Haggis Pinball CAN'T Come Back from THIS...

Cary Hardy·video·23m 38s·analyzed·Jul 18, 2024

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.030

TL;DR

Haggis Pinball appears headed for collapse amid eviction, unpaid bills, and communication blackout.

Summary

Cary Hardy examines the apparent collapse of Haggis Pinball, detailing financial distress signals including eviction proceedings, unpaid invoices, lack of game shipments for 45+ days, and zero communication from founder Damien Hartin despite repeated attempts to reach him. Hardy defends his Centaur unboxing video against accusations of hype-building, emphasizes his role as information provider rather than cheerleader, and warns that only admission of defeat could salvage community trust.

Key Claims

Damien Hartin has not responded to Hardy's outreach attempts for at least 48 hours after initial contact, and Zach at Flippin' Out Pinball has not had communication with Hartin for months
high confidence · Hardy states he reached out to Damien multiple times with no response; separately notes Zach from Flippin' Out Pinball confirmed months of no contact with Haggis management
The last recorded games shipped from Haggis facility were over 45 days ago, with six games visible in boxes via Pinside
high confidence · Hardy cites Pinside posts documenting last shipment: 'the last recorded games leaving that facility was over 45 days ago'
Damien Hartin has not been logged into Pinside (where he was previously very active) since 2022
high confidence · Hardy states: 'the last time damien was even logged in to pensign where he used to be very active and transparent about everything was in 2022'
Haggis facility is being evicted, with new tenant moving in within a month
medium confidence · Hardy cites posts on Pinside claiming someone contacted the landlord/building owner who allegedly confirmed eviction and new tenant arrival; Hardy expresses skepticism about information source, noting 'i just don't see them giving out that information so take that information with a little bit of a grain of salt'
Damien Hartin allegedly has not paid rent for months and owes approximately $5,000 in unpaid parts/component invoices
medium confidence · Hardy references 'third-party source in the industry' stating Hartin 'has not been able to pay invoices for like parts and stuff' and notes 'he hasn't been able to pay invoices for even longer than he hasn't been able to pay his mortgage'
Only Damien and Marty have been manufacturing recent Haggis games, with the company essentially operating as a two-person operation
medium confidence · Hardy states: 'more than likely it's been only those two people that have been working there for a good while now chances are the last few games that have been sent out the doors have been built by those two alone'
COVID facility shutdowns caused months/years of revenue hemorrhaging that ultimately depleted Haggis's funds

Notable Quotes

“The chances are the last few games that have been sent out the doors have been built by those two alone they have been trying their damnedest to keep this company afloat for as long as they possibly could but it looks like the inevitable demise is upon them”
Cary Hardy@ 2:02 — Sets up core thesis that Haggis is a two-person operation in terminal decline
“I'm not going to give you all the information of our conversation, But would it surprise you that Zach hasn't had a conversation or talked to Damien in wait for it months”
Cary Hardy@ 5:38 — Reveals critical communication breakdown between sole US distributor and manufacturer
“The ball is in your court But whatever you have to say, I'm afraid it won't save you at this point. Because if there's anything I know that can kill a pinball company, it's a bad reputation.”
Cary Hardy@ 21:45 — Hardy's final verdict on Haggis's prospects; emphasizes reputational damage as terminal
“What troubles me the most is the lack of communication that's going on. And that really pisses me off. And if you don't want to talk to me, Damien, fine. If you don't want to talk to your customers, that's bold. Stupid, but bold.”
Cary Hardy@ 15:47 — Hardy's core grievance: Hartin's refusal to communicate is worse than the financial problems
“You making a statement about possibly like, oh, we're just downsizing, we're still going to be getting games out... That is like the equivalent of me telling my wife, oh, yeah, sure, baby, we can go round two, just give me five minutes to recoup, and I'll be ready to go at it again. Which, her and I know damn well, there's not going to be round two.”
Cary Hardy@ 20:32 — Illustrates Hardy's view that any vague statement from Hartin about continuation will be disbelieved

Entities

Haggis PinballcompanyDamien HartinpersonCary Hardyperson Zachperson Martyperson FathomgameCentaur Revisited

Signals

?
business_signal: Haggis Pinball showing multiple critical failure indicators: eviction proceedings, unpaid invoices (~$5k parts/components), unpaid facility rent for months, zero game shipments in 45+ days, founder communication blackout
high · Hardy documents eviction rumors, unpaid invoices from third-party industry source, rent non-payment allegations, 45-day shipment gap, and complete lack of Damien Hartin response to media/distributor inquiries
?
business_signal: COVID-19 manufacturing shutdowns identified as contributing factor to multi-year revenue hemorrhaging that depleted company reserves
medium · Hardy theorizes: 'covid restrictions killed haggis plain and simple every day that their factory was shut down every day they weren't making games was a day they were hemorrhaging money and they were hemorrhaging for months if not years the money ran out'
?
business_signal: Cash flow mismanagement: Haggis allegedly took Centaur deposit money to fund Fathom production fulfillment rather than allocating it to the promised game, creating cascading delays and financial instability
medium · Hardy theorizes: 'taking money from centaur allegedly and putting it into the company by getting fathoms out the door and stuff like that that's where you did the wrong' and notes 'if you're any good at math you can start to add up you know the overhead and stuff like that versus how much is going in the money's coming from somewhere'
?
community_signal: Significant community blame-shifting regarding Centaur deposit losses, with some pinners attempting to hold Cary Hardy partially responsible for unboxing video despite Hardy's stated neutral information-provider role
high · Hardy defends himself extensively against accusations of cheerleading and hype-building; notes some community members on Pinside claiming he was 'complicit' by unboxing Centaur; references Flinnibus defending him

Topics

Business failure and manufacturer collapseprimaryHaggis Pinball financial distressprimaryCustomer trust and communication breakdownprimaryCary Hardy's role in unboxing and media coverage ethicssecondaryDeposit/pre-order holder sentiment and lossesprimaryDistributor (Flippin' Out Pinball) impact and burdensecondaryCOVID-19 impact on manufacturingsecondaryComparison to Deep Root Pinball collapsesecondary

Sentiment

negative(0.15)— Hardy expresses frustration, disappointment, and resignation about Haggis Pinball's collapse. While he was initially hopeful the company could succeed, he is now resigned to failure and angry at the lack of communication. He defends his own editorial decisions but is harshly critical of Damien Hartin's mismanagement and silence. Tone is serious, investigative, and increasingly exasperated.

Transcript

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so firstly I want to state I don't want to make this video I honestly don't but we're gonna have to do this now in 4k now secondly not all the information that i'm going to discuss in this video is factual okay there will be opinions there will be information that has been sent via third party so let's get that clear as well now thirdly i have reached out to damien for comment explanation something as a matter of it's been at least 48 hours i have sent him messages and especially after i talked to someone i said this is my final attempt to get information from you and what have i got nothing in return now i could reach out to marty but the chances are and rightfully so he would send me to damien because in the end damien should be held responsible for the actions of his company not his not his employees him so i haven't attempted to reach out to marty for comment on this because more than likely he won't give me one and he'll send me to damien i don't know for sure but damien's the only one that i've tried because he's the one that should have all the answers but why do i mention only those two because more than likely it's been only those two people that have been working there for a good while now chances are the last few games that have been sent out the doors have been built by those two alone they have been trying their damnedest to keep this company afloat for as long as they possibly could but it looks like the inevitable demise is upon them a little over a year ago i had an interview with damien in regards to the remaining fathoms and his early release of centaur revisited and the questions that were asked were submitted by the audience. Potential or current buyers submitted these questions and they wanted answers. So I asked those questions. Yet, supposedly, the questions I asked were softball questions. My retort back to those of you that say that is that if my questions were softball and you wanted answers for a particular thing, then maybe you should have submitted what you perceive to be a hardball question that interview wasn't for me that interview also wasn't for haggis the interview was for those of you out there on the fence that either had ordered a fathom or thinking about ordering a fathom were also wondering more about these centaurs basically you needed more info to make a decision that's what that interview was for so if you watch that interview and you left with the mental thoughts of going you know what i put faith in them i'm gonna give them money then the interview did its job if you left that interview thinking uh i don't trust them they're not getting a dime for me then the interview did its job and that's who the interview was targeted towards not towards you that are praying for the company to fail i mean i honestly don't want them to fail but it looks like that's that's where it's going now this info right here was shared via facebook and then further spread by canada and i immediately reached out to Damien for comment and confirmation. Nothing. And then later, I think it was the next day actually, another image began to spread online, and once again, Facebook and then by Kaneda, and this is one of many trucks that have been getting loaded up at the Haggis facility. Now, you're probably thinking, oh, you know what, maybe they're just, you know, shipping out games. The last time I ordered a game, it wasn't being unloaded out of a budget rental truck. And I'm pretty sure that a lot of you out there that are getting a game delivered to you from a distributor, it's not coming off of a budget rental truck. Just saying. So I reached out to the only other individual that should know more than the rest of us, aside from Damien himself. And that's Zach at Flip N Out Pinball because he is the only authorized Haggis dealer in the United States. So, surely, they've been in communication and Zach knows what's going on and I can get some information from him. But would it surprise you guys? I mean, I'm not going to give you all the information of our conversation, But would it surprise you that Zach hasn had a conversation or talked to Damien in wait for it months What Are you serious And for those that don know Zach has been taking the blunt of this okay And he's been doing his damnedest to make these early adopters and deposit guys happy. Doing whatever he can. And his reasoning behind doing this, I quote, because it's the right thing to do. And Zach looks at this as another business decision that he made. There's risk versus reward, and obviously the risk definitely outweighs the reward. And he's dealing with it, he's taking it on the chin, and he's pushing forward. Now one could assume that he might be able to press charges and do something or whatever like that, But then you have to think, okay, so lawyers, fees, and all that stuff and junk, and just other things that he would have to do on top of already running his business. But throw more money into something to hopefully get Damien to give him his money back. But the thing is, Damien doesn't have any money to give. so yes it would be easier and obviously save money in the long run just to move on dealing with the centaur deposit fiasco is already bleeding his damn capital as we speak now according to some posts here on penside damien hasn't paid his rent for months now so he's being evicted from the premises now this is supposedly someone reached out to the landlord or the building owner and they allegedly willingly gave out this information that the current tenant is being evicted and the new tenant should be moving in in the next month or something like that i don't know how true that is i just don't see them giving out that information so take that information with a little bit of a grain of salt so on top of that i've also heard from a third-party source in the industry that he has not when i say he meaning damien has not been able to pay invoices for like parts and stuff and the the bill is like maybe like five thousand dollars type of thing and for those that are in the pinball industry manufacturing if you have an invoice it's like around five grand that's kind of a drop in the bucket for what it can be guys and so for those that work at stern jjp and you see these invoices i'm sure you're like five grand that's that's pretty small so so take that note is that once again allegedly he hasn't been able to pay invoices for even longer than he hasn't been able to pay his mortgage i said mortgage i meant the rent on the facility the plant whatever now also the last recorded game being shipped out was over 45 days ago and that was via bally pinball on pin side over there there was like i don't know six or so games that were in boxes so that's the last recorded games leaving that facility was over 45 days ago and now on top of that the last time damien was even logged in to pensign where he used to be very active and transparent about everything was in 2022 now i'm sure there's plenty of you out there that are holding on to that whiff of hope and they're you're just like maybe they're just downsizing that's that's that's all it's doing we'll still see our games won't we guys there's a couple of words that you don't want to hear companies say when they're talking about their future and that is downsizing and recapitalization Those are two big words that have been stated. Well, they haven't said downsizing yet, but those are two words that are more than likely going to be uttered by Damien. And those are two words that are not something you want to hear if you are expecting product from them. Now, there's someone on my Patreon, guys, that bought a fathom, has one, loves the build quality on it, So he also put in a deposit for Centaur. And as things began to progress and looking pretty bad for Haggis, he fell on his own sword. He was like, you know, it's my fault. I put down the money. I should have known better. Basically, he put the blame on himself. He saw all the signs, but yet he still gave the money out. So you have the people that are willing to fall on their own sword for their money being gone. Then you have those that are also willing to put the blame on Haggis, and rightfully so. This is on Haggis to be able to fulfill their end of the bargain here. But then you have those very special select few that want to blame me. They feel that I was cheerleading and campaigning for you guys to put in deposits and give Haggis more money. By all means, show me the proof on that. If I ever uttered the words in writing or verbally that you guys should buy a centaur, you guys should give freaking Haggis your money at any time Especially while unboxing that unicorn centaur that i still getting shit for for whatever reason any one of you out there i state it again i stated it before any one of you enthusiasts that said that you wouldn't have at least stood by to watch the unboxing let alone do the unboxing you're lying and the thing is if you want to give me shit about unboxing a centaur for your viewing pleasure and you're welcome because it's the only unboxing of a centaur that you're ever gonna see you think you're gonna get more centaur unboxings do you think you're gonna see those no you're not so you're welcome if you feel like you need to place blame on me even though you are an adult you have your own brain you should make your own decisions, but you feel I'm at least partially to blame? What the fuck is wrong with you? You're accountable for your actions, your decisions. I have never told you what you should or should not buy. I merely like to give all the information that you possibly, hopefully could need, if not more, for you as a grown adult, although the way things were worded and typed out on pin side i kind of wonder how old you actually are to make the decision that's on you or that's on haggis what are those two but if you want to blame me by all means send me an email i got my link down in the description down below the way if you want to place your blame on me by all means let me know and i will be sure to respond with a fuck off look i want i wanted haggis to succeed I wanted a centaur I want that game I enjoy it but going by the information and everything that I had seen I as an adult gathered the information and came to the decision that no I'm not going to send them money because I go by a company's track record their reputation so when I see that a company is delivering games very slowly like really slow and things are looking a little sus man i got my kids language going on now suspicious meaning things might be going kind of iffy with the money then no i made the decision to not give them money and that's my own decision i have merely commented on their build quality because I was there for the Centaur unboxing. I saw it. I felt it. I saw how well it held up against falling down on top of a pallet jack. Things like that. I have merely complimented them on the craftsmanship of putting this machine together. That's what I do. I don't comment on marketing or anything like that. That's not my field. I want to know how good the build quality of a game is and how well it plays that's my primary showing for that video was if all I wanted to do was play it that's all I would have done just unboxed it and played the damn game but no I lifted the play field went over all the hardware went inside the cabinet the backbox everything to give you more information to help you make a decision on if this is a game you should buy and guys if you're commenting down below oh no reason to explain evidently guys i have to explain this for some of the dull people out there so if you get it no worries but for those that evidently are on pin side that's towards them not towards everybody i gotta simplify things break it down so they understand evidently But what troubles me the most is the lack of communication that's going on. And that really pisses me off. And if you don't want to talk to me, Damien, fine. If you don't want to talk to your customers, that's bold. Stupid, but bold. And you're killing your repeat customers on that. But okay. But to not talk to the person, the only person, that is selling your games, the fucking audacity you have. Honestly, this isn't going to disappear, Damien. You can't just bury your head in the sand and think it's just going to get better over time. It's time for you to act. And there's those of you out there that want to say this is Deep Root 2.0. I agree to a small extent on that. I disagree with them being Deep Root because they've actually manufactured games and they've gone out to customers. Where I do lean towards agreeance on that is that money was going where it should not have been going. granted deep root robert was doing things way wrong by stealing from the elderly their retirement to make his own enjoyment vacations and stuff like that and putting it into the company and stuff versus damien granted still not good by taking money from one thing and putting it into another but at least it was going into the company he wasn't going on extravagant vacations i mean we You can go into, oh, the intent and the road to good intent was painted with, what, the road to hell is painted with good intentions. That's the phrase or something like that. So good intentions or whatever his intentions were aside the fact was I do believe that damien wanted to make games he wanted to get people their games that what he wanted in game wise i think where he messed up is that he continued to try to keep the company alive when he should have just gave up or found an investor sooner or something else but taking money from centaur allegedly and putting it into the company by getting fathoms out the door and stuff like that that's where you did the wrong and again we don't have facts on where money was going but if you're if you're any good at math you can start to add up you know the overhead and stuff like that versus how much is going in the money's coming from somewhere i mean covid restrictions killed haggis plain and simple every day that their factory was shut down every day they weren't making games was a day they were hemorrhaging money and they were hemorrhaging for months if not years the money ran out and i think that's where damien messed up instead of calling it quits and pissing off only your fathom people you decided to keep on going and take money for centaur to keep the what was your thinking i'm going to assume that you just wanted to keep the the company afloat as long as possible until you found an investor that's the only thing that somewhat makes sense on this but you should have called it quit sooner and i wish that you would have somehow found somebody to invest or move to the states somehow found a way that way but now instead of just pissing off your fathoms you've also added to the hatred group all the centaur people so you've made it even worse for yourself you need to make a statement damien plain and simple although i really don't know what you could say at this point to gain the trust from the community. I don't think there is anything that you could say. So if you say anything other than admission of defeat, I don't see the community having your back anymore. Not after what's going on and the lack of communication. I don't see them having your back. You making a statement about possibly like, oh, we're just downsizing, we're still going to be getting games out, and all these other promises again. That is like the equivalent of me telling my wife, oh, yeah, sure, baby, we can go round two, just give me five minutes to recoup, and I'll be ready to go at it again. Which, her and I know damn well, there's not going to be round two. There's going to be me passed out. That's what's going to happen. So that's where I see the equivalency on this, Damien. You giving us promises and the rest of us going, no, that's not going to happen. What I lack in size, I make up for with speed. So look, guys, my faith in Haggis was already low, but I was content because they were at least getting games out the door. Granted, really slow, but at least they were getting games out the door. and since that evidently has come to a halt then it looks like my faith in them has also come to a halt so now we've got radio silence no games for at least 45 days but i guess it won't be over until you actually say something damien the ball is in your court But whatever you have to say, I'm afraid it won't save you at this point. Because if there's anything I know that can kill a pinball company, it's a bad reputation. If there's anything Pinside does for me, it gives me entertainment. because I read these comments and thank you to a lot of you out there that come to my defense. I don't ask for it or do I need it, but thank you. And oddly enough, someone was a little bit at my defense that historically is not. Flinnibus actually somewhat defended me and he has a long history of doing the opposite. So him defending me to an extent was actually, I guess, speaks volumes when you have people that say things like, can we also rope some other complicit parties into this as well carrie hardy was really excited to show off his centaur remake and hyping up putting down deposits even when it was obvious from everyone that the company was frozen and non-responsive all for those precious clicks his response after the fact was essentially what did i do something wrong i had no idea i got to unbox one so of course i would on camera read the room dude deplorable oh you crack me up man you crack me up because the only thing that would make me mad about other people's comments is that they were true but when they're just can be factually disproven it it makes me laugh honestly so there is that Fuck.