on RoboCop. Yeah, well, they... The Spookies sound awesome. The Spookies do have good sound cut. You walk into a bar with a Spooky game, and you can hear from, like, over everything, so it'll have a sub built in. That's true. again going into the weeds but yes there's nothing you can really do unless you know the operator and then you can provide input you can let them know kind of your preferences once you have like a friendship in past being friends it's also in the operator's best business or it's in their best interest to keep regular customers happy yeah so if they know that you're like hey man i love this metallica game but like there's no point playing it when i can't hear metallica even if the operator hates metallica he'll probably go turn it up because he knows you're going to keep dumping quarters into his game yeah there's a symbiotic relationship with operators and players i mean neither one can get what they want without the other so the operator is putting games out so you the player can play and the player needs an operator so they can play a wide variety of games on location without having to buy seven to ten thousand dollar games all it's right like you guys are supposed to be friends the one thing i guess i would add before we move on is the biggest way to get around this is go play those games when the place is dead and I recommend I mean that's that's the thing I go out to I play a lot of pinball on location and I go out on like busy weekend nights and stuff but I really really prefer going to like wedge on like a weekend you know early in the day you guys open at noon or whatever and it's nice to go in there and you have your pick of games and you can hear anything and it's a different experience than when you're like slammed I I like that feeling of being in like a packed bar that's kind of like fun part of like the social side of pinball to me but it's also a completely different feeling when you're in there you can hear everything and it's like you've got the game to yourself that's so that's a big recommendation there is i guess you can go during slower hours especially if you're like going to bars because it's like a lot of a lot of bars open at 12 for their regulars and their regulars are guys that just sit there silently you know on the rail and so it's like you can go into a bar that has a pin at like 2 p.m on a saturday and they might kind of you know they might give you an eye if you're making a bunch of noise on the pinball machine but it's part of the business and they don't mind as long as you're there to support them totally 100 so question number four is uh is it rude or weird to watch the techs work on a game so again some of these questions are like i i feel a little bit uncomfortable like speaking for everybody because yeah i'm one tech i'm one operator but i i'll just speak for myself it's like just understand that we're all different people like but i'd say like i don't mind like when people watch me work on a game, I don't mind. I don't mind if they just sit there and watch me and don't say anything. But I will say that if you're going to, I would just introduce yourself. You go, hey, I'm Peter. You know, I love pinball. These things are fascinating. I've never seen the inside of one, which is something that people say to me all the time. Yeah. Can I watch you work? Or can I take a picture of the underside of the playfield? And I just go, sure. Yeah. Even when you've been in the hobby for a long time, you might see a game open that you've never seen opened up and you're curious about how one mech works or something yeah because it's like the first time you see like a brand stoker's you're like what the fuck is going on with this conveyor belt and it's yeah that little corkscrew yeah it's interesting to to like when you see that stuff so i don't think it's it's definitely not weird at all you just unless you make it weird you got to just be like a normal person introduce yourself don't be pushy if they're like oh i'm just trying to get this fixed quick if it's a busy night just let the guy kind of i'd say move on with it yeah But it's like if it's a slow day or something and there's a guy working, most techs are usually pretty eager to talk to people about it. I don't mind talking to somebody. It's I'll be soldering. I don't mind showing them like usually I have a series of like, oh, you think this is cool? Like, here's the flipper. Like, here's the coil. Here's what a coil does. It'll magnetize and I'll slam the flipper bat down and I'll go, you see how this works? Here the pop bumper like I show them some of the max and I sort of give them like an overview and like Oh that very interesting and they like so what are you doing i like oh this drop target broken or i rebuilding this flipper or whatever they like oh that cool right and so or when you have kids or something like i'll let them hold one of the pinballs so they can be like oh this is so heavy it seems so heavy right one thing that always blows everybody's mind if they don't play pinball the first time you hold one you go oh that thing's heavy yeah it's heavier than it feels when it's rolling around yeah is it rude or weird to watch the text work no not unless you make it weird yeah not unless you're weird i i think in general i mean some texts might really really hate it and that's why i hesitate to speak for them yeah i say from myself like it doesn't bother me at all it's hard for the course we have a small bar and arcade and like we have games and storage but i have to do pretty much all the work on the games i do on the floor i don't have like a separate workshop yeah you don't have a back room at wedge no and so it's like i have to do all my work on the floor so i'm very accustomed you kind of know what you're getting into yeah you go like start pulling a driver board out of a game and you have the whole thing laid out there on like a sunday afternoon you're like if people are gonna yeah like what just happened like when you walked in and i had the driver board out yeah you know like alex is gonna come in here it's gonna take 30 minutes longer but it's like that's the risk that the techs you know waged when they uh when they start working on games during business hours yeah so uh next question is it is it okay to nudge tables at an arcade or bar there's a part of me that feels kind of bad about hitting a very expensive piece of furniture or store of art okay so this is another very very common question i think is it okay nudge tables at an arcade or bar uh yeah i mean you have to the biggest thing here is defining what like a nudge is versus like a slide save so some people think they'll call anything where they move the game they're just nudging it and it's like no there's a difference if you're doing like if if you're doing death saves if you're really thrashing a game around that's very different than like nudging if you want to see nudging you go watch a tournament nudging is a integral part of pinball like if you're not touching the game if you're not kind of rocking it like up and down like north to south or you're slap saving i mean that's just part of pinball yeah that is 100 pinball it's built into the game so it's been part of it before there were flippers you were nudging the game right because you had no other way to influence the ball so you're right so it's like nudging is 100 part of the game like alex is saying is like some bad actors will try to you know slide or really thrash and kick games around and like kick the legs and and then when you call them on it they'll be like oh well that's just part of the game and you're like you're nudging a game in a way that is fine i mean slap saves always make noise right like if you slap the shit out of a cabinet it's going to make noise and people might look at you for that so i don't want to say this too art of a line but if if people are staring at you and glaring yeah well you play a game you're you're past nudging you're like once it becomes a spectacle it's like hey what the fuck are you doing yeah because that's the big thing when you see someone in a quiet bar like death save a game the whole place will turn their head and that's the point where you're like and they'll be like well i just got a single danger and you're like yeah stern sets the long d bounce they set the games friendly a lot of operators leave them friendly from the factory because operators kind of give you the benefit of the doubt but just because you can get away with something doesn't mean you should but like going back to the actual question nudging 100 okay and like and you shouldn't feel bad about it yeah that's part of the game in every operator you go watch like roads play a game and he's nudging the costume He does really heavy slap saves.

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I will say the thing about nudging is you need less force than most people think you need. Effective nudging is timing more than it is force. Yep. But there's a lot of players that never learned finesse, and so they end up picking games and really kind of making a big show out of it. it's like when the ball's going straight down the middle and you shove the whole game over an inch to catch it, you're kind of past. That's what I mean by slide saves. And it's like, that's kind of past a nudge. And it's like, you kind of know when you're doing that. But there's also, there's something he said, like operators can set tighter tilts and it's really up to the operator on what they're going to allow. I mean, that's really what it is. So it's like, that's the big, as much as proper etiquette should dictate that you shouldn't abuse the game. Certain types of players are habitual line steppers and they will find that line and they will leafily jump over it and over it and over and over it so it's hard to condemn that because that's kind of the nature of pinball of the game it's like when you are just playing the game how you know alan or i would play it whatever you know we being us obviously think that how we played is how everyone should play pinball but it's like yeah we've you set the tilts you set the tilts tight and we find the limits of those like i still tilt it's not like i'm not tilting games at wedgehead every single time i'm there like i tilt constantly because you're always finding the limit and so that's why it's hard to kind of say with like an iron fist but really to me it's like you know when you're beating it's one of those things that and if you've lied to yourself and you don't know if it's abuse or it's fair play nudging the other people in the bar know yeah and they're probably looking at you yeah i mean because then it's too far i think when you get into the hobby everybody goes through that phase of being like well i can push it like i know this game at this place like i can death save all day and some people are edgelords that's what they do we have a whole thing on death saves for a different episode because that's that's gonna be a whole episode this is youtube video i remember when i got into pinball this is whatever not that long ago but five years ago or something and there's this youtube video that's ancient it looks like it was filmed in the 90s it was the first time i had heard about death save i didn't know what they were and it's like what comes up if you google like pinball death save and it's titled death save the manliest move in pinball and it's this really low res video of a guy death saving like a lethal weapon or something i just always think about like it's just the manliest move it's so cool you're like no don't do it you must resist there's just a reason everybody gets into it and it's like it's so easy on some games it's some games and some operators will let you it's just a bad move we'll get into it in a later episode because we need to cover that in more detail yeah i've got mixed feelings always yeah i think those are i just want to thank uh peter for sending in those questions uh as for anyone else if you're listening to this show and you want to send any feedback to the show or if you have a die on this hill game or anything, send them to Wedgeheadinfo at gmail.com and tell us about the show or ask any questions and we'll try to incorporate them in the show in a future episode. Thanks again, Peter, for the questions. I hope that answered them for you. But to continue on with this episode, I think we have to acknowledge that there are bad operators out there. Like, we're operators and we focus on operators and we're talking about this, but you may be in a situation where you're like, you know this game got put out there it's two years old they've never done a code update it's filthy right like that's slings don't work right like they're just badly maintained like those that exist and the worst part about that is you can reach out to those guys and a lot of the time if it's a bad operator bad if it's a bad business they just won't do anything and the sad part of that is you kind of just have to give up that was the situation in where i lived previously Sioux Falls South Dakota it was like there were two at the time there were two locations that both owned their own games it's 81 arcade and bonus round at the time and then there was an operator that owned he did all of the pool tables is big business not one guy big and he did all the pool tables and jukeboxes pretty much everywhere in that entire city it's a city of 200,000 people or whatever and it was just dominated I can't remember their name at the time because I would call them out it was bad enough but they did they did animal machines and it's like they did them as an attraction they'd been doing them forever and they didn't work on them at all though the text would come out and the texts were there to take quarters out of pool tables and if you told the text in person that something was wrong their official line was as long as it takes quarters and flips it's good that was the official yeah it repeated that over and over that was that's probably what they're being told by their bosses as long as it takes quarters and so as long if there was a coin jam they would fix it if a flipper quit working they would fix it anything else would be completely done and i like there was an x-men that was still incandescent and it was like probably one quarter of the lights on the game functioned right i'm sure it had switches that didn't register i'm sure it had there was stuff like that there was i remember they got an elvira house of horrors and it was right when the game came out and it was because like a customer had requested or whatever so they put one in and it was on factory code and from the box one of the ramp switches didn't register and it never got fixed so it's like okay that game may as well not exist because you couldn't hit like the center ramp or whatever so we're saying is there's bad operators there are bad operators we are an operator friendly podcast i am an operator we are location players alex has games in his house as well but he lives in portland a great city to play location pinball and uh and we're going to talk to more good operators on the show but you know there there's a reason why some people feel adversarial towards operators and we can't just think we can't do this episode and not acknowledge it so that's why yeah i can't remember if I already said but it's like it's easy to kind of think that all operators are this nameless corporation or whatever and that they're the enemy they're the bad guys because it's like you might have an experience with like a Walmart of operators like that but when you run into the good ones it's very real people it's usually people that love pinball also if they're doing this and uh it's just important to kind of remember that and like think about who you're talking to oh agree now you've moved on from the bad operators in your area you're only going to a place that has a good operator that has a way to report issues and stuff and so now we're just talking about like what issues should you report and what not to report we kind of touched on that earlier but i would still say anything that affects functionality of the game anything that's going to affect scoring is worth reporting i think anything that's cosmetic it could be an intentional choice by them if the game's been set up in a way to bypass something that was very much an intentional choice by the operator because they went into the menus they're aware then so it's like anything that's just a cosmetic thing like a toy that doesn't actually affect the ball i wouldn't say is worth reporting but anything that affects the function of the game is yeah i think you should always report any issues if you're talking about pitch level don't report that shit oh god if it if the game's not level side to side make sure it's like really like make sure it's actually not level and you're not just mentally ill like because there are some players they're like it's leaning left and you're like it's not leaning left yeah we've talked right like we talked about that a little bit in a previous episode but it's like i would say that's why like setup doesn't affect funk i mean it obviously don't complain about like the types of rubbers they use and i will say that on pinball machines especially on the in lanes from all eras or old games some like gi or some inserts sometimes a bulb will kind of flicker a little bit on and off bulbs is that's a tough one because it's like if it's a super important light yes you can let them know but when you're dealing with like led swapped old games they have problems with the sockets with just a lot of the time it's like if it's an incandescent old game they'll burn bulbs out as fast as you can replace them when they're on location in like modern games when you have like a spooky and the connectors are flaky it might be one of those things where it's like oh they're well aware and they've done everything they can because yeah i've got a rick and morty that i've done everything i can and it's like every once in a while the lights just kind of changed to a different tint of color and then they pop back in 10 seconds later and it's like yeah there's if that game was on location i'm sure i would get complaints but when you just know what's happening you're like it's not a big deal so lights can be finicky and i wouldn't bother reporting them i would say i would say sometimes you do i just don't you can because they are important sometimes like because that's how you mark what shots lit or whatever it's not that you shouldn't report lights it's just sort of like just be aware of like the setup and some things like I say for example complaining about a tilt being too tight whack Yeah Don report that Yeah That clearly set by the operator So like you being like the tilt so tight No, really. I didn't even touch it. No, I swear. I didn't even touch it. The amount of times people have tilts and go, I didn't even touch it. And I was like, I see you, buddy. Like I can hear you playing the game. You're not in a vacuum. Right. Come on, buddy. We also had one where it was like, stay away from like snarky jokes. like when you're reporting issues don't make jokes i would say like you're if you're reporting issues like via like a text or something it just needs to be very objective it's not the time to try to be like funny or cute you're like you're just trying to report something you should be looking at that the way you would tell a doctor something so what happens is if someone has a clipboard or someone has or they go on pinball map there's a reason why we didn't say to report issues on pinball map film that's a great resource they allow you to add a comment on a game the problem is is that most operators won't check those yeah and even if they do there's not a way for them they can create an account and respond it's just i'm just speaking from experience and knowing lots of operators we just don't do that or most of us don't so like a good operator will give you a way to communicate with them so use that way and just don't be like leaving snarky comments like we had a on a ghostbusters where a spotlight like a gi spotlight that was mounted on a sling had spun itself loose and was pointing back yeah upwards like to the player and somebody wrote like looks like the operator set it up so it'd shine light in your eyes to steal your quarters otherwise plays good or some shit like that and you're like you're like that would be insane you're just facing all the lights at the player it's just crazy because obviously like we're not doing that obviously that's something that we can fix and we would fix you just don't need that because it leaves a bad taste in we're people man like and shit breaks shit breaks like dude just tell us that the light shining in your eyes that's it like you don't need to make weird jokes yep and especially it's always just out of place to leave like stuff like that on like a google review or something where it's going to just live in eternity and it'll just haunt the owners that is like the I just know, having been friends with multiple arcade owners now, it's like the Google reviews that just sit there forever, and they have some dumb shit that you misunderstood, or just the game happened to be broken on one day out of 364 days that year. That's not the place to report stuff. No. It's not going to get to them in time. It's just not effective, and it's just rude. It's the whole point of talking to operators, making a relationship, and then you can talk to them directly, and they'll fix your issues. but just be you know nice yeah be friendly that was something else we wanted to talk on is it's just you kind of want to build rapport with these guys and i don't know you you want to like be complimentary don't dog on their shit don't go up to a guy you don't know and be like hey man nice games like it would be cooler if they had like if you did this like it would be cool if you bought a jjp like when are you gonna do that you're like that's annoying i had a guy who i won't say his name he's a good regular i love him he's wonderful he did one time come up to me during a tournament night and he looked at me and he goes oh we're playing this game we'll save us fun house we're playing this game and i go yeah he goes did you fix that fucking problem or he's like did you fix that piece of shit and i was like what and then he's like did you fix that thing and i was like start over yeah i just looked at him i was like start over what's wrong with it and he goes oh Well, you didn't know. I was like, tell me, but in a different tone of voice. Yeah, you're like, that's not how that's not going to help the relationship. And that's the thing is like, he's still a regular. I love him very much. He's a sweet person. I believe he was trying to make a joke. We were very busy. And I also didn't even know what he was talking about. So I'm like, if there's an issue, like, tell me the issue. Like, just I really need you to just look at me and go, Alan, did you know that there's this issue on Funhaus? and I go, oh yeah, I fixed that or whatever. Or I didn't know it had that issue. Thanks for bringing it up. We won't play it in this round and I'll look at it. Like that's what the relationship that you want. I always say like treat your early interactions like you want to go out with them. Like be nice to them, even kind of flirt with them a little bit. Flirt with Rhodes. Yeah, exactly. Like flirt in a way like you're like, hey, like I love this place. Yeah, we're going back to like getting the volume up. That's how you get the volume up on a game. Yes. Isn't it? You're like, dude, like this. Yeah. You're like, I love all your stuff, man. Like, you like that Metallica? It would be nice if I could hear that Metallica. And they'll probably be like, okay, man. Here's the thing. You go, hey, you guys have the nicest Metallica in town. I just wish I could hear it. Yeah. Right? Like, you do that and someone's like, all right, I got you. They don't like to do stuff like that. They like, like we said, people like making their customers happy when they like their customers. And flattery helps. If you're an asshole, they're not, they're going to, what they're going to do is they're going to go get the Metallica and pull it out of the place. Yeah. They'll be like, ah, fuck that guy. But also if you, you know, if you flirt and you make a good impression, like, then the operator, like, I know I do this with our regulars. I was like, what game you want to see? Yeah. Like, what do you want? Or someone's like, could you bring back Dracula? Can you bring back Sopranos? Can you do, I'm like, yes. Yeah. We'll do it for you because you're a regular. Like, I want you to have games that you want to play. So. You want people excited to come back to you. Yeah. Of course. Okay, so last topic here, credit dots. What do you think about credit dots, Alan? Okay, so I struggle with some of this because I'm a little bit concerned about creating the Streisand effect. I don't know if anyone knows what the Streisand effect is, but basically it was a situation where Barbara Streisand had a neighbor in her swanky neighborhood in Southern California, and they had built like a statue or something that blocked her view of the ocean a little bit or she felt made it worse and so she tried to sue them to get them to remove it but really all it did was she loses the suit and she just looks like an asshole yeah right like it brings a lot more attention to something attention to something suddenly everyone's going to talk about it and with credit dots if if you don't know what a credit dot is you should just stop the episode now and you know this has been a fun one but if you're someone that knows what a credit dot is and a lot of us when you get into the hobby you learn what a credit i'm going to explain this to you in the best way i can possible the only reason i put it on here is because i see it happening on forums and i see dumb fuckers for lack of a better term explaining this to people and i just and i just want to explain to a layman because if you see someone's like oh i won't play a game with a credit dot i'm gonna explain what a credit dot is on 90s bally williams games so adam's family right medieval madness attack from mars no fear no fear right hitters so they had a system where if a certain switch in a game hadn't been hit for a set number of plays yeah it'll put like a little dot right after the credits so like on the screen when it says either one credit two credits half credit or if it says free play they'll have like a little period yep right after it's a dot it was meant to alert the operator who's walking by who could look at the display and go oh there's a dot maybe there's maybe there's an issue with the game the problem is that a lot of switches in those games just genuinely don't get hit for like hundreds of games and the credit dot pops up pretty fucking quick i don't know so i'm sure you can look up how many games it actually takes but it's like it can be a switch that awards no points and is put behind one really tight rubber and it's an impossible switch to ever activate in normal play yeah that thing will throw a credit dot so some you'll see it where it's like the org lock in star trek the next generation where you lock it in the ship you can go many many many many many many many games start many multi balls and never and never lock it up there yeah whitewater bigfoot's cave is one that happens all the time we have whitewater that's my favorite game it's like if you have to hit it past him there he's a diverter bigfoot hotfoot or whatever right there so that's a switch that only normally goes to the whirlpool but it'll go past him because he's spinning around during hotfoot so that switch doesn't get hit and so throws a credit dot it's it's one of those things that was probably i mean it was a great idea at the time i understand what they were doing it made total sense until the internet came along and everyone gets a little bit about like of knowledge about something and then they use it to like act like an expert and so you have people that are like well it's got a credit dot something's wrong with the game and you're like no that's not what it means it's really the boy that cried wolf dot is really what it is and it's a dumb thing to look at a game and not play it because of it and And the only reason I brought it up is because I see dumb fuckers on the Internet. It comes up on the pinball. They will say they'll be like, hey, don't ever play a game or what would be a perfect arcade? And they'll be like, oh, perfect arcade is a place with no credit dots. I was like, that just doesn't exist. What is that? Not real. It's not real. I wish as an operator you could turn them off just because like, man, it's just some provide useful information. Some dumb fuckers out there just think they're like, oh, I'm not going to play this because the game's broken. Game's not broken. man like it's not a good indicator of whether something's broken it's an indicator that something might be broken yeah but that's also kind of like any other pinball machine something might be broken on their pinball machine of the world i don't know broken too it's just bally williams will have that period on them yeah it's funny it's a bummer but yeah if you can see you can see how serious alan is about this stuff i think that's a good place to wrap up the episode how to talk to an operator i felt like this was a good time to do this episode because we got listeners submitted questions and it's something that shows up all the time. And I don't think that really anyone's really covered it that well in depth. Or it's certainly not from an operator's point of view, you know, which I think you're talking about how to talk to an operator. Talking from an operator is probably the best way to do it. So I would just say be friendly, be nice, ingratiate yourself, find out how they want you to report issues and report them the way they want to hear them. Yep. Yeah. And just be nice. and that's really it yeah they're just people at the end of the day you know just like you know they put their pants on two legs at a time yeah we all jump into our pants the same way everyone else does like we hold them out in a hoop and then we jump through them both legs at the same time just like you yeah just like you we're just like you but yeah i think this was a good episode thanks for joining me again for another episode alex for everyone out there won this episode with We talked about it. Go play some pinball on location and hopefully start up your new fling with a new operator. You know, throw some pickup lines out there. Bring them some candy. Yeah, be nice. You know, be nice. Say hi. Give them a compliment. We usually hear only the negative things, which is okay. I mean, that's what we're there to hear. We need your help to report issues. But sometimes it's nice when they're like, oh, man, you guys do such a great job. Like, you're like, I love hearing that. Yes. Yeah. Look, thanks. We work hard. Yeah. So go out, find some pinball to play on location. Talk to your local operator until next time. Good luck. Don't suck.