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Full conversation with Enzo

Don's Pinball Podcast (patreon feed)·podcast_episode·1h 1m·analyzed·Aug 28, 2024
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.034

TL;DR

Industry insiders discuss Avatar leak, Stern/JJP release timing, and pinball's mainstream expansion strategy.

Summary

Don and Enzo discuss recent pinball industry news, including the leaked Avatar photo from Jersey Jack Pinball, the upcoming Stern releases (Jaws topper mode, X-Men speculation), and Stern's Costco strategy. They analyze game design philosophy (John Wick as a first-person shooter experience), code updates, pricing dynamics, and the role of Insider Connected tracking technology in driving player engagement and manufacturer data collection.

Key Claims

  • Jersey Jack Pinball knows what their next three games are and is working on them simultaneously, potentially juggling release windows

    medium confidence · Enzo, citing Gonzo's UK interview with JJP, paraphrasing JJP's statement about their pipeline

  • Avatar for Jersey Jack will include content from the first two Avatar movies based on decoded mode lights visible in the leaked photo

    medium confidence · Don and Enzo analyzing the leaked photo's insert mode lights

  • John Wick is designed as a first-person shooter experience in a pinball machine, not a traditional pinball game

    high confidence · Enzo's design philosophy explanation; he frames the flippers as guns and the gameplay as mimicking the movie's fast-paced gunfire

  • Stern's Costco strategy aims to reach new audiences and drive brand awareness, not necessarily move all units

    high confidence · Don's strategic analysis: Stern already paid by Costco; exposure value exceeds sales risk

  • Insider Connected tracking data revealed that Venom is the most popular game on Stern arcade sites

    high confidence · Enzo citing George Gomez's statement about Insider Connected analytics

  • The Avatar photo leak appears to be intentional/professional, not accidental (high-quality image, captured with glass off, names visible)

    high confidence · Don and Enzo analyzing the photo quality and composition; suggesting it was strategically released

  • James Bond is Stern's best game overall, according to Enzo's opinion after extended play

    medium confidence · Enzo's personal assessment after playing the game more and understanding its strategy depth

  • Jaws was the last major commercial success for Stern (released January 2024), with the second half of the year being 'empty'

    medium confidence · Don's market observation about sales momentum and operator budget cycles

Notable Quotes

  • “It is a first person shooter in a pinball machine...your flippers are the guns, right, and you're in a battle with guns”

    Enzo — Core design philosophy for John Wick; reframes how players should approach the game's difficulty and tight shots

  • “I find YouTube quite time consuming...they do a lot of home cinemas and high-end hi-fi two-channel stereo stuff”

    Enzo — Explains why Enzo isn't a major content creator despite industry knowledge; competing business demands

  • “They've really encapsulated Elton John's soul in that pinball machine”

    Enzo — High praise for JJP's thematic design on Elton John; indicates successful IP execution despite initial skepticism

  • “Stern is a business...they're there to make money and to make a lot of money”

    Don — Defends Stern's Costco and market expansion strategy as business-rational, not anti-community

  • “She literally, if she forgot to scan in, she loses her marbles...I want to scan in. Don't go to ball three”

    Enzo — Example of Insider Connected's psychological engagement hook, particularly on younger players

  • “Everyone hated it...Stern's best game is James Bond”

    Enzo — Contrasts initial market reception with long-term quality; James Bond initially poorly received but praised after deep play

  • “I played Venom Pro when it came out and I absolutely hated it...And then my local cafe got a Venom LE...I was like, I'm just gonna give it a shot”

    Enzo — Pro vs LE edition differences heavily impact game experience; Pro version is 'plain' without lights and shaker integration

  • “The modes, the modes are just colored lights. There's really no callouts...It's really hard to know even what you're supposed to do”

    Enzo — John Wick code update critique: early versions lack clarity, needs callouts and full integration of experience systems before 1.0

Entities

EnzopersonDonpersonJersey Jack PinballcompanyStern PinballcompanyAvatar (Jersey Jack Pinball)gameJohn Wickgame

Signals

  • ?

    machine_intel: High-quality professional photo of Jersey Jack's Avatar playfield surfaces, showing UV/glow-in-dark lighting effects and staff names visible; strategically released or leaked during Stern Jaws livestream

    high · Don and Enzo analyze the photo quality: 'professional photo...zoomed in on there with the glass off and got a good quality picture...it happened to drop right in the middle of Stern's live stream'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Jersey Jack Avatar positioned at ~$17,000 USD (15k + tax + shipping), significantly higher than Stern Pro editions (~$5k-7k); justification based on collectible, premium-only placement strategy

    high · Enzo: 'Me and Chris were just doing the calculations. It's like $17,000 US. Yikes.' Don: 'You could get three Stern Pros right now for that $15,000'

  • ?

    business_signal: Stern pursuing mainstream channel distribution (Costco) for Jaws homebrew to reach non-endemic audiences; strategy frames as publicity/awareness play rather than primary sales driver

    high · Don defends move: 'Stern is a business...they're there to make money...if they can get you know 3 growth per year...I think that a good move for them...Even 1% growth'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: John Wick deliberately designed as first-person shooter experience in pinball form, not traditional pinball; tight shots and fast gameplay are intentional rather than flaws

    high · Enzo: 'The shots are laid out there kind of in the back third and then as soon as you shoot out fire is coming right back at you...your flippers are the guns, right, and you're in a first person shooter'

  • ?

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.185

0:00
The only yank I listen to. Love that. He reckons when he's in the van, he goes, he's the only other person in pinball that he listens to. Dude, that's awesome, man. Yeah, the Gons is legendary. Now, do you have like a social media presence like on your own, like your own channel or something? No, look, I've got, I've got like a, I used to do a lot of toy, like vintage toy and vintage gaming collecting. And I had a little small Instagram, it was called RetroOzGamer. And I was using that, but because I do a lot of YouTube with work, I own a hi-fi business. So we do a lot of home cinemas and high-end hi-fi two-channel stereo stuff. I find YouTube quite time consuming, as you know. Oh, dude, yeah, it's incredible. It's incredibly hard. And I just happened to be invited on Chris's one a long time ago because I actually found him through his other page, which is his West Ham United YouTube channel. Oh sure, yeah, for the footy, right? Yeah, the soccer. So and then I saw he had a pinball one. I was like, what are the chances? And I made a comment on a video all the way from Australia and he laughed at it and I messaged him and said, you know, thanks for the comment. And then we just hit it off and next minute I'm admin on his bloody YouTube channel. Dude, sweet. Let me set up another light real quick. I'm like sitting in the dark. Yeah, go, go.
1:41
Boom! That's so much better. That's so much better. Alright, yeah, dude. Whereabouts are you in the U.S.? I'm in Wisconsin, right in the middle of the state. Yeah, right. I'll leave these on.
1:53
My eyesight is terrible. Um, yeah, so, uh, yeah, I live here, so I'm just like three hours from Chicago, so Stern, JJP, American Pinball, the barbecue headquarters, all located right there. So, so it's super fun to get to go down. Uh, Spooky's not far from me, so I pop over there a lot. Nice. Yeah, so, I mean, it really works out. And I got a cool arcade downstairs here, so. Yeah. Cool. Interesting. I was talking to Erica this morning because she wants me to jump on her channel. Sure. Probably tomorrow actually. And I said to her, I don't normally watch any other pinball content apart from yours. I just struggle with the negativity and the yelling and the screaming. Jersey Jack Pinball needs to get it together if they're going to expect any sales. Where's the world under the glass? Yeah, it's exhausting. The Wally Winka Show, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Winka Podcast, I started recording. I was just going to do, I'll probably do a podcast and just drop this in there so we can like just double team this little podcast episode. I just did one yesterday, but then we've gotten avatars dropped, you know, Alice's got more content out, so we can just kind of talk about the topics of the day here.
Jaws
game
Elton Johngame
James Bondgame
Venomgame
X-Mengame
Alicegame
Insider Connectedproduct
Godfathergame
Godzillagame
George Gomezperson
Gary Sternperson
Steve Ritchieperson
Costcocompany
Jay's Silver Pinball Roomvenue
Pinball Collectiveevent
Chrisperson
Gonzoperson

code_update: John Wick early code lacks callouts and mode clarity; modes are 'just colored lights' without audio guidance; experience system and John Wick points functionality unclear pre-1.0

high · Enzo: 'The modes, the modes are just colored lights. There's really no callouts with them. It's really hard to know even what you're supposed to do. So that all needs to come'

  • ?

    product_concern: Stern Pro editions lack expression lights, back box lights, and shaker motor integration; creates significantly degraded experience vs LE/Premium; Pro players report confusion about virtual locks

    high · Enzo: 'You walk up to a John Wick pro and you don't have expression lights, you don't have the back box lights, you don't have shaker motor integration with the gunshots on the screen...It's weird to go play a pro in location now and it's like, no it's not, you lying game'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Initial market rejection of James Bond and Venom games later recognized as misjudgments; pattern of games improving significantly after extended play and code updates

    high · Enzo: 'I played Venom Pro when it came out and I absolutely hated it...And then my local cafe got a Venom LE...I was like, I'm just gonna give it a shot' and 'Everyone hated it...Stern's best game is James Bond'

  • ?

    technology_signal: Insider Connected tracking system provides real-time data to manufacturers on play patterns, popular games, player demographics; drives engagement psychology; Jersey Jack exploring equivalent system

    high · Enzo's daughter won't play without scanning in; George Gomez shared that Insider Connected revealed Venom as most popular on arcade sites; Don notes data feeds back 'who's playing, when are they playing, what times of day'

  • $

    market_signal: Second half of 2024 'empty' for major releases; competition for operator budget spending; X-Men release status unclear (delayed from prior target month); Avatar release timing uncertain but strategically positioned

    medium · Don: 'The last banger game, sales-wise, I think, that came out was probably Jaws, and that's back in January. But now in the second half of the year, it's been a little bit empty...who's going to be the next release'

  • ?

    collector_signal: Jersey Jack games positioned as collectible art pieces for home installations, not functional pinball within mixed collections; high price justified by thematic presentation and visual spectacle

    medium · Enzo: 'JJP are meant to be like a piece of artwork that you can play pinball on...not necessarily pin number 11 in a 12 pin lineup...Something just to put down on their downstairs to really stand out and be a spectacle'

  • ?

    community_signal: Games receiving incremental reveal strategy (photo, toy, artwork snippets) to maintain sustained community engagement; Avatar photo appears intentionally leaked to compete with Stern releases

    medium · Don: 'We've had some snippets for a long time now. Playfield up photo and toy in the back and now we've got this little ricochet off'...photo 'happened to drop right in the middle of Stern's live stream'

  • ?

    venue_signal: Perth, Australia pinball community limited to one venue; Enzo organized Pinball Collective (34 machines, 3 days) with higher-than-expected attendance; community hunger for local events and diversity beyond location operators' typical selections

    medium · Enzo: 'Unfortunately in Perth we don't have a lot of events. We've only got really one place you can play pinball in Perth...we took 34 machines, hired a community hall and organised what we called the Pinball Collective'

    • 3:37
    Cool. So yeah, I'll just introduce you and then we'll go like we've been, like just started recording. www.inzolopegna.com And there's a lot going on at the moment, that's for sure. Perfect. Compliments are always welcome, so thanks for opening with that. Yeah, no, we've been following you very closely for a long time, and the time difference is great because I wake up and there's something new. That's perfect. And anything that helps my penetration into Australia too is going to help me out. I can't wait to get out there. You got Ryan, he's a huge ambassador of yours and a big fan, so I'm a fan of him too. We're going to take over the Sunbird country, I'm so excited. So yesterday, I thought I was all caught up on the news, right? Dropped an episode, did a live stream or whatever, and then all of a sudden, we get dropped it literally in our lap, this picture of Avatar, right? The rumored game from Jersey Jack, and then it like, it was rumored to not be that, and then here it is. Hmm. I mean, do you, I was interestingly thinking, is it like, maybe it is the game, but is it the next game? Has it been planted to throw us off? Um, yeah. Very good picture, very detailed, very clear. I mean this wasn't somebody sneaking in as a janitor late at night with a potato camera and like smuggling this out, like you know someone zoomed in on there with the glass off and got a good quality picture of it. I'm looking at it right now. It's a professional photo and it happens to capture the name of the couple of the guys that have worked on the game as well by the looks of it. Yeah, and it happened to drop right in the middle of Stern's live stream of their new topper mode for Jaws. The Wally Williams Show, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams,
    6:08
    Deana Cagg flips the station, Bob Betarr kicks the base, David Navarro inflates the hochладing, Kenneth Hall and then there's more content in the future than the game seems kinda dated so you know in this Jersey Jack I mean it is going to do the new movie is it just to be the old movie are they gonna do avatar for then repeat like what's going to be for but looking at this and decoding what we saw on the little insert mode lights it looks like it's gonna be content from the first two movies at least you know I know that the obviously the modes are quite prominent there you can say that uh... you can say that the Closed Captioning provided by 선� sync.
    7:35
    Stephanie Domigno, Are you a fan of the Stern Avatar? Did you ever play that? Yeah, I just played it last weekend, actually. I'd come across it before, not working in the best manner, but then I was over at Jay's Silver Pinball Room over in Iowa. This guy's mad. I mean, he's got like 60 games in his house and he does like public tournaments. So I finally made it down there to it, and he had a Stern Avatar, and I got to spend a little bit of time on it. And, you know, it's a game of that era, but it played awesome. It was fun, you know. Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams and Scott Danesi. They led an epic journey of All microorganisms, evolutionaryлемормany people. Knapp Editorango. Now, in May 2019, TV person, Bournemouth 화이 Mittelk radi need to see you. And help the show. Hello my name'somrrn. Welcome to New Game Gamer. So How long have you been at the World Cup? For the past time. The only thing that's up is though that he's taken the Steve Ritchie flipper design and put that in here so we get a good flipping game. And I think they'd be mad lads not to do that. That would be very, I mean to not get him to come in and go what do you think of this and get his two cents in would just be a weird move. I think he'd be, he'd have to be touch and feeling everything that they do now. Yeah, or you know, or is this made by other Eric? Well, the one thing we don't know is maybe JJP could have two or three games pretty far into production to the point that they may, you know, kind of juggle like which release, you know, it could be. You know, they may, you know, we heard talk about like, you know, early on Avatar was coming and then Avatar definitely wasn't it and it was going to be Matrix, you know. Maybe both of these games exist and they're kind of juggling like which one is going to get this release window. So that could be a thing, you know. Well, funny enough, when Gonzo interviewed JJP in the UK, he told him in the interview that he knows what his next three games were and they're working on them. So, like you said, maybe one's not ready to have decided to run with the other one. But I think, you know, with obviously D23 and the success that Disney's had with Deadpool, Wolverine and the movies coming out, it'd be stupid not to release it. You know, at the moment, you know, if they are doing Harry Potter, there is a new Harry Potter TV show coming, but that's not out until next year. You'd probably want to coincide with that, I guess. Yeah, there's a new theme park land opening next year, too, in Florida. And, you know, that license is like perennial. You can drop it any day of the year. I think it would attract a lot of attention. I like what I'm seeing from this picture, because obviously it's in like a dark UV mode. Tim Kitzrow, Steve Kitzrow, and, um, you know, one is reminded of Stranger Things. I finally got my UV kit after, like, months and months and months of waiting for them to rerun it again. And it's just such a, such a moment when the UV hits and, like, the whole playfield changes, the art comes out. And, you know, the bioluminescent aspect of this Pandora world is, like, a large part of the draw that brings you into this physical, visual splendor, as it were. So if they can do that with pinball, which this photo definitely looks like they're doing, with the glow-in-the-dark rubbers, um, yeah, dude. Sponsor AOB Follows Sw Wii Sponsors AOB Follows Sponsor AOB Follows Thank you, John. That's a nice name. And I think that's going to be a good one. Yeah. Thank you, John. I think that's going to be a good one. We're going to move into the shopping center, the Starcourt Mall. Yeah. That is a normal shopping center, and then obviously the UV comes in and it's got all the veins all over it. So I'm hanging out to try that. But yeah, look, I think you're right. I think the little sneak peek which looks like it was shot on purpose was a very smart move, especially because lately there's been little snippets of Alice here and there, The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi. and then you had Elton John in the corner with his projection and everything, just standing as a spectacle on its own. Like, it really seems to fit there, more so than the guy that's got, you know, 10 Data East games, 5 Stern pros, and this is kind of wedged somewhere in there, right? So imagine going downstairs and, like, here's Avatar, right? Here's Pandora in a box with like the Mermaid's Edition Fathom projections on the ground, right? So there's water everywhere on the walls and everything and it just becomes like like a spectacle unto itself And you know with the high-end polish and everything that's kind of what that sort of person would want You know something just to put down on their downstairs to really stand out and be a spectacle and not Necessarily pin number 11 in a 12 pin lineup, you know wedged against the wall. So I kind of see that
    14:16
    Especially with them having that higher price, you know It's hard to justify, you know, what is like, you could get three Stern Pros right now for that $15,000, you know. Well, me and Chris were just doing the calculations. It's like $17,000 US. Yikes. Well, you know, 15 plus tax plus shipping plus, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, probably. I mean, yikes. Yeah, you're right. You know, it is a high ticket item, but it's, you know, I think it's like a really fancy car, you know, like a, You could buy a Hyundai, but a Mercedes is so much better, for instance. You know, like, I think JJP are meant to be like a piece of artwork that you can play pinball on. You know, I honestly think that it's a product that ticks all the boxes. Yeah. You know, it isn't, very rarely do you see one mixed between, like you said, all the pros and all the data reests and stuff. I mean really since Toy Story 4 you know when they released Godfather and then Elton John you can really feel like they where they putting their energy and their focus in when it comes to pinball design The Gold Lions man Gold Lions Gold Wireforms Godfather looks fantastic like Like the radcal type effects on the cabinet art on the side the sparkly gold in the playfield I wish the gameplay was more compelling, honestly, because that's the reason I don't play it that much. But the machine with the topper and everything, like it looks fantastic. And then the collector's edition Elton John the same way. 액etasQNAPd movgebra Demraiq Ayatsad Central, imba protest, arab aktiv, Chapmanいい hey!
    16:25
    It's interesting because a lot of people were anti Elton John when it first got announced. A lot of people were like, I'd never play that, I'd never buy that. We had a little festival that we just had on the weekend, a little pinball tournament, and we had to kick people off it to give everyone else a turn. So it's a game that surprisingly everyone wants to play. Get back, honky-kat. Yeah. And everyone had like, you know, Pinball Wizard. You just can't go wrong. And everyone's hips are moving and everyone's hips are thrusting and they're all playing that game. You know, it's, they've done it in a way where, like I said to Chris, they've really encapsulated Elton John's soul in that pinball machine. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I will say, you know, following Godzilla, or Godzilla, Godfather, and then into Elton John, you know, both themes like I don't think anybody was asking for, this, at least our The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi. This is it. I kind of see the reasoning behind it, even though I don't think there was a rousing ruckus from the pinball enthusiast community for another Avatar pin. Yeah, but they also weren't that fussed by Jaws and they weren't that fussed by Elton John either. So I think once it comes out, I mean imagine surely they'll do a 3D mode with Avatar. Oh man, I didn't even think of that. We're gonna be checking, checking some 3-D goggles. We're gonna rejoice, not that it's the best, but it's still fun, still fun.
    18:48
    I think, I think at their hand, they were a bit forced to, you know, there's been so many, obviously Stern had a leak, someone was leaking information, so you might as well do it yourself and do it, and do it properly, right? So I think, you know, keeping people guessing or keeping people excited as opposed to, we know that the titles are coming every three to four months, I think that's the timeframe now. Yeah. So it's inevitable. Everyone's talking about it and you could just drop a little hint and everyone will keep talking about it, you know, in front of mind, right? So I think there's nothing wrong with it and I think the way games will be released will probably change now, you know, be evolved a bit more. And we've already seen it. You know, look at Alice, you know, we've had some snippets for a long time now. Playfield up photo and toy in the back and now we've got this little ricochet off the We're going to be talking about the art blade today with the spinning ball save in the outlanes. The player-controlled discs, yeah, that are in both of the outlanes. Yeah. Gameplay-wise, we'll have to see how that fits. I think a Magna save still would have been, like, kind of maybe the way to go. But we'll see. We'll see when we see more. I do like all the sculpts that are in it. But yeah, it seems like, you know, the last banger game, sales-wise, I think, that came out was probably Jaws, and that's probably going to continue to do so. And that was back in January.
    20:14
    Looney Tunes has been doing pretty well. Labyrinth is in the mix there. But now in the second half of the year, it's been a little bit empty. So maybe people's pinball fund budgets have built up. And so now it's kind of like who's going to be the next one to release something major into the market that's going to get a lot of that initial attention and start draining these budgets of folks. So I wonder if they're kind of vying like who's going to be the next release. Is Stern going to take it with X-Men and gobble up all the operators' budget for the rest of the year? Peter Earl привилог учил 아드리언 Birthday Night Live Review告訴 선 골�張 � astrolog allowed to aqui 2 지만 Mobile Was There was talk that it was meant to be released last month. Ah. And then it got pushed back. Um, but, um, yeah, I don't know, like, uh, I still think, you know, the hidden gem here is still John Wick. I think people are just, they, they have done too early what they did with James Bond. James Bond came out and everyone hated it. Yeah. Everyone hated it, and that's, Stern's best game is James Bond. To today, in my opinion, Stern's best game is James Bond. Audition,
    22:06
    We've had and the more that I play it and I start to kind of strategize around, you know, stacking the multiballs with the modes and having some intermittent glimpses of something there. I think this game has a lot of potential to really become something, you know, once we get closer to that 1.0 code. Because right now the modes, the modes are just colored lights. There's really no callouts with them. It's really hard to know even what you're supposed to do. So that all needs to come. There's this experience system and these John Wick points that we don't know what we're supposed to do with those yet. I mean, we'll be able to spend those like shark teeth for some kind of 8-bit video mode for all we know, you know. Yep. Well, I'm just reading some of the updates that just got announced now. Ally perks, allies, a lot of stuff with allies, it looks like. Nice. Some, obviously, bug fixes, but I think the misunderstanding of John Weekend, we had a conversation about this on the weekend at our... So we held a three day event. We took 34 machines, hired a community hall and organised what we called the Pinball Collective, which was just designed to bring the community together. Unfortunately in Perth we don't have a lot of events. We've only got really one place you can play pinball in Perth. And they're all Sterns predominantly and they're all kind of new games. There are a few older games there at Barkadia, but we had a chat as we were finishing up It's cool, man, you're playing a really hard role there. Yeah. Because that's what yes, umm people were saying that John Wick is hard, right, and the shots are very tight, especially that middle ramp. But I think what are you people are missing here is that the game is designed with the idea that you play as John Wick, your flippers are the guns, right, and you're in a first person shooter. Whoa! Like Call of Duty, right? Yeah. And it is fast and in a battle with guns, like, if you've seen the movies, there's constant gunshots. Constant. You probably can't even count the amount of bullets that are being fired. And this feels like it. I mean, there are times where you're playing and the shaker mode is just going off because people are shooting at you. You got the blue little AI enemies that are just popping out of nowhere and they're firing at you. And I think people are approaching John Wick as a traditional pinball machine and it's not that. It is a first person shooter in a pinball machine. Dude, I need to play it again now with that in mind. But yeah, I see what you're saying. and like you know from from his perspective you know the shots are laid out there kind of in the back third and then the you know as soon as you shoot out fire is coming right back at you you know yeah yeah and your weapons I mean when I get into it and you know I'm in a mode and I got a multi ball going and I hit that atta ball and now there's four balls flying like like mad everywhere and like you know as soon as you get it up into an orbit you think you can breathe for a second but that ball is coming back as fast as you send it By the way. Yes, it is fast and there are air balls. No question about it, for me it's a huge theme, I love that franchise. I am a huge Keano fan and I think the BLE could have done with some gold instead of the matte black, in my opinion but not that you can't modify yourself but it is a gorgeous game. The best you could have chosen for the call outs. He's just the best voice in Hollywood in my opinion, or one of the best voices in Hollywood. The Continental appreciates your accuracy John. Yeah, you know, so it's just, you know, I think this game is magical. How about another ball? Yeah. People have to give it a chance. You do a good impression. I think, you know, it's a bit like the hate that Venom got because, you know, Stern will You're not going to release a game, but everyone gets the pro edition first. Yeah, oh God. Everyone plays the pro edition and it's crap. Yeah. I don't like to use the word crap. It's plain, right? It's plain. I mean, yeah, you walk up to a John Wick pro and you don't have expression lights, you don't have the back box lights, you don't have shaker motor integration with the gunshots on the screen. You know, so... They have a little bit more ramp lock. People go, you don't need it because it does it virtually. I don't care. I need it. I want it. Yeah. It's so weird to go play a pro in location now and it's like, you know, ball one is locked And it's like, no it's not, you lying game, it's coming back to my flipper. It didn't lock nothing. I'll tell you something Don, I played Venom Pro when it came out and I absolutely hated it. I was like, this is the biggest miss ever, right? And then my local cafe in town got a Venom LE. Nice. And I was like, I'm just gonna give it a shot while I wait for my almond long mac. The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi. www.willywonka.com The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi. ever A podcast designed to inform, contribute, and inspire.
    28:59
    Okay. The still to this day doesn't even think pinball is a thing anymore. You know, like appealing to a new crowd. You know, I mean, again, the Costco thing is about getting in front of new people, right? Yeah. It is, you know, getting in front of people that um... don't even know pinball's a thing. Yeah, you're just like, you know, walking through, doing your sips and nibbles at Costco, you got your hot dog in one hand, and all of a sudden, oh hey look, it's a pinball machine. I don't know, do you guys have Costco in Oz? We do, we do, and there are some high ticket items at Costco. Yeah. And they're still TVs. Yeah, yeah. I don't see the issue. You know, I don't. I was pretty passionate about this. We shot a video about this recently and I said, look, at the end of the day, Stern is a business. I don't believe that they have excess stock of this model. I think they have given distributors an opportunity to sell a homebrew jaws and it hasn't panned out that way. And they've gone, okay, well, how do we get this to a different generation, a different crowd of people? Sure, they want to inflate their books, they probably want to sell the business or they want to go public with it, right? At the end of the day, it is a big beast. It is the Disney of pinball. You can't compare what JJP does or Dutch or Spooky to Stern because Stern is there to make money and to make a lot of money and their games just won have the better rubbers and the better this and the better that because they churning and burning I mean there nothing wrong with that And if you know this Costco thing can move the needle even a little bit I mean if they can get you know 3 growth per year as far as you know people who are now into purchasing pinball you know I think that a good move for them Even 1% don't like, honestly, 1% is like if they then spend like let's call a million dollars on an advertising campaign, right? They don't need to. They've just forced Costco to buy a million dollars worth of stock. Yeah. Stern doesn't care if that sells or doesn't sell. They've already been paid.
    31:27
    Right? They've already been paid. Yeah. So, but the fact is, is that they, even if they don't sell any machines, right? 20,000 people have just walked past the pinball machine, had a play with it, and have now realized that that's pretty fun. Yeah, like that's something I could own, really? Not only do they still make them, but like I can, somebody will take it out to my truck and throw it in there. Now, if in a year's time, Costco still have all these and they didn't sell them at 4999, Costco are well within their right to go 3999, it's yours now, Boxing Day sale, right? So, I'm a frequent Costco visitor and that's one thing I do. Like I'll see a product, particularly if it's a big ticket one, and I'll just keep my eye on it The Wally Winka Show, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, They have big ticket things, especially on the website. They sell hot tub spas that cost around the same cost as what this is going for. If you're just there for paper towels, then you're probably not in that market anyway. But somebody's going to see this, and the holidays are going to come up, and he wants to be like the hero of Christmas. And so he wants to have this thing unboxed under the tree, and that's he's going to pick these things up. Yeah. Yep. And you know what? If I was Stern and I said I've got an idea for a publicity stunt, I'm going to give one Jurassic homebrew to every school that looks after kids with autism or disabled kids. Let's donate one to every school, right? That's the... It's like, okay, instead of spending a million dollars advertising, let's just write one game off. Let's give one to like one to every state in America, right? And that's what they're going to cost them. Right. Right? All of a sudden, you've got one pinball machine in a school that all these kids are going to play, right? That they've donated, and that's one hell of a publicity stunt. Mm-hmm. Like, this is a move like that, right? They're forcing Costco's hand to buy the stock. They're not giving it to them, but they just want to get it out there. They want to get the name out there. And how great is it they put Insider Connected on this, too? I love it. Yeah. Because I think Insider Connected kids... I mean, my daughter, she's a gun pinball player. She finished third on the weekend in the tournament, and she's 10 years old. Now, she has a conniption if she doesn't scan in. She literally, if she forgot to scan in, she loses her marbles. Yeah, it's like, well, why do we even want to play if I'm not logged in, right? Yeah, she's like, no, I want to scan in. Don't go to ball three. So she'll run off and get it. It is an addiction for her, and it's a smart move. Absolutely, yeah. And I can only imagine like the data that instantly feeds back to Stern on who's playing, when are they playing, what times of day are they playing. Yep, and look at George Gomez. He said that with Insider Connect they were able to tell that Venom is the most popular game on site. Yeah, boom. There you go. Tracking sales. Yeah, I mean, yeah. So, no wonder Jersey Jack wants to come out with something similar to that. welfare of that to protest at the with avatar on mother when i play other companies games i feel a little desire that i can't leave login and keep track of what i've been doing you know it's been a couple back and that you're had squins where when you last played that you know let me try to hunt around all the different editions of machines they can throw out his course he you know and the renomads of the speech height thank you bet there's a this is just shen lohets on gratuitous a button families We will be able to play probably Pokemon in the future. You know, scan into my machine and I can play Don all the way in Chicago on his machine versus each other. Man, that would be like fantastic. And can you imagine like if they came out with a companion app to their pinball machine so like when you weren't in the arcade you could sit there and play like a mini game on your phone that would, you know, level up your characters so the next time you do play like that's integrated into there? Yep. It wouldn't surprise you. I mean this is all about appealing to a new generation which is consumed with video games and Playstations and Switches and Minecraft and all that right? So I think ultimately a model where I can stand in and play my Star Wars against your Star Wars and we take turns because I can't come over to your house and I'm player one and you're player two. Can you imagine firing up Star Wars right? And like you had been playing last night, I log into my machine and all of a sudden like my Death Star starts blowing up. Like you blew up my Death Star, damn it. And now I've got to play to get you back so I can blow up something in your game. Why not? Yeah. Why not? I'm excited. I think it's a smart move. I think, look, at the end of the day, you know, with the man in charge from H-Disney there, I forget his name all the time,
    36:42
    Ed Stern, they are there to increase. Yeah, I can't always forget his name. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Knapp Arcade, I think if we can do that by introducing them into Costco, introducing them into high schools, or relying on a pub or a barbecue house to buy a pinball machine, they're not going to outlay. Those guys are struggling already. They're not going to outlay 20 grand or 10 grand for a machine to hope that they're going to have to share 50% of the profits with the person that bought the machine in or whatever it is. I think it's a smart move, honestly, I really do. Yeah, yeah, I can't wait. And I don't think we see the prices coming down at all, but if they can at least pack more value in there so it hurts less, I think that's the way to go with it. Yeah, look, I think, like at our event, we obviously expected the usual crowd that always comes to these things when we host it. Dearly sino Lordo the Inner selfie Thatife im Oh Yeah Yo here Come out yo Yay Let's shit it sos okay here common sh they vale sick death now we just keep your girl and we happy at not this and don't like them all from you . far
    38:20
    We're now being shown as we're getting into the fall season. Look, I'm not disappointed that it could be X-Men from Stern. I would have liked to have seen, you know, Gary had always said that he wanted to do King Kong. You know, he did a bit of a sneaky photo last year in front of King Kong on his social media. So everyone always thought it was going to be King Kong and or Godzilla versus King Kong maybe. 가능 panzer
    39:19
    and it looks like Avengers Infinity Quest with like, you know, Zombie Yeti doing art on it. It's got the shots and the crazy ramps and things and shoots okay and has convoluted code. That's the lowest bar I think we can hit, you know. Everything else... Yeah, so what's wrong with that? Yeah, that's fine. The IQ plays great. I really, really, really hope it was X-Men 97. I think we all did, yeah. If it's X-Men comic, I can swallow the pill, but X-Men 97 is just a masterpiece. I mean, I haven't actually watched the new one yet because I'm trying to get through the old one and relive my childhood again. But X-Men 9, X-Men 11. Right. One of the best intros in cartoon history, I think. Yeah, man. Made by Saturday Morning is awesome. Yeah, man. It's just one of the best intros. That and I don't know if you ever watched The Mask. Remember the toys, The Mask? The last intro was phenomenal. Now, are you talking about like the 80s toy line mask or like the Jim Carrey cartoon? No, no, no, the 80s toy line mask. Oh man, I do remember that, yeah. I know it had a good theme song, I can't place it. Yeah, I can't. It's like, it was just, it was that typical, you know, that synth piano type music. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Kevin MacLeod, and David Van Es, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi. Rob Astle's Should I Into Madness by Brian Taylor
    42:10
    I've gotten to the point now where it's going to be one in one hour now. I just don't have the space anymore. Yeah, I set a limit of 10, which is plenty, and I'm sitting at 16, so it's gone awry, man. Yeah, dude, I started at 4 and I'm way past that number now. If anybody needs a Lebowski, let me know. I just moved on my Lebowski, actually. It got to a point where I was the only one playing it. The family didn't really play it. My kids like the pinball, the bowling ball thing, the alley there, but not enough to justify such an expensive machine living at home. So, and we're going to bring Elton John in for a bit, get a bit, you know, have a great experience with that and see where John Witt goes. I'm going to turn mine on soon and get some new update done. But yeah, look, it's exciting times, exciting times. I don't see anything wrong with, you know, getting a game in, enjoying it, and then when you find yourself just not playing it as much as the new things, you know, switch it out. Get it out to someone else, get something new in there, you know, keep the lineup fresh. I love that. Yeah, look, there are games that for me are bolted to the floor. Bond, Star Wars, Ghostbusters, Jaws, Deadpool, they're never going anywhere. You're not taking my Star Wars, yeah. Now I'll take it my, although I actually, something controversial, uh, controversial, I played the premium Star Wars and I couldn't gel with it. I felt that they just missed the mark with the, uh, the toys and the mechs and there was no upper playfield, there was no bottom playfield. Mm-hmm. And then a year later, someone was selling a Star Wars comic edition. Ooh, yeah. And that didn't make me feel like that. I accepted the way it was more than I did when I had the movie playfield graphics and the movie trans light. I felt like the comic one you could get away with not being full of toys and assets. I mean it's almost like it has that 80s aesthetic, you know? Yeah, like, I mean, we had them side by side at a workshop that a friend works at, and everyone was more enticed by the comic con. Mm-hmm. You could get away with what they did. I feel they missed the mark a bit with the movie edition artwork. It feels a bit of a letdown. Yeah, I think the good thing is, you know, this doesn't mean that that's the only Star Wars machine we're ever going to get now. visit that well and, you know, come out with a game that plays completely different. Just come out with an Empire Strikes Back and just have a whole snow battlefield and we'll drop E.T.A.T.'s and probe droid bash toys.
    45:04
    Yep, and a bottom playfield which is like the odd cave with the... Yeah, like in Congo, right? You could have a wampa back there, but that's the ball back and forth. Oh, we got this thing already designed, man. Let's do it. What was the Yeti called in Star Wars? It was the wampa. Wampa, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then like, like his arm breaks off, and then that ends the mode. Yeah, yeah, and I always, always had this vision of this upper playfield being like the Return of Jedi, you know, the Emperor's chair, and you had to bash the toy around it. Good, good. You know, with the window in the background, and I thought that would have been a wicked upper playfield. Alas. Yeah. You know. You want this, don't you? Grab it. Strike me down. And your transition to the dark side will be complete.
    46:18
    Cool to experience I put my Jurassic Park I put that in there and it does change the game a lot Wow The Valley Company Subsidiary of Walter Kidde Co Inc Mirco Playfields Tim Kitzrow Scott Danesi Yeah, nah, look, I think, you know, obviously like you said, there's always limitations that a license will allow you to do things and not do things. Classic example is the guns on Wick, but although I'm looking forward to my little gun, what do you call it? Oh, the shooter rod, yeah. My rod. That was cool, I ordered that. That's the fact that you can still do your skill shots and also store your cigarette lighter. I'm gonna be surprised if that makes it through Australian customs. I bought toy guns to make a John Wick topper. Okay. And they got through customs. Okay, good, good. I was worried. Oh, John Wick is updating. Look at that. See? Awesome. It'll be interesting to see. Look, I think it's a beautiful machine. It plays well. My balls sometimes get stuck where the crate is. They're probably gonna come up with something for that, I think. But... Okay. Have you had yours, you know, where it lifts where the coins are? Grant W worse than PCI, Though UNIVERSAL REPORTING based in Gin, absolutamente uninspired, which I can never stand, N curtis Dude and you learn to go to business. Philip Vickery Talking about The Johnny Pinball Show. Chris Lewandowski Speaking of HelloA tratar's a lot of까 tog. So we're going to discuss today and talk about Z hai ni Shake the Ball to Shoot and versus Destiny's sein have fow cheato green. Fuck, I'm sorry. Yeah, I want to elevate this build, man. I dig it. But the LE, man, that mirrored backglass, this has got to be the best backglass.
    48:49
    It's the stained glass. But even the art on the side, it looks like the candles are on. Yeah, I love it. Like the foil of the candles. For people that haven't seen the John Wick LE in person, man, each flame of that candle is foil. And so it's reflective as you walk by. Like, yeah, it's just, it looks great, man. I had to. I had to. The Willy Wonka Show, Knapp Arcade, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, I've got a magnetized coin door with John Winke pointing a gun at me and some other bits and bolts. I'll send you a photo. Perfect. All right. Well, we'll compare photos. We'll whip our wicks out and we'll see which one is better. Yeah, let's compare wicks. My wick is better than yours. Mine's goldier. Mine's got better go. Your wick's got a stuck ball on it though. The Winning Pinball Show, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams, Sticky Ball Wick, Sticky Ball Wick, I'm taking some photos now before I forget. Perfect. But I think there's so much opportunity with Wick and it's just going to get better and better. There's no doubt about it. Alright, what do you think the Stern teaser is going to drop? Next week it's been like, it's coming in two days, it's coming in three days and three days comes and oh, it's got to be here soon. That's an interesting one because like I had a really good insider information. No, no, just someone that's really, you know, been selling Stern for quite a while. Sure. I think, you know, there's always rumors circulating around and, you know, there's patterns that Stern tends to follow with their releases and stuff and we all anticipated it was going to be August or end of July, August and then it got pushed back obviously for whatever reason. I don't know, but I think I wouldn't be surprised if we see something. When's the Texas Pinball Festival? That's March. March 21st, I think it'll be next year. So if they were to release something now, that gives them time to release something at the end of the year. Yeah. Well, Jaws was in that January release right after New Year's, and then that was their big new game at Texas. Tim Kitzrow, Director of Photography, Yeah, so look, I think probably we should see something first week of September, I reckon. Week was like the first week of, I want to say, I don't remember now actually. I was there and I can't even remember when it was. Yeah, I was going to say. Everything's been running together. That'd be April or something. Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was the first week. Yeah. So look, I wouldn't be surprised if we see something probably next week. I'm excited, man. Mmm. Yeah, look, I'm... Any pinball release by Stern's always gonna be exciting, get people talking. Pinball, man. Pinball. It's an addictive hobby. Yeah. Sure. Everyone was disappointed that John Wick didn't eat the ball, though. Oh, yeah. We got them loaded up with guns. I think we'll be alright. Yeah. I... Did you swap the plastic out in the crate with the weapons? As soon as I got my game, heck yeah. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi.
    52:56
    I know how that is. So yeah, but we'll definitely do something, that's for sure. Cool buddy, welcome back anytime. Pleasure, thank you very much for having me. Yeah, alright perfect, that'll probably wrap up like the official podcast part of this, but we can keep chatting in the after part for the Patreon, or if you gotta go, that's fine too. No, no, I'm cool. I didn't know whether you wanted to go live, I know sometimes you go live on Facebook and read people's comments and, um, what do you call it, they're always interesting because it's, uh, people ask questions. The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Scott Danesi. So I'm wondering, like, with this new game release now, are we all going to get invited back down to Stern again? Or have they decided, like, once is enough of that? Look, it's a hard one, right? Because I think there's always one idea that ruins it for everybody. Oh, yeah. And the genuine ones, I think when things settle down, I think the genuine ones will probably get an invite back. You know, like... I mean, I like the idea of the publishers here just doing, like, an open house, like, alright, we launched our game last week, The Wally Winka Show, Knapp Arcade, Bally Williams, Straight Down the Middle, Bally Williams,
    54:56
    I think it was a smart move. Unfortunately pissed off a lot of people but it is what it is. How do you be pissed off about that? You know, like, well, I'm doing this many shows and I'm entitled to come on man, stop it. No, and I think, you know, if you're going to be ranting and yelling and screaming all the time, you know, I wouldn't invite you to my factory. Chris Olom &
    55:48
    You can stand it, you can get it, you can get it. Yeah, yeah, I got it. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Keith Elwin, Laser Los, Bowen Kerins, Lyman F. Sheats Jr., orbit ramps, Automated Amusements, Python Anghelo, Joe Kaminkow, Tim Kitzrow, Scott Danesi. This Because it's like this and other stuff sorry i just gets and to maybe is like listen to this around and you're like against us man kind of an angry you have to have what the rules like well we are talking about him all right by it is just involved racked with double over it laser checkemporal no The world has it has the best someone hence just shipping forward you know But yeah, look, I mean, I know there's a lot of clickbait and there's a lot of things that people do to obviously get likes and that, whatever, if it works for them so bad. Yeah, I don't need likes that bad. Neither do I. I do it for the love of doing it, you know. We put on that little three-day thing and we did it for non-for-profit and it actually, we call it, it cost us money, but we don't care, you know, it's just a passion. Super cool. Well, hopefully, if all goes well, December, I should be heading out to Western Australia for a bit around the holidays. So maybe I can Perth it up. Yeah, for sure. I mean, look, Perth is the capital of Western Australia, if you'd like to put it that way. But Perth is everything is 20 minutes away. That's the best thing about it. Nice. All right. So, you know, it's cool. I want to get some Hungry Jacks on there. I want to spend some dollar-y dues. I want to try Australian pizza. Yeah. The pinball side. It's a different world. That's for sure. I have water and the toilet goes the other way. Oh yeah, I heard about that. The Coriolis effect. So does that mean I have to sit backwards? No, luckily you don't. Oh, God. So what else is on the cards for yourself? I don't know. John Popadiuk, Bob Betor, Ballywind, The Valley Company, Subsidiary of Walter Kidde & Co., Inc., Mirco Playfields, Tim Kitzrow, We'll be right back. I mean, that's a beautiful topper. And actually, funny enough, it's amazing how many people don't actually talk about the fact that we don't have a topper for Venom yet. Right? What the heck, man? Where's the Venom accessories? It must be Marvel. It's either that or they had like a $2500 topper they wanted to release and they were like, ooh, there's no way we can move this thing. Let's redesign, redesign. I probably had, I had this vision that it would be the, you remember the old creature from the Black Lagoon was a massive green half a monster? Yeah, yeah. Can you imagine like this? That had this massive venom? Reaching around, oh man. Yeah. Yeah, there was talk about adding Ghost Rider to the game as a playable character. Hmm. Which I, sure, yeah, like a, a venomized Ghost Rider. Well they've done, like they've unlocked the Venom Wolverine for, obviously since the release of the film. Sure. Some good synergy there. Yeah, but I've got a sneaking suspicion that this relationship with Sony and Venom and Marvel must be the reason that they're having problems. I think Venom needs a proper video mode too. That Carnage hair thing is just weird. It is, isn't it? Yeah, it's like, why am I playing as... Oh no, not Carnage, Scream. Why am I playing as Scream all of a sudden? Where's this coming from? But if they could put an 8-bit playable video mode in all their games now, The Jaws one was amazing. Have you been able to play it? Yeah, yeah, the Jaws was great. I mean, no different to the Street Fighter-style thing on Deadpool. Well, yeah, but this one you're like more directly controlling though, you know? Yeah. Like, I love the Street Fighter fights in Deadpool, but like, you know, if you were like hitting shots to do specific moves, and I don't know if that's the case really or not, but like, I love that interactivity. Playing a video mode by playing the pinball machine. Yes. More of that, please. Nice. www.willywonka.com against Comey,