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Yukon Yeti by Turner Pinball

LoserKid Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·48m 58s·analyzed·Apr 17, 2026
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.036

TL;DR

Turner Pinball's Chris Turner reveals Yukon Yeti strategy and confirms Chris Granner as audio designer.

Summary

Chris Turner of Turner Pinball discusses the development and launch of Yukon Yeti, a spiritual successor to the classic Whitewater (1992) designed by Dennis Nordman. Turner explains the company's strategy of building unlicensed original IP games as stepping stones toward eventually releasing licensed titles, details the design philosophy behind Yukon Yeti's playfieldand cabinet, and announces that legendary audio designer Chris Granner (who worked on the original Whitewater and The Addams Family) will be handling the game's audio package—a major coup for the boutique manufacturer.

Key Claims

  • Ninja Eclipse sold out its 100-unit production run at Expo in October (three years after initial TPF showing).

    high confidence · Chris Turner confirmed the timeline of Ninja Eclipse launch and sold-out status during podcast interview.

  • Turner Pinball is planning a facility expansion that will substantially increase production capacity for Yukon Yeti fulfillment and future releases.

    high confidence · Chris Turner stated: 'We're working on a new facility, and when we get into that facility, that is going to ramp up our production capabilities substantially.'

  • Yukon Yeti will be produced in a 500-unit run.

    high confidence · Chris Turner stated: 'I think we'll sell out of the 500 of these and it'll be a great collectible.'

  • Chris Granner, the legendary audio designer for the original Whitewater and The Addams Family, has been hired to create the audio package for Yukon Yeti.

    high confidence · Chris Turner announced this during the podcast and confirmed he reached out via LinkedIn; community reception was extremely positive.

  • Almost all Yukon Yeti orders are for the all-in package, with only some arcade operators choosing the base package.

    high confidence · Chris Turner stated: 'Almost all of the orders include the all in package. There are some arcades that have decided that they just want the base package.'

  • Turner Pinball's next major game after Yukon Yeti will be a licensed IP title (details confidential).

    high confidence · Chris Turner: 'Ultimately, this system is going to be a great foundation for the next game that we do, which is probably going to be a licensed game. I can't really talk about any of the things that we're working on.'

  • Chris Turner previously worked for Lockheed Martin for approximately 12 years before transitioning to entrepreneurship in San Antonio around 2013.

    high confidence · Chris Turner provided personal background during podcast interview.

  • The original cabinet design for Ninja Eclipse was criticized for looking like a 'Zizzle' (non-commercial-grade appearance), prompting Turner Pinball to pivot to a full-size cabinet design.

Notable Quotes

  • “People want a game that looks good in their lineup. And, you know, if you've got this little cabinet, even if the play field and everything in the game is the same, it just doesn't look good in the lineup.”

    Chris Turner @ ~11:00 — Reveals critical market feedback that drove Turner Pinball's pivot from compact to full-size cabinet design—a key business lesson about consumer expectations.

  • “It is a much harder path for a pinball company to make unlicensed themes... You will never have that with an unlicensed theme, right? Because there's nobody in line to get the theme that they've never heard of.”

    Scott Larson @ ~22:30 — Articulates the fundamental market challenge for original IP in pinball vs. licensed games—speaks to sales velocity and pre-order dynamics.

  • “I think Yukon Yeti is a great game because people were clamoring for a Whitewater 2.0 because they love this game.”

    Josh Roop @ ~32:00 — Confirms that nostalgia for Whitewater (1992) and demand for a spiritual successor is driving interest in Yukon Yeti—important market signal.

  • “Oh, my goodness, like this is Dennis's game. And like he just said how much he loved working on Whitewater with Dennis and everything... I can't wait to talk to you.”

    Chris Granner (via Turner's account) @ ~42:00 — Documents the emotional hook that got Chris Granner excited about Yukon Yeti—the connection to Dennis Nordman and Whitewater legacy.

  • “It's an engineer's dream. It's like, you know, you've got electrical and mechanical and software engineering and then you've got the art and you've got the audio... I don't know what other kind of field you could be in where you combine all those things, except maybe like Disney animatronics or something.”

    Chris Turner @ ~15:00 — Reveals Turner's core motivation and worldview—pinball as a multidisciplinary engineering challenge. Important for understanding design philosophy.

  • “We know that this wasn't originally a Turner game... Dennis originally started this game with Deep Root Pinball. And obviously, you know, most of you know that story. When that company shut down, I acquired the assets of that company.”

Entities

Chris TurnerpersonTurner PinballcompanyYukon YetigameDennis NordmanpersonChris Grannerperson

Signals

  • ?

    product_launch: Yukon Yeti launched at Texas Pinball Festival with strong community reception; 500-unit production run confirmed; Chris Granner announced as audio designer same day as podcast.

    high · Chris Turner: 'I put that little fire together and got that out on social today and shared it. And Jason Knapp published an article.' TxPF described as 'bell of the ball' with everyone discussing the game's beauty.

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Turner Pinball explicitly positioning all games (Ninja Eclipse, Merlin's Arcade, Yukon Yeti) as family-friendly with broad appeal, avoiding darker themes.

    high · Chris Turner: 'We want to make family friendly games... we want our everything about our game to feel family friendly... make games that have broad appeal and are definitely welcome in anybody's house.'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Turner Pinball using unlicensed original IP games (Ninja Eclipse, Merlin's Arcade, Yukon Yeti) as stepping stones to validate manufacturing and build platform before moving to licensed titles.

    high · Chris Turner: 'Ultimately, this system is going to be a great foundation for the next game that we do, which is probably going to be a licensed game.' He also acknowledged unlicensed themes are harder path but necessary for smaller manufacturers to avoid overwhelming production scale.

  • ?

    manufacturing_signal: Turner Pinball is working on new facility that will substantially increase production capacity; Yukon Yeti designed as stepping stone to new facility capabilities.

    high · Chris Turner: 'This game was kind of designed to be our stepping stone game. We're working on a new facility, and when we get into that facility, that is going to ramp up our production capabilities substantially.'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.147

0:00
Thanks for tuning in to the Loser Kid Pinball Podcast. I am Josh Roop. With me, my co-captain, Scott Larson. Scott, you know, Texas Pinball Festival just happened and there was a bell of the ball. Everyone's talking about how beautiful this game is. If you want this game, where are you getting it, Scott? I'll call Zach and Nicole Minnie at Flip N Out Pinball. They can help you out with your new games, your used games. If you want to pick up Yukon Yeti, go ahead and reach out and talk to Zach and Nicole Minnie at Flip N Out Pinball. Well, seriously, this game looks amazing. I am a huge fan of Whitewater myself. So to hear a spiritual successor like Yukon Yeti, I'm excited. I'm excited to play this. I'm jealous I didn't get to go to Texas Pinball Festival. But to talk about it and all the shenanigans going on at Turner Pinball, we have the man, the myth, the legend himself, Chris Turner. How are you doing, Chris? I'm doing great, guys. Thank you so much for having me on. Definitely. This is the first time we've had you on, and I'm excited to have you on because you've been doing these projects. You started out with Ninja Eclipse, and I remember you coming to Expo three years ago. Has it been about that long? I think so, yeah. And playing Ninja Clips, I want to say kind of for the first time, and you took all that feedback and everything that you'd heard along it from Texas Pinball Festival when you first showed, and you've just, you've used them as stepping stones, right? And like, I feel like you've done it right. Because like, the original cabinet design almost looks like, like a zizzle. I don't know how else to put it. You were not alone in that assessment.
1:40
You definitely heard that loud and clear. So, okay, I will say that to your credit, you guys took feedback and you were able to pivot very quickly to adapt the game to what people expect in a pinball machine. And if you're going to compete with other companies, you're going to have to compete with a product that people look at and assess as a commercial-grade pinball machine. So I do appreciate that you are willing to look at those things and pivot very quickly, which is a credit to you and the way you're approaching things. Thank you, Scott. I appreciate it. So prior to that expo, we had actually come with a Whitewood to TPF that same year and it was in a full size cabinet. We were working on the smaller cabinet because we thought that we were solving some problems that were like a, you know, pinball's hard to move around, it's hard to get upstairs. So we had this like unique back box concept that could like come off completely and had like there was really no back to it. We're trying to make it really as lightweight as possible. And then we had the slimline cabinet and that drove a lot of design of like the playfield elements. It's like you couldn't have things too deep because everything had to fit in this small cabinet. I thought, oh, man, people are going to love this because like it's way easier to move around. And then people looked at it and they're like, what is this? And I was like, oh, dear, this is not what I planned. But anyway, you know, we're we go to the shows to listen and learn. And obviously, I want to deliver a product that people want. And so, yeah, we got the feedback and then we we pivoted. And I think the thing that made so much sense to me is that people want a game that looks good in their lineup. And, you know, if you've got this little cabinet, even if the play field and everything in the game is the same, it just doesn't look good in the lineup. And so I heard that loud and clear and we fixed that and then launched again at TPF the next year. And it was great. People love the game and things just kept moving forward from there. When I think it goes to show, because you're trying to drive some innovation in this industry and look at stuff from a different angle. And I didn't know this, but we were kind of talking about this right before we started recording. But you used to work for Lockheed Martin in aerospace and whatnot. Do you bring those ideas and stuff? And how do you apply that to this? Because they're kind of two separate things, you know? You know, you bring up the history with working for Lockheed and stuff. And that was great. That was my first job out of college. I worked there for about 12 years. It was it was awesome. I made a lot of great friends and worked on a lot of cool projects.

high confidence · Josh Roop and Scott Larson discussed the feedback; Chris Turner acknowledged: 'people looked at it and they're like, what is this?'

Chris Turner @ ~38:00 — Clarifies the provenance of Yukon Yeti and Turner's acquisition of Deep Root assets—critical to understanding how this spiritual successor came to be.

  • “The all-in package, you're buying the common options plus the premium topper. And you're getting that as a package deal. And as a result of that, you're saving $250 off the cost.”

    Chris Turner @ ~34:30 — Demonstrates packaging strategy and pricing psychology—bundling to drive premium tier adoption and increase average transaction value.

  • “We have a dust cover that's a themed dust cover that will go with the game. And then obviously the the premium Yeti topper. We call it the Northern Lights topper because it's got this light show that it plays that casts like what looks like the northern lights on your ceiling.”

    Chris Turner @ ~35:30 — Details the premium Yeti topper feature—a major differentiator that addresses community criticism about the Yeti not moving, by making a moving head topper instead.

    • Josh Roop
    person
    Scott Larsonperson
    Deep Root Pinballcompany
    Ninja Eclipsegame
    Merlin's Arcadegame
    Whitewatergame
    Flip N Out Pinballcompany
    Zach Sharpeperson
    Nicole Minnieperson
    Brad Dukeperson
    Jon Norrisperson
    Texas Pinball Festivalevent
    Expoevent
    Sterncompany
    Lockheed Martincompany
    Turner Logiccompany
    LoserKid Pinball Podcastevent
    Jason Knappperson
    ?

    design_innovation: Turner Pinball developed proprietary PCB-based electrical system and integrated LED design to solve manufacturing and maintenance challenges endemic to traditional wired pinball systems.

    high · Chris Turner: 'When I set out on this pinball journey, there were a couple of things that were like kind of must haves for me. And being able to improve the electrical and wiring system was one of those... we just can't have all this crazy wiring under the game.'

  • ?

    product_concern: Community concern that Yeti doesn't move (unlike Whitewater original); Turner resolved by creating moving-head topper instead of playfield-mounted moving mechanism.

    high · Chris Turner: 'We talked about a lot of different options for movement of the Yeti... the mechanical design of it when we tried to make him move just wasn't working right... so in lieu of having that Yeti move, what we decided to do is we will make a Yeti topper.'

  • ?

    community_signal: Strong community demand for Whitewater spiritual successor; nostalgia for 1992 classic driving interest in Yukon Yeti; Whitewater is enduring beloved title with collector appeal.

    high · Josh Roop: 'Yukon Yeti is a great game because people were clamoring for a Whitewater 2.0 because they love this game. I mean, it's from 1992. People wanted to see where this game would go. It's one of those ones that's just very well beloved.'

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Chris Granner, legendary audio designer for Whitewater and Addams Family, returning to pinball after extended absence to design audio for Yukon Yeti.

    high · Chris Turner: 'Chris has been out of pinball for quite some time. And this is going to be him coming back to pinball, which I am just so happy that I get to be a part of that.'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Positive community sentiment shift following Yukon Yeti reveal at TxPF and Chris Granner announcement; community enthusiastically embracing game and recognizing Granner's legendary status.

    high · Chris Turner: 'The community has also shared their excitement for this... they're just like, oh, my goodness, this is incredible... it's going to be one of those cool pinball stories.'

  • $

    market_signal: Majority of Yukon Yeti orders are for all-in premium package; only arcade operators choosing base package, indicating strong collector demand and price elasticity at premium tier.

    high · Chris Turner: 'Almost all of the orders include the all in package. There are some arcades that have decided that they just want the base package. But for the most part, I think the people that are interested in this game, that are collectors really want the best of this game.'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Turner Pinball offering multiple SKUs (standard, Legendary Edition, All-In Package) with $250 discount on all-in bundle; a la carte options available for customization.

    high · Chris Turner detailed all-in package features (InvisiGlass, RGB speakers, art blades, sliders, dust cover, premium topper) and stated 'you're saving $250 off the cost of what it would if you a la carte all those options individually.'

  • ?

    business_signal: Turner Pinball acquired assets of defunct Deep Root Pinball including Yukon Yeti project to preserve work and deliver game to community.

    high · Chris Turner: 'Dennis originally started this game with Deep Root Pinball... When that company shut down, I acquired the assets of that company in hopes to be able to bring some of these things to the community.'

    • 4:24
    Also, there was this really cool thing we did. It was like this robotics competition like that we'd have each year. And that was a ton of fun. But anyway, yeah, I learned a ton of stuff and I really enjoyed it. And when I when I moved from Florida to San Antonio and so I'm in Texas now, obviously, that was around 2013. My wife grew up in San Antonio and she kind of imported me out here and I transitioned with Lockheed to a facility that they have out here. It wasn't like one of their corporate offices. It was just like they were renting some space in another building. And it was a kind of a totally different dynamic. And I decided, you know, I really wanted to start my own business. And I feel like I'm at a point in my career where I know what I need to know to do that. And so that was kind of the start of Turner Logic, which is my software company, and basically worked doing custom software and electronics for startups and companies here in the San Antonio area. And so, yeah, I mean, taking all of that stuff to pinball, it's like my background is just building cool things. And there's a ton of opportunity to build cool things in pinball. It's like an engineer's dream. It's like, you know, you've got electrical and mechanical and software engineering and then you've got the art and you've got the audio and like.
    5:50
    I don't know what other kind of field you could be in where you combine all those things, except maybe like Disney animatronics or something, you know, so for me personally, it's just so fun to build all these cool things. And that's what we get to do every day. So it's great. Now, Ninja Eclipse was basically your gateway, your test case to say, hey, is this something we can do? And is this something that the people want? Now, your initial goal was 100 games. And I believe you sold all those. You finished it at a show, right? Which show was it that you actually finished selling all your games? It was. So you talked about Expo three years ago. And then we came to TPF with the new model in the large cabinet. And then we went to Expo that same year in October. And that was when we sold out. Yeah. So I think that shows that people looked at it and were able to say, hey, this is something that we could get behind.
    6:55
    I've actually been a big fan of the way your cabinets look and the art that you are able to do, because a lot of art is really hard to get right in pinball. Because everybody's trying to figure out what they want to be. And it seems like you guys have this kind of whimsical, almost a comic book style adventure, like swashbuckling adventure type thing. So how did you come approach to say, this is who we are and this is what type of games we want to make?
    7:25
    So that's an interesting question. I mean, one of the things that really drives the way we do things, it's actually what Josh said right before we started. It is like, hey, this is family friendly. And that's great because that's what we are as a pinball company. You know, we want to make family friendly games. And so like the tone of our games is going to be something where anybody could put this in their living room and they have their kids around it and it's going to be a welcome addition.
    7:53
    And so we want our everything about our game to to feel family friendly. And the art is a part of that. I think, you know, you can have like darker art or, you know, lighter art that's appealing more broadly and to also a younger audience. And so we we just want to focus on the family friendly stuff and make games that have broad appeal and are definitely welcome in anybody's house.
    8:21
    So is that so is that kind of why you led towards Merlin's Arcade after that as well? So, I mean, Merlin's Arcade specifically, like I chose that particular game because John Norris had this layout for it and we really liked the layout. I like kind of like the King Arthur and the Knights of the Roundtable stuff. And so I thought, man, I think this would be a really fun game. It's definitely family friendly. It's recognizable. I think the I love the art on that play field and then all of the knights on the cabinet and everything. I think it looks great. The game is just a lot of fun. So we built something that we thought people would really enjoy. And I think that it's been a little bit challenging with like unlicensed themes. You know, we're creating our own IPs with Ninja Eclipse, with Merlin's Arcade and now with Yukon Yeti. It's a little different than like, you know, it's a lot different than launching like a Pokemon, but it's a little different than any any known IP, whether it's a movie or a video game or whatever.
    9:28
    And so, you know, we we try to pick games that we think will have broad appeal, even though it is an unlicensed theme.
    9:36
    But yeah, we pick things we like. We pick things that we think other people will like, too. And that's part of the reason why we selected Merlin's Arcade. So the question is, is this a viable option in today's market when people are used to seeing themes they connect with when they're looking at spending money on a $10,000 game? It is a much harder path for a pinball company to make unlicensed themes, I think. I think getting licenses, there's already this established brand identity that is recognizable. I mean, just think about the sales process for a license versus an unlicensed. So it's a license, it's Pokemon, right? Everybody knows Pokemon. There are people that will have money down with their dealer to get Pokemon, but they've never seen the game. They don't know what the art looks like. They don't know what the game plays like. They don't know the shots, the play field, anything. But they're like, take my money. It's a Pokemon game. I want that game. You will never have that with an unlicensed theme, right? Because there's nobody in line to get the theme that they've never heard of. It just it wouldn't make sense, right? Like, hey, give me the next unlicensed theme. No, it's not going to happen. And so the sales cycle for an unlicensed theme is you develop this new IP and then you create this game around it and then you market that game, you bring it to shows, people play it and people have to play it. They have to like it. They have to talk about it with other people and that spreads around. And then like that can create the sales numbers that you need for the game. That's a much harder path than just having an IP and saying, hey, we're going to build Pokemon.
    11:25
    But obviously, there are factors in being able to secure a license like Pokemon. And so obviously, that's a great title for Stern because of the quantity of machines they can produce. And so I think all the manufacturers are kind of looking at what fits their niche and what licenses they can get and then also what those licenses cost and how many machines they're going to have to make and all those things. And I would just say that we are going to move in that direction as well. I think that we've grown the company to this point with these unlicensed themes because I thought that was a good strategy for the business. One we got to make themes where we really had the full creative freedom to do everything we wanted which was a lot of fun But also Scott you mentioned kind of like we were kind of learning with Ninja Eclipse and things and like you don know what you don know That's why we only released 100 of that game. We wanted to make sure that we could come to market, that we could deliver a really high quality and reliable machine and that it would do well in the field. And we tested that with Ninja. We iterated on that for Merlin's and again on Yukon Yeti. And I think we've got a really good, stable system. I think our platform for building pinball machines is really pretty far ahead of anything that's out there. And I'd love to talk more about that. But ultimately, this system is going to be a great foundation for the next game that we do, which is probably going to be a licensed game. I can't really talk about any of the things that we're working on with it, but I think we are ready for that and we took the right steps to get there and that's kind of the direction to move, I think. So I guess I know that this is a spiritual successor, so is Yukon Yeti technically an unlicensed theme? It is, yeah. So do you think, though, it does benefit because there was, like Whitewater was such a beloved game from the 90s? I definitely think so. Yeah. I mean, this as an unlicensed theme is kind of a unique one because obviously Dennis is involved in this game. He was involved in the other game and like people see it as this successor. And I think that the popularity of that game, it does have some impact because people talk about it more. They recognize it, but it's still not the same, I think, as a licensed game. Right. But, you know, I think we'll sell out of the 500 of these and it'll be a great collectible. But, you know, how many Pokemons are they going to sell? It's going to it's going to be like, who knows? This is a lot of a lot of Pokemon games. So it's not like that. Well, it does bring up a good point, though, is like, obviously Stern's an established brand. They've been around for how many years? They have a massive factory. You guys are still in the first five year stage. You know what I'm saying? You're still growing. I think Yukon Yenny is a great game because people were clamoring for a Whitewater 2.0 because they love this game. I mean, it's from 1992. People wanted to see where this game would go. It's one of those ones that's just very well beloved from the Bally Williams era. And so to have a company of your size that is able to produce these games at a rate that feels comfortable to you, But not because it would be overwhelming if you got Pokemon, right? And you're like, oh, man, I've got five, ten thousand of these I got to build. You know what I'm saying? So but it's a great stepping stone, right? So absolutely. I guess the question is, what is Turner Pinball doing? Are you guys trying to expand more? What is the game plan moving forward? I assume you, Kanye, is that stepping stone that helps that, right? It is absolutely, yeah. I mean, this game was kind of designed to be our stepping stone game. We're working on a new facility, and when we get into that facility, that is going to ramp up our production capabilities substantially, and that'll be great for fulfilling the orders of this game. And that's kind of all the way we had hoped that it would go. And I think it really has followed that plan very well.
    15:46
    But yeah, this will be the stepping stone game that'll get us into the new facility and we'll be able to ship all the Yukon Yeti games while we work on the next title and then be prepared for larger releases at that point. So also not just larger releases, but releases that we can deliver more units faster. I'm curious to see how this is similar to Whitewater and how it's different and what's the next step it takes. Yeah, so this is a totally unique story to this game. I mean, I think that if you're looking at similarities, I think the things that would be most recognizable would be the ramp on the left that kind of has the wave. And then the shots in the upper playfield have some similarities because there's two main shots up there. There's the one that goes around to the rapids ramp and then the one that comes down. So basically returning to either the right or left flipper. We also have like a trapdoor shot. So there's another shot up there. And then obviously it can fall forward off the front to feed the flipper to get up there again. But those are kind of the similar elements. Then from there, the whole theming of the game is completely unique and independent. So the story is set in like the 1890s, kind of just the gold rush of the Yukon. And you are a prospector that is traveling to that area. And then you will go through a series of modes that are really taking you on the journey that you would have gone on had you been in this kind of final frontier gold rush. You start out in a city called Skagway, which is kind of like a port city where people would arrive on boats to start on their expedition. And then you have to like buy all these supplies because you're going on this this crazy journey. And so the the deal was you're supposed to gather 2000 pounds of supplies and then you basically got to go up this mountain pass called Chilkut Pass. And then you've got to like go over some rapids. You build a boat. You go over these rapids. You get further down where you can actually stake your claim and find some gold. And then you you end up in these towns like further along where people found gold and then they had all this money and they want to spend it somewhere. So these towns sprung up along the trail. And one of those is Dawson City. And so there's several modes in Dawson City in the game. And then obviously we've got the Yeti and this character is just kind of a mischievous character that's he's not menacing. Sometimes he messes with you and he'll take stuff from you. Sometimes he helps you and he'll give stuff. But he just has this attitude of like, hey, like this is my mountain. And what are you silly humans doing here chasing all this gold? So it's just it's kind of a fun and whimsical game around a real story. Right. It's the 1890s gold rush. So I think with this being a spiritual successor, people are going to pull a lot of parallels to Whitewater. And one that I've heard a handful of times now is the Yeti itself does not move. What was the decision there? Because on the original one, you know, the Dennis Norman looking Yeti moves when it's around. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I guess it does kind of look like Dennis. It's pretty funny, actually.
    19:14
    So, yeah, so they have the head that moves on the Yeti. We talked about a lot of different options for movement of the Yeti on the playfield. And we had several iterations. If you look at that area of the playfield, like the goal was we want the Yeti to be as big as possible because like we want him to be obvious there, like right up on that mountain area on the upper playfield. And so in order to get this Yeti to move is kind of this compromise of like being able to fit the parts in there to make him move, not make him where he's like hitting the glass. And then also just the mechanical design of it when we tried to make him move just wasn't working right in order to fit him where he needed to fit and be the size he needed to be to look like he was this Yeti on the mountain. And so in lieu of having that Yeti move, what we decided to do is we will make a Yeti topper. And like the Yeti topper is like this huge Yeti and his head moves and he interacts with you throughout the game. And so we thought that that was a better option for Yeti movement because like the head moving back and forth to us had very little value on the play field. But we thought the Yeti topper would make a really strong impact. And so that was just a call that we made on the team. I know people have talked about, oh, like, you know, why doesn't it move like the whitewater one? But for the most part, I think people have accepted that this one doesn't move and obviously liking the game and enjoying it. So that's the decision process that we went through to come up with that. Now, you have a few different lines on here, and I'm just looking at your website as we're talking. And so there is, you know, there's the most popular. There's the Legendary Edition and the All-In Package. So why don't you walk me through? Sell me on the All-In Package. Why should I pay more for this game? Yeah, so the all-in package includes a lot of the options that I think most collectors are going to want. So like Invisiglass is an option, for instance. And you can buy these options a la carte, by the way, before I go through them all. But the all-in package, you're buying the common options plus the premium topper. And you're getting that as a package deal. And as a result of that, you're saving $250 off the cost of what it would if you a la carte all those options individually.
    21:57
    And so the we've got the InvisiGlass, we've got the RGB speakers with the five inch speakers that are coaxial instead of the foreign speakers.
    22:08
    We've got the art blades. We've got these nice cabinet furniture sliders that we put on the back. We have wooden ones as standard, and then we have these like custom CNC nylon ones that are the upgrade.
    22:24
    Let's see. I think there are a couple other things on there. We have a dust cover that's a themed dust cover that will go with the game. And then obviously the the premium Yeti topper. We call it the Northern Lights topper because it's got this light show that it plays that casts like what looks like the northern lights on your ceiling and around the game. Looks really cool. And then the Yeti head moves around and his eyes light up and he interacts with you during the game. So that's the the all in package. As I said, you can a la carte any of those options individually. And then we do have a standard topper, which is like kind of the flat layered plastic topper, which you could option in if you so choose. And I would just say that almost it is a vast majority. I mean, almost all of the orders include the all in package. There are some arcades that have decided that they just want the base package. But for the most part, I think the people that are interested in this game, that are collectors really want the best of this game. And so that's what they're choosing. We actually had one comment from our Patreon that he said he's bought the all-in Legendary Edition, but he was curious because a lot of high-end of them have the mirrored back glass. Is that an option you're going to bring available to Yukon Yeti, or is that something that's in the future? You know, if a lot of people expressed interest in that, it'd be something that we could do. It's not an option that we have available right now or something that we put in any of our games to date. But yeah, if there's demand for it, I'd certainly be willing to do it. Honestly, this game looks fantastic. You know, you've talked about, we've talked about being a spiritual successor and I'm excited because the one thing that I heard from a lot of people was like the sound package needs to be fixed. And today you announced today before we interview you the legendary Chris Granner who did who did Adam Family who did the original Whitewater who is so influential on pinball is going to be doing Yukon Yeti
    24:37
    Yeah. How did that happen? Like, OK, how did that happen? And how excited are you to have this happening? Oh, man, it's awesome. I I was really hoping this would work out. It was kind of a long shot. And but. We knew that we were going to do more work on the audio. I think it was an instance where people they recognize that the audio could use some work. And even though we were going to do that work, I think it created an opportunity for us. So there are a lot of folks in the community that reached out to us that do audio design for pinball. And it was very nice. I talked to a lot of them. And I think we had a lot of great possibilities. And I obviously knew that Chris Granner worked on the original Whitewater. And I was like, man, if we could get him to do this game, I mean, it would just be such a perfect fit. And so I actually reached out to him on LinkedIn. I didn't I didn't have his contact information. And I just messaged him. I was like, hey, you know, we're we're working on this game and I want to talk to you about possibly helping with the audio package. Is that something you might be interested in? And he he responded and he was like, well, yeah, like we can set up a time to talk about it. Like, you know, I don't know that I'll have enough time to do it, but, you know, we'll we'll definitely talk about it. And so then I guess he he like looked up the game because he didn't know me or what we were working on. And so he looked up the game and then realized what it was. And then he emailed me back and he's like, oh, my goodness, like this is Dennis's game. And like he just said how much he loved working on Whitewater with Dennis and everything. And it's like his next email, he was just like so excited to talk. He's like, I can't wait to talk to you. I was like, oh, man, this is great. So even that that initial before we had talked, like he was excited, I was excited. And so, you know, we got to talking and there were some things that he had to get approval for with his current work situation and everything. And so we were kind of waiting and we just got the green light to make the announcement. And so I put that little fire together and got that out on social today and shared it. And Jason Knapp published an article, which is awesome. And yeah, it's incredibly exciting. And I think that the community has also shared their excitement for this. And there are a few people that are like commenting on the posting like, oh, like, what did this guy work on? And they're like, like everything. This guy's a legend. And they're like, oh, so there's a few people that maybe don't know. But for everybody else, they're just like, oh, my goodness, this is incredible. And so what a neat opportunity. And I think it's really cool because Chris has been out of pinball for quite some time. And this is going to be him coming back to pinball, which I am just so happy that I get to be a part of that. It's just such a neat story. And I'm excited to see how it comes together. I think he's just going to do this phenomenal job and it's going to be one of those cool pinball stories. So we're definitely excited.
    28:01
    Now, tell me about who's doing your LCD work and all the presentation, because you've actually done, I think you've done a great job in your previous games. And so let's talk about that. How is this one going to be different? And what's the next step on this one? Yeah, so our artist that does the art for the play field and the cabinet and everything is Brad Duke. And so he does a lot of the assets that go on the screen. And then my software team animates those things on the screen. And so what people saw at TPF was like obviously an early version of the code. I think we had four or five modes coded, but most of the UI for the modes was like just kind of like an image on the screen, just something to be presentable for the show.
    28:54
    Those are all areas that we're working on and like building out all of those mode screens and then the animations for those and everything. And so much like you see in Ninja Eclipse or Rowan's Arcade, I mean, Yukon Yeti will feel similar to that in terms of the way we do the animations and all that stuff.
    29:12
    We kind of know that this wasn't originally a Turner game. So how did it end up coming to Turner Pinball? Yeah, so there's definitely a little bit of history there. So Dennis originally started this game with Deep Root Pinball. And obviously, you know, most of you know that story. When that company shut down, I acquired the assets of that company and in hopes to be able to bring some of these things to the community and just not have all that work get thrown away. Obviously, Dennis's game was in that and Dennis approached me probably, oh man, it was at least a couple of years ago at one of the shows and he expressed interest in completing the game and wanted to work together on it. And I was like, oh man, that would be awesome. We would love to do that. And so we kind of set down that path at that point and just, you know, work to get it all built out. So that game was started at Deep Root and then Dennis just really wanted to get it done and we were very happy to get to help.
    30:22
    Dennis was at our booth at TPF which was so cool because the lines were crazy and he was just smiling the whole time. It was so cool to see him there and just so happy that he had a game out and people were just loving it. So it's really great. And another, there's a lot of really good stories that have come out of this game so far. So it's awesome. When I was at Expo this last year, you were there with Merlin's Arcade and with Ninja Clips and stuff. And some of the cool stuff you have is your cabinet designs. Like the glass actually folds up and you can pull the play field out. There's some cool stuff you can do with linking your phone to the game. But one thing that really caught my eye is when you lift up that play field, there's these massive PCB boards under there. What made you decide to cut the electrical and go the PCB board route? Yeah, so this really kind of dives into a lot of the differences between our games and the electrical system and mechanical system than pretty much everything else that's out there. So I'll kind of talk through that, explain our reasoning behind it and kind of the goals that we had when we set out. And then also the way that we approach kind of our place in the pinball market a little bit differently than I think all the other companies do. And so two things. So first of all, when I set out on this pinball journey, there were a couple of things that were like kind of must haves for me. And being able to improve the electrical and wiring system was one of those. I remember meetings that we had with my team at the very beginning. And this would be like before you saw that small cabinet ninja clips. Right. So my must have was like, we just can't have all this crazy wiring under the game. It's a nightmare for maintenance. It's hard to assemble. It's hard to manufacture. And so I was like, we've got to do this differently. And I had some ideas and methods that I wanted to try. And I was like, look, we got to make this work somehow. Let's try this. And so we kind of started with that and iterated to come to a solution that really takes away a lot of the pain of the manufacturing process and makes the game much more maintainable and user friendly.
    32:54
    Pinball is the ownership experience. It can be intimidating, especially if someone's not familiar with pinball. Taking off the glass, which we'll talk about here in a minute, flipping up the playfield and trying to troubleshoot something. We wanted to make that process just easier so that people would be less intimidated. It's easier for us on the manufacturing. It's more scalable and also just more user friendly. And so those are all our goals. Now, the second thing is. Because in my career, I have always tried to, if I have to build something to solve one person's problem, there might be other people that have that same problem. And if I can solve that problem for more than one person, that's going to be a better business than if I just solve it for one person. And so I kind of set off on this pinball journey with manufacturing, usability, and the idea of creating the system that we could provide to other manufacturers all as like fundamental goals. And so throughout building Ninja Eclipse and Merlins and now Yukon, we have built this really efficient and great electrical and mechanical system that makes our process easier, much less error prone in manufacturing, where it doesn't require nearly as much testing to get a machine that is reliable and produced well. There's just so many things that it really has improved tremendously.
    34:34
    And I hope to be able to offer this to other pinball companies. And I have had some talks with some of them and I'm trying to share this because I think the stuff that we've built and worked on patenting for all our technology, it is a better system to build pinball. And I think that any of them that would implement the system, it would make their business, their product, I should say, it's going to be more reliable, easier to manufacture. And ultimately, like that's going to end up being a more profitable business for them because of those things. And so anyway, those are the things that we're working towards. We've done that with our electrical system. We've built a lot of new components like like our pop bumpers. I don't know if you guys have seen those, but we've kind of taken the Williams style pop bumper and we have modified it to make it where it doesn't need a spoon switch. And it's way more reliable. No tuning needed. Things should last forever. And we started that in Merlin's Arcade. We've got the same pop bumpers in Yukon Yeti. Just looking for all these opportunities to improve the pinball ownership experience, improve the manufacturability. And then that takes us to the glass frame. Like, I don't know about you guys, but I hate taking glass out of pinball machines. Like, I mean, you get used to it, but just because you're used to it, does that make it something you want to do or that we should have to do? I think the answer is no. And so we have a system where it's just like this one latch and you just open the coin door, just push the latch and it makes this click and you pop the thing like the trunk of a car and it can pivot or you can just take it off completely. It's got all the lights integrated. So it's like this beautiful down lighting system, which I think is ideal for pinball because when you want to really get great illumination, like you've got lights shining up, but really you want down lighting. I think that the most efficient thing to do And so it provides that downlighting And then there are no connectors or wires that you have to fiddle with when you taking this on and off It pretty incredible And when people see it for the first time it very unexpected because it looks like every other pinball machine that they have But then it works in such a way that it's so much better. And then the first question is like, why aren't all of them this way? And I'm like, I hope they will be. So it'd be great. I think there would be very few complaints if every pinball glass came off the way ours did, I think.
    37:12
    Yeah, those are some of the goals that we set out with. And we just tried to build a better way to build pinball. And then we are showcasing that through the products that we make at Turner Pinball. Now, when you release games, the biggest thing people want on most of these games is, okay, how else can I customize it? So, Chris, I have a question. How come I can't see the topper on your website? Like, I find it on, when I search for it, I can see it, but am I missing something? If I pull up your website, how come the topper's not there? So, I think there is a picture of the topper, but you have to go through the gallery. I probably should make it more prominent. I'd also like to put a video of the topper up there and, you know, there's just so many hours in the day. Oh, no, no, no, I get it. I'm just saying that is that is a big selling point because a lot of people are like, OK, so if I'm if I'm getting upgrades, I want to see what the upgrade is. So, no, it's absolutely true. And it's definitely an area I can improve on. And I don't know if you noticed, but like our website, I redid the entire website for the launch just before the launch of Yukon Yeti. And there's I made a lot of improvements that people had asked for about like, I really want to see the play field and I want to see the shots. And so now we have this really nice down view, like a top view of the play field, like on all these different things and I'll show you what that is. So we're making iterative improvements and there's definitely room to go further with that. So I'll keep working on it. Okay. I did find it. You're right. It is the last pictures of the, well, it's this almost to the end of the gallery. But yes, it is on there. Okay. So I was curious because I was looking at the best places I could find is people's videos at Texas Pinball Festival. I'm like, okay, what does Turner say on that? For sure. So what's your favorite part about Yukon Yeti? My favorite part? Yeah. Like if someone comes up and you're like, this is why this game is fun. This is the cool thing. Do this. There are a lot of cool things about the game. And obviously I'm a little biased, right? Because, you know, we've worked on this game and tried to make it awesome. But there is one cool feature and another cool story that I'll tell. And it has to do with the big mech in the game, which is it's that scare mech. That takes the ball up. It's like the Chilkut Pass and that brings you to the upper playfield. So Dennis had this idea of these stairs and kind of how they might work. And I don't know if you guys saw this, like when I was a kid and you go to the mall and like you go to KB around Christmas time, they'd have like these little penguins on the stairs and they just would go up the stairs, you know, and we wanted to do something like that, but with the pinball. And it needed to be like this ball lock that was very visible right in the middle of the play field. And we wanted it to be like a five ball lock. And so those were like the criteria at the outset. And so we worked on this and we kind of got into it a little bit. And I was like, OK, so these balls get up on the stairs and then the game ends and we've got to clear all the balls. Right. And so we're going to like raise these balls like the little penguins climbing up and they're going to get to the top and they're going to go all the way down the upper play field, all the way down the wire form and then finally come to the drain. And I was like, someone's going to be sitting for like 30 seconds waiting for all the balls to like move all the way to the back of the play field on top and then come all the way down. It's like we can't do that. So we either need to make this thing like really fast or we need to come up with like some way to release all the balls at once. And like right as I said that, I was like, oh, man, I was like.
    41:10
    This could be like an avalanche. And I was like, that could be like our multiball. It's like avalanche multiball. And so this is just like this epiphany moment that we had just brainstorming, trying to solve the problem of the balls are going to take too long after a game ends to like all get to the drain. And so then we set out to like, OK, can we actually build this thing so that it can do the stair step thing like the penguins and then also turn to like a slide and just shoot all the balls straight down? And we worked on it for a while. And my mechanical engineer, Gabe, and I went back and forth and we came up with something and he was able to draw it all out. And we we tested it. And with a couple of iterations, it works awesome. And so now we have the five ball avalanche multiball, which I think is a definitely a huge feature in the game. Probably my favorite feature, but there are a lot of other really cool features that are close behind. But if I had to pick one, it's the avalanche multiball. Can you set it up for ball stealing? So in some options, like going up to a game, you're like, hey, there's two balls already on the couch at Simpsons. Like maybe I want to play because there's already two balls locked there. Is there a setting to say, hey, go ahead and keep those balls or do you just clear them every time? We've talked about that. And so there are two locks in the game. There is one on the right and it's under a plastic behind the mid flipper, the mid right point. And so a ball can like go behind that flipper and it'll get captured in that lock. And that right now, the way we have it coded, you can steal that ball.
    42:58
    Stealing on the stairs was not in the code that we took to TPF, but it is something that we're talking about and that we could do. I think it probably makes sense to make it a setting so that people could opt in or out of that for their game. But I mean, I think it would be fun.
    43:15
    TNA is one of my favorite games. I'm like, you know, I love seeing that lock load up and then like they drain and I'm like, my turn. So ball stealing is a great thing and a lot of fun when you're playing multiplayer. So I'd be all for it. And John Norris is on our team and works on all the rule sets for our games. And so that would be something that I would work through with him and kind of see, make sure we get it all working just the way we need to. But definitely open to doing it and adding a setting in the game so that we could select that. It seems like this game's been so well received. Would you consider doing other spiritual successors to old Bally William games? I don't know. You know, this one came about kind of as a unique thing because Dennis had started working on it and really wanted to see it through. And so this one made a lot of sense. You know, I think there are a lot of people that are remaking games. Obviously, that could be an option. But I don't know. I think this was just kind of a special thing. I don't know that it makes sense to do that with other games. Right place, right time kind of situation, huh? Yeah, I think so.
    44:26
    There's been a lot of that with this game between Dennis and then Chris Granner. It's just a neat story, the whole game. So how can we order it and what is the anticipated if people order today? How long is it going to take to get these things out to the market? Absolutely. Yeah. So you can order direct on our website, turnerpinball.com. You see the Yukon Yeti. Click on that and there's a buy now button. Also, if you go to our website, we've got a link for all our distributors. There's a page that lists all the folks that we work with. So if there's one of those guys that you are familiar with and like to work with, you're certainly welcome to do that. And then timeframes. So we're going to make 500 of these games. And in our current shop, like our capacity is about a little over 200 a year. So it's like maybe 220 a year. And so like if we were in our current shop, it's going to take us two years to do this. We have a new facility and I was just over there earlier this week. We're getting the road in and then working on power and all the other stuff that we need to do. We hope to be in that building by the end of the year. Obviously, the exact timing of that will impact the overall delivery of these units. And so I've been telling people that it could be up to two years because that's our current capability in the current facility. But the sooner that we can get into the new one, we're going to be able to ramp up and expedite the delivery of all the games. And so that's a lot of my focus is just kind of making sure that that happens sooner than later. And it's going to be we talked about kind of this game being like the stepping stone. Right. And this is part of that. So getting to the new facility and then being able to have this increased production capacity to finish out the build for Yukon Yeti and then proceed with future games. Awesome. Sounds like you guys are on the right track and everything's looking up. Well, thank you. Yeah. I mean, we've put a lot of work into building a foundation for the last three years. You know, we went into this with a plan and a strategy of like kind of how to approach this. And we've just been working through this kind of slow and controlled to make sure that we just, you know, didn't take on too much early on. Or, you know, start doing stuff where we didn't fully understand the problem we were solving and jump into it too quickly. So I feel like we've really built this strong foundation and it's great.
    47:02
    We love what we're doing. We're excited for what's coming. Awesome. Well, Chris, if you want someone to get a hold of you, what's the best way they can get a hold of you and Turner Pinball? Yeah, so just go to turnerpinball.com. I am very reachable. If you fill in the contact form on the website, it comes to my email, so I'll be the one responding. If you call the number on the website, it rings my cell phone. People do this all the time. They'll call and I'll answer and I'm like, hey, this is Chris. How can I help you? And they're like, is this Chris Turner? And I was like, yes. They're like, whoa. I'm like, really? That's awesome. Thank you for that. You just made my day. But they're just surprised that I answered the phone and I'm like, yeah, this is how we do it. So yeah, pretty easy to get a hold of. Go to the website, email or call.
    47:52
    That is awesome. So if you want to get a hold of us, we are LoserKidPinballPodcast at gmail.com. We have all the socials, which is at LoserKidPinball. If you're looking for us on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, doesn't matter what it is. You can get a hold of us there. Silver Ball Swag if you want some of our t-shirts and whatnot. And right now we are doing a poll on what is the greatest JJP game of all time. Who's going to take home the crown? If you want to do that, go to our Patreon, patreon.com slash Loserkid Pinball. And we are starting round two right now as we speak. So, Scott, give us our final words. You know what? Go play Yukon Yeti. I'm excited to play it in person and absolutely. And again, order it through Turner Pinball or Flip N Out. So thanks again for listening.
    48:45
    Thank you.