it's time for another pinball profile i'm your host jeff teolis you can find everything on pinballprofile.com all your subscriptions past episodes and more you can also find us on facebook we're on twitter and instagram at pinball profile and you can email us pinball profile at gmail.com let's go to australia ah i wish i could my goodness did i have fun there back in January, February, but we're about to meet somebody that is pretty new into pinball. And I say new as far as really jumping both feet in here in 2020. So kind of a bright spot here in 2020. And she is Jessie J. Hey, Jessie, how are you? I'm great. Thanks, Jeff. How are you doing? I am so excited to talk to you because Jessie J, as many people know, but some don't, has her own podcast on the Pinball Network, along with Ryan C, who you remember from head to head, And the reason this is fascinating to me is because here you are, six shows deep into a podcast, and you just got into pinball. Sort of just got into it. My history with pinball is a little bit unusual, I guess. So I started playing as a youngster. My dad introduced me to pinball when I was about four years old. I think a lot of people start playing when they're kids. And over the years, I just played casually until about eight years ago, I started playing at Pizza and Pinball, which is a great venue that we had in Newcastle in Australia, which spawned Pinfest. And back then, I was totally astounded by the fact that anybody actually cared about pinball at all, let alone enough to put on an event like that. But in the intervening years, I didn't really play a lot. You know, I'd have a game if I saw it at the pub or something like that. And then I met Ryan and everything changed. I hope for the better I mean I know Ryan and sometimes that's something that you can't get out of your memory it's like a dark spot that you just try to therapy will make you forget those kind of things but for you maybe it was positive look my psychiatry bill is increased exponentially since meeting Ryan um no it's been great we starting since starting the show the world has just opened up it's the pinball community has um really welcomed me everyone's been lovely It's so cool realizing the depth of interest out there and how many people are super into the hobby because that's a whole new world for me. So I guess in one way, I'm not new to playing pinball, but I'm definitely brand new to the scene, so to speak. And that's been a really fun learning experience so far. I like hearing your history of being exposed to it when you were younger. I think that's pretty impressive because you're a young woman and most people your age are exposed to video games. It only makes sense. There's more of them. There's home consoles and more. Pinball is a bit of a rarity, but for you, that is impressive to see you fall in love with something like that. And I know that Ryan talked about it on Jesse J's Pinball Adventures on your first podcast, that when he was introducing you, there was a lot that reminded him of when we first heard Mrs. Pin, who Ryan and I both think the world of, and her podcast. And what she did was really talk about watching her husband's hobby and obsession. And it kind of became hers, too, and really has. And so that kind of freshness was exciting for myself and Ryan and everyone else that listens. It was good because we remember that. It's been so long since we're so far removed from that. But it was exciting. And it makes us realize why we like pinball. So that's why I enjoy listening to your podcast. That's great. I'm so happy that my enthusiasm for it comes across because at the end of the day, you know, this is something that Ryan and I started just for a bit of fun. And if people like it and they relate to it in some way, then that's just a bonus because, you know, it kind of started out. The genesis of it was us just talking a bit of smack with each other. So, you know, if people it's reminding people of good times playing and being involved in the hobby, then that makes me really happy. That's the best I can hope for is a brand new entrant. So one of the things you're talking about on your podcast is this need to get into competitions, which Ryan was a little worried about because you look at pinball machines a lot differently when you're in competition. These machines that you absolutely love, you know, Ryan said, well, when you get in a competition, you might not like it. Now, you haven't been in a competition yet. I have to agree a little bit with Ryan there because, you know, these games that I once loved. I'll tell you one of my all-time favorite games. It's called Champion Pub, which I think you would like because a lot of people may or may not know this about you. You are or were a boxer. That's right. I am still a boxer in the sense that I train, but I used to fight. I'm retired from that now, so to speak. So I'm definitely on board with this. Tell me more. Champion Pub has this big figure in the middle. It's this toy. And basically, it's a punching bag, but when you build up enough level on this punching bag, the punching bag turns around and there's this guy that you have to fight. And he's got his arms swinging, and the funny thing about it is it looks like me, this old guy with the big mustache and ginger and stuff. I have always laughed and enjoyed playing that before I was in competitions. You never see it in competitions anymore because there are, quote-unquote, exploits or certain paths that you do, so you don't play the whole game. And that's, I think, what Ryan was talking about is that I've said it many times. I'll say it again. One of my all-time favorite games is the Simpsons Pinball Party. Love the theme, love the game, love the layout. But for competitions, people only do one thing. When I play it at home, I do all kinds of different things. You have a game very similar in the depthness, and you have the shadow at your house. That must be hours of fun. Having the shadow has been a really good time. And, you know, we're in Melbourne. We're in a really tight lockdown at the moment. We've had a bit of a second wave here, and so we're under very strict restrictions. And I was fortunate enough to get the Shadow during this time. And so, yes, it's been hours of fun. But Ryan and I actually talked about this recently. It has already changed the way that I play as well, having access to a machine, because prior to that, you know, my casual play was at the pub or at venues, and that was playing that I had to pay for. Now that I've got a machine in my home and it's on free play, I can do whatever I want, which means I've been able to invest a lot of time into trying to develop my skills. Whereas, you know, before on location, perhaps I would kind of just flip around and have fun with the game. And so because I've been doing that, especially on a machine like Shadow, which is, you know, I guess a little more difficult. It's Ryan's machine, so it's set up pretty fast. We were talking about how that's actually kind of changed the way that I play. And I've definitely improved, but it's also changed my mentality in approaching the game. And so I can definitely see how competition might do that as well. But I don't think that it could take the love out for me. It might change the way that I look at different machines, and that's fine. There's so many out there, Jeff. So I'm willing to take the dive and see what happens. That's the great thing, too. And as you start competing more and more, you will see some of these games you've never seen before. And there are all these whole new loves out there that I know that you're going to appreciate. But with the Shadow, now that you have it and you're putting hours on it, do you watch tutorials and see how other people play the Shadow? Yes, I have actually. My consumption of pinball media has also grown exponentially since meeting Ryan. But I tried not to, when I got Shadow, I tried not to look too in-depth into it because I wanted to try and figure it out myself. And another thing that we've been speaking about is as a casual sort of player, I tend to just step up to a machine and have a flick around and see what happens. I don't really read the rule card. And part of the reason for that is that I find it much easier to just play and learn it. Looking at a machine or even watching streams, you know, I was looking at the stream for Avengers the other day, and I turned it off because I just couldn't really follow what was going on. And I guess that's something that will come with more experience. But, yeah, playing Shadow at home, it's definitely so different to playing on location. So I'm learning a lot. You said your pinball media consumption has grown exponentially as well. So you know a lot about the history of pinball. If I throw out a name like Roger Sharp, you know about Roger. I do know who Roger Sharp is. And it's actually a funny story in the history of my pinball career as well, right? So Ryan and I met in an unconventional way. Go ahead. I know. So Ryan and I actually, we met on a dating app, right? And it's quite funny because I had something about pinball in my profile. thinking that that was very niche and nobody out there would like that and think that was very weird. And so Ryan pops up. And that creep stuck his hooks into you. That's right. He was like, this is my time to shine. So Ryan pops up all smooth and he's like, hey, you like pinball machines? I've got 30 of those. We should hang out. I want you to finish the story, but I just want to interrupt one thing here. Okay, when I met my wife, how I met her was my buddies were trying to pick her up. I was their designated driver. Nice. And one of the lines my buddy said to my now wife was, Hey, I've got 10,000 songs on my iPod back at the suite if you want to come back. So she's like, beat it, nerd. I abuse him for that every single day I see him. And now to hear Ryan say, Hey, I've got 30 machines. what a right slow down casanova oh but hey it was a conversation started jeff and you know we got talking so i guess it worked yeah by the way it's funny enough he and i met on a dating app too that's so bizarre small world wow and neither of us worked out with him so he's really got some stuff to work on doesn't he yeah and the therapy yeah you're right good point good point that's Right. But look, he's brought us together, Jeff, so it's really good. It's all good. And like I said, you have this podcast. If you look at the font there, it's very Indiana Jones, but I understand that's one of your all-time favorite games. It is, actually. Indie's definitely one of my favorites. And I actually just posted a picture today on Facebook of myself playing in Indie about eight years ago at the first pin fest in Newcastle. So that's a little blast from the past. Nice. Yeah. So that's how Ryan and I met. And one of the first conversations that we had was I was kind of going, oh, my God, you like pinball? This is bizarre. He was like, little do you know. But I actually said to him that because we been in lockdown one of my friends had proposed this concept for a Zoom meeting because you know in lockdown one everybody was very good about getting online and connecting with each other via Zoom before we all kind of burned out on that And she had this Zoom party where all her friends would get on, we'd have a few drinks, and everybody had to do a PowerPoint presentation on a niche topic. So my friend did a prezzo on Peter Garrett's dance moves, Peter Garrett from Midnight Oil. Yep. That was excellent. And my presentation was about pinball. Now, I went all in on this, Jeff. I had slide transitions. I had pitches. I had music from The Who. And I called it Lazarus Ball, A Timeless Tale of Tilts and Tables. Holy cow. It was a whole thing, right? And here's me at this time prior to meeting Ryan thinking, this is cool. Like nobody's looked at this before. This is brand new information. I had a slide featuring Roger Sharp. It was a capture from, I think, Special When Lit. I had facts about, you know, Roger's big moment in the courtroom. We had a pinball terminology section. You know, it was all happening. And at that time I was like, nobody knows as much about pinball as me. I am an expert in my friend group. And then a few weeks later, I met Ryan and things just blew up from there. That is just incredible. Isn't it? I'll have to send you my slides, Jeff. You'll be proud. You have to post them. I have to see them for sure. That's really cool. And okay, I'm a couple. One, two, maybe three at most years older than you. And my math isn't the greatest. But here's what I do know is that I loved pinball a lot when I was a teenager. and then in my early 20s. And then pinball kind of disappeared, certainly location as video games became more popular, and it was harder and harder to find this. So in 2014 on Facebook, somebody said, we have a pinball league. And I just went, wow, I haven't seen that in 15 years. 15 years. Yeah. And I went, person had 11 machines, including one you love, Medieval Madness. Yes. In fact, they had an Indiana Jones, too. And I was just like, wow, this happens once a month? And then I found out about other leagues and then tournaments and competitions. Both feed in. My big hobby was poker before that. And I've always loved sporting events, by the way. My all-time favorite sport is boxing. Amazing. Yes. And I just became in love with all aspects of pinball. But that's six years ago. I didn't know who Roger Sharp was. Well, I did my research. I had to know, you know, what was the genesis of pinball? I'm interested in these kinds of things. And I guess that's why it's been really fun to just dive in with Ryan and learn on the way. You know, the podcast is called Jessie J's Pinball Adventures because the point is kind of for me to learn and explore this world as we go. And that's really fun. And I think that as much as it's frustrating sometimes, you know, I'll try to look things up. And Ryan's like my stage mom. He'll be like, no, don't Google that. Like, wait until we're on the show together. It's kind of good because it means that I'm not overloading all at once. And the last thing I want to do is to get jaded about pinball because for me, it's so much fun. It's something that really gives me a lot of joy. You know, I've been doing it my whole life since I was a little tyke standing up on a little stool to play the Addams Family. And I don't want to lose that machine and the excitement of it. So learning gradually along the way is actually a lot of fun. And yeah, there's just so much to be discovered. Even though you're in major lockdown right now, I know just recently you traveled to Sydney. I was there also late January, February, and you and I went to the same place. Yes. For me, it was watching the video on their website that said, I have to go to Frankie's in Sydney. By the way. Are we talking about that unhinged advertisement? It is South Park meets Team America meets Rick and Morty times a million. It is the most crazy graphic video. I was totally hooked. I maybe laugh my head off because I find humor in everything. But the pinball was great and the venue was great. They had all these good bands playing. I was just like, this would be my hang if I was in Sydney. Right? It's such a cool place. And it's kind of funny how things come full circle because a really good friend of mine, who unfortunately passed away a couple of years ago, actually used to work there. He was the bar guy for a while. And I always said, you know, I've got to go there. I've got to check it out. This place is my kind of spiritual home. You know, it's a dive bar. I don't like fancy places. I love a dive. They've got great music. They've got great drinks. I didn't even know they had pinball. And so when I went there a couple of months ago, I was like, this is really cool. I'm finally checking out, you know, this place where my friend worked. Not only that, they have all of these great machines. And because of the lockdown, I think they had quite a few less than they normally would. But they still had a good solid six or seven there, I think. They had that when I was there in January, six or seven. So, yeah, that sounds like they had the same amount. But you're right about the great music. I was looking at the history there and I'm like, Wolfmother played a recent gig there as kind of an anniversary? I'm a massive Wolfmother fan. Are you? Wolfmother are Australian, aren't they? Oh, absolutely, yeah. Yeah. We've actually got a bit of a musical theme going on in the show with Ryan as well, but he never knows who I'm talking about, Jeff. I think he needs to get some culture. That is the adventure right there. I mean, I'm sorry. I can't help you there. I know that you would like to see a Danzig game. You're not alone. There are a lot of people. That'd be great. That's the thing. Anything can be a theme. And really, it's just a matter of getting the license and whatnot. But I'm getting a call here. Hello. Oh, Jesse, I'd like to introduce you to my pinball dad. Oh, my gosh. Roger, thanks for calling in. We've got Jesse Jay on the program right now, host of Jesse Jay's Pinball Adventures. and did you know that she once did a huge project on pinball and talked about you? Oh, my God. I did not know that. I hope she had good things to say. Oh, my gosh. This is such a stitch-up. Roger, it is such a pleasure to talk to you. I just saw on the Skype app on my phone, it just popped up and said, Roger Sharp joined the call, and I think that I had a heart attack. Okay. Well, I'm glad that you didn't, I guess. Cardiac arrest is not part of my menu. I've just revived by my excitement to chat to you. This is amazing. And, yes, I did do a presentation. I was just telling Jeff it was a PowerPoint presentation that I did via Zoom a couple of months ago, and it was called Lazarus Ball. It was very dramatic. It had a capture of you from special when lit. It was very exciting. Wow. Okay. How are you? I am great. How are you? I don't want to take up too much of your time. I mean, my God, you're dealing with my best son. So I've heard. Yeah, so Roger is not only the guy who saved pinball and means so much to us that I thought, I can't do that, but I can save his parenting in a way. He's a great parent, but he doesn't have a lot to work with. So I thought, you know what, I will be your adopted son, the son you've always wanted, and it's worked out really well for both of us, I'd have to say. I think so. I mean, it gives me a chance to say that I have two out of three. Are you looking to expand the family at all, Roger? Am I looking to expand it? No, I leave that to both Zach and Josh. It's never too late to adopt a daughter, I think Jesse's trying to say, Roger. Oh, there you go. Okay. In advance of this, I will share something with you that is actually true. my own father's name was jesse j jay sharp so talk about me adopting you my god wow are the family this is amazing i could be jesse j sharp jr it's got a pretty good ring to it don't you think it does as a matter of fact yeah i think this is fate roger i think so and all because of my favorite. I've been enjoying listening to Jessie on her podcast. She's just started the podcast this year in 2020 and really came back into pinball. And to jump in with a podcast and just know so much about the history and just consuming it all. We were talking before you came on about some of the games when Jessie was young and games like Adam's Family and her dream themes. And it brings me to you in the sense that a lot of these great titles that you love, Jessie, that we all love. You know, Roger's the guy who gets these licenses. Yeah. And then when you wind up saying when she was young, my heart just dropped because, yes, Adam's Family is an old game. I mean, you know, it was 1992 before most people were born. But, yeah, Jeff is right. I don't know if this is going to win me any points or lose me points by saying this, but that means that the first time I played Adam's Family, it would have been two years old if it was released in 92, and I would have been four. And I was 14, just starting out in the business. So there you go. Sharp kid. Pardon the pun. Wait, I don't know then if that makes you quite old enough to be my father. There you go. Okay. Now, Roger, Jesse is so looking forward to getting into competition. So here you are, the person who saved pinball, the licensor. But really, this whole IFPA, you are, along with the wonderful late Steve Epstein, the founders of this incredible competitive pinball that Jesse now wants to jump into. And we will get there once this COVID crap goes away. But isn't that exciting to hear younger people, first of all, obsessed with pinball, but really want to dive into competition pinball? No, I think that it's wonderful. And I think that, you know, whether it's leagues, different, you know, single events, the types of things that, and you are correct, Jeff, that Steve and I, you know, really dreamed of and what I really felt very strongly about that somehow, some way, at some point in time and equating it with bowling and not to diminish pinball or to overly elevate bowling, but, you know, bowling leagues. I started playing in a bowling league when I was like 10 or 11 years old. And you know you wind up watching it on TV And hopefully with this growth exponentially worldwide we get to that point where it will be on TV and not just streaming which is great as a starting point So, Jesse, the fact that you want to actually start something and get involved with it, nurture it, please. You know, that's what we need. We need more and more ambassadors and people to get all of the groups together because the common language and the common ground is pinball. And no matter how good or bad you might be, if you can go out and socialize and have fun and just enjoy the experience, that's half the battle. And I think with all the multiple divisions that we used to do back in the old Papa days with, you know, A, B, C, D, parent, child, youth. I mean, you can carve things out. and, again, wanting to be politically correct, but you can carve things out accordingly so that everybody feels that it's, you know, a level playing field, so to speak, even though it's at a slight angle. Thanks, Roger. I think you're right in that, you know, no matter how good or bad you are, it's all about the love of the hobby, right? And that's something that I've found fantastic about diving into pinball is that people are so welcoming. It's a great community. And, you know, you talk about me loving the game as a younger person. And I received some fan mail this week from a young lady who's just nine years old. She's super into pinball. She's playing all her dad's machines. And, you know, it's really cool to see that the torch is still being carried by children today. So hopefully it'll just keep going from strength to strength, and we'll see even more women in the hobby as well. That'll be really exciting. Well, and if you watch anything that my sons post, if they do post it publicly, Benson is starting to play, and he just turned two, and Colin and Charlotte are aggressively playing. And when Evan, who's one and a half, will get a chance to actually just not watch the flashing lights and the ball bouncing around, but will have the ability to actually start flipping on a game. But I think that, yeah, I mean, there is no age barrier. And we've seen that. We've seen that with some of the incredible young players that have gone on and competed and won major tournaments. I'm all for women coming into pinball. These younger people? No, no, no, no, no, no. I'm sorry. I've been to many of these competitions, and anybody over the age of 30 not winning, I mean, look at last year's Expo. The top four were all under the age of 20. The younger people have got to stop playing pinball. Pinball needs to start at 21. I'm putting my foot down. We need to raise the age limit. Actually. I'm going to put two feet down. I'm waiting for super seniors. You know, when can people over 80 start competing? So I can be at least, you know, competing against people from a comparable era. Not when I'm playing in things like Pinball where they wind up seeing games for the 1950s or 60s. Oh, this is going to be a game that Roger can really play because he knows this. We'll let him win this game, but when we start moving into the 80s and 90s and the 1000s, we got him dead to rights. I think you still have it, Roger. You know, one thing I actually really enjoyed from watching Special When Lit was observing your power stance when you play pinball. You've got a really cool kind of split stance going there, Roger. And so I would like to know, if I start getting into competition, do I need a power stance too? What's your best tip for me? Best tip in regard to my power stance is don't get too ruptured discs in your back, which means that you have to stabilize yourself so that you're taking the pressure off your back. Okay. Truthfully and seriously, for those who have ever seen my pinball book, There's a line drawing, which is a profile view of how to play pinball. That used to be my own stance from way back. Wow. That was actually gone as a drawing off of a picture that was taken of me. That's cool. But it was one foot in front of the other. So the power stance is based on necessity and just old age. And Jeff has been with me in certain competitions where, you know, the marathoning tends to go on and on. And I think that Jeff can attest to the fact that, you know, Roger's power stance gets lower and lower and lower as the evening wears on and more games are being played. So in all seriousness, get something that you're really comfortable with, that stabilizes your weight and whatever the lack or need of tension in your arms and wrists are to alleviate that so that you are poised. I've seen enough people that bend all the way down. I see other people that wear flashlights on their heads. I mean, there's all sorts of ways to kind of perfect something that becomes your comfort zone. Yeah. You know what's funny? My friends that are not into pinball want to try to, I don't know why, make fun of me or take a shot at me. I've never done that to anyone in my life. But anyway, these people, when they hear that I play competitive pinball, they're like, oh, do you work out? And I don't want to tell them yes because I don't. But I do want to say that some of these longer competitions, you think of a Pinberg on the cement floors, you think of the 24-hour battle at the Sanctum or some of these long, long events, just even normal qualifying. Roger and I have been to Freeplay Florida. That's 10, 12 hours, if you want, of qualifying. Right. And that's being on your feet. So comfort is key. Shoes are definitely key. But you were talking about your discs, Roger. The one thing I noticed, because you're kind of bent over just a little bit, your lower back gets a little sore. I one time took a break, one time, at Pinburgh, by the way, with a torn meniscus. All right, I'm lucky to be alive. Let's just call it as it is. Torn meniscus. I'm at a break. New Iron Maiden pinball machines there. I'm like, you know what? This isn't competition. I'm just trying to get a couple games in. I pulled up a stool. I sat on it and played. and have I been ridiculed for that ever since? Hi, Laura Fraley. I know you're listening. But you know what? It was about comfort. It was just to get me off my feet for a few moments, and that's something. It's about commitment too, Jeff. That is commitment to the game. Absolutely. I expect nothing less, and in all honesty, cannot play with a stool or anything else. It wasn't competition. It was just, okay, I'm just going to sit down for a second here. No, I understand. I think it's great. But it's funny when, I mean, talking about the subject matter for a moment, I remember years and years ago, people used to talk about golfers and bowlers. I mean, come on, what kind of shape are they in? Everybody goes out and plays golf. Everybody goes and bowls. And I think it was when Tiger Woods started the tour as this young phenom and had a physical fitness routine. And suddenly everybody started working out. Everybody started bulking up. the same thing if you go back and take a look. I guess Chris Hardwick's dad, professional bowler, probably started around the era when people started working out. So yeah, I mean, there is physical endurance playing pinball. Not to take a cheap shot at any video game people that are out there, but come on, I'm sitting at a computer screen all the time. Yes, I have to work out on my wrist so I don't get carpal tunnel. Jesse will be fine because she is a boxer, Slightly retired, but, I mean, you talk about physical fitness. She'll be fine. Yeah, we were just thinking about this before you came on, Roger. So now I'm thinking perhaps we could integrate some friendly combat with the next pinball tournament that we run. Just get people really fit, you know? I'm liking it. I mean, you know, I don't know if you want to go a few rounds or get on a speed bag, but I think that, yes. Let's get people starting to work out and people starting to get in shape so that, you know, the marathoning is something that, as I've said countless times, it is an endurance test. And it's physical and it's mental. It's all of that where, you know, the emotions have to run in an even keel, probably the same way that it is if you're in the ring, boxing or whatever it is that you were doing. I don't get into the details on that because now I'm kind of shivering and wondering. It's like, damn, okay. I will not meet you in the octagon. Please don't. No, it's all friendly here, Roger. But, you know, I'm thinking there might actually be a niche opportunity for us here because Jeff and I were just talking about how I just got my first machine at home, which is the Shadow, which I really, really enjoy. And I actually purchased a couple of Shadow comics from eBay recently. So these are 1975 edition Shadow comics, and they're very cool. One thing that really tickled me about reading these was the inserts in these comics. There's the old school coupon pages where, you know, they advertise these crazy things and you cut out a coupon and you mail it in. Some of them are truly hilarious. There is like a guide to, you know, ninjutsu or send this coupon in for the Mega Muscle Man book, edition six. Roger wrote that book, I believe. Of course he did. I thought it looked familiar. So I was having a really good laugh at these, but you know what? I think that we could actually bank on this. If people nerdy enough to read something like The Shadow were mailing in to get these fitness books, then people nerdy and fantastic enough to like pinball could also be interested in a fitness regime, right? I think we might have cornered the market. I think that you're on to something, and I think that whether it's videos, a la Jane Fonda from years back. Oh, yeah. It goes along with it. I think exercises and keeping fit, diet, nutrition, physical fitness for pinball competitors. Roger, I don't think we're going to see that happen. First of all, Jesse's from Australia, so it won't be Jane Fonda. It'll be Olivia Newton-John doing physical. Yes. Thank you. I like that one. Secondly, if you have to start asking some sort of physical requirement or basic need, We're going to lose a lot of players just as if they started doing drug testing. It's not going to happen in pinball. Okay. You say that now, Jeff, but when I have a successful pinball aerobics video in a couple of weeks from now, you're going to be eating your words. You know what? I think you're right. I do want to say this. The gauntlet has been thrown down. Roger, we were talking about one of my favorite just novelty games. Every time I play it, it makes me smile. Do I want to play it in competition? Probably not. I just think it was a very unique game. I was mentioning it to Jesse, and I want to talk to you about it because of her boxing background. There are some great boxing games out there. The game I'm thinking about is Champion Pub. I just find it funny beyond all belief. But there are some other ones out there. Knockout is a tremendous EM game. I really enjoy that one. Great game. And Stern Ali is just, ask your son Zach about when we played Ali at Papa, and I beat the living hell out of him. Made it into a T-shirt, by the way. So there are some good boxing games out there. We'll skip Rocky. that's a don look at that one Jesse well and what is it title fight I think was another title another Gottlieb game If I not mistaken Yeah this is exciting I think that Ryan might actually have an Ali but I haven seen any of the others so I'm going to have to go on a bit of a quest. Well, there you go. Yeah. Actually, I'm on a mission now to find a secret service. I never played it, but I saw it online, and I went, I need to own that. because, you know, now that I've got Shadow in my place, I've got the bug, you guys. I just want all of the pinball machines that I can possibly own, and Secret Service might be the next one, but it's kind of hard to find. It is, and if you have trouble finding it, just get the knockoff. It was called Black Knight. I'm sorry. Okay, good tip. I'm wrong. Sorry. Let me correct that. It was called High Speed. High Speed. Okay, cool. Actually, it did remind me of that, Roger, because I was watching a video online of Chase playing. Yeah, right. That makes sense. Which came first? Oh, High Speed. Right. And I think 1986, 87 timeframe was when Secret Service came out. It was the, I think it was the second game that Stern wound up doing after Laser War. Second or third, somewhere around that timeframe. And Laser War, as anybody who has some familiarity, was a knockoff of Game Plan's Loch Ness, which never made it into production. I've been in pinball for a while. I'm learning these things too. I mean, that's where Jesse is right now. It's the fun part of pinball for me was just this world opening up in the personalities, the games, the history, the competition. It's a fun time to be getting into pinball. As we're seeing with Jesse, it's a fun time to continue being in pinball. We just have to keep our fingers crossed and help places that need us the most here. You know, we've seen places like Flat Top Johnny's. I just heard today Buffalo Billiards in Austin, Texas, which I love, the home of the Bat City Open. They're now permanently closed. So what do we do, Roger? We have to hope that there is sanity that takes over, not only in this part of the world but elsewhere, and people start really following the guidelines that the science tells us, which is masks and social distancing. and getting everything under control. And if everything is under control, then guess what? We can start going back into places and enjoy playing games, seeing movies, eating at restaurants. I mean, all of that. And I think, unfortunately, there's a schism that exists without becoming too heavy. But the schism exists, which some people feel is somehow, you know, taking away some of their human rights. If they're forced to do certain things, they're going to provide safety not only for them but for everybody else. But yeah, I mean, I feel it. And it is, it's a shame because having been more sensible earlier on, and I think Australia did a marvelous job, if I have the correct memory, early on in really kind of controlling and maintaining certain protocols, which kept, you know, the spread of COVID down, contact tracing and all the rest of it. And by doing that we can get back to a new normal quicker because right now the clock is ticking and it's a shame. I was just going to say one of the things that maybe might be a boon for pinball coming out of this is that you know yeah Australia has been fairly good here in Melbourne where I am mask wearing is now mandatory and one of the things that I think that people are saying a lot out of the COVID pandemic is that it reminds us to be a little bit grateful for what we've lost access to and I wonder if that might intersect well with the pinball world because I was just talking about this with Ryan after watching Special and Lit. It's interesting to me as a newcomer that there was, you know, pinball was so popular and then there was a bit of a drop-off and now there's kind of a resurgence again and there was some talk for a while there about whether it's a bit of a lost art, I guess, people getting into video games and such and so I'm hoping that maybe the gratitude that people are having for things they can't do, like going to the beach or seeing their friends, might also come into pinball as well. We can go, well, you know what? We need to hang on to this. We need to keep this community going because if we don't, we're at risk of losing it. These locations are shutting down. So hopefully we can spread the good word and keep that going too. There's definitely some good places in Australia that are keeping the fight up. Well, I was going to say it's people like you, a younger generation obviously, obviously, that have this enthusiasm and this passion for pinball. And, you know, I've said it in the past, until someone can create another entertainment form that provides all that pinball provides for somebody like myself, the tactile experience and all of the sensory immersion, pinball is going to endure and survive. And I think to your point, what you're saying is correct. When people are able to get back out into the world, the physical touch of other people, And I say that in a nice way, but the physical touch with other things that you get to interact with. And I'm not talking about a controller or, my God, everybody's been on computers. The idea of playing any more computer games is beyond comprehension. But the physical interactivity of playing a pinball machine, I think, are going to get a lot of younger people curious and involved, probably with a sense of awe as to, oh, my God, I hit that and it disappeared. Well, that's a drop target. I hit that and look at that. It spins around. Yes. I mean, they're going to look at all of these wonderful component parts that comprise a pinball machine and each and every time they wind up hitting something or affecting a change, they're going to start to be drawn in. And I think that that is probably the best look. I've seen it with my grandchildren, you know, firsthand most recently, forgetting about the boys when they were growing up and just seeing their level of fascination. And it's not as if they don't have all of their iPads and tablets and games and all the rest of it. You know, it's the pinball machine that speaks to them. And I think for a young generation to have that object of love is going to be wonderful and great. And the fact that we have the types of incredible machines that are being created today only add to it. And the fact that there's such a rich heritage kind of reinforces it. I hope that love of pinball for Colin and Charlotte, now Benson, is legit and not just some ulterior motive from their creepy fathers to try to get them into pinball so that they get permission to go to more competitions. And they're using their children as bait. It disgusts me. It's all in a very short. There you go. No, unfortunately or fortunately, I think that both boys are actually following the guidelines that I had set down, which was they were not allowed to play pitfall in the house. And it was only when they were really good and did their chores and finished their homework where I was like, all right, fine, you can go play a game or two. So it tends to be the same. I guess it doesn't fall that far from the tree. Roger, that's so funny that you just happened to call me just coincidentally. I mean, this was never set up. This was never planned, just our nightly call, if you will. Yeah, it was a surprise to me. I was just calling Jeff to see how's life. It's Monday night. How's your favorite son? Yep. Yeah, and just wanting to make sure that he's doing okay. We hadn't talked over the weekend. I apologize. My Sunday call I missed. And look at what's happened. You've now adopted a daughter in Jesse Jay. This is great. I'm loving it. My family grows. I'll be sure to start using junior at the end of my name, Roger. You're on. Roger, thank you very much. I appreciate you coming in and talking to Jesse. No, hey, I'm loving it. And both of you, take care. And hopefully, you know, in the not-too-distant future, we will find ourselves somewhere by a pinball machine and we'll have a chance to play together. Sounds fantastic. Thanks so much, Roger. It was great to speak to you. Take care, guys. You be good. I'll let you get back. Sorry for interrupting. Well, Jessie, I heard you talk with Ryan about interviewing, and I know he was kind of setting up for this. I got to say, you know, for somebody I thought might be nervous, might be phased, you need to start interviewing people. You're pretty darn good at this. You think so? Thank you. I had to take a moment to compose myself after that unexpected introduction. But, yeah, it was a great chat. Thanks so much. I'm surprised in the sense that a lot of people are nervous when they first talk to a stranger, and that's what you and I are. I mean, we know each other from listening to each other, but we don't really know each other. And then when you add another element, you know, there's the nerves that set in. But you're very well spoken. You hear that on Jessie J's Pinball Adventure. I'm glad you've asked Ryan to kind of back off a little bit. It is your show. He talks too much. But I do look forward to the next time I hear you on the Pinball Network. Thank you so much, Jeff. And look, I can only aspire to have a voice as soothing as yours one day. So I'll get practicing on my vocal exercises. Okay. Truth be told, when you said what you said about something about it's a voice that you'd like to hear when you go to sleep or something to that effect. You can talk me to sleep in a good way. My wife and I were driving up north and that came on. We were just listening to the show because, you know, I certainly enjoy it. Plus, we also know Ryan very well. And that came on. Oh, my God. Did we laugh? And the best part was Ryan was disgusted by you saying that. And then you said something like, Marty's got a nice voice, too, but, you know, Jeff can, you know, that's soothing. My wife then turns to me and said, geez, I really like Marty's voice better. Oh, my goodness. Oh, she's a sucker for Australians. Yeah. Well, hopefully she enjoys my accent then because, you know, sometimes I think, oh, is there too much of a twang going on? I've received fan mail from people saying, oh, I love the way that you say this particular word. And it's made me quite conscious, actually, of my Aussie twang. So hopefully it's going over well. I'm Canadian. I apparently can't say the word out or dollar or sorry properly. So don't you worry about it. It's who we are. You do a great job. And I look forward to your next episode. Thanks very much, Jessie. Thank you so much, Jeff. Great to talk to you. This has been your Pinball Profile. You can find everything on pinballprofile.com. All past episodes, subscriptions, and more, you can find us on our Facebook group. We're also on Twitter and Instagram at pinballprofile. Please email us, pinballprofile at gmail.com. I'm Jeff Teolis.