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The Pinball Show Ep 172: Things Are Heating Up

The Pinball Show·podcast_episode·1h 31m·analyzed·Mar 11, 2025
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TL;DR

Stern production surge, market tariffs, and 2025 release logjam analysis

Summary

Zach Minney and Dennis Creasel discuss the upcoming pinball release logjam in Q1/Q2 2025, analyzing Stern's production strategy, inventory management, and the three-cornerstone model. They examine market headwinds from tariffs and international sales impacts, while covering D&D code updates, King Kong trademark news, and Kevin Smith's unexpected involvement with a potential Jay and Silent Bob pinball project.

Key Claims

  • Dungeons & Dragons has been a consistent great seller, exceeding expectations despite Zach's initial low expectations

    high confidence · Zach states 'this has been a consistent great seller' and expresses surprise at sales performance

  • Stern is deliberately managing inventory scarcity through vault strategies and limited production runs to maintain FOMO

    high confidence · Zach provides extensive inventory list of out-of-stock titles and discusses vault announcements as incentive mechanisms

  • Stern's three-cornerstone strategy is actually five new products per year with remasters and studio titles added

    medium confidence · Zach states 'I think the three cornerstones is actually kind of a mirage. It's actually like five, five new products a year'

  • Canada will face reciprocal tariffs on pinball machines per trade policy documents

    high confidence · Dennis states 'Canada will have reciprocal tariffs, and pinball is definitely in their list because I've seen it. I read it myself'

  • Non-U.S. markets (Canada, Europe, Australia combined) likely represent double-digit percentage of total pinball sales

    medium confidence · Dennis estimates 'Canada plus Europe plus Australia is double-digit percentage' but notes lack of official data

  • Kevin Smith thought he was being brought in to voice a Jay and Silent Bob pinball machine, not D&D

    medium confidence · Zach relays information from NAP Arcade: 'he thought that that's what they were going to be doing but that's another company supposedly has'

  • Stern Metallica Remastered Premium run is scheduled for mid-March production

    high confidence · Zach states 'mid-month we're going to have Metallica Remastered Premiums. I believe that mid-month we're going to have Metallica Remastered Premiums'

  • Playfield promo (free playfield with new game purchase) has returned after absence

    high confidence · Zach states 'The Playfield promo is back. It's made its return' and confirms he received one

Notable Quotes

  • “They're really starting to – they're doing well on reducing the overall pool of products. So almost as if they're preparing.”

    Zach Minney — Describes Stern's deliberate scarcity strategy and vault management

  • “I think the three cornerstones is actually kind of a mirage. It's actually like five, five new products a year, but they're just blanketing them as, well, there's only three cornerstones.”

    Zach Minney — Reframes Stern's product strategy as more aggressive than publicly stated

  • “I did. I really did. Understandable. And I'm not even going to lie. I love these people. But when it comes to the design team overall that encompasses everyone working on the game, I thought that that team is due for a hit.”

    Zach Minney — Expresses initial skepticism about D&D game that proved unfounded

  • “It's going to be even worse now. That wasn't so much the case. Yes, it will be. That wasn't so much the case with Canada, though. So with Canada, it was basically on par with other than like they have a certain tax structure that made it more expensive in Canada.”

    Dennis Creasel — Discusses tariff impact on Canadian market specifically

  • “Stern. Stern. Dennis here. Zach here. I need to know what the break – at least tell us how much of your sales percentage are U.S. versus non-U.S.”

    Zach Minney — Direct appeal to manufacturers for sales data transparency

Entities

Stern PinballcompanyZach MinneypersonDennis CreaselpersonDungeons & Dragons: The Tyrant's EyegameDwight SullivanpersonKevin SmithpersonJersey Jack PinballcompanyBarrels of Funcompany

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: Tariff implementation threatens international market growth; Canada, Europe, Australia estimated at double-digit percentage of sales; cost pass-through likely

    high · Dennis confirms 'Canada will have reciprocal tariffs, and pinball is definitely in their list' and discusses broader international impact across regions

  • ?

    community_signal: Stern actively promoting D&D through streaming partnerships; Dwight Sullivan guest appearances on major YouTube channels driving exposure

    high · Dwight Sullivan appeared on both Flippin' Out Pinball and Aimless Pinball; Zach notes 'he always has fun over there with those guys'

  • ?

    leak_detection: Stern King Kong trademarking leaked/discovered; working title includes 'Myth of Terror Island' suggesting Kong retirement/island theme narrative

    high · Zach cites NAP Arcade discovery: 'Stern Pinball recently trademarks King Kong and, quote, Myth of Terror Island for the use of pinball'

  • $

    market_signal: Stern actively managing inventory through vault announcements and production constraints; extensive out-of-stock list indicates deliberate scarcity strategy

    high · Zach provides comprehensive list of out-of-stock titles and discusses vault mechanics: 'they don't just open up full throttle and say, hey, here's all the games we got'

  • ?

    community_signal: Kevin Smith approached for pinball voiceover work on Dungeons & Dragons; has unconfirmed involvement with Jay and Silent Bob pinball project with separate manufacturer

    medium · Zach relays stream incident where Kevin Smith discussed expecting Jay and Silent Bob project: 'he thought that that's what they were going to be doing but that's another company'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.273

0:00
Warning, the following episode contains adult language and screaming goats. Listener discretion is advised.
0:11
The Pinball Network is online. Launching, The Pinball Show. On this episode of The Pinball Show, Dennis and I lay it all on the line as we dive into the log jam that could be as this hobby is heating up with upcoming game releases from Stern Pinball, Jersey Jack Pinball, Barrels of Fun, Pinball Brothers, Chicago Gaming Company, and Multimorphic, which then leads us to conversation about the market in general, points of view from the different manufacturers on when to launch their new games, scenarios that we could see unfolding, what's coming later this year, non-U.S. markets and how recent governmental changes may affect the hobby, as well as other pin industry news and, of course, pinball market trends. Official club members of the Pinball Show get exclusive podcast content this week on one hell of a deal of the WTF that had Dennis extremely amused and me, well, just out a lot of money. Thanks again for tuning in to an all-new episode of the Pinball Show.
1:15
Pinball is a game of skill. For some, it's a passion and a lifestyle. It's time for the Pinball Show. It's Pinball with Personality.
1:33
Welcome to the Pinball Show episode 172. Alongside my buddy Dennis Creasel, I'm Zach Minney. Dennis, these people don't even know. They don't. What a nice conversation we've been having for the last, like, we forgot that we were supposed to even do a podcast. You know, maybe they wouldn't like that. No, no, this is. They're here for pinball. They're not here for the deeper dives, the real discussions. Could they handle it?

  • D&D Dragon Fix kits include replacement motor and new wiring harness

    high confidence · Zach states 'comes with a motor, a replacement motor' and describes installation process

    • Pinball Brothers
    company
    Chicago Gaming Companycompany
    Multimorphiccompany
    King Kong: Myth of Terror Islandgame
    Metallica Remasteredgame
    Godzillagame
    Jawsgame
    Flippin' Out Pinballcompany
    Aimless Pinballcompany
    American Pinballcompany
    NAP Arcadecompany
    Jay and Silent Bobgame
  • $

    market_signal: No recent price increases despite wage inflation; tariff costs likely to force pricing adjustments across manufacturers

    medium · Dennis states 'We haven't seen price increases lately. But wages don't just go up because tariffs have decided that they're going to be tariffs'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Stern accelerating production timeline to complete units before April; Jaws pro/premium start pulled forward from April to end of March

    high · Zach notes 'they're trying to get that started at the end of march' for Jaws; production focused on completing runs before April timeline

  • ?

    product_strategy: D&D Dragon Fix kits distributed; includes replacement motor, new wiring harness, and DIP switch configuration; installation guidance provided

    high · Zach provides detailed installation instructions: 'kit comes with new wiring harness' and 'comes with a motor, a replacement motor'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Despite market pessimism about tariffs and sales, hosts confident 2025 will be strong title year; counternarrative to Pinside negativity

    medium · Zach states 'easily like the best year for titles in a long time' despite acknowledging 'the tariffs and the markets down and all this shit'

  • ?

    business_signal: Stern three-cornerstone model may actually represent five products annually with remasters and variants; production driven by sales data rather than constraints

    medium · Zach states 'the three cornerstones is actually kind of a mirage. It's actually like five, five new products a year' based on sales data patterns

    • 2:01
    No, I think they can handle tapioca. They can't handle the truth. No. This ain't Jack. Jack Nicholson. I'd say, what have you been up to? But I know what you've been up to because we've been chatting. Yes. Absolutely. Things have been pretty busy at work for me. But what about you and pinball? Are things heating up? Things are heating up, my friend. Very much so. The pinball industry, it's always ever-changing, ever-moving and evolving. The ups and downs. Because when people tell me about pinball, the first thing I think of is, wow, progressive industry.
    2:38
    Always just on the cutting edge there. Undoubtedly. They're still so proud of figuring out how RGB lighting works. I'm sorry, Zach. I struggle mightily with this. Wow, look at what we got this coil to do. There's always something going on in this industry. That's true. How about that? Absolutely. For better or worse. And a lot of stuff comes straight from the pulp that is Stern Pinball.
    3:02
    That's right. It is true. Over the last couple of weeks, they've been creating more and more Dungeons & Dragons. Have we talked about how surprised I still am about the sales of this game? I think only a little bit. Why am I so surprised? Did you just have low expectations because of the theme? I did. I really did. Understandable. And I'm not even going to lie. I love these people. But when it comes to the design team overall that encompasses everyone working on the game, I thought that that team is due for a hit. But the last couple have been tepid, you know. So it's just the combination of things, the timing of things. I just, I knew it would do okay because all Stern games do better than everything else in the market. They just do. But I didn't know that it would do this well. But this has been a consistent great seller, and it's a bit surprising. I'm sure a lot of it is driven by the reaction once people have been able to play it. But I guess I would present to you, do you think it has benefited as well from the fact that it's been a kind of light period from the other companies? Well, that and light when it comes to Stern, too. Because if we think about the other releases like Uncanny X-Men or John Wick, those came out hot and heavy like all Sterns do. But then they kind of poofed out a little bit. But Metallica Remastered did it. That one was always hot. That was always good. Yeah, that one's on fire. But they only had so many to make, and then they sold, and then we're kind of waiting on them to make more. But, yeah, those previous two cornerstones, I think people were ready for something good, and this has exceeded the expectations of myself and many. So that game, that's why they continue to make so many of them. The past couple weeks they've been doing that. This week their goal is to make the remaining units of D&D LE and premiums. So that is their goal. By the end of this week having them all caught up. All right. And then next week, the following week, is going to be Metallica Remastered Premiums. I think that's the week of what, like 17? Yes. I believe that mid-month we're going to have Metallica Remastered Premiums. It cannot come soon enough. people are pre-ordered and waiting march the rest of march is going to be godzilla pro and premiums they did say that they're aiming to even start on that jaws pro and premium runs at the end of this month so that was originally going to be in april they're trying to get that started at the end of march it feels like they're just they're really trying to produce everything before april because in april they're going to try to knock out some uncanny x-men premiums i don't anticipate that being a large run because the larger dealers do still have some in inventory. So probably a tiny run of X-Men premiums. And then that leaves April open, Dennis.
    5:50
    Well, it is about time. It feels like we've got... Rumor Corner? No, we've had that. No, Stern Corner, Corner Stone, that is. Elwyn Corner. Yes. It feels like Keith Elwin is taking his swings in the on deck. Oh, on deck? Yeah. That's what it feels like. I'm not really a baseball person.
    6:15
    He's on deck. Yeah, he's on deck. He's getting ready. And hey, the production team is too. They're getting really used to by running those Godzillas and those Jaws just before to remember how to fold those 180 ramps and have a captive ball installed on a play field and all the other kind of Elwin tropes. Does Gorilla eat ball?
    6:35
    You know, I don't think so. I think he's going to triple down on things not eating things in his games. I have seen Stern some patterns over at Stern Pinball. A lot of things have been occurring, just a purveyor of pinball. I sit and I watch these behavioral patterns and sales patterns and trends from all of these different manufacturers, Dennis. and I've seen some patterns over at Stern Pinball. They've been doing a really good job, even if people are saying, oh, yeah, nobody's buying games and stuff. They've been doing a really good job at still balancing their production line and keeping their titles set to a level that still makes dealers, understandably that's kind of their focus. Their focus group, of course, is the end consumer, but they sell through dealers. So making dealers want to keep inventory, buy this before it runs out. They don't just open up full throttle and say, hey, here's all the games we got. We're going to inventory them forever. They keep us guessing. So as we see them making dealers wait for Metallica Premium remasters, Godzilla, some of the Godzillas, Jaws, some of those Ellen things, they have no problem letting people run out of them. Same goes for doing that vault. Remember months back they announced we're going to do this vault where all of these games are no longer going to be. So that entices the industry to start purchasing before they do run out. And I've seen that kind of stuff because if I go to the inventory of Stern, what they have in inventory, there is a bunch of stuff that is just simply out of stock. And I think that would surprise a lot of listeners here because a lot of listeners say, oh, my goodness, the warehouse is just full. They can't get rid of any. Okay, well, look. For example, as a dealer right now, if I want to buy the following games, I'm shit out of luck. Black Knight Pro out of stock. Godzilla Pro out of stock. Godzilla Premium. Iron Maiden Pro. James Bond Pro. James Bond Premium. Jaws Pro. Jaws Premium. Jurassic Park Pro. Metallica Remastered Premium. Rush Pro. Rush Premium. Stranger Things Pro. Star Wars Comic Pro. Star Wars comic premium, Star Wars comic in general, both pro and premium, Mandalorian pro, Mandalorian premium, Uncanny X-Men premium, Dungeons and Dragons Elite, like all of these things out of stock. And why is that relevant? Well, I think we need to also keep a watch over the vaulted games, those games that once they're gone, they're gone. Because as I've listed, Avengers pro, Iron Maiden pro, all the Star Wars, they're all out of stock. They're vaulted. Stern will not be selling those to dealers. Again, they're gone. And then they even have what they call low stock on Avengers, Infinity Quest Premium, Elvira Premium, Foo Fighters Pro. All three of those are going to be vaulted. So once those are gone, they're gone. So you see what I'm saying, Dennis? They're really starting to – they're doing well on reducing the overall pool of products. So almost as if they're preparing. Let me ask you a question.
    9:40
    What do you think – I've heard some others. Some of the other commentators, the expert commentators in this hobby, who have felt and suggested that Stern would be wise to move away from three cornerstones back down to two. What do you think about the current approach that they're taking with the restoration of the three cornerstones and sticking with it? I think it's a good question. I think from a hobbyist perspective, I can see them thinking that that would be a good idea. For Stern Pinball, I think that might be the worst idea ever. just because it's data. Until those data sets come back and say, oh, that cost us money coming out with that product. Until then, no, they're going to keep on cranking out. I think the three cornerstones is actually kind of a mirage. It's actually like five, five new products a year, but they're just blanketing them as, well, there's only three cornerstones. I know we do. Now we're going to have a remaster. We might have a studio title. So they're going to crank out as many new options as possible because the data shows that when you have a new product, that's the big boom in your analytics. There's your boom in sales right there. Your other stuff has long tails, but those tails still combined, those tails still probably are not surpassing that of, quote, unquote, new products. Now, I think that they would be silly. I think the only reason they went to two is because they couldn't get the parts. Well, that was my impression as well. Yeah, if they had the team and if they had the ability to crank out more, they might do more. When you have Dungeons & Dragons that are selling so well, and even their lowest-selling games, like I said before, listener, still selling better than everybody else's stuff. So, yeah, I do not see them doing that unless there is a restriction in parts. So they're shaping up, it feels like, for an April, a new product here in April.
    11:38
    Speaking of incentives to purchase, the Playfield promo is back. It's made its return. Remember that? Oh, yeah, from last year. Yeah, they're giving like a warped Playfield or like something that wasn't, you know, they were going to throw it away. WWE Playfield. Yeah. So I actually did just get one. So this promotion is back. I don't know if it's all games besides the LEs or Dungeons & Dragons, but when you buy a new game from maybe select dealers, I don't know who all does this, but as long as these dealers have their allocation of spare play fields, you get a free play field with your purchase. Are they going to do this ever? Is this like the McRib for Stern? I don't know, because it does entice people. It does work. It's a headache, too, but it does work, the McRib. Who doesn't love a good rubbery McRib? Why is the McRib not just permanently on the menu? I don't know. That's why I'm always hesitant about specials when you go to a restaurant. I'm like, if it's that damn good, why isn't the chef cooking it all the time? You know? Because he's lazy. Like the Szechuan sauce. McDonald's. Playfield promo is back. We also get some new code over at Stern Pinball for Dungeons and Dragons. The V86.
    12:46
    Okay, so we get Tavern Brawl. Who doesn't love a good... Have you ever been at a bar fight, Dennis? No. So once upon a time, I missed a pinball event, though, where there was a pinball event here in the area. I've never been in a bar fight. I can just see you snapping a pool cue over your knee. Are they easy to snap? I don't know. I don't really. I haven't. I've never tried to snap a pool cue. Now, baseball bat, it's a little trickier. Bo Jackson could. Oh, Bo Jackson. Hell, yeah, he could. So they added on Dungeons and Dragons. They call it a chaotic wizard mode. A tavern brawl. You'll also, whenever you make eligible this tavern, bro, you also get to add to your arsenal the legendary glass sword of unmaking. That sounds, that is a term, isn't it? That sounds haunting. It's like opposite of Excalibur's charm of making. I was thinking like a circumcision, the sword of unmaking. Like, oh, boy. Watch out.
    13:45
    A glass sword, too. Isn't that, wasn't that. That sounds like the worst material to make a sword. That's like when Frodo gets stabbed by that Death Eater or whatever the hell that thing was. It's like, oh, you're fucked, man. A Morgul blade. You're screwed. That shit's going to be in you. But it was poisoned. That's why. You're going to be going off to the land with Bilbo because of that shit. He's going to become a wraith like one of them. We got more polish and more general tweakage over there on V.86 Dungeons & Dragons. New Stern trademarks. I saw this on Nap Arcade. Stern Pinball recently trademarks King Kong and, quote, Myth of Terror Island for the use of pinball. What the hell does that mean, Dennis? Does that mean we're getting King Kong? You know, what if no? What if this is all an elaborate ploy? Ooga? That's my King Kong. It's going to be like the we've got King Kong at home. Curious George. It's Curious George.
    14:44
    And you as the player are the man in the yellow hat. Yes, we're getting King Kong. So, myth of Terror Island. Yes. What happened to Skull Island?
    15:01
    You know, I think they want to tell their own stories. And Kong loves any island where he can just be alone and dominate the island. Kong made upgrade.
    15:11
    Skull Island getting kind of trashy. Freshie. There's not enough fear in Skull Island. It's just bones. Big spiders and shit. Kong don't like that. Oh, that scene from the one with Jack Black. I've seen that movie, right? Yeah. The one with the insects. That's right. Yeah. And the, like, Lee cheats the guy. I love that Kong retired, and that's what he's retiring to, Terror Island. Yeah.
    15:38
    Kong Summer Beach Island. He swims south for the winter. I need 200 IQ. Call it Terror Island. No one visit. Yeah.
    15:50
    All right. So that feels like King Kong, Myth of Terror Island is coming. I'm really amped for it. We'll talk more about the release here in the next segment. But also, these Dragon Fix kits for the Dungeons and Dragons, all of them for the most part have went out. People are installing them. I've done a couple myself. Wasn't bad. Does it come with a new Node Board 10? It does not come with one unless you've already fried yours. Okay. The kit itself comes with a new wiring harness, and what surprised me, it comes with a motor, a replacement motor. Oh, wow. Yeah, so I don't know if they're beefing up the motor or whatever they're doing. You have to install the new motor, and then the wiring harness only works on that motor, like the connector only works for that motor. But it wasn't bad at all. What I do want to remind people, if you did burn up your Node 10 in that process, your dealer or myself, if I'm your dealer, we've gotten you out the Node 10 board. Don't install that thing until you install all the other stuff because then you're risking blowing it again. So do it all at the same time. Also, remember, a lot of people are like, it didn't work. I installed it. It didn't work. Well, on Node 10, on that Node 10 board, there are a set of four DIP switches. Remember, dip switch number two does need to be set to the on position. I don't know if it comes like that from the factory. You need to switch number two to the on position, and then you should be good to go. The other tip that I will give you guys for those installing this fixed kit for the motor, the only thing that could be potentially tricky during this installation, if not, you can knock it out 10 minutes tops, there's a set screw that goes to the shaft of that motor or the motor rod or whatever, and it holds on to that. Sometimes, I think they put Loctite on that little set screw. If it does not budge with that little bitty thin-ass Allen wrench, if it doesn't budge, don't strip out that Allen set screw. If you strip that out, life will not be fun. So give it a good one, but if it doesn't go, then my recommendation is heat up that set screw a little bit. All you've got to do is take a soldering iron. Yeah. A hair dryer will do it, too. Okay, yeah. And just heat that bad boy up a little bit and then try to crank it out. I had one of them that was like that, and it freed up. But you've got to get it pretty hot. Yeah, but a hair dryer on high, really close, often can get through Loctite. Perfect. Because the metal screw that you're working on is going to channel that heat to the Loctite. Yeah, so that's what I had to do on one of them. I've never tried the soldering iron idea, though. I might try that on some stuff. Just the tip, Dennis. Just stick that tip in there. Let it sit for a while. The problem is it's hard to gauge sometimes how much heat is coming off of that. That's the thing. That's where with a hair dryer on high, you can't put your hand on it. It'll burn you. It's very hot. But it's not going to be like, hey, look, it's third degree. Your new friend. We're turning into slam tilt over here. We've got to get off this subject of fixes. You brought up the dip switches. I wasn't going to mention it. Next, what are we going to bring up? Competition pinball? Jeez. Let's talk about just YouTube channel and fondness. I know that there was some D&D LE gameplay over at the Flippin' Out Pinball channel on YouTube. Oh, isn't that... Yep.
    19:13
    I'm so sorry, but I'm not really sorry. They caught me off guard. Yeah, Joel and Jared streamed that with special guest Dwight Sullivan. Oh. Lead programmer of the game. Really? Mm-hmm. He always has fun over there with those guys. I love watching Dwight. He's hilarious and carefree, and he says it as it is kind of thing. I love it. And speaking of streams, Aimless Pinball. I didn't know of this channel. I do now. They streamed D&D this past week with Kevin Smith. The voice actor? Yes. Well, the actor, but yeah, the voice actor for this project. He was a voice, right, in D&D? Mm-hmm. Yeah. What did he voice in D&D? What is his voice in it? One of the goblins or something. I don't know. One of the little, I don't know, dwarves. I don't know who it was. But he voiced somebody. And so that's a big exposure. I like that. I did also like the follow-up. Kevin Smith, if you guys check this out, I read the specifics at NAP Arcade. Apparently during the stream, he was telling about thinking, like, he wanted to have a pinball machine done. And his manager was like, yeah, I'll look into it. And then Stern Pinball called and be like, hey. and his manager's like hey we're going to go to Stern Pinball do some voiceover stuff and he's like alright sweet and then he sat through all the D&D stuff and then at the end he was like I'm looking forward to working with you guys more on pinball and they were like what are you talking about and he was like oh I thought I was working on like Jay and Silent Bob pinball I thought it would be cool to have a pinball machine around Jay and Silent Bob and apparently he thought that that's what they were going to be doing but that's another company supposedly has oh so that's very interesting yeah so he's like i found out that it's a different company and i probably shouldn't be saying this but yeah cats out of the bag but that makes me ask you dennis jay and silent bob is a pinball machine i mean i can't see it being a huge seller no i mean i've seen like jay and silent bob strike back and I think they were recurring characters in several Kevin Smith films. Dogma and Clerks. Yeah.
    21:25
    It's not big enough. I like it, though. It's a cool thing. As a vanity project, I kind of get it. It's just they alone don't really – I don't think they're a strong enough theme. Maybe it's one of those white labels from American Pinball. Yeah, I was going to say, this is the sort of license that we ride up American Pinball's alley to at least contemplate. But, I mean, Cuphead's a stronger theme than this. So I just like that. Kevin Smith is like his day to day. He's just working. He has no clue. He's like, Oh, no, that's as fast as I, what my agent just said, come here and talk. It felt very role play, but whatever. Did you ever see that movie he did with Bruce? No cop out.
    22:05
    He did cop out with a cop out or I didn't know that. I don't, I just don't remember. I remember the movie. I just don't remember him. I remember, uh, Oh God, what's his name? Tracy Morgan and Bruce Willis. Yeah, I actually really like Cop Out. I guess it wasn't a great filming experience. If I remember correctly, Kevin Smith had worked briefly with Bruce Willis on something else, and so he really wanted to do a movie with Bruce Willis, but then I think he just had a lot of conflict as a director with Bruce Willis as an actor on the film. But as a buddy cop movie goes, I actually really enjoyed that movie. Somebody got to get pregnant Yeah I love Tracy Morgan Yeah and they got this whole ridiculous it just a let let Tracy Morgan be Tracy Morgan scene early on in the interrogation room where he says these are not the droids you looking for It's like, Star Wars?
    23:00
    It doesn't make any sense. It's Tracy Morgan's greatness. It's just fun. But anyway, Cop Out would be a good pinball thing. It'd be just like Jay and Silent Bob again. So much is coming. i we've been telling people have we not i know that in discord we've been talking like there are things coming this year that give me everybody oh the tariffs and the markets down and all this shit nobody's buying pinball there's threads dedicated i don't know how many pin side threads are you must be crazy if you're buying new inbox pinball like all of this stuff and i'm still like oh just wait until you see what we have coming in 2025 easily like the best year for titles in a long time. We've been waiting for this. Sure. Do you think that really nobody's going to buy any of this stuff? Oh, people will buy. It's just there are, I think, a lot of fair questions. Like, it's obviously those overseas are perhaps going to have a bigger struggle. That might be a bit, yeah. You know, Canada is a good case in point. We already know from the write-up from the first, you know, initially threatened and then pulled back tariff that Canada will have reciprocal tariffs, and pinball is definitely in their list because I've seen it. I read it myself. So that obviously there will be markets that will be compromised. And then there's a question about the impact on parts supply that we might be bringing in from countries that we have tariffs on because the importers, the U.S. importers will have to pay for those tariffs and they'll probably pass at least a portion of those costs on. So then the question is, can the pinball companies absorb that or will they have to do a price increase to cover the tariffs, at least in part? I think we're going to see the price increase from most everybody regardless. We haven't seen price increases lately. But wages don't just go up because tariffs have decided that they're going to be tariffs. Absolutely. So given all of that, there are – I would be concerned in the sense that I do think there will be less buying in general because there is this blanket that is smothering everything that didn't have to exist. That does not mean that they will not be good years for pinball companies. I'm just saying that there are some people that might have to be out, so it would have been better if there weren't tariffs. Does that make sense? It does. And then I'm trying to figure out if relative to that, because of what they're getting compared to what they've gotten in the past, if, for example, JJP, rumored Harry Potter, their previous game Avatar, does a better market when avatar comes out yield more products sold than a horrible market and harry potter come out i seem to think that because of what is about to come out even in a low market sales will be higher than that of a good market with worse products worse titles if that that makes sense yeah i see where you're coming yeah yeah no it's a fair point so yeah in a perfect market, it would be even higher. But yeah, I think that a lot of these units are going to sell. What also interests me, because listener, we're about to talk things heating up here. What may be coming out? How many things? We're getting in that, as you and I have predicted since last year, we're going to get into this Q1, Q2, big old monster release from all these companies. But I'm going to ask you this. in the past remember how reliant upon export bally williams was these export dealers like in germany remember they changed shit because of all of that whatever happened to that are export just not as big anymore in pinball i think that's probably the case but remember that the market is different in the sense that that that era was arcade operators okay um in europe For example, homes tend to be smaller than in the United States.
    26:53
    So there can be pressure. You can't buy as many homes. There's a lot more smaller home living and stuff in a lot of those areas. Americans blow money on stuff more than a lot. Well, it's like Manhattan in New York City versus Manhattan, Kansas. In Manhattan, Kansas, having a big house is no big deal. Shout out to Manhattan, Kansas. And you can get a lot of house for the same money that you would spend on an apartment where your space is going to be more limited. in New York. So it's all of that. I think that's the biggest thing though, is that it's just, we have a bigger home market. I think that's why you tend to see where we talk exports the most. It's Canada, Australia, and the US where having sizable homes is pretty feasible. Do you think, how big do you think these other, how many units do you think these other countries are selling, do you think they're selling still higher per dealer than any dealers in the U.S. since there's so many?
    27:52
    I'm not sure what you're asking. Do you think that, let's say, if one dealer has Canada, do you think that that dealer is because they're covering the whole country selling more pinball machines as one dealer than all of the dealers in U.S., single dealers in the U.S.? No. No, maybe not. Because it's like one dealer versus 80 in the U.S. I just don't.
    28:21
    That's why I'm wondering how many are moving. I won't say all of them. The biggest U.S. dealers might outsell the all of Canada dealer, but I'm sure the all of Canada dealer probably is pretty high up there on the dealer list. Like they might be in the Justice League of dealers.
    28:36
    I completely agree with you, but that also makes me want to put things in perspective a little bit, too, for people. There are – to even think that there are some U.S. dealers that single-handedly are selling more pinball machines than entire countries, that is very interesting. It is, but let's say that those other countries still – It puts things in perspective. Still account for – well, let's say Canada accounts for 10% of Stern's sales. Do you think it's that high? I would love to know. I have no context. I don't know if they've ever shared with the dealers. They usually talk like home versus arcade, not U.S. versus non-U.S., but we know that there's a pretty high level of interest of pinball in Canada. Sure. Just like Australia has a pretty high interest level. Europe, yeah. They have a lot of other barriers that already existed that help suppress, like Australia in particular because of the shipping and stuff, that you have to be in an even stronger financial position to be able to get a game. Let's put it that way because of the additional cost to get it to you. And it's going to be even worse now. That wasn't so much the case. Yes, it will be. That wasn't so much the case with Canada, though. So with Canada, it was basically on par with other than like they have a certain tax structure that made it more expensive in Canada. But it wasn't absurd. But now it may be absurd. So I'm just saying like they might off the top lost a certain percentage of sales because of this stuff overseas. And I do think it's a double-digit percentage when combining all the countries. I'm not saying Canada is 10%. I'm saying Canada plus Europe plus Australia is double-digit percentage. I would love to know what the percentage of non-U.S. together would be. This would be really interesting. Stern. Dennis here. Zach here. I need to know what the break – at least tell us how much of your sales percentage are U.S. versus non-U.S. We get consumption numbers on podcasts. Come on. This is – I don't think this poses any sort of competitive disadvantage to share this information. So if you could write into the pinballshow.gmail.com and let us know that, it would be very helpful for us to have a more informed discussion. Or of all the people there that know this information, message me. I'd love to know from the other companies too, like Pinball Brothers. Like, they're European-based. Yeah, it doesn't have to be just Stern. Like, what percent? Surely, they're higher European percentage than Stern is. I'd love to know how much.
    31:06
    Wow. What I do know is, as we talk about this segment, things are heating up. There are many manufacturers releasing new games in 2025, many of which are aiming at Q2 of this year. I think this is part of also, though, why some people maybe are kind of chicken littling, but none of this came out in Q1. And for it to be such a busy year, it feels like it should have been more spread out. They run into this issue every week. It happened a few years ago when we had that mega bomb drop with Galactic Tank Force and everything, and that all came out in a six-week period of February, March. It just all dropped. I think it is in preparation to be spread out, but it's not like these companies are talking to each other, so they don't know. They're going to try to spread it out, but then again, you've got to hit at just the right time to increase the likelihood or probability of sales based on the public information that is rumored or heavily suggested. So I say this. Who has the imminent game releases? We know that Stern Pinball is damn near ready. Jersey Jack pinball, Barrels of Fun, Pinball Brothers, Multimorphic. That's what, five of them?
    32:24
    Yeah. I don't know if anybody else. I mean, if we're counting CGC with their Cactus Canyon Remake Enhancement Package. I wouldn't count it, but. And we know that they've got an imminent MMR release. That, I think, is more of a thing to count. That's going to sell more units than most of these other manufacturers are going to sell new products. Oh, there's big demand for it, yeah. So they're a contender here. But the question is, a lot of people ask in this hobby, what are we going to see at TPF, right? That's March 21st through the 23rd or even Midwest Gaming, April 4th through 6th. I know what my thoughts are. What are your thoughts? Because my thoughts are that TPF at least is going to be light. I think so too. Basically, it's going to be evil deads and D&Ds. I don't think these companies are ready. Yeah, I don't either. I'm actually, I mean, I'm still going to TPF, but I'm, this, in terms of the new release schedule, this is probably the least exciting I've ever seen it. I don't think I'm going this year. That means you're not, by the way. Yeah, probably not. I've learned that. Yeah, probably. You'll be like, no, I bought the plane ticket, and then you're like, I canceled the plane ticket. Well, no, I didn't cancel it last time. The fucking weather got me. What am I going to do about that? I don't know. TPF, I don't think we're going to see hardly anything there. I think we're going to see Multimorphics. It would make sense because it's their home show And Multimorphic is like the low man on the totem pole So they need to just They need to get out If they want to get any sales of anything Well they're in their own little genre So they can kind of do whatever they want I guess But the rumor for Multimorphic is Portal That's a pretty good license Is it? Video game wise yeah It's better than Cuphead Are you too close to it being a video game fan? I might be I don't think it's, again, like compared to Weird Al, it's not going to be a system mover in the same way. But as a license goes, Portal's got great humor. I'm curious to see how they would work it with pinball. But, yeah, no, I think it's a good license. Do you think the general population knows what the hell Portal even is? Oh, yes. Really? Again, it's dated, but Portal was a huge game. There were actually two games, and they're very popular. They got the – oh, gosh. I'm blanking on his name. The guy who played James Jonas Jameson or whatever from Spider-Man. Parker. That actor. Yeah. He was a voice line of like Cave Johnson in Portal 2. And I don't know if they'll have him do the voice work. I doubt it. Well, they probably try and have the GLaDOS voice and stuff. Portal. Yeah. Anyway, Portal is a – Who's the primary demographic buying these games? What have we got? I mean, it's not. 40 to 60? Again, it's not a current video game license, but please understand it's incredibly famous. Okay. All right. Any time that one of us says something's not famous, then we've got to deal with a whole next week of emails and messages and proof that something is big. Frankly, I don't give a shit. So you can spare typing it up. I don't think it's a good thing for pinball. All right. Okay. I disagree with you. We'll see.
    35:38
    We'll see. So that's the rumor anyway. I think that might hit TPF. I do think that there is some advantage depending on which company you are to jump out ahead. All right. Let's go through this. Stern Pinball, the rumor is King Kong. Jersey Jack Pinball, the rumor is Harry Potter. Those are big. Those are the big ones for the whole year probably. Here's where I'm going to use the market thing on the former. Harry Potter is going to be massive because it's Harry Potter, and people have wanted it forever. The game could suck, and it will do well. That's how powerful of a theme it is. King Kong, when it's all said and done, sells worse than Jaws.
    36:19
    Wow. It's a worse theme, and the market pressure is going to show. Elwynn is Elwynn. It will probably be a very good game. but Jaws was in a better market and Jaws will perform better. You want to compare a 12 month to a 12 month after Kong's out for 12 months. I bet you you'll, I bet you yourself, just as your distributorship flipping out pinball will have sold more Jaws. I don't, I mean, there's a large likelihood, but Jaws did not come out of the gate like Godzilla did. No, it did not. But that was a very different economic time. And Godzilla, again, Jaws was a better theme than Godzilla. I don't think it's necessarily the economic time that the reason that Godzilla hit the way it did. It just felt different. It's just the layout, the toys, the mech. Yeah, but Joss feels really different, too. Having spent a lot of time with it. I mean, it doesn't maybe have the same iconic set piece as the building, but like the shot geometry, it's different than everything else. Elwynn's done just like Godzilla was. So but what do you think King Kong does better than D&D? Yes. All right. So we're good there. Yeah. No, it's still Elwynn. Let's not. I mean, there will be people who will buy it. Again, kind of like how Harry Potter will sell regardless of it sucks. King Kong will sell regardless of it being King Kong because people trust Elwynn's design. Hmm. Okay. This is just science. Of those behemoths, when do you think Stern and Jersey Jack, we'll start with those two, when do you think they launch? Because they don't have to jump in front of anything. No. In fact, Stern doesn't plan any of their stuff around shows and stuff. We already talked about the upcoming release production schedule stuff for Stern. I think it's pretty obvious Stern plans to launch in April. And I think it's going to be after MGC. I don't think they need to land there at all. MGC is really early in April, right? Yeah, April 4th through 6th. No, I think it's after. Let me put it this way. I don't think Kong is at MGC. I'll phrase it like that. Maybe the teaser trailer comes out when MGC is going on or something. Do you think there will be this back and forth like there was with the Avatar release?
    38:35
    Remember that back and forth where Stern was coming out with Uncanny? Was it Uncanny? And they got in front of the Avatar release. And remember J.J.P. teasing basically a lot of stuff to say, wait, hold your money, hold your money. Do you think there will be a back and forth like that again?
    38:52
    Yeah, I think Jack will post some stuff. Because as soon as King Kong or the rumored King Kong gets teased, I think we'll see something from Jersey Jack because they just can't help but remind people. Yeah, I think so. I think the issue. Yes. Let me just put it that way. Yeah, I agree. Sometimes JJP gets a bit impulsive with some launch stuff. I mean, the attempts to get people to hold their money when D&D came out, when they were still months away from launching Harry Potter, felt weird to me. In a way, though, it makes more sense if Harry Potter is very, very close. The problem is it's almost a boy who cried wolf scenario now. Yeah, they've got to be careful with that. They're teasing Potter, and then it doesn't come out the year that they tease. It's like, you know, I don't get it. Do you think it's more advantageous for Stern to come out with their game before or after Potter?
    39:48
    Before. I agree. But does then J.J.P. get worried that, well, damn, that's going to be a lot of, especially in this market, it's a lot of money going towards Stern's Elwynn, and we know that they're going to love our theme.
    40:07
    That's what I worry about. Because I think that Stern is going to, like you said, April. We're going to see mid-April. We're going to see King Kong. But then I think Harry Potter still after that even, maybe even May. But I don't know if they can help themselves.
    40:28
    I mean, here's the thing. Yeah, I do agree that they will be worried about people that bought Kong not being able essentially to afford to buy Harry Potter because you can only buy so much a year. There's only so much disposable income for collectors. That's a fair thing to be worried about. But I think they are savvy enough to know that Harry Potter, the theme power on Harry Potter is such that there will be a lot of people that will find a way, even if that means taking a loss on their Kong and selling it after a month. If they're just like hell bent on getting Harry Potter. for me i think what jersey jack's bigger concern is may not be whether or not harry potter is ready but rather i think they are fully aware whatever sales they're still trying to get out of avatar and even possibly elton john will crater the moment harry potter is like it's going to kill the rest of their skews for a while so they want to be ready to like say are we okay moving on from all of this now and going into harry potter because once they do harry potter it will kill the entire JJP catalog. They got a nice little catalog game in Elton John. I don't think that dies. I think that if anything,
    41:39
    if Harry Potter gets people into it, would come back. But I think that they're very worried about what Potter is going to do long term on the rest of their catalog. And I think they should be concerned. I think they see the numbers and they don't see anything being catalog worthy except for Harry Potter. I mean, honestly, with Harry Potter, if Harry Potter becomes their next Woz and it's like the only game they need to make, hey, that's fine. That's still a best case. It's better than just relying on the catalog anyway. Here's the other thing, Dennis. It's a good scenario to be in. You know what Jaws didn't have to worry about? Jaws didn't have to worry about people saying, well, Jaws looks good, but I do know that JJP's got such and such or Chicago Game has got such. They didn't have to worry about any of that. I worry maybe, what about King Kong? People saying, man, I want that, but should I just wait to see what Harry Potter looks like? That could really affect sales, too. In the short term. True. But Stern plays the long game on there. They know they're going to produce King Kong for a couple of years at least. And no better long game than Elwynn. Exactly. And his titles, again, it was only recently, right, that Iron Maiden was said to go in the vault. so given that it doesn't like for stern they kind of win either way yeah their initial sales are definitely going to be influenced by when harry potter comes out but if harry potter does drop right away and it sabotages initial kong sales i think the worst case scenario is maybe the le sit a little bit long i still think the le's are going to sell out really fast on kong because it's elwynn Mm hmm. So you may impact the pro and premium sales. But over time, again, still makes me think, Dennis, that JJP is like, we got more to gain by getting in front of this. They do. Because here's the biggest risk for JJP is if Harry Potter isn't a very good player, what will happen is the hardcore. I got to have it. Pokemon collectors have to throw their little Pokeball or whatever those things are called and capture Harry Potter right away in the highest edition. Those sales are there no matter what. But if word of mouth spreads that Harry Potter is a middling game with a great theme, long-term sales will start to be like, well, do I want a – there are plenty of people like me who are like, oh, yeah, I know Harry Potter, but I don't love Harry Potter. Just like I know King Kong, but I don't love King Kong. My dollars are for whichever game is better. So if Harry Potter doesn't have the gameplay to compete with Elwynn, in the long term, the people that are not hardcore Potterheads might go, you know what? After hearing how bad it is or how it's not the greatest thing ever, I'm going to go with Elwynn.
    44:27
    So Stern's going to be okay no matter what on Kong. It's J.J.P. getting in front of Kong would be in my mind, and you correct me since you actually do sales for a living. in my mind if i were jjp i'd be like i really want my harry potter out before kong because then there are others that will be like well ellen's game's not out yeah you know not everyone listens to shows like this and they're not going to really know that kong's imminently coming out in april and they're just going to go okay get you gotta get some i haven't had a new game since uh since jaws i want to buy something new that's why yeah i i completely agree with that stance and that's why i'm like i think jjp like they try to be more cognitive in their approaches because they've seen what's worked and what hasn't in the past uh via launches so like their mind says one thing but as we inch closer their heart starts pushing them another way uh or what's in their pants that's my mom think what's in your head not what's in your pant right and they might get a little excited we don want to be premature either so they trying to they not edging all right this has become sexual I sorry Let throw another dodgeball into if you can catch a wrench you can catch a dodgeball Let's throw another wrench into it. Let's throw in, I don't know, a rumored predator, another huge license by Pinball Brothers. Now, this last week, Canadian Pinball Podcast, Chris reporting the following rumors, that this game is going to be a wide body game, that it is Predator, it will have film assets, there will be 1,000 units, and it will launch April 25th. Now, given that Chris is about 15-20% correct with his predictions and rumors, let's, for the benefit of this argument, assume that all of that is true. Okay. Throwing that into April 25th, that now throws King Kong. Does King Kong come out right before that? Let's say it does. Let's say King Kong is announced. Then it's Pinball Brothers Predator. At this point, with this type of knowledge, does JJP really start thinking, shit, can we really wait? And then it turns into something like this. Boardroom meetings saying, look, where are we at on supplies, parts? Where are we at on launch materials? How are we going to do this? Is there any scenario that we launch prior to all this to get ahead of it? If not, do we now start talking about pushing it away from this crowd as much as possible?
    46:58
    June. Predator, for whatever it's worth, is a big license. It is. Oh, if Pinball Brothers has Predator, what an excellent score. Alongside Alien, yeah. Yeah, no, well, the problem with Pinball Brothers is outside of the highway design that they have milked to death, they don't have a great reputation on having all that fun of games. Correct. So that's their biggest issue. They've had some okay themes and other themes that like Queen was an excellent theme that should have done way better for them than it ended up doing. But saying all that aside, yeah, Predator is excellent. And I think some people might be cautious about it, but the bottom line is most people in pinball now don't even remember Skippy. Like they weren't around. Yeah, that's a non-point at this point. They weren't there when the forging of the world was like we were. So given all that, yeah, excellent. I don't know, at a cap of 1,000 units, if JJP is going to weigh too heavily on that. Because, again, we're assuming all these statements are true. And that's, you know, so you know there's a finite count. In this industry, that's pretty significant. It is. I mean, you've heard me plenty of times rant about Stern when they were running with 1,000 unit LEs, acting like that was particularly special when it's not they should do that for king kong though but um but uh yeah i mean i guess strategically as long as they're and given their backing i'm sure they would be financially fine with doing it i think it would make sense for them to go ahead and it move later in the year if that's the case because i i think given all of that nothing else that we've talked about other than of course the medieval madness remake uh which again is a remake that has already been released before is really in their way that's notable. Like Cuphead's not going to be a serious threat if it ends up coming out. And when MMR comes out, the one thing I'm not as worried about, plenty of people will plop down $1,000 for a deposit, but they know that they're not going to have to pay the remainder for a fucking year or so. You know, that's, I don't think, I think people do consider that whenever they're making purchases. Oh, sure. So I'm not worried. But yeah, that muddies the water here. A predator potentially coming, landing at the end of April. And then I'll do this to you, listener. We still have to sprinkle in barrels of fun.
    49:24
    The rumor is possibly like, Dune? Dune. When in the hell? So at this point, Dennis, I want you to become the CEO or president of barrels of fun. let's say hypothetically you could be ready to launch whenever you know whether or not you'll have games in boxes or whether to be a couple months like many manufacturers will do uh what do you do what are you thinking about here if you have let's say for argument's sake let's say you have like a dune or even the other rumors like gi joe let's say you have one of them which in my opinion it's not as strong as harry potter is a theme um it's as strong as king kong but it's not got the selling point of elwynn uh it's not as strong as predator but it has more i think it has more collectability and and confidence as a company barrels of fun than pinball brothers that may sound crazy but i think it's true people are excited about what's coming from barrels of fun so they have that momentum what do you do well given the if everything else is playing out as we have talked about like you know jjp is going to push out potter sometime around maybe may june you know kong coming out in april all of that predator april yeah predator or you know maybe late april may sometime in there i would say it might be best for them to have dune ready for Expo.
    51:00
    Oh, so you're saying push completely. If I were them, I would push it, even if they are ready, unless they can get it at TPF. Dune could be at TPF. It's great. Otherwise, I think you wait until Expo. Okay, hold up. I'm going to throw a wrench.
    51:16
    Another wrench. No. What are we throwing? I guess. I don't know. We're throwing darts. Whatever it is. Tomatoes. What if you realize that your company can't be sitting that long and paying people.
    51:30
    Right? They don't have enough labyrinths to build in the meantime. They only have like 80 more labyrinths. They're done essentially building labyrinths. They might have another month, maybe two months. They can spread it, slow down, but they're going to be ready. They have to do something.
    51:50
    So what if you couldn't wait until Expo? Then you just launch when it's ready. There's nothing else to be said. Do you, but I'm saying, do you try to get ahead of all of this in March? Do you try to hit TPF? Do you try to wait until April right before CERN pinball? Or you just say, you know what? These are the cards we're dealt. We're just going to have to launch whenever. I don't think they do that because they're like, there's still some strategy here. I just don't see a scenario that they can't force getting out in front of all of this. If it is a Dune or a GI Joe. Yeah, the thing is, I feel like they're so oriented around the fact that they scored tremendous goodwill with the community by having games ready when they revealed. Yes, that's a big one. And to immediately on your sophomore effort go, and it's a little bit of a loaded term, and I don't mean it to sound super aggressive, but betray all of that and become just another company that wasn't ready and you had to get your announcement and then everyone gets pissed off six months later when you're still not shipping games. I just don't think they can do it. I think they have to be able to have at least games ready for people to try. Even if they're not ready to immediately ship and sell, they have to have games ready to try. That would be better than a lot, yeah. And I think, given their size, they need to tie it around a show. So, like, they could be ready by MGC and do it at MGC. That would make sense. Texas is their backyard. Texas would be the best option because also the attendance is a lot stronger. But they have to have games on the floor for people to play. I think it's critical to their entire strategy and how they won Goodwill in the first place. And they are still a very small company, and that Goodwill could very easily be cost. Let us not forget, Haggis earned a lot of good will with Celts, and then they started to lose it with Fathom.
    53:42
    How many games did JGP have of Elton John at that expo? It was like two or four, and then they didn't make them for, like, ugh. Well, CGC ran into that issue at the expo when they did Cactus Canyon. Yeah, same thing. They had like two of them, and they weren't ready to ship forever in a day, which I know people are used to with CGC. That's why Barrels was so man, so cool. They came out with like five right on the floor and then with 12 of them at one point, like, oh my god. Yeah, no, it was like yeah, I want to think, listening to the last Silver Ball Chronicles, which covered Barrels of Fun, I want to think they had mentioned something along there was around 10 units that were on the floor at TPF when Labyrinth came. And they got it wrong. It wasn't TPF, it was Chicago Expo. Yeah, that was the thing I was like, I didn't think that launched at TPF. I remember it being at tpf because i played it at the next you know that next year but i was like i don't think that was the launch but so that was that was huge i think this and but then they and they had some on the line but uh they started producing labyrinths more heavily january february and then it built from there so a couple months after x but i think they need to get ahead of it. So that's at Chicago Gaming Company. I think MMR June, they'll say okay, we're ready to launch that. We'll start making them. Do you think we see that Cactus Canyon remake enhancement package anytime soon? I think that's going to be before MMR personally.
    55:14
    It needs to be. I don't know what they're smoking if it's not. I have zero sense. I think so few people care anymore. Oh, okay. Unless you already own the game. It ain't going to goose more Cactus Canyon sales, I don't think. Not notable amount. There's a lot of Cactus Canyon out there, though. There is.
    55:30
    It's just like with MMR. MMR, there are a lot of people who are waiting for MMR, but I don't think MMR in this landscape of Potter, Kong, Dune, all that, I don't think MMR wins over people that weren't already waiting to get MMR, but there are some people that are. That money is set aside. They want MMR. I think there's a number of them. Too close to CCR because I'm really anticipating that and I can't wait for it. Okay, so what else might release this year then? We know Pedretti Gaming is going to have a remake at some point. Yeah, I'm not too concerned about it being a significant player, though, in the purchase dollar space. Same with Turner.
    56:09
    Turner's still too small. Cuphead might come out this year, and it's a known license. But again, in this landscape, it's weaker than everything. As I told you, Portal is a better theme than Cuphead. yeah i just i don't know enough about it to to go either way there but again it's not just theme i mean obviously with portal you have to be willing to embrace the entire p3 ecosystem concept yeah and and cuphead would be a more traditional pinball machine but nonetheless it's from a company the problem with cuphead is even if the game is great the rules are awesome and you love the theme there's just so little confidence that american pinball is honestly going to keep the operation going to be able to support the company, to support the build. I think a lot of people just don't trust it. And that's how that bell has been rung.
    56:57
    It's really hard to unring that bell. For those that are club members, they heard all about Pins Up before everybody, didn't they? Last week or the week before. Now everybody knows because there's articles and stuff following what we did. But yeah, a lot of Pins Up stuff. So Turner Pinball, yeah, they may have something this year. Spooky Pinball, we know they reserve that area. They like that November, December release away from everybody. Chicago Gaming Company, I don't see us getting anything else from them this year besides MMR.
    57:31
    And then Stern Pinball we know is going to have another Cornerstone, another probably remastered. So more is coming from that as well.
    57:40
    That's a lot of stuff. It is. Speaking of Spooky Pinball, did you know that they – just went over the threshold of selling 800 Evil Dead. I did not know. So we're close. We're closing in on about probably 75 more units until they sell out of that game. Yeah, I was going to say, I didn't remember what their cap was. I think it was 888.
    58:02
    And I think they're like 825 now, something like that. Well, that reduced number was really smart for them, obviously. And people are still liking that game. It's holding up. So it's been helpful that other than D&D, nothing else has really come out. Absolutely. And so, so different. Those two themes. I think right now they're shipping. A lot of people ask me and a lot of people like every day, where are they at? What numbers are they shipping? I think they're shipping in like number 60s on games. So just getting to number 60 or so. Then I don't know how many they produce a week, but you can do the math. There was a, I did a, for flipping out pinball, did an unboxing short or real. People like those quick one-minute unboxings and such. It shows off the sexiness of a new game.
    58:49
    So go check that out if you haven't seen that. And if you want to be one of the ones that share it, I think it's been shared between Instagram and Facebook and TikTok. I think it's been shared over 500, 600 times. Yeah. So it's out there. You see my ugly mug out there. And Spooky Pinball also has new code for Looney Tunes. I love that this company still focuses on games that they've made in the past. I mean, and these aren't just like tweaks and stuff like that. It is that. But they've added two new modes slash episodes to Looney Tunes. That's bravo. That's really, really nicely done.
    59:30
    I don't see a lot of companies continually doing code over, you know, a couple years after a game's been released. So I like it. You know what else I like? No. Screaming goats.
    59:44
    Oh. I'm getting to the point, Dennis, in life that I think by the age of 50, there's a significant chance that I have turned away from everything and I own like a 100-acre farm and I've got goats and chickens and a horse.
    60:05
    Farms are a lot of work. I think that at some point I'll just say to hell with the world and I'll just, that's what I'll do. I'll just tend a farm and walk around naked. I think that I'm going to turn into that weird, naked, half-drunk farmer.
    60:20
    I think that might be my calling. Will you come visit? Probably not. Can't you see me pulling up on my tractor, my balls just flopping around?
    60:32
    It's quite the visual. You're here. All right. So where was I going with that? Oh, yeah, yeah, screaming goats. Yeah, I'll own some goats as well. But we have to say thank you to our highest level club membership supporters. And it's really simple. All you guys have to do to sign up to be a member of this Pinball Show Club is just go to patreon.com slash pinball show. But these individuals, they're in the halls of the pinball show, the recording studios. They've got framed pictures up. One of them's of a bobcat.
    61:10
    Because we want to thank Rodney for the continued support. Oh, shoot that fucker! Bumblebee. Bumblebee! Yeah, he's there as well. Steve, very, very much appreciate your continued support of the pinball show. We need you guys. The panther.
    61:28
    In his portrait, he's wearing a white tie, which is interesting. He could have went black and just blended in, but he went white. Thank you, Rob, for the continued support. The Falcon with a bow tie for whatever reason. Are you a bow tie guy? No. I'm not. I own zero. I think they look goofy. I just don't understand them. It always reminds me of Pee Wee Herman.
    61:54
    Well, logical. I just have a hard time taking someone seriously with a bow tie on. I don't know why my stereotype because it is I'm just branding people is when I see people wear bow ties saying aside tuxedo bow ties which are logical is that you're trying to look intelligent oh you think they go that way and well because it's like almost like professorial maybe that's because I remember like nutty professor and all that but my problem is I'm like why is it important to you to send that message why are you trying to convey visually that you are intelligent. Oh. And it makes me wonder if maybe you're not. Are you referring to Eddie Murphy, Nutty Professor, or are you referring to, what's his name? Jerry Lewis. Yeah, Jerry Lewis is the one. I've not seen the Eddie Murphy, Nutty Professor. At least I don't remember seeing it. Oh, my gosh. Email thepinballshow at gmail.com. Do not email us about that. We do not care. Yeah, I skew more towards, like, they're trying to be cute when they wear a bow tie. like i'm always like oh here comes this guy he's gonna talk too much he's gonna oh god i just i don't have time for that guy not to say frank that you're that guy i would be interested frank if uh if you do wear a bow tie or if you go with a tie and and what is it with the the skinny ties i understand with the bolo ties no not the bolo like the texas no not the cowboy yes you see I was trying to say I'm from the South. No. Have you seen like this? They're really skinny. Like there's a modern skinny, which I like. I don't like the big, fat, outdated ties either. I can't wear those anymore because those are like, hey, I haven't bought a tie in a couple decades. But just a modern thin tie will suffice.
    63:46
    Like I wear. I don't even wear ties anymore. I'm lucky to have a collar on my shirt now that I work in pinball. Oh, I'm such a fucking bum. The Fox, thank you so much, Joe, for the continued love, for the continued support.
    64:03
    I haven't talked to Joe in a while. I need to call him. The Bell, thank you, Charlie. Do people wear bells?
    64:11
    Not sexual stuff, but like just normal. They never reach my lap because I have nothing else. Okay. I don't have a bell in my ensemble.
    64:23
    Nicole, add that to Amazon. no not like a cowbell but just like a regular i got a bull we don't have a cow we've got a bull yeah uh thank you dude and your dudeness william we appreciate your continued your continued support you son of a bitch no argument hey careful man there's a beverage here Well, cock-a-doodle-doo my ass. Thank you, rooster. Josh, thank you for the continued support. Being a Screaming Go Club member.
    65:01
    I'm going to rock out with my cock out. See, the rooster doesn't need to wear a tie. He's got his dangler. He's like an ascot, a built-in ascot. He always has to have it red, though. I still, that's one of my life goals is to touch a gobbler to see with it. I'm telling you, I'll have a rooster. I'll have chickens. I'll have it all and I'll smell like aqua Velva There's something about an aqua Velva mouth John thank you for the continued Support John hung out during our happy hour Hangout In February it was good to see him And we've already scheduled the March one We have it's what March 19th 8 to 9 p.m. Central yeah that'd be a lot But honestly that last Happy hour hangout that was intense that was a good one yeah all i remember is you're 15 minutes late yeah but i made up for it in a big way as i always do i was i was a heavy hitter heavyweight ding so thank you for all of those screaming goat club members and uh i've got some ideas on our on our newest member whenever we get another person we did we did have somebody reach out and say i almost want to bump up from nordman to uh to screaming goat so i can become what was it what did they want to be? I was thinking onion, but it wasn't an onion. I think I proposed onion to someone once. I forgot what it was because they were like, oh, that would be funny. Was it the egg? It might have been the egg, yeah.
    66:32
    Excellent. Yeah, it was. It was egg. If you are a club member, officially, look, patreon.com slash pinball show, as low as $10 a month. You get access to our Discord channel. Like right now in Discord, people are talking about whether JJP's POTC, Pirates of the Caribbean, is that the real deal? And if so, is it worth that much money? Is it overrated? They're also talking about Harry Potter and what's to come there and D&D shooter rods. Somebody had a, I think it was Ed, had a really cool D&D shooter rod that he was showing everybody and where to buy it. So a lot of talk over there. But you get Discord access. You also get exclusive content, and we're about to tap into what that exclusive content is going to be this episode. But you get all kinds of other goodies as well. So sign up today. Bye-bye-bye. Support, support, support. Keep this train rolling. Look over the horizon, Dennis. You see that? Smokestack of steam? Oh, no.
    67:28
    It's coming. It's coming quick. It's coming hard. It's none other than pinball market trends. turning up this week dennis creasel is dungeons and dragons or dragons and dungeons i don't care what order they come in they're hot hot hot i said at the at the top of the show listener i'm a little surprised at the sales and they continue to roll in i wanted to give you an update, Dennis, that remember whenever games are released, we always talk about kind of the breakdown between how many people are buying an LE versus a pro versus a premium. And typically, over the last year or two, premiums always outsell the pros. And initially that was the case But I here to tell you Dennis Creasel this may surprise you we have now surpassed that uh the sales of of premiums by pros on dungeons and dragons that doesn happen as often and that's not to say that the premiums are not selling well because i just ordered more of them but the pros are just selling really really good i think it's a multiple reasons why number one And you're not losing a lot when it comes to the pro, I would argue you are. But from an outsider efficiency perspective, people are like, okay, so you don't shoot balls from the mouth of the dragon and the dungeon. You know, it is what it is. So you're not compromising a lot. You're still getting a lot of the game. And then I think the fix kit thing, the whole fix with the dragon kind of scared some people into a pro. And then the premium was delayed a little bit longer because of it. So people are like, well, shit, pros are out now. Might as well buy a pro. So I think that's why we've seen a surge of pro sales over the last two weeks. Having said that, now that premiums are rolling out, I would say over the last week we've had more sales of premiums than of pros. But overall, pros have surpassed the sales of premiums, just as a part of my own company flipping out pimple. Nonetheless, interesting, I think, for people. I think people like to hear that kind of stuff. But Dungeons & Dragons. I don't know if they sold out of the LE I think they did sell out of the LE right now snapshot picture wise over the last three weeks selling better than Elwin titles oh really that says a lot yeah I mean it's the new thing but sometimes the new thing fizzles and Elwins come in the Elwin effect we talked about that which is in effect still but D&D doing very well also training up this week is the used market Woo!
    70:09
    Man, Pinside is like, their servers are steaming over there because of all of the for sale ads. I think a lot of things are happening at the same time. This is Pinball Market Trends. I give my analysis, right? Yeah, you do. I think we are in a more qualitative, but hey, it's entertaining. I think right now, the market, as everybody's suggesting and sometimes screaming obnoxiously, is lending itself to the used market. You can get a lot of game for the money or these new games that came out brand new in the box and people get tired of them after six months and they sell them or get out a pinball. It's substantially cheaper. So you see people selling them and then some people fear, Oh my God, I'm gonna lose a lot of money. I need to get rid of this. So they sell that. But also at the same time, you're also getting the word of new games coming out. Oh, Harry Potter, King Kong predator. What? So people are trying to sell their games now to make some room, free up some, some money right now there are a lot of good deals to be had on the pre-owned market so trending up very much so is the used market also trending up is used toppers because hell i mean if you're going to be trying to get the deal on a game i've seen more so in this last month people trying to buy toppers that are used from me it'd be fine if they were like saving a little bit people are like just like hey how much you want for that they'd like trying to just lowball the hell out of me on these toppers they're thinking oh since that mandalorian topper is out of the box it's only worth 500 right what no no get piss off get out of here but uh yeah people trying to get a good a deal on these used toppers that's a thing right now that i didn't know we would be uh really dealing with but i have to answer a lot of questions about used topper so much so that I'm trending the overall used topper market up this week because it's not just low prices on toppers. I sold a Guardians of the Galaxy topper at a record high two weeks ago. So people are still spending ridiculous amounts of money for some of these very popular, out of production, long out of production pinball toppers. So don't think the market's down on everything no no no it's still hot and toppers are still hot they are still a thing but it's where are they a big thing and for a lot of it it's some of these used toppers i never thought i would report that here on pinball market trends but it is what it is and speaking up i have to train this up because hashtag facts training up this week low ballers you know about these low ballers uh i mean i'm familiar with low ballers in general but i'm not quite sure where you're going with it Where's the world of high ballers?
    73:00
    I mean, some of these people, I guess I'm just experiencing this more because we're doing a lot of pre-owned sales right now in our company. But these low ballers, is it the gall? These little shitheads coming in and low balling individuals, they're turning up because they're everywhere. Like parasites, low balling. Some of you are said low ballers. and I'll say I'm just bringing it up because I'm saying this to you. Your argument is, well, what's it hurt? Right? You ever heard that? Yeah. Doesn't hurt to ask. Yeah.
    73:37
    Worst you can say is no. I've heard that one too. They'll come in and offer like 50% of the price. I've gotten to the point, Dennis, with on Facebook market when somebody, this is wrong to do bad business here, but this is just, this is your guy's act. This is who I am. I'm transparent. Let's say a game is $7,000. They'll come in and offer $4,500 for it. $4,500 on a $7,000 game. You know what I'll say? Most people just not respond. No thank you at this time. But if you go through 40, 50 of these things a day, it gets to you, people. So I'll say, you know what? Absolutely. And then they're like, oh, shit.
    74:18
    Oh, really? Is shipping included? Oh, hell no. I always say, you bet it is. And I'll provide free white glove service, too. Fuck. Why not? Oh, this asshole. So the argument is, it never hurts to ask. I'm going to actually argue against that. Because you know what? Whenever somebody lowballs me, it takes time for me to respond. And what does time equal, listener?
    74:44
    Dennis, you can provide the answer. Money. Time is money. And you're wasting my money. I'm like Big Perm, sorry, Big Worm on Friday, you haven't seen Friday I don't know what you're saying, it sounds terrible playing with my money is like playing with my emotions I've never seen Friday come on, let's smoke a spliff and watch Friday with Dennis but yeah, so you're wasting people's time and money and, not to mention if somebody does that to me and then later on down the line they're interested in the game and that chat history pops up I'm going to be like, oh this is that fucking tool that lowballed me. No. So it does actually cause harm. Let's jump to the trending down here on Pinball Market Trends. Trending down, well, I mean, it is what it is. Spooky, you get a couple games here. I don't know what's going on. Rick and Morty being one of them. Trending down Rick and Morty. We've had a couple of these come in on trade and the values of them have dropped. I remember when Rick and Morty, remember 750 is all they sold? This game's selling for 10,000. Six months ago, it was in the mid-9000s. It's been sitting there for quite some time. This is the Bloodsucker Edition or the top edition for the Rick and Morty. Remember, this is before they made the CEs. So now, though, right now, for Rick and Morty, BSE, like mid-8s, you can get one maybe even lower 8s. For Rick and Morty, that's been unheard of since it released years back. Sorry, Morty. Nobody likes you. Sorry, Morty. I can't do a good Rick. You know who can do a phenomenal Rick and Morty? Ken Cromwell, JJP. Oh, really? Oh, he would hate that I'm talking. Ken Cromwell, JJP, does some fantastic voices. You would never have thought, but yeah. Oh, cool. It's uncanny, actually. He has a good talent with that. So Rick and Morty is down, not to mention T&A. T&A also down right now in the marketplace. And you hate to hear that, Dennis. You still have your T&A, don't you? No, I sold mine years ago. Okay, you sold. But, you know, it's Beatgate ever since they changed the beat. Well, right now you can get a CE. Those things came out. There's only sold, what, 500 of them, 550? 550 on the original run, and then they did a second run. Remember the second run? Well, the CE was that second run. Right. I don't know how many they did. Did they make 500 of that? I thought they planned to make 500 of them. I remember they took a while to sell them. Maybe it was 300. I don't know. Yeah, they did take a while. Because those were in the pandemic, and the price was way higher than the old one. And they loaded these things down. They did. Like metallic powder coat. Some of them even had butter cab, the non-reflective glass. But right now, you can get one on the pre-owned market around $7,000 for a top-of-the-line TNA. That's a value right there. OGs, original ones, you can find in the mid to low $6,000s. What do you think of butter cabs? In general? Yeah. I love the looks of them but they are very very prone to damage and when you damage them you can't fix them and most people don't replace decals on their games but even if you did replace a regular decal on like a stern or something it still is much easier to do than replacing anything on a butter cab because it is direct printed onto the cabinet and then clear coated if you scuff that down there's no fixing it. You would have to sand down the entirety of the cabinet and then you'd have to get the printer you'd have to buy a whole other cabinet. Oh, okay. I'll keep my butter as my Alice face on some $1,000 Alice games. I like that.
    78:27
    I always tell people the butter, if you can take care of your games and you think you'll have it for a while you've got to go butter because there's nothing that looks quite like it. But, oh. There should be a kind of repairable version. Someone should come up with this. This is the idea of margarine cabs. You can't believe it's not better, but it's not. And it's a little easier. Actually, there is. Jersey Jack produces it. It's called the Rad Cal. Essentially the same thing. Margarine cab would have been better. They clear coat over, it's like a, yeah. But those things are pricey too, but not like a whole cabinet. Spooky does the looks of the cabinet they have the highest quality option when it comes to pinball cabinets believe it or not the uh the finish on a spooky pinball with the butter cabinet but yeah they're very prone to damage all right we got into cabinet talk all right it's also trending down this week uncanny x-men dennis oh they're coming in by the truckloads on trade at flipping out pinball i'll take them all too because i love that only time is going to tell whether these uncanny x-men are going to join the rankings of frequent trade-ins such as Mandalorian and Scooby-Doo. Those things, I always have a Mandalorian or a Scooby-Doo, it feels like, for trade. I think we've traded in five Scooby-Doos since January, so they're always coming in on trade. Right now, if you want an Uncanny X-Men on the secondary market, you can get a pro for around $6,000.
    79:58
    Pretty substantial savings, but they go deeper the higher you go up trim levels. like a premium mid to upper seven thousands that's a ninety seven hundred dollar game and then le you can they clocking in right around 99 99 right now that's three thousand off msrp now for those of you who are interested in an uncanny x-men i would say pull the trigger now because i do think that i'm a believer i'm a believer you guys know that all's trading down is fine dining dennis oh no Have you ever eaten at a fine dining establishment? Define.
    80:36
    Michelin star-esque? No, I'm in Kansas. Well, he travels. I didn't know of like special occasions. Nicole and I were on vacation and we've never done fine dining. So we went to one of these things just as a special occasion. We're celebrating love. Oh, so you like eight course meal and all that. Oh, yeah, that whole thing. But we've never been, so we didn't know what to expect. We just knew that we were going to pay way too much money. But it was an experience, you know, yellow. And so we went. We have not had a worse experience eating in our lives. It was horrible. That's why I'm training it down. It's just not our style. I think if you're raised country like me, I don't think that any of this food will ever taste normal or even good. It was atrocious, Dennis. And listener, I don't know if you feel the same way or if I'm just uncultured, but everything tasted undercooked. Oh, like even chicken. How do you mess up chicken? I knew that that was coming. Like, of course, seven. I can't get through all these courses, but this is disgusting. At least I know I have chicken coming up. And how do you fuck up chicken? Well, have a really good chef cook it because he barely cooks it. It comes in like a roll or something. I was like, is this spam? It was horrible. Horrible chicken. It was horrible. Everything. Everything that they brought out was like, oh, scallops. It's like, I like scallops. Oh, God, no, not these scallops. I like this, not these. Everything, they triple down on taste. So if they're giving you something truffle, they're like, well, here's truffle, but then we're going to sprinkle truffle on top and then load it with cream truffle. Pickle. If it's a pickle, we're going to serve you a pickle with charred pickle on top as a seasoning, and then we're going to dump pickle sauce on top of it. So it tripled down on everything. And then for the life of me, why does everything fine dining have to have its own foamy sauce? Oh, every single dish that came out here, they come with their little sauce thing. Oh, the chef prepared this bullshit bullshit for you and then just smothers it. And I like gravy, but this was like foamy. Oh, it's no good. It's just bad. And then the kicker was they're so concerned with the artistry of what they're presenting that if you don't eat something, all of it. they are concerned and then they report it back like fucking snitches to the chef this is the the people that bring out the food i don't even know what to call them maitraldi i i have no clue what to call these people but they hover and then you get the wine guy so then they'll snitch on you back to the chef and then the chef brings out something else and makes you eat that i can't eat all this food and i don't like any of it so then he brings out something uh chef concerned so see if chef wants to see if this uh agrees with your palate better Oh, please, no. Just stop bringing stuff. It was horrible. And by the time you get to all these fancy little foods at the end, you just want to be done. And you're drunk because every course comes out with its own guy with a wine. And then he laughs at you pretentiously if you're like, yeah, I like a drier wine. French wine, everything dry. Napa Valley, you got fruity bullshit wine. And then he lectures you. Now, a thing that I will never probably do again, trending down fine dining. unless it was with Dennis Creasel. I'd go with you. I want to go to you. I want to go to Disney with you. I want to go to, what else haven't you done? Apparently, I haven't seen Friday. Yeah, you don't have to consume cannabis, but I want to watch Friday with you. Maybe we can do fine dining, cannabis, and Disney all in one day. Still awake this week. Do you want to save a buck or two? I've got a Mandalorian Premium. Of course I do. With a topper. Yeah I marked this thing down It was like in the 8000s I brought it all the way down to $78.99 But for you listener We're going to slash that $75.99 Buy buy buy For a Mandalorian premium With a $2000 topper on it I've already had several people Hey how much do you sell that topper for? And if it doesn't sell at $75.99 I'll probably just have to sell the topper To one of these people Yeah just to make ends meet I know And you know what we have not done in a while Here on Pinball Market Trends Is deal of the what the what Do you remember that segment? I do. The sub-segment of Pinball Market Transmissions. Deals of the what in the fudge. And we're going to do that because it's a good one. Whoa. Dennis has heard this one. Yeah. So much so that he was like, these people have got to hear this one. We're going to do so for our exclusive club members of the Pinball Show.
    85:08
    You're going to hear about the deal of the WTF. Go sign up today at patreon.com slash the pinball show. for mature audiences only.
    85:18
    Pinball bounty! I'm still looking for a Congo. Those juicy Segas. Home use only. Museum quality restored only. Need not apply if not. Batman Forever South Park Independence Day. Please. Data East like Batman, Hook, Last Action Hero, Tales from the Crypt, Star Wars, WWF Royal Rumble. If you've never seen a game look newer, please reach out to me and tell me what it would cost to get. And as always, I'm just here to report the facts because numbers don't lie, and neither do I, on pinball market trends.
    85:51
    I think I just like fried food. I'm good. I'm good with country, gross food. Do you have an air fryer? Absolutely. I like the air fryer. I do like the air fryer. Yeah, we've neglected our microwave now. Yeah, I'm using the air fryer a lot more than the microwave now. Dennis, where can people catch you? They can always reach out at eclecticgamerspodcast.gmail.com. Easiest way to get a hold of me. Or you can reach out to us collectively at thepinballshow at gmail.com. Follow us. Like us on Facebook, on YouTubes, on all of that kind of TikToks, Instagrams, whatever it may be. And then sign up for Patreon. Please help us out. Thank you. Discord, you can join. If you're a Patreon club member, you can join the Discord too. We have a lot of fun there. Straight down the middle, a video series I do on YouTube. We did a Pulp Fiction review. But also, we just came out with the top five greatest pinball machines from each company. You've got to go check that out. We've even parceled it off so that there's the one big collective video with all of them. But if you just want to watch the top five Stern, we've got that for you, or the top five Data East, we've got that for you. I wonder which one's going to get the highest views between those. Bally Williams, maybe? Maybe. It's a good contender. American pinball? And of course the sponsor of this show Is none other than Flippin' Out Pinball When I buy my pinball shit I buy from Flippin' Out From Toppers or Braze Studios I've got it figured out Flippin' Out When I take a pinball I think Flippin' Out When I buy buy buy I buy from Flippin' Out Buy buy buy Over at Flippin' Out Pinball we have a lot of pre-owned games So much so that I've ran out of room in the showroom so come on guys we're gonna get rid of some of these things but they are truly going out as fast as they're coming in but they're they're going out a little less fast i guess is that how the math adds up just a lot of people are trading in stuff a lot of people like oh because the market's no it's because a lot of people traded in for dnd a lot of trade-ins toward dnd and you can do that too if you want to trade in your old game i don't want to crust a game but a game that you're no longer playing trade it in you don't want that venom premium anymore we'll take it fine you don't want that simpsons pinball party okay we'll take it and we'll send you something new product showcase right now or all the pre-owned games that we do have and it's super simple all you need to do because we'll update it like daily we get games in if you go to our flipping out pinball facebook page every day just check it out see what uh see what's new that we're selling and we offer probably the most competitive prices as a retailer in the industry, and we can get them to you fast and safe. Check it out. John Wick accessories we now have in stock, ready to go. So if you want yourself an hourglass top or whatnot. All of the new games like Dungeons & Dragons, we're taking pre-orders for Metallica. If you want a Jaws, Labyrinth, Pulp Fiction, Elton John, you name it, we've got it. The Escalier Stair Climbing Hand Truck. The turnaround time on those now, Dennis, is only like two to four weeks. It's really good. But for those of you wanting that Tilton truck table, everybody sees them in our Instagram reels and TikTok reels, and they're like, holy shit, where do I get that? They are prototyping a new model right now. So we're taking an interested list. If you want to get on that, I suggest you email us at Zach, Z-A-C-H at flip, the letter N out, pinball.com. You can email me there as well for any other needs you may have, new and used games. If you have any sales questions or even tech questions, you can email Greg, G-R-E-G, at FlippinOutPinball.com. Or any billing questions or anything, Nicole, at FlippinOutPinball.com. We'd love to earn your business in 2025. FlippinOut Media Channels. Right now, YouTube is hitting it hot over at FlippinOut. Joel and Jared are streaming, I think, Evil Dead this week, hopefully. And hopefully, he's got his whole giveaway bot figured out and fixed. That was a mess. tried to give away something and he didn't have it prepped with his new computer thing. He ended up giving the damn thing away to three different people. He just messed it up and thought it was this person, but it wasn't. It was this person. Oh, God. I think we fixed it. Dennis, teach these people. The top billing for 2025 is obviously going to be Jersey Jacks, The Boy Who Lived versus Elwynn's Giant Ape is vacationing, earning 20% on the beach at a weird, scary-sounding island. Which one's actually going to do better? We shall have to wait and see. And always practice safe pinball. And why limit yourself to just one of these new hotness that's about to come out? Oh, my God. Why limit yourself to two, Dennis?
    90:30
    The phrase is buy, buy, buy. So I'm encouraging everybody to buy all three. You're asking them to pay the price of a cyber truck and the pinball machines. Well, if you listen to our exclusive DILDA WTF, maybe I shouldn't be suggesting it.