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King of Pin

BlahCade Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·49m 7s·analyzed·Apr 13, 2017
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.031

TL;DR

Hosts debate Pinball Arcade leaderboard reset strategy and Eight Ball Deluxe restoration.

Summary

Chris and Jared discuss pinball restoration projects, specifically Eight Ball Deluxe maintenance and playfield repairs, then pivot to a lengthy debate about Pinball Arcade leaderboard reset policy. They argue that annual or quarterly leaderboard wipes would improve player engagement and community health, citing stale high scores, bogus entries, and the demoralizing effect of unreachable records. They compare leaderboard dynamics to real arcades and reference the Donkey Kong resurgence via 'The King of Kong' documentary as evidence that active competition drives participation.

Key Claims

  • Eight Ball Deluxe requires six clear plastic lane guide pieces; missing or broken pieces cause ball routing issues and affect flipper response

    high confidence · Chris details specific missing/broken plastic pieces on his Eight Ball Deluxe and their functional impact on gameplay

  • Farsight Studios cited licensing restrictions when declining to provide CAD dimensions for Eight Ball Deluxe playfield parts

    high confidence · Chris states: 'I asked the guys up at Farsight. So, any chance you can give me the dimensions of that? And they were like, no, it's a licensing thing.'

  • Pinball Arcade leaderboards have become psychologically demotivating due to stationary, unreachable top scores and suspected bogus entries

    high confidence · Chris argues leaderboards create a psychological barrier: 'they're so far out of reach for you that then you kind of go, well, why do I even want to bother trying?'

  • Farsight is performing collision detection and physics tuning on certain Pinball Arcade tables that will 'completely change how that table plays'

    high confidence · Chris states: 'There is one table in particular that we've been told about that apparently is going to completely change how that table plays. Yeah. For the better.'

  • Post-pass technique (tapping flipper to move caught ball backward) is effective on Eight Ball Deluxe but difficult to execute on home machines with different rubber conditions than Pinside location machines

    high confidence · Chris watches tutorial video demonstrating post-pass technique, attempts it on his machine, but struggles: 'I can't get the ball to move more than like maybe an inch backwards'

  • Complete plastic lane guide kits for Eight Ball Deluxe cost $130 but include parts Chris doesn't need; laser-cut custom alternatives would be stronger

    high confidence · Chris researches replacement options: 'I have found they do sell the complete plastic kit for Eight Ball Deluxe, and that's with all the printed parts also, but it's $130. I don't need all the printed parts.'

  • Annual or quarterly leaderboard resets would improve Pinball Arcade engagement and player retention, modeled after arcade operator practice of resetting high scores every 1,000 games

Notable Quotes

  • “Eight Ball Deluxe, what I'm discovering myself is it's a drain monster. It throws house balls at you left and right.”

    Chris @ ~3:30 — Establishes Eight Ball Deluxe difficulty baseline and motivates discussion of machine tuning/maintenance

  • “I asked the guys up at Farsight. So, any chance you can give me the dimensions of that? And they were like, no, it's a licensing thing.”

    Chris @ ~18:15 — Reveals licensing constraints affecting pinball part reproduction and third-party support

  • “if you want to just pump in your high score and then never touch that table again, you want to be crowned king forever. That's a pretty hollow crown.”

    Chris @ ~42:00 — Core argument for active leaderboard competition vs. static records

  • “they're so far out of reach for you that then you kind of go, well, why do I even want to bother trying? Or if you look at the top scores and you're like, well, obviously some of these are fake.”

    Chris @ ~24:30 — Articulates psychological demotivation from unreachable leaderboard records and suspected cheating

  • “if Farsight is actually making these tables play either more difficult or more true to their real counterparts, then obviously that's changing what is possible on the game for a leaderboard.”

    Jared @ ~48:00 — Highlights tension between physics updates and leaderboard validity—key argument for resets

  • “It makes the app look healthy. That's right. Instead of being this anemic thing that's on life support...”

    Jared @ ~35:00 — Business/engagement argument: active leaderboards signal healthy, vibrant community

  • “There is one table in particular that we've been told about that apparently is going to completely change how that table plays. Yeah. For the better.”

    Chris @ ~21:30 — Signals upcoming physics/collision overhaul on unnamed Pinball Arcade table

  • “Do you reckon Usain Bolt would actually be comfortable with just sitting at the top of the Olympic world record holding leaderboard? He doesn't do that. He constantly strives to beat his record.”

Entities

Chris FreedmanpersonJared MorganpersonEight Ball DeluxegameFirepowergameFarsight StudioscompanyPinball ArcadeproductThe King of Kongevent

Signals

  • ?

    community_signal: Chris soliciting advice from local pinball league on playfield clear coating technique, planning to attend tournament specifically to recruit expert consultation

    high · Chris: 'The Pinball League is meeting in my city... I'm just going to start asking everybody. Just be like, hey, have you ever cleared a table?'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Growing frustration in Pinball Arcade leaderboard community regarding stale, unreachable top scores and suspected bogus entries creating psychological barrier to participation

    high · Extended debate showing player demoralization: 'if you look at the top 200 scores and notice that they're never moving... why do I even want to bother trying?'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Hosts argue leaderboard reset frequency (quarterly or annual) is critical engagement mechanic mirroring real arcade operator practices; static scores signal dead community

    high · Jared: 'operator will often have the high score-to-date system reset every 1,000 games... I think every quarter would be reasonable... that would actually really keep interest in the tables'

  • $

    market_signal: 'The King of Kong' documentary effect cited as evidence that spotlight on competitive play drives participation and leaderboard churn; model for revitalizing digital pinball interest

    medium · Chris references documentary's impact: 'suddenly it shines a bright spotlight on it. Next thing I'm seeing, within the next year, the leaderboard for that... changed about four different times'

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Farsight Studios invoked licensing restrictions when declining to provide CAD dimensions for Eight Ball Deluxe playfield parts, preventing direct digital reproduction

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.147

0:00
This is a Blockade Podcast with your hosts, Chris and Jared. You are listening to The Blockade Podcast. I'm your host, Shut Your Trap, a.k.a. Chris Freedman. Joining me, as always, Jared Morgan. Hey, hey, how's it going? It is going rather wonderfully well. What's going on with you right now?
0:47
I am sort of going solo with the kids this weekend. Kim is down in Sydney, and I am looking after them all the weekend. So this podcast has been recorded with them out watching a kid's programming at the moment. There you go. But not you alone. It's not you solo with the house all to yourself. Oh, no. No, I'm not bacheloring it. I'm not just basically drinking beer and watching movies like I did that other time, which was pretty good. I actually did manage to catch a movie last night, which was kind of good on Google Play. Deep Water Horizon. Okay. It was actually pretty good. for what it is.
1:30
So yeah, that was full of action. And then the night before I watched Doctor Strange, which was mind-bending.
1:38
So good. It would have been really good in 3D, that one. Amazing in 3D. I think that was one of the ones we talked about. Yeah, I went and saw it in 3D, and it didn't blow me away. I mean, it was certainly interesting in it, but I didn't feel like it was totally mind-expanding. But then again, I haven't watched it in 2D yet, so maybe if I watch it in 2D then I'll go nope, needs to be in 3D but I'm not sure. It looked pretty good, I have to admit. I was pretty impressed with just the way they did the effects in the movie for me was just like that sort of uncanny valley level where you would think it's almost real but it's just not quite real. Right. And it's good for that sort of that type of I guess the idea of what Doctor Strange is all about. It really worked for me.

high confidence · Jared argues: 'the operator will often have the high score-to-date system reset every 1,000 games... I think every quarter would be reasonable'

  • 'The King of Kong' documentary revitalized Donkey Kong competitive interest, leading to multiple leaderboard shifts, increased player participation, and eventual classroom instruction at arcade events

    medium confidence · Chris references: 'The King of Kong... suddenly it shines a bright spotlight on it. Next thing I'm seeing, within the next year, the leaderboard for that... changed about four different times.'

    • Chris @ ~43:15 — Competitive philosophy: champions defend titles actively, not rest on static records

    Donkey Kong
    game
    Attack from Marsgame
    Marco Specialtiescompany
    Savage Restorationscompany
    Arcade Expoevent

    high · Chris requested part dimensions from Farsight; response was 'no, it's a licensing thing'

  • $

    market_signal: Aftermarket reproduction parts for classic pinball machines (plastic lane guides, standoff bells) experiencing supply constraints; no Firepower overlay commercially available

    high · Chris reports Marco Specialties standoff bells out of stock; unable to find Firepower overlay despite extensive searching

  • ?

    product_concern: Eight Ball Deluxe's plastic lane guide components are fragile and prone to breaking; Chris reports missing pieces and broken tips causing ball routing issues

    high · Chris details six plastic pieces acting as lane guides, notes left flipper lacks piece causing uneven hop, reports two upper lane guide pieces broken at tips causing ball ricochet

  • ?

    technology_signal: Pinball Arcade undergoing collision detection and physics tuning that will materially change how specific tables play, though table not yet publicly identified

    medium · Chris: 'There is one table in particular that we've been told about that apparently is going to completely change how that table plays... looks great, but... nothing like the real one... because of so many wonky collisions'

    • 2:30
    Yeah, I liked it a lot. It was really good. I had one of those, I get the house to myself totally alone just yesterday.
    2:41
    Oh, did you? The boy was in school and the wife went to a scrapbook expo. And as is always the case with those situations, I then spend about the first hour going, what should I do that I don't normally what am I going to it usually involves me throwing a movie on it and turning the volume up to absurd levels yep and the problem for me yesterday though was but I want to go play my pinball machine out in the garage so that's what I did so you went and played pinball I didn't play pinball does Mason get into it? Does he come and play with you? he has come out a couple times now and he's witnessing the frustration that, you know, when a table is particularly mean, like A-Ball Deluxe. Like A-Ball Deluxe. Yeah. A-Ball Deluxe, what I'm discovering myself is it's a drain monster. It throws house balls at you left and right.
    3:41
    So you reckon they need to do some serious tuning? No. No, this is – because then – so I was seriously wondering about, well, God, do I have it at the right angle? Do I have – because I haven't – I've checked the angle. I think I'm at 5%, which I think is standard for that era. I don't think it's too much steeper than that. but I wasn't sure there was my question of how strong the slingshot bump is, how sensitive it should be so I went ahead and looked it up on looked for a pop-up video on it because I figured well those are going to be tuned and so I watched and oh no it was a drain monster there too and he was warning about it. He was warning how risky it is to send the ball up into the pop bumpers and stuff. Now, he was able to do, because as soon as I saw the technique, I went, oh, I've got to try that.
    4:47
    He was calling it a post-pass. Basically, what he was doing was with the ball caught in the right flipper, he was just giving it a little tap, and it was going back up the lane, and then rolling down far enough that it would go like halfway up the flipper and then he could flip and he could do a backhand to the eight ball oh uh drop target i was like oh that is so sweet so i went out to the garage and turned on the machine and went and did that and yeah i can't get the ball to move more than like maybe an inch backwards and so i'm not sure if that has to do with maybe if the angle is steeper maybe if my rubber was fresh um maybe i think all those things would contribute because the thing with the PAPA tables, they're all super basically, they re-rubber them regularly and they're always at the peak of their working condition. Exactly. So that'll be now what my goal is to get it to so that I can get that backhand going because it was a technique he was using on both flippers and I was like, that is totally a good way of controlling the ball on that table. Can we do that in TPA?
    5:52
    Have you tried it in TPA? I have not tried it in TPA. not yet that'll be interesting to see if we could do that because i don't know i don't know if it'll work in ppa because it's literally you got the flipper up and it's just that ever slug ever so you know slight stutter to get the ball to roll so yeah i know that they've adjusted their flippers but still it's a pretty automatic all the way down all the way up situation i think it looks like that but i think the way the flipper physics 3.0 work is that it does support tip passing and tip passing requires just a little pulse of the flipper at the end. So you might be surprised. It would be a good test. I might be. I think we should try it. As soon as we finish the podcast, we'll go and fire our BBD and try it out and see if we can do it.
    6:38
    Exactly. So anyway, yeah, he does come out, and he's been playing a little bit and getting frustrated, and he's starting to let me say, well, here's the deal. Don't always send the ball to the pop bumper. Do you want to send it to the lanes to the side? I've been trying to tell him where to better shoot.
    6:57
    He just keeps on asking, though, can I take off the glass and just play with it that way? I'm like, no!
    7:02
    No cheating! No, you can't. It's no good. So I guess we can roll right into this week's EBD talk then, since that's what we're talking about.
    7:15
    Probably should, actually, yeah. Yeah, the update is there's no update. I missed my window. I was working on Monday and the guy was finishing up with WonderCon and was going to come over on Monday evening to try and get the squawk and talk, squawking and talking.
    7:33
    And I texted him and said, well, I might not be able to get home until say 8 o'clock. And he was like, okay, that's fine. That'll be fine. I'm like, okay. So we had two units working that day.
    7:49
    And as the day's progressing, I'm looking at our call sheet, and I'm looking at how many more scenes we have, and I'm like, oh, I don't know if we're going to be finishing. I need us to finish at 7 o'clock, basically.
    7:59
    And that would have been a 12-hour day, which this show was being pretty good at doing, 12 hours from the other times that I've worked on it. Okay. And I'm looking, and then I hear one of the assistant directors go, no, I don't think we're going to get out of here until 8. I'm like, oh, no. And then the other unit comes in, and they were wrapped at 6.30. I was like, no, I need to be on that unit. So I texted the guy and I said, I'm not going to make it home by 8. I go, I'll be home around 9 if that's fine. Otherwise, let's postpone until another time. And then he got back. He was like, yeah, I'll come back next week, and then I'll have all my gear with me. And, you know, all the more stuff. So, yeah. Next week is fine. Yeah.
    8:40
    Right? So sometime before Easter, I should have him over, and he'll have all of his gear. and hopefully he'll get it up and completely running that way, which would be spectacular. It'll be the Easter bunny of pinball for you. He'll leave lots of little eggs and eggs on your swan and dog ball. So it works. So I did try something that I have yet to try with the machine. But out of curiosity, I had a quarter in my pocket. I was like, I haven't tried the corn door yet. Let's see if this actually functions. And I discovered that one of my coin slots doesn't work. It just wants to kick the corner right back out. And then the other one, it was working, but it would basically, you put the quarter in, nothing would happen. You give a little pound to the coin door, and then it would drop the rest of the way.
    9:28
    So it just needs to be cleaned up, obviously. But what I was thinking was we're going to have a garage sale the second week of May.
    9:42
    And I was like, you know what I'm going to do. Oh, have a coin drop. Absolutely. Because these people love paying in coin.
    9:50
    I'm going to roll that thing out and be like, there you go. Oh, man, you're going to rake it in, I reckon. People will be there playing it, for sure.
    10:01
    You know, the problem is that the driveway is slightly slanted, and I don't want to have it all the way. I mean, I don't want to have people going into my garage. So I'd want to have it out, but then it's just a matter of balancing it. So, I mean, that's not an issue. I think you should make it work. I think you need to make it work for great justice.
    10:22
    Just think how easy it would be to get some spare money for rubbers and stuff that you need to get if you could just get those mix working nice. Yeah.
    10:30
    Yeah, that'd be pretty good. I tell you what, it's having a working pinball next to the dead pinball, which kind of became this out-of-sight, out-of-mind thing. but now it's not so out of sight because it's right next to the working one. And it's sitting there like a pair of dog's nuts hanging out there going, you've got to do something with me. Dude, this has got me jonesing. It's so hard to work on. So I started watching YouTube videos again about clear coating and they're just as scary as the first time I remember watching them. Correct. You know, because I say, it's not the spraying that I'm concerned about. You know, fine, I go to the hardware store, I buy the suit, I buy a respirator mask. You spend the $20 and you're protected that way, right? And I'm not concerned about the actual spraying of it either. That's, you know, again, I watched the video and it was like the guy did six passes, you know, basically doing lanes of clear. Boom. Done. Okay, I'm not worried about that. It's the prep work.
    11:33
    You've got to have it prepped properly in order to get a good clear on. Otherwise, if you fail, it's locked in forever.
    11:42
    That's the part that has me nervous and I really want to talk to somebody that's actually done this to their table so that I can make sure that it's prepped properly before taking that next step. But, like I said, it totally got me jonesing to get it going on. I think if you're going to do that you need to take it away to a... I don't know. I'd take it away to do restore the playfield. Actually restore it Because if you going to lock in the play field you may as well lock it in with decent art on it of some description Well but well here the thing though It's if I can either take it all the way down to wood, right?
    12:30
    Which is kind of pointless because I don't have an overlay. No. And I can't buy one. I've looked, I've not been able to find anybody that's selling a firepower overlay I've found it for other tables, I have not found it for firepower I can't believe that they haven't got one for firepower it's the worst table for playfield wherever I know so there's no point in me taking it all the way down to wood so it's a matter of locking in the paint that is there which I've posted pics before, maybe I'll post some to Twitter again it's not terrible it's the same wear points as on everybody else's fire powers which are you got the inserts that go right up the middle and most of the inserts are shown wood because that's just where the ball was always going and how it comes off the inserts it just rubs like crazy so that's and the top of my planet is worn essentially the targets yeah so those are those are the areas but you know the videos that I've been watching they all talk about how it's,
    13:37
    hey, if you put a base coat of clear on, that locks in all of that. And so long as it's smooth, if you find an overlay, now it's got a really nice smooth surface to be stuck down to. It's true. If you want to do any of your painting, it makes it so much easier because you can paint and if you make any mistakes, you can wipe it right back off. That's quite true. Or you can even do all of your one color and then throw another layer of clear and then do the next, basically doing layers like you would in Photoshop. so this is actually this is what i know savage restorations here in australia they they do that themselves like if they have a play field that is just in the worst condition paint wise yeah they will just lock in the the state of the play field just with one layer of clear and over that that's what they actually paint over exactly whatever you want yeah because it's so paint yeah but you have to start with a flat surface. You've got to make sure that it's flat. My thing was I feel that I have a flat surface now. I feel like I've sanded it to where it's flat, but again, I want somebody else's expertise where they go, no, you need to do it even more. You'll do it over the entire table. I don't know. There's that whole thing of doing buffing it a little with a fine grit sandpaper because the clear has to have something to actually grab onto. I'm not that. that I'm not positive on how to do over the good paint. Doesn't that ruin the good paint? I don't know.
    15:08
    That's where it's like I really need to talk to somebody. That's what I'm going to be doing tomorrow.
    15:14
    The Pinball League is meeting in my city, so I'm going to go because I won't be gone for seven hours like I do sometimes when I'm at faraway cities. This one I can be in and out in three, basically. I'm just going to start asking everybody just be like, hey, have you ever cleared a table? And if you have, can I bring it over to you to look for prep work or do you want to come over after the tournament and come take a look? Anything. I just need somebody to give me that advice.
    15:45
    Yeah, I'm sure someone's going to go yeah, no worries, let's come over. You supplied the beer, I'll supply the technique.
    15:52
    At least that's how it would work in Australia. Yeah. It's so funny. Well, you know, in anybody else's league, there's alcohol involved in our league. We have no alcohol involved.
    16:03
    Somebody does not want 40 drunk people at their house bashing on their machines. Yeah. Fair enough. So, you know, we invade the neighborhood and take up all the parking. So I think that would be just a step too far.
    16:17
    So I do on, on able deluxe. It's got these, there's six clear plastic pieces. And basically what they are lane guides. So remember when we were talking lane guides last time? And I was saying how it does that little bump? Yes. Well, it turns out that on the side it's doing a little bump, my lane guide is just metal. On the other side, it's this clear plastic and then a bell on top of that and then that's where the metal is. So why it even has the metal, I don't know other than for looks.
    16:50
    But it's not using the metal as the lane guide. It's using the plastic. My left side flipper doesn't do the giant hop that it does on the right side. So I figured it's probably because the plastic is a little bit thicker and doing a better job on the angle. So I'm missing that piece of plastic.
    17:07
    And also, up on the lane for where the multiplier targets are, there's two pieces of clear plastic there that act as lane guides. Both of them are broken at the front tips.
    17:21
    which is causing when you shoot the lane for the deeper targets, not for your two-time or three-time, but once you get into four-time and five-time and you're shooting deeper, well, the ball is hitting those blunt, broken-off areas and causing it to ricochet funny instead of going smoothly up the lane.
    17:38
    So a buddy of mine, he has a laser CNC machine and would be able to cut pieces of plexi. Okay. So I'm like, great, I can do brand new ones. Here's where the problem comes. You need a CAD file for them. Well, a CAD file, that's not a problem because he knows CAD left and right. So all we really need to do is either scan a piece at a one-to-one ratio and then import that into Illustrator, which is a vector file.
    18:14
    Do a tracing of the line for that. That will convert to CAD with no problem. and then he can do it in. Or, and I was, I knew it wasn't going to work, but I figured I'd ask anyway. I asked the guys up at Farsight. So, any chance you can give me the dimensions of that? And they were like, no, it's a licensing thing. I'm like, ah. Really? So I can take the, because what I was thinking, if I do one piece, or if I do those, like, if I make the other side lane guide, because that's a mirror of the lane guide that I already have. Well, screw it. I might as well do all the plastics, make them all out of the same material, make it all – because they're all yellowish now, obviously. Yeah, may as well. So make it nice and clean, clear.
    18:59
    So I can put all those on my flatbed scanner and scan them in. But for those two pieces where the tips are missing, I don't know what that – I can look at photos and kind of guess, but I don't have the actual dimensions. so what I really hope for, again listeners help me out please, if you happen to own an 8 ball deluxe and don't feel you know feel like unscrewing a couple of screws and popping one of those off and plopping it onto your flatbed scanner and scanning it and sending me the image file then I have something that I can complete that with the only other issue that I'm going to have is those little metal bells, the spacer bells they're called standoff bells they are listed on the Marco Specialties website but they're out of stock and I don't know how frequently that stuff gets restocked yeah I'm sure there'd be another supply that would have them though because I need three spacer bells for the return lane I'm missing those completely the other ones I could obviously remove them from the plastic that I already have Why don't you just fabricate them with a bit of tube A bit of PVC tube Because I want the metal bell It looks pretty, it's sparkly, it's jewelry Hang on a sec, so there's a metal bell? There's like a It's called a metal standoff bell So it's what the plastic So that is directly on the table And it's what the screw goes into So it goes through the metal bell into the wood Right? And so it's just a little metal It's kind of got a bell shape Because on all the modern DMDs, those standoffs are actually just plastic. Yes. Yes, they're just plastic. At a pinch, you could just get that. At a pinch. Yeah. And they're probably easier. But, yeah, I can understand you want the shiny. I want the shiny.
    20:57
    Of course, then I've got to figure out also how to attach it then to the plastic, which I saw somebody, they take their soldering iron, and they stick it actually inside the bell and heat the tip of the bell, and then it melts into the plastic hole.
    21:14
    Anyway, I could, I have found they do sell the complete plastic kit for A-Ball Deluxe, and that's with all the printed parts also, but it's $130. I don't need all the printed parts.
    21:27
    And you're still dealing with the old material that was prone to breaking, whereas if I can go with a hard composite, then I don't have to worry about that.
    21:36
    Yeah, that's right. They'll be real strong. That's kind of attractive. I would actually, obviously, when you're doing these, I'd get 10 sets done and then think about selling those sets on eBay.
    21:49
    That's what I think about doing. Yeah, you know. That's just me. Not a bad plan. Yeah. So, anyway, that's what the current update that's going on with that table. So what's happening in digital pinball land at the moment? Digital pinball land. That's a good question. You know, we mentioned the Farsight's working on some of the collision detections on a few of the tables and, you know, kind of getting rid of those vacuum ramps, that kind of thing. There is one table in particular that we've been told about that apparently is going to completely change how that table plays. Yeah. For the better. Yes. Yeah. It's one of those tables that it looks great, but everybody goes, that's about the, you know, it looks fantastic, but it's nothing like the real one, you know, because of so many wonky collisions going on.
    22:48
    Well, this has once again sparked the debate on Pimple Arcade fans, which is, but what about the leaderboards?
    22:57
    That's a fair thing to debate. Yeah, it's a fair thing to debate, and we're going to go right back into what me and Jared always have said in the past, but it's been long enough that I think that we can safely jump right back into that. And I'll state what my opinion is, and then Jared can join in with his opinion. But my opinion has been for a very long time, every year, clear the leaderboards completely. Just wipe them. that way because so many of them... If you wipe them completely, you get rid of all the bogus scores. You get rid of all what I consider the dead weight scores, which are people that have played the game a long time ago. They posted that score and they may not even be active players anymore. And so now you have a leaderboard that has 20,000 scores on it when only in reality 5,000 people are playing.
    23:52
    So clear those boards because psychologically, if you want to play in the leaderboard game and you want to see where you're going,
    24:03
    it has an effect when you look at the top 200 scores and notice that they're never moving. And they're so far out of reach for you that then you kind of go, well, why do I even want to bother trying? Or if you look at the top scores and you're like, well, obviously some of these are fake. Again, why do you want to bother trying where you legitimately post a good score? and then all of a sudden, two days later, one of those bogus scores pops up again to supplant you. So there that aspect to it but then there also the other aspect is hey some of these tables have had significant changes done to them And therefore the leaderboard score is not representative of what is possible with the table today, as opposed to what it was available when you first released the table. So I'm, that's why I'm, I'm very much, it should be an annual thing. Basically when a new season is introduced or maybe when a new season is completed, I don't know. I probably would say new season introduced, just wipe them completely. Start from scratch. Sorry, all you leaderboard whores that, you know, think of yourself as professional leaderboard gatherers and you want to have all the number one top spots. Well, hey, if you're worth your salt, jump back into the fray and go to it. I know there's 80 plus tables. It's a war of attrition.
    25:18
    Pick your battles. You know, plant your flag on a couple of tables rather than trying to plant your flag on every single one of them. And hey, you know what? If you can't plant your flag on every single one of them, then good on you. good luck to the next guy. But that's my opinion. This rant has been brought to you by Chris Fever.
    25:36
    But basically, I do agree as well. I think, in particular, those tables that they do manage to do performance tuning on or physics tuning on that have a direct impact on the playability of the game, i.e. make it harder or change it in an appreciable way, they should absolutely zero out the leaderboards at a minimum that is the minimum they should do but I also agree with you that really I'd actually be gunning for a more frequent leaderboard reset. Think about what happens when you go into the arcade, like if you go into a popular arcade and you're playing a game the operator will often have the high score to date system reset every 1000 games well you relate that back to TPA and of course there'd be probably that many games being played a day so you wouldn't want to do that but I think every quarter would be reasonable and that would actually really keep interest in the tables and it would make people
    26:40
    you know that serial leaderboard chasers it would actually give them more drive to come back and play the game and this is the thing with any app or any product any website you need to think about how you're actually going to get customers or players to come back and have face time in front of your app that's the secret to success that's the secret to how you get people to think about buying other things in your app particularly if it's a dlc related product which tpa is so the more time you have eyes in the product the more chance you have a chance to cross sell or you know they might consider buying other things or doing other things in the app. It makes the app look healthy.
    27:26
    That's right. Instead of being this anemic thing that's on life support, you know, even though it's just using that in terms, I'm not saying that the game itself is anemic or on life support, but no, I'm talking about the community of players. It makes it look like it's this healthy, vibrant thing. And when people are excited about the game because it is healthy and vibrant, it makes them want to play it more and get more involved. And it's It's a circle story, essentially, if you will. One thing leads to the other, which leads to the other, which leads to the other. Now, you think about it. Let's liken Pinball Arcade to an actual real arcade with 80 tables in it, right? So if you were in this arcade and you used the behavior of leaderboards that we're currently seeing at the moment with basically very stable stationary scores at the top, it would pretty much be an empty arcade. there would be the feeling of of a pinball arcade arcade would be no one would be in it because there is no activity there is no feeling of movement but because we don't have because we're in a digital world here with pinball arcade we need to see the the only thing we can see that is different is scores moving and that if you're relating that back to the real world would suggest that the arcade is full of people and they're all playing the games, they're all having a great time. So it's a bit tricky when you're trying to think about relating Pinball Arcade in its digital form back to real arcade, but I think it actually makes sense. You've got to have that movement. It encourages people to interact. Well, I think a good example would even be look at the Donkey Kong phenomena that happened, right? For years, there was a very select few people that knew about the high score that was possible on it and what the high score was. And they knew about the kill screen, right? And then you got that documentary that came out, The King of Kong, and suddenly it shines a bright spotlight on it. Next thing I'm seeing, within the next year, the leaderboard for that, if you will, changed about four different times. The score kept on increasing. Now it's gotten to the point where I know they were offering at Arcade Expo 3.0 class on how to play Donkey Kong. Yep, they did that in Netherworld as well recently. Right, so right there you understand that we're talking about rejuvenating something that's been out there for years and that there has been a small niche community that was keeping it alive. but the general population was like nah, but all of a sudden you pump that life back into it now you're going to have young players who suddenly are interested and going, oh, well this is an active thing, it's not some it's a task, no doubt about it, but it's not insurmountable as we've seen, so if you keep on showing that the top score is able to be bumped off then that makes people want to come back the other thing that I say with that is okay so you're one of these who wants to be king of leaderboard. Well, what's that say? If you want to just pump in your high score and then never touch that table again, you want to be crowned king forever. That's a pretty hollow crown. In my opinion, if I'm competitive, I want to be actively defending my crown.
    30:52
    Do you reckon Usain Bolt would actually be comfortable with just sitting at the top of the, um, the Olympic world record holding leaderboard? He doesn't do that. He constantly strives to beat his record. You know, and why is he striving? Because there's constantly people nipping at his heels ready to get it. Within milliseconds of him losing his title. Now, at the moment, the TPA leaderboards, they don't feel like that. Basically, if you liken it to a running race, basically you're about 200 meters in front of the start already before the starter goes. Yeah. So it's really just not a challenge at all.
    31:31
    It's not that it's not a challenge. it's a challenge that you don't want to even attempt because it's pointless it's like like i thought for example you know i thought that when i got a 50 or 60 billion score on um attack for mars i was super stoked at that it was the best i ever did and then i have a look at the leaderboard and it's a a 60 trillion high score or something like that i went oh you know it just makes you feel like crap when you see that. If you've had a really good game, you should be feeling good about having a really good game. You should see some evidence of your good playing up on the leaderboard, but with scores like that people just grind away on,
    32:17
    it just makes you go, well, why bother? Then if you add on again, what the whole thing spurred this on was,
    32:27
    if Farsight is actually making these tables play either more difficult or more true to their real counterparts, then obviously that's changing what is possible on the game for a leaderboard. And like your example where you said, oh yeah, the person's already out 200 feet. Well, now they're out 600 feet and there's absolutely no way that you're ever going to be able to catch them. You know? Yeah. Some people were going, well, oh, updates on the leaderboards? Well, that's why you just look at what the monthly score is. the first thing that pops up though is the all time so here's what my proposal would be and that is within the game itself reset it every season or every year or whatever for the top scores that's where it's posted you want to have legacy score fine you go on to Farsight's website they have legacy score for and it's dated you know what I mean and then it's just posted there then you can look yourself up and you can go, you know, show it to your friends, take a screenshot, whatever, and be like, look, see, at one time I was king of this table. But as for active play, it should be wiped every year. Yeah. You'd almost have like a the winner of season six on this table, the winner of season seven. Think about it like, um, you have seasons in your pinball league, right? And you have like the 2016 season. Right. And, you know, you got the best score on this table all year. Right. Well, you know, that gets reset in 2017. and it's a new year. And you could do that. You could actually group them by year if you really wanted to. And again, then, hey, if you want to stake your claim and say you're king, fine, defend one table.
    34:10
    Be the king on one table every year. Be that guy, right? I don't have a problem with that. Be the king of Kong. Exactly. Prove it that every single year nobody can bump you off your perch. You know what I mean? You're that good. Right. So I don't agree. I really hope that Farsight, and we know you're listening, I really hope that you would take that into consideration.
    34:34
    At least give it a go. What's the biggest risk that they could... Exactly. You're going to tick off what? Maybe... 1% of the user base. If even that.
    34:45
    Yeah. 1% of the user base that's actually in the top 100 or 200. That is big. Yeah. Because I was going to say, I would bet there's maybe 60 people that care. Probably. Out of the tens of thousands of users. Yeah.
    35:03
    So maybe annoy those people for a little bit. Do it one year. See what the fallout is. Because the only way you're going to find out is to do it. So the risk-gets-assumption test in this one is, what would happen if we reset the leaderboards? Would we lose these top players? Nope, you wouldn't. Nope. because they own the tables, and they're just going to keep on playing them anyhow. When you think about it, too, there are some leaderboard scores that were from when they introduced a new table, but it mucked up something to where you're playing Theater of Magic, but it's really scoring that score onto Genie.
    35:44
    Yes, that's right. And that hasn't been rectified. There's been a mess-up with leaderboard linking, and yeah, it's just screwed it. I mean, they go back and they eventually fix the link. They fix it so that it goes to the proper table, but they don't go back and clear the scores. No, they don't zero out the scores. I think they should. So again, one more reason why every single, at a regular interval, everything should be wiped. Just 100% across the board. Boom. Gone. Started from scratch. The thing is that even if they do wipe the leaderboards, you've still got your record of your highest score in your personal fast side account. So if at any time you're getting flogged by players better than you, you can go back to your little corner of the world and rock yourself to sleep with your scores that you got this one time at Bandcamp. Oh.
    36:39
    Hey, you know what I've been doing? I've been doing some binging of TV because I can now. So I started by binging Have you heard of a show called Into the Badlands No You going to lose me here most of the time Cause I haven watched the television series for about six years It isn on free to wear and isn on between the hours of eight 30 and nine 30 So, uh, so basically nothing. Clearly you have no DVR. Um, uh, no, we have no, we have no pay TV, which is where they're all distributed on in Australia. Right. So yeah. Right. I was going to say DVR saved me when I had a kid because then it didn't matter what time the show was on. I could still watch it whenever kids take on Apple. Time to watch the show. You know, anyway, Into the Badlands, it's a martial arts show that's on AMC.
    37:31
    And it's pretty spectacular martial arts. If you've watched Iron Fist on Netflix and kind of cringed at how bad the martial arts are, all you have to do is watch Into the Badlands and you'll really cringe at how bad the martial arts were anyway they just started their second season so I went ahead and I binged the first six episodes, there was only six episodes in the first season because I wanted to re-watch those and on Monday I believe Better Call Saul is back on so I'm right now binging the first two seasons of that again, which is spectacular and And then Netflix just came out with the second part of the first season of The Get Down. So I'm going to go ahead and rewatch the first six episodes of that and then binge all of that. So I'm having some fun just absorbing TV. Meanwhile, I have that box set of The Sopranos that I've only gotten through the first season of. So I've still got six more seasons of that to go. And I have the three seasons of Hannibal that I want to go through again. Mate, you need 36 hours in a day with all that television you've got to get through far out that's a good problem to have though isn't it I love that problem it's the reason why I've kind of gone through the shows that are actively on TV and we just got a new DVR so I had to set all my recordings again and yeah, I cleaned house I was like, you know what, I'm never watching this show I'm just too many things recorded This is never going to happen. I'm not going to do this. The thing is, this is the problem I have. If you don't have pay TV here, and the problem is that I'm sure you've got the same problem over in the US. Some series are only on certain pay TV providers. So you might say, you know, The Walking Dead is only on AMC, and therefore that's only provided through certain pay TV providers. Oh, no, we don't have that issue. We do. this is a problem we've got Fox here that have some franchises and then we've got Fetch TV which have other franchises then we have Netflix which have their own franchises and so the problem we have is if you want to go and if I go now to movies and TV and get into say the first one that came is probably terrible but it's Big Little Lies and if I want to watch season one it's $17.99 Australian to watch season one, all episodes. So if you don't have pay TV here or you don't have a pay TV service that has that show on, you're up $18 to watch the entire series. So that's season one. The show you picked happens to be an HBO show.
    40:25
    Yes, it is. So that's what we call premium channels. Oh, right. Okay. So that's something that I don't even... I mean, HBO is available to me, but I don't pay for HBO. So we'll get to watch that show. But I realize also you guys suffer from the issue of obviously the shows are American made.
    40:48
    And so your providers are being selective as to what they're going to broadcast. Yeah, absolutely. Well, Netflix Australia does not have all of the U.S. shows on it. Right. And we used to be able to get around that by using a VPN and masquerading in the fact that we're in the U.S. and actually having a U.S. Netflix account. But Netflix have clamped down on that now, so we just have to pirate them. Not really. That's what it comes down to. We just have to pirate the TV shows. Isn't that amazing? It's like, you know what? You want to scream about piracy? Then make it available.
    41:24
    Yeah. Don't make it hard for us to give you money. Exactly. Yeah. we want to actually there's been a study on this and given the opportunity for people to legally purchase and download seasons without any delay they'll do it here in Australia Australians will actually reward the studios with actual cash money if they let them download the movie or the series or the thing immediately when it's out in the US. Now I know the reason why they don't do it is because the pay TV companies in Australia don't get access to it immediately. Therefore they lose their reason for being in the market. Right.
    42:08
    And that is a problem. So it's, it's commercial issues. The reason why they don't do it. But the thing is that if the company was smart or when they were actually brokering the deal with all the providers, what they do is they just go, everyone gets it now. Yeah. and the problem goes away. Well, that's what BBC realized with Doctor Who,
    42:33
    where they were delaying the season for BBC America by about, I don't know, a month or two, right? But what they were then wondering was, why is the show being pirated so much? It's like, because we have internet, and we can talk to people from other countries, and when other countries are spoiling the show for you, then you need to watch the show at the same time as they're watching it so that you don't have an issue. And so finally BBC got smart to that and was like, okay, we're going to air Dr. Who day and date with when it airs in, in the UK. And then, yeah. And then the same thing was happening with, with Downton Abbey, which yeah, you weren't gonna find me watching that, but I understand people's plight. Uh, cause that was on PBS, I believe. And again, it was airing in the UK and then it was taking, uh, three months before it was airing here in the U S and they finally realized it, I think by their final season, Hey, why don't we air it at the same time? It's like, yeah, it's like, there's actually a market in another country that isn't the UK. Jeez, maybe we should service that market and actually make it available to them. Yeah. You know, I understand when you're a first season, not making it because again, you want to see what's the audience reaction and should, is this something that our country would be interested in watching? Um, so there, I understand they're being delayed, but once you find that audience, once the audience is there, service them.
    43:59
    You know, I think in some ways, while torrenting and file sharing isn't a good thing, it is actually an interesting metric for studios to use. Because if they see one country torrenting their absolute nuts of something, it's an indication to them there's actually a market for it there, and they should probably, for the next season, make it instantly available. because if they do that, people will probably buy it or at least subscribe to a service that has it. Like, it's pretty obvious really, isn't it? Like, I don't know. You don't have to be a genius to work that out, but it seems that in the film and movie and TV show industry, you do.
    44:40
    Anyhow. It is what it is. So we'll just keep on doing what we do down here in Torrent, which will be easier for some of us now because the National Broadband Network is rolling out down here, and I am now officially, well, registered for it. I've got the modem. I just need the service connected, and I'm just waiting for that to happen. So I'll have 25 theoretical, 25-meg download and up to 5 meg upload, which is much better than what I'm on now. Much better. Yeah. We won't have a spotty video as you and I chat back and forth with each other. No way. It'll be super good. All right. Well, other things we should look forward to is next week because I think we're all done here, folks. Yeah, I think so. I think so too. So why don't you go ahead and give us a follow on Twitter?
    45:39
    The show is at Blockade. You should probably go ahead, though, and follow Jared and myself. I am at ShutYourTraps. He is at JaredMorgz. The reason why I say that is because although we post show stuff on the show, more of our personal, I don't know, picadillas, if you will, whatever you want to call those, eccentricities come out on our individual threads. And it's far more interesting.
    46:08
    Yeah, so it's good to follow those two. It's strictly business on the BlackHaid Twitter, but it's business casual.
    46:16
    Well, it's certainly business except that I forget that I'm logged into Blockade and not logged into Shutter Traps. And then I post. I go, oh, wait a second. I'm saying I and me, and I'm talking about we. So anyway, go ahead and also check out our website. It is blockadepinball.com. There you will find all of the past shows that we have plus show notes and links to websites that we mentioned during the show. you can also drop us a email blahblahblockade at gmail.com tell us what you want to hear in the show, tell us what you like in the show and send images files to me that relate to either Firepower or 8BallDeluxe that's right all your Firepower and 8BallDeluxe picks exactly, whatever you can send my way that I can use to help restore my machines that would be wonderful So beyond that, that's it. That's all we got. There's nothing more for us to sell. Nothing more for us to pitch. All right. So we're probably, I think it's safe to say, not going to be recording next week with it being a holiday weekend. No, I'll be up in a little bit, more than likely next weekend. So, yeah, it'll be out. There you go. So mark that on your calendars, folks. It's going to be a two-week delay between now and the next podcast. So, yeah, go check out some of those early scary podcasts that we used to do and laugh at how terrible they were. Have a laugh. Have a laugh, yes.
    47:49
    That being said, though, you know, we do miss some of the people that used to pop onto our podcast and talk with us because those were good times. We didn't kick anybody out. They just stopped coming on. Yeah.
    48:07
    We miss you. All right. We'll talk to you all again. Coming soon. Bye-bye. Bye. WizardAmusement.com, the West Coast leader in classic pinball. Makers of custom pinball shooter rods and buyer specifications. Swap out your standard ball plunger with something themed to your specific table. Installs in less than five minutes with no custom tools. Even if you don't own a table, looks great as a pinball memento to admire. Prices start at $39, but mention Blockade Podcast and receive 10% off your order. WizardAmusement.com. Sales, restoration, customization.
    48:48
    Don't forget to leave a review on iTunes for your favorite podcast hosting service that Blockade is delivered to. We can't approve unless you tell us how. Now stop listening and place it in goal.
    49:05
    you