Welcome to the Great British Pinball Podcast. And here are your hosts, Scott Rundell and Neil McCrae.
Oh my god, we're back.
We're live.
We're alive. Happy New Year, Scott.
He's laughing about that before. Yeah. Happy new year, Neil.
Um, yeah. So, apologies. Both Scott and I have had uh a lot going on and just trying to And actually, to be fair, the last time we're supposed to record this a week ago and I completely forgot about it. Um,
a best friends. You know,
the good the good news is loads of people asking me, Neil, when do we do when you do the next podcast? So, um, Pinball at the beach, which I'll talk about later, lots of people say, when's the next podcast coming out? Neil, we thought you would have done one. I was like I was like, "Yeah, I'm just trying to stay awake right now." Um
Yeah, I bet.
Cuz uh a lot's uh going on. Scott, tell me what you've been doing pinball wise for the last month.
Racking my head on why I'm doing another CPR playfield if I'm honest with you. Um I [ __ ] hate them. I don't care what people say.
I tell you, there's so much and they're no longer making playfields. Thank god. Well, there's a controversial start to the uh to the podcast and it wasn't me
out swinging, you know, but yeah, look, I I I cannot I I sat there right on this Elvire and the pie monsters going, why are the so [ __ ] far out? Like, if I followed them, right, there's a part where you have a bank of targets. If I followed them, the target would be in the wood. it was it was so far out that it wouldn't even be in the hole like let alone the wood. It was like it's so dumb. It was just like I cannot work with this. And I ended up just like getting tracing paper out and diligently then taking from the old playfield the markings and uh turning the underside into Swiss cheese to correct all the incorrect pilot holes.
This is why I give my work to other people. I just wouldn't have the patience for [ __ ] like that. I'd end up setting fire.
I'll be honest with you, man. much to everyone's probably [ __ ] cheer and joy. I can't be bothered to do this anymore. I think this will be my last one. I just can't be bothered. It's just like I'm losing the joy from it. It's
It kills me. I I haven't played pinball if I'm honest with you all this year. I haven't played any because all I'm doing is if I'm if I'm not doing my work, I'm doing the the playfield restoration or let's call it pinball machine restoration. And if I'm not doing that, I'm looking after the little ones. So, it's just like, yeah, I I I'll have to sack it in if I'm honest with you. I mean, I might I say that I'll probably end up getting someone saying, "Oh, yeah, you'll pay you this and you'll do it." And I'll be like, "Shut up. I'll take your money then." But I just I just at the moment I'm just drawn out on it. I just can't be bothered anymore. It's just I I feel like I'll give you why. I'm having a winge now. You You set me off. But I got a [ __ ] like uh washing machine like was playing up and had the engineer over and they paid me 300 quid to just come in and fix it and I'm like here I am working on chump change for hundreds of hours on restoring the game and I have people winging at me about my cost and I mean this guy showed up for 5 minutes and got 300 quid.
300 quid m you could buy a [ __ ] new washing machine for 300 quid. Well, to be fair, I had a Mer and US those things cost
eventually. I've got a MA.
Oh, you know, as is. But yeah, no, this long story short, my wife used to work at MA and she got us a good discount when we got it. But um I was I just didn't want to see it go because to replace it for like would have been a grand. So I was like,
I know. I've I've got AEG um which is in the same
the same space.
Porper has the AEG. It's great because when I'm flying on a plane, it it pings up on my phone to say that the washing is done and then I forward it as a text message to my wife as a way of amusing myself.
I I wouldn't do that. I've never been brave enough to do that.
I've done it twice and that was that was the the the uh all my clothes chucked chucked at me afterwards was enough. Anyway, I wish I deserved entirely. I mean, I hear what you're saying though, by the way, pinball being a fun thing versus a labor of love.
Yeah.
Where is where is that labor of love on on the line before you think, "Fuck it. I'm out."
No, it's a thankless task. I bet I don't do it.
So, I got bits of pinball gear lying in my shed that have been there since the last UK Open. I just haven't had time to deal with
m I had the same thing. I had people messaging me going, "How's your homebrew going?" I was like, if I could just get rid of it now, I would have already. But I I can't be bothered with it. I've got no time for it. And it's like I'm like you. The work life balance is getting really difficult at the moment. I think
I think it is for a lot I think it is for a lot of people. But the thing is I got to go got to tournaments. I'm actually The reason you can't see my normal background is I'm just outside um San Diego and I'm going to indis, right? I'm gonna play awful in this because and and the last three tournaments, in fact, more than that, last four or five, I've played awful because I haven't played any pinball except when I turn up to the event.
So, you're going in cold. Yeah. Practice. I'm thinking to myself, actually, maybe I should just become one of the people that just gets to play day and night, turns up and plays well at a gig, and goes home. You know what I mean? and and I genuinely um feel that way right now. Now, in the fullness of time, once once I've got over this, I hate making decisions based on what just happened. I like to think about it.
You got Yeah. You got to reflect on it. Yeah. Yeah.
And we'll see how these next few events go. But I I give another example, right? There's a thing called Suavy, the Sav Pinball Show, right? That Mark Squires, who's a who's a superstar, I love Mark, right? um he's he's organized it for the last hundred years, right? And it's great fun. It's a social event with a bit of pinball, right? And we've loved it. Now, last year he told everybody he wasn't going to run it again.
And and you know, I can respect that. You got other things going on in your life. You for you.
And I I chatted to him and said, "Mark, look, um if you don't want to run it, there's other people that want to run it." Um, and he was like, "Well, you know, okay." I said, "Because people don't people I mean, I really like this event because you just sit back, have a few beers, play a little pinball. It's not like a tournament where I'm running around like a blue ared idiot trying to make everything work."
Yeah.
You know, the community just just does it and it's it's it's phenomenal. It's and and when he said he wasn't going to run it,
um, a few of us had a chat and we decided actually, okay, if Mark doesn't want to run it, we'll run it. um which is what I kind of said to him last year. So I phone up the pub and say, "Hey, you know, you've been doing this event um and now, you know, uh Mark's not wanting to do anymore, but we're keen to keep running the pubs. Like, we'd love you to come, you know, cuz cuz pubs are struggling right now, you know, they're they're fighting hard." I wanted to announce it so people get it in their in their diaries. But you know the conversation I had with him last year is as well you know someone's going to do something um and and we have and also and and you and actually you know Mark himself he's a legend um and we want to keep something that in the community we find valuable going. So anyway um we're going to we're going to run it. So, I've had the feedback with the usual thing in pinball. A few people who do nothing moaning. Hello. Those people look in the mirror. You know who you are. And a few people that are like, "Well done, Neil. Excellent idea. I'm really happy you're doing this.
I already
I don't know how you bother with it if I'm honest with you, but maybe that's just because I'm already burnt out." Um, actually I kind of this this was a conversation because we were like fed up of this [ __ ] rain Carl Weathers that we've had in the UK for the last
It's horrible.
I know. It's been horrific.
I I literally been trying to do this cabinet like sanding job for the last three weeks, but it's just like rain. It's horrible.
Yeah. and and and basically again it was just another thing I was like really man I can't you know I'm we're we're trying to do stuff cuz
we have started out this whole podcast is negative but I think the the bottom line really should be if you're you were talking about a couple of things right so let's summarize one you're trying to work find a work life balance between family and and work and hobby right and I get that it's not easy
y
I think if you're then taking on more responsibility by trying to organize other events only because as you say you did it a commitment over last year but now you're stretching yourself further I think you have to kind of at a point take a step back and go what can I actually achieve if I'm I'm setting my own standards and I set my own bar of what I expect from me
exactly exactly
achieve that you need to either go right I either condense what I'm doing by minimizing your scope of what you're going to take on or you spread it out evenly to other individuals that are willing to take it on and if no one's there to take it on then you have to just drop it. I'm sorry to say mate but like that that to me is better than doing the clubs inspired a few other clubs. So there's a new one opened up in called the pinball machine in Birmingham. Shout out to those guys. Great job. There's one in in Blackpool um that Luke Wells is I think it's Luke Wells has started. Shout out to him. Great job. Um, and you know, you know, I like to think that what we've done in in PBR has has inspired those folks. Um, if you if you rely upon, you know, pinball runs, pinball events run because of the goodwill of the community,
but you can the problem you get is is where you try to extract too much of that goodwill without putting in enough of your own goodwill. And but what you have to be what you have to be mindful of is is ensuring that everyone's putting in enough of their goodwill that makes them be valid about being involved in the first place. If that makes sense because you what what can't have is someone effectively generating more work for everybody else by the way that they behave if that makes sense. Right.
Yeah. Yeah. So, so look, you're right. And and and by the way, so look, I've got um British Masters, I've got Sav, and I've got um UK Open and EPC, which are all announced now, by the way, if you look
Yeah. about your biggest role, man.
What's that?
What? Stall. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Sorry. Stole's easy.
Um but it's it is refreshing to see you're going to be doing it again. I mean, no tell me I have had so many messages about that. I say, "Oh, [ __ ] hell, McCree. I'm coming again." Because I because I we're running stall. So, uh, yeah, we're gonna have a bit of fun with that. And fair play of Phil, you know. Um,
does that mean that you two are now best friends again?
No one ever claims to be my friend, Scott. Not even you.
Is that right?
Not even you. No. I mean, seriously, look, um, Phil reached out to me. I was kind of surprised by it, but we had Phil and I had a great um a great time because because where my games were, he was out at the front, I was out there, we were chatting a lot and I certainly felt, you know, he's he's had a few things going on in his life as we all do.
Yeah. Yeah. Um, and I think there was a a coming and actually fair play to Tony as well, but I think there was a a kind of a plugin of of um of uh thinking that that you know um where where you know I think both of us would say, you know, we didn't we didn't exactly um perform at our best through that through that dark time. But look, I'm up for stall ball. I'm bringing a ton of games. Uh, and and the shadow is back. That's that's all you need to know. The shadow is back for
to be fair. It is a good game for storeball.
It's the best game. It really is the best game. I wish we could do the barrel ball on the shadow, but um anyway, I need to
That would be quite a lot of coding, but someone could probably do it.
Someone would probably do it. But um so yeah, I mean look and so I mean this is the thing, right? Pinball community works because the community people in the community put stuff in. There are there are some amazing people in this community. Phil's one of them that put puts tons of effort in. Um, you know, there's there's a bunch of others that that run events and do stuff and help people out. Um, and and it's it's a it's a great gang. Um, and you know, just I think I think my message is is basically, you know, self-awareness. what what what is it you're doing that's contributing positively or negatively? Um and and and you know what what what could you do different? I think where I want to go and moving from another from that event to another event. So I got new so new games. The Walking Dead remastered arrived at my h at my house.
Yeah.
It's it's glorious sadly. And and actually I was warned this might be the case. There's not a lot of new stuff in it codewise yet, but boy does it play nice. [ __ ] hell, it plays really nice. Very impressed with how it plays.
Does The Walking Dead can play anyway.
No, no, no. Maybe if you're not good at pinball, Scott, but uh No, I am actually I'm one of those people. I'm no longer good at I was never brilliant at pinball, but
I still hate those pops, man. like that was just all
they've fixed that a little bit. One thing they have fixed is the ramp though. That shot is so it's like butter now.
Oh, really?
Yeah. And and um Yeah. So, I got that.
Have you done anything with the animations yet? Cuz I remember we
they've done Yeah.
Have they done a part where you can now switch between DMDR and CGI art or they're still
Yeah. So, I was told that the licensor hasn't yet signed off on that, but they think they will. It's just a matter of time.
Yeah. It kind of makes sense why you had such a loss of real estate.
Yeah, I think they fixed a lot of that as well though. It's like I think there's cut scenes where it's widescreen and then it goes back to the kind of scoreboard bit where it's kind of split. Um, I think they've got plans for that and and some of the some of the plans they've got that have been, you know, Stan kind enough to share them with me are um looking pretty good. I'm excited about it. It's my favorite game. I got the topper as well. It's bizarre. Actually, I got the topper before I got the game.
Oh, really?
Is a first ever. So, yeah. I mean, so, and then I um I played a lot of Dungeons and Dragons. Well, not a lot. I played a little bit of Dungeons and Dragons over the Christmas break.
Does that got better on the code now?
Yeah, I think it's a I think I really think if you like if you I think I personally think the game shoots really well. I know not everybody thinks that. Um, I think if you wanted a if you were like had space for one game and you could only afford it, you know, one game and you'd have to keep it for a year, I would put that game quite high up on the list to get because there is so much to do on it. And and also it's hard, you know, what I've started to realize is that, you know, the game changes when they respin the um the seed and and the the changes are quite different um more different than I would expect them to be. And I think it's quite cool that they've made a game. It's I mean, the game's huge. I think you could play that own that game for five years and still not see half of it. Um so I kind of like it. They still haven't got to version one yet, unfortunately. But and they've had a few bugs that were really awful.
Yeah, I heard about that. Yeah,
some real howlers. Um that I don't know, you know, I don't know how they got past the release engineering, but it happens, right? But I think um you know, I was, like I say, if you like how that game shoots, this the code on it is great. Anyway, and then back to kind of other pinball stuff. So, I went to Pinball at the Beach. Um, and it was a great show. Small show. It's not like Texas. It's more actually reminds me a bit more of Pinfest. Like a Pinfest size show in Florida with with in a a not so great hotel, I have to say. Um,
I saw your pictures, man. I'm glad I wasn't in that hotel. Cockroach.
Let me let me let me come back to the story of the cockroach. um cuz it is it's [ __ ] hilarious. But yeah, so it was um and literally all the manufacturers are there. So Stern were there, Spooky, Barrels of Fun, JGP, everybody is there.
It's good.
And you know, Jack Jack was there, Gary Stern.
Out of all the v the events I to go to, I think that would be one of the ones that's high on my list because it's just so cool to have a beach right next to the venue like that. This is it. So, I went with I went with Mandy. We flew out.
We had a week's holiday and then we had the show. It was glorious, right? We know Carl Weathers could have been a little bit better.
Um, a bunch of p a bunch of friends out there. Um, Travis and Joel from Triple Drain. Bunch of guys from the Hangar Pinball um location. If if you're in that part of the world, Google Hangar Pinball. They got a phenomenal location with some really really really great people. We went out on a sailboat into the bay. We just had like a day on a sailboat. Um the Carl Weathers was it was sunny. It was a little bit windy, but Scott, it was just the most the most relaxing day I've had in years. We're just [ __ ] and I dropped my hat in the ocean. They had to rescue it and it was just it was such a greatation.
Loved it. Such such great people. Um, we were just talking and and chatting the whole the whole day and and it was one of the the higherup pinball guys that that um organized the boat and everything and and he paid for it and so I I paid for lunch but um as a kind of thank you for him organizing the boat. But it was such a great day. I can't wait for next year on it because we had we had such a lot of fun. Um Mandy loved every minute of it except for the mighty cockroach. So um and the beach the beach there was just beautiful. The sand is lovely. We we were on the beach a couple of days. Um it was it was absolutely phenomenal. The hotel u so the the the the function room where the event is is brilliant. It's in this kind of weird sort of tent-like building,
right?
And it's it's brilliant. It's it's not huge. which is it's probably about the same. It's probably maybe a little bit bigger than the pinfest room, but Stern literally had I think just about every game they've ever made there since since they became Stern Pinball. But not the Stern electronic but since
they transported how many games then?
Oh, good question. I don't know, maybe 200.
Really?
Yeah.
Wow.
Maybe not. Maybe not even that number. Spooky had about 10 uh Beetlejuices and then they had every single Spooky game ever made was there which is quite cool.
Is it far for them to travel to you know transport all that?
Yeah, it's miles away from them. They're in they're in near Chicago. They're in in Wisconsin
but they but I think the guy Vandervine who organizes it is one of the guys that helped them out at TPF when they first started.
So I think there's a bit of a loyalty thing there.
Okay. Colin ran they ran a tournament was a lot of fun and again the venue and the beach that that part of it was just was was phenomenal. The hotel though I have to say I wouldn't stay there again.
Yeah.
If you watch if you watch the videos it comes out like it's some sort of kind of um Seavoy by the beach.
Is there like other hotels nearby though? I imagine there is.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's loads. I have to say St. Pete's right. So this is on St. Pete's Beach which is the far side of of Florida. I used to go, me and Mandy used to go there fairly regularly years ago uh when we first met back in the 2000s and it was an amazing place to visit. We we loved it there. Co and successive storms have really hurt it badly. It feels a bit rundown. Um, and then you got this place um, in the middle of it where this hotel, I mean, if you watch any of the YouTube videos or the brochures or the pictures, you know, the the whoever runs marketing for this hotel deserves a payriseise because
what you see there, you think, "Wow, this place, this is like the rits, right?"
When you arrive, it's kind of like more like Motel 6. And it it it is it is tired. like the drawers open by themselves because the the chester drawers are so ancient. It's got a hob gill hob type grill that that you know died in the 80s. It it's all very warm. And you can see they've tweaked a few things but not enough. Like they've put air condition modern air conditioner which um thank god actually. Um, but it's it's it's very rund down and and and also for what they charge. So there's a there was a a pimple at the beach rate that was quite reasonable. Um, but even that for that quality hotel was probably the top I would pay, but their normal rates are like 400 500 bucks a night and and more for some of the rooms and it's just not worth it. And then and then basically I'm I'm uh I'm down playing can't remember what I was playing. I think I was playing Winchester actually and I've got my headphones and the phone rings and I answer while I'm playing and it's like Mandy screaming on the phone, there's a cockroach here. There's a cockroach here. And I'm like and I and I kind of started to laugh and I was like she's like and I was like I had to bail car up to the the room and deal with this thing and and there was two of them. It was huge. And then we found a third one and then people were talking about it around the around the you know because we you kind of know a lot of people there from the pinball
and there's a lot of people at it and then and then this is so I was happened to be talking to a mate of mine that's that's um he's built a few hotels in his lifetime and he and I he pinged me and said I saw the cockroach and he's like what the hotel say I said I haven't been to see them yet but I'm I'm going to go see them cuz there's some other [ __ ] up going on with the bill anyway. He says, "Neil, right?" He says, "Here's what happened." Right? If they if they say it's if he goes to me, they here's what they'll do. They'll say, "It's Florida. It's normal." Right? That is a sack of [ __ ] Right? And I said, "No, I know that." Cuz I've I've been to Florida hundreds of times. I've never seen a cockroach in my life. Right? And then and then and then basically um and certainly not one in a hotel that's supposed to be the level that hotel is for sure. Right. sleeping in the beach or something or you're sleeping in the in the
This isn't the IIS, is it? So,
so anyway, fast forward um I went So, I went to see them. Oh, yeah. You know, this is Florida. We expected. I was like, you know, we're we we'll spray your room. And I'm like, and I kind of said this bit loud, I think you should spray the whole hotel. um cuz they were just pinging me off and everyone's like all these people checking in starting to look at me and I was like and I was showing them pictures of the cockroach and um the um and you know my take on this is you give them a chance to fix it and they just didn't. So, uh, we'll be back at the at the show. Although, probably me having to go at the hotel, they probably wouldn't want me back. But anyway, um, I think it's I kind of feel that you you got to
clarify. They didn't offer you any discount or compensation for
they offer me free breakfast. Um, and and I said I said, "Thanks, but I don't think my wife would want to eat in this hotel anymore."
That was true. And actually, here's the here's the thing. the following day. Um, so Mandy gets these, um, brutal migraine headaches. She got a migraine. She's convinced it was cuz she got freaked out by this thing in the and it was in the shower.
Um, it really stressed her out.
And so the last day she was she didn't come out. She was stuck in the hotel room because she had this killer migraine headache she couldn't get rid of. Um, you know, might might be not related, but I she was pretty convinced. And I mean she we were I mean the day before if it was if this had been at the start of the holiday we would have checked out. No question about it.
Sure.
Luckily it was luckily it was the last day and we were checking in the next day and I said like if you want to check out there's a hotel there's a Hilton down the road. We'll go to the Hilton.
Um anyway a lot of other people were talking about it. I think I think a lot of people got a different hotel and just walk walk to the walk to the event and and um you know and and actually there was an amazing steak place just just next door to the hotel. Absolutely stunning. Uh we went there. It was place was rammed. Um and then the food was phenomenal. That's why I love going to America. Um but but yeah, so we I play Beetle Juice.
Yeah.
Um I'm going to say one thing. This is will be an unpopular opinion. The topper is the most hideous thing I think I've ever seen. The thing is though, you're not a Beetlejuice fan, so you probably don't why it's so scary and ugly looking because it's meant to be scary and ugly looking.
It's It's not It's Why anyone would want that in their home.
It's beyond absolutely freaking awful looking.
It's well built, don't get me wrong. It's well built, but
And it's huge. I mean, it's massive.
People say it's the same height as Evil Dead. Tell you what I'm interested to know, right? And maybe you'll be able to answer this based on Evil Dead. Would you be able to ever fold the backbox down with the topper on or would you have to take off?
I'm convinced you'd have to take it off
based on what I saw. Um,
that is the problem with these over the top toppers, isn't it? It's like they're not
dead. Evil Dead you have to take it off. You can't leave it on with Evil Dead. It just weighs too much.
Is it easy to remove?
Yeah, Evil Dead. If you're moving, if you fold the top down, Evil Dead, you cannot keep the top on.
Yeah, but can you take it out easily to uncouple it from the
Oh, so on Evil Dead, there's three or four cables and then there's two wing nuts. Spin spin off. Um,
crazy. The hard part is putting it back on because
Evil Dead, the topper's got all this hair on it and it kind of gets in the way of finding where the hole is. Um,
right.
And we don't have that problem. No, we definitely don't. So, anyway, the the um the thing the thing um that I uh the thing the thing I Yes,
we'll go back to Juice. Go on. Tell me what you the game. You said unpopular opinion top is ugly. What else?
Yeah. So, I mean, and look, Franch's done a I mean, you know, if you're a Beetlejuice fan, you can't help you're going to love what he's done with the art. is it is so well presented. Um as he always does frankly and he you know he was there and said hello um and you know I had a quick chat with him the and and so I played the game and actually again shout out to Spooky. He let me play it before the um event opened um to you know to help test them and the game I felt that the the game was a lot of fun. Uh, it is a fan layout. I know a lot of people have challenged me on that, but it is definitely a fan layout. It feels like you're playing, for me, it felt like I was playing Attack from Mars and they just moved the spaceship to the side. Um, and that to me that's a good thing. You know, I I kind of see this as a modernday Attack from Mars. Um, from a shots point of view, the the one thing that I I'm kind of I actually forgot it was there more than I remember, but then I went back to really have a go with that. The upper flipper seems a bit superfluous. Um, and and I'm again, I'm not saying this as a as a criticism, but it kind of feels like they had a spot to stick something, so they stuck a flipper there. Um, and and the kind of shots that it hits are not, you know, they're not um,
what shots does it hit at the moment?
Well, I'm trying to remember. There's a couple of there's a couple of standups that that it hits. I think that might be a drop target. I can't remember. But what it's not is like a third flipper where you've got like a fan of shots. It's just not not that at least or or at least I couldn't I couldn't see anything else other than that. It's not that it's bad or, you know, it's there. So, it's there, but it just didn't feel like um it kind of feels like the the extra flipper finger on the sling on Evil Dead, which is I'll be honest with you, it's a bit of a gimmick on Evil Dead. Um I never I never ever use it.
I think what always threw me off with Evil Dead is you expect it to bounce. Do you know what I mean? like to kick it and then if you're not used to it and
I mean I I I was I have to say I was looking at it and thinking I wonder if I could put a sling in there take it out and put put a regular sling on because I actually think that would make it
could Yeah.
I think it would make the game better genuinely. So what else about I mean like I said the art's beautiful. The video on the back seems great. It's got this it's got the um day mode where everything's dancing and singing. And the challenge with that is is you know when the like the the sofa that where the ball lock goes moves around. So you can't you probably can't jack this game up too high because I think that that will stop working or you'd have to turn it off. Um the day mode with the song going is it is it's it's it's definitely a moment. It's fun. Um the other the other I mean the code's obviously super early. They've just but they've got a lot done. Um there's a couple of really nice shots on it. There's this I think the orbit shots are really great on this game. There's one where it kind of goes all the way around and then comes to your flipper and then you whack it to hit the Polaroid camera. I felt that was a super satisfying shot. I really liked that. The rest of the shots feel like to me genuinely felt like AFM. Even the the the the monster thing that moves around.
Not necessarily a bad thing anyway, but as you say,
I think I think it's a good thing. And I mean this other thing and Spooky did say this. The game was super easy to play. I mean I had almost an hour on ball one.
Yeah, it's crazy when you told me that. I was like, "Wow, that's a long time."
I kind of gave up because the people behind me were been waiting for so long. I didn't play balls two and three. Um I think I put I don't know 600 million on it. I can't remember. Um it it I enjoy playing it. Um I mean so I haven't got one. I know everyone everyone in the world thinks I've bought one from Stefan. Right.
I did. Yeah.
I have not bought one from Stefan. Phone him up and ask him. Right. He was he had one and then the price was like, "Uh, you're having a laugh." So, I didn't buy it from him. But I am looking for one. Um, I've got a
Yeah, the kineticist um quoted me in for the Dutch pinball news that they said that they they're still making Back to the Future, but it was like a misquote anyway cuz Mel I think Mel I forget who responded.
Mel's Mel's probably made the most sensible choice he could have made, which is to leave them and go do something else.
Oh, really?
Yeah, he's out and and uh and I've got a lot of time for him. Uh he's very he's he's he's probably the only person in Dutch Pinball I don't know him that well to be fair but he definitely felt more customer focused than the rest of them. So I met I spoke to him in a few times at different gigs. I asked him about Jack the backup so I could have a proper game of it and he did.
I'm still the rumor was going to be that obviously Stern which was incorrect obviously but Stern was going to partner with um Dutch now to make Back to the Future which is obviously is wrong. Um, but I'm more interested to know they're still doing Back to the Future. I mean, I I'm just like,
yeah, so they have the license, but there's four parts to to the license. Well, in my view, there's four things you need for the license. I think they've got two of them. I think they still lack the other two. So, they've got the movie rights. Um, I think included in that is the audio rights, but I'm not sure. I don't So I'm not convinced that includes Huey Lewis in the news. So actually there's five things I think they need. So I think they've got the movie rights that includes the soundtrack, all that [ __ ] the Libyans and all that good stuff, right? I don't think they've got Huey Lewis in the news because I'm pretty sure he's with a different production company. So they would have to do that individually. Um they have Delorean apparently. So, so some company in America in Texas bought the rights to Delorean. Apparently, Dutch Pinball have agreed those rights to have the Delorean on the um playfield. I would
So, that's the other thing that I don't believe that they have.
I heard I heard a rumor there was a rumor bouncing around that they'd signed up
Christopher Lloyd. Um and there was another rumor that they'd sign Michael G. Fox, but not Christopher Lloyd. I mean, if they don't have those two,
no.
Plus Biff, plus um what's Marty McFly's dad? I forgot his name. Um George.
Yeah.
Plus, um Marty's mom. I mean, those are core characters and that that they just have to have. Um otherwise we don't want another predator where we have some sort of rush some sort of
struggling to make 300 units like a certain other company right but yeah
Brazilian guy going get to the chopper and then there's one other thing that they need just got in my head no that so it's the cast members right
I know speaking to Joe Kamikov who licensed it originally for Stern or data east as it was back then.
Yeah. Yeah.
They struggled to get the rights and actually one of the reasons Stern didn't want to as I understand it I don't I'm you know it's just what what I've kind of heard and pieced together because Stern couldn't get all the rights they didn't want to make it. Um you know
I think so I think and but also I think there are people in Stern that would love to love some of the designers that would love to to have made the game.
It's interesting. Yeah, cuz pinball now I'd say is a little bit more um I suppose like as a we haven't spoke about yet, we'll talk about in a bit, but you know, obviously Pokémon and that you just start to realize now that big IPs are possible. Um and that I would have thought given that you'd have a better time trying to puh persuade those licenses that you know you've got this kind of like reputation for making these games, you can do it. So
yeah. No, I mean you think that, but I think to be honest you 90% of the time you're dealing with lawyers or agents and then sometimes you got to deal with a family. You know, I know um Stern put a bit of effort in trying to get Broady. Um and I think from what I heard, I think um George said this in one of the TPF sessions was Brody's family just weren't interested at all. And if you know and then you're stuck, what do you do? Oh, we're not going to make the game. Um, you know, I think they had enough of Brody in the movie that that they got away with that. Yeah, he wasn't on the playfield. Kind of annoying. Um, but, you know, the the fact he was in the movies, I think, made it work. You know, Predator, Arie's not even on the screen.
No. Um, I mean, you see you occasionally you occasionally see his his boot knife and some of the other cutscenes and
and his gun or maybe his arm,
but it's not there, right? It's a joke.
Yeah.
I um, you know, I think the um I think yeah, the big big themes are there, but I don't think you like you know I think Predator has proven don't do a theme unless you've got it. Blues Brothers even more so. Um, but you can do it. You know, I look at Jurassic Park where Stern had very little amount of the rights. Basically, they didn't have any any of the characters except Ned
because he he didn't. So, the guy who plays Ned, I forget his name. He said, "I don't give a [ __ ] Do whatever you want." And and they did.
Um, and I think that was fine. You got people that did the movie code, which you know was was okay. Um, but it's it's like when you do if you do it badly. I remember um Guardians of the Galaxy it got released with no music and I'm like
where's the music right that's just
I remember the Cleveland code kind of sorted a lot of that out but
they eventually got some music in it and some other stuff but it just it was it was a definite miss. So yeah, these I think these big titles are there, but I think I think like I think the pinball companies have to say, you know, look, unless we get and I think this has happened to Stern on a couple of occasions where they got a title, they believed they would get the assets they wanted and they didn't. And and I think the last one, and I don't know this, but this is my guess. They they were deep down a load of work on Indiana Jones and then killed it.
Oh, really?
I'm gonna I I would put money on it. That was because there was some license that they just either couldn't make the business case work for or they just couldn't get
or they had to release based on like a bit like Toy Story 4 if it was.
Yeah. I mean, what the hell?
The worst movie out of the entire franchise
and had a pinball machine with no toys on it. Um, yeah. I mean, just
the irony, isn't it? Build a game based on toys.
We put an iPad on it. Tell you what is funny actually in Toy Story 5 I've noticed I don't know if it's like the main villain or something but they've made it so that the lily pad which is like an iPad thing is is basically a bit of a bad guy and I just thought that's quite funny because there's an iPad in in the Toy Story pinball machine. That's quite you know when you think about it.
Yeah. I mean that is like a big iPad in the back of it. So yeah. So I think Beetlejuice I think I mean I couldn't hear the audio because the show um but I think those have got an order. I think they'll be happy with it. A lot of people say, "No, Evil Dead or Beetlejuice." So, cards on the table. I am a massive Evil Dead fan, right? I am not a big Beetlejuice fan. So, I've got bias here, right? I'm I'm human. Um I think Evil Dead if I if I if I was to strip these games and not have any theme on them, I strongly believe Evil Dead shoots way better. Was Evil Dead more at release date on sticker price?
No, it was less. Less
slightly less. Yeah.
Wow.
And and they made less Evil Dead. So, um
that's true.
I think the shots on Evil Dead again. I think Spooky done a great job with a wide body. Um there's a lot of shots on it. The shots are are pretty all of them are pretty satisfying. Um, and I I kind of feel that Evil Dead, if you had to if you could only have one, I would be pitching for Evil Dead. Um, but but don't me.
We got to crack on. What about Winchester?
Winchester. So, I played that um in Chicago. I played it again. Um, I mean, it's a tough game. No question about it. Um, and when you see Carl play it, he makes it look easier. Actually, I'm going to get to play that tonight because um I'm running the tournament at Ace Goi. The best Korean barbecue on the planet, by the way. If you're ever in LA, go to Ace Go. It is amazing. All you can eat. It's Korean barbecue just the business. And it's got an awesome set of games. Shane, who runs it, is a superhero. So, I guess it's in they've got one cuz um Carl's Carl's a buddy. It's kind of Carl's local place. I don't think it'll be there tonight though. But um I'm running a tournament up there which I'm looking forward to preending this tournament. Um so yeah, it's a tough game. The code hadn't moved much since I last played it which was a little bit disappointing. I
was going to ask you if there was like code updates, but
they put a big release out. I think it must have come out just after it. Um I think they've done a few tweaks. Um it's a tough game, but I I really enjoyed it. The vibe of it is just amazing. It does. It It's for me it's like a It's If you were to the other They could take the same layout, theme, etc., and they could put Luigi Mansion on it. It's this kind of spook, you know, the haunted house. You're in Luigi's Mansion.
That would be pretty cool actually as an IP.
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And I think we're going to see more and more video games.
Well, now that Nintendo's in there, right, that's pretty cool. But yeah,
Pokemon Company is just there's a there's a subtle difference. We'll talk about that in a minute, but okay.
I think um I think um
I mean I really like Winchester. I don't think it's going to be for everybody though. Um because it is a it's like you play um
I wouldn't worry about it being for everybody. It's only 500 of the damn things.
Well, I mean that's that's the upside. You know, you probably for at least for a year you'll probably get your money back. So if you don't like it, but I I kind of feel that um you know, Beju, anyone can play that. um Winchester, there's a couple of tight shots that you're gonna have to get used to. Again, I personally love games like that. Um so, I really enjoyed it and and again, a shout out to um the Barrels of Fun guys. Um who's their boss? I forget his name. Um
David
David, sorry, David. Um David and I had a really good chat. We're talking about a lot of things. The guy's a machine. He was there day and night and and really really um really welcoming. actually again the spooky guys as well. They were really welcoming. I met met a few more of them. I got a bunch of merch and a few other things from them, but um really lovely people. And then and then Stern had Walking Dead there. Uh obviously they're big game at the moment and a lot of people thought Pokemon would be there but it wasn't which is kind of annoying. The launch for Pokemon or at least the media launch was the following week. I got invited to it but unfortunately I couldn't make it. you know, so just great, Winchester, great, Walking Dead, great. All all good titles. GGP were there with Harry Potter. I had a couple of games of that. I still I don't know. It's just
to get one now.
No, it's just not it just doesn't do it for me. I I think it's this the whole thing is kind of gear around this scoop and it just I don't know. It just doesn't feel it's not a game I just naturally want to go back to. I did have a good few games. Elton John though was [ __ ] awesome game. Really, really, really well done. And then there was a couple other kind of weird games. They had this game, I forget, it's called Rotate or something where it was a it was a table pinball machine. Four players, four plungers, and the actual playfield rotated.
Weird.
When you play lose a ball, it would rotate it to player two who would play. It was a It was the most coolest thing I've ever seen. I mean, the game wasn't great, unfortunately, but it was it was it was
that sounds good. Yeah.
Yeah, it was good. I mean, keeping that thing running must be massive, but um it was it like you just see it in the pub, you know, sat around there and people playing it. I just think it would be massive. So, yeah, some Pokemon. I ordered one. I've got an LE coming.
I would never buy Pokemon. I'm not interested. Does nothing for me. Bought Pokemon. Who would have thought Neil's bought another Sternelli? Everyone news.
I have to say. So, look, Phil sold out of them. I
actually But look, I'm a barrels. You can see it there. Look.
Okay. Yeah. Well done, man.
Yeah, that's I mean I mean David send Scott a Fiverr. He's giving you all that.
Yeah, exactly. All that all that publicity.
He deserves a Fiverr for that. Um David, where where are our games? Scott and I demand our games.
Waiting patiently. I do. I do harass our local David in the UK saying is there an update on when we're going to get Winchester but not yet I've heard apparently they're turning through them so who knows right maybe we'll get it
I I am not convinced we will get our games by the end of March though that's the new
maybe March I think April personally
but when we I thought the I thought the wasn't the promise that all the games would be done by March
I think they messed up because David as in Vaness made the assumption he could run two games on the line at once. And I think that proved a lot more difficult in reality. And they then had to finish up June, which obviously they stopped the orders in by the end of what was it, December. And then they had to then run with the last few units of June. And now they're just fulltime on uh Winchester. So I don't know how many games they're going through uh a week versus a month. I don't know. But like the I imagined or something.
Yeah, I've seen about 15 of them I think on on the Facebook and pinite.
Yeah, you could run an extrapolation, right? There isn't that many to run through. So,
but I don't I genuinely don't I mean I think this game is going to keep them busier till probably July
maybe. Actually, probably until actually did David did tell me that they probably wouldn't have a new game at TPF. It would be after that.
Really? Okay. expect this will keep them busy until then. Maybe a bit busier. I mean, one thing actually and this what this is the thing I love about David, you know, we're talking about June. I played it again in June definitely a great game and getting better and better with all the code updates and had that back glass on it. It's just staggeringly nice. You know, I think they realized that there was, you know, there's probably another way of doing what they did with June that that would have been better for it. But um you know he's such a such a nice bloke. Uh
yeah, absolutely.
Really really nice guy.
Yeah. So so Pokemon I couldn't make it out there. What's your take, Scott? Give us your Pokemon take.
So for me it was a no-brainer to do it as a brand. Um Pokemon people don't I think maybe realize it in the pinball industry, but my god the trading card world makes pinball look insignificant when it comes to spending money. Like there's like Logan Paul selling trading cards for like 16 million for one card. I'm telling you now, I'm amazed that anybody actually got a pinball machine as an LE because I would have thought all the trading card collectors would have scalped the hell out of it. I don't fully expect it to like lose value. I honestly think it will probably go up in value, even though I know people hate that. They they don't like seeing it as an investment opportunity. I'm telling you now though, when it comes to trading trading card games, they they're just there to make money. It is a massive money-m scheme Pokemon these days. I don't think it like it used to be when you were a kid. People used to just collect them as, you know, trade them in the playground. Those days are dead. I mean, it's taken over by like millennials crowding over like vending machines fighting to get the latest. I mean, you can see it. Just type in Costco Pokemon and there's people literally punching each other to get the latest box of Pokemon cards. Like to
everyone everyone's got their I kind of find it funny like on pin side there's a bunch of pinball people ripping the out of Pokemon people and I'm like uh people in stone people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. You know what I mean? It's like which is the which is the weirder hobby?
Yeah. I'm focusing obviously truly on the the value there, but I mean for me at least I feel like it it will hold value at the very least. I think as a game I was a little bit disappointed in the art package only from a perspective if you had it in a lineup you'd only see the word Pokemon regardless of the addition of the game at the front and I felt like that was a little misstep. Um art package wise I I think it's very on form. They've obviously had to follow what the licens had dictated. So, they probably didn't have much freedom anyway, but it looked great. I think it was nice. It was colorful exactly as Pokemon should be. The assets look great. The sound seems okay. They had Meow, I believe. I'm not followed anime for a long time, so I don't actually know if it was a new voice actor. I'm used to the kind of like early seasons of Pokémon when I was a kid, so it didn't sound like the Meow I knew anyway. But the only thing I was griping about, if I'm honest with you, is that you didn't have Jesse and James from the Rocket, Team Rocket.
Yeah, I think I mean a lot of people have made that same observation. I think it and also the players don't the players don't seem to be there either because you're the player, right?
Well, you don't play Ash. Yeah. But then again, that's that seems to be a tired old trope of any pinball machine with licensing. I you don't play the character from the movie. You are the character. Blah blah blah.
Yeah. Exactly. So, I mean, it's it's
Yeah, I mean, I think they probably ran out of cash or or kick
whatever. It doesn't bother me too much not playing Ash if I'm honest with you. They still have the your usual Pokemon in there, right? You got like And the fact I' I don't know and you maybe can firm this up for me or not, but I've heard you'll be able to trade Pokemon through Insider Connect if that's true.
Yeah. So, I think I think there's I think there's a lot of Insider Connected stuff to come out.
Yeah, that'd be really cool. I mean honestly I think it's the perfect like platform for pinball. It's going to bring lots of new people in. You'll have people coming up logging in online. Man, if I was an operator, I would love this. That is a cash cow. Like it is going to be absolutely hammered on location that game. I guarantee it.
Yeah. I I mean I mean I was talking to one of the distributors actually when we were on the boat. Shout out to Troy at Tilt Amusements. Really really great guy. Uh he was on the boat with us. He was a bit nervous because Stern announced it whilst he was on this boat and his like phone went on fire.
I bet he's like Jesus Christ and and he's like like um they did the I think the the pre the pre thing you know the little trick teaser that they release and he was like trying to like cope with it because I don't think I don't think he knew it was coming out that day specifically. He I mean he was saying Neil I'll have a hundred of these in locations in about a week. Like holy [ __ ]
I mean it's a king title. I think I'm really glad Stern somehow managed to convince them to get that IP. I mean that's a hard IPA to get. I imagine it's it's huge.
It's interesting though because um in terms of collabs like that, Fortnite are doing a Pokemon collab this year as well. Um
it's different with Fortnite though. Fortnite is huge. I mean had me wrong Fortnite.
It's a different league. But I just thought it was kind of funny that they were both talk, you know, literally on my Facebook I had like starting Pokemon and I had Facebook Fortnite Pokemon. I was like, "Holy [ __ ] I have to say back in the day
I got a couple of Pokemon games and I thought they were absolute pants. They were they were
I played I played a fair amount of Pokemon when I was a kid on the Game Boy. I had on Game Boy and Game Boy Advance. So Pokemon Red, Blue, Yellow, God knows how many others of ones I did. Ruby edition. But like for me back on the game little bit disappointed. It was kind of a if I'm honest with you by the numbers layout. You talk about fan layouts that has a fan layout if I ever saw. And I
it's I mean Star open about it. Look, we've made this game easy and approachable
which is fine. I think I think say they're trying to bring in new audiences and this is the perfect mechanism for that for me. So too much for that.
I am so unconvinced about oh we get one big title and all of a sudden you know we double the population of Pim.
You won't you'll just get operators happy because they'll be making more more buck at the at the location. I mean I mean I definitely think I mean there are titles where I think um you could move the D like Dungeons and Dragons you know STEM went to a few Dungeons and Dragons events and they definitely shipped a lot of
Yeah they definitely shipped a lot of games because of that and and actually there was one thing they were at and before they opened the doors and this this um I don't know what the venue was but the place was rammed and um I was like holy [ __ ] I mean, I know I know it's a big um I know it's a big thing. Um but when you see it at a convention like that where there's like literally it looked like there was like I don't know 20,000 people there and I was like holy [ __ ] Probably more than that. Yeah. I mean Pokemon for me I know nothing about Pokemon other than um Bulbasaur. I don't know and I don't know why I know how
Pikachu surely but yeah.
Oh yeah. Pikachu. everyone. I mean, everyone knows Pikachu, but Bulbasaur is the only non Pikachu Pikachu that I know um or whatever they're called. So, I I kind of look I'm kind of intrepidly um going to play this game from the point that I hope it's a good pinball game. Um
I think it's got the huge potential for replayability.
Also, the reason the reason that I bought it though, everyone's like, I was out on this game, right? Let me tell you, right? I was out on this game. Phil had sold all the Ellies. EC had no more Ellies. They were all gone. And then the price fiasco happened, which we'll we'll come to next. And the the um Pokemon trailer came out and I had on my laptop and my grandson Theo comes over and I'm watching this. He's like, "Granddad, what's that?" I was like, "It's Pokemon Pinball." He's like, "What?" He's like, and I turn the volume up. He's watching. He's like, "Ah,
I bet." And um he said, "Granddan, are you getting Pokemon Pibble?" I said, "I don't think so, F." I was like, "Why not?" I was like, "I'm not a big Pokemon guy." He's like, "But I love Pikachu." Um I phone I ping Phil and said, "Have you got any more games?" He's like, "No, they're all sold out." I was like that. I kind of left it. I was like, "Sorry, F. They've sold out." And then um during this pricing thing, I was talking to one of my many friends at Stern and they asked me, "No, did you get did you get a game?" I was like, "No, they'd sold out of LE." He's like, "Do you want one?" I was like, "Yes."
Okay.
And and he said he said, "Well, we we'll we'll we'll get another one to electrocoin." And then and then it's
really lucky, I must admit, man, cuz
and and thank you to Stern for that. Oh yeah. Uh I feel I feel blessed and special.
It's good.
I'll probably sell it almost a week after I get it. But
you don't I mean I'm hoping to get to play it this week over here. I
I think it will be it will be a fun simple shooter. I think it's going to have a lot of replayability. I like the the mechanism in the center which is the Meow sort of air balloon ship thing. I think it looks incredibly smooth. I like what they've done with it, but I felt for me the only downsides I feel like because it was the half Gomez, half Jack Danger thing, I just got the feeling like the game could have been more and it was kind of cut back and made simpler because they were like, "We don't want to make complex ball paths next. We just want to create a game that's accessible."
Yeah. I mean, I keep hearing that, but I mean, what I heard was at Pinball at the Beach. I think it was Jack that said it. Or was it George? They said that the game was like 80 or 90% Jack. So, I don't think they changed an awful lot.
Well, that's good in that in that way, right? But yeah, disappointing in the
I don't think you're going to have crazy ball paths on a game that you want to be open to others to play, right? So,
my biggest gripe, I forgot this pun. The ball does not eat the ball.
It does actually. It goes underneath the scoop
way. Yeah, it cheats if you've got the premium or le Yeah. Then the diver lifts up and
you've shelled out like half your life savings. You get the ball eating the ball. I mean, I think look, I looked at it when I looked at the trailers and and a and a few videos of people playing it and then a few people that were at the the launch event, which I was I was invited to, but I couldn't make um because of work. Basically, um you know, I was pinging a few people um Retro Ralph, Tom Graph, um Vic and uh and and and others that were there, Mel, and they were all saying this game's fun, really fun. Um, so I was I was kind of like and then I think Theo saying that he was disappointed I wasn't getting it. Um,
yeah kind of made me get it. Anyway, thank again thank you to Stern EC and Phil
given the new price adjustments which I know we're going to short to very talk short
yes very shortly. I would have been tempted to get one. I'm not going to lie cuz it's it's not something I I I just think I need to try it first. And I obviously I wait.
I mean that was that was what I was going to do. I was going to wait play it and if it was a good game I pick up a premium. Um when whenever I'm not convinced about a theme, you know, I I'll I'll wait and see. cuz you know for a fact as well as I do, right, Stern in the UK was kind of like, why buy a game that should be cheaper for more money when I can get a boutique game that's got more packed in it for the same cash? It's like it just from a value proposition, it just didn't feel like the right choice anymore. But yeah.
Well, I think and and you know, potentially, you know, resale, which I mean, Evil Dead is the resale prices for that are nuts. I've got two of them as well. Um, but I I I don't think and and you know, I'm I'm trying to get a Beetlejuice again if if if you've got one. I'm not, by the way, I'm not paying I'm not paying.
Don't tempt me. I can sell you my one.
I'm paying list. I'm not paying anything other than list.
No, you're paying double, mate.
No, I'm not. Well, I won't buy it, man. Because it's because
Let me tell you, this game is not worth a premium. Beetlejuice is not worth a premium. If you've paid a premium for it, you've been you you will regret it. I promise you that. It's It's a fun game. It's a good game. It is not a premium title in my view. Um absolutely not. Um just want to Yeah, let's move on to the pricing fun. Um
yes,
it we're at 1 hour 15 minutes.
Yeah, I'm going to get hassle from my wife soon. I need to eat something.
Yeah. So look um I have been talking to Stern I don't know for two or three years more than that actually to say you've got pricing badly wrong in the UK and I did a and many of you have heard me I'm going to buy a a game from the US I'm going to see how much it costs I'm going to compare it blah blah blah blah and I did all that did all the work for that important Star Wars again help me clarify that for less but I've import if you go to the club you'll see few games there that I've imported from the US you you can tell by the coin door at the front right so I've got a pretty good understanding of prices and you know shipping costs and not shipping on a boat I fly it right um
yeah air freight So, um, I've been making this this, you know, I've been saying blah blah blah and and you know, I say it to Gary, to Seth, to John, to the new the new guys. They got a new chief revenue guy. I forget his name, but sensible guy. And, you know, I think Stern's been looking at um, you know, in the US, the, you know, everyone's like, "Oh, the market in the US, I think the market's pretty decent right now." I don't see what we're seeing here in terms of Yeah. the used prices have been gone down a little bit. I think that's a supply issue rather than a market issue. They started to pick up a little bit as well. Um but but you know I definitely think we had an over supply for a while. I think that's that's you know becoming less of an issue. Um helped by big titles like Harry Potter that's just you know they're going to be making that until Harry you know until the guy who played Harry Potter is 100 I think. Um, which is good news for good news for them. But you know, you know, every time I saw Stern and and a few other Brits that go to TPF, etc., you know, they banged this drum as well. But we, you know, we I made a you know, I put together a few bits and pieces on paper and said, "Guys, explain this to me." Um and um at some point during they announced this at DPO, but I I'd got wind of it before they were and they told me like they were going to put a bit bit more focus into Europe. We'd love to have a chat. So I had a I don't know about a couple of conference calls, you know, I gave them my position on what I thought them where the market was, some of the issues, some of the opportunities. Um, and and I also said, you know, in in in the US it's very much barcade focused. Here in Europe, it's probably more club focused. And I said, you need to figure out how you adapt to that. And these clubs aren't rich clubs. They're like, you know, they're they're not for profofit and most of the games probably are are borrowed rather than owned. Um, really good chat with John, um, Seth and actually Gary as well. Um, and you know, they're like, "Yeah, we we we're going to do something. We're going to do something." And then DPO, if you're at DPO, Jack and Gary said it at their their talk, you know, that, you know, we're we're moving John over to focus on on Europe and we're going to start trying to help build the EU UK base. And then I want to say I can't remember when it was but it must be about a week before maybe along that a week before the the trailer the teaser came out for Pokemon and and was like what I heard was is oh there's going to be a European RRP and I was like oh really that's cool. Um hoping that it would be lower. Um, and then you know there was a uh things happening and then the game got released and the pricing came out and I said to I said to Phil, "What's the pricing? What's the price on the game?" And he's like, "The price has gone up." I was like, "What?" I was like, "ST told me it should be coming down."
Yeah.
He said, "Cuz they're putting an RRP on." He's like, "Well, Electric have told me it's going to be more."
And I'm like, "Wow." So, you know, I kind of pinged pinged them and said, I don't know, maybe um maybe putting a maybe it help us if you put a UK price on as well as a European one. Um and and to be fair, so I suggested that,
especially when the dollar rates been weaker recently as well, right? So,
yeah, I suggested that um they might have So, um actually, cuz I'm a dick, I'm going to take credit for it. It's all because of [ __ ] me. I don't know if they were planning on doing that. I don't think so. I don't I think there was going to be a euro price and then they added a GBP price, right? And and a few conversations, you know, if anyone wants to um if anyone disbelieves me, I've got a few um things I could show you because there are people who just think we make [ __ ] up. Um but um yes, so I've literally been banging on this drum. you know, I was chatting to Phil and David um and and and I had a chat with with um John from ElectroCoin. Um he he called me to ask me, you know, what was going on? And and I think all of those guy, you know, we we we're always, you know, I look at the the thread for Pokemon, it's literally like, who can we set fire to for the pricing? Is it Stern? Is it this guy? Is it that? It's like it's like there's like pitches and there's torches and pitchforks. we will find this evil person, right? And you know, anyway, we've got to a place where, you know, prices are what, two grand, three grand better now, right?
Massive difference.
Massive. And I have to say, if you ask me that
market back into life,
if you'd asked me that six months ago, I would say no chance, right? Um, but I think Stern have listened, they've analyzed, and they've acted. Um, a lot they get, you know, lots of people give stam load of [ __ ] Um,
I mean, the only thing I'm concerned about, right, is the knock-on effect of the second mark secondhand market. So, anybody who bought a game that was, you know, still in production now and then goes to sell it, that you're instantly two to threek worse off. I get the fact,
yeah, but I don't I don't know if they're going to sell games before Pokemon at the new pricing. I think this is only going to apply to new games. I I hate to be that person because I'm not sure if I can say it or not, but I've already been told it can be done and it is being done.
Oh, okay.
Production is basically on the new price.
Yeah. Yeah. So, maybe so new games. Yeah. But look, we've had this both ways, right? So, I think I get it, right?
Right. So, if they built a new if they built a new batch of Kongs,
yeah, there's a chance they could be the new pricing. I I'll remember every remind everybody though, right? The that there's a bunch of people who bought Stranger Things at six grand and then they they they made a new batch at eight and then all those [ __ ] put their price up when they were selling them by two grand and claimed that
those effers.
I mean I mean oh yeah, I'm in the community but I'm going to [ __ ] you for two grand. I don't know. Maybe I'm too charitable, Scott. But that that to me feels a bit of a laugh really.
Okay, maybe we've lost money on other games. I don't know. But I I um that doesn't feel community-minded. And and anyway,
I mean, back on the pricing, right, though,
it is a genuine shocker that we've now got games at two to three grand cheaper. It does put Stern back in the I would say, you know, forefront to say this is a choice now. It's a really good viable choice. There's value for money in that game now. It's a a definite positive thing. I felt like, you know, Sternweather is in a death spiral because I don't know what the sales were like for Sterns in the UK, but I can't imagine they were as good as they were.
Yeah, they were definitely they were definitely down, isn't you can see that. No question. I think um at least
I'm grateful you've done it.
Yeah, I'm I'm grateful I've done it, too. I mean, it's so you know, look, I I I defin make their own own choices. I I kind of gave them data and informed them.
Yeah. Look, I'm glad they did it. I'm glad I know.
Whether that was relevant or not, I don't know. But I I was I was in the middle of the the discussion with them. I think they've done a great thing. I think they've made pricing much more transparent. Um but I think we got a long journey ahead. You know, Trump's all over with tariffs again and the price of the dollar versus the pound's going to move. So, look, enjoy it while it lasts is my kind of um message. Yeah, go order a Pokemon. Um,
but
I'm gonna have to go, man, because my son,
but look. Um, anyway, so, uh, yeah, thanks, Scott. It's been good to catch up. We had a lot to talk about. Um, we'll probably do a pre-Tpf one hopefully, um, in a couple of weeks time, um, or maybe a postTPF one. I don't know. We'll have to think about it. Um, but, um, apologies that we were late in getting this out. Um that's life and um I leave you with one glorious message. In this world, my friend, there are two types of people. People with loaded guns and people who dig. You dig?
Okay. That dirty Harry comment or was it? I don't know who that is.
I don't think I got it right, but it's from uh the good, the bad, and the ugly.
Oh, is it? Oh, yeah. I mean, okay, fair enough.
Glorious quote. Um, yeah. So, go dig your pinball. Have fun. Enjoy it. Um, and, uh, when you don't play so well, don't stress about it. Um, there there are people fighting a war in Ukraine. Context for you folks. Scott, pleasure as always. Give my love to everybody and uh, we'll see you soon.
See you later.
Bye-bye.