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52: 7th Day of Balls: Kevin Manne

Pinball Party Podcast·podcast_episode·24m 26s·analyzed·Dec 21, 2023
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

Kevin Manne discusses pinball awards, market trends, and 2024 hopes for his podcast and industry.

Summary

Kevin Manne from Buffalo Pinball joins the Pinball Party Podcast for a casual holiday episode featuring personal questions, pinball discussion, and commentary on 2023 industry trends. Topics include the GTF Signature Edition's questionable value, Spooky's dual development approach with code quality concerns, market stabilization post-COVID, the P3's module-swapping process, and his favorite 2023 release (Final Resistance). Kevin expresses frustration with pinball awards as a popularity contest dominated by Stern's market reach and discusses upcoming expectations for Mark Seiden's JJP title.

Key Claims

  • The GTF Signature Edition bundles items that are already available for purchase separately (glass for $20, banner for $100, powder-coated armor) with minimal additional value beyond signatures and a hologram sticker

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, discussing GTF Signature Edition specifics

  • Spooky is doing two separate development teams for simultaneous releases (Texas Chainsaw Massacre and another title), similar to their Ultraman/Halloween approach

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, based on observed development patterns

  • During COVID, used pinball machines were selling for more than new machines, and Stern Premiums were being marked up $3,000+ over MSRP due to FOMO

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, reflecting on market dynamics

  • Tron Pro machines went for $11-12k during COVID despite new MSRP around $4.5-5k

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, personal market observation

  • Total Nuclear Annihilation was launched at $9,000, significantly higher than the original game's $5,500 launch price

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, discussing pricing history

  • P3 module swaps take approximately 1-1.5 minutes including glass removal and service positioning

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, with video reference on Buffalo Pinball YouTube channel

  • Final Resistance is Kevin's favorite 2023 release because it offers more gameplay variety and approachability for home players compared to Total Nuclear Annihilation

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, direct statement about game preference

  • Pinball awards are flawed because they function as a popularity contest where Stern dominates due to higher installed base, making smaller manufacturers' releases unlikely to win

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, expressing grievance with awards system

  • Mark Seiden has a pending pinball machine release from JJP in development

Notable Quotes

  • “all the awards nonsense that's going on right now. Like, yeah, the awards are like pinball awards are done to begin with... it's like annual awards for an industry that produces like a handful of things every year. And one company has far greater reach than everybody else.”

    Kevin Manne @ N/A — Expresses frustration with award system structure and Stern's market dominance effect on voting

  • “I'm glad the kind of like insanity of COVID is over where everybody was just buying everything that comes out before they had a chance to play it. And then the used games were more expensive than the new games.”

    Kevin Manne @ N/A — Reflects on unsustainable market dynamics during pandemic

  • “Final Resistance hits that vibe but brings more stuff to do different ways to approach it while you're playing. I think that's going to be my pick for the year.”

    Kevin Manne @ N/A — Names Final Resistance as favorite 2023 release, emphasizing gameplay variety

  • “I think they pushed the price up too much on that... it's a very simple, fast Iron Man type of game. Even more linear.”

    Kevin Manne @ N/A — Criticizes Total Nuclear Annihilation's pricing relative to game complexity

  • “Hopefully this is the year that Mark Seiden's pinball machine comes out from JJP. I'm really looking forward to seeing what he's been working on.”

    Kevin Manne @ N/A — Expresses anticipation for Mark Seiden's upcoming JJP title

  • “If American Pinball is thinking that Cuphead somehow is a good enough theme, then I think Metroid, if it comes to video game themes, would smash that.”

    Kevin Manne @ N/A — Speculates on Mark Seiden's possible game theme, suggesting Metroid would be stronger than Cuphead

  • “I really want JJP to... I mean, they put their heart and soul into games. And the last two, like, theme-wise... I want JJP to do The Matrix... they're going to be making those for years. Printing money.”

    Kevin Manne @ N/A — Advocates for major IP licensing for JJP (Matrix, Harry Potter, Star Wars) as commercial driver

Entities

Kevin MannepersonBuffalo PinballorganizationBrody Even Talk PinballcontentFinal ResistancegameStern PinballcompanySpooky PinballcompanyGTF Signature EditionproductTotal Nuclear Annihilationgame

Signals

  • ?

    product_strategy: GTF Signature Edition criticized for bundling already-available aftermarket items (powder-coated armor $20, banner $100, glass $20) with minimal additional value beyond signatures and hologram sticker

    high · Kevin directly analyzes each bundle component and questions pricing

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Spooky Pinball executing simultaneous development on two titles with separate teams, repeating pattern from Ultraman/Halloween releases; pattern of extended code maturation acknowledged

    high · Kevin notes Texas Chainsaw Massacre in long development with separate team structure

  • $

    market_signal: Post-COVID market normalization: used machines now cheaper than new (reversing COVID dynamic), FOMO-driven pricing cooling, ability to wait for game evaluation before purchasing

    high · Kevin explicitly discusses end of COVID-era insanity, used games now more reasonably priced than new

  • ?

    product_concern: Total Nuclear Annihilation pricing inflation criticized: $9k launch vs. predecessor's $5.5k despite 'simple, fast, linear' gameplay comparable to Iron Man

    high · Kevin documents pricing history and evaluates gameplay complexity relative to cost

  • ?

    gameplay_signal: Final Resistance preferred over Total Nuclear Annihilation for home play due to greater gameplay variety and multiple approaches, despite TNA's competitive appeal

    high · Kevin explains choice of Final Resistance citing gameplay depth and approachability for home vs. competitive-only games

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.073

0:00
Merry Christmas, Meth! Merry Christmas! Hey, quick request. Do you remember last time we had the Buffalo guys on and you fucked it all up? Eat shit! Can you not do that this time? Because of what you've done. You scared off Nick, so... Just Kevin. 12 days in rules. 12 days in... God damn it, Meth. Let me say it. Come on, man. Well, for those who haven't heard the previous episode with the Buffalo pinball guys on, Let's give you a quick recap on how Mef screwed all that up. Hello and welcome to episode 12 of the Pinball Party Podcast. We have a fantastic show for you today. We have the Buffalo Pinball guys here. So without further ado, Mef, bring in our guests. Hey, what the fuck? Yo, Mef, what? Is that a goddamn buffalo? Yes. In the fucking house? Yes. You idiot, what you do? What? Get down! Oh, ah, shit! Oh fuck. Ah! Fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck. Ahhhh! Fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck. Uh. Eat my lasers, you hairy fuck. Yeah, get em' man! Fuck yeah! Yeah! Die! Watch out! Die! Die, die, die, die! Ahhhh! Fuck yeah, you got him! I got him good. Oh.
1:27
For the podcast. So please, Mef, just don't try to help. Alright, let's just get to it. On the seventh day of balls, pinball gig to me, Buffalo, Pinball, Kevin, Shipwreck, David Dennis, Kiel, and Rachel Best. Time's pinball podcast, show runs, pinball drain, one half a fan, Feather Shoe, Mads, and many. Merry Christmas to Kevin from the, well, you know, Brody even talked pinball, Buffalo, you've been on the show before. Hey man, how you doing? What's going on? Merry Christmas, happy holidays. Thank you. Not a lot going on other than doing these 12 days of balls and thank you for being so accommodating. I know I reached out, I was like, hey, can you record like now or like very soon and do this because this is chaotic and dumb that I'm doing this. So thank you very much for joining. Sure, what the heck, let's talk. Let's talk. Some of this is pinball related, some of it not, but I have some questions. And to kick it off with a very specific pinball question, do you believe in aliens? Yes. You want yes or no answers or do you want explanations? You can keep going. Either, man. You've got more to it? Yeah, I just feel like the universe is so big there's got to be something out there. Yeah. Do you believe in ghosts? No. Yeah. It's not. We're done, it's over. That's it. Yeah, thanks for the show, I'll see you later. The closest we had is like, I don't really either per se, but I like hearing the stories of people like, oh yeah, I walked in the kitchen and I saw this dead man floating. I like to get freaked out even though it's not whatever, but Kayla had this really interesting story. For anyone listening, go back and listen to, or wait, are you after or before, scheduling wise, you can figure it out. Whatever. It's in there. He has a funny story about a hotel and some water. But on pinball, and for those who don't know, you guys do the Buffalo, the whole, I mean, it's under the moniker of Buffalo Pinball, but Bro Do You Even Talk Pinball, one of my favorite pinball podcasts. In fact, I just like paused it. I'm like halfway through your last one to record this with you. You were just talking about the GTF Signature Edition. Oh my good, dude. My goodness, dude. What a joke. I saw that video and I just, I was like, they're trying to like sell this as an investment. I can't even handle this. I can't handle it. So I was like, we have to do a breakdown of this on the show. So. So what, all right, so I got to the point where you were just, they're just talking about the powder coated armor and the, I mean, the Titan flipper bands. And then the kid was saying something about some toy that light reflects off the field. And I was just. Yeah, so what they're launching this signature edition pinball machine and like all the perks that they're giving are like things that you could just buy on their store for like 20 bucks. It's like you get this glass for $20 or you can buy a banner that's $100. You can get powder-coated armor. Okay, that's cool. If you really like that color, just get your armor powder-coated that color. I was like, but the signatures on the apron, I guess that's a thing you can't get somewhere else, but where's the value? And there's like a hologram sticker that they put on there. Like, I don't, I don't see it. What's the price? Do they say in there? It's a call for pricing price. Oh, so five dollars. Exactly. I will give you five dollars for this. Actually, that'd be a funny.

high confidence · Kevin Manne, stated as anticipated 2024 release

  • Buffalo Pinball is scaling back stream team collaborations and shifting channel direction while maintaining monthly podcast schedule

    high confidence · Kevin Manne, discussing upcoming channel changes

  • “Dialed In is probably the correct answer for sure. It's great. Well, hey Kevin, Merry Christmas.”

    Host @ N/A — Affirms Dialed In's quality after discussing community sentiment shifts

    • Tron
    game
    Ghostbustersgame
    Texas Chainsaw Massacregame
    Multimorphiccompany
    Dialed Ingame
    Mark Seidenperson
    Jersey Jack Pinballcompany
    Guns N' Rosesgame
    Scott Danesiperson
    American Pinballcompany
    Cupheadgame
    Ken Cromwellperson
    fun with bonuscontent
    Broken Token Podcastcontent
    Addams Familygame
    Pirates of the Caribbeangame
  • ?

    industry_signal: Pinball industry awards function as popularity contest favoring dominant manufacturer (Stern) due to installed base size; framework biases against smaller manufacturers' quality releases

    high · Kevin articulates awards criticism: 'annual awards for industry that produces handful of things every year... one company has far greater reach'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Dialed In experienced negative reception at launch due to 'mom jeans' theme criticism, but community sentiment shifted to recognition as excellent Pat Lawler game; now recommended as JJP's best

    high · Kevin notes initial theme criticism but current community consensus (9/10 Facebook comments recommend Dialed In)

  • ?

    machine_intel: Mark Seiden (new designer) has pending release from Jersey Jack Pinball anticipated for 2024; community speculates theme is Metroid based on his prior Twitch homebrew project

    medium · Kevin expresses hope Seiden's title releases in 2024, acknowledges speculation about Metroid theme, expresses uncertainty on confirmation

  • ?

    content_signal: Buffalo Pinball/Brody Even Talk Pinball transitioning format: scaling back stream team collaborations, maintaining monthly podcast cadence, planning new channel direction

    high · Kevin announces changes explicitly, directs audience to enable Twitch notifications for upcoming announcements

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Community belief that JJP pursuing major entertainment IP (Matrix, Harry Potter, Star Wars) would be commercially dominant; Cuphead licensing by American Pinball viewed as suboptimal choice vs. gaming IP like Metroid

    medium · Kevin advocates for Matrix/Harry Potter/Star Wars for JJP, positions Metroid as superior to Cuphead for video game theme licensing

  • ?

    technology_signal: P3 module hot-swapping verified at 1-1.5 minutes including glass removal; three connectors and two latches per module enable rapid changeover

    high · Kevin references YouTube demonstration on Buffalo Pinball channel, breaks down technical specifications

    • 4:59
    I wonder if you'd have to get permission, but like record it and call them and just get off lowball them big time. I'll give you two grand. How many of these you got sitting in your warehouse? Yeah, I'll take them all. 50 bucks. I'll take them all. But in opposite of that, what was your favorite pinball thing this year in 2023? Oh man. Could be game, rules. Personally, I got to go and hang with Scott Danesi at the Multimorphic headquarters and play Final Resistance and that was pretty amazing. I saw one of your streams and then that was like, I think that was lead up to TPF. Is that right? Is that early in the year? Yeah, it was right before TPF. Yeah. They haven't played the game. You have a P3, right? Do you have the game? I don't even remember. Did they make it yet? Yeah, they're building them, shipping them. Lots of people have gotten them already. I got mine a couple months ago. That was one of the first on the line. So yeah, it's awesome. It's everything I want in a Scott Danesi game. And it's built by Multimorphic, which I appreciate. As opposed to his other pinball machines. uh yeah uh spooky man and you guys were talking about that as well like the you know the themes are they doing pretty good with the themes but like it know fool me once you know like yeah it like yeah I hate to like I understand there a lot of effort and people put a lot of time and money and passion into these pinball machines So it's hard to like, crap on somebody's hard work. Like, I don't want to know, you know what I mean? But it's also like, if there's a repeating pattern and there's an issue, I think it's fair to call that out, too. You know what I mean? Right. So like, you know, they're doing something similar that they did with Ultraman and Halloween, right, where they're doing two pinball machines at the same time. Last time they did that, the code was, it took a lot of time for the code to get where it needed to be. Yeah. I'll give them credit. Like, it looks like they're doing two separate development teams on these games. And it sounds like the Texas Chainsaw Master has been in development for a long time. So but it's with the market the way it is right now. Right. You know, used machines, you don't have to rush out and buy these games right away. Like, play the game if it's great and you love it, buy it. But you know, just we can take a Wednesday approach, which I'm glad about. I'm glad the kind of like insanity of COVID is over where everybody was just buying everything that comes out before they had a chance to play it. And then the used games were more expensive than the new games. And that kind of like was just driving this insane cycle that was not sustainable. So I think I chilled out a little bit. We're going to get a chance to enjoy the machines and see if it's for you and buy it. And then even if you did miss out on a brand new inbox, chances are you're going to be able to get a used one less than new inbox, which is awesome. Yeah. And for those who hopped in during COVID, that's the norm of like, you should be able to get a used game cheaper than new, you know? I mean, yes. And Fear Missing Out was like a stranglehold for at least a year on everyone of like people were spending three grand over MSRP on like Stern premiums just to be able to play Deadpool. Yeah, I remember Ghostbusters prices went like through the roof. It was insane. Yes. And when I had mine, people couldn't wait to get rid of that game. Everybody hated that game, and then everybody decided they loved it. So it was crazy. Or like one of your games in the background, Tron, like during COVID, that was going for like 11, 12 grand for a Tron Pro. Uh-huh.
    8:17
    And those new were what? Five, four and a half? Five-ish, yeah. I bought mine. Mine was home use only, so I bought it secondhand. It was like imsavichit is our YouTube channel as long as it is widely used andğlu preserve you and the reflecting humanity of the world palavras yannick these observations about online burlles probabil知 scotland as woeh to Thanks for watching
    9:22
    In the first episode of the场 I forget what it's called. It's kind of a more arcadey one, like a roguelike where I think you were streaming it. Oh, Dungeon Door Defender? Yeah. What is the playfield for that one? What is it? It works on Heist. Heist, okay. Because you're defending the dungeon door and Heist has the prison door. Sure. Yeah. And have you, do you have Heist, the module? Yeah. I have them all except for Cannon Lagoon. Out of all the games I've seen from them, that has been the game that to me, I don't know why that came specifically, but that's exactly up my alley. Yeah, that was the game that got me to buy it. And I was like, I had had a loaner. They sent me, what was it like 2017, 2016, something like that. They sent me a loaner game to stream for a while. And then I sent it back. And then during COVID, they released Heist. And I was like, man, I should just buy one of these. I knew like I from borrowing it I was like this is really awesome I need to just own one of these and then Ice was the game where I was like all right I'm gonna jump in because it looked really cool and I'm glad I did you know because I've been all I've been all in since then it's been great. I have a few more questions but I gotta ask one more thing about the the P3 when you're gonna because you're like one of the most you know you just have a lot of experience with it and I'm talking to people like uh when you are going to change a module how long does it take you think roughly? So there's a video of me doing this on our YouTube channel. So if you go to the Buffalo Pinball YouTube channel, and the video is like a minute and a half. And that includes me messing around with streaming gear because I was doing it during a stream. So a minute and a half. Yeah, and mostly that time is taking the glass off and getting the game into service position. Once you have it in the service position, there's three connectors, you disconnect all the module out. Yeah, three connectors and two little latches on the side. Pull it out. Don't All right, so let's get into the show. So, we're going to start with the ball's into the trough, put the new thing in, lock it down, slide it back in, and you're done. Okay. Yeah, I have so many questions. All right, so move on. What is your favorite, quote unquote, real world monster? Like Sasquatch, Loch Ness Monster, Chetty, Yeti, Chupacabra. No, I don't spend a lot of time thinking about monsters, but... Yeah me neither I guess the Yeti Give me a good old Yeti A good good ol Yeti A good Yeti Okay Yeah Um what is your favorite curse word and could you please enunciate it clearly Oh, ah, phew, there's so many to choose from. I know, a lot of good ones. I think if Nick were here, he would say fuck. He definitely would. I mean, that's, that's a, I mean, you can't go wrong with that. It's, it's context, uh, dependent for me. If I'm playing pinball and I get really mad, you know, a big ol' fuck's gonna come out. But if it's, you know, if I'm less passionate and not feeling it as much, there's a good shit in there too. Yeah. You know, so I like a good shit for more reasons than one. Yeah, right. And definitely everybody clipped that part. Yes, yes. There's a little pause for you too, a little air on each side. The amount of terrible things I say when draining a ball, specifically, I'm thinking of like Step Forward was released by W lídernkova Gooditt Jilic, and Mr. Terence Buranch, who everything will spoil! All of these are great. I'm going to let them all come out. Yep. If you wouldn't mind, could you tell me something about yourself that you're proud of? That's a rough question, but... I don't know. I'm a dad. Nice. I think my kid's pretty cool, so I'm proud of my son. How about that? Hell yeah, man. How much do you bench? Oh, jeez. I don't. Okay. So 450 is the default answer, so we'll say 450 pounds. That's... 8,000 pounds. That's impressive. So, initially this 12 days of balls was going to be a pinball party festivus thing and I was going to have to do this you know with you and everyone else and then string and then make one large like two and a half hour episode and do like air grievance airs feats of strength all that and I was like well that'll just be three hours of people bitching about galactic tank force scooby-doo it'll just be like negative like I'm like I don't think I want to listen to it. Bad vibes at the end of the year. Yeah but I need to have a little sprinkle of it so can you Please, either we can go to a couple questions and come back to this. Error, a pinball grievance of 2023. If you have one at the top of your mind, feel free to shoot it out. Yeah, all the awards nonsense that's going on right now. Like, yeah, the awards are like pinball awards are done to begin with. Like, yeah, we've we've intentionally like we're not going to waste our time on the podcast talking about this stuff. So I'll talk about it on yours. Yeah, please. So it's like annual awards for an industry that produces like a handful of things every year. And one company has far greater reach than everybody else. So chances are if it's like a popularity contest, that's going to get the most votes because, you know, Stern's probably going to get the most votes because most people have played Stern's just out of sheer numbers. All of these are great. And then you've got one or two other games that are probably not going to make the cut. And that's it. So it's done to begin with, and then you have all this dumb drama going on. And people are like, let's just be done with those. That would be my answer to that. No more awards. Everybody did great. High fives all around. We don't need to have an award show. Yeah. Here's my pinball awards. Probably Foo Fighters is the best. Favorite podcast, actually, no offense to everyone else, probably Buffalo or Brokeback. I'm sorry, I didn't even talk about the branding. And there we go, awards over. What do you want for Christmas this year? Oh, hmm. Like the travel. Travel's good. I've been thinking more about, less about buying stuff and more about like experience things. So let's put less stuff in landfills and just spend more time with our friends and family, All of these are great things to do. I think it's really important to have a good experience with your family. You know, you're doing cool stuff, having experiences versus buying stuff for each other. It's hard to, I agree, especially in pinball when you think like one machine is a vacation for your whole family, like price wise. Exactly. It's crazy. You know? So if you had, like if I just gave you 20 grand, which I won't because I don't have it, where would you just suddenly, like you and your family go? Or maybe just you. Probably Hawaii because my son has been like, I don't know, for whatever reason he was like, I always wanted to go Hawaii. I don't think it costs 20 grand to go to Hawaii, but it would be great. We could live it up and just stay in the best hotels and everything. So we'll do it someday. But yeah, not this year. He's a junior in high school right now, so we got college in our future and all that stuff. If I remember, I think when we were getting to know your balls the last episode, his favorite game was Pirates. Who was that your favorite game? It's probably like it's hard to pick a favorite single pinball machine for me. Like I have different games I like for different reasons. Like, like Tron and Pirates are probably up there. But it's hard to deny. Godzilla is an amazing game. And I really like Final Resistance.
    17:22
    Dialed In is great. Addams Family is like my my nostalgic favorite. So I have many, many favorites for different reasons. This year, I guess, of releases. Well, I mean, we had the beginning of the year. Crazy, you know, explosion of releases.
    17:36
    What's your favorite game, you know, of this year? Of this year? Probably Final Resistance. It's, it's, uh, um, like, Godfather's really good too, but I think Final Resistance wins out on, like, the overall experience. Because I tend to gravitate towards sci-fi themes, and I really like the cyberpunk theme, and I've always liked Total Nuclear Annihilation, but I felt like I'm a fan of the game. I think it's a little too linear for a home play keeper game. I love playing it competitively. I don't necessarily want to own it. Final Resistance hits that vibe but brings more stuff to do different ways to approach it while you playing I think that going to be my pick for the year Okay Yeah and TNA I owned it twice And Aamir Tauqali of China last year launched his first demo of Spittain and its anzaビ tr scheduling'' over a year. This and much more were producing The newer version, but I mean, when it came out, they were asking like something ridiculous like 9,000 or something. But I think I bought it on the used market or traded with a buddy for like eight grand. And even selling it like 1,500 below was, I think I ended up selling it for seven and a half. But it took like two months to sell a perfect condition, like under 100 plays TNA. So it's a tough one. I think they pushed the price up too much on that. That was like 5,500 when they launched the first one, right? Yeah. And that's what it, that game fits there. Like it's a... Right. It feels like the right price. Right. And not from a design or anything. Like, I mean, it's a, or I should say not from a big build quality of what Scott put into it. It's phenomenal, but it is a very simple, fast Iron Man type of game. Right. Even more linear. Yeah, they put extras into it too for the CE version, but not like double the price. Right. No, no. It's like GTF version of the Signature Edition. It's like, yeah, those things are nice. I'm not going to pay that much extra for it. Sorry. Swindler Coat Painting, and some plastic. Not to discount it, but yeah, when you're asking $4 grand extra, nah. Bruh.
    19:46
    Last question. In 2024, what are you looking forward to the most in the world of pinball? I would say less drama, but that's never going to happen. Right.
    20:01
    Hopefully, this is the year that Mark Siden's pinball machine comes out from JJP. I'm really looking forward to seeing what he's been working on. So a new brand new designer with the you know the bill of materials that JJP allows their designers really curious to see what what comes out of that so Is there a rumor on... Hopefully this is the year Is there any rumors on the theme for him? I have no idea everybody wants it to be Metroid because that was his that was his homebrew that he used to he used to build it on Twitch I used to watch him make this game on Twitch like if there's nothing else going on I was like I'll see what's going on with Mark is building this game again and And it was really cool and innovative. So looking forward to what's coming out of them. If American Pinball is thinking that Cuphead somehow is a good enough theme, then I think Metroid, if it comes to video game themes, would smash that. But I mean, you know, Mario. Yeah, Nintendo is notoriously difficult to work with license-wise, so I doubt it's going to be that. Well, I think Ken, I'm going to have Ken Cromwell on tomorrow. Well, whenever you're listening... Just ask Ken what the theme is. He'll tell you. I'm going to. I'm going to ask him on the air. Ask him how Mark Seiden's Metroid game is coming along. All right, Ken, get ready. I'll listen for the answer. Yep. If he's listening, I'm talking to him tomorrow. That might air before this or after. Whatever. Time doesn't really matter. It's a good call. I really want JJP to... I mean, they put their heart and soul into games. And the last two, like, theme-wise, I mean... I mean, just for the masses, I don't think was the right call. Yeah. I want JJP to do The Matrix. They need to do The Matrix. This is fucking A. Hell yeah. Please. If they do the Matrix or Harry Potter or Star Wars... They're going to be making those for years. Printing money. Yeah, they'll turn it around. But they have so much money to work with anyways. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think they're doing all right. But I just want them to have a runaway hit again like they had with Guns N' Roses, you know? Yep. That and, I mean, even like Wizard of Oz back then was... That game is still one of their most impressive. If not most, could be. On the other hand, the game is packed. Other games, people came around on the other games too. I feel like, you know, Dialed In obviously got slammed when it came out, because people were hung up on the quote unquote, mom jeans, or the phone theme or whatever. Right. It's like, dude, this is a Pat Lawler disaster theme game. It's amazing. It's a great game. And I stand by that. I love that game. And so it's funny now, and like on Facebook when people are like, what JJP should I get? Like nine out of the 10 comments are like, you should get Dialed In. That's their best game. I was like, what am I even telling you people? Dialed in is probably the correct answer for sure. It's great. Well, hey Kevin, Merry Christmas. Thanks for joining I hope you have a happy holidays with the family. Hopefully you get to travel more Um, what do what do you guys got coming up soon on Buffalo or Brody even talk? So I you'll get to this since you're about halfway through the episode
    22:49
    Towards the end I talked about how we're shifting the channel a little bit So I had been you know for like the past nine years. I've been doing Fun director, director, studio, and title contender, yeah, Andre Kudrow . We're still going to do the podcast every month. We're also not doing the stream team thing anymore. So we had been doing, you know, for years we've had other, you know, non-local Buffalo folks on the stream sharing their gameplay with everybody. So we're scaling that back too. So, but we do have a vision for the future of the channel. So if you're not subscribed to Buffalo Pinball on Twitch, do that. And if you are, leave your notifications on and when the new stuff happens, you'll be there. That's awesome. Yeah, and go check out Brody Even Talk Pinball on your podcast thingy. It's phenomenal. All right. Happy New Year's. Thank you. Merry Christmas. Happy New Year.
    24:25
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