I'm No Longer Under NDA!

Cary Hardy·video·16m 29s·analyzed·Dec 9, 2020

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

Deep Root NDA lifted; Hardy reports manufacturing not ready in Sept, urges proof of production capability.

Summary

Kerry Hardy releases a joint statement from the 'Deep Six' (six industry figures who visited Deep Root Pinball) announcing their NDA has been lifted, then provides detailed personal analysis of the facility visit. Hardy criticizes the prototype playfield quality, questions whether the innovative 'pin bar' feature was necessary for the initial launch, and expresses serious concerns about Deep Root's manufacturing readiness as of the September visit, noting an empty production facility with only plans in place. Despite concerns, Hardy and the Deep Six express genuine support for Deep Root's success and urge Robert Mueller to publicly demonstrate manufacturing capability to ease pre-order buyers' concerns.

Key Claims

On the day of the visit (September), there was no active manufacturing, assembly workers, or operators in the production facility—only plans and equipment placement.
high confidence · Kerry Hardy directly observed the facility and reported 'there were no assembly workers, no operators, no any kind of clues that production and assembly manufacturing was close to being ready or ready to go.'
The Raza prototype playfield shown in Deep Root's video was significantly better finished than what the Deep Six saw in person, suggesting post-visit refinement.
high confidence · Hardy states: 'The play field was definitely not glass...it was pretty rough...Thankfully [they said] it was work in progress' but the video version 'was definitely better.'
Deep Root's new 'pin bar' feature was innovative but unnecessary for the initial game launch and could have been developed for later titles.
high confidence · Hardy: 'I feel it's not needed...I felt like they could have definitely gotten Raza out by now and it had been just a regular traditional pinball machine...don't try to make it your monumental best thing ever on your first.'
The pin pod shipping container is an optional $1,000 add-on that most buyers likely won't purchase due to cost and storage limitations.
high confidence · Hardy discusses the pin pod sizing issue and cost: 'It's an extra $1,000...I don't feel that a lot of people are going to spend the extra for a box.'
Deep Root's side rail glass-lifting mechanism shown in their video represents significant engineering improvement over what the Deep Six saw during the facility visit.
high confidence · Hardy: 'When he was showing us how it lifted up on this video and how he was just slamming it down and it was locking in place all smooth like that bravo that is very good...it was very prototype-esque' during the visit.
The Raza game contains mechanics not present in any other current pinball machine (unspecified 80s-themed mechanics).
medium confidence · Hardy states: 'Mechanics in that game are not in any other game to my recollection' regarding the 80s title, but refuses further details due to proprietary concerns.

Notable Quotes

“The facility was nice...but there were no assembly workers, no operators, no any kind of clues that production and assembly manufacturing was close to being ready or ready to go.”
Kerry Hardy@ 10:31 — Direct observation about manufacturing readiness—the core concern of the entire video and community.
“I wouldn't consider it to be an issue. I can definitely see the potential in it. But I want to say that that could have been something that could have evolved over time.”
Kerry Hardy@ 8:28 — Critiques Deep Root's design prioritization; suggests pin bar feature was premature innovation.
“If we wanted you to fail, then we wouldn't have given you any good feedback and our thoughts and concerns about your product. We could have just sat back and watched it burn if we wanted to.”
Kerry Hardy@ 13:54 — Emphasizes that the Deep Six's criticisms come from good faith desire for Deep Root to succeed.
“Show us manufacturing. I guarantee you that's what over 90 percent of the potential buyers at least on Pinside and the ones that are deep in this hobby that's what they want to see.”
Kerry Hardy@ 14:58 — Direct call-to-action for Deep Root to provide manufacturing proof; claims 90% community preference.
“It would power on, but they were having issues with certain things. It wasn't playing right, or it was rebooting, so they had their engineers over there messing with a lot of things, and we had to come back later that night.”
Kerry Hardy@ 9:50 — Reveals prototype stability issues during the visit, requiring evening troubleshooting session.

Entities

Kerry HardypersonChris ChandlerpersonColin McAlphinpersonJeff PattersonpersonCrystal GimnichpersonLauren GraypersonRobert MuellerpersonSteve BowdenpersonDeep Root Pinball

Signals

?
business_signal: Deep Root Pinball showed no active manufacturing capability in September despite years of development and current pre-order campaign; only planning and equipment placement visible.
high · Hardy: 'There were no assembly workers, no operators, no any kind of clues that production and assembly manufacturing was close to being ready or ready to go.' Production facility was 'basically an empty room.'
?
community_signal: Pinball community (particularly Pinside forum users and deep hobbyists) heavily skeptical of pre-orders due to past failures like Jersey Jack Pinball; wants manufacturing proof before committing deposits.
high · Hardy: 'Plenty of people have been burned before...by going on a deposit...you got to think that a lot of people have not forgotten this.' Also: 'Over 90 percent of the potential buyers...want to see [manufacturing].'
~
sentiment_shift: Deep Six (six respected industry figures) express genuine support for Deep Root's success but lack confidence in manufacturing readiness; see value in critical feedback as constructive.
high · Hardy: 'We want Deep Root to be a competitor. We don't want you to fail...the information that I'm giving you...is not supposed to be taken as if I'm trying to smear Deep Root. It's merely I'm wanting to make you aware.'
?
design_philosophy: Deep Root invested heavily in innovative 'pin bar' feature for initial Raza launch, but this may have been premature innovation that could have been deferred to later games.
high · Hardy advocates for traditional flipper-based game logic first, then pin bar innovation: 'I don't feel it needed to be on your initial game launch...start working on the development...after that.'
?

Topics

Deep Root Pinball manufacturing readinessprimaryRaza pinball machine design and featuresprimaryNDA release and industry transparencyprimaryPin bar innovation and necessitysecondaryPlayfield quality and finish standardssecondaryPre-order and sales strategysecondaryCommunity concerns about pinball manufacturer reliabilitysecondary

Sentiment

mixed(0.35)— Kerry Hardy expresses genuine support for Deep Root's success and innovation, but serious underlying concerns about manufacturing readiness, product maturity, and ability to deliver on pre-orders. The tone is critical but constructive—Hardy positions feedback as tough love meant to help, not to harm. There is frustration with Deep Root's apparent lack of preparedness despite years of development, tempered by acknowledgment of engineering improvements shown in recent video.

Transcript

youtube_groq_whisper · $0.049

i'm free that's right guys the nda has officially been completely released and we are no longer restricted to talk about deep root let me first start out by giving you the official statement from the deep six which includes myself hello pinheads the deep six that went to deep root a couple of months ago have been released from our ndas now we have been getting a ton of questions over the last couple of months so we wanted to put out a joint statement now that the NDA has been lifted. The number one question we have received is about manufacturing. While we did see the manufacturing area and heard an overview of their planned production process, there was no manufacturing or production taking place when we visited. So, like the rest of us, we will have to rely on Deep Root to share any current details regarding manufacturing. We truly appreciate the hospitality of Deep Root and hope that their vision for pinball will materialize. Sincerely, Kerry Hardy from Kerry Hardy YouTube channel, Chris Chandler, the Deep Root correspondent of the pinball show, Colin McAlphin, 2017 Pinberg champion, top competitive player, Jeff Patterson from This Week in Pinball, Crystal Gimnich from Marco Specialties, Riptide Podcast and The Plum Podcast, Lauren Gray from the Backbox Pinball Podcast. That is the official statement from the Deep Six. Now let's talk about my official thoughts and opinions on this whole encounter. Before I continue, let me stress once again that the first statement I read are the feelings of the Deep Six. From this point onward is on me. All the thoughts and opinions going forward do not reflect the thoughts and opinions of the other five. Now guys, I honestly cannot stress how good it feels to be able to express and talk about this going forward because you know me, I like to speak my mind and be honest and I can't and I was not able to do so due to the NDA. Now that I can I'm going to discuss with you the good the bad of my experiences and I'm already getting messages like crazy about this whole thing. Let's first talk about the facility. The facility was nice. I mean we went like I said the first thing we saw and I'm still not going to discuss with you guys the prototypes for the games and stuff like that. I do not think that that should be discussed even though you know the titles of them. I'm not going to tell you about what the 80s theme, what all is in that current white wood, and stuff like that. I will tell you that mechanics in that game are not in any other game to my recollection. So there is that bit of information, and that's all I'm going to give you when it comes to that 80s title that they talked about. Now, one of the very first things that we were shown in the video is available on the Deep Roots YouTube channel and their website, and that's going over the pin pod now as you will see on there i had i think at least one question that was in the in the actual video and that was due to the nature of the size of that it was probably not going to be able to fit through a standard door and that is true it would not be able to then you have the also thing that this is only an option and that was one thing that i was relieved to hear because honestly i don feel that a lot of people are going to spend the extra for a box to help their machine keep from getting issues or dents or scratches or anything like that It's an extra $1,000, and that stuff is not easily able to just be put aside unless you have, I guess, the ability to do so, whether it be a large storage facility. It's for some, but for the majority, they're going to be choosing the cardboard box version. I personally would not go for the pin bot either, the pin pod or whatever. When it comes to him showing off Raza's play field, now, yes, this is one of the things that all of us noticed, is that and it's been mentioned before is the play field was definitely not glass i do not know what the play field looked like on the recent uh stream footage and everything but i want to say they took pictures and it definitely what definitely was better but it was not something that i recommended that they should have been putting out into the public because no one would have liked to have seen this play field it was if i would have been clear coding and my play field looked like this it would have been something that I've been like, well, time to sand it all down and start over again or put on another coat. It was pretty rough. I mean, you could hear the ball going across the play field and they said it was work in progress. Thankfully, because if they would have said that, yeah, this is what we want it to be. That was one of my concerns was like, no one's going to like that. No one in this hobby that I'm aware of is all about a lumpy play field or dented or whatever and stuff like that. If people are grabbing about dimples, they're definitely not going to like the ruggedness of a plate field. That's a no-brainer. One of the things he mentions in the video is talking about our standard pinball machines today and how when you take off the lockdown bar, what are you doing with it? Like put it down somewhere or whatever, and that was an issue that he wanted to basically resolve and get rid of that. So that's why they come up with the pin bar feature. Now, here's the thing is that, and I had to point out, is that the arcade edition, which was the standard one, you still had that issue. You would take off the portion that covers up the pin bar, and you still had that plate that you had to do something with. So it wasn't resolving an issue for that. But on the LE or whatever the top tier one was, they did resolve that. and the and honestly with the engineering and the way it looks and everything on the video it's on their channel when he goes over the whole like side rails and how they lift up with the glass and he's over there letting it slam down onto the cabinet guys i i was very impressed because that is not what we saw when we were there it was very prototype-esque it was one of those where i'm like okay it looks cool i see the potential but in its current state i don't know about that so whenever he was showing us how it lifted up on this video and how he was just slamming it down and it was locking in place all smooth like that bravo that is very good so if all machines are like what we saw in that video then that is definitely a plus for that definitely in comparison to what we saw while we were there now my thoughts on the pin bar do this is one of those things when i saw it i saw the potential and I saw how it could be useful in certain scenarios, but I don't feel it's needed. I feel that a lot of the time and effort and innovations and everything has been put and relying solely on this pin bar that it didn't need it. I mean, one of the things that I stated in my initial interview while I was there for the cameras was that I wanted to see more items under the glass, like whether it be wire forms or mechanical features and stuff like that, that what I wanted to see And then we see the pin bar and I like okay that cool I can see where it could be useful But for me I have no problems choosing or finding a certain thing using my flipper buttons and then the action button in the center It's worked for decades and I think it can still continue to work just fine. So I wouldn't consider it to be an issue. I can definitely see the potential in it. But I want to say that that could have been something that could have evolved over time. I felt like they could have definitely gotten Raza out by now and it had been just a regular traditional pinball machine using your flipper buttons to make your decisions inside the store, the atomic shop, and going on forward. And while you're selling Raza's, start working on the development of the pinball and implementing that into your next game or the title or so after that. I don't feel it needed to be on your initial game launch. This is something that I feel that even authors who write books, the good ones, they state that on your first book, don't try to make it your monumental best thing ever because chances are it won't be. You learn from your mistakes. So the pin bar. Cool. I see the potential, but not needed. Now let's talk about the number one question that we were asked, and that was about manufacturing. and what we have in our statement, we got brought in to see the manufacturing area. We saw the model that you've seen, like in the videos and stuff like that, but honestly, on that day, the machine did not work. I mean, it would power on, but they were having issues with certain things. It wasn't playing right, or it was rebooting, so they had their engineers over there messing with a lot of things, and we had to come back later that night. honestly it was like i want to say like nine or ten o'clock at night that we got called back in because they were able to get the game going and that's when we were able to play it to an extent there were still some issues here and there but the main thing that got all of us a little concerned is that we got brought into basically an empty room but there were things in place for a future production line. But at that time, on that day, there were no assembly workers, no operators, no any kind of clues that production and assembly manufacturing was close to being ready or ready to go. Now, granted, like I said, this was September. Many days and a few months have passed now, and I do not know what they have in stated right now. So this is only going by what we saw on that day. And that was, there was no manufacturing in place. There was plans that he talked about and this is what's gonna go here. This is what we're gonna have going on here. Operators are gonna be here, here and here. So the plans were there, but that's all they were at that time. So this needs to be said to all of you guys that at the time, no, there wasn't manufacturing in place. Can they get it in place by the time that they've had it? Us questioning it? Yes. But it's one of those things that I felt, and I'm so glad, especially since they've released this to the public to where you're able to order games. This is something that you need to keep in mind, guys, is that, yes, at that time, there wasn't manufacturing. They could have it now, but I feel like, Robert, slash deep root you need to prove to everyone else ease their minds that you have manufacturing ready to go that you can actually manufacture this game for those that want to put in their deposits and order this game otherwise they're just going by your word and there's been plenty of people out there that have been burned before particularly by J by going on a deposit or money put down and a promise that they were going to receive something you got to think that a lot of people have not forgotten this so i would hope and i would love it if you were to release some images of like machines lined up ready to go on a manufacturing line um something to ease those minds out there that are just not willing to take the plunge prove it and i think you will have a much easier time selling these games they're taking pre-orders for this game right now guys all the way until the end of the month at a particular time all that information is available on their website whether they sell one or 1,000. This is the only time that you're able to order this game. And I feel like they've got to be ready to be done with this game. I think after all this time and years has been going on this one machine, you got to know and think that they're ready to move on to the next one. Now, I know I said that everything going forward was going to be my thoughts and opinions, But I want to take it back, and I want to say that the five and myself, the deep six, we want you to succeed, Robert. We want Deep Root to be a competitor. We don't want you to fail. If we wanted you to fail, then we wouldn't have given you any good feedback and our thoughts and concerns about your product. We could have just sat back and watched it burn if we wanted to. But we didn't. We want you to succeed. We want you to do well. So guys, take the information that I'm giving you right now is not supposed to be taken as if I'm trying to smear Deep Root. It's merely I'm wanting to make you aware that at least on the day we were there, manufacturing was not in place. but if they can make what we saw in the video with how easily the side rails were to go down and all that stuff then i think that they definitely have a chance so robert Steven Bowden and everyone there at deep root studios i by all means i wish you the best of luck and i do want you to succeed and hope you do but to give everyone an ease of mind a peace of mind whatever you want to say show us manufacturing i guarantee you that's what over 90 of the potential buyers at least on pin side and the ones that are deep in this hobby that's what they want to see they want to see proof that you can deliver get some images out online of a whole row of cabinets of rosas and you know a bunch of parts in a box something start like leaking those out you know every so often throughout the day or week or whatever. Give people interest in what you're capable of doing. And I feel like that's all I need to say on this video right here. If I feel that I need a follow-up due to a lot of questions from you guys, then by all means, put the questions that you want answered in the comments down below. And if there's enough, then I can do a follow-up. If you like what you've seen here, give me the thumbs up. And if you haven't already, subscribe button down below. That way you can be notified of whenever I upload content for your viewing pleasure. And until next time, guys, peace out.