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Episode 49 - Cinnamon Hands Only Please

Special When Lit·podcast_episode·53m 23s·analyzed·Apr 23, 2019
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.031

TL;DR

Deep Root teaser hype, American Pinball momentum, and pinball etiquette discussions.

Summary

Ken Cromwell and Bill discuss Deep Root Pinball's Raza teaser video (with Pripyat/Chernobyl-inspired nuclear theme), American Pinball's progress shipping Oktoberfest and developing games 3-5, Jersey Jack's Willy Wonka reveal and streaming strategy, and optimal announcement-to-delivery timelines (both favor 90 days). The episode concludes with a "Drain It or Save It" segment on lock stealing mechanics and playing pinball while sick.

Key Claims

  • Deep Root Pinball released a teaser video for Raza on YouTube, uploaded in March

    high confidence · Ken Cromwell mentions the teaser video for Raza being out on YouTube and notes it was uploaded in March

  • American Pinball has shipped 30-40 Oktoberfest units to operators and dealership venues

    high confidence · Ken cites Josh Kugler interview on Canada's Pinball Podcast stating 30-40 pins shipped

  • American Pinball is actively working on games 3, 4, and 5 simultaneously

    high confidence · Ken references Josh Kugler's statement that they are working on game three, four, and to a certain extent game five

  • Jersey Jack Pinball shot for a 60-day release window from Willy Wonka reveal to shipping

    high confidence · Ken states 'Jack said the goal was to try to get these games shipping within 60 days of reveal' referring to Jack Wichary

  • Willy Wonka will have 5,000 limited edition units and 250 collector editions

    high confidence · Ken lists production tiers: standard, 5,000 limited editions, and 250 collector editions

  • American Pinball is discussing manufacturing partnership with Kingpin/American Pinball to produce their machines

    medium confidence · Ken mentions Josh Kugler said they've 'talked to the Kingpin guys at some shows about potentially maybe getting involved in doing manufacturing'

  • Raza is supposed to be one of Deep Root Pinball's first releases from Texas

    high confidence · Ken introduces Raza as 'supposed to be one of the first releases by Deep Root Pinball out of Texas'

  • American Pinball originally revealed Oktoberfest in October 2018 at Pinball Expo

    high confidence · Ken states 'Oktoberfest originally in 2018, and it was in October at Pinball Expo'

  • The ideal announcement-to-delivery window for pinball games is 60-90 days before community interest wanes

Notable Quotes

  • “I could tell by the teaser that the pinball machine's gonna have some issues already”

    Bill @ early in episode — Bill predicts Deep Root will have quality/execution issues based solely on the teaser video, reflecting community skepticism about the manufacturer

  • “They've made it past Big Lebowski. They've made it past Alien and all these other kind of milestones.”

    Ken @ mid-episode — Ken uses industry reference points to argue American Pinball has proven itself can deliver multiple games, unlike manufacturers that failed after one release

  • “If it's three months... I'll wait for somebody to unbox one, and then I'll take one of those”

    Bill @ mid-episode — Bill expresses willingness to buy secondary market rather than pre-order if delivery takes too long, indicating how long delays kill new-in-box sales

  • “I think where the difference was in that stream was that you were really able to kind of sit down and have more of a one-on-one approach, like an intimate approach with the design team.”

    Ken @ mid-episode — Ken contrasts Jersey Jack's controlled office stream with chaotic public reveals, suggesting curated manufacturer-hosted streams deliver better information

  • “I just think that some people would benefit more by not seeing is believing.”

    Ken @ late-episode — Ken reflects on the NDA problem: pre-release enthusiasm can set unrealistic expectations for consumers, better to let the machine speak for itself

  • “If you're a competitive pinball player, lock all those balls... But for me, I'm not a good enough player to steal and stuff like that, so I'm biased.”

    Bill @ final segment — Bill reveals how skill level affects game mechanic preferences, illustrating the tension between casual and competitive player design

  • “If I'm sick, I don't go anywhere because I don't like the idea of spreading that or giving that to someone.”

    Bill @ final segment — Bill prioritizes community health over social/event attendance, revealing pinball community etiquette norms

Entities

Ken CromwellpersonBillpersonJosh KuglerpersonJack WicharypersonEric MeunierpersonChris KavalarispersonRob BurkepersonDeep Root Pinballcompany

Signals

  • ?

    product_launch: Jersey Jack Pinball conducted manufacturer-hosted office stream of Willy Wonka with design team present, contrasting with earlier public venue streams. This controlled approach allowed better Q&A and was perceived as more credible by community.

    high · Ken details the office stream with Eric Meunier and staff, comparing it favorably to Buffalo Pinball's 12,000-person public stream

  • ?

    announcement: Deep Root Pinball released a teaser video for Raza on YouTube, featuring nuclear/post-apocalyptic carnival theme inspired by Pripyat/Chernobyl. Video was uploaded in March (timing unclear if newly public or previously private).

    high · Ken and Bill discuss the teaser video at length; Ken notes March upload date and questions visibility timeline

  • ?

    product_strategy: Hosts debate optimal announcement-to-delivery window: Bill favors 60 days, Ken favors 90 days. Both agree that beyond 90 days, consumer interest drops as other manufacturers release competing titles.

    high · Extended discussion with specific examples (Munsters, Black Knight Sword of Rage); Ken canceled Munsters pre-order after missing 90-day window

  • ?

    business_signal: American Pinball discussed potential manufacturing partnership with Kingpin (American Pinball) to produce additional pinball machines, signaling capacity to expand beyond own game development.

    medium · Ken states Josh Kugler mentioned talks with 'Kingpin guys' at shows about manufacturing involvement

  • ?

    product_launch: Jersey Jack's Willy Wonka structured in three tiers: Standard (unlimited), Limited Edition (5,000 units), Collector Edition (250 units). Operators and locations prioritized for early shipping before home collectors.

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.160

0:00
coming at you out of st charles illinois the special when lit pinball podcast starts now hey what's going on pinball land and welcome to episode number 49 of the special when lit pinball podcast my name is ken cromwell and i am bill uh bill uh we are episode 49 what's going on with you buddy nothing man it's just uh after easter and uh you know had the family over and my nephew to play some pinball, which was a good time. What about you? You had the kids over playing on your collection. How did that go? Good. They used Wizard of Oz, the real nice fancy glass for a cup holder. I thought it was good times. Oh, yeah, the Invisiglass, right? Yeah, the wife gave them popsicles, too, to bring downstairs. No, I'm kidding. Oh, I was like, oh, my gosh. Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I don't know if I was mad at you, mad at your wife, mad at the kids. That would sound horrible. No, no, no, no, no. No, it went off without a hitch. All right. But we'll get further into that later. Good, good. So what about Ken? What's good with Ken? Nothing, man. Steady the course here, so nothing really to report. I did want to just kind of talk a little bit about a few things today. First of all, there's a Deep Root teaser video for Raza that is kind of out and about, and you can catch it on YouTube. We can maybe try to link to that in the show. So Raza is Retro Atomic Zombie Adventure Land, and it's supposed to be one of the first releases by Deep Root Pinball out of Texas. Bill, did you get a chance to see that teaser? I know you did because you sent it to me. I did. I was actually kind of enthralled by it, man. It looked – here. It seemed kind of campy. You were enthralled by the teaser video. I was actually like, damn, this actually looks kind of cool. I like that stuff. You know, like those creepy kind of games. and uh i could tell by the teaser that the pinball machine's gonna have some issues already uh no kidding me oh my mouth was dropped i'm like how could you tell that man i mean was there like hey images nothing surprises me at this point but uh keep going i didn't mean to cut you off no but you know what though honestly with the premise of what it seems like the backstories that it's gonna have is uh you know nuclear um did you catch the backslide and yeah on top of a Cemetery? Defunct carnival or amusement land on top of an old burial site. Yeah. I thought it was kind of creepy and cool. It was kind of like Chernobyl.
2:29

medium confidence · Bill states '60 days' is pinnacle; Ken prefers '90 days' and notes that beyond 90 days means other manufacturers have released new games making the original feel 'old news'

American Pinball
company
Jersey Jack Pinballcompany
Razagame
Oktoberfestgame
Willy Wonkagame
Munstersgame
Black Knight Sword of Ragegame
Wizard of Ozgame
Getawaygame
Pirates of the Caribbeangame
Stern Pinballcompany
Pinball Expoevent
Canada's Pinball Podcastorganization
LeRmods.comcompany
Steve Beattyperson
Jeffperson

high · Ken details production tier strategy and acknowledges business logic of location placement before home delivery

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: American Pinball's progress shipping Oktoberfest (30-40 units) and simultaneously developing games 3-5 signals recovery from earlier launch issues. Hosts express cautiously positive outlook despite past delays.

    high · Ken notes they've 'made it past Big Lebowski, past Alien and other milestones'; both acknowledge company has capital and direction to continue

  • ?

    product_concern: Bill expresses skepticism that Deep Root will face execution issues on Raza based solely on the teaser video quality, reflecting historical community doubt about the manufacturer's ability to deliver.

    medium · Bill states 'I could tell by the teaser that the pinball machine's gonna have some issues already' (unexplained intuition)

  • ?

    content_signal: Ken reflects that pre-release enthusiasm under NDA constraints can set unrealistic consumer expectations. Plans to refrain from sharing pre-release opinions to avoid painting false mental pictures.

    high · Ken discusses how vague pre-release praise can disappoint consumers expecting more than delivered; vows to wait until public reveal

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Lock stealing mechanic debate reveals split between casual and competitive player preferences. Casual players favor advantageous rule variance; competitive players prefer mechanical consistency (Getaway-style retention).

    medium · Bill drains lock stealing due to skill level bias; Ken saves it for casual/multiplayer advantage; discussion of Pirates of the Caribbean plundering as similar mechanic

  • ?

    community_signal: Discussion of pinball night hygiene norms: hosts establish that sick players should not attend shared venues; hand sanitizer and wipes encouraged; pizza-eating players warned against contaminating machines.

    high · Extended segment on not spreading illness, hand hygiene, and specific reference to Jeff (This Week in Pinball) carrying hand sanitizer

    • Well, the whole thing is kind of like this animated teaser. And if the animations are anything like we saw in the teaser video, I think that's going to be pretty awesome to be able to see that on an LCD or whatever the heck Deep Root might be thrown into pinball machines. And again, it's a teaser video, but I think it's exciting to talk about simply because we haven't heard anything from Deep Root in a while. And now to see something that's out there is interesting. The one thing that I did notice, though, was on that YouTube video, it looked like it was uploaded in March. So I'm wondering if that was set to private for a while and just recently got turned over to public or if it's just been sitting out there and nobody's been talking about it. I find that hard to believe. You know what? And I have to clarify because I said Chernobyl. It's actually Prypryat. That's the town next to Chernobyl where a lot of the people that worked at Chernobyl worked. That actually had an affair going on a week after the nuclear meltdown in Chernobyl. And they had all these brand new amusement parks. And if you ever look at Chernobyl, you'll see this bumper car thing that's never been used and this Ferris wheel. And it really kind of reminded me of that creepiness. It is very creepy, man. Like when you watch the documentaries and whatnot on the fallout and everything that happened with that nuclear meltdown. And I'm kind of a history buff. Not buff, but I'm very intrigued by the history of a lot of that stuff and how stuff happened. So that was really interesting to see their take on this. I didn't get a creepy vibe from the pin, though. I got kind of a fun, campy kind of retro vibe. Nothing that was like, oh, I don't want to play this with the lights out. It just seems like it's more of a humorous, fun approach to that type of a theme. Yeah, and we're not all about nuclear meltdowns or anything. No, no, no. I'm educated by that. It's given the opportunity. We would pass on nuclear meltdowns or partial meltdowns like Fukushima or Three Mile Island. But, yeah, overall, you know, Bill, you're watching a lot of History Channel there. You know what? Honestly, yeah. I mean, that's why, you know, like the whole nuclear thing and it just really reminded me of Prypariat, the town next to Chernobyl. Remember, we were discussing maybe doing a, like, hidden history podcast on the side. Remember, we had brought that up. You had brought that up. Yeah. Well, I really like history. Yeah, you do. But, yeah, you know, going back to the video, I thought it was really cool. The animations looked cool. Now, in all honesty, I just want to see the teaser. Yeah. I mean, let's see it. Again, we haven't seen anything from Deep Root. So to have anything out there is you would hope that that's there not to just keep people interested and still expect it to be far away. But I think it said 2019 we should see this thing. So we'll see. Right. Hopefully soon. So looking forward to get a chance to catch Josh Kugler. He was interviewed by Chris Calouris on Canada's Pinball Podcast. A little bit. Okay. I thought it was interesting. Josh, I thought, did a really good job, and I thought Kaneda did a really good job. It was a really good interview trying to figure out what the heck's going on with Oktoberfest. And I think just a couple bullet points, the Oktoberfest line is up and running, which I think is nice, obviously. They have, I think you said, 30 or 40 pins that have shipped and are in the wild at this point. Most of those games have gone to, like, operators or to, like, dealership venues where they have those things on display. but it's nice to know that the line is set up and they're going. He also commented on they are actively working on game number three right now, also number four, and to a certain extent game number five is being worked on. What are your thoughts on that? It's real hard to tell because of the past of what has happened with reveals and whatnot. And not that I think that ill intentions or anything. I think when they showed the game in October that they really wanted to get it out faster and stuff like that. So I'm just really hoping that now that they've, you know, sort of gained some perspective on what it takes to have a successful launch and, you know, get things out in the wild and theme. I know some people weren't crazy about theme for a while, but, I mean, I think they are a good company and would like to see them succeed. And I'm really curious to see what they're working on next. I mean, because let's think about it. Well, Josh, he said he's very excited about working on game number three right now. So I'm thinking to myself, like, what theme excites Josh? You know what I mean? Like, I don't know him on a super personal level. I don't really know what makes him go. But if he's passionate about it, what were the three themes? It was Robin Hood, Valkyries, and Sherlock Holmes. Like, those were the three speculated themes based on, you know, IPs or that they had kind of tried to register. I think there was one more, too. Okay, those are the three that I remember. Yeah, yeah. So if it's one of those three, I mean, do you have a favorite? I think we might have discussed this. Yeah, we did. Sherlock Holmes. But let me twist this back on you, okay? So I'm going to give you my perspective on this. So how many companies have we seen come to market with one game, and they couldn't get one game out? Oh, I agree. I agree. So, I mean, they've gotten Houdini out, and they've gotten a decent amount out. To a certain extent, they got the Magic Girls out. Now, they weren't fully functioning machines as they probably would have intended, but again, I think a lot of that – process and getting that done. But you're right. I mean, that's water under the bridge at that point. There's no sense in steering the ship back that way. So Houdini came out. So you had the Houdini, which came out. You have Oktoberfest, which is on the line and getting shipped out and, you know, still have pre-orders for. So, I mean, dude, let's look at it this way. They've made it past Big Lebowski. They've made it past Alien and all these other kind of milestones. Well, not Alien yet, because Alien was the second game from Highway Pinball. But, I mean, it seems like they're on the right track, and they are trying to move forward, and they have the capital to keep going. Yeah. So it seems like they can afford to make a few mistakes and still keep going. I think you're right, right? I mean, we've seen that everything has not gone smoothly for them, and they haven't disappeared into the night. And, in fact, they're not planning just Game 3 before Game 2 has shipped, but Games 4 and Game 5. It looks like they've got the confidence of financial backing, and they've got direction in the company and they feel confident within themselves, that instills confidence in me because they have not asked for pre-order dollars for any of these pinball machines. And with Oktoberfest, again, was a theme that was puzzling for some. Again, I always kind of was appealing to me was that theme of Oktoberfest. So, you know, I'm hoping that the game just gets rolling. Now, Josh did say, and I don't want to recap the whole interview, because if you want to hear this interview, it was really well done. Go to Canada's Pinball Podcast. Look at the Josh Coogler interview. Check that out. But Josh did say they are still at their original office or their manufacturing place, which is in Streamwood, Illinois. They're waiting to make that move. And once they make that move, I would assume that they'll be able to set up multiple lines. He also said that they are excited about the possibility of manufacturing some other pins. They've talked to the Kingpin guys at some shows about potentially maybe getting involved in doing manufacturing for those pinball machines. So American Pinball is something that intrigues me because, to your point, they've done it. They are still doing it, and I'm wondering how far they will ultimately go when all is said and done. And it seems like they're trying to spread their line on different things that they can produce. So, I mean, I think they've got a good grasp on it.
    9:42
    It's really going to be just a time will tell. But, I mean, honestly, with, like, Balser and Coogler there, I mean, I like both of them. And Schober's there. I mean, another guy that's qualified to do code. But again, and we bring it up that it was revealed, Oktoberfest originally in 2018, and it was in October at Pinball Expo out here. Josh goes on to say, hey, listen, maybe we did kind of get it out there a little bit earlier than we should have. But hey, we were trying to support this local show. We were trying to support everything that Rob Burke was doing. And we wanted to bring that show to Expo. So I appreciate that whole aspect of it. But let me ask you this. And we may have touched on this in the past. You've got October. So December, January, February, March, and April. We're five months outside of Expo. Games are just now starting to ship. They haven't really hit consumers as far as being in their homes. We're not seeing unboxing videos yet. When is too long from announcement to home delivery for a pinball release? Here, when something is being shown, being on the line is like the best thing. If not, you know, no more than like 60 days because, you know, people, I think, have patience for up to about 60 days. 60 days? Yeah. Okay. I think that's kind of the pinnacle, maybe 90. That's where I'm at. I'm at 90. 90 is like pushing it, but yeah. Because this is my thing. 90 days, it's three months, it's a quarter of the year, and most likely other manufacturers have released games since your last release, and then you don't feel like you're getting anything new at that point. Like, you're already old news. So, I mean, I think that does play a role in some people's heads. Obviously, if it's a pin that you're looking for and something that you're passionate about owning, the wait can take six months, eight months, 12 months, even 18 months. But for me, that 90-day period is where I start getting a little disappointed that I don't own the game that i have put money down on or uh that i'm anticipating since it was announced it's 90 days for me let's look at the turn cycle of uh stern here right so monsters was uh dropped in like january mid-january right yeah and they just came out with uh black knight sword of rage so you're talking 90 days so if you're putting money down and you don't have another game in 90 days and you're still waiting for the one that's already now kind of old yeah but you know what And again, this is where it's interesting because when Munsters was announced, I put an order in for Munsters with the distributor. Now, because I didn't put an order in like the day it was announced, I was on the second run of pros. And what had happened was January goes by, February goes by. Crickets. And then I'm expecting this second run of pros happened in March. March goes by. The premiums weren't out yet. So I was like, all right, now I'm at 90 days almost. I lost interest and I canceled my order because there were other things that came out. And I don't know if they ever filled the second run of pros. I mean, you never have to wonder if that's going to be reran. It's absolutely going to be. Yeah, they'll take care of you. You're going to get your game. I lost interest in owning the game. And it's not because I don't think it's a good game. It's because now there are other things that I've been exposed to. And you know what? Is it possible I will lose interest in these things? Potentially. But again, for me, it was 90 days. If it's three months. Well, let's be honest. I'll wait to get a used one, to be honest with you, Bill. I'll wait for somebody to unbox one, and then I'll take one of those that I know is all set up and there aren't any play field issues. Yeah, and they just unbox it, and you're like, well, that's it. Right. So part of the new unbox it is being the first to own that, to kind of brag a little bit and be the first kid on the block with the shiny new toy. I get to enjoy it for longer than somebody else. But if I'm waiting three months, please open that and please sell it to me because I will let you take the new unbox it. Yeah, we'll pass it along to you. Does that make sense? Oh, yeah. But you know what? To reiterate, though, with Munsters, it's not that we didn't like the game. It just you know one of the big things about doing that was we really wanted to have a kick stream of playing it with everybody and you know because of how that all panned out Which game Munsters Oh yeah Munsters Right. And because of how that all panned out, we weren't able to do, you know, fulfill what we had originally planned and wanted to do. Right. You know, it was unfortunate. You're right. And it sucked, but, you know, I mean, we can't go there and hijack a pinball machine. No, and I mean, we're not going to be given any type of leeway or privileges. Yeah, no. I mean, we're a consumer. We're a pitball consumer. And it really came down to I just didn't order mine on time. And even though it was still early on in the order process, I was already outside of the window for the first run of pros. And I just missed out. So it is what it is. I'm not mad. I'm sure I'll own a Munsters at some point. I'll just pay a little bit less than I would have if I would have ordered it new in box. So no big deal. No harm, no foul on that one. So, I mean, but speaking of, like, revealed games, obviously Willy Wonka's been out. Really? Yeah. Jersey Jack came out. I must have missed that. No, it's there. It's this brand-new game by Jersey Jack Pinball. I wanted to comment, Jersey Jack Pinball did their first kind of official stream from JJP Bensonville, Illinois, and they did it out of Eric Minier's office, and there were staff there, and they kind of were able to kind of walk through the game at a more controlled approach, I think, and they were able to really answer a lot of questions in chat. Did you get a chance to check that stream out at all? I would be lying if I said I did. Okay, that's okay. But you know what, so I'm going to shoot from the hip here even though I didn't see it, but just going off of the things that I know about the stream, you know this, it was a controlled environment. You didn't have a machine that wasn't set up properly, and you have people that know the game being able to shoot it and explain it. So I'm sure that that was probably the best stream of that game that has happened because it's just been well portrayed in the proper environment and the proper people playing it, not just somebody that doesn't know a thing about it shooting it. Yeah, I mean, there's some of that. I think where the difference was in that stream was that you were really able to kind of sit down and have more of a one-on-one approach, like an intimate approach with the design team. So there were answered questions that might have been missed because that Buffalo Pinball stream was hugely popular. And, I mean, you're not going to be able to monitor 12,000 people in chat. It's just not possible. No. No, and I think that was more just a reveal that, hey, this is what's coming, which was good. Right. I mean, that was a great stream for that purpose. When I saw that the pinball was being streamed, I was excited because I'm like, this is another opportunity for people to get kind of another look on a stream, again, which I don't think is the ideal way to do that, but we all know my feelings on that. But it did seem like a lot of people, after having a second look and kind of collecting their thoughts, did walk away from the stream with, again... greater appreciation for the game yeah absolutely and i think that was beneficial now where i wanted to ask you this though bill is if you're jersey jack pinball and you have that initial stream that was at launch and then you have this follow-up stream that had happened how often do you stream willy wonka to keep it interesting without over flooding the streaming of the machine where it's just not fun to flip on your own at that point i don't know i would say maybe every two to three weeks for when you update the code and do something fun and say hey listen so here's something new that we added to this game check it out you know so we are in april so by standards for me for it to still be interesting for me to want to own new inbox we we would have middle of may middle of june so by middle of july these should start showing up in people's homes i would i would hope i think jack said the goal was to try to get and that's jack whenary the uh founder of jersey Jack Pinball. He was shooting for trying to get these games shipping within 60 days of reveal. So if that's the case, you're looking at sometime in the middle of June where they start trickling out. The standard version of the game will go out first, and that's going to be followed by the limited editions where there are 5,000, and then the collector editions, which I think it's 250, that will be available. So again, to keep me interested, I hope to be real close to inception there in that middle of July on the LE. Now, I got standards in front of me, right? Yeah, but you know what, though? I'm going to say this, though. I mean, you were probably one of the first people to have your order in on that game, though. That is true, right? A week early. That is true. So at that point, I'm hoping that, I mean, obviously I know they have to kind of fulfill the distributors and the operators need to get those games because it has to be on location in order to drive new sales. Not livelihood, but I mean, that's a profit.
    17:48
    Right. I mean, it makes sense. If you've got Willy Wonka in my basement, yeah, sure, I might have 20, 30 people that come over and play it in the first month. But if it's on location somewhere, you're looking at maybe 200, 300 people that walk up to that machine in the first month. Or 1,000, depending on the location. Right, exactly. So I do understand from a business standpoint, that's how you're going to increase the exposure of your pinball machine. So I can't be mad about that. Yeah, I still suggest people get in front of that game. Yeah, absolutely. And it'll happen. It'll happen. I think the one thing that I kind of took away when I look at this now in like a more just relaxed attitude about it is I probably think it's in the best interest of anybody involved for me to refrain from sharing any opinions or thoughts on the actual game until that game is revealed. Because what really occurred to me is that by me trying to explain my thoughts and somebody not knowing anything as to what to expect, there was like a blank canvas. and by me trying to paint a picture in somebody's head but purposely having to be vague because of an NDA. Yeah, a color portrait with black and white. Right. I think what happens is it's only natural that somebody takes the phrases that I said and they concoct this thing in their head, right? And then when it's displayed, if it's not holding up to what they anticipated based on a blank canvas, your first feeling is like, well, that's not what I anticipated. so i think for me my approach now will just be i don't want to uh set expectations for somebody based on uh on my personal feelings on machine i'm just gonna lay back and let the machine be revealed and then i'm happy to share all my thoughts and that way i'm not getting anybody uh ruffled out there yeah but you know what though i i understand where you're coming from the thing is that you and i do both believe in this game and there's no doubt i do so you know what i mean i i agree with what you're saying but you know what i mean in hindsight would we Would I change anything? I don't think so. Yeah. And again, and I'll just say I'm not taking anything back that I said. So I'm not like backtracking and apologizing for anything that I said. I just think that some people would benefit more by not seeing is believing. Right. Exactly. And not listening to me be excited about something and then put something in your head and then potentially be let down because that shouldn't be the case on this pin. So absolutely get out to a show and play it if you can. And we'll leave it at that. But how about we do this? How about we shift a little gears here and we play a little Drain It or Save It.
    20:14
    It's time for this week's edition of Drain It or Save It. All right, Bill. Drain It or Save It is brought to you by Lermods.com, and they are offering you custom quality playfield mods and lighting for your pinball machine. It's L-E-R-M-O-D-S. Visit Lermods.com today. All right, so the first item we have for discussion on Drain It or Save It, for those of you that might not know how this segment works we bring up a topic three topics if we agree with it and we like it we will save the topic and if we disagree or we don't care for it we drain the topic just a little conversation and it's a little bit more of like a lightning round are you ready yep first item up is lock stealing and that is a pinball machine that allows you to lock balls for a multi-ball but if you don't complete the multi-ball on your turn and any balls that you had locked will be transferred and potentially be stolen by the next player in line. Bill, lock stealing, drain it or save it? I think it's an interesting concept.
    21:12
    I guess I'm old school, so I'm going to say drain it because I still think of it like a getaway. But that's just me, not saying it's right or wrong. What are you thinking about getaway? So getaway, you're able to lock the balls up on the top right ramp or wire form. and even if the player that was player two comes in and they lock all three, the ones that were in the lock get launched, but the first player doesn't lose their balls. Instead of coming off the wire form down to the right flipper, they just come out of the shooter area. Okay. So I like that a little better. Okay. I'm not a good enough player to steal and stuff like that, so I'm biased. So you're going to drain it. I am going to drain that. Okay. I'm going to save lock stealing. And I think the simple reason is this. If you're a competitive pinball player, lock all those balls, right, and then take your multi-ball. But for me, I'm not playing with a lot of competitive pinball players, and where I might not be able to complete that lock, I'm happy to take a little advantage of somebody else's hard work. And I will absolutely take a ball after somebody's locked it. Absolutely I will. I mean, that's just fine. The other thing is this. I think, and it's kind of a side note, but lock stealing is fun as if I'm playing with somebody that I know might not be up to my caliber, where I can purposely lock a couple balls, leave that last shot intentionally for that person that's not as good as I am to get that shot and experience that multi-ball. Like your daughter or family that wouldn't normally be able to get three balls locked? Yeah, right, exactly. But I think it's all in good fun, and it goes into plundering and things like you see on Pirates of the Caribbean, an Eric Menier's game where you can steal somebody's turn. I mean, you could steal their points. I played a game of Pirates with Eric at Jersey Jack in Bensonville, and it wasn't enjoyable. I was plundered on several occasions. But I still appreciate for what it is. So lock ceiling, I'm going to save it. The second item is going to be, and this one's kind of interesting. So we'll see how we both kind of react to this. And that is this. It's playing pinball with your friends or family while you are currently fighting a cold. So let me paint the picture for you, Bill. You're a little under the weather. Okay. You've been a little bit maybe sneezing and coughing, and you've got some raspiness and some congestion. So essentially, the picture you're painting for me is like the bubonic plague is going through your house. Well, it doesn't even have to be anything that crazy, but you've got the sniffles. You're not 100%. It's pinball night, okay? So it's like a Thursday night or a Friday night. You look forward to this night all week. Maybe we're going over to Steve Beattie's, but you're just feeling kind of like garbage, but you're kind of coming out of the woods. Do you go there and play pinball? Do you save it? Or do you just not put yourself in that position and drain it? Drain it, save it, or drain it, stay at home, don't spread the wealth. Drain it. Yeah, I don't like that. Yeah, if I'm sick, I don't go anywhere because I don't like the idea of spreading that or giving that to someone.
    24:10
    That kind of drives me nuts, man. And then someone comes over and they're not feeling well. Dude, 10 minutes later, you're wiping everything down with alcohol.
    24:19
    You think I'm kidding. You're pouring beers all over your machine. Yeah, I'm not like Jeff. Or rubbing alcohol. Rubbing alcohol, yeah, not beer. I'm not quite as bad as Jeff from This Week in Pinball.
    24:30
    Jeff is awesome. He's got the hand sanitizer normally on him. But, yeah, you know what? I drain that. Don't come over if you're sick. I won't go by your place. Let's not share the wealth. It works both ways for you. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I'm going to drain it too. And I've been in a position where I really looked forward to something and I knew it wasn't 100%. And I maybe wasn't completely sure. We've even had this like podcasting, right? Oh, yeah. Where it's like, man, do we really want to get in the same room just in case? So, I mean, there's like an ultra level of concern because nothing would make me feel worse than knowing that I might have not even potentially got somebody sick during pinball night. But if they got sick after I was sick, there's no way to prove that I was guilty or not. And what are we doing, right? We're all sitting down and our hands, which are probably some of the more accessible things while you're sick that path germs around. Oh, yeah. You're pressing flipper buttons. Your hands are on these lockdown bars. So, I mean, it's easy transmittal of germs. So I don't know that I'm a germophobe, but I absolutely try to contain the germs. So, right. If you're not feeling well, don't come to my house for pinball night. And if I'm not feeling well, I won't go to your house. And if you have pizza on pinball night, you wash your hands before jumping on someone's machine. Oh, yeah. Okay. That's a whole thing, right? bothers the snot out of me. You ever get the guy that's eating pizza and it's all greasy and you're like, oh man, this guy's got to watch his hands. And then he licks his fingers and then he presses start. And you're just like, dude, I'm selling the machine. Well, no, that's just when I replace the side rails and flipper buttons. That's when I replace my friend that licked his fingers after pizza. That guy's not allowed down here. I've had that happen. That's disgusting, man. That's gross.
    26:02
    That's why hand sanitizers and wipes should be on all four walls of your basement and just encourage people to go home with dried out skin. because it's just gross. But you've been to my house. All right, so for anyone that hasn't been to my house on pinball night, I have a bathroom that is readily accessible. It's like 15 feet away. Yeah. And I've got some Rockstar hand soap that's $12 a bottle that your hands will smell like cinnamon,
    26:28
    just to make sure that you want to keep your hands clean. And I know why it smells like cinnamon. It's because you like to casually sniff people's fingers throughout the night to see if they been washing their hands right You can get a waft if somebody been washing Yeah because when they walk by and they like what up You know their hand waves You like wafting the air into your nose You like oh cinnamon that guy all right That guy's cool. He's invited back. Yeah, he smells like pizza grease. This guy's out. Yeah, so all right. So I'm also draining the playing pinball with your buddies while fighting a code. Lastly, trough lighting mods. And those are essentially LED strips that go in between the flippers towards the back in the trough to kind of illuminate the ball-draining area. Drain it or save it, Bill? Go ahead. I'm going to save it on certain games. I think certain games would really lend well to it. Like, I know Waz is kind of dark down there and some others.
    27:16
    Is it for every game? I don't know if it's for every game, but I think it's definitely a nice addition on certain games. Yeah, I would agree. I'm going to save this, too. I think when you really think about a pinball machine, I think your eyes are really focused in that flipper area so often. To have any type of complementary lighting down there is important for me. So I do like trough lighting, and to your point, assuming a machine's not overly lit and I haven't run into too many machines that are too lit up, to have that trough lighting mod, I do like having that in there. So I'm going to save that, too. So when you have a playfield that's lit pretty consistently throughout the playfield, and then you go down, you're looking down towards the flippers, and it's kind of dimly lit, that throws your eyes off, and it throws your shots off. In my opinion, am I a great pinball player? Absolutely not. I can build a cabinet. I love seeing how I drain it too, man. Yeah. When that ball goes right down the middle, I like to be able to track that all the way down. It's like a good hitter is going to track that ball all the way to the catcher's mitt. That's me as a pinball man. I'm going to watch that ball go all the way down to the back of the trough. Okay, but if you have your machine set on a little steeper than like 6 1⁄2 or like 7 1⁄2, or my buddy Joe F., we used to have Terminator on a 2x4 extended all the way. So, I mean, it was just, you know, the flippers were as rebuilt as they could be and whatever. um but uh you know literally that thing would sometimes come down and then bounce back up hit the kick back and launch back into play um you know for anyone that thinks i'm a liar we can give you joe's uh information yeah so he can verify this but uh have you ever seen that or no yeah no absolutely okay so you know and most people walk away once it goes past the flippers so yeah save save the trough light all right so in a little recap here on drain it or save it brought to you by LureMods.com. We had lock stealing. Bill drained the lock stealing. I saved the lock stealing. Playing pinball with your buddies while dying from a cold. We both get ahead and drained that. Please stay out of our houses. We will stay out of yours. And trough lighting mods. We're both in agreement that those are absolutely beneficial. So we're going to save that. So that's this week's edition of Drain It or Save It. And before we go anywhere else, Zach Many is messaging me. Hopefully, he says, hopefully you're still recording and you can take a look at this dick pic. but there's no pick i think that was in retaliation i think i accidentally messaged him last week and he was recording on this week in baseball or this week in baseball that's see that's how much time from around the league so he literally he he does we can pinball this week and pinball and this week in baseball so it's great right right he's like the uh the mel allen of uh pinball is uh zach many so yep so i'm pretty sure that was in a little retaliation nicely played zach i don't know how you know what i'm recording but the eye is in the sky so yeah but he's offended both of us now so now it's now it's home getting the news from around the industry in this week's industry buzz so joining us on this edition of industry buzz we have the creator of pinball supernova his name lee will golynski aka lee doves lee doves joining us online lee what's going on man how are you hey guys how are you thanks for having me i appreciate it oh thanks for joining us you know what thanks for having me it's great let's start by explaining to everybody that's listening who is lee who are you lee is a person uh who started pinball supernova probably about five years ago something like that and um i don't know i just wanted to make a um like a channel a pinball channel of videos uh blog post a website just to help people out in the hobby of how to fix things or uh reviews of mods just to kind of i was kind of like the week the this week in pinball before this week in pinball happened oh there we go like like basically what i would do is kind of um post just subject matter like just on a on one subject matter you know could be multiple ones but i didn't take everything and incorporate it into like one week's worth of like posts. So it was like just, you know, random things here and there about everything. So I did that and really to help people in the hobby and like really nice people that I've met to promote their items if they're really good items and just to show people how to fix their pinball machine because it's something that I would want. So I wanted to kind of give back for something that I would think that other people would want to look at as well, like maybe installing a color DMD or, you know, installing a shaker motor or unboxing that pinball machine or something like that. So it just gives people a better visual on things before they go and purchase, before they go and handle that repair or something like that. So that's what my channel tries to do with all the things I have incorporated. Nice. So what exactly is Pinball Supernova? Is it a podcast, a Twitch channel? What is this? Yeah, Pinball Supernova. I know the answer to this question. I'm just kind of iterating this for the people that might not have found it already so they know where to find you. Sure. Pinball Supernova is a YouTube channel. It's a blog like on WordPress. I have a website, www.pinballsupernova.com. Everything can be linked from that homepage. I have all my links on every one of my pages on that site on my website. so I also have an Instagram site, Facebook site, and also a Twitter site as well. So I have like four or five sites that kind of just kind of repeat the things of what I post but for the people who might not be on YouTube or might not be on Facebook, there's another outlet to see those things if they're not like enrolled in those social media sites or something like that. So I try to get the whole audience, you know. How much content have you uploaded? Where are we at as far as uploads on YouTube and that sort of thing? That's a good question because I went back before I was going to come on tonight onto the podcast. I'm like, how many videos did I actually create? I have almost 200 videos that I've created on my YouTube channel.
    33:21
    That's over how many years have you been doing that? It's about four years, five years, something like that of content. And we all know like how much time goes into doing the – like to do your podcast every week and to do like my videos. It takes a fair amount of time to do it. We always say we don't really get any money for doing these things, but it's just giving back to the hobby and to the great people that we've met through the hobby, the time that you dedicate to the hobby to give back. So, yeah, so between my YouTube channel or my videos on my YouTube channel and everything else and all the information I have out there, my blog posts too. There's hundreds of posts. If you went to my WordPress site to go look, there's a lot of content on there. If you did a search or whatever, a lot of unboxings. My big video that people always want to go see or a lot of hits on that video is how to install the pin blades, the game blades on the cabinet of the inside of your pinball machine. I thought it was the video where you go nuts in Vegas. Oh, that one. Yeah, well, that one you need a pass through to get into. That's the adult section. Exactly. The hangover was loosely based off of that, right? Oh, yeah. That's what I heard. My life is just crazy like that.
    34:42
    That's awesome. But yeah, so that video gets a lot of hits because a lot of people take out their play fields or – I've seen crazy ways of people installing these game blades in their game. I just spray the back of it with like water or soapy water, get it in there, position it, unpeel it a little bit, position it again, and they go right in without having to like manhandle your game. So that's a pretty popular one. And honestly, the other ones that are really big are the visual pinball ones. I have about four videos of like how to install visual pinball and all the other components of visual pinball, which people in the pinball industry or in the hobby sometimes frown upon because it's not real pinball, people say.
    35:26
    They get tons of hits, thousands of hits these videos get. So like tutorials, because I mean, I know that that can be a perplexing go trying to set up everything to communicate, work together as it should without running into issues. I've had issues before. Totally. And you're totally right. There's no easy way to set that up there. You have the main like, you know, visual pinball and all the other components that go into that, like five or six other things that all need to work together. that's what I kind of showed in my videos like the front end of pinball x and all that kind of stuff so right and it's gotten fat and a lot of people have posted very positive comments about it that it really helped them out so so yeah so those videos get tons of hits so I have that the unboxings the monster bash le unboxing I did with my friend ed his pinball machine gets it got tons of hits my friend joe he's a monster bash le that's one of the few that are out there huh it's I'm like, he knows how to use gold. Seriously. He got his early on, my friend Ed. And yeah, we did the unboxing, and I think it turned out great. And a lot of people have written to me in the video saying, hey, you changed my mind. Now I'm definitely going to get one. So yeah, so that video was pretty popular. And my friend Joe buys every Stern, Elliot, Note to Man when they come out. We always do an unboxing of them. so uh i want to thank joe for buying all those games because that means i don't have to buy them to do the unboxings well yeah a friend that keeps buying le's is a friend indeed totally you get to try them out see if you like it and you get to do a video with it if you're doing a channel like mine so uh yeah it really helps out so i really appreciate it says best friend like limited edition yeah every le and it's an le it's not like a pro we're a premium he goes you know Those are your acquaintances, the pro unboxers. It's like, well, it's an acquaintance of mine. Totally. But the LA buyer, that's your best look. Totally. He's like the guy because he buys the LE. So, but yeah, a lot of my videos, you know, I built a light box, you know, for trans lights to show people how to do it on the cheap for like under a hundred bucks. You know, the colored DMVs, like I said before, those are pretty popular because everybody has a colored DMV in their games. And walkthroughs of some game rooms I did of my buddies and stuff like that. So that's what I try to cover in my – anything that's pinball related. And I just did one like on a 3D printer, how to print 3D printed parts and how maybe that whole genre of printing might help out the hobby in the future because we know these parts aren't going to be made forever. and you know there's a lull sometimes with these parts when they're not being be able to be purchased at that point so you know the only way you can do it is to make them you could be my hero by printing a ramp flap for a whirlwind right now if i could print in metal that would be great no just a little little plastic no big deal yeah um but i do have to i do have to ask you um so how frequent do you try and upload these videos um well sometimes i go a little bit on a lull. You know, like I try to get, I try to get my way from the hobby a bit, just so, I don't know, like you're reading Pinside sometimes and all that kind of stuff, or like work kind of gets in the way or your life gets in your way. You know, sometimes you want to post a video, but you just don't have the time. But lately I posted probably like three or four videos within, I'd say the last week or two. So, you know, I go into these, like, you know, I got to do a video, got to do a video and I do four of them, but there might be a month when I don't do a video. So it kind of depends on the timing of what's going on in my life, I guess, as it is with everybody, you know. All in cycles. Yeah, sure. You fit it in. I'll tell you what. I mean, I've been a fan of Pinball Supernova for a while, and I was excited to have you on the show and have you talk about it because I'm sure that there's a segment of our audience that maybe doesn't use YouTube as an outlet as far as – or as a place to gather information, and they have more resources and something that's done in a way in which you do it is always appreciated. Could you tell the listeners exactly how they can find you and how they can contact you if they want to check out Pinball Supernova a little bit further? Sure. To see Pinball Supernova or want to watch a video, go to YouTube and do a search for Pinball Supernova. My channel will come up The easiest way to do it like I said before is go to www and at the very bottom of every one of my pages you click on there a link for all of my sites for my wordpress instagram um youtube facebook all of those are on my pages on my website so that is probably the easiest way without giving out a url of everything that would be the easiest way to get access to all those things so well if you don't mind lee i mean we'd like to Maybe start sharing some content as well. Maybe make it easier for the listeners to kind of click and find you. In fact, when we upload this episode, we can put a link in the show notes. And then, you know, when you have content coming in, I know I get flagged right away and notified with YouTube. I can start sharing some of that stuff over at Special Winner. I'm sure the listeners would appreciate it. That would be great. Hey, any content that's helping the community or informing the community, I always like to share. So absolutely. Sure. Yeah, and your videos have definitely really impacted a lot of stuff that I've seen. throughout some of the things that I've done. And as a whole, I want to say thank you as a pinball community for the contributions that you've made. Thank you. You really acknowledge that it's a non-for-profit, just to educate people on what they're doing, not to break stuff. And everybody really needs to be appreciative for all those resources that are out there by people like you that put that stuff out there. Otherwise, people would be screwing up blades and programming their virtual pins. Melting down and going into a psychotic fit because their virtual pinball machine is on. I think it's really great, too, when you get the positive feedback from people like yourselves. Or like even when I listen to your podcast, I really enjoy it because, you know, you get, you know, you're kind of doing your things in your day. And then you you're listening to something that you're you can relate to and you enjoy. And again, we do these things to help other people out or just to do it for the enjoyment of the hobby. And when you hear the positive comments or reinforcement that you get back, it really makes you feel like – sometimes you sit back and you're like, why do I really do these videos? They take a lot of time. But then when you hear the positive comments or reinforcement from people, that is the reason why you do these videos or your podcast or whatever related to pinball because, again, you're helping the hobby out and you're trying to make it grow. And right, we're a little community here that we all want to kind of relate to and kind of make great friends and enjoy what you're doing. So that's the reason why I do what I do. Yeah, I mean especially when you go to these shows and you run into people that you've never met. I mean we met at TPF and it was a blast.
    42:29
    I mean when we go to shows now, it seems like it's more about just hanging out with the people you don't get to hang out because it's coast to coast distances. Yeah, and it's funny too. like when you go to a show like you said like sometimes the only time you see these people are at shows and like like i um see tallard reese and like i'll see him at shows and i'll that's the only time we see each other but we talk for a while and you just catch up with everything and then you go on your way again and then again at another show you kind of catch up again or you know you chat online and all that but when you see each other face to face and get a beer and just talk that's a great thing and again i met a lot of great people in this hobby and um if i didn't If I wasn't in this hobby, I would have never met the people like yourselves or many of my pinball friends that I have. So I'm happy to be in the hobby for that reason as well. Totally agree with you. The hobby is better off having you involved, Lee. Yeah. I appreciate it. So let's check out Pinball Supernova. We'll go ahead and we'll link everybody to there. And, Lee, I want to thank you very much for jumping on Special When Lit in our industry buzz segment. Thanks, man. Thanks, Lee. I appreciate you having me on. I really appreciate it.
    43:38
    What's up with Whirlwind as we go into Bill's Corner here now? You had anticipated April 20th as the, like, Sunday, Sunday, Sunday, Sunday. Yeah, dude. All right, so here's the thing. It was Whirlwind done on Sunday. Whirlwind was not completed. Okay. So here's where we're at with Whirlwind. Literally, I was told that I would have a ramp flap with my five-piece ramp kit and ordered it a month ago, came in and no ramp flap. Get contacted by the manufacturer. Hey, we're out of this, but you'll have it in a week. The manufacturer or the vendor? The vendor, sorry. Okay. So here we are, and I still don't have a ramp flap. So anyone that's listening that has a ramp flap for Whirlwind and wants to sell it at a good price, contact Special Inlet. Why did the ramp flap not come with the ramp set? So allegedly the manufacturer screwed something up, even though it says on the website that they are in stock and ready to ship. So that's the only part that pisses me off, is that if that's not the case, you yank that down and don't lead people on and believe that you have a part that doesn't. That's happened to me a couple times in pinball, where stuff's showing in stock and then it wasn't, and then I complained about it, but they don't change the in-stock status because they're just looking for their sales and they're hoping people don't cancel. I think that's... I don't like it. So I ordered some parts from a company out... I want to say in Europe. And, you know, put it on PayPal. Use the account. I don't have my own. So the wife and I share it. And, of course, I get a refund for $80. And she's like, what's a refund for $80 from this pinball company? I'm like, I don't know. And then, of course, she sees the $200 and some dollars I spent on everything else. So it kind of backfired. But, yeah, so going back to Whirlwind, yeah, we're missing a ramp flap. I got a couple of little gremlins to work out.
    45:31
    You know, I would say at most I probably got two or three days left and it would be done. Oh, so you're really close, man. Yeah, I mean, it fires up, dude. I mean, you could play a game on it right now without ramps, so it's pointless. Yeah, you don't get the full effect without the ramps, though. Yeah, and then I scratched the brand-new Translight that I had over the weekend when I was putting it in, so that was a little disturbing. But honestly, you know, so I think we're at fault because we keep promising we'll upload pictures. Yeah. And this week we will upload pictures, promise. Absolutely, we'll do that. But we've got a lot to upload this week. We've got to upload Lee's latest pinball supernova video. We've got to put the whirlwind picks up. I've got something else that's kind of exciting that we're going to announce here in a few minutes for those listeners that might want to get a little bit more involved in the show, which is going to be fun. So what's the updated, would you say, ETA and whirlwind? You know what? Honestly, I'm just held hostage by a ramp flap. So, like I said, if anyone does have one. So any day it could come in, though, right?
    46:27
    I don't have a lot of faith. No. Yeah, yeah. Please do this. Two weeks? two weeks yeah yeah who knows um but yeah i mean like i said it's there it's just i don't feel like getting creative and trying to build one right now so okay okay um but it's nice because i you know the time that i took off to make sure that it was done for you know the nieces and nephews i got the pinball the pinball repair room clean the garage clean so you know now we're just a waiting game so as soon as it's done we'll have that uh the final pictures up and maybe some other cool stuff about it yeah i know i know there's some stuff in the pipeline so it's exciting so we'll Get the pictures up. We'll keep everybody going. All right. Now, this is something that might be exciting for somebody that's looking to get involved in the show. Maybe you've been somebody that's that peruses the headlines of the day and you're listening to podcasts and you're on Pinside and you're on all these different discussion groups and you've just got you're kind of involved. You're in the know of what's going on. Right. So we wanted to start looking for weekly correspondence. And the way that this is going to work is we are looking for somebody to focus on one manufacturer each week. And we're going to have several correspondents. And what your job would be, should you choose to accept it, your mission, would be literally focus on your manufacturer. So if I have, let's say I have American Pinball. All week long, I'm in the American Pinball threads. I'm reading what's going on in their Facebook page. I'm looking at all the chatter that's going on All the buzz online And then at the end of the week On Sunday afternoon or Sunday night I'm submitting to Special Inlet Pinball Podcast A 60 second recap Audio clip Audio 60 second audio clip Of that week at American Pinball Now there's going to be some prerequisites here One You're going to need some type of decent recording gear Because we do take a lot of effort into trying to make our audio sound as professional as possible on the budget that we're on. So you're going to have to have recording gear. You're going to have to be able to carry yourself well and articulate what you're saying, hopefully better than me because I struggle as it is. And we just need you to be able to really get all that news in under 60 seconds, right? So what we're going to do is we're going to take submissions. If you are interested in doing this, go ahead and pick a manufacturer that you're enthusiastic about. Pick any week that has happened for that manufacturer. Give us a 30-second clip of your best effort, and we will reach out back to you. So, I mean, if you want to get involved in the podcast, that's going to be your 60-second contribution every single week. You'll be following that manufacturer. We're not asking you to go behind the lines and try to get backdoor information. Yeah, we're not trying to get, like, industry secrets and blow the doors off the industry with some amazing stuff. That's not what we're trying to do. No, but this is what's happening at this point is myself and Bill were realizing that we've got so many things going on in pinball and outside of pinball and then taking on this new streaming kind of venture that we are really focusing on that's going to get more legs as we happen or as it goes on. We don't really – it would be nice to have a little bit of help where somebody can really focus on a manufacturer. And then what we'll do is our industry buzz segment will cover all those manufacturers in 60-second clips. So maybe we get five or six minutes of industry buzz, and then we can kind of discuss the news as it came in from our on-field correspondence, so to speak. Now, that doesn't mean that we're not going to be reporting on our own stuff because we do have our own lines of communication for that. Yeah. But I think it would be really interesting for somebody to come in, objectively be able to provide us with some material. And a different take on it. Different take. Now, I'm not asking you to editorialize. I'm not asking you to give your own personal comments. We're talking about objectivity here and just covering the events of that manufacturer. Now, we've got some people that we initially thought of immediately that would fit in well with the show that we already know. So we'll be reaching out to those people this week. But, hey, guys, if this is something that you might want to do and you don't have time to do a whole podcast, but you kind of want to help out with the show and you're driven and you can hold yourself in a professional manner and come across as somebody that can articulate. And have to dedicate definitely once a week that you can do this. I mean, that's the other thing is the dedication. That's the thing. It's not just 60 seconds. It's a whole week of gathering information that you're condensing into 60 seconds. Well, you know what? I mean, come heck or high water, you know, every week if we're sick. I mean, I think the only time that I've taken off was literally my daughter. We had to take her to the emergency room because she was having an allergic reaction to something that we had to get addressed. I mean, that was the only time that I've taken off. That was at the last minute. We haven't taken any time off. No. I mean, we're at 48 weeks in a row, 49 weeks now today. Yeah. So next week will be our 50th episode. But, I mean, consider it, guys. Send us an audio submission to specialwhenlitpinballpodcast at gmail.com. It's all one word, specialwhenlitpinballpodcast at gmail.com. Just give us a 30-second audition, if you will. Let us know what manufacturer you want. And then you know what? Obviously, when stories are a little bit hot around your manufacturer, we bring you on the show, and you're talking about what's going on. You were deep diving that week. So I think it's a fun way to get the listeners involved. It's going to give a little bit of a different voice. Again, not overly opinionated, but objectively covering a manufacturer. It helps us out because we're focusing on a lot of different things. And Back to the Future is here. So I think it'll be fun. Let's see how it goes. It might not pan out. I don't know if people are interested in doing this or not. We're happy to do it, but I think it'd also be fun to have some listeners get involved in the show. Make sense, Bill? Absolutely. Yeah. So please get involved. All right. Got anything else to add before we shut down episode number 49? No, I think we already have a weather person for that show, so weather people need not apply. Yeah, so I think that's a wrap there, Ken. Yeah, cool. I wanted to take a minute and again thank Rob and Kim at LearnMods.com for sponsoring our Drain It or Save It segment. And if you are looking for custom quality pinball mods for your pinball machine, go to LearnMods.com. We have a coupon code set up for you. It's SWL10 for a special one with a 10. Enter that at checkout, get 10% off your order. and again if you want to contact us you can jump on our facebook page and leave us a message or you can post there and that's special when lit pinball podcast if you want to find us on twitch it's special when lit podcast and it's one word special when lit podcast you can also contact us via email and that's where you want to put those submissions or for the auditions and that's special when lit pinball podcast at gmail.com for bill webb i am ken cromwell everybody have a good morning good afternoon good evening and don't forget to take some time out of your day and play some pinball so long everybody
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    Thank you.