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DPP #141 "Pinball rules! Trent Kennedy interview!"

Don's Pinball Podcast (regular feed)·podcast_episode·47m 52s·analyzed·Aug 24, 2024
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.036

TL;DR

Jaws gets robust new video mode; Don critiques manufacturer product strategies and positioning.

Summary

Don discusses Jaws' latest code update featuring a new 8-bit Shovel Knight-inspired video mode integrated with multiball gameplay, praises Stern's investment in post-release coding and Insider Connected, contrasts competitive positioning with Spooky Pinball, reviews his installation of the Stranger Things UV lighting kit (criticizing inefficient engineering), expresses frustration with vague Stern teaser timelines and Dutch Pinball's slow Alice in Wonderland reveal strategy, contextualizes Home Pin as budget consumer furniture rather than competitive commercial-grade machines, and previews Zen Pinball's Princess Bride table.

Key Claims

  • Jaws is probably the most robustly coded Stern game of the modern era (last couple years), with more depth/breadth than Godzilla, Foo Fighters, Venom, or John Wick

    high confidence · Don's direct assessment based on personal gameplay experience; part of his regular game analysis

  • The new Jaws video mode integrates screen gameplay with multiball simultaneously rather than locking up balls during video mode

    high confidence · Don watched Stern's official livestream and observed gameplay; confirmed by his description of the integration mechanics

  • Stern invested significantly in the Insider Connected scheme and post-release coding teams to differentiate from competitors

    high confidence · Don's analysis of Stern's strategic positioning; observable through continuous Jaws code updates

  • The Stranger Things UV lighting kit requires replacing 8 plastics, swapping the apron, and installing new PCB board despite playfield already having UV ink

    high confidence · Don's first-hand installation experience; detailed breakdown of kit contents and installation process

  • Dutch Pinball's Alice in Wonderland is positioned as priced under $12,000 and loaded with sculpts and topper

    high confidence · Don's market positioning summary; aligns with previous KB context about competition in this price range

  • Home Pin's Blues Brothers has limited licensing rights (only words 'Blues Brothers', logo, and character caricatures) without music, themes, or movie imagery from the film

    high confidence · Don reports this as discovered community information during the Taiwan show prototype reveal

  • Home Pin Blues Brothers is actually a re-theme of Stern Stars

    high confidence · Don reports this discovery from community analysis of the Taiwan prototype

Notable Quotes

  • “Jaws is probably the most robustly coded Stern game that I've seen, you know, of the what I call the modern era, right, the last couple of years.”

    Don @ ~5:00 — Frames Jaws as industry-leading in code depth despite initial community skepticism about the game

  • “This is a video mode that also incorporates like a multi-ball as well so it's like interact it's like you're playing pinball and controlling the video mode at the same time... please please more of this have more of this integration with the screen”

    Don @ ~8:00 — Highlights the technical innovation of the new video mode and establishes it as a design direction other manufacturers should follow

  • “This code, I think, is their distinction. They did put forth a sizable investment, and we should commend them for that, into implementing the Insider Connected scheme... when I go get a Stern, I know that the investment in code and quality are going to be there”

    Don @ ~15:00 — Identifies Stern's post-release coding as their competitive advantage strategy against Spooky and other rivals

  • “It's ludicrous what this thing is... so why not do the plastics the same way... Wouldn't that make a lot more sense?”

    Don @ ~25:00 — Critiques inefficient UV kit engineering and questions Stern's design/manufacturing decisions

  • “If you want the UV kit, you've got to buy the special one... you engineer like three different models. Like, like it didn't make sense to me.”

    Don @ ~28:00 — Documents the complexity and resource inefficiency of the UV kit implementation

  • “Home Pin is making pinball machines that would be featured in the Sharper Image, not even at Costco. Like this would be like Throw it at the Think Geek... you kind of Bozoing around”

    Don @ ~65:00 — Reframes Home Pin as consumer novelty furniture rather than competitive commercial-grade machines

  • “This is like the SkyMall catalog that used to be on the jet airliners, right? The amateur Schlemmers, the mail order catalogs... just stupid crap like that.”

Entities

JawsgameDonpersonStern PinballcompanySpooky PinballcompanyDutch PinballcompanyHome PincompanyBugperson

Signals

  • ?

    event_signal: Bug's Thursday night 'Stream and Scream' on Spooky Pinball Twitch channel features casual gameplay followed by open Q&A discussions about film/pinball topics, positioning as community engagement format

    high · Don: 'Bug Corwin Emery does this great little gameplay stream... The fun part of them are the conversations that happen at the end'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Growing fatigue with Stern's vague teaser timeline; community speculation has become self-referential goalpost-moving ('it's going to happen Friday'...'they typically do them on Tuesdays')

    medium · Don: 'everybody, it seems, online is talking about the Stern teaser and they keep doing this goal post movement... I'm not even participating in this hype train anymore'

  • ?

    competitive_signal: Stern differentiating primarily through post-release code quality and Insider Connected investment while competitors (Spooky) focus on factory-loaded features; code becomes primary distinction point

    high · Don: 'This code, I think, is their distinction... when I go get a Stern, I know that the investment in code and quality are going to be there'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Stranger Things UV kit requires inefficient triple-engineering (multiple aprons, 8 plastics, PCB) despite playfield already having UV ink; Don questions whether factory inclusion would have been more efficient

    high · Don's detailed installation breakdown questioning triple-model engineering: 'you engineer like three different models... it didn't make sense to me'

  • ?

    leak_detection: Home Pin Blues Brothers confirmed as Stern Stars re-theme through community analysis of Taiwan prototype; raises questions about development strategy and game differentiation

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.144

0:00
It's the time again for another episode. I believe it is. We're up to 141, if you can believe it. Jam-packed is what this episode is. We've got another interview coming at the end with Trent Kennedy from Interactive Pinball, maker of an amazing new mod for our pinball machines, as well as new Jaws stuff and all sorts of pinball. Let's go.
0:30
I'm like, come on, guys. Come on, guys. Everybody to the limit. The cheap is to the limit. Everybody come on, guys. I couldn't even get everything out I wanted to in that introduction. We're going to talk about this amazing new Jaws update and video mode challenge that dropped just like today, yesterday, honest. I got lights installed on my stranger things. There's so much going on. So much going on. What's going on with you? Welcome. Let's get into it. We are back with the On Spinball Podcast. Thank you so much for joining everybody. Thank you for the emails and the messages and the fellowship and the hugs and the boxes of cash. They're appreciated, but really not necessary. You guys spoil me. We're also getting spoiled with amazing code from Jaws. Love this game. I was just talking last night. I was going to get to it a little bit later, but if you haven't checked out Bug's Stream and Scream streams, Thursday night, Spooky Pinball Zone, Bug Corwin Emery does this great little gameplay stream, and it's great. He plays his games and everything. But the fun part of them are the conversations that happen at the end. He happened to mention, we were talking about horror movies, favorite modern pins, and I kind of got put on the spot like, hey Don, what's your favorite modern pin? And I just, I spurted out Jaws, but for good reason. It's funny to think now, all of the kind of instant, not quite hate, but like, oh, we were expecting so much more when this game came out. Remember the shark doesn't eat the ball controversy, and then you look at the play field, there's no collapsible building mech, there's no orca that sinks into the play field, you know, this is garbage. And then come to look now, this is probably the most robustly coded Stern game that I've seen, you know, of the, what I call the modern era, right, the last couple of years. Okay, you know, Godzilla got there, but if we look at Foo Fighters, Venom, Jaws, John Wick, like easily Jaws is putting them all to shame as far as like the depth and the breadth of the code. and I know we're not even at 1.0 yet but over the summer Jaws has really been fleshed out with those 4th of July modes that came out adding more robust scoring and things and such and then the accessories just came out so I kind of feel like we have plenty of Jaws to play for right now and then I didn't know this was coming but we got another video mode and Jaws already has what I would consider a quite above average video mode as it is right you know the 3d shark hunter game you know it's a throwback god i love this i love this theme because like it's nostalgic so it gets full points there but it's integrated in a modern way so it gets full points there too it's like win-win man you know as great as godzilla is i keep talking about it the license and theme for jaws and nostalgia is kicking on such a higher level that man this thing is firing so they had this retro inspired 1980s holographic type 3D video game mode in there, you know, where you flip the buttons and shoot the sharks. It's fun. It's engaging. And when you compare it to the video mode that was in Venom, which, you know, didn't make any sense. Like, why am I playing as Scream right now? Scream, Scream, Scream. So playing the Shark Hunter is super fun. You can play it in 3D. You can play it in regular mode. I love playing it in 3D with my 3D glasses at home. That was fantastic. So, like, I was already satiated as far as, like, dude, you understood the assignment for the video mode. You brought it. And then what did they do? What did they do? They got like, oh my God, almost like a Shovel Knight type remake of Jaws the Revenge mode, they're calling it. It looks like an 8-bit game. It's got 8-bit chiptunes. If you haven't seen the streams by now, go check it out. Unfortunately, I was not able to run downstairs and go play Jaws because my game has been sold. But I did tune into the live stream that Stern put on yesterday. And, you know, I didn't watch the entire thing, but I watched a good 10, 15 minutes of it, watching it play through the modes. And my God, dude, what fun. this is a video mode that also incorporates like a multi-ball as well so it's like interact it's like you're playing pinball and controlling the video mode at the same time it's not like the gameplay takes a break while you play on this just the screen like this please please more of this have more of this integration with the screen i love it you know so far when you get to a video mode you know everything locks up balls in a buck balls somewhere and then you kind of play on the screen for a little bit and then it's like back into the gameplay here they have integrated the screen and the gameplay field in such a great way with chiptunes, with classic 8-bit style graphics. Dude, I love this. I love this. I want to go out and play it. So far, it doesn't appear that this is a mode that appears within the game itself, although that would be kind of fun. But this is one of those challenge modes that you can spend your shark teeth on. So here we go. We kind of come full circle. When Jaws came out and I was playing it for my first time at Interium, I'm progressing up the ranks from starting at sardine, heading towards mackerel. I'm getting these shark teeth. I have no idea what this currency is supposed to be used for. Finally, I found out, okay, well, you can cash them in and play the shark hunter video mode if you want. I guess that's kind of cool. But now there's this really cool, robust mode in there that you can play completely separate from what I would call the main campaign of the game, the gamification of pinball. Like, I love it. I love video games. I love retro classic movies. I love retro video games. I love pinball. This is all of them in one big porridge pot. So I think when I was put on the spot and I blurted out that Jaws is currently my favorite game, you know, kind of of modern era, yeah, yeah, I mean, come on. How could it not be? Fantastic. I'd love to get that again. So check that out. Stern did the stream. The code update is out. Everybody with a USB dongle has been able to get this thing and try it out. People are digging it. I'm digging it. I can't wait to see more as we build towards that 1.0 code. This, this Stern, this is what I want to see. this is your point of difference you know um you know other companies are bringing the competition to uh stern's doormat i mean you know if this rumored alice in wonderland game comes out you know two thousand dollars less than le and is loaded with sculpts and a topper and everything else like you know that's the type of competition we need to bring to keep stern up in their game you know spooky pinball loading the games with absolutely everything you can imagine you know magnet graphics powder coated everything powder coated ramps even code updates every week it seems like. There's still another round of spooky updates I haven't even got caught up with now, so I'm back to the USB exchanging. They're really bringing it. I think Stern, when they bring their box of lights out, and of course they've got everything with the economies of scale, the budget engineering, where they're bringing down that box of lights and everything. This code, I think, is their distinction. They did put forth a sizable investment, and we should commend them for that, into implementing the Insider Connected scheme, hitting the Wi-Fi with everything and then investing in the coding teams post-release to really amp these things at this point, how does a Jaws compete even on the used game market against a Venom or something or some of these other games that are coming out this is where the competition is and I love it because it's great for us to play pinball, man when I go get a Stern, I know that the investment in code and quality are going to be there Spooky, I know what I'm getting with them so i'm good with my subscription with them that's pinball waits to be seen they've had one release and it took a little bit of time they got there thankfully it's sink like the haggis boat um but we'll see what dpx has to bring um you know all eyes are on the rest of the companies now like american pinball step it up home pin this is your time to shine this kid can polish that uh that that rusty piece of coal there um so yeah so that that i wasn't expecting it it dropped on us It kicks butt. I can't wait to go play it. I love it. So thank you for doing that. Also, man, this has been like a great week that I've been having. I got one day off and like all this stuff was dropping on that day. What the heck? Sorry, auto plays on.

Don @ ~66:00 — Establishes Home Pin's market position as impulse-buy novelty product for non-enthusiasts

  • “If a Stern game comes out in August, fantastic... I'm not going to be like waiting on the bit like, when's it coming, man?”

    Don @ ~47:00 — Expresses frustration with community speculation about Stern teaser timeline; signals fatigue with FOMO marketing

    • Stranger Things
    game
    Alice in Wonderland (Dutch Pinball)game
    Blues Brothers (Home Pin)game
    Zen Pinballcompany
    Venomgame
    Godzillagame
    Foo Fightersgame
    John Wickgame
    Insider Connectedproduct
    Jack Dangerperson
    Princess Bridegame
    Kerry Hardyperson
    Pinsideorganization

    high · Don: 'this is just Stern Stars that they've taken and essentially done a re-theme on'

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Home Pin's Blues Brothers license appears limited to title/logo/character caricatures only; lacks music, themes, movie imagery; raises questions about development feasibility and community credibility

    high · Don: 'they only license that they had purchased or got the rights to use for Blues Brothers was literally just for the words Blues Brothers, maybe the logo and kind of caricatures... not the music from the movie, not any of the themes'

  • $

    market_signal: Home Pin explicitly targets non-enthusiast consumers ('blokes that want a pinball machine in their basement') at sub-$5k price point; not competing with commercial-grade $10k+ machines

    high · Don quoting Home Pin's own positioning: 'Mike has said this... He's making pinball machines not for people that are passionate or into or know a thing about pinball'

  • $

    market_signal: Dutch Pinball executing extended 6-month incremental reveal strategy for Alice in Wonderland (playfield photo → backglass crop → game announcement → playfield photos); community member Kerry Hardy describes approach as 'edging'

    high · Don: 'they started with showing us the bottom of a play field six months ago... And it's like, we can do this, like, 18 more times? Show the game or just say, hey, we're going to show the game in three months'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Jaws receives new 8-bit Shovel Knight-inspired video mode integrated with multiball mechanics, representing sophisticated screen/playfield interaction design

    high · Don watched official Stern livestream of new mode and confirmed integration mechanics: 'it's like you're playing pinball and controlling the video mode at the same time... it's not like the gameplay takes a break while you play on this screen'

  • ?

    product_concern: Stranger Things UV lighting kit installation revealed poor documentation and wire bundle organization; finding correct harness required significant search effort at late hour

    medium · Don: 'the instructions that it came with just say... plug in the power supply... and then it's like turn it on and test it and i'm looking around i'm like where the hell is this am i missing a wire harness'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Don's perception of Home Pin shifted from dismissive to contextual; reframes Blues Brothers as consumer novelty furniture (Sharper Image category) rather than competitive commercial machine, reducing direct comparison to premium manufacturers

    high · Don's extended Sharper Image/SkyMall metaphor and conclusion: 'Home Pin is making pinball machines that would be featured in the Sharper Image... This compares more to, like, a piece of furniture or a sofa than it does to a commercial-grade integrated circuit pinball machine'

    • 8:40
    So yesterday I got in my mailbox, I can't believe I'm even saying this. I got my Stern pinball, Stranger Things, UV lighting kit delivered to my house finally. When was that run of Stranger Things Premiums? Was it November last year? And I've had the game. I've got it completely powder-coated out, bought it out. It looks awesome. Got the topper on there, the official one. I made my shooter rod. I put it on there. The shooter rod that I had made back when I had Rush LE, like two years ago, before I even got a Stranger Things, I found a D20 oversized, and I made my own shooter rod. It was one of the first ones I made. Actually, I made two of them, but one of them was translucent, and I now have that on my Stranger Things. with the Rush LED panel. I sold from there, so I got a red glowing D20. Super cool. But this game has had absolutely everything except for one thing, and that was the damn UV kit. And I had ordered through Mad Pinball. When the game was coming, I'm like, all right, I need a UV kit. And Jeff's like, all right, bet. We're getting them in. They were coming. So a painful, we're good. And then, like, almost none were delivered. and then it's been like, okay, well they're supposed to come in the next few weeks and we've been next few weeking it, I think, for months. Nothing against any of the distributors. I mean, this is where the supply has been. So finally, I don't know if the 40-foot trailer backed up to Stern and they finally got it out. I don't know if it was misdirected to Albuquerque and it's been sitting in a dead letter office, but I got that damn box to my front porch and I had it downstairs and I was up until around 12.30 at night putting this thing in my Stranger Things. I had to have it. I was going to put it off to the side. Maybe we'll start with some plastics. We'll go get some dinner. We'll get some rest in the morning. We'll hit it. Nah, fam. I came down and put that whole thing in there. So, yes, it's amazing. I knew it was because I've seen it on location. I've seen it in other games. But, like, literal game changer? Absolutely it is. Is it necessary? Yes, it is. Is it, in fact, so necessary to have this in your game that it should have been included from the factory? Absolutely. It's ludicrous what this thing is. You know, I was thinking, okay, I'm going to order the LED strip lights and that punched-out steel panel. We're going to plug it in. I'm going to plug it into a node board, and we're ready to go, right? Like, all the code should already be in there. Nuh-uh. Like, there's so much in this kit. So much, though, that it's just, it seems absurd and unnecessary, okay? So, not only are there the slingshots and the outlaying plastics that you have to replace, but also like the two plastics from each side of the upper part of the play field under the ramps. So like this thing, you have to dismantle the plastic ramps, replace about eight plastics total, which takes some doing. You've got to chase the nuts when they go running away. You've got to pull the plastic ramps off or whatever and put those in. And the reason is because there is some UV details, some details that show up under the black light UV system in the art on the plastics. and like what's the point of making two versions of that stern the play field already has the uv ink in it so you make one play field it has it in there whether you have the kit or not right so why not do the plastics the same way i mean how much more would it cost to make a plastic with those extra little details versus just having to run to the regular ones and then having to keep track of like, okay, these are the UV ones. These are the non-UV ones. Like, why not just put those in the game when you're just making it and then be done with it and then nobody ever has to mess with it again. Like, wouldn't that make a lot more sense? This kit comes with an extra apron, a replacement apron. Now, I've got a premium machine with a premium apron with Insider Connected from the factory already. But no, I have to get another metal apron, take my metal apron out that's working. It's got the projector hidden underneath it. Like I had to take that one out, put a new one in, replace my QR reader just because there's, you know, three or four little holes in the out lane for an LED strip behind there. What are we doing? Why did they go through the trouble of like, you know, we'll take our regular steel, no, it's not even a regular steel apron. It wasn't as if this is like the general issue stern steel apron. We'll put this in the Stranger Things. If you want the UV kit, you've got to buy the special one because the one that's in Stranger Things is already special, at least in the premium and the LE for that matter, because it already has a cutout in the apron for the projector. You already have to have this special apron that's only good for the premium and LE machine for Stranger Things only. You can't use it in any other machine because it's got that special cutout for the projector, but like you didn't just go ahead and put the holes in there for the LED strips to go behind there. Like what does it, you engineer like three different, different models. Like, like it didn't make sense to me. So, okay. So I swapped that out. I mean, no big deal. It, you know, went in pretty easily. Uh, it's just swapping nuts and bolts over, but it just like seemed like a lot more resources than it needed to be. Um, all right. And then I, I got the LED strips in on either side, uh, plugged everything back in. Um, there is a power distributor board that goes in the bottom of the play field now there's already pin inserts like pilot holes on the underneath side there so that goes in fairly easy it's easy to find where it goes in um the wiring harness connects without too much difficulty um but then i had to power the thing and the instructions that it came with just say you know plug in the the the power supply from the from the main power harness of the game and then it's like turn it on and test it and i'm looking around i'm like where the hell is this am i missing a wire harness so it turns not like tucked into that nested bundle of wiring harness from the factory there are the plugs in there you have to snip several cable ties to free them up but like i was like oh man i'm like at step like 11 of 12 like this is the second to last step of this and am i missing something what's going on plus it was midnight at this point a little bit delirious uh but eventually like it dawned on me to like really look through that braided knot that braided dreadlock of cables running down the main part of the playfield i found it i found them in there i freed them up plugged it in, it's working fantastic, literally changed the game. But, like, for all this work, for what was it, $250, $300 or something, paying for this thing? And it has to be because they have to include another apron, they have to include all these plastics, plus the wiring harness and the little PCB board. This could have just, this could have been so easy.
    15:09
    Installing this from the factory would have taken, like, no extra time because, you know, you're doing the whole build-up anyway. I don't know. So where's the profit margin on that? When you figure you need to sell an extra apron, look, those aprons are like $100, right? And then you get the price of lights, the PCB, everything else. Like was it worth it to have that little margin when you're already putting all the paint on the play field anyway? I don't know, man. If I had an arcade, like this would be excruciating. I think I would have said, you know what? I don't know if this is going to generate all that much extra income. I'll probably just skip it. And then you got people having a substandard experience. So I don't know. Tell me. Like, I think for at least the remake of these things going forward, just include the lights, man. Just include the lights. Nobody has to wait for them, you know. It just seems so weird. I'm glad to have it, though. Was it worth the money for me? Hell, yes, it was. It was a fun adventure putting it in there. It's just in my brain I was having trouble making sense of everything. Speaking of things not making sense, everybody, it seems, online is talking about the Stern teaser. and they keep doing this goal post movement like we're going to get a Stern teaser for the next cornerstone. It's going to happen today. Oh, it didn't happen today? It's going to be the first part of next week. You're going to see it. Oh, it'll be Friday. This Friday. It's going to happen Friday. And then now it's like, well, they typically do them on Tuesdays, so I'm sure that's when it's going to happen. Look, guys, if we keep this up, eventually we'll be correct because you keep just saying it's the next couple days in the future. So I'm not even participating in this hype train anymore. I'm just going to wait and see. If a Stern game comes out in August, fantastic. We're going to talk about it. I'm going to go find one on location and go play it. I'll tell you all about it. All right, if it comes out in September, same thing. If it comes out in October, same thing. I'm not going to be like waiting on the bit like, when's it coming, man? They said they. Who's they? Random voices out there on the internet as craziness. The other side of the teaser hype train is what Dutch Pinball is doing with Alice in Wonderland. Alice's Adventures in Wonderland. Alice's Adventures in Wonderland as an adult. So it's not creepy. I don't know. But, you know, they started with showing us the bottom of a play field six months ago. Then some, you know, kind of cropped out photos of some back glass art. Then they announced what the game was, but we still didn't see it. Then they gave us, like, you know, some kind of, you know, bad camera shot of part of the play field and, like, another one. So we can see that there's sculpts in there, and we're getting hype for it. And it's like, we can do this, like, 18 more times? Show the game or just say, hey, we're going to show the game in three months. And then I'm like, okay, cool. I don't know that you need to kind of foster this.
    17:41
    Kerry already called it edging. You've got to keep edging us for like six months to be hyped for this game.
    17:47
    It seems when you're building up towards a launch, you want to build up somewhat of a little bit of a fervor, right? Is this the best way to do it? You know, by just kind of almost like you're playing volleyball, just keep bumping that ball just a little bit, and we'll kick it down the road without actually telling people that need time to plan a budget if they're going to go in on this. I mean, the game looks attractive. I think the game would sell based on its merits alone. You know, price that's under $12,000, loaded with Lior's sculpts, interesting gameplay, a kind of mysterious pedigree of John Papaduke. I mean, it's got a lot going there for it. Coming from Dutch, who had a hit with Flavowski when they got him made. Like, I think all the pieces are there, and you don't really need to do this, like, you know, kind of goosing us down the road.
    18:32
    Especially because, you know, it's not like this is going to be someone's album drop or a video game drop that's going to cost under $100, right? This is going to be a multi-five-figure game. And so it would help me out, like as a consumer, if I was interested in this game, which I am a little bit, to know, all right, well, like what part of the year is it coming? You know, is this going to be a game that I can look at getting at after a tax refund season? You know, is it going to come with my yearly bonus? Do I have to save up money? If, you know, American Pinball drops, Berrio's Challenge number two, you know, can I go in on that knowing that I'll, you know, expunge all of my saved up pinball budget, you know, like, like kind of help me out here. Let me gauge. You don't have to give me a hard date, but like, is it coming in the fall? What's it going to be? You know, I don't want to like miss out on another opportunity. Something cool comes up on the pin side, you know, sales that was an America's most haunted that just popped up in Pennsylvania. And I was like, Hey, maybe I could go pick up one of those. Get spooky's first game. It has been stadiums in it. Low plays homies only, you know why not you know but then if alice is coming out like but i don't really haven't seen that much of alice maybe they've already shown us the best parts of it you know so i don't know i don't know tell me in the comments tell me on the discord tell me on the email what you guys think um listen to bug hanging out with everybody last night that was super fun man if you have a chance on a thursday night tune into uh twitch to bug scream and stream um check out the gameplay you know leave it on the background make the kids their macaroni and cheese and dino nuggies But then when he gets to the question and answer It's just an open freeform forum What do you want to talk about with the dude that's Running one of the top three pinball manufacturers In the planet right now And we're just talking about Movies like Evil Dead I extolled my love of the movie UHF from Weird Al Yankovic And that spurred on conversation It was just a good time that we were hanging out And it's like every Thursday it seems like So check that out So let's change all of the gears, because I want to talk about Home Pin for a minute. I think it's in Brisbane, Australia in September, which is coming up. Home Pin is supposed to be debuting for what it's worth their Blues Brothers game at a trade show. This one's supposed to be playable. Now, it was at a show in Taiwan and we actually had somebody that was out there that captured some images of this game. Now, it was a non-playing prototype and the details were just all over the place at that point, you know, with, well, it's going to be, it's going to be like open source coding, which is just inviting, you know, problems, you know, and you would turn around and say like open source coding, like officially, I know that happens unofficially, you know, there's, there's a movie and sound upgrades for different games. I've got one, a big Lebowski. It's fantastic. I hear great things about the Jurassic Park one, the Cleland mod for Stranger Things, which I haven't touched, you know, so like, I know those things exist, but they don't require it to go through licensing and make sure that, you know, Sony has signed off on everything and Pepsi signed off on everything and whoever makes the dino nuggies has signed off on it. You know, so to say something is open source, I would think would cause some static between the licensor. And then it turns out that the only license that they had purchased or got the rights to use for Blues Brothers was literally just for the words Blues Brothers, maybe the logo and kind of caricatures of the Dan Aykroyd and Belushi, but like not the music from the movie, not any of the themes or anything from the movie, not even like the movie poster, not even like the lunchbox, all right? And then you look at the game and quickly it came out that, you know, this is just Stern Stars that they've taken and essentially done a re-theme on. And so this has been kind of, you know, imagine like question marks and mathematical problems floating around through everybody's brains as they're trying to wrap around like, who is this for? Who put this idea out there, right? I think I'm coming to terms with it. I'm coming to a place where I'm comfortable with what Home Pin is. This is a game that's supposed to be under $5,000. Look, Home Pin makes toys is what they make. And Mike has said this. He's making pinball machines not for people that are passionate or into or know a thing about pinball. He's making games for blokes that want a pinball machine in their basement or something. And I'm looking around like, dude, that's me. What are you talking about? But here's the thing. They're making a toy. This is somebody that's not looking necessarily for a pinball machine, looking through the forums, looking through the used ads, talking to people, finding out what they want. This is somebody that kind of has it in their head like, oh, I wouldn't mind having something like that in my game room next to my pool table. And then somehow they'll happen across this and say, okay, yeah, we'll go for it. So this is like the SkyMall catalog that used to be on the jet airliners, right? The amateur Schlemmers, the mail order catalogs, where you're not really shopping for anything in particular except a way to waste time, and you've got some extra money, right? Oh, look, here's a disposable ice rink for my front yard. Yeah, I think the kids would love to have that. Ooh, look at this heated towel rack, and it doesn't even mount into anything. You just plug it on in. Fantastic. Like, just stupid crap like that. The sharper image, right? So HomePen is making pinball machines that would be featured in the sharper image, not even at Costco. Like this would be like Throw it at the Think Geek or something You know you kind of Bozoing around You know when you loafers on the way to Banana Republic and you happen across this thing and you like oh what a lark Let put this in the home area And then if you play it, I mean, it's Starz, so it probably plays okay, right? So, okay, it's a toy. I like having pinball machines because of the fact that, I mean, I like pinball, I like the gameplay, I like the lights, but I like having a commercial-grade machine in my home. This is like the thing that only lived at arcades, right? You had to be lucky, get good grades, sneak out of the house or something to get down there to be able to play these things. And it's like, damn it, if I could ever get one of those in my house, how awesome would that be? Now, how would it feel if you did get a pinball machine in your house, but it wasn't that commercial quality machine that you could also put out in a pizza place? It didn't have a pedigree of coming from somewhere where people had enjoyed it, and now you have it, right? It was just like the consumer grade budget version. It would feel like an arcade one-up machine, fine for what it is, but it's not that same exact game. Imagine if I was 14 years old and I had a Mortal Kombat 2 machine that I was playing down at the Quickie Mart with whatever change I could scrounge around after school and spend my afternoon playing Mortal Kombat 2. Imagine me at that time if I had that full actual game. Now, when it came out for the Super Nintendo, I went ahead and got it. It was super amazing to be able to actually have that gameplay at home, but it wasn't like the machine right so like that's for me that's like 50 of the allures like yeah this game plays great you know yeah jack danger designed it he's fantastic but like this is the commercial machine there's a coin slot on here like this is the real deal that's what i want and that's what home pin is not so we give home pin a lot of crap and hard times probably deserved, but it's not even in the same category or league, really. So it's not like, you know, should I buy Ninja Eclipse or should I buy Blues Brothers? It's like, those are two different things, right? Those are completely two different things. And so now I'm like, all of a sudden, okay, fine. I'll go play it if it shows up, just like I went and played those At Games pinball machines with the horrible delay that were at Expo. And I'll pass on and I won't buy it, But, you know, if someone wants to get one, okay, you know, it's in that category. It's just totally different, right? It's totally different. You know, it compares more to, like, a piece of furniture or a sofa than it does to a commercial-grade integrated circuit pinball machine. So that's kind of, like, where I'm at here in the whole HomePin situation. So that's good. Let's check email. I've carefully set aside this time for checking my email. Randy emailed me. Thank you, buddy. I must have missed this. It came a couple days ago. The guy sent me a link to a YouTube video. That's all I got was a YouTube link. And so whenever I get just a blank YouTube link in my email, I click that with a quickness. What the heck? It might be inappropriate, right? And so this is what I got. This is what I got here.
    26:56
    I got a Princess Bride trailer. And it was a Princess Bride pinball trailer, but not the Multimorphic game. So my interest was Immediately peaked with this Alright I'm going to talk about this And we'll play the rest of it Alright so Zen Pinball Has a virtual pinball table For Princess Bride Oh it looks sweet It looks really good It's got the extra overlay of, like, the 3D graphics. So, you know, not a strictly traditional one-to-one remake of a pinball machine. But this will be coming out for home systems, right, probably on Steam, Xbox, PS5, I think we're up to. And it's dropping August 29th. So, like, I love this. Like, this thing's revealed, and it's going to be out in a couple of days. And I'm going to go find it. It'll be for pinball effects is what they call their program. So you download pinball effects. And then I think the way it works is you pay per table or per pack of tables, and sometimes they have deals and things. And then you can play this thing virtually on your huge 85-inch screen TV that, you know, we all have downstairs. This thing looks cool. Gameplay-wise, right, it's kind of similar in scope to the Multimorphic machine. Multimorphic, of course, has all the mechanistic things in the back third and then that big screen. I think this has about an equivalent level of stuff as far as like mechanisms and interesting shots, but it's more dispersed like a regular traditional machine where there's like a bottom third, a middle third, and a top third. It's all kind of evenly spread around. There's some cool little graphical touches and things. There's a little mini play field with a Humperdink drop target that moves back and forth almost like the shark fin on Jaws. It's kind of cool. He's got some stand-up targets behind him, so like at some point there'll be a battle with Humperdink, and there's two flippers up there in the upper play field, so you get a little mini battle up there. About midway through this trailer, there's about 10 drop-up targets that pop up from the middle of the play field in almost like a bowling alley, and they're all soldiers, right, like guarding the portcullis, right, as they're about to storm the castle. And then you can, you know, what a cool idea to have like 10 stand-up targets of like little soldier guys just pop up, and you've got to knock them all down. Like that would be fun to see in an actual machine, but like mechanistically it costs a lot of money to put 10 individually controlled drop targets in. But dude, that was super cool So I'm looking forward to playing me Some Princess Bride pinball at home Who knew? And without buying a multi-morphic machine I've been warming up to multi-morphic So folks out in Texas Don't get super mad at me I'm getting around to the point That I want to play more of this I think Final Resistance And putting some time on it at the pinball lounge Was really what kind of turned me over Into like, you know what, this is actually I think I'm seeing what this thing brings, how it's integrated and how it could be fun maybe it was because Final Resistance is a little more simpler at least gameplay wise, there's only two flippers down at the bottom all the shots are up there there's not a big moving screen of a bunch of weird stuff to do, it just shows the play field so it was like, okay, I can wrap my head around the gameplay, I know what I'm doing it's not just kind of throwing assets for the sake of just assets, it's actually like just thought through gameplay and if an asset or a graphic elevates the gameplay and serves it well, it's put in there. But it's not just splashy effects because, hey, we've got this screen, we've got to do something with it. I think I like that. And I think Princess Bride integrates that a little bit better than what I've seen with like Weird Al and then on and down with Lexi Lightspeed and stuff. Heist is still a cool game, but it doesn't really do a lot for me theme-wise. But if I had a Molden Morphic, I'd probably pick one of those up. So I got a conscious eye on them. But Princess Bride, this is a standalone title. It goes for the Pinball FX platform. You can go ahead and download it and then get in on that. That looks super cool, man. I mean, thanks for sending it on. All you have to do is get in, break up the wedding, steal the princess, and make her escape.
    31:08
    As you wish. My name is Inigo Montoya. Prepare to die. Love it. The Princess Bride Pinball. PS5, PS4, Xbox, Epic Games, Steam, Nintendo Switch. Oh, dude, I'm going to get Princess Bride for my Switch. So when I'm on the road, this is like something I could play. That's totally cool, man. Any extra Easter eggs here at the end of this video?
    31:30
    No, that was it. That was it. All right, so check that out. It's up on the YouTubes. But, yeah, that was fun. Randy, thanks for sending me that email, homie. That was super cool of you. Okay, we did an interview, we being the singular me, Don's Pinball Podcast, with Trent Kennedy from Interactive Pinball. The website is interactivepinball.com. This is a guy that makes amazing pinball mods. He's a mechanical engineer by trade. I love these guys because they do what I wish I could do. I've got a 3D printer. I've got slicer software, 3D modeling, and I'm doing my level best to make some halfway decent stuff. And these guys just, they're functioning at the S tier level, right? So Trent Kennedy did the Rick and Morty jerry ramp that I installed on my Rick and Morty machine. Makes just another way to get to that portal shot. Fixes some of the alignment issues with that upper ball path. and it's just super fun for like around $189.
    32:21
    He's added ramps to games that didn't have ramps before, particularly on the Pro. So there's a ramp for Led Zeppelin.
    32:28
    What do you call that, the Traveler ramp or the Hobo ramp? What do you call a guy that lives out in the woods by himself? Not me, but like somebody else. Anyway, it's like that ramp. There's a couple of them you put in for Avengers Pro, so it replicates a little bit more of that activity that you get on the Premium. and I think there's one for Rush too. So that middle area where on the Pro, which is a stand-up target, the ball comes back at you, but on the Premium LE, there's a Vuck into a wire form. So he added that wire form for Rush Pro. So like super cool stuff he's doing and in a way that it doesn't like nerf the game, you know, or like make it way too easy. It just adds in some complexity, you know, so if you have a Pro and you want more gameplay and more mechanistically interesting things going on, of course, he's got it. Now, this is a guy that also finally brought the ball-eating jaws mechanism to the public on the Pro and the Premium. So we have a really good conversation here regarding his newest mod, which is a gun shooter, ostensibly for John Wick, but really for any mod in a certain game. And it also worked for, like, Deadpool. It worked for Bond. Like, anything where you want a gun shooter. Now, we get into a little bit of this, but it's not strictly just like we've seen before with Indiana Jones, where you squeeze a trigger, ball launches. This thing has three mechanisms in it where it does function as a physical ball plunger by racking the slide on the top over the receiver. Also, it's wired in with the launch button so you can actually pull the trigger of the gun and auto-launch a ball. And then the clip even comes out, and you can hide stuff in there for storage like the key to your game and stuff. It's fantastic. So let's get into that right now.
    34:04
    All right, back again with Mr. Trent Kennedy. How you doing, sir? How's British Columbia? How are sales? How's interactive pinball?
    34:12
    It's gorgeous up here in D.C. Sales are going well, and yeah, interactive pinball is just running away. Yeah. So obviously you've come up with yet another good idea. I know it's a great idea because I had something similar, but I did not accomplish and put it through as good as yours did there. Was this an idea that you had before John Wick and the gun controversy, or did that kind of spur it on? I kind of had this idea back when I made a portal plunger for Rick and Morty a long time ago and I was just kind of looking at all the different machines that could potentially have a similar edition as that and then I was thinking about the gun and how the slide action can work and I was like that could be the plunger and then the trigger could shoot the ball as well so this was like an idea I had I don't know before I was even really making mods. And then when John Wick came out, it kind of reignited that, I guess, idea. You're like, okay, the time for this is now. I saw that Rick and Morty launcher, and Rick and Morty just uses an auto launcher anyway. So you made the portal gun that was activated by the trigger, right? Yeah, the thumb button on that one. And, I mean, we've seen guns launching balls in games going back to antiquity, but it was always like an auto launcher function. You know, the gun's at 45 degrees, you pull the trigger, and boom, it launches. But this was actually where you could pull the slide back and use that as an actual plunger, like a physical plunge mechanism, which is what was awesome. I had, you know, of course, a similar idea. I was able to model it. The trick though was getting everything to be nice and lined up and that what I couldn do consistently you know like for a customer or something But you seem to have taken care of that because you actually send the mounting plate and the whole assembly ready to go with this mod Yeah, it's a full assembly ready to install. Try to make the install as simple as possible for this launch drum. So you should be able to do it within 15 minutes, I think. Okay. And then, I guess it sounds like since you already had that portal gun launcher ready to go, did you reuse the similar circuitry? no the that one had a button on rick and morty so i actually used the existing button that was in the um the back end of the launch button and integrated that into the portal plunger whereas this i needed to add an actual switch into the gun handle itself and include that wiring that'll attach to the center button with machines with the center button and then if your machine doesn't have a center button, you can hook it up to your right flipper and then turn on the setting to auto launch with the right flipper. So then your trigger is essentially your right flipper button. I see. Perfect. Yeah. Like I'm in awe of this thing. Like as soon as I saw it, I was like, all right, yeah, this guy is definitely next level. You know, I, of course I got one of the John Wick guns. You can find the, the files online. I bought it from an artist there and just kind of cut theirs up. But you modeled this thing yourself. yeah yeah this one's modeled from scratch i did uh download a similar gun just to kind of have some reference for sizes and such but uh yeah yeah it turned out pretty good i'm happy with it feels really really nice in the hand it's not at the 45 like guns that you've seen on previous pinball machines but it's still if you're stepping back it's pretty comfortable to grab the grip yeah man i can't wait to see this one in person i know you did the uh the the rick and morty ramp mod that I had. I love that one. You've done a lot of other extra ramps to games and things, too. I like what you're able to do to switch up the gameplay. You gave premium functionality to Rush and to Avengers Infinity Quest, too. Yeah, I did one for Led Zeppelin as well. I've got a hermit wrap, I call it. I did see that. Yeah, that's good. That's a fun time. So, this thing not only functions just like the regular shooter route by pulling the slide back, you can also use the auto launcher function. And then you've got a third functionality built into this thing. What is this, like a hidden stash container? Yeah, so the mag, it's not the same size as a gun mag. It's a little shorter because of the switch location in there, but it's big enough to fit a standard size Bic lighter. I did that for reference. I thought that would be pretty funny to fit a lighter in the mag, so I did that. I like the idea that you can take the coin box key and just keep it right in there. That's so cool. I always leave them in the front of the machine or in the coin return, but it's nicer to have it in an actual spot. That's so cool. I was watching your video, and I'm like, okay, cool. You rack the slide, shoot the ball. Oh, he's got the functionality with the trigger, too. And then when you drop the magazine, the little hidden storage container, I'm like, boom, chef's kiss, man. That's going to put this thing up over the top. That was actually pretty difficult to model in and make that work well.
    38:58
    I've been tinkering. I can definitely appreciate it because, yeah, this stuff's not easy, especially not to get it working as good as you do so that's awesome so are these in production now? are you shipping them? yeah I'm shipping them I'm able to keep up with shipping so there's no wait right now which is good I had a lot made before I dropped it which I haven't done before but there's quite a few people complaining about having to pre-order mods I know that's kind of the standard so with this one I kind of wanted to get away with that get away from that yeah it's been working out well Man, attention pinball companies, right? You know, if you could just go ahead and get something ready to ship when you launch something, that's just so satisfying, you know, because I see it, I want it, here's my money, where's my toy prize, right? And you got it ready to go.
    39:44
    So that's awesome. So these, I saw that they're on the website. People can just order through interactivepinball.com? Yes, yeah. And I saw you got the rest of your mods and everything that are available up there too. This is $249.99?
    39:56
    Yes. Is that U.S. or is that Canadian? U.S. Oh, okay. All right, perfect. And then, yeah, short wait. Go ahead and jump on it and get it. That's awesome.
    40:05
    Yeah. Now, as far as the install, I didn't see, like, an install video or anything, but this comes already mounted to the stern shooter plate, so you shouldn't have to mess around with that at all. So it should just be a matter of, you know, just removing the three screws that hold that in place and put in the other one. Or would you have to remove the red screws, too?
    40:22
    You need to remove the inner. No, those can stay. The red screws that hold that plate should stay. The backer plate on the inside. Those do need to come out because I include a new plate that has a hole drilled through it with a grommet. So you need to install my backing plate and then put the wire through the extra hole and then mount the gun. And then there's a T-splicer that you put on the end of the wire and then clip that into the wiring, either on the center button or the right flipper. Okay, all right. Now, once you get it set up in there, is there any kind of fine-tuning you have to do to get this thing aligned? Or can you use, like, kind of the pre-existing, those red screws that line up the plate? The red screws will work, yeah. Okay, all right. So that takes a lot of the headache out of it, just use your pre-existing holes. I usually just reinstall, or in the instructions, you reinstall the red screws first, and then you get your three screws from the backing plate into the mounting plate of the gun shooter assembly, and then you can straighten it up and then tighten those three screws. Perfect. Yeah, I've seen some people already have this in hand. I saw them pose in some photos. Everybody's excited about it because, I mean, this is a great tool. Oh, good. I haven't seen those. I think Retro Ralph is showing it off, and I think Kerry's going to be talking about it, so that's awesome. Okay. So we should see, I'm sure we'll get some detailed YouTube install videos here soon. Great. Yeah. And then, so, really, I mean, you know, it came out in the age of WIC, but any game with, you know, a center shooter button or, you know, shooting auto-launching for the right flipper, you can put this in there, right? It actually, yeah, it should work all the way back to early data use games.
    41:58
    Yeah. So any Stern, Sega, or Data East with a regular plunger, it will work with that, as long as it's got the right flipper launch button option in the menu. All right, Deadpool fans, Bond fans. Yeah, and I am going to test it out in Pulp Fiction. Ooh. Yeah, so I think, from what I've tested, I believe they're the same as Williams plungers, which are about a quarter inch longer. so if I could just include a little plug for the inside of the rubber shooter tip and then it's the same length as a Williams one but I don't know if the Chicago Gaming Company is the same length I'm looking over my Pulp Fiction right now just wondering how that would look there do you have any I kind of was inspired by the Desert Eagle Deadpool's guns with the model for this they use that in a couple scenes in Pulp Fiction I mean sure yeah what better of an iconic grip to have sticking off your game I like how you made it too so the gun's only about as far as front to back or X dimension it's only about half the length of a real full size barrel so it's not going to be sticking out as far as what I was trying to do I had like a full size gun stuck to the shooter plate that's a little long yeah the ridiculousness was part of it but yeah Yeah, it's 6.5 and a half inches.
    43:26
    Okay, and I see that it comes black. Is there a different color with the handle there that's on there?
    43:33
    I'm just doing black. Yeah, just black. All right, perfect. And for those 3D modelers out there, 3D printers out there, is this a PLA? Is this ABS? What are you printing with? What material? It's a PLA metal.
    43:47
    It's called metal. It just kind of has more of a metal effect. I went with that just because the cosmetics are really nice and not material. And then the handle and the trigger and the sight are black, same with the mag. So it's all black, but there's two different colors of black. Perfect. Man, I really love how your mind works. You know, like we had Jaws come out, and there was that Jaws, you know, Shark Eat Ball controversy, and then here you are with a mod that works. I had it in my premium, loved it. I've since sold my Jaws. It's out on location at the 1UP Lounge in Billingham, Washington, and they're loving it. Even their pro players that come by that are kind of finicky, they were loving it too. So there's some good feedback for you. Yeah, yeah. Awesome. We were sitting there. We had a tournament for the unveiling, and then we were all kind of watching this one guy that's the top dude there, and we were just kind of giggling like, Mikey, Mikey likes it. He likes it. Look at this. The Guild Life cereal commercial. So that was awesome. And then we get the John Wick and the gun controversy, right? John Wick doesn't eat the bullet. And then, boom, here you are again. So, fantastic.
    44:51
    I can't wait to see what you're cooking up with next year. Yeah. Trying to take a little bit of a break, but we'll see. Yeah. Now, tell me, what's your background again? Were you a mechanical engineer? Do you design these things? Yeah, I'm a mechanical engineer. So, I design, assemble, and ship all of the items I sell. So, this has to be, like, second nature. I'm out here on the struggle bus just trying to learn all this.
    45:14
    Yeah. Yeah, I enjoyed it. I do a lot of my work, and this is just like a fun, creative outlook for me. So, yeah, I really, I mean, pinball sucked me in real hard. Same. Sounds like for you, so. Oh, for sure. Yeah. I love it. I haven't reached the bottom of the hole yet, man.
    45:31
    All right. Me neither. So, you got any ideas out there floating for Alice in Wonderland? I know we haven't seen the play field or anything there, but you going to have like some rabbit ear plungers or something we can have?
    45:41
    No. Nothing planned for Alice. Yeah. All right. Perfect. So these are in production now. They're $249.99. Interactivefinball.com is where you order them. If I put in the order today, what's the turnaround time, do you think?
    45:56
    I'm going to do another shipment probably tomorrow. Oh, so, yeah. No wait, man. Come on. Jump on this line right now.
    46:05
    Yeah. Well, great. Anything else you want to mention real quick? I'm going to be at Expo. Oh, perfect. Yeah. I'm excited for that. I've finalized that. I'll be down there.
    46:19
    Rob Burke and I are discussing. I might do a presentation as well. Yeah, that'd be awesome. You're going to have some of your mods to demo there too? Yeah, I'm going to bring border-dependent a bunch of stock, so I'll have availability at the expo. Oh, dude. All right, so if you want to kind of wait and see and get your hands on it first, that sounds like a cool way to do it. I can't wait, man. I'm excited. I like the stuff you make. I had the Jerry Ram. I had the Sharky Ball. I've got to get myself a gun now at this point.
    46:49
    Yeah, we'll be at Expo. All right. Well, thanks so much, man. Awesome. Thanks, John. Trent, thanks as always for spending a little bit of time with us and letting us delve into your brain a bit. And also, these things are available right now on interactivepinball.com. $249.99, I think, is what USD is, what that will get you. And there will also be some at Expo. He may even have some customization possibilities available at Expo as well. So that's coming up in October. We are on the road to Expo, everybody. It's around the corner. We're going to see some drops and things. So is that Stern teaser here yet?
    47:27
    I certainly don't see it, but when it does drop, I'll be kicking back. And when it does, we'll talk about it because that's what we do here on the Pincast. I'm Don. You can email me at donspinballpodcast at gmail.com. Follow me on the Discord. Follow me on YouTube. we have a Facebook page that's pretty raucous so check that out I'm gonna go play some pinball don't know about you but yeah let's go flip some balls later