Episode 1105: "Calm Before Predator Storm & Harry Potter's AI Art Issue"

Kaneda's Pinball Podcast (Patreon feed)·podcast_episode·23m 51s·analyzed·Jun 18, 2025

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.036

TL;DR

Predator launch, Dune struggles, Harry Potter AI art controversy, and industry criticism on hype and manufacturing.

Summary

Host Kaneda discusses the impending Predator Pinball reveal by Pinball Brothers, expresses skepticism about Dune Pinball's sales trajectory and streaming strategy, analyzes controversy over AI-generated artwork in Jersey Jack's Harry Potter game, critiques pinball content creator integrity and disclosure practices, and speculates on upcoming Stern releases (Jaws 50th, Star Wars Episode I-III, X-Men code updates) and Dutch Pinball's manufacturing capacity constraints.

Key Claims

Dune Pinball has sold between 200-300 units out of 1,000 planned production run since launch
medium confidence · Kaneda's own estimate on live stream; acknowledges uncertainty and difficulty in getting truthful sales numbers from manufacturers
Pinball streaming is ineffective as a sales tactic and takes FOMO out of purchasing decisions
high confidence · Kaneda's repeated assertion that streaming is 'lackluster' and 'one of the worst sales tactics there can be'
Jersey Jack's Harry Potter features AI-generated or AI-filtered artwork with visible artifacts (malformed eyes, castle windows through trees, locomotive distortions)
medium confidence · Community observation noted in thread; Kaneda acknowledges evidence but concedes JJP may not have known and that WB approved all artwork
Predator Pinball will outsell Dune Pinball due to nostalgic appeal of the IP despite lacking Arnold Schwarzenegger
medium confidence · Kaneda's direct prediction: 'Even without Arnold, pinball brothers will sell more predator machines than barrels of will sell of Dune Pinball simply because of nostalgic love affair for the property'
King Kong sales have 'flatlined' and the game lacks sufficient appeal to drive current demand
medium confidence · Kaneda's assessment citing quality issues (Kong arms falling off) and the need for third-party mods to fix design flaws
Stern Pinball took down Jack Danger's post about new X-Men code 'coming soon' due to expectation management issues around the vague timeline
low confidence · Kaneda's speculation on why the post was removed; no confirmation from official sources
Dutch Pinball manufactures only 10-20 games per week and has produced one game in 12 years, raising concerns about Back to the Future fulfillment capacity
medium confidence · Kaneda's estimate: 'I think it's like 10 games a week' and reference to Alice's slow production timeline as evidence of manufacturing constraints
Most pinball content creators receive perks (wholesale pricing, free machines) without transparent disclosure and flip games quickly for profit

Notable Quotes

“Even without Arnold, pinball brothers will sell more predator machines than barrels of will sell of Dune Pinball simply because of nostalgic love affair for the property.”
Kaneda @ ~27:20 — Core prediction about relative commercial success of competing games; explicitly declares confidence in Pinball Brothers over Barrels of Fun
“Watching someone play pinball is not exciting. I think it's one of the worst sales tactics there can be.”
Kaneda @ ~10:30 — Challenges conventional industry wisdom on streaming as marketing; reflects broader skepticism about content strategy effectiveness
“For $13,000, I have to now go buy a bracket from a dude who's making them? Really, for $13,000, Stern hasn't fixed it yet?”
Kaneda @ ~36:50 — Articulates frustration with King Kong quality issues and Stern's failure to address design flaws in premium-priced product
“The people that annoy me the most are not the so-called stern army... the JJP shills that have been saying this game is perfect out of the box.”
Kaneda @ ~20:45 — Critiques fanboy culture and calls for constructive feedback; indicates community tension between critics and loyalists
“I would have taken the long payout. I would have said, look, we'll do the deal. I want 500 bucks per game sold. And I would have taken a plane to the Caribbean and sat on a beach and collect checks for the next five years.”
Kaneda @ ~48:30 — Hypothetical reframing of Back to the Future licensing deal; underscores belief that Dutch Pinball negotiated poorly
“One game in 12 years. You are not a manufacturing company. You've made one game in 12 years.”
Kaneda @ ~50:00 — Directly challenges Dutch Pinball's ability to handle Back to the Future orders; questions their core competency
“If I treat people like I did last night, if I treat people to dinner, I don't mind it if they say, hey, Chris took me out to dinner. Doesn't make them love me any lesser anymore.”
Kaneda — Defends relationship-building and transparency about perks; suggests industry should normalize disclosure of manufacturer support

Entities

Kanedaperson Pinball Brotherscompany Barrels of Funcompany Jersey Jack PinballcompanyStern PinballcompanyDutch Pinballcompany

Signals

?
product_launch: Predator Pinball official reveal scheduled for same day as podcast recording (3-6 hours after episode starts); marks end of extended teaser campaign that community found frustrating
high · 'Predator, it's coming. It's coming. It's going to be out in like what? like three hours, six hours.'
?
product_concern: Dune Pinball estimated at only 200-300 units sold (of 1,000 planned) one month after launch; slow sales attributed to weak theme appeal in core demographic
medium · Kaneda's personal estimate; acknowledgment that actual numbers are hard to verify; no one unboxing the game despite new release status
$
market_signal: Secondary market pricing for games expected to decline when new competing titles launch (e.g., Jaws 50th affecting Kong LE pricing); purchasing strategy shifting toward waiting for premium/pro tier releases rather than immediate LE buys
medium · 'If Jaws 50th comes out in two days... then what's going to happen to all those Jaws, L.E.'s. They're going to go down. Everything's going down.'
~
sentiment_shift: Growing community skepticism toward pinball content creators' transparency; criticism that 95% operate on wholesale perks without disclosure and flip games quickly for profit; calls for normalized disclosure of sponsor relationships
high · Extended segment on content creator ethics; Kaneda criticizing flip-and-sell behavior ('It's the greatest game ever... A week later, it's up for sale for $3,000 less')
?
regulatory_signal: Harry Potter artwork potentially contains AI-generated or AI-filtered elements; community flagging malformed features (dragon eyes, castle windows, locomotive); Warner Bros. approved final artwork, limiting recourse for JJP

Topics

Predator Pinball launch and hype managementprimaryDune Pinball sales performance and streaming as marketingprimaryHarry Potter AI artwork controversyprimaryContent creator integrity and disclosure of perks/sponsorshipsprimaryKing Kong sales decline and quality issuessecondaryDutch Pinball manufacturing capacity and Back to the Future viabilitysecondaryStern Pinball upcoming releases (Jaws 50th, Star Wars, X-Men code)secondaryTheme IP selection and nostalgic appeal in pinball demographicssecondary

Sentiment

negative(-0.65)— Kaneda is critical and skeptical throughout, particularly regarding Dune's weak sales prospects, pinball streaming ineffectiveness, content creator ethics, King Kong's design failures, and Dutch Pinball's manufacturing constraints. However, he expresses measured optimism about Jersey Jack's responsiveness to Harry Potter feedback and Stern's ability to fix X-Men code. Tone is frustrated with industry trends (FOMO marketing, unaccountable content creators, theme mismatches) but not antagonistic toward specific manufacturers beyond constructive critique.

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.072

Cause there ain't no party like the pre-party, after the party's the after-party, it's the parking lot party! I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, I said. Welcome to Canada's Pinball Podcast, live on YouTube, because we all thought that Jengiz meant 9am was gonna be when the Pinball Brothers finally revealed Predator Pinball to the world. We're all tired of the teasers. No, Jeng is we're not tired of you. We are tired of the slow rollout of this game. And today is finally going to be the day where all the questions are answered. Is Predator Pinball going to be worth it? Are we finally going to see a game that has interactive mechs? We know Arnold is not in the game, but that Gatling gun is pretty cool. I don't think it fires any pinballs, but it's got some cool Gatling gun action. we've got a lot of drama brewing over in the Harry Potter thread because of artificial intelligence was AI used to generate the artwork on Harry Potter something's going on there right John Youssi it I see it there's a dragon with like two eyes on one side the crest is a little weird the locomotive is all over the place the castle's got all weird stuff going on there's like windows coming through trees what happened with the filtering of the artwork on this game we're going to talk about that we're going to talk a little bit about King Kong is that game going to have some sort of second life because I think sales have pretty much flatlined on that machine Dune Pinball has a new mode out there rescue mode I want to talk about if barrels of fun can actually get people excited again about this game and if pinball streams are the way to go because I just have to be candid you ever see like a pinball stream and it's like a dude he's in a dark room and one camera's on him one's on the play field one's on the screen of the game and it's all happening at once and it is the worst way I believe to experience a pinball machine what you really just want is someone to shoot it in a way that gets you excited and you to be focused on the thing they want you to be focused on. Let's just start there for a minute. So like if you're Barrels of Fun and you're seeing all these games selling right now around you, and how many do you think, I'm on a live audience right now on YouTube, I'll see what these guys think, but how many Dune examples. Do you think Barrels of Fun has sold after the game being out for a month? I want to see what some people say. It's kind of fun doing it in a live audience like this because they can see that Kaneda doesn't need much editing. He's got no show notes. How many examples of Dune Pinball do you think Barrels of Fun has sold? I think they said they're going to make 1,000 in total. Wasn't that the number? Because it wasn't 1,100. I think it's 1,000 examples of Dune Pinball. And so how many do you think were sold since the day the game was revealed? Because I've got a number in my head. I don't know. I could probably just ask David. I'm not sure anybody will tell the truth. But since the game's been revealed, there's been a lot of other games, right? It revealed right on top of King Kong. You've got Predator coming out today. You've got Harry Potter, which is going to take the majority of pinball sales. You've had Portal that nobody really bought. Owen thinks they sold 500 Dunes already. Owen, that's a very optimistic number. I don't think they sold out of half of them already. I would say Dune is probably sold between two to 300 out of a thousand. Have you seen anybody unbox the game? That's the big issue. And so now the strategy, the only strategy left to move these games, because you only get one chance to make a first impression. The only strategy left now is to stream the game. And I just feel like streaming the game always, And I mean, is always takes some of the FOMO out of wanting to own it. It's kind of like John Youssi everything. And if Carl's going to go through all the modes of the game and John Youssi it, is it going to make you want one? And again, because pinball streaming is so lackluster just to begin with, it's literally not exciting. Like, I don't know any other way to say it. Like watching someone play pinball is not exciting. I think it's one of the worst sales tactics there can be. Now, look, you always want a little bit of gameplay before you order a game. But I believe one thing now with where we're at in pinball, I believe in one thing now is the only thing you need before you order a game. You yourself have to walk in front of the machine and fall in love with it to pay these kinds of prices. Because remember, Dune fully loaded is somewhere around like $13,000 plus. With the topper, it's going to be like $14,000. And so, yeah, you got to play it yourself. The days of needing to order these games right away on week one in the first month are over. So everyone needs to go find a Dune and play it. Now, that's problematic because most people don't have access to a Dune machine. I don't even have one over at Automated, and he carries barrels of fun machines. I should ask Mike when he going to get it but I think it going to be a very very slow burn for this game And the big issue surrounding Dune just hovering over it is this You don care about the theme And because you don't care about the theme, you seeing more moments from the movie make their way into the game isn't going to do anything for you. Whereas when John Youssi clips from the Predator movie you love, that's going to do something to you. When John Youssi more Harry Potter movie scenes coming to life, that's going to do something for you. And I think that's the big difference. I just worry that this theme, much like Labyrinth, I think even more so than Labyrinth because people had nostalgic love for Labyrinth. Nobody in this demographic has a nostalgic love affair with this theme. And so I'm hoping that David understands that now. And the next titles coming out from him connect more with the pinball buying demographic. And I think that's going to be important. I'm going to say this right now. Even without Arnold, pinball brothers will sell more predator machines than barrels of will sell of Dune Pinball simply because of nostalgic love affair for the property. Okay. I mean that. All right. What did someone say? Like that Predator is $19,500 in Australia. Look, if you're in Australia and you're buying pinball machines in 2025, you just have to be loaded, like loaded. Like how can you guys drop this much on these games? I've always said this. it's cheaper to simply buy an airplane ticket and go to these pinball shows and get your fill versus 20 grand for one game. I mean, at least in your market, though, the games kind of hold value because you're always going to have more demand than supply in Australia. All right, let's talk about Harry Potter and the sorcerer's artificial intelligence artistic layout mode of the game. No. So everyone is now seeing what seems to be some clear evidence that the artwork on Harry Potter was using some sort of filter, whether it was an AI filter or some other filter. There is some weird stuff going on. There is weird stuff going on on the castle, on the train, on the hands. Like throughout this game, you can notice some things that look like they were manipulated by some computer program. And so I don't think the folks at Jersey Jack knew this happened or was happening. I think they just saw it at face value. It looks really good when you first glance at art like this. And that's the thing with AI art. It always looks really good. But then when you sort of look closer at it, a lot of weird stuff is happening. I feel bad for Jersey Jack if that is the case. Do they need to redo the artwork? Will this create a delay for them? I don't think they're really going to change it at this point. But who knows, right? If Warner Brothers catches wind of this and someone flags it for them, they might be forced to go back and fix some of this stuff. But also remember, Warner Brothers approved all of this. It's not like they didn't see it. It's not like they didn't go over it with a magnifying glass. Like they had every opportunity to make changes. Someone pointed out that the dragon with like two eyes on its left side, they filled in one of the eyes. So that's like maybe people are like, oh, they must have caught this and made a slight correction to it. I just want to say this. I was talking to Brett yesterday, Brett Abbas, and they know what people are saying about the game and not just the artwork. I didn't ask about the artwork, but they know that there's work to be done, that they need to wake up the connection between the movies people love and the pinball experience. And they are working on it. And I just want to say to everybody out there, let's let them bake on it. Right. Let's let them fix the things they know need to be fixed on the game. They're going to focus on this game for the next year. And I do think they're going to fix the problems. And I feel good that they know and are listening to the feedback. But I just want to say this. The people that annoy me the most are not the so-called stern army that's being blamed for pointing out the AI artwork. I don't believe in that. The people that annoy me the most are the JJP shills that have been saying this game is perfect out of the box. You know who they are and you know what they've been saying. And to those people, if the world operated on feedback from people like that, nothing would ever get better ever. And I'm just tired of when people are trying to give constructive feedback, myself included. We get attacked by these like happy go lucky shills who are telling us to shut up, that we're ragging on the game. And I'm like, you haven't even listened to my shows. I'm not ragging on Harry Potter. I'm giving a balanced feedback on the game and the things that I want to see improved. I think we'll make this game maybe a masterpiece. So should I bury my feedback? Should I just tow the company line, order two, one for each of my houses and say that everybody else has no taste? Like I just don think that a very constructive way to look at this game So look they know what needs to happen Stern Pinball knows what needs to happen with X Now Jack Danger put up a post that said they working on new X code coming soon And then he took the post down. Now, people are speculating, why is it removed? And I think it's because of the word soon. What does soon mean in the world of pinball? Does that mean in July? Does it mean by the fall? Is it sometime this year? And I think that's why they took it down, because now you're going to have all these people expecting something soon. And as soon two weeks, who knows in the world of pinball? Now, I really hope this game gets fixed as well. It's a great shooting game. It's a beautiful game. I think it's one of Stern's nicest games they've ever launched. I think it looks much nicer than King Kong. I actually find it to be a more interesting game to shoot than King Kong. And so I hope the code on X-Men gets to a good place. That's what we all should want. We all should be rooting for these companies every time they release a game to make a great game. Now, what we shouldn't do, which is what 95% of pinball content creators are today, we shouldn't just say everything that comes out is awesome. Everything that comes out, I'm going to buy it. Everything that comes out is great. I'm going to review it. It's awesome. They did a great job. And then I sell it like a week later. Like that literally is the vibe of so many pinball content creators. It's the greatest game ever. I just ordered an LE and it's never leaving my home. A week later, it's up for sale for $3,000 less. They probably paid the wholesale price on the game. I love it. We've got now the content creators now are letting us know if they paid in full for the product or they paid out of their own money for that. Look, I get it, gang. Take the perks if you get them. If you get the perks, just let us know you got the hookup. Okay. If I treat people like I did last night, if I treat people to dinner, I, you know, I don't mind it if they say, hey, Chris took me out to dinner. Doesn't make them love me any lesser anymore. It probably makes them love me a little bit more. Guy like Kaneda, right? I got to buy my friends. You know how I roll through this world. I'm just joking. Am I? Maybe not. Brenda, what do you think? She's upstairs. She can confirm yes or no. Have I had, have I had to use the almighty dollar to make people like me? I don't think so. I think if I was broke and I was on an island and all I had was a mic, I'd be dropping this heat every week for you guys. And you'd still subscribe to Canada's pinball podcast. Everybody comes back. We lose people every month. You know, the same people that cancel always come back because where are they going to go? Where are they going to go? All right. So is King Kong dead? Is there like a second life for King Kong or is it over? My thing on Kong is this. It's just not enough. It's just not enough to excite people. I get it shoots great. There's just something about the unlicensed Kong. There's something about the art all looking the same. There's just something about this game. The quality is not great. Kong's arms are falling off. You've got to buy some dude's mod so the Vuck doesn't shake. Really, for $13,000, I have to now go buy a bracket from a dude who's making them? Really, for $13,000, Stern hasn't fixed it yet? And I'm just saying, I'm just saying, I don't know. I just feel like Kong isn't enough to want it right now. Because I also think everyone's just so much smarter now is you know if you really want a Kong, the code's not done, you wait six months, Kong LE is 10, Kong Premium 7,500, and a Kong Pro is five. Like that's the way it's all going. If Jaws 50th comes out in two days, I don't know. I haven't heard anything. Like I haven't heard a scheduled meeting with distros. I kind of feel like it's not happening. But if it does happen and Jaws 50th comes out, then what's going to happen to all those Jaws, L.E.'s. They're going to go down. Everything's going down. Everything's headed south. It's fine. That's why you should buy games you love. You should buy games you love. Brenda's trying to give me coffee right now. We're live, baby. 60 people. 60 people. I hope you're all subscribers. If you're a subscriber, you get to see now how Kaneda does the show live. All right. So we've got Kong. The next game might be Jaws 50th. Then we've got John Borg, Star Wars Episode 1, 2, and three, Darth Maul, baby, pod racing, baby, Guado, is it Guado, Wado, who's, what's his name, the blue dude with the wings, Wado, I don't know, I forget his name, ah, Annie, somehow you know, somehow you know, Annie, Metachloriates edition, what is gonna happen, are we gonna go back, are we gonna go back to episode one through three, and the main guy, baby, Jar Jar Binks, They need to make a Jar Jar Binks super limited edition. Miso, want that version, Stern? Using a bigger doo-doo Jar Jar. Look, I think these movies, since Star Wars has had so many bad TV shows, I think everyone's looking back on episode one through three with a lot more fondness than they used to. I mean, Hayden Christensen now goes to the Star Wars conventions and he's like treated like a celebrity. They go nuts when they see him. And so look, it's Star Wars. When that theme song hits, if John Borg makes a great game, it's going to sell. If you want to go up against Harry Potter, it's a good one-two punch to hit back with Star Wars and Pokemon and maybe Tron The one game they better not make and you know what it is they better not make a remastered like comic version of The Walking Dead Nobody wants another run of Walking Dead That's not the game. It's Tron and then it's Lord of the Rings. Those are the two games everybody wants another run of. It's not Walking Dead Stern. And then Stern, you really need to get more great themes going. You don't have enough of the nostalgic stuff we want. I still can't believe we're not going to get Back to the Future from Stern. By the way, everybody, if you're following how slow Dutch Pinball is making Alice's Adventures in Wonderland. How the heck is this company going to make Back to the Future? How? What happens when they get 5,000 orders and they're making 20 games a week? What happens? How are they ever going to fulfill orders? 20 games a week at best. I think it's like 10 games a week. I don't think they can make even 500 games a year. And so what's going to happen when they try to manufacture back to the future? What Barry should have done, he should have inked the deal with either Stern or like JJP. They both wanted it. The thing is, is like, I know Barry wanted like a lot up front. He didn't want to wait for the money. If I were Barry, I would have taken the long payout. I would have said, look, we'll do the deal. I want 500 bucks per game sold. And I would have taken a plane to the Caribbean and sat on a beach and collect checks for the next five years. And I'm talking people millions of dollars. We're not talking a few hundred thousand dollars here. I'm talking millions of dollars he would have made over the duration of that game's manufacturing. And I also would have said part of the deal is don't cap this game. Make 88 SLEs, make another LE, but then the premium unlimited runs. They would never stop selling it. And it was going to be made by Keith Elwin. And if it was over at Jersey Jack, it would have been like Richie and Eric or somebody, and they would have done it justice. And they've got Joe K getting all the assets, Bob Gale. Like he could have like just made himself set. And also we know this Dutch one game, one game in 12 years. So I'm worried. I'm worried because again, I just don't feel like they're going to be able to handle the demand. And you know, sometimes in life you got to know your limitations. We all have to. That's what guides us in our professional careers. Like you just got to know what you're good at and what you need help with. and they're not good at manufacturing. It's just not their strong suit. One game in 12 years. You are not a manufacturing company. You've made one game in 12 years. And so we'll see what happens there. I mean, that's not happening anytime soon. We really can use Alice as a marker to see how they're doing. And it's not flying out the door. It really isn't. So today, Predator, it's coming. It's coming. It's going to be out in like what? like three hours, six hours. We will see Predator. All the teases are over. I'm going to get this show up. Everybody, thank you for hanging out and watching a live recording of how Kaneda does Kaneda's Pinball Podcast. You can see how I have to edit a little bit here and there, but I love doing this show. And if you're not a member of Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, please join the show. It's only $5 a month. And if you join today, it unlocks for you. I think something like 500 episodes are now on Patreon that you can go back and listen to. So you get a lot. You also get access to the chat on Patreon, which is so much fun. Every hour of every day. Those who are members can contest to this. Every hour of every day. If you ever just want to hang out and chat pinball, people are there. It's a lot of fun. So I hope you guys join and you become a member of Canada's Pinball Podcast. Everybody get to the chopper today. We'll be back here at 2.50 p.m. to see what this game is all about. Going to have a lot of feelings on it. We know Arnold's not in it. And that's going to manage our expectations, right? Because we know he's not in it now. So I'm not going to get devastated by it because I know it. I wish they would have said it. Maybe he's got call outs. We shall see. Everybody have a great Wednesday, and we'll be back later today. Kaneda out. I think I haven't seen that before. Oh! Amen.