Episode 673: "Too Many Designers in Pinball"

Kaneda's Pinball Podcast (Patreon feed)·podcast_episode·27m 52s·analyzed·Apr 29, 2022

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.034

TL;DR

Kaneda argues pinball has too many designers but insufficient manufacturing capacity to deliver games at promised rates.

Summary

Kaneda discusses critical bottlenecks in pinball manufacturing, arguing that too many designers exist relative to production capacity across multiple manufacturers. He covers rumors about American Pinball's Sonic the Hedgehog Spinball acquisition, Chicago Gaming Company's Pulp Fiction and Twilight Zone remakes, Jersey Jack Pinball's dual-line Toy Story production, and concerns about Haggis Pinball's manufacturing pace. Key theme: manufacturing capacity, not design talent, is the limiting factor in the industry.

Key Claims

American Pinball has not delivered on its promise of two games per year despite David Fix saying this three years ago—they've only made one game.
high confidence · Kaneda, directly contrasting stated goals vs. actual output
Stern Pinball successfully releases three cornerstone games per year (Keith Elwin, Brian Eddy, John Borg), plus occasionally a George Gomez special edition.
high confidence · Kaneda, using Stern as benchmark for manufacturing consistency
Ryan McQuaid's Sonic the Hedgehog Spinball game will be the best-selling American Pinball game of all time if made with the proper license.
medium confidence · Kaneda, opinion/speculation about Ryan McQuaid and Sonic IP acquisition
Haggis Pinball's Fathom factory tour video appeared staged and showed minimal production activity—possibly a skeleton crew of 4-5 people building one game at a time.
medium confidence · Kaneda, expressing skepticism about production tour authenticity
Chicago Gaming Company's next two games are rumored to be Steve Ritchie's single-level Pulp Fiction and a wide-body Twilight Zone remake.
medium confidence · Kaneda, explicitly labeling as rumor: 'The rumor I heard'
Jersey Jack Pinball now has both production lines running simultaneously to manufacture Toy Story, indicating acceleration of output.
medium confidence · Kaneda, citing recent information about dual-line production
Dennis Nordman's upcoming American Pinball game is likely Sherlock Holmes with Christopher Franchi artwork, releasing in August as a premium tier (Limited/Super LE, no Pro version).
medium confidence · Kaneda, speculating on game identity and pricing tier
Stern Pinball's new strategy is to re-release premium limited editions of classic games (e.g., Ghostbusters) at $25,000+ by targeting wealthy collectors in their prime earning years.
medium confidence · Kaneda, inferring manufacturer strategy from pricing patterns

Notable Quotes

“Manufacturing is why Gary Stern, Sam Stern always says, We Are Pinball, not American Pinball company. We Are Pinball a manufacturing company. And those words mean more than anything I've ever heard in pinball.”
Kaneda @ ~mid-episode — Core insight about what differentiates successful vs. struggling manufacturers; encapsulates the episode's central thesis
“I'm afraid the world economies are going to go into a recession and all of these pinball companies have not been able to sort of capitalize on this super hot pinball market. They don't have anything to sell you.”
Kaneda @ ~early-mid — Identifies inventory/supply crisis amid peak demand as existential risk to manufacturers
“How do you go on a podcast and say we're going to get out two games a year and then like two, three years go by and you haven't done that?”
Kaneda @ ~mid-episode — Directly critiques credibility gap between manufacturer commitments and delivery; applies to David Fix and Jack Guarnieri
“I've never seen a more staged video in my life. This Week in Pinball, Joust or Johnny Pinball, Shane Black, Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, Twippies Awards...”
Kaneda @ ~mid-episode — Expresses strong skepticism about Haggis Pinball factory tour authenticity; signals community trust issue
“If they're not going to make Sonic the Hedgehog Spinball, right, if they're not actually going to make his game and get the license from Sega, then this acquisition makes no sense to me.”
Kaneda @ ~early — Frames Ryan McQuaid/American Pinball partnership as contingent on Sonic IP licensing; highlights deal risk
“You know, it just makes no sense to me unless your manufacturing can crank out at least two games a year. You should not have four designers on staff.”
Kaneda @ ~mid-episode — Core economic argument about designer-to-manufacturing capacity ratio as efficiency metric
“Back to the arcade future. If they re-ran Ghostbusters, right? If they just re-ran Ghostbusters with a special limited edition and put the topper back on it, they could get $25,000 all day long in this market.”

Entities

Kanedaperson American PinballcompanyStern PinballcompanyJersey Jack Pinballcompany Chicago Gaming Companycompany Barrels of Funcompany Haggis Pinballcompany

Signals

?
business_signal: Core thesis: pinball industry has structural imbalance—too many designers relative to manufacturing output capacity. American Pinball, Jersey Jack, and others consistently underdeliver on production targets.
high · American Pinball promised 2 games/year three years ago, delivered 1. Jersey Jack promised 2 games/year for 6 years. Kaneda argues this is industry-wide pattern indicating manufacturing is true constraint.
$
market_signal: Stern Pinball adopting strategy of premium limited editions on legacy games (Ghostbusters rumor) at $25,000+ targeting wealthy collectors; distributor margins compressed.
medium · Kaneda infers from recent pricing patterns that Stern is re-releasing classic games with special LE variants; predicts $25,000 retail feasible in current market
~
sentiment_shift: Kaneda expresses loss of confidence in manufacturer commitments and tour authenticity; criticizes Haggis Pinball factory video as 'staged' with minimal visible production activity.
high · Direct skepticism: 'I've never seen a more staged video in my life'; estimates skeleton crew of 4-5 building one game at a time despite claims of active manufacturing
?
machine_intel: Ryan McQuaid's Sonic the Hedgehog Spinball acquisition by American Pinball hinges on securing Sega IP license; without it, deal lacks strategic value per Kaneda.
medium · Kaneda: 'If they're not going to make Sonic the Hedgehog Spinball...then this acquisition makes no sense to me'; cites Sega's track record licensing Sonic as positive indicator
?
product_strategy: Dennis Nordman's Sherlock Holmes game (rumored) adopting premium-only tier structure: Super LE and LE only, no Pro version; distributor pricing expected $40,000-$50,000 retail.

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.084

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Happy Friday everybody! Are you ready for an episode of Kaneda's Pinball Podcast? The only pinball podcast that can really see a video and say, hey this whole thing looks staged! The only pinball podcast that can look out in the pinball world and say, there's way too many designers and not enough games. Are you ready for episode 600 and something of Kaneda's Pinball Podcast? I want to welcome Blake and Kevin to the club. We are going to reach 500. I think What boxing and Pinball Marketing has While philanthropic Regulatory workscere Peru teasing & Information 쿠ияхrlgatorial essense Balou Tantrum, Tantrum, Tantrum, Tantrum The game is being hired by American Pinball. Now first and foremost, this is great news because Ryan McQuaid and his Sonic Spinball game is really, really cool. And if they're able to make Sonic Spinball, it will be the best selling American Pinball game of all time. Now, the bar is not very high over at AP, but this is a great move. But here's the question I want to ask. When would we even see this game? Because remember, American Pinball is a great game. American Pinball has Dennis Norman working on two titles. They've already said they're going to make another Riot pinball game. They also said officially they are going to make Barry O's last game. So if you look at a company like American Pinball, they're another company that's not even close to getting out two games a year. You know when David Fix said that AP would make two games a year? That was almost three years ago. And they've only got I'm John Papadiuk, Black Water, Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, Twippies Awards, translite The Week in Pinball, John Papadiuk, Black Water, Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, Twippies Awards, transliteelectronic panel in backbox that is backlit during playelectronic Game of Thrones unint This Week in Pinball, John Papadiuk, Keith Elwin, John Popadiuk, Tanyo Klyce, tilt bob), or abbreviation for retro unint Toad, The Three guys. If they have three cornerstone games a year, each one of them will have a new game out each year and Stern has consistently hit on that note, right? You know you're going to get a new Elwin every year, you're going to get a Brian Eddy game, and you're going to get a John Board game, and then they might throw into the mix a George Gomez special edition game. But when you look at a company like American Pinball and I'm super excited for Ryan and I see the victory lap, I can't help but wonder when we would see his game. Like, like what would be the earliest date we would see this game? I don't know, right? Would it be 2023 2024? I don't know about you guys, but I really am afraid of one thing. I'm afraid the world economies are going to go into a recession and all of these pinball companies have not been able to sort of capitalize I'm this super hot pinball market. They don't have anything to sell you. It's absolutely crazy It's the greatest time in pinball history to have used games for sale, right? Like Zack many is selling a Batman Ellie for $21,000, right? I sold my super Ellie like four years ago for $16,000 it would now sell for $40,000 but the reason why Zack is selling it for that. There's no inventory Torey, like if you do not want a Legends of Valhalla, AP has basically nothing to sell you. But I want to go back to Ryan Mcquade and Sonic Spinball because here's the other thing I want to ask each and every one of you. If they're not going to make Sonic Spinball, right, if they're not actually going to make his game and get the license from Sega, then this acquisition makes no sense to me and I want to explain why. First and foremost, Crapman, Black Water, Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, Twippies Awards, translite The Big Lebowski and that's why that game had so much magic in it because they loved the theme so much and Ryan loves Sonic so much that he's making a game with a loop-de-loop and all this cool stuff and I'm even more excited because now if he's over there with Dennis Nordman and Sophia he's gonna have more access to someone to help him tighten up the shots and maybe even add in a few more toys into the game that are absolutely amazing because they have great engineering backgrounds to help them make Sonic even better. But if they don't get the Sonic license and they make him re-skin this game into something else, I think it makes no sense to partner up with Ryan Mcquade. And so I have all of my fingers crossed that they will be able to get the license. Now look Sonic is not an impossible license to get Sega absolutely licenses out Sonic the Hedgehog all the time. All I need to know is that you running out of time I am drinking from a water bottle right now that has Sonic the Hedgehog on it The question becomes will he be able to get all of the access to like the Sonic cartoon and the different video game footage but I believe Sega owns it all and Ryan been talking to Sega as he been making this game so hopefully there a good relationship there The one part that people always forget Is you could have IP laws and you could have this and you can have around a lot of the costs associated with things We all remember when slash just picked up the phone and got live and let die into the pinball machine They didn have to pay Paul McCartney for it He just said slash It cool You can use it They didn have to pay a dime That what relationships can get you So I really hope we see Sonic Spinball But the bigger question is this So now you got like four designers over at AP You got four Atomicniestiner's over at Jerseyjackpinball, a company which can only get out one game every 18 months or more. And then you have to pay these people salaries, right? That's the other part. It's like someone comes into Jerseyjackpinball. Like, let's just say you're Steve Ritchie and you walk into Jerseyjackpinball. When is your game even coming out? Like, is there even a schedule of when his game is going to hit? And then what are you doing every day? Like Steve is very prolific and let's say that he designs his game in like six months. He's got the whole game design Okay, and then he has to wait three years to get it on the line Does he then move on to his next game see these companies? You know, it just makes no sense to me unless your manufacturing can crank out at least two games a year You should not have four designers on staff. I think you're wasting money Tr belongs To Alan The Designers and they rotate right because in the time it takes to get the next game out the other designers game will be done So Eric Minier did Guns and Roses Then we're gonna see Toy Story and then we're gonna see Eric Minier's next game The Godfather is what we're hearing and the reason why do you know why because Eric Minier's Guns and Roses was? Completed like a year and a half before it even came out and that's how it is over at Jersey Jack design is so far behind manufacturing date that they have so much time to move on to future titles and then look over at haggis pinball right they're barely getting their first fathom in a box and you've got marty robbins pinball designer like when is marty robbins's game going to come out now if you go listen to old haggis interviews like a year ago they said fathoms would have been completed in 2021 and they were going to bring marty's game to like expo or tps buchavec Machaek 84 My franckxman414i dhfa4 jvt8wv2 sup4 bcae4 jvtt8wbf0 おじづ cioè embed arip obwhitech gfe5b9nie named buch باле 5è NamebagFPCa 흡ραرا kes☆zemง reefs The Closed being built and I think all of this I mean is I think all of this speaks volumes about the problems in the pinball world I think manufacturing needs to dictate design and I think the main issue with pinball is that it's fun to Design games right we saw over at deep root. It's fun going in every day and pretending to be a pinball wizard and design a bunch of fun stuff and work with artists and work with coders and make the game and design the game. But the real part of pinball that matters is not design. It is manufacturing. It is why Gary Stern always says, we are not a pinball company. We are a manufacturing company. And those words mean more than anything I've ever heard in pinball All because everybody else has been struggling to figure out how to manufacture the ideas, how to execute on their designs. And I don't understand the part where people go on podcasts and say like let's take David Fix for example. How do you go on a podcast and say we're going to get out two games a year and then like two, three years go by and you haven't done that? How many times did Jack Winari said we're going to come out with two games a year? Jack's been saying that for like six years now. I mean, I just don't understand how left brain right brain like how does the design part of a pinball company? How are they so optimistic? And then the manufacturing side is really where the rubber meets the road. Like that's where the ultimate truth lies in pinball is in manufacturing. And I still can't get over the fathom video guys. I've been watching it more and more this week. And I know some of you don't want me to talk about it. But I've never seen a more staged video in my life. The Week in Pinball, Johnny Pneumonic, Black Water, Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, Twippies Awards, transliteelectronic video that is backlit during playelectronic Game of Thrones unint Text passengers preface Text from screen

12:35

PINNEDONATIONALANDTAYEANTHAT THEYBOXEDUP. If the line is going, if manufacturing is actually taking place, then they can do a little video tour to show us that. There's a reason why they didn't and hashtag no words. Well, Canada's going to hashtag just words because words can be powerful, because asking questions can be powerful. And now the funny part begins, right? Are you seeing what's happening on pin side? They've started a club thread for haggis and now all the owners are moving over there. Closed Caption by The Closed Caption Project The But from what I can see in that video There aren't many people in any of the shots You've got the big factory and I bet it's a skeleton crew of four to five dudes like screwing together like one game at a time Like that was one game at a time They had one prototype and one new game built you will see dr John unbox it and say everything is a Everyone's gonna get their game soon and look the quality is there the game is beautiful But my gosh you are not gonna see these fathoms like flying out the door Anytime soon as I said before they're gonna grind them out But there is no way I can see them making any money with the slow pace All right, so what else is going on in pinball? I gave you the rumor I heard. Now keep in mind everybody, this is a rumor that CGC's next two games are going to be Mark Ritchie's single level Pulp Fiction which we've heard about forever. That game is happening. And also the big surprise I'm hearing is that Twilight Zone is going to be the next remake from Chicago Gaming Company, a wide body game with so much in it. Will they do it? This week's topic is the following. The first question is, how do you make a new Twilight zone? Will this be the next game they remake? Now, I know there are some of you out there that are like, there are so many Twilight zones out in the world. It doesn't matter. Like, if you make a brand new Twilight zone with some new code and the wides screen and modern lights and everything and a topper, you're going to sell a ton of them. You are absolutely going to sell a ton of them. But here's the thing. I think the one thing I was wrong with in my rumor is the dates because we both know that Ultimate Limited Sometimes there s excellent damn The movie deserves a multi-leveled game with ramps and toys with all of the modern goodies we want to see in a pinball machine like if Jersey Jack pinball made pulpfiction we would be doing back flips you know a single level game by Mark Ritchie I just don't think it's what people want and again who knows when we'll see it but I am hearing that pulpfiction is done and we will see it sometime in the near future Twilight Zone would be probably I would have to say Twilightzone would be like two years from now like 2024 if we see Twilightzone but I haven't heard anyone else say Twilightzone so you heard it here first on Kaneda. The other rumor I heard is that Jersey Jack Pinball has closed down their factory tours. Well, that's not a rumor. But here's what I heard this week. They have both lines going working on Toy Story right now. So it's not just going to be one line making Toy Story. It's going to be two Page one by Place One Textbook Web tuition DOUBLE Closed Caption by The Closed Caption Project Blake principeizzardran encuentrebook sle DOM thumbnail decomposite Lydia CARTUTO Super attractive woman rocking machine. It was the greatest single pinball piece of content I've ever seen. I've never seen anything better than that. Like nothing sold a pinball machine better than that video. Right. Remember the lame dialed in one where like the guy pulls the cell phone out of his pocket and starts flipping and was like, oh, now I really don't want it. Right. All right. So that's happening. We also heard like American Pinball has a really weird like new strategy with their deluxe machines. And this condoms, Alicia Fau Ennis, Alex Justice lineage belongs to the raus Kunst peuvent сделaan procedureiries in progress of Atième dicht onto retro Roland egenting link on screeety and below TJ рассignatusane.thia to be angry surprisingly on heats sports Today james sla皆ctary Hoffney elientrieto youtube.com and courtesy Тутtan canine h Flying a8 Kes farmer All this is just FOMO spin. He did the same thing with Legends of Valhalla. I still think the marketing over at AP is all wonky. I really do. I think they don't really have a plan. I think they don't really have a vision. I think for them, they need to make the games look better. Those backpacks, those Crapman, Black Water, Kaneda's Pinball Podcast, Twippies Awards, translite New in box David you know why cuz I can go get any three of those titles for less than new in box So why do I want to buy a new in box version of the game American Pinball I just always so perplexed by the moves they make And what do we think the Dennis Nordman game is Do we think it's going to be Sherlock Holmes with Christopher Franchi on artwork? That's kind of where I'm leaning lately. I don't think it's going to be Yukon Yeti. There's no way it's that because Dennis was probably still nervous that Deeproot owns that license. I do think it's going to be Sherlock Holmes. I do think it's going to have Franchi on artwork. And I think it's going to be loaded with toys and some fun stuff. And will it sell well? Well, look, if you're going to make an original IP game, Sherlock Holmes is actually not a bad selection because we all know Sherlock Holmes, right? It's not like dialed in original. It's something we're all familiar with. So we'll just have to wait and see. And I hear that game is coming out ill time sometime in August, which is when headlineslict The game is going to be a Kapow title in which there's only going to be a super le and an le and then maybe a premium. There will be no pro version of this game. I expect there to be versions of James Bond that Stern will sell through its distributors at around Elvira 40th prices. So they are going to give the games to distributors for $15,000 and then distributors can price them at around $50,000. So if you're a distributor and you're TIP 3 Get ready to see distributors test the waters at $30,000. You're hearing it here first. You're gonna see this! Because just think about it. This is Stern's genius plan. They're gonna keep doing this. Like back to the future. If they re ran Ghostbusters, right? If they just re ran Ghostbusters with a special limited edition and put the topper back on it, they could get $25,000 all day long in this market. I think everyone's just realizing that older millennials and boomers are rich. And this is not the most expensive hobby by any means. And so all these companies are realizing that their target audience is in the prime earning of their lives. A lot of these guys are multimillionaires and then some, some are billionaires, and they know that this is nothing to them. Especially when you zoom out and it's a global market of pinball buyers, right? Crapman Rstick Or le analys descobl law to Kat Use separately takeo atby стать ammon Winter.cess Like global ASUS You know what? More power to them. I would be the same exact way. You think if you're rich, you care what someone on an internet forum or a podcast says about your lifestyle choices? You absolutely do not care. Because as I tell people, the greatest liberator in life, the thing that gives you the most freedom in the world is money. Everybody knows that. It's like this weird thing. I think sometimes I'm working with a lot of younger kids these days, right? And they're all about their principles and they're all about Franchise The money tells you where you can live what pinball machine you can buy what clothes you can wear where you can go on vacation It is the ultimate liberator and look you should be compensated when you work hard You should be compensated when you invent something when you have great ideas when you add something of value to this world You should be compensated for and I'm one of the people I like to look at successful people Saman Dasmichten, I'll stay on your side. OSTRANовать Card toothpasteięeralty,호� sne metaphor otherwise n Naj Shoutout D juegoMovies to defense. 나도 Uteza Helualfolde, The end of the week. I'm going to keep doing these shows and look, we're going to get new soon. Like something's going to happen. Maybe it's at MGC. Something's going to happen in June. If you just stick with me through May, because I think May is going to be pretty brutal. I think May is just going to be about whether or not people get their fathoms and whether or not like Cactus Canyon, Ellie ships. And if you just stick with me, trust me, together we are going to get to Toy Stories launch together. And then you're going to be able to hear my elation or me screaming in pain at how they messed up ToyStory. So I really can't wait for all of us to go on the journey together. Everybody have a great weekend. We are going to be on the Saturday Morning Spectacular. Yes, Chris and Kaneda, bipolar Chris is going to be there doing our 90-minute show. If you haven't joined, I highly recommend you join In the same way, we are doing Kaneda's Pinball Podcast on Facebook and you hang out. It's every Saturday morning at 10 o'clock Eastern Standard Time. Everybody, great weekend. We'll talk to you soon. PINBALL PINBALLPINES PINBALLPINES PINBALLPINES