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043 - Pinside Top 10 Machines

Punk Rock Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·35m 27s·analyzed·Apr 13, 2026
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.032

TL;DR

Hosts re-rank Pinside Top 10, debate King Kong underrating, announce scene leaderboard updates.

Summary

Stephanie and Mike from Punk Rock Pinball Podcast re-rank the current Pinside Top 100's top 10 machines according to their personal preferences, while discussing community-specific tournament updates and venue highlights. The hosts debate the rankings extensively, noting disagreement with several placements—particularly King Kong's position at #20 and Jersey Jack's Pirates of the Caribbean at #17—and propose future episodes on top 10 revisions and early software code debate.

Key Claims

  • King Kong is ranked #20 on Pinside Top 100, lower than several games the hosts believe it should rank above

    high confidence · Stephanie and Mike both checked the Pinside Top 100 list during the episode and confirmed Kong at #20

  • Star Wars Fall of the Empire is outside the top 100 on Pinside

    medium confidence · Mike stated during the episode that Fall of the Empire appears to be outside top 100, though they didn't confirm the exact ranking

  • Punk Rock Pinball Association scene leaderboards now filter rankings to top 20 best performances instead of cumulative totals

    high confidence · Stephanie explained this as a major update to PRPA leaderboards to allow new players to enter the competitive ranks

  • Scott Lozier took CJ to five games in league finals, including an 830+ million score on James Bond

    high confidence · Mike described Scott's recent tournament performance and noted his improvement over the past year

  • Iron Maiden machines have high setup-sensitivity affecting player performance more than other games

    medium confidence · Stephanie observed that her performance on Iron Maiden varies dramatically between different machines at different locations

  • King Kong suffered from expectation mismanagement due to being an original Stern interpretation rather than a licensed film adaptation

    medium confidence · Mike theorized that King Kong's lower ranking stems from initial disappointment when players discovered it wasn't based on classic or modern film versions

  • Walking Dead Remastered is rated #53 on Pinside Top 100

    high confidence · Mike looked up the ranking during the episode

  • Dumb Records in Springfield, Illinois hosted its first tournament with a Pokemon launch event

    high confidence · Stephanie and Mike attended the event and described the venue's arcade and custom trophies

Notable Quotes

  • “My number one's Jaws, my number 10's Harry Potter... if Kong was in the top 10, I would put it number two. After Jaws? Yeah. I agree.”

    Stephanie and Mike @ ~18:00-22:00 — Core debate: hosts both rank Jaws #1 and both believe King Kong deserves top-10 placement above several ranked games

  • “I can't believe Kong was not in there. Yes. That shocks me. 100% agree. Is King Kong the most underrated pinball machine of all time?”

    Stephanie and Mike @ ~24:00 — Identifies King Kong underrating as major community sentiment issue and potential episode topic

  • “Pirates of the Caribbean, Jersey Jack... That game is a fucking mess... it's beautiful to look at and like tons of cool stuff and mechs, but playing pinball, like actually shooting the game like Jersey Jack Pirates versus King Kong, get out of here.”

    Stephanie @ ~26:00 — Critical evaluation of game design vs. aesthetic appeal and mechanical complexity in ranking discussions

  • “I think King Kong suffered from expectations versus what was delivered... It's their interpretation of a story... So I think a lot of people were taken aback initially by that.”

    Mike @ ~28:00 — Analysis of marketing/expectation management failure as reason for King Kong's underrating

  • “Scott... took him to five games out of a best of five... he shot a little over 800 million... And CJ came back and beat him with like 830 million. So kudos to Scott... a year ago like Scott was not the player that he is today.”

    Mike @ ~3:30 — Recognition of player development and scene progression in Punk Rock Pinball Association

  • “So now within the scene leaderboard, it is the total of your top 20 best performances... it allows people to kind of get into it... if we always gained points every time, you'd never catch us.”

    Stephanie @ ~2:00 — Explanation of competitive leaderboard reform to improve accessibility for emerging players

  • “There are so many games on here that are not nearly as good as Fall of the Empire... The group of games like the Pro Premium LE is number 128. You people are crazy.”

Entities

StephaniepersonMikepersonScott LozierpersonCJpersonJoepersonKeith ElwinpersonPunk Rock Pinball PodcastorganizationPunk Rock Pinball Associationorganization

Signals

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Hosts express significant frustration that King Kong ranks #20 instead of top 5-10, noting it deserves higher placement than several top-ranked games

    high · Both hosts called King Kong underrated, Stephanie said 'This is bullshit' about Kong at #20 vs. Pirates of the Caribbean at #17; Mike said Kong suffered from expectation management issues at launch

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Hosts question the accuracy and legitimacy of Pinside Top 100 rankings, suggesting community voters lack judgment

    high · Stephanie: 'You people are crazy' about Fall of the Empire ranking, 'these people don't know' about Kong placement; Mike: 'If it is below 97... I was gonna throw my phone across the room'

  • ?

    community_signal: Central Illinois Punk Rock Pinball scene showing strong growth with many skilled active players; leaderboard reform implemented to enable newcomers

    high · Stephanie noted need to 'grow some fresh meat' because all active players are now competitive; PRPA implemented top-20 filtering to allow new players to compete

  • ?

    product_strategy: Community discussion emerging about whether games should ship with complete code or if early-access rolling updates are preferable

    medium · Stephanie proposed future episode on whether buyers enjoy purchasing games with early code and watching them develop vs. waiting for completion

  • ?

    design_philosophy: King Kong case study showing licensed IP names without film assets creates customer expectation mismatch vs. original interpretations

    medium · Mike explained Kong used only name license, creating original Stern interpretation that disappointed players expecting classic/modern film versions

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.106

0:00
Hello. Hi. Welcome back to the Punk Rock Pinball Podcast episode 43. Okay. You may see a new dog. I don't know if she's in the frame. This is Stella. Stella. She's visiting. She's visiting. She's visiting. She's going home tonight. It's Marshall's best friend. Marshall's best friend in the world, Stella Dog. She's a nice, nice girl. Oh, we didn't introduce ourselves. I'm Stephanie. I'm Mike. We're the hosts of the show. This is our show. This is how we do it. Mm-hmm. So we've got an episode for you today we just concocted. It's right now 834 Sunday night. Mm-hmm. We had a big weekend. Yeah. Talk a little bit about it. Not too much. A little bit. Just. But we're going to, each of us, re-rank the top ten pinball machines on the pin side top 100 as it is today. I know it changes. It's an ever-changing list anyways. It changes all the time. We can't add anything into the ten. We're just you can agree with the order or reorder things, but we're going to take those games and put them in the order that we think those top those 10 games should be. Those 10 games. Because if you could add or remove, I'd be doing a lot of removing. The rules say we can't. Because I think some maybe some of you, but maybe people that watch this don't participate on the Pinside Top 100. But I was just looking at the top 10 and like some pinball ranking people are crazy because there's games in this top 10 that if I could choose, they wouldn't be anywhere near the top 10. But we just have to re-rank them as they are. That's what we're going to do on the show today. That's going to be today's show. I do have one update, a fun Punk Rock Pinball Association update. Okay. And I know some people get annoyed if we talk about that too much, but this is a big update. Punk Rock Pinball Association, there's, I don't know, 50, 60 places around, mostly the Midwest, but throughout the country you can go and participate. Pinball tournaments that show up on our rankings on punkrockpinball.com. And within the leaderboard, there are different scenes. So that's one way we're a little bit different than the International Flipper Pinball Association. We don't have like statewide rankings. We have scene rankings. Mm hmm. So we have a central Illinois scene. There's a Madison, Wisconsin scene. There's an eastern Iowa scene. There's a northern Ohio scene. Those are your biggest ones currently, but there's lots of other scenes. But those scene leaderboards now, it used to be the rankings would just take the total, your total points from all the tournaments you've played and that's your total and it could always go grow.

Stephanie @ ~20:00 — Expresses frustration with Pinside ranking accuracy and community voting behavior

  • “I think for some future episode ideas... five games that should be in the pin side top ten that aren't... do you enjoy buying a game with early code and watching it grow or does it frustrate you?”

    Stephanie @ ~33:00 — Teases planned episodes on ranking revisions and software maturity debate

    • Pinside Top 100
    product
    Jawsgame
    King Konggame
    Metallica Remasteredgame
    Godzillagame
    Iron Maidengame
    Pirates of the Caribbeangame
    Evil Deadgame
    Dumb Recordsvenue
    Star Wars Fall of the Empiregame
    Walking Dead Remasteredgame
    Stern Pinballcompany
    Spooky Pinballcompany
    Jersey Jack Pinballcompany
    Chicago Gamingcompany
  • ?

    gameplay_signal: Iron Maiden identified as having exceptionally high setup-dependent playability variation across different machines and venues

    medium · Stephanie noted Iron Maiden performance varies more dramatically by machine than other games; different machines feel comfortable vs. unplayable

  • ?

    venue_signal: Dumb Records in Springfield, Illinois launched inaugural pinball tournament, indicating arcade/music venue expansion into competitive pinball

    high · Hosts attended Dumb Records' first tournament with Pokemon launch event, described venue as record shop with 100-150 capacity arcade hosting rock/metal shows

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Scott Lozier demonstrating rapid skill development and high commitment to local scene, transitioning from casual to competitive player

    high · Mike noted Scott took CJ to five games in league finals with 830M+ James Bond score; Scott tied with Kat Davis for most PRPA tournaments played; Mike said 'a year ago Scott was not the player he is today'

  • ?

    content_signal: Punk Rock Pinball Podcast planning future episodes on Pinside Top 100 revisions and software code maturity debate

    high · Stephanie explicitly outlined two planned episode topics: 'five games that should be in top ten' and 'early code vs. complete code at launch' discussions

  • $

    market_signal: King Kong Pro models selling quickly through demo channels, indicating growing player adoption and improved secondary market performance

    medium · Mike noted Tilt Amusements' Kong Pro demos 'go fast' and King Kong is 'becoming a popular game' and likely a 'slow grower like James Bond was'

  • ?

    industry_signal: Wide-body design format creating ranked-game disadvantage despite mechanical/gameplay merit; Pirates of the Caribbean criticized for overemphasis on mechanics/aesthetics over playability

    medium · Stephanie noted Evil Dead would rank higher 'if it wasn't a wide body'; Pirates criticized as 'not fun to shoot' despite 'beautiful' and 'tons of stuff'

  • ?

    community_signal: Hosts seeking community input on Top 100 rankings and future episode topics through YouTube comments and email

    medium · Stephanie asked viewers to comment on their top 1 and 10 rankings; invited email feedback to mike@livefromtherockroom.com; requested votes on planned episodes

    • 3:14
    So now within the scene leaderboard, it is the total of your top 20 best performances. Interesting. And we're doing that because, for one, it allows people to kind of get into it. And, you know, if you came into the central Illinois scene right now and there's like Joe and CJ and Shelly and me at the top. And if we always gained points every time, you'd never catch us. So it helps you there because it's like this your top 20. So all you got to do is play 20 and you can be in the mix. Okay. I love it. And it's a little bit more the ranking when you filter it that way is a little more true to like kind of who's the best. And I know like Madison is going to use this leaderboard for their like city championship. Later this year, early next year, we will have Central Illinois Scene Championship at our congratulations. Punk Rock Pinball HQ. But that's the new update. The scene leaderboards are, it's filtered down to your top 20 best performances. So if you've got 20, you need to do better than you've done in some of those other ones. That's cool. To gain the rankings. Yeah. That's that. That's pretty exciting. Mm-hmm. We also played in a bunch of things this week. I know we can just kind of touch on it. We had our league finals that you played in on Saturday. Yeah. And then we, and you came in fifth. I tied for fifth. Tied for fifth.
    4:52
    Joe won. CJ second. Dennis third. Kevin fourth. And then we raced down to Springfield, Illinois to Dumb Records, which is a really cool record shop. Yeah, check it out. If you're anywhere, if you're near St. Louis, it's not that far from you. If you're in central Illinois, if you're traveling through, stop by Dumb Records in Springfield. Yeah, it's a record store and also they have this really cool arcade in the back and they hosted their very first tournament last night and it was also a Pokemon launch and it was super cool. They created these incredible trophies. Yeah. Maybe I'll pop a picture up if I can find one off of my phone, but they were really, really cool. And one of the owners actually won the tournament, which is kind of cool though. Might have been the first tournament he's ever played in. It is. Yeah. And they're going to have that really cool trophy in the front of the shop. They also do shows there too. Yeah, they have rock shows there. They have a little space. I guess they could hold 150 people. Looks to me more like it could hold 100, but they put 150 in there. So yeah, they have like punk and metal bands that come through and play there. It's a really cool spot. Very cool. So check that out. And today we did our Pro Poor Bros tournament and came on back and here we are. Yeah, I did a lot of driving because yesterday I drove to Peoria, hey, Simmer, and back to here, and then down to Springfield and back to here. This dog wants to play. I do want to give one special shout out before we get into the topic. Is it Kevin? No, it's not to Kevin. Kevin wants this whole episode to be about him. One special shout out to our friend who I think listens to every episode just about Scott Lozier. So in the league finals yesterday, Scott was matched up against our friend CJ who's one of the best players around here. And while Scott did not defeat CJ, he took him to five games out of a best of five. Wow. One of his losses was on James Bond where Scott shot a little over 800 million and CJ came back and beat him with like 830 million. So kudos to Scott. He's I think he would agree like a year ago like Scott was not the player that he is today. No, he just kind of started playing. He just started playing. But I was looking at our punk rock pinball leaderboards and like Scott, I believe is tied with Kat Davis for the most punk rock pinball tournaments played. He's grinding. So he's at every league. He's at every tournament. Goes to poor bros. Not today. Maybe it was busy. So Scott gets my like most improved player award and like the grinder award. The grinder award. Because there was a point in time a year ago for playing in Peoria, I wouldn't mind having Scott in my match. And now if he's in my match, like I'm kind of nervous. I know. I don't really want to play against Scott anymore. No, there's really like nobody I really want to play against where it's like, okay, that's a gimme. Yeah, our scene's gotten so active that like everybody, all of the active players in it now are like good and you don't really want to play any of them. Yeah, we need to grow some fresh meat. We need some we need some noobs to come in and grow. But I just wanted to give that shout out. I know some people, you know, you don't want us to talk about our local scene all the time, but it is our scene. And a good majority of our listeners are from this like they all listen So we going to talk about it some but we get into the main topic now But congratulations Scott for taking CJ to five games It's pretty awesome. I'm proud of how he played. Like, I've liked watching his growth as a player. Yeah, me too. Me too. And just a really nice guy. Really great guy. His brother used to come around, too. He doesn't come around anymore. Scott, get your brother back out. Yeah, what the heck. All right, Pinside. This is Stella is going to be a whiner. Pinside 100. We're going to do like the top 100, not EMs, not any of the other things. So you can go on Pinside and you can answer all these questions and they figure out this kind of weird ranking system on games. And the top 10 in the top 100 right now, this is the order and we're going to reorder it. This is as they are. As they are. User ratings. Number one is Godzilla. Number two is Harry Potter. Three, Jaws. Four, Medieval Madness. Five, Evil Dead. Six, Jurassic Park, the Stern One. Seven, Attack from Mars. Eight, Metallica Remastered. Nine, Monster Bash. Ten, Iron Maiden. Okay. All right, so you've got like four Keith Elwin games in there. Yeah, Keith is a good pinball designer. You've got one Jersey Jack. Yep. And you've got one Spooky. One Spooky and then two Chicago Gaming remakes. Three. Oh, three. Well, Monster Bash, it's the Williams slash CDC. So three of them are Chicago Gaming, basically, that were Williams.
    10:37
    All right. Well. How do we want to do this? Do we want to go like you do your number one, I'll do my number one? Reranking them? Yeah. I mean, my number one's Jaws. Same. Jaws, Jaws. And I just gotta say, more than half of these wouldn't be in my top ten at all. I mean, I agree, but we're not going to talk about that. There's only probably two of these that would be in my top ten. And that's okay. We're not going to talk about that. We're just re-ranking it. I'm really with a lot of people about pinball machines. You know what? You should go on Pinside and do ratings. I do. You do? Yeah. I've rated a bunch of games. Really? Yeah. How many? I don't know. Six or seven.
    11:24
    Okay. All right. My number two on this list. Mm-hmm. I'm going to say... I can't believe Cactus Canyon is on this list. Cactus Canyon is better than Medieval Madness. It's better than Attack from Mars. It's better than Monster Bash period. Okay, we weren't going to do that. I know, but I mean, you said you couldn't believe it's not on the list. It's better than all three of those games. I'm going to say after Harry Potter, I mean, after Jaws, I think I might say Metallica. I agree. Metallica Remastered number two. Okay. Are we going to be the same?
    12:06
    I don't know. Do you want to go next? Okay. My number three from this list is going to be Jurassic Park from Stern. I agree.
    12:21
    We didn't talk about this beforehand. No, we just came up with this. This is happening in real time. We didn't even know. We decided we were going to do this 15 minutes ago and just looked at the list. So this is just off the cuff, but I feel like we got Jaws number one, Metaka Remastered number two, Jurassic Park number three. What's your number four? My number four on this list is probably going to be, I'm going to say Monster Bash. Monster Bash, huh? Okay. I like that one. Okay. That's not going to be my number four. Okay. I haven't decided my number four yet, but it's not Monster Bash. I like playing that one. I have fun. It's a fun game. It is fun. I don't know. I mean, really, is it... Monster Bash is not my number four. I might say Godzilla. Godzilla number four. Yeah. Okay. And keep in mind, although I said a lot of these wouldn't be in my top ten, they are... Every game on this list is a good game. Oh, yeah. These are all very, very good games. Just most of them would not be in my in my top ten. All right. Well, we can do that next week. Okay.
    13:44
    So, Steph went Godzilla number four. I'm going to go with Iron Maiden. I was thinking that. As number four. But.
    13:56
    Okay. So, what's your number five? It's probably going to be Iron Maiden. Number six. I'll do my number six. Wait, what's your number five? Oh, I didn't do number five. Yours was Iron Maiden because Maiden was my four. So I have Jaws, Metallica, Jurassic Park, Iron Maiden. I'm going to go number five best, Godzilla. All right. All right. Six. So that's where we differ, Iron Maiden and Godzilla. Yeah, you can pick number six first. Number six is going to be Evil Dead.
    14:53
    I'm just looking at what's left here. If Evil Dead wasn't a wide body, I'd probably have it higher. I just don't love wide bodies. If it's a normal body, you could take out that hand thing on the left side and just make it normal width, then it'd probably be higher on this list.
    15:15
    I am going to say... It's dead air. I know. You gotta think quick. I am trying to think quick. You gotta think quick. I'm gonna say, I'm not saying, Evil Dead is great. Mm-hmm. It's great. There's so much greatness to overcome the fact that it's a wide body. I know. It's really great. I'm just trying to think like, I got Left, I got Harry Potter, Medieval Madness, Evil Dead, Attack from Mars, Monster Bash. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I'm probably going to go Evil Dead and then I get to pick number seven. Sure. I'm going to say I'm actually going to put Harry Potter there. You're putting Potter at seven. Yep. I'm going to go number seven, excuse me, Medieval Madness. Okay. Medieval Madness number seven. All right. Then I pick number eight. Wait. Hang on. I'm just, I'm playing. Oh, I'm hearing, I'm hearing things. Somebody breaking into our house. I don't know. I heard it too. I think it's the wind. It's very windy out, but it almost sounds like there's an intruder. All right. So you said medieval madness. We're going to keep on going. I'm going to say, I'm going to say Monster Bash. Okay. For eight. I will concur. Monster Bash number eight. Okay. Then you pick nine. Number nine, Attack from Mars. All right. That is a great game. I'm going to say Medieval Madness. You didn't have that one yet? No. So that leaves ten. What's your last one for ten? My last one for 10 is going to be Attack from Mars. Attack from Mars, number 10, rounding out the top 10. So for me, that leaves Harry Potter at number 10. So that's how we would re-rank them. It looks like we were very Keith Elwin heavy at the top. Well. But he makes great games. He does make great games. His games are great. And yeah he does make really great games And those are all solid like those are all fun games that The only one I really there three that I if I had to choose in let just say you doing a tournament and you have to pick games there just three on this list that I would not pick Like you wouldn't pick to play them? No. In a tournament? No. Well, I think there's a difference between the game being a good game and whether or not you'd pick it to play it. Well, I know. I'm just saying there's like three on here that I would... Which three would you not want to play on a tournament? I don't like playing Godzilla.
    18:21
    I used to feel that way, but now I'm on like a five-game win streak or something on Godzilla. I like playing it. I just don't like playing it in a tournament because most people are better than me on it. A lot of people are good at that game. So that one I don't really love playing in a tournament. I also feel that way. Well, I used to feel that way about Iron Maiden, but I kind of don't feel that way anymore. I just that one for me is like rush. I don't want to hear the music. Yeah, it's like I don't like Iron Maiden. I feel like Iron Maiden and maybe if you if you're listening, if you're if you play a lot of pinball. Well, Iron Maiden to me feels like a game that different examples of it, meaning like the one here versus the one over there versus the one over there at different locations, the playability in my ability to play that game varies so greatly from one Iron Maiden to the next. More than other games? More than other games. To me, it's like the most, just for me, like set up specific game in terms of like how good I'm going to be able to do on that game. Because there's some Iron Maidens like I cannot do anything. And then some of them I seem to like score really well consistently. And every game is like that. Yeah. Another one I would call out for that, like John Wick. Like, I'm really good on certain John Wick machines and really terrible at other ones. I think Iron Maiden for me the most- You've just noticed. Very challenging, like if it's not set up in a way that feels comfortable to me.
    20:13
    Stella agrees. She's like, don't worry, I'm here. She's like an emotional support animal. She's, I don't, I don't think she- But that's how we'd, how would you re-rank the top 10? Like you can't add anything in. You can't add anything. Yeah, if you had to reorder it, what would you do? What's your number one? And what's your number 10? That's really what I want to know. Yeah, what's your number one and what's your number 10? My number one's Jaws, my number 10's Harry Potter.
    20:43
    Your number one was Jaws, your number 10 was Attack from Mars. Yep. Attack from Mars, I really enjoy playing it. It's not one I would pick to play in a tournament because I struggle.
    20:54
    I feel like it just it doesn't. I don't know. I mean, it's like it's a great game out of all of these. I don't want to hit start again. I want to hit start on Harry Potter more.
    21:09
    Yeah, I don't. Well, I don't. That's why they make all of these different pinball machines. Yeah. And there's hundreds of other ones because you can continue down like 11 is Dune. Well, we're not going down there. No, but I'm just saying there's hundreds of other ones and thousands. That's why there are thousands. Yeah. And these are the top 10 chosen by the people that we've re-ranked. Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting that I guess, how long does it take for a game to get up there? Because like, where is Pokemon? I might not have enough reviews yet to be in there. Because I feel like it's very interesting how the new games always seem to get up there, but I'm saying that and I'm not seeing Fall of the Empire, people don't love it. Fall of the Empire is on the list, I think it's just down there pretty far. I'm pretty sure it's in the top 100. It's great. I'm not seeing the Walking Dead remastered. People don't love it. I think only us and like 20 other people bought that one. I love that game, The Walking Dead Remastered. It's great. Yeah, I don't know. Is Fall of the Empire on the top 100? It's gotta be. I might just have to look up the game. If it is, it's like way not up there very high. I like it. There are so many games on here that are not nearly as good as Fall of the Empire. Well, there's also a lot of really great games on here, but... The original Walking Dead is number 53.
    22:42
    Where is Star Wars Fall of the Empire rated? What the heck? I think the Fall of the Empire... Oh my god, like, if it is below 97, which is Guns and... oh, that's Data East. I thought it was the Jersey Jack Guns and Roses. I was gonna throw my phone across the room.
    23:04
    I think it is outside the top 100. The group of games like the Pro Premium LE is number 128. You people are crazy. People don't love it. People are crazy. I have not reviewed that one. I guess I need to review that one. Yeah, we've got to do our part. I think it's a great game. It's phenomenal. I think it got a little bit of a bad rap because it did the first ones did ship with the Death Star was not makeable. Yeah, it's fixed now. And that's a tough shot. And to have that shot always reject the ball would be pretty frustrating. That would be frustrating. So if you couldn't hit the Death Star and make the shot, I wouldn't put it in the top 100 either. But there is a fixed kit. The fixed kit works. You hit the Death Star, it's like 98% of the time if you hit it clean, it's going in the hole. Yeah. This is not my top 10. Looking at the top 100 is actually making me mad right now. Uh-huh. Is that why you're an emotional support animal? Because I'm getting mad. You're making the dog mad. If you're not watching on YouTube, Stella's getting in Stephanie's face. She's the same height as Marshall, but she's like a feather. Yeah, I think she weighs about half of what he weighs. I don't even understand it. She's got bird bones. So you're getting mad looking at the top 100 about games that aren't in the top 10? Yeah. I would have Fall of the Empire in the top 10. I would. We weren't going to talk about that. I know, but I'm just saying. I think I put King Kong up there. I mean, we're at 24 minutes. We got to fill some time. I couldn't believe Kong was not in there.
    25:00
    So pick three games that shock you to not be in the pin side top 10. Ripley's believe it or not. No, no, that does not shock me, but it does. It does shock me that Kong isn't in there. Yes. That shocks me. 100% agree. Is King Kong, here's a new topic, is King Kong the most underrated pinball machine of all time? You're just jumping topics. I'm just jumping topics because we've got like five more minutes. We've got to talk. Well, I thought you were going to pick a game that you're shocked that is not. King Kong. Well, I said that. Well, that's what I was thinking. That would be the number one. King Kong. I cannot believe it's not in the top 10. I can't believe that. It's better than Godzilla. It's better than Jurassic Park. It's better than Iron Maiden. I agree. If Kong was in the top 10, I would put it number two. After Jaws? Yeah. I agree. And I want one really bad. I want King Kong really bad. We don't have one. Well, trade something. I don't want to trade anything. Well, then... I want to acquire. It's just not in the cards right now. I want to acquire one. Not in the cards, bro. No, eventually. Maybe. Eventually. But that's fun re-ranking the things. Yeah. That's fun. The Kong kind of makes me mad. It number 20 That insane Wait let me double check that but I pretty sure it was number Did you look at it Okay so we didn put a whole bunch back up in there It number 20 That ridiculous It's after... And this is bullshit. Number 17 is Pirates of the Caribbean, Jersey Jack. No way. Bullshit. That game is a fucking mess. Yeah, it's expensive. It's rare. It's got a ton of stuff. It's got too much. There's a ton of stuff to do. It's wide-bodied, not fun to shoot.
    27:03
    It's pretty to look at. So you're trying to tell, it's beautiful to look at and like tons of cool stuff and mechs, but playing pinball, like actually shooting the game like Jersey Jack Pirates versus King Kong, get out of here. Get out of here. It's not even close. I can't believe that and James Bond, 24. Bond is a top 10 game. Period. Bond is a top 10 game. And I would put King Kong above Foo Fighters. Foo Fighters is number 19. Yes. Love Foo Fighters. Love the game. Own the game. Kong is better than Foo Fighters. And I love Foo Fighters. Yeah. Cactus Canyon is number 18. I would not put it in the top 10. Cactus Cannon, not a top 10 game. It's a great game, but not a top 10. Fantastic. But you know what? Better than Kong, and it's two positions higher than Kong.
    28:04
    Cactus Cannon, not better than King Kong. Yeah. No, King Kong is great. These people don't know. I think King Kong suffered from expectations versus what was delivered. And I was one of these, I was among people disappointed when I first saw King Kong and what it was. You didn't like the art? Well, because King Kong, the Stern King Kong is essentially an original theme.
    28:44
    Mm-hmm. It's their interpretation. It's their interpretation of a story. Of a story of King Kong, all new animations of a Kong that we've never seen before until this game. So I think myself and others were expecting a licensed title when you've heard of Stern's gonna do King Kong Pinball and he thought it's either gonna be those old classic movies or even one of the more modern movies but what you got was an original theme. So I think a lot of people were taken aback initially by that. I mean, it's still licensed. It's just not licensed of the films. Like the name is licensed because you have to license that name, but it is.
    29:31
    Nothing else in the game is like licensed, really. It's like their own drawings of a Kong that was created by the Stern people. It must have been an inexpensive license. Yeah, because you're basically using the name and like no other assets from anything.
    29:51
    But it seems like if you were, I don't know, so interesting. I wonder how much that was in comparison to some of the other titles. Yeah. Because it makes me feel like it probably wasn't inexpensive if you're going to put Keith Elwin on it. Right.
    30:09
    But what do I know? Who knows? I mean, we don't. There are people who know. But I think the facts of the matter is like because it's basically an unlicensed game, that's why it is rated where it is. Yeah, the art package? Yeah. Art package and lack of any assets from anything anybody has ever seen in their life. Yes. And the dog's barking. But no assets that anybody has any nostalgia for. No. So you stripped that away though, the game is exceptional. It's awesome. So you just have to kind of warm up to it. Yeah. After the initial shock of it not being what you were expecting it to be. Yeah, it seems like I don't know what the right move would have been in managing expectations on that when you launched it. It's hard because when people, it leaks, you know, that this is what they have. And everyone starts dreaming. And you can't come out and say before the game's announced, like, hey, we do have King Kong, but just so you know, it's not any King Kong you've ever seen before. I mean, they could say it is like a new King Kong world. Yeah. There are ways to say that. There are ways to say that, I guess.
    31:34
    But. King Kong, like through the imagination of the Stern Pinball. And I think it's, I think over time it's been a successful game. I know it's hard to, like when Tilt Amusements out here like sells his demo games from shows like the Kong pros especially go fast. Oh yeah. So I think it is becoming a popular game and I think it's going to be kind of a slow grower, much like James Bond was at the time, but I think the initial launch period really hurt Kong. It seems like maybe like the on these modern games, no matter the manufacturer, because the code changes so much once it starts being shipped. There's so many code changes. It almost seems like you got to wait to the codes finished. Yeah. Before making maybe Pinside shouldn't let anybody do anything to the codes finished. Yeah, no reviews until it's like to like .94 code or something. Okay, we can wrap this up here shortly, but I have a couple. We should write this down. I only have a pen. On your app. On your notes. Okay, what am I writing down? So I think for some future episode ideas, I'm going to put them out there right now. Okay. Look forward to these episodes in coming weeks. This is a teaser. Cliffhanger. So, five games that should be in the pin side top ten that aren't. So we have to kick five out and add five in. Okay. Number two, I've got two episodes for you. Because you just mentioned the early software code for the games. Mm-hmm. And I've seen this debated back and forth in a lot of pinball groups. Some people are like, you need to, You need to holler in at people that buy games brand new and like you need to stop giving them your money for a beta product and wait until the code is complete to buy it. So let's have a discussion in an episode about do you enjoy buying a game with early code and watching it grow or does it frustrate you? Should the games launch with more complete code? You know, let's talk about that. Okay. I have some opinions on that. I'm sure you do. Yeah. Stella does too. Okay. What else you got? That's all I got. I got those two episodes. Okay. If you like those topics. Yeah, they sound great. Okay. What do you think? Let us know in the comments below if you want to hear those two topics. If you say no, we won't do it, but I think they would be fun topics. Also, I'm curious here, number one, number 10, or the full list, but at least like number one, number 10, comment below. Send Mike an email at mike at livefromtherockroom.com. Yeah, tell me how wrong I am.
    34:51
    That's fine. And say goodbye to Stella because she's going home in about a half hour. Oh, Stella. Marshall's so exhausted. He's over there sleeping on the chair. She's younger than him. She's kind of run him ragged the last couple days. He needed it. Yeah. He loves her though. Yeah. So we're going to wrap this up and go edit it and mix it. Put it out tomorrow. Put it out for you tomorrow. For you. Okay. That's all we got. Toodaloo. Bye.