Episode 731: "Spooky's Next Coming This Year"

Kaneda's Pinball Podcast (Patreon feed)·podcast_episode·21m 30s·analyzed·Oct 14, 2022

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.034

TL;DR

Spooky's unrevealed game coming soon; needs design/mech improvements to win back community trust amid market softening.

Summary

Kaneda reports that Spooky Pinball will reveal a new game this year (predicted to be Scooby-Doo based on insider information), and conducts a wide-ranging critique of Spooky's design philosophy, manufacturing capabilities, and market positioning. He praises their visual/audio execution but criticizes weak playfield design, lack of original mechanical toys, and reliance on off-the-shelf parts. The episode also addresses broader market concerns: pricing saturation, secondary market depreciation, FOMO-driven purchasing, and competitive pressure from Stern, Jersey Jack, and American Pinball.

Key Claims

Spooky Pinball will reveal a new game this year, expected to launch with minimal gap between reveal and production.
high confidence · Kaneda citing 'a very good source' and pattern precedent from Rick and Morty reveal
The unrevealed game is predicted to be Scooby-Doo based on thematic fit and Spooky's IP strategy.
medium confidence · Kaneda's prediction, not confirmed by Spooky; stated as 'prediction' and 'secret I think'
Spooky Pinball will have produced 11 titles after the new game, more than Jersey Jack Pinball has released.
high confidence · Kaneda's count of America's Most Haunted, Rob Zombie's Spookshow International, Domino's, Jetsons, TNA, Alice Cooper's Nightmare Castle, Rick and Morty, Halloween, Ultraman, second TNA, and Scooby-Doo
The new Spooky game has been playtested and represents a significant improvement over Halloween and Ultraman in design.
medium confidence · Kaneda: 'I heard from someone who played it is a big improvement over Ultraman and Halloween'
Spooky's games lack original mechanical toys; Halloween and Ultraman use exclusively off-the-shelf components.
high confidence · Kaneda's challenge: 'name me one single toy in Halloween and Ultraman...that's actually a toy' and 'almost everything is off the shelf'
A new coder is working on the unrevealed Spooky game, and the animator from Halloween will not return.
medium confidence · Kaneda: 'I'm hearing there is an all new coder working on this game' and 'I do not expect them to use the animator who worked on Halloween'
Majority of pinball machines released in 2022 have depreciated in value; buyers lost money on secondary market.
high confidence · Kaneda: 'the majority of pinball machines that came out in 2022, if you bought them, you lost a lot of money on them. And that really hasn't been the case in pinball since I've been covering this hobby'
James Bond Limited Edition will exceed $16,000 with accessories, taxes, and shipping; secondary market shows no flip potential.

Notable Quotes

“I'm hearing from a very good source that we are able to see the next game from Spooky Pinball this year.”
Kaneda @ Opening — Core claim: Spooky will announce a new game in the current year based on insider sourcing
“I think Spooky Pinball is so close. Here are the things that Spooky Pinball really needs to change.”
Kaneda @ Mid-episode — Transition into detailed critique of Spooky's strengths and weaknesses
“They have the best playfields in the industry. They have really great light shows...but they need better design. They just need a better designer.”
Kaneda @ Mid-episode — Encapsulates core tension: Spooky excels at presentation but lacks design depth
“Can you imagine if Stern let everyone order an Avatar Limited Edition? Well, you know, the funny thing is Jersey Jack Pinball's actually making more CEs than people actually want of Toy Story.”
Kaneda @ Mid-episode — Critique of Spooky's Collector's Edition strategy; compares to JJP/Stern's scarcity model
“There is just no room anymore for mediocrity. This entire hobby cannot accept mediocrity.”
Kaneda @ Later episode — Market thesis: at $10k+ price points, inferior products will not convert
“The majority of pinball machines that came out in 2022, if you bought them, you lost a lot of money on them. And that really hasn't been the case in pinball since I've been covering this hobby.”
Kaneda @ Later episode — Landmark claim about market depreciation breaking historical pattern
“If you line up these games...Cactus Canyon vs James Bond vs Scooby-Doo vs Toy Story vs Spinal Tap vs Queen. Do you see how many games we just mentioned?”
Kaneda @ Late episode — Illustrates crowded product pipeline and finite buyer capacity
“The greatest bang for the buck is in all of pinball...just enjoy the games you have and increase your Kaneda's Pinball Podcast subscription.”

Entities

Spooky PinballcompanyKanedapersonStern PinballcompanyJersey Jack Pinballcompany American Pinballcompany Total Nuclear Annihilationgame Rick and Mortygame

Signals

?
machine_intel: Insider source confirms Spooky Pinball will reveal new game this year; predicted to be Scooby-Doo IP; production ramp imminent post-announcement
high · Kaneda: 'I'm hearing from a very good source that we are able to see the next game from Spooky Pinball this year' and pattern precedent from Rick and Morty reveal timeline
?
product_concern: Spooky Pinball games consistently criticized for poor playfield design geometry, tight shot openings, inadequate flow, and reliance on wide ramps as design shortcut
high · Kaneda: 'I don't think those games are designed very well. I don't think there's good flow in those games...openings to the shots are too tight. And so this is gonna be it...absolute brick fests'
?
product_concern: Spooky Pinball lacks custom mechanical toys/engineering; relies exclusively on off-the-shelf components across Halloween, Ultraman, and Rick and Morty
high · Kaneda: 'name me one single toy in Halloween and Ultraman...There isn't one single thing in the game' and 'almost everything is off the shelf'
$
market_signal: Majority of 2022-released pinball machines show significant secondary market depreciation; buyers lost $2-3k per unit; breaks historical pattern of value retention
high · Kaneda: 'the majority of pinball machines that came out in 2022, if you bought them, you lost a lot of money...really hasn't been the case in pinball since I've been covering this hobby'
$
market_signal: Premium pinball machines ($10k-16k+) creating market saturation; finite buyer base cannot support 7+ simultaneous new release competition; no room for flipping/arbitrage

Topics

Spooky Pinball's unrevealed 2024/2025 game announcement and IP predictionprimarySpooky Pinball design philosophy: strengths (lighting, playfields, sound) vs. weaknesses (playfield geometry, lack of original toys/mechs)primaryMarket saturation, secondary market depreciation, and FOMO-driven purchasing collapseprimaryBoutique vs. mass-market manufacturer competitive dynamics and pricing strategyprimaryStern Pinball's James Bond title positioning, pricing, and anticipated secondary market performancesecondaryCommunity trust recovery requirements for Spooky post-Halloween/Ultraman depreciationsecondaryCollector's Edition production models and their impact on perceived value/scarcitysecondaryEconomic downturn impact on luxury hobby spending and portfolio depreciation anxietymentioned

Sentiment

mixed(0.35)— Kaneda expresses cautious optimism about Spooky's potential (praising past accomplishments, noting improvements in unrevealed game) but tempered by sharp criticism of design weaknesses, manufacturing shortcuts, and poor secondary market performance of recent titles. Broader sentiment is pessimistic about market conditions, pricing insanity, and consumer FOMO. Late-episode pivot to encouraging restraint and self-reflection shifts tone toward advisory/concerned rather than negative. Tone is analytical and critical but not hostile.

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.064

ware 001 to 229 Have of and начина는 Oh, look at Kaneda's Pinball Podcast giving John at Jack Bar his bang for the buck. Two shows in two days. But we got some news on this episode of Kaneda's Pinball Podcast. I'm hearing from a very good source that we are going to see the next game from Spooky Pinball this year. Now, it makes total sense like they are wrapping up production of Halloween and Ultraman and they are taking orders on TNA 2.0 but that's like a separate build kind of game. This company needs to keep the The main lines going and so I think we're going to see what we saw last time when they did the Rick and Morty remember Rick and Morty was revealed in December and spooky pinball is good at this when they reveal a game that game is basically on the line when the reveal happens there's not too much of a window or a gap between reveal and production so here is my prediction and we all know the secret I think it's going to be Scooby Doo Pinball and I think it's going to be probably hopefully I'm begging I'm praying Spooky Pinball's most impressive game to date. Now for some of you out there, maybe many of you out there, the bar over at Spooky has been lowered by Halloween and Ultraman. Let's talk about Spooky Pinball. Let's talk about Spooky Pinball for a minute and let's actually give Spooky Pinball some credit, okay? Because I think Spooky Pinball, when you really zoom out and think about it, this company over the years has made a lot of pinball machines over their tenure. If you think about all the boutique pinball companies that have come out and have failed to deliver, a lot of boutique companies never even shipped a single product. Now let's count the amount of games Spooky Pinball has made. I'm going to try to remember this without looking it up. America's Most Haunted, Rob Zombie Spookshow International, then Domino's, then the Jetsons, then TNA, then Alice Cooper's Nightmare Castle, Rick and Morty, then we got Halloween, and we got Ultraman. Hal I'm going to do another TNA and they're going to do this new Scooby-Doo game. So that is a 11 titles that spooky pinball will have put out into the pinball world. 11! That's more games than Jersey Jack Pinball has managed to get out the door. So I think we have to give spooky pinball some credit for getting it done. Now the history of spooky pinball as we know has always been this. It's been inconsistent. Like there have been games that have been okay. There have been games that have been terrible. There have been games that they've been commissioned to build. There's been games that Scott Denisi made that had a huge following. But for the most part, I think everyone is still waiting for Spooky Pinball to make a game that is just as good as, and I mean this, as good as a Stern pro. They just haven't made a game yet that shoots really well, that has interesting mechs in it, that has the total package. And I think Spooky Pinball is so close. Here are the things that spooky pinball really needs to change and here's the things they do really well. The things they do really well are this they have the best playfields in the industry. They have really great light shows. They use full RGB LEDs in their games. Their games look great. The cabinets look good. They have great sound when they can get the sound right and I mean this is spooky games. They can really crank really nicely, but sometimes the volume levels are all over the place. So they need to figure that out. The areas of spooky pinball where they need work are the following. They need better design. They just need a better designer. Like I don't know if these kids can design a game that's as good as a stern pro. I don't know if they have the experience and I just haven't seen a design or a layout from spooky pinball that has been very good. The Denise games are separate from the spooky design team. And so what I'm looking at with this new game is can they design a game that actually and has really good geometry because even if you look at Halloween and Ultraman, I don't think those games are designed very well. I don't think there's good flow in those games and I think having a super wide ramp like that is also a cop out. Like, that's not what we want. I think they really need to make a game that's just a good design and here's the thing, I don't think there's any excuse anymore for bad design. If you're designing a whitewood of a pinball machine, How can you stop designing that white wood until it shootss great? And why is it so hard to make a game shoot great? Can't you study all the other pinball machines that are out there and just borrow ideas from existing designs? How can it be that hard when you think about it? Because the playfield on every single standard body machine is the exact same dimensions. So why can't you study like Pat Lawler's designs and Steve Ritchie's designs? It is embarrassing to me some of the designs that Spooky's put out there because most of them if you've played their older games, they're absolute brick fest. Like they not good designs Like the openings to the shots are too tight And so this is gonna be it I really do feel like this game and I heard from someone who played it is a big improvement over Ultraman and Halloween So that is what I think everyone is going to be looking at with this game Is the design better The other thing we really want to see in this game are toys and mechs and I mean this. When you look at spooky games, are you seeing any mechanical engineering whatsoever? Where? Like everything is always been off the shelf parts and I just think at this price point they really need to up their team they need to get some mechanical engineers in there to be able to design some mechanisms and toys that are not off the shelf like when you look at a game like Rick and Morty everything is off the shelf when you look at a game like Halloween and Ultraman almost everything in there is pretty much off the shelf like name me and I mean this name me one single Pinball toy in Halloween and Ultraman, A toy, something that interacts with the ball, that's actually a toy, that does something, that moves. There isn't one single thing in the game. So if you're going to make Scooby Doo a team that has a bunch of fun, campy stuff, and I can see it right now, you got have a toy. You got have a toy. Are you going to have a Scoobydoo head that eats Scuby snacks? What is it going to be? Is it going to be The mystery van that opens up and locks the balls. Something needs to be in this game that feels like a toy because at these prices, I don't think Spooky Pinball is going to get away with what they've been relying on. You know the number one thing they've been relying on is really good artwork and their games recently have looked really nice, but really nice artwork doesn't make up for a lack of toys and a lack of mechanical engineering. And here's the other thing that's going to be really interesting because Most people who bought Halloween and Ultraman lost money on those games. The other part about this reveal that's going to be super interesting is Spooky Pinball is not going to be able to not show us gameplay before people go in on the game. I don't think people are going to preorder these games ever again. I think we're going to need to see gameplay. I think we're going to need to see the code and the animations. And I think they're going to need to stream this game before people run at it because as all of you know, there is absolutely no point now running at a spooky pinball machine to get one early or get your deposit locked in. There is no way now that they're going to be making over a thousand of these games, there's no way the games are going to be hard to get. There's no way they're going to be rare. I also think Spooky needs to rethink how they're doing it where like the majority of the games become the collector's editions. That's absolutely silly. Can you imagine if Stern let everyone order an LE? If Stern said we're gonna make as many LEs as people order or Jersey Jack said we're gonna make as many CEs as people want. Well, you know, the funny thing is is like Jersey Jack's actually making more CEs than people actually want of Toy Story. But that's the thing. It's like if you want like a spooky CE, like you don't need to order when they reveal it. And I don't think people are going to be putting $2,000 deposits on this game anymore. I think this community was burned on the last two games. And I think people are going to have to see something that really impresses them. Now let's just hypothetically say it is Scooby Doo. Is Scooby Doo a theme that's going to get over a thousand people to say take my money now without saying anything? The game play I don't think so is Scooby-Doo a good theme for pinball I think Scooby-Doo is a good theme for pinball I think it's really campy I think it's really fun and I think it's perfect for spooky pinball how many of you out there grew up watching Scooby-Doo I did you probably did so there is enough people out there remember you only need like 1500 people who like this theme to make it a successful launch for spooky pinball. So I don't think they're going to have a problem finding buyers, but I do think they have a hurdle to overcome and they need to win back the goodwill of the community. If I could give them some advice, Spooky, you've got to show this game. And I'm praying for them that the code is far along because this can't be another like the code is not complete, the code is very spartan and here's the game, give us your money before you see anything. And I'm hearing there is an all new coder working on this game. So I fully expect Spooky to come out with this product and have the code much further along. I do not expect them to use the animator who worked on Halloween. I think they heard the feedback there. And I think they know that this game is crucial to this brand. Like this game is so crucial to Spooky Pinball and they need to get it right with the looming economic recession we're all living in. With all of these games costing so much money. There is just no room anymore for mediocrity This entire hobby cannot accept mediocrity If you going to come out with a game like Queen it not going to sell If you going to come out with a game like Spinal Tap it not going to sell Spooky Pinball needs this game to be a statement game that shows that this new design team can actually figure it out and gets all of it together in a way that works Because the community is just spending so much money now that it at the point now we like two games are costing you over You got to make before taxes for just two pinball machines And I don know about you Everyone watching their portfolios lose like five six seven figures in value And I don care what anyone says Like nobody immune to it No one immune to what about to happen in the economic world And The dirty little secret in this entire hobby is that if you all looked in the mirror right now, do you need another pinball machine? Do you need another pinball machine to be happy? Is your collection filled with great games? Do you even have just a few great games that you love? Why do you need another game? And if you want to sell some of your existing games, it's going to be a lot harder to sell those machines. And for the first time ever, and I mean this, the majority of pinball machines that came out in 2022, if you bought them, you lost a lot of money on them. And that really hasn't been the case in pinball since I've been covering this hobby. And I'm not talking about these things as investments, people. We don't approach pinball as investments, but you can't ignore the fact that nobody wants to lose like two to $3,000 in one year on a pinball machine. Because if you buy three pinball machines, So, you have just lost 9 grand because you bought 3 pinball machines. Right? Now, you probably made up that money because some of your older machines have gone up in value but you know how pinball people are. They don't want to sell the old stuff. How can I sell it now? My Toronto Lee is worth $18,000. So then the question becomes what is the price of Scooby-Doo? Is Scooby-Doo going to cost more than Ultraman and Halloween? I don't know. I think Spooky is going to keep the price kind of where it's at. I think we're going to see the collector's edition cost around like $89.99. Maybe they make it $9,500. But for the most part, this game with tax is going to be around $10,000. If you add a butter cabinet to it, it's going to be around $11,000. The other thing I hope Spooky does is I hope they make their toppers a little nicer. When I see a Spooky game from the side for $10,000, I don't want to see servo motors and wires like on the topper. Like just put a case It's spooky. It's not that hard for this much money. You can design something that encases the topper. It might cost you another 50 bucks, but that's what people are going to expect for this much money. But at least they give you a topper. I will say that at least they give you a topper. I mean, it is crazy that we're spending $13,000 on stern, Elise, and there's no topper. I mean, think about it right now. If you add the accessories to James bond, like once they make a topper and they make the shooter rod and they make everything else that you can add to the game, Plus taxes and plus shipping, James Bond will probably be over $16,000. And that is why I am seeing this industry softening. I am. I'm seeing James Bond games for sale right around what they cost at MSRP. There's no room to flip these games. Like you can't be all in at $14,500, $15,000 on a Stern machine and then go flip it for more money. And I don't think James Bond's gonna be as good as Godzilla. I don't think it's gonna be one of the best Stern machines of all time. I just don't. I think it's gonna be good. I think it's gonna appeal to James Bond fanatics, but I just don't think this game is gonna be like, you know, oh my god, I gotta take out a second mortgage on the house to get one of these games. And I think everyone's feeling that way. Everyone is feeling like, oh, I'm kind of over it. And also, like, the delay on this James Bond reveal has made everyone's FOMO sort of dissipate. I don't know about you, but I feel like this game The game came out six months ago. I already feel like I bought James Bond, I played it, I've seen it all, and now I'm selling it to get the next Stern pin. I feel like everyone's already like, what's next from Stern? Like, we're already like, is it going to be Back to the Future? Is it going to be He-Man? Is it going to be Venom? Like that window, right? There's that one month window where you really need to have the game out and about. But we do know now that this game is most likely going to be at Pinball Expo, which is a good sign. Here's why I love the fact that this game is probably going to be on the floor at Expo. Because think about it. How often do we actually get consumer reviews, like real consumer reviews, not distributors reviewing the games telling us everything is amazing, but real consumers jumping on a game and getting to play it and giving us their feedback before we have to send in those final checks for the game because remember stern pinball machines are refundable deposits. Nobody's money is nonrefundable. So I think this is great. I can't wait to see what message from Clemo McCarthy Siobhan, PDA,我是 Jun Boy P b If I American Pinball I want to get my game out or revealed or announced before Spooky shows Scooby David Fix don wait because there only so many tens of thousands of dollars people are willing to spend There are not enough people in this community at these prices to float these games and we saw it with TNA 2.0. It's still not sold out. So you got to remember like this is it David Fix. This is it Charlie Emery, you guys are battling it out. You have two boutique games and they're both around $10,000. Stern is asking people for 10 grand for premiums and 13,000 for LEs. It's crazy how many people want your money. And then you got Jersey Jack trying to cajole you to buy a Toy Story but no one's going to buy Toy Story at MSRP anymore because you're going to lose $2,000 on an LE and you're going to lose at least $2,000 to $3,000 on a CE. So it is going to be a brutal competitive fall in the pinball world. We haven't even talked about Cactus Canyon LE. Like nobody's unboxed that game yet. That game was revealed at Expo a year ago and that game's going to finally start shipping. And then here's what's going to happen. You know there are scalpers and flippers who don't want the game, who want to scalp that machine and get it sold to a new buyer. So that game is also going to start to pop up on the marketplace for sale. And remember Cactus CanyonLE was like affordable. It was like $9,200. And so we're going to see that game hit the block as well. And if you line up these games, and I mean it, Cactus CanyonLE is packed. So Cactus Canyon LE vs James Bond vs Scooby Doo vs Galactic Space War new backbox David Fix game vs Toy Story vs Spinal Tap vs Queen Pinball. Do you see how many games we just mentioned? And all of these companies they need consistent sales to keep the line going. You know what the greatest bang for the buck is in all of pinball and where the most enjoyment is? Imagine if you don't buy any of those games, you just enjoy the games you have and you just increase your Kaneda's Pinball Podcast subscription from $5 to $10. And if you do, if we get enough people to do that, I'll make three shows a week and you'll save yourself tens of thousands of dollars a year because you know this is where the most entertaining thing is happening in pinball. It's just talking about it. It's just observing it. Buying these games at these prices isn't really exciting people. You know it. Stare deep into your pinball soul people. You know it. You're happy with the games you have. You know you want to use this money to treat your kids and your wives to vacations that will change your life. Don't believe the hype. Don't believe the FOMO. These distributors and these companies need you to feel like you need every new game. The only person that needs every new game I do not Order James Bond guys, I think you're gonna be happy. I think the Keith Elwin pin is gonna be silly. I do. I think when they show that game and distros start asking 20 grand for it, I think people are gonna laugh at it and I don't think people are gonna chase that game. I don't. I'll tell you why because the people who chase that game if it's over 20 grand, they're gonna be ridiculed. Nobody's gonna want to be ridiculed. And if you don't chase that game right when they reveal it, here's what's gonna happen. I guarantee you, you'll be able to buy it from a distributor in like three to four months. The B cro Joining www.captionRubmäßig.com http://www.captionrub ACC avenue.org This Week in Pinball, FranchiCameraman We'll see what happens. It's always a pleasure doing this show, the world's number one pinball podcast, the only pinball podcast that shares the only numbers that really matter, people. We're the only show that really, when you ask people to pay to play, we're killing it, and it's because of all of you. And do me a favor, invite a friend to Kaneda's Pinball Podcast. The more you invite people, the more we show everybody that this is where it's at. Later. This Week in Pinball Question Mark Subtitles by the Amara.org community