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Pinball Industry News: October 2018 Re-cap

Pinball News & Pinball Magazine Pincast·podcast_episode·1h 56m·analyzed·Nov 2, 2018
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.034

TL;DR

October 2018 Pinball Expo reboot succeeds with record numbers; Oktoberfest and Monster Bash remakes revealed.

Summary

A October 2018 Pinball News recap covering the successful reboot of Pinball Expo in Chicago, featuring interviews with organizer Rob Burke about record attendance (323 pinball machines, 43 vendors), and reveals of two new games: American Pinball's Oktoberfest and Chicago Gaming's Monster Bash remake. Key topics include Expo logistics improvements, behind-the-scenes factory tours, game design features, and licensing challenges.

Key Claims

  • Pinball Expo 2018 achieved record attendance with 323 pinball machines and 43 vendors on the floor

    high confidence · Rob Burke confirmed these specific numbers in interview; exceeded all expectations with positive vendor feedback

  • American Pinball plans to discontinue Houdini production and transition to full Oktoberfest production

    high confidence · Email from American Pinball stated orders must be placed soon as production is ending; factory visit confirmed imminent facility move

  • Oktoberfest priced at $7,400 USD and includes internal cabinet artwork (Widebody blades)

    high confidence · Directly stated during Expo reveal discussion

  • American Pinball planned to move into new facility and begin Oktoberfest production before end of 2018

    medium confidence · Factory representatives expressed confidence during mid-October visit, though stated as ambitious timeline

  • Chicago Gaming is discontinuing Medieval Madness remake production and finalizing last run in Q3-Q4 2019

    high confidence · Company stated during factory visit unless significant demand changes

  • Monster Bash remake licensing approval was delayed due to Scientific Games organizational restructuring

    high confidence · Direct statement about licensing delays from Scientific Games management focus issues

  • Monster Bash remake features RGB GI lighting throughout playfield on all editions

    high confidence · Observed during factory tour; enables color-changing playfield feedback effects like red flashing on Dracula targets

  • Oktoberfest artwork controversy involving monkey image grabbed removed; artwork will be changed

    high confidence · American Pinball acknowledged backlash and committed to replacing controversial back glass artwork section

Notable Quotes

  • “Well, it exceeded all expectations... the amount of positive energy in the air... It felt different this year, and it was alive, and a lot of energy and excitement, and people were just glad to be there”

    Rob Burke @ mid-interview — Key validation of Expo reboot success from organizer; indicates fundamental shift in event atmosphere

  • “My wife stepped up in a big way, but more than that, I had two new chairmen at the show... they just went over the top”

    Rob Burke @ mid-interview — Credits team effort; Dave Fix and Rob Craig as key organizational figures enabling Expo success

  • “43 vendors this year, 323 pinball machines... combined, you have over 400 corner-operated machines on the floor at one time. I mean, it was crazy.”

    Jonathan Euston @ post-interview discussion — Emphasizes record-breaking scale of 2018 Expo; establishes baseline for future growth

  • “It's a new feature and that's never been seen... one-handed pinball... quite good for fun tournaments and parties”

    host discussing Oktoberfest @ Oktoberfest segment — Highlights innovative dual-flipper button control scheme for magnet operation or single-handed play

  • “The game is based around visiting 14 different tents... they could be festival tents, they could be music festival tents, they could be comedy festival, any art festival tents”

    host discussing Oktoberfest flexibility @ Oktoberfest discussion — Identifies reskinning/re-theming opportunity for Oktoberfest framework; suggests South by Southwest branding possibility

  • “when I was in the factory, they had the machines next to an original Monster Bash, and the original Monster Bash looked very dim and dull and yellow and old, by comparison”

    host describing factory observation @ Monster Bash segment — Direct visual comparison demonstrating lighting and aesthetic upgrade in remake

  • “when you hit the Dracula targets, for instance, there's a big flash of red going across the play field, and when you start Dracula, the whole play field goes red”

Entities

Pinball ExpoeventRob BurkepersonAmerican PinballcompanyOktoberfestgameChicago GamingcompanyMonster BashgameJonathan Eustonperson

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Chicago Gaming holding significant Attack from Mars inventory (many boxes stacked at factory) while transitioning to Monster Bash production; indicates demand forecasting and production planning strategy

    high · Observed stacked inventory with serial number tags; explained as maintaining strong expected ongoing demand while concentrating on new title

  • ?

    business_signal: American Pinball pursuing aggressive expansion with facility move and three-line production setup; second factory building leased for boutique/custom line; confidence in meeting late 2018 production deadline

    medium · Factory visit documented warehouse lease acquisition; third production line planned for low-run custom projects; ambitious timeline expressed as achievable despite October facility visit

  • ?

    community_signal: Oktoberfest artwork controversy over monkey image; community backlash regarding inappropriate artwork prompts American Pinball to modify back glass image

    high · Host acknowledged 'very sensitive subject'; artwork showing monkey grabbing women under skirts caused 'commotion being politically incorrect'; company committed to replacement

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Chicago Gaming Monster Bash remake implements RGB GI color-changing feedback system to enhance player response compared to original; example cited: red flashing on Dracula target hits

    high · Factory observation comparing original vs remake side-by-side; RGB GI lighting confirmed on classic edition; specific effect examples provided

  • ?

    event_signal: Expo 2019 positioning as 35th anniversary edition with commitment to exceed 2018 scale; same Western hotel venue confirmed; Rob Burke planning even larger event

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.351

0:00
Oktoberfest revealed Monster Bash remake revealed Sea Witch remake revealed Hi, my name is Jonathan Euston and with me is What's up from Pinball News and welcome to our monthly update of the events in the pinball world over the past couple of weeks, or four weeks, I guess, which would be taking us back to... The month of October, that's what we call it, yes. That's the one.
0:34
And it has been quite an exciting month, and we say that every month, but this month really has been an exciting month, because it was Pinball Expo month. It was, and a lot of things happened during Pinball Expo, some of them to do with Pinball Expo, and some of them around Pinball Expo. Right. I wasn't there, but you were So I guess this will be your time to shine Oh, yes, well, okay Let me talk about Pinball Expo first of all then I was vaguely involved in helping Rob Burke With the reboot of the Pinball Expo show Now that Mike Paceback was no longer involved with it I gave some kind of advice to Rob Met with him a couple of times suggested things which could be improved and suggested also some of the equipment that they could do with buying for the seminars to make that a little more up-to-date, shall we say, when it comes to the technology, rather than trying to have an old VGA projector running 640, 480 and analogue and stuff. Get a nice HDMI 1, full HD, big screen, all that kind of stuff.
1:51
So that was the extent of my involvement prior to Pinball Expo, and I was also discussing some of this with David Fix, who was looking after that side of things to make sure we had the equipment that we needed.
2:05
But Pinball Expo rebooted this year. There was a lot of extra effort going into it, and I believe, Jonathan, you had an interview with Rob Burke shortly after Pinball Expo finished, to talk about all the way it went, basically, and lessons learned, and how Rob felt about the reboot, and all the credit, I think, that goes to the people who worked so hard to make it really quite an excellent show. Is that correct? That is correct. Do you want to switch to that now? We'll come to that in a minute, I think. but this year when it first started it looked like the seminar schedule was going to be a little bit thin on the ground but over the past few weeks the weeks leading up to the show it really padded out and became a really packed schedule and with some great seminars well they're all great seminars in fact and that provided me with quite a lot of work as well I'll talk about that a little bit later but now might actually be a good time to hear from Rob because this year's show was certainly, I think,

host describing Monster Bash RGB effects @ Monster Bash technical discussion — Specific example of RGB GI feedback mechanism improving player feedback and game feel

Jeff Bushperson
Dave Fixperson
Rob Craigperson
Rogerperson
Scientific Gamescompany
Ametroncompany
Houdinigame
Medieval Madnessgame
Attack from Marsgame
Vancouver Flip Outevent
Joe Balserperson
Gary Flowerperson
Dan Spoilerperson

high · Rob Burke stated 'next year is going to be the 35th edition, which is going to be even bigger than this year's edition'; same hotel venue confirmed

  • ?

    event_signal: Pinball Expo successfully rebooted with record-breaking attendance, vendor participation, and machine count (323 machines, 43 vendors); shift to 2-day format with Saturday closure resulted in positive vendor sentiment and cost efficiency

    high · Rob Burke confirmed 'exceeded all expectations'; vendors reported positive energy; specific numbers provided (323 machines, 43 vendors, 400+ total corner-operated machines)

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Scientific Games organizational restructuring caused extended Monster Bash licensing approval delays; company prioritized internal management over IP licensing partnerships

    high · Direct statement that licensing delayed due to Scientific Games management focus; games were in production (20-30 units built) awaiting approval

  • $

    market_signal: Game reskinning/re-theming opportunity identified for Oktoberfest framework; festival-themed 14-tent structure adaptable to music, comedy, art, or other festival brands (e.g., SXSW mentioned as example)

    medium · Host suggested multiple festival reskinning possibilities; framework flexibility noted as major upside for American Pinball intellectual property reuse

  • ?

    announcement: Chicago Gaming revealed Monster Bash remake with RGB GI lighting system; licensing approved after Scientific Games restructuring delays; three tier models (CE/SE/LE) on display

    high · Three machines displayed at Expo; factory observations of 20-30 units in production; specific RGB lighting effects described

  • ?

    announcement: American Pinball formally announced Oktoberfest at Expo after Vancouver preview; $7,400 price point confirmed; unique one-handed play feature via dual-flipper control

    high · Full game reveal with multiple machines on show floor; price announced; feature descriptions from factory visit documentation

  • ?

    product_launch: Medieval Madness remake production ending Q3-Q4 2019 unless significant demand emerges; signals Chicago Gaming's intention to focus entirely on Monster Bash after extended Medieval Madness run

    high · Company stated during factory visit; distributors notified to place orders quickly; unless significant demand changes, final run will be last

  • ?

    business_signal: Pinball Expo reorganization strategy: eliminate unpopular features (banquet, extended Sunday hours), consolidate to 2-day Saturday schedule, increase vendor/machine floor space utilization, implement professional tournament broadcast setup suggestions

    medium · Multiple discussion points about removing banquet, eliminating Sunday vestigial day, maximizing hotel space usage; suggestions for tournament broadcast infrastructure made

    • 3:21
    a success. It was deemed by everybody to be a success with a very positive atmosphere and vibe to the whole thing. It cut out some features from previous years which were maybe not as popular. Things like the banquet on Saturday evening, extended hours for the Games Hall, more vendors this year, more games to play, and the show actually officially finished on Saturday, rather than trying to pretend to carry it on to Sunday, when Sunday was always just like a teardown day, really, and there were hardly any games to play, and all the vendors were basically packing up and ready to ship out. So, it was something that I don't understand, because I think they're the only pinball show that is not doing anything on Sunday except for finishing the tournament. There are other shows which don't do it on Sunday as well in deference to all those people who brought games and the vendors themselves who basically want to get back home on Sunday and people do travel a long way to Pinball Expo being the big show it is so if they can pack up on Sunday morning or even Saturday night as some of them do and move out then that's cost effective for them and I know some people I share rooms with They were, they didn't stay beyond Saturday. So they actually left Saturday evening. Yeah. Are you referring to who I think you're referring to? Yes, our good friend and permanent caller, Gary Flower. He certainly was one of those people who left on Saturday late afternoon, early evening. And, no, because the hotel's not cheap. I think it's about $140, $150 a night. So if you can leave and not have to pay an extra night at the hotel, but still enjoy the whole day of Saturday at the show, then that's definitely worthwhile saving. What a cheap bastard.
    5:28
    Well, as you said yourself, the only reason really to stay beyond Saturday is... Oh, that's true, that's true.
    5:36
    He told me, because he called me as well, the stalker that he is, he told me that he was too tired to stay.
    5:46
    Well, not tired enough to get a room to sleep in, obviously, but yes, he was getting a ride back to Milwaukee, I know, and it's not just up to him, it's up to who he's getting a ride with as well. So it made perfect sense to not pay for an extra night just so they can leave first thing in the morning. Oh, hang on, my phone's ringing.
    6:07
    Is that Gary? I have no idea. It is. It's Gary. I wonder if I should find out what it is he wants. Maybe I should. No, not Gary. Oh, I missed it. Oh, he's rung off. I'll call him back later and find out what it was. He does it all the time. At the most inconvenient moment... He must know we're doing a podcast. He must have some kind of secret camera hidden somewhere, either in your place or in my place. I think you and Gary have gone back such a long time. That must be a telepathic... Yeah, it's true. Yeah, we had this link, you know, you must know that we were thinking about him and he called. I'm sorry he called again. Maybe even during this podcast. Oh, we left voicemail. Oh, that's nice. All right. Tournaments are therefore taking place in what's virtually a vacuum. You know, there's no show to support them at that point. So it's only those players who are there. There's no crowd other than the tournament players themselves watching. So they could maybe work out a way to finish it on Saturday Make it more of a spectacle Have more people there Incorporate it into the show a bit better Rather than it just being a sort of stand-alone event Out in the hallway And also, you know, televise it Or broadcast it around the hotel Have it on one of the Something you suggested to me You could have it on one of the hotel's TV channels Internal TV channels so people can watch it from the hotel room.
    7:38
    It can have TV set up around the hotel, so you're always reminded this is going on. It had proper overhead cameras, commentary, all that kind of thing going on. Make it a big spectacle, because it's a big tournament. The prize of a brand-new Stern pinball machine, and there's big cash prizes out there as well. So although it's an incredibly well-run tournament, And it just needs that extra sort of boost to the profile of it to make it more,
    8:07
    and make it appeal to people who maybe are not even aware that that's going on in the hotel. And those people outside who couldn't make the show so they can see what's going on. There were people there with their phones doing sort of Facebook Live type thing. But I think we've moved on a bit since then, since Papa TV kicked it up a notch. and we do a proper commentary and proper coverage over their cameras, split screens, all that kind of stuff. And that's the kind of tournament which would certainly benefit from that. It's big enough. It's got all the top players there. Well, most of the top players, anyway. And it should be a high-profile event and I think it's kind of slacking that bit at the moment. But that's something that can easily be addressed. But that's part of wrapping it up into Pinball Expo and just giving people a bit more boost as well.
    9:00
    Okay, so let's hear what Rob Burke has to say. Absolutely. Rob sent me an email with some post-Expo facts, which has actually been discussed in the little talk that we did. So let's listen to that right now. Well, it exceeded all expectations. Congratulations on that. Yeah, the amount of positive energy in the air.
    9:30
    And we heard this from a lot of vendors, too. They just said it felt different this year, and it was alive, and a lot of energy and excitement,
    9:40
    and people were just glad to be there and happy to be there, and just all had positive results. Good. The vendors were very busy. We had, you know, very big crowds this year, So, almost like a turn of lights switch off around there. Just a complete change from what we've had in the past.
    10:00
    Right. So, any personal highlights for you? Just seeing the show as I had always envisioned it could be. To see it in reality. and see everybody's, so just a warmth, a general warmth feeling throughout the whole group, from the attendees to the vendors to the speakers. It was just the positive vibes.
    10:35
    Okay, cool. So any things that you think like, okay, for next year we can still improve on this or that area? Or are you like, no, this is the way we're going to do it next year?
    10:50
    Yeah, good question. You know, you always strive for perfection, so there's always room for improvement. And we're working that. You know, we had some suggestions, which, of course, we'll take into mind. and next year's the special year because it will be number 35. So we're going to try especially hard to just really take it over the top. Right, okay. Now, obviously, Expo isn't a one-man show. You're the main organizer, but obviously you have help.
    11:23
    Yeah, and that's a good point, Jonathan, because, you know, my wife stepped up in a big way, But more than that, I had two new chairmen at the show. And I didn't know what to expect, but they just went over the top. And that was Dave Fix, who handled the exhibitors for the vendor area, and Rob Craig, who handled the free game area and the games that were brought into the show. I reached out to Rob because he had been our speaker several times at Expo. and I always liked how well he presented himself, handled himself, very thorough and detailed in his presentation. So I reached out to him and asked him if he would come out of semi-retirement and help me with the expo. And he agreed to do so. But Rob Craig brought a real true lust of enthusiasm and excitement and organizational skills. And a lot of it probably he developed, you know, from doing his own show many years ago. But actually, he's also a, he works for the university, so, you know, he's got that skill set that you do something, you do it right, and you research it, and you put a lot of time and effort into it. And it really showed on his part of it. So he was really excellent. Dave Figgs was terrific because, you know, just his communication skills were great. several times. He was under heat to get things done, to move things around, to change things, but he was calm and collective under the collar, and he just did it quickly, quietly, and it just worked. As a group, all of this worked very hard, but these guys were over the top and really handled their positions extremely well. Okay, excellent. You also had Roger handling all promotional aspects of the show. How did that turn out?
    13:30
    Well, it was interesting, Jonathan, because not only did I use Roger, but I also had a local marketing person that I found in the Chicago market.
    13:44
    And Roger was great as far as spreading the word through multiple press releases and interviews that he had done. but I also used another person that I just kind of discovered late in the game that came forward to me and offered her services.
    14:03
    And she was able to get me new spots on WGN, which is the local Chicago newspaper, Chicago TV station. I think it's a CBS or Fox, I can't recall it. But she also got me on a live segment Saturday morning at 6.50 So I was on TV there in Chicago on ABC.
    14:27
    They had me do about a five-minute interview on that station. So she really helped get some exposure for me. We did billboards this year. So the exposure was just out of hand. It was just out of sight. And that helped us reach new record numbers in attendance. and I think between that and the social media and the other efforts we made collectively,
    14:56
    as you saw on that text message, I think, or the email, I think we reached a new high on vendors and whatever else I showed you, everything was just over the top, I guess is the best I can tell you. Right, 43 vendors this year, 323 pinball machines. That is absolutely a record for pinball actually because I've been there at years that I think there were hardly 50 pinball machines.
    15:27
    Well, it wasn't that bad. I think the lowest I remember is below 200. But yeah, 323 on the pinballs and 114 on the videos. So combined, you have over 400 corner-operated machines on the floor at one time. I mean, it was crazy.
    15:47
    Right. So, large attendance in two days, which is great. I think there were three pinball machines to be given away to people attending or playing in tournaments and all that kind of stuff. That's always great.
    16:06
    Right. We had a raffle there for a new Deadpool game. We had Dan Spoiler from Project Pinball. He had an auction going on, a charity auction going on to raise, I think, $10,000 for his charity. Right. So we had that machine. I mean, it was just, there was something everywhere going on. It was just constantly. Plus, we had the 24-hour game room, and that was buzzing all night.
    16:36
    Great. So, obviously, Expo is over, and people are looking already at next year. So, is next year's show, is it going to be in Western again? Yes, same hotel, same hotel, yes. Same hotel, okay.
    16:55
    It's just that, you know, the results were above any expectation they had. And, you know, we just want to keep the positive energy going forward.
    17:07
    So, there you have it. Rob Berg of Pinball Expo after the show. Very happy how the show went. Very appreciative of the people who helped him organize the show. And obviously next year is going to be the 35th edition, which is going to be even bigger than this year's edition. So that's definitely something to look forward to. I think so. It was certainly a big push this year to give a much higher profile and to have more machines, more vendors. basically Rob took over the whole space that was available from the hotel there were no rooms that were booked out to anyone else or not booked at all there were no bar mitzvahs or weddings going on in your concern absolutely not and no vacant rooms no other rooms could have been booked out or just left vacant so everything was used and the space was absolutely filled with games vendors and seminars. So congratulations to everybody involved in the organization of that. Okay, so not exactly moving on from Pinball Expo, but at Pinball Expo we did see two new games from two different manufacturers. So that is sort of tied in with Expo. Let's start with American Pinball's Octoberfest. Yes, Octoberfest, Pinball on Tap. The details have been revealed of the title and a little bit of the artwork at the Vancouver Flip Out Pinball Expo, as we reported last month. And you and I were both there to see that, as Nirmal and... Joe Balser. Joe Balser, that's it. Joe, I couldn't get his surname again. Yeah, Joe Balser revealed at their seminar. So we knew what the title was, knew a little bit about the artwork, but just before Pinball Expo Reveal took place, I was able to go to the American Pinball Factory and have a little tour and see what they were working on there, and of course that included Oktoberfest, as well as the continuing manufacture of Houdini, which is coming to an end fairly soon. So there was an email recently from American Pinball saying if you want to get a Houdini, get your order in now, because it's about to stop and so they move over to full Oktoberfest production. So they're not going to be doing like Stern, that if there's a demand for 50 titles that they do run another 50 titles? Well, they're not committing to that at the moment. I imagine if the orders came in, they wouldn't be averse to putting some more on the line. They can definitely do that. They have that flexibility. But they are saying they don't have any more planned production at this moment. Right. And they do have to worry about moving the whole facility.
    20:06
    Well, yes, that was one of the things that we saw when we were looking around the factory and seeing how they make Houdini at the moment.
    20:14
    We also, from there, went to a couple of other buildings, one of which was Ametron, which I think it's probably fair to call the parent company. It's family-owned, and it's where they make a lot of printed circuit boards using both surface mount components and through-hole soldering for various industries, some defence, some amusement and coin-op boards and other businesses as well. But the reason they took us to that was to see the kind of culture that they have in that parent company and the way that they sort of lay out the factory and they have everything worked out and everything's very clean. The floor is spotless.
    21:02
    They know how to build circuit boards. And although they didn't want to name any names of companies, they have and do make circuit boards for other coin-op companies now and have in the past as well.
    21:18
    But we don't get into the details of exactly who they made them for because they don't want to talk about their customers. But we all know that CERN used to be a customer of them. I'm not sure whether they still are, but in the past they were. That's correct, yeah, I believe they were. But from there, we then went to another factory, which was another building. It's not a factory. It was actually a warehouse that used the store, the supplies for a sort of party hire company. So they have tables, chairs, tents, marquees, gazebos, catering equipment, all that kind of stuff. It's a big building. it's full of this stuff but this company is moving out and the reason they're moving out is because that's where American Pinball are going to move to and at the moment it's absolutely full of party stuff and in the back area there's a kind of slightly more spacious area which is having a lot of maintenance done to it but that's going to be where their third production line goes when American Pinball move in and the third production line is going to be used for boutique or low run or custom projects rather than two production lines they're going to have in the main area which I guess would initially be for doing Houdini and Oktoberfest and whatever the third title will be so they'll have two lines there which they can run or if any of those games become that popular, run the same game on both lines. But the interesting thing was, we were there you know, mid-October, looking at this factory, and they were very, very confident that they would be in there making Oktoberfest games before the end of the year, which seemed a hugely daunting prospect to me. But, you know, they're the kind of a company which thrives on tight deadlines, getting Houdini ready for the Texas Pinball Festival in March, getting Oktoberfest ready for Pinball Expo in October. that's what they do they set themselves very tight deadlines and they have hit them so far and they seem to have a very professional team behind them who can push that through so that was the look behind the scenes at American Pinball but at the reveal itself we had a couple of machines there which are the ones we've seen being built in the factory itself and I have to say it's a very bright very colourful, very entertaining-looking game. It's full of fun. It's almost, although the title is Oktoberfest, you can probably think of it more as like a fairground-type game along the lines of Hurricane and Comet and Cyclone. Yeah, those three.
    24:12
    But they brought more up-to-date with LED lighting and more features on the playfield as well. I'm sure you've seen pictures, or if not, you will be able to. And it seems to be not so much about the drinking, although they have had a few, well, one particular problem related to the artwork, which I'm sure you've been following, Jonathan. Well, yeah, I probably should watch what I will be saying about this, because this is apparently a very sensitive subject. the art on the game is done by Jeff Bush just like Houdini but it's a very different style and on the back glass is one section where there is a monkey picture who is apparently grabbing two women one with each of his hands under their skirts and that caused a little bit of commotion being politically incorrect and so on yes I can see why people would say that on the other hand if you see monkeys if they are at parties or whatever that's usually what they do so in that sense I mean there's plenty of videos on YouTube of women holding a monkey and the monkey is grabbing their boobs so apparently it's not that unusual but I'm not saying that it's okay or not okay, I'm just saying that's apparently how monkeys respond when they get near women or some monkeys but apparently the artwork is going to be changed and that section is going to be replaced with something else yes, I think American people have seen the backlash or the reaction to that and done a sensible thing and said, we'll change that. It maybe wasn't a wise idea to put that in there in the first place.
    26:20
    So, yeah, but, you know, if that's the worst thing that people can criticise the game for, then I don't think I've got too much to worry about. I haven't played it, but did you? I only had a very brief flip on the game because being Pinball Expo, I'm pretty busy doing other things,
    26:40
    doing many other things, actually. But the few flips I had, it seemed to have got a nice flowing game, and it also has these double flipper buttons as well, which allows, in normal play, the second flipper button on the right-hand side allows you to operate magnets, two magnets, one on the right orbit, one at the top of the right orbit, to grab the ball, either to drop it onto the upper right flipper, a bit like roller games does, you know, with the don't flip flip thing. Yeah. Only it's manually controlled rather than it being automatic. And also you can grab the ball when it goes over the top rollover lanes and then drop it into the rollover lanes from there rather than letting it go all the way around the orbit. But they're also intending to have this other feature, which is operator accessible, but it hasn't, it isn't actually a mode yet in the game but it might be, I said where you can actually use one button to do the left flipper and the other button to do the right flipper so you can operate the entire game with one hand such that you can use the other hand to hold a beer or a drink or whatever yeah it's a new feature and that's never been seen so that's innovative whether it will actually be playable that way, it would be quite good for fun tournaments and parties, I guess, to play one-handed pinball. So that's a new feature which they put on the game. And, yeah, I don't think there's an awful lot more I can say about it, other than the price has been announced at 7,400, I think, US dollars. Yes, which includes our blades. Yeah, absolutely. In other words, internal cabinet artwork, which looks very nice and makes the game even brighter, rather than having black size to it, lightens the whole thing up. So I think that's very good. And it's due to start production shortly, I think.
    28:43
    I don't think the software is finished yet, but as we've seen before, that doesn't necessarily stop anybody releasing a game. And I think it will be a very popular title for them. It's light, it's fun, it's... The title might put people off, but I think once they play the game and once they get the feel of it, they'll probably change their mind a bit. In that sense, it's probably a bit like Dialed In where the title may not have led you to understand what the game about but once you get your hands on the flipper buttons and start playing it you see how well it plays Right So one thing, usually we record what happens, but I can't help but think of a great opportunity for this game and for American Pinball probably. I mean, while it is being seen currently as Oktoberfest, basically you could also see it as, like you said, a generic festival themed pinball machine. But there's plenty of other festivals that could be interested in having a pinball machine branded around their festival. And then all you need is new artwork and a new name and you change a few modes and that's it. True, yes. The game is based around visiting, I think It's 12 different tents. 14. 14, is it? Okay. And then collecting, basically collecting the tents as you go around. So, yes, they could be festival tents, they could be music festival tents, they could be comedy festival, any art festival tents. They don't need to necessarily be theater tents. I mean, so, for example, South by Southwest, if they would like to have their own pinball machine, and where pinball is like the place to go, or a re-theme of Soberfest, then there you go. Good point. Yeah. You should suggest that to them. I probably will So that was Oktoberfest, Pinball on Tap Right At Pinball Expo there was also Another new game As in a remake revealed And this time it was by Chicago Gaming It wasn't exactly a surprise Monster Bash had been Had been announced In fact as being their next title to be remade, following on from Medieval Madness and Attack from Mars, so the third Williams Valley title.
    31:14
    And a few leaks had come out about bits of the game, like the topper and things like that. But, again, we were fortunate enough to visit Chicago Gaming just before Pinball Expo and see the factory and see them making Medieval Madness. Sorry, not Medieval Madness, Monster Bash, I should say. One of the things we talked about, Medieval Madness One of the things they did say was They are not planning to make any more Medieval Madnesses Until the Third or fourth quarter of next year Which will be the last run They're planning to do with them Unless there's significant demand So if you want to get a Medieval Madness remake Snap it up quickly While it's still at the distributors They did have lots and lots of Attack from Mars in boxes stacked all around the factory, all with serial numbers printed on them,
    32:12
    little tags on them, so unfortunately we weren't allowed to take any pictures because they were in the process of making Monster Bash, and I didn't want any risk of that leaking out until they'd made their own reveal. Yeah, okay.
    32:30
    What I wonder is if you have that many games in stock, and Chicago Gaming is not the only company that has apparently many games in stock. No. I tend to think of that as a bad sign, because it's inventory, it's games built, but not sold. It is, but I think they think the demand for Attack from Mars is strong and ongoing. So, they don't want to be building lots of ashes for the moment, and they don't want to be, you know, have that interrupted by having to build more Attack from Marses as the orders come in, the orders they expect to come in. And they probably also have to keep the factory busy by months of being delayed, as it were, for almost six months or more even. Quite, so they can keep building the games. So it's quite a small production line they have going there.
    33:26
    So they don't have the capability to run two games at once, or at least not in any sensible way at the moment. So they want to concentrate on doing Monster Bash at the moment as indeed they have been. So when we were in the factory there were probably I guess 20 to 30 Monster Bashes that were being built and being completed. They weren't short of the ability to build them what they were short of the ability was to sell them because it hadn't been given the full licensing permission yet but that was actually the licensing not from Planetary Pinball but from the owner of the Williams brand Scientific Games because apparently Scientific Games are undergoing a bit of a how can I describe it an organisational reshuffle at the moment as regards their management structure. So their concentration was not on approving the licensing deal with Chicago Gaming. So it took a lot longer than was expected. But they did get it, and so the game was revealed at Pinball Expo. There were, I think, three, one of each model on the show floor there. There was the classic edition, the special edition, and the limited edition. Right. And I have to say, when I was in the factory, they didn't have this on the show floor, but in the factory they had the machines next to an original Monster Bash, and the original Monster Bash looked very dim and dull and yellow and old, by comparison. And the new one, the lighting effects they put into it are far superior. because they have RGB GI lighting throughout, right? So they can vary the color of the play field at any point. This is even on the standard edition, on the classic edition, I should say. It's the CE version. So when you hit the Dracula targets, for instance, there's a big flash of red going across the play field, and when you start Dracula, the whole play field goes red. so all the feedback you get is a lot more enhanced and the playfield is brighter it gives you more of a positive response when you achieve something than previously on the other game you might hit the tracking target and unless you look at the display you might not even notice whether it's registered or not but now you hit the targets and there's a big flash of red across the playfield and it's obvious that that's been sent and you've added letters so positive feedback it's very good I do have a question.
    36:22
    We, at the IEPA show in Amsterdam, a distributor of Chicago Gaming that I happen to be talking to, mentioned that the game was likely to have two game modes, being the classic game mode with the rules that everybody knows and a new and improved game mode with maybe different rules. I don't know. Is that also the case, or was it just the standard rules as we know them, but enhanced?
    36:58
    No, I don't think that is true. I don't think there are any enhancements to the standard rules. The game plays as the original. There are no extra features added in, as far as I know, or extra modes, other than enhancing the lighting and display effects. and that's just on the, the display effects are just on the upper two models where they have the higher-res versions of some of the animations, and they'll see color display as well for those things. Right. I actually asked Doug Duber about that, and he said they weren't, they have no intention of, or had no intention of creating any other version or any other rules for the game. Right, okay. I did take a look at some of the Comparisons of the Display animations Which on the Special edition and the Limited edition are High res so to speak Obviously it's a larger display But they basically Divided each Original pixel up into four Separate pixels so they have a Higher resolution and it looks like they even redraw most of the animations.
    38:16
    It looks very cool to me. Yes, they haven't done all of them. I didn't get a chance to talk about this specifically because I don't think he's necessarily across exactly what they do to high res or to up res the graphics on the game. And they obviously do redraw them. It's not just a simple case of rescaling them because they obviously cull them as well. So there's extra work in that. But it seemed to me, just from a pretty observational comparison, that it seems any displays which are, shall I say, dynamic, they're not necessarily always the same. If they've got a score or a value or something like that associated with them, which will change depending on what you do in the game, they are low res still. Right. But the higher res ones are the more fixed animations, the ones which don't change each time. You know, like the mode start, that kind of thing, and getting a replay and an extra ball, you know, they are always the same no matter what happens in the game. Right. So those are the higher res ones. Like Frankenstein with the ban and all that kind of stuff. Exactly, yeah. I mean, if you did that and it said, you know, 20,000 or something over it, or 20 million or 5 million or whatever, and that value was different each time, then that would be a lower res one. But if it's always the same Then it would be a high res one Right, okay So, well the games look very impressive And It appears that They are already shipping So that's a good thing Yeah, absolutely I'm sure they've been champing at the bit To get the games out of the factory They've got them ready to go When we were there I'd say there were probably 20 or 30 and probably a dozen or so in test at the time, just going through their final test while they were boxed up and shipped out. So, yeah, they're keen to get them out the door. And I don't think there's any reason why not. You know, talking to Doug Duvall, he said around about 70% of the game is now common part to Attack from Mars. You know, so all the flip mechanisms, the pop bumpers, the slingshots, the switches, you know, that's all and the display the back box, lighting probably, that might vary slightly depending on the positioning of the lights the cabinet, hardware that's all the same between the games, so they're now really geared up to push through new games very very quickly and they know how to emulate them as well of course so it's probably more things like getting that high res dot art done, which would slow them down from doing any more games, although there's no hint as to what their next title might be, although we did, scientists certainly asked and put a few ideas and I think basically you look at what's in the higher echelons of the price range and you can probably guess what the next titles are going to be it's probably things like, you know, I'm guessing Cactus Canyon or something like that games where there aren't many of them out there and the prices are high and they can sell them. There's no point in them making a remake and selling it for $8,000 if you can buy a standard one for $4,000 or $5,000. So they're going to be looking at the more expensive games. But that's just my sense of what they might be looking at next. There's certainly no indication from Chicago Gaming or Doug as to what they might be working on now. Speaking of pricing of the games, The standard edition Or classic edition if you want to call it Is apparently Priced around 6,000 American dollars That makes Chicago Gaming A serious competitor For Stern Pinball Yeah, Doug said they actually Deliberately made the new game I think it was about $500 cheaper Than the previous model Than the Attack from Mars I guess Maybe part of that It's down to what I was saying before about having the commonality of parts and the expertise in knowing how to do this now. And maybe the license wasn't that expensive either with Universal to get all the creatures in. So, yeah, they're very, very keen to push that fact. And I think it makes it a very attractive package, personally. Yeah, and especially for the operator market. I mean, no disrespect or anything like that to Stern, but with the new game, you have no idea how it will earn.
    43:04
    Molesebes has been a very well-earning title for over the years, and with this improved package, even if it's the classic edition with the smaller display, like you said, all the light effects are still on the playfield and so on, which are improved. So that might actually still convince operators to rather go for a Monserrat that they are familiar with than with any new Stern title of which they have no idea how well it will perform. Well, you're right. Monserrat is a known entity. It's a timeless theme, I guess. People know the characters in it. And the only question Would be, you know, are people bored With playing Monster Bash Those who don't know that it's a It's a remake and therefore It's slightly different Would they think, oh that's an old title I played that years ago Where's the new game?
    44:09
    I can't answer that But I guess we'll find out all the time Yeah But I think for sure Chicago Gaming has a winner on their hand with this game I think so. They were very confident on pre-sales on it. They were, I think, talking well over 1,000 pre-sales from their distributors, which would probably, you know, if it carries on anything like that strength, would make it their most popular title. I think they said that they sold something like 1,700 Tacra Marses already.
    44:43
    And obviously they have quite a few more in the factory they can sell, so that I could potentially go up to, you know, 2,000 or more. And Montespan, if you've got 1,000 pre-orders or even more than that, I think I haven't got the exact number to hand, so I think I will err on the side of safety and say, you know, 1,000 plus pre-orders from distributors so they were very confident on filling. Right. Okay. So I guess that wraps it up for Chicago Gaming. Yes. Yes, and thanks to Doug for showing us around. And it's a shame we couldn't actually get any pictures at the time, but hopefully we'll get some. He did promise to send us some pictures for the factory after the event, so hopefully they'll arrive fairly soon. Right, okay. So then let's move on to the second remake that has been announced this month, which is a remake that has also received a new name. It's a remake of Sea Witch, originally a Stern Electronics game from 1980, designed by, I think it was Ed Cuban or Mike Cuban, one of the two. Mike, I think, yeah.
    46:00
    And it's a title that has been actually quite in demand for quite a while. Even Gary Stern told me that a couple of weeks ago. and to brush it up a little bit, I guess, they decided to re-theme it as a Beatles pinball machine. Beatles pinball, Beatlemania pinball, I should say. Yes, it's the Beatles Beatlemania pinball, the full title. Interesting decision to take a 1980 game and re-theme it. and to be fair there have been various changes made to the playfield but they're not drastic and it's still a single level fairly simple playfield layout with three banks of drop targets on the playfield and that big circular orbit at the top where the only real change there has been until they're having a star rollover at the top of the orbit, they now have a magnet which can grab the ball and drop it into the pop bumpers. Right.
    47:12
    But it's basically the same playfield layout. As you said, there's some other stand-up targets being added to the playfield. There's, behind one of the banks of drop targets, there's a super jackpot shot.
    47:26
    And a passage as well over there. There is. There's also a spinning disc in the middle of the playfield, very much like the sort of twister disc. Only this is a record, a ticket to ride. But it's a magnetic one, so it actually can hold the balls in the centre as well. Yeah, it's like the twister one does, outside a multi-ball. And it's very bright, and I guess turquoise is probably the best way of describing the playfield. Right. It features lots and lots of artwork all over it All done by Chris Franchi, I think Yeah But probably in co-elaboration with the licensor Which is Apple Core in this case And I think the licensor has probably imposed quite a few restrictions on Or conditions, shall I say On exactly how the game is made, what's in it And how it is used Well, I can briefly talk about that, as far as the restrictions go.
    48:36
    The number of games to be produced is limited to 1,964, representing the year 1964, which was the year that the Beatles appeared on the Ed Sullivan Show, and that was their breakthrough in the US. So it was a very important year for the Beatles. There will be three editions named after the awards that in the record industry are common, being 100 diamond editions, 250 platinum editions, and 1,614 gold editions, which are rumored to be priced at US$8,200. US dollars. I'm not sure whether that is the actual price or the MSRP.
    49:32
    The game has a coin door, but there are no slot or coin mac openings in it. Obviously, a game needs a coin door to make sure that you can access under the playfield and remove the playfield slots and so on. But in this case, it was apparently a requirement from the licensor that the game is not to be operated on location. So, no coin slots and also no possibility to add those. Although I'm pretty sure that with all the possibilities that there are, that's easily hackable and it could be implemented after all. Yeah, you also have to bear in mind there are quite a few locations around the world where the games are actually operated on free play. And either the cost is in entry to the venue or they make the cost out from the cost of drinks and the food that they sell at the venue. So we visited somewhere where games are free play. So that game can easily be operated in a barcade as long as it's not charged, or there are some other ways, as you say, you know, it's not rocket science to actually find a way of charging for these games one way or another. Right. So now what's interesting is I think the price point for the Gold Edition, which is what normally would be the Pro Edition, has been announced, which is already higher than a regular Pro Edition. which some people might think is odd because hey this is a 1980s playfield with two extra magnets and a couple of other stuff so why would it be more expensive?
    51:33
    I know Gary Stern said it's a drop target game three drop target banks and four flippers that makes it more expensive but no it doesn't really does it I mean compare that to a game like Iron Maiden or even Deadpool that's got a lot more on the play field than Sea Witch Remake has.
    51:56
    No, you're paying for the license, you're paying for the exclusivity. And it's also worth pointing out that those numbers that you quoted earlier, the 100 diamond editions, 250 platinum and 1614 gold, are maximum production numbers. Right. Now, there's no guarantee they're going to make that many If they don't sell 1,600 gold editions at 8,200 or whatever the price is, that's fine. They'll make as many as they can, but those are the limits on what they're going to make, not the definite production numbers. Right. So the rumor going around right now is that pricing for the platinum and diamond editions has not been announced, and that has to do with basically Stern not having decided yet on what it's going to be. They have an idea, but they are reportedly, from what I hear from various sources, testing the waters, what would be the best pricing to come out with. The highest that I can get away with. I didn't put it like that but this is as far as I can recall having received Stern press releases for goodness knows how many years it's the first time they've ever released a game and they haven't put the prices on the press release it just said contact your distributor for prices I don't think distributors know what the prices are either at the moment right but they presumably in due course they will but that's a very unusual move, and it kind of suggests that they don't quite, the Stern don't quite know what they can get away with at the moment. I think they're trying to push it as high as they possibly can,
    53:51
    but maybe they're also testing to see what the demand is from distributors. Now, what the interesting thing is, sorry for interrupting. No, no. So I get the feeling that at Stern they might be thinking like, oh, we're going to do a Beatles machines. And in the past we heard Joe Chemical talk about how Paul McCartney on that taxi show or whatever it's called.
    54:23
    Carpool Karaoke. Yeah, exactly. that have 100 million people watching within a day or two. Sure, but watching a clip on YouTube doesn't cost as much as buying a pinball machine. So that popularity, I'm not sure whether that translates to a game sold. And especially, I pointed out on Pinsight, there is a difference between Beatles memorabilia, which is actually like guitars that John Lennon played or owned or whatever, and merchandise, which is made afterwards, and the Beatles basically have nothing to do with it. That's right. Yes, it's all done by their merchandising companies. Yes, and there still are Beatles fans that will pay $20 for a mug with the Beatles on it, which is fine. But that's still different than a pinball machine that starts at $8,000 and might even be more expensive depending on how exclusive it is. Yeah, I think Spen have had their fingers burnt in that way before, assuming that when they produce games like Rolling Stones and Aerosmith and Elvis, the people would be willing to pay that kind of money. And as soon as you discover that they couldn't, or they couldn't sell them for that kind of amount.
    55:49
    I think Rolling Stones in particular didn't do that well, even the limited edition. I'm sure there were plenty of those left over at the end of the run. Right. That's as far as Beatles goes for now. What we can mention is, as mentioned in the press release, the game does feature eight songs by the Beatles, A Hard Day's Night, Can't Buy Me Love, Ticket to Ride, All My Loving, Help Drive My Car, It Won't Be Long, and I Should Have Known Better. In that order, that's almost like a verse of someone regretting lending his car to someone.
    56:31
    And that went terribly wrong, but okay. So, eight songs in the game. Not complete songs, as I understood. I think it's like 15-second loops that are basically being looped. And so it will appear to be longer, but it's just a 15-second loop.
    56:54
    Let's see how that works. I guess there's only one way to find out, and that is play the game. Now, what's also interesting is that the game was basically announced through a video teaser, which was on the Stern Pinball YouTube channel, but Stern didn't come out with it. It was the Beatles store that put it on their website and then was quickly picked up. But you couldn't Google for it. because apparently it was not findable for Google. It wasn't set to private, but it was difficult to find in Google, let's put it like that.
    57:42
    And then it took Stern a couple of days before they actually officially announced the game with the press release. so interestingly after the video appeared obviously Pinside went berserk as always lots of people crapping on the game but it's interesting to see how many people by now are sort of changing their mind and after getting used to the idea they can actually see how this could be a fun game so let's hope for that else I can see Stern being stuck with a bunch of people games Well I think people were definitely calling for a remake or several remakes of earlier Sten electronic games Yeah, but not at this price point. Well, that's exactly it. They were expecting that because they were simpler and should be cheaper to build, that they would be at a lower price point, whereas this is actually the opposite of that. It's actually a higher price point, despite being a simpler game. So, you know. But you're right that it was announced on the Beatles store And that's obviously where They see the audience Being for this game With the market being with the Beatles fans And collectors And I'll have to find out whether or not that's true But I'm sure There'll be a certain number of people Collectors who are going to have it as well No matter what price is Or what the game design is But I'm sure However it sells that Stern will do all right out of it, and so will Kapow, who were their partners with Joe Kimigau in making this game and licensing it from the Beatles. Right. So, sticking with Stern for a moment, there is some other news about Stern. I think there were a couple of software updates. I don't recall exactly which games, but some of the recent ones. There has been a Making of Deadpool Video release Which oddly enough Although understandable doesn't mention anything About the first design of Deadpool that was done by a designer Who we shall not mention anymore But it focuses Mostly on the game as we know it now Yes that's right George Gomez in his Pinball Expo seminar showed the Premiere of that video and of course it's on the Stern YouTube channel now but you can also let me just make a blatant plug here you can see George's entire seminar along with I was going to say all the other seminars from Pinball Expo there is just one which I haven't quite got on the Pinball News YouTube channel or on the Pinball News site yet but other than that all of them you can watch thank you Rob Burke for letting us do that this year, first time ever. Rob was a bit unsure about whether it would be a good idea to put all the seminars onto YouTube for people to watch, but I did it anyway. I recorded them all and put them up there, and he hasn't taken them down, so I assume it's okay. I don't think he knows, but that's a bit better.
    61:09
    Well done, Martin. I have to give you a heads up for that. Thanks. I'll work on the basis that it's often said it's easy to ask for forgiveness than it is to ask for permission.
    61:20
    Well, I think it's an interesting test case, actually, because there are different ways how you can look at it. Of course, you can look at it like, well, if you can see the seminars online, then why would you go to the event? But on the other hand, you could also see it as a year-long promotion for the next show. Oh, that's absolutely right and there is no substitute for actually being there at the seminar itself and being able to meet and ask the speaker themselves the questions you always wanted to ask you know, you can't do that in a YouTube video and you can't get anything signed by people and you can't get a vibe for the whole seminar in the same way that you can if you're there so I don't think it's in any way a substitution I think it is a promotion, as you say, and always has been in the past when we've just done the audio previously. But it was a bit of a challenge this year doing the video because it ended up being sort of about 25 hours of live broadcasting, which, you know, it's not the easiest thing in the world to do, even if you're a professional broadcaster. But when you're sitting there with a laptop And also having various other duties To deal with Such as sound mixing the whole seminar Okay So we're looking for an intern To mark in for next year at Swimball Expo That'd be good Anybody who can point a camera That would be useful And anybody who's got a camera Would also be useful Because mine blew up Halfway through the show So if you're looking for a very exciting As you can hear Internship Then send an email to Pimble News Yes To the Pimble News website Also if you happen to know Of a camera A webcam Or not a webcam But a camcorder That happens to output Over USB And can be used for streaming That would be wonderful I'd say Jack Danger is I've actually spoken to Jack about this Because of course he was one of the One of the subjects of the seminars So I've asked him about that and found out what he's using as well. But it's a slightly different proposition to do a coverage of seminars than it is to do a streaming of a pinball game. Because obviously you've got a very fixed rig, looking down at the playfield, one at the score, one at the player.
    63:51
    That's fixed. Whereas in a seminar you've got to pan and tilt as people move around. you've got to have shots of the audience, you've got to have shots of the screen. Let's not drift away too much. Yeah, yeah.
    64:03
    Well, he did mention it, but anyway. So in that seminar with George, he was showing the Deadpool video, which was very well received, I think, in the hall, and talking about the making of Deadpool, was introducing all the people who worked on the game, well, not all of them, but many of the people who worked on the game, and explaining how he went about developing various aspects of it. So that's an interesting thing, which you can see some of, we can see all of it, but obviously there's no substitute for being there to see George himself. And of course George was there later on the same day had passed the Sternorama event, which was effectively the closing of Pinball Expo on Saturday evening. Now there's no Sunday and no banquet. So George was there along with the team that were responsible for Deadpool, and they were there to answer questions, sign flyers, translate whatever, and answer questions. And people waved free beer and the opportunity to play the game and compete in tournaments. So that was a nice way to end Pinball Expo. So kudos to Stern for putting a lot of effort into that. Right. Now, speaking of George, George Gomez, along with Keith Elwin and Stern licensing manager Jodie Dankberg, this is at the Harry Potter theme park, which I think is in California, but I might be wrong.
    65:39
    Is that the Wizarding World of Harry Potter, which is at the Universal Studios in Florida? Florida. Yes. Oh, that's in Florida. It's not California. Sorry about that. I haven't been there, so I... Oh, I have. It's very good. I recommend everybody goes. They have some amazing rides, especially the main one, which is sort of a robotic travel around the world of Harry Potter, but don't get too distracted from that. Right, okay. So, obviously, this led to speculation that Harry Potter could be a future license to be turned into a pinball machine by Stern.
    66:19
    Why else would they be there? It's interesting to note that it was pointed out to me that the theme park is operated by Universal, but Universal is not the studio that is making Harry Potter movies. No, that's Warner Brothers. Right. But then again, if you want to see or get familiar with anything Harry Potter or get some inspiration for a game that's probably the place where you want to go anyway Absolutely, it's also interesting to note that one of the reasons cited that hasn't been a Harry Potter pinball up to now was J.K. Rowling's dislike of having her theme potentially appearing in bars and alcohol related establishments and one of the classic ways of avoiding that happening is to not put a coin slot on the front of the game. And now there seems to be a certain precedent of how they could get away with doing that. Now there's a Beatles game with no coin slot on the front and a restriction that it can't be operated. So it's maybe not beyond the realms of possibility that that particular restriction has been overcome and that might potentially lead to a Harry Potter theme being given the go-ahead by J.K. Rowling. Right. It would be interesting to see whether, since Keith Elwin was visiting the theme park as well, whether he would be given that theme. Because with all the designers that Stern has, nothing to take away from Keith. But you might think that they might want to throw such a theme to a veteran designer. On the other hand, you might give a young designer like Keith Elwin a shot. and he might surprise everybody and blow them away. Well, it might be that they sort of ask their team who's particularly interested in the Harry Potter theme and they're really keen on it and maybe Keith has got some background and some experience and really likes all the aspects of that theme. That would be a good designer. You'll want to have a designer who's passionate about the theme rather than somebody who gets it thrown to them. although that didn't work out with WWE but that's today a different question a different game in many ways yes then the last thing about Stern we almost forget that we're still waiting for the Munsters yes we saw the artwork of that what last month was that yes I think that it was last month the cabinet art leaked and apparently even at Stern apparently both games are ready to go the other one being Beatles of course and it was basically a flip of the coin like which one are we announcing first and that turned out to be Beatles but we're still waiting and it might not even be long before Monsters is announced as well probably that means that obviously the Beatles game is targeted at a different audience or a buying audience that is than the Monsters game.
    69:35
    Yes, it does leave a gap for operators, of course. If the Beatles can't be operated, what are operators meant to buy? Once they fulfill their Deadpool orders,
    69:49
    they have nothing to buy. So the Monsters will be the next game for them to purchase. Right. Speaking of games to buy, what I also heard is that in games, that Stern had plenty of games in the back of their factory, sitting and ready to go, waiting for someone to buy them.
    70:11
    They absolutely did, yes. I didn't personally go on the Stern factory tour this time, because I had to... Yeah, yeah, those camera work, we know you did a lot of work. But my good friend MG Brown did go and took some pictures on the tour. So, yes, you can see on the People News report from Thursday, the big stack of boxes at the back of the factory with various countries.
    70:39
    On some of them, others not yet being designated to where they're going to go. So, yes, they do have a lot of machines there. But then, as I say, so did American Pimble with their Tacra Marses. So I don't think that's a problem.
    70:55
    I hope it's not a problem. No, I don't think so. I think they're pretty confident in selling them. Okay, good. And last but certainly not least about Stern, they have been running Metallica again silently. They didn't announce it, but they did. I saw it on the line when I was in the factory in early September. But apparently this is the last run Of Metallica that they Will be doing Yes, they did publicize the fact that It's the last run again That's why I previously said that they wouldn't Be making any more Well, they previously said that they wouldn't Be making the game Anymore in 2017 Which was last year They didn't exclude that they Might do it again in this year Which they actually did Yeah But So Not to conflict those two But apparently This is indeed The final run Of Metallica For now Well Unless they renew the license And try to make some more Right So Well They can always do a vault edition Oh absolutely Yeah again We're going to get the licensing Sorted out I don't know if the license Has run out On Metallica Or whether Whether there was ever a license as such, because it seemed to be very much a collaborative work with the band themselves. And I'm sure the band would like the game to be made forever. Right, but there's also a matter of demand. Oh, of course. If everybody who is interested in the game has one, then there's no point in making them. Then, moving on,
    72:43
    let's go with Deep Root. Deepu did the seminar at Expo as well. You were there. I did indeed. And their four design heads were there. So that was Barry Osler, Dennis Nordman, John Papaduke, and John Norris. The four of them were there, which was the first time we'd seen John Papaduke in public for quite a long time. Right. Despite various people saying they were going to, I don't know, kick up a fuss and ask awkward questions or protest. We did not see any lynching going on, that's correct. Nobody said anything at all during the seminar. What was it afterwards?
    73:23
    Well, that was hardly a surprise, to be honest. But, you know, on the other hand, people kept it classy. If they had any disputes with John, they could take them up after the seminar, and the seminar was probably not the place at which they should tackle him head on. Right, okay. So it's not about John right now. It's about, okay, Deep Root is working with a bunch of designers. Now, the funny thing is, while I am very appreciative of you recording all these seminars in video, I was actually told, don't bother watching that one because nobody is saying anything. Yes. Well, that was hardly a surprise because, obviously, Deep Root is saving their big reveal for Texas show.
    74:08
    And there was five days of Deep Root. Yes. they're doing there. They're mentally releasing four titles, is it, or five titles? Who knows? Yeah. But everybody can get ready, I guess. Yeah. Well, at least four, shall we say, one from each designer at the Texas show. So that's what's going to happen. But Robert Muller was very clear that they weren't going to talk about the game specifics at this point. No, they'll wait for the games to actually be there for you to see for yourself in March. which kind of took the wind out of the sails of the whole seminar in a way, because here's a seminar talking about games that we can't talk about.
    74:53
    So it was more about questions which the designers themselves, and it wasn't just those four, because Steve Bowden was also there, as one of the sign-ups for Deep Root. But the designs themselves were kind of asked questions about how Deep Root, the philosophy of Deep Root was different from previous jobs they'd had designing games and how they were going to make games that appealed to the masses more than had been the case in the past. And to be honest, none of them seemed that enthused by the questions and the answers were a little bit on the weak side and formulaic, shall we say, without giving anything away about what they were going to do because they were not in a position to give details of their games. Okay.
    75:51
    I wouldn't say don't watch it because I think it's interesting and the body language is interesting and it's almost as interesting as what they don't say as what they do say. Right. So I think it's worthwhile watching. But, yeah, you're not going to get any secrets or much in the way of insights into what these four designers are working on. Right, okay. Then, Jersey Jack pinball.
    76:19
    Absolutely. Well, this was an interesting one for Jersey Jack because they announced their Pirates last year.
    76:27
    So they weren't announcing another game this year. having experienced what it's like when you announce a game before it's ready and the problems that come with that the game that you show is not production ready therefore the game that you do produce might be significantly different in this case it was minorly different in that the spinning disc changed from being three spinning discs to being one spinning disc so why would you show a game that's got something which you're not going to be able to produce. So they learnt that lesson. It's been a hard way, I'd say. Yeah, the hard way. There's been a change of culture, a bit of a change of management at various levels. And so they're now moving towards the point, which I think all people manufacturers want to be at, where they don't announce a game until it's ready to build and ship. So they weren't going to announce their next game at this point. Although that's not to say they didn't have a great show at Expo with their Pirates, and also Pat Lawler there, of course, talking about Dialed In and the making of that as well.
    77:44
    But yes, they had Pat Lawler and Eric Meunier were there talking about their two games. So it was still a good show, I think, for Jersey Jack, even if they didn't have anything to announce. But then Stern didn't have anything to announce either at that show. Right. They waited until two days afterwards to announce theirs, which was interesting timing. Right. So Pirates is currently being made in the Jersey Jack factory. probably not at the pace as they would like them to make it appears that there has been a sort of like a supply chain problem but it looks to be solved by now so there might have been a little delay but at least they are producing games now so obviously let's not forget that the biggest problem with pinball machines is if you have like 3,500 parts as Gary Stern always used to say, if you're missing one for whatever reason, you can't build the game. Yes, the most important part, they say, is the one you haven't got. Right. So apparently there may have been some of that going on or vendors unintentionally screwing up something. I don't know. I don't know the details, but apparently they had a bunch of games waiting for certain parts and then it appears that once the parts are delivered, then they can start moving everything.
    79:21
    And that leads me sort of to, we get back to some other talks at Pinball Expo, but this is a nice bridge to say that. Jean-Paul De Wynne, who is the LCD animator for Jersey Jack Pinball, is one of the special guests at the Dutch Pinball Open Expo, which is held the weekend of November 10th and 11th in the city of Drunen in the Netherlands.
    79:47
    And other guests at that event will be Martin Ayer of Pinball News. Oh, he's good. Yeah. Paul Ferris, pinball designer from, no, sorry, pinball artist from Belly, Data East and Sega. And Deeproot, no? And Deeproot, indeed. Jim Petla will also be there Who was a pinball designer for Belly And he also worked behind the scenes At Williams And Jack Danger will be there to stream Most of the tournament Live on his Deathflip stream And there's also Janos Kisov team Pinball will be there to discuss The making of the Mafia There's Two Germans coming over to do a seminar about a very unique head-to-head pinball game that they built, which is actually the size of two regular pinball machines, but then basically head-to-head.
    80:47
    It's called Good vs. Evil. They're going to be talking about that, and that game will also be there. So, lots of reasons to attend the Dutch Pinball Open Expo. And another one, you were too modest to mention which was a certain Jonathan Houston will be there as well. Oh, right, yeah, which reminds me that Jonathan Houston that you mentioned and this Martin Ayub that I earlier mentioned, they are going to do this quiz called So You Think You Know Pinball, in which they will be giving away lots of goodies sponsored by Jersey Jack Pinball, Stern Pinball, and American Pinball. so thank you to those kind sponsors for sending over some swag if you want to call it that can be won by participants in the quiz and I remember last year the quiz was very popular and people were very happy to be winning all sorts of goodies in the t-shirts, strength lights, whatever so I look forward to doing a new quiz with you actually. Yes, yes, it should be fun. We have to work out exactly how we're going to do it in the new venue, or the new old venue, because last time we did it, and it was in Eindhoven, and now we're back into a venue that was used the last time, three years ago, for this event. Yes, which has a big auditorium with lots of very plush seating. But we've got to get the audience up on their feet and moving around to do our quiz. Because we like to stir things up That's what we do Yep Okay, so moving on So yes, that's about two weeks time Isn't it from now? Yeah, it was a little sidestep But getting back to Expo Because there were Other Seminars that are Worth mentioning Let's start with Nick Parks from the Pimble Company Yeah, well Nick was there with his wife Brooke And they were talking about the formation of the Pinball Company But the Pinball Company is more than just a pinball reseller They were also responsible for commissioning Spooky Pinball to make the Jetsons game So that was sold, I think exclusively through Pinball Company But probably more importantly than that was they announced plans to open a new Chicago Pinball Hall of Fame, which they're planning to open in Schaumburg, which you and I, Jonathan, both know very well, because that seems to be the place where we've stayed every time that we've gone to Pinball Expo in recent years, which is a very social area with lots of shopping malls and restaurants and bars. Hotels too, yeah There's a big expansion in hotels there And it's home to places like Level 257 Which is the Namco themed Barcade And also Gameworks Are there as well But they're going to open this Chicago Pinball Hall of Fame Which they're planning to have 140 I think or more Maybe 150 pinball machines As well as other games So now Obviously this is great news But Allow me to play devil's advocate for a second Isn't that just A sort of Moving The pinball store to a new location And basically saying The showroom is now the pinball hall of fame No I think this is A definite dedicated Arcade, barcade As well It's going to be have a licensed bar. It's going to be kind of like the Emporium headquarters of Chicago, but with far more machines. As I was saying, it's going to be like the Pimble Hall of Fame in Las Vegas. But with a bar. But with bar and dining and a much, much more plush surrounding, shall we say. And when is this supposed to be opening? Well, that's the exciting part. Bang, next so he was expecting it to be ready by the time of Expo next year. So that's, you know, now it's still 11 months away.
    85:28
    He hadn't finalized the location at the time of the seminar, but he's got a pretty good deal on with one of the mall owners there. I think probably even talking about putting it in the Woodfield Mall, the same place as Level 257. Right, because what I hear is level 257 is key pinned. They are being offered more and more space because CES is moving out.
    85:56
    Well, moving out, shutting down. Yeah, whatever. Yeah. So that space is becoming available, and apparently they can easily move walls or whatever and expand.
    86:08
    Yes, indeed. There's plenty of space in that mall. and the important thing for Nicola who was saying was that it wouldn't be within the mall, it would actually be on the sort of edge of it, have an exterior access. So even if the mall closes down at, you know, 11 o'clock or midnight, people would still go in and out of the Hall of Fame there up until whatever time their licensing restrictions allow them to open, you know, 1, 2 o'clock in the morning. So that place will be self-contained And cut off from the rest of it So yes The intention is definitely to make it A barcade Entertainment complex And a dining and entertainment centre Right Yes, great plans for it And I think we should definitely be keeping on top Of what's happening there Because that would be quite an amazing Place If it comes to fruition and certainly in the time scale that he says. And next year, who knows, we might be reporting from there just prior to Expo. Right. Grand opening. Yes. And talking of Halls of Fame.
    87:21
    No, we're not going there yet. No? No, no, no. I know you want to go to 2MR and all, I know. But there's another sort of rumor involving the pinball company. And that is that they might have acquired a license for a future Pimble game Yes I haven had this confirmed in any way but I guess you talking about the suggestion that Scooby-Doo would be a title for them in an upcoming design, is that right? That is right. Right. So I think if we mention that at least, it's not confirmed, although I think there has been confirmation that the license for Scooby-Doo have been picked up for a Pimble manufacturer, and then it remains to be seen who it will be, but rumor has it that following the Jets and Scooby-Doo would be a next game by the Pimble company. And we'll still have to see whether Spooky Pimble would be making those again or whether they would source it out to someone else. But I think although not confirmed, I'd say I'd like to mention the rumor so that at least we mentioned it. I was actually talking about this very subject many years ago, actually, around about the time the Jetsons deal was, well, even before the Jetsons deal was announced, talking about it with Ben Heck and Spooky, and it looked like it was on the cards back then. So it's not a great surprise. I came to the conclusion That it was probably a package deal With Hanna-Barbera To get the Jetsons And Scooby-Doo All in one Oh no, well they got Well yeah, there could be others Well, maybe, yeah But I guess it would depend on how well The Jetsons did for them Whether they Made their money back on that Or whether it sold according to expectations I personally thought Scooby-Doo Would be a better title Than the Jetsons More widely known and more Internationally known as well Because I don't, well personally I had no knowledge really of the Jetsons In this country, in the UK But certainly Scooby-Doo was Part of my childhood TV watching all the time So I was I would never find Scooby-Doo I thought it was rather silly Of course it's silly That's the whole point Oh, then I missed it, I guess We would have got away with it too If it wasn't for you meddling kids So let's get to Tim Arnold Oh right, yes, Tim Talking of Hall of Fame Yes, well we know that Tim Arnold Was talking about Was planning a move From the current location Of the Pinball Hall of Fame In Las Vegas From Tropicana Avenue onto the Strip And at Pinball Expo he basically fleshed out his plans a lot more, explained what he was planning to do, what he was originally planning to do, what he was then planning to do, and what he's now planning to do, and why he needs to raise money and how he's planning to raise money in order to get this to happen.
    90:42
    It's far too much to go into in this podcast. Okay, so watch the seminar. That's why you recorded it. Absolutely. He's got all the diagrams. as he points out, you know, how they originally thought they'd just build into one plot of land and then another bit of land became available and maybe they could move a bit further south, a bit more towards the Harley-Davidson store. And there are various rules about how many car parking spaces you have to have for a certain location, depending on whether it's a museum or whether it's a retail outlet. and he's looking forward to, well, not looking forward, looking beyond his tenure of the Hall of Fame and when the place might be sold to a retail concern and how, if they didn't have enough car parking spaces for a retail operation, that would lower the value of the property.
    91:39
    You can imagine the risk. But it's very detailed. And Tim, I have to say, Tim is a very entertaining and creditable speaker. So I would definitely urge you to watch his presentation. There's no tricks. There's no flash or anything. It's just him explaining exactly what he's doing, pointing at the plot, explaining the sums. and at the end of it you've got a very good overview of what his plans are, what he needs to do and how he plans to do it. Okay, excellent. So we'll check that out. Then, moving on, Mirko Steffen from High Class Playfields High Class Pinball, I should say, sorry.
    92:34
    He did a seminar as well. What can you tell about it? He will be doing a seminar, by the way, at the Dutch Primal Open Expo in Drunen, which is the weekend of November 10th and 11th as well. Right. Oh, in that case, I don't want to spoil that, but I will just give a sort of brief summary of what he said. And basically he's developed this playfield manufacturing system, which he keeps pretty much to himself. he doesn't want to spread too much information about exactly how he does it, but he's got these robotic systems which first of all he's got a router to cut the play fields, but he's also got other robots that have got vision to them as well, so he's saying what they do is they just take a big take all the inserts that are required for the play field, just put them all into a big bin and a robot can go through and it can pick out the right size, the right colour the right shape insert from this pile place it properly and glue it into the playfield and it's got that amount of vision it can detect the shapes and the colours and the sizes of everything and then it goes through a sanding process and he's got robotic clear coating printing of course as well and followed by clear coating and he was talking a little bit about the clear coat process that he uses and uh but not too much because that is proprietary um and we didn't show us any pictures because um again you know he wants to keep this he has a a very unique i don't want to use the word very he has a unique uh manufacturing process and he doesn't want to uh give away too many details of exactly how it works, but he does share a lot of information there. So I think his new company, or his new website, is Merco Playfields, rather than High Class Pinball. And also, mercoplayfields.com is probably the place to go to. But the key thing to take away from all this was that, using this process, he's able to produce very small runs of playfields as long as he's got the CAD drawings for the router and the artwork. So if you can provide him with those, he can do down to individual playfields. If you need a replacement playfield, you don't have to wait for 5, 10, 50 other people to also want that. If you've got the means for him to cut them and print them, he'll do it. Right, okay. And let's not forget that Rico is doing the playfields for Jersey Jacks pinball. So, the method that he found, his playfields are definitely good. He's also doing them for American as well, I would say. Yeah. Oh, he's doing some of them for American. American dual source playfields. So, he does probably half of them for them.
    95:47
    Right. So, he's a very reliable playfield maker I would say. Yeah, I think so, yeah. He's got the capacity now, he's seen the demands there and he's invested and got the infrastructure and the equipment there and developed various bespoke techniques and software and built hardware as well. These robotic systems that he has built so he has that competitive advantage to be able to offer that to not just the big manufacturers, but also to the likes of you and I. Right. So from Mirko, it's very easy to segue into Scott and Easy, as Scott also has a CNC router in his garage, which is sort of the same thing. It's not robotized, but still, you get the idea. Yes, Scott can cover his own playfields, absolutely.
    96:43
    He obviously is well known for his Total Necro Annihilation. Great game. Yeah, which is about to become Spooky Pinball's biggest selling game. Right. And right for itself. Right for itself, yeah.
    97:02
    Although, you have to bear in mind that some of those titles have been... Limited. Limited by Spooky deliberately to a certain number of models or a certain number of machines made. But Scott did announce What the title of his second game Would be, which he is working on now With Spooky It's Haunted House Party Right, but I also read That that was sort of a spoof So it's not that It's a sort of place to throw everybody off So I'm not sure what to believe now It certainly didn't seem like A totally credible title But you never know What's in a title anyway It's about the game that really matters Right But his second game will be The next spooky game produced Once they finish making the Alice Cooper Alice Cooper's Nightmare Castle That seems rather ambitious I would say In the sense that I know we've all seen How long it took Scott to Develop Total Nuclear Annihilation And Since he kept on working on Total Nuclear Annihilation while with updates and all that kind of stuff while Alice Cooper had already been announced.
    98:23
    I tend to think that leaves maybe not enough time for Scott to finish the game in time before the production of Alice Cooper is over. Okay, well two things there. Firstly that Spooky have got basically back orders on their games for quite a long time into the future. Right. It will take them probably most of 2019 to produce all the games that are pre-ordered. Okay. So at least a little bit of time has gone. But also Scott's not working alone in producing his second game. He's doing some of the aspects of it like the playfield design but he's not doing all the software and he's not doing all the art which he didn't do obviously because he didn't do the circulation. I understand now but yeah. Yeah. Well, he did say who he was working with on each aspect of these things. So there was a team of about five other people. Sure, but I'm sure that Scott's in the lead, and being a programmer himself, that obviously will mean that even when everybody's gone, that he might still be tinkering with some stuff and working on things.
    99:31
    And, you know, if he says someone else is not to take anything away from Scott, in the contrary. But I find it hard to imagine that if he has someone else working on software that he wouldn't interfere himself if he has an idea and he starts programming it himself instead of letting it be handled by someone else. You know, if he wants to try out something, then he will just put it in. That's just a feeling that I can imagine that I mean, if you have the quality to do something yourself, then it's difficult to give it to someone else Absolutely That's a skill that needs to be learnt Isn't it To relinquish control of various aspects Of the game and not to hang on to it Totally But that's part of the skill set of a designer The game Is not entirely yours It's a team product And it has to be If it's going to be made If you're going to do this for the long term Rather than just a one off you have to take that on board and I'm sure Scott's up to that ok, so well it's good to know that Scott is working on the second game and I still doubt whether it will be called Haunted House for him we'll see in the future what it will be yeah there was a logo shown but it didn't entirely ring true should we say let's see what comes out of that right, ok so Keith Owen did a seminar on the making of Iron Maiden from Archer? He did, yeah. He showed pictures that, well, I think we both saw Archer when it was at the Museum of Pinball in Banning, and that was the game which eventually ended up as Iron Maiden,
    101:22
    albeit with quite a few changes along the way. And, yeah, Keith basically gave an introduction to his experience of when he first started getting into pinball, making pinball, designing it with his brother Randy and how that led to him getting that design taken up by Stern and him getting a designer job at the company and what that experience was like actually how it was different from making a single one-off custom game into turning into something which can be mass produced which is quite a different discipline I think you can appreciate that if you're making one, then you just keep tweaking it until you're happy with it. But if you've got to make thousands of them, everything has to be repeatable and reliable every single time. So that was what Keith was talking about.
    102:19
    Okay. I'm just going through the list of items that you sent me to discuss. we've been discussing basically most of the seminars at the Pinball Expo sort of related the Lopping Ghost yeah, that was kind of tied in with what Nick Park was saying about opening his Hall of Fame in Schaumburg Doc Mack who runs the world's biggest arcade, video arcade I should say in Brookfield I think it is in the outskirts of Chicago,
    102:58
    which is quite a sight to see. Everyone should go there, whether you're a pinball or video fan or not, because it's just astonishing what they built there. And it's just expanding all the time.
    103:12
    He announced that he was, firstly, he was expanding into a fourth, I think he said fourth building. It would have got three. And they just keep building more and more. And he said every time they build or they move into another building, their business expands accordingly and it's always been successful for them. But he also said that their pinball offering had been fairly minimal up till now. Yeah, like less than five games or so. Well, it varied. Sometimes it'd be nine, it'd be down to four.
    103:46
    And even when they had nine, it weren't necessarily all working. They had problems with maintenance. So he said, well, what they're going to do is they're going to tackle this head on. and they're going to open a pinball arcade, not actually in the same building, but I think it's in about two blocks east of where they are now, where they're planning to have, I think, 40 to 50 pinball machines in it. So that would be like an arcade neighbourhood then. That's right, yeah. Yes, in fact, knowing that area as well, there's a very nice barcade just across the street called Brixie's, where a good friend of mine, Dan, likes to play, and I think they have eight pinball machines there and normally there's the very latest games there. So I think they've got Deadpool and they had Iron Maiden there and it's one of the popular locations. So that whole section there is going to be a very good place to visit and almost as good as Schomburg with the Hall of Fame. Right. It's a bit of a sort of, it's not, shall we say, a high-class area. It's got a light industrial in many ways, the area. But It's certainly somewhere that's Up and coming and Easily get to on the train as well by the way If you don't drive So I'd recommend Yeah that area To go and see Galloping Ghosts anyway Because it's a sight to see Visit Brixley's across the street Play their pinball, drink their beer And before long You will have the Galloping Ghosts Pinball Arcade In the same neighbourhood as well Then, finally, I saved the best for last.
    105:27
    Yes. Can I get a drumroll? Not from me. Oh, sorry. No, just a sort of internal household announcement.
    105:42
    There it was, the drumroll. Pinball Magazine has a new webshop. Ka-ching! sorry but no i forget i mentioned it um it's one of the things that um as a visitor you might well you might notice it when when you visit it but um actually was quite a few headaches for me i was forced to upgrade to php 7.2 and my good i my former webshop software wasn't compatible with that. So I needed to upgrade.
    106:21
    Originally, I had someone to program the webshop for me. So I sourced that out and that guy is I think I don't know what happened to him, but he doesn't respond to emails anymore.
    106:37
    So I was sort of like, okay, what do I do now? And eventually I found someone new to source it out to. You were trying to pay him, I suppose. Yeah, I had to pay them, but that's usually not so much the issue. But I had like two days left before I needed to make a switch, else the workshop would be blank.
    107:00
    But this guy fixed it in like an evening, and so I was very happy with that. So I got a new, improved look on the workshop. The magazines are now in order as well, with the latest one being the first one shown.
    107:17
    And after that come all the posters that are available in the webshop. So for those who haven't ordered Pinball Magazine No. 5 or any of the other issues, I do recommend everybody visit the Pinball Magazine webshop. See, ah, beautiful. And then place your order. and I still need to tweak a few things.
    107:43
    But I think it's a huge improvement compared to what it was, especially the checkout process is more common than people are used to.
    107:55
    Yeah, that's very nice. I'm just visiting it now, although I do notice that People Magazine number 5, it says if you're in the US, they want to order it through Amazon. Is that still the case or not? No, no. Oh, I should take it down. Okay. All right. Okay.
    108:10
    Thanks for reminding me of that. I will take it down. If you want to order People Magazine number five in the US, do not order it through Amazon. No. Order it through this new web shop. It's not available on Amazon, and we covered that in the past. Amazon is just charging too many fees. It would be more expensive with them than even with me. And in the meantime, I also have Rob Anthony of Pinball Classics and Steve Young of the Pinball Resource, both offering Pinball Magazine No. 5. And as far as I can tell, they're both very happy in doing so. Steve Young has been reordering. He had no idea how well it would do, and he's been ordering more copies. So I guess that's a good sign. Good. Okay. Well, that's the biggest news. out of the way.
    109:07
    Do you want to talk about what's happening at Dutch Pinball at the moment? Right. Yeah. Well, we mentioned briefly, I think, there was something going on, but I wanted to wait for Dutch Pinball to make an official announcement. And that announcement came in the form of a newsletter. It's not the news what people may have been expecting actually have been news in a completely different category because obviously Dutch Pimble has their court case or is supposed to go to court with their former contract manufacturer, ARA, or A-R-A, whatever you want to call it. But this news was of a completely different order, I would say. Jaas Nauta, who is one of the two owners of Dutch Pinball, has been diagnosed with throat cancer and he has been undergoing chemo treatment for the past two months, I'd say. By now, the chemotherapy should be over. If everything went as they scheduled it. but obviously he's still recovering and all I can say is that they were in a rather early stage of discovering this cancer and all I can hope is that they are able to treat Jap well and that he will get well soon. Absolutely, I'm sure we all wish Jap the very best and a full recovery from what's a particularly nasty, not necessarily a nasty disease, but also a nasty treatment they have to go through as well. Right. Human therapy is pretty horrible.
    111:06
    And obviously this is delaying the ongoing, the production of the big lobality even more. But, well, it just seems like these guys get basically thrown everything in their way to prevent them from moving forward. And this is obviously a tough one. But being Dutch, they're tough guys. And I'm still confident that they can move forward. And hopefully we'll see them succeed in eventually making these games. Yeah, absolutely. It's not going out to the buyers. But it's priorities at the moment, and that's what we all understand, that their thoughts and their concentrations are elsewhere at the moment. Right. So, I think we've covered everything that we've done. I think there's one more thing we can mention about Multimorphic. Oh, right. This last couple of weeks, obviously they've got their Multimorphic P3 platform, Which Is the host or the platform Which a number of other games Run such as Lexi Knight's Speed Cosmic Kart Racing And a couple of smaller games That use actually the same play fields As those two Yeah, Cannon Lagoon And quite a few others as well Which are Rocks I can't remember them all But there's quite a number of different games We have up to 10 games on that platform right now Yes, it's a very impressive system. And they were not at Fingal Expo. No, they were not. Because they were at Houston, weren't they? And what were they doing there?
    113:01
    Basically, they revealed new cabinet artwork for Lexi Lightspeed and for Cosmic Carcasing. I think, I'm not sure whether they hired a different artist, but they went with more brighter colors which gave the game probably more of a pinball type of look. Yeah, I quite liked it, I have to say, both of them. I thought they were improvements to my eye but I guess I probably got used to the previous very detailed almost pen drawing style the earlier Lexi Lightspeed design they also released code updates and what I don't know for sure what I'm actually curious about is whether they improve the art on the LCD in the game as well during gameplay but that's something I will look into. But I thought it's thank you for bringing it up because I thought we were there but okay and then another trick came out of the head.
    114:22
    But no, it's good to see that they are still developing their platform and upgrading their current games and let's not forget that Multimorphic is one of the few companies that had orders for games and fulfilled every one of them, which can't be said for every pinball company, sadly. Yes, at the same time, they're also producing their P-Rock and P3-Rock systems and boards for other manufacturers as well. Right. There's like up to five companies already using their platform.
    115:02
    Yeah, so kudos to Jerry and the whole team there for being a very successful pinball manufacturer and designer. Yeah. And obviously they were not at Expo because they were at the Houston Arcade Expo, which was the same weekend. And it was much more local to them than Chicago is, a big base in Austin. Right. And I look forward to seeing Jerry and his upgraded games in Texas. Absolutely. Not long now. Yeah. Yeah, five more months. I've stopped booking flights.
    115:38
    Exactly. Yeah. I can already, I sort of have to make my reservation at hard aid, I guess. Well, every night. Oh, you bet, yeah.
    115:50
    What do you mean? Are there other restaurants? I was going to say for breakfast, lunch, and dinner every day.
    115:57
    I wouldn't say no. I'll bet you wouldn't. Okay. Well I think that brings us to The end of this particular monthly roundup Right So Yeah well Thank you for your Expo report both on the show As well as on your own Website pinballnews.com You're very welcome It was a very entertaining And informative Show as it always is And I hope everybody else Who went or who saw it online enjoyed it too. Right, okay. So, we'll be back next month with a new update bringing you the news of November. So, until then,
    116:47
    bye-bye for now. Bye-bye.