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The Pinball Show Ep 85: Turning Tides In Pinball Media & How The Kriesel Stole Christmas

The Pinball Show·podcast_episode·2h 1m·analyzed·Dec 21, 2021
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.036

TL;DR

Pinball Network launches dedicated streaming channel with Stern sponsorship and ambitious 5+ night/week programming.

Summary

The Pinball Show announces major expansion of the Pinball Network with a dedicated multi-platform streaming channel launching January 1st, featuring minimum five nights weekly programming with top streamers and multiple corporate sponsors (Stern, JJP, Flippin' Out, Scorbit, Measlemods, and others). Episode covers holiday gift exchanges, industry updates on Stern code releases (Godzilla, Mandalorian), Jersey Jack bonuses, Haggis Fathom delays, and Spooky staff changes.

Key Claims

  • The Pinball Network streaming channel will launch the week of January 1st with minimum five nights per week of programming

    high confidence · Zach Minney announces official TPN streaming initiative with multi-platform rollout (Twitch, YouTube, Facebook simultaneous streaming)

  • Stern Pinball is now the primary sponsor of the TPN streaming channel

    high confidence · Zach announces 'Stern Pinball is now fully supporting the TPN dedicated streaming channel' and explicitly states this is 20+ year market leader

  • TPN has more listeners than comparable pinball media entities despite producing fewer podcasts in 2021 than 2020

    medium confidence · Zach claims 'some of them are extremely strong' and 'would be the highest in the industry' without comparative data verification

  • Haggis Pinball Fathom is delayed due to parts arrival but will proceed; described as 'winding up'

    medium confidence · Dr. John reports 'Fathom will be going ahead as soon as all the parts have arrived' and notes Haggis has become 'half a year behind'

  • Stern released major code updates for Godzilla and multiple Spike 2 games this week

    high confidence · Craig Bobby reports new code for Mandalorian (second week), Godzilla with 'lots of new goodies,' plus Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Black Knight, Guardians, Aerosmith, Aerosmith

  • Jersey Jack Pinball gave year-end bonuses to every employee

    high confidence · Ken Rudberg reports 'owners have given year-end bonuses to each and every employee of Jersey Jack Pinball' due to successful year

  • Spooky Pinball experienced staff departures (Bowen and David mentioned) but is hiring for coding and quality control improvements

    medium confidence · Dr. John reports 'big changes with some staff moving on, such as Bowen and David, and new staff coming in'

  • The next Stern title (rumored to be Rush) is delayed due to supply chain and parts shortages

    medium confidence · Craig Bobby reports Rush 'was supposed to be slated for release by right around now, appears to be delayed as part shortages continue to plague all pinball manufacturers'

Notable Quotes

  • “The Pinball Network is coming in hot to the end of the year and to the start of 2022 in a very big way. We are announcing today...we have done a terrific job in building a network of media and content creation for all of you.”

    Zach Minney @ TPN streaming announcement segment — Announces major TPN expansion and official streaming channel initiative

  • “Stern Pinball is now fully supporting the TPN dedicated streaming channel. And I couldn't be happier with the number one manufacturer for 20-plus years, saying we love what you guys are doing and we want to be a part of this.”

    Zach Minney @ Sponsor announcement segment — Confirms Stern as primary TPN streaming sponsor, validates market positioning

  • “The owners have given year-end bonuses to each and every employee of Jersey Jack Pinball. This is sure to help push the teams to continue to make the great games that have been coming out of that factory.”

    Ken Rudberg @ JJP Update segment — Indicates JJP financial health and employee morale commitment

  • “Haggis kind of built a name for itself on being really transparent with updates and my understanding is the updates quit coming and when you change behavior like that, people are going to get gun-shy.”

    Dennis Creasel @ Haggis discussion segment — Explains community skepticism toward Haggis based on communication patterns

  • “Fathom will be going ahead as soon as all the parts have arrived. I'm so sure that I'm in on number one on the Fathom Mermaid Edition.”

    Dr. John @ Haggis Fathom update — Reassures listeners about Fathom production status despite delays

  • “Godzilla, with lots of new goodies in that code as Stern continues to add and develop their latest absolute monster of a game.”

    Craig Bobby @ Stern News Update segment — Confirms substantial Godzilla code development and ongoing improvements

  • “At minimum, there's going to be five nights a week that you're going to see a stream on the TPN streaming channel...we're looking at filling every single night of the week.”

Entities

The Pinball Network (TPN)organizationZach MinneypersonDennis CreaselpersonStern PinballcompanyJersey Jack PinballcompanyHaggis PinballcompanySpooky PinballcompanyCraig Bobbyperson

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Jersey Jack Pinball demonstrating strong financial health with year-end bonuses to all employees

    high · Ken Rudberg announces 'owners have given year-end bonuses to each and every employee of Jersey Jack Pinball' due to successful year

  • ?

    business_signal: Stern Pinball becomes primary corporate sponsor of Pinball Network streaming channel, signaling major manufacturer commitment to community media infrastructure

    high · Zach announces 'Stern Pinball will now be fully supporting the TPN dedicated streaming channel' and characterizes them as '20+ year market leader' validating industry dominance

  • ?

    community_signal: TPN launching ambitious multi-platform streaming initiative (Twitch, YouTube, Facebook simultaneous) with minimum 5 nights/week programming and top-tier sponsorship package

    high · Announced partnerships with Stern, Flippin' Out, Scorbit, Measlemods, Flawless Creations, Pinball Photos, Speaker Light Kits, Comet Pinball; plans for daily streaming schedule

  • ?

    community_signal: TPN establishing itself as dominant pinball media entity with claimed listener numbers exceeding other industry competitors

    medium · Zach claims TPN shows 'would be the highest in the industry' and suggests 'most listened-to entity' without comparative data; notes listener count grew despite fewer podcasts

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Spooky Pinball positioning itself as distinct niche home game manufacturer; Dr. John advocates for appreciating Spooky games on their own merits rather than comparing to Stern/JJP

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.364

0:00
Warning, the following episode contains adult language and screaming goats. Listener discretion is advised.
0:11
The Pinball Network is online. Launching The Pinball Show. It's the holiday season on 85 The Pinball Show. Join myself, the Pinball Santa, and Dennis, the Grinch that stole Pinball Creasel, as we discuss ginormous news from the Pinball Network, along with news of the 2021 Crystals. Zombie Bumble appearing on the Freeplay Pinball Podcast. A hefty Godzilla update. Certain production updates on Insider Kids, Game Timelines, and the next Cornerstone. JJP truly giving back to their employees this holiday season. An Alien LV sighting. Have yourself a hot dog from hell. Multimorphic, adding a couple of pilgrims to their team. Dennis versus the Halloweeners. Pinball market trends. A top 100 heist. And issuing you, the listener, a pinball bounty. All of this and more for you, our lovely listeners, as we bring you the hap-hap-happiest podcast since Bing Crosby tap danced with Danny fucking Kay. And when Santa squeezes his fat white ass down the chimney tonight, He's going to find the jolliest bunch of assholes this side of Pennside.
1:32
Pinball is a game of skill. For some, it's a passion and a lifestyle. It's time for the Pinball Show. It's pinball with personality. I'm so down.
1:47
I'm watching you fall. I love people around Baby, please come on Well, Dennis, I don't know if the snow is coming down, but we're in episode 85, I believe, of the Pinball Show here exclusively on the Pinball Network. Dennis Creasel and myself, Zach Minney, are your hosts for this lovely program. My friend Dennis, how are you? I'm fine. Just fine, huh? It got cold, and my little tire indicator came on, so I think I'm going to have to re-air up the tires to get them into proper pressure again. Oh, really? Yeah, I saw that this morning when I was going out to get my pizza rolls. What kind of pizza rolls? Your combination? No, no. I got some knockoff pizza rolls. What? I don't know the real brands anymore, Zach. I've passed that a long time ago. You were on the Flippin' Out stream with Joel Engelberth and Craig Bobby doing live video. Me and Craig Bobby? Yeah. Did you know he now is a mahogany conference room table at Stern? I loved that when you said that, yeah. That's like his thing now. What was that from, like Get Smart? Who was the agent? Probably. Or that kind of reminds me of that Dana Carvey Master of Disguise. Am I not turtling up for you? Yeah. I like the part where he's a turtle. I'm a terrible turtle rage. Turtle, turtle. That's where my turtle lines come from. It's the only good thing to come out of that movie. I was going to say, that movie was atrocious. We know you don't like Christmas music. What about Christmas movies?

Zach Minney @ TPN streaming initiative announcement — Outlines aggressive TPN streaming schedule and ambition

  • “We're going to be streaming...we're going to be multicasting across Facebook, YouTube, and Twitch simultaneously. And then after that show is over, it's going to be uploaded on demand onto the pinballnetwork YouTube page.”

    Zach Minney @ TPN streaming technical details segment — Describes multi-platform streaming strategy and on-demand content preservation

    • Dr. John
    person
    Ken Rudbergperson
    Godzilla (Stern)game
    Fathom (Haggis Pinball)game
    Bowen Kerinsperson
    Flippin' Out Pinballcompany
    Scorbitcompany
    Measlemodscompany
    Comet Pinballcompany
    The Mandalorian (Stern)game
    Rush (Stern - rumored)game
    Deep Root Pinballcompany
    Highway Pinballcompany
    Dwight Sullivanperson
    Pinball Photoscompany
    Speaker Light Kitscompany

    medium · Dr. John states 'if people just stop trying to compare them to Stern and JJP and appreciate them for what they are, I think everyone will have a much better time'

  • $

    market_signal: Haggis Pinball facing community skepticism and criticism due to reduced communication transparency and production delays; described as approximately 6 months behind schedule

    high · Dennis notes Haggis 'built a name for itself on being really transparent with updates...the updates quit coming' and is 'half a year behind'; compared to Highway/Deep Root precedents

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Spooky Pinball experiencing staff departures; Bowen and David leaving; new hires for coding and quality control improvements

    medium · Dr. John reports 'big changes with some staff moving on, such as Bowen and David, and new staff coming in to improve coding, quality control and production'

  • $

    market_signal: Supply chain constraints affecting pricing and production across pinball industry; manufacturing delays impacting distributor, operator, and consumer satisfaction

    medium · Craig Bobby notes 'shortages and supply chain issues continue to plague all pinball manufacturers, much to the frustration of distributors, operators, and consumers'

  • ?

    announcement: TPN sponsors hint at exclusive product reveals and announcements planned for upcoming streaming channel programming

    medium · Zach states 'we might have some new releases coming from these sponsors that you're going to see exclusively and first on the Pinball Network streaming channel'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Stern's next title (rumored Rush) delayed due to parts shortages and supply chain issues; no official announcement timing confirmed

    medium · Craig Bobby reports 'Rush...was supposed to be slated for release by right around now, appears to be delayed as part shortages continue to plague all pinball manufacturers'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Community sentiment toward Haggis Pinball shifting negatively due to perceived communication breakdown and delays; compared unfavorably to established manufacturers

    medium · Dennis explains 'when you change behavior like that, people are going to get gun-shy'; comparison to Highway/Deep Root precedents; Dr. John requests listeners 'chill out'

  • ?

    technology_signal: Stern continuing active code development cycle with major updates to Godzilla and multiple Spike 2 games; Mandalorian receiving second consecutive week of updates

    high · Craig Bobby reports new code for Godzilla 'with lots of new goodies,' Mandalorian (second week), plus Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Black Knight, Guardians, Aerosmith

    • 3:19
    Yeah, Die Hard's pretty good. What about, like, Christmas movies? I don't know. The Ralphie shooting Zion? Usually on Christmas Day, I watch A Christmas Story. Okay, with the family?
    3:33
    Yeah, we'd usually have it on. Some channel will always run them, so we would put that on. And, I mean, I've seen some. I've seen a number of them, I guess. I just don't. They're fine. What about The Grinch?
    3:47
    I mean, I saw the cartoon one when I was a kid. Okay. I never saw the one with Jim Carrey. Dennis Creasel? I saw Ace Ventura, though, so I think I've got that, like, covered. Yeah, but, I mean, can there ever be enough Jim Carrey?
    4:03
    Well, probably. I mean, you're going to watch Sonic 2, probably. Sonic 2? Yeah, he's got a pretty big mustache there. Mm-hmm. I'm going to watch that because it's got Idris Elba. Oh, yeah. Tough-ass sexy. I'm canceling the Sonicpocalypse. That's a line from Pacific Rim, kind of. Oh. I'm just spelling them all out for you now because I know you haven't seen any of this stuff. I've seen Pacific Rim, but it wasn't notable enough to remember. Oh, someone's anti-kaiju. No wonder you hate Godzilla so much. Yeah, I'm more of a King Kong guy myself. I'm already seeing people, total separate from the Pinball Network, but I'm already seeing people saying stuff like, I'm going to cancel from straight down the middle of their Godzilla review as a B+. I did hear that. People are going to see that. God has been thrown. Well, yeah. Listener out there, if you have not seen Jim Carrey's How the Grinch Stole Christmas, I think it passed the classic for me. There's just enough in there that is really good. And coming out of that film, Dennis, is one of the greatest Christmas songs of all time. Where are you Christmas? Why can't I find you? Why have you gone away?
    5:19
    I know there's no saying. No, I don't think so. I don't think I know it. Not well, at least. And speaking of, we talked last week, listener, about how the Creasle stole Christmas. you gifted Nicole and I something so special, and I've already raved over it last week. But thank you again, Dennis. And for those of you who didn't hear, go back to last episode, 84, where Dennis Creasel was turning up in a big way. I wonder what you're going to get this year for Christmas, besides a fan.
    5:47
    Yeah, I hope I get that fan. Don't you have like an Amazon list? I need an Amazon list. Yeah, I do have an Amazon list. Does it have a toaster on there? No. I thought about putting on a new toaster, though. I told my wife, I said, he's very practical, so I need to find something practical. I just don't toast things much is the only reason why I haven't replaced the current toaster. Side note, I did reach out to Tony because I asked him, I was like, do you know this or what's this? And he was helpful. Was he? Yeah. One of the things I wanted to get, he was like, man, he's already got that. Damn it. And he didn't know your shoe size, so.
    6:25
    Yeah. What best friend doesn't know his shoe size, honestly? We don't, like, trade shoes. I know Greg Bone's shoe size. I think that's kind of weird, but... Really? Yeah. I think... And there are new people who would... The closest there would ever be is, like, someone had huge feet. You'd be like, whoa, what size shoes do you wear? That'd be, like, it. No one else would care. Like, people with, like, little feet like me, no one cares. Oh, little feet. I'm going to go... I think we've discussed it here, but I've forgotten. I think you're a... I think you're a 10. Yes. Am I right, Steve? Yeah. I know your shoe size. You're the same as a... Greg Bone is a... He's a 10 and a half, sometimes 11, depending on the fit size. Sometimes his feet just swell. Do bees sting him constantly? Well, it depends. You know, Nike runs to a certain size. Yeah, Greg Bone, little hands, too. Small, tiny little hands. Yeah. Almost like a genetic thing. Really weird. Like a... Maybe he's a Trump.
    7:20
    Trumpy hands, Merry Christmas to all of you. There's no other holidays It's only Christian faith Merry Christmas Look at my Jurassic Park Jeep I also want to take the time to thank All of you out there who gifted Nicole and I This year You got gifts from the community I did, a lot of it for distribution stuff But a lot of our customers were Very, very gracious this year I've got sweets baskets Even from Doc Finlay We know Doc Finlay from the Poor Man's Pinball Podcast He gifted me a Dolly Parton Christmas CD. Oh. Yeah. Well, she can sing, so her songs are probably good. Oh, girl can sing. She still holds up. And I received one of the coolest gifts ever. For those of you I didn't list, I'm sorry, I can't think of everybody, but thank you for the gifts. But one of the coolest gifts ever, I remember weeks back, Dennis, where I was like, if anybody wants to know what to get me for Christmas, I was joking. Not joking, I guess. I said the slot machine, Willy Wonka topper? Vaguely. I remember you talking about toppers. It was like training or something. It was like $350, $400. But somebody sent that to me. Gosh. How awesome is that? That's pretty cool. It made my whole week. I was so happy. So for you out there, thank you so much. People are generous, Dennis. Guess I'll quit learning how to install an in-ground pool.
    8:45
    I can't top you, but what am I going to get you this year? Listener, what do you think I should get Dennis Caruso for Christmas? I've got some ideas. Anything in particular? They can write into the pinballnetwork at gmail.com and share their ideas. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Let's do that. I don't think we're going to get the correspondence or anything for Christmas this year. We already got them the greatest gift of all, a platform. Oh, snap, yo. They've been doing a wonderful job this year. Let's kick it over to a couple of them to discuss their end of the year as well as your news for the week. It's time for TPN Industry News.
    9:24
    Hello and welcome to the Pinball Show's Stern News Update. I'm Craig Bobby. Well, the one thing on the minds of Rush fans around the world these days is where the heck is that new Rush machine, which is hotly rumored to be Stern Pinball's next new title. Like we've been reporting here for weeks, the title, which was supposed to be slated for release by, well, right around now, appears to be delayed as part shortages and supply chain issues continue to plague all pinball manufacturers, much to the frustration of distributors, operators, and consumers the world over. So it seems that as soon as Rush, or whatever the next Stern title happens to be, appears on the assembly line, then and only then will Stern make their new release announcement. And speaking of announcements, Dwight Sullivan seems to be burning the holiday season midnight oil these days as Stern's coder extraordinaire posts new code for the popular Mandalorian title for the second straight week in a row. Of course, Dennis Creso must be very excited this week as well as Stern Pinball dumped just a mountain of new code on its owners and operators this past week as so many of Stern's Spike 2 games continue to get new code updates because of the release of their new Insider Connected kits that continue to make their way out into the wilderness. The list of new code is so long, my holiday gift to Dennis is not going over all the version codes. You're welcome, Dennis. Instead, I'll just say that new code dropped this week for The Mandalorian, Guardians of the Galaxy, Led Zeppelin, The Beatles, Aerosmith, Black Knight Sword of Rage, and the biggie of the week, Godzilla, with lots of new goodies in that code as Stern continues to add and develop their latest absolute monster of a game. Well, that's about it for this week and maybe even until the new year. Happy holidays and happiest of new years, everyone, to all our fans and listeners of The Pinball Show. We certainly appreciate all the wonderful feedback and encouragement we've received this past year from everyone and look forward to entertaining you again in 2022. Thanks, everyone, for The Pinball Show. I'm Craig Bobby. Catch you on the flip side.
    11:40
    Hi, this is Ken Rudberg with your Jersey Jack update. As the holidays near, I wanted to share with you a heartwarming update from the Jersey Jack Pinball facility in Elk Grove Village, Illinois. The company has had such a successful year, thanks to all of you, that the owners have given year-end bonuses to each and every employee of Jersey Jack Pinball. This is sure to help push the teams to continue to make the great games that have been coming out of that factory for the past year Now let's hope that we can hear about what's next in the first quarter of 2022 And in the giving spirit, I also wanted to pass on a tip that might help those who are struggling to understand the rules of any of Jersey Jack's games If you want to hear a layman's description of how the rule sets in your games work, head on over to tiltsforums.com They have a wiki with rule sheets for every Jersey Jack game written by experts who have a deep understanding of the rule set. And this isn't just for Jersey Jack games. Almost all modern games are represented. It's really a great resource, and many thanks to all who have written these up to help us enjoy our games more. And finally, happy holidays, everybody. I hope you all get to enjoy some pinball with friends, which to me is the greatest gift of all. For the Pinball Show, this has been Ken Rudbrook.
    13:09
    Hello everyone and welcome to the SHIT Update with Dr. John on the Pinball Show. I just want to pass on my thanks to Zach and everyone involved in the Pinball Network for promoting pinball media in such a great way. And for my update, just a little chill out factor for the holiday period. There's been some posts questioning Haggis' intentions and worried about social media posts and the progress of Fathom. I can tell you, Kels is pretty much winding up. Fathom will be going ahead as soon as all the parts have arrived. I'm so sure that I'm in on number one on the Fathom Mermaid Edition. Damien, Martin, Greg, everyone involved at Haggis are very open and receptive to inquiries and feedback. and I think the final product will be an excellent result. Same with Spooky. There's been some big changes with some staff moving on, such as Bowen and David, and new staff coming in to improve coding, quality control and production. I've managed to own every Spooky game that's come out, apart from the latest two, and I always have the attitude they are a great home game in a niche market, which is what they were designed to do. And if people just stop trying to compare them to Stern and JJP and appreciate them for what they are, I think everyone will have a much better time with the games. Code is progressing with constant updates for both Halloween and Ultraman to include more movie clips and more call-outs, which is what everyone seems to want in the games. The result will not be for everybody, but if you like the themes, you'll love the games. Anyway, that's my chill-out message for this Christmas. So have a great holiday, as I said, and enjoy some pinball. Catch you all next year. Signing out from Dr. John.
    15:12
    Well, it's great to hear from a couple of the correspondents there, Zach. Craig Bobby and Dr. John came in with a haggis update, kind of telling people to chill out a little bit. They've been taking, Haggis has been taking a little bit of heat on the pit side out there. They have been taking some heat. And maybe in other places, too. That's right. Where's our fathoms? That's what people are saying. He's saying they're coming. Chill out. It's all right. The dragons, they're coming. That's what we heard about for the whole first season of Game of Thrones. Oh, I thought it was a specific Rim thing again. No, I went to Game of Thrones now. Everyone's seen Game of Thrones. I love Game of Thrones. Well, don't you remember in season one, everyone was all like, where are the dragons? and then there was the last episode and they were just babies. No one cared. They had the eggs. I don't know. When she walked out of the fire my Khaleesi and it wasn't the eggs I was looking at her. I don't know.
    16:08
    So yeah, Haggis taking some punches. Well, I mean they are like half a year behind. Sure. So is the rest of the world. I know, but this was a I think, I'm not saying that the criticism is necessarily fair. All I'm saying is it's, Haggis kind of built a name for itself on being really transparent with updates and my understanding is the updates quit coming and when you change behavior like that, people are going to get, you know, people are gun-shy, Zach. I think you understand. We've lived through the Dutch pinballs and the Kevin Kuliks and the highways and the deep roots of the world, you know, some that do, some that don't and then some that kind of limp along and Haggis is in that boat where I think the most apt comparison, honestly, that some people are throwing out that hopefully is, of course, untrue would be Highway, where it's like they turned out a pretty low production game in the case of Highway Full Throttle. In the case of Haggis, it was Kelp. And then everyone's acted like they're an established manufacturer now, but they're really not all that established. So people are like, you know, it's not like Spooky where you know you're getting the game because Spooky's done like over a half dozen at this point. And people should be able to ask these questions. I think asking the questions, asking for updates, I think that's all fair play. How you ask is another thing. How, and that's the thing with, you know, I'm not allowed to criticize Pinside anymore because I get called out on it when I do so, but that's not a strong suit of that forum, let's just put it that way. The other thing is, also you have to ask yourself, how many updates do you need? Do you really need a weekly update? is there really enough new news to warrant a weekly update from a manufacturer like this? Like this? No. Well, I mean, it came up with Deep Root as well earlier, before we knew that Deep Root was completely, totally imploding under the whole issue with the SEC. It was, they were trying to do basically monthly updates, and some people wanted more frequent, but it was obvious from the monthly updates we were getting that there wasn't going to be any additional information with a weekly update. Yeah, that is true. And look, listener, I've got a lot of money with Haggis. A lot of money to me. So if anybody's concerned about their money, it's me. I'm still not in a situation where I'm worried. But then again, maybe I'm just falling.
    18:27
    You're pretty susceptible to the hype. Hashtag I'm part of the problem. Is that it? Well, it's only a problem if they fail.
    18:35
    Here's my thing. If they don't fail and we get games that we love from Haggis Pinball, all the people that we're shitting on, throwing all kinds of hatred toward publicly, Do you think they then, in retrospect, come back and say, you know what? I was wrong. Do you think they do that? Do they apologize after that? That's the issue I have with people in general, oftentimes. Who apologizes to companies?
    18:59
    The public. Apologizing to the public. No, they don't. No, I'm saying to you. Like, I hate when people come flaming about something because of what ifs in the world. And then when it turns out that what if wasn't correct, you don't hear from them. They say, well, wait a minute. Well, yeah. You've done publicly tried to humiliate me. You found out that there was no truth to that.
    19:20
    Where's the simple apology? Well, the answer is it depends on the person. There will probably be a couple of apologies. Most people will pretend like they never said anything, and a few will pivot their complaint and say, well, okay, it worked out, but the company still didn't do it the right way. Yeah. And, listen, that was a more personal thing. It wasn't even the highest thing.
    19:40
    I think they could tell that. It's Christmas, everybody! I think we have a gift for these fine listeners. Some pretty big gifts, honestly. So big we're going to lead our show with it, Dennis, and it has to do with the Pinball Network. That's what they're listening to right now. This is news. This is big, big news coming out of the big, huge, it's huge, it's an entity of the Pinball Network, TPN. We've been teasing this for a while. We have. Perhaps we've been teasing it for too long, one might say. We're waiting on parts, Dennis. I'm not going to ask for people to apologize to us for being upset that we teased it for so long that we had. Okay. But for some pretty big streaming news. Oh. You know, the hardest part of the hobby.
    20:29
    Poor Robert Byers right now is like, he'll never get over it. I've never publicly named who said it. Oh, sorry. I've never.
    20:38
    Robert Byers. That's my mercy. Am I not possible? The Pinball Network is coming in hot to the end of the year and to the start of 2022 in a very big way. We are announcing today, and you're going to see a promo as well, we have done a terrific job in building a network of media and content creation for all of you to hear, watch, smell, taste, touch. Don't touch people. We've done a wonderful job with podcasts. How many podcasts? It's hard to even think about awards without thinking about some of the providers at TP and agree or disagree to. Yeah, it's I'd say our lineup of podcasts. We actually have fewer podcasts in 2021 than we did in 2020. But that said, the strength of the show seems to be a lot better. And the numbers have still, even though we put out less shows than we did back then, our overall listener count has grown since 2020. So I think based off of that actual real-world data feedback, they're pretty popular. Plus, we know the breakdowns by our particular shows, and some of them are extremely strong. Yeah, the numbers of many of our shows, I think, listener-wise, would be the highest in the industry, I would say. Without knowing the other numbers, I would put myself out there to say most listened-to entity. So we're proud of that. We've had streamers, streaming galore, streaming affiliates over the last, what, two years, a year and a half. We have, what, 20-plus streaming affiliates? We've onboarded so many. I can't keep them straight, which is a good way. George Fisher with Don't Panic does for us. That's right. It's too overwhelming for me. Anytime you see that, and we thought to ourselves, how do we continue to provide not only programming, but high-quality programming and consistency? And right now, our YouTube is an area of growth in 2022, listener, and we want to do that, but we're going to do that indirectly through another way. Starting the week of January 1st, the Pinball Network will also, in addition to all of our affiliates, have a dedicated TPN streaming channel. Yes, this is something that we actually have been discussing since TPN formed. And I guess before we kind of go into what that's going to look like, just for those that like to know how the sausage is made a little bit, I'll just say, when we formed the Pinball Network, one of the initial issues we had on the streaming side was how do you offer up streaming, especially if you're doing it all on one channel like TPN's hosted channel on Twitch, for example, and then equitably share bits and subs and all of that, that sort of revenue generation, with the content creators that are participating in that venue, plus how does that relate vis-a-vis their own already existing channels? Because almost everyone who actually, everyone who's ever come to us has already been streaming. We've never had someone say, hey, I want to start streaming. I'm going to start with PPN. Good point, yep. So it's always been a bit of a struggle. And the easiest answer was, let's not do it that way. Let's not use a unified streaming channel. Let's have everyone promote. Let's have everyone use logos. Let's have everyone talk about each other's streams. and I think that's resonated really well with our creators, but we've always wanted to do something more that works better for the viewer side. And that's where I think this steps in. And finally, thanks to some very impressive sponsorships that you have worked really hard on, Zach, we had the incentive package together that we didn't have to worry about monetizing the Twitch channel at all. We have sponsors that take care of the value to the creators, and then we can offer the unified streaming channel, which is of value to the viewers. Yeah, you can't go on Twitch right now and watch pinball without seeing a TPN affiliate streaming pinball, usually at any given time. I love it, sometimes multiple times. But in addition to that, we are now going to have a dedicated TPN streaming channel. Our goal is actually lofty, but I think we're going to do it. At minimum, there's going to be five nights a week that you're going to see a stream on the TPN streaming channel. And notice I'm not saying twitch.tv slash pinballnetwork. That'll work. Because there's going to be multicasting. It's not just Twitch now, Dennis. Yep. We're going to be streaming, but we're going to be multicasting across Facebook, YouTube, and Twitch simultaneously. And then after that show is over, it's going to be uploaded on demand onto the pinballnetwork YouTube page. Right. And that's something we're able to do because we're not going like affiliate our partner with Twitch. so we avoid the monetization and the limitations that you have when you do that, and then that allows us to legitimately be able to be on the multicast platforms at once to maximize the ease for the viewer to be able to enjoy the shows. Absolutely. So minimum five nights a week, we're looking at filling every single night of the week. We have terrific, terrific. The cream of the crop in pinball streaming has joined this dedicated streaming channel. So when you see some of your favorite streamers streaming on the TPN channel, they won't be on their own channel. For one night a week, they're going to take on that TPN channel. Super, super exciting. Even more exciting is what, Dennis, you were alluding to is the sponsors. The companies that are getting behind and loving the idea that we, what we have been doing at the Pinball Network, as well as what we are bringing into the industry this year and next. Yeah. And those sponsors we reached only for the top echelon of companies. Ones that we love their products, ones that we feel comfortable as a group supporting, and they are as follows. TPN is very proud to announce that we have a partnership moving forward with our streaming channel with Stern Pinball. Stern Pinball will now be fully supporting the TPN dedicated streaming channel. And I couldn't be happier with the number one manufacturer for, what, 20-plus years, saying we love what you guys are doing and we want to be a part of this and we want to help support not only TPN but the community at large. with some of the fun stuff that we have coming. Stern Pinball is now sponsoring the Pinball Network. Also, it goes without saying, but Flippin' Out Pinball Distribution will be sponsoring the Pinball Network.
    27:12
    Oh, and Scorbit. How about it? Let's get some Scorbit action. Everyone likes Scorbit. Heck yeah. You're going to see a lot of Scorbit installation, a lot of utilization, JJP machines. so you remember scorebit works on everything you're going to see a lot of score but thank you so much scorebit uh for the partnership in 2022 as well as measle mods you want the mod company i've bought the most mods from i think most people can say the same measle mods they have the biggest selection anytime you get a brand new game that's one of the first places i go is measle mods the hits don't stop there we've got flawless creations and Amusements. Those individuals that were looking forward to powder coating their pinball machines or arcades or whatever you want to. Flawless Creations and Amusements is now partnered with TPN. Pin Monk. We're going to love Pin Monk. It's the most pious of the pins.
    28:07
    Do you have a mantra? Do you meditate? I was about to say masturbate. Do you meditate? No. Mine is... Dun-dun... I feel like I walked into a prop on that one. That was actually an improv. Pinmon, thank you for partnering up. Cooling fans. He makes all kinds of mods and everything. And the more the merrier. We have Pinball Photos, crystal recipient from last year. Pinball Photos is partnering up with TPN as well. Get those canvas ready, baby. because you're going to see a lot of that on the upcoming TPN streams, as well as Speaker Light Kits, one of my favorite mods ever. You know how much I love Speaker Light Kits. You love Speaker Light Kits. Well, have you not seen that? You've seen that expo, the prototype Godzilla. I've thought about getting some Speaker Light Kits for my games. I just never pulled the trigger. And look, if Dennis Creasel is even considering a mod, let that speak for itself. And as of right now, our final partnership is with sponsor Comet Pinball, everybody's favorite LED bulb. That's true. I can't remember the last time I bought an LED that wasn't Comet. I don't think it's a... I was talking to Greg about this, Dennis. I don't think it's a discussion anymore. They are the... Generally speaking, they are the preferred LED bulb. Yeah, I agree. And accessories. You talk about those strips. Oh, those LED strips. Yeah, Comet pinball. If you guys want to know the best produced pinball bulb, I've put this in everybody's memory in the last couple of years. The Comet Pinball 2SMD Frosted Sunlight. That is the perfect pinball bowl. You heard it, Bruce. That's normally all I use anymore, yeah. See? It's that good. And more sponsors to come very soon. Still in negotiations with some. But you've heard it here. The support that we are receiving and partnering up with from the 2PM streaming channel is Stern Pinball, Flippin' Out Pinball, Scorbit, Measlemods, Flawless Creations and Amusements, Pinball Photos Speaker Like Kids and Comment Pinball All of those are helping make this happen for these individual streamers Thank you so much Yes we very very appreciative of them because obviously the streamers that are coming on the streaming channel they have their own shows, they have their own channels, and they're giving up some of their time and what they would make doing that to participate on this. And these sponsors provide an incentive for them to take advantage of that. that and these sponsors are going to now be able to utilize some primetime space and a built-in audience to showcase some of their new stuff. Yep. Ooh, we might have some new releases coming from these sponsors that you're going to see exclusively and first on the Pinball Network streaming channel. That's exciting. So these people are asking, Dennis, well, hold up. Is it just going to be Zach doing a song and dance every damn day? Who is going to be streaming on TPN? Is it me? You didn't sign it. Oh, no, it's not. Coming soon. Sorry, that was super-arbitrary for you guys.
    31:18
    Coming soon. We had a lot of people wanting to be a part of this because we have a nice big family over here. Tentatively right now, here is your schedule. Coming in on Sunday at 9, 8 Central, Fliptronic Jordan and Becca. One of the highest-viewed pinball streams in the industry. Extremely popular. Wavy arm tube guys. Yeah, wacky wavy arm tube guy. Wacky wavy arm. Think the green screen.
    31:46
    Fliptronic is big, and they are starting off the week right at TPN. We will likely have somebody on Monday coming in. Tuesday at 8, 7 central is going to be the pinballers. Eh? The Gaffelmans. He's down Carter. Yes. Carter man getting a haircut. Fine, though. Look like a hippie. Hashtag no judgment.
    32:06
    That kid can play. Wow. So if you want to see them eating tasty treats and blowing up pinball machines, it's going to be Tuesday exclusively on the Pinball Network. Wednesday's coming in hot with just another pinball and Joel Engelbert. If he's got his carpet installed finally in that room.
    32:27
    I don't know. It's a project that doesn't end. Pending carpet installation. Joel Engelbert has grown immensely over the last year. He's a cornerstone in pinball media and personalities. He is going to be dedicated to the TPN streaming channel As well as Thursday Don't panic with George Fisher himself Talk about broke right there, right? Imagine all those head-to-head fight challenges That might show up now Who knows? Who knows what his plans are Iron battle, baby George Fisher was like rated with 5 to 700 people Last week on his channel He's huge That's a big, big pinball streaming channel But he's putting that all on the wayside One day a week for Thursdays to come be part of the dedicated TPN streaming channel. And Friday, oh, so many people's favorite streamers. One of my personal favorites. I'm always throwing them bitties. It's Hub Challenge.
    33:20
    That's right. Jordan, Becca over there. Always bringing you, like, the newest games ever on location, as well as some fun play at home during lunches. They're coming in Friday, 530, 430 Central. Hub Challenge, Jordan, and Becca. Did it get better than that, Dennis? That's a pretty strong starting lineup. but I know we're working on some others. Other announcements we'll be following, possibly, tentatively, from Chuck Wirt, SDT and Pinball. Hadi Syed Ali from Frisco Pinball, an up-and-comer. He's an elitist, by the way. Did you notice that? Yes, I've seen his Discord post. I can tell that. He's an elitist. He's one of us. Tommy McNicholas from... He's more like me. He's like, why are the prices so high? That's right. He's from Jedi McMuffin. Kevin and Lindsey from What the Flip, possibly, and the one and certainly only Robert Byers, Top Room Pinball. Oh, yeah. Perhaps the most charismatic. Absolutely. It depends on the day.
    34:20
    I like that his last name reminds me of ice cream. It reminds me of Stranger Things. So that's pretty exciting news. That's extremely exciting news, and you guys are going to start seeing it in January 2022. Thanks again to all of our sponsors. And this is just, again, the start of what we're going to continue to grow here in the pinball community for you, the listener, the viewer, the supporter. Thank you so much to all of the TPM partners on our dedicated stream channel. And make sure right now you go. You can go to twitch.tv slash pinball network. Like, follow there, as well as YouTube. I think that's probably the smartest place. And Facebook. YouTube, Facebook right now. Go like the pages. subscribe to the pages so that you can be informed every day when something pops up. Man, I feel like that meme from Titanic. It's been 84 years. Just like working on this to finally, finally, finally get to announce it. Oh, my God. It just won't die. Just let it go. Old Rose is just as charismatic, if not more, than Robert Byers. I just love that snarky little Old Rose. Puts bill packs in his place, drops the big Hope Diamond, It's so bullshit. Yeah, no one ever dropped that diamond. Oh, come on. You've got to have diamond hands, baby. Hold on to that thing tight. Hold on to it tighter than you did Leo. Squeeze it. So we've got the Pinball Network coming in. Is that it for now? Why don't we announce more stuff? How about that? Gasp. Insert gasp here. This last week, the Pinball Network announced that the Pinball Industry Awards are back, presenting the 2021 crystals. Are we still calling them the crystals? I think so. Good. I don't know. Instead of a clink sound, they make a funk. We make them out of rubber this time. Foam crystals.
    36:08
    We need them to be less breakable. We need them more bouncy. Now, Dennis, you know a lot about this. You're part of the committee this year with the PIAs. Can you tell us a little bit about, is it the same thing we've come accustomed to last year? Is it different? No, we've blown it all up. It's all different. Once you were out, we could make major modifications. It's like, Zach's out of the way. We're changing everything to histogram. There was a sigh of relief whenever I was not on that first committee meeting. It's like, well, we were like, is Zach joining us? I was like, no, I think he said he wasn't going to do it this year. But he was a maybe. But I guess it's a no. It's a no. So moving on. So, no, I mean, there's a lot that is the same. There's only actually a few things that have been modified based off of feedback. We decided we would, and we knew we would make changes from the first year because there were going to be a lot of experiments. So in terms of what's staying the same, there's still going to be the same three categories of award types. So we're going to have, like, the category awards for the games, the excellence awards for content creators, and the Hall of Fame for the pinball machines. Yeah, pinball machine, Hall of Fame. I like those three. So in terms of what's staying the same, that category award categories are all the same. Okay. And we made no changes whatsoever to how the Hall of Fame went. We thought that went pretty good. Terrific. So the excellence section is where there has been significant reform. Oh, okay. And so the main changeup is we had, and you've commented on this on a number of podcasts about how it went. We had a group of 12 TPN people that got together and nominated and debated and selected recipients of the Excellence Awards. We're not doing that at all this time. Instead, we're not giving away our own trophies. We're not giving ourselves our own awards. Yeah. Well, as you remember, one of the things that I know frustrated you greatly was the members of the team were very, very, and I perhaps more so than anyone else, was very uncomfortable with the idea of giving TPN people awards when it was all being selected by TPN folks. Sure. And so for me, I refused to grant an award to anyone who was for their TPN show. They had a non-TPN I was willing, but ultimately we didn't. You know how it went, and I know you felt there were some very deserving TPN groups. It was a tough position, but yeah. Well, so here's our solution to that now. But we're okay with the TPN organizing the Pinball Industry Awards and giving the awards to TPN groups as long as it's not TPN picking the awards. That's where the hang-up was. So what we're doing now is the same judges that select the category awards for the games that came out during the year, they will write in. It will be all write-ins. They will write in, if they want to, a single name of whatever they want to win those various excellence awards. Okay. Those will be tallied up by the committee, and then the winner will be determined just based off of that. And if there are ties, then we'll give out more than one. But that's the idea there. I like that. Not a drop-down. We're not pre-selecting. We're saying we have a set of rules on, like, that people have to be, quote-unquote, good for it. We have a Trudeau rule, basically. Okay. where you have to be a positive force for the hobby. But beyond that, it's going to be whatever the category judges write in. That's what it is. There's no nominations at all. It's just going to be write-ins. So instead of TPN choosing these Excellence Award winners, it's the community, essentially. The media community, the hobbyists. It's the judging community. We're calling them pinball personalities this time because that's another change that we've made. We've broadened up the judging category. That was another piece of feedback. But we didn't get a lot of blowback, but we had some people saying things like, hey, why is there, you know, you're not doing like their tournament people that know stuff about games. The whole thing that our judges, as you remember from last year's Pinball Industry Awards, is we really wanted to emphasize that we're not doing it as a People's Choice Award. We want the people judging to have a high likelihood of understanding and knowing and taking seriously all the selections. Yeah, it's close to informed experts. We wanted informed voters. And a lot of people who vote in the Twippies are informed, but we know a lot aren't because people are going out and asking their friends and family. Mom, dad, yeah, man, man. Yeah, and that's true for any people. This is how people's choice works.
    40:41
    So what we've done is we've added – Deceased voters do deceased voters. Well, I'm not playing corruption shenanigans. That sort of stuff is a separate thing. Obviously, that's harder to police on these days. Can't buy votes. But well, with us, because of how it works, we're able to basically give a specific link to every judge. So we know when they voted and we and there's no outside votes possible. It's all very controlled. That's big. So so all the categories of the judges are the same as they were the prior. Like the same. Like if you're a writer who writes articles about pinball or a podcaster, the thresholds to meet all of that are the same as before. We didn't change any of those. but we added three groups.
    41:24
    So now there's like a social media group for people, and we will let you combine across multiple social media platforms to reach a certain threshold of followers. But if you're doing a lot of social media promoting pinball, then we feel you're probably pretty well informed, and that would make sense that you should go ahead and be allowed to be a judge. Kind of like a nap arcade. Yeah, nap arcade is probably the one that people would think of right away. They'd be like, nap arcade's Facebook page is massively followed. He posts pinball all the time. He's a pinball expert. He should be able to be a judge. Good thinking. So that's one. The second grouping is tournament organizers. Oh, I like that. Because they often have to, I mean, it depends on the location and stuff, but tournament organizers typically are pretty well informed about the current releases and stuff involving pinball. They know the game. And so we've got a threshold for a certain number of IFPA-sanctioned tournaments because that's something we can kind of vet. So that's why we went that way, including the main threshold is I believe we do ask that they have to organize at least one of those tournaments has to be, I believe, 40 plus people. I think it's what we went with. Okay. That's a good threshold. So, again, we're trying because we try and verify this stuff. We need to make sure we don't get overwhelmed. And if we don't have enough people, if it's a low participation group, we may make it easier to get in through it the next time around. But, again, we learn from our mistakes. And then the third group is also tournament organized, and that is high-level players. And the way we went ahead and done it this time is if you're in the top 50 of the women's IFPA or the top 50 overall IFPA, you can be a judge. Because high-level players typically know all the new games, too. And they know, yeah, they know what's good. They know pinball in general. They know pinball. But, again, because so many of the category awards are all about stuff that came out this current year, tourney players are some of the most likely to have experienced it, especially high-level ones who tend to go to the major events which tend to have all the new stuff. That's the logic that we went with. So those are all the main changes involving the selection process and how the award format is going to be. And it's a good measurement to increase diversity as well, which we're huge about here at the Pinball Network. So, man, nicely done there, PIA committee. So we'll see how it shakes out, and the plan will be in 2022's awards to make more changes based off of what didn't work. But that was a lot of the feedback that we got really at the start of the first year. The excellence stuff was the most confusing and contentious. But there were some people that kind of felt we were too media-focused on the industry, because on the industry awards. So now we've sort of broadened it. That's why we're kind of calling it personalities now, because obviously tournament players aren't media. But the goal wasn't to be a media, you know, this isn't the media awards for pinball. This is people awarding the industry, and we want a selection of judges that know stuff about it. Sure. You're very informed if you're a top 50 player in the world. You are pinball. We think all these things are reasonable proxies for knowledge. That's what they are. It's a proxy process. A scientific process into awarding pinball. I like it. Now, when's this thing coming out? Like, we've got April, May? What are we doing? No, no, no. Just like before, we like the idea from the first year that the awards need to come out in January because we're recognizing the prior year. And we think it's a little, you know, our logic last year was it's odd to have people, especially when you have the votes happen early on. And that's when, obviously, we're going to be kicking off the process for getting the judges here, I think, relatively soon this month. And the voting will happen pretty early in January if I'm remembering my schedule correctly. So it's like we don't want there to be a long lag time between that and then actually saying what the results are. Because fundamentally, once the votes are in, it's not hard to tally them up. So we don't see the reason to sit on it. So we're going to do this stuff will be all announced before February. It will happen in January. Oh, that's exciting. I like award stuff in January. However, we are the presentation process is also going to be dramatically different. OK. And I don't know if this is going to play as well as before, but it's what we felt was in our capabilities. Because when we got together as a team to start doing the planning, it was, okay, well, if Zach and Greg are not doing a presentation format like last year, no one else was comfortable that we could live up to it. So we said, all right, we're not doing it at all then. That's way too kind. We're not going to do like a Twitch or YouTube ceremony. So we're going to roll this stuff out on social media. Sort of award by award is the idea. So it's not going to be a show like it was. It's just going to be, we'll be able to spread it out over multiple days, and we'll be able to do something to display, like, here's the winner for best music. Oh, okay. And just kind of push that out. So in some ways, I love the show format, but whatever we would try and put together would be compared to what you did with Greg, and none of us could do it. We were just like, no, we don't have the time, it's not going to look as good, and we'd rather just try something dramatically different and just get the awards out there in a really clean and efficient process and see what the people think about that. And if they miss the ceremony, then we can see about bringing the ceremony back with some experts next time. But everyone involved at this point was like, we just can't put it together in a good way. and there's no we couldn't do it live because there's no major show in january so we couldn't tie it to a an event so that's just kind of what what we decided let's we started thinking outside the box it was okay well what could we do really different it's like well let's just focus on pushing it social media wise and not doing it the way that everyone's going to assume we would do it but it's still be kind of cool though if it goes that way because you're like every day you kind of get another little nugget i kind of like that it's you know where it's Definitely the one that we were most torn on whether or not it would be well received. We don't know. But the nice thing is, like, the award is the award. So the recognition is the recognition. Yes. And so that's not cheapened by however the ceremony is. Still, the award is still as good as it always was. So if the way we announce those awards doesn't play well, this is something to learn from and change next time. And I do want to go ahead and say thank you to you, though, Zach, because you did say Flippin' Out Pinball would sponsor the trophy. Yes, yes, yes. Very appreciative. That is a huge help. Absolutely. Because we were running the numbers, and we're like, all right, let's reach into our pocket. How many crystals can we buy? We don't want to call them the plastics. And I was like, well, I was like, well, you know, we could go to glass, and I think we could shrink them down a little bit. If I miss China. I haven't been able to teach myself how to forge crystal trophies. Yes. And there may be additional sponsors as well to the Pinball Industry Awards. They're working on that. And always fun. I'm always looking forward to the awards each and every year. So are you pleased to have a breather? Are you kind of like, no, I want to help my little bird fly, and now you're on the sidelines and the birds are doing what they want? I'll transition to the next story without asking that question, but you asked it. It is extremely difficult for me. I thought it would be. It's difficult to a degree that I can't properly describe here. It always is. And whether it's this or anything else that I've done or do, always, always difficult, even if it is in my best interest not to be a part of it this year, it's still painstaking to me.
    48:52
    Well, it's been real interesting because in our meeting, someone will go, I don't think Zach would do it like this. And then I can go, we're not in Zach's business anymore. anymore, precious. Where is Zach? He's not here. Where is Zach?
    49:06
    I'm your king. I don't think there's a better group that could do it or put on an award show, so I'm not worried in the least, but yeah, it's extremely difficult not to be a part of anything that is production award based kind of stuff.
    49:22
    I'm pumped. I'm pumped. And, you know, I'm still flipping out as a sponsor, so I'm still helping a little bit here and there. which is really easy. Yeah, you've been helping get us, put together some of the lists and stuff for us, too. So, because, I mean, oh, well, I guess that's one of the things. So, like, eligible games, or you've been a big help with helping us get information on accessories, too. Yeah. For the eligible games, we have, on the Stern side, we have Godzilla, Led Zeppelin, Jurassic Park pin version, The Mandalorian. Perfect. And then we have, on the spooky side, we have Ultraman and Halloween. They are treated separately on all the categories. And then for American Pinball, we have Legends of Valhalla, because our understanding is locations did get the games before December. I think customers did as well. Okay. There have been a few. But we don't have Cactus Canyon Remake in, because we heard that they did not. Only the prototypes had gone around to shows. Is this true? Okay. And then on Multimorphic P3, we have Shoot and Scoot, Silver Falls, and Sorcerer's Apprentice. Wow. Three there. And I think it was Led Zeppelin and Shoot and Scoot both came out after December but before January but met the threshold. So that's why it's the list. We did not put in a viola. We discussed that for Art Cab and stuff, but I didn't see any support for putting it in, so that's not in. But I guess for full transparency, that's the list as it stands. Kelch was last year, and Fathom hasn't been released. Right, right. Someone did ask, someone on, when I was on YouTube for Flippin' Out, actually, when Joel and Craig were on, And someone had gone into chat and asked about Kelts. Kelts was recognized last year, was an eligible, and we had it in the ballot last year. Terrific. Most people didn't see him until this year. Yeah. But, you know, the companies don't plan their release schedules around what's going to maximize my chance of winning an award. Not yet. Yeah, and same with Heist. Heist was the last year. In fact, it won Best Toy last year. Hold up. I did have, it's not beef, not Kobe beef. It's like lean turkey with you and Tony over on the Eclectic Gamer podcast. Lean Tony. You brought up the wonder, the joy that is the Game Awards, and my vision has always been something like that for pinball. You said that a lot of it is releases and launches, reveals of trailers. It's not really about the awards via the Game Awards. and you said something to the effect of the following. Nobody in pinball has any power to talk manufacturers into releasing stuff during an awards ceremony. Something like that, right? Yeah. Yeah, almost exactly what I said. You have no power here, Zachary the Gray. Yeah, well, okay. Just remember that one. Maybe was it a bit of a challenge? It might have been. Was Tony a bit of a challenge in you a little bit? Really? Oh, okay. All right. Yeah, you couldn't even get it. Couldn't even make it. Can't even get it so rushed as announced during the Pinball Industry Awards. Okay. Yeah, I don't think you can. I think you lack that ability. Well, as long as we release it on January. I mean, for those that don't know, I don't want to, obviously, this is the Pinball Show, so I don't want to go into a whole bunch on the video game stuff. But the Game Awards, I mean, in a way, at this point, in fact, there was an article, I can send you a link later if you're interested, Zach, but there was an article about someone, and I thought they were overly, because I like all the trailers, but they were very upset, and they're like, what is this? It's not even an awards ceremony anymore. There were awards they gave out where they didn't even read the names of the nominees. Oh, no. They just would show them up on the screen and say, congratulations, Final Fantasy XIV, and they were just flying through them because people are tuning in to a three-hour ceremony. It's not really a three-hour ceremony. It's really a two-hour and 42-minute trailer of new reveals and a little bit of awards. Is it a huge event? It's massive. You said to your listeners on the Collected Gamers podcast last episode that you confused it at one point with E3.
    53:26
    At this point, I think the Game Awards is more exciting than E3. Absolutely. Because the problem with E3 is half the stuff leaks out early, sometimes because of the company's own decision-making, and it sprawls over multiple days for all these reveals. Game Awards is three hours, and as I noted, over two and a half of those hours is just new reveals of stuff after stuff after stuff. And it's things that people haven't heard of. It's exciting. But understand that it's not really about the awards at this point. It's about all the people are watching because they want to see the trailers. That's why they're there. Yeah, and you want to see Game of the Year, I would assume.
    54:02
    I mean, yeah, it's neat, But Game of the Year is the only one they make a big deal about. They play famous music from all of the nominees over about a five-minute period, and then they announce the game. So it's still there? The person gets a 30-second speech. It's still there. It's just a story. No, it is, but some people are like, it's not about the awards anymore. And that's not something that people have been able to say about, like, Pinball Industry Awards or Twippies or anything. Those have been about the awards. It's about recognizing them, celebrating. And some people feel the Game Awards has become too commercial. because it is a giant commercial. But it's giant fun too, right? People look forward to it. Well, I mean, part of the thing is there's so many video games. A lot of times, a lot of the nominees I haven't played, so I just don't feel the same like I do about with most of the pinball awards. I've played these games, so I kind of like have this vested stake in which ones win because I have my favorites and my least favorites. But with the video games, it's like, hey, look at the top five. I didn't play any of them. How did the game awards start, though? it was something spun off of Spike TV I think it started as very much awards right I think I don't remember Jeff who organized those he worked really really hard I've researched very much so and it very much started as awards and it morphed into what it is now which is a global phenomenon and something that pinball will be seeing in the future how about that boom could be It is time to put pinball into the top gear. Stay tuned. That would be nice, yeah. Too bad you lack the strength to do it. You've underestimated my sneakiness. Wow, so the Pinball Network, how about it? Thank you, listener, for the support over the last couple years and on to the future.
    55:45
    We can't talk about the future without talking about Stern Pinball. Did you hear our last episode, episode 84, where I talked about trademark pending Stern's hybrid model as well as the potential for a pricey vault in 2022? Yeah, I vaguely remember it. I just want to get some of your thoughts. Do you see they're having the potential, Stern Pinball, to have a very pricey vault, and that is how they do these vaults in the future? Do you see that as a possibility, and if so, how strong a possibility? Yeah, it's definitely a possibility. I don't think it's likely. No, we don't think it's likely. So not likely for vaults or not likely for modified pricing vaults? Not likely. Well, currently, I don't really expect a vault. Like in 2022, I don't expect there to be a vault. Okay. And moving forward, I wouldn't be surprised if it would go back to vaults. But no, I don't. I don't expect them to be pricey. I expect them to probably be priced like the current run gains. They'll throw a Sam on the line and do a Sam. How many do you think they'll make, though, when they throw a vault up there? Well, not many. I think when they did Game of Thrones, sorry to interrupt. I think when they pulled back Game of Thrones, it wasn't really a vault. But they're like, hey, we're going to run this again. and we get the license, and we'll run it again. I think they ran, like, maybe 200, 300 units. Yeah, no, I don't think they'll run a lot, no. It really, really makes sense that they need to fill the line. I don't think they're going to try and use Vaults as a way, as like a money-making model. They make so much off of the new stuff. It seems like it's more work than it's worth to me. I don't know. Profit margins, if they're that much more, and you have to make that much less. Yeah, but why do that and get compared to, well, this is what the original price game was, when you can just do like an Iron Man 40th or whatever, some nonsense crap thing. Well, I think that's what I mean, though.
    57:31
    Well, I don't see that as a mean. Well, bringing back a title that is not a cornerstone that you can exponentially mark up because you're only making 200, 300 units. It couldn't be as a vault. I mean, to me, it wouldn't be as a vault than it has to. They have to make you feel like you're getting some special. Sure, sure, yeah, yeah. No, I still think it's highly unlikely. Okay. All right. Do you think Stern's on the hybrid model? Have they thought about that, how they get these huge intellectual properties, what I'm calling the hybrid model, huge intellectual properties, but they're morphing them with the love and the adoration of the original themes of Bally Williams, so you morph them into this Avengers Infinity Quest or Jurassic Park. Well, they already do this. It's not a hybrid model. I'm calling it the hybrid model. I know you are because you want to get some intellectual credit for something.
    58:25
    Let's Jurassic Park without the, you know, we're in Jurassic Park, but it's not any movie plot. Let's get John Williams. All I'm saying is they already do this. So, yes, they're going to do it because they already do it. My question to you is. Is this a way to cheap out on assets? My question to you, Dennis, is do you think they see this type of amalgamation? Do you think they're seeing this or do you think they're just like, oh, we just don't want to pay for assets? There's nothing more to it than that. I think it's pretty much that. I don't think they're doing it over the creativity that it offers them. You don't think they're thinking... I think it's a happy side effect. But I think it's like, holy crap, it is... Well, because you have so many people that get upset when they can't watch their entire movie on the back box. So, in some cases, they'll guardians it and give that to you when they can. Mandalorian. And other times, it's like, you know what? It's just there's so many limits on pricing to be able to afford the Avengers on the screen. Let's do it as a comic. And the designer will like it because they get more freedom. Like a rumored Venom. Yeah. But, I mean, most people are buying over two types of buyers in my mind. It's like those that are buying over the art package and then those that are buying over the layout and rules. And both of those pretty much can happen under either model. Granted, the art can be more restrictive. Hello, Star Wars.
    59:42
    Hey, comic book. Hey, hello. interesting to discuss. And speaking of limitations to Lucasfilm's Star Wars artwork, Zombie Yeti, aka Jeremy Packer, was on TPN's Free Play Pinball podcast this last week. That was a good podcast. Jeremy was pretty frank, pretty transparent, a lot of fun. That personality of his, I love it. Jeremy's a multifaceted fellow, though. He presents one way, and those gears are turning in another. He can't tell me any different. Nobody else can tell me any different. It's different. It's a book, and I can read it. It's not a good thing. It's not a bad thing. It's a Jeremy Packer thing. So I always love listening to him on podcasts to hear what he's saying but to also hear what he's really meaning. I think he'd be the Riddler if he was in the DC universe.
    60:33
    Well, I haven't heard this podcast yet. I just downloaded it. He was talking about artwork on some of the different packages he done with Stern Pinball For example Avengers I did not know this He was going to have the same art package on every Backglass Pro Premium and Ellie of Avengers Infinity Quest
    60:55
    That would have been very different from what Stern normally does. And he was worried about it. And usually at the last second, you go up to that finish line. He said he had a couple weeks that everything else was approved. It was good. He could have just stopped there, but he was like, I just want something different, though, for the Premium LE. So he went back and crafted a new one. It would have been pretty big brain, though, to be like, hey, you can't pick which back glass is your favorite to go with which model is your favorite if they're all identical.
    61:25
    But, yeah, so I didn't realize that. Hell, we were complaining the Premium LE had the same similar back glass. He was about to have one. He was also discussing his newly released Godzilla art package.
    61:39
    Yeah, that's what his... Insert that little girl's scream there. That's what his... Oh, yeah. That one hurt his brain. Because he said he made it exclusive on TPN's Freeplay. He said he wasn't completely happy with that project all in all. Now, that's pretty expensive. Was that ongoing or was that because of the quote-unquote backlash? No, he just said throughout, he just, he had ample time. He just kept going, kept trying, kept changing. He just said he wasn't, the conclusion wasn't as close to what he thought he would have or want to have as some of his other projects. For better or worse. Doesn't mean the package is worse than any others. It's just, in his mind, he had that battle of, just still, not what, he said the pro back glass, for example. He just painstakingly, he started over at one point after something was done. Started over. He just wasn't happy with where it was at. And he said he's his own worst critic, too. Nobody on Pennside can say stuff that he hasn't already defeated himself on. So he's not too worried about that. He likes the feedback. But I found it interesting that Godzilla was one that he just can't put his finger on. He's just something who's beating himself up. I think it could be not the package itself. because when you're interpreting dreams, Dennis, as a psychologist, you typically don't interpret the details of the dream. You interpret, so if it's a building or if it's a, you don't interpret that. It's the emotions tied to said content or topic. So I don't think it was the Godzilla thing. If I was interpreting this, I would think that this is an ongoing pressure for Jeremy Packer, who is heralded as the greatest pinball designer right now easily, but maybe one of the tops of all time. It's his ongoing internal struggle, consciously or subconsciously, that he has to continue improving and bringing more to the table. So as projects continue, I think we're going to see this internal conflict potentially continue as well, if not identified. I don't think it was a Godzilla art package. I think it was more.
    63:48
    Is that getting too deep there in the weeds? Well, yeah, probably. Okay, fair. Maybe it was just this Godzilla art package. He said that if he could have done something different, he would have made that green more saturated. Got to have them colors pop if you want to knock it out of the park and make things satisfying. I love that he hears the criticism and he just leans into it. He's like, if I could have just made it more green.
    64:12
    He also talked about sometimes getting caught up in some crossfire for publicly and vocally standing up for Stern Pinball.
    64:19
    I guess that's a thing. He does stand up for them from time to time. There's a thing with him and Steve Rich, I think. He says Steve Ritchie hates his guts, and that was a thing at Expo. Yeah. Did not know about that. Yeah, no, I've seen him post from time to time where, you know, I get where Jeremy's coming from. He had, obviously, his first experience with pinball and creation was Zidware, which was not a great experience for him. And then he goes, and there's a company that actually produces what he does, and so they keep their word with him, so he appreciates that. coupled with, I know back in the past, I haven't seen this recently, but I've seen him come up a few times where sometimes when people are kind of bashing on Stern, which is the biggest company that's going to get bashed, he seemed to get irked when the bashing would turn into the, that they're like all the designers, the content creators, the programmers are soulless, and they're all just doing it for their paychecks, and that they don't actually love their product. And that seemed to be what pisses him off more than anything. That's my read, regardless of what his dreams mean. I think that with Jeremy there, because you're on something, I think with Jeremy it is, we hear a lot of times media creators are oversensitive, or artists in particular, if we're talking about the industry. Artists are oversensitive, right? You've heard that, correct? A lot of them do seem to be pretty sensitive. I don't know whether it's over or under, but they seem more sensitive than some of the other professions that work in the field. Sure. So what I gain, again, I don't particularly agree with that. I think that everybody, for the most part, if we took a measurement across the board of industry people, everybody is sensitive at times. Everybody is overly sensitive at times, probably more so than undersensitive. Is that even a possibility? I don't even know. But you get what I'm saying. I think that when it comes to content creators, and particularly artists who are oftentimes eccentric, colorful, artsy, maybe we're more vocal about it. I think that the designers of the world are super sensitive too. The coders of the world are super sensitive too. They just, whether it's a personality or a platform, they just don't express it as much, I think. Maybe. That would be my argument. So it's a chicken and egg argument. Did the sensitivity create the artist or did the artist create the sensitivity? All right. Well, I mean, back when I was writing, other than maybe one, I think every article I ever wrote on Pinball, I got criticism for on some aspect of it from either that they hated my writing style to that they didn't like my approach to the content. Like I didn't cover the content in a way they wanted it covered.
    66:58
    And it's sort of like by and large, like if they said it in a certain way, I might reply to them and say, oh, I see what you're saying. This is why I went the way I went, and that's that. But I'm not trying to change their mind. And those that would say to me that they didn't like my style, it was like, I don't care in the sense that I can't. I would never change my style. So I'm just not the right fit for that person. You don't tell them to go eat a bag of dicks. Well, but I also don't get upset that they didn't like the style. Does that make sense? Because it's irrelevant. I don't like how you guys meander for 10 minutes at the start of the show. You know what? There are other podcasts for you. It's hard for me to relate to this whole entire conversation because negative feedback is something I'm not accustomed to. I don't, you know, it's something that. Your issue is, I'm going to tell you because, you know, I'm a highly trained psychoanalytical person. Your issue is you oscillate between both extremes.
    67:55
    You will have a mode where you are, I don't give a fuck. And you don't. And you'll just say and do whatever. And then within 48 hours, you might flip and be like, I really don't like that everyone's upset about what I did. I'm sorry, baby. Please come back to me. No, you're not big on apologizing, Zach. But sometimes you seem. I apologize for my wrongs, damn it. Sometimes you are not. So, again, that's where that personality thing comes in. As you noted, it depends. Sometimes people are upset and are not. I think some in pinball also, because they've been in pinball longer than others. like a lot of these artists are more new to the field, I think they've learned that they just don't respond publicly. A lot of them are just like, just stay quiet. When people criticize you, just stay out of it. Yeah, I say take your criticisms. If they're smart people, you'll get a lot of the criticisms, and you'll modify your work to fulfill that. If they're idiots, then you just laugh it off and think, you couldn't do anything better than this, so fuck off. Well, yeah, there is constructive criticism, and then there's criticism that's not going to be of any use to you, But it's not necessarily bad either. It's just standard opinion criticism. And then there's like the trolling criticism, which is designed to hurt you. I always say at the end of the day, I'm going to say at the end of the week, at the end of the month, Jeremy Packer is the greatest there is out there. And until somebody steps up and does better work than him, then he can tell everybody to go eat a bag of dicks.
    69:20
    Sorry, Dirty Donnie. Yeah. I still like you. Yeah. Great artist. Just not great enough. Where's he hiding? I don't know. There's been a whole lot of code lately at Sturm Pinball.
    69:32
    We've got just your basic clean-up, aisle nine code. We've got some Insider Connected updates for code. There's a shitload of games that got code updates. And then you have your hefty big mama of a Godzilla version .85. Again, small increments, but large results. Anybody playing .85 knows what I mean. Man, it's a good game. Production updates. We've got Insider Connected kits. Here's your update.
    70:01
    Right now, this is the hottest question I get via email and messenger and text and phone. Hey, Zach, I pre-ordered one of those kits from your website. Do you not have them in stock? No. Why don't you have them in stock? Because Stern's not sending them out to non-operators until 2022. Simple enough, right? Most people are okay with that. Operators are getting them. Operators are putting them in. And Stern Pinball is really cranking out a lot of these Insider kits. So I'd say here within the next two to three weeks, you're going to see all those operators fulfilled of those ones that were initially approved to get the first ones, and you're going to see them continue to go to operators that didn't have that quick approval and they waited too long and requested after, and you're going to see homeowners start getting theirs as well. We have hundreds upon hundreds ordered at Flippin' Out Pinball, many of which are taken. We're trying to have an inventory of them, but they get snatched up. That's the hottest item over the last two months sold. Probably the hottest item sold in history of our company. They're selling very well, and they are going to come out. I think they're going to roll out a lot quicker than you see other accessories or games from Stern Pinball. For the most part, very little issues that we're having. We've sent out probably 30, 40 of these things. Very little issues. The only issues we've seen come back were one person's LED light wasn't working, and that's it. That's good. So far, not problematic at all. And the ease of installation, I've heard, is fairly simple. So that's terrific as well. That worried me. The only other thing is like, and I have to check with Stern, I don't know the answer to this. Some people have asked, when I get the Pro Insider Kit, I get the new apron and everything, which is great, but I don't get any replacement, like, Deadpool stickers for that new apron or Avengers or whatever it may be. That's a good question. I'm assuming that Stern wants you to pull them off the old apron and put them on the new one, but I don't know. Or is it that, and this could be the case as well. Again, I'm sorry, I don't have the answer. They may issue those in the future. If you need, you show proof of purchase and you can get your updated decals or whatever. I don't know. Stay tuned for that. And on the production update timing of games, I think there is this week online we have the 40th anniversary Elvira, if I believe that to be correct. And the next week or two is going to be, to end up the year, Stranger Things Pros, that last run, Beatles, that last run, Beatles Gold, and I believe a couple Deadpool premiums. Where's Rush? The rumored Rush, or the next Stern title game, I think we're going to see that probably the following week. we'll see, maybe see or hear something about a title and then in typical fashion that following week after that we'll get a reveal and all that. So it's coming very, very, very, very, very soon. Okay, we'll just have to wait and wait. And Jersey Jack, I don't know where Jersey Jack is. Yeah, Jersey Jack. What's going on with Jersey Jack? Yeah, we still got a while. But the JJP owners did something really nice and holiday inspired this last week. Oh, did they Put up festive garnishes. Yeah, we heard. Or garlands. I guess garnishes are for food. Well, they could be. Maybe they'd ran short. Parts supplies. So they've got lettuce hanging above the threshold of the door. There will never not be enough ranch.
    73:30
    I can just see Joe Katz sitting under a leaf of lettuce under the door threshold. Hey, Zach. Did you try that Wonka 2.0 code?
    73:39
    Yeah, he'd probably say that. Love the cats. Love the keeper. Yeah, Jersey Jack Pinball owners this last week. came in and they issued, we heard from Ken Redberg, year-end bonuses to every single JJP employee. Oh, I didn't get any year-end bonus. I didn't either.
    73:56
    I did unbox an LE for myself. Maybe that's a hell of a bonus, isn't it? So congratulations to all the JJP employees. Keeper. That's nice. Let's get that pirate's coat done.
    74:10
    No one cares. Oh, Keeper's my brother from another mother. Speaking of brothers, Pinball Brothers. Oh. Their LV version. How do you do that? You do the better, Alien. Yeah. There it is. It's going to have a rasp in it. Alien LV limited version Teeter trailer was released this past week. Nicely done. Very teasy. Yeah, very teasy. It looks like Alien. Yeah.
    74:36
    Yep. Nailed it. Yep. I do like it. I couldn't tell in the video if they were doing this cobalt blue trim with the head laser cut around the flipper buttons. I do like that color. I don't know if I'm just seeing it on a promo and it's not representative to the color in real life.
    74:56
    It looked good. That game looked good. That game always looks good. The backlash artwork, phenomenal. That seemed good. Playfield.
    75:05
    Man. All said and done. if they went over that play field artwork again. Jeez. But it's a stunner. I love that it showed the beacons, the new lower profile beacons, do you see? Yeah, yeah. And I love that the format in which they showed, or the room of which they showed and did the promo in, was the ceiling line was just tall enough to sit the low profile ones. I'm like, I wonder who designed that. The owner of this room designed that. He said, well, the beacons won't fit in my basement. The low ceiling is a real challenge. You know, that's a challenge for me. Oh, my gosh. I got to tell you this side note.
    75:44
    I don't want to admit this, but I did make a pretty big mistake. Uh-oh. Well, not really. Yeah, pretty much really, yeah. I call it a facility because I don't want to call it a barn because it's too expensive. We're building something on our property for a showroom. I saw the photos. It's coming along nicely. And at last second, we're like, you know what? We want more space. So we built a loft in the showroom area. It'll have a bar and everything and a bathroom for all you party people that come over to hang out with me. So it has all of that. But I'm like, man, I would like to squeeze in some more games. So we built a loft. Now, these are 16-foot ceilings, so a big space. But the main floor is, I think, what, 9-foot, 10-foot maybe? So the loft was just going to be for storage. You know, you put parts up there. You put show stuff. You take your shows, put them there. I was like as long as It's as big as a pinball machine Maybe I can even get pinball machines up here So the contract was like Alright well we're going to have to make sure How much weight do you want to put up here And I'm like well at least a ton I'm taking you know 250 pounds to 300 pounds per machine How many machines can you get up So it's going to do a ton So he even extended it past 16 foot To make I think it's Six and a half foot Up there But sadly, Dennis, it's not going to accommodate toppers. Nope. Uh-oh. So we're talking to the contractor tomorrow to see what we can do about that. Going to have to raise the roof. Raise the roof? They've already got it all framed. There's no raising. Raise the roof. I may have them inset areas just for the toppers.
    77:26
    You're going to have to dig out an undercroft. Have a little pinball dungeon But I'm thinking about it But yeah I made a mistake And didn't Didn't think about that Wait a second It goes to the undercrop Oh man Flip it out Bye bye bye Or die die die Sounds like Rumpelstiltskin Yeah I don't really have A good cryptic voice Sorry You just gotta make do With the B team Rumpelkeeper It's ready Mmm I wonder if Funhouse 2 2.0 Rudy's Nightmare Yeah!
    78:03
    I love her taking that twist. It's got mayo on it. I was like, that's what makes it an extra hell hot dog. Ketchup was bad enough, but holy cow. Mayo, yeah, that's very European, isn't it? Yeah, but I don't know if they put it on hot dogs. I'd have great food on hot dogs. I don't know if they eat hot dogs in Europe. A poutine hot dog? I need that. I don't know what they eat out there. I would eat that. Pedretti came out with their gameplay teaser of Rudy's Nightmare. Oh, wait. That's the wrong sound.
    78:32
    That's the really sound at midnight. I'm still thinking get your hot dog in hell. Get your hot dog in hell. Buckle, buckle. Flip. We got that gameplay teaser. It gives us a little bit more indication of what the modes are going to look like, sound like, play like. Have you pre-ordered this? I haven't. Because I was going to order from PPS, but I don't know if I missed the boat. I don't know. I've got one of my buddies that has one on order, and he may or may not keep it, so I just told him to sell it to me if he's not going to keep it. Yeah, not an easy enough fix. Did you know that there's been some criticism of the Rudy voice? No, I did not know.
    79:13
    Like, you're not going to match Ed Boon. You're not going to match his voice. So they went, like, a different direction in its own kind of character for this 2.0. My name is Rudy. I'm here to tell you about the problems with your health. Oh, that's German. You have to eat in the chair. Is that why? Because it sounded basically the same to me. No, it was not. We think you are trying to eat my hot dogs.
    79:36
    With mayo. We've got to be careful with that. But then again, Bruce Nightingale goes all out Italian, but his Italian accent always includes stereotypes in his content.
    79:47
    That was my carny accent, and I don't think I have to be careful. Oh, okay, that was carny, just General Carney. There's this general maniacal clown carny accent about hot dogs. In Hill. But the voice itself, I don't have a problem with. A lot of people were like, I don't know. Do you know who that voice is? No. I think I have it pegged.
    80:07
    I don't think it's publicly been announced, but I know he's a friend, so I know his voice enough. I think it's Mark Silk. Really? I do.
    80:15
    I really do. Listen to it again. It should be more mystical then. Now, if you listen to it, I'm like, I think that's Silk's voice. I may be wrong, so my apologies, but I think that's Mark Silk.
    80:26
    I wish I had me do the Rudy voice. And he's European, so mail and hot dogs probably make sense. Well, Britain's like separate from continental Europe. It's like a totally Brexited place. Yeah, I missed that class in high school. I don't know. It's just over there and here is how I see the world. Yeah, it's very America of you.
    80:45
    That's right, Bush Light, baby. And catch up on my hot dogs. You know what else is American? Texas. People hate when I do that. Y'all get yourself a hot dog now, you hear? That was the southern carny of indiscriminate southern origin. Hey there, Pilgrim. You want a hot dog with mail and hell?
    81:06
    I like that. Yeah. So we've got Multimorphic down there in Texas. They added a couple critters to their team.
    81:14
    Said critters include Bowen Gunslinger Cairns and Colin... McCalliber Calpine. Yes. Colin McCalliber Calpine to the coding team over at Multimorphic. Why? Hell, I don't know. I guess for the new game. Because like a trusty Winchester, you gots to have your rules with you at all times.
    81:37
    You know, I'm surprised I didn't get any negative comments about Old Yeller on a couple episodes ago. No, no one's seen that. They don't... They didn't hear about that? That's a good one. I mean, I'm sure they've heard some vague reference. A dog had rabies. It had to be shot. There's a lot of foley. You can't save things from rabies. Actually, we have saved a couple of people with rabies. It was really hard, though. You have to put them into induced comas, and it doesn't always work. Is this true? Yeah. I don't know about that. But they have saved a couple at this point. Yeah, because people on Pinball Podcast totally care. If I remember right, the idea is if you can put someone into a coma, you can slow the disease, which progresses, I guess, through the nervous system to the brain in time for the body, in theory, to adapt and actually be able to kill it. Normally, the disease progresses too fast for your body to be able to fight it off. Is that like horse dewormer for COVID? Like, is that what we're doing? No, and it's not like a record. This is like a, oh, you got bit by a bat and you didn't tell anyone and it's too late. We have no other solutions. But it has worked a couple of times.
    82:39
    It's worked a couple of times. So that happens to people who have actually contracted rabies and survived, but I think it's less than 10. Don't rely on this Get your vaccine You get bat bit Bat bit Copy Be ready If someone If I play you Even though I'm not a bat I could be rabbit I'm still pretty angry about deeper Where's the code?
    83:04
    Why is .85 code So thoroughly developed When it comes from start But when I have .85 code It doesn't even have an engineer with it It's just the ramps work I don't even get ramps Where's my engineer? That's why I'm at American Bimble. Did you know that I'm at American Bimble now? Joel and Travis and Neil's dad. Did you know?
    83:27
    Oh, man. I wonder what Nordman thinks about the new heartthrob that's sweeping the country and sweeping the world, Spider-Man. That man's kind of taking a back seat here. Yeah, well, Marvel is more popular than DC nowadays. I don't think that was true back in the golden era with the comic sales. And, in fact, Marvel almost went bankrupt. Oh.
    83:50
    That's why Sony has the license to Spider-Man and such. Spawn is they sold those. Oh, I see. Sold those rights out. But now Marvel has its own studio, even before under the thrall of Disney. Anyway, so now things are good for Marvel is my point. But back in the day, the joke was always, and there used to be a joke separate from the comics, of Marvel does good movies and terrible TV, and DC is great on TV and has terrible movies.
    84:20
    Multimorfer, what do you think about them adding Bowen Cairns and Colin McAlpine? Overall, I think it's a good move if their plan in particular is to try and get the P3 into tournaments, because I'm not aware of it being in many tournaments. I only ever heard of one. It had Lexi in it, and there wasn't much feedback other than that it wasn't well received for the tournament. But I don't know if they had a mechanical issue or if it was the rules. Like, I was so not – I wasn't at the tournament, so my interest level was nonexistent in terms of what happened. But I just remember it came up. Honest question here. Would you like a multi-morphic P3 in your local tournament? You know, I don't know. I don't know if they can be exploited or not. My initial thought would be if it had heist, that sounds like it could be fun. I'd just like to have a heist on location to play, though. So that's part of the issue. But I don't know if it's a good tourney game or not. I would think Bowen and Cullen could make it a good tourney game, but I also don't think they're going back and quote-unquote fixing prior games. Yeah, but Bowen works for the new stuff they're working on. Probably. Bowen worked on Rick and Morty, and that's not like heralded as a tournament game. I love that game. But how much of that is this code, and how much of that is that layout? Maybe, but the code was great So I'm looking forward to this I heard pretty positive things about his code for Alice Cooper Yeah, and that was good too Took a while to get there, but that was good too Sure, but I never heard a lot about Spooky games and tournaments, Zach Other than TNA Which isn't really a spooky game It's Spooky Belt So we got Bowling Cairns over there Scott Denise, who we know, that was over there On the new game, upcoming game as well For music for music. So, they're building something over there. I don't know. They teased that game so long ago. Do you think they teased it too early? Because I do. Yeah, absolutely. But I just still don't see those units. I don't think they're moving. So, I don't... It seemed like they picked... My impression was they picked up some... I thought it was good that Jerry was at Expo. I think that helped. But if you're selling an extra 20 units... Yeah, but he's indicated that the sales volume is good for what they want. Okay. But again, these are contract games. It's not like Bowen and Cullen are moving there. Yeah, I get that. I guess Cullen's probably pretty close. Though that's dangerous for me to say, given how big Texas is. And another news this week, spooky pinball. Not much news coming out. We got rid of all of our popular programmers and rules people. I did hear some of your snarky bullshippers last week on my episode. Yeah, I thought I had a nice little segment last week, Things I Like, Things I Don't, on Spooky Pinball's Halloween. And I had to hear you degrade it and degrade me for liking it.
    87:03
    I did not degrade you. You were coming in hot with what I'm calling us group of Halloweeners. Yeah. I just like that you had all these top things and they were all like just aesthetic things. No, they were not. It's fun. The feel. I like the feel of it. That's not aesthetic. The feel. Do you like the feel of those non-frosted lights? That's a look.
    87:28
    I may... Complete yes. Honestly, I did. I won't say the name, but I did have somebody from Spooky reach out and say, Oh, you don't like my lights, huh?
    87:37
    You see, that's the thing. You can't be critical of some of these, especially smaller companies, because you don't usually hear from the person who did them, but you'll get the fanboys. Well, you know, you said nobody has power to bring in and influence an industry and award shows. And it's just, hashtag remember. Okay. Oh, hashtag try. You came in hot against us Halloweeners. Not that hot. And we want resolution. We will not stand for this. No. I don't want to be like Neil's dad harassed. You said that anybody who likes Halloween is not a pinball player. I think what I said was from everyone I had heard from so far who was a pinball player doesn't like Halloween. But more in the way that you just said. You're churching it up. You were putting your nose up. I've been trained by the pin monk. Don't you doubt my piety.
    88:40
    No, the game, a lot of people say the game is a dog. I haven't played it yet, though. So I have not yet. You know who's been saying it's a dog, too? People who haven't played it. I'm not saying that right. I'm not saying what I'm hearing people say. That's the difference. Maybe it is, though. I will not pretend like those people are not out there and they are not high-level players saying, you know, the Carl DeAngelos of the world that might not say something but spell it after playing 30 games on it. One person is, come on, I know he's a pimp influencer, but, eh, what does Carl know?
    89:10
    I think if you realize there are certain players that you align with in terms of what they like to play, you can, you know, it's like reviews. You find a reviewer. Carl knows you like your lover. I don't complain about reviews, but you find a reviewer that you agree with, and then you have someone you can trust because you know you kind of think the same way. This is very true. I was very concerned from the photo images of the play field once we saw the, not the underside. I'm not good enough at interpreting underside play field. I was concerned as well. But based off of that, like to me, I haven't played it yet. Does not look like it would be my sort of game. No way that code could change that. Bullshit. Code can change everything. Not for me. No. Now that's a bunch of crap. No, it's not. You cannot fix any bet. The idea that you can fix a terrible layout with code is a myth. The dichotomy and the strength of my argument is the same as yours, saying code can't fix anything, and I'm saying code can fix everything. No, I did not say code cannot fix anything. I said code can only do so much. If you have a good layout, you can only do so much. Look. That is true. That's something we saw a lot historically. So, I mean, let me give you a case in point. I'm going to give you some examples since apparently you need your hand held. I don't need the spoon. Allow me to do this. Allow me to walk you through real logic, Zach. Okay. So, for example, I had a game from Gottlieb, Premiere, called Silver Slugger. It is, in my opinion, the greatest single-level layout ever designed. Wow. I loved that layout. However, at the time, when I owned 10 pinball machines, it was my worst rule set of all of them.
    90:53
    That game could be great with a reprogram. Truly great A real classic But you would have to redesign the rules But the layout is there But I didn keep the game because given how you score points given how you even did modes and stuff it just, the rules weren't there to keep me interested. And that, I think, is true on a lot of EM games in particular, especially if you look at, like, Gottlieb EM games, where it was more about, here's all the stuff you do to earn special, but there's nothing that, like, scores points except shooting one shot. That's where you see ideas where the rules are the problem with why the game isn't great But the layout itself is okay.
    91:30
    Now, you could have a good rule set, a great rule set, but if you throw it on a total clunker of a game, those shots can't be made to feel good just because the code tells you you have to shoot the entire play field. Really? See, the layout still sucks. Really?
    91:47
    Have you never seen a pinball machine that had a truly sucky layout? Tell me about the genius that is total nuclear annihilation again. The design. Just scream to me how wonderful a design that is. And when have I ever screamed to you about the design of TNA? You own it because you love it. I own it because I like it. Okay.
    92:12
    The rules, you know, in my view, TNA is, it's a blend. So I like the layout, but I don't love it. Clearly, I don't love it as much as Silver Slugger as a single-level layout. I think it's a reasonable shooter, but there are improvements. Like if I were a designer, I would have done some things differently on it.
    92:32
    I think if we take that layout and we say, all right, everybody, this is genius, people are going to say it's a bunch of stand-up targets with a scoop that's designed in a way that's hard to hit in one orbit.
    92:45
    And code saved that. There's two orbits. in fact the biggest thing I have you said pair of pants or pair of pant it's got two legs an orbit's an orbit right entrance and exit I guess it's two orbits it's about the direction but anyway actually for me the bigger issue is my biggest issue with TNA is the code really? my most likely reason for getting rid of that game will be the rule set that's surprising No. The layout, I actually think, yeah, no, as you point out, there's a little bit of clunk to her. There's a little bit of clunk to that layout. What about Lord of the Rings? What about the design there?
    93:29
    I mean, it's a pretty traditional fan layout. I think most people really like fan layouts. That's why we see so many of them layout-wise. So it's a question of what you do with the rules to make them stand out from each other. How many fan layouts are better than the design? I don't know. WWE could never be saved by code.
    93:45
    Rob Zombie could never be saved by code. Rob Zombie. The layout is just too clunky. It's just too clunky. And I don't mean flow versus stop and go. I mean truly clunky, in my view, just cannot be saved.
    94:00
    That's what I mean. Okay. Now, most of the time, games are somewhere on a spectrum, right, Zach? Sure. I think you would agree with that. I think so. Yeah, there are games that would be like, Walking Dead would be a good example. There are plenty of people that don't think that's a great layout. Because I think it's a great layout. And I do, too. I think it's a really clever layout and it's different. But it's not a flow layout, and that's what bugs some people. Because some people are flow players. I get that. But, you see, there are some people that may not love that layout but don't think it's terrible. But it was the rules that said, oh, now you have to use these dangerous drop targets on the left and stuff that made it become the gym that it is. That's a good point. Okay. But sometimes someone will give you a layout and it's just not good enough. It cannot be. You could improve it, but you'll never make it great. People really like Simpsons Pinball Party, too.
    94:48
    See, I don't. People like Wizard of Oz. And if anybody tells me that's a great layout, I'll tell them. Yeah, I don't.
    94:55
    It's like, I guess because the rule of thumb that I have, if I were to dumb it down the way I think about pinball, is the most important thing for code to do, and it's really looking back historically because this is where they suffered, I think the most is you want rules that incentivize you to shoot everything on the play field. Yes. That's the most important thing a rule set can do for you. But as you know, a rule set cannot make the shots feel good by themselves. You have to have something about the geometry has to work. Not every game that got produced had working geometry, workable geometry. Or there's just certain frustrations that, like one example, so we were talking about Halloween. So let me give you a Halloween one. Again, I haven't played it. So I'm not saying whether this bugs me or not. But one of the big complaints I've seen is because of all of the subways, I've seen some fans of the game who say, I really like how this plays, but I don't like the delay in shooting and then getting my ball back. Wouldn't it be great if the ball could be staged so there was always a ball ready to come back? Well, it can't. That's not how it was designed. So that's a flaw. And I don't think that that would work because I have a hard enough time still seeing the blinking and expecting the ball down there as an advanced player. So, yeah. Hmm. Advanced player, huh? Well, yeah.
    96:12
    Yeah. I mean. Oh, you're so. Advanced player. You're probably better than me. Sorry, expert player. Is that better? Yeah. Yeah, an expert. I think I'm an expert player. You probably are. You play a lot. Play more than me. I'm not an expert, though, so. I don't know what that threshold means. I'm a certified reviewer, I think. I'm just here to talk crap about games. Here's where I'm at on the Halloweeners. Halloweeners over here. Yeah, tell us about the Wieners. Here we go. Now, are the Halloweeners the ones that are the fans or the ones that are the anti-fans? No, these are the fans. These are us Halloweeners. That's what I thought. We love the Halloweeners. Don't listen to Dennis. He's wrong.
    96:47
    He's trying to lump all of this on a layout. And the fact is, and remains the same, that I can take a layout that's maybe not my favorite, certainly not the worst layout I've played, and it fall with some of the most classic and sought-after pins of all time. So for me, it does fall to code And I think code Will make this A great game As it's showing Some great immersion already It's showing some great light shows already Sound package is Perfect, I love that too There's a lot going for it Ultimately, it's still too early For me to say whether or not I deem this as an expert reviewer As a fantastic game a classic game, a mediocre game or just the dog of a game but I'm here to tell you the layout itself cannot condemn this game because it is a fun shooter there's some frustrating shots you have to beat it around a little bit but I would expect if you want the theme to be appropriate and not have hey family teenage mutant ninja turtles it's impossible to shoot, this is Halloween, you're killing people I expect it to be more of a difficult nasty little shooter and it lives up to that How does that translate to Ultraman then? Much more family-friendly theme. I don't even know. What do you call the fans of those? Ultra Mandalorians? I don't know. I have no clue because Ultraman is a theme that people claim to like that don't know. I don't get the Ultra. That's a hard take. Well, look, I don't think I'm taking a very hard take here, though. I will agree that there are issues. It's a truth in all players know better than to like Halloween. I did not say that. You said, I'll bring it up. You said something like that. Nope. We don't care what I said. What we do care about is, I do agree with you that the code can make a difference. And I know one of the big complaints has been, Travis has touched on this multiple times after multiple updates, the shoot up the center all day sort of thing. Kind of a complaint that Mandalorian gets, actually.
    98:50
    Shoot up the middle. Why are we just shooting up the middle? That's what I did say. Hey, let's not focus too much on that part of the code. Numbers don't lie, Zach. Numbers don't lie. And the market, what's going on with that game, I am not in the minority here. Yeah, that's a good segue. We'll let you have that one. But keep in mind, Halloweeners out there, part of the Fang Club. I still want to try it. Part of us Halloweeners out there, we remember. I'm so glad it wasn't at Expo. We remember the days that people shit on Stranger Things. We remember the days that they condemned us for loving the Hobbit. All the complaints about Springer things were primarily that broken Demi-Gorgon toy. And they had to code around the break. They said we're dumb loving Popeye. They said how dare we like Rick and Morty. But guess what? Popeye doesn't even like Popeye. We are now sitting on the throne of righteousness. Keith Elwin doesn't like Popeye. So, what's that mean? Well, he is our lord and savior. He is.
    99:51
    The guy can make a design. That's okay. That is true. But just remember, people. Just remember. And Spooky, I'll put myself out there. Don't fuck this up. It doesn't matter. They sold them all. It doesn't matter. It does matter. They won. They all won. No, because it's more. It's more than just the dollar. No, it's not. It's not. It's not what you're all about. It's about pride. You buy things without any. It's about legacy. No. It's about justice.
    100:18
    Dennis thinks there's a trend here with Halloween. We're going to have to wait and see. No, as a Christmas present, let's not do pinball market trends. Your Christmas present's coming. But until then... Krampus has got you some pinball market trends! This segment's silly. What's Krampus sound like? They were calling you Krampus in the Discord channel. That is mean, too. Y'all are mean, Charlie Brown and me in this hobby. I went with the Grinch how the Creasles still Christmas. I think it's smarter. That's mean, too. I know, because the Grinch at the end of the day is like the beloved one. You're lucky I'm not a pinball artist and getting well worked up about this. I'm like Cindy Lou Who trying to bring you to the enlightened side. Rebel scum.
    101:00
    Synergistic. I was waiting for him to save a giant at some point. All right, take us on this tour. Turning up this week is not Halloween. Damn it. Okay, turning up this week is holiday pricing.
    101:16
    Holiday pricing, what I mean by that, listener, is that right now you're going to see some games pop up in inventory from some of these dealers and secondary sellers and these home hobbyists that you want, and they're available, but the price is going to go up, especially if you think you're going to jump in that Woody Station wagon of yours there, Griswold, and drive clear across Wally World just to pick up one of these Godzilla Pros so that your children, who you think will care, will not give a shit about, but it'll make you feel like, hey, I re-gifted something that looks pretty for them, but it's actually something I want. It's called rationalization. Psych 101. But if you're going to pay for it, you're going to pay $7,000 for it. Wow. Yeah. This is what it is. Maybe even higher. Have you seen Jurassic Park premiums right now? 11K. Wow. 11K.
    102:04
    That's a lot for that Jeep. That doesn't even look like a Jeep. So training up is pricing right now because we are in the Christmas week. You're going to see people try to get these games, and they'll pay whatever they need to for the Turbo Man. They fought for our freedom. I'm not a pervert.
    102:22
    So wait until the holiday season is over. Probably the first year you'll see those prices come back down just a hair. Still going to be neutral or high up. We're not going to drop too much below that pre-December threshold of pricing. But you're going to see a high right now and low again January 1st. So hold out unless your kid really has to have that. Bye, bye, bye. Also trending out this week, I've seen, never so lie, only reports facts here on PetMallMarketTrans, ACDC Premium LA for some reason. I think people are like, oh yeah, if we're going to throw up Ghostbusters at $10,000 to $20,000, if we're going to put up the, you know, well, why not ACDC? So you're seeing that go up as well. Right now you see a couple premiums listed for $12,000. Those aren't loose, these people. Those are just premiums. And I've seen them sell for $10,000, $11,000 for a regular premium. Lucy's going to be a little bit higher up, anywhere from probably 11,000 to 14,000 right now. This is crazy. But that's kind of where it's at. And your last training up of this holiday season is heist.
    103:30
    Heist? No, I mean, hold on. Go back here. No, what's training up this week is multi-morphic fanboys and fangirls who are going on to pin size and boosting up their beloved multimorphic heist game in efforts to be recognized as a real pinball machine. Oh, I saw this. We're pinball, too. Hashtag not yet. Ouch. No. I'm sorry, people. I'm sorry.
    103:59
    Even the heist owner, even Chariot Multimorphic. It wasn't a good look. Maybe people thought it was funny, but it kind of looks like, I mean, people complain about it all the time. It almost looked like it was organized, as you're pointing out. It probably was. So you make it worse on your go-up. I thought it was amusing, but now people are going to be like, oh, yeah, the game that got falsely boosted because of a coordinate campaign. Why do that? You could have naturally got up there, I don't know, and worked hard like, hmm, Stranger Things. Why do you keep bringing up Stranger Things? Because organically, that's what happens when something is truthful. It'll get up there. Walking Dead got up there. No, Walking Dead never really did because it had all those early reviews where the code was bad.
    104:44
    It's still pretty low. Willy Wonka. It's below where it should be. Crept up there. Elvira? Got up there.
    104:51
    Naturally, organically. Heist people, back off. Don't lie to yourself. Even Jerry would say it's not the number two game of all time. Piss off. Be lucky if that thing breaks the top 50 because that is truth. Hey, I don't have enough time yet to know if I think it's a top 50 game or not. It's my favorite P3 game I've played so far. Yeah, I'm being dramatic. I'm in the same position. I know. You always support with facts and drama. Maybe I need a theme that I actually enjoy.
    105:22
    You don't like heisting? If I want heisting, there's a hundred movies that are actually awesome. I don't need Mr. Big Pants and a generic city. No, I don't need it. Don't need it. I just want a pinball machine. That's all. Turning down this week. Dennis said it, and he's right. It's Halloween. Ultraman. Pre-orders. Still flooding the marketplace.
    105:44
    Like Xbox 360s. Do people still buy those? Probably not. So you're probably right. They're trending again. I love the old people and the detached people that don't know what's in them now, and they always get the old version of something for their kids or grandkids. They're like, hey, I got that new hot Xbox for you. Like, Mom's Xbox One Yeah, number one Yeah, you know, that happened for you I mean, it was like when you'd ask for Voltron for Christmas Instead of getting the real Voltron with the five pieces You got the car Voltron Oh With 30 parts Or even worse, you got Omnicron Or you asked for Transformers and they got you GoBots I mean, it happened That kind of thing, right? I wanted Pokemon, not Digimon Yeah, Digimon Not Digimon I prefer Digimon, honestly I liked that show when I was a kid Do you know anything about Digimon? Nope. Digital monsters, Digimon, all those things.
    106:35
    Also trending down this week is finding a game that you want for sale on Pinside, then that seller not even returning your messages or even updating their post. Thanks a lot, seller of Guardians Premium outside of Chattahoochee, Chattanooga. It was somewhere around there. Damn it. Definitely are following up now.
    106:53
    What the hell? I'm looking for a Guardians, Dennis. Why? I want a Guardians again, a premium. Oh, no.
    107:00
    Let it be. I'm rude? I can't even believe that's still getting officially billed. Castleman's. Sick him.
    107:09
    They're lovers. No. Leave me alone. Oh, man. What's coming up? What's going down here in the market trends? I don't know. You want to save a buck or two, Dennis? Size 10? No. Let's go to our deals of the week. Buy, buy, buy! Deal of the week this week is a dialed in on Pennside right now. Original themed game by Jersey Jack. I like dialed in. Who doesn't? Apparently not the person selling it. They're getting rid of it. Yeah, price-wise right now, you can go to Pennside outside of Palmyra. Pennsylvania. The Beef Supreme. What an awesome username. The Beef Supreme. Isn't that a taco from Taco Bell? I wouldn't fuck with the Beef Supreme. I can tell. They don't put mayo on their hot dog. You probably put ketchup on your tacos. Hell no. Put hot sauce, baby. No lettuce, though. No, no, no, no. No lettuce on my tacos. I don't like lettuce or tomatoes in general. So, no. Meat and cheese only. I'm like a 12-year-old. Well, the ketchup hot dog thing already kind of proved that. Jolingo Burr, that's fair. Dialed in number 99, Ellie. The thing's clean, you guys. Got a crap load of mods, including toppers and et cetera. Even a visiglass, which is standard. I love et cetera. Yeah. Come on, $8,500? That's a whole lot of game for $8,500. This is a Dennis Creasel special right here. Buy, buy, buy! A game that has no personality, but is greatness for a discounted price. The Dennis Creasel Special. Yes, because I'm an L.E.Dist. No, if you got an L.E., this would be the type of L.E. you would buy. That's what I'm saying. So mean. So true. It's mean regardless of its truth. Oh, another deal of the week this week is, oh, well, how convenient. It's here at Flippin' Out Pinball. Buy, buy, buy. They're the Jurassic Park The Pin. You know, the brand new one? You can have it. You're listening on Monday or Tuesday. Time's running out. All you've got to do is hop in your car and drive down to Flippin' Out Pinball for a cash pickup deal of $4,500, Dennis. Other dealers are jacking up these prices for the holiday season. No, no, no. Not here at Flippin' Out. That's under MSRP, baby. You can't get one until next November. Get one now.
    109:22
    What's the Jurassic Park? What do you try to do on the collective game? You're trying to make the sound of a raptor. Oh, oh, oh. That's what it is. You're like, it's supposed to be a raptor. Why do you listen to that show?
    109:33
    To roll my eyes and take deep breaths. Why don't you stop listening to that show? Yeah. Sometimes I listen to it and I say, deals of the WTF this week. You can go on Pinside right now and find it. It's a Deadpool stern armor set. Oh, what's wrong with that? It's a nice set of armor for your Deadpool. So, look, I agree. I think it's great. You got B. Arthur's all up in there. You guys know what I'm talking about. Armor's terrific. But the price is a WTF. D-B-D-A. Outside of Oregon City, Oregon. I know things are more expensive than Northwest there, but come on, bro. $700 for this armor kit? Hey, Dennis, I've got about 10 sets in stock still. Really? Wow. That's $280. So why? Why? This is a premature listing right here, ladies and gentlemen. $700 is what they will go for easily, easily in the future if they stop making these. Probably up towards $1,000 because they're awesome armor pieces. But they're new in box right now. Same for like Deadpool topper. People don't overpay. I heard Canada reporting they're going to make Deadpool toppers again. You're going to get more of them. They're going to be $200 more. So I've got them in stock. Buy them for the regular price. We've been saying that for months. That's not news. Buy, buy, buy! Buy, buy, buy. Stranger Things toppers, one of the coolest toppers in the last decade ever. In stock. Ready to go. So don't buy this. It's a deal with WTF. I don't know what this is. Also, WTF this week. Did you see, Dennis, the 24-karat gold hand-heated topper for Indiana Jones? I did on Straight Down the Middle. A pinball store that continues to promise rubber band interviews and never delivers. Well, one of the limited edition Elite models finally hit the secondary market. First one that I've seen. And it's for sale. Only $25 made with a little smoke puffer.
    111:28
    They want $5,000 for this thing. Holy hell. Smell, smell, smell. Where are you, Christmas? I wouldn't put this under a tree for $5,000. The pinball tot outside of New Jersey. Washington Township. $5,000. You're not going to get it. The box was open to ensure that it was not damaged in shipping. Sure. I would check that fog reservoir.
    111:52
    Run that pinky through it and sniff on it. Was there any fog juice in here? Nope. $5,000 is ridiculous. What are these things? $2,200 when they were released? Maybe the price of gold is up now. Oh. Metal market trends, huh? And a new segment. We're going to put them to the pinball market trends. It's now called pinball bounty. All right, so we have a new sub-segment of the Pinball Market Trends. You guys are going to love this. It's called Pinball Bounty. You got to say it like that, Dennis. Can you say it like that?
    112:26
    No. Write in the pinballnetwork at gmail.com and ask for Pinball Bounty. We dropped this sub-segment. Listen here, partner. I think you like my John Wayne a little better. I was clever, but all right. So what is this? All right, Pinball Bounty is where I... It's like a third of the show now. Well, I need you all's help here. I'm issuing formally here on the Pinball Show a pinball bounty. For all of you out there, the reward is great. I have a bounty out for a machine. This particular machine is called Whitewater. I'm issuing a pinball bounty on this machine because it's got to be a special one. And you're included if you can find me a Whitewater. We're going to see how much we can pay for a Whitewater, ladies and gentlemen. The nicer the better. I need a minty one. Does that have chrome? I'll take it. If not, I can have it. But I want a really nice Whitewater. willing to pay, the bounty is $10,000? $15,000? Dennis, can we go $20,000 on the pinball bounty that is white water?
    113:30
    I'm not opposed to it. I'll spend $20,000 on a white water if it makes sense to. At $20,000, it better be the nicest one ever made in existence. But I'll pay $15,000. I'll pay $10,000. it's got to be nice and for you listener if you find this bounty for me and I secure it you yourself are awarded the bounty of $1,000 that's how you put a bounty on people right there $1,000 wanted not dead we need this fucker alive very alive and numbers don't lie I'm going to need a nice ass one if we're going to spend $15,000 to $20,000 but you heard it here I'm willing to spend $20,000 on a whitewater if it's warranted. Dennis, what do you think about the pinball bounty that I'm issuing to our listeners?
    114:25
    I think you've lost the plot. Look, they get to earn money listening to the pinball show. Yeah, no, I get it. And lately you've been doing a lot of this where you're like, hey, if someone does this, I'll throw money at you like they're a dancing whatever. Monkey? Bear? Whatever. What animal do you like dancing? Lots of animals dance. A dog? I've seen many. I've seen all those dance. Why do you hate dogs and dog owners? That's what this is. Or it's a finder's fee, but that's what this is. I don't want to do my work. I'll throw money at people to entertain, either amuse me or do my work for me. This is for me. This is personally for me, my collection. I know, and I also lost the plot. We will possibly go to $20,000 for a common game like Whitewater. Why? Holy cow. It'd be cheaper for you to just buy any old Whitewater and then have it fixed up. there's where you're wrong. No, I am not. And that's why the pinball bouncy is in place. No, I am not. Because time is money, Dennis. And I ain't got the time to be still. This is the sort of thing, this is the style of loss of plot when people start going, you know what, I think I'd like a centigrade 37 sort of style. Oh, I see what you're going to do there. It's like, no, you wouldn't, because it's not a fun game.
    115:33
    Listener, I about bought a centigrade 37 for $10,000. But, hey, throwback to EGP, if you're not a real player, maybe you would love it. Oh, yeah. It is just about the art. Don't shame my chrome. That's all I'm asking. Don't shame my chrome. Because, listener, that's your pinball bounty. And unlike many others that are going to take money from you, I'm here to give. Because I'm a giver. And as always, I'm just here to report the facts because numbers don't lie here on Pinball Market Trends. Email in and say the end of the part of the segment. Market Trends too long. Hashtag is too long.
    116:08
    Let's close the show out, Dennis. I hope you have a holly jolly Christmas. It's already been great. It's the best time of the year. Instead of singing now, I'm just going to read lyrics. No. Where can people catch you?
    116:23
    They can always go to the Eclectic Gamers Podcast. You can email me at eclecticgamerspodcast.gmail.com. You can go to facebook.com slash eclecticgamerspodcast.
    116:32
    Somebody gave me a Wonka topper. So awesome. God, I love you. Swap machine topper. So cool. And you can reach me at straight down the middle, B on the lookout. This week you can go click probably right now for the Godzilla review that Greg and I do. Ooh, it's a good one. I guess I'm on a top ten list that's just, it's awesome. And we'll give that to you this holiday week as well. You can reach me there, sgtmpinball at gmail.com. Or if you're ready to buy a brand new used pinball machine or an awesome off the top mod, you can buy it at Flippin' Out Pinball. Product showcase this week of Flippin' Out Pinball is the next Stern interested list. That's weird. Okay. What I mean by that is it's coming. It's coming quick. No hints. But if you would like maybe one of the earlier premiums. Look, people, I don't want you calling me now and saying, Hey, Zach, looking for a Godzilla premium. Wondering if you could get me on that for a second round. It don't work like that, people. Even the smallest dealers out there are like, I have nothing until end of 2022. Don't be that person. If you think you might want one, let's get on the list now. Remember, all the first pros generally go to operators. But that second run, come on, people. You're going to regret it. Because how much does it cost, Dennis, to get on that interested list? Zero. Zero dollars. Not going to hurt you. You can also preorder your Texas Canyon SV or SE Plus through us. They're going to take forever for those things. I don't know what's going on. Elvira, 40th anniversary. Still got a spot or two left for that. Star Wars. I don't know if I have any more Star Wars. The pins.
    118:03
    Yeah, I don't know. We just sold some Mando Pros. I don't know if I have any more of those. Godzilla pre-orders. Come get them. Elite Pinball IGA Deluxe Toppers. Not the $5,000 version, but the $1,200 version. Stand-up arcades, shooter rods, banners, art blades, toppers. Before you overpay for a secondary pinball mod, at least contact me. I'll tell you if they're in stock, if they're going to be made, if they're not going to be made, what to do there. Escalator turnaround time, 8 to 10 weeks. Man, y'all are buying some escalators lately. Woo! And merch helps support the show by buying your favorite Creasel t-shirt. Last week on 2PM, we had a slew of stuff. Man, hot and heavy here in December. We had the final round pinball podcast where they welcomed back Rincey as they all bickered over the pinball market. I thought it was cute. We had a free play pinball podcast with special guest Zombie Yeti. They bickered about art packages and me putting art on banners and vans and stuff and such. the Flippin' Out Pinball stream where Dennis Creasel appeared with Craig Bobby and Joe Lingleberth. Go check out that video on demand right now on YouTube, Flippin' Out. A year in review with Triple Dream Pinball Podcast. Neil's dad, Travis Murray, Joe Lingleberth. It's a good podcast. Don't pay any flip. They've been rated recently with a lot of listeners. And go follow, like, and subscribe to everything the Pinball Network so that you can be ready for that dedicated streaming channel that's going to bring you entertainment each and every day of the week. TP in this week, we have a nice little Hubmas holiday streams that are going on December 20th through December 23rd, Monday through Thursday, over at Hub Challenge, twitch.tv slash hubchallenge. We also, for all of you New Year's lovers, we've got a four-strike knockout tournament up at District 82 Pinball. That's going to be streamed live at Fox Cities. Go check that one out. as well as some ongoing District 82 stuff. I think they're going to have like a Winter Classics Tournament January 15th, etc. And I think we might get, I don't know if we'll get a final round this week. I don't know what we'll get. Be merry. Drink the eggnog. Do you drink the eggnog? It's just nasty. Yeah. I just bought some today. Of course you do.
    120:14
    For Dennis Creasel, I'm Zach Manning. And remember, folks, you could go hybrid, you could go vault, but if it's a bad layout, the game's always at fault. And always practice safe, pinball And screw it, it's Christmas Have yourself A merry little Christmas Make the yuletide gay I wonder if I don't think I'll have anybody on Next week 26, I don't see that happening You think I'll get anybody on? why you quit her I don't know if anybody even come on and people seem to really love my solo episodes let me tell you I guess you could just drop another correspondence only even my grandma called and was like eh not so much there's Zachary faithful friends who are dear to us gather near to us once more you