Hey, what's going on pinball land and it's episode 17. That is one seven of flipping out pinball podcast. And my name is Ken Cromwell. Guess who's with me today, guys. Guess who he is. His name is Greg bone. Greg, what's up? Oh, I was about to say, who's with you? Who's here? Special guest, reoccurring for the 17th consecutive time. Took me by surprise a little bit. I thought you were throwing something on me I didn't know about. No, no, just trying to see where it is. I wanted to say Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, and Happy New Year to you, man. Yeah, you as well. Thanks, man. First podcast for us of 2026, and we're excited. Did you do any New Year's resolutions or anything like that? Are you a resolution type of guy? I'm not really, man. I kind of work on myself all year long anyway, so it's like the New Year. I mean, kind of. I mean, there's always small things. I want to travel a little more this year, that sort of thing, some stuff like that. Wow. Did I hear that you want to go to more pinball shows this year? I don't know about that. Well, my wife got a new job, so she travels quite a bit now. She literally just started. And so I want to take advantage of that and kind of go in places with her and all that. you know see some more things get out there and live a little bit that is a pretty cool benefit of working at flipping out i mean really we only need a cell phone and a laptop and we could be anywhere knocking out work oh yeah yeah because i mean she'd be working through the day so then i just yeah hotel just no different than an office or at home and i literally just did that uh over the last two days my son was visiting his girlfriend in uh in in indiana before he goes back to school uh he's studying abroad for the semester she's stuck at school so this is like the last time he's going to see her and i i just bunker down in the best western with my laptop and my cell phone and i worked two days you know it was but it was fine i i didn't mind it but then it got me thinking it's like i would like to treat myself every two or three months to like a florida beach airbnb oh yeah where i'm just working on the on the balcony for two or three days yeah i mean that would be amazing. That would be a huge difference. Oh, for sure. The other thing I noticed too, is when you have something that's just over the horizon to look forward to, you're just in a better mood. Oh, million percent. I like, I, I, I, I started traveling a lot more in the last year or two, um, just because of that, like, you know, one vacation wasn't enough, you know, and I'm fortunate enough to be able to take, you know, a couple there I'll call them vacations we go on one main vacation and then you know we'll do little two night things uh but but i've started trying to do something like that like quarterly because you just almost need that reset and like if you can do that like i highly recommend like if you have the means to to get away for just a weekend or get away for like two nights through the week somewhere and do it because it is such a recharge man for everything in your life and and i'm super frugal like let me tell you like you We've talked about my trips. You know. That's true. I watch for deals. All of my trips, I don't go a specific time. I don't go a specific month. You've literally booked three-day trips for less amount of money than it would take for me sometimes to take my family out to dinner. I'm like, how did you even do that? I'm crazy, man. I watch hotels, discount. I do everything that I can. But, yeah, dude, I agree with you. Like you, you, you have to take care of yourself like that sometimes and get away. It just makes, makes all the difference in the world. And so I look forward to Christmas time because it's like the one time of the year where my whole family is getting together on Christmas Eve. And it's just, it's just a good vibe. I just love that time of the season. I talked about that in the last episode. But then, you know, when you get past new year, you're just still kind of in the dead of winter. You're wrapping up football playoffs. And man, when football playoffs end and Super Bowl's over, you're just really in a state of man that you're waiting for pitchers and catchers to report. because now you're just hoping for spring to come. And out here in Chicago, man, spring might not come until July 18th. It's just depressing. You know what? You're not wrong. We were at Midsummerfest one time, and I had a sweatshirt on. It was so damn cold. Yeah, yeah. And it was still cold then. And that's – when is that, June? Yeah, I mean, for sure. That's why I stopped going to opening days for baseball because it could be 22 degrees or it could be 70. It's just like you don't have any way to figure it out. So the next thing that I'm looking forward to right now, though, is I guess February, early February, Super Bowl weekends, pinball at the beach. It's in Florida. Looking forward to getting out there for a couple of days. Sadly, it sounds like you're not going to be able to make it. I know. I'm a little bit depressed about that. I'm so jealous. I've heard nothing but good about that. We've got a lot of listeners that have been hitting us up via the email and direct message asking if we're going to be there. So they're going to be disappointed to see you or to not see you. don't be disappointed to see me that called and i told him i wasn't gonna be there because they were like oh we talked to ken ken said you guys are gonna be a pinball at the beach this is amazing and i'm like i'm not and they were like oh really it's like they didn't even talk to me anymore they didn't want to do business they're gonna be super mad at me because i lied i guess i didn't realize you weren't going until recently so my my apologies no it was my fault before we get into the show i want to take a minute and thank our new patreon members and that is jason and Scott coming in, joining Patreon. We've got our Patreon meet and greet after hours thing going on on Thursday of this week. By the time you hear this episode, it probably will have already taken place. But we have another one at the end of the month. And if you're looking to kind of get involved with the show in a different sort of way, you can go to patreon.com slash flipping out pinball podcast and join there for free. Or we have some tiers that have some extra benefits. Again, just another way to support the show that we appreciate. We went online and we posted another question via the Facebook, Greg, and the community engagement that we have via Facebook is pretty awesome. So the question that we posed on Facebook to everybody that was frequenting the page is this. What pinball myth or fact do you hear all the time that you don't think is actually true? Oh, man. Yeah. You know, I've got one right off the bat that I can tell you. I would love to hear yours off the bat because what I did is we had a bunch of feedback. We had like over 130 comments on that post that's gone through Facebook. Sadly, we can't read them all just for the sake of time and everybody's sanity. There were some that stood out to me. There were some that were funny. There were some that I just couldn't read because I didn't think it was appropriate. We had good interaction over at Patreon. And I think what we'll do is we'll take the Patreon and we'll put it separate and we use it as a bonus episode for everybody that's over at Patreon to discuss that. So today we'll discuss Facebook. Out of curiosity, Greg, what's one or two that you had? Oh, man. You've been told it's been ingrained in your head since the beginning of pinball time, only to find out that I don't think that that's real. Just knowing what I know and being in this business, you hear this all of the time. Pinball is hard. Making pinball machines are hard. Making pinball machines are not hard. These manufacturers have it easy. Like, I know so many manufacturers. We deal with all these manufacturers. Developing a pinball machine is not that difficult. Getting employees is not that difficult. You know, actually getting parts. Like, you just hear all this whining and excuses, but it's just not hard. It's just a myth. Yeah. Right? That's just bullshit. I want to see people's faces as they're listening to that at first. I was going to say, hey, I think we've got to start this over because you don't understand what I'm asking you. That's why I was kind of nodding my head. I took a drink of water and I'm like, do I stop them now? And then I thought maybe I just didn't understand what you were coming from. But the sarcasm came through. But yeah. OK. So the well, the myth in that case or the fact that you've been hearing is that making pinball is easy. Right. Or a pinball making pinball is not hard. It's not a big deal. That would be a myth. That would be something that you find out at some point. Because making a pinball machine is incredibly difficult. like these manufacturers deal with so many hurdles and everything else. Like, you know, I, I do not envy them in, in what they do. Well, I thought it'd be fun. Let's go ahead. Let's go down the list of some of this user feedback, user comments. And then, you know, we can comment on what we want. We can pass over what we want. Again, I'm not going to read 133 comments or whatever it was, but I picked out a couple. The first one is from Kyle. Are you ready, Greg? We're going to get it going. All right. Pinball myth is Greg knows magic tricks. Oh, Oh, damn! Kyle came right in. I had to start the episode with that one. For those that are new to the show, Greg's been talking about his passion for magic since episode one, and he's offered to show us some magic tricks. The only problem is, with his creative sleight of hand, his tricks have disappeared. We've never seen a magic trick out of Greg. Hey, Kyle, you know what's so bad is Ken is up my ass all the time. Just random will be out, and he's like, hey, Greg, they're still asking for that magic trick. It's so true! I totally am. I feel like I'm a burden now. And I'm like, man, I don't know how to bring this up, Greg, but you're going to have to like float or something like massive. It's built and it's going to be the shittiest, weakest trick you've ever seen. Whatever it is, we got to figure it out. But all right. So that was that was the first one that that kind of came up. All right. So the next one is from Jeremy. And he says that there are two that come to mind. One is that pinball is just a game of chance. It's not a game of skill. Oh, yeah. I mean, that's a huge that's a huge myth. I mean, but that was debunked easily. I mean, Roger Sharp showed the world that, showed the court system that. Well, and that's what he went on to say. He said, adding flippers greatly changed that mindset, but it took a skilled player to actually demonstrate the skill to greatly diminish this chance, quote unquote, mindset, and drop the chance of, or the chance slash gambling aspect greatly. And by doing so, it opened up the doors for accessibility for pinball to go to many more people. So that was that was one of the myths. His second one is that and this I thought this was interesting. Harry Potter will never be a license available to pinball because of J.K. Rowling's supposed disapproval of placing them in bars, pool halls, etc. I mean, I remember that was a talking point for years, for years, ever strong talking point. You never really heard any any other side of that story. I mean, that was what was kind of ingrained in people was like, no, she's against it all. Never going to see it. Never going to see it happen. And then there's Jersey Jack. Snag that son of a bitch. I remember thinking, I'm like, that probably makes sense. You know, she didn't want anything to taint her, maybe her license or IP that brought in a lot of kids. She didn't want them subject. And I'm like, okay, that makes sense. But, you know, obviously the story's been told here. And then another myth that went along with that was, myth, rumor, whatever. I remember once that license was secured and it was kind of leaked and people started, oh, shit, okay, it's going to happen. It was going to be the wizarding world of Harry Potter. You weren't going to have the characters. It wasn't going to be Harry Potter. You know, they had to work around just the world like a video game, you know, that didn't have the characters. You were just in the world of Harry Potter. Right, right. The other one was, well, the reason that she caved and allowed this to happen was because there's not going to be coin doors. so that it can't accept money on location. It's only going to be for homes. Yeah, I remember that too. Man, there's a lot of rumors on this Harry Potter. Anyways, we'll get past Harry Potter. But yeah, that was a good one. Another one here by Joe. He says, when buying used games, mint condition as good as new in box. Very rare. I think what he's trying to say is somebody that's saying that something is mint conditioned should be as good as new in box, and that's a very rare thing to say. So if you're listing a used game as near mint, yeah i mean mint is like yeah like you only breathed on it probably i don't know like i mean obviously i mean shit i mean you know you get a couple couple of divots and stuff in there a little bit from playing but i mean sometimes it could be better than new in box if they worked out some of the kinks yeah yeah that's true that's true that that one's a kind of uh that's kind of all over the place. I mean, that just depends. I do find, though, that people over-exaggerate the condition of their games quite often. Yeah, whether it's intentional or not, you probably always think that what you have. I've always been the opposite. I've always been very hypercritical of any of the games that I've had to sell because I know how critical I am of getting something. So it's like I never want to be like, ah, maybe I set false expectations. And I'm like you, honestly, like when I first got into the hobby, I seriously thought people were just being shysty bastards. Like I thought, OK, like I drove two and a half hours to come look at this game. And you told me it was in really great condition. I get here and it's like you can't even see the play field because the mylar, it's got full play field. I did this one time with a shadow and it was hazy. You couldn't see the art. It was so. And, you know, I can't remember if I told this on here when not long after I drove like another two, two and a half hours. look at a terminator and the guy was like oh really great condition everything i get there the teeth the teeth on on the t1000 are taped on they're taped taped oh it's taped it's literally a piece of clear tape with the teeth that were printed off of a printer on there and i was like what the fuck is this and that dude was so proud of that game though and it was like at that moment i started paying more attention to these people and i was like these people just don't like like some people don't, they, they truly don't see it. Like it's, it is in good shape to them or really great condition, you know, to them. Uh, so I've, I've kind of learned to get past that and take great condition with a grain of salt and get plenty of photos or make sure you see it in person, uh, sort of thing. Yeah, no, it's fair. I think you're going to appreciate this one. This one's from Brian, but his pinball myth is this jumpstarting the power supply on a Jersey Jack pinball machine will somehow boot the computer is, is Brian's myth. Oh. What's it do? I thought that was the whole point. I know. What's it jumpstart? I guess it jumpstarts the computer, but it doesn't boot it unless you go back in the settings. Oh, he said read it again. Read it again. All right. Jumpstarting the power supply on a JJP, Jersey Deck Pinball, will somehow boot the computer. now from a tech standpoint greg i that's that's blowing my mind because i thought that was the intention of i know jump starting that power supply was to get the computer to to at least turn on so maybe he's saying boot the computer meaning it's not going to just load into the game until you go back into uh you know bios and change those settings but i found it interesting as a tech support thing because i thought that was the whole intention of jump starting yeah yeah me too i kind of yeah i'm at a loss because i mean typically you have to do that if you got a dead battery replaced the battery yeah um sometimes you have did he say what did he say though the power supply jump starting the power supply on a jjp will somehow boot the computer i don't know this next one's from kimberly she says i had to leave a certain pinball page uh because the only content being memes of women not liking pinball i literally compete in women's pinball tournaments or the jokes about how the wife said no more pins or had to ditch the girlfriend and keep the pins She says, El Bundy humor needs to stay in the early 90s. Better joke material desperately needs to be created. So she's a little frustrated that the ladies are not getting their proper due. They're getting made fun of a little bit on that page. It's a myth. It a myth that women don like pinball It exactly what she saying I would agree with her I think that you know you can go online all over the place whether it competitive or people hanging out There a lot of women in pinball Now I will say Substantially more men in pinball but that doesn mean that there no women that that particularly don know I think that's where it comes from, and I do not think that it is. I think it's a very spouse driven thing. I don't think. Oh, what are you playing into the are you playing into the myth? No, I'm not playing into the myth. What I'm saying, though, is yes, like I see a lot of wives that say, no more pinball. What are you doing? What are you bringing at it? Even my wife, and she used to love pinball until it became part of my life, and now she despises pinball. Well, you're proving the myth because now your wife hates pinball. Yes, she hates pinball. My young daughters hate pinball now. Well, the youngest one still likes pinball. She just won't play. But what I'm saying, though, is I also know plenty of women. who, like pinball, their husbands are not really into it, and the husbands are the ones like, I don't know if we're getting that other game. And the wife is like, no, we're getting that game. Like, I want that game. So that's what I'm saying. I think it's just a spouse thing, and I think it's like you said. There tends to be more males in here, so I think that that's where you get that. Because, again, I do know plenty of women who have to, you know, get their husbands in check, too, because they want a game and their husband does not. Also wanted to give a little shout out to Jeannie, who also said the pinball myth is that women don't like pinball. Women do love pinball. Stop being mean to us. So we have a ton of female customers. Yeah. I had an awesome conversation with somebody yesterday about her trading in her game, a pinball machine, for something else. But her husband isn't in pinball at all. And she's competitively ranked. And she's got like a really nice collection of Stern LEs. Yeah. And she was sending some pictures because one of the games she wanted to trade in, I asked for some pictures of it. And I could see in the background, great collection. So, yeah. I love it. I love it. Like a lot of the people, honestly, like I had, when I had my larger location, I would almost say that we probably, it wasn't split. But, I mean, we were probably 40% women, 60% guys there at our tournament. Okay. Like huge, huge, huge turnout for women. Loved it, man. That's good. That's good. So this next one is Randy. Randy says pinball myth is it's just a fuse. That's says you will not believe number of people that call my pinball repair shop and tell me their pins stop working. And it's probably just a fuse. So that now, ironically, a lot of times it is just a fuse on those older games, especially. Yeah. But it is the most common explanation for something not working. It's probably just a fuse. Or the other pinball myth, when somebody's selling a machine, as is, I don't know if it works. I never tried to turn it on. It's like, dude, if you've got a game, why wouldn't you just plug it in to see if it turns on to see if you can get more money for it? That probably means it's not turning on. So that's a little – that's a myth in my opinion. I don't know if I believe that. Here's a story that I don't even really want to tell because it's kind of embarrassing. um so you know you hear something like that a myth like that and you're just kind of hell bent against it and i was at a a customer's house and i was working on a halloween that he had bought and uh he didn't get it from us he got all of his other games from us but this fucking halloween so but i still yeah i went and helped him out good that's the kind of it's kind of service you provide over at flipping out pinball great yes so i'm working on this game and they were like, yeah, we don't know what's wrong with doing this and that. And I found, you know, this broken bracket or whatever. And then I was not getting any, anything to the servos. And I was like, what the hell? Like I've received these connections. I was like, you know, I'm just sitting there. I'm like, what board would be bad? I was like sitting there racking my brain about what could have happened with these servos. So I call AJ at spooky and I'm like, AJ, I was like, dude, I have no power to any of my servos or anything else. You know what he says? it's just a fuse greg check the fuse and sure enough i checked the fuse and the fuse was awesome yeah now i had to track down the servo that caused the fuse to blow but it literally was just a fuse and i just stood there and shook my head i was like son of a like the one time this actually is true i was on a modern game too that's awesome oh there you go there you go all right these next two first one's from jim He says three balls better than five. And then Adam counters and says five balls are better than three. Oh, always three ball play factory. What do you mean? Expand on that a little bit. Stick with three balls. You don't play five ball games. It was meant to be a three ball game. Okay. Now that's interesting because I took that differently. And now that you said that, that makes a lot of sense. I took it as three ball, multiball better than five ball, multiball or five ball multiball better than three ball multiball because honestly when i got into pinball like the more multi-balls and the more balls that were in play the better but now like i i prefer i almost will try to not purposely drain like anything after three but i know i can at least trap up and play three ball multiball and have control instead of just flailing i prefer now a three ball multiball over four five or thirteen if that is what they are talking about i will will tell you that I agree with you actually, because it like all these games are so much, I mean, you always had to shoot at particular things on the older game, whatever, but I feel like there's so much going on on these newer games. It's just so hard to try. Like I just, I I've never been able to gain that skill. I know some people like, Oh, I know some of the top players, like they're very good about juggling multi balls, trapping up and then picking their shots. But it's like, there's just so much shit in my way. Too many balls. Like I can't, yeah, I just, I'm like you, like I can juggle the three balls. I'm fine with that. I'm fine with that. But I'm like you. Yeah, kind of while exhilarating, five, six balls. Nah, not really my cup of tea either. My strategy when it's like more than three balls is I will wait for that ball save to stop flashing. I'll just fly all over the place. Oh, yeah, do too. You know, I'm just like a three-year-old just banging. I don't even care. And then when that ball save goes away, then I'm like, all right, I'm just going to narrow this down to three, and I'm going to try to navigate the multiple with three. A hundred percent. I agree with you. But I personally, if it's about how many games or how many balls you can play per game, I would prefer probably to stay at three balls and moving it to five. But again, if it's your game and you want to get further into the game and you want to go into the settings and change three balls to four balls or five balls, all the power to you. I was going to say that. It's not mine either, and I disagree with it. But I also understand that if you do not have the ability and you want to see more of the game, I completely get that. I did that with Walking Dead, like the very first time I owned it. I put it on five ball so that I could get to Last Man Standing and stuff like it. I had to have that or I couldn't have ever made it there at all. Not even close. So I guess I've got more respect for that than taking the glass off and manipulating switches to get into a wizard mode. Yeah, that's terrible. There's no point. There's no point. Jeremy says, and this is a more recent kind of talking point. He says this is a pinball myth, and that is shots are the new mechs. I, I've always agreed. That's why, again, like when, when Richie's Star Wars came out. You agree. What does that mean? You agree. You agree with that? Oh, no, I mean, I disagree with him. I agree. I agree with the myth. Like, I think shots, I think a pin lacking mechs can easily be made up for with the shots. Like, that's why I always loved Richie's Star Wars. There was really nothing that went on in there in the pro. I mean, you had nothing really. You know what I'm saying? You had a freaking TIE fighter that jiggled back and forth. But that game shot so good, and Dwight's code was so good to me. And people will disagree about the code, whatever. But I didn't miss toys. So, yeah, I understand what you're saying. I would rather have a game that shoots well that might be light on mechs than a game that has mechs that doesn't shoot well. That's just the way that I look at it. Now, does that mean that shots are a replacement for mechs? No. But shots, I mean, because in an ideal world, we want to have both. I think shots can be. We want to have both. We want to have nice shots and we want to have nice mechs. But I'm going to have more fun with good shots than I am going to have probably with good mechs. Because as fun as a mech is, it's the redundancy of a mech over and over and over. There's very few mechs, in my opinion, that will keep you coming back for more and keep wanting to see it. But the shots, I mean, that's what pinball is about. Now, I'm not saying that's an excuse for a company not to put mechs into a game. But again, if fun is part of the value equation, I would rather have shots that are fun. I agree. And to your point, that's why I sometimes hold back on ever expressing that to people, and especially publicly like on here, is because people immediately run with that shit and be like, oh, you're scaring me. I'm scared to not do that. These bastards are stripping everything out of games anyways. And I'm like, hey, I want the mechs in there too. Like, I think they're fun, but it's not everything all of the time to me. You know, I, I'm like you, like, I just want a game that shoots good. And that is fun because sometimes there have been games that a lot of people, the majority of people have preferred a pro version over a premium version before. I've had that before. Yeah. Because it blows and shoots better. It just, cause you don't have the stopping of the stop and go. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Uh, do you like Beatles? You like shooting Beatles? Yeah, I do. Yeah. I think it's a fun game. And that's like a game that is a single level game. But yeah. Yeah, there's no mechs. I mean, again, it's not like the most genius shot layout, but it's a fun game. But it's like if they put an unnecessary mech in there, they just stop playing. I don't know if that's just an example. But yeah. Okay. Again, probably a polarizing topic. And I think you need to be careful because if you do say, hey, the shots are the new mechs, then you're not a consumer advocate. And then you're part of the problem. All these companies are cutting out corners and taking down the industry. So it's, you know, I don't know. Shots are not the new mechs, but shots are more important than mechs, in my opinion. But then, yeah, the other talking point would be, well, then that should be in the equation of what they're asking for price-wise. So I don't know. It's a situation you can't win on that conversation. In all reality, what is one of our favorite games this year? King Kong. Okay. On the pro, what toys are on there? What mechs do you have other than the kickback target? Right, right. You have nothing in there. A buck? If you want to consider a buck, I mean, it's a mech, but I mean, not in the mech, I don't think, the way these people are. Freaking blast. A blast to play. Jurassic Park's another game. I don't mind having a pro. No. The T-Rex in the upper left corner is cool, but I don't need it. See, I need it, but I'm a giant fan. Right, right, right. The Velociraptor pen that's on the left is a physical ball lock, I think, on the Premium LE. It's not on the... I do love that, though, too. things i just i love the game stranger things is another game like i don't mind the pro oh no not all i prefer the pro okay you do prefer the pro because i was talking to somebody today and i said that there's toys in there i mean you still got the demogorgon in the ramp you're shooting there's toys and mechs in there you know technically i mean yeah the difference between the two but but it's the projection mapping is probably the deal the kinetic uh ball lock in the upper left yeah but actually drastic park really has no toys though like you said like the pro i mean there's not really a toy in that i guess you consider the the truck the jeep i agree next one is from robert uh and his pinball myth is old playfields don't get dimples like the new ones and i thought that was interesting they do yeah yeah no they do i just think it looks different now and and i'm not a chemist i don't know what's going on some games tend to dimple more than others it looks like but i think a lot of that is what artwork is under the clear coat how much clear coats being used i mean All these things are factors. You know, there was a different clear coat method back in the day, so we don't need to deep dive it. But I agree. I mean, those old playfields, they did dimple at some point. Maybe they don't look as pronounced as today's playfields do for whatever reason. I think that's what it is. Next one's from Andy. He says pinball is, and this is a myth, right? A fable that he believes to not be fact. But you'll hear it all the time. And that is pinball is still a niche hobby. It's growing beyond what I think he says to follow it up. I think pinball still is very niche. I do too. It's growing, but in the grand scheme of things, when you look at other major hobbies, I don't know that there are any as small and as passionate as pinball is. I still consider it niche. I kind of like that it's niche from a business perspective. I would love for it to be totally mainstream, but yeah, no, I still think it's niche. I mean, look at how much it's grown. Look at the difference when we really got into it, especially in the media side and everything nine years ago or so. So look at how much things have changed because of the growth between then and now of what we've seen. I kind of like it being smaller too, in a sense. Again, like you said, business-wise, it'd be nice always for it to grow. It's just that it's an odd hobby. It's a very odd hobby. Because, I mean, pinball machines are prevalent. They're out there more. You've got that right, Greg. You've got that right. Yeah. Everybody I talk to doesn't even think it exists. missed i went in the sam's club one time i had a pinball shirt on the guy was like oh pinball and i was like he was working the door taking you know looking at your your membership card and i was like yeah and i was like uh i work for a pinball company and he was like really no way what do you fix them up and sell them yeah they still exist i said yeah man i said you know it's fairly thriving and i just had that uh conversation with a car dealer the other day I sold my truck, and the guy said the same thing. He was like, you've got to be kidding me. What are those things now? You know, about $3,000? That's exactly right. It's like, ironically, sticker shock usually comes from the dealership, but hold my beer on the pinball pricing. Let's go. Yeah, the pinball you're getting, it could be a used car out there on your lot. Yeah, that's true. That's true. You could probably trade in some of these games and pay off a car on some of these used lots. Next one is from Mike. this was a pinball myth that came to me right away and i'm glad that mike brought it up and that pinball myth is all i need is one oh so true meaning i'm only gonna buy one game and that's all i'm ever gonna get it's like you know what man just activated the launch sequence and good luck to you sir or madam because nobody buys just one ever i don't know anybody that's ever seriously dude i don't know anybody who's bought one pinball machine and maybe they've only only owned one at a time yeah but they've never stopped at one yeah i don't know one person i i literally will do that to customers sometimes like brand new ones that come in and they'll be like you know is there anything else i should know you know about owning the game and all this i'm like man okay there is there is just like one thing that you really have to be aware of and they're like what and i'm like you're gonna buy another one like it's right that's right and so be prepared like and if you enjoy this at all you will buy multiple ones so just be prepared to be addicted and it's funny because my follow-up question will be uh are you married and and not not to play into the whole myth of women not liking pinball but you know happy spouse you want to keep your spouse happy because when he starts showing up any spouse on either either rooms and master bed and i look i've been to houses where i walk in and i'll be like oh my gosh, like incredible. Why is this a collection in the family room, in the basement? You got two in a dining room? Like what's upstairs? Oh I got pinball machines upstairs Like oh my gosh This is a little bit insane And there a lot of guys locally that are like that All the power to them All right Another one is from Brandon Brandon's pinball myth is the pin side top 100 list is a good measure of the truly best games. And I thought that was interesting. The pinball top 100, the pin side pinball top 100, it's similar in the sense that, like, when we do the pinball power rankings, which is like what's top of mind for people what's trending i i kind of tend to view the pin side top 100 closer to that than i do like a true ranking system and the only reason that i that i say that is because a lot of times like new games will shoot to that top 10 list and even get to number one and they'll spend a week or two there and then they drop back down to reality number two it seems like there's some games and gamemanship going on there and it's almost like politics where if if somebody's got lead a group of people will come in and and they'll throw some shade on some rankings to drop something while pumping up their uh their candidate for the number one spot so there there's a little bit of that going on it's more like popularity in the sense of because if i have a game i want it to be on the top 10 list yes you want you want to be an advocate for that that game yes but but you know over the years i mean you've kind of seen you know like medieval madness and attack from mars and stuff not really move i mean you know they moved because they used to be number one number two in there but i mean not move far so you know you have some consistency but they've been there forever like yeah like a game like that might have a thousand reviews where a game like let's say harry potter for instance uh it was on uh it was number one for a little bit yeah uh smaller sample size right maybe there's a hundred ratings in there and i'm not saying it doesn't deserve to be there but it's just like you see how this kind of manipulates or shifts. But that's a good point, too, because a lot of what you would hear when I used to get on Pinside originally was that... I'm trying to remember what list it was. There was another list that was considered the actual top 100 list. I forget where it was. But again, it just had all the classics. Medieval Madness, Tales of the Arabian Nights, and those are great games, but Modern Pinball is formidable. I'd actually love to see them kind of separated by era but have something that's you know what i mean have something that's a little bit more i mean godzilla number one i i i can't say that i disagree with that i can totally i see it i see it eric comes in with his pinball myth and that is uh solder fumes are bad for you that's a pinball oh i don't know i don't know i don't know either i I mean, I think inhaling any anything that is burning off. Right. Like anything like. Unless it's like a fine tobacco leaf coming from. A finely rolled cigar can smoke. No problem. No issues there. Noah says, pinball myth, leaving a tongue smear on the glass for your opponent is cheating. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I don't know what was going on there. It made me chuckle because I think I know people that would probably do that. I would never lick pinball glass, especially out in public. I'd be hesitant to lick my own. I would not lick flipper buttons. In fact, I tend to want to wash my hands after I play pinball. Exactly. In general. There's a lot of stuff going on. But yeah, so I don't know if that's a myth. I don't know. Craig says this myth. Pinball machine owners are wealthy and able to buy machines regularly. No. No, I thought this was interesting, right? Because I think people that have nice collections, depending on what groups you're hanging out in, tend to get a little bit of a bad rap. And we've had a discussion with a particular somebody offline that just hates the rich people that are buying these pinball machines. And it's like, dude, these people, maybe they're well off, and it's because they probably worked hard, and that's where they're at in life. But there are plenty of people because, look, as much as I feel like I'm wealthy in a lot of other things that not necessarily monetarily wise. Like, I don't have millions of dollars where I've got money I can blow on games. Like, I've got to be pretty smart about how I spend money with kids and school and all that kind of stuff. But I still own pinball machines, but it's not because I'm rich. It's just because I built a little bank on my other hobby, which was, you know, restoring and fixing arcade games. And I had that extra income. But, you know, I'm not out blowing a bunch of money. And that's a lot of people. I've known a lot of people build their collections like that. They just buy absolute turds that don't work and everything else. They fix them up. sell them go on to something else maybe a nicer turd and fix that up and they slowly build a collection like it took me forever to get my second game and in you know like my class i've got a nice collection but everything's kind of been built up over you know a 10-year span and you know buying selling trading so forth and then just you know i'm i'm frugal in a lot of other aspects of my life that allows me to be able to throw a little bit more money towards pinball yeah whereas you know it's just i think so some things come down to priorities as well i couldn't agree more what what was your second game you remember um johnny mnemonic okay that's no wait i can't oh my god because your first was what there's a jurassic world your jurassic world yep and then i had johnny mnemonic and i think i got rid of johnny mnemonic and got uh my very first was star trek which is behind me right now um stern star trek pro was my very first like modern game modern day game i started i had a earth shaker was my first game and i loved it because i had played it before you know outside of my house and it was a game i wanted but my second game was a judge dread and i'll tell you what man when you go from like a System 11, and you go to any type of DMD era, it was, you know, wide body, like, you've got a DMD, you've got different audio. I was like, pinball can never get better than this, Judge Dredd. I was convinced of it. And then my first, yeah, my first modern day game was Ghostbusters. I own a Ghostbusters. So once I started rolling, I started rolling with pins because I was just trading and moving stuff all over the place because most games early on they didn't last three months uh but you know i've kept i never wrote things down but all of my for sale ads i've always kept every single picture that i've taken of all of my games when i go to sell them so i've never deleted them off my phone like i still have pictures of every single game that i've ever owned yeah that's that's cool actually it's you don't realize how many you have at some point it got ridiculous here and i was getting some criticism from the neighbors because it's like, hey, can you help me move this game upstairs? That was a big reason why I moved the game room into the garage and made it the studio, just because of easy in and out. I carried the first Lost World, I carried downstairs with a friend. No Dolly. We carried it. And then Johnny Mnemonic, that was carried. Greg, the first game I bought, we pulled out of a basement. It was the Earthshaker. pulled it down the head and we carried it upstairs with the legs on. Oh, you tell me. Yeah, fuck that. I don't even know what I was thinking. No. Because when we got it to the car, you know, I coffin loaded it. I took the back legs off or the front legs off, slid it in. And I was like, wait a second. Why did we do this? Yeah, it was nuts. It was terrible. It was terrible. Yeah, it was the worst thing ever. Heavy, heavy. Yeah. I wouldn't want to do that with a modern stern now. There's no way. And it's quite a bit lighter than an old Bally. All right. This next one comes from Asivet. My apologies if I'm not saying the name correctly. Ossie Veth says, Pinball Myth, I heard a few times that nudging is cheating. No. And nudging, if you're just joining and you don't know what nudging is, it's when you're kind of physically manipulating the machine and bumping it or nudging it to try to usually save a ball or throw a ball into a different direction. That's why there's a tilt bump. That is true. When I started in the hobby, I never nudged because I did think it was a form of cheating. But then when you think about it, that tilt mechanism is there, one, so you don't abuse the game terribly, but two, so you're not sliding it around and obviously never draining. So I heard that rumor on, and man, I didn't nudge for years, honestly. It wasn't until a buddy of mine showed me how he did some gentle nudging. I was like, oh, I can kind of see that. And then one day Eric Minyer came over here and just violated one of my games so atrociously with the nudging that I was mad at him. I was so turned off by it, but I was like, he's like, dude, he's like, it's a commercial machine. It's like, it's meant to do this. He's like, you're not going to flip it over. You're not going to hurt it. You can just bang it around and nudge it. And then from there, I just, I still not a big nudger, but obviously I'm a strategic nudger. But I'm terrible at nudging. You know what times I nudge to try to keep the ball out of an outline only to get it into the outline? Like we're probably wouldn't have. I hate that. I do it. My whole thing is, is the slap save is, is what I, that's my thing. Slap save. Going down the middle. Yeah. Slap save. That's mine. Nice little scoot, just enough to that flipper so it moves. Do you remember Slap Save Pinball Podcast? I wonder what Jason and Matt are doing these days. Oh, yeah, I do. I miss those guys. Yeah, me too, man. I loved Jason was one of my favorite pinball people ever. Yeah, same man, super nice guy. I mean, it's not like he's not with us any longer, but he's not in the whole pinball thing. I'm still mourning your presence. Jason Fowler. Love that dude. Salute to you, sir. Salute to you again, sir. All right, so Kurt says, Pinball Myth, not to worry about shit-quality dimpled playfields as they'll end up all joining together and flattening out. What a load of bullshit, he says. I agree. I have seen when dimples get out of control on particular games. That's funny. It's not pretty. Who said that? Was it? I remember that. That was years ago when dimpling was like a thing and people were really noticing it. They were like, that's what they said about old games. It's like back to the person that was talking about the old games that didn't have dimples, the myth. Like, that's what people would say. It's like, oh, your old game's got dimples, too. They've just got, like, 60,000 plays on them, and they've all smoothed the play field back out. It's crazy. But yet you can't find one little crater anywhere. It's like, dude, like millions of ball paths. I don't know. I've seen some modern games with 20,000, 30,000 plays on there. Yeah. You'll see some dimples. You'll still see some dimples. Didn't flatten out? No, it didn't flatten out. That's awesome. It's flatter, but you still see some dimples. I love that. It's like, wouldn't I see a divot between the ball paths and under plastics? Wouldn't it be raised under the plastic where the ball would never dimple? You know what I mean? Because I was thinking about that. I'm like, oh, that makes sense. I'm like, wait a second. I don't know. I don't know that that makes sense. But yeah, so I would agree with that myth that I don't think every pre-modern game has flattened itself out from every possible impact of ball space. Maybe eventually it will. Maybe we need to hit, you know, 60, 70,000 plays. I don't know. And see what it does. Charles says that his pinball myth is that he heard is that flipping out pinball is the best place to buy your next machine. Terrible, right? Terrible. Charles, I wanted to bring it to everybody's attention here that we are not biased. It's not all positive. So sorry, you don't feel that way. An email can at flipping out pinball dot com. You can discuss why, why you feel that way. But we'd love to earn your business someday, buddy. We still love you, Charles. We still love you. There was another one that came up several times, and it was waxing playfields are beneficial to modern games. And that was a myth by a lot of people. They said that waxing a playfield was beneficial to games that didn't have clear coat back in the day to help preserve the paint. Yeah. Whereas right now, and you'll notice if you wax, it's one thing to clean your playfield. When you wax a play field, it plays completely differently. Yes, it does. For a little while. It's got to calm down, right? It's nuts. It's quick. Yeah, it seems like the ball tends to slide a little more than it rolls. I guess that I just – I've started hearing that recently as well. And I just don't know. Because I got my carnauba wax. I've waxed playfields before. I haven't lately. I always wax my stuff. So here's my point. Is it may not be fully necessary, but there's a lot of things in your life that are not necessary, but they benefit you. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. And that's what I think that it is with that. Like, why in the hell am I waxing my car? Just for a shine? It's not just the shine. It's protective qualities to that. Now, while probably pretty small, they're still protective qualities. Why would I be waxing a game to preserve the paint on an older game, but there's no reason to wax it and help preserve my clear coat a little bit and protect it even further? Sure. Again, not necessary per se, maybe, to whereas older games it was necessary. But to me, it's still beneficial to wax your modern clear-coated games. I think it's a fair assessment. I get it. get all the grime off and just kind of get that play field all buffed out. It looks so good. Another one was mods, modifications, pinball mods, increase the value of your game. Oh, that is a perfect. I literally told a customer this. So this customer, he's brand new, buying the Jaws, and he was wanting to, he was like, I'm going to add this, and he was questioning me about aftermarket stuff and, like, warranty questions and all this other stuff. And I said, listen, I said, there's something I do want to stop and tell you. You know, you want to add all this stuff. You're most likely going to get rid of this game. And he was like, well, I don't ever see getting rid of this game. I said, everybody says that too. I said, especially, I said, you know, depending on how much room you have, everything else. I said, you might have room for five games. You hit that five game mark or you get tired of this game. You're going to move it. And I said, so that being said, I said, I do, because I knew they were on a little bit of a, not a budget, but, you know, they were kind of being frugal but wanting to go all out. And I said, mods will not add any value to your game. I said, I just want you to be aware of that, that, you know, I just don't want to see you go dropping a ton of money on this game and a bunch of mods and then be very disappointed when you do go to sell it or trade it or do something else. I said, now, some things, there are particular accessories and mods, to me, that do retain some value. You know, on older games, Color DMD, I think, does that. HD Glass, ah, maybe. Shaker Motor, ah, maybe. I mean, you know, you're not really factoring that in, but it is. Speaker Lights. Color DMD holds value. I mean, doesn't, I mean, stuff like that. I think a pin sound would. Yeah. Maybe if you had, like, a rare topper or a topper that was highly coveted. Yeah, topper. Yeah, some top. Yeah, like you said, it'd have to be rare. But I told him, I said, you know, the great thing about all of those things, though, is even if they didn't retain any value, you can, they're universal for any of your Spike 2 games or things like that, you know, depending on if they're in that same era. Then, you know, you could put a color DMD in another game. You could put your expression speaker lights in another game if you got it and just pulled off your one. I said, so there's a lot of pluses to those. I said, but just be a little careful about game-specific mods and going crazy. I said, because you can easily get into a couple thousand dollars in mods, you know, especially something like Jaws, Godzilla. Godzilla has some beautiful mods. And I'm not advocating against mods. I love them. No, no, no. Of course. But in this context, you have to be willing to lose that money because I deal with the majority of the trades. You deal with some trades that we get in and everyone thinks that they're mods. You know they list all their mods and they like oh it a beautiful game And while it is not everyone looking for that Not everybody cares about that And it kind of narrows your buyer pool a little bit Well, and you brought up an interesting point, too, because when you started the conversation with him, you were like, hey, listen, at some point you're going to get rid of this game. And he's like, no, I'm not. And that would be another pinball myth. And I know I saw it posted, but it was another one that came to my mind because I've learned that it's a myth when somebody says this game's bolted to the floor. It's like it's not bolted to the floor. uh it's probably you know probably gonna move along it someday unless it's your first game and you got sentimental value i would like to think lethal weapon wouldn't just because i got that lethal weapon so freaking cheap like and it's in such good shape that's the only reason um but i've said that about a lot of games that i didn't think and then it just hits a point maybe three years later four years later and it hits a point so it's like yeah you're time to move on to something else. So check this one out. This is from Jason and he adds a myth and he adds a little context. And I thought this was interesting. And he says that the biggest myth in pinball is that a low play count game is better than a high play or routed game. And he says two quick stories to support this. He goes on to say, I sold a Jurassic Park last year with 25,000 plays. And the man who bought it said that it was the best playing Jurassic Park he'd ever played. and that was before I told him how many plays. And then the second was recent. He said, I sold an Iron Maiden Premium to a friend, HUO, with around 200 plays, and shortly after he picked up a routed one and put it on location near his house. And this guy calls him asking how he can make his HUO game, which is Homies Only game, play as good as the routed game. And he replied to this guy and said, hey, you've got to put about 10,000 plays in it. So he's insisting that more plays is like a break-in period where the game really kind of settles in. Little things have been kind of adjusted. And a game that's got maybe 10,000, 20,000 plays, if it was maintained, should play a lot better than like a crisp game out of the box. What do you think about that? Because it made me think. I mean, there's logic to it to a certain extent, right? I tend to agree. I don't know if it's every circumstance, but I have a very – I would say that. It's not every game, but I can see where that plays a role. I have a very high number play count on Stranger Things that I have out on location. And I've got a good friend, Chad, and he's a very, very talented, very, very good player. And he swears that my Stranger Things is the best playing Stranger Things. Literally, I shared it to come play it and everything because it's set next to Dungeons and Dragons. That is very interesting to me. Yeah. And he even commented on my post for the season finale of Stranger Things. He was like, get out there and play the game. It's the best playing Stranger Things I've ever played. And so, and I know like Zach's got a lot of restored games before. And Zach will always talk that he needs, like, you got to put some plays on there while they're fully restored. You got to put some plays on there to get them broken a little bit. Yeah. Because they just, they don't play like you're used to. So, I mean, I actually cannot, I can't say that I disagree with what he's saying. Now, I think that they look a lot worse because of all the dimpling and you'll get some wear and stuff and maybe you just got to put 50,000 plays on the dimpling. Yeah, exactly. But from an actual playing standpoint and how good the game plays, I just I don't think that I can disagree with that and say that he's wrong. So in this alternate universe that we've joked about living in over the past couple of years, because especially in pinball, everything's wild, turned upside down. Could you imagine now that low play games would go for less money than high play games? And rounded games would be what everybody's looking for because it's like broken in. Broken in. I've seen where people like you could pay somebody. For instance, if you're on a computer game or a video game that requires leveling up, you can pay people to go into your account and just grind all day. Could you imagine if there was people just send me your pinball machine and I'm going to put 10,000 plays on this thing. Yeah. And you get paid to play pinball. You send it back. It's like, oh, it's totally broken. So much better. And now I just increase the value of my game by like $1,200. Like, I mean, I just don't know. I mean, maybe some of the stand-up targets are a little looser. I'm just trying to wrap my mind. I'm thinking like even ramps, right? Like where the natural path of the ball, kind of the ramp maybe starts giving a little bit and it's not tightened down and it just kind of creates a more natural path. I don't know. I can see it. The other thing is this. Very rarely at a pinball company are you going to have the same group of people making the same game more than a couple consecutive days in a row because shifts are rotating and stuff. So a lot of it's not even quality of build, just approach the build. It should all be matched, but it just isn't. I mean, it's so hands on, it's handcrafted. There's going to be a little bit of variance and tolerance that that is give and take. But, and you know, and that's why when a game goes to final tests, that should all kind of be buttoned up, but there's different final testers too. Maybe, maybe it's one of those things. I mean, besides metal ramp, but even maybe with metal ramps, maybe it's just like, maybe it's that subtle difference. Like, you know, what, what we talked about just earlier with waxing your play field and waxing your game and how it plays, it plays different for a while. Well, I wonder if just, you know, some of the ball scratches, the scratches on the ramps, uh, you know, the mechs being worn in a little bit. even if you've replaced coil sleeves and stuff. And then you've got fresh, rebuilt, nice flippers that are still powerful, but it kind of slows the ball down just enough to where it almost has like a little bit more of a smoothness instead of, you know, such a freaking power, you know, because Sternzer is jacked up anyways. So you know what I'm saying? Like you've got a lot of power and they're quick. So I wonder if it just like for some people, maybe it slows it down. Just that difference between waxing your play field, not waxing your play field gap. but it's like a fresh play field versus a little bit of a worn play field in game. Like, yeah. Does it make it feel a little bit more approachable? It's interesting. I don't know. Does that make sense? I think though. Yeah, I does. It does make sense. I like that one. That might be one of my favorite ones of the day. Yeah. Yeah. I wanted to give Michael who offered this and we talked about it earlier and it was down on the list and his pinball myth is saying that, Hey, changing anything in the game settings, such as the ball count per play, ball save time or moving, you know, the posts makes you less of a player. He goes on to say, you know, that's not true. Just play the game however you want to enjoy your game. And I agree. That's what those settings are there for. I do agree. I mean, that's no different than tournament players when posts are fully removed and stuff saying, oh, you play at factory. You're a pussy. Yeah, that's right. I don't know. Those are just kind of some of the more interesting or oddball pinball myths that were shared on our Facebook page. We're going to go over to Patreon and we're going to discuss all their comments over there. And that'll be on some bonus content for our Patreon members. If you want to go to Patreon.com slash Flippin' Up Pinball Podcast, you can subscribe for free. And support the show in a different way. Get a little bonus content. And again, what do we have? Thursday. It's already over by the time you heard this. But we got another one coming up. End of the month. Join us on our after hours where you can talk live with us and we just talk pinball. It's good times. Hey, man. I think that's going to wrap the episode. But ironically, well, not ironically, time does fly when you're having a good time. It feels like we haven't done this in a long time, but it was just a couple weeks ago. But it's going to be bad. It seems like just because we were doing that felt every week, every three days for the longest time. That's why like an actual two weeks feels like forever. Yeah, because the podcast, we started doing it, I think, July. So this will be our sixth month. Super happy with it, man. It's just fun to do. Well, and hopefully we get hit with a Stern release soon. A nice cornerstone. So maybe the next couple of weeks, you know, we'll have a couple of back-to-back podcasts. Well, it's kind of interesting because typically we would have seen a Stern reveal by now. They would have brought a game to CES. The rumored title is Pokemon. So we haven't seen it. CES is going on. The game is not there. Do we see Pokemon this month? Is it something that maybe is pushed into February, March? Okay. I mean, I guess February could be. Is it Pokemon? are you convinced of it like that's the other thing convinced because what did george gomez said he said it's pokemon or it's transformers oh really i heard fallout too at some point but i i heard like it but it's not real strong on so i heard fallout was potentially the next uh Keith Elwin title that's just what i'm reading online yeah obviously don't know okay i don't know i like that but while we're on the topic of certain titles you know there's two games i don't know I think it's important to discuss like that Jaws 50th game. There's been people that have called and they thought that they could no longer buy the game because the last call was like the end of the year. And it just wasn't true. Right. It was same thing with Dune. Right. They're not making them after the first of the year, but inventory that remains is still available for sale. Yes. So I would say if it's and again, not to sound salesy, but honestly, if if either of those titles are interesting you like that's something you probably want to move on. We do have stock in both. That's what I had to tell people because they were coming in and they were saying the same thing to me. And that's what I told them. I said, hey, listen, I don't want to be pushy or FOMO because we tried to stock up on Jaws 50th, but those have dwindled very, very quickly. And once they are gone, they are gone. And same thing with Dune. We do have some Dunes coming in March, a small shipment of what we could get left of those. But, again, it is small. and so you know those could go within a week they could last three weeks we don't know so you know if you guys are on the fence about it get in on one of those games because we will not see either one of those we definitely won't see jaws 50th again and dune most likely we will never see that produced again that's what makes it hard because and i've got three people that i've been talking to regular regularly regularly what am i slurring not even a tough word is it regularly it's a tough word i'm not it's like not even drinking not regularly regular regularly and it was have two three people i've been talking to frequently and uh and they're like well you know should i do i need to buy this today can i wait until uh you know march and it's like look it's not gonna sell out today unless there's like a mad rush but like i i in good conscience i can't say, yeah, just wait until February, March on either of those games. I just, I can't do it. And I feel bad because I don't, I don't want to be coming across as like this, like the sales guy. Yeah. And more times than not, I'll tell somebody, I say, look, I'm not a, I'm not a commissioned salesperson in that sense at all. So it's like, I just want you to get the game that you want. And I, and I'll always try to give you advice if you ask for it. I would advise you again, no sense of urgency. You don't have to do this like immediately do it sooner than later, because if it's gone, they're like, I can't help you. There's not anything I can get for you. Well, and I see it firsthand happen because, you know, we have a tracking sheet of our inventory. And there will be times when I look at that inventory and I'm like, oh, my gosh, man. Like, okay, we've got that many games. And then literally like in a week or two, I'll look and I'm like, whoa. Like, hell, man, I sold like one of these. Like, what can Zach do? Like, you know, I mean, they just go through spurts and they'll go. And there'll be games that, you know, that we we've had a couple of, uh, you know, that same title for a while. And then all of a sudden we're sold out of them out of nowhere. So it's just, there's, there's not necessarily any rhyme or reason behind it. And that, that's why I just see it. You know, one day we've got a lot of this game. I look up and then next we're dwindled down. We're like five or six in stock, you know? So that's, I'm like you, I hate, I hate telling people that, but I also don't want them to miss out on a game that they're really wanting. Yeah. Right. I'm not, look, I'm not motivated. to buy now. It's whatever. But yeah. On the topic of barrels of fun, though, because we're talking about Dune, Winchesters are shipping. They're starting to ship. So as they start ramping up production, I guess that's a good sign. Slowly. Don't let your slow burn in the beginning. Right. So call Greg and ask him where you're at in the line for Winchester. I think those are all going to be knocked out by, what do they say, summer of 2026. So, you know, worst case scenario, you've got months, but that's cool. Beetlejuices are kind of on the line, right? They've got cabinets going and that's in production over at Spooky. And what else with this housekeeping? Predator. Little research into Predator. A lot of people asking about it. I don't even, I don't know. People are starting to come around on it a little bit. People are. It was another one of those expo things like we've talked before. Yeah. And I've heard even more people getting their hands on and playing it and people are loving it. People are loving it. So, yeah. I mean, yeah. If you guys are interested in Predator, let us know. we'll hook you guys up with a predator too i'm gonna be working a little bit more on the arcade side of things for 2026 and we've got some cool products that we're going to be adding that we haven't you know we've got our agreements worked out with the manufacturers we just haven't posted them on the pages yet and that's just because we want to set up some campaigns and get behind it but you know if you're looking for things outside of pinball to kind of complement the game room because i've always been somebody that likes to do that i like to try to figure out little things that i can add for people that might be coming over that don't want to play pinball all the time and that was a big reason why I got into Golden Tee another big reason why I got into Big Buck Hunter but we've got some other product coming so stay tuned for that we'll have some more information if you're looking to buy a new game you can visit us at flip the letter N out to pinball.com that's the main website right so you can go check it out you can see everything that we have games accessories it's not limited to pinball you can get an ice cold beer in there you can get the aforementioned Golden Tee or the Big Buck Hunters any of the Raw Thrills arcade stuff it's all there so that's important to go check it out if you're looking for the used inventory though we don't have that migrated into the website just yet. So in that instance, you want to go to our Facebook page, which is Flip N Out Pinball, and there's a pinned link at the top. You can click it, and it'll show you all the used inventory that we have available. The other option would be to just, you can scroll through the posts, and you've got pictures, you've got descriptions, you've got prices. You can see that too, and that's only at Facebook, so check that out. You've got a game sitting around that you're looking to trade in. You're not playing it as much anymore. Want to get hooked up with a newer game? then, you know, reach out to me, Greg at flip in out pinball.com. A couple of things just off the bat, save us some time, a couple of email communications, because I'll have to tell you this anyways. Cause if any of you guys are looking for trades, always send me some good detailed pictures of the game. Make sure to include a picture of that shooter lane. If the game is applicable, you know, obviously if it's an older game, it's they're all the play counts, not going to be correct, but you know, on any modern game, get me the lifetime play count note, any kind of mechanical issues, any kind of cosmetic issues. And I'm talking no matter how small, if you got a little bitty ding on there, a little head scuff, you know, let me know about that and send me a picture of that as well. It's a fly once landed on your game. If you got fly poop on your game, let me know about fly poop on your game. I'd be trading mine in if it had fly droppings. Once I have all that stuff in your location, I can get you over an evaluation for your game. Gets you something new in that game room. And then finally, again, just thank you to everybody who's been really supportive and just kind of listening to the podcast and hanging out with us here on the show over a Patreon on Facebook. It's been a good time. We're going to grow that YouTube channel a little bit. That's one of the goals this year. A little bit of some YouTube focus. And we did talk about adding some video up there. So that's going to be fun. What? Maybe we record once a month from a video standpoint. Maybe every other podcast because we've been on twice a week. But we could have another podcast coming up here soon. if Stern's new game is released. We always try to get out there with the first impressions, so stay tuned for that. But I think that's it, man. You good? I am good. All right, guys. Well, thanks for listening. Go to flippantoppinball.com, get your new pinball machine today. Whatever you do, don't forget to take some time out of your day and play some pinball. So long, everybody.