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DPP# 152 "The Alice Episode! New TEP Topper!"

Don's Pinball Podcast (regular feed)·podcast_episode·39m 22s·analyzed·Oct 9, 2024
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.032

TL;DR

Alice in Wonderland review + Attack from Mars topper announcement and interview.

Summary

Don reviews Dutch Pinball's Alice in Wonderland game, which launched with 500 units at $12,500 USD. He praises the cabinet build quality and hand-painted sculpts but criticizes the dated layout, inconsistent art direction, and questions whether the premium pricing is justified. In the second half, he interviews Robin Rath about Electric Playground's new officially licensed Attack from Mars topper launching with 300 units, featuring interactive lighting synced to gameplay.

Key Claims

  • Alice in Wonderland launched with exactly 500 units total, 300 allocated to US with 200 to Europe, split among CoinTaker (200), Gap, and Pinball Traders (50)

    high confidence · Don reports exact allocation numbers from industry sources at launch

  • One secondary market flipper already listed one of two reserved units for $1,500, initially asking $1,750

    high confidence · Don observed this directly on secondary market within 24 hours of release

  • Dutch Pinball can produce 30-50 games per month, capable of completing all 500 units in just over a year

    medium confidence · Don's projection based on Dutch Pinball's stated production capacity

  • Alice layout and mechanics are 15-20 years old, originally conceived as unfinished papa duke design that sat in storage

    high confidence · Don explains the game's origin through Zidware bankruptcy, Chris Turner auction purchase, and Melvin acquisition

  • Electric Playground's Attack from Mars topper is officially licensed through Planetary and uses artwork by Brad Albright

    high confidence · Robin Rath confirms official licensing partnership with Planetary

  • Attack from Mars topper limited to 300 units with seven light shows, articulating alien/UFO plastics, and two additional solenoids for synchronized movement

    high confidence · Robin Rath details topper specifications and features

  • Stern's Pinball Alley marquee sign (11 feet wide with ruby red pop bumper lights) returning at $3,500 from factory, with secondary market attempts at $10k now dropping to $6,500

    high confidence · Don reports direct observation at Stern factory and current market pricing

  • Alice pricing strategy mirrors Stern LE tier and JJP Limited Editions but Don estimates base game at ~$7k-$8k with $3.5k in custom mods/sculpts added

    medium confidence · Don's opinion-based cost analysis of where pricing breaks down

Notable Quotes

  • “if this thing sells all 500 units, which I think is entirely possible, then who cares what we think of it... it's going to be a killer success for the company”

    Don @ ~37:00 — Core philosophy on game success being sales-driven regardless of critical reception; addresses gatekeeping in enthusiast community

  • “This looks like a game that if it just had come out with standard armor and no art blades and no topper... I would expect it to sell for $69.99... Then it looks like somebody took that $7,000 base game and took $3,500 worth of mods and put them in there”

    Don @ ~41:30 — Explicit cost breakdown criticism; questions pricing justification for luxury add-ons vs core game value

  • “At $12.50, I haven't ordered one... If this was $9.99, I'd say all day, I'm interested”

    Don @ ~43:00 — Personal purchasing decision commentary; price sensitivity threshold articulation

  • “We've got seven light shows going on with this, and we do have some articulating alien and UFO plastics going on. This thing has got a lot to it. I think it's our best topper to date in terms of light show.”

    Robin Rath @ ~57:00 — Product specification confirmation; competitive positioning vs prior toppers

  • “It's interactive with the game, too. That's the thing. It's not just running through modes where you have a remote control... it's interactive with how you hook it up with the game”

    Don @ ~54:30 — Explains differentiation of Electric Playground's topper approach vs simple LED accessories

  • “The Big Lebowski problems were not necessarily related to cranking games out of the factory. I think it was because they had to fight a years-long legal battle across two countries and two continents”

    Don @ ~46:00 — Explains historical context for Dutch Pinball's production challenges; relevant to Alice delivery expectations

  • “The creatures of Wonderland... are delightfully wicked and creepy looking, like comic book type style. And then you've got these very kind of just a complete departure for these two women”

Entities

Dutch PinballcompanyAlice in WonderlandgameDonpersonRobin RathpersonElectric PlaygroundcompanyAttack from MarsgameStern PinballcompanyPapa Dukeperson

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Stern re-releasing Pinball Alley marquee signs at $3,500 (down from $10k+ secondary market attempts); market correction indicating secondary market speculation premiums evaporate when official supply returns

    high · Don reports direct observation at Stern factory, $3,500 MSRP, and secondary market collapse from $10k to $6,500 asking price

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Alice community response 'all over the place' immediately post-launch; Don emphasizes commercial success metrics (500 unit sell-through) take priority over critical reception in evaluating game viability; frames 'not every game's got to be for me'

    high · Don states 'community response has been all over the place' and 'if this thing sells all 500 units... then who cares what we think'

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Electric Playground positioning Attack from Mars topper as improvement over prior CGC topper offering; 300 unit limit designed to capture demand 'of all those that didn't get in on that CGC topper'; appeals to collectors with FOMO strategy

    medium · Robin Rath states limited to 300 units 'hoping to kind of fill the need of all those that didn't get in on that CGC topper'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Art direction inconsistency: creatures rendered in comic book style while protagonist characters use voluptuous Legends of Ahala aesthetic; Don notes the styles appear to exist in separate visual universes rather than cohesive world

    high · Extensive art critique describing 'competing art styles' and characters that 'don't exist in the same universe'; notes styling departs from creature design coherence

  • ?

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.118

0:00
Alice in Wonderland? More like, Alice, I'm wondering why they made this game. Oh, what's up, everybody? Apologies to Kerry Hardy. I'm just joking around. The last thing I'm going to do is just crap all over this brand new game that just got released, only because I'm not getting one. I'm not going to do that, but I will give you an honest review and first reaction, or review, of everything that's been released so far. Hello and welcome once again to the DPP, the Don's Pinball Podcast. From my heart to yours, an outpouring of enthused exuberance from me to your ear holes. So get a little drip of this and, you know, wipe that baby oil off if you just came from a ditty party. This is a pinball podcast. I got a lot to talk about today. I mean, Alice, come on, that dropped on us. The community response has been all over the place. I can't wait to get into it and give like a final hot take. Also, we've got some new news from some accessories from Stern that are coming out that we'll talk about. And an interview. We've got an interview here. Spontaneously, Robin Rath from the Electric Playground, purveyors of great aftermarket and now officially licensed pinball toppers. We'll talk to him at the end of this episode. So buckle up. Buckle in. Get ready to begin the den of sin and follow the white rabbit down the rabbit hole that is pinball. Okay, so Dutch pinball extreme. No, it's exclusive. We finally got the drop and the reveal for Alice in Wonderland. Now, I'm in a position that's kind of, financially, it's great for me because I'm not in a pinball-buying position right now. X-Men and Avatar made damn sure of that. Plus, I'm looking to get a new truck. So I was out on this game before the official reveal, all right? And it didn't have anything to do with this theme specifically or, like, any leaks that I had gotten. I knew I was just going to back away from this one and just let it wash over me like a giant wave that's coming you know i wasn't going to catch this one i'm gonna dive underneath and we'll see what's coming up down the line now it wasn't a total shock and surprise when i saw this layout because we've all seen the paper craft version from papa duke back from 2011 or whatever it was so we knew there was going to be those two papa dukey ramps right a game that seemed to have the same scope and scale as a circus voltaire you know uh had the uh originally They had the screen down low just like Circus Voltaire did. This one doesn't do that. A bit of a departure. And just to recap, what had happened is Zidware went belly up. Somehow Chris Turner ended up with the license rights for this that he purchased at auction. So way to go, bro. And then Marvin from the Netherlands came down and he purchased at least this license. And so then somehow it winds up here. Now, Zombie Yeti was involved initially. Now he's with Stern for reasons he's not involved in this. reasons I don't even know and I'm not even going to speculate on. So they took what was essentially a half-baked idea but wasn't a complete game, hashtag magic girl, and they went ahead and fleshed it out and made a game out of what was there in paper craft form. And they had some rudimentary art treatments that were done, which were then finished in definitely a style, and that's what we got dropped on us. Now, the rumors were that this was going to be sub $13,000, So kind of going right up against the Stern LE tier. Numbers were going to be low. $500 total, one edition. It's going to be loaded, and that's all they're going to make. And so they're banking on the exclusivity of only having $500 of these things to carry it through. And by all accounts, it is doing well. This isn't a game where 2,000 of them were released, and they're not sold out yet, so it's a failure, right? Only 500 were going to be made. Only 300 allocated to us here in the United States. What, 200 with CoinTaker and 50 split between Gap and Pinball Traders? As of this recording, Pinball Traders still has some spots open. And there's already been one guy, one entrepreneur, who's already listed one of the two games that he reserved up for $1,500. I think he was trying to get $1,750 there initially, received some pushback in the comments. It's dude is just trying to get his hustle on. Man, no shame in that game. You don't like it? Move along, homie. But that's listed there for $1,500 if you want it, if you want to get through Cointaker. I have no idea how the $200 for Europe are doing, but I did see that Pinball Heaven is still advertising that it's available. This thing just got released, though. It's not even been hardly 24 hours. So regardless of what the loudmouths in the media, myself included, especially, think of this game, ultimately, if it sells its 500, it was a smash success and to be commended. Now, so what did we get? Okay, let's go with the art first because that is, it's been dividing everybody. So this is not a younger Alice, thank God for that. This is a voluptuous, straight out of Legends of Ahala art style freaking Alice here, and the Queen of Hearts as well. They look like they're both compatriots, like the same age, you know. So there's not even – I won't get into that.

Don @ ~16:00 — Identifies core artistic inconsistency concern; establishes art direction as divisive issue

Melvin Louwersperson
Chris Turnerperson
Zombie Yetiperson
Brad Albrightperson
Pinball Expoevent
CoinTakercompany
Pinball Traderscompany
Planetarycompany
Kerry Hardyperson
Mad Pinballcompany
Texas Pinball Festivalevent

design_philosophy: Alice design philosophy diverges from contemporary pinball trends toward interactive elements, articulating features, and complex shot sequences (X-Men, Halloween, Elton John); Alice perceived as more similar to older games like Queen or ABBA in scope and innovation

high · Don extensively compares Alice layout unfavorably to recent Stern releases, noting lack of 'interesting locking mechanisms' and 'next-level things with ball guides'

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Electric Playground achieved official licensing partnership with Planetary for Attack from Mars topper, contrasting with typical third-party aftermarket accessories; indicates IP holder willingness to collaborate on premium accessories

    high · Robin Rath explicitly confirms 'officially licensed topper' status and working relationship with Planetary IP holder

  • $

    market_signal: Secondary market flipper activity detected within 24 hours of Alice launch; single entrepreneur attempted $1,750 resale, dropped to $1,500 after community pushback; Don notes this is normal market behavior without shaming

    high · Don observes specific flipper listing and pricing adjustments in real-time; frames as 'hustle' rather than manipulation

  • $

    market_signal: Don questions whether Alice's $12,500 price is justified given perceived dated layout design and mechanicals; estimates base game at $7-8k with $3.5k in mods; indicates $9,500-10k would be purchase threshold

    high · Extended pricing analysis and direct statement 'At $12.50, I haven't ordered one... If this was $9.99, I'd say all day'

  • ?

    announcement: Electric Playground officially announced Attack from Mars topper with 300 unit limited production, officially licensed through Planetary, featuring Brad Albright artwork

    high · Robin Rath confirms official licensing and 300 unit production run in interview segment

  • ?

    product_strategy: Dutch Pinball's Lebowski faced years-long legal battles across two countries that impacted production timelines; Alice delivery expectations tied to post-Lebowski production ramp-up capability (30-50 units/month)

    medium · Don provides historical context: 'years-long legal battle across two countries and two continents' explaining why Lebowski delays weren't production capacity issues

  • ?

    product_concern: Alice lacks under-cabinet lighting, back lighting, lighting effects, and projectors that Don expects from contemporary premium pinball; perceived as incomplete implementation compared to recent Stern releases

    medium · Don notes 'Could have used some under-cabinet lighting and some back lighting, some lighting effects, some projectors or things, but it is what it is'

  • ?

    technology_signal: Electric Playground's topper technology integrates dual solenoids for synchronized movement with in-game saucer mechanics; RGB lighting syncs to game state (multiball, video mode, flasher events); represents advancement over previous topper implementations

    high · Robin Rath details two additional solenoids firing synchronized movement; Don emphasizes interactive gameplay feedback vs. standalone decorative operation

    • 5:11
    We'll just leave that alone. Leave that alone. The Teen Milf thing, we're not going there. I'll cut that out. Anyway, what we got, though, was a sense of a couple different competing art styles, right? You've got the creatures of Wonderland, which are delightfully wicked and creepy looking, like comic book type style. And then you've got these very kind of – just a complete departure for these two women. Now, I get the aesthetic that Wonderland is a make-believe land and Alice was from reality, right? But they should both exist in the same universe. I think what we're getting here is almost like some creatures from one universal reality went into a wonderland from a separate one because the styles are kind of clashing. I'm no art critic, okay? Female forms, I'm totally fine with. Though, unbeknownst to me, there's kind of been a trend to kind of get away from the more exploitative style of female protagonists and maybe, you know, dress them a little bit more, you know, so that it's not just like body parts on display, right? Not that, you know, I don't like body parts as much as the next guy does, but, you know, it was a little bit jarring, and I don't think I kind of realized why I thought that until I looked kind of like through contemporary superhero movies and such. and at the expense of sounding prudish, it was a little bit jarring, right? And the main thing that I can say is that, okay, the Alice in Wonderland art, if it was on a van or like a dark ride at a carnival, like it would fit right in with that, right? It just seems a little weird, a little odd, especially can I talk about the art panel that's on the left side of the back box cabinet, right? This is probably the most racy image of Alice over there, right? The classic under boob shot. But now the way she is drawn with that blue strap of her tube dress, torn, right, exposing said underboob and leaving this tiny strip of cloth, I think somebody must have ran out of some areola-colored ink because, like, you know, like, if you had never seen a human breast before, then maybe you would come up with something like this. For me, it's like, okay, as tight as that is, there's got to be some blossom there. I think you guys know what I'm getting at. You know, the skittle with the ring around the middle, right? So it's just, and then, and why does she have this strawberry jam on her legs? Like, it's a little bit strange. Somebody had commented that this looked like somebody took Zombie Yeti's art and then went over it with an airbrush or something. So I, you know, parts of it are creepy. I do like the card warriors that are on the box there. I'm definitely not offended, but it's just, I don't know, maybe it just wasn't what I expected. I don't know, the more I look at it, I mean, it's kind of growing on me. I think if it was in your game room and you like this aesthetic, I think it's going to be just fine. It's fine. I'm not going to pick this thing apart based on art. I don't hate it. Looking at what you get, and I want to get to kind of like a final sense of what I think of this whole package here.
    8:08
    Looking at the layout, the layout art kind of looks like it's a bit of a departure from what you see on the cabinet. The characters are a lot smaller. They're not as revealing.
    8:17
    I guess it's not very busy. The inserts seem to be in a good location. Who the heck am I to criticize insert locations? This looks fine. It looks fine. As near as I can figure, there's about seven shots Seven or eight main shots, including this captive ball in the croquet area Which looks perfectly serviceable I don't think it's breaking any new ground And why would it? This design is 20 years old, probably, at this point When it was first conceived At least a good 15, and it's been sitting in a storage locker somewhere And even then, it was unfinished So it does feel a bit dated with its layout I would really liken this to the layout on Queen had a really strikingly similar shaped upper playfield in almost exactly the same location. It had a Wembley Stadium instead of a Jabberwock. But, like, it looks about the same-ish class of layout. You know, this isn't like an X-Men layout where there's, you know, pretzel bumper shots and stuff. There's not three upper playfields like a Halloween. You know, it's not, you know, a fast and open layout with some interesting ramp designs like we saw with an Elton John, which, you know, that really kind of pushed the integration of lights and music and speedy shots and just feel-good shots, right? You know, interesting locking mechanisms and things. And that's kind of what this game is lacking. And I'm judging this game because there's, you know, there's only one form of this. It's $12,500 USD, and that's without any value-added tax that you would tack on in Europe. But the game doesn seem to deliver an experience I haven played it yet and I can wait to But it doesn seem to deliver the experience of a contemporary with an Elton John or even really like a Jaws LE or anything where those shots are really doing some next-level things with ball guides and such. But this seems fine. This seems fine. You know, Queen is fine when it's set up right. I'm sure ABBA would be fine. This kind of gives me vibes of that style of game. Now, I haven't seen a lot of gameplay. No one's seen a lot of gameplay. We did hear the call-outs, and my goodness, I hope that's not the final form, because the whole jackpot, Alice, was a bit grating. Shout-out to the kineticist for looping that and giving me nightmares watching that back and forth.
    10:29
    Let me give you the feel, like the sense I get. These are all vibes and senses. I haven't had time to sit down and play this game. I can't wait to do it. I'm excited to go play it. but remember when we saw the Whirlwind 2.0 kit, and you're like, oh, great, updated code and LCD screen for Whirlwind Classic Layout. How can this thing go wrong? And then you saw Suey and the Grannies, and then you saw the Scare Boys, and then whatever was going on with the pigs, and it was like, where is this coming from? It's so weird. What does this have to do with anything? And so animation-wise, it's just kind of like, what's happening? Why is the Mad Hatter like probably the most beloved character in all of Wonderland? You know, he's kind of, you know, nefarious but also friendly and seems like he has a good heart and is really just a crackpot. And, you know, the living embodiment of the phrase, you know, mad as a hatter, right?
    11:24
    You know, he just looks like a little bit of a kind of like a – and then when you look at the White Rabbit, you know, he's got this almost like steampunk, you know, like clock eyeball or something. So I just, I wonder if, kind of, you know, with the whole project, everything there looks good individually. But, you know, as far as, like, being cohesive, this is me probably nitpicking more than I need to. I don't like the look of the knave of hearts. That just looks weird. Caterpillar's okay. I don't know. So it's just all these little things. It's like, it's close. It's so close. And if everything was just kind of moving towards the same goal, it seems like, you know, I think I would like that better. So what do we got? I haven't played it yet. I can't really comment on the magnet flippers and how they feel. I tend to prefer being able to kind of trap up on a flipper and then more precisely dissect away at an upper play field. Probably can't do that with these little magnet flippers, but maybe it plays really cool and intuitively. I do like the shots that go into the plastic ramps. I get why they did the plastic, because that's kind of like the thing that Papa Duke is known for, although he also had neon lights in the plastic ramps, I don't really see any of that represented here. You know, wire forms, I'm sure, would look nice and shiny and chromey and would probably fit just fine, just fine. The sculpts in this game, like everywhere there would be a plastic is like a fully hand-painted, resin-cast, you know, Lior magical thing, which just, I mean, of course, that looks amazing, right? And that is where the cost is probably coming with this game. You know, the whole back part by the Jabberwock, it's all like rock work. that's all sculpted in one huge piece. He's got a giant sculpted piece for the back plate of Iron Maiden, and it's like $800 or something for just that one piece. And I'm sure this would be something kind of similar to that. So if we were to go through and add up the cost for all of these little eccentricities that were put on there, all of these sculpts, I think that's why this is commanding such a price, plus the exclusivity. So I get it. And again, if this thing sells all 500 units, which I think is entirely possible, then who cares what we think of it you know if we think it's missed the mark on the art or maybe there should have been a couple more interesting shots or why are we getting plastic ramps instead of wire forms whatever it's not going to matter because it's going to be a killer success for the company and you know that we'll see what they have next not every game's got to be for me right so ultimately you know clicking through this thing um we still need some more gameplay and whatnot and my photos aren't loading that i had set up here do you see that they did the uh the acrylic there on the right side by the little screen with the watch, almost like, you know, like totally Papa Duke style. I love all the detail on these sculpts too, looking at them. All right. So jewel of the game. I'll say what I was commenting initially, you know, on the Patreon I did after the game released. If you're excited for this and you got one, like, you know, good for you. I think you're going to enjoy it. It's Dutch pinball. It's going to have like an incredible cabinet build quality because, you know, Lebowski was nuts. You know, but we have a game that's, you know, priced right at, you know, Stern LE, right at JJP Limited Editions. And, you know, is it worth it? Is it worth it? That's so subjective. So my final thought kind of on this from where we're at, it's only a day into this thing. We haven't even had time to, you know, warm up to it. I don't even know what the second flipper does or the second flipper buttons on each side do. But I will say, this looks like a game that if it just had come out with standard armor and, you know, no art blades and no topper or any of that stuff and just plain plastics, I would expect it to sell for $69.99. You know, like Stern Pro price, right? And then it looks as if somebody took that, you know, $7,000 base game and took $3,500 worth of mods and put them in there because the Lior stuff is incredible. The whole thing is powder-coated. There's RGB lighting in the armor. The armor is laser-cut. You know, so it looks like a machine that I would expect to run around $7,000 to $8,000 maybe on the higher end. And then had Invisiglass and all this stuff put into it. and then you know what do you get what do you get right you know you can take the mandalorian and you can fill it with sculpts and a two thousand dollar topper and step back and then is it suddenly worth twelve thousand not to me not to me and that's kind of how i feel about this game i'm not calling it another mandalorian it looks like it's got some better flow than that game um but you know for similarity you know taking a game of that class and then dumping just tons of cool stuff into it is going to be expensive. And when you step back with the overall product, is that worth the price? If this was $9.99, I'd say all day. I'm interested. I'll try her out for six months, no problem. At $12.50, I haven't ordered one. I still have an opportunity, and I'm going to go play it at Expo. I can't play it at Expo. If you're getting one of these, invite me on over. Let me come play it, man. I think it's going to be cool. Could have used some under-cabinet lighting and some back lighting, some lighting effects, some projectors or things, but it is what it is. So that's my take on this thing. I like the little screen. I like the little screen with the watch. Those graphics look pretty cool. So it looks like a fun kind of quirky game with cool build quality from the Dutch folks. I love the Netherlands. I love the free candles and the cassoufles, the cheesy little fried snack you get in the Netherlands. Awesome. I don't want to piss anybody off over there. I don't want to get held up when I go to Schiphol Airport next time I head out there. at the Dutch Pinball Museum. So it's out there. People that have ordered it seem very enthusiastic about it, except for the guy that bought two and is trying to flip the other one, and now he's selling it for cost. So we'll have to wait and see what happens. Now, good on Dutch Pinball Exclusive for offering that if this game isn't made and you've ordered it by January 2026, you can get that refund, so that is built in there. So you're not going to be waiting two years for this game with your money tied up. You may be waiting a year for the game and get your money back, Or I kind of figure by now they'll be able to meet that 30 to 50 games a month and get through this entire build in a little over a year. So I think that's fine. I don't think the problems with the build of the Big Lebowski were related necessarily to cranking games out of the factory. I think it was because they had to fight a years-long legal battle across two countries and two continents and then try to start again and slowly build and ramp up. So now that they're going, they're successful, they finished the Lebowskis. Churn and burn this thing out, and then we'll see what's next. We'll see what's next. All right, what else is going on? Pinball Alley signs are back. I was at the Stern factory, and they had one of those giant Pinball Alley signs. You know, the ones before the one we just got, that square one that was $1,500 or so with the plunger in it? The big, big one where it's, like, surrounded, like, with popcorn lights, like a marquee. It says Stern Pinball's logo up there, and then Pinball Alley in huge letters. The thing is like 11 feet wide, it seems like. And all the little popcorn lights, they're actually like ruby red plastic see-through pop bumpers. It's great. It's such a pinball sign. You know, I've seen them. They haven't had them in years. People have been trying to sell them for $10,000. You can't get them anymore or whatever. Well, due to popular demand, they're back. When I was there, we commented like, man, do you guys have another one of those signs in the back somehow I could just kind of buy off you? And they're like, just wait. Just wait. So we got a little tip off that they were coming, and boom, out of nowhere, I get the ad. Mad Pinball had shared it. Jeff at MadPinball.com, he's got them. $3,500. Some guy must have been tipped off early and had one of these in his game room and tried to get it out for $10,000. And then I saw that he just dropped the price to $6,500. And, brother, you're going to have to go like $29.99 to move that thing at this point because they're coming out of the factory for $3,500. Put that into a little bit of perspective and look at a $2,000 pinball topper. that is, what, 26 inches wide, and this thing is, like, feet wide. In your house, this thing is going to be massive. You could put this thing up on a pole in front of your business, and it would be appropriately sized. This thing is huge. Like, it's bigger than a marlin that you would put on your game room wall. So, yeah, man, if you're in for one of these, good on you, man. I know Jeff's taking orders right now. Go ahead and grab one Thank you Stern for remaking these and just making these things available I think they all going to get snatched up pretty quick and maybe we see some subsequent runs of them But what a freaking sign man Things look awesome. All right. So I was just sitting around in my easy chair today, hard at work out in the risley drifts of Ohio. I guess we call it a drift. When I got an email from Robin Rath from The Electric Playground. I always want to say Electric Pinball. The Electric Playground or teppinball.com. These are the guys that make those awesome pinball toppers. And so they're releasing a new one tomorrow. They're going to reveal the whole thing. That'll be Wednesday, October 9th. On October 10th, the order banks will open. They're making 300 toppers for Attack from Mars. And it looks cool. Okay, there's a teaser video out right now revealing what it is. Price has not been revealed yet. That will be tomorrow. I got to have a little sneak peek, though, at, like, the sizzle reel trailer for this thing. And at first I was like, okay, it's going to be a nice layered plastic, LED-lit, interactive topper, just like they've done with Godzilla. Awesome. If you look at all the things that are third-party available, I think they make the best third-party toppers that are actually professionally made and such. But, man, I was blown away with what I saw. So here is an interview with Robin Rath. We talk about the process a little bit, talk about the product, what else is coming up around the line, what you can expect at Pinball Expo, where these will be at, where you can play one in person, play before you buy, and if you want to order one, banks are opening up tomorrow, so we'll drop that right here.
    21:13
    What's up, man? Back with my homie, the Robin Rath of the Electric Playground Pinball, purveyors of some of the best aftermarket toppers you can find for your pinball machine. Rob, how are you doing this week? How's your Monday treating you? Good, man. I'm excited to see you at Expo. I think it'll be probably the third time we've had a chance to hang out. So big week coming up. I can't wait, man. I'm working every day until Expo, and then I can't wait until Thursday. I'm going to be down there. It's going to be awesome. And so I'm sitting here in my work suite, and then I get an email update that there's an announcement coming tomorrow, Tuesday, around 10 a.m. Central, from you guys. And so I had to get you on. What's up with that? Yeah, Wednesday, because it is Tuesday today. Tomorrow at 10 a.m. you know guys don is uh he's got a video on right now he's at work this man is a hard worker uh i reached out to him and he's like yeah let's do it right now baby so here we are uh tomorrow morning at uh 10 a.m central we've got a teaser uh well a full reveal video of our next topper uh very excited to share this with the world and talk to you about it here don yeah i mean i remember you guys the first time i saw you before i knew who you were i saw the godzilla topper floating through and then like the Conquer Edition upgrade and you're doing things with like video screens on aftermarket toppers which I hadn't seen and then of course the Twilight Zone topper right with that eyeball that blinks and lights up you guys did a black and white version too that thing was devastating I wanted to get one I don't have a Twilight Zone I wanted to get one just to kind of sit on my shelf and just run through that routine you know we had that little worm drive or carousel that would bring the ball up and roll down along there like I loved that you know and so then we got your Lebowski topper which like sold out in less than two days i think and and you uh you had it for a short time congrats on making the sale yeah make room sometimes it happens maybe go yeah yeah and then here we are on the cusp of releasing it have you said which one what game it's for i think it was a teaser well i'll tell you now we should just shout out an email to our email list it is attack from mars uh a classic obviously amongst all of us um this is exciting for us because it is an officially licensed topper. We've been talking with Planetary and of course now working with Planetary for a while now. So this will be an officially licensed topper with them, therefore using all the artwork that we had at our disposal. We've got artwork by Brad Albright, who has done many things in pinball, but recently did the Motorhead game that was so highly touted at Texas Pinball Festival. And yeah, this is going to be available for Our Bally and CGC games works for both of those games. It's going to be limited to 300 units. So we're hoping to kind of fill the need of all those that didn't get in on that CGC topper. And it's got a lot going on, so excited for you to see it. And, Don, I just shared it with you. Any early impressions? Yeah, I just got a sneak peek of the actual video of this thing running through all of its different modes and the motions and things that are in it. And, like, yeah, like I love this game. You know, I played in LE before with the CGC topper. But, yeah, if you did miss out on that, this thing looks, I think it might be a little better. RGB integration, moving alien, moving UFO. But it's interactive with the game, too. That's the thing. It's not just running through modes where you have a remote control and you can change it to whatever color you want. It's, like, interactive with how you hook it up with the game. Yeah, we've got seven light shows going on with this, and we do have some articulating alien and UFO plastics going on. This thing has got a lot to it. I think it's our best topper to date in terms of light show.
    24:52
    It's also, you know, we continue to improve our dog technology, improve the installation process. So excited to get this in everyone's hands. We've actually got an install video coming out with Kerry Hardy tomorrow, and then we've got an in-depth interview with the Loser Kid Pinball Podcast. So really just want everyone to know what's up and enjoying being a part of all the pinball news, for sure. For sure, man. So everybody listening to this, you'll be able to see it soon. If not, it's probably already available. But, like, this isn't just, you know, blinking LEDs that you put on this thing. It looks like it's throwing light all around the room when it's going off, you know. Yeah, we were able to use the layered plastic to kind of illuminate the topper. So there's a couple modes. one in particular uh the um oh man i'm drawing a blank here um the uh the saucer the saucer multi-ball the um the hurry up multi-ball yeah flashing flashing lights why why can't i remember it um that that really uh lights up the room uh in a cool way we've got a special light show for video mode uh we've got a light show for extra ball flashers the green flasher on the dome like it's really going to hopefully, you know, reinvigorate your interest in the game because it's going to add new light to the room. Yeah, absolutely. And so, you know, they say, you know, the game isn't up on top, you know, the game's on what you're looking at. You know, so putting like a detailed video screen or something on a topper, you know, it's going to be impressive to people that are watching around you but not to the player. But having like that feedback of the flashing lights like coming in your peripheral vision as you're playing or like, you know, when you get to video mode, you're looking at the screen, and then this thing's like RGB crazy on top during that. Totally, totally. And then, you know, that moment we just – Strobe multiball, strobe multiball. Strobe multiball, okay. If I could remember for whatever reason, but it's a cool mode where there's a hyper-flashing light, and the topper, of course, does the same thing. So very in sync with the experience. Yeah, and it looks like, you know, the big thing it does, you know, when you do destroy a saucer and everything's going nuts, like that is a moment you can kind of sit back and watch. You've got a saucer exploding on the game field, and then you've got the saucer blowing up on top of your game as well. Yeah, it'll be a little hard to understand without seeing it, but basically when you hit the saucer and the saucer shakes, and of course there's the aliens that shake too, and we really wanted to lean into that amazing design decision by Brian Eddy when he designed that game to kind of make this obvious movement. So whenever you see the saucer shake in the game, you're going to see two elements on the topper that are actually fired by additional solenoids, two additional solenoids that are in the topper, and you're going to see a synchronous not only movement but sound whenever you make an attack on the saucer happening in two places on the topper. Yeah, that's awesome. And this isn't just somebody's aftermarket third-party accessory. This is like an officially licensed accessory you're bringing out now. It is, yeah. So we worked really closely with Planetary both on the licensing front and also just making the installation as smooth as possible.
    27:59
    We're not tapping into the circuit board or the motherboard through a Cat5 cable, but there is going to be a dedicated manual both for the CGC game and the Bally game. It's pretty straightforward. It'll probably take you 30 or 45 minutes to get that bad boy installed, and then once it's set up, you're good to go. All right, yeah, one little tidbit I saw there. 300 of these things, but 50 ready to go at launch? Yeah, so this will be the first time in our company's history since we launched about two years ago where we have products available at launch. Anybody who places a deposit on the product of $100 will be contacted by us within two to four weeks for final payment, and we'll be shipping the 50. So we've got 50 that are probably about 95% done right now. And then beyond that, you know, we're going to be doing 300 and we can move through 300 in about six to nine months, I would say. So we're aiming towards, you know, in the case where we do move all of these units, we'll be getting those all out by the end of, you know, middle of 2025, hopefully. Are you going to come out with a wall art version of this as well? Yeah, well, I kind of thought about it. I mean, we did do that for Lebowski because there's so many people there into the movie and bowling. We've considered it, but we do have some other stuff coming too real soon. We going to be showing another topper at XPO So we decided to do another topper not another wall art that awesome yeah so not so will this this one will be at at expo though will you it will yeah yeah have you guys both new toppers will be at expo have you guys found an attack from mars on the floor that you can use to model this thing oh man you know uh we're so fortunate to have a community around us in st louis that will lend us games in the case of Tech, and then we've also got Rob Burke, who runs Expo, offered to put his machine in our booth. So, yeah, we will definitely have it on a machine at the show. Your booth is going to be fire, because you're going to have that. You're going to have this new mystery topper here, too, for unannounced, so I can't wait to see what that is. You're going to have at least one homebrew, maybe more, in the booth as well? Yeah, yeah. So, we've got a 10 by 30 booth, which is like, you know, three times the size of a standard booth. And we were brainstorming ideas, and we were such a fan of Friday the 13th, which won Best of Show at TPF, that I kind of begged Kyle to come to Expo to bring the game. And I was like, you know, we'll put you in a prominent spot in our booth so people can really see it and let it shine. And that kind of brought up the idea. Do you know about that machine? I assume you played it at TPF. Yeah, the Friday the 13th? Yeah. That was awesome. Amazing game. It's like a Stern quality game, one of one.
    30:56
    And he's made a bunch of updates to it in terms of the code. So we decided to do a homebrew section. So a third of our booth is going to be dedicated to homebrews. One, Kyle Spetz, Friday the 13th. And then we've got a new one debuting from a buddy of mine here in St. Louis. His name is Nick. And he's been working on this. This is a passion project for him on so many levels. and it's got some of the craziest shots that I have seen. And he showed me some video. I can't reveal the title, but I can promise you you're going to want to see it and super honored to have two amazing homebrews in our booth. That's awesome. And we're not going to have to wait that long to find out what mystery at a dopper is going to be. And also this cool new homebrew. I'm excited. I've heard rumors, but I'd love to see what you guys got there. Yeah, yeah. So the homebrew, I'll give you one hint, the 360. Okay. 360. I hope you bring them onto your show and learn a little bit more about what that is at some point. And then our topper is an EM topper, which is pretty cool. It's going to be the world's first interactive commercially available EM topper. It will be officially licensed. and yeah it's going to be awesome I'll just leave it at that definitely come by and check it out and we'll have it on our website probably around expo time too that was too obvious of a hint because 360 I'm thinking Sharknado the pin is coming and if it's anything less Don I don't know how you feel about it I can see it in your eye man Sharknado Jaws is very much on brand right now for the perfect game at the perfect time. I can't wait.
    32:43
    Oh, man, yeah. So, Don, have you been enjoying keeping up with the pinball news? Have you been getting all your Alice and X-Men and Avatar news you can handle? Yeah, I got my five Alice pre-orders in. My seven X-Men are on the way. Really? It's been a crazy time. I'm involved in the tinkering myself, although still at the pro-am level.
    33:04
    So people have seen what I do to machines, and now they're starting to order through me. So I've got an order for at least one X-Men to get redone, powder-coated, toppered, shooter-rotted, start-buttoned, insert apron-carded, and then out to a customer now. So that happened. So it's been crazy just trying to keep up with everything. I unboxed the LE.
    33:24
    I caved on an Avatar CE because I was persuaded and mystified by the blue Smurf people. I've got to have that. And then Alice drops on us, and it's like, I'm tapped out, man. I can't keep going like this. Yeah, it's just timing. I got to play Avatar. It was a lot of fun. I haven't had the chance to play X-Men yet, but it's awesome to see lots of options out there. And this Alice one, we'll get to see what's going on with that at Expo, too. This Expo is going to be so great. Everybody's going to get to play, hopefully, all three versions of X-Men, both versions of Avatar. So far, very few of us have played the Collector's Edition and even seen the prototype play field for that. but they're going to have one there in a tent in a dark environment so you can hear it and see it and kind of see what we saw. Oh, man. And then Alice is going to be there, and who knows what else is going to creep out. Stern's probably got something else they're going to bring out. Do you still hold out on Cuphead over there, Don? I mean, we got to. We got to. I can't wait to see. There might be a black and white Berrios challenge there.
    34:26
    I was thinking, like, what better game to retheme, Just give Steven Seagal his due and just do a Steven Seagal redo on deadly ground or something. Or like Under Siege. Was that the movie where he was the cook on the ship? I want to play that game. Well, I know what's not going to be there, Don. It's Sharknado. Oh. Completely out of line. Breaking my heart. It's because it's a double release of Sharknado 2. Ah, we're on the right wavelength. I dig it. All right. So Wednesday, which is tomorrow, 10 a.m. Central time. Wednesday, Central, we'll have the full reveal. And then on Thursday, same time, 10 a.m., 11 Eastern, we'll have them available on our website. The only place to get it is electricplaygroundtppinball.com. And it's first come, first serve. There's no wait list this time or anything like that. Thursday, if you want to check it out or if you know somebody's got the game, let them know because you'll see the full reveal tomorrow. If you order early, any local pickup chances at Expo if you're going to be there? uh no i got it i got a lot of that on my gazilla already oh that's right the last couple lebowskis uh that that went international and we got some guys flying in that wanted to take them home so yeah so no no pickups uh but we are uh offering a bomb ass hat that's free with your order oh awesome um so anybody who orders before the end of expo is going to get this really high-end custom hat. It's got custom stuff on the inside. It's got the alien on the front. It's got this cool logo on the side. And if you do place an order, you can get your hat at the show. So definitely you'll see some more on that in the next couple of days. That's rad. That's rad. So shout out your website. Where do we go order? Yeah, Electric Playground, TEP Pinball. So two P's, TEPpinball.com. And that's where to pick it up. And of course, we're on all the socials too. So give us a search and you'll find us. Yeah, and also a bit of a hiatus, but in before the lock, like the Homebrew Mod livestream podcast, usually on Mondays, coming up to Expo, but then usually we can find you on Mondays there with Stumblr, right? Yeah, yeah. So in before the lock, doing it with Davey at Stumblr. We are really excited about Alice and the fact that Davey's partnered with Dutch to do some mod stuff with the game. So really excited to see on top of everything that Dutch is doing is they're pushing the mod community forward by allowing for mod integration directly with the game. And then we're going to be doing a special episode of the show. So if anybody's there and wants to hit us up and say hi, Don, we're certainly going to talk to you, I hope, and we'll be doing a show cover and cover and expo along with all the other amazing creators out there. That's awesome. That's awesome. What a great game to pick, too, Attack from Mars. Like a classic, very much like the brother of medieval madness, right? The CGC remake, very well accepted and well received. But that topper, very limited. And now there's not only just a viable option, but an officially licensed one now, too. Totally, totally, yeah. I mean, it's a great game. Lots of people out there. We get requests for a lot of CGC games. Like Monster Bash is actually one of the top ones that we get. But this one was really high up there, and it's a personal favorite of Alec and I. So we wanted to make it happen. All right, man. I'm excited. Anything else? No, thank you, Don. Get back to work. Oh, man. The W word. I hate it.
    37:55
    All right, thanks. Take. Robin, dude, what a class act. Thank you for joining me here on Don's Pinball Podcast. This was episode number 152. We're less than 50 away from the bicentennial episode number 200. I can't wait to see what kind of special guest we can get on that episode number 200. We're having fun in pinball. Pinball Expo is nearly a week and a few days away. I'll be on site from Thursday to Sunday come on hang out I got a new t-shirt I'll be wearing I'm so excited I get to see everybody all these new games Alice is going to be there Barrels of Fun is going to be there with some Labyrinths we're going to be a bunch of avatars they're going to have an avatar CE in it's own tent where it's dark and you can like really see what's going on hopefully they've got that prototype inked play field in there because I want to see that what is Stern going to surprise us with will Metallica be there will Dungeons and Dragons be there will Gary Stern be there handing out pizza coupons i don't know but i will say that i will be excited to hang out with everybody come to the medium mixer it's gonna be fire man don spinball podcast trucking along heading back to wisconsin tomorrow and then more mayhem well surely and stew check out the youtube channel email me at don spinball podcast.com for those of you ordering x-men shooter rods i'm getting your orders i'm building them i'm sending them out as fast as i can make them now they're popular people dig them Fire up the printers. We're going to make some more. Hallelujah. Howdy.