Episode 1078: "Kaneda's Shocking Take on Dune After Sleeping On It"

Kaneda's Pinball Podcast (Patreon feed)·podcast_episode·20m 26s·analyzed·Apr 15, 2025

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

Kaneda: Dune's execution & marketing botched, but game itself is ambitious 'universe under glass' with solid mechanical depth.

Summary

Kaneda critiques Barrels of Fun's Dune pinball launch as a marketing failure despite praising the game's mechanical design and theme integration. He discusses the cabinet artwork, playfield features including the sandworm mechanism, atmospheric lighting system, and express concerns about pricing ($13-14K fully accessorized), poor communication strategy, and unfavorable release timing against King Kong. He predicts the game will sell well to the boutique 1,000-unit target but acknowledges theme may not resonate with modern pinball demographics.

Key Claims

Dune base price is $11,600 with additional accessories (sculpted slings, topper, shooter knob) bringing total to $13,000-14,000
high confidence · Kaneda discussing pricing structure early in episode
Barrels of Fun plans to produce 1,000 units completed by end of 2024 with production starting next month
high confidence · Kaneda citing distributor communications about production timeline
Dune theme has weak emotional resonance with modern pinball buyers compared to other sci-fi properties
medium confidence · Kaneda's opinion on theme appeal and market research
Barrels of Fun failed to deliver on promised content creator partnerships and marketing commitments
high confidence · Kaneda's personal conversations with the team regarding unfulfilled promises
Game features new RGB LED atmospheric lighting system, two LCD screens, three flippers, and motorized sandworm mechanism
high confidence · Kaneda reading official game specifications from distributor materials
Dune game looks significantly more mechanically complex than Labyrinth with more playfield features
medium confidence · Kaneda's visual comparison of the two games based on available imagery
Harry Potter game will feature muted movie clips unlike Dune which will have full audio
medium confidence · Kaneda referencing recent Jersey Jack information about Harry Potter approach
Dune and King Kong releasing simultaneously is worst possible timing for both games
medium confidence · Kaneda's strategic market analysis of competing releases

Notable Quotes

“I don't understand why David Van Es and the team over there that has been in communication with various members of the pinball media, how they ended up with such a fumbled launch.”
Kaneda @ ~0:45 — Sets tone for episode—acknowledges disconnect between marketing promise and execution
“All they were talking about was the shaker motor, the non-reflective glass, they were talking about the lighting system, all the stuff they were focusing on was not Dune. The modern version of Dune and getting you excited about this game.”
Kaneda @ ~1:00 — Core criticism of marketing strategy—wrong focus on specs over theme and experience
“I'm over it. I don't know why David did it. I don't know why Blake and Brian Savage did it this way. Maybe it wasn't their intention, but whatever they had planned, this was not it.”
Kaneda @ ~2:15 — Moves past frustration to analysis; implies disconnect between plan and execution
“This game looks like it's got ten times more fun stuff to shoot at than Avatar does. This game definitely looks like it's got a universe under glass.”
Kaneda @ ~5:30 — Direct comparison rejecting Avatar comps; establishes Dune as mechanically deeper
“I really do want to give Barrels of Fun a lot of credit for these sculpts because this is what should be under glass for this much money.”
Kaneda @ ~7:00 — Acknowledges quality execution in playfield design despite pricing concerns
“The only game you're really going to have to probably pull the trigger on today is a King Kong. Just because historically Keith Elwin have done really well and once they sell out it's hard to find one.”
Kaneda @ ~16:00 — Market advice on purchasing urgency and secondary market dynamics
“When these games were six to seven thousand dollars, it was a lot easier to just pull the trigger, support these boutique companies and pull the trigger. But at $13,000, $14,000 all in, it's hard to know whether or not you should pull the trigger.”
Kaneda — Core industry observation about pricing barriers to consumer commitment

Entities

Kanedaperson[name withheld pending review]personBlakeperson Brian Savageperson Barrels of Funcompany Dunegame King Konggame

Signals

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product_launch: Official reveal of Dune pinball specifications including three flippers, RGB LED atmospheric lighting, dual LCD screens, motorized sandworm mechanism, 1,000 unit production target, $11,600 base price with accessories planned for later
high · Kaneda reading official distributor materials and game specifications; full feature list detailed in episode
~
sentiment_shift: Community negative sentiment toward Barrels of Fun's marketing approach for Dune despite eventual game quality recognition; Kaneda describes launch as 'marketing disaster' and 'fumbled'
high · Kaneda's opening critique: 'I don't understand why... they ended up with such a fumbled launch'; emphasis on bad communication vs game quality
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product_concern: Dune shipping with placeholder topper and flat plastic slings; sculpted slings, specialized topper, and custom shooter knob will be sold separately at unknown future pricing, making total cost opaque to buyers at launch
high · Kaneda: 'So much talk for getting everything on day one from Barrels of Fun... A little disappointed it's not all available on day one'
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market_signal: Pinball boutique pricing ($13-14K fully accessorized) creating decision paralysis for buyers; secondary market dynamics now favor waiting for depreciation rather than new purchase commitment
high · Kaneda detailed analysis: 'When these games were six to seven thousand dollars... it was a lot easier to just pull the trigger... But at $13,000, $14,000 all in, it's hard to know'
?
competitive_signal: Dune and King Kong releasing on same day (described as 'today' in episode) creating competition for limited buyer attention and deposit capital; Kaneda calls timing 'worst timing ever'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.061

0:00

Hey! The man you're talking back to me! Take him out! Gotta keep him separated. I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said I... Welcome everybody to Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, we gotta keep him separated. I'm gonna have to separate my feelings about how Barrels of Fun launched this new Dune game, The worst kept secret in all of pinball from the game itself because I'm going to talk about both of them. I'm going to start out by saying this. I don't understand why David Van Es and the team over there that has been in communication with various members of the pinball media, how they ended up with such a fumbled launch. The thing I'm hearing happened is that some distro leaked the YouTube Mountain Vince Fields,

0:59

David Von emerging fans. bütünماot.com Send all yourassees on my messenger situation. Join the Indianuaаются sicher ingame Bad marketing, it's a bad way to communicate the game, and I don't understand why they didn't utilize more positive content leading up to the launch of this game. All they were talking about was the shaker motor, the non-reflective glass, they were talking about the lighting system, all the stuff they were focusing on was not Dune. The modern version of Dune and getting you excited about this game, getting you to watch the movies again, getting you to connect with the property. That's what I would have done. We know the Elton John effect. Elton John is one of the best shooting pinball machines of all time, but people didn't want Elton John and instead of like giving people a runway so they could get over that fact And then control the narrative around the game. You launch it like this. Now, that being said, so I'm over it. I don't know why David did it. I don't know why Blake and Brian Savage did it this way. Maybe it wasn't their intention, but whatever they had planned, this was not it. They just could have done it much better than they did. All right. So I'm over it. My little hissy fit. I went on YouTube last night. I was extremely tired. I'm over it. Let's talk about the game. The game is now real. The game is out. The game is going to go on the line within the next four weeks. I have a laundry list of features. I've got a humongous email that they sent to the distributors, how it's all going to work. I'm hearing a lot of message about how this is a universe under glass, not a world under glass, a universe under glass. Look, I think these guys are very proud of this game. And as I look at the game, I think there's a lot here to be proud of. I do. While it's not the theme I would have selected, it's not. I don't think the modern pinball buying demographic clicked with these movies. There's not like an emotional connection to these modern Dune films. It's not the kind of movie you're going to go back and watch time and time again. And it's not the kind of movie where you're going to get a tattoo of it. It's not the kind of movie where you're reciting lines from the film. I bet if I asked most of you, name me three characters from this movie, you wouldn't really be able to do it. Now that being said, on a theme level, it's not a very strong theme for modern pinball. It's not. And it's very brown, right? It's like this company is stuck in a beige brown world. It's gonna go really nice next to your labyrinth, but boy oh boy, it is again another brown game from Barrels of Fun. So just aesthetically, you know, the colorful fun of an Evil Dead, or we know King Kong's gonna be colorful and fun. This game, a lot darker. I think Harry Potter's gonna be very dark too, but it does fit the theme. I'm looking at the Knapp's arcade images right now and let's go over this game, all right? Let's talk about the cabinet first. What do we think about the cabinet artwork? We've got the character Timothy Chamelet. See, I don't even know his character name. I really don't. I don't know who the main character in Dune is. He's holding up his knife. I think he's like leading the army with this rebellious sort of fist pump with the knife in hand. That's on the right side of the cabinet. The Translite has all the characters from the movie They got everybody from the films I mean everybody in this So I fully expect there to be movie clips without muted clips which is going to be good Because if you saw the Jersey Jack note the other day it seems like there going to be muted clips in Harry Potter And you know how I feel about that It kind of a deal breaker but everybody is in this And here what sad I on Knapp Arcade right now And there is nothing but a low res flyer of the game Low res, I can't read any of the text. I can see it and this is their first official assets of the game. Low res, cannot read what is going on here. On the left side of the cabinet, it's much darker. Reminds me a lot of Lord of the Rings where one side is sort of orange and red and the other side is sort of black and blue. I'm zooming in here and it looks like there's a few characters fighting is what it looks like. Okay, but that's not what everybody's talking about. And then you got a topper on this game that's just a placeholder plastic topper because they're going to, at a later date, offer an accessory package which is also going to have a new topper. So, so much talk for getting everything on day one from Barrels of Fun. They've been doing a lot of communication around how they're giving you the best bang for the buck in pinball, but the price has gone up. I believe the price of this game is $11,600 and that's not with the more expensive topper. It's not with the sculpted slings. If you look at the slingshots, just flat plastic and it's not with the shooter knob. So if you add all of those things up, you're getting much closer to a $13,000 to $14,000 game. I don't know how much the topper is going to be. A little disappointed it's not all available on day one. So people don't know how much in total they're going to need to spend if they want to buy this game with all of the accessories. I don't like that. From a communication standpoint, I would like to know on day one, how much is everything all in? We know there's going to be a thousand units and it sounds like games are going to start to be made over the next month. They're anticipating to make all 1,000 of these games by the end of the year. Now that's a lot. That's a lot because it's already mid-April. So all these companies promising we're gonna have all the units made by the end of the year, I hope they get there. Now looking at the game too, you know, the coin door is weird, that one coin slot, and then they've got just the generic shooter knob. The armor is just basic armor. I just feel like there's certain details where I would have liked to have seen a little bit more. For example, the speaker area. I guess it looks like a worm, right? The speaker grill itself, which is kind of nice. But it's just a lot of dark brown. The legs, the armor, the speaker grill area. So I have to stand over the machine. But look, if you like Dune, I think this game really does a great job Bringing the theme to life. Now, looking at the playfield, the universe under glass, what do I think about this game? Well, first and foremost, I've heard a lot of people say, this is just like Avatar. It's a theme nobody really wants, and it's going to go down just like Avatar. And I 100% disagree. And here's why. This game looks like it's got ten times more fun stuff to shoot at than Avatar does. This game definitely looks like it's got a universe under glass. It definitely looks like all these wire forms going all over the place. I mean, you kind of get that sense of like the worms slithering through the desert. I'm getting that vibe. I love the sculpts in this game. I mean, people are saying it reminds them a little bit of whitewater. And the only reason that is, is because of all the sculpts. It really looks like a three-dimensional world under glass. And that's what you want to see. So kudos to the team over there for not going flat plastic. I bet you were going to see a lot more flat plastic today when we see King Kong. I don't know if Harry Potter is going to have this level of sculpts, but out of all the companies in pinball right now, I really do want to give Barrels of Fun a lot of credit for these sculpts because this is what should be under glass for this much money. And you know, look, last night I was like, oh, the art. Yeah, the art is very barren, like a desert. It really is like there's not a lot of art. There's not a lot of detail. And when I look at it now, you sort of have just a few characters in the middle. The inserts are interestingly located in this game. What you can see in this game is sort of how the inserts are going to light up. And I feel like they're going to escalate as you're getting through the different modes in the game. I like that there not too many inserts My one fear when I looking at this game right now and this is probably why they have the new lighting system if you look at the middle of the game there really not many inserts which means there not going to be a lot of light So I think this game is going to utilize the new lighting system on the rails to create much more of an atmosphere because I don think you going to get like a ton of inserts lighting up on the playfield itself And it kind of makes sense, right? You're in a desert and that's where this franchise takes place. You wouldn't expect there to be too much light. You kind of want that desert vibe to come through more. And I'm really happy to say it does. I mean, what's going to be stunning in this game, I can kind of tell right now. My favorite area of this game is that back one third of the playfield. I love all the sculpts and then it goes into that LCD screen that's in the back box area, right? The back of the game, the ability for them to sort of have a desert sequence. It's almost like the physical playfield is blending into the film and I think it's going to be really, really cool. I really do. Got three flippers in this game. I'm going to be talking about the pinball game. It looks like you've got a physical ball kick out in the left out lane. Really interesting area there. It looks like it kicks it out up the wire form and then feeds it back to the left flipper. So that's going to be really cool. There's some drop targets. There's a third flipper. And then there's obviously the main mech, that big sandworm that comes up with the magnet and apparently it's going to eat the ball. I'm not sure what happens, right? They haven't shown us the whole sequence. We're going to get more of that. And then there's another mech in the upper left corner. I'm not sure what that thing is from the movies. I should know the movies better. And what's also interesting is you've got that sculpt in the upper right with those two holes. And I don't think the balls come out of there, but really atmospheric and well done on the overall look of this game. It comes with the inner art decals. Let's read the game features. Three flippers, six balls, Horizon Atmospheric Lighting. So I think that's going to be really cool. I think this game is going to have more of an atmospheric effect than even Avatar does, which never really worked right. In all new RGB LED low profile inner cabinet lighting system for Arrakis Day night lighting effects. Can't wait to see that. All RGB WLED playfield insert lamps, general illumination lamps and playfield apron floodlights. Evergloss high gloss decal art with metallic embedded details. So that's the cabinet artwork. It's kind of like their version of Radcals. Infinity glass, thunder from down under. It's got the two LCD screens. Now I'm hearing that we're going to see the full reveal of this game today. So a lot's going to happen today. We're going to see more of Dune. We're going to see King Kong. We're going to get a lot, right? Harry Potter seemingly a few weeks away. So here's my overall take on this Dune game. If they sold a thousand labyrinth machines, they're gonna sell these games. And this is the thing about boutiques. You only need to sell a thousand. And did you give enough to sell a thousand units? Now, the one thing is it's not cheap. And I think people are gonna wanna fully accessorize this thing. And I think fully accessorized out the door, you're looking at 13, $14,000. And then the question becomes, do you wait it out? Because as we saw with Labyrinth, towards the end of the run, the demand dries up. You know, it's interesting about David Van Es' strategy here. He sent a note to the distros. They're really trying to get distros to order more Labyrinth machines to bump them up in terms of when you'll get your Dune machines. I don't know how much demand there really was for Labyrinth. I don't think there was even a thousand, but this game looks so much better than Labyrinth. I gotta be honest. It looks so much cooler than Labyrinth. There's a lot more going on in this game than there is in Labyrinth. And look, I think the response to this game is going to be interesting because it's definitely a game that has a lot in it. And I think it's going to be interesting to see what we get from King Kong today. Because if Kong has no assets and is an all original Kong adventure and it doesn't have a lot in it, people might start to look at this Dune machine with a lot more favorability. Now I also think most people are going to wait to see everything before they pull the trigger. The only game you're really going to have to probably pull the trigger on today is a King Kong LE. Just because historically Elwin LEs have done really well and once they sell out it's hard to find one. We know all the King Kong LEs have already sold through but you know will distros still have them come the end of the week It only Tuesday right It only Tuesday I can wait to see Kerry Hardy review after he gets to jump on this machine Poor Kerry, man. He flew down there and they seemingly screwed him on all the exclusive stuff he was going to be able to do, but he will be the first one to have hands-on time with this game. Colin is down there. I think Cale might be down there as well. I was not going to make the trip. I was not going to make the trip because when this game actually does ship, it's going to go to automated and I'll have a chance to play it. Same with King Kong. So lots happening this week, people. Lots happening this week. Look, I just want to end by saying this is a really, really good theme integrated game. Whether or not the theme speaks to you, yeah, it's not where I would have gone. I don't think market research takes you here. I think there are other sci-fi sort of nostalgic things that would have sold better. Stuff like Spaceballs. Heck, even Last Starfighter might speak to more So I just think the new Dune, and a lot of people that love Dune also have fondness for the David Lynch Dune. It's just like the new one, right? It's like none of us are into Timothy Chamolay and Zendaya. Like these are like Gen Z actors, right? These aren't the actors and these aren't the movies that have forged an indelible bond with you. But I am impressed that David Van Essen team got a modern blockbuster theme. Only one issue too is, isn't there a third movie coming out? And so now they've made this game based on the first two films and a third installment might come out. You know, a better theme would have been to make the new Tron movie coming out, which is happening this fall. And in the end, it all comes down to one simple thing. When these games were six to seven thousand dollars, it was a lot easier to just pull the trigger, support these boutique companies and pull the trigger. But at $13,000, $14,000 all in, it's hard to know whether or not you should pull the trigger. Because what you don't want to do is give that $2,000, they raised it, it's a $2,000 non-refundable deposit. What you don't want to do is lock yourself in on this game, and if you want all the accessories, that's a $2,000 deposit on a game that might be $13,000 or more thousand dollars, which Which then might lose $3,000 in one year because Back to the Future is coming out, Harry Potter is coming out, Stern is not done, right? In four months, another Stern machine will be coming out by John Borg and it might be Pokemon. That's the problem I see in all modern pinball is you really can only go in on these games when you want to keep them. And then the problem becomes if you really want to keep them, you might as well wait And let the new in box buyer take the big hit and then swoop in and get it for $3,000 or less. It's just a problem with the whole industry now is like nothing makes you really want to pull the trigger right away. Because again, six, $7,000, these things are sold out in day one. $13,000 fully accessorize, I don't know, especially with King Kong dropping on the same exact day. I mean, talk about the worst timing ever. It is the worst timing ever. I wish this game would have like stole the show at TPF. It really would have. Like this looks way, way cooler than Portal. All right, so we shall see. I'm obviously gonna do more shows today. And also I'm gonna go live when King Kong drops today. So join me on YouTube and let's watch Kong together. But these are my first impressions of Barrels of Fun's new game, Dune. I think it was a marketing disaster. David and team have a lot of maturing to do when it comes to how to market a game and bring it to market and utilize all the content creators that are out there to their benefit. I don't think they did it properly and it's really a shame because I had a lot of personal conversations with them and they did nothing they said they were going to do. So that's unfortunate, but that does not take away from the effort I see in this game. It does look to be a real universe under glass and it looks really neat. And I think when we see this whole thing lit up with the atmospheric effect, I think it's going to be the opposite of Avatar. I think this game is going to bring that sand world to life and then some where Avatar missed the mark completely on bringing the world of Pandora to life. Everybody, thank you for being a subscriber. More shows coming today. Crazy day. There's a reason I took off. I go back to work tomorrow because I knew, I knew I needed to recover from the jet lag and I knew this was going to be a crazy day in pinball. Kaneda out. Hey, hey, hey, Pinball Mike, 218, I want to be with you anytime. Hey, hey, hey, come on and play.